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[01:13:51] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: The end of that article says it's just a myth (spider deterant)
[01:25:08] <pcw_home> and a myth is as good as a mile
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[01:31:41] <Thomaxo__> here's the dragknife toolpath i've managed to generate
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ept8e2dph5twjz8/Screenshot%202015-10-18%2003.31.28.png?dl=0
[01:31:52] <Thomaxo__> what do you think?
[01:39:46] <Jymmm> SpeedEvil:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-LFPSd_KH8A
[01:40:32] * SpeedEvil is mostly asleep
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[01:52:44] <CP-KG7AMV> Ahhh good good gun show this weekend one more day.
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[02:28:08] <fenn> Thomaxo__: how did you generate that toolpath?
[02:28:39] <Thomaxo__> if you're interested i guess it's good? :)
[02:29:09] <fenn> my roomate is interested in cutting cardboard with drag knives
[02:29:15] <Thomaxo__> i see
[02:29:20] <Thomaxo__> our interest align
[02:29:25] <Thomaxo__> is he an architecture student?
[02:29:29] <fenn> no
[02:29:41] <Thomaxo__> ah well, you guys use rhino?
[02:29:46] <fenn> wants to make furniture out of cardboard
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[02:30:13] <fenn> i am also interested in cutting corrugated plastic to make a catmaran
[02:30:24] <fenn> but that doesn't really require any dragging
[02:32:24] <Thomaxo__> i posted it here
http://discourse.mcneel.com/t/drag-knife-toolpath-generation/25779/4
[02:32:51] <Thomaxo__> its not exactly a toolpath but you could export it to dxf and such
[02:34:34] <Thomaxo__> its a monologue, i know :P
[02:35:22] <fenn> instead of an IF statement you could just put a tiny radius at each corner
[02:35:38] <Thomaxo__> yep
[02:35:45] <Thomaxo__> done that in the last reply to myself
[02:35:47] <Thomaxo__> heheh :D
[02:36:37] <Thomaxo__> still generates a mess of data though
[02:36:40] <fenn> the diagrams themselves look pretty cool
[02:37:13] <fenn> so, does it work?
[02:37:18] <Thomaxo__> not sure
[02:37:26] <Thomaxo__> i kinda completed it an hour ago
[02:37:37] <Thomaxo__> i'll try tomorrow
[02:37:48] <Thomaxo__> but, in theory, it should work
[02:38:16] <Thomaxo__> all that's left to do is to lift the toolpath a little bit (where the circlesegments are)
[02:38:33] <Thomaxo__> and to clean up the mess of data
[02:39:08] <Thomaxo__> if tangent previous point == tangent current point then remove previous point, something like that
[02:39:31] <Thomaxo__> not sure if it works on windows, but it should
[02:40:21] <Wolf_Mill> http://www.ebay.com/itm/271974407226 looks like a winner for a spindle light
[02:41:18] <fenn> yellow and blue for that special shine
[02:41:42] <Wolf_Mill> its cold white light output
[02:41:50] <fenn> no imagination
[02:41:50] <Wolf_Mill> have them on the desk here
[02:41:51] <jdh> I bought one of those 2 or 3 years ago and it's been sitting here ever since.
[02:42:38] <fenn> since they come in various sizes you can stack them concentrically for differet color balance
[02:43:18] <Wolf_Mill> hmm i didnt think of that
[02:43:35] <fenn> no red though
[02:43:39] <Wolf_Mill> i did get a few sizes to nest up
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[03:00:44] <Tom_itx> Jymmm, could be but i've found it works on some things
[03:01:07] <Jymmm> spiders?
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[03:02:50] <Tom_itx> well, that and crickets etc
[03:03:00] <Jymmm> nice
[03:03:05] <Jymmm> black widows?
[03:03:09] <Tom_itx> dunno
[03:03:19] <Jymmm> lol, gee thanks =)
[03:03:22] <Tom_itx> we mostly have brown recluse around here
[03:03:29] <Jymmm> ah ok
[03:03:37] <Tom_itx> not too many black widows
[03:04:10] <Tom_itx> get a few hedge apples and test it before you decide to grow a whole orchard full
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[03:04:27] <Jymmm> true
[03:04:46] <Tom_itx> the trees probably aren't that costly though
[03:06:11] <Wolf_Mill> love ebay sellers some times, order 10 bearings, 1st in the sleeve is correct (5mmx16x5) other 9 are 4mm bore
[03:09:41] <Wolf_Mill> least they were quick to reply
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[03:16:21] <Wolf_Mill> shiny..
http://i.imgur.com/ZvN0qkt.jpg
[03:17:18] <Tom_itx> new ring light?
[03:17:36] <Wolf_Mill> yup, $11 for 2
[03:17:44] <Tom_itx> led?
[03:17:50] <Wolf_Mill> cob led
[03:17:54] <Tom_itx> put a shroud around it
[03:18:17] <fenn> use a stove burner grease catcher as parabolic reflector
[03:18:19] <Tom_itx> i made one for my scope
[03:18:35] <Tom_itx> with a pot for brightness
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[03:20:14] <Wolf_Mill> yeah, I'll probably do a shroud the lazy way, 3d print one
[03:21:14] <Wolf_Mill> local auction scores were good today for shop stuff
http://i.imgur.com/NAFbTHP.jpg
[03:22:26] <Wolf_Mill> 1 ton electric chain fall
[03:24:26] <Tom_itx> what mill is that?
[03:24:50] <Wolf_Mill> which pic?
[03:24:57] <Tom_itx> leds
[03:26:01] <Wolf_Mill> super x1 base + x2 head + LMS hightorque spindle and solid column
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[03:33:25] <Wolf_Mill> same thing I have been working on putting together for a few weeks now lol
http://i.imgur.com/cbTjU5A.jpg
[03:34:02] <Tom_itx> did you get the spindle motor working?
[03:34:11] <Tom_itx> the sewing machine one
[03:34:17] <Tom_itx> i see it's mounted
[03:34:32] <Wolf_Mill> well, they sent me a diffrent control board then what it had in it
[03:34:41] <Wolf_Mill> waiting to hear back from them on that
[03:35:02] <Tom_itx> you should have asked them if they had one that did reverse
[03:35:02] <Wolf_Mill> in the mean time I was thinking of trying to use a BE25A20 to run it
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[03:37:50] <fenn> for a direct drive lead screw can i just use a pair of thrust ball bearings on one end and a bushing between them to handle the radial load?
[03:38:17] <Tom_itx> that's what my sherline does
[03:38:27] <Tom_itx> i had to fix my z though
[03:38:35] <Tom_itx> it was rubbing from the get go
[03:38:38] <Tom_itx> poor design
[03:39:06] <fenn> if i skip the bushing can i use a solid coupler to the motor shaft? since it already has a radial bearing built in
[03:39:32] <Tom_itx> i wouldn't want to rely on the motor bearings personally
[03:39:47] <Tom_itx> mine does have a solid coupler though
[03:39:57] <fenn> it just seems silly to constrain something and then introduce a flexible coupler to un-constrain it again
[03:40:49] <Tom_itx> i think it would put undue side load on the bearings without a thrust bearing
[03:41:11] <fenn> you mean radial bearing?
[03:41:29] <Tom_itx> yeah
[03:42:29] <Wolf_Mill> http://i.imgur.com/NdXBYOT.jpg like that?
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[03:43:01] <Tom_itx> more or less yes
[03:43:14] <fenn> minus the needle bearing
[03:43:50] <Tom_itx> well the needles keep the shaft centered so it would also help support it over the motor bearings
[03:44:01] <Tom_itx> but the shaft would float in them
[03:44:54] <Wolf_Mill> only reason for the couplers are to take up any mis-alignment
[03:45:22] <fenn> but there can't be misalignment in the first place without a radial bearing to align the screw
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[03:55:43] <Wolf_Mill> i remember someone asking about the stacks in those walmart steppers
http://i.imgur.com/VogeASe.jpg http://i.imgur.com/2bHc5Ip.jpg
[03:56:31] <fenn> what are "stacks"?
[03:56:46] <Wolf_Mill> no idea
[03:57:12] <fenn> just so you know it's possible to permanently damage some stepper rotors simply by removing them from the housing
[03:57:32] <fenn> they will have less torque because the magnets demagnetize
[03:58:47] <Wolf_Mill> good thing I picked the one with damaged wires then
[04:00:14] <fenn> i think you're supposed to slide the rotor out into a ferrous pipe of similar inner diameter to conduct the magnetic field around
[04:00:29] <fenn> or another motor housing
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[04:03:36] <Wolf_Mill> neat to know
[04:05:32] <Tom_itx> triple stack
[04:11:36] <Tom_itx> i should have gotten some of those
[04:11:53] <Tom_itx> didn't really have a need though
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[04:58:59] <XXCoder> omg i'm home
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[05:06:21] <XXCoder> Wolf_Mill: whats up
[05:08:52] <Wolf_Mill> tired...
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[05:10:25] <XXCoder> lol ok
[05:10:33] <XXCoder> just got home from hours drive
[05:10:38] <XXCoder> been busy at event for hours
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[06:02:13] <Jymmm> XXCoder: Weekend jail is NOT an "event"
[06:02:53] <ganzuul> lol
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[08:29:57] <Deejay> moin
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[08:41:32] <Sync> zeeshan: that is why people throwdown steel plates
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[09:16:16] <Mac-phone> mornin
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[09:34:47] <Mac-phone> anyone making anything today?
[09:47:24] <archivist> a fire
[09:48:41] <archivist> had a rubbish pile, was getting too large
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[09:56:09] <Mac-phone> fair enough. I'm trying to get motivation
[09:56:44] <Mac-phone> to go out in the cold garage and work before church...
[09:57:07] <archivist> I am on a tidy to make space so I can do things
[09:57:49] <Mac-phone> do you have a dedicated shop or an enhanced attached garage
[09:58:28] <archivist> garage in poor condition, some in a bedroom, some in the kitchen
[09:58:42] <archivist> electronics in the lounge
[09:59:00] <Jymmm> Dont ask what he has in the bathroom
[09:59:05] <Mac-phone> ha-ha. ultimate man cave hub?
[09:59:29] <Mac-phone> solvent tank in the tub?
[10:00:09] <archivist> ultrasonic tanks are in the kitchen
[10:00:27] <Mac-phone> someday I want to visit
[10:03:37] <Mac-phone> you guys have any suggestions on injection machines?
[10:04:05] <Mac-phone> the prices seem to range on used equip a bit
[10:04:56] <archivist> inject what, drugs, plastic, aluminium
[10:06:10] <Mac-phone> plastic for interior auto knobs
[10:06:55] <archivist> mass production or small qty
[10:07:52] <archivist> mass production means more items per shot, bigger machine
[10:08:06] <Mac-phone> the estimate is 20 knobs per vehicle and 250 set minimum
[10:08:37] <archivist> the die cost at 250 is a killer
[10:09:10] <Mac-phone> yeah. hoping to put 5-10 per die
[10:09:31] <Mac-phone> different knobs
[10:09:57] <archivist> a set with all 20 in one shot
[10:10:15] <Mac-phone> that would be sweet.
[10:10:21] <archivist> colour match is better
[10:10:36] <Mac-phone> yes all are black
[10:10:53] <Mac-phone> with white symbols
[10:11:25] <archivist> printed symbols or moulded in
[10:12:33] <Mac-phone> original were printed in the cavity
[10:13:15] <archivist> best would be search for the original moulds
[10:14:51] <Mac-phone> http://redlinelandcruisers.com/product-category/interior/billet-knobs/
[10:15:14] <Mac-phone> those are machined versions, but you can get the idea
[10:15:43] <archivist> rofl Warning: Division by zero in /home/redlinel/public_html/wp-content/plugins/woocommerce/templates/content-product.php on line 38
[10:16:09] <Mac-phone> perhaps subing out the injection part out would be better?
[10:16:29] <Mac-phone> I want to do the molds on my cnc
[10:17:46] <archivist> yes but talk to a local injection place, there is some art to the moulding process
[10:18:55] <Mac-phone> OK. the cnc programming instructor is a retired mold maker and hoping to get some mentoring after the semester
[10:20:21] <archivist> ok he will have some of the clue you need, but do get the cost profit and loss calculations before you start
[10:20:43] <Mac-phone> ok
[10:21:13] <archivist> the start up cost is high for plastics
[10:22:00] <Mac-phone> do you mean start up as equipment or as in molds?
[10:22:17] <archivist> moulds and equipment
[10:23:36] <Mac-phone> everything I see on the equipment side is 3phase 240v or more. was hoping for something that could run in the garage
[10:23:58] <Mac-phone> no 3phase
[10:23:59] <archivist> there are small prototype presses
[10:24:29] <Mac-phone> ahhh. any brands you care to share?
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[10:26:19] <Mac-phone> hey malcom. gm.
[10:27:37] <archivist> might get one in a garage
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Plastic-Injection-Moulding-Machine-ARBURG-All-Rounder-50-Ton-Year-1989-/271953458357
[10:30:10] <archivist> this google image search works over here plastic prototype moulding machine bench
[10:30:24] <archivist> change speeeeeling to suit
[10:30:34] <Mac-phone> that one looks good
[10:32:26] <Mac-phone> http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&id=231715127123&alt=web
[10:34:38] <Mac-phone> that one is like 250 miles from here
[10:38:03] <malcom2073_> Morning Mac-phone :)
[10:38:49] <malcom2073_> Forklift loading is free, nice!
[10:39:07] <archivist> trucking not so free
[10:39:19] <malcom2073_> Eh, this is *murca. Everyone has a pickup truck
[10:39:55] <malcom2073_> That could easily fit on my trailer
[10:40:34] <Mac-phone> oil patch rig?
[10:41:33] <Mac-phone> a better way to put that may be access to a truck
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[10:42:43] <Mac-phone> at the farm we got a double axel trailer and a truck.
[10:43:44] <malcom2073_> But is that trailer good for highway speeds?
[10:43:51] <archivist> homebrew machine
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8McsSZ3O-gM
[10:44:39] <Mac-phone> hah. we pulled a ford 8n to Cali from Arkansas. but it was kinda pushing the limits
[10:44:52] <malcom2073_> Heh
[10:44:55] <malcom2073_> Silicone is easier than plastic
[10:46:57] <Mac-phone> archivist that goes back to a conversation Malcom and I had about covering a 50 ton bearing press
[10:47:15] <Mac-phone> less ratcheting
[10:50:27] <Mac-phone> malcom2073_ you get your plate tapped and mounted?
[10:50:41] <malcom2073_> Nope, got two of the holes done and then had family stuff
[10:51:38] <Mac-phone> dang family holding up progress :)
[10:54:25] <fenn> Mac-phone: check out vince gingery's book for the super hacky method
[10:55:06] <fenn> but for those "billet knobs" might as well just machine them from a bar of delrin
[10:55:48] <fenn> or whatever autophile material people want
[10:56:27] <Mac-phone> good idea.
[10:57:35] <fenn> this gives you a general idea what's in the gingery book:
http://rick.sparber.org/Articles/gpi.pdf
[10:58:06] <Mac-phone> like late a blank knob then use fixtures for the faces?
[10:58:23] <Mac-phone> late = lathe
[10:58:25] <fenn> well i don't know what equipment you have available
[10:58:36] <fenn> but that would work
[10:59:03] <fenn> then you get to do walnut burls and all that craziness
[10:59:29] <Mac-phone> only a mill. but trying to brainstorm equipment and process ideas
[11:00:48] <Mac-phone> a subplate for this small table could handle 50 knobs
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[11:02:28] <Mac-phone> thanks for the PDF fenn
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[11:13:27] <archivist> a lathe can produce a better finish, also easier to polish on
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[11:39:36] <Mac-phone> the wiki article on plastic injection moulding w good start
[11:39:57] <Mac-phone> was a*
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[11:45:23] <JT-Tn> Morning
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[12:59:03] <JT-Tn> It's 30f this morning at Wears Valley
[12:59:44] <malcom2073_> Nice
[13:00:04] <JT-Tn> Sunny
[13:00:37] <JT-Tn> We rode 225 miles in the mountains yesterday
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[14:50:34] <enleth> Is about 0.005mm of runout acceptable for spindle bearings?
[14:51:49] <enleth> That looks like the ABEC 3 rating limit
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[14:55:31] <LatheBuilder2> Good morning
[14:55:56] <LatheBuilder2> building an encoder for g333.1 moves
[14:56:01] <LatheBuilder2> g33.1 rather
[14:57:03] <LatheBuilder2> do spindle synchronized moves look at index any time other than the beginning of the cycle?
[14:57:11] <archivist> enleth, that is better than the schlesinger limit in testing machine tools 8th ed
[14:57:57] <enleth> interesting.
[14:58:25] <archivist> nearest to spindle nose .01mm
[14:59:48] <archivist> 8th ed was 1978
[15:01:14] <archivist> enleth, a taper test bar, .02 at 300mm from nose
[15:02:31] <enleth> of course there could be something wrong with the way I'm measuring it
[15:04:13] <archivist> for a used machine sounds reasonable though
[15:05:58] <CaptHindsight> using the logic in public schools those old books on machine design are obsolete :)
[15:06:46] <CaptHindsight> they probably use old math and old history
[15:06:46] <archivist> there is a huge amount the schools are forgetting
[15:06:49] <enleth> this is what I'm doing right now:
http://i.imgur.com/Tnqhbmx.jpg
[15:07:30] <LatheBuilder2> some of my favorite books are old ones full of first principles rather than
[15:07:31] <enleth> runout seems to be the same on both bearings
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[15:07:59] <LatheBuilder2> basic training distilled from first principles
[15:08:33] <enleth> and yet I've got a noticeable wobble on the ISO taper
[15:08:39] <archivist> enleth, I am quoting the mounted figure
[15:09:23] <archivist> mount bearings on v blocks them measure the nose
[15:09:32] <Wolf_> in that pic I think you are only measuring the run out of the balls and the outer race
[15:09:43] <LatheBuilder2> enleth is that a 30 taper?
[15:10:01] <LatheBuilder2> (sorry missed most of the conversation, joining late)
[15:10:40] <enleth> Wolf_: the bearings are preloaded even out of quill, so it seems to be meaningful, unless I'm forgetting something important
[15:10:47] <enleth> LatheBuilder2: yes
[15:11:27] <Wolf_> you have 2 more things that could be out of concentric that you arent measuring in that setup
[15:13:54] <enleth> problem #1 is no v blocks at hand, I have to buy or improvise
[15:15:51] <archivist> just some edges, 4, to drop onto
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[15:16:53] <LatheBuilder2> right, a pair of bars with flat bottom cuts would work. bearings rest on the 4 points
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[15:33:42] <enleth> the nose cap is a problem here, on a qc30 spindle it doesn't come off downwards
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[15:34:57] <enleth> note to self: when replacing bearings, make SURE the nose cap is on before pressing the first bearing on
[15:36:11] <enleth> anyways I did it the ghetto way for now, using the edges of a table t-slot as a very shitty v block
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[15:49:13] <enleth> putting it on something is not a problem
[15:49:21] <enleth> clamping it down is
[15:50:54] <archivist> should not need to clamp much if any as that will spring the bearings out of round
[15:51:25] <enleth> the problem is that the bearings are at the end of the spindle
[15:51:41] <enleth> the third one has a much lower OD
[15:52:11] <enleth> so with no clamping on the main bearings the spindle wants to rest at an angle
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[15:55:49] <enleth> I can support the third bearing with some shims, but that doesn't look like a good idea
[15:56:29] <archivist> or press back into the head :)
[15:58:51] <archivist> or what I did for a temp job, some hose clips
[15:59:45] <enleth> with the spindle supported at an angle, resting on upper main and top bearings, lower main bearing in the air, there is about 0.01mm of runout on the shaft just before the splines start, 27 and 11.5cm from the supported bearings, respectively. not sure how useful that measurement is
[16:00:51] <archivist> about the distance in the schlesinger diagram maybe
[16:01:35] <archivist> and .01 for an old spindle cant be too bad
[16:02:37] <archivist> that being a sum of the errors in the bearings and spindle
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[16:03:20] <archivist> and a lot better than my horizontal mill
[16:07:43] <t12> https://twitter.com/angealbertini/status/655684556092116992
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[16:10:27] <enleth> long story short this is what I did now
http://i.imgur.com/3sjPgiO.jpg
[16:11:39] <enleth> the indicator's protractor is riding along the front part of the taper about 3mm below the edge of the socket
[16:11:57] <enleth> I'm getting 0.03mm of runout there
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[16:12:54] <enleth> can't really get any deeper, no lever indicator around
[16:15:26] <archivist> may be better/different again when back into the head
[16:15:36] <enleth> yup
[16:16:13] <archivist> often when testing like that there are human induced extra errors
[16:17:39] <archivist> even a couple wood lumps carved into some form of v just so you can clamp better
[16:17:51] <enleth> the thing is, when the spindle is in the quill and running at a low speed, I can feel some wobnle just pressing the top of a fingernail into the wall of the taper about halfway in. not a very scientific test, but I shouldn't be able to feel any pressure changes that way
[16:18:04] <enleth> *wobble
[16:18:27] <archivist> but was that before you changed bearings
[16:18:43] <enleth> no, still the same bearings
[16:18:59] <enleth> so I'm still not sure what's wrong
[16:19:12] <enleth> just the taper maybe?
[16:19:37] <archivist> iirc you said it felt rough
[16:19:42] <enleth> ah
[16:19:49] <enleth> only the top bearing
[16:20:02] <archivist> so if the top inner is worn
[16:20:11] <archivist> it will wobble
[16:20:40] <enleth> you mean the bearing race on the spindle?
[16:21:41] <enleth> I did replace that bearing, it feelt rather snug on there. I did not touch the main bearings at all. wobble still there.
[16:21:42] <archivist> yes
[16:22:22] <archivist> also if it has ever had a crash the spindle may not be perfect
[16:23:09] <archivist> there are people who come to machines ad regrind the taper insitu
[16:23:44] <enleth> I am considering having it done
[16:24:20] <enleth> but as far as I understand, the head has to be trammed really well before this can be done
[16:24:36] <archivist> but if cnc, you could just do it yourself with a grinder on the table
[16:25:48] <enleth> what difference does it make if the machine is cnc?
[16:27:50] <archivist> you can take the taper path needed easily
[16:28:57] <enleth> if I understand correctly - not on this machine, it can only do one axis at a time
[16:30:50] <archivist> when you have put linuxcnc on it :)
[16:30:50] <enleth> about the way grinding is done on a manual, do they just use a cone-shaped grinding "wheel"?
[16:31:57] <archivist> or a taper path on a small machine mounted on your table
[16:32:33] <enleth> anyway, I still don't really know if the 0.3mm runout I'm getting at a mill shank is caused by busted taper, spindle or bearings, although the taper is probably the first thing to try fixing, being the cheapest to fix
[16:34:19] <enleth> it would suck to re-grind it just to realize that the spindle is shot anyway, but it would suck more to shell out $1000 for a new spindle and bearings when a taper grind would have done it
[16:35:11] <archivist> is the machine needed to be of a high quality or good enough
[16:36:06] <enleth> for now, good enough, but 0.3mm of runout is still far from that.
[16:39:38] <LatheBuilder2> enleth, is there any chance you have a minor burr or stuck chip in the socket?
[16:47:22] <enleth> waaaaaait a moment, something wacky is going on with the qc30 locknut
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[16:53:39] <enleth> there are those two thingies that grab and press onto the toolholder flange
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[16:54:34] <enleth> they are so horribly worn that the taper could be loose
[16:55:35] <archivist> the taper is normally part of the spindle not separate
[16:55:47] <enleth> I was able to loosen it up by hand with the nut tightened pretty hard, didn't notice it before because the alignment blocks acted as an improptu takeup
[16:56:12] <archivist> driving dogs?
[16:56:26] <enleth> archivist: I mean, the toolholder could be loose in the taper
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[16:56:55] <enleth> yeah, that's what they would have been called if they were meant for that
[16:57:09] <enleth> but they aren't, obviously
[16:57:12] <archivist> if any dirt /damage, tighten fully
[16:57:26] <enleth> so it kinda "worked"
[16:57:37] <archivist> the dogs are for driving not alignment
[16:58:01] <enleth> you sure? in a qc30 spindle?
[16:58:16] <archivist> the taper is the alignment
[16:59:39] <enleth> I was pretty convinced that they are there only to help align the holder before the locknut is tightened, at which point the taper provides both alignment and torque transfer
[17:01:04] <enleth> I removed them now because they got in the way of the indicator but I milled with both in place
[17:02:12] <enleth> and I'm sure now that they were the only thing keeping the holder from spinning in the taper because the locknut couldn't apply pressure properly
[17:03:46] <archivist> taper does torque transfer too, the dogs guarantee no taper damage where the torque rises above the usual grip
[17:04:23] <archivist> eg drive in a slabbing cut
[17:04:24] <zeeshan> i didnt read the entire conversation
[17:04:29] <zeeshan> but did you try removing the drive dogs
[17:04:33] <zeeshan> and just spinning the tool holder by hand?
[17:04:36] <archivist> he did
[17:04:53] <zeeshan> also if you take a prybar
[17:04:57] <zeeshan> wrap it in tape
[17:04:59] <zeeshan> or foil
[17:05:09] <zeeshan> if you can pry it with a regular 8" prybar
[17:05:26] <zeeshan> (wait is this hydraulic?)
[17:05:26] <zeeshan> :P
[17:05:30] * zeeshan reads
[17:05:30] <enleth> the locknut:
http://i.imgur.com/Aeq18uJ.jpg
[17:06:11] <zeeshan> archivist: do you to stargazing w/ a telescope?
[17:06:32] <enleth> note the lower "fingers" on the nut are so worn down that there's a step on them
[17:06:36] <archivist> zeeshan, not for a very long time
[17:06:42] <zeeshan> darjn
[17:06:45] <enleth> they just don't grab
[17:06:47] <archivist> why
[17:06:48] <zeeshan> i figured with all your precision stuff, youd be into it :P
[17:06:54] <zeeshan> im just getting into it
[17:07:01] <zeeshan> my gf got me a telescope for my bday last week
[17:07:11] <zeeshan> i tried to see stuf last night, failed :)
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[17:09:06] <enleth> time for a new locknut then. shit.
[17:09:26] <zeeshan> youre missing a bearing there dude :P
[17:10:04] <enleth> kennametal sells them but the price is a complete ass pull
[17:10:11] <enleth> zeeshan: what?
[17:11:02] <zeeshan> being silly
[17:11:46] <archivist> enleth, I cant see how the nut affects it
[17:12:40] <archivist> zeeshan, it needs cold clear nights!
[17:12:51] <archivist> I prefer warm
[17:12:53] <zeeshan> dude i was amazed
[17:13:01] <zeeshan> w/ how much stars i could pick up with the finders scope
[17:13:05] <enleth> archivist: well, it does. hard to explain in text form.
[17:13:05] <zeeshan> and not even see them with my eye,..
[17:14:54] <archivist> enleth, unless the nut is so worn it can lo longer pull the taper in tight
[17:15:01] <archivist> no longer
[17:15:14] <enleth> archivist: it is, that's the point
[17:16:17] <archivist> if you can rattle something after tightening, time to add shims, make new or buy new
[17:16:24] <enleth> archivist: there are two pairs of fingers extending inwards in the locknut, one that pushes the holder in by the flange and the other that pulls it out. the first pair is heavily worn
[17:16:38] <enleth> I can.
[17:17:59] <enleth> the pull-out fingers push hard against the spindle face before the pull-in fingers really engage the holder flange
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[17:21:10] <enleth> as a quick fix for a nut that needs replacing anyway, I could remove the pull-out fingers and get some more lifetime out of this nut, in exchange for holders getting stuck in the taper
[17:21:31] <enleth> not sure if that's a good deal
[17:22:16] <archivist> or grind the pull in so its thinner
[17:22:26] <archivist> pull out I mean
[17:23:29] <archivist> or machine the nut a little so more space for the pull out
[17:23:47] <enleth> also, the pull in fingers look replaceable
[17:24:40] <enleth> but to get the whole inner assembly out, I'd have to remove a retaining ring that clearly wasn't meant to be removed
[17:26:11] <enleth> actually I got it on the last photo - above the pull out finger a split in the ring can be seen, but nothimg to grab onto
[17:27:06] <enleth> it's just a split spring steel ring
[17:27:13] <archivist> I saw that
[17:27:42] <archivist> one of those near impossible things
[17:28:20] <enleth> the only way to remove it I can think of is to drill a hole fron the side to push one end in and grab it
[17:29:25] <archivist> I have a right angle head with an impossible ring, because it is so strong
http://www.collection.archivist.info/showresult.php?prog=1&srcprog=searchv13.php&srcdata=title&Type=PD&Accn_no=9023&subject=25811
[17:30:14] <enleth> yours looks removeable
[17:30:31] <enleth> there are eylets for a circlip remover
[17:30:38] <enleth> *eyelets
[17:31:25] <archivist> I just cannot get enough force on it, it jumps off and back in the groove
[17:32:30] <enleth> ah.
[17:35:19] <enleth> at least you could try
[17:35:56] <enleth> with mine, I don't even know how they assembled that
[17:36:52] <enleth> holy shit, a new locknutvis over $250
[17:37:11] <enleth> gotta find a used one
[17:37:36] <enleth> and hope it's in a better condition
[17:38:04] <archivist> care with a dremel grind the ring so it can be broken, make a new
[17:39:09] <enleth> a normal circlip could be fitted there if the dimensions are anywhere close to some retail size
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[17:52:52] <enleth> small success - I was able to pry the ring out of there with a pair of flat screwdrivers
[17:53:14] <enleth> wasn't in very tight, just hard to get at
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[18:05:12] <enleth> holy crap, the inner assembly is almost cracked in half
[18:06:08] <archivist> had some use then
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[18:08:06] <enleth> the worst thing is, I can't buy it outside a $260 set
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[18:41:34] <enleth> in fact $200 more gets me a spare spindle with a lock nut
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[19:05:24] <enleth> they used to be $110, now the cheapest out there is $230
[19:06:16] <zeeshan> whats they
[19:06:17] <zeeshan> :P
[19:06:23] <Tom_itx> zeeshan get yourself a star chart now
[19:06:34] <zeeshan> Tom_itx: not looking for something specific yet
[19:06:37] <zeeshan> just point and shooting
[19:06:46] <enleth> zeeshan: QC30 locknuts for a bridgeport
[19:06:50] <zeeshan> ah
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[19:06:52] <Tom_itx> does it track?
[19:07:04] <zeeshan> no
[19:07:05] <zeeshan> its manual
[19:07:10] <Tom_itx> you need to be level and at your longitude
[19:07:14] <zeeshan> why
[19:07:17] <zeeshan> im pointing and shooting
[19:07:21] <zeeshan> finding something with my eyes
[19:07:22] <Tom_itx> to follow a star
[19:07:25] <zeeshan> pointing with finders scope
[19:07:33] <zeeshan> and trying to zoom in w/ the big scope
[19:07:38] <zeeshan> but it still looks like a small star :P
[19:07:44] <Tom_itx> heh it will
[19:07:55] <Tom_itx> look at the moon
[19:08:02] <Tom_itx> you can find some planets too
[19:08:08] <zeeshan> i need to find staturn!
[19:08:22] <Tom_itx> i've seen it a few times
[19:09:09] <Tom_itx> mine's all packed away in the closet now
[19:09:12] <zeeshan> im trying to find a red flashlight..
[19:09:14] <zeeshan> why
[19:09:34] <Tom_itx> too light in town and never seem to go where things are visible
[19:09:44] <Tom_itx> in fact the local observatory finally closed
[19:09:56] <Tom_itx> i think partially because it was getting too light there
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[19:10:05] <Tom_itx> that and funding
[19:10:48] <Tom_itx> http://www.telescopes.com/products/celestron-nexstar-8-se-telescope?utm_medium=cpc&utm_source=googlepla&variant=1962183620&gclid=CKGIx8XczMgCFZWHaQodaNkL9Q
[19:10:53] <Tom_itx> mine is similar but older
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[19:11:18] <zeeshan> mine is a basic
[19:11:19] <zeeshan> 8"
[19:11:28] <Tom_itx> reflector?
[19:11:31] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/LI9zw5v.jpg
[19:11:31] <Tom_itx> probably..
[19:11:32] <zeeshan> ya
[19:11:57] <enleth> eh, making a new locknut insert from scratch would be far from trivial
[19:12:08] <Tom_itx> mine's got a star database so it's a bit easier to find stuff
[19:12:24] <zeeshan> i wanna try to find stuff manually
[19:16:32] <Jymmm> zeeshan: isn't that fround upon in at least 39 states?
[19:16:52] <zeeshan> huh
[19:17:03] <Jymmm> nm
[19:17:19] <Tom_itx> he's not in a state
[19:17:23] <Tom_itx> he's exempt
[19:17:31] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: state of confusion?
[19:17:49] <Tom_itx> dazed n confused
[19:18:15] <Jymmm> I prefer naked eye star gazing... Just outside of Sedona Arizona is pretty awesome!!!
[19:18:33] <Jymmm> no light pollution
[19:24:13] <Tom_itx> yeah this would be great there
[19:24:37] <Tom_itx> where we camped we could nearly always spot falling stars etc
[19:25:03] <Jymmm> Heh, out there I spotted 85 in an hour
[19:25:27] <Tom_itx> yeah during a 'shower' it was quite active
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[19:27:24] <Tom_itx> makes you wonder how many actually make it all the way down
[19:27:28] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: PERFECT SPOT - far enought from the hwy to avoid headlights
https://goo.gl/maps/aw479FQA4QA2
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[19:53:07] <alex_joni> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOIWy6MsXOs
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[20:19:38] <Tom_itx> alex_joni, i like watching those videos but it makes you wonder at what machine cost and is that cost worth it in production
[20:20:18] <Tom_itx> very cool though
[20:20:43] <CaptHindsight> much more affordable if DIY and a good bargain hunter
[20:21:13] <Tom_itx> DIY isn't gonna pay for the cam to run one
[20:21:24] <Tom_itx> most aren't brilliant enough to manually program that
[20:21:35] <CaptHindsight> yeah, that's a big hit for DIYers
[20:21:48] <Tom_itx> so back to my question.
[20:22:30] <Tom_itx> the software will cost as much as a DIY is willing to pay for a machine
[20:22:30] <CaptHindsight> DIY for business is what I was referring to vs hobby DIYers
[20:22:43] <Tom_itx> i know
[20:23:22] <Tom_itx> i think it's awesome what we can do with machines nowdays
[20:23:30] <CaptHindsight> then again Andy and Archivist would cobble it together just for fun
[20:23:37] <Tom_itx> true
[20:24:24] <Tom_itx> i wish these videos would show the pains they go thru setting up the part and tooling
[20:24:46] <CaptHindsight> I looked into the open CAM for 4+ axis a couple of years ago..
[20:25:48] <Tom_itx> Stuart's company was looking at this at one point:
http://www.nccs.com/
[20:25:55] <Tom_itx> dunno if they sprung for it or not
[20:25:56] <CaptHindsight> I was going to get some help writing it for a project but the end user of the project decided to use NX
[20:26:47] <CaptHindsight> their thinking that since they already use NX and have experience with it they didn't want to have to learn Heeks for 5 axis or similar
[20:29:01] <t12> today from the fleamarket:
https://www.dropbox.com/sc/h2aelqmkahui3jh/AACw4GVypqjxjLm0L5hQgWQWa
[20:29:06] <t12> doppler radar frontend!
[20:30:13] <CaptHindsight> t12: going to make a giant speed gun?
[20:30:20] <t12> Doppler Radar; manufactured by Teledyne Ryan; used in UH-2, SH-3, SH-34J, CH-53D, Z-1
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[20:31:01] <t12> i guess helicopter radar
[20:31:26] <CaptHindsight> just don't roast your eyes out
[20:32:01] <t12> i will try and avoid that
[20:32:41] <CaptHindsight> "I don't see any microwaves, are you sure it's on"
[20:33:32] <CaptHindsight> a question I was once asked by someone next to a 10m uplink antenna
[20:34:16] <CaptHindsight> then he placed his hands on the dish and said " it doesn't feel warm"
[20:34:33] <t12> i've heard of people heating their lunch in large radar dishes
[20:34:50] <t12> hard to find info on this one
[20:36:08] <CaptHindsight> Tom_itx: any idea what NCL costs?
[20:36:59] <Tom_itx> not at all
[20:37:02] <Tom_itx> KimK might
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[20:42:42] <Deejay> gn8
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[20:59:20] <JT-Tn> Pete we made it to Craw Daddies today. Good food for sure.
[21:01:13] <Loetmichel> hmm, can someone suggest a "lighter" browser for lubuntu 14.04? The up to date Firefox is a BIT heavy on this notebooks P2-366 ;-)
[21:01:38] <enleth> I measured spindle runout in situ with no toolholder. 0.01mm right at the mouth of the taper
[21:02:03] <enleth> so it was the locknut after all
[21:02:41] <enleth> and maybe the taper is due for a regrind
[21:03:30] <enleth> but there is hope that the spindle and bearings are fine after all
[21:04:18] <JT-Tn> Grandmother's kitchen and Geppettos in the valley are super goog
[21:04:48] <JT-Tn> Put a dowel in a tool holder and measure that
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[21:10:50] <JT-Mobile> Damn dumb phone.
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[21:17:13] <JT-Mobile> We saw all kind of wildlife this weekend, a heard of elk, bunches of turkeys and even a button head.
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[21:17:38] <JT-Mobile> Damn spellchecker butt head
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[21:34:21] <MacGalempsy> archivist: are you still up and around?
[21:38:18] <MacGalempsy> can anyone with PID tuning experience tell me how Kv and Kvff fit into the Linux CNC tuning?
[21:38:27] <XXCoder> t12: I recall a story where guy at some event commented that there was so many newsvans that if he threw up raw chicken it would come down cooked
[21:39:03] <XXCoder> Loetmichel: I know of couple but googling because forgot name
[21:40:06] <MacGalempsy> NM it is Feed forward
[21:40:56] <t12> fleamarket ruled today
[21:41:06] <t12> i'm ending up like oxtoolco here
[21:41:37] <XXCoder> ah pale moon, Loetmichel
[21:42:50] <t12> https://www.dropbox.com/sc/3u4r070fe3f0zsv/AAACEDdNRX61l6MZXa6NJSzka
[21:53:46] <MacGalempsy> is that a little servo motor above the button?
[21:54:17] <t12> motor tachometer gen
[21:54:28] <MacGalempsy> cool find
[21:54:47] <t12> i never quite understand these old mil motors
[21:54:51] <t12> lots of obscure 3phase things
[21:54:54] <t12> insturmentation things
[21:55:06] <t12> they tend to be a few bucks
[21:55:12] <MacGalempsy> which fleamarket you hit? san jose or oakland?
[21:55:17] <t12> old airplane insturmentation is full of it
[21:55:21] <t12> alamaney, sf
[21:55:36] <t12> theres one dude who always has mil stuff, i think he does san jose and the ham too
[21:55:41] <MacGalempsy> ah. I use to like going to Denios and Oakland
[21:56:02] <MacGalempsy> the ones down in modesto always had good tools
[21:58:36] <Roguish_> hey all. anyone familiar with TOUCHY gui?
[21:58:59] <Roguish_> when the heck are the 'touchy' pins created?
[22:01:19] <t12> are sheetmetal gauges and wire gauges the same?
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[22:17:13] <Roguish_> ok. got it. the file 'touchy.hal' does not need to be called in the HAL section of the .ini file. it just resides in the running directory. this is inconsistent. would be better to be called (maybe last?) in the HAL section. yes????
[22:19:39] <JT-Tn> Makes sense to me
[22:19:58] <JT-Tn> But Touchy is a bit weird
[22:20:06] <XXCoder> bad touch! no bad touch!
[22:20:19] <JT-Tn> lol
[22:20:23] <Roguish_> JT_shop is that you?
[22:20:31] <JT-Tn> Pete you here?
[22:20:46] <JT-Tn> Yes I'm in Pete's backyard
[22:21:16] <JT-Tn> Vacation with the wife
[22:22:32] <Roguish_> ok. well it took some time but I have a touchy config, including jog wheel, for my bridgeport. now need to add some probing. like edge finding and center finding.
[22:22:39] <Tom_itx> JT-Tn, good travel weather?
[22:23:28] <JT-Tn> Tom Yea a bit nippy but not bad
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[22:24:44] <JT-Tn> Roguish there are some ngcgui subroutines for probing
[22:25:06] <JT-Tn> Did you add ngcgui and gremlin?
[22:26:31] <JT-Tn> Tom the mountains were pretty cold yesterday we rode 225 miles in them
[22:27:08] <Tom_itx> saw that
[22:28:05] <Tom_itx> where are you near now?
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[22:34:26] <JT-Tn> We are in Wears Valley
[22:35:15] <JT-Tn> We head back to the barn tomorrow
[22:35:26] <zeeshan> t12 yes
[22:35:36] <zeeshan> for ferrous
[22:35:49] <zeeshan> er
[22:35:53] <zeeshan> for non ferous they are same
[22:35:55] <JT-Tn> Zeeeeeeeee
[22:35:58] <zeeshan> *just woke up
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[22:36:00] <zeeshan> JT!!
[22:36:01] <zeeshan> hows your trip
[22:36:03] <Tom_itx> just on the edge of the hills then
[22:36:08] <zeeshan> did you meet pete! :P
[22:36:18] <JT-Tn> We are having a blast
[22:36:23] <Tom_itx> zeeshan would you admit that?
[22:36:31] <Tom_itx> :)
[22:36:33] <JT-Tn> Yes I met Pete yesterday
[22:36:35] <zeeshan> hehe
[22:36:56] <zeeshan> what did you guys do
[22:37:13] <JT-Tn> Good to put a face with a nick
[22:37:34] <Sync> hmm, just looking at those segment welded exhausts, is there a way to calculate them?
[22:37:47] <zeeshan> sync those pie cut exhausts?
[22:37:56] <JT-Tn> Just a quick chat then we rode 225 miles of mountain roads
[22:38:14] <zeeshan> thats a lot of riding mate
[22:38:15] <zeeshan> :P
[22:38:24] <zeeshan> your legs must be beast
[22:38:35] <JT-Tn> Yea we got back kind of late
[22:38:53] <JT-Tn> My legs are tough
[22:39:34] <Sync> yeah zeeshan
[22:39:50] <zeeshan> dont do it :P
[22:40:41] <Sync> why not?
[22:40:59] <zeeshan> bad air flow :P
[22:40:59] <Sync> the shape I want is annoying to bend
[22:41:06] <Sync> nah
[22:41:10] <zeeshan> grab a donut
[22:41:14] <zeeshan> its super tight bend
[22:41:25] <Sync> I can hammer the welds flat on an anvil
[22:41:40] <Sync> it is a compound curve in 2 axis
[22:44:19] <Sync> and my mandrel bender guy said, that he doesn't really want to have to do it
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[22:45:24] <Sync> and it is .9 or 1mm inconel tubing
[22:45:32] <JT-Tn> Can you induction heat bend it?
[22:45:35] <Sync> so I can actually hammer it nice and smooth
[22:45:43] <Sync> it will kink
[22:48:26] <zeeshan> pie cuts it is :P
[22:50:28] <Sync> yep
[22:50:30] <Sync> as I said :D
[22:51:07] <andypugh> Sync: Have you seen the technique where you hydraulically inflate a pipe to the right shape then cut and twist?
[22:51:49] <Sync> yeah I thought about making a die and then hydroform them
[22:52:05] <Sync> but I think for test and development welding them is more cost effective
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[22:53:52] <andypugh> You don’t need a die.
[22:54:25] <Sync> yeah I can weld the shape and then hydroform
[22:54:32] <Sync> but that's not really working here
[22:55:19] <andypugh> Not the best example, but shows the idea. Some people do this professionally:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ppXRMTeR2NQ
[22:55:58] <andypugh> So, you inflate a flat version, then weld in the teist.
[22:56:02] <andypugh> (twist)
[22:56:49] <zeeshan> no safety glasses
[22:56:50] <zeeshan> nice
[22:56:57] <Sync> yeah, I thought about that
[22:57:07] <andypugh> With water there isn’t very much risk.
[22:57:15] <Sync> but I think my pipes don't really are suited for that
[22:57:25] <Sync> as I want them round and relatively small
[22:57:34] <Sync> I'll have to fiddle with the pie cuts
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[22:58:09] <zeeshan> do you have a cad software
[22:58:11] <zeeshan> w/ sheet metal
[22:59:02] <zeeshan> if its truly a messed up a shape you cant do with regular tube that you pie cut
[22:59:08] <zeeshan> then that is the way to go
[22:59:32] <SpeedEvil> 3d print.
[22:59:47] <Sync> yeah but I want to avoid having to bend all the pies
[22:59:52] <zeeshan> you'll draw your shape and have a 3d version, then make a split line, then choose the number segments you want
[22:59:55] <zeeshan> then you can slip roll it
[23:00:02] <zeeshan> and weld em together
[23:00:04] <zeeshan> no need to hammer
[23:00:10] <zeeshan> tig em
[23:00:17] <Sync> I'll need to hammer the insides
[23:00:25] <Sync> even when tigging
[23:00:25] <zeeshan> why
[23:00:30] <zeeshan> youd weld the shape you want
[23:00:33] <Sync> yes
[23:00:39] <Sync> but I need to smooth the weld
[23:00:41] <zeeshan> and you would want to fusion weld it
[23:00:43] <zeeshan> so its smooth
[23:00:46] <zeeshan> while back purging
[23:01:09] <zeeshan> ive never tried fusion welding inconel..
[23:01:10] <SpeedEvil> zeeshan: I was pondering CNC english-wheel
[23:01:12] <zeeshan> so :p
[23:01:17] <Sync> that's for sure, but the first one flowed better when I redid the same shape and hammered it
[23:01:31] <Sync> so, eh
[23:01:44] <zeeshan> inconel is death for all tools
[23:01:49] <zeeshan> so i havent played with it
[23:02:12] <XXCoder> zeeshan: it is definitely mean to tools
[23:02:23] <zeeshan> SpeedEvil: that'd be interesting
[23:02:26] <XXCoder> I usually replace engraver tool each 30 parts
[23:02:31] <zeeshan> you guys do realize
[23:02:36] <Wolf_> just 3d print it
[23:02:37] <zeeshan> all your problems would be solved if you were superman right?
[23:02:44] <Sync> LAZORWELD
[23:02:52] <XXCoder> compared to alum ones (similiar task, engrave) I can do over 500 one tool
[23:02:52] <zeeshan> you'd pick up a sheet metal piece and just bend it to shape with your hands :P
[23:03:08] <XXCoder> superman is powerful but not precise.
[23:03:16] <XXCoder> his tol probaly is .1"
[23:03:20] <zeeshan> good enuf
[23:03:21] <zeeshan> :P
[23:03:24] <Sync> it is not really that bad zeeshan
[23:03:31] <Sync> I mean, it is shit
[23:03:36] <Sync> but I machined worse
[23:03:41] <XXCoder> like what?
[23:03:48] <zeeshan> ive never had a need to use it to be honest
[23:03:54] <XXCoder> though fiberglass is as mean on tools
[23:03:55] <zeeshan> ss321 works for most of the stuff i want
[23:04:02] <XXCoder> due to it literally sandpapering tools
[23:04:24] <zeeshan> XXCoder: you're sayuing you can do 500 in al
[23:04:26] <zeeshan> vs 1 in inconel
[23:04:30] <zeeshan> for the same engraving task?
[23:04:30] <XXCoder> 30
[23:04:36] <zeeshan> oh i misread
[23:04:45] <Sync> ss will be heavier
[23:04:47] <zeeshan> damn inconel :)
[23:04:57] <XXCoder> 500 is under actually I managed to do 1,000+ before. depends on luck and tool
[23:05:02] <zeeshan> Sync: most car apps it doesnt matter
[23:05:05] <zeeshan> they're not f1 :P
[23:05:13] <Sync> the final version will have progressively thinner pies
[23:05:15] <Sync> well
[23:05:22] <Sync> we need to get under the spec weight
[23:05:25] <XXCoder> incocel once a while lucky get tool tough enough to last 40
[23:05:31] <XXCoder> and sometimes it breaks at 20
[23:05:37] <Sync> so we can put DU plates on the underside
[23:06:25] <zeeshan> jesus
[23:06:33] <zeeshan> i did not know inconel had a lot of nickel
[23:06:36] <Sync> yep
[23:06:42] <zeeshan> wow i was always under the impression it was ferrous base
[23:06:48] <zeeshan> w/ just a shit load of chromium
[23:06:52] <Sync> no
[23:06:54] <zeeshan> no wonder it's so hard to machine
[23:06:56] <Sync> it basically is nickel
[23:06:56] <zeeshan> damn you nickel!
[23:07:30] <zeeshan> 150 ksi yield strength
[23:07:39] <XXCoder> isnt chromium really tough
[23:07:45] <Sync> well, they are not F1, but they are racing
[23:07:50] <Sync> so everything counts :P
[23:07:58] <zeeshan> Sync: its just my opinion man
[23:07:59] <XXCoder> I always wondered on composition. I suspected there was some tungsein in it. guess not
[23:08:01] <zeeshan> the extra 5lb you save
[23:08:05] <zeeshan> isn't worth all the hassle
[23:08:14] <zeeshan> but in some applications i can see it being helpful
[23:08:35] <XXCoder> with chromium it should resist MUCH corruption. same for nickel
[23:08:44] <XXCoder> so its pretty tough all around.
[23:08:55] <zeeshan> XXCoder: inconel is superior to stainless though
[23:09:00] <XXCoder> with thin coating of gold I bet it's so tough and long very long
[23:09:01] <zeeshan> in high temp environments
[23:09:05] <XXCoder> *last very long
[23:09:10] <zeeshan> it doesnt creep
[23:09:31] <zeeshan> and its yield at that temp is also much higher
[23:09:41] <XXCoder> interesting. high temp it wouldnt need any thin gold coating as it would melt off lol
[23:09:48] <zeeshan> basically when you work out all the math it comes down to: .0625" stainless steel
[23:09:49] <zeeshan> or
[23:09:53] <zeeshan> .03125" inconel
[23:10:20] <XXCoder> guess it means less weight overall at end, even when inonel is heavier overall
[23:10:21] <Sync> zeeshan: well, we are about as quick as our competition, but some of the drivers suck so we need to get more performance out of the car
[23:10:27] <zeeshan> XXCoder: yep
[23:10:45] <Sync> and lowerering the CG will give us an advantage over them because they are currently too lazy to do it
[23:11:01] <zeeshan> Sync: yea you're competing
[23:11:03] <zeeshan> every bit counts
[23:11:11] <zeeshan> especially if you've optimized weight everywhere else
[23:11:26] <Sync> well, not everywhere
[23:11:40] <Sync> but I have a good contact to get inconel tubing
[23:11:40] <zeeshan> like if someone really wants to drop 5lb from the car
[23:11:49] <zeeshan> you can do that for about a $100lb
[23:11:49] <zeeshan> er
[23:11:52] <zeeshan> $100
[23:12:01] <zeeshan> by using aluminum fasteners in locations
[23:12:01] <XXCoder> airplanes it does make sense
[23:12:11] <XXCoder> 1 lb means fuel savings. and lighter plane
[23:12:20] <XXCoder> one plane needs quite a lot of endcaps
[23:12:25] <XXCoder> for example
[23:12:28] <Sync> well, another guy is making carbon body panels
[23:12:38] <Sync> that will save some over the glassfiber ones
[23:12:54] <zeeshan> you need to ask your driver to go on a diet too
[23:12:56] <zeeshan> that'll easily drop 5lb
[23:12:57] <zeeshan> :-)
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[23:13:20] <XXCoder> lol I guess endcaps save around .1 pound each. and one plane needs hundreds
[23:13:31] <XXCoder> as well as more of different types
[23:13:31] <Sync> well, it is still amateur racing, so that's pretty hard to ask :D
[23:14:23] <XXCoder> first thing, take that chair out
[23:14:30] <XXCoder> replace it with superlight chair
[23:14:37] <Tom_itx> Sync get new drivers?
[23:14:38] <Sync> although next year I'll probably get to make my double wishbone suspension
[23:14:40] <XXCoder> easy weight savings lol
[23:15:42] <Sync> we are already running carbon seats
[23:15:48] <Sync> 4.5kg
[23:16:06] <zeeshan> don't eat a 5lb steak
[23:16:08] <zeeshan> before the race!
[23:16:08] <zeeshan> :D
[23:16:28] <zeeshan> man i have a lot of shit to move in the garage
[23:16:30] <zeeshan> in 4 grs.
[23:16:32] <zeeshan> *hrs
[23:16:40] <SpeedEvil> zeeshan: >10000lb?
[23:16:45] <zeeshan> no
[23:16:48] <zeeshan> much less thank god
[23:17:07] <Sync> but yeah, realistically it is all just for the fun ;)
[23:17:07] <Tom_itx> it'll sit all week waiting for you
[23:17:21] <zeeshan> im gonna start working on the lathe in about a month
[23:17:31] <zeeshan> i really need to finish my rx7
[23:17:35] <zeeshan> all this car talk
[23:17:41] <zeeshan> thing needs some attention
[23:17:44] <zeeshan> it was so shiny after i washed it
[23:17:51] <Tom_itx> it needs a home less crouded
[23:18:01] <zeeshan> Tom_itx: i actually am looking at properties
[23:18:11] <zeeshan> i came across this sweet property..
[23:18:13] <zeeshan> 10 acres!
[23:18:18] <zeeshan> already has a house
[23:18:22] <zeeshan> but would need to build a shop
[23:18:33] <Tom_itx> who cares about the house... need a good shop
[23:18:51] <zeeshan> lol
[23:18:56] <JT-Tn> Your young just do it
[23:18:59] <malcom2073_> You need a shop with a small bedroom attached
[23:19:01] <malcom2073_> what's this house bs
[23:19:15] <zeeshan> i have 5 passions
[23:19:18] <Tom_itx> just a cot in the office
[23:19:19] <SpeedEvil> malcom2073_: Bunk-bed over the lathe
[23:19:21] <zeeshan> 1. cars
[23:19:26] <zeeshan> 2. machining/engineering/design
[23:19:31] <zeeshan> 3. astronomy
[23:19:32] <zeeshan> 4. farming
[23:19:34] <malcom2073_> SpeedEvil: Loft bed indeed!
[23:19:36] <andypugh> Wolf_: 3D printing exhausts might work, or at least 3D print then electroform.
[23:19:36] <zeeshan> 5. women
[23:19:44] <zeeshan> *woman
[23:19:49] <Tom_itx> that one will be the death of you
[23:19:52] <zeeshan> to meet all these passions, you need a house and a lot of acre
[23:19:53] <zeeshan> :)
[23:19:56] <malcom2073_> Yeah, the last one will kill all the others
[23:19:58] <JT-Tn> I think you're backwards
[23:20:09] <malcom2073_> Cept farming, that'll kill you
[23:20:17] <Wolf_> andypugh: I was thinking more towards laser sintered 3d printer
[23:20:18] <SpeedEvil> malcom2073_: Wells are easy to dig
[23:20:23] <zeeshan> JT-Tn: don't tell my wifey
[23:20:24] <zeeshan> haha
[23:20:27] <SpeedEvil> Wolf_: e-beam is shiny
[23:20:33] <zeeshan> im kidding, she's the best
[23:20:35] <zeeshan> super helpful
[23:20:35] <JT-Tn> lil
[23:20:39] <zeeshan> any woman who'll help me move my machine
[23:20:43] <zeeshan> is in my heart forever
[23:20:53] <zeeshan> most women frown upon that stuff.
[23:21:01] <zeeshan> too busy doing superficial stuff
[23:21:11] <JT-Tn> Mine helped build the house
[23:21:15] <zeeshan> there you go
[23:21:19] <zeeshan> life partner
[23:21:28] <andypugh> Wolf_: This is a friend’s electroformed 5:1 colector:
https://picasaweb.google.com/108164504656404380542/Roj?authkey=Gv1sRgCJbSsrD-kfr3Hg#6200435035477197074
[23:21:36] <zeeshan> JT-Tn: does she bike with you?
[23:22:07] <JT-Tn> She rides everywhere I go
[23:22:18] <zeeshan> nice to have the same hobby
[23:23:06] <andypugh> For sharing hobbies it probably helps to be gay.
[23:23:16] <JT-Tn> lol
[23:24:05] <JT-Tn> We both enjoy riding
[23:24:18] <malcom2073_> Lol
[23:24:29] <malcom2073_> My wife likes cars, and tolerates my other hobbies
[23:24:48] <andypugh> Though I do know two women who have described my Rivett Lathe as “Pretty” so it isn’t hopeless.
[23:24:54] <zeeshan> haha
[23:25:04] <humble_sea_bass> tolerance is all we ask for
[23:25:16] <zeeshan> +/- .001"
[23:25:25] <humble_sea_bass> *rimshot*
[23:25:30] <malcom2073_> +/-0.1" at times
[23:27:02] <JT-Tn> I came home with a 98 goldwing one day and the wife said take me for a ride. We have been riding ever since
[23:27:48] <zeeshan> nice
[23:28:40] <JT-Tn> I came home with a '65 John Deer 350 crawler and she never asked for a ride lol
[23:29:19] <JT-Tn> We have put 39
[23:29:50] <JT-Tn> 30k miles on a bike since then
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[23:32:37] <andypugh> My Ex was the one who persuaded me to but my 2004 R1 brand new. I still have the bike. I don’t miss the mad woman.
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[23:33:30] <andypugh> (100k miles on the R1, but 99.5k of that is solo, she had her own bike)
[23:34:59] <Tom_itx> she must have had one good quality if she talked you into the bike
[23:36:06] <andypugh> I am not sure, she might just have seen it as yet another way to control me.
[23:38:42] <Sync> I try to avoid riding with a brake weight
[23:39:46] <andypugh> Yeah, having a pillion does make the bike a whole lot less fun to ride. It can make being at the destination more fun.
[23:41:18] <Sync> I once had a girl riding with me that frantically tried to lean the wrong way because she was scared that we'd tip over
[23:41:23] <Sync> took me some time to realize that
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[23:45:16] <JT-Tn> I get 45 mpg riding 2 up and 40 solo go figure
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[23:48:02] <Sync> the good thing is, once you realize what's going on you can still lean over but you need to ignore the yelling from behind
[23:49:43] <JT-Tn> Yep
[23:52:23] <JT-Tn> :-)
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[23:58:13] <Sync> hmm, I wonder if that guy from argentinia will show up again
[23:58:23] <Sync> I know what his problem with the yaskawa spindle drive is
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