#linuxcnc | Logs for 2015-07-20

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[00:00:11] <zeeshan> is there a way i can somehow put a back stop
[00:00:16] <zeeshan> like cause im drilling a hole inside that flange
[00:00:18] <XXCoder> Tom_itx: so basically I select a point machine to call home
[00:00:25] <zeeshan> so most of the force is going to try to push the part off the table
[00:01:11] <XXCoder> then just use 123 block on all tools so all offsets is same, find part xyz point then it should work fine?
[00:01:45] <PetefromTn_> zeeshan I thought you were facing that flange
[00:01:50] <XXCoder> and if I decide to change method - say if I stop using 123 blocks and use touch off plate, would programs suddely not work anymore?
[00:01:55] <zeeshan> no
[00:01:57] <zeeshan> im drilling a hole
[00:02:03] <zeeshan> a 1.5" hole
[00:02:03] <zeeshan> :/
[00:02:04] <PetefromTn_> oh with that big bit
[00:02:09] <zeeshan> yes
[00:02:13] <zeeshan> i can do it in steps
[00:02:18] <PetefromTn_> if that grabs you are gonna not be happy anymore
[00:02:22] <zeeshan> haha
[00:02:30] <zeeshan> i was thinking of going 1/2"
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[00:02:30] <PetefromTn_> can you switch to a boring head?
[00:02:30] <XXCoder> drill extra slow?
[00:02:32] <zeeshan> then 3/4"
[00:02:34] <zeeshan> no
[00:02:36] <zeeshan> no room :(
[00:02:40] <zeeshan> cant even fit a drill bit in tehre
[00:03:13] <PetefromTn_> damn that could be dicey especially with the geared down spindle spinning slow...SERIOUS torque there
[00:03:13] <zeeshan> i guess i could move the manifold
[00:03:15] <zeeshan> more forward
[00:03:20] <XXCoder> http://www.cimco.com/docs/cncbook/en/Ch06_MachineAndToolOffsets.html
[00:03:22] <XXCoder> HMMM
[00:03:58] <zeeshan> the material is only .180 thick
[00:04:02] <XXCoder> thats method I use at work
[00:04:03] <zeeshan> so not much to remove
[00:04:07] <XXCoder> fixture offset z
[00:04:15] <zeeshan> maybe i should use circular interpolation?
[00:04:20] <zeeshan> vs this big ass end mill
[00:04:28] <PetefromTn_> would be safer
[00:04:36] <XXCoder> tool length offset is method I used at internshi[p
[00:04:53] <zeeshan> cause the drilling force is what will try to shift the clamp
[00:04:58] <zeeshan> but moving it in the Z and X
[00:05:01] <zeeshan> it'll be held against the clamp
[00:05:02] <zeeshan> hmm
[00:05:10] <XXCoder> zeeshan: I do suggest reading http://www.cimco.com/docs/cncbook/en/Ch06_MachineAndToolOffsets.html
[00:05:10] <PetefromTn_> I once was using this bigass champfer bit in some structural steel tube on a knee mill
[00:05:15] <XXCoder> nice info!
[00:05:18] <PetefromTn_> I was going nice and slow
[00:05:31] <zeeshan> did you spin the tube? :-)
[00:05:32] <PetefromTn_> and that SOB grabbed and it ripped the part right out of the fixture
[00:05:37] <zeeshan> fuckl
[00:05:37] <zeeshan> haha
[00:05:40] <zeeshan> dont tell me that
[00:05:40] <PetefromTn_> I am really lucky it did not hit me
[00:05:53] <PetefromTn_> geared down spindles are wonderful for torque
[00:06:00] <PetefromTn_> but they don't stop real fast hehe
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[00:06:12] <PetefromTn_> that time can be the scariest of your life believe me
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[00:06:12] <XXCoder> PetefromTn_: ow
[00:06:22] <zeeshan> iok im adding 4 more clamps
[00:06:25] <zeeshan> after that story
[00:06:35] <PetefromTn_> Just saying
[00:06:40] <XXCoder> clamped clamps ;)
[00:06:41] <XXCoder> jk
[00:06:47] <PetefromTn_> would not want to see you get hurt or damage all that work you already did
[00:06:54] <XXCoder> zee did you check that url?
[00:07:00] <Tom_itx> more isn't necessarily better... make sure they're holding something
[00:07:31] <zeeshan> XXCoder: yes
[00:07:39] <zeeshan> PetefromTn_: yes beetter to be safe than sorry
[00:07:46] <zeeshan> i really wanna put these on my car!!
[00:07:52] <zeeshan> not into my face
[00:07:58] <zeeshan> *in
[00:08:20] <PetefromTn_> amazing how quick that can happen ask me how I know....
[00:08:40] <XXCoder> I definitely need to add the sensors for limits
[00:08:49] <XXCoder> I has it but figuring how to attach em lol
[00:08:54] <XXCoder> so it triggers correctly
[00:11:47] <justanotheruser> Is this guide recommended? http://www.cncroutersource.com/homemade-cnc-router.html
[00:12:25] <XXCoder> dunno theres lots guides out there.
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[00:14:06] <zeeshan> os1r1s: still there?
[00:14:11] <os1r1s> zeeshan: Yep
[00:14:15] <zeeshan> i tried to draw the angles
[00:14:20] <zeeshan> based on the info that website is giving
[00:15:29] <os1r1s> zeeshan: I was looking at this pic from the wiki. But it isn't helping much ... http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/uploads/lathetools.jpg
[00:16:19] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/lAF3KlG.png
[00:16:22] <zeeshan> i tried to draw it
[00:16:32] <zeeshan> :)
[00:16:38] <zeeshan> it makes zero sense
[00:16:40] <zeeshan> the 35 degree
[00:16:46] <zeeshan> especially for the 80 degree insert
[00:17:26] <os1r1s> It really doesn't
[00:17:55] <zeeshan> youd be crashing the tool in the work piece :P
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[00:20:57] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/JU7nkWl.png
[00:21:01] <zeeshan> here is solmething that makes more sense
[00:21:46] <XXCoder> I dont get those tools, I use "90 degree" tool that is eprfectly equdistant - that means angles is all 60
[00:22:44] <fenn> justanotheruser: fancy meeting you here
[00:23:06] <XXCoder> ohhh showdown!
[00:23:20] <fenn> i thought he was more of an abstract math person
[00:23:31] <fenn> whip out yer glue gun mate
[00:23:31] <justanotheruser> "he"?
[00:23:42] <fenn> whatever pronoun you prefer
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[00:25:29] <fenn> it's now possible to buy a complete (small, and probably terrible) cnc gantry router on ebay for $500
[00:26:43] <fenn> before anyone can advise you what to build and how to build it, they need to know your budget, your skills, and what you want to do with the machine once it's completed
[00:27:19] <XXCoder> yeah and what stuff you got laying around too
[00:27:31] <XXCoder> might need just electrics kit thats $100
[00:27:31] <fenn> the guide you linked to looks like crap to me though
[00:27:48] <XXCoder> or may need everything and probably cheaper just buy machine
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[00:28:47] <PetefromTn_> http://www.altdriver.com/general/128-hp-electric-go-kart/ Nice build...
[00:29:17] <XXCoder> fenn: might be good http://www.cnczone.com/forums/cnc-wood-router-project-log/127895-cnc-forum.html
[00:30:17] <XXCoder> even better http://www.overclock.net/t/755828/complete-2-x-3-custom-cnc-router-from-80-20-aluminum-extrusion
[00:30:24] <XXCoder> I planned to build this one
[00:30:32] <XXCoder> but realized I dont know enough to build it lol
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[00:33:02] <fenn> wow that is quite the contraption on the leadscrew thrust bearing
[00:35:34] <fenn> where are you supposed to get the "extended rail carriages" from? it looks like a custom machined part
[00:35:47] <justanotheruser> fenn: No, I was just wondering if you were referring to me
[00:35:56] <XXCoder> fenn: theres one store that has it
[00:36:01] <XXCoder> but yeah decided not to go for it
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[00:36:36] <justanotheruser> I'm not so much an abstract math person as I am a learn2hplus person
[00:37:43] <justanotheruser> fenn: which guide should I use instead?
[00:38:03] <fenn> what's your budget, skills and goals
[00:38:15] <fenn> also i have no idea what guides are out there
[00:38:25] <XXCoder> in many cases if youre starting with nothing, its just ebtter to get cheap chinese cnc
[00:38:51] <fenn> yeah these chinese routers didn't exist when many of these guides were written
[00:39:07] <fenn> relatively recent phenomenon
[00:39:25] <justanotheruser> fenn: budget is however much I want to allocate away from other expenses, somewhere between $500 and $2k ideally
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[00:41:52] <XXCoder> 2k just buy machine stright up from aliexpress or sometjong
[00:42:38] <XXCoder> justanotheruser: mill, router or some other cnc?
[00:44:09] <justanotheruser> router
[00:44:19] <XXCoder> ok lemme see examples
[00:44:22] <XXCoder> second
[00:46:13] <XXCoder> http://www.aliexpress.com/item/cnc-router-cuttting-machine-3020-1-5kw-water-cooling-spindle-water-cooled-cnc-router-spindle-motor/32395782692.html
[00:48:04] <XXCoder> http://www.aliexpress.com/item/800W-3Axis-drill-router-for-PVC-Aluminum-etc-engraving/32287722980.html
[00:48:11] <XXCoder> much larger one
[00:48:26] <XXCoder> 2'x3'
[00:48:54] <XXCoder> spindle is water cooled , should last better
[00:49:42] <XXCoder> oh - Working dimensions 600*400*90mm
[00:50:05] <XXCoder> 2'x1.25'x probably 9 inches. still bit larger than mine lol
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[01:03:45] <PetefromTn_> question for you cad guys
[01:03:52] <PetefromTn_> in autocad based programs
[01:04:01] <PetefromTn_> if you had two random circles
[01:04:22] <PetefromTn_> say one a t 0.0 and another....somewhere else
[01:04:45] <PetefromTn_> is it possible to draw a line tangent to the outside of both of them at the same time somehow?
[01:05:09] <justanotheruser> XXCoder: that 2nd one is $122k
[01:05:23] <justanotheruser> also, isn't it more fun to build your own? :)
[01:07:28] <XXCoder> whoa!!
[01:07:36] <XXCoder> didnt see shipping, justanotheruser that is just insane4
[01:07:44] <justanotheruser> XXCoder: it seems like a scam
[01:07:58] <XXCoder> it is, shipping scdam
[01:07:58] <justanotheruser> anyways, if aliexpress has routers with very low margins I'll consider
[01:08:10] <XXCoder> yeah I got mine for $500 shipped
[01:08:24] <XXCoder> just a frame, I already had most stuff other than frame
[01:08:31] <fenn> identical machine on ebay http://www.ebay.com/itm/3-Axis-CNC-Router-Engraver-3020T-Engraving-Drilling-Milling-Machine-Metalworking-/121137902050
[01:08:34] <XXCoder> just wish I didnt buy 43 mm router clamp one arrgh
[01:09:31] <justanotheruser> I am interested in one with very high precision as we spoke of yesterday
[01:09:42] <XXCoder> justanotheruser: oh yeah
[01:09:46] <XXCoder> what size you need?
[01:10:06] <justanotheruser> precision or dimensions?
[01:10:11] <XXCoder> dimensions
[01:10:43] <justanotheruser> I suspect I will use this for more than making small mechanical components, so I would like a large area. I was interested in DIY because I could just expand it myself when I need to
[01:11:19] <XXCoder> my earlier 2'x3' isnt bad if you already has some machines to make some parts
[01:11:38] <XXCoder> not aliexpress but 8020 how to build. it will cost bit more though
[01:12:04] <fenn> are the chinese producing 8020 knockoffs yet
[01:12:25] <XXCoder> nah extrusions is good for home hobbist but not most cost effective
[01:12:36] <fenn> but the extrusions are so expensive
[01:12:57] <XXCoder> yeah like I said not very cost effective
[01:14:23] <XXCoder> justanotheruser: http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Wood-Lathe-3040-Cnc-Router-Milling-Machine-with-43mm-bracket-Mechanical-Kit-Aluminium-Alloy-Frame/32279070195.html
[01:14:27] <XXCoder> thats what I bought
[01:14:38] <XXCoder> not recommanded as it has hard to use 43 mm clamp
[01:14:44] <XXCoder> tht seller is nice though
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[01:15:49] <XXCoder> http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/NEW-3020-CNC-ROUTER-ENGRAVER-ENGRAVING-DRILLING-AND-MILLING-MACHINE/512815_1613454595.html
[01:15:52] <XXCoder> complete kit
[01:16:56] <justanotheruser> I like the looks of it
[01:17:32] <justanotheruser> I'm interested in building it from scratch or a previous design though
[01:18:24] <fenn> PetefromTn_: in librecad you do Draw->Line->Tangent (C,C) and there are two options when you mouse over the circles (usually the first one that shows up is the one you want)
[01:18:32] <justanotheruser> I'm a bit confused though, why is the surface a bunch of lined up extrusions rather than a single piece?
[01:18:39] <XXCoder> justanotheruser: then one of those 8020 plans is better
[01:18:51] <XXCoder> cheap way to do surface that is mountable
[01:18:59] <fenn> er, there are actually 4 tangent lines, not 2
[01:19:26] <justanotheruser> can't they just have one thick sheet of metal with screw holes in the side?
[01:19:30] <justanotheruser> or would that not be as sturdy?
[01:19:39] <XXCoder> dunno
[01:19:47] <XXCoder> iyt works fine though
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[01:20:33] <justanotheruser> well sure it works fine, I'm just curious about the design decision
[01:20:54] <XXCoder> yea
[01:21:19] <justanotheruser> I really like the looks of the 80/20 plans
[01:21:19] <fenn> PetefromTn_: http://fennetic.net/irc/librecad_tangent_lines.png
[01:21:43] <XXCoder> oh yeah lemme find that one..
[01:21:53] <justanotheruser> I have it I think
[01:22:02] <justanotheruser> if this is the official page http://www.8020cnc.com/
[01:22:05] <XXCoder> justanotheruser: https://www.finelineautomation.com/products/complete-2-x3-router-kit
[01:22:15] <XXCoder> all you need is electrics kit
[01:22:26] <XXCoder> and well surfae of some sort lol
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[01:23:04] <XXCoder> https://www.finelineautomation.com/products/4-axis-electronics-kit
[01:23:21] <XXCoder> cheaper elsewhere though my entire kit cost me couple hundred lol
[01:23:55] <justanotheruser> it doesn't come with a spindle or electronics?
[01:24:06] <XXCoder> nope
[01:24:06] <justanotheruser> That metal looks like it could be bought for 1/4th the price
[01:24:33] <XXCoder> its other stuff that costs. but yeah cheaper if you just stright up buy extrusions
[01:24:42] <XXCoder> expecially if you are lucky and has local supply!!
[01:24:49] <XXCoder> look for 8020 extrusions
[01:24:55] <fenn> justanotheruser: also note that "8020" is one of those things like "kleenex" or "coke" that doesn't really have a generic name
[01:25:16] <justanotheruser> tissue and soda?
[01:25:26] <fenn> i guess the generic name would be "t-slot extrusion"
[01:26:01] <PetefromTn_> fenn thanks man I figured it out already
[01:26:17] <XXCoder> justanotheruser: yeh one you linked to is very good
[01:26:21] <justanotheruser> great
[01:26:22] <XXCoder> expensive
[01:26:43] <justanotheruser> why expensive
[01:26:51] <XXCoder> oh wait a sec
[01:27:02] <justanotheruser> It is a guide, there is no kit afaics?
[01:27:14] <XXCoder> yeah not right one. that ones very good though too
[01:27:34] <justanotheruser> where do you guys source your hardware?
[01:27:37] <justanotheruser> home depot? Online?
[01:27:46] <XXCoder> for me aliexpress or amazon unfortunately
[01:27:58] <XXCoder> since 8020 is heavy and shipping tend to be more than beams themselves
[01:28:10] <justanotheruser> do you not have a hardware store nearby?
[01:28:23] <XXCoder> not one that has 8020s
[01:29:55] <justanotheruser> perhaps I should check my lowes and home depot for them
[01:30:02] <fenn> unlikely
[01:30:11] <XXCoder> they those stores dont supply em
[01:30:19] <justanotheruser> what kind of store would supply them?
[01:30:28] <XXCoder> I have yet to find one
[01:30:55] <justanotheruser> what are they used for other than 3d printers and cnc machines
[01:30:56] <XXCoder> I would love to have some, I want to build frame for my cnc router for dust chips so on
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[01:31:08] <XXCoder> lots actually
[01:31:14] <fenn> it's very common in factory automation and laboratories
[01:31:22] <justanotheruser> so perhaps an industrial supply store?
[01:31:32] <XXCoder> my work theres BIG rail system to transport parts to and from cnc machines, and they use 8020 to build cage around it
[01:31:38] <XXCoder> possibly
[01:31:47] <justanotheruser> The next city over has an auto plant
[01:31:57] <justanotheruser> maybe I can beg them for some
[01:32:16] <fenn> get a free car while you're there
[01:32:32] <justanotheruser> yeah
[01:32:33] <XXCoder> lol
[01:32:48] <justanotheruser> I'm gonna get a new car soon
[01:32:49] <XXCoder> I would love to get free car even if few years behind
[01:32:58] <XXCoder> because its still much newer than my 1996 van lol
[01:33:07] <justanotheruser> maybe I can tell the dealer to package some 8020s with ti
[01:33:28] <justanotheruser> I'm probably just going to end up asking a bunch of industrial supply stores if they have them
[01:34:17] <XXCoder> 8020.net says nearest ones for me is seattle.. or seattle.
[01:35:41] <XXCoder> I hate sites where has quotes and no porices
[01:37:13] <justanotheruser> 2 hour drive there and back
[01:37:19] <justanotheruser> to the nearest
[01:37:26] * justanotheruser is getting ahead of himself
[01:37:36] <XXCoder> dang yer lucky
[01:37:39] <XXCoder> lol
[01:37:48] <XXCoder> what state you in, if in usa?
[01:37:58] <XXCoder> washington state, near inlet sea lol
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[01:39:01] <XXCoder> finally found prices http://www.sunsourceconnect.com/advancedwebpage.aspx?cg=140&cd=2&SBCatPage=
[01:39:18] <justanotheruser> surely companies other than 8020 produce these, right?
[01:39:42] <XXCoder> 8020 dont make em I think actually
[01:39:47] <XXCoder> they just control specs
[01:39:51] <XXCoder> other companies make em
[01:40:05] <justanotheruser> oh
[01:40:17] <XXCoder> could be wrong
[01:40:42] <fenn> there are other brands that are merely overpriced instead of outrageously overpriced
[01:40:53] <XXCoder> like?
[01:42:17] <fenn> blah it's all "request a quote"
[01:42:19] <justanotheruser> the actual 8020 headquarters are relatively close to me
[01:42:39] <XXCoder> fenn: yeah I hate that
[01:43:05] <justanotheruser> maybe I could get a tour of their headquarters and get some free samples as a parting gift
[01:43:17] <justanotheruser> maybe I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one
[01:43:45] <XXCoder> bleh
[01:43:47] <XXCoder> lucky ya
[01:44:41] <fenn> 5.5MB pdf http://www.tslots.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/TSLOTSPriceList_12115.pdf
[01:44:43] <justanotheruser> I'm surprised hardware stores don't sell these, they're very useful
[01:45:12] <fenn> things range from $0.2 to $3 per inch
[01:45:19] <XXCoder> fancy
[01:45:24] <XXCoder> so lets see
[01:45:34] <XXCoder> longest one I would need is 8 foot
[01:45:44] <XXCoder> bleh lunux calc sucks
[01:45:59] <XXCoder> meh just round to 100 inches
[01:46:10] <fenn> a 2x4 is $1.13/inch
[01:46:26] <XXCoder> whoa
[01:46:29] <XXCoder> pdf is weird
[01:46:33] <XXCoder> I cant select a line
[01:47:06] <XXCoder> wsuppose I wanted beefy frame
[01:47:23] <fenn> then dont make it out of t-slot
[01:47:29] <XXCoder> so it is 2x100"x$1.8 approx
[01:47:39] <XXCoder> $360
[01:48:20] <XXCoder> thats just sides lol
[01:48:20] <XXCoder> honestly 1530 would do
[01:48:20] <XXCoder> $200
[01:48:23] <XXCoder> for sides, half size, $100
[01:48:39] <XXCoder> actually add another half length for attaching screw
[01:48:45] <XXCoder> $350 so far
[01:49:07] <XXCoder> probably couple thousand for 8'x4'
[01:49:11] <XXCoder> work space
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[01:50:47] <fenn> i want to learn more about building machines from concrete
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[01:50:57] <XXCoder> or epoxy granite?
[01:51:57] <fenn> i guess epoxy granite is preferred because it doesn't change shape after hardening
[01:52:12] <XXCoder> looks awesome too.
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[01:52:41] <XXCoder> I want to try making aluminium chip epoxy for fun
[01:52:41] <XXCoder> statue of some kind. not for one of those wrackos on "aura" or something
[01:52:59] <fenn> pyramids
[01:53:14] <fenn> orgone blaster holy hand grenade, die satanists die!!!
[01:53:16] <XXCoder> yeah with crystals, copper spirls so on. so laughable
[01:53:40] <fenn> i made one to see if it did anything
[01:54:11] <fenn> i got some weird ice cubes in the freezer
[01:54:30] <XXCoder> lol
[01:54:51] <fenn> success?
[01:55:16] <XXCoder> maybe?
[01:55:16] <XXCoder> http://www.spandanayoga.com/orgone_pyramid.jpg
[01:55:19] <XXCoder> looks awesome
[01:55:32] <XXCoder> too bad people think woowoo stuff happens due to this.
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[02:02:53] <XXCoder> nyway
[02:02:53] <XXCoder> epoxy is bit pricy
[02:02:53] <XXCoder> so yeah waiting on it for later lol
[02:04:09] <fenn> so i think there's a place for cheap concrete tools with drawer slides etc
[02:04:22] <XXCoder> yeah
[02:04:38] <XXCoder> saw a project online about cnc router with drawer slides and mdf
[02:04:41] <XXCoder> impressive
[02:04:48] <fenn> or some other type of bearing, but you get the idea
[02:04:53] <XXCoder> precision wasnt too high, like .001"?
[02:05:03] <XXCoder> .003" maybe
[02:05:15] <fenn> the point is most of these DIY machines are severely lacking in 1) mass and 2) rigidity because they don't have enough material in them
[02:05:50] <fenn> also concrete is anisotropic which helps cut down on chatter even more
[02:05:54] <XXCoder> yeah depends on what use for
[02:06:03] <XXCoder> anti-vibration?
[02:06:35] <fenn> vibration is usually what limits how deep of a cut you can take
[02:06:56] <XXCoder> what does anisotropic nean
[02:07:06] <fenn> it's a conglomerate of different materials
[02:07:10] <XXCoder> ahh
[02:09:35] <fenn> isotropy means "same in all directions" so a block of cheddar cheese is isotropic but a block of wood is not
[02:10:10] <XXCoder> makes sense
[02:10:52] <XXCoder> so other word basically means different in every direction (unlike wood which is basically same for same side but different on different surface)
[02:12:11] <fenn> wood is stronger with the grain than against it
[02:12:24] <fenn> reinforced concrete is stronger with the grain than against it
[02:13:17] <fenn> because the rebar has a different young's modulus than the sand and rock, when you flex a beam the parts rub against each other inside the material and dissipate energy
[02:14:35] <fenn> also the different fillings have different densities which scatters acoustic waves
[02:15:08] <fenn> it's like how index of refraction differences cause light to scatter
[02:18:00] <XXCoder> hmm
[02:18:16] <XXCoder> heh bit tough concept
[02:18:23] <XXCoder> so concerete scatters acoustic waves
[02:18:28] <XXCoder> so result: less vibration
[02:18:32] <XXCoder> while wood dont
[02:21:43] <SpeedEvil> That rather depends on the wood, and the orientation
[02:22:28] <SpeedEvil> (s)
[02:23:32] <archivist> and if it is designed to be a sounding board (guitar)
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[02:24:31] <fenn> the wavelengths we are interested in are much larger than the aggregate in concrete though, so most of the vibration reduction is due to mass
[02:24:55] <XXCoder> fenn: what about rubber balls that dont bounce?
[02:25:10] <XXCoder> that special rubber-like material that eats vibration and turn it to heat
[02:25:11] <fenn> is this about viscoelastic shear
[02:25:49] <XXCoder> dunno?
[02:27:14] <XXCoder> I know old volkwagon beetles used em
[02:27:20] <XXCoder> inside doors and such so its quieter
[02:27:37] <fenn> a substance with low tensile strength but high ductility will easily deform and dissipate energy internally as heat because bonds are being broken
[02:28:25] <fenn> i'm still learning about metallurgy and what makes alloys have particular properties
[02:28:41] <XXCoder> cool
[02:29:13] <fenn> anyway the car soundproofing works because there is a difference in material properties between the sheet metal of the door and the viscous rubber-like sheet
[02:29:45] <fenn> as the sheet metal flexes it stretches the rubber sheet like taffy
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[02:30:02] <XXCoder> finally found it
[02:30:04] <XXCoder> Butyl rubber
[02:30:33] <fenn> it's probably under-vulcanized so it's not really butyl rubber
[02:31:41] <XXCoder> I wonder if I could buy some and stick in bottom to eat some vibration
[02:31:59] <XXCoder> http://www.mcmaster.com/#butyl-rubber-sheet-stock/=y4m075
[02:32:35] <XXCoder> interesting idea but doubt I will do it lol
[02:33:35] <fenn> they sell something called "sorbothane" which is more like what you want
[02:33:55] <XXCoder> not really want actually
[02:34:01] <fenn> and 3M makes a special purpose viscoelastic tape
[02:34:02] <XXCoder> just tought up and wondered lol
[02:37:25] <fenn> this is a cool article from many years ago about MIT precision engineering research group http://demg.penton.com/content/am/out_of_the_box.pdf
[02:38:00] <XXCoder> its over 20 years old
[02:38:02] <fenn> about viscoelastic shear damping and concrete machine tools
[02:38:41] <XXCoder> interesting read so far
[02:39:10] <XXCoder> "The viscous-shear damper,
[02:39:10] <XXCoder> in contrast, is frequency
[02:39:10] <XXCoder> insensitive"
[02:42:22] <XXCoder> bit hard to follow lol but interesting
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[02:54:25] <fenn> i thought this was neat too, from the same lab: http://pergatory.mit.edu/research/Cortesi/index.html
[02:56:02] <fenn> the linear motor provides downward force to keep the sliding part from lifting up, so there are only 2 bearing surfaces
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[02:58:43] <fenn> anyway, air bearings on a cast concrete surface can be a good way to do "ways"
[03:00:33] <XXCoder> yeah
[03:00:49] <fenn> the proof of concept prototype used magnets instead of linear motors to keep the parts aligned
[03:00:52] <XXCoder> I used fractionless (very nearly) rail at lab for physics
[03:00:53] <XXCoder> fun
[03:02:58] <fenn> granite countertops are also easy to come by and sometimes flat and accurate
[03:03:32] <XXCoder> fenn: talking about that
[03:03:49] <XXCoder> recently company hired guys come in and regrind Surfaces
[03:03:50] <XXCoder> amazing
[03:04:06] <XXCoder> one I usually use was new so passed, but other one was .004 off
[03:04:08] <XXCoder> wavey
[03:04:19] <XXCoder> it was so bad guy took hours to regrind it
[03:04:31] <fenn> did they do it by hand?
[03:04:34] <XXCoder> its now .00019 wavey
[03:04:40] <XXCoder> yeah with BIG block of alum
[03:04:45] <XXCoder> with white powder
[03:05:03] <XXCoder> then smaller block with some kinda sandpaper
[03:05:14] <XXCoder> then something finer so it got to .00019
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[03:32:39] <XXCoder> cat it up http://cubiclebot.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/catzooka.gif
[03:36:24] <XXCoder> ok that is weird
[03:36:30] <XXCoder> seller says it is er8
[03:36:42] <XXCoder> I gonna borrow work one, with permission and see
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[03:52:20] <furrywolf> obvious editing in that animation.
[03:52:49] <XXCoder> oh really? LOL I know. 3 cats being same is olvious
[03:53:44] <XXCoder> besides few misaligns of videos
[03:53:56] <XXCoder> though I wanna try something like that, wonder how he edited video
[03:54:54] <furrywolf> dunno what tools he used, but you can see the cat suddenly appear inside the tube in one frame.
[03:55:14] <furrywolf> probably just merged three sequential videos together
[03:55:21] <XXCoder> yeah
[03:55:35] <XXCoder> worse error is edit inside hole of air blaster
[03:55:45] <XXCoder> olviously to hide cat sitting inside
[03:56:08] <furrywolf> also, poor cat. lol
[03:56:13] <XXCoder> yeah
[03:56:20] <XXCoder> I guess it jumped out
[03:56:30] <furrywolf> yep
[03:56:35] <furrywolf> and got stuffed in again.
[03:57:07] <XXCoder> yeah
[03:57:57] <XXCoder> I wonder how he get together 2 shootings
[03:58:18] <XXCoder> I think I see cut between aiming and shooting second cat
[03:58:57] <XXCoder> or maybe he just held "blaster" at same place and let cat jump out, and edited in only cat
[03:59:21] <XXCoder> not easy to figure how he did it
[03:59:43] <XXCoder> I have that toy actually, its fun lol rarely play with it but fun
[03:59:56] <XXCoder> even shot it off in water
[04:00:10] <XXCoder> very still water, took me 30 minutes of just chilling at one end
[04:00:56] <XXCoder> then took it underwater and shot it. ring got huge at end lol only could see two tiny whirls on top slowly moving forward and get futher and further apart too lol
[04:01:01] <furrywolf> what is it?
[04:01:08] <XXCoder> it makes air donut
[04:01:23] <XXCoder> it moves fast and quite a long distance
[04:02:13] <XXCoder> http://www.adorablekidsdressup.com/product/Airzooka.html
[04:02:49] <XXCoder> its easy to make one yourself, almost full decade before I got that, I made cannon air blaster
[04:03:00] <XXCoder> it worked so well I could hit targets 20m away
[04:04:17] <XXCoder> furrywolf: what you do is take a tin that comes with plastic lid, open one tin on both ends, use whatever it contained whatever you like
[04:04:27] <XXCoder> then put lids on both ends, cutting small hole at one end
[04:04:38] <XXCoder> use it like drum, it will shoot donut
[04:04:50] <furrywolf> I have a honda water pump that shoots out perfect smoke rings from the exhaust.
[04:05:03] <furrywolf> it burns a LOT of oil. the smoke rings fly about ten feet then lazily settle.
[04:05:15] <XXCoder> it takes a bit to learn how to do aim and hit "drum" side to make good donuts
[04:05:19] <XXCoder> lol
[04:05:28] <XXCoder> I remember my bro truck
[04:05:34] <XXCoder> it made donuts each few minutes
[04:05:55] <furrywolf> the seal between the pump and the engine went out, and filled the block with water. it's never been quite not-a-piece-of-crap since.
[04:06:31] <XXCoder> http://www.physicscentral.com/experiment/physicsathome/cannon.cfm
[04:06:43] <XXCoder> ouch
[04:07:06] <XXCoder> that site instructs to hole hole on metal itself
[04:07:10] <XXCoder> I just used lid lol
[04:07:51] <furrywolf> "scissors or sturdy knife (Caution: Ask an adult to help you use these tools)" ... seriously? anyone who can read the web page can use basic pointy objects.
[04:08:05] <XXCoder> lawsuits.
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[04:09:02] <XXCoder> anyway theory is simple, just need one end that suddenly decrease volume
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[04:09:11] <XXCoder> and other end with clean circle near center
[04:09:23] <XXCoder> sharp or jags cause short life
[04:09:38] <furrywolf> " Anything flexible makes a good target: your friend’s hair, posters, cats, candles" ...If you have a fog machine, then you can observe the shape of the toroidal vortex created by your air cannon. You can also put some flour inside the bucket and shake it up to simulate fog." now if you want fun, do both a candle AND flour. :P
[04:10:56] <XXCoder> https://youtu.be/QrgTtZXuj4w lol
[04:11:50] <XXCoder> 3 pigs
[04:12:05] <XXCoder> lets see if brick house pig lives this time
[04:12:39] <XXCoder> nope, but then structure sucks
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[04:14:32] <XXCoder> trash can cannon https://youtu.be/QrgTtZXuj4w
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[04:14:41] <XXCoder> er https://youtu.be/JkSunujURI0
[04:16:30] <furrywolf> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F49r9wFkDgo what would happen if you followed their suggestions of filling it with flour and aiming it at a candle.
[04:17:19] <XXCoder> looking
[04:17:48] <XXCoder> they suggested it? jeez
[04:17:59] <furrywolf> not intentionally. :P
[04:18:24] <furrywolf> in one spot they suggested aiming it at candles. in another spot they suggested filling it with flour to make a visible ring.
[04:18:34] <XXCoder> ahh impiling aim it there
[04:19:01] <furrywolf> if you do both of those suggestions... it becomes much more entertaining.
[04:19:12] <XXCoder> it cn be fun
[04:19:18] <XXCoder> just carefully done
[04:19:33] <XXCoder> or firemen come in join fun too
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[04:21:02] <furrywolf> most people who don't live near grain silos seem to have no idea just how explosive fine dust can be.
[04:21:21] <furrywolf> grain dust, flour, coal dust, sawdust, etc, etc...
[04:21:37] <XXCoder> yeah
[04:21:48] <XXCoder> I kwow it from knowing history
[04:22:10] <XXCoder> one of big explosions in factory was due to fine wood dust slowly building up
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[04:31:55] <furrywolf> there's been a lot of big explosions in factories from dust
[04:39:25] <furrywolf> bbl
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[05:29:26] <XXCoder> wow
[05:29:28] <XXCoder> http://makezine.com/2015/07/17/see-made-3d-cube-illusion-wooden-bowl/
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[12:47:24] <SolarNRG> any of you guys know anything about stainless cone rolling?
[12:48:14] <SolarNRG> basically its 4mm 306l stainless IIRC, the cone has to be 60mm at the top, 300mm at the bottom diameters and it has to be 250mm high
[12:48:23] <SolarNRG> any ideas how I draw that onto the sheet?
[12:48:27] <SolarNRG> the sheet stainless
[12:48:50] <SolarNRG> I'm guessing a bit of old 2*pi*r is required here
[12:48:58] <SpeedEvil> Pretty much.
[12:49:34] <SpeedEvil> Neglecting stuff, you have a 180mm (ish) top, 1m bottom, and 250mm between top and bottom
[12:51:02] <SolarNRG> yeah the bottom circumference is pretty much gonna be a meter
[12:51:04] <SpeedEvil> Do you mean 250mm slant-height, or height
[12:51:19] <SolarNRG> y axis height not slant heigh
[12:51:20] <SolarNRG> t
[12:51:49] <SpeedEvil> Think about the cone. What do you know about the cone. What does that imply when you cut a slot in it and flatten it out
[12:52:17] <SpeedEvil> Also - 4mm stainless ~300mm long is a very non-trivial bend
[12:52:23] <SpeedEvil> what are you going to be using
[12:53:19] <SolarNRG> I'm just cutting it with the grinder I'm taking it somewhere to get bent
[12:53:29] <SolarNRG> hopefully they won't tell me to get bent
[12:53:31] <SolarNRG> lol
[12:53:49] <SpeedEvil> Why 4mm
[12:53:51] <SolarNRG> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_q_MgYa0Mjc
[12:54:12] <SolarNRG> it seems I gotta make the circles twice as big radii with this method
[12:54:21] <SolarNRG> cos ur only doing semicircles
[12:55:39] <SolarNRG> basically I gotta draw from one edge a 600mm circle that only covers a semicircle and a 120mm circle, but how far apart are the two circles?
[12:56:14] <SpeedEvil> Why 4mm? That's a very, very,very thick cone and hard to roll
[12:56:41] <SolarNRG> becuase of hot shit and piss being boiled by a 4m parabolic reflector dish that's why
[12:57:03] <SolarNRG> and I'm a crap welder so I need thick metal cos I can't afford a mig
[12:57:20] <SpeedEvil> Doing it wrong.
[12:57:33] <SpeedEvil> There is no reason to use thicker than 1mm, reinforced appropriately
[12:57:33] <SolarNRG> enlighten me oh wealthy and wise one
[12:57:43] <SolarNRG> if I weld 1mm I BURN HOLES IN IT
[12:57:43] <SpeedEvil> use a copper backing plate while welding
[12:58:01] <SolarNRG> huh?
[12:58:04] <SolarNRG> Like a bus bar
[12:58:08] <SpeedEvil> yes
[12:58:08] <SolarNRG> underneath the stainless?
[12:58:31] <SpeedEvil> Large aluminium also works
[12:58:38] <SpeedEvil> Though not as well
[12:58:43] <SolarNRG> umm aluminium and steel makes thermite right
[12:58:44] <SolarNRG> ?
[12:58:53] <SpeedEvil> No.
[12:59:01] <SpeedEvil> Aluminium and iron oxide
[12:59:04] <SpeedEvil> finely divided
[12:59:34] <SolarNRG> actually this is stainless so it doesn't oxidize very well
[12:59:51] <SolarNRG> although when it does it makes a pale yellowy oxide, not a red rusty oxide, why's that?
[13:00:08] <SolarNRG> cos I pick up a lot of scrap stainless cheap from the scrappy, I love welding stainless
[13:01:31] <archivist> SolarNRG, http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJC/BK/BK662/
[13:02:20] <archivist> geometry of sheet metal work
[13:02:47] <SolarNRG> archivist, sweet
[13:03:37] <archivist> then you can make http://www.collection.archivist.info/searchv13.php?searchstr=tinware
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[13:10:34] <_methods> did you make those archivist
[13:10:58] <_methods> people are losing the skills to make that stuff anymore
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[13:12:31] <CaptHindsight> ah, you just get plastic ones at wallyworld now
[13:12:59] <SolarNRG> 277.3mm worked it out thankx guys
[13:13:14] <SolarNRG> that's the sloping length of the cone I need to make
[13:13:35] <SolarNRG> _methods, yeah I used to know all this stuff 10 years ago, now I've forgotten high school trig
[13:13:40] <SolarNRG> my brain's turned to mush
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[13:15:11] <archivist> _methods, yes, its is just biscuit tin, a soldering iron and a pair of scissors and some bending
[13:15:19] <CaptHindsight> that's why they used to have trig tables and now you can look them up or use a calculator
[13:15:26] <_methods> well sheet metal patter making is an art that's not taught much anymore around here
[13:15:31] <CaptHindsight> no real reason to memorize them
[13:15:43] <_methods> s/patter/pattern
[13:15:58] <archivist> plenty of old books around to get sheetmetal data from
[13:16:04] <_methods> pretty hard to find a sheet metal school
[13:16:09] <_methods> yeah the old books are incredible
[13:16:17] <_methods> i use them extensively
[13:16:24] <_methods> solidworks can't figure everything out
[13:16:30] <archivist> I never went to any school, just collect books :)
[13:16:55] <_methods> it sure is easier to lay out a pattern in autocad than it is doing it by hand though lol
[13:16:57] <archivist> any sheetmetal school I should say
[13:17:12] <_methods> well that's impressive if you just made those on your own
[13:17:34] <archivist> my patterns are in the paint on a pit of tin
[13:17:44] <archivist> bit
[13:18:03] <_methods> heh
[13:18:21] <_methods> they used to call sheet metal workers tin knockers here
[13:18:37] <archivist> the watering can spout is fun, turn a taper, bend around, then roll with a ball bearing
[13:19:06] <_methods> now with cnc press brakes these guys really don't have a clue
[13:19:17] <archivist> the watering can top is a press tool, turned and uses a ball bearing as the die
[13:19:18] <_methods> they just load a program and grab a part from a pile
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[13:20:22] <archivist> that is the press and tool http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJCPD/PD/2013/2013_10_11_Smart_Brown_Press_repaired/IMG_1672.JPG
[13:20:31] <SolarNRG> archivist for a man who didn't go to school u sure are smart
[13:20:55] <_methods> ah nice little press
[13:20:55] <archivist> I meant sheet metal school
[13:20:59] <_methods> i'd love to have one of those
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[13:21:28] <SolarNRG> i think health and safety would shut the place down in an instant once a student sliced his finger open on some sheet ally
[13:21:50] <archivist> was making tooling yesterday for the probe spring
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[13:21:57] <_methods> i dont' think there are many sheet metal schools left in the US
[13:22:34] <_methods> i'm pretty sure i'm one of like 3 people in my whole town that know how to setup and run a turret punch
[13:23:02] <archivist> most skills can be reverse engineered and relearned
[13:23:11] <SolarNRG> what is a turret punch?
[13:23:27] <_methods> see
[13:23:35] <_methods> most people don't even know what one is lol
[13:23:44] <SolarNRG> lmgt
[13:23:54] <archivist> loads of different press types
[13:24:06] <archivist> I want a fly press too
[13:24:12] <_methods> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turret_punch
[13:24:41] <_methods> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzDSZcPvl_E
[13:24:44] <archivist> noisy buggers they are
[13:24:54] <_methods> video of trupunch 5000 running
[13:26:20] <archivist> good job I moved the speakers to another pc
[13:26:27] <_methods> heheh
[13:26:36] <_methods> yeah they aren't quiet
[13:26:56] <archivist> bit like steam hammers
[13:27:29] <_methods> i love them...........when they're working
[13:27:45] <_methods> incredibly easy to get wrong
[13:28:10] <_methods> lots of variables
[13:28:10] <FinboySlick> Video for the 2020 is more impressive.
[13:28:24] <_methods> is it?
[13:28:40] <FinboySlick> I thought so anyway.
[13:28:41] <_methods> i just grabbed teh first punch link i saw
[13:28:51] <_methods> that's not an actual turret punch though
[13:29:01] <_methods> since trumpf puts their tools on a linear rail
[13:29:09] <SolarNRG> its like a cnc machine that bangs holes in sheet metal, right?
[13:29:21] <archivist> yes
[13:29:39] <_methods> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nOF7fi4JhDc
[13:29:46] <SolarNRG> probably less complex than a cnc mill
[13:29:48] <_methods> that is an actual turret punch
[13:29:50] <archivist> or punches louvres
[13:29:55] <FinboySlick> SolarNRG: These also bend and shape small portions of th e sheet (up to about an inch high).
[13:30:13] <SolarNRG> inch thick stainless!?
[13:30:22] <SolarNRG> that would take me all day jsut to cut with the grinder
[13:30:24] <_methods> no
[13:30:24] <FinboySlick> SolarNRG: no, 1 inch thick features.
[13:30:29] <FinboySlick> I mean 1 inch high.
[13:30:35] <_methods> small bends
[13:30:45] <_methods> or raised features
[13:31:09] <SolarNRG> looks wicked for making stylish metal furniture, ipad casings etc
[13:31:30] <_methods> they are typically used for hole intensive chassis work
[13:31:38] <SolarNRG> also looks like the sort of tool AK47 receivers are made in bulk
[13:31:48] <FinboySlick> Apple uses fancier methods. Your typical beige-box PC or Dell will be made on this though.
[13:31:50] <_methods> since they can outperform lasers on parts with lots of holes
[13:32:07] <_methods> for truly high production stamping presses are used
[13:32:21] <SolarNRG> less coolant required for sure
[13:32:35] <CaptHindsight> there was a shop a few doors down with an AMADA, too little business to keep it busy
[13:32:38] <archivist> I have seen insane speeds on a stamping press at a show
[13:32:39] <SolarNRG> instead of gneeewam gneewasmm its just bang, hole's done
[13:32:56] <FinboySlick> Or for even higher production, you can use 6 chinese men in a press: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sF865wbEeyI
[13:32:58] <_methods> yeah turret punches need production higher than a laser but less than stamping
[13:33:02] <CaptHindsight> they would even compete with China on price
[13:33:05] <_methods> it's a real fine line
[13:33:23] <_methods> that's why turret punches are so hard to find operators/setup people for anymore
[13:33:24] <archivist> stamping presses often have multiple dies in series and are fed strip metal
[13:33:34] <CaptHindsight> we could get parts overnight
[13:33:54] <_methods> CaptHindsight: yeah it can still be done
[13:33:58] <_methods> but it's not easy
[13:34:13] <CaptHindsight> I could use one
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[13:34:33] <_methods> i love turret punches
[13:34:42] <archivist> I have a sheet metal company only 3 miles away with a few trumpfs and lasers
[13:35:01] <_methods> yeah we have a trumpf laser here
[13:35:16] <_methods> komatsu plasma
[13:35:20] <_methods> and flow waterjet
[13:36:27] <_methods> lets us cut a large range of materials and thicknesses and prices
[13:36:46] <_methods> but no turret punch :(
[13:36:53] <archivist> I did wonder at production of the watering cans for these "collectors" of miniatures
[13:37:07] <_methods> but honestly we don't get the production work to "feed" a press
[13:37:24] <CaptHindsight> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Amada-EM-2510-NT-22-ton-CNC-Turret-Punch-/161749036000 $167,500, wonder if they would take $167K even?
[13:37:26] <_methods> i think you'd go crazy making those miniature water cans alld ay
[13:37:33] <archivist> me too
[13:37:33] <_methods> lol
[13:38:07] <_methods> honestly the only punch i'd buy is a trumpf
[13:38:19] <_methods> that linear tooling real is awesome
[13:38:21] <archivist> I bet it was $168,000 new
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[13:38:30] <CaptHindsight> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Trumpf-TC180-20-Ton-Turret-Punch-16-Station-/231618675115
[13:38:45] <_methods> woah
[13:38:52] <_methods> that's an old trumatic
[13:38:58] <archivist> cheap enough
[13:39:16] <archivist> retrofit linuxcnc, profit
[13:40:25] <archivist> heh "Has been rewired with updated controls at least once." meaning and now its fsckd again
[13:44:46] <FinboySlick> archivist: I have a feeling it wouldn't be trivial to bring home though.
[13:46:39] <SolarNRG> my compass is tiny, how do I make big circles like 300mm radius?
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[13:48:41] <FinboySlick> Piece of wire and two pins?
[13:49:05] <_methods> stick
[13:49:20] <_methods> with 2 pts lol
[13:49:26] <FinboySlick> Yeah, stick with two nails.
[13:55:08] <archivist> rotary table and a pen in the chuck
[13:55:29] <archivist> FinboySlick, minor detail, hire a truck
[13:57:15] <archivist> see also beam compass
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[13:59:45] <archivist> also known as trammels
[14:09:37] <archivist> ebay search for trammel points gets you the bits you add to a stick/bar
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[14:34:41] <SolarNRG> dudes, if I cut the sheet metal like this will the bottom be perfectly circular? http://i.imgur.com/bQZ9mr4.png
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[14:36:08] <_methods> i don't understand that question
[14:36:16] <SolarNRG> u see the image right?
[14:36:20] <_methods> yeah
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[14:36:26] <SolarNRG> I got a sheet of metal scratched out like that
[14:36:33] <_methods> ok
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[14:36:54] <SolarNRG> when I get it bent will the bottom be flat?
[14:37:02] <SolarNRG> or will it be lopsided?
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[14:37:25] <_methods> well how did you lay that pattern out?
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[14:37:26] <skroon> hi all
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[14:37:50] <_methods> if you layed it out correctly it will be "flat"
[14:37:56] <SolarNRG> ok
[14:38:02] <skroon> i'm cnc'ing plastic (HIPS) with a 2 flute end mill... but plastic metls around my bit... i'm wondering how to prevent it... lower RPM?
[14:38:04] <_methods> if by flat you mean will the bottom of teh cone be planar
[14:38:08] <skroon> or high RPM?
[14:38:12] <_methods> higher
[14:38:20] <_methods> plastics require high feed and speed
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[14:38:41] <_methods> i'd look for feeds and speeds for hips
[14:38:43] <SolarNRG> high impact polystyrene?
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[14:39:11] <SolarNRG> ill tell u now if you cut that too fast that polystyrene gives off TOXIC GAS BE WARNED
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[14:39:28] <skroon> indeed high impact polystyrene
[14:39:39] <skroon> SolarNRG: ow really? indeed it smells funny
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[14:39:55] <SolarNRG> skroon, yeah don't breathe that shit, it's like level 4 toxic
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[14:40:15] <SolarNRG> they add that shit to petrol to make napalm
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[14:40:34] <SolarNRG> excuse my french
[14:40:54] <SolarNRG> it can easily be dissolved using toluene!
[14:41:11] <SolarNRG> and it goes SCREEETCH if you wipe it on glass
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[14:43:27] <SolarNRG> I highly advise you to invest in an uber duct fan if you're milling bad shit like that, I knew a plastic warehouse where loads of people died in Glasgow they were storing all sorts from polyproylene, polycarbonate, polystyrene and the firefighter's respirators didn't do shit the fire killed more from the burning plastic fumes than the fire did
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[14:44:40] <SolarNRG> you REALLY REALLY REALLY do not want to burn it, so I advise you to go slow and mill at a slower rate as milling causes heat that can reach the autoignition temperature of polystyrene which I THINK is 240 degrees c
[14:46:00] <_methods> interesting
[14:46:11] <_methods> i've never actually made anything from it
[14:46:37] <SolarNRG> used a lot in drones
[14:46:44] <SolarNRG> very lightweight
[14:48:31] <SolarNRG> I like my metals I do, at least when a lot of those burn they aren't toxic, watch out for galvanized tho, that zinc is nasty
[14:49:19] <_methods> auto ignition for hips is 450c
[14:49:34] <_methods> and i'm not finding any data about it being dangerous like you've said
[14:49:58] <SolarNRG> thanks for confirming that _methods wiki only gave the melting point and I've worked with plastics that ignite well before their melting points so I often deal with melting them in a vacuum for various reasons
[14:50:36] <SolarNRG> _methods, https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20071103193123AAm2z1A
[14:51:14] <_methods> yahoo questions isn't really something i use to source material data lol
[14:51:33] <_methods> or any data
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[14:52:01] <SolarNRG> I'm reading it's msds and I actually see 440 degrees c autoignition temp 10 degrees lower than u said
[14:52:04] <_methods> except for like maybe is teh color purple my favorite color cardigan
[14:52:21] <_methods> there you go msds is credible
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[14:52:45] <_methods> i got 450c from plastics intl page
[14:53:09] <SolarNRG> b4 u work with a new material, ALWAYS read the MSDS, that titanium hammer factory learned that the hard way, it caught fire then the firefighters poured water on it, next thing it was raining hot white metal that burned through everything
[14:53:58] <SolarNRG> minor discrepency, anyway, key here is mill SLOW
[14:54:49] <SolarNRG> another question for the dude I should have is what sort of coolant should he be using as toluene dissolves the stuff?
[14:55:12] <SolarNRG> hmm, not as bad as I thought when burning, polycarb is the real nasty one to burn, releases phosgene gas
[14:55:36] <SolarNRG> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhqMvsSdo3A
[14:55:41] <SolarNRG> ignites well easy
[14:55:48] <SolarNRG> defo a fire hazard
[14:56:31] <_methods> skroon: i think lots of sign shops use that stuff to make signs for store fronts and stuff
[14:56:52] <_methods> you might be able to talk to them about speeds and feeds they use to get acceptable cuts
[14:57:06] <SolarNRG> yeah u'll be fine, jsut mill slow, wear a gas mask if ur a pussy don't smoke near it u'r alright
[14:57:39] <SolarNRG> can u laser cut polystyrene?
[14:58:51] <SolarNRG> defo waterjet
[15:00:50] <SolarNRG> anyways it's cooled down now so I'm off 2 cut a cone, hope my reading was useful to u, remember BE SAFE
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[15:17:27] <Loetmichel> solar: you can
[15:17:35] <Loetmichel> ah, already gone
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[15:42:37] <monttyle> http://burningsmell.org/images/v-actuator2.jpg Getting there...
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[15:49:27] <_methods> wtf is that
[15:50:06] <monttyle> Trying to build an X/Y actuator with two motors on one rail.
[15:50:31] <_methods> what advantage does that design provide?
[15:52:30] <monttyle> Compact and mechanically simple.
[15:53:00] <_methods> interesting
[15:54:01] <monttyle> The radial play in the pillow blocks is giving it trouble though. I think I'll have to double up at least one of them.
[15:54:07] <_methods> i bet
[15:54:21] <_methods> looks like a kinematic nightmare
[15:54:24] <SpeedEvil> That seems quite flexible
[15:54:40] <_methods> if the angle is off on the v part on either bearing it will throw everything out
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[15:55:42] <monttyle> Yeah, I quickly figured out the triangle end had to be EXTREMELY rigid.
[15:55:47] <_methods> yeah
[15:56:53] <monttyle> control-wise it's surprisingly simple though, linear in all directions. Turning the threaded rod and holding one puck still moves X. Turning one motor forward and the other back moves Y.
[15:59:25] <SpeedEvil> how ar eyou holding still
[15:59:34] <SpeedEvil> you have two motors?
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[16:00:55] <monttyle> Yes, one's a non-captive motor.
[16:01:48] <monttyle> Kind of 'hollow', the threaded rod winds straight through it
[16:02:23] <SpeedEvil> ah
[16:03:02] <archivist> is this for 3d printer
[16:04:24] <monttyle> Intended for CNC.
[16:04:40] <archivist> machining?
[16:04:54] <SpeedEvil> As long as it's nothing toughened you'll be fine.
[16:05:05] <SpeedEvil> Like, for example, particularly dense expanded polystyrene
[16:05:26] <SpeedEvil> Or hardened merringue
[16:05:40] <SpeedEvil> Is that spelled correctly?
[16:05:50] <archivist> hardly up to the task as regards rigidity for anything much harder than marshmallow
[16:06:40] <monttyle> If you think that's bad, you should have seen my last design.
[16:06:42] * archivist dreams of lemon meringue pie
[16:06:46] <SpeedEvil> Though it does depend on the tooling - what you need to push a 1mm dremel abrasive bit through work at 35000RPM
[16:06:48] <monttyle> http://burningsmell.org/images/crazycnc5.jpg
[16:07:52] <cradek> that looks like it would have a very tiny working area, maybe 1" square?
[16:08:07] <cradek> how do you add a Z?
[16:08:10] <monttyle> Incorrect, 1" equilateral triangle
[16:08:26] <monttyle> There would be a milling head above.
[16:08:50] <monttyle> But yeah -- increasing axis range is why I moved from rotating to sliding joints. Also strength.
[16:08:51] <cradek> well it's not really a triangle either, is it?
[16:09:12] <monttyle> It'd be a warped square root shape of a triangle.
[16:10:22] <archivist> stiffness of those bars against bending moments from cutting forces is rather low for a cnc
[16:12:14] <monttyle> My next attempt will have the bars all together on the bottom.
[16:12:41] <monttyle> And maybe some support underneath
[16:13:28] <monttyle> If I can get it working well enough I might redesign it all with extrusion.
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[16:17:09] <archivist> my failure of the day is my press tool, it split the shim stock, not ductile enough
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[16:37:06] <_methods> ooops
[16:37:59] <archivist> might need to anneal the shim before or during
[16:38:06] <archivist> or rethink
[16:38:24] <_methods> did you acct for material stretch
[16:39:08] <_methods> what material?
[16:39:26] <archivist> I was expecting some stretch, but this is a wing it, hand turned no calcs experiment
[16:39:28] <_methods> and did you lube the forming tool/material?
[16:39:37] <archivist> no lube
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[16:39:42] <_methods> sometimes that will help
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[16:39:52] <_methods> keep the material from tearing
[16:40:04] <_methods> lets it "slide" some in the die/punch
[16:40:29] <zeeshan> what shape were you forming :D
[16:40:52] <zeeshan> i need to clean my Y axis scale
[16:40:59] <zeeshan> had a massive failure yesterday
[16:41:10] <archivist> was 2 thou usafoil
[16:41:15] <zeeshan> i was machining my manifold and the ttool crashed into the wor kpiece
[16:41:19] <zeeshan> and it wasn't even my fault!
[16:41:48] <zeeshan> even though linuxcnc says 2.000 on the readout
[16:41:51] <archivist> something like a bean can base annular corrugations
[16:41:53] <_methods> oh wow super thin
[16:42:04] <zeeshan> putting a dial indicator on the Y axis shows that the axis is moving a whole 200 thou
[16:42:07] <zeeshan> over 5 minutes..
[16:42:12] <zeeshan> in certain locations
[16:42:18] <zeeshan> some locations it's perfectly fine. like 1.000
[16:42:33] <zeeshan> but if i move it in 50 thou increements, there are locations of the scale where it starts moving on its own
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[16:43:34] <zeeshan> =/
[16:46:30] <_methods> might be worth tryin it again using some oil/lube on the material/die/punch
[16:47:31] <archivist> I might polish up the ring that failed so it has less stretch too
[16:47:44] <_methods> yeah smoother is better
[16:47:55] <_methods> aluminum likes to "catch" on tooling when it forms
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[16:48:18] <_methods> i shoot down punches and die with wd-40 every 10-20 parts or so
[16:48:27] <_methods> depending on how bad its galling on my tooling
[16:48:37] <archivist> I have a steel punch and al die
[16:49:14] <SpeedEvil> Impact forming is cool
[16:49:40] <archivist> I dont have the explosives for that
[16:50:30] <_methods> hehe
[16:50:47] <SpeedEvil> Do I mean impact forming?
[16:50:51] <SpeedEvil> Impact extrusion
[16:50:54] <archivist> yorkshire fittings and the copper tee, that is hydraulic pushed out the side
[16:50:55] <SpeedEvil> How they make coke cans
[16:51:07] <_methods> deep draw
[16:51:38] <archivist> I have the Scientific American when that was first developed
[16:51:49] <archivist> it made the cover
[16:52:24] <SpeedEvil> archivist: REally?
[16:52:24] <zeeshan> 5457 magic aluminum
[16:52:27] <zeeshan> that forms so wellllllllll
[16:52:29] <SpeedEvil> You can do that with paper?
[16:52:47] <archivist> SpeedEvil, yup
[16:53:01] <SpeedEvil> nvm. 'It made the cover'
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[16:54:55] <archivist> bah cant find it on google images
[16:55:41] <archivist> amazes me that they also do it with steel cans
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[16:55:57] <SpeedEvil> archivist: I was addressing the purely bad joke 'made the cover' as in 'manufactured the cover by impact forming'
[16:57:08] <archivist> you need to use the IRC irony font for that
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[17:04:01] <zeeshan> archivist: https://www.google.com/patents/US4811582?dq=ininventor:%22Matthew+P.+Sklad%22&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0CB4Q6AEwAGoVChMIgMSRrpjqxgIViQ2SCh3v8wer
[17:04:28] <zeeshan> that patent is held by one of the profs here
[17:04:28] <zeeshan> haha
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[17:04:39] <zeeshan> he gets a huge % of profits from it
[17:04:47] <zeeshan> cause that's used in forming aluminum cans for beverages
[17:04:55] <zeeshan> i need a patent like that :{
[17:05:00] <_methods> heheh
[17:05:09] <_methods> sarcasm and irony font
[17:08:12] <archivist> that references https://www.google.com/patents/US4233831
[17:08:54] <zeeshan> yessir
[17:09:34] <archivist> I seem to remember it was the thickness and depth rather than the speed in the article I read
[17:09:50] <zeeshan> aluminum is highly strain rate sensitive
[17:10:22] <zeeshan> i think you're referring to limit draw ratio
[17:10:36] <zeeshan> which is the blank diameter to cup height
[17:11:22] <zeeshan> ive done some testing on stainless steel and aluminum
[17:11:42] <zeeshan> where you use a hemispherical punch and slowly deform a clamped round specimen
[17:11:43] <archivist> 1970's cans had a bottom, then out came the deep draw ones with a lid and body
[17:12:08] <zeeshan> you notice with punch that the failure happens as a ring
[17:12:14] <zeeshan> well away from the pole
[17:12:23] <zeeshan> you add some grease, it gets closer
[17:12:37] <zeeshan> you add some rubber sheet with grease
[17:12:40] <zeeshan> and bam its almost at the pole!
[17:13:21] <archivist> hmmmm rubber goods
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[17:13:26] <zeeshan> but i noticed metals like 7075 form like ass at room temp
[17:13:28] <zeeshan> 6061 is decent
[17:13:32] <zeeshan> 5457 is boss
[17:13:55] <zeeshan> with a thin material like that
[17:13:58] <zeeshan> i bet any stretch is bad
[17:14:01] <zeeshan> you want to draw it
[17:14:21] <zeeshan> then you can get infinitely long cups :)
[17:14:37] <zeeshan> (depending on how much material is available)
[17:15:17] <archivist> I did consider metal spinning
[17:15:33] <archivist> but that is a black art
[17:15:37] <zeeshan> haha
[17:15:58] <_methods> andypugh seems to have revived it
[17:16:00] <_methods> hehe
[17:16:11] <_methods> he spun those headlights
[17:16:25] <archivist> seen a few vids of the technique
[17:16:46] <roycroft> metal spinning looks kind of scary, but heaps of fun
[17:16:49] <archivist> not sure I could do it to thin shim
[17:17:05] <zeeshan> what shape are you trying to form?
[17:17:08] <Loetmichel> zeeshan; 7075 doesent "form" at all iirc
[17:17:10] <_methods> i have no idea
[17:17:13] <Loetmichel> it shatters
[17:17:15] <zeeshan> Loetmichel: everything forms :)
[17:17:15] <_methods> i've never done it on purpose
[17:17:40] <archivist> try to form cast iron
[17:17:43] <Loetmichel> at room temperature it shatters instead of bending/forming
[17:17:43] <roycroft> try spinning a thin sheet of cast iron some time
[17:17:57] <_methods> hehe
[17:18:09] <zeeshan> Loetmichel: you can do light forming at room temp
[17:18:12] <zeeshan> it still has some ductility
[17:18:13] <zeeshan> not much
[17:18:26] <zeeshan> 10%?
[17:18:27] <zeeshan> i forget
[17:18:28] <Loetmichel> not much is great understatement
[17:18:32] <roycroft> the instant you start spinning it it's no longer at room temperature
[17:18:35] <Loetmichel> less iirc
[17:18:42] <zeeshan> http://asm.matweb.com/search/SpecificMaterial.asp?bassnum=MA7075T6
[17:18:54] <Loetmichel> you can bend a 1mm sheet 7075 with a 20mm inner radius
[17:18:59] <Loetmichel> 10mm and you have 2 parts
[17:19:26] <Loetmichel> been there, tried that ;)
[17:19:40] <zeeshan> basically i was making a pan for my apparatus
[17:19:44] <zeeshan> and needed a 90 degree bend
[17:19:48] <zeeshan> 7075 failed after 45 deg
[17:19:54] <zeeshan> 6061 suceeded
[17:20:04] <zeeshan> but you could see the microcracks
[17:20:11] <zeeshan> 5457 a joke :D
[17:20:12] <Loetmichel> i know
[17:20:19] <Loetmichel> thats my daily job
[17:20:29] <zeeshan> same here! :P
[17:20:39] <Loetmichel> i use a trick tho: i bend by hand and mill it down at the bends to half thickness
[17:20:48] <Loetmichel> and i use AlMg3
[17:20:56] <Loetmichel> not 7075 ;)
[17:21:08] <Loetmichel> no idea what that is in material number tho
[17:21:20] <Loetmichel> 6061 comes close i think
[17:21:47] <Loetmichel> i do thinks like this out of 1,5mm thick sheet: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=15862&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
[17:21:52] <Loetmichel> all bend by hand
[17:22:22] <zeeshan> nice
[17:22:55] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14160&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 <- some fritzbox router enclosures in different states of finishing
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[17:23:10] <Loetmichel> you can see the milled slots
[17:23:58] <zeeshan> what are those boxes for
[17:24:12] <Loetmichel> shielded router enclosures
[17:24:18] <zeeshan> ah
[17:24:27] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14217 <- before/after
[17:24:46] <zeeshan> very nice :)
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[17:26:09] <Loetmichel> of course the wifi/dect antennae are soldered off and deactivated ;)
[17:28:02] <Loetmichel> zeeshan: i had a similar problem to yours
[17:28:14] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=14597&g2_serialNumber=2
[17:28:21] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14778&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
[17:28:30] <Loetmichel> laptop PSU with extended temperature range
[17:28:49] <roycroft> odd
[17:28:55] <Loetmichel> and the only already ribbed al sheets you can buy are cast aluminim
[17:29:01] <roycroft> i'm looking at a paper folder that is rated at 11,000 sheets/hour
[17:29:07] <Loetmichel> ... so they break when you try to bend
[17:29:09] <roycroft> but its monthly duty cycle is 20,000 folds
[17:29:25] <Loetmichel> so i took 4mm sheets of alMg3 and MILLED the ribs in it...
[17:29:27] <roycroft> so it can be use a couple hours/month
[17:29:41] <roycroft> or less than an hour/month if you're doing tri-folds
[17:29:52] <roycroft> seems a little dubious
[17:30:06] <Loetmichel> took quite a bit of time ,)
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[17:32:11] <Loetmichel> zeeshan: there you can see the slots in the sheets even better: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=15332&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
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[17:59:22] <zeeshan> yea :D
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[18:13:45] <Tom_itx> zeeshan, how'd the manifold come out?
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[18:20:42] <zeeshan> Tom_itx: massive failure
[18:20:45] <zeeshan> my Y axis moved by itself
[18:20:48] <zeeshan> crashed into the flange
[18:20:57] <zeeshan> now i have to somehow try to salvage it
[18:20:59] <zeeshan> or replace the flange
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[18:38:23] <Tom_itx> oops
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[18:44:16] <_methods> http://www.hkepc.com/12824/page/17#view
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[18:45:13] <_methods> might have to upgrade on this one
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[18:51:20] <zeeshan> woohoo
[18:51:23] <zeeshan> i have so many tomatos
[18:51:24] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/O5WQ5T6.jpg
[18:52:17] <Tom_itx> any red ones yet?
[18:52:25] <zeeshan> i predict about a week
[18:52:27] <zeeshan> to two
[18:52:29] <_methods> guess i'll wait till dec or so and see if it has any issues
[18:52:52] <PetefromTn_> Jeez man I just spent two and a half hours at the DMV like a moron renewing my one day expired license.....
[18:53:03] <skunkworks> your y axis moved by itself?
[18:53:17] <zeeshan> skunkworks: yes
[18:53:23] <zeeshan> without ferroring
[18:53:44] <skunkworks> points to an encoder issue...
[18:54:00] <_methods> dmv is one of the layers of hell
[18:54:25] <_methods> i'm pretty sure dante is stuck there now
[18:54:37] <PetefromTn_> I think I saw some devils demons and illegals in there heh
[18:54:59] <Tom_itx> long lines and little seating
[18:55:26] <zeeshan> skunkworks: so basically the encoder isn't counting
[18:55:29] <zeeshan> when it's supposed to?
[18:55:35] <Tom_itx> what pisses me off about that is you'll be waiting in line and someone went online and gave themselves a placeholder ahead of you
[18:55:46] <PetefromTn_> I even used the automated teller, did not want to change anything related to my license and I STILL was there for over two hours
[18:56:22] <skunkworks> more likely counting (noise or such) when it isn't supposed to.
[18:56:25] <_methods> heh i got my CDL in virginia and i went into the dmv and there was no one there and like 20 people sitting at the counters
[18:56:36] <_methods> they said the governer had to use a regular dmv one day
[18:56:50] <_methods> and after that he reformed their dmv system lol
[18:57:15] <_methods> no lines at a dmv was just skary
[18:57:46] <jdh> pete: couldn't you have renewed by mail?
[18:57:55] <PetefromTn_> worst part is I found out that I could actually do it online even after it expired
[18:58:15] <PetefromTn_> its been five years so I don't remember last time LOL
[18:58:35] <PetefromTn_> they don't even give you a hard license anymore at the DMV
[18:58:50] <_methods> hahah
[18:58:52] <PetefromTn_> they give you this printed copy until the real one arrives in the mail.
[18:58:59] <Tom_itx> yeah same here
[18:59:19] <Tom_itx> issued from the state instead of the local office
[18:59:31] <PetefromTn_> the guy at the desk told me they do that to ensure it goes to the correct address LOL
[19:00:04] <_methods> that's funny kid you don't look like you're 55
[19:00:22] <PetefromTn_> I guess people were lying about thier actual address to get valid licenses..... unbelievable
[19:00:32] <_methods> hehe
[19:00:36] <_methods> mclovin
[19:02:05] <skunkworks> zeeshan: did it stay off?
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[19:06:42] <skunkworks> or not counting.. :)
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[19:09:09] <zeeshan> sec
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[19:09:42] <zeeshan> skunkworks: if it was counting when it wasn't supposed to
[19:09:54] <zeeshan> wouldn't that show in the dro
[19:13:24] <furrywolf> ARGH
[19:13:36] <furrywolf> I tried going back to work today... failed miserably.
[19:15:15] <furrywolf> I can barely walk, I crunched my neck trying to look behind backing up the van and fell over onto the passenger seat, I'm back to having my leg numb, everything hurts too much to move.
[19:15:15] <furrywolf> this is really fucking pissing me off!
[19:16:53] <furrywolf> I told the people I work for that they should start trying to find someone else, as I don't know when or if I'll ever be able to do my job again.
[19:17:31] <furrywolf> I haven't had any income for almost a month now, and I really need to be working...
[19:18:21] * furrywolf curls up into a painful and depressed wolfyball
[19:18:59] <zeeshan> sue that person!
[19:19:20] <PetefromTn_> Sounds like you might need a Chiropractor
[19:19:30] <furrywolf> she lives in the low-income retirement apartment complex. probably doesn't have any money.
[19:19:46] <CaptHindsight> the shop needs air conditioning
[19:19:54] <furrywolf> PetefromTn_: I think I need a lot more than a chiropractor.
[19:19:58] <PetefromTn_> CaptHindsight So does mine LOL
[19:20:09] <cradek> sounds like you need short or long term disability income
[19:20:20] <CaptHindsight> I left the doors open for the painters to do the jambs
[19:20:49] <CaptHindsight> and now it's a humid mess
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[19:21:22] <PetefromTn_> I have a couple different window AC units in the attic and also one of those floor mounted ones that goes thru the window I can use probably that I bought when our old AC unit in the house stopped working
[19:21:45] <CaptHindsight> ever stand at look at the parts and it's so hot and muggy you don't know what to do with them
[19:21:57] <PetefromTn_> I kept saying I would sell them to help pay myself back for the new AC unit but I keep thinking what if something goes wrong with it at some point then I am screwd
[19:22:21] <furrywolf> cradek: from where? she (the responsible driver) has crap insurance and probably has no money.
[19:22:51] <PetefromTn_> there are plenty of people on disability that were injured by people with no money
[19:23:21] <cradek> yeah, I mean the first-world social program type of help, not the car insurance type of help
[19:23:34] <furrywolf> I'm not about to be a government parasite.
[19:23:47] <PetefromTn_> you should see if you can get a job doing phone based technical support....you are pretty good at it!
[19:23:55] <_methods> lol
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[19:24:09] <cradek> being able to eat while you heal up is a good thing
[19:24:14] <furrywolf> I'm only good at it on irc. on the phone they can hear the sound of my head hitting the desk. :P
[19:24:20] <cradek> heh
[19:24:27] <PetefromTn_> yeah there is nothing wrong with getting help when you ACTUALLY need it
[19:24:53] <PetefromTn_> there are plenty of sapsuckers that get it and don't need it
[19:25:33] <PetefromTn_> not that I am advocating welfare here just saying if you really can't work due to injuries and have no other recourse it is there.
[19:26:14] <PetefromTn_> Oh and I agree about the phone and actually hearing the frustration in your voice might cause problems..hehe
[19:26:35] <cradek> yeah, you guys can never hear the things I say to the screen
[19:26:42] <_methods> hehe
[19:26:42] <PetefromTn_> like JEEZ MAN this asshole doesn't even know how to use a chinese DC power supply!!!!
[19:27:00] <furrywolf> nah, I'm nicer than that. :P
[19:27:10] <_methods> cradek: did you see that motorcycle with teh nixie speedometer
[19:27:13] <furrywolf> asshole requires an attitude, not just ignorance. :)
[19:27:35] <cradek> _methods: no (nixies don't work in sunlight)
[19:27:39] <PetefromTn_> besides they mostly do online tech support nowadays anyways...
[19:28:13] <_methods> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QoKS5pUxWZg
[19:29:31] <PetefromTn_> thats pretty cool
[19:29:36] * zeeshan is swearing at all of you
[19:29:37] <PetefromTn_> I LOVE Cafe racers
[19:29:40] <zeeshan> :-)
[19:29:54] * PetefromTn_ thinks Zeeshan can kiss it :D
[19:29:56] <_methods> figured cradek might be interested
[19:30:11] <cradek> outdoors, overcast? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8N6n4Epcdw8
[19:30:34] <_methods> no idea
[19:30:38] <PetefromTn_> I really want to build one here
[19:30:40] <_methods> i know you had some nixie projects
[19:30:46] <_methods> thought you might get a kick out of that
[19:30:49] <cradek> thanks
[19:30:59] <cradek> (I've made clocks out of all sorts of things)
[19:31:05] <PetefromTn_> I have visions of grandeur of machining custom triple clamps and clip ons etc etc.
[19:31:07] <_methods> i have no idea if they're even nixie tubes
[19:31:11] <_methods> i'm a nixie n00b
[19:31:13] <cradek> yeah, they are
[19:31:22] <_methods> actually not even a n00b
[19:31:26] <_methods> i just like them
[19:31:27] <PetefromTn_> Need to find me a decent builder for a song
[19:34:07] <CaptHindsight> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8Wx2PHIYGI Droplet Dancing
[19:35:41] <zeeshan> wow CaptHindsight
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[19:35:46] <_methods> cool
[19:35:47] <zeeshan> that surface tension based sorting
[19:35:48] <zeeshan> that is COOL
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[19:46:45] <SpeedEvil> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZIv6WtSF9I 52 axes of lamb nightmare
[19:47:05] <SpeedEvil> Scott - Automated Lamb Boning System 2011
[19:52:08] <XXCoder> cant imang ecleaning whole thing
[19:55:54] <furrywolf> it's hard to imagine that's cheaper than immigrant labor...
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[19:56:37] <XXCoder> very high inital cost, but number of workers in few years and its paid off
[19:57:03] <XXCoder> I would say it would need hmm 20 workers to go at same speed
[19:58:05] <_methods> http://www.commitstrip.com/en/2015/07/15/a-brief-history-of-flash/
[19:58:26] <XXCoder> 16627.2 year wage * 20 workers = 332,544
[19:58:58] <XXCoder> I assumed $8 minium wage and 20 workers, I'm sure it needs more.
[19:59:50] <CaptHindsight> it's interesting to see what has to be SS vs what doesn't in that meat plant
[20:00:15] <furrywolf> ss or not, it's probably all designed for washdown duty.
[20:01:24] <SpeedEvil> I would be very surprised if there aren't a lot of high-pressure wash nozzles around
[20:01:38] <XXCoder> maybe
[20:01:56] <CaptHindsight> they make such a big deal about SS and then there are robots arms draped with plastic, so it must be up to the inspectors opinion
[20:02:27] <SpeedEvil> They may simply replace the plastic daily.
[20:02:33] <PetefromTn_> does this mean we dont need flash player anymore LOL
[20:02:34] <SpeedEvil> Plus - it may be at 5C or so
[20:03:12] <_methods> that is a LOT of stainless
[20:03:48] <SpeedEvil> So - the conclusion of the Falcon 9 launch accident is that it needs more struts.
[20:03:52] <SpeedEvil> They analysed struts holding the helium pressurisation tank down in the upper stage, and found that a percent or so of them failed at 1/10th design failure load
[20:04:02] <_methods> yeah i'm sure there is a kerbal joke in there somewhere
[20:04:22] <_methods> need more strut
[20:04:44] <SpeedEvil> 'After testing at an enormous number, found one that fialed at below 2,000 lb. level. Did some material analysis, problem w/ grain structure
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[20:40:42] <XXCoder> CaptHindsight: probably easy to detech parts that get dirty to clean
[20:41:15] <XXCoder> you notice machines that go all over is completely covered in plastic. probably often replaced
[20:41:26] <XXCoder> plastic
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[21:05:55] <Deejay> gn8
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[21:11:56] * JT-Shop fires up the plasma table
[21:13:12] * furrywolf sits around being useless
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[21:17:31] <SpeedEvil> furrywolf: still not better?
[21:20:09] <furrywolf> no
[21:20:17] <furrywolf> I tried working today, and now can hardly move.
[21:23:54] <SpeedEvil> Damn.
[21:23:56] <SpeedEvil> :/
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[21:45:13] <PetefromTn_> Damn man I think it is gonna rain and thunderstorm all summer long!!
[21:46:48] <furrywolf> it's been nice the last few days here, but I've been too useless to enjoy them.
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[21:57:02] <PetefromTn_> WOAH man that bolt just shook the whole damn house LOL jeez man the gods must be PISSED!!
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[22:03:40] <_methods> oh no its hittin you now?
[22:03:52] <_methods> probably be hittin us tonight then
[22:04:45] <PetefromTn_> yep get ready man the stuff is heading your way
[22:05:32] <_methods> i hope not my dog goes nuts
[22:05:38] <_methods> that means no sleep for me
[22:05:48] <PetefromTn_> Your dog too...
[22:05:52] <_methods> yeah
[22:05:57] <PetefromTn_> my Husky DOES NOT LIKE BANGS OF ANY SORT!!
[22:06:05] <_methods> he got so bad the other day he wouldn't stop vomiting
[22:06:06] <PetefromTn_> he cowers like a baby in the corner
[22:06:11] <_methods> we had to take him to the vet
[22:06:14] <PetefromTn_> WOAH he never vomited
[22:06:21] <_methods> yeah it was bad
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[22:06:27] <_methods> he couldnt keep anything down
[22:07:16] <PetefromTn_> when we first got him he was on the run outside when our neighbor had to shoot another neighbor's Pit bull with his 12gauge home protection weapon because it was killing his cat and the dog watched the whole thing.
[22:07:28] <PetefromTn_> he has not been the same since when it comes to loud bangs
[22:07:54] <_methods> i bet
[22:08:06] <PetefromTn_> Oh and fireworks are just as bad
[22:08:15] <_methods> yeah mine is same with them too
[22:08:28] <_methods> we gave him valium on 4th this year
[22:08:31] <_methods> that worked pretty good
[22:08:35] <PetefromTn_> our mortars we shot off on the 4th had him cowering again in the corner inside
[22:08:46] <_methods> we tried buspirone and acepromazine but neither of those worked well
[22:09:49] <_methods> heh the buspirone was the worst
[22:09:58] <_methods> he actually tried to bite me when he was on that
[22:10:19] <PetefromTn_> damn
[22:10:47] <_methods> yeah
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[22:15:32] <JT-Shop> yea my Cocoa didn't like loud noises either
[22:17:07] <_methods> we got him from the pound
[22:17:15] <_methods> and he was like 3 or 4
[22:17:27] <_methods> i think the people that had him before left him oustside all the time
[22:17:46] <_methods> the spca said he was a bad digger
[22:17:54] <_methods> and hes never dug in our yard
[22:18:40] <PetefromTn_> I got my last pup from the pound. He was a Cocker Spaniel and he was a great dog. Sad he is no longer with us.
[22:19:03] <_methods> yeah i'll never buy a dog from a breeder
[22:19:11] <_methods> there are just too many dogs at the pound for that
[22:20:28] <PetefromTn_> the only reason we got our husky is because we got him from a craigslist ad that was from a wife of a soldier who was going to be overseas for extended periods of time and he did not want his wife to be burdened with taking care of him while he was gone.
[22:29:24] <furrywolf> my dog didn't care too much about noises. a relative's dog completely freaked out every time. my neighbor's dog has been out hunting/shooting enough that she doesn't care in the slightest...
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[23:07:11] <Valen> no such thing as an outside dog
[23:07:33] <Valen> there are dogs that are kept outside, but there is no such thing as an outside dog
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[23:35:03] <CaptHindsight> XXCoder: you mean that they just wash everything down daily? They don't firebomb the plant every night to sanitize and rebuild? :)
[23:35:22] <PetefromTn_> Valen I agree man all of our dogs have always been inside dogs unless they are out on the run or the leash but they are in the house most of the time and every night.
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