#linuxcnc | Logs for 2015-05-02

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[00:00:33] <SpeedEvil> 'when the toolholder is bigger than your lathe'
[00:00:37] <zeeshan> nice andypugh
[00:00:53] <MrFluffy> theyre bt40, my interact is qc30 :(
[00:01:04] <zeeshan> http://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8656/16666114501_0cb7f73d42_h.jpg
[00:01:11] <zeeshan> do you think i f'ed up my indexable end mill
[00:01:14] <zeeshan> when i was doing a while back
[00:01:23] <zeeshan> i think i shoulda done it weld on style.
[00:01:29] <zeeshan> not completely like that..
[00:01:40] <MrFluffy> I thought the auction was going to be for some of those chinese clone qc30 holders that dont fit properly and was all excited for a moment
[00:01:46] <zeeshan> i currently have that in an end mill holder with 2 set screws
[00:03:09] <andypugh> MrFluffy: Ah, sorry.
[00:03:29] <zeeshan> answer me!!! :P
[00:03:51] <zeeshan> think they'll pull out?
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[00:05:06] <andypugh> zeeshan: I wouldn’t be using the Vee-block saddle there, I would be using another T-slot clamp
[00:05:23] <zeeshan> andypugh: lol it was a really crappy way of holding it
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[00:08:14] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/7jWZQoS.jpg
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[00:08:18] <zeeshan> i wonder if this is worth any money
[00:08:25] <Computer_barf> looks like I am nearing the completion of another attempt at building the kernel
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[00:09:50] <Computer_barf> yep, done. rebooting and brb
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[00:16:08] <Computer_barf> hmm still joint 2 following error
[00:16:12] <andypugh> MrFluffy: Would it be impolite to glat about the set of BT30 holders I giot for £80 ? https://picasaweb.google.com/108164504656404380542/HarrisonMill?noredirect=1#5901893704893194114
[00:16:22] <andypugh> (gloat)
[00:16:34] * zeeshan is jealous of your collection
[00:16:50] <zeeshan> mine is smaller ;[
[00:17:24] <MrFluffy> Nah im good, I got 30 with the machine as a sweetener, they just needed tickling to get them to fit first. http://gallery.pipandphil.com/d/38768-1/toolholders_processed.jpg
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[00:17:51] <zeeshan> most of my tool holders are excessive in the wrong form
[00:17:58] <zeeshan> like i have 4 mt3 cat40 holders
[00:18:07] <MrFluffy> its collets that drive me potty, I think I have 9 different types now
[00:18:17] <zeeshan> 3 jt6 (like do you really need that many drill chucks?!?)
[00:18:27] <zeeshan> rest are tg100 or er32 or em holders
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[00:18:42] <zeeshan> and the 3 shell mill holders im try8ing to put on ebay right now
[00:18:56] <Computer_barf> although my latency test seems to be coming in much better 17180 so far
[00:19:00] <andypugh> My machine was 30INT from the factory. I converted to BT30 for the power drawbar. Then that set of holders was SK30 so I shortned one drive dog, so it is now a universal BT30 / SK30 spindle.
[00:19:34] <andypugh> Computer_barf: 17180 is fine. Move on.
[00:19:46] <MrFluffy> iso40->harrison screwed nose fitting adaptor, that should make you wince... http://gallery.pipandphil.com/d/38770-1/bt40_adapter8.jpg
[00:20:07] <Computer_barf> yes i think i need to update the ini to reflect the new numbers
[00:20:23] <Computer_barf> before it was 14060516
[00:20:56] <Computer_barf> so it appears RT-prempt being compiled correctly made a diffrence
[00:21:08] <_methods> hehe
[00:21:25] <_methods> that's much better
[00:22:51] <MrFluffy> it seemed like a good idea at the time to mount a 4 jaw on the mill and use it to grab a lathe tool for a late night get out of jail job, but Ive used it lots of times since for really stupid things.
[00:22:56] <andypugh> MrFluffy: Not wincing, but drive dogs would have been nice
[00:23:15] <MrFluffy> yes thats just on the bench for checking fit with the blue in the pic
[00:24:12] <andypugh> I abuse my mill fairly often. That very slow instoppable rotation in the lowest gear is just so useful: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thtDRjgbxRE
[00:24:50] <zeeshan> LOL
[00:24:53] <zeeshan> that is pure abuse dude
[00:24:55] <MrFluffy> If you added a second roller, you have a ring roller setup
[00:25:02] <zeeshan> get yourself a proper roller!
[00:25:09] <MrFluffy> I always wondered about doing that, with Z to control the radius of the ring
[00:25:36] <andypugh> Is this better or worse? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rwoD2vZUl0
[00:26:11] <zeeshan> that's not as bad id think :P
[00:26:44] <zeeshan> is that a cast iron pulley
[00:26:46] <MrFluffy> if you had a faceplate on a 30 shank, thatd be civilized
[00:27:03] <andypugh> Yes, cast iron pulley for the Rivett
[00:27:40] <zeeshan> its so funny youre running a lathe program on it :)
[00:28:02] <andypugh> It’s all just numbers to LinuxCNC
[00:28:07] <zeeshan> yes
[00:28:17] <zeeshan> that is a bookmarked video to show others
[00:28:28] <MrFluffy> tony griffiths purveyer of fine custom belts to the masses eh
[00:28:29] <zeeshan> ill show it to the students next year in the machine shop course
[00:28:30] <zeeshan> haha
[00:29:28] <andypugh> and creator of the best web site in the world
[00:30:04] <andypugh> I read every article in that site, and now I just need to read the updates
[00:30:05] <MrFluffy> I have a 40 taper press tool somewhere that I made when I got a bit carried away...
[00:30:06] <MrFluffy> http://gallery.pipandphil.com/d/38773-1/press_chuck4.jpg
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[00:30:20] <MrFluffy> Yes, indeed everyone loves lathes.co.uk
[00:30:27] <zeeshan> what is the purpose of that
[00:30:49] <MrFluffy> I stamp 40 taper shaped holes into metal shelves for tool storage... http://gallery.pipandphil.com/d/38776-1/press_chuck5.jpg
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[00:30:56] <zeeshan> ROFL
[00:30:57] <zeeshan> nice.
[00:31:30] <furrywolf> any ideas how to grease the linear bearings on a bosch sliding compound miter saw? liberally greasing the rails and running it back and forth has not been successful, but I see no access, nor do I even know what's in them.
[00:31:46] <andypugh> MrFluffy: Abuse of Mill _and_ QMax cutter: https://picasaweb.google.com/108164504656404380542/CNCUnsorted?noredirect=1#5678684612017184674
[00:32:06] <zeeshan> is that a knock out punch
[00:32:07] <zeeshan> lol
[00:32:31] <andypugh> I had a _lot_ of holes to make.
[00:32:37] <MrFluffy> I abused my lathe with a rotary broach in it, does that count?
[00:32:40] <MrFluffy> it was homemade...
[00:32:42] <furrywolf> lol
[00:33:03] <furrywolf> my mill wouldn't have nearly the strength to work a knockout punch.
[00:33:06] <zeeshan> im just trying to calculate the loads in my head
[00:33:14] <zeeshan> that looks like 1.25" diameter..
[00:33:31] <furrywolf> does anyone here NOT own one of those chinese holddown sets?
[00:33:39] <andypugh> The holes were the first stahe in making https://picasaweb.google.com/108164504656404380542/CNCUnsorted?noredirect=1#5681316089753717346
[00:33:44] <zeeshan> assuming you were punching out steel sheet, those forces are prolly a bit more than drilling a large ass hole
[00:34:16] <andypugh> Transformer steel is fairly soft at least
[00:35:27] <furrywolf> I have a hydraulic knockout punch. it has to work hard. you were either cutting very soft metal, or you have a very strong mill.
[00:36:20] <zeeshan> you can estimate the force as: diameter of hole
[00:36:30] <andypugh> A bit of both. It’s a 750W servo on the Z
[00:36:30] <zeeshan> * thickness of material
[00:36:44] <zeeshan> and use the ultimate tensile strength of the material to get an idea of force
[00:36:47] <zeeshan> i dont think its a lot
[00:37:33] <andypugh> It didn’t feel particulary evil when I was doing it.
[00:39:26] <MrFluffy> did you ask the mill though? :)
[00:39:29] <Computer_barf> ok just got first movement from the mill
[00:39:42] <andypugh> Great
[00:39:53] <Computer_barf> the z axis went down when I told it to go up
[00:39:59] <andypugh> Was it the right direction? (that’s a 50:50 gamble)
[00:40:02] <Computer_barf> when i told it to go up, it did not go
[00:40:30] <andypugh> Could be step and direction switched
[00:40:32] <furrywolf> how about estimating it this way: the cylinder on my punch is, at a complete random guess (it's not handy), about 2" diameter. the pump is about 1/4" diameter. that's 64 times force multiplication. it has about a 18" lever, which moves the pump about 3/4" for about 12" of movement. that's about another 16 times. that's about 1024 times force multiplication. I push about 25 lbs on it. that's about 25000lbs at the punch.
[00:40:39] <zeeshan> F = shear stress * A = [(1/sqrt(3))(63800)]*[pi*1.5*.065] = 11282 lb force for a 1018 steel .065" thickness sheet, punching a 1.5" diameter hole.
[00:40:44] <zeeshan> to give you a feel for it
[00:40:52] <zeeshan> so i guess it is abuse
[00:41:02] <furrywolf> good, our estimates are similar. lol
[00:41:05] <zeeshan> thats way more force than you'd see even with drilling a 1.5" hole without a pilot
[00:41:14] <MrFluffy> rotary broaching setup, I had to machine a guide into the rear and use the tailstock to get enough force for it to work. http://gallery.pipandphil.com/d/38779-1/wobblebroacha.jpg
[00:41:44] <furrywolf> now what kind of mill do you have that can exert tens of thousands of pounds of force with the spindle?
[00:41:49] <andypugh> zeeshan: What’s that 63800?
[00:41:57] <zeeshan> uts of steel
[00:42:11] <Computer_barf> andypugh: p,
[00:42:15] <Computer_barf> woops pm
[00:42:23] <zeeshan> 1/sqrt3 is getting the shear stress of the material
[00:42:33] <andypugh> Ah, OK. I can’t believe you still use those silly units.
[00:42:44] <zeeshan> andypugh: i use lb whenever i can
[00:42:50] <zeeshan> but N works too
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[00:42:54] <zeeshan> just multiply by 4.48
[00:42:59] <zeeshan> thats one number i keep in my brain now
[00:43:47] <zeeshan> andypugh: all i know is your machine is crazy well built
[00:43:49] <zeeshan> :D
[00:44:18] <andypugh> The point is that that was a Q-max so it pierces two holes then progressively shears the rest. Normally they are operated by a 12mm bolt and a nit.
[00:44:41] <furrywolf> grrrr. my dewalt screwgun needs a small ring in the clutch assembly. dewalt only has a part number for the entire clutch, and wants more than the tool is worth for one.
[00:45:00] <andypugh> furrywolf: That is why we have lathes.
[00:45:17] <furrywolf> andypugh: normally they're operated by a big fucking hydraulic cylinder. the bolt ones are toys. :P
[00:45:31] <zeeshan> andypugh: im curious to know how that effects the force
[00:45:46] <zeeshan> i bet it drops it by like a factor of 4
[00:46:11] <MrFluffy> I made this up to use for punching in the mill, but not for steel http://gallery.pipandphil.com/d/38165-1/dinker.jpg
[00:46:11] <zeeshan> its like opening a can all at once or using a can opener
[00:46:16] <andypugh> It does the same work but rather than being over a distance of the material thickness it is over a distance of 10mm
[00:46:22] <zeeshan> shit maybe it's even less less by a factor of 8
[00:46:24] <zeeshan> i dont have a feel for it
[00:46:46] <andypugh> I think a factor of 10 for 1mm material.
[00:47:32] <zeeshan> so in summary, it wasn't abuse of the mill
[00:47:49] <zeeshan> it was equivalent of drilling a .5" hole prolly without a pilot
[00:47:49] <zeeshan> :p
[00:48:12] <andypugh> Talking punches, these things are cool: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EU3SKaBFHIk
[00:48:27] <zeeshan> thats what we had at eaton
[00:48:33] <zeeshan> a different model, by same company though
[00:48:34] <_methods> yeah man those things are bad ass
[00:48:36] <MrFluffy> I know a guy who operates one of them
[00:48:40] <zeeshan> they are annoying as hell
[00:48:43] <_methods> trumpf 6060
[00:48:46] <zeeshan> cause they shake the whole ground when running
[00:48:50] <_methods> what a coincidence
[00:49:02] <furrywolf> http://www.machinedismantlers.org/East-Chicago-/Agricultural-and-Construiction-/Plants-/Greenlee-7306SB-type-hydraulic-knockout-punch-knock-out.shtml I have a punch similar to that one. The ones with bolts are for tin foil only. lol
[00:49:13] <zeeshan> furrywolf: those are expensive
[00:49:34] <furrywolf> that's a chinese knockoff. mine is Ensley.
[00:49:39] <zeeshan> you'd be suprised that they perfer punch turrets over laser cutting.
[00:49:55] <zeeshan> especially when you have a lot of holes, you get some serious distortion when laser cutting
[00:50:04] <furrywolf> note how many times that ad says greenlee, then only mentions in the fine print it's not greenly. that person should be killed as a benefit to classified ads.
[00:50:06] <zeeshan> you either have to slow down, or distribute the holes
[00:50:11] <zeeshan> either way is slower than using a punch turret
[00:51:03] <furrywolf> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ensley-Rothenberger-5-8-2-Knockout-Punch-Dies-with-Pump-Hydraulic-Greenlee-/181497539936 there we go
[00:51:03] <zeeshan> fuck that video makes me want to build one
[00:51:20] <MrFluffy> the guy I know does battery boxes for bikes in his lunch break :)
[00:51:26] <furrywolf> same box as mine and everything
[00:51:36] <zeeshan> dude thsoe things can punch through .188" steel
[00:51:38] <zeeshan> like it is a joke
[00:52:03] <zeeshan> i made some reinforcement brackets for an overhead enclosure that weighed 4000lb
[00:52:08] <MrFluffy> I couldnt even afford the steel to make the tooling from myself
[00:52:52] <zeeshan> they had a lot of holes in them for mounting and the machine that made them had no prob
[00:53:26] <furrywolf> I have no idea how to fabricate this ring for my dewalt screwgun. it's about 1" diameter, .080 wide, and .080 thick. it's made of very brittle metal. I have several pieces of it. lol
[00:53:45] <zeeshan> lathe
[00:53:51] <MrFluffy> the windows operating system that can connect to your network. imagine your punch press getting a zero day...
[00:53:57] <furrywolf> (just random guesses; I haven't measured anything. and measuring the diameter will require measuring where it fits, as I don't have enough parts to assemble half a circle. lol)
[00:54:31] <furrywolf> I don't have enough lathe tooling to make useful things like that. specifically, I have no parting tool, and no ID-adjusting tooling of any kind...
[00:54:35] <MrFluffy> itll be windows embedded probably, which has been EOL for about 5 years now
[00:54:56] <MrFluffy> do you have a offhand grinder and a hss blank?
[00:55:24] <furrywolf> no
[00:56:02] * furrywolf has very little tooling or materials
[00:56:20] <zeeshan> sand paper
[00:56:23] <MrFluffy> do you have a dremel and some silver steel or something?
[00:56:38] <furrywolf> dremel, yes. no idea what silver steel is.
[00:56:54] <MrFluffy> its just a medium carbon steel you can harden easy
[00:56:56] <furrywolf> brb, I probably should measure it rather than guesstimating.
[00:58:03] <andypugh> “Silver Steel” is basically O1 tool steel in the form that the US calls Drill Rod.
[00:58:29] <andypugh> It’s nice stuff to work with, and easy to heat treat.
[00:58:39] <MrFluffy> yep, drill rod it is, or normal low carbon and some kasenite
[00:58:46] <MrFluffy> or just mild steel, its only got to last one job
[00:59:40] <_methods> man you can probably go to any machine shop and just ask for their old HSS
[00:59:44] <_methods> they'll give it away
[00:59:52] <_methods> we got boxes of it no one ever uses
[00:59:53] <MrFluffy> kasenite is probably illegal now due to the cynide in it
[01:00:11] <MrFluffy> I use hss a lot still because my old lathe has a very low top speed in modern terms
[01:00:19] <_methods> yea i use it at home
[01:00:26] <_methods> but at work inserts have killed hss
[01:00:39] <andypugh> Kasenite is carbon, I think, not HCN
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[01:01:17] <MrFluffy> sodium ferrocyanide decahydrate apparently
[01:01:37] <MrFluffy> I know its hard to get now, I had to buy some from a seller in estonia and import it last time
[01:01:40] <_methods> that sounds tasty
[01:02:14] <MrFluffy> funny you should say that methods, its actually used in salt as a anti caking agent
[01:02:55] <_methods> see
[01:03:02] <_methods> i know a good thing when i hear it
[01:03:09] <MrFluffy> please dont eat mine though, I need it for future use
[01:03:13] <_methods> i guess cherry red works just as good
[01:03:27] <_methods> i've never used it we still have a ton of kasenit at the shop
[01:03:55] <_methods> whenever we run out of that i guess everyone will have the kinks worked out of the new stuff lol
[01:05:11] <zeeshan> man this butteryfly fucking plate
[01:05:15] <zeeshan> is actually more work than i thought
[01:06:40] <furrywolf> ok, measured. ring is .102 wide .078 thick, and the space it fits is .916 on the inside and 1.167 on the outside. it seems to be a loose fit when the parts are put in the space.
[01:07:07] <furrywolf> bah, I typoed my guesses. I guessed that it was .100 by .080, but typed .080 for both.
[01:07:46] * MrFluffy converts that to mm to make sense of it...
[01:07:56] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/CDvya2u.png
[01:07:57] <MrFluffy> so, its a big washer
[01:07:59] <zeeshan> look at this plate
[01:08:03] <zeeshan> its a big annoyance
[01:08:12] <zeeshan> the 15 degree chamfer is different for the top vs the bottom.
[01:08:23] <zeeshan> im worried when i flip it, ill lose alignment.
[01:08:24] <furrywolf> the grease looks more like antiseize than grease from the amount of metal in it, so those measurements probably include a fair bit of wear. :)
[01:08:26] <zeeshan> cause those bolt holes aren't accurate.
[01:08:42] <furrywolf> MrFluffy: more of a bushing than a washer. it's too narrow and thick to be a washer.
[01:08:53] <zeeshan> and i dont have any shoulder m4 bolts.
[01:09:11] <furrywolf> sec, finding picture online.
[01:09:18] <Computer_barf> _methods: might you have an idea why i might be able to get my axis's to move in one direction but not the other?
[01:09:32] <furrywolf> http://www.mmtoolparts.com/store/media/catalog/product/cache/1/small_image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/m/a/mar3_0056.jpg lower left
[01:09:43] <_methods> did you home your axis?
[01:09:45] <zeeshan> looks like a extra heavy washer :D
[01:09:57] <furrywolf> everyone only seems to sell that entire kit, not just the one ring, and they want more than the tool is worth for it.
[01:10:01] <PCW> miswired step/dir could do that
[01:10:02] <_methods> or are they unhomed still?
[01:10:13] <Computer_barf> _methods: no i've not done any homing
[01:10:26] <_methods> what pcw said
[01:10:29] <Computer_barf> PCW: i just redid the wires on the z axis and seems to be behaving the same way
[01:10:31] <_methods> double check your wiring
[01:10:33] <furrywolf> $27+shipping to fix my $5 screw gun? fuck no.
[01:11:02] <MrFluffy> could you bore a hole in a fixture to locate the butterfly in with two holes to secure it once its located on centre?
[01:11:17] <_methods> Computer_barf: you sure you got your pairs right?
[01:11:23] <furrywolf> I'm tempted to go find something at the local hardware store that can be cut to fit..
[01:11:24] <MrFluffy> wait, its not the same diameter when you flip if the angles change...
[01:11:24] <_methods> i'm assuming you're using steppers
[01:11:45] <_methods> seem to remember you mentioning stepconf
[01:12:07] <MrFluffy> furrywolf: thats what I do, Id find something near in the scrap bin and alter it to the job
[01:12:50] <furrywolf> unfortunately, every single hardware store here stocks the exact same Hillman garbage.
[01:12:53] <Computer_barf> pcw & _methods: I have step2- to the z axis pull- , step2+ to pull+, dir2- to dir- , dir2+ to dir+
[01:13:17] <Computer_barf> unless if step and pull are diffrent things i believe I have them right
[01:14:07] <PCW> check the stepgen output mode in the hal file
[01:14:32] <PCW> it may be set for quadrature
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[01:16:25] <andypugh> PCW that would certianly do it, but how would that happen?
[01:16:44] <Computer_barf> i am using his config files
[01:17:28] <PCW> yeah make sure the output type is 0 for all axis
[01:17:41] <furrywolf> I'll hit up the local tool repair place on monday and see if they have a parts unit they can yank one out of.
[01:17:47] <MrFluffy> zeeshan: fixture it at an angle and cut the outer edge from one side as a parallel cylinder?
[01:17:53] <Computer_barf> http://pastebin.com/hSchBRMj
[01:18:06] <zeeshan> MrFluffy: i was gonna use a chamfer mill
[01:18:11] <zeeshan> er taper end mill
[01:18:38] <MrFluffy> how thick is it to matter?
[01:18:49] <zeeshan> this angle is pretty important
[01:18:50] <Computer_barf> step type? control type?
[01:18:53] <PCW> change setp hm2_[HOSTMOT2](BOARD).0.stepgen.00.step_type 1
[01:18:55] <PCW> to setp hm2_[HOSTMOT2](BOARD).0.stepgen.00.step_type 0
[01:18:57] <PCW> (and 01 and o2)
[01:18:58] <zeeshan> for sealing the butterfly against the throttle body port
[01:19:04] <MrFluffy> theyre normally only a mm or so thick. Yes its to break away from the walls quicker
[01:19:26] <MrFluffy> Ive made them in the past but I confess I just made up discs...
[01:20:31] <MrFluffy> they wont be in contact with the walls anyway as the idle screw will hold the butterfly open slightly
[01:21:43] <Computer_barf> PCW: i seem to have gone back to joint 2 following error
[01:22:16] <PCW> what did you change?
[01:22:38] <Computer_barf> wait i think i messed up
[01:23:11] <PCW> dont change the control type (it must be 1)
[01:23:17] <Computer_barf> yes thats what i did
[01:23:19] <Computer_barf> retrying
[01:24:08] <Computer_barf> FUCK YAH
[01:24:18] <zeeshan> MrFluffy: i got an idea.
[01:24:30] <Computer_barf> crash potential averted, mill head goes both ways now
[01:24:34] <zeeshan> i can make a quick fixture that has round protrusions that fit inside the holes of this butterfly
[01:24:41] <zeeshan> then ill just bolt it down to that register
[01:24:45] <zeeshan> :D
[01:24:52] <Computer_barf> PCW: very excited
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[01:25:17] <PCW> (control type 1 is velocity mode)
[01:25:17] <furrywolf> http://www.ereplacementparts.com/ball-bushing-p-186757.html what do you do when you have one of those that's rusty and stuck? I can't even see how to get it out; must be pressed in.
[01:25:18] <PCW> step_type 0 = step/dir
[01:25:20] <PCW> step_type 1 = up/down CW/CCW
[01:25:22] <PCW> step_type 2 and > = Table driven
[01:26:10] <Computer_barf> my x axis is stuck but I believe thats probably mechanical
[01:26:14] <PCW> man hostmot2 for the meaning of all the hardware parameters
[01:26:20] <andypugh> furrywolf: Yes, they are pressed in.
[01:26:33] <andypugh> But that’s a mad price
[01:26:56] <furrywolf> yeah, that's just a random forum link. it's for a hitachi that's identical to my bosch. figure that one out!
[01:27:21] <PCW> also you must determine the max velocity and acceleration (so expect stalls until you get these set)
[01:27:29] <andypugh> furrywolf: http://simplybearings.co.uk/shop/product_detail.php?products_id=152959&gclid=CJaji9DzocUCFUyWtAodpGMAwg
[01:27:38] <andypugh> Is that a less frightening price?
[01:27:43] <PCW> bbl dinner
[01:27:47] <Computer_barf> PCW: commentary logged to notes, at this point im going to slow down and read over all the stuff ive saved, i wrote down before about the velocity and accelleration settings.
[01:27:58] <MrFluffy> budget bearing, does that mean it comes pre worn out?
[01:28:08] <PCW> Well that was easy :-)
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[01:28:58] <furrywolf> I can't find the specs for the one in my exact saw.
[01:29:08] <MrFluffy> I have some real world experience of simply bearings budget range, and er, it did.
[01:29:27] <andypugh> You probably need to press out the old one and measure
[01:30:28] <furrywolf> http://www.repairtoolparts.com/bosch-parts/bosch-5412l-parts/2-610-915-760-sliding-bearing found places selling it, but no specs
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[01:31:47] <Crom> wee
[01:32:41] <Crom> link uptime is now 0 again... Router had 32 days of uptime on the link.
[01:32:44] <furrywolf> I don't want to spend money on it. how do I grease it without needing to take it apart? :)
[01:32:45] <furrywolf> I tried liberally greasing the rail and running it back and forth repeatedly, with only marginal success.
[01:33:14] <furrywolf> it randomly binds, and non-randomly leaves rusty streaks on the rail.
[01:33:28] <furrywolf> this in the saw that "works perfectly" according to the guy I bought it from. bleh.
[01:34:02] <Crom> what kinda saw? radial arm?
[01:34:33] <furrywolf> sliding compound miter saw
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[01:35:12] <furrywolf> http://powerhousetoolparts.com/part-list/bosch/3915-0601475039/ note that diagram is incomplete - the top right corner that fades out has parts!
[01:35:38] <furrywolf> top left
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[01:36:12] <Crom> ahhh on my 2 there is a plate I can take off and get the slide bearings out. but otherwise to clean them out I use brakefluid and a airnozzle with a rubber tip
[01:37:21] <furrywolf> the plates on mine seem to only hold the felts in place; the bearings seem pressed.
[01:37:27] <Crom> ugh direct drive
[01:38:07] <Crom> Mine's belt drive Rigid 12" and a crap Harbor Freight 10yr old 10" compound miter
[01:38:42] <furrywolf> got this one for $60 today... guy said it worked perfectly. not.
[01:39:07] <Crom> pull the felts back so you can see the opening into the bearing around the shaft. Blow brake fuild into there and bunch of air
[01:39:10] <furrywolf> I need one, and my old ryobi non-sliding seems to have been permanently borrowed, so bought this one...
[01:39:25] <furrywolf> yes, I have the felts pulled out. that's how I was getting grease in it...
[01:39:36] <furrywolf> there's almost no gap between the bearing and the rod. not blowing anything.
[01:40:10] <Crom> I had 0.025" gap on mine
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[01:40:31] <Crom> which is why I say use the rubber tip
[01:40:47] <furrywolf> I guess since it's still leaving rusty streaks in the oil every time I run it in and out, it is slowly un-rusting itself... I probably should just work it back and forth more.
[01:41:04] <MrFluffy> diesel, that frees stuff out
[01:41:06] <furrywolf> I should go strap it to the mill and write a little loop to run it back and forth all day for me. :)
[01:41:16] <Crom> setup linuxcnc and a stepper heh
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[01:41:53] <furrywolf> brb
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[01:42:23] <Crom> diesel, kerosene, brakefluid. I like brakefluid better since it doesn't suck up water like keresene of diesel
[01:42:41] <MrFluffy> diesel cut with atf, works for me. I always worry about what brakefluid does to rubber and paintwork etc
[01:43:04] <MrFluffy> brakefluid is hydroscopic big time
[01:43:29] <Crom> brakefluid does nothing to rubber. Which is the reason it was invented. mineral oil disolved the rubber seals in the brake cyclinders
[01:43:48] <MrFluffy> thats why you have to change it as a service item, it absorbs moisture from the air
[01:44:22] <Crom> hmm Dot5 isn't
[01:45:09] <Crom> Rolls Royce uses mineral oil, since they use all Viton rubber in their brake systems
[01:45:19] <MrFluffy> fair enough, I dont have anything that takes sillicone fluid myself
[01:45:30] <MrFluffy> citroen uses lhm, but theyre just odd
[01:45:45] <Crom> they need it for the hdralics
[01:46:07] <MrFluffy> yes the same fluid for the suspension, power steering and brakes
[01:46:12] <Jymmm> Is an HP 54510A digital crt scope that might be overheating worth it?
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[01:46:36] <Crom> Jymm YES! overheating can be fixed
[01:46:44] <zeeshan> silicone fluid seems pointless when you got dot5.1:D
[01:46:58] <Jymmm> Crom: It'ss THAT GOOD of a scope?
[01:47:30] <Jymmm> Crom: Smells liek something (pcb) is frying
[01:47:56] <Jymmm> Crom: went into power down mode after 5 minutes
[01:50:33] <Crom> 300mhz scope
[01:50:44] <Jymmm> 250MHz
[01:50:59] <Crom> oh year B is a 300
[01:51:41] <Jymmm> Crom: If it's something VERY simple, I cna solder in a new compntent, but not really beyond that.
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[01:52:52] <MrFluffy> right gnite all
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[01:53:14] <Crom> service manual http://cp.literature.agilent.com/litweb/pdf/54510-90903.pdf
[01:53:23] <Jymmm> Crom: No schematics
[01:53:44] <Crom> well the hot area is gonna be dark
[01:53:58] <Jymmm> lol, ya think?
[01:54:17] <Jymmm> by the smell, it's gonna be BLACK and maybe even a crater
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[01:54:36] <Jymmm> Crom: But is it THAT GOOD of a scope?
[01:57:03] <Crom> How much are they asking?
[01:57:27] <Crom> 5min shutdown I wouldn't pay over $20
[01:58:09] <Crom> once you fix it it'll be worth more to the right person. But I'd keep it until it died again
[01:58:34] <Jymmm> Crom: Well, I don't want to pay $1 and find out I need $100 in components
[01:59:11] <Crom> it's probably a PS problem... it's old enopugh it might need some new caps
[01:59:37] <Jymmm> ah
[02:00:01] <Crom> electrolidic caps do dry out
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[02:00:21] <Jymmm> It had a nasty stench... smelled like PCB burning to me
[02:00:42] <Crom> so yeah probably a crater then
[02:00:43] <Jymmm> not the typical PVC overheat/meting smell
[02:01:47] <Crom> it's working so it should be pretty cheap to fix
[02:02:17] <Jymmm> well, it was before it went into shutdown
[02:02:39] <Jymmm> sorta, I never could get it to read a signal
[02:03:03] <Jymmm> the logic part worked and I could get thru menus
[02:03:27] <furrywolf> repeatedly greasing the rail and running it back and forth seems to be helping, slowly. unfortunately, to the neighbors it looks much more like I was humping it than fixing it. see, the best way to run it back and forth is to step on it with one foot, then get your thigh against the sliding part...
[02:04:28] <Jymmm> Crom: Oh well, maybe one of these years I'll finally get a scope =)
[02:05:17] <Jymmm> Crom: ty btw
[02:05:39] <Crom> scopes are nice. usb scopes are not too bad price wise
[02:05:41] <furrywolf> could be a failing cap, could be a lot of things...
[02:05:53] <furrywolf> usb scopes are just bad spec-wise. :)
[02:06:21] <furrywolf> I have a tektronix tds-210 and a 465b... happy with both of them.
[02:07:26] <Crom> I can get a usable signal out of one, which is what I require. It doesn't have to be a great scope it just has to be better than my 10khz heath kit scope
[02:07:49] <furrywolf> lol
[02:07:56] <furrywolf> both mine are 100mhz, one analog, one digital.
[02:08:17] <Crom> yeah 10,000 times fast than mine
[02:08:27] <Jymmm> recall notice... http://www.tek.com/service/safety/tds210-tds220
[02:08:33] <furrywolf> I also have an incredibly cute tek pocket 'scope, but it doesn't work. makes burning smell and blows power fuse. haven't had time to diagnose it.
[02:09:11] <furrywolf> "ground connection"? you mean that prong that goes into the little grey adapter and doesn't come out the other side? :P
[02:11:56] <furrywolf> my serial number isn't in the range given
[02:12:22] <furrywolf> about 24,000 too new for the recall
[02:12:26] <Jymmm> bummer, no free calibration for you
[02:13:11] <zeeshan> furrywolf: did you figure out your washer
[02:13:49] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/BBcRZYY.png
[02:13:52] <zeeshan> me luf mastercam!
[02:14:22] <zeeshan> its amazing how quick it can generate tool paths
[02:14:29] <furrywolf> I made no further effort on the washer, and instead went back to working on the chop saw.
[02:14:34] <zeeshan> furrywolf: haha
[02:14:39] <zeeshan> if thats a cast iron washer
[02:14:44] <zeeshan> you can prolly use a thrust washer.
[02:14:53] <zeeshan> that might exist in that size
[02:14:55] <furrywolf> yes, it's cast iron.
[02:15:25] <furrywolf> I'm not even sure what it does. it fits so loosely I'm not sure it does anything. that could just mean everything is so badly worn my measurements are useless.
[02:15:35] <zeeshan> haha
[02:15:40] <zeeshan> do you see wear on the shaft?
[02:15:43] <zeeshan> can you ffeel it with your finger nail
[02:16:04] <furrywolf> it's not on a shaft. it's on a forged part with no size reference near it.
[02:16:13] <LeelooMinai> zeeshan: Is that Mastercam thing expensive?
[02:17:20] <furrywolf> http://www.mmtoolparts.com/store/dewalt-clutch-asm-429634-00 shows the parts in detail, http://www.mmtoolparts.com/store/media/diagram/files/dw274_2.png shows how they all go together. it's in the "31" assembly, in the middle of the parts in it.
[02:17:40] <zeeshan> furrywolf: which #
[02:17:41] <zeeshan> is it
[02:17:48] <zeeshan> in 31 assembly?
[02:17:59] <zeeshan> to the right of the tooth thing
[02:18:18] <furrywolf> it doesn't have a number. it's the large ring about in the middle of the assembly.
[02:18:24] <zeeshan> tokay i see it
[02:18:29] <furrywolf> if it had a number, I could order it separately!
[02:18:29] <zeeshan> that doesnt look like a thrust washer
[02:18:55] <furrywolf> I think it's to keep the other parts from wobbling around when the clutch disengages
[02:19:08] <zeeshan> it is definitely being ridden against
[02:19:13] <zeeshan> maybe thats why its cast iron
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[02:19:32] <furrywolf> there's no thrust on it. when assembled, it's pinched between two parts of the housing, I think.
[02:19:43] <zeeshan> those 2 tooth gear things
[02:19:50] <zeeshan> theyre moving relative to one another right?
[02:19:55] <zeeshan> when the clutch is disengaged
[02:19:59] <furrywolf> part 40 and part 24 sandwich it when they're screwed together
[02:20:06] <furrywolf> yes
[02:21:44] <furrywolf> it could just be acting as a rear bearing for the output shaft
[02:22:19] <furrywolf> I suspect they broke it by over-tightening #40. I had to get it off with a pipe wrench.
[02:22:44] <zeeshan> lol i just went through my catalog
[02:22:48] <zeeshan> that isnt a standard thrust washer
[02:22:48] <zeeshan> lame!
[02:23:09] <XXCoder1> hey furrywolf about lights
[02:23:13] <furrywolf> it's not a thrust washer, in that there's no thrust on it.
[02:23:23] <zeeshan> furrywolf: its similar
[02:23:26] <XXCoder1> white is ground, and brown and red is hot, respectively?
[02:23:32] <zeeshan> it needs the tribology
[02:23:35] <zeeshan> of a thrust washer
[02:23:39] <zeeshan> even though it doesnt see much load on it
[02:23:46] <zeeshan> theres 2 sliding surfaces
[02:23:49] <furrywolf> I think it's a bearing, in that it stays still while the parts inside it spin.
[02:23:57] <Crom> brown?
[02:24:15] <furrywolf> XXCoder1: white is generally neutral, yes.
[02:24:16] <XXCoder1> Crom: stop/walk sign has strange wiring code
[02:24:17] <zeeshan> furrywolf: use your lathe! :P
[02:24:21] <zeeshan> grind some HSS!
[02:24:32] <Crom> maybe not a bushing, but a radial bushing to keep things aligned?
[02:24:37] <furrywolf> I don't have random hss nor sufficient tooling.
[02:24:42] <furrywolf> Crom: that's my guess.
[02:25:02] <furrywolf> it seems to be working surprisingly well without it. lol
[02:25:10] <Crom> I was gonna say cut it out of the bottom of a dead skillet
[02:25:40] <zeeshan> http://www.ebay.com/itm/HIGH-SPEED-STEEL-CUTTING-HOLE-SAWS-LOT-OF-4-IN-SAME-SIZE-2-3-8-2-375-/131497738425?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e9de040b9
[02:25:40] <furrywolf> on monday I'll stop by the local tool repair shop and see if they have a parts unit they can pull one from
[02:25:41] <zeeshan> wow
[02:25:43] <zeeshan> these are SEXY
[02:25:45] <zeeshan> hss hole saws
[02:25:46] <zeeshan> ive never seen that!
[02:26:04] <Crom> black, red, blue are generally 120v phases. with White as neutral
[02:26:14] <zeeshan> furrywolf: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Huge-7-1-2-lb-Lot-of-Lathe-Tool-Bits-HSS-60-Pc-Lot-REX-AAA-Rex-95-/281676778983?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item41953e8de7
[02:26:15] <zeeshan> :D
[02:26:30] <zeeshan> what do you see for shipping cost
[02:26:45] <furrywolf> zeeshan: http://www.hougen.com/cutters/magdrill/images/Hougen-annular-cutter_group.jpg your hole saws aren't nearly as sexy as the annular cutters on my magdrill. :P
[02:26:51] <zeeshan> haha
[02:26:54] <zeeshan> those are superior
[02:26:59] <zeeshan> but its kinda cool to see hss
[02:27:04] <zeeshan> ive never seen it
[02:27:04] <furrywolf> $12
[02:27:19] <zeeshan> i see $60 lol
[02:27:21] <furrywolf> hss is the cheap holesaws. good ones are bimetal with cobalt teeth.
[02:27:28] <zeeshan> are you sure?
[02:27:29] <furrywolf> well, mid-grade.
[02:27:42] <zeeshan> regular hole saws dont look like hss
[02:27:44] <furrywolf> cheap, like the stuff they sell from china, is the same metal they make desktop pc cases from.
[02:27:45] <zeeshan> theyre a lot softer lol
[02:28:09] <Crom> they last 1/3 of a hole.
[02:28:30] <furrywolf> http://images.speedyservices.com/ProductImages/c1402008_nwtools_srcv140.jpg.ashx?width=1200&height=900&bgcolor=ffffff&scale=both cutter porn
[02:28:44] <Crom> I've switched to carbide teeth hole saws. they pay for themselves so fast
[02:28:55] <furrywolf> yep. I gave my neighbor a harbor freight holesaw because I wasn't going to let him touch my good ones. it failed to drill through a ford body panel.
[02:29:15] <zeeshan> well if it was hss, it would easily drill trhough a steel panel
[02:29:19] <zeeshan> i feel like they are some other material
[02:29:22] <zeeshan> just hardened steel.
[02:29:32] <zeeshan> like 1045
[02:29:37] <furrywolf> yeah, mid-grade ones are hss. the cheap ones are the cheapest junk steel they can find.
[02:29:46] <furrywolf> the good ones are cobalt bi-metal
[02:29:50] <furrywolf> the great ones are carbide.
[02:29:52] <Crom> body panels on older stuff is pretty tough stuff.
[02:29:54] <zeeshan> yea i have the bimetal
[02:30:08] <zeeshan> i dont really look at carbide cause the teeth break too easy
[02:30:11] <zeeshan> when using a handd rill
[02:31:19] <furrywolf> http://www.toolstop.co.uk/components/com_virtuemart/shop_image/product/ee8893f614d1a860e966f8d1dfc6c6cb.jpg more rotabroach porn
[02:31:28] <zeeshan> what are those made out of
[02:31:35] <zeeshan> looks like hss
[02:31:35] <zeeshan> ;p
[02:31:51] <Crom> http://www.zoro.com/ideal-carbide-hole-cutter-78-in-hole-36-301/i/G4226817/
[02:32:17] <zeeshan> crom that looks beefy
[02:32:19] <zeeshan> hard to break :p
[02:32:36] <furrywolf> probably hss, although the pricing suggests they're made from ground-up unicorn horns or something...
[02:32:36] <Crom> hard to break, hard to wear out.
[02:32:47] <zeeshan> but too little number of teeth
[02:33:11] <Crom> though usually change out the pilot drill for a masonery bit
[02:33:19] <zeeshan> http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41Gth8NgHDL._SX342_.jpg
[02:33:25] <zeeshan> thats the stuff i broke teeth off relatively easily
[02:33:32] <XXCoder1> furrywolf: it works
[02:34:07] <XXCoder1> walk sign shows perfectly, the stop hand only some leds work. if I was electrician I probably would be able to fix it lol
[02:34:11] <Crom> yeah those are tiny teeth
[02:34:32] <furrywolf> now you know why it was pulled.
[02:34:37] <XXCoder1> indeed
[02:34:43] <Crom> xxco: long leg of the diode goes towards positive side +
[02:35:06] <XXCoder1> timer dont seem to work, but it may require quick switch from one hot to other
[02:35:14] <XXCoder1> Crom: I know.
[02:35:23] <XXCoder1> its not leds thats broken probably
[02:35:39] <Crom> traces?
[02:35:48] <XXCoder1> maybe would have to look lol
[02:35:55] <furrywolf> if some but not all work, you have a bad led, bad solder joint, or bad resistor... I suspect any actual circuitry is shared between all leds.
[02:36:05] <XXCoder1> that is possible
[02:36:23] <XXCoder1> though its pretty cool to finally see it light up after all those years
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[02:36:45] <XXCoder1> I always thought it was more complex, like hot ground and signal wire
[02:36:55] <Computer_barf> furry , is this the mill that was left outside and rusted?
[02:37:17] <furrywolf> zeeshan: http://www.ohiopowertool.com/p-8512-hougen-12000-series-rotabroach-cutter-2-x-2-12264.aspx check out the price. that's the downside to annular cutters.
[02:37:21] <Computer_barf> or was that someone else
[02:37:41] <furrywolf> Computer_barf: the stuck linear bearing? no, I bought a "works perfectly" sliding compound miter saw, and found the slide binds badly.
[02:38:09] <Computer_barf> ah i think it might have been _methods that mentioned a mill that was left outside
[02:38:32] <furrywolf> XXCoder1: it's designed to be a direct replacement for a fixture that consisted entirely of two light bulbs.
[02:39:18] <XXCoder1> yeah I thought otherwise before meeting you lol
[02:40:27] <furrywolf> I have 5 cutters, and I hope I never need a size I don't have, or to replace one of these..
[02:41:02] <furrywolf> XXCoder1: now pull it apart, find the bad led, replace.
[02:41:16] <Crom> furrywolf, I'd still stay flush with brake fuild move it a bunch, tilt it up and pure more brake fluid into it. move it more, then blow with a rubber tipped airgun
[02:41:16] <XXCoder1> I would check internal stuff first
[02:41:31] <XXCoder1> may be bad trace "burnt" out leds in same chain
[02:41:52] <furrywolf> ... the current-carrying capability of your average trace far exceeds that of your average led. they're not going to burn.
[02:42:08] <furrywolf> more likely you have a bad led, bad resistor, or bad solder joint.
[02:42:13] <XXCoder1> well I said bad trace, may not be caused by actual burnt out
[02:42:23] <XXCoder1> weather for example. its probably been out for years
[02:42:31] <Crom> more likely mechinical fatigue from temp cycles...
[02:42:35] <furrywolf> less talking, more unscrewing. :P
[02:42:36] <XXCoder1> yeah
[02:42:43] <XXCoder1> lol
[02:43:00] <Crom> open, open, open, open, open, open, open, open, open, open, open, open!!!!!!!!!
[02:44:02] <furrywolf> bbl, more humping of the chop saw.
[02:44:20] <Crom> LOL
[02:44:35] <Crom> hump, hump, hump, hump, hump, hump, hump, hump, hump, hump, hump, hump, hump, hump!!!!
[02:44:45] <Crom> open, open, open, open, open, open, open, open, open, open, open, open, open, open!!!!!!!!!
[02:45:58] <XXCoder1> lol
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[02:48:24] <Crom> shit memory leak on the winbloz machine
[02:48:48] <Crom> HD is going full tilt swapping
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[03:08:13] <Crom> swap error..
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[03:17:09] <furrywolf> saw humping has resulted in significant improvement. twice it suddenly got easier. I think that was stuck sets of balls freeing up.
[03:18:10] <XXCoder1> heh
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[03:24:34] <furrywolf> it's getting dark and the bitey bugs are out... project deferred until tomorrow.
[03:25:18] <XXCoder1> yummy
[03:25:36] <XXCoder1> its not worthy meal unless it tries to bite you back! lol
[03:26:43] <furrywolf> http://www.grainger.com/product/AMPCO-Adjustable-Wrench-4DC25 picked one of those up today for $1... who knows when you'll need non-sparking tools!
[03:27:03] <XXCoder1> $100??
[03:27:12] <XXCoder1> damn you had a great deal
[03:27:58] <furrywolf> it's a very specialized tool.
[03:28:14] <XXCoder1> yeah not often do people need tools that wont spark
[03:28:44] <furrywolf> non-sparking and non-magnetic
[03:30:44] <furrywolf> and Beryllium-free, although that might not be a good thing.
[03:31:03] <XXCoder1> wonder if theres any application for extra sparky tools lol
[03:31:29] <furrywolf> yes. survival fire starters. :P
[03:31:36] <XXCoder1> lol
[03:31:38] <furrywolf> and, of course, lighters, etc.
[03:31:58] <furrywolf> my oxytorch has an extra-sparky tool on a wire on the stand. :P
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[03:52:55] <XXCoder1> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgnsXPnAX8M
[03:52:57] <XXCoder1> interesting
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[04:14:02] <ffurrywol> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmIb2zkMtjQ more fun with aluminum
[04:14:27] <XXCoder1> yeah saw that before. pretty cool allright
[04:16:26] * ffurrywol wonders when aliens will start pouring aluminum into random earth skyscrapers to use as art on their homeworld
[04:16:38] <XXCoder1> lol
[04:20:50] <XXCoder1> I remember one strange project
[04:20:57] <XXCoder1> guy used mecury to make telescope
[04:21:06] <XXCoder1> of course, heavily protected in case it tips over
[04:21:17] <XXCoder1> anyway its on disk that spins slowly so it curves
[04:22:19] <ffurrywol> yep, there's a few of those.
[04:22:38] <XXCoder1> its an amazing metal
[04:22:43] <XXCoder1> too bad its so damn toxic
[04:24:20] <ffurrywol> bbl, wolfy bedtime
[04:34:06] <XXCoder1> bah
[04:34:12] <XXCoder1> coveres is glued on
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[05:00:23] <Crom> hmm
[05:01:46] <Crom> bandsaw
[05:02:24] <XXCoder1> yeah dont wanna break it
[05:02:27] <Crom> angle grinder
[05:02:28] <XXCoder1> dunno lol
[05:05:50] <XXCoder1> man wish I really am good electrican lol I bet I'd hve fun with tiny eink screens
[05:06:03] <XXCoder1> http://www.pervasivedisplays.com/products/panels
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[05:23:44] <XXCoder1> LOL
[05:23:49] <XXCoder1> such a bad photoshop http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Free-shipping-7-Inch-PDF-eBook-Reader-MP3-MP4-Player-FM-eReader-4GB-2015-New/32284015366.html
[05:23:59] <XXCoder1> its umm supposed to be epaper display lol
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[05:54:52] <Crom> the chip is a color display chip
[05:56:28] <XXCoder1> yeah?
[05:56:42] <XXCoder1> its umm supposed to be epaper display lol
[05:56:44] <XXCoder1> er
[05:56:52] <XXCoder1> sorry scrolled up by mistake
[05:57:04] <XXCoder1> anyway I was saying, I guess its regular led ereader then
[05:57:10] <XXCoder1> still bad photoshop though
[05:59:11] <Crom> true
[05:59:50] <Crom> man I need some new monitors.. running single headed SUXS!
[06:00:16] <XXCoder1> rocking with 2 here
[06:00:25] <XXCoder1> unfortunately dead standard type
[06:00:27] <XXCoder1> dvi
[06:00:40] <Crom> VGA here
[06:00:53] <XXCoder1> vga is still alive
[06:00:59] <XXCoder1> and older than dvi lol
[06:01:27] <Crom> I do have dvi just no hdmi, I take that back the blueray to the TV is hdmi
[06:02:38] <Crom> playing with 2 arduino's uno and a Mega
[06:03:46] <Crom> almost ready to get a raspberry pi or a beagle board
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[06:43:15] <Crom> $53 for 1TB 2.5 sata3 drive http://aaawave.com/p-16187-western-digital-wd10ezex-wd-1tb-blue-sataiii-64mb-7200rpm-desktop-oem.aspx?gclid=CJvQgou6osUCFaVj7AoduXYALA
[06:43:39] <Crom> 7200 rpm
[06:44:37] <Crom> seagate 1TB for $50
[06:44:51] <XXCoder1> I gonna build new pc
[06:44:56] <XXCoder1> kickass one
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[06:48:18] <Crom> 3TB 3.5" for 105
[06:50:02] <Crom> yeah 3TB are best bang for the buck right now..
[06:52:41] <XXCoder1> not bad
[06:52:58] <XXCoder1> unless planning 0+1 or 1+0 raid or 5
[06:53:09] <XXCoder1> then 4 1 tb drives cheap
[06:54:00] <Crom> 3tb == 2x 1tb drive, 4tb == 3x 1tb drive 5TB=4x 1tb, 6TB==4.7x 1tb
[06:54:43] <Crom> well $550 for 5 3TB drive for a 12TB raid drive... is tempting
[06:55:30] <XXCoder1> which raid type
[06:55:41] <Crom> 5
[06:56:32] <Crom> cap for 5 is n-1
[06:58:03] <Crom> 5 is nice... 6 is a bit better but it raises the price to $660
[06:58:27] <Crom> 5 can loose 1 drive and recover. 6 can lose 2
[06:58:29] <XXCoder1> heard 1+0 is strange version but has speed of raid 0 but with nice raid 1 backup
[06:59:05] <Crom> 5 is so much better
[06:59:30] <Crom> it's what I'm used to as well
[07:00:01] <XXCoder1> indeed
[07:00:08] <XXCoder1> my pc used to have raid 4
[07:00:09] <XXCoder1> er 5
[07:00:16] <Crom> but I'd get a raid 5 controller or MB with raid 5 with 7 sata's on the MB
[07:01:00] <Crom> 1 boot drive, 2 blueray, 3-7 raid
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[07:06:34] <Deejay> moin
[07:08:09] <XXCoder1> yo
[07:10:39] <Crom> morning
[07:11:08] <Deejay> \o/
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[09:46:32] <Crom> hmmm think I'm gonna try to convert my Weller TC201 iron into a temp controlled YiHua solder station
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[09:47:11] <Crom> my temp control magnetic switch went out in my iron and it's cheaper to buy the YiHua parts
[09:50:10] <Crom> ahhh Chrome has memory leaks
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[12:45:56] <jt-mobile> Morning
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[12:47:20] <_methods> allooo alloo
[12:47:38] <_methods> breakfast done
[12:47:51] <_methods> time to get some work done
[12:48:18] <jt-mobile> We are at SpyderFest
[12:48:36] <_methods> ahh cool
[12:48:42] <_methods> i hope you sell a bunch
[12:49:17] <_methods> do they have a spyder2 out now?
[12:49:49] <jt-mobile> I did sell some stuff last night. But I don't get a vendor boot
[12:50:22] <jt-mobile> They have a FL now
[12:50:35] <jt-mobile> F3
[12:50:50] <_methods> seems like i saw a commercial for it the other day
[12:51:20] <jt-mobile> Yea they are advertising it a lot
[12:52:24] <jt-mobile> Can Am delivered the 100,000 spyder at the fest
[12:52:27] <_methods> so where's spyderfest at?
[12:52:46] <jt-mobile> Springfield Mo
[12:53:29] <_methods> see any boobies yet lol
[12:54:30] <jt-mobile> That is a Harley thing lol
[12:55:46] <_methods> hahahha
[12:55:55] <_methods> spyder chix don't show the boobies
[12:55:58] <_methods> damn
[12:57:09] <jt-mobile> Most are 50+
[12:58:06] <_methods> haha ok ok point taken
[12:58:31] <_methods> i used to go to bike week in myrtle beach every year
[12:58:41] <_methods> i'm too old for all that insanity anymore
[12:58:53] <_methods> i stayed with the hell's angels one year that was pretty cool
[12:59:06] <_methods> swat teams rollin through the hotel hallways all night
[13:01:19] <jt-mobile> I'm a bit more reserved
[13:02:29] <jt-mobile> I don't even like harlies
[13:03:30] <jt-mobile> Time for some breakfast
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[13:47:32] <Tom_itx> _methods you probably wouldn't wanna see _those_ boobies
[13:55:23] <_methods> heheh
[13:55:26] <_methods> knee draggers
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[15:32:08] <zeeshan> http://www.kijiji.ca/v-business-industrial/windsor-area-on/cnc-lathe-cincinatti-falcon-400/1064827268?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true
[15:32:13] <zeeshan> hmmm!
[15:32:22] <zeeshan> _almost_ perfect
[15:32:32] <zeeshan> but i wish it had a 7.5HP motor and 6000 rpm spindle
[15:32:46] <zeeshan> has all the other specs
[15:32:50] <zeeshan> 5" spindle bore lol
[15:33:25] <Tom_itx> kinda big
[15:33:36] <zeeshan> it'd fit in the garage
[15:33:53] <Tom_itx> with anything else??
[15:34:01] <zeeshan> no id have to get rid of my lathe
[15:34:04] <zeeshan> move my bead roller to the basement
[15:34:07] <archivist> and the car
[15:34:11] <zeeshan> nahh
[15:34:13] <zeeshan> itll fit w/ car
[15:34:29] <zeeshan> i dont wanna spend more than 4000 TOTAL
[15:34:33] <zeeshan> so that means after conversion
[15:34:42] <Tom_itx> you got 460 3phase?
[15:34:43] <zeeshan> so i'd need to find the machine for 2500~
[15:34:51] <zeeshan> no, but i would convert it
[15:35:05] <zeeshan> so it runs off 240v single
[15:35:07] <pcw_home> will you garage floor like 18000 lbs?
[15:35:19] <zeeshan> yea itll take it
[15:35:27] <zeeshan> with the appropriate plate
[15:35:45] <archivist> and underpinning
[15:36:28] <zeeshan> its really hard to find a lathe that'll do 30" Z travel, slant bed, live tailstock, live turrett
[15:36:34] <zeeshan> for under 3000
[15:36:42] <zeeshan> i found one, but i missed on it by an hour.
[15:36:51] <zeeshan> :(
[15:39:46] <pcw_home> looks like it will run on 240V 3 phase 120A
[15:40:38] <zeeshan> too bad the spindle is too big and slow!
[15:41:00] <pcw_home> well its for turning big things
[15:41:53] <archivist> and dont spin long thin bits too fast
[15:42:26] <pcw_home> lessn yo wants to be whupped to deth
[15:42:31] <zeeshan> lol
[15:42:37] <zeeshan> you can spin em fast, just need support
[15:42:45] <zeeshan> im thinking a 2" diameter bar
[15:42:49] <zeeshan> 24" long
[15:43:34] <archivist> but yo is often moving the support
[15:45:07] <zeeshan> :)
[15:45:37] <pcw_home> notice where it came from, sticker on the nameplate
[15:45:54] <zeeshan> TAIWAN
[15:46:07] <Tom_itx> imagine whipping a 4.5" bar around in your garage
[15:46:08] <pcw_home> Ontario Hydro
[15:46:34] <zeeshan> pcw_home: thats just an electrical authority approval tag
[15:46:42] <zeeshan> pretty stnadard here after inspection
[15:46:46] <pcw_home> oh OK
[15:47:49] <zeeshan> man i wish there was an easier way to do this
[15:47:59] <zeeshan> without making a plate with protrusions that fit in these holes:
[15:48:02] <zeeshan> http://gyazo.com/0b5001a15e639800c69d807e1f10a0ad
[15:48:16] <zeeshan> i gotta chamfer the butterfly in the bottom side of that pic
[15:48:23] <zeeshan> but from opposite face (i gotta flip the part)
[15:48:30] <zeeshan> i need to still maintain alignment
[15:49:44] <CaptHindsight> zeeshan: how does Canadian customs handle the charge for trailering in 3 tons of scrap machine?
[15:50:04] <zeeshan> not sure :/
[15:51:07] <CaptHindsight> probably by whatever is on the invoice or receipt
[15:51:55] <CaptHindsight> I once called them to ask about if I'd be charged for carrying 500lb of hand tools across the border and back
[15:52:04] <CaptHindsight> they said it might be $20
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[15:59:53] <Tom_itx> zeeshan what size holes are those?
[16:00:39] <zeeshan> 4mm
[16:00:50] <Tom_itx> bolting isn't an option?
[16:01:13] <zeeshan> im doing peck drill, then bolting them down to a sacraficial plate
[16:01:25] <zeeshan> actually thats not gonna work
[16:01:26] <Tom_itx> ok, use 3 dowel pins on the perimeter for xy alignment
[16:01:28] <zeeshan> cause i gotta face mill em
[16:01:35] <Tom_itx> machine the plate to known dimensions
[16:01:53] <zeeshan> oh i remember now, i was gonna peck drill
[16:01:54] <zeeshan> and face
[16:01:55] <Tom_itx> nm, that won't work either
[16:02:00] <zeeshan> while holding from corners
[16:02:14] <zeeshan> then before the contour, i was gonna bolt it down
[16:02:32] <Tom_itx> you said you have to flip it over
[16:02:42] <CaptHindsight> zeeshan: I did find out that the customs duty into Canada for that resin I sent you is rather steep
[16:02:55] <Tom_itx> ok, the 3 dowels will work...
[16:03:02] <zeeshan> CaptHindsight: school paid it no?
[16:03:18] <Tom_itx> face the middle, drill, flip, contour and whatever else you need on the backside
[16:03:34] <CaptHindsight> zeeshan: something like 50%, yours was a sample so they just paid for shipping
[16:03:43] <Tom_itx> you will need a plate under the center though
[16:03:47] <Tom_itx> to support it
[16:04:00] <zeeshan> CaptHindsight: wow wtf
[16:04:00] <Tom_itx> not the best plan...
[16:04:01] <Tom_itx> hmm
[16:04:09] <zeeshan> tom how about this
[16:04:13] <zeeshan> i face it, drill it
[16:04:25] <zeeshan> but when i contour, i only contour the portion that needs to be chamfered
[16:04:27] <Tom_itx> first, what do you need to do to the backside?
[16:04:35] <zeeshan> this way i can drill some holes on the plate on the corners
[16:04:41] <zeeshan> for dowel holes..
[16:04:47] <zeeshan> (3 hole alignment)
[16:04:59] <zeeshan> i need to chamfer in opposite ends
[16:05:25] <Tom_itx> can you chamfer before you profile?
[16:05:48] <zeeshan> probably not
[16:05:56] <zeeshan> tip doesnt cut
[16:06:43] <zeeshan> i think my idea will work
[16:06:56] <Tom_itx> you don't need to drill locating holes for the dowels
[16:07:08] <Tom_itx> just pin them on the outside and at the corners
[16:07:18] <zeeshan> take square plate, hold it down from corners. drill holes in the corners to hold shoulder bolts
[16:07:36] <zeeshan> and only complete enough contouring so that i can chamfer with the tool
[16:07:37] <Tom_itx> you need dowels if you want alignment
[16:07:46] <Tom_itx> ok i'll buy that
[16:07:50] <Tom_itx> cut halfway down
[16:07:53] <Tom_itx> and chamfer
[16:07:57] <Tom_itx> then flip and finish
[16:07:58] <zeeshan> yes
[16:08:06] <zeeshan> this stuff is weird
[16:08:12] <Tom_itx> but you will need dowels, not bolts for alignment
[16:08:14] <zeeshan> if i had to ever redial it back in, it'd b a pain in the ass
[16:08:21] <zeeshan> well im using shoulder bolts
[16:08:22] <Tom_itx> at least 2
[16:08:27] <Tom_itx> then bolt the other two
[16:08:28] <zeeshan> the ones with ground dowels in them
[16:08:38] <zeeshan> okay that works too
[16:08:39] <Tom_itx> and maybe a clamp by the dowels
[16:08:42] <zeeshan> but i dont think i have dowels that small
[16:08:43] <zeeshan> ill have to check
[16:09:01] <Tom_itx> doesn't matter what size if they're in the corners
[16:09:43] <Tom_itx> then make sure your cam aligns the dowels for each side
[16:09:47] <Tom_itx> remember one is opposite
[16:12:17] <Tom_itx> don't rely on threads for alignment
[16:13:48] <Tom_itx> if you cut halfway and chamfer, make sure when you flip it to finish the profile the center is bolted
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[16:20:05] <zeeshan> will show you simulation in a few min
[16:20:14] <zeeshan> i think we're talking about the same thing
[16:22:59] <Tom_itx> you may as well get used to having a sacrificial plate on your mill
[16:23:05] <zeeshan> hahah
[16:23:25] <Tom_itx> get one big one and use it until it's gone
[16:25:15] <Tom_itx> drill a grid pattern in it and tap half and ream the other half
[16:25:30] <Tom_itx> then you'll have bolt locations and dowel alignment as well
[16:27:32] <zeeshan> peck drill tap drill size in sacraficial plate -> pause program -> tap by hand -> peck drill clearance hole -> face the part -> use same end mill to drill 4 holes at corners of plate for .5" dowel -> pause program -- put in bolts -> contour one half of plate -> chamfer one half of plate. -> pause program and flip plate (realign with dowels) -> face mill -> pause program -- bolt in part from middle
[16:27:47] <zeeshan> two bolts -> contour other half -> chamfer
[16:27:48] <zeeshan> done
[16:29:06] <Tom_itx> i'd use smaller dowels
[16:29:11] <Tom_itx> but it's your call
[16:29:19] <zeeshan> i dont wanna change the end mill
[16:29:19] <zeeshan> lol
[16:29:29] <zeeshan> trying to save a tool change
[16:29:41] <Tom_itx> you using the em for the dowel holes or profiling them?
[16:29:54] <Tom_itx> pfft tool change vs precision alignment?
[16:30:01] <zeeshan> my final part for drawbar came in -- so ill have a drawbar soon
[16:30:09] <zeeshan> power
[16:30:16] <Tom_itx> alignment holes should be reamed
[16:30:27] <zeeshan> end mill does pretty good with circular interpolation
[16:30:37] <zeeshan> i can hold 2 tenths
[16:31:07] <zeeshan> remember the throttle body porting?
[16:31:11] <zeeshan> that was within 5 tenths!
[16:31:15] <Tom_itx> mkay
[16:31:24] <Tom_itx> should work then
[16:31:55] <Tom_itx> the larger dowels will just wear out your sacrificial plate sooner
[16:32:09] <zeeshan> thats true :/
[16:32:12] <zeeshan> ok fuck it
[16:32:13] <zeeshan> tool change
[16:32:50] <Tom_itx> if you leave the plate on, you can drill / ream a row of them in an L shape
[16:32:58] <zeeshan> dude
[16:32:59] <Tom_itx> then you can use them for multiple setups
[16:33:01] <zeeshan> if im only doing this for alginment
[16:33:07] <zeeshan> why cant i just machine the corners of this plate?
[16:33:26] <Tom_itx> i said that first off
[16:34:19] <Tom_itx> you will still need to hold the center on the 2nd op
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[16:40:45] <SpeedEvil> magnets
[16:42:12] <Tom_itx> non ferrous
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[16:42:34] <Tom_itx> not so good for chip management anyway
[16:43:45] <SpeedEvil> You need special aluminium magnets then
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[16:46:55] <zeeshan> found tons of 1/8 dowels
[16:47:12] <Tom_itx> all you really need
[16:47:28] <Tom_itx> i generally use 3/16 or 1/4
[16:47:38] <zeeshan> i only got 1 1/4 dowel lol
[16:47:41] <zeeshan> i need to get those
[16:49:30] <Tom_itx> the bolts will hold it, you just need them for alignment
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[16:58:00] <zeeshan> lol this is going to be annoying
[16:58:29] <zeeshan> 11/64 clearance drill, then #30 tap drill, then 7/64 drill, then 1/8 reamer
[16:58:37] <zeeshan> this is where i wish i had 4 drill chucks!
[16:58:52] <zeeshan> so i didnt have to keep resetting the Z height
[17:00:45] <roycroft> i'm still machining manually, so to tap a hole it's spot drill, tap drill, countersink, tap
[17:00:49] <roycroft> then move on to the next hole
[17:01:11] <zeeshan> hehe
[17:01:22] <zeeshan> i might have to spot drill too :[
[17:01:28] <zeeshan> 5 drill chucks!
[17:01:41] <zeeshan> ill definitely be keeping one tool holder as a spot drill
[17:01:42] <zeeshan> permanently
[17:01:47] <zeeshan> cause its so commonly used
[17:02:13] <roycroft> i never, ever start a hole without a spot drill
[17:02:21] <roycroft> even when using a hand drill
[17:02:25] <zeeshan> for non critical stuff
[17:02:30] <zeeshan> it doesnt really matter
[17:02:32] <roycroft> perhaps i should say especially when using a hand drill
[17:02:35] <zeeshan> for a small drill yes
[17:02:40] <zeeshan> but like say im doing a 1/4" hole
[17:02:41] <zeeshan> i wont bother
[17:02:42] <roycroft> drill bits wander too much
[17:02:51] <zeeshan> for cnc this is
[17:02:59] <roycroft> i have lots of battery drills though
[17:03:08] <roycroft> so when doing things by hand i have lots of chucks available
[17:03:31] <zeeshan> instead of 4 drill chucks
[17:03:34] <zeeshan> i think a tool setter would be nice
[17:03:42] <zeeshan> so after tool change, it goes to set the tool automatically
[17:03:49] <zeeshan> and updates Z offset automatically
[17:03:52] <roycroft> i start with a center punch when hand drilling, of course, so that adds yet another operation
[17:04:02] <roycroft> yes, a tool setter would be nice
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[17:45:10] <Tom_itx> zeeshan yeah i keep a spot drill in a permanent holder
[17:45:50] <Tom_itx> we had pencil holders with collets for the smaller drills
[17:46:09] <Tom_itx> 1/2" shank holder
[17:46:33] <Tom_itx> mine is valenite
[17:47:23] <Tom_itx> http://www.ebay.com/itm/2-300DA-Collet-Tool-Holders-1-2-Shank-5-used-assorted-collets-/261852603471?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cf7a1a44f
[17:47:26] <Tom_itx> very similar to that
[17:47:26] <_methods> Tom_itx: you have a sherline right?
[17:47:37] <Tom_itx> yes
[17:47:47] <_methods> can you climb mill with yours?
[17:48:01] <Tom_itx> sorta
[17:48:06] <_methods> yeah same boat
[17:48:17] <_methods> i can climb as long as i stay in the cut
[17:48:23] <Tom_itx> yeah
[17:48:30] <_methods> just wondering lol
[17:48:47] <_methods> my whole column is flappin around comin off a straight climb lol
[17:49:16] <Tom_itx> i just go slow
[17:49:30] <Tom_itx> and learned to use small cutters
[17:49:38] <_methods> yeah i'll just convential mill straight runs
[17:49:48] <_methods> yeah i'm using 1/2" carbide 4fl on steel
[17:49:54] <Tom_itx> i'm used to being able to use 6" shell mills at full till
[17:49:57] <_methods> raising quite the ruckus
[17:50:07] <Tom_itx> sherline won't quite do that
[17:50:08] <Tom_itx> :D
[17:50:17] <_methods> no
[17:50:29] <_methods> neither will my bottom of the harbor freight mill
[17:50:54] <Tom_itx> i stick with .250 or smaller mills
[17:51:16] <Tom_itx> usually 1/8 or 3/16
[17:51:27] <_methods> maybe i should take up that position also lol
[17:51:39] <_methods> i need to finish the belt mod quick lol
[17:51:45] <_methods> my gears sound like doo doo
[17:51:57] <Tom_itx> you'll probably get better results
[17:52:05] <_methods> can't get much worse lol
[17:52:21] <Tom_itx> i'm certainly glad i went to timing belts instead of the vgrove
[17:52:29] <_methods> on your spindle?
[17:52:32] <Tom_itx> yes
[17:52:42] <_methods> ah shit i'm doing the vbelt one
[17:52:52] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/new_pulleys/timing_pulley_index.php
[17:52:53] <_methods> never thought to try using timing on spindle
[17:52:55] <Tom_itx> check those out
[17:53:02] <Tom_itx> oh hell yeay
[17:53:03] <Tom_itx> h
[17:53:17] <_methods> well that would have bene much easier than making pulleys lol
[17:53:23] <Tom_itx> changed the encoder out too
[17:53:40] <Tom_itx> last thing i was working on before i had to pause for a while was spindle reverse
[17:53:42] <_methods> guess i'll do that some other day
[17:53:55] <_methods> yeah i remember you were working on that
[17:54:01] <zeeshan> hey is there a way to manually set a new Z height for a tool in between a program ?
[17:54:19] <Tom_itx> zeeshan not that i know of
[17:54:22] <Tom_itx> oh wait...
[17:54:35] <Tom_itx> somebody was working on pause / resume
[17:54:45] <Tom_itx> you might check the logs/forum etc
[17:54:45] <zeeshan> yea i can see why it would be so useful
[17:54:52] <zeeshan> cause you can jog to set your new height
[17:54:55] <Tom_itx> for tool breakage etc
[17:54:58] <zeeshan> without having to reset the program
[17:55:06] <zeeshan> well for automatic tool setters?
[17:55:10] <zeeshan> isn't there a routine?
[17:55:30] <Tom_itx> the trick is getting the tool table updated and being able to resume where you were
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[17:56:10] <Deejay> re
[17:58:18] <Tom_itx> zeeshan wait for reply in -devel
[17:58:25] <zeeshan> ty
[17:58:54] <Tom_itx> i doubt it's in mainstream yet
[17:59:06] <_methods> bah too late i guess i think i just killed my gears lol
[17:59:14] <Tom_itx> ?
[17:59:28] <Tom_itx> broke a tooth?
[17:59:42] <_methods> hmm bearings might be smoked
[17:59:57] <Tom_itx> switch over to timing belts
[17:59:59] <_methods> yeah
[18:00:02] <_methods> working on it lol
[18:00:08] <Tom_itx> just make sure they're heavy enough
[18:00:12] <Tom_itx> mine is 9mm wide
[18:00:22] <Tom_itx> which is plenty for the sherline i think
[18:00:56] <Tom_itx> and i already had the ones i used on the encoder
[18:01:00] <Tom_itx> which are smaller
[18:01:47] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/new_pulleys/new_pulley_mounted2.jpg
[18:01:52] <Tom_itx> that shows the series i used
[18:02:07] <Tom_itx> sdp-si.com
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[18:06:55] <Jymmm> My new cellphone ??? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8eaiNsFhtI8
[18:08:31] <XXCoder1> it's so slim
[18:10:20] <Jymmm> Kinda cool that we can do that though.
[18:10:26] <XXCoder1> indeed
[18:12:31] <Jymmm> XXCoder1: It's voice + 2G_ONLY, but it has a LiIon charger built in... https://www.adafruit.com/products/1963
[18:13:20] <XXCoder1> nice
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[18:17:42] <_methods> http://i.imgur.com/ulFNzi5.jpg
[18:17:45] <_methods> buwhahahhaha
[18:17:47] <_methods> oops
[18:18:11] <Tom_itx> time for belts
[18:18:30] <_methods> no kidding
[18:18:34] <XXCoder1> motor fell in or what?
[18:18:41] -!- Computer_Barf1 [Computer_Barf1!~technoid@c-50-186-255-137.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #linuxcnc
[18:18:47] <XXCoder1> because as I see it, gear has no room to rotate lol
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[18:19:16] <archivist> spastic gear
[18:19:28] <Tom_itx> i wish i had those screws on mine
[18:19:45] <MrFluffy> hi all, has anyone got camview-emc installed on a wheezy install?
[18:20:19] <XXCoder1> _methods: got any before pic? lol
[18:20:31] <MrFluffy> Im sure i did this and had it working, but I cant find the binary so probably it was on a gentoo box to test the camera and Ive got mixed up.
[18:21:15] <archivist> camview is a little unmaintained I believe, needs someone to cuddle it
[18:22:42] <MrFluffy> hmm python-camunits is depending on a older version of python...
[18:24:52] <MrFluffy> I saw CaptHindsight mentioning he had it working under wheezy in a archive of this channel, fishing for a response
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[18:25:26] <MrFluffy> it must have been on my gentoo laptop, but Im sure I remember marvelling at how horrible my machine bed looked in it..
[18:25:32] <CaptHindsight> yeah camview is old
[18:25:41] <CaptHindsight> heh
[18:26:16] <CaptHindsight> I forget the Debian versions, wheezy sleepy sneezy etc
[18:26:24] <MrFluffy> how did you get it on wheezy?
[18:26:33] <CaptHindsight> is Wheezy on the current live cd?
[18:26:39] <MrFluffy> yes
[18:27:11] <CaptHindsight> I used the earlier packages and did some massaging by hand
[18:27:14] <MrFluffy> /etc/debian_version from my install 7.7
[18:27:27] <MrFluffy> ok, I guess man apt time and force it a bit
[18:27:30] <CaptHindsight> the machine is across the room from me
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[18:27:49] <CaptHindsight> the dependencies are required that i can see so far
[18:27:57] <CaptHindsight> some util might not work
[18:28:09] <CaptHindsight> but I had camera in the Axis window
[18:28:55] <CaptHindsight> MrFahrenheit: I'd really take a look at the other image processing app/library bu Google
[18:29:11] <CaptHindsight> heh MrFluffy ^^^
[18:29:47] <CaptHindsight> http://opencv.org/
[18:30:52] <MrFluffy> ugh this is going to be fun... crosshair.c:5:19: fatal error: GL/gl.h: No such file or directory
[18:31:04] <archivist> CaptHindsight, I spotted a logitech web camera today in a Maplin store 15mp http://www.logitech.com/en-gb/product/hd-pro-webcam-c920
[18:31:41] <CaptHindsight> more res and lower prices all the time :)
[18:32:28] <MrFluffy> this is for one of those usb microscopes
[18:32:47] <CaptHindsight> MrFluffy: somehad openCV on Wheezy and was using the libs to spot and measure the diameter of circles
[18:33:05] <CaptHindsight> I just haven't touched it in a few months
[18:33:17] <pcw_home> Skunkworks
[18:33:38] <CaptHindsight> yes, but he's busy with a new child
[18:33:46] <pcw_home> (who is probably pretty busy right now on the home front)
[18:33:55] <CaptHindsight> so he might be afk for the next few weeks
[18:34:07] <MrFahrenheit> I'm getting quite popular in this channel, it seems
[18:34:15] <MrFahrenheit> :P
[18:34:21] <CaptHindsight> definitely not sleeping
[18:34:48] <CaptHindsight> heh, MrFahrenheit that darn auto-complete :)
[18:35:04] <XXCoder1> MrFahrenheit: youre hot now! lol
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[18:36:50] <CaptHindsight> there's an openCV package in wheezy
[18:37:12] <CaptHindsight> getting it in Axis should be pretty similar to camview
[18:37:45] <CaptHindsight> once it is all the fun stuff should run in opencv
[18:38:16] <CaptHindsight> the trick will be getting info from openCV to generate offsets for Lnuxcnc
[18:39:56] <MrFluffy> just installed mesa-common-dev for the header and now its barfing on a missing header from FreeImage
[18:40:37] <CaptHindsight> I might have forced some earlier packages in myself
[18:41:42] <MrFluffy> Im used to typing emerge and fixing what breaks during a compile, its been a while since I did much on a binary distro
[18:41:51] <MrFahrenheit> XXCoder1, 200 degrees, that's why they call me MrFahrenheit
[18:42:05] <XXCoder1> you sure its not 451? heh
[18:42:24] <MrFahrenheit> don't stop me now
[18:42:41] <XXCoder1> watch out for firemen
[18:43:20] <MrFahrenheit> the nick is a reference to this song https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HgzGwKwLmgM
[18:43:43] <MrFluffy> CaptHindsight: haha its just failed because its dependant on opencv anyway :D
[18:44:10] <Computer_Barf1> did someone say barf?
[18:44:13] <XXCoder1> MrFahrenheit: interesting. I was reffering to book Fahrenheit 451
[18:44:27] <CaptHindsight> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XAifvRri2ss FirePick Delta computer vision centering
[18:44:35] <CaptHindsight> openCV inside ^^^
[18:44:49] <XXCoder1> intel inside
[18:44:51] <Computer_Barf1> cause I have a patent on all computer related barf
[18:45:19] <marmite> anyone have a good leed on a chuck key for me emco compact 5 :D
[18:45:49] <marmite> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Emco-Compact-5-Lathe-3-Jaw-80-mm-Drill-Type-Chuck-Key-1017-E-/390983931096?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5b087554d8 only key i find will cost me 80 usd :<
[18:45:57] <MrFluffy> this is going to be one of those things that to document Ill need to save out my bash history...
[18:46:24] <Computer_Barf1> could you possibly mill one?
[18:46:41] <marmite> dont think so not on mine anyway
[18:47:21] <CaptHindsight> it's like a drill chuck
[18:47:58] <CaptHindsight> marmite: could you get lucky by discovering a drill chuck key that fits?
[18:48:09] <CaptHindsight> or with minor mods
[18:48:23] <marmite> have tryied a couple no match so far
[18:48:32] <CaptHindsight> http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTAwMFgxMTQ5/z/~mkAAOSwaNBUckIB/$_57.JPG
[18:48:52] <XXCoder1> marmite: could use belt wrench to tighten and loosen meanwhile
[18:49:02] <CaptHindsight> just for scale what size are those screws?
[18:49:05] <marmite> iam :D
[18:49:10] <marmite> gonna check
[18:49:19] <MrFluffy> dinner, I shall pick this up in a bit, ldd cant find something now
[18:49:36] <XXCoder1> looks like m10 but dunno
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[18:51:04] <CaptHindsight> so that key is pretty big
[18:51:48] <XXCoder1> looks like it
[18:52:15] <CaptHindsight> http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/261862204411 $60
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[18:52:33] <XXCoder1> drill type 3
[18:52:34] <marmite> https://www.dropbox.com/s/cgd9y7nnv5po3rc/TAND.jpg?dl=0 have this crappy image
[18:52:46] <marmite> CaptHindsight: + 30 usd shipping for me
[18:53:07] <marmite> sweden
[18:53:39] <XXCoder1> thats probably suffecent info, besides unknown diameter
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[18:54:44] <CaptHindsight> grind 2 flats on each side and use a big wrench :)
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[18:55:41] <marmite> well could work :P
[18:55:42] <CaptHindsight> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Emco-Compact-5-Lathe-3-Jaw-80-mm-Drill-Type-Chuck-Key-1017-E/390983931096?_trksid=p2054897.c100204.m3164&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20140407115239%26meid%3Dad62f3a46fe74a4e9ff756e5d4c0020b%26pid%3D100204%26rk%3D5%26rkt%3D29%26sd%3D261862204411
[18:55:48] <marmite> but seems there should be a easier way
[18:56:02] <marmite> seems like it should be somewhat of a normal key
[18:56:37] <CaptHindsight> http://www.thetoolwarehouse.net/lisle-12060-P22056.aspx?gclid=CK35ipXeo8UCFQEGaQod6SIArA
[18:58:26] <CaptHindsight> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MIegFURsGFE
[18:58:35] <CaptHindsight> the lever
[19:00:09] <XXCoder1> awkward but works
[19:00:12] <CaptHindsight> http://newman-tools-shopping-cart-2.myshopify.com/collections/jacobs-drill-chucks-accessories/products/jacob
[19:00:26] <CaptHindsight> maybe a key for 1" chuck?
[19:00:58] <marmite> maby
[19:01:14] <marmite> gotta read upp on sizes
[19:01:20] <CaptHindsight> ^^ that site has some specs on pilot hole and teeth
[19:01:21] <XXCoder1> https://www.hswalsh.com/categories/emco-compact-5-accessories
[19:02:15] <marmite> wierd sizes
[19:02:20] <marmite> 1/ what that even :D
[19:02:24] <marmite> mm is the shit
[19:02:45] <CaptHindsight> 25.4mm = 1 inch :)
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[19:04:10] <XXCoder1> I do prefer scienfic standard, but I work at usa company lol
[19:04:20] <marmite> ah
[19:04:34] <CaptHindsight> i have to go back and forth all the time
[19:04:40] <marmite> then i need a chuck key that is 0.275591 inches :P
[19:04:48] <gene78> my crash-o-matic lathe computer? I just put a clip lead to ground the lathe frame to a motor cable shield
[19:05:01] <gene78> hasn't crashed in 20 minutes now.
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[19:05:29] <CaptHindsight> it's gets irritating to have to translate microns to 1/1000" for shops
[19:05:32] <XXCoder1> mr clippy finally helped
[19:05:42] <marmite> CaptHindsight: uhhhhhhh i understand that :D
[19:06:28] <CaptHindsight> RJ3-16 fits close enough
[19:06:41] <zeeshan> man there has to be an easier way to do this!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
[19:06:51] <XXCoder1> zeeshan: yeah
[19:06:54] <XXCoder1> just dont do it
[19:06:55] <XXCoder1> lol
[19:06:56] <CaptHindsight> https://wiki.xtronics.com/index.php/Tapers_and_Chuck_keys#Chuck_keys
[19:07:16] <zeeshan> 16 steps!
[19:07:18] <marmite> http://www.carolynrelei.com/inchchart.htm best site ever
[19:07:19] <marmite> :D
[19:07:26] <marmite> so i need a 1/4
[19:08:48] <XXCoder1> zeeshan: remember my tip ;)
[19:09:39] <XXCoder1> plenty of awesome conversion software for phones but my work dont allow phones lol
[19:09:43] <CaptHindsight> just under 9/32"
[19:10:25] <CaptHindsight> marmite: maybe a KK key will work
[19:11:06] <CaptHindsight> http://www.sears.com/jacobs-kk-t-handle-chuck-key-with-9-32/p-00988749000P?sid=IDx01192011x000001&kpid=00988749000&pla=&kispla=00988749000P&mktRedirect=y
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[19:11:15] <CaptHindsight> $2.99
[19:11:22] <marmite> not bad
[19:11:25] <marmite> http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-9-32-PILOT-1-2-DRILL-CHUCK-KEY-SIZE-AS-MILWAUKEE48-66-3480-JACOBS-KK-/321711336420?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ae77d6be4
[19:11:48] <CaptHindsight> $6 with shipping
[19:12:34] <marmite> well more for me in sweden
[19:13:51] <CaptHindsight> $24.75
[19:14:02] <marmite> cheeper on ebay then :D
[19:14:05] <marmite> gonna order and try
[19:14:06] <CaptHindsight> or first class for less but 4+ weeks
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[19:16:19] <Computer_Barf1> I was to create a build thread , where should I do it for my g0704
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[19:25:23] <tjtr33> gene78, jumper clip to star ground! "use the sink, luke"
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[19:34:30] <MrFluffy> my mill kept having random joint errors and several mr clippys were recruited and eliminated them
[19:34:41] <zeeshan> boy this program
[19:34:43] <MrFluffy> Ive only just got round to running actual ground wires in place of them
[19:34:46] <zeeshan> is a lot longer than i thought it would be,.
[19:35:19] <XXCoder1> yeah some mysterous program is longer than expected
[19:36:12] <zeeshan> face, flip & reset origin, face, spot drill, drill #30, drill 17/64 clearance, drill 7/64, ream 1/8, pause program (tap holes by hand and bolt down), contour, chamfer, pause(flip part and rebolt down those bolts) , contour, chamfer
[19:37:09] <zeeshan> 18 min program
[19:37:17] <zeeshan> with a shit load of tool changes and part resetting
[19:40:46] <MrFluffy> cu-plugins just compiled, make didnt understand the -l flag linking it to opencv... wth...
[19:41:39] <XXCoder1> linux version of dll hell
[19:42:24] <MrFluffy> no make must have changed flags, make -h says -l is for load average niceness levels now
[19:42:41] <MrFluffy> unless its a typo in the makefile and they meant -L all along
[19:45:04] <MrFluffy> now apparently googles cert on code.google.com has expired... surely not.
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[19:49:57] <XXCoder1> odd
[19:50:16] <XXCoder1> no error here
[19:50:18] <MrFluffy> its ok, its my box, ntp is borked it seems
[19:50:23] <MrFluffy> it thinks its 2014
[19:51:31] <MrFluffy> Uh I remember why too, defeating some time based thing
[19:53:12] <MrFluffy> spillage from the day job
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[19:56:39] <XXCoder1> lol
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[20:02:57] <MrFluffy> run into bug of configure not finding glBegin, fix? no, horrible fudge edit configure to carry on anyway and hard link it in the makefile, horrible fudging inc.
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[20:39:42] <XXCoder1> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00MV6TAJI/ref=as_li_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=B00MV6TAJI&linkCode=as2&tag=bkgas-20&linkId=WLMVSPXNSH3CJ3WD
[20:39:44] <XXCoder1> dang
[20:39:46] <XXCoder1> tempted
[20:41:12] <MrFluffy> stock up on sd cards...
[20:41:36] <MrFluffy> they havent changed the design of how the broadcom soc uses the sd card during io, just put more cores on it
[20:42:32] <andypugh> I looked at PREEMPT-RT on the Pi, but latency was pretty bad and the ethernet port is USB.
[20:43:00] <MrFluffy> Ive got four here and 3 of them corrupt the sd cards during heavy io, and the fourth is well behaved with exactly the same cards
[20:43:18] <MrFluffy> on the same psu ...
[20:43:21] <XXCoder1> wonder whats happening
[20:43:27] <XXCoder1> and can you reformat
[20:43:36] <XXCoder1> I had reset sdcards before so yea
[20:44:24] <MrFluffy> there was a massive thread at the time on the forums and everything was blamed but the pi, I believe the soc doesnt handle io correctly in certain situations
[20:44:47] <XXCoder1> thanks on tip
[20:44:59] <XXCoder1> just dunno what I would do with it so not buying for now lol
[20:45:14] <MrFluffy> I think the pi compute module access its flash module differently and doesnt suffer the same
[20:45:27] <XXCoder1> gonna run later
[20:45:34] <MrFluffy> I was using them as mythfrontends, the gpu is amazing for the price
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[20:50:04] <gene78> tjtr33, I spoke too soon, just came back from running the rider so I could see past the jungle, and it crashed about 2/3rds done.
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[21:09:19] <MrFluffy> ok, I need to put down camview for now and go wire my suds contactor instead. Glut segfaulted and missing cvGetSeqElem symbols in the cv library
[21:09:40] <MrFluffy> frustrating I was certain I had tried this and had it working under axis.. maybe I dreamed it.
[21:10:00] <CaptHindsight> andypugh: preempt_rt is supposedly good on the imx6, have you ever tried it with your Udoo (sp)?
[21:10:38] <andypugh> I haven’t, but it might be worth a try
[21:11:00] <andypugh> The problem seems to be that the Udoo needs kernel work to boot.
[21:11:13] <CaptHindsight> krap
[21:11:14] <andypugh> (ie, a vanilla kernel won’t biit it)
[21:11:30] <CaptHindsight> all those projects always needs work
[21:11:52] <CaptHindsight> they do ahve working but they don't share the stable trees
[21:12:12] <CaptHindsight> ahve/have
[21:12:28] <andypugh> Udoo has a sourceforge page, you can get theit kernel tree
[21:13:31] <tjtr33> i heard the beaglebone black was being closed out at radioshack cheap
[21:13:59] <andypugh> Anyway, I have to be up before 5am tomorrow. So time to go.
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[21:14:07] <CaptHindsight> hasta
[21:15:22] <CaptHindsight> https://community.freescale.com/thread/329106
[21:15:37] <CaptHindsight> FIQ and IRQ latency differences between different i.MX6 CPUs ^^^
[21:20:33] <skunkworks> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pe2RACwiEbg
[21:21:39] <tjtr33> does a microprocessor , say a pic or 6502 or 6800 or Z80 exhibit any of this latency problem? is it just untested complexity that leads to unknown execution timing?
[21:21:42] <CaptHindsight> https://www.osadl.org/Latency-plot-of-system-in-rack-b-slot.qa-latencyplot-rbs7.0.html?latencies=&showno=&slider=0 imx6
[21:22:31] <CaptHindsight> hey skunkworks was that with Wheezy?
[21:23:09] <CaptHindsight> tjtr33: it depends on the design of the micro as well as the code
[21:24:08] <Tom_itx> skunkworks, how close to the hole does it have to be to recognize it?
[21:24:18] <Tom_itx> crosshairs in the perimeter?
[21:24:37] <CaptHindsight> also imx6 https://www.osadl.org/Latency-plot-of-system-in-rack-a-slot.qa-latencyplot-ras6.0.html?latencies=&showno=&slider=0
[21:25:16] <MrFluffy> do you have that setup documented anywhere skunkworks?
[21:25:17] <CaptHindsight> latency max on the second link was 20.015uS
[21:25:42] <MrFluffy> It has occured to me camview-emc is segfaulting because Im ssh -XYA into the machine not local
[21:25:49] <skunkworks> CaptHindsight: yes - wheezy
[21:25:51] <CaptHindsight> MrFluffy: yes, right there in youtube :)
[21:26:19] <skunkworks> MrFluffy: I think I may have posted it on the mailing list...
[21:26:42] <skunkworks> the circle has to be in the frame.
[21:26:46] <CaptHindsight> MrFluffy: the camview work is old now and never stable unless that dev was in the channel translating how to set it up
[21:26:59] <MrFluffy> Ok, I will hunt it down in a bit if going out the shop and trying camview-emc doenst fix it
[21:27:34] <CaptHindsight> MrFluffy: there is a thread on the ML about all the hoops somene went through to get it working with just the crosshairs
[21:27:52] <CaptHindsight> and a recent hackaday about using it
[21:28:05] <MrFluffy> I think I saw that on HaD
[21:28:16] <CaptHindsight> opencv is the way to go
[21:28:17] <MrFluffy> thats what made me buy this model of inspection microscope
[21:28:44] <CaptHindsight> camview is no longer actively developed
[21:28:56] <MrFluffy> I can see that from just getting it to compile and install
[21:29:18] <CaptHindsight> I tried to update the howto but i ran into what you are
[21:29:33] <CaptHindsight> and didn't want to waste anymore time
[21:29:56] <MrFluffy> I need to install linuxcnc on something other than my mill to break tinkering with
[21:30:00] <MrFluffy> into a vm maybe
[21:30:16] <CaptHindsight> good enough to see how things build
[21:31:46] <MrFluffy> hmm on another note, now need to find out how much a warco vmc table weighs... I feel a trunnion table build coming on.
[21:32:44] <CaptHindsight> the trunnions from trunnions r us or something similar aren't bad
[21:33:16] <CaptHindsight> http://www.trunniontable.com/
[21:33:35] <CaptHindsight> I start with them and clean them up to spec
[21:38:13] <MrFluffy> I think you overestimate vastly my usual starting budget of 60c and a packet of sweets
[21:38:56] <MrFluffy> Ive won a warco vmc xy table on ebay with the end plates, and I already have a lathe headstock cut down into a table, if you squint, and use a lot of imagination a cunning plan forms
[21:39:28] <MrFluffy> camview-emc gave RTAPI: ERROR: could not open shared memory on the machine console, so different error but still broke, I shall give up and try the opencv route
[21:43:24] <CaptHindsight> MrFluffy: did you install from psha's repos?
[21:43:47] <CaptHindsight> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Adding_Camview
[21:44:30] <CaptHindsight> no Wheezy repo so I forced it in using the testing repo
[21:46:39] <CaptHindsight> bbl
[21:46:55] <MrFluffy> CaptHindsight: I cloned the psha git repos and built it
[21:47:00] <MrFluffy> not very well it seems
[21:48:07] <MrFluffy> I followed that page in the wiki but balked at adding testing to apt sources
[21:49:25] <Deejay> gn8
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[21:53:08] <XXCoder1> look alive!
[21:53:31] <Crom> don't wanna
[21:53:57] <XXCoder1> ZOMBIE!!
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[22:28:46] <tjtr33> gnite
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[22:33:10] <XXCoder1> real time lol http://www.gadgethovel.com/?comic=hard-core-kerbal-space-prgram
[22:50:27] <malcom2073> That's like those people who refuse to use a mouse
[22:50:41] <malcom2073> Tools? Psh... tools are for pussies. Real men use their hands to do things.
[22:50:43] <malcom2073> :P
[22:50:45] <MrFluffy> I dont use a mouse...
[22:51:07] <XXCoder1> I use fancyass mouse
[22:51:14] <MrFluffy> trackball here
[22:51:15] <malcom2073> What's a fancy assmouse?
[22:51:31] <XXCoder1> exactly that
[22:52:51] <MrFluffy> Ok, I am overthinking camview with opencv and all fancy stuff, I just want a image from my cam in a tab, so Ive embedded mplayer and it works, but it runs all the time even when the tab is not highlighted. Theres no fix for that is there...
[22:54:05] <zeeshan> fuck i hate this brass nonsense
[22:54:10] <zeeshan> its got tons of residual stress in it
[22:54:16] <zeeshan> asap i fly cut it
[22:54:19] <zeeshan> it lifts up.
[22:54:24] <zeeshan> like after i remove it from the vise
[22:54:28] <MrFluffy> are you still doing those butterflies then?
[22:54:33] <zeeshan> rofl yea
[22:54:37] <zeeshan> im gonna have to do em another way
[22:54:41] <MrFluffy> tried supergluing them into the fixture?
[22:54:56] <MrFluffy> I have to superglue things onto my mag chuck because its poorly
[22:55:45] <zeeshan> im gonna just bolt them down to a solid plate
[22:55:49] <zeeshan> and force them square
[22:55:52] <zeeshan> i mean flat
[22:56:03] <zeeshan> ill work on it tomorrow :P
[22:56:09] <MrFluffy> I still would make the edges square, they dont actually close in use you know...
[22:56:16] <MrFluffy> ever
[22:56:30] <MrFluffy> theres a mechanical hard stop on the linkages stops that
[22:56:34] <zeeshan> well i already lapped them
[22:56:40] <zeeshan> one of the butterflies to make it smooth
[22:56:46] <zeeshan> in the factory condition, they were closed
[22:56:52] <zeeshan> you couldnt get water through them
[22:57:00] <MrFluffy> is this for a engine intake?
[22:57:08] <zeeshan> butterfly for a throttle body for an engine yes
[22:57:18] <MrFluffy> the idle adjust screw holds them open
[22:57:21] <MrFluffy> or the engine cant idle
[22:57:32] <zeeshan> its got a stepper motor
[22:57:34] <zeeshan> for air bypass
[22:57:53] <zeeshan> it doesnt use the butterflies for idle
[22:57:57] <MrFluffy> IAC ok, I dont run them, there be dragons for me
[22:58:02] <zeeshan> haha
[22:58:02] <MrFluffy> I just have screws I set on everything
[22:59:07] <MrFluffy> Ill go look at a car body with a iac on it after, Im sure it still has a mechanical hard stop
[23:03:35] <zeeshan> it does
[23:03:36] <zeeshan> youre right
[23:04:15] <MrFluffy> Im not too concerned with idle quality so I just wind the stop up myself, but I do race motors
[23:05:17] <MrFluffy> that sounds a bit er, of a floral description. I am a mad tinkerer in a shed playing with a engine for my race bike
[23:05:54] <MrFluffy> So stupid I have three throttle bodies... http://gallery.pipandphil.com/d/38671-1/bike_with_shifter.jpg
[23:06:34] <Tom_itx> zeeshan got the part figured out?
[23:07:02] <zeeshan> Tom_itx: no
[23:07:04] <Tom_itx> i need to get spindle orient and rigid tapping figured out this evening
[23:07:04] <zeeshan> massive failure
[23:07:09] <Tom_itx> how so?
[23:07:10] <zeeshan> brass had too much residual stress
[23:07:15] <zeeshan> it bent up after i faced it
[23:07:21] <zeeshan> (whjen i removed from vise)
[23:07:25] <Tom_itx> was that a brass part?
[23:07:27] <zeeshan> mrec: that is COOL
[23:07:31] <MrFluffy> arent they flat stampings originally?
[23:07:32] <zeeshan> MrFluffy: i mean
[23:07:40] <zeeshan> im machining them out of rolled flat bar
[23:07:44] <zeeshan> 3/16 by 3"
[23:08:11] <MrFluffy> I think theyre thinner because you want them to bend if you have a intake explosion for some reason
[23:08:21] <Tom_itx> it's been so long i'm gonna have to review my setup again... :(
[23:08:29] <zeeshan> ;p
[23:08:34] <zeeshan> ill work on it maybe later tonight or tomorrow
[23:08:38] <zeeshan> gotta go to a stag and doe :/
[23:08:45] <zeeshan> cu guys
[23:08:57] <Tom_itx> same here, gonna go enjoy the evening a bit first
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[23:38:12] <norias> hi
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[23:53:56] <MrFluffy> hello norias
[23:55:57] <t12> i think i'm just going to buy this weiss lathe