#emc | Logs for 2011-04-02

[00:00:03] <FinboySlick> SWPadnos: No, ours use plain ATX.
[00:00:09] <SWPadnos> ah
[00:00:28] <SWPadnos> I've been wondering about some of the ones with integrated power supplies, but haven't tried any of those yet
[00:00:29] <FinboySlick> SWPadnos: Got them in a lovely little 1U 8" deep case.
[00:00:43] <SWPadnos> they're kind of expensive compared to a normal one and a PicoPSU
[00:01:12] <FinboySlick> SWPadnos: We needed 48v input so we went for a standard 48v 1U atx PSU.
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[00:01:25] <SWPadnos> ah
[00:01:44] <SWPadnos> incidentally, Netgear GS105T gigabit switches don't work so well on 48VDC
[00:01:52] <SWPadnos> just FYI
[00:02:17] <atom1> this case was recomended to me here and i'm happy with it: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811154091&cm_re=itx_case_with_power_supply-_-11-154-091-_-Product
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[00:02:50] <FinboySlick> SWPadnos: They could be wonderful if they didn't use that dreadful config utility.
[00:03:02] <SWPadnos> which?
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[00:03:12] <FinboySlick> SWPadnos: GS105T
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[00:03:20] <SWPadnos> oh. actually I menat GS105, no T
[00:03:25] <SWPadnos> so not managed
[00:03:52] <FinboySlick> If there was a web if (like the 108T) for its built in features, it'd be a killer little switch for the price.
[00:05:41] <SWPadnos> hmm. is there a 105T?
[00:05:48] <SWPadnos> Netgear doesn't seem to think so
[00:06:41] <FinboySlick> I meant 105E apparently.
[00:06:56] <FinboySlick> http://www.netgear.com/business/products/switches/prosafe-plus-switches/GS105E.aspx
[00:07:03] <SWPadnos> ah. phew
[00:07:30] <Jymmm> wth is a 5port good for???
[00:08:05] <SWPadnos> well, for one thing you can stick them in a small case with a computer on the inside and "network in" and "network out" ports on the outside
[00:08:11] <FinboySlick> Jymmm: These can be used as surprisingly accurate little rate limiters, they can do vlan tagging on dumb hosts, etc.
[00:08:47] <Jymmm> 5 port managed switch?????????
[00:08:51] <FinboySlick> Yup.
[00:09:04] <FinboySlick> All it's missing is a non-idiotic way of managing it.
[00:09:16] <Jymmm> java?
[00:09:26] <FinboySlick> Adobe air or some other nonsense.
[00:09:34] <Jymmm> dumbasses
[00:10:03] <FinboySlick> Jymmm: I was thinking of reversing the protocol and writing a python config front-end at some point.
[00:10:19] <Jymmm> ssh ftw
[00:10:22] <elmo40> FinboySlick: that JetWay only has DDR2. Why is it more then the DDR3 version? same CPU. Although, it does support more memory then the DDR3 variant, odd. Maybe it is the PCIe slot that costs more?
[00:10:58] <atom1> pretty sure mine has a pcie slot
[00:11:42] <FinboySlick> elmo40: I don't know. The one I got had an add-in card for 3 (total 5) discrete gigabit lan, which is why we picked it.
[00:11:43] <Jymmm> SWPadnos: Ok, a 4x5" mgnd gig switch aint too shabby and even 12v too, not some funky ass 17.5 crap
[00:12:12] <Jymmm> it gets 3.5 stars, 5 if it had ssh
[00:12:13] <SWPadnos> I actually don't need the management (unless it's in the same case as the GS105)
[00:12:27] <SWPadnos> nope. too big :)
[00:12:37] <Jymmm> SWPadnos: pull it out of the enclosure
[00:12:53] <SWPadnos> hmmm. or not. apparently the new model is the same size. cool
[00:12:59] <Jymmm> just case the enclsoure fo rthe lifetime warranty
[00:13:05] <Jymmm> save
[00:13:10] <SWPadnos> Jymmm, that doesn't work so well - there's nothing to grab onto
[00:13:25] <Jymmm> SWPadnos: screw pules on teh pcb
[00:13:28] <Jymmm> holes
[00:13:37] <SWPadnos> the GS105 has two screws that hold the board to the case, in the back, and the front is held in place by the jacks
[00:13:39] <Jymmm> duct tape, velcro
[00:13:50] <SWPadnos> no good when you move the machines around
[00:13:58] <Jymmm> ok, DUCK tape
[00:14:07] <Jymmm> silicon
[00:14:13] <Jymmm> liquid nails
[00:14:25] <Jymmm> two part epoxy
[00:14:51] <SWPadnos> too bad there are pins sticking out the bottom of the board ;)
[00:15:06] <Jymmm> SWPadnos: lots of silicon
[00:15:09] <FinboySlick> You guys are likely to see a bit more of me in the coming weeks/months, btw. I bought some pretty serious steel for a total noob.
[00:15:21] <Jymmm> atom1: does that case PS have a fan in it?
[00:15:29] <SWPadnos> I thought about board guides, similar to the ones sometimes used for motherboards, but that actually takes up more space
[00:15:52] <FinboySlick> SWPadnos: What are you trying to put it in?
[00:16:38] <SWPadnos> oh, there's a system I designed that uses 12-24 computers which are in custom-cut enclosures
[00:17:04] <SWPadnos> each enclosure has a mini-ITX PC, SSD, ethernet switch, and other custom hardware
[00:17:55] <Jymmm> (detonator)
[00:18:03] <SWPadnos> the switch is so they can daisy-chain, and the computers don't have to be on (as they would need to be if you used software routing on motherboards with 2 ports)
[00:18:08] <FinboySlick> Why a bunch of 5 ports then? Wouldn't you have better port density with a larger switch?
[00:18:09] <Jymmm> (Secure Rf Trigger)
[00:18:17] <SWPadnos> not within each case
[00:18:29] <FinboySlick> SWPadnos: Oooh.
[00:18:49] <FinboySlick> SWPadnos: There are boards with dual-lan that do passthrough when off.
[00:18:55] <SWPadnos> gigabit?
[00:19:06] <Jymmm> 10GigE ?
[00:19:18] <FinboySlick> SWPadnos: Think so. I found them while shopping for another embeded thing, lemme look.
[00:19:51] <SWPadnos> does it act like a switch/bridge when the board is on?
[00:20:02] <SWPadnos> I wouldn't want routing to change when I boot up each machine
[00:20:30] <SWPadnos> and there's also the time between power-up and OS switching, when I'd rather keep the connection active
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[00:21:32] <FinboySlick> SWPadnos: I think it acts like a pair of interfaces when it's on so you'd probably want to start a bridge early. I'll have to find one.
[00:21:46] <SWPadnos> ok. post a link if you find it. gotta run though, thanks
[00:24:16] <Jymmm> atom1 you whore, get back to the kybd!
[00:24:34] <atom1> huh?
[00:24:41] <atom1> what did i do now?
[00:24:56] <Jymmm> atom1: you have that apex case?
[00:25:07] <atom1> yessir
[00:25:32] <atom1> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/intel_atom/atom_index.php
[00:25:50] <Jymmm> atom1: Favor, could you take some hi-res photos of the internal front bezel and the side vents? I'd like to mod it with some lights
[00:26:26] <atom1> in a bit i can
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[00:26:29] <Jymmm> atom1: is that a 2.5 or 3.5 hdd?
[00:26:36] <atom1> 2.5
[00:26:39] <atom1> on the side
[00:26:44] <Jymmm> yeah, ew
[00:26:47] <atom1> it wasn't really meant to mount there
[00:26:57] <Jymmm> k
[00:27:03] <atom1> the rails were made for a 3.5
[00:27:10] <Jymmm> they even sell replacement PS too
[00:27:24] <FinboySlick> Cute, a little sherline! I have one of those. Sadly not CNC though.
[00:27:27] <Jymmm> atom1: http://www.apextechusa.com/products.asp?pID=42
[00:27:55] <atom1> nice
[00:28:08] <Jymmm> atom1: Yeah, I wanted to see if it had a fan in it
[00:28:13] <atom1> it does
[00:28:19] <atom1> it runs really slow
[00:28:29] <Jymmm> it's variable speed
[00:29:34] <Jymmm> atom1: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817154024&Tpk=AL-8250SFX
[00:29:59] <Jymmm> atom1: cheaper than buying a replcement fan
[00:30:05] <Jymmm> for the price
[00:30:09] <atom1> yup
[00:30:25] <Jymmm> atom1: is the fornt bezel plastic?
[00:30:31] <atom1> yes
[00:30:37] <atom1> snaps in with 4 clips
[00:30:45] <Jymmm> atom1: PVC ?
[00:30:52] <atom1> i'll get some pics in a few min
[00:30:55] <atom1> probably
[00:31:12] <Jymmm> atom1: FUUUUCK, I cna't lsaer PVC anything else sure
[00:31:38] <atom1> any way to tell for sure?
[00:31:50] <atom1> the recycle mark on the back maybe?
[00:31:51] <atom1> if it has one
[00:32:13] <Jymmm> atom1: Well, if you can get a piece of the plastic itself, there is a destrucive test for pvc
[00:33:27] <Jymmm> Get a piece of copper wire (14-13ga), and tourch it till there in no more green color in the flame. touch the hot wire to the plastic till a bit melts on it, hit it with the tourch agian and if there is a green flame == Chrlorine == PVC
[00:33:48] <Jymmm> less the typos
[00:34:28] <atom1> you just want me to screw up my front bezel :D
[00:35:08] <atom1> maybe there's some flash on the back...
[00:35:40] <Jymmm> atom1: Nah, like cd bezel
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[00:41:26] <Jymmm> atom1: Or if there was a way I could fab my own bezel and attach it would work too
[00:42:53] <atom1> ok, you want pics of the inside front and what else?
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[00:43:43] <Jymmm> If you remove the bezel, the metal where the bezel would sit, the inside of the bezel itself, and the inside of the vents of the vents of the cover
[00:44:18] <Tom_L> i'll take a few here and if you want more detail we'll go from there
[00:44:22] <Jymmm> oh, can you tell me if the top part of the frame comes out?
[00:44:26] <Jymmm> k
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[00:47:59] <Tom_L> the top is rivited in
[00:48:08] <Jymmm> bastards
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[00:49:09] <Tom_L> it says ABS on the backside
[00:49:43] <Jymmm> OH HAWT DAMN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[00:49:51] <Jymmm> I can do ABS =)
[00:50:22] <Jymmm> and there is a 3pin fan header on the mobo
[00:51:35] <ds3> do ABS?
[00:51:56] <Jymmm> ds3: I can laser any plastic BUT PVC
[00:52:04] <Jymmm> lethal
[00:52:14] <Jymmm> to hu-mons and machine
[00:52:34] <ds3> Jymmm: have you cut ABS yet?
[00:52:42] <Jymmm> nah
[00:53:08] <ds3> the problem I found was massive warping in ABS
[00:53:23] <Jymmm> Yeah, too much heat for too long.
[00:53:43] <ds3> how much power do you hve?
[00:53:49] <Jymmm> 30W
[00:54:22] <ds3> I have 40W and I used max power
[00:54:30] <ds3> acrylic is the only one that is reliable
[00:54:54] <Valen> FinboySlick: the mesa products plug into a normal PC, they run the servo and stepper controllers, not the whole thing
[00:54:56] <ds3> well, and paper ;)
[00:54:59] <Valen> I use a dual core atom
[00:55:40] <Valen> SWPadnos: I use a dual core atom with onboard nvidia 9300 for TV computer, seems to work ok
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[00:56:06] <FinboySlick> Valen: Oh, okay, you used their servo controllers, not their system boards.
[00:57:48] <Valen> yes
[00:57:53] <Valen> bbl
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[01:02:40] <Tom_L> Jymmm, you want the full size pics?
[01:02:47] <Jymmm> sure
[01:05:59] <Tom_L> brb
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[01:07:39] <Tom_L> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/intel_atom/detail/
[01:08:16] <Tom_L> i tried different angles on the back. it's hard to get good detail of black plastic
[01:08:23] <Jymmm> heh
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[01:10:28] <Tom_L> ok, more requests while i got it out?
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[01:11:41] <Jymmm> Tom_L: The inside of the cover vent holes by chance?
[01:11:46] <Jymmm> TYVM btw
[01:12:22] <Tom_L> tyvm?
[01:12:26] <Tom_L> oh
[01:12:27] <Tom_L> np
[01:12:29] <Tom_L> :D
[01:12:44] <Tom_L> oh the metal cover/
[01:12:45] <Tom_L> ?
[01:13:09] <Jymmm> yeah, want to see if i can insert an acrylic window
[01:13:33] <Tom_L> i don't see why not
[01:13:55] <Jymmm> mounting, clearance, blah blah blah
[01:14:15] <Jymmm> LOL you use PCB for a table top, that's funny
[01:15:15] <Tom_L> that's a small piece
[01:16:39] <Jymmm> Tom_L: The vent holes in the BACK of the PS, do they blow or suck in air?
[01:17:33] <Jymmm> these holes http://www.apextechusa.com/images_u/psu/AL-B200SFXa.jpg
[01:18:02] <Tom_L> i think they blow but i'll check once i get it plugged back in
[01:18:07] <Jymmm> np
[01:18:37] <Jymmm> In the 3.5" slot, it looks Like I could mount fan blowing up on the bottom of the hdd
[01:18:56] <Jymmm> to keep the hdd cooler
[01:19:15] <Tom_L> 11..13 up now
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[01:20:14] <Jymmm> Heh, there's even a nice alignment lip there too =)
[01:20:27] <Tom_L> yep
[01:20:38] <Tom_L> it's a nice case for a cheap one
[01:20:53] <Jymmm> Tom_L: does the BOTTOM of the 3.5" tray solid?
[01:20:59] <Jymmm> s/does/is/
[01:21:11] <Tom_L> yes
[01:21:19] <Tom_L> i was just getting ready to say that
[01:21:31] <Tom_L> no fan unless you mod it
[01:21:42] <Jymmm> well, I guess I could cut it, not like it'll show
[01:22:17] <Tom_L> might be hard to get to to cut
[01:22:28] <Jymmm> it looks removable
[01:22:40] <Tom_L> riveted from the front
[01:22:52] <Tom_L> you might take out the psu and get to it from the top
[01:23:06] <Jymmm> ah
[01:23:19] <Tom_L> it's all one piece part of the side rails
[01:23:33] <Tom_L> rails, cd and hdd bay
[01:23:47] <Tom_L> if you cut the bottom out, there's nothing holding them together
[01:23:56] <Jymmm> DOH, lol
[01:24:47] <Tom_L> oh shit. wait. that was my ssd bottom i saw. it is open
[01:24:58] <Jymmm> heh, cool
[01:25:10] <Tom_L> not used to seeing a flat plate in a hdd bay
[01:25:25] <Jymmm> =)
[01:26:07] <Jymmm> $204.81 to my front door w/ case/ mobo/ 2x2gb ram
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[01:28:01] <Tom_L> mine was $345 with 4g ram and the ssd with a 320g hdd
[01:28:25] <Tom_L> the case is on sale
[01:28:32] <Tom_L> the mb was the other day
[01:28:49] <Jymmm> bastards
[01:28:54] <Tom_L> $5
[01:28:55] <Tom_L> offf
[01:29:00] <Jymmm> oh
[01:29:37] <Tom_L> the case was $39 when i got it
[01:29:45] <Jymmm> ah
[01:30:19] <Tom_L> ram 45
[01:30:42] <Tom_L> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233122
[01:30:47] <Tom_L> haha sold out
[01:30:49] <Jymmm> Crucial is just up the street from me if I need an RMA
[01:30:57] <Tom_L> i paid 78 for that
[01:31:46] <Tom_L> oh and i got a couple other unrelated things
[01:32:23] <Tom_L> if you plan to put in a cd, get an angle sata plug
[01:32:41] <Jymmm> that tight?
[01:32:44] <Tom_L> it'll still fit, it's just nicer
[01:32:49] <Jymmm> k
[01:33:03] <Tom_L> no, 1.5"
[01:33:17] <Jymmm> I wonder if I should get two of these systems
[01:33:18] <ds3> Jymmm: how accurately can you cut acylic?
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[01:33:34] <Tom_L> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812264007
[01:33:39] <Jymmm> ds3: define accurately?
[01:33:41] <Tom_L> i got that one
[01:34:11] <ds3> Jymmm: say I pay you to cut a 1" square, can you give me a 1.000x1.000 peice +/-0.001 and have all the corners be 90deg?
[01:34:36] <Jymmm> +/-0.001 percent? mm? in?
[01:34:44] <ds3> +/-0.001 inch
[01:34:47] <Jymmm> how thick?
[01:34:47] <Tom_L> does it flare the edged like waterjet?
[01:34:53] <Tom_L> edges*
[01:34:58] <ds3> say 0.125 nominal (i.e. 3mm)
[01:35:02] <Jymmm> Tom_L: tapered you mean?
[01:35:05] <Tom_L> yes
[01:35:14] <Jymmm> tom on thick stuff
[01:35:17] <Tom_L> probably a bit
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[01:36:15] <Jymmm> ds3: whats the application?
[01:36:38] <ds3> Jymmm: enclosures. my cutter has a backlash problem that I don't quite have time to solve
[01:37:37] <Jymmm> is the sq an insert? wall? bracket?
[01:38:07] <ds3> Jymmm: that is just a test sample size.. the actual peices are basically a bezel around a LCD
[01:38:18] <Jymmm> ah
[01:38:33] <Jymmm> ds3: when would you need these by?
[01:38:40] <ds3> let me see if I can find a pic of what I did last time
[01:39:10] <ds3> Jymmm: mid next week is my guess
[01:39:24] <Jymmm> qty?
[01:39:31] <Tom_L> the psu fan blows out the back
[01:39:50] <Jymmm> Tom_L: very cool, I can add partial filters to the vents
[01:39:51] <ds3> http://www.hy-research.com/beagle_tab7.html <--- like those pictures but a bit bigger
[01:39:59] <ds3> Jymmm: 1
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[01:40:42] <ds3> Jymmm: the question is can it be done...the one I did turned out to be trapazoid and I am debating playing with the backlash comp settings or paying someone else
[01:41:09] <Jymmm> trapazoid from side or top view?
[01:41:15] <ds3> top
[01:41:23] <Jymmm> oh, heh.
[01:41:23] <ds3> side view is normal with lasers
[01:41:32] <ds3> hence the belief I have a lash issue
[01:41:55] <ds3> I can reproduce it on cardboard. always homing before changing directions seems to have a lot (at least on paper)
[01:42:09] <Jymmm> ah, gotcha
[01:42:20] <Jymmm> 1/8" or ???
[01:42:33] <ds3> 1/8"
[01:42:53] <Jymmm> actual dimensions?
[01:43:41] <ds3> final dimensions depends on how well things simulate in alibre (got a nasty "flex" cable to accomodate)
[01:44:51] <Jymmm> I have some 0.108" clear
[01:44:52] <ds3> no peice will be bigger then a letter size paper
[01:45:03] <ds3> I can supply material
[01:45:17] <ds3> going to have to get it regardless if I do it or someone else does it
[01:45:29] <Jymmm> cast or extruded?
[01:45:54] <ds3> cast, IIRC... it'll probally be the stuff from tap with the paper backing
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[01:46:14] <Jymmm> well, hold off on buying it.
[01:46:29] <ds3> why?
[01:46:36] <Jymmm> do you need JSUT the window, or an entire enclosure?
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[01:46:58] <ds3> I need the enclosure and it is designed as a laminate of 1/8" peices
[01:47:17] <ds3> anyways... can you cut it accurately? otherwise this is moot
[01:48:40] <Jymmm> Sure, not measured to 0.001" but I can adjust for beam kerf to accomiate a snug fit. Even weather can effect the results.
[01:49:40] <ds3> Hmmm
[01:50:41] <ds3> Jymmm: what about squareness? that really got me into a bind with that one
[01:51:09] <Jymmm> My laser is not a "home brew" system if that's what you mean.
[01:51:18] <Jymmm> It's a ULS M-300
[01:51:20] <ds3> as in, that case is actually inside out (buttons are on the wrong side) due to the inability to assembly it
[01:51:48] <ds3> Jymmm: I donno if this is an emdemic problem to lasers or just my poor quality chinese laser
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[01:53:08] <Jymmm> hag on
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[01:55:21] <Jymmm> Heh, i don't have anythign around here with square corners, all radius. But what I did was replicate a stock part and it fit perfectly
[01:55:43] <ds3> I see
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[01:56:05] <Jymmm> No trapazoid like you are desripbing.
[01:56:29] <Jymmm> There is some tapered edges, when you get into thick stuff (of course)
[01:56:52] <ds3> 'k... let me see how things look in alibre
[01:58:00] <Jymmm> ds3: Ok
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[01:58:27] <ds3> Jymmm: how long do you need to cut it from the time I give you a DXF?
[01:58:58] <Jymmm> it's gong to depend on the drawing complexity, etc
[01:59:01] <Jymmm> going
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[02:00:05] <atom1> give him a dxf then ask how long and how much
[02:00:13] <ds3> shouldn't be too complex... if there are sticky stuff, I can design it out ;)
[02:00:39] <ds3> atom1: still modeling it to make sure the cables can fit (!@#$@!$#;2R$!@$#@! flex cable with a non flex section in the middle)
[02:00:39] <Jymmm> (famous last words ;)
[02:01:01] <ds3> Jymmm: I am designing it assuming I was going to cut it myself
[02:01:12] <ds3> so I either tackle the lash issues or outsource it
[02:01:34] <ds3> and I write the G-code for EMC to cut it
[02:02:53] <Jymmm> I don't need to write/use gcode
[02:03:12] <ds3> yes, but that gives you an upperbound on complexity
[02:12:56] <atom1> http://www.machinistsfriend.com/
[02:13:04] <Jymmm> atom1: there is no RESET button on the case, is there?
[02:13:07] <atom1> just found that on my hdd. didn't even know i had it
[02:13:12] <atom1> no
[02:13:18] <atom1> there's a jumper for it
[02:13:37] <Jymmm> but no button in the case
[02:13:43] <atom1> nope
[02:13:47] <Jymmm> bastards
[02:14:14] <atom1> put one inside the front usb door
[02:14:19] <atom1> tactile button
[02:14:33] <atom1> hidden
[02:15:14] <atom1> just drill a hole and hot glue it in from the back
[02:15:40] <Jymmm> that plate looks screwed on, so I could do that
[02:15:59] <atom1> what plate?
[02:15:59] <Jymmm> and a TURBO switch too =)
[02:16:07] <Jymmm> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/intel_atom/detail/DSC_0004.JPG
[02:16:25] <Jymmm> bbl
[02:16:42] <atom1> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/itx/frontpannel1.JPG
[02:16:52] <atom1> i did that board for my other one
[02:17:00] <atom1> pwr and reset buttons
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[02:59:39] <FinboySlick> SWPadnos: http://www.silicom-usa.com/default.asp?contentID=657 Here's a standalone version of what I was talking about.
[03:01:41] <FinboySlick> http://www.portwell.com/products/detail.asp?CUSTCHAR1=CAD-0205-06-08 Is an embeded system with bypass ports on it.
[03:03:04] <FinboySlick> SWPadnos
[03:03:26] <FinboySlick> SWPadnos: http://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/Commell-LE376/?kc=rss is an sbc with it too.
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[03:09:42] <FinboySlick> SWPadnos: And you can get a dual-gigabit bypass module for those too: http://www.liantec.com/product/emboard/ITX-6M45
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[08:08:21] <anonimasu> where is tomp? I wonder
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[08:26:45] <archivist> anonimasu, never seems to lurk
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[10:24:22] <LarsTorben> !!! DAS neue LINUX www.snowlinux.de THE NEW linux !!!!!
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[11:18:41] <stillme> Sup guys?? i just got my cnc working with emc2, but wondering how to convert my models to gcode, any ideas??
[11:23:57] <archivist> stillme, some options to try http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/emcinfo.pl?Cam
[11:24:21] <stillme> thanks archivist
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[15:50:17] <elmo401> atom1: what are those mini USB programmers used for?
[15:51:18] <Jymmm> To take over the world
[15:52:20] <jdhNC> one uC at a time
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[15:59:44] <elmo401> lol
[16:00:18] <anonimasu> atom1: what's up?
[16:00:44] <skunkworks> this is what drives the hydraulic servo valves on our lathe.
[16:00:45] <skunkworks> http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/cincinnatimi/ampright.jpg
[16:00:58] <skunkworks> http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/cincinnatimi/ampleft.jpg
[16:01:45] <skunkworks> I really think a simple amc servo amplifier would probably drive it just fine.
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[16:08:43] <tom3p_> irc client crashed, how do i kill the ghost user tom3p?
[16:10:14] <archivist> Usage: GHOST <nick> <password>, Kills a ghosted nickname
[16:11:32] <tom3p> thx
[16:12:56] <tom3p> hmm you may not GHOST yourself well log out may help
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[16:13:59] <tom3p> mo betta
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[16:18:22] <tom3p> shuttle rack ATC vismach http://videobin.org/+43z/4gk.html
[16:18:30] <elmo401> skunkworks nice g command http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/cincinnatimi/00005.jpg
[16:18:34] <elmo401> G33
[16:18:43] <elmo401> for tapered threading
[16:18:55] <elmo401> goes EMC support that?
[16:19:15] <tom3p> any examples of using the HUD in vismach or how to implement the alpha channel on objects?
[16:20:49] <elmo401> tom3p: nice.
[16:21:03] <tom3p> i forced the built in HUD by hacking vismach.py and putting a .show right in there ( couldnt figger how to trgr it externally )
[16:21:15] <tom3p> thx elmo401
[16:22:16] <tom3p> i got the alpha channel to work for indiv objects with another hack, but havent gotten it to work via a halpin
[16:23:35] <tom3p> during a tool change, i could invisibilize the tool pallet (when chuk is empty) and setthe size pins to reflect tool from the rack AND a tool pallet when 'grabbed'
[16:23:58] <tom3p> if id get the alpha ( transparency) value tied to a pin
[16:24:55] <JT-Shop> Kraftwerk is playing so it must be nap time :)
[16:25:06] <JT-Shop> tom3p: cool vid
[16:28:14] <tom3p> thx JT-Shop
[16:28:42] <tom3p> the vismach file is just a hack of Cradek/JMK's max5gui http://pastebin.com/3TSkhykn
[16:30:48] <tom3p> the hacked up vismach.py http://pastebin.com/ZY6k4DHL
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[16:32:56] <tom3p> the hal file http://pastebin.com/HKPF4bfm
[16:34:00] <tom3p> the ini http://pastebin.com/9W0KwaYB
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[16:36:39] <tom3p> driver pgm that chgs the appearance of the tool using m6Tn and the shapes from the tool table offsets http://pastebin.com/AUwgznUG
[16:38:33] <tom3p> skunkworks_, often the old 'spool valves' ( moog & pegasus brands ) were just 20ma devices, and any amplifier was more for signal matching than amplifying :)
[16:39:18] <tom3p> meaning a simple op-amp might suffice ( it'd buffer and size & offset for you )
[16:40:02] <tom3p> the valve is the real amplifier, converting 20ma to thousands of pounds of pressure
[16:40:04] <elmo401> I don't understand how you mad the virtual part of your machine.
[16:40:17] * Jymmm sends the full auto drawings to JT-Shop... MAKE IT SO
[16:40:18] <elmo401> what is doing the drawing?
[16:40:35] <elmo401> ei ei captitain
[16:40:48] <Jymmm> o
[16:41:08] <tom3p> elmo401, use a text editor and vismach try the examples in your emc installation, see the 'vismach' directory
[16:41:27] <elmo401> there are simple machines in there? 3-axis?
[16:42:40] <tom3p> well the 'hbm' is 4 axis xyzw
[16:43:36] <tom3p> my dir is full of different attempts, but the other choices in a std install are a bit complex ( like 5 to 9 axis )
[16:43:46] <tom3p> so start looking into hbm
[16:45:20] <tom3p> i should set up a fixed bed one, my machines have fixed tables and move the xyzwc from a pedastal sitting behind the fixed table.
[16:45:43] <tom3p> and A&B are trunnions mounted on fixed table
[16:46:40] <tom3p> damn the hack for displaying the HUD is in the vismach.py, so i always get same message on all cfgs :(
[16:46:49] <tom3p> anyone used the HUD?
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[16:54:06] <tom3p> the tool table that uses offsets to describe tool shape http://pastebin.com/ymMn6eBU
[16:54:39] <tom3p> the offsets are connected to pins 'tool-wid' 'tool-dep' 'tool-rad' 'tool-len'
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[17:03:35] <tom3p> typical tool pallet ( for some reason the catalog is always upside down ) http://tinyurl.com/3hch5pd
[17:04:40] <tom3p> the palletes are designed for extreme precision between tool changes, height, rotation, x&y are very tight ( 1u & .001 degree repeatability )
[17:04:53] <anonimasu> tom3p: hey I had a question to ask about the heidenhain dnc is it supposed to be goddamn slow?
[17:05:05] <tom3p> haha
[17:05:11] <anonimasu> even at the fastest baudrate my control coudnt keep up
[17:05:29] <anonimasu> with what I fed it
[17:05:37] <tom3p> ask Heidenhain, i really dont use their spoon feeder
[17:05:55] <tom3p> the guys in USA are friendly
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[17:07:28] <tom3p> get those names?
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[17:09:13] <tom3p> a typical sink edm tooling chuck ( receiver ) http://www.system3r.com/3r/en/products--services/products/die-sinking-edm/macrohighperformance.aspx
[17:09:41] <anonimasu> tom3p: just wondered if you did that before since your the only person with any knowledge of heidenhain i know of
[17:09:56] <tom3p> notice like the tiny air blast holes to clean the surfaces before joining the tool
[17:10:07] <tom3p> anonimasu, those guys know a lot too!
[17:10:19] <anonimasu> hehe
[17:10:26] <anonimasu> yeah they are friendly to ask here also
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[17:10:43] <tom3p> and i never used the spoon feeder cuz the language was compact, like the o-words in emc2.
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[17:11:02] <anonimasu> wel, I have a 160000line mold I need to cut :)
[17:11:03] <IchGuckLive> 7join cam
[17:11:14] <tom3p> but i never did contouring much in edm
[17:11:30] <tom3p> and heidy never did wedm
[17:11:35] <anonimasu> I saw some edm:ed stuff
[17:11:41] <anonimasu> wedm...
[17:11:50] <anonimasu> 0.05mm slots in something
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[17:12:17] <tom3p> ? heidenhain ? lemme know any links ( they dropped the 4n6 line a few year back )
[17:12:26] <anonimasu> no idea what machine
[17:12:27] <IchGuckLive> anonimasu: 168k lines thats way mutch
[17:12:41] <anonimasu> IchGuckLive: 0.01tip tool and a ( contour
[17:13:01] <IchGuckLive> this coudt be done in a G02 03
[17:13:15] <anonimasu> well, with text on top
[17:13:27] <IchGuckLive> anonimasu: is your mashine only accepting straits ?
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[17:13:49] <IchGuckLive> or the standart 5Axis
[17:13:58] <IchGuckLive> G-code Stuff
[17:14:01] <anonimasu> it does accept arcs in all planes
[17:14:24] <IchGuckLive> so your generator is not good
[17:14:44] <IchGuckLive> witch cad/CAM are you on
[17:14:47] <anonimasu> mastercam
[17:15:13] <IchGuckLive> you can change it to use ARCs instred of lines
[17:15:34] <anonimasu> it does use arcs when it can but it's just so many stepovers
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[17:16:03] <IchGuckLive> ok so you now what you are doing from the programming side
[17:16:16] <anonimasu> yes
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[17:17:24] <IchGuckLive> why woudt you try to run the mashine with EMC2 isend there a controle already ?
[17:17:30] <anonimasu> yes
[17:18:05] <anonimasu> one that works very good, just the issue about the serial transfer that i figured out
[17:18:14] <IchGuckLive> yes means there is a controling on the mashine working ?
[17:18:30] <anonimasu> yes
[17:18:45] <Jymmm> SWPadnos: Donkey
[17:19:16] <anonimasu> got emc on other machines, but the issue is that I cant really swap that over since I'd have to teach others how to use g-code or cad/cam for everything
[17:19:31] <anonimasu> better fixed cycles, and stuf for drilling/boring/facemilling and everything
[17:19:36] <tom3p> anonimasu, there is a source code available for LSV2 transfer protocol. i used to have it , i bet those contacts can get you the src
[17:20:03] <anonimasu> tom3p: I figured out my big problem it was with a usb->rs232 adapter but im wondering in general if it's supposed to be slow
[17:20:06] <IchGuckLive> anonimasu: im from Germany so you only need the transfering
[17:20:33] <tom3p> for those who think gcode is easy, they havent used canned cycles on heidenhain ( its the MAC of CNC's )
[17:20:40] <anonimasu> agreed :)
[17:20:46] <IchGuckLive> anonimasu: your mashine does accept RS485 i think
[17:21:08] <anonimasu> no
[17:21:10] <anonimasu> only rs232
[17:21:22] <anonimasu> it's a old control but it works too well for 90% of the stuff i do to replace
[17:21:32] <anonimasu> and we'll see if it's up to cut this stuff
[17:21:40] <tom3p> anonimasu, agreed usb2ser is a prob withthe heid protocols, best find ancient laptop with rs232 and use dos xfer apps
[17:22:10] <anonimasu> i'm gonna get set up with a normal computer someday soon
[17:22:11] <tom3p> (dos xfer apps from heid )
[17:22:25] <IchGuckLive> http://www.adontec.com/index.htm?GO=/plsv2_e.htm
[17:22:26] <anonimasu> it made a wold of difference with another adapter but i still think a normal serial port would push data faster
[17:22:32] <IchGuckLive> there is a free tool
[17:23:01] <anonimasu> seems like the new adapter did 2kb/s
[17:23:24] <Jymmm> TRUE UART, DOS support as well as linux, mac, etc... http://www.microbarn.com/details.aspx?rid=102431
[17:23:32] <anonimasu> and the old one did like 0.9kb/s
[17:23:45] <anonimasu> probably a normal port would be even faster
[17:24:23] <Jymmm> and only $16 too
[17:24:30] <anonimasu> tom3p: ah so you knew about the usb to serial problem ^_^
[17:24:35] <tom3p> Jymm its the LSV2 protocol thats the bitch
[17:24:46] <anonimasu> I think it relies on interrupts or something
[17:25:05] <Jymmm> USB polling is the issue with USB2Serial
[17:25:14] <anonimasu> that's what I figured
[17:25:15] <IchGuckLive> anonimasu: Notebook or Dektop
[17:25:27] <tom3p> lsv2 ( heidenhain & bosch ) http://www.control.com/thread/1002637731
[17:25:45] <anonimasu> they still keep the lsv2 for the new controls so it cant be extremely terribly bad
[17:26:01] <Jymmm> tom3p: I love telling ppl I have a serial port on my Mac =)
[17:26:16] <anonimasu> my control is supposed to handle 60m/min so how the hell can they not allow for enough data to be transferred :)
[17:26:53] <anonimasu> IchGuckLive: btw, that 160k lines was the finishing op :)
[17:27:09] <anonimasu> like 3 hours..
[17:27:40] <IchGuckLive> no Your Transmitting PC is a Notebook ?
[17:27:57] <tom3p> lsv2 toolbox from heid http://content.heidenhain.de/doku/oma_zubehoer/TNC-Zubehoer/Software-Beschreibung/28368110.pdf
[17:28:20] <IchGuckLive> tom3p: are you German 2
[17:28:37] <tom3p> nope, American :)
[17:28:54] <tom3p> but Germans build good machines
[17:29:01] <IchGuckLive> agree
[17:29:20] <IchGuckLive> but alot of using USA build also like here 50+ HAAS
[17:30:32] <tom3p> Haas = Chevy Truck good bang for buch DMG/SZimmerKreim = BMW
[17:31:08] <TekniQue> has anybody here made their own toolchanger?
[17:31:36] <IchGuckLive> tom3p: HERMLE
[17:31:54] <IchGuckLive> C series is mutch better
[17:32:13] <tom3p> yeh, sweet engravers , stiff machines
[17:32:49] <IchGuckLive> i got a C1200 for Heavy loads in 1.2316
[17:33:12] <anonimasu> yes
[17:33:17] <tom3p> TekniQue, me not yet, but watch the developement of the o-word tool change enhancement by MHA et al
[17:33:38] <anonimasu> :)
[17:33:44] <anonimasu> IchGuckLive: yes it is
[17:33:45] <anonimasu> for now
[17:34:00] <IchGuckLive> Thanks
[17:35:44] <tom3p> 3rd party toolbox (iirc 800$) http://www.adontec.com/index.htm?GO=/plsv2_e.htm
[17:35:58] <TekniQue> tom3p: talking about the mechanical part. I'm just wondering how these conical toolchanger spindles work
[17:36:48] <tom3p> orient spindle, pull up on stud
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[17:41:45] <tom3p> anonimasu, maybe these CA guys http://www.e-manufacturing.com/brochures/Ax2200HS-Feature-Sheet-S102025.pdf
[17:42:37] <anonimasu> tom3p: it's cheap setting up a old pc to do serial comms :)
[17:43:45] <anonimasu> 480mb programs for the cnc :D
[17:43:47] <anonimasu> up to..
[17:43:48] <anonimasu> wow
[17:44:02] <tom3p> heid still has the tk http://www.esd.bg/download/Heidenhain/Heidenhain%20DNC%20virtualTNC%202007_07%20628_968_21.pdf
[17:45:08] <anonimasu> since my tncserver still works and I need a serial port that's what I'll do
[17:45:12] <tom3p> they didnt have ethernet on 3n6 4n6 series but had a server app so i cobbled up a cheap pc running the app in the control cabinet.
[17:45:23] <tom3p> anonimasu, yep good plan
[17:45:45] <anonimasu> only thing I were worred is about keeping up with the data rate required
[17:46:02] <bzzzz> anyone having trouble cloning git.linuxcnc.org?
[17:46:03] <anonimasu> probalby 600mm/min contouring shouldnt be too much even by serial -_-
[17:46:08] <bzzzz> i'm getting timeouts
[17:48:08] <tom3p> bzzzz, this irc logged user having problems there today
[17:48:51] <bzzzz> tom3p: thanks, guess i'll download a snapshot somewhere
[17:50:31] <bzzzz> tom3p: uh, any idea where the irc logs are located?
[17:50:51] <anonimasu> !thislog
[17:51:01] <bzzzz> !thislog
[17:51:09] <anonimasu> no :/
[17:51:12] <bzzzz> !help
[17:51:16] <bzzzz> :<
[17:51:26] <IchGuckLive> O.o
[17:51:32] <bzzzz> no problem, i'll check back another time
[17:51:41] <anonimasu> one second
[17:52:00] <IchGuckLive> its late here i finish and go grilling BBQ
[17:52:06] <IchGuckLive> By
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[17:52:33] <anonimasu> cant find them...
[17:52:44] <anonimasu> bbl too
[17:56:21] <tom3p> bzzzz, anonimasu reliable logs http://psha.org.ru/irc/ thxs psha!
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[17:57:22] <ktchk> Hi kde is going to not use hal, does emc need hal?
[17:58:16] <tom3p> hal for kde is differnt than emc2-hal ( an overloaded name, used by both kde & emc, meaning differnt things )
[17:59:09] <ktchk> OH but does the hal deamon run?
[17:59:11] <tom3p> the std ubuntu install of emc has its own hardware discovery tools ( what hal does for kde )
[17:59:26] <tom3p> dunno if its called hal or not, but it finds the hdwr
[18:00:08] <tom3p> i dont see it in top
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[18:00:55] <ktchk> Can anyone using gentoo rtai without hal?
[18:01:37] <JT-Shop> bzzzz: it's been down all morning
[18:02:51] <archivist> bookmark
[18:02:51] <the_wench> http://emclog.archivist.info/
[18:02:58] <archivist> there is another :)
[18:03:18] <archivist> bzzzz, ^^^
[18:05:18] <tom3p> some info on hal vs hal man hald (<< for what kde uses ) man hal (<< for what emc2 uses ) (likely only will work on an emc2 install tho, where the names are overloaded in the emc2 preferred way )
[18:06:10] <tom3p> its like using the name axis for the cnc gui, makes googling info impossible (great app tho )
[18:07:05] <ktchk> naming by germans?
[18:10:50] <ktchk> thanks tom3p
[18:10:55] <ktchk> bye
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[18:11:06] <tom3p> i think it was Mollier, whos play Adam & Eve, had Adam naming all the animals like 'yellow billed quaker' and along came Eve saying 'Its a duck!' the name is up to the author , live with it :)
[18:11:07] <tom3p> bye
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[18:20:31] <tom3p> for those using gedit i find this plugin handy ( i like folding in a text editor ) http://code.google.com/p/gedit-folding/downloads/list
[18:21:46] <tom3p> works on indents like python, but pretty printed o-words are indented too, even text files with notes can be folded if you indent
[18:23:29] <anonimasu> :)
[18:26:19] <Jymmm> I prefer SciTE http://www.scintilla.org/SciTEImage.html
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[18:35:16] <tom3p> yep scite is nice ( i forgot it was installed , and its gnome icon isnt in accessories like geany & gedit ) ( so edit the damn menu :)
[18:38:29] <skunkworks_> I need a remote pendon.
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[18:38:43] <skunkworks_> I cannot run the jog wheel from the other side of the machne
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[18:41:31] <tom3p> scites icon is in /usr/share/pixmaps/Sci48M.png not in /usr/share/icons
[18:42:47] <tom3p> longer cable? extension cable? i just repaired 2 hand pendants, they used a weird curly cable with 2cond for estop & 4 cond for Vcc Gnd DTR RXD
[18:43:14] <tom3p> luck it was end connector cuz the cable is uberexpensive
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[18:54:55] <tom3p> anonimasu, just stumble don a bunch of heid hdwr here in chicago ( alss ebay ) http://www.bargainmargin.com
[18:56:09] <bzzzz> archivist, tom3p: thanks!
[18:56:40] <tom3p> the html is way past bad
[18:56:45] <TekniQue> one thing, is there a way to set EMC to pause or halt execution on a tool change line?
[18:56:55] <TekniQue> the "manual tool changer" only presents a dialog
[18:56:57] <anonimasu> tom3p: I see, I did that the last week got a 4th axis encoder comming this way
[18:56:58] <anonimasu> :)
[18:57:10] <anonimasu> TekniQue: m00?
[18:57:17] <TekniQue> but if you don't have a quickchanger, that is not of much use because you need to realign the Z height manually
[18:57:27] <tom3p> if you use the new o-word tolchange, you are in complete control of the handshake and abort
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[18:57:35] <anonimasu> on my machine I go up to Z toolchange plane and I issue a m00
[18:57:37] <anonimasu> so I can swap tools
[18:57:49] <anonimasu> then I just press nc start(run) again
[18:58:04] <TekniQue> ok
[18:58:29] <tom3p> anonimasu, lemme know if you need heid scales or rotaries or exes or dros or...
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[20:25:28] <skunkworks_> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTPkw5BNmVw
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[20:29:25] <skunkworks_> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TFyExOaBysY
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[20:32:59] <awallin_> you really need to watch out for collisions when that turret rotates, and interference from nearby tools when close to the chuck ??
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[21:19:15] <skunkworks_> looks like the 2 turrets on the lathe we have are 3 bit binary. 3 solinoids gives you 8 positions.
[21:19:20] <skunkworks_> easy peesy
[21:20:01] <skunkworks_> older stuff is probaby more like that - easier to do some of that stuff mechanically vs control
[21:28:50] <awallin_> skunkworks_: check out the front panel on that lathe, if you fancy old stuff :) http://www.cnc-tekniikka.com/CNC-forum1/index.php?topic=1842.msg9577;topicseen#msg9577
[21:30:48] <cradek> skunkworks_: any motion from your lathe yet?
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[21:32:13] <alex_joni> cradek: it moved downwards about .0000001 because of dust weight
[21:32:23] <cradek> ha
[21:32:37] <cradek> and sinking further into the concrete
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[21:46:01] <skunkworks_> cradek: not a high priority at the moment.
[21:47:08] <skunkworks_> cradek: did you see the circuit that was there originally to drive the vavles.
[21:47:22] <cradek> no - sadly I lost my scrollback when I lost power
[21:50:04] <alex_joni> logger[psha]: bookmark
[21:50:18] <skunkworks_> yeck
[21:51:07] <skunkworks_> awallin_: http://imagebin.org/index.php?mode=image&id=144376
[21:52:43] <skunkworks_> cradek: http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/cincinnatimi/ampright.jpg
[21:52:51] <skunkworks_> http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/cincinnatimi/ampleft.jpg
[21:52:52] <awallin_> it's like a washing-machine mechanism: the program goes round and round ?
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[21:53:09] <alex_joni> skunkworks_: I hear Mark has been talking about you
[21:53:12] <alex_joni> "the skunkworks are in high gear right now"
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[21:54:49] <skunkworks_> ?
[21:54:52] <cradek> skunkworks_: cool - can you keep that amp part? looks like several amps at +-10v
[21:55:13] <alex_joni> skunkworks_: http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/646
[21:55:29] <skunkworks_> cradek: sadly - we had thrown them out...
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[21:56:13] <cradek> oh noooooo
[21:56:13] <skunkworks_> heh
[21:56:26] <cradek> darnit
[21:56:35] <skunkworks_> ;) - so - we like re-inventing the wheel.
[21:57:04] <cradek> you don't have six spare machines just like this?
[21:57:14] <alex_joni> haha
[21:57:24] <skunkworks_> we have 2 - but all but one was scrapped.
[21:57:34] <skunkworks_> did that make sense? ;)
[21:57:49] <alex_joni> we're used to you by now, don't feel bad
[21:57:55] <alex_joni> :P
[21:58:24] <cradek> wonder what DIR COIL is
[22:01:02] <skunkworks_> dir coil?
[22:01:33] <cradek> contacts between amp and valve, NC shorting the output (?)
[22:01:58] <skunkworks_> ah - I see
[22:02:18] <skunkworks_> I bet estop maybe?
[22:02:27] <cradek> yeah maybe so
[22:02:31] <skunkworks_> some sort of safety coil
[22:02:43] <skunkworks_> it makes sense that it is n/c
[22:03:01] <cradek> right
[22:03:41] <skunkworks_> the valve is actually 4 coils hooked in parallel - wonder if you could hook them in series for higher voltage and more sensitivity
[22:04:30] <skunkworks_> *2 sets of coils hooked in parallel
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[23:32:51] <Jymmm> Anyone enjoy chess?
[23:33:10] <jdhNC> no, I find it quite frustrating
[23:33:19] <Jymmm> LOL
[23:33:31] <Jymmm> Patience Grasshoper
[23:34:01] <Jymmm> jdhNC: What do you think of GO then?
[23:34:32] <jdhNC> never really played
[23:34:38] <Jymmm> ah
[23:35:19] <Jymmm> I was just looking for ideas for a themed chessboard
[23:35:24] <Jymmm> on granite
[23:35:51] <jdhNC> back in college, when I used to partake in things of a less than legal nature, I would play chess and we played go for a brief time.
[23:36:20] <Jymmm> Maybe I could do something like this and overlay the scene... http://www.victorianweb.org/art/illustration/tenniel/lookingglass/2.3.jpg
[23:36:38] <Jymmm> how in the hell do you play chess stoned?!
[23:36:56] <Jymmm> well, I guess you don't actually.
[23:37:04] <jdhNC> sure you do, just not so well.
[23:37:10] <jdhNC> but, you think it is
[23:37:16] <Jymmm> lol
[23:37:27] <Jymmm> chess with a checkers mentality, huh?
[23:37:41] <jdhNC> no, as I recall, it took a realllly long time to play
[23:37:47] <Jymmm> Oh I bet
[23:38:33] <Jymmm> I like that tree scene a lot. I think I have some line art like that already.
[23:38:39] <jdhNC> we wrote a lot of code on a TRS80 model I also
[23:38:59] <Jymmm> Oh, like that took effort. <rolls eyes>
[23:39:10] <Jymmm> too it longer to rewind
[23:39:14] <Jymmm> took
[23:40:32] <Jymmm> plowed fields might give the field some character
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