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[00:01:25] <Tom_itx> how'd those other parts turn out?
[00:01:32] <zeeshan|2> which ones
[00:01:33] <zeeshan|2> the barbs?|
[00:01:42] <Tom_itx> the ones you turned to mill the bottom off
[00:01:55] <zeeshan|2> ah
[00:02:00] <zeeshan|2> i just grabbed them in the vise
[00:02:03] <zeeshan|2> with a tig wire in between
[00:02:07] <zeeshan|2> seemed to hold them fine lol
[00:02:20] <zeeshan|2> skimmed the top till it was like 20 tho thick
[00:02:23] <zeeshan|2> then broke the pieces off
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[00:02:33] <zeeshan|2> fishy business :P
[00:02:36] <Valen> what is the name of the way of mounting ballnuts such that wobble etc in the screw isn't translated to the machine?
[00:09:17] <gromits> I have read the classic ladder documentation, tutorials, etc. I kind of get it, but am having problems getting started, mostly trying to relate in my head how the relays, etc in the gui get related to actual pins. Can I play with it live while Axis (and the classic ladder gui) is running?
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[00:12:38] <skunkworks> gromits: yes
[00:12:57] <skunkworks> there is a classic ladder config,
[00:13:06] <skunkworks> iirc
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[00:17:44] <gromits> I have CL running (not in front of me but at the shop) and have a mylathe.clp file. So check my thinking.... I can create a rung that has a NO relay which gets set to be the HAL variable called collet-close. I string that to an output that is set to hm2.5i25.0.0.output-11 (or somesuch), and when the input is triggered the output gets set. I set those relationships in the HAL file, or do...
[00:17:46] <gromits> ...I do it in the CL interface?
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[00:46:34] <JuzCnc> Hi guys, Is it recommand to have linuxcnc-dev version as the same version linuxcnc debs?
[00:48:51] <Crom> if your futznig with things
[00:48:52] <Valen> MattyMatt: what were you using as your search terms when you found those motors?
[00:49:13] <Valen> searching for "Servo motor" is surprisingly unhelpful
[00:49:18] <Crom> I don't have -dev installed on this machine
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[01:51:00] <Valen> are mesa's 7i29's going to come back into stock at some point?
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[02:38:31] <JuzCnc> Hi I am currently running the lucid linuxcnc package, if I were to update linux kernel for onboard drivers. would that be a problem for linuxcnc?
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[02:52:05] <cradek> you betcha
[02:52:21] <cradek> if you change the kernel you have to compile rtai and linuxcnc to match it
[02:52:53] <cradek> probably easier to move to wheezy, if it supports your hardware, or else just replace the hardware
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[03:06:19] <JuzCnc> thanks, would keep that as final option but first would still want to fight with the system before giving up. ;) if I backport a display port driver them to lucid would they work cos I am having pretty bad latency could be cause by the nvidia graphic card
[03:14:04] <cradek> this is for a video card!? just use a different one. try ten, they're cheap or free
[03:14:24] <cradek> I have a stash of matrox millenium II pci cards, they always work
[03:15:04] <cradek> unless your time is free!
[03:15:27] <cradek> if you install the matching header package, you can in theory build drivers against that kernel, but jeez it's old
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[03:43:42] <JuzCnc> thanks cradek, you are right. really regretting getting a high end pc to do machining
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[04:08:12] <alex4nder> hmm
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[06:01:28] <MattyMatt> Valen, "3 phase servo motor" search term
[06:09:02] <MattyMatt> http://www.ebay.com.au/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_nkw=3+phase+servo+motor&rt=nc&LH_Auction=1
[06:09:22] <MattyMatt> doesn't work so great on ebay.au tho
[06:11:48] <MattyMatt> so, why can't you use an induction motor as a servo? is it just the behaviour at close to 0Hz that's different?
[06:14:58] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: Was it you looking for temp sensors?
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[06:15:31] <Jymmm> Tom_itx:
http://www.amazon.com/Vktech-DS18b20-Waterproof-Temperature-Transmitter/dp/B00CHEZ250/
[06:18:47] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: you can connect them in a master/slave(s) configuration on a single bus
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[06:23:36] <Jymmm> Tom_itx:
http://www.maximintegrated.com/en/products/analog/sensors-and-sensor-interface/DS1822.html/tb_tab2#tab2
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[06:35:07] <MrSunshine> hmm checking a round shaft for straightness is one thing, how to check a rectangular or square tube for straightness ?
[06:35:27] <MrSunshine> ofc, using a surface guage one could just flip it over and check the sides against eachotehr but
[06:35:36] <MrSunshine> maybe a machinist level to run over it ?
[06:35:38] <archivist> a straight edge, or a level
[06:36:58] <MrSunshine> but a straight edge .. how do you know that one is realy straight? :P
[06:37:14] <Crom> sighting sticks or parallels, look over them to see if you have twist. straight edge for flatness
[06:37:29] <MrSunshine> hell .. if its long it just needs a little bang to bend quite thick and stirdy stuff
[06:37:46] <MrSunshine> Crom: could use the level for twist also
[06:38:25] <Crom> true, but not my levels, bubles are too shor
[06:38:27] <Crom> t
[06:38:39] <MrSunshine> hell got a level that claims 0.02mm/meter so i guess that would do close enough =)
[06:40:46] <archivist> look at machine too measuring with levels and interferometers, where you move along the bed noting the local angle making a graph of the wavyness
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[06:51:39] <Deejay> moin
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[08:02:51] <Tom_itx> Jymmm, that's the Dallas onewire protocol
[08:05:18] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: and?
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[08:13:03] <Jymmm> http://playground.arduino.cc/Learning/OneWire
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[10:12:17] <Valen> MattyMatt: induction motors have all sorts of magic in them, they depend on rotating magnetic fields to produce a torque
[10:12:45] <Valen> and they have slip between the rotating magnetic field and the rotor in order to work
[10:13:27] <Valen> one with magnets is basically a stepper with fancy electronics, the magnetic field produced by the windings is locked to the position of the rotor
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[10:14:27] <Valen> you can use AC servo's to do stuff, but the mesa 8i20 won't drive them, so you need a driver and then to interface with it and I have an irrational dislike for analouge segments in my setup lol
[10:16:14] <Valen> do levels get better than ~.02mm /meter archivist?
[10:16:46] <Valen> I'm pondering how to align the rails on a gantry machine that won't have the best foundation
[10:17:28] <Valen> cracked concrete on clay so it may go up and down with the ground water levels
[10:19:28] <malcom2073> How accurate do you need? I've seen people put rails direct on
[10:19:33] <malcom2073> steel beams*
[10:19:47] <malcom2073> as long as one rail is aligned to the other, and they're fairly level they do ok
[10:20:02] <Valen> its aligning the two rails that is my query
[10:20:31] <malcom2073> My plan is actually to use the gantry itself on the one I'm building. Get one rail secured, then run the gantry along the other and adjust as needed as I tighten down
[10:21:09] <Valen> I'm thinking of a laser system to get the beams straight, and the machine should be relativley good at keeping them so, but where the feet go could well move some
[10:26:46] <SpeedEvil> Verdi:
http://www.totallyscrewedmachineshop.com/documents/FoundationsofMechanicalAccuracy.pdf
[10:26:48] <SpeedEvil> Valen:
[10:27:31] <Valen> but thats *long* lol
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[10:49:03] <jthornton> I must have a bad network connection on the shop computer the backup speed was 0.12 MB/s
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[11:04:43] <SpeedEvil> varesa: yes.
[11:04:49] <SpeedEvil> oops
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[12:46:17] <dirty_d> these bearings should probably be replaced right?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DUtQHQ4PAME
[12:46:59] <dirty_d> first video cleaned with WD-40, then this one lubed with oil
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exF--umgc5E
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[13:11:43] <skunkworks> gromits, !!
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[13:14:08] <archivist> dirty_d, too quiet to make a judgement
[13:14:22] <dirty_d> yea it was louder in the reals
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[13:14:40] <dirty_d> i could tilt the bearing a little bit
[13:14:45] <dirty_d> but no noticable radial play
[13:14:52] <archivist> I think your camera shuts down the audio due to tapping the camera
[13:14:59] <dirty_d> hmm
[13:15:17] <dirty_d> the noise was worst cleaned with wd-40
[13:15:21] <archivist> that click at the beginning of the vid
[13:15:23] <dirty_d> almost silent lubed with oil
[13:16:03] <archivist> silen with oil is not too bad, can you see pitting in the races
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[13:21:19] <archivist> !later Valen my Cooke Troughton & Simms Ltd 12 inch level 1 div= .0005" in 10" .05mm in 1M easily senses the floor bending, will also see you machine bend when you lean on it with your little finger
[13:21:19] <the_wench> will tell Valen when he/she joins next
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[13:22:29] <skunkworks> we have a .0005" level too.. works really great for leveling machines..
[13:22:58] <archivist> I think he wants an excessive resolution for his job
[13:23:28] <archivist> but good levels are magic :)
[13:23:33] <skunkworks> they are.
[13:24:31] <archivist> a pair of us made some wooden steps, got the sides slope parallel to 19 minutes
[13:24:41] <archivist> was a giggle
[13:24:45] <skunkworks> heh
[13:25:13] <archivist> I wonder how far they have moved since
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[13:28:53] <MrSunshine> who wants excessive resolution for a job? =)
[13:29:36] <MrSunshine> ahh Valen
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[13:42:47] <dirty_d> archivist, nope no pitting or rust, looks perfect
[13:43:03] <archivist> use them then
[13:43:58] <archivist> they will probably never sound nice dry or nearly dry with wd40
[13:45:05] <archivist> I assume this is that experimental fuel injection thing
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[13:52:34] <JT-Shop> dang it's cold this morning
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[14:27:18] <dirty_d> archivist, no this is a friends jet ski
[14:27:32] <dirty_d> the taper where the flywheel mounts is haggard beyond repair
[14:28:22] <archivist> ran it loose?
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[14:30:09] <witnit> Im not using joint 1 and i have no limit switches connected, yet i get random joint 0 or 1 following error and error on limit switch. Im using a ti33 and 7i90.
[14:30:30] <witnit> 7i33*
[14:31:25] <archivist> limit switch configured but not wired? (we had one a few days ago do that
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[14:37:14] <witnit> yeah, they configured, not wired
[14:37:41] <archivist> then make sure pulled up/down as needed
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[14:38:07] <dirty_d> archivist, i have no idea what actually happened, i have a feeling it was like that when he bought it
[14:38:38] <witnit> well, im also getting random following errors on axis which are not attached either
[14:38:44] <dirty_d> i think someone might have put it together wrong
[14:38:56] <witnit> so i feel like the two problem are not connected
[14:39:03] <witnit> are connected*
[14:39:04] <archivist> dirty_d, lots of bodgers about
[14:39:20] <archivist> witnit, porbably not connected
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[14:41:12] <witnit> well i will try to drive the z axis and will get joint 0, joint 1, and limit switch errors, back to back, but otherwise it may run fine. is it possible a realtime issue would call random faults to the card?
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[14:41:39] <archivist> dont think so
[14:42:08] <archivist> unless you have really dodgy wiring and noise problems
[14:43:22] <pcw_home> random errors scattered between axis may be interface related
[14:45:18] <pcw_home> errors on EPP interface to 7I90 could cause bad encoder reads which would show up as random following errors
[14:45:59] <MattyMatt> dirty_d, there's no such thing as haggard beyond repair, if you watch enough keith fenner vids
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[14:46:30] <MattyMatt> he'd blob it up with weld, then machine it true again
[14:46:47] <pcw_home> so perhaps noise getting into interface or a ground loop (so significant HF current feeding though interface cable to PC ground)
[14:48:50] <dirty_d> MattyMatt, well i really mean haggard beyond my ability to repair
[14:49:04] <dirty_d> if i had a lathe maybe, but even then i dont know the taper angle and dimensions and stuff
[14:49:19] <dirty_d> its that screwed up that there is nothing that can be measured
[14:49:34] <MattyMatt> and no lathe could be a problem :)
[14:50:32] <dirty_d> oh haha, ive seen taht channel
[14:50:33] <witnit> pcw_home go to work so i can call in two more of these cards :)
[14:50:37] <dirty_d> diy 3d metal printing
[14:51:25] <witnit> I will try taking the extension cable out of the loop and use an alternative power supply for the mesa cards
[14:52:05] <witnit> the wiring is very simple in the machine, strange it is pulling these errors, so it could be the extension cable to
[14:52:23] <witnit> the cards or it could be EM near the boards?
[14:52:55] <witnit> possibly a goofy epp?
[14:55:13] <pcw_home> My guess would be direct coupling to the EPP cable or a ground loop
[14:56:09] <MattyMatt> all 3d metal printing I know leaves either a porous sintered form, or a welded one, which is like cast metal, so it'll probably still need machining
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[14:57:31] <witnit> ok, lets say its the the motor V is feeding back into the card via encoder or through the drv/gnd signal lines via the amp?
[14:58:55] <witnit> is it possible the encoders are drawing too much on the card and my card is under powered?
[14:59:49] <dirty_d> this was fun to get off
http://imgur.com/pJvimOT.jpg
[15:00:03] <archivist> coupling inductively, capacitively, or on the ground and therefore a common mode problem
[15:00:40] <pcw_home> sure that needs to be checked with a voltmeter
[15:00:42] <pcw_home> but most noise problems I have seen can be traced to ground loops
[15:01:53] <archivist> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ground_loop_%28electricity%29
[15:05:27] <DaPeace> thanks for helping me yesterday guys.. 2 steppers on x-axis is working without problems.. stepperconf is only running one of both steppers but axis and gmoccapy are doing what i want :-)
[15:06:39] <witnit> well i have the machine about 2 towns over, everything worked well here then i sent it over, they built it a new box and wired it up, i checked everything out and now fired it and am now getting wild errors. thanks for the help guys im headed over right now to double check all these intereferance possibilities
[15:07:39] <archivist> dont forget your scope :)
[15:08:27] <witnit> I built a rack for it, to hang in the back of the pick-up truck cab window
[15:08:35] <MattyMatt> DaPeace, you could've run 2 steppers off 1 driver.
[15:08:54] * archivist slaps MattyMatt bodge
[15:08:54] <MattyMatt> it's a bit evil, but it works
[15:09:25] <MattyMatt> in parallel if the driver has enough amps, or series if it doesn't
[15:09:34] <archivist> and also fails to get the phases correct for a square gantry
[15:10:09] <dirty_d> i need to make a jet ski trailer on the cheap
[15:10:14] <dirty_d> should i just use aluminum?
[15:10:41] <dirty_d> cheaper than stainless
[15:11:23] <MattyMatt> isn't it always cheaper to start with a plain trailer chassis?
[15:12:17] <dirty_d> i dont have one
[15:12:23] <MattyMatt> craigslist do
[15:13:48] <MattyMatt> trailer wheel bearings are a surprisingly cheap source of tapered roller bearings, as an aside :)
[15:13:56] <dirty_d> cant find anything appropriate, and its all expensive anyway
[15:14:07] <SpeedEvil> search wheel bearing
[15:14:10] <SpeedEvil> on ebay
[15:14:26] <dirty_d> leaf springs and wheels will be the most expensive
[15:14:31] <dirty_d> the metal is cheap as hell
[15:14:49] <MattyMatt> I don't want random sizes. trailer wheels are all 1" or 1.25", worldwide. good for open source
[15:14:53] <dirty_d> jet ski is only 250lbs
[15:14:56] <archivist> or scrap like
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/181748070076
[15:15:11] <SpeedEvil> dirty_d: scrapyard
[15:15:24] <dirty_d> thats where i get the metal
[15:16:05] <archivist> two mini rear hubs
[15:16:17] <SpeedEvil> old mini
[15:16:33] <dirty_d> hmm, i see no leaf srpings for less than like 1500lbs
[15:16:37] <SpeedEvil> basically look for the smallest vehicle you can find
[15:17:04] <SpeedEvil> for 250lb, you could make wood leaf springs just fine
[15:17:05] <archivist> get a subframe of old mini includes all you need
[15:17:47] <dirty_d> id use these with no springs,
http://www.amazon.com/WheelEez-Low-Pressure-Polyurethane-Wheel-WZ1-30UA/dp/B002R664AK/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1432221423&sr=8-1&keywords=balloon+tires
[15:17:53] <dirty_d> dont think theyre street legal though
[15:18:37] <dirty_d> the laws are rediculously vague
[15:18:39] <archivist> using old car bits gets you stuff capable
[15:18:48] <dirty_d> yea
[15:18:55] <dirty_d> i want it to be as light as possile
[15:19:11] <SpeedEvil> dirty_d: motorbike bits?
[15:19:14] <dirty_d> because i want to tow it with my car and be able to cart it by hand down a sand beach if i need to
[15:19:24] <archivist> look for indispension units too
[15:20:14] <dirty_d> neat
http://www.indespension.co.uk/213-units-complete-with-stub-axle
[15:20:18] <dirty_d> didnt know those existed
[15:20:42] <archivist> no leaf springs needed
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Indespension-TRAILER-SUSPENSION-UNITS-500KG-with-hubs-bearings-and-caps-/111675230984
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[15:23:50] <dirty_d> trailer might be too light for those
[15:24:21] <archivist> dont forget your load too
[15:25:06] <dirty_d> load is 250lb
[15:25:11] <SpeedEvil> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-Heavy-Duty-Metal-Green-Garden-Cart-Barrow-Utility-Trolley-Garden-Home-/181736601803?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item2a505878cb
[15:25:16] <SpeedEvil> I'm sure this'll work just fine
[15:25:49] <dirty_d> i dont think i can tow that
[15:25:58] <archivist> they bed very easily /me has experience :)
[15:26:02] <archivist> bend
[15:26:46] <dirty_d> archivist, the indespension units?
[15:26:56] <archivist> those garden barrows
[15:27:35] <archivist> indespension units are a little stiff and can get hard with age
[15:27:43] <dirty_d> that thing has suspension?
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[15:28:01] <archivist> only the tires
[15:28:07] <dirty_d> yikes
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[15:28:23] <dirty_d> i think i can just make my own suspension
[15:28:30] <dirty_d> mount the tire on a lever with a regular spring
[15:28:59] <archivist> the rubber in the indespension acts as a damper too
[15:29:30] <MattyMatt> does the jetbike resemble a quadbike from the same manufacturer?
[15:29:53] * MattyMatt just remembers jeremy clarkson's one
[15:30:02] <dirty_d> ill use a copper pipe and rod with a neodymium magnet piston bolted on it as a damper in the middle of the spring
[15:30:07] <dirty_d> just kidding
[15:31:23] <dirty_d> but it would work!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keMpUaoA3Tg
[15:33:04] <MattyMatt> it works with alu too
[15:33:18] <dirty_d> https://www.kjmagnetics.com/proddetail.asp?prod=RX038DCB-N52
[15:33:20] <dirty_d> ahh yes
[15:33:50] <MattyMatt> where that'd be good is as a speed limiter on the ramp, which wou've extended so you can ride straight into the water
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[15:34:18] <MattyMatt> fairground rides and elevators use them all the time now
[15:34:25] <MattyMatt> frictionless brake
[15:34:35] <dirty_d> https://www.onlinemetals.com/merchant.cfm?pid=6996&step=4&showunits=inches&id=71&top_cat=0
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[15:34:56] <dirty_d> its like they were made for each other
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[15:35:47] <Rab> Is the effect dependant on the mass/wall thickness of the tube?
[15:35:52] <dirty_d> probably
[15:36:10] <dirty_d> i have no idea how to figure out how much damping there would actually be
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[15:37:12] <dirty_d> probably like the resistance of a ring of the pipe the same height as the magnet
[15:37:17] <dirty_d> and the velocity of the magnet
[15:37:23] <dirty_d> and stuff
[15:37:44] <archivist> thicker copper= more current, more field
[15:37:57] <MattyMatt> if you geared up the spring travel, with a quadrant etc, you'd get more damping for less weight
[15:38:07] <dirty_d> wont it mot matter after a certain thickness because of inverse square strength of the field
[15:38:17] <MattyMatt> 2 small magnets either side of an alu quadrant, like brake calipers
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[15:38:54] <dirty_d> beyond 3/16" it probably wont do any more
[15:39:06] <dirty_d> wild ass guess
[15:39:34] <dirty_d> do i even need any damping?
[15:39:39] <dirty_d> leaf springs dont right?
[15:39:43] <dirty_d> or is the rubber?
[15:39:54] <MattyMatt> jetbikes are made for bumpy rides
[15:40:15] <dirty_d> yea not worried about that, more worried about the trailer getting out of control somehow
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[15:40:36] <dirty_d> like bouncing
[15:40:39] <dirty_d> maybe swerving
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[15:40:53] <archivist> damping, the right much
[15:42:28] <SpeedEvil> MattyMatt: that would also - gearingup - massively increase 'unsprung weight'
[15:42:32] <MattyMatt> active suspension. put the magnet calipers on a servo loop
[15:42:55] <MattyMatt> just gear it up for the damper
[15:43:15] <MattyMatt> if you need to, dunno how smooth the intended roads are
[15:43:53] <MattyMatt> if it's an off road trailer then it's likely going fast enough to work a mag damper alreader
[15:44:22] <SpeedEvil> Also - supermagnets die at ~80C
[15:44:36] <SpeedEvil> andthe damper is not lossless
[15:44:57] <MattyMatt> ah right :)
[15:45:32] <MattyMatt> it'll be in the wind, but constant use on a suspension is not how I've seen these work
[15:46:42] <dirty_d> well the damper is all loss right?
[15:47:12] <dirty_d> converts all of the work to heat
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[15:47:17] <SpeedEvil> dirty_d: yes - you have losses - resistive - in the copper/Al
[15:47:49] <dirty_d> i guess i can use go cart tires
[15:47:51] <MattyMatt> put a row of magnets through a coil. regenerative damping
[15:47:56] <dirty_d> trailers below 3000lb dont need to be inspected
[15:48:21] <dirty_d> and i dont raelly plan on going on the highway
[15:48:37] <MattyMatt> regenerative damping powers GPS theft tracker. works forever no battery
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[15:49:47] <MattyMatt> "the signal's getting stronger, colonel. they've left the hardtop"
[15:50:37] <dirty_d> cat beat that price
http://www.amazon.com/NEW-10-AIR-Tires-Wheels/dp/B000J6A4S8/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1432223416&sr=8-1&keywords=go+cart+tires
[15:50:54] <MattyMatt> yeah I saw those
[15:51:46] <MattyMatt> good robot wheels, but I wouldn't trust them on the road
[15:51:57] <MattyMatt> certainly not above 30mph
[15:52:11] <SpeedEvil> I wish there was a nice way to drive those
[15:52:13] <dirty_d> because of the rubber?
[15:52:33] <SpeedEvil> Actually - those aren't bad
[15:52:47] <dirty_d> you can make a flange from a large od pipe and a plate
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[15:52:51] <dirty_d> then bolt it to the hub
[15:52:56] <dirty_d> and mount a sprocket on it
[15:53:19] <SpeedEvil> yeah - the ones I saw were considerably more annoying to mount to - that doesn't look too bad as it's flat
[15:54:25] <dirty_d> im reading comments saying not to use it for even a go cart
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[16:03:05] <dirty_d> i could do something silly like torsion bar suspension
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[16:09:55] <MattyMatt> rear frame off a renault 16 will get you a good setup like that
[16:10:29] <archivist> they all went back to iron ore :)
[16:11:19] <MattyMatt> mine was on its way at the time :)
[16:13:06] <MattyMatt> dirty_d, attach hoverskirt for towing jetski. also useful for large flat beaches
[16:13:47] <MattyMatt> too much top gear
[16:15:04] <MattyMatt> http://www.amazon.com/How-To-Plans-PLAN0053a-Utility-Trailer-Plans/dp/B00BGSB4PK/
[16:15:32] <archivist> I wonder how many of the DAF rubber band cars are left
[16:18:01] <archivist> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DAF_Daffodil
[16:19:24] <archivist> my lathe has the same idea for variable speed and predates that
[16:19:48] <MattyMatt> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AC-INVACAR-Model-70-Salisbury-Variable-DRIVE-PULLEY-NOS-Invalid-Carriage-/131506577378
[16:19:53] <Rab> 0-50 MPH time was a 29 seconds, as tested by the Consumers Union in the United States.
[16:20:31] <MattyMatt> aargh, £45 is just the pulley. that invacar looks tidy
[16:21:32] <archivist> most were snatched back by the gov and crushed
[16:21:43] <archivist> rare beast now
[16:22:24] <Rab> Haha @ DAF engine pic, typical Bosch distributor cap with two contacts sealed off.
[16:23:15] <SpeedEvil> ' Two separate transmissions ran the two driving wheels, eliminating the need for a differential.
[16:23:21] <SpeedEvil> well, that's special
[16:24:06] <archivist> the end
http://www.3wheelers.com/endinva.html
[16:25:21] <dirty_d> meh, for now i guess ill just make due with picking it up and puting it in a truck bed
[16:25:27] <dirty_d> easy enough with two people
[16:25:32] <dirty_d> still doable with 1 person and rope
[16:26:04] <archivist> a bugger after you fell off it at speed though
[16:26:29] <SpeedEvil> dirty_d: a little loading platform might be a good idea
[16:26:49] <dirty_d> yea
[16:27:39] <dirty_d> metal ramp and a winch
[16:27:50] <dirty_d> some kinda little platform with rollerblade wheels taht ride on the rails
[16:28:13] <SpeedEvil> Scissor jack
[16:28:25] <SpeedEvil> Catapult
[16:29:00] <dirty_d> yes catapult
[16:29:30] <MattyMatt> jato
[16:29:38] <SpeedEvil> https://www.youtube.com/user/JoergSprave - related
[16:29:40] <dirty_d> giant quadcopter
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[16:31:59] <MattyMatt> http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/old-vintage-440-variable-speed-drive-electric-motor-automotive-pulley-industrial/121342247812 ah australia
[16:32:33] <dirty_d> yea taht not a winch
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[16:32:44] <dirty_d> arent there like spiral pulleys?
[16:32:57] <dirty_d> wrap rope around and pull it tight and it will pull it
[16:33:01] <dirty_d> with a motor
[16:33:27] <MattyMatt> that's a capstan
[16:33:46] <dirty_d> yea that
[16:34:01] <dirty_d> yea no spiral, the rope is the spiral
[16:34:31] <MattyMatt> it's the wrap. one full turn gives huge drive friction
[16:35:12] <dirty_d> yea
[16:35:31] <MattyMatt> it needs someone to mind it tho, which makes launching a 2 man op
[16:36:13] <dirty_d> yea
[16:36:19] <dirty_d> plus i dont have a truck
[16:36:32] <dirty_d> have access to one, but not all the time
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[16:37:26] <dirty_d> ill put it on my roof, lol
[16:37:28] <MattyMatt> dig a channel to the water
[16:37:46] <MattyMatt> jetski to where you want to jetski
[16:38:08] <dirty_d> too bad there arent old style sewers like in indiana jones
[16:39:20] <dirty_d> http://www.amazon.com/Best-Choice-Products%C2%AE-Watercraft-Capacity/dp/B00LXCLE72/ref=sr_1_cc_5?s=aps&ie=UTF8&qid=1432226339&sr=1-5-catcorr&keywords=pwc+trailer
[16:39:31] <dirty_d> just gonna tie that to my car with a rope and hope for the best
[16:39:37] <dirty_d> good luck everyone
[16:42:53] <DaPeace> short question.. my 3-axis-controller has pwm/vfd-output. ive figured out that the spindle is only moving if pwm is output. do i need to connect the enable-pin too or would that be enough ?
[16:43:54] <cradek> sometimes enabled but stopped and disabled are quite different
[16:43:58] <cradek> so ... it depends
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[16:56:32] <dirty_d> hmm, i wonder how hard it would be to make a AC/DC tig with 4 of these
http://www.ebay.com/itm/2-PRX-CM600HA-24H-IGBT-Power-Modules-1200V-600A-H-Series-Powerex-/191578231431?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c9af3d287
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[16:58:47] <SpeedEvil> you need isolated drivers
[16:59:00] <SpeedEvil> do you mean starting from a normal buzz-box?
[16:59:25] <SpeedEvil> If you're starting from AC, you need 8
[17:00:35] <dirty_d> i have i have a lincoln AC/DC 225
[17:00:52] <dirty_d> i use it as a dc tig also
[17:00:59] <dirty_d> with no current control besides the knob
[17:01:25] <dirty_d> havent tried AC tig with it, 60Hz probably is too slow
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[17:02:31] <dirty_d> hmm
http://www.millerwelds.com/resources/articles/Inverter-technology-revolutionizes-TIG-GTAW-frequency/
[17:02:32] <SpeedEvil> If you have DC out, then you can do it with 4, yes
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[17:02:38] <dirty_d> i guess all ac tigs used to be 60Hz
[17:02:41] <ssi> 60Hz is fine, it just doesn't focus as tightly
[17:02:49] <ssi> many ac tigs are still 60Hz
[17:02:51] <SpeedEvil> also, you cna do modulated 60hz just fine
[17:02:57] <ssi> I have a relatively modern synchrowave and it's 60Hz only
[17:03:01] <SpeedEvil> which won't quite be the same as simple AC
[17:03:03] <SpeedEvil> ssi: 120
[17:03:03] <dirty_d> hmm
[17:03:08] <SpeedEvil> ssi: if DC anyway
[17:03:09] <dirty_d> awesome
[17:03:15] <ssi> the big advantage of the inverter machines is the freq control
[17:03:15] <SpeedEvil> (unless it's fucking wierd)
[17:03:27] <ssi> you can tighten up the arc quite a bit for welding aluminum
[17:03:38] <ssi> but it's not necessary
[17:04:42] <dirty_d> ssi, 60Hz fixed duty cycle?
[17:05:15] <ssi> my machine is a squarewave machine, and it has adjustable balance
[17:05:19] <ssi> but not adjustable frequency
[17:05:27] <ssi> my machine also has a pulser
[17:05:46] <dirty_d> ahh
[17:05:49] <ssi> balance is the duty cycle
[17:05:58] <ssi> allows you to adjust the balance between penetration and cleaning
[17:06:01] <dirty_d> why locked at 60Hz then?
[17:06:09] <ssi> because it's just a rectified transformer machine
[17:06:19] <ssi> it's not an inverter
[17:06:24] <dirty_d> how is balance adjusted then
[17:06:28] <dirty_d> and how is it square wave?
[17:06:29] <ssi> beats the shit out of me :D
[17:06:41] <dirty_d> i thought youd need an inverter for that
[17:06:47] <ssi> you don't need an inverter for square wave
[17:07:10] <ssi> I dunno how they do duty cycle control
[17:07:16] <ssi> but it's definitely a transformer machine, not an inverter
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[17:08:12] <dirty_d> i need to go get some argon and try this out
[17:10:06] <SpeedEvil> In principle, if you simply add a rectifier and big cap, and an inductor, and a h-bridge, you can do arbitrary stuff
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[17:10:34] <archivist> including create fire
[17:10:37] <dirty_d> yea
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[17:10:51] <dirty_d> if 60hz sine wave works for aluminum ill make do with that
[17:11:30] <SpeedEvil> Simply adding a bilateral h-bridge to an AC welder will let you change AC/DC balance, pulse, ...
[17:13:28] <dirty_d> whats taht mean, 4 transistors?
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[17:14:02] <dirty_d> just like this?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H_bridge#/media/File:H_bridge.svg
[17:14:29] <SpeedEvil> Not quite.
[17:14:49] <SpeedEvil> You can't switch AC with four IGBTs, or FETs, you need 8.
[17:15:09] <SpeedEvil> But for DC - sure
[17:15:23] <dirty_d> i already have DC so good
[17:15:38] <dirty_d> youd need an inductor on the output right?
[17:15:43] <SpeedEvil> That is 'DC' that is pulsed 120hz AC
[17:15:59] <SpeedEvil> Not if you're relying on the inductance of your welder
[17:16:01] <dirty_d> yea i dont think there is a capacitor in theis welder
[17:16:27] <dirty_d> hmm
[17:16:28] <SpeedEvil> The cap would be to use the existing welder simply as a 300A/30V or whatever supply
[17:16:31] <dirty_d> but not in the off time
[17:16:44] <dirty_d> in the off time the current is just freewheeling through the body diodes
[17:16:46] <dirty_d> right?
[17:17:29] <SpeedEvil> For a DC output welder - if the h-bridge simply puts high/low each side, then there is no freewheeling
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[17:18:23] <dirty_d> hmm, dont you need to to not destroy the transistors?
[17:18:39] <dirty_d> the cables have inductance
[17:18:57] <dirty_d> well i mean not something you need to do, wouldnt it just happen?
[17:19:27] <SpeedEvil> those won't cope with HV start
[17:20:02] <dirty_d> i wouldnt even bother
[17:20:09] <dirty_d> scratch starting is easy enough
[17:20:14] <dirty_d> tahts what im doing now
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[17:57:25] <dirty_d> neat
http://www.arcpig.com/howitworks.html
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[18:16:07] <furrywolf> a strap-on trigger, eh? I do like strapons!
[18:21:02] <dirty_d> lol
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[18:36:11] <SpeedEvil> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRsfOGJ5lZg - Learning about resonance.
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[19:19:32] <dirty_d> neat
http://entropyproduction.blogspot.com/2005/10/uber-atomic-battery.html
[19:19:55] <dirty_d> they should make jet engines powered by that
[19:20:04] <dirty_d> for mars
[19:21:22] <unfy> kinda weird. installed some old windows software or whatever - and i didn't have to worry about going into custom install or selecting 'no' for bundled b.s. with the installer.
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[19:28:31] <unfy> just reading the opening sentence, if it's a standard RTG, it's 1-2 kw/hr or something... for a lenghty period of time and decays as it ages - but as far as jets ? a typical passenger jet engine produces like 90kva of juice .... and there's 2-4 of these per plane :D
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[19:28:33] <dirty_d> it uses a thorium-228 chain
[19:28:33] <dirty_d> excess of 20kW for 10 years
[19:28:33] <dirty_d> per kg
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[19:29:03] <dirty_d> i think it starts off over 100kW/kg
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[19:32:58] <zee-Lathe> need some help with tool table for lathe
[19:33:11] <zee-Lathe> finally using multiple tools in the same program and this is confusing me.
[19:33:45] <zee-Lathe> i zero the g54, then go touch a known work piece at the appropriate x and z. set my g54 to that
[19:33:51] <zee-Lathe> all this with tool 1.
[19:34:27] <zee-Lathe> now i go t05 m06 g43, and go to the same x and z point and touch off with the "tool table" option
[19:34:37] <zee-Lathe> now i do t01 m06 g43
[19:34:47] <zee-Lathe> and tool 1 is in the wrong position? what am i doing wrong
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[19:40:43] <cradek> if you want t01 to be your reference tool, make sure it has zero tool offset, and make sure no tool offset is active when you touch off g54 with it
[19:41:06] <cradek> then follow your procedure and you'll find t5's tool offset is the difference between t5 and t1
[19:41:20] <zee-Lathe> so i gotta do g49
[19:41:24] <zee-Lathe> when i am using tool 1?
[19:41:27] <cradek> check the tool table as you're doing each step and make sure you're getting numbers that make sense
[19:41:43] <cradek> what is tool 1's offset?
[19:41:49] <zee-Lathe> 0
[19:41:53] <zee-Lathe> in the tool table
[19:42:14] <cradek> then it doesn't matter if you've done g49 or g43h1
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[19:42:34] <cradek> but you better do one or the other after loading t1 before expecting no tool length offset to be in effect
[19:42:59] <zee-Lathe> maybe a step by step procedure will help me cause this is confusing
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[19:43:09] <zee-Lathe> so far i have g54 setup. tool 1 offset is 0 in the tool table
[19:43:15] <cradek> no you don't need a procedure. you need to look at the tool table and the dro at each step and see if it makes sense
[19:43:17] <zee-Lathe> and t01 is selected
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[19:43:32] <cradek> ok
[19:43:34] <zee-Lathe> now im doing t05 m06 g43
[19:43:38] <cradek> stop
[19:43:52] <cradek> after t1 m6 did you do g43 or g49 or neither?
[19:43:59] <zee-Lathe> neither
[19:44:07] <cradek> ok do you see why that's wrong?
[19:44:22] <cradek> because you probably had some other tool's tool offset still in effect
[19:44:35] <zee-Lathe> okay i did g43 and it didnt change anthing
[19:44:38] <zee-Lathe> for the x and z
[19:44:45] <zee-Lathe> did g49 too
[19:44:47] <zee-Lathe> didnt do anything
[19:44:53] <zee-Lathe> well thatd cancel the offset
[19:44:53] <cradek> ok
[19:45:05] <zee-Lathe> should i keep g49 active before i do t05 m06
[19:45:16] <cradek> ok touch it to the end of the work and see if you see Z=0
[19:45:16] <zee-Lathe> (good practice?)
[19:45:33] <zee-Lathe> yes its correct for tool 1
[19:45:39] <cradek> also X is right?
[19:45:41] <zee-Lathe> yes
[19:45:46] <cradek> ok
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[19:45:55] <cradek> so now you do t5 m6 g43
[19:46:29] <cradek> touch the tool to the end of the work, what does Z say?
[19:46:44] <zee-Lathe> i think i know the problem..
[19:46:52] <zee-Lathe> i already have an offset in the tool table for t05
[19:46:58] <cradek> sure
[19:47:03] <zee-Lathe> so asap i do g43 for t5
[19:47:10] <zee-Lathe> it loads up that offset
[19:47:21] <cradek> yep
[19:47:25] <zee-Lathe> i dunno if me now touching off using the tool table option
[19:47:28] <cradek> but that's ok, tool touch off will update it
[19:47:32] <zee-Lathe> will overwrite in refrence to those values
[19:47:34] <zee-Lathe> or to g54
[19:48:03] <cradek> it will choose the tool offset such that the dro becomes what you say when that tool length is reloaded
[19:48:06] <cradek> then it reloads it for you
[19:48:11] <cradek> so it does just what you want
[19:48:34] <cradek> so now go touch the tool to the end of the work again, and do TOOL touch off for Z=0
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[19:48:38] <cradek> be sure you get the tool one
[19:49:31] <XXCoder> heys
[19:51:29] <zee-Lathe> ok don e
[19:51:32] <zee-Lathe> going back to tool 1
[19:51:48] <zee-Lathe> by doing t01 m6 g43
[19:51:57] * skunkworks just recently did this.. following the directions in the linuxcnc manual for lathe tool touchoff works wonderfully
[19:52:58] <zee-Lathe> okay it works
[19:53:05] <zee-Lathe> the only thing i did this time was delete the values inside the tool table for t4
[19:53:17] <zee-Lathe> t5 i mean before touching it off with the tool touch off
[19:53:18] <zee-Lathe> hmm..
[19:53:38] <cradek> haha there's no mystery: you did it wrong before and you did it right this time :-)
[19:53:45] <zee-Lathe> wtf
[19:53:50] <zee-Lathe> now run my g-code
[19:53:52] <cradek> changing an unrelated tool didn't fix it, trust me!
[19:53:53] <zee-Lathe> and the offset is wrong
[19:54:21] <cradek> does the gcode change offsets?
[19:54:36] <XXCoder> yeserday was fun. had to reboot machine I was using in order to fix xyz drift.
[19:54:37] <zee-Lathe> (TOOL 1)
[19:54:37] <zee-Lathe> T01 M06
[19:54:37] <zee-Lathe> G43 H05
[19:54:37] <zee-Lathe> G96 D1800 S300 M03 (CSS MODE)
[19:54:47] <cradek> G43 H05
[19:54:47] <zee-Lathe> G00 G54 Z0.25
[19:54:48] <cradek> !!
[19:54:52] <zee-Lathe> whoops LOL
[19:54:55] <cradek> dude!
[19:54:57] <cradek> :-)
[19:54:59] <zee-Lathe> bhhahahahaha
[19:55:02] <zee-Lathe> bhahahahah!
[19:55:03] <cradek> DUDE
[19:55:09] <zee-Lathe> been going in circles
[19:55:22] <XXCoder> programmings like that zee-Lathe
[19:55:28] * zee-Lathe is never gcoding by hand again
[19:55:28] <XXCoder> little thing can kick your ass
[19:55:41] <zee-Lathe> yep that was it
[19:55:53] <zee-Lathe> so silly.
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[19:56:02] <zee-Lathe> i should just do g43 with no hxx after
[19:56:20] * JT-Shop needs to add some info to the GoldWing manual... if the seat heater doesn't work see if it is plugged in
[19:56:23] <cradek> yeah I always type: t_ m6 g43
[19:56:44] <cradek> haha seat heater on a motorcycle!
[19:56:45] <zee-Lathe> hahaha i cant believe i did that
[19:56:47] <JT-Shop> same here
[19:56:48] <zee-Lathe> thank yo1
[19:56:57] <JT-Shop> and grip heater too
[19:57:23] <cradek> I used to warm my gloves on the front cylinder head
[19:57:25] <JT-Shop> I was thinking I needed to get them to work for the 5:30 departure tomorrow with temps in the high 40's
[19:57:34] <cradek> now I'm old and I drive a car with seat heaters
[19:57:39] <XXCoder> lol
[19:58:08] <JT-Shop> lol I'm old and ride a couch on two wheels with a stereo
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[19:58:43] <JT-Shop> I thinking is has not worked since the last time the seat was off the bike
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[19:58:50] <cradek> heh
[19:59:47] <JT-Shop> you should see all the stuff under the seat and the top cover
[20:01:46] <JT-Shop> this trip we are packing light and not taking the trailer so I build a carrier for a water resistant box
http://gnipsel.com/images/GL1800/GL1800%20Carrier%2003.jpg
[20:02:34] <JT-Shop> the color doesn't match but neither does the trailer lol
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[20:36:24] <XXCoder> LOL!
[20:36:25] <XXCoder> https://i.chzbgr.com/maxW500/5282472192/h0DF730A0/
[20:36:37] <XXCoder> antitheif wood
[20:37:13] <XXCoder> For extra evilness dip the tip in oil to make it look used
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[20:56:36] * Tom_itx swipes JT-Shop's leafblower when he's not looking
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[20:59:40] <JT-Shop> only if you use it here first lol
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[21:05:28] <Tom_itx> mine's just about shot
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[21:08:06] <_methods> sweet scored teh tool post grinder for my little atlas lathe for $50
[21:11:02] -!- per_sonne__ has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
[21:11:33] <zeeshan|2> wow that is cheap
[21:11:49] <Deejay> gn8
[21:13:10] -!- Deejay has quit [Quit: bye]
[21:13:17] <_methods> we got a 39"x290" lathe
[21:13:24] <_methods> can turn some big stuff now
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[21:17:22] <_methods> pete's going to kill me though i let 2 4th axis tsudakoma rn-100's get by for for $250/ea
[21:17:40] <_methods> the 2 4station 4th axis's went for $500/ea
[21:26:29] <CaptHindsight> lovely, now the USPS online forms print out as black pages when using FF on Linux
[21:26:31] <SpeedEvil> That is some lateh
[21:26:39] <SpeedEvil> CaptHindsight: fraud prevention
[21:26:45] <SpeedEvil> lathe
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[23:31:39] <the_wench> Valen: archivist said my Cooke Troughton & Simms Ltd 12 inch level 1 div= .0005" in 10" .05mm in 1M easily senses the floor bending, will also see you machine bend when you lean on it with your little finger
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[23:35:25] <Valen> the_wench: nifty thanks ;->
[23:35:27] <archivist> Valen, and some light reading on testing machine tools the section on levels
http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJC/BK/BK3151/
[23:38:51] -!- ve7it [ve7it!~LawrenceG@S01060014d19d0b68.pk.shawcable.net] has joined #linuxcnc
[23:39:09] <Jymmm> ve7it: Mr L
[23:40:02] <ve7it> Mr J... whatsup?
[23:40:31] <Jymmm> ve7it: Nada, just saw you signon and wanted to say hi
[23:41:44] <ve7it> I just crashed after shovelling 2 yards of fish compost onto the garden.... getting old sucks!
[23:42:24] <Valen> archivist what book?
[23:42:27] <Jymmm> ve7it: What?! No powered wheelchair front bucket?
[23:43:12] <ve7it> maybe next year....
[23:43:13] <archivist> Valen, testing machine tools, G. Schlesinger
[23:43:35] <Valen> oh about your website, have you considered cloudflare? its pretty much point and click and they will transparantly cache all your images and such
[23:43:37] <Jymmm> ve7it: Ah, ok. Or bribe/blackmail the neighbor kid?
[23:44:11] <Valen> the book is in metric, bliss ;->
[23:44:13] <archivist> Valen, who pays!
[23:45:11] <Valen> you do if you get "big"
[23:45:36] <Valen> (as in lots and lots and lots of pageviews, or you want https or other fancy stuff)
[23:46:01] <archivist> my data dir is 14gb
[23:46:08] <Valen> doesn't matter ;->
[23:46:51] <Valen> https://www.cloudflare.com/plans
[23:48:02] <Valen> bit fiddly, you need to make them the nameserver for your domain, then set your dns stuff in there
[23:48:30] <Valen> so www.foo won't point to your modem anymore, but you can make say direct.foo point to your modem for remote access stuffs
[23:49:02] <archivist> way over priced for a business page
[23:49:40] <Valen> depends on what you are doing
[23:50:34] <Valen> I presume if you are doing enough stuff on the interweb to warrant the extra features in it, $200 is chump change
[23:54:25] <Valen> (note just because its a commercial site doesn't mean you need a "business" plan)
[23:54:56] <Valen> I wasn't aware they crawled your site
[23:55:02] <Valen> that may not suit you
[23:55:44] <archivist> not a lot of space either Client maximum upload size 100 MB
[23:55:46] <Valen> ahh you can turn that off
[23:56:00] <Valen> that is the maximum size that somebody can *upload* to your site
[23:56:07] <Valen> through http post/get stuff
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[23:57:42] <archivist> apart from static ip I am on standard isp costs only
[23:57:57] <Valen> are your uploads billed?
[23:58:54] <archivist> no
[23:59:04] <Valen> eh, leave it on then I guess
[23:59:26] <Valen> it'll slurp the whole 14gb (if its spiderable from your root page)
[23:59:41] <Valen> then anybody who hits it gets it from their CDN rather than your website
[23:59:43] <archivist> and 3 of us run the dns
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