#linuxcnc | Logs for 2015-04-08

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[03:42:19] <MacGalempsy> hello
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[06:59:31] <Deejay> moin
[06:59:40] <Jymmm> hi Deejay
[06:59:53] <Deejay> hi Jymmm :)
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[07:54:03] <miss0r> I am experiencing some backlash issues with my home converted mill. Some of the backlash came from too weak bearings locking the ball-rod in place. I have mended that. Now it seems that I have something like 0.15mm backlash in the ballnut itself. My question is as follows: is it possible that I am simply asking too much of the ballnut? as in: am I trying to moove too much with this stuff?
[07:54:03] <miss0r> are you guys familiar with this?
[07:54:59] <miss0r> or did I perhaps buy it too cheap
[08:00:28] <archivist> cheap screws are cheap, look at the spec
[08:00:59] <archivist> c6,c7 or whatever
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[08:04:57] <miss0r> so, if nothing is mentioned about any C-value where I bought, it means it is probally shit :) Can you reccomend somewhere good to get a sfu1605 with ballscrew that are trustworthy?
[08:07:35] <archivist> I remember reading the catalogue I got from a show http://www.misumi-europe.com/en/bestseller/screws, but there are plenty of makers
[08:09:24] <archivist> where I got the cx specs data from, cant find my copy today though
[08:09:56] <miss0r> alright. thanks. I will see what I can find. because what I've got is basically worthless
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[08:18:41] <archivist> I just program my machine to cut one way without climb milling so backlash is not much of a problem for me
[08:19:56] <miss0r> hmmm.. But I would never be able to make a precise pocket with the backlash
[08:21:01] <archivist> sure you can, add the backlash compensation value to the config og the machine
[08:21:31] <miss0r> so, you are telling me, I can just program my way out of this?
[08:21:45] <archivist> yes
[08:21:53] * miss0r is reading up on that
[08:22:52] <archivist> you can even map pitch error of the screw and calibrate it out
[08:23:09] <miss0r> woah... one step at a time :)
[08:23:19] <archivist> hehe
[08:23:40] <archivist> you want the big step too?
[08:23:44] <miss0r> I wish I knew how it can do this?
[08:23:48] <miss0r> sure
[08:24:47] <archivist> backlash is on http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/html/config/ini_config.html
[08:25:31] <miss0r> Thanks
[08:25:32] <archivist> BACKLASH = 0.0000 - Backlash in machine units. Backlash compensation value can be used to make up for small deficiencies in the hardware used to drive an axis. If backlash is added to an axis and you are using steppers the STEPGEN_MAXACCEL must be increased to 1.5 to 2 times the MAX_ACCELERATION for the axis.
[08:26:06] <miss0r> why must the max_acceleration be increased?
[08:26:50] <archivist> I think a fault in the stepgen acceleration code, that noone has bothered fixing yet
[08:27:33] <miss0r> i'm pretty sure I don't understand how it can possibly make this work properly. Do you know of a link explaining how it compensates?
[08:29:42] <archivist> just put that .15 in there and retest
[08:30:06] <archivist> magic happens
[08:30:14] <miss0r> I'm not sure I like what I see. no matter how much I compensate, the cutter will still be able to move the table
[08:31:11] <archivist> yes that can happen hence I only conventional mill so it always pushes the screw the right way
[08:31:50] <miss0r> hmm... I will go test. Thanks
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[11:42:18] <skunkworks> http://www.cnczone.com/forums/tormach-pathpilot-/264676-well-pci-pp-back-stock-ordered-mine.html
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[11:52:37] <jthornton> yea! the cave computer is back on line
[11:53:09] <skunkworks> what was it?
[11:54:18] <Tom_itx> seems the Tormachers are happy with their new stuff
[11:54:23] <jthornton> I had to edit the etc/network/interfaces
[11:54:45] <Tom_itx> i do that so seldom i gotta check my notes every time
[11:54:47] <jthornton> add a couple of lines so the pci network card worked
[11:55:08] <jthornton> the onboard network died and I added a PCI card
[11:58:02] <Loetmichel2> how do you even kill a Twisted pair nic?
[11:58:10] <skunkworks> it happens
[11:58:20] <Loetmichel2> they are supposed to withstand 2kV on each pin in respect to ground
[11:59:37] <jthornton> we had a power blink and it died
[11:59:58] <Loetmichel2> meh, thats chinese quality then
[12:04:01] <_methods> jthornton: what torch did you put on your plasma?
[12:04:10] <_methods> hypertherm 80?
[12:04:53] <_methods> or powermax 45?
[12:05:58] <jthornton> hypertherm 1250
[12:06:07] <_methods> ahh
[12:06:37] <jthornton> they don't make that model anymore
[12:06:46] <_methods> yeah looks like that is the powermax 65 now
[12:06:57] <_methods> you buy new?
[12:07:35] <jthornton> aye
[12:07:48] <_methods> you happy with it?
[12:07:51] <jthornton> then added the machine torch
[12:07:57] <jthornton> yes
[12:08:00] <_methods> kk
[12:08:10] <_methods> you running on 220?
[12:08:14] <_methods> single phase for it
[12:09:12] <_methods> what's the max pierce for yours?
[12:09:16] <jthornton> yes
[12:09:20] <_methods> the powermax 65 says 5/8"
[12:09:29] <jthornton> let me look
[12:10:40] <jthornton> aww that directory is not shared on the plasma... I can look in a bit when I go out to the shop
[12:10:48] <_methods> k
[12:10:50] <_methods> no rush
[12:11:10] <_methods> my oxyfuel torch mixing assembly melted on me last night
[12:11:19] <_methods> and i was like you know i should just get my plasma now
[12:12:41] <_methods> i can use it for roughing out all my parts for my plasma table build
[12:15:17] <renesis> the torch handle itself?
[12:15:20] <renesis> scary shit
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[12:19:16] <Loetmichel2> i once ran a fire INSIDE the oxygen hose to the bottle
[12:19:36] <Loetmichel2> beat it and closed the bottle/detached the hose...
[12:19:41] <Loetmichel2> was close tho
[12:20:01] <Loetmichel2> that could have been a bad idea if i would have been a bit slower
[12:27:32] <Loetmichel2> since then i look for missing backfire suprossors on the hoses before starting an oqy/acetylene torch ;-)
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[12:46:21] <JT-Shop> _methods, the 1250 will pierce 5/8" and side start up to 1"... the thickest I've pierced is 3/8"
[12:46:39] <JT-Shop> and I usually cut 11ga or thinner with the FC nozzle
[12:58:24] <renesis> first time i did anything with oxy fuel was 1" from the side, 1/8" cut across 12x12 plate
[12:58:50] <renesis> when i got maybe 3/4 in, i look at the start and its opened up like 2"
[12:59:39] <renesis> i was doing the machining program at the time, so going through 1" like that with a 1/8" cut with virtually all the metal vaporized was mind blowing
[13:00:19] <renesis> pretty sure it took way under a minute, too
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[13:11:56] <_methods> yeah the acetylene mixing chamber melted
[13:12:19] <_methods> i guess it back fired in there, i did have a couple pop offs from getting too close
[13:16:17] <_methods> thanks JT-Shop those sound about the same specs as the hypertherm powermax 65
[13:16:23] <_methods> i guess that's what i'll pick up
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[13:28:56] <_methods> piercing 5/8" should be good for about 95% of what i plan on doing
[13:32:02] <_methods> JT-Shop: is it an air hog?
[13:32:14] <JT-Shop> not as bad as my CHNC lol
[13:32:19] <_methods> haha
[13:32:32] <_methods> looks like you can run it on nitrogen
[13:32:56] <JT-Shop> I have an air dryer inline when I run the plasma
[13:33:15] <_methods> damn i'll need to upgrade my compressor and get a dryer
[13:33:20] <_methods> maybe i'll wait on this
[13:33:42] <JT-Shop> I'd go the Powermax85 if I was doing 5/8" all the time
[13:33:56] <_methods> i'm sure i'll be in the 1/8"-3/8" range
[13:34:12] <_methods> if you had it to do over you'd get a more powerful pak?
[13:34:16] <JT-Shop> 65 will do fine for that with occasional 5/8"
[13:34:30] <JT-Shop> no, I do mostly 11ga and thinner
[13:34:33] <_methods> k
[13:34:45] <JT-Shop> some 1/4 and 3/8
[13:34:55] <_methods> how is the cut quality on that thinner stuff?
[13:35:58] <_methods> guy down teh street from me works at kaliburn
[13:36:20] <_methods> i wonder if i should talk to him about getting one of theirs refurb or something
[13:38:18] <_methods> guess i need to get my priorities straight first
[13:38:25] <_methods> dry air would be the first step
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[13:41:06] <JT-Shop> yea, dry air is important for consumable life
[13:41:20] <_methods> yeah, not nearly as exciting as plasma
[13:41:30] <_methods> sux when you have to spend money on boring stuff
[13:41:53] <_methods> like buyin tires for your car
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[13:42:19] <JT-Shop> and both my cars need tires
[13:42:28] <_methods> haha
[13:42:44] <_methods> dry air or sexy plasma machine with sparks and flames
[13:42:49] * JT-Shop heads to town to mail packages
[13:43:36] <JT-Shop> or moist air and shorter consumable life... having said that I cut for a year with shop air and no dryer
[13:43:57] <_methods> i have a crappy little harbor freight compressor
[13:44:34] <_methods> little 2gallon
[13:44:48] <_methods> i can barely fill a tire with it
[13:44:53] <Jymmm> 2gal would drive me nuts
[13:45:00] <JT-Shop> it could work for shorter cuts, if the pressure gets too low the plasma cuts out
[13:45:05] <_methods> yeah it's horrible but i don't have a lot of air tools
[13:45:12] <JT-Shop> mine uses 85psig when cutting I think
[13:45:14] <_methods> so thankfully i don't have to fire it up often
[13:45:26] <Jymmm> I just use nitrogen tank instead
[13:45:28] <_methods> yeah said like 6.5scfm at 85psi
[13:45:35] <JT-Shop> no, 75 psig
[13:45:41] <_methods> k
[13:45:55] <JT-Shop> gotta run
[13:46:07] <_methods> later thx
[13:47:08] <ssi> morn
[13:47:30] <_methods> hola
[13:47:58] <_methods> what torch you use on your plasma ssi
[13:48:18] <ssi> I have a powermax 45, and I used the stock hand torch on it for ages, but I have the t65m machine torch now
[13:48:24] <ssi> only downside there is it uses different consumables
[13:48:33] <_methods> yeah i'm lookin at the powermax 65
[13:48:45] <ssi> actually it might not be the t65m? I forget the model
[13:48:47] <ssi> it's the SHORT one
[13:48:48] <_methods> but looks like i need to get my air right first
[13:48:49] <ssi> without a rack
[13:48:57] <_methods> yeah that mini torch
[13:49:00] <ssi> yeah
[13:49:09] <ssi> 180?
[13:49:11] <ssi> something like that
[13:49:14] <ssi> http://www.bakersgas.com/HYP059481.html?gclid=CK31zdrs5sQCFdcXgQodSxwASA
[13:49:30] <_methods> yeah
[13:50:10] <_methods> i guess i might just get a big harbor freight compressor
[13:51:18] <_methods> http://www.harborfreight.com/air-tools/air-compressors/5-hp-60-gallon-165-psi-two-stage-air-compressor-93274.html
[13:52:49] <ssi> do you need 165psi?
[13:52:58] <ssi> cause I can show you the value in compressors if you're ok with single stage
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[13:53:54] <ssi> http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_211720_211720
[13:54:03] <ssi> I've bought two of them, and they're great compressors for the money
[14:00:51] <_methods> k
[14:01:07] <_methods> yeah i'm not picky
[14:01:09] <_methods> i just need air
[14:01:13] <ssi> yea
[14:01:23] <ssi> that IR is awesome... 18.1cfm
[14:01:27] <ssi> it's got a decent 5hp motor on it
[14:01:30] <ssi> the HF one I'd be suspect
[14:01:38] <_methods> um yeah it's HF
[14:01:39] <_methods> lol
[14:01:41] <ssi> :)
[14:02:06] <_methods> that plas says it need 6.5 scfm at 85
[14:02:56] <_methods> i think i'd rather have IR than HF
[14:03:58] <ssi> I know I would
[14:04:04] <ssi> and it's more money but not a lot more
[14:04:23] <_methods> wow lot of bad reviews on northern tool though
[14:05:59] <_methods> wonder if i should just get teh HF and plan on it blowin up and put the money in a better aftermarket compressor and motor
[14:06:11] <_methods> when it dies
[14:06:46] <ssi> I lost a motor in one of mine, but it was like seven years in
[14:07:28] <_methods> i'm always watching auctions to try and get one
[14:07:40] <_methods> but haven't seen one at the right price yet
[14:07:46] <ssi> also the HF compressors that I've seen are extremely noisy
[14:07:48] <ssi> but the IR is quiet
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[14:08:21] <_methods> the shop next to us just gave us a 25hp gardner denver rotary screw
[14:08:28] <_methods> i'd love to have that
[14:08:35] <_methods> but that's so overkill lol
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[14:11:59] <ssi> yuuuup
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[14:14:21] <_methods> heh 2hp 20gal dental air compressor for sale on craigslist for $1000
[14:14:35] <_methods> probably won't do enough cfm for what i'll need though
[14:14:53] <_methods> http://charleston.craigslist.org/tls/4939425020.html
[14:16:10] <ssi> that's pretty cool
[14:16:18] <ssi> that'd be a great laser compressor
[14:16:20] <_methods> yeah clean dry air for sure
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[14:55:54] <_methods> oh nice got a line on a speedaire 60gal for around $400
[14:56:10] <ssi> very nice
[14:57:01] <_methods> http://imgur.com/7dG1NPE
[14:57:31] <dirty_d> whoa https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=18&v=Jt9hEvjmHjI
[14:57:36] <JT-Shop> that's about the same as my Ingersol Rand
[14:57:57] <_methods> yeah uv cure
[14:58:27] <_methods> we'll see what the price ends up going to
[14:58:35] <_methods> but i'll try and get it for under $500
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[14:59:16] <ssi> I wonder how you get that stuff unstuck
[14:59:21] <_methods> uv
[14:59:25] <_methods> uv cure and uncure
[14:59:28] <ssi> weird
[14:59:29] <dirty_d> how?
[14:59:39] <_methods> the uv is used for a certain time to cure
[15:00:16] <_methods> http://www.mmsonline.com/articles/light-activated-glue-holds-and-releases-workpieces-in-a-flash
[15:00:23] <_methods> they can explain better than me lol
[15:00:35] <_methods> that article if from 2004 lol
[15:00:49] <ssi> I need a lot more money
[15:00:50] <ssi> D:
[15:00:56] <dirty_d> i bet in the future they will have some kind of nano gel that responds to some kind of signal to harden and unharden
[15:01:22] <malcom2073> "even ice"
[15:01:27] <malcom2073> That's scary
[15:02:03] <dirty_d> in these videos, it just looks like they break it
[15:02:06] <dirty_d> with a bolt
[15:02:55] <_methods> not sure when i used it you had to hit it with a second shot of uv
[15:03:02] <_methods> then you could tap it free
[15:03:05] <dirty_d> neat https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNdua_KpL9Y
[15:03:13] <dirty_d> they have a tool for cleaning off the grippers
[15:09:56] <dirty_d> http://www.reddit.com/r/Machinists/comments/31ttmn/any_of_you_guys_try_this_product/
[15:10:03] <dirty_d> superglue, never though of that
[15:10:34] <dirty_d> i guess if you take light cuts, theres no raeson it wouldnt work
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[15:21:38] <JT-Shop> dang 1.001" reamer was too long
[15:27:08] <Rab> Wonder if that Blue Photon stuff is related to dental composite filling material.
[15:29:00] <Rab> If it's UV release, I wonder if it's contra-indicated for certain processes like welding or plasma cutting. ;)
[15:29:50] <dirty_d> i dont get it, i dont see anythign with any springyness here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YY05iBfHszs
[15:31:33] <Rab> Fixed preload, you would have to change to a thicker shim if the system wears.
[15:32:16] <dirty_d> ahh
[15:33:05] <archivist> every metal is elastic under strain
[15:35:30] <dirty_d> i made a cut last night on my machien that was supposed to bring a part down to 1.5" height, came out to 1.494"
[15:35:41] <dirty_d> not sure what the hell happened, thats more than my backlash
[15:36:15] <dirty_d> i clamped it in a vice with a thin parallel under it, tightened the vise, tapped the part down to make sure the parallel was tight under it
[15:36:31] <dirty_d> touched the tool off the parallel
[15:36:50] <dirty_d> moved the tool to 1.5" for the finishing cut of about 0.01"
[15:37:06] <dirty_d> cant see how it came out that far off
[15:38:00] <_methods> JT-Shop: you reamed over?
[15:38:07] <dirty_d> its good enough for what i was making, but my OCD is bothering me
[15:40:02] <archivist> 6 thou under is a lot, check the vice does not lift when tightened
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[15:40:29] <_methods> make sure you end mill didn't pull out of tool holder too
[15:40:44] <archivist> seen that too :)
[15:40:57] <_methods> yep
[15:41:14] <_methods> and is it 1.494 all over
[15:41:14] <JT-Shop> I reamed 1.001" and it is a perfect fit whew
[15:41:22] <_methods> heh nice
[15:41:27] <_methods> is it an over reamer?
[15:41:41] <archivist> or a blunt reamer
[15:44:08] <dirty_d> archivist, i touched off after i tighted it though
[15:44:22] <JT-Shop> over reamer?
[15:44:31] <dirty_d> _methods, yea
[15:44:33] <_methods> yeah you can buy reamers over and under
[15:44:57] <JT-Shop> yea it is an over reamer, the bushings are a bit over and the hole spec was 1.001"
[15:45:27] <_methods> yeah that will put you to the high side
[15:45:28] <JT-Shop> I still have to ream the bushing after assembly as the pins are a half a thou over
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[15:46:06] <_methods> you can play with the feed rate some usually to make the hole bigger or smaller
[15:46:24] <_methods> if you want to make it smaller speed up the feed a bit
[15:46:52] <archivist> or lap for the tenths
[15:47:12] <_methods> yeah or burnish it
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[15:48:56] <_methods> http://phillipecantin.blogspot.com/2015/03/teeny-tiny-build.html
[15:48:59] <_methods> heh that's pretty cool
[15:50:38] <archivist> but we had those displays in the dark ages of the 1970s
[15:51:25] <_methods> yeah lol
[15:51:28] <archivist> MK14 kit had them, bugger to play moonlander on it
[15:51:46] <zeeshan|2> im never ordering something from china again
[15:51:46] <zeeshan|2> lol
[15:51:49] <zeeshan|2> it takes forever!!
[15:52:22] <_methods> yeah one of the hidden reqmnts of sourcing from china is a large reserve of patience
[15:52:44] <_methods> and always order 2
[15:54:43] <CaptHindsight> _methods: todays funny http://www.3ders.org/articles/20150408-never-lose-your-drill-bits-again-with-this-useful-3d-printed-tool-wristband.html
[15:55:21] <syyl_ws> uh yeah
[15:55:26] <syyl_ws> that looks as usefull as
[15:55:27] <syyl_ws> hm
[15:55:31] <syyl_ws> an smartwatch?
[15:55:35] <archivist> impossible to get out quickly
[15:56:02] <CaptHindsight> http://www.3ders.org/articles/20150408-ir3-industrial-revolution-iii-3d-printer-pick-place-assembly-bot-launches-on-kickstarter.html is that thing already warping or is it just the angle of the pic?
[15:56:17] <_methods> buwhahahaha
[15:56:28] <syyl_ws> "industrial revolution"
[15:56:44] <syyl_ws> and the guys with 20 SiPlace laugh their ass off
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[15:58:49] <archivist> no strength in that design to lift anything weighing more than a feather, nor press fit the parts
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[15:59:48] <archivist> not fit for purpose, must try harder
[16:00:11] <CaptHindsight> if was designed and built by the girl in the pic then it's impressive
[16:00:22] <malcom2073> Makes me want to stick grippers on my printer, it can push down with enough force to press-fit things heh
[16:01:05] <malcom2073> I'd be excited about it for having nuts and the like dropped in, except I discovered melt-in plastic nutcerts and haven't looked back since
[16:01:06] <archivist> I think thaey are designing for a piss fit rather than press fit
[16:01:11] <_methods> https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/817819607/the-industrial-revolution-iii-become-a-global-desi
[16:01:14] <_methods> hahaha
[16:01:22] <_methods> they got $4.47
[16:01:32] <malcom2073> People need to stop buzzwording stuff
[16:01:52] <CaptHindsight> the price is right
[16:02:02] <CaptHindsight> <$5 in junk parts
[16:02:32] <archivist> I need some ground rod, must back it for 1p
[16:02:51] <CaptHindsight> how little can one donate?
[16:02:53] <malcom2073> "WE EXTEND NO WARRANTIES REGARDING YOUR FITNESS OR THAT OF OUR PRODUCTS FOR ANY PURPOSE. "
[16:02:57] <malcom2073> Well, at least they're honest
[16:03:01] <_methods> wow
[16:03:04] <CaptHindsight> do they also accept good advice?
[16:03:15] <_methods> there is a whole "team" behind making this
[16:03:35] <malcom2073> No wonder they need 75k
[16:03:36] <CaptHindsight> yes, Mrs Smiths 4th grade science class
[16:03:45] <_methods> the pic looks that way
[16:03:54] <_methods> scroll to the end of the kickstarter for much lulz
[16:04:36] <CaptHindsight> http://createspacelondon.org/
[16:05:26] <malcom2073> There's a makerspace starting up in a town not far from me
[16:08:30] <archivist> seems like none of these new inventors ever did any structural design
[16:09:25] <CaptHindsight> it's made of metal so it must be strong.... just look at bridges, tanks and hammers
[16:09:38] <Rab> $225 billet aluminum brick looks pretty structural to me.
[16:09:55] <Rab> Especially after its li-poly pack craps out.
[16:11:13] <Rab> (Yesterday's design lol:) https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1363754907/brick-lamp-reveal-the-light
[16:11:27] <archivist> I like looking at bridges, I see design and thought, not when I look at repcrap though
[16:12:29] <CaptHindsight> Rab: now that is magic
[16:13:03] <archivist> it contains snake oil
[16:14:18] <CaptHindsight> https://www.adafruit.com/products/1946 turns any device with a uart into a quad band phone
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[16:16:10] <CaptHindsight> https://www.nabitablet.com/nabi-big-tab going to put one in here and use as my new smartphone
[16:16:34] <roycroft> i'm assuming that 3d printed wrist band screwgun bit holder is an april fools' joke posted a week late
[16:16:53] <malcom2073> CaptHindsight: Please say you'll put a microphone on the bottom, speakeron the top, and hold it to your face?
[16:17:04] <CaptHindsight> malcom2073: thats the plan
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[16:17:07] <malcom2073> Sweet
[16:17:24] * archivist sets pagespeed looking at that crappy adafruit cake site
[16:17:27] <JT-Shop> one more pair to go and it's lunch time
[16:17:30] <CaptHindsight> kickstarter here we come
[16:20:46] <PetefromTn_> Hey linuxCNC junkies!
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[16:23:05] <JT-Shop> http://ibin.co/1xdot9nhWbd0
[16:24:30] <archivist> production!
[16:26:09] <Rab> CaptHindsight, trying to figure out if that big tablet is actually battery-operated.
[16:26:19] <CaptHindsight> Rab: it is
[16:26:25] <CaptHindsight> saw them at Walmart
[16:26:54] <CaptHindsight> https://www.nabitablet.com/nabi-big-tab/specs
[16:27:01] <Rab> 1650 mAh, Rechargeable Lithium-ion Battery 30 minute backup for portability*
[16:27:04] <Rab> haha
[16:27:10] <CaptHindsight> tiny
[16:27:50] <_methods> ermahgerd pete lives
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[16:29:25] <PetefromTn_> so far anyways LOL
[16:29:34] <JT-Shop> hey Pete
[16:29:45] <PetefromTn_> Hey JT HOWSITGOIN?
[16:29:48] * JT-Shop notices it is half past lunch... be back later
[16:29:49] <_methods> where you been hidin
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[16:29:58] <JT-Shop> busy as a three legged cat
[16:30:03] <ssi> peet
[16:30:11] <PetefromTn_> well I went on vacation for eleven days to Florida
[16:30:28] <JT-Shop> one more op on those blocks...
[16:30:32] <JT-Shop> nice
[16:30:32] <PetefromTn_> and when I got back tore my kitchen apart and been working on refinishing my cabinets
[16:30:44] <PetefromTn_> glad you are busy JT
[16:30:47] <PetefromTn_> nice
[16:30:52] <JT-Shop> when your done you can drop by here lol
[16:31:05] <ssi> PetefromTn_: I fired my contractor last week
[16:31:07] <JT-Shop> I'll be glad when I'm caught up for a change
[16:31:10] <ssi> and I'm just gonna do it my damn self
[16:31:12] <ssi> hahahahaha
[16:31:16] <PetefromTn_> beleive it or not I have several projects for the CNC shop I am working on right now!!!
[16:31:32] <PetefromTn_> oh yeah what kinda contractor?
[16:31:39] <ssi> general
[16:31:40] <ssi> heh
[16:31:50] <PetefromTn_> are you rebuilding your home?
[16:31:53] <ssi> the only thing they've done is R&R the roof
[16:31:54] <ssi> yeah I have to
[16:32:07] <PetefromTn_> Damn that kinda sucks huh
[16:32:12] <ssi> yeah
[16:32:24] <ssi> I'm gonna get my buddy's brother who is a builder in michigan to come down and do the bulk of the work
[16:32:28] <PetefromTn_> maybe you can get it fixed up nice and get it sold...
[16:32:34] <ssi> insurance is issuing me the ACV check, which is like $78k
[16:32:49] <ssi> and then when it's done I get another $40k in replacement cost
[16:32:58] <PetefromTn_> wow nice you could probably almost build a new house for that much
[16:33:06] <ssi> yeah seriously
[16:33:11] <ssi> which is why I didn't want to pay a stupid contractor to waste it
[16:33:44] <PetefromTn_> I have several projects I am working on for the race shop guys right now
[16:33:57] <ssi> excellent
[16:34:05] <PetefromTn_> and I got a text from a local company that I have been frequenting lately that has kind been blowing me off
[16:34:18] <ssi> hey you want to look at a print and quote me?
[16:34:19] <PetefromTn_> they want me to come by today and look at a production piece they want done..
[16:34:31] <PetefromTn_> sure...
[16:34:40] <PetefromTn_> my CNC lathe is STill not done tho..
[16:34:47] <ssi> yeah hurry up with that
[16:34:48] <ssi> haha
[16:34:56] <ssi> if you can do this entirely on the mill, I'd have you do it immediately
[16:35:03] <ssi> needs to be 304 ss
[16:35:14] <ssi> and those tapped holes don't have to be thru all, they can be thru to the bore, either way
[16:35:39] <ssi> I need 500 pcs
[16:36:13] <PetefromTn_> are you in a real hurry?
[16:36:19] <ssi> yea kinda
[16:37:05] <PetefromTn_> what is the time frame because I have committed to do some CNC work for the race shop that will probably take the next week or two to finish.
[16:37:27] <ssi> I dunno, they said ASAP
[16:38:03] <ssi> I was planning on trying to get the hnc running and doing it with some manual millwork
[16:38:09] <PetefromTn_> but I probably could do that on the mill making them from stainless barstock if the tolerances are not too tight
[16:38:18] <ssi> the bore tolerances are the only important ones
[16:38:48] <ssi> let me know what you'd want to do the lot, and if I don't get my stuff set up by the time you're ready to roll then you can do them
[16:38:59] <PetefromTn_> I got a question for you guys...
[16:38:59] <jthornton> what kind of part ssi?
[16:39:02] <PetefromTn_> OK
[16:39:06] <ssi> http://www.prototechnical.com/~imcmahon/Adapter.PDF
[16:39:12] <ssi> oh yeah you have the chnc
[16:39:33] <PetefromTn_> I have a customer that is having me machine some parts for him that are kinda odd shaped
[16:39:52] <PetefromTn_> and after they are machined they are sending them out to be high speed balanced.
[16:40:03] <ssi> neat
[16:40:08] <Rab> <INSERT COMPANY NAME HERE>
[16:40:17] <ssi> that's what I named my company
[16:40:32] <jthornton> busy little part
[16:40:37] <PetefromTn_> I was wondering what would be involved in getting some kinda balancing apparatus setup here?
[16:40:40] <ssi> yeah it's a pain in the ass
[16:41:06] <ssi> I can do the turning work on the hnc if I get it running again, but the setscrew holes confound me
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[16:41:30] <ssi> best thing I've come up with is to make a softjaw to hold them in the manual mill with two locations, one with a dowel hole
[16:41:40] <ssi> and do the driling and tapping there, with a tapping head
[16:41:47] <jthornton> are they tapped from each side or through?
[16:41:47] <ssi> it'll be like a six operation part that way :(
[16:41:54] <ssi> can be through or just to the bore
[16:41:56] <ssi> doesn't have to be through
[16:41:57] <PetefromTn_> yeah I would do them in soft jaws as well in the VNC
[16:42:01] <ssi> I'm not sure why I drew it that way :)
[16:42:20] <jthornton> does it hold something in the center bore?
[16:42:23] <ssi> yeah
[16:42:26] <PetefromTn_> two jaws vertical and horizontal
[16:42:28] <ssi> the bores are toleranced, they need to be reamed
[16:42:32] <ssi> the rest .01" is fine
[16:42:39] <jthornton> it would hold better if the set screws were 90 degrees
[16:42:48] <ssi> well there's just one setscrew
[16:42:51] <ssi> again, not sure why I drew it thru
[16:43:06] <jthornton> oh, ok that makes a difference
[16:43:08] <ssi> yeah.
[16:43:25] <ssi> also, because of the drill/tap operation, I figure the reaming op would need to happen after the tapping op
[16:43:33] <PetefromTn_> exactly
[16:43:59] <PetefromTn_> anyone ever built any sort of balancing machine?
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[16:44:38] <_methods> not i
[16:44:49] <ssi> my plan was: op 1: face/chamfer barstock, drill .095" or so to .900", pull and part; op 2 (or 2-5 if on a manual machine), drill and tap setscrews on a mill; op 3 in a collet with stop, face and chamfer back side, drill .120", ream .125 to .375, ream .100 thru
[16:44:54] <ssi> or something like that
[16:44:55] <archivist> nope but there are some opensource turbine balancing machine designs
[16:45:16] <ssi> that's how I'm going to do it if I can get the hnc going in the near future, but if someone's ready to rock to make that part I'll happily sub it
[16:45:22] <archivist> I have some old code for balancing machine
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[16:46:17] <_methods> do you have a toleranced print of the part?
[16:46:49] <PetefromTn_> archivist code?
[16:47:04] <_methods> and what is your deadline?
[16:47:20] <jthornton> I would think a thread forming tap for that job
[16:47:21] <archivist> PetefromTn_, http://www.collection.archivist.info/searchv13.php?searchstr=AN162
[16:47:40] <ssi> jthornton: yeah that's the conclusion i came to also
[16:47:44] <ssi> but I need to acquire a tapping head
[16:47:45] <_methods> the qty is 500 right?
[16:47:47] <ssi> since I have no cnc mill :(
[16:47:49] <ssi> _methods: correct
[16:48:00] <ssi> no toleranced print, I could make one
[16:48:08] <_methods> yeah i'll need that to quote it
[16:48:35] <archivist> PetefromTn_, just needs some accelerometers and a data grabbing system (and the rotation of course)
[16:48:47] <ssi> archivist: that wouldn't be too hard
[16:48:53] <_methods> what was the material?
[16:48:55] <_methods> 5052?
[16:48:59] <_methods> or 6061?
[16:49:05] <ssi> 304ss
[16:49:11] <_methods> ah crap that's right
[16:49:19] <archivist> piezo buzzer can make very sensitive accelerometers
[16:49:21] <_methods> gotta make it difficult eh
[16:49:22] <_methods> lol
[16:49:26] <ssi> yeah :(
[16:49:45] <PetefromTn_> I don't see anything there man what am I missing?
[16:50:31] <PetefromTn_> never had much luck with form taps in stainless...
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[16:51:58] <jthornton> it take more than luck to tap stainless lol
[16:52:04] <Rab> Lots of lube + precise hole dia is critical.
[16:52:39] <ssi> well so, they didn't specify the material
[16:52:43] <PetefromTn_> I have tapped thousands of stainless holes I am well aware...just never had much luck with form taps in it.
[16:52:45] <ssi> they want "some kind of steel that won't corrode unfinished"
[16:52:49] <ssi> suggestions? :D
[16:52:50] <archivist> PetefromTn_, here is one I spotted at an exhibition http://www.collection.archivist.info/searchv13.php?searchstr=balancing+machine
[16:55:08] <archivist> PetefromTn_, sensing device is made with http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/10Pcs-12mm-Thickness-1-0mm-Piezo-Disc-for-Buzzer-Pressure-Sensor-Speaker-DIY-/171120915838
[16:55:18] <archivist> or similar
[16:55:44] <dirty_d> how do those work as pressure sensors?
[16:56:23] <archivist> use them to block a port, measure the voltage they produce
[16:56:33] <PetefromTn_> honestly this part is pretty large and odd shaped. Probably weights about five to six pounds.
[16:56:53] <PetefromTn_> must be balanced to 12k RPM
[16:57:03] <archivist> use a smaller more sturdy accelerometer
[16:57:04] <ssi> what the heck is it
[16:57:28] <PetefromTn_> I'd rather not say ;)
[16:57:31] <ssi> hahah
[16:58:07] <PetefromTn_> but they currently send them out for balancing and they pay handsomely for it. They said if I could do it they would let me do everything on this part.
[16:58:18] <ssi> it'd be pretty neat to design a balancing machine that could weigh the part, spin it up, measure the accel vector, and then output data that could be post-processed into G-code whcih your mill would use to precisely mill away material to balance it
[16:58:18] <PetefromTn_> would mean some good consistent work in here
[16:58:34] <archivist> but the rc jet turbine makers are running up to over 60k rpm
[16:58:39] <ssi> and not exactly trivial, but well within the limits of diyp
[16:58:46] <ssi> -p
[16:59:10] <PetefromTn_> I know I had a friend that made a simple weight balancing machine for motorcycle wheels and we used it to balance the wheels and tires on racebikes
[16:59:10] <jthornton> actually it looks like a spiral point tap is the best for 304
[16:59:25] <archivist> does that mean I have to scan that doc?
[16:59:45] <jthornton> you don't want to break too many at $45 a pop
[16:59:55] <ssi> eesh
[16:59:59] <archivist> is in basic so should be easy to translate to any other language
[17:00:04] <ssi> what taps are $45/ea?
[17:00:10] <ssi> I was lookxing at form taps in 6-32 and they're like $13-18
[17:00:12] <archivist> over priced ones
[17:00:22] <jthornton> the OSG ones for tapping 304
[17:00:32] <PetefromTn_> buy a GOOD tap if you intend to do that job yourself
[17:00:34] <jthornton> hmm they are all H3
[17:00:55] <PetefromTn_> OSG are excellent I have several here
[17:01:18] <jthornton> it's all I use
[17:02:22] <PetefromTn_> I have some morse and even some fastenal that are decent for larger stuff. Smaller taps in tougher materials I always pay for better quality ones.
[17:02:57] <jthornton> bbl
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[17:03:08] <ssi> exotap va-3 is the one the osg thing recommended me
[17:03:12] <ssi> and it says $14.17 each
[17:03:14] <ssi> I can handle that :D
[17:03:24] <ssi> ooh they have a georgia warehouse
[17:18:42] <_methods> +1 for OSG
[17:21:50] <_methods> is there a mesa card that can control both steppers and servos?
[17:22:05] <malcom2073> Daughterboard?
[17:22:08] <malcom2073> Or you mean at once
[17:22:19] <_methods> sure daughterboard
[17:22:39] <ssi> not that I'm aware of, but you could run two daughterboards on one io card and accomplish that
[17:23:09] <_methods> yeah that's what i mean with one io card can i control a combination of steppers and servos
[17:23:15] <ssi> yep
[17:23:16] <CaptHindsight> close your eyes, click your heels twice and say "is there a mesa card that can control both steppers and servos? pcw_home
[17:23:22] <_methods> hahah
[17:23:38] <ssi> you could easily run, say, a 7i76 and 7i77 on one 5i25
[17:23:42] <ssi> but I dunno if there's a firmware for it
[17:24:05] <malcom2073> The 7i77 has tons of extra I/O, can you run step/direction out of some of those?
[17:25:03] <CaptHindsight> there are 7i76 with 7i77 configs for 5i25
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[17:25:58] <_methods> i wasn't sure if you could run the servo stuff and stepgen stuff all at the same time
[17:26:06] <ssi> sure
[17:26:37] <_methods> so just get a 5i25/6i25 and 7i76 and 7i77
[17:26:41] <ssi> hell, you can have as many mesa cards as you have PCI slots, and each of them have two or three daughtercards, and you can run all that horseshit at once
[17:26:47] <ssi> but you'd run out of AXES in linuxcnc ;)
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[17:34:36] <CaptHindsight> _methods: working on a screw machine?
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[17:37:04] <_methods> yeah kinda
[17:37:09] <_methods> want a real 4th axis
[17:37:17] <_methods> turn my minimill into a live tooling set up
[17:37:19] <_methods> http://littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=2299
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[17:37:28] <_methods> i think i'm going to use that for my 4th axis
[17:37:31] <CaptHindsight> I asked the devs about expanding beyond 9 axes and they said it was possible
[17:37:39] <_methods> i only need 4
[17:37:49] <_methods> i just want to use a servo for the 4th
[17:38:04] <ssi> I should set my g0602 up and refit it with some simple live tooling
[17:38:11] <ssi> that'd be an ideal machine for something like this little part I need to make
[17:38:25] <_methods> yeah
[17:38:35] <_methods> would work well for that part
[17:38:38] <ssi> yep
[17:38:56] <ssi> even just a qctp toolholder with a small spindle in it
[17:39:01] <ssi> and spindle orient
[17:39:09] <ssi> (main spindle orient tht is)
[17:39:38] <XXCoder> ssi: once saw someone use small drill mounted on spidle to do 90 degree drills
[17:39:39] <XXCoder> small one
[17:39:43] <ssi> yeah
[17:39:44] <CaptHindsight> I've only made it to 8 axes so far
[17:40:08] <ssi> I wonder how that works with the JA branches
[17:40:09] <_methods> there's a guy that's done all this to his little x2
[17:40:18] <ssi> is it still a 9 axis limit, but more joints, or is it a 9 joint limit?
[17:40:30] <_methods> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b2-Kdud7eiA
[17:41:18] <CaptHindsight> I believe 9 axes but more joints
[17:45:34] <ssi> that's a pretty nice setup
[17:45:49] <XXCoder> yeah, almost had impact though
[17:45:50] <ssi> god a decent spindle like that on my VMC would be everything I'd need
[17:45:57] <XXCoder> drill was mm away from top
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[17:48:37] <_methods> he's got balls droppin the end mill down in the tslots lol
[17:48:51] <_methods> thats one way to get some extra room
[17:49:46] <_methods> yeah i would imagine you could really do some work with something like that on a real vmc
[17:49:53] <_methods> with a tool changer
[17:49:57] <ssi> yep!
[17:50:03] <_methods> you could put the turning tools in spindle
[17:50:04] <ssi> could make some custom tool holders to hold lathe tools
[17:50:05] <ssi> yeha
[17:50:09] <_methods> and spindle orient
[17:50:16] <ssi> could even change rake angle that way
[17:50:19] <_methods> yep
[17:50:33] <_methods> ghetto live tooling lathe hehe
[17:50:37] <XXCoder> yeah
[17:50:57] <XXCoder> on cnc with toolchanger can add lathe tools so its live swappable
[17:55:33] <CaptHindsight> ghetto live tooling lathe or next kickstarter?
[17:55:46] <XXCoder> CaptHindsight: kickstarter kickstarter kickstarter!!!!!
[17:55:47] <_methods> oh damn
[17:55:54] <_methods> this is our chance
[17:55:59] <XXCoder> CaptHindsight: new collets
[17:56:00] <_methods> nah nm this is actually useful
[17:56:06] <XXCoder> lather holder collets
[17:56:11] <XXCoder> *lathe tooling
[17:56:13] <ssi> ooh you know what
[17:56:16] <ssi> square ER collets
[17:56:19] <ssi> would hold lathe tools
[17:56:20] <ssi> bam
[17:56:22] <ssi> live tool'd
[17:56:27] <_methods> yeah
[17:56:30] <XXCoder> it exists already?
[17:56:52] <ssi> shit yeah
[17:57:00] <CaptHindsight> _methods: could be used to make wristbands to hold end mills
[17:57:05] <_methods> hahaha
[17:57:10] <_methods> or pancake printers
[17:57:39] <XXCoder> well. first invent it, then invent really crappy use for it
[17:57:48] <XXCoder> let smart people see actual use for it
[17:58:05] <ssi> actually I'm having a hard time fining square ER collets
[17:58:09] <ssi> square 5C are common tho
[17:58:13] <_methods> yeah
[17:58:19] <_methods> i was going to say 5c
[17:58:28] <CaptHindsight> http://reprap.org/mediawiki/images/f/f2/Printrun_fr.png and be sure to use this GUI
[17:58:28] <ssi> but I have ER tooling for the VMC
[17:58:30] <ssi> cat40 ER chucks
[17:58:31] <_methods> they make cat40 5c adapter i'm sure
[17:58:37] <ssi> yeah probably
[17:58:37] <XXCoder> cool. I recently finally setup and use 4th axis. .. it was interesting.
[17:58:48] <archivist> endmills with er shape shanks so length is preset
[17:59:18] <XXCoder> heyyyy turn it around. invent stock holder for spidle
[17:59:27] <_methods> maybe not on the adapter lol
[17:59:30] <XXCoder> turn cnc mill into lathe like hmm ssi menioned?
[17:59:39] <CaptHindsight> http://www.3ders.org/articles/20150406-us-navy-researcher-3d-prints-adjustable-groove-joint-pliers.html for plastic fasteners
[17:59:49] <XXCoder> also, table mount lathe tools
[18:00:34] <CaptHindsight> "postdoctoral research associate"
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[18:00:55] <ssi> lol postdocs
[18:01:22] <CaptHindsight> I guess tey don't let you have real pliers until after postdoc
[18:01:32] <ssi> you know what would have done that job perfectly adequately?
[18:01:37] <ssi> SMOOTH JAW PLIERS
[18:01:43] <ssi> like knipexb
[18:01:44] <ssi> -b
[18:01:54] <XXCoder> well research can be useful
[18:01:58] <ssi> http://www.amazon.com/Knipex-8603250-10-Inch-Pliers-Wrench/dp/B000X4OG94/ref=sr_1_1?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1428516112&sr=1-1&keywords=pliers+knipex
[18:02:01] <ssi> problem solved
[18:02:03] <XXCoder> on space you can't dock and get more tools.
[18:02:30] <XXCoder> if something unexpected happened and you need certain tools, its good to know how to print it so it stands up to task,.
[18:02:58] <XXCoder> If I recall, there was first 3d print recently
[18:03:07] <ssi> and what do you do if you're in space and some dickhead used up all the plastic filament on moustaches and fake sunglasses
[18:03:08] <PetefromTn_> Wonderful some fucking asshat just phoned a bomb threat into my kids school. They evacuated and did not find anything.
[18:03:17] <_methods> buwhahahahhaa
[18:03:24] <XXCoder> not very funny
[18:03:34] <XXCoder> hope they trace and arrest that person
[18:03:45] <_methods> i was laughin at the mustache comment
[18:03:49] <XXCoder> ssi: yeah space that guy
[18:03:52] <PetefromTn_> I hope they kick his ever lovin' ass into the ground....
[18:03:52] <_methods> not bomb threat you nipplehead
[18:04:01] <ssi> lol
[18:04:13] <XXCoder> _methods: didnt see funny one yeah sorry
[18:04:21] <_methods> :)
[18:04:29] <PetefromTn_> nipplehead...teehee
[18:04:40] <_methods> haha it's my go to
[18:05:57] <JT-Shop> ssi, would 7075 be strong enough?
[18:06:37] <ssi> JT-Shop: honestly probably, but they specifically asked for steel
[18:06:54] <XXCoder> oh yeahj
[18:06:55] <ssi> it's a shaft adapter for a vibrapencil
[18:07:00] <XXCoder> did you guys ever mill tungesin
[18:07:09] <ssi> and aluminum would probably deform the bore
[18:07:11] <XXCoder> ssi: "pencil" right ;)
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[18:10:25] <_methods> ssi: what's the tolerance on teh 2 through holes i'll just write it in so i can quote it
[18:10:46] <XXCoder> .0000001
[18:10:54] <_methods> and are the tapped holes thru?
[18:11:16] <_methods> i seem to remember you saying they weren't supposed to go through allt he way
[18:11:23] <XXCoder> actually if I recall, Lego uses that tolence. 0.0000001
[18:11:36] <archivist> patent pending! http://www.genswiss.com/er_taper_integrated_tiloc_tooling.htm
[18:11:55] <ssi> _methods: they can be thru or to bore... I think I drew it thru cause I figured it'd be easier to do
[18:12:28] <_methods> well less tapping is probably better with 304
[18:12:33] <ssi> the holes ought to be reamed to size, they didn't give me an actual tolerance but the .125 bore is slip fit on a shaft, the .100 bore isn't as critical but probably +/-.002 is a good target
[18:12:43] <_methods> k that works
[18:13:00] <ssi> everything else is cosmetic
[18:13:06] <ssi> OD can be barstock dimension
[18:13:28] <_methods> so is stock scale fine?
[18:13:34] <_methods> or does it need to be turned?
[18:13:37] <ssi> thread class 2B is fine, hole location +/-.01" is fine
[18:13:49] <ssi> um I think mill scale is fine
[18:13:55] <_methods> k
[18:14:01] <ssi> 304 is pretty bright in scale isn't it?
[18:14:59] <_methods> bar stock usually isn't
[18:15:23] <_methods> sheet's usually not too bad
[18:16:00] <_methods> but bar stock is usually a dull gray
[18:16:06] <ssi> that's probably fine
[18:16:10] <_methods> i might have some out there i can take a pic of
[18:16:12] <_methods> one sec
[18:16:21] <ssi> although I imagine that OD finish turning wouldn't add a ton of machine time and doesn't add an OP
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[18:19:27] <_methods> i found some 303 it looks pretty good
[18:19:30] <_methods> 304 looks about the same
[18:20:11] <XXCoder> whats you guys making
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[18:21:35] <_methods> http://imgur.com/akWYQ3O
[18:22:57] <_methods> http://i.imgur.com/oz2stty.jpg
[18:23:07] <_methods> sorry horrible pic trying to hold it and camera
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[18:23:57] <ssi> yea that's plenty fine
[18:24:01] <_methods> k
[18:24:05] <ssi> it's bright compared to, say, A36 :)
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[18:27:13] <_methods> alright i got the boss man doin a quote now
[18:27:19] <ssi> awesome thx
[18:27:22] <_methods> np
[18:27:36] <ssi> when you have it I'll call them and make sure they didn't find someone else, and if it's inline I'll get approval and have you jam it up
[18:30:21] <_methods> cool
[18:30:48] <_methods> unless someone else in here wants/needs teh work
[18:30:50] <_methods> i'll stay out
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[18:32:25] <_methods> i'd give pete or jt first dibs
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[18:33:01] <_methods> PetefromTn_ or JT-Shop were you going to get with ssi on his parts?
[18:33:31] <ssi> pete's back a couple weeks and doesn't have a lathe at the moment
[18:33:48] <ssi> he's making big kid parts right now :)
[18:33:52] <_methods> hehe
[18:36:21] <_methods> http://i.imgur.com/ZheHF4a.jpg
[18:36:35] <ssi> HAHAHA
[18:36:49] <_methods> haha
[18:36:53] <_methods> i have no idea if that's true
[18:36:57] <_methods> but it sure was funny
[18:36:58] <PetefromTn_> honestly I would like to do the parts but I JUST got some work to do actually several jobs for one customer and I am heading over to another customer that wants me to look at something right now. If any of these go thru I will be working for a little while on them.
[18:37:15] <_methods> right on
[18:37:28] <_methods> well i don't want to take any work away from anyone
[18:37:37] <PetefromTn_> if he decides that there is not a big rush I am working on a quote for him.
[18:37:38] <_methods> i'd rather see you guys get it then my shop get it
[18:38:02] <PetefromTn_> would be easier if my CNC lathe was working DOH!
[18:38:09] <_methods> heheh
[18:39:38] <PetefromTn_> yeah I wish I could laugh about it but it is a sore spot right now. Been approached with several jobs that would be good for it.
[18:39:46] <ssi> I feel the same way man
[18:39:49] <ssi> if I had my vmc going
[18:39:51] <ssi> or even just my hnc
[18:40:29] <FinboySlick> You guys seen this yet? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LVODJm05plw
[18:40:53] <_methods> heh
[18:40:57] <_methods> i've never nuked a bearing
[18:41:11] <PetefromTn_> I thought it was a bad thing to nuke metal parts?
[18:41:22] <FinboySlick> I guess dipping it in boiling water would work too.
[18:41:27] <XXCoder> PetefromTn_: pointy stuff would make plasma
[18:41:50] <XXCoder> even so, it's not very good idea
[18:42:04] <PetefromTn_> Gotta go meet a NEW potential customer right now wish me luck guys!
[18:42:10] <XXCoder> good luck man
[18:42:15] <FinboySlick> Break a leg, PetefromTn_.
[18:42:21] <PetefromTn_> ;)
[18:42:23] <_methods> go get it
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[18:42:34] <PetefromTn_> BBL
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[18:42:59] <mknawabi> anyone here good with isilon ACLs? :D
[18:43:13] <XXCoder> also 15 sec isnt enough for any serious issue
[18:43:31] <_methods> i don't even know what that is
[18:44:11] <_methods> mknawabi: not emc
[18:44:11] <XXCoder> any of you guys ever nuked a cdrom or dvd? you should do it once in least. only 1 or 2 seconds!
[18:44:18] <mknawabi> o shit
[18:44:19] <mknawabi> sorry
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[18:44:22] <_methods> mknawabi: it's linuxcnc lol
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[18:56:58] <JT-Shop> well them bad boys are done and now some of the pins are a bit tight and need to be polished
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[19:36:00] <cnc1> hallo to all
[19:36:54] <_methods> hello
[19:37:00] <XXCoder> hey
[19:37:16] <cnc1> i have question
[19:37:37] <_methods> fire away
[19:37:45] <cnc1> MDI_COMMAND = O<probez> call
[19:38:11] <_methods> calling a sub in mdi?
[19:39:23] <cnc1> the make error unable to open file
[19:39:38] <_methods> are you doing this in axis gui
[19:39:42] <_methods> under the mdi tab
[19:39:48] <cnc1> sorry i'm slowly
[19:40:29] <cnc1> yes axis
[19:42:04] <_methods> i honestly don't know what you can or can't do in axis mdi
[19:42:22] <cnc1> with a button
[19:43:24] <_methods> is there like a more advanced axis gui doc than this
[19:43:26] <_methods> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/gui/axis.html
[19:44:25] <JT-Shop> cnc1, the file has to be in the path specified in the ini file and a few more things
[19:45:16] <cnc1> http://imagebin.ca/v/1xenx74cV9FU
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[19:45:52] <_methods> ah integrator manual has more adv axis stuff i guess
[19:47:39] <JT-Shop> in the MDI tab type o<probez> call and see if it runs
[19:47:54] <JT-Shop> o<probez> call
[19:48:07] <cnc1> ok
[19:49:09] <cnc1> no
[19:49:19] <cnc1> same error
[19:49:39] <cnc1> unable to open file
[19:49:44] <JT-Shop> what directory is the file in?
[19:50:25] <cnc1> 0<probez> sub
[19:50:26] <cnc1> G38.2 Z-35 F60
[19:50:28] <cnc1> G92 Z-31.97
[19:50:29] <cnc1> G0 Z10 F400
[19:50:31] <cnc1> 0<probez> endsub
[19:52:00] <cnc1> i make this tuturial
[19:52:02] <cnc1> http://rlirc.blogspot.de/2014/03/verwendung-des-stepcraft.html
[19:53:16] <cnc1> the last section
[19:53:41] <JT-Shop> where did you put the file?
[19:54:30] <cnc1> in same folder were is ini and hal
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[19:56:05] <skunkworks_> the probe.ngc needs to be in the nc_files directory
[19:56:28] <cnc1> aha
[19:56:31] <JT-Shop> The file must be in the directory pointed to by PROGRAM_PREFIX or SUBROUTINE_PATH in the ini file.
[19:56:47] <JT-Shop> and you must restart Axis so it knows it is there
[19:57:12] <skunkworks_> ^better answer
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[21:24:47] <Deejay> gn8
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[21:51:39] <furrywolf> I need entertainment for a plane trip. I was going to download mythbusters, but looks like they haven't made any new episodes in the last few months since the last plane trip. Suggestions? No stupidity.
[21:52:08] <furrywolf> non-fiction. (so no "reality tv" either)
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[21:52:59] <zeeshan|2> mythbusters is so shit now
[21:53:07] <zeeshan|2> they're doing all this movie myth busting nonsense
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[22:11:21] <furrywolf> it's far more interesting than most of what's on TV. Of course, that doesn't take much.
[22:13:53] <Tom_itx> look out the window
[22:14:15] <furrywolf> at cross-country cruising altitude at night, there's not much out the window.
[22:14:23] <Lowridah> secialized set of circumstances busters
[22:14:26] <Lowridah> specialized
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[22:14:29] <Tom_itx> you might see some aliens
[22:18:47] <furrywolf> I might, but it's very unlikely.
[22:19:15] <adb> gn
[22:20:05] <furrywolf> so, suggestions? Something at least marginally intelligent, that's easy to download.
[22:21:35] * furrywolf doesn't usually watch tv, so doesn't know what's currently available
[22:22:36] <LeelooMinai> I watch TV series only when taking breaks to eat during the day.
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[22:23:01] <LeelooMinai> But that's, I don't know, I guess "fiction" in your book
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[22:24:26] * furrywolf isn't sure how watching tv during food breaks implies fiction
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[22:25:59] <furrywolf> hrmm, they made a new season of survivorman? might be worth getting.
[22:26:02] <LeelooMinai> I wrote TV series...
[22:26:19] <LeelooMinai> But movie-like TV series, not shows like Mythbusters
[22:26:31] <furrywolf> ... does "TV series" mean something different there than it does in us english?
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[22:27:05] <LeelooMinai> Not sure - is there a special term for the "movie-like" ones?
[22:27:37] <furrywolf> made-for-tv movie
[22:27:39] <furrywolf> ?
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[22:28:11] <LeelooMinai> But that includes just... movies. I mean series that have lot's of parts:)
[22:28:41] <furrywolf> here "tv series" just means anything that airs on tv and has more than one episode, including wildlife documentaries, the simpsons, modern marvels, jersey shore,... :P
[22:28:49] <furrywolf> that is, it tells you nothing about what the show is.
[22:29:12] <LeelooMinai> Yes, right, so I am not sure how to describe the ones that are movie-like.
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[22:30:51] <Lowridah> dramatic nonfiction?
[22:31:04] <furrywolf> oh goody, my favorite easy-as-fuck-to-download-from streaming site has some of the last survivorman series.
[22:31:26] <LeelooMinai> Lowridah: But movie-like includes fiction...
[22:31:48] <Tom_itx> download crockadile man
[22:31:56] <furrywolf> it's a streaming site that wants you to watch their crap, but it's plain html5, downloads at 10mbit, and doesn't seem to have any detection whatsoever that you're wgeting ten things at once. :)
[22:31:59] <Lowridah> movies are like fruit, they can be fiction or an orange, but not all oranges or fiction are fruits and movies?
[22:32:09] <Lowridah> either way just download BBC's a history of art in 3 colors
[22:32:17] * furrywolf thinks Lowridah might be a bit fruity
[22:33:53] <Lowridah> could be could be
[22:34:50] <LeelooMinai> furrywolf: Won't downloading video take 2 months on your connection? :)
[22:36:09] <furrywolf> I'll be spending a day at someone else's house before the plane trip (leaving my car there and getting a ride), can use broadband there.
[22:36:53] <furrywolf> downloading them to my webhosting now
[22:36:56] <LeelooMinai> I see, temporary return to civilisation
[22:37:10] <furrywolf> hrmm, their server is slacking, only 185K/sec now.
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[22:39:27] <andypugh> Lowridah: That was rather a good series, certainly.
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[22:39:55] * furrywolf doesn't much like art
[22:40:29] <andypugh> Then you can read “Pattern Recognition” for more abour International Klien Blue.
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[22:41:32] <andypugh> furrywolf: It is more about colours than it is about art.
[22:41:56] <Lowridah> color and material scarcity
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[22:44:57] <Lowridah> sorry, colours, it is a BBC show after all
[22:45:36] <furrywolf> hrmm, they seem to have bumped your speeds down to 185K/sec and limited you to 4 files at once now. oh well.
[22:46:12] <furrywolf> that's still >700K/sec at least. :)
[22:46:14] <andypugh> I obsessively watch anything with Lucy Worsley too.
[22:47:46] <furrywolf> nevermind, it's just that video is broken. another works fine. downloading five at once now.
[22:47:58] <furrywolf> never heard of (her?)
[22:51:40] <andypugh> Cute, clever, sexy lisp. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0QTRYPcaGUo
[22:52:45] <furrywolf> I have written plenty of lisp. I never found it cute, clever, or sexy. :P
[22:52:51] <furrywolf> oh, you don't mean the language. :P
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[22:55:27] <furrywolf> yay, getting around 1.3MB/second. too bad I can't get them from my webserver to here at that rate. heh.
[22:56:05] <furrywolf> I downloaded something the other day from youtube to my webserver at 34MB/sec. good to know google doesn't ratelimit.
[22:56:55] <furrywolf> I then downloaded it from there to here, which took much longer. I then found out it utterly fucking sucked, and it was a waste of bandwidth twice.
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[22:58:25] <andypugh> www.speedtest.net says I get 6Mb up and 106Mb down.
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[23:01:09] <furrywolf> I get around 20-100K/sec down, 5-20K/sec up
[23:01:14] <furrywolf> when it's working
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[23:01:42] <andypugh> Do you really mean K? And are you taking bits or bytes?
[23:02:35] <furrywolf> big-K. kilobytes.
[23:03:10] <furrywolf> when it's not working, it can range from barely usable to unusable...
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[23:05:07] <_methods> 6-32 tap drill
[23:05:11] <_methods> oops
[23:05:34] <furrywolf> 7/64
[23:05:42] <_methods> correct
[23:05:43] <_methods> hehe
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[23:07:11] <furrywolf> andypugh: if it were kbits, it'd be even worse. :)
[23:07:11] * _methods needs to get a tap drill chart to hang up
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[23:07:46] <andypugh> It’s easy. You subtract the pitch from the diameter.
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[23:08:08] <andypugh> M6 x 1 = 5mm. M25 x 2 = 23mm…
[23:08:25] <andypugh> M4 x 0.8 = 3.2mm
[23:08:53] <andypugh> As the angles are the same that should work in your quaint units too.
[23:09:20] <furrywolf> It's even easier than that. you look at a chart. :)
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[23:09:36] <furrywolf> the chart will tell you the nice fraction, rather than you having to figure it out. :P
[23:10:21] <_methods> yeah well i'm havin to tap for stupid mobo standoffs that use 6-32
[23:10:29] <_methods> metric is so much mo bettah
[23:13:34] <andypugh> furrywolf: You take a digital caliper to drills in the box smaller than the screw :-)
[23:13:52] <furrywolf> lol
[23:14:24] <furrywolf> I've picked drills by just holding them up to the tap and seeing what looks about like the right one...
[23:15:11] <andypugh> So, 6 - 32 would be 5.96875 tapping size…. Wait, when things get small you use random code digits rather than a size? You are on your own then.
[23:16:48] <cpresser> andypugh: for most metric threads the subtraction method for the core-drill-diameter works. but not for all. DIN recommends a table
[23:16:58] <furrywolf> lol
[23:17:01] <cpresser> there is a table on the back of my caliper, thats handy
[23:17:39] <furrywolf> I was working on a car project that had M9 and M11 bolts. yay hard to find.
[23:17:52] <andypugh> furrywolf: Bugatti?
[23:18:00] <furrywolf> historic-ish subaru
[23:18:57] <andypugh> The baffle in a Puch maxi moped silencer is held in with an M7 nut. I have no idea why.
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[23:20:00] <furrywolf> also had m10 in a very fine pitch, which is also quite hard to find. had to order them from a specialty fastener place (no, not fastenal - they couldn't get them, as always).... twice. because the first time the factory put normal fine pitch bolts in the box even though the sticker had the correct extra-fine pitch...
[23:20:56] <beebee> hi, does LinuxCNC work with r323?
[23:21:32] <furrywolf> subaru flywheel bolts are the same size and pitch as toyota driveshaft bolts, and neither is easy to find. :)
[23:21:47] <andypugh> beebee: What is r323?
[23:21:48] <_methods> rs232?
[23:22:07] <beebee> andypugh, _methods : yes rs323 sorry
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[23:22:27] <beebee> 232*
[23:22:32] <furrywolf> that would explain why my googling for r323 cnc was finding exactly nothing...
[23:22:39] <andypugh> A bit. What do you actually need to do?
[23:24:19] <beebee> oops, rs323, i'm sure this time. i need LinuxCNC to speak to a rs323 controller
[23:24:59] <cpresser> beebee: we will need details on that controller. specs, datasheet, ...
[23:25:41] <beebee> conquer design and engineering
[23:26:13] <beebee> m140 i think
[23:26:27] <andypugh> What data is transferred by RS232 in this case?
[23:27:06] <furrywolf> yes another product google says doesn't exist...
[23:28:23] <beebee> furrywolf: sorry found it http://www.eaziform.co.uk/index.php?products,m401
[23:29:05] <furrywolf> It helps if you know what you have before asking about it. :)
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[23:29:15] <andypugh> This is nice :-) http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Max-Muller-Geidermeister-CNC-Machine-Lathe-Metal-Turning-/151636899731?&_trksid=p2056016.l4276
[23:29:29] <beebee> yeah i suppose it does
[23:29:43] <beebee> it's for my uncle so i'm not 100%
[23:30:10] <andypugh> OK. LinuxCNC can’t talk to that because LinuxCNC does _exactly_ the same job as that.
[23:30:12] <beebee> so can LinuxCNC work with that controller I posted above@?
[23:30:18] <beebee> oh
[23:30:18] <furrywolf> It is very unlikely to work with linuxcnc without some coding.
[23:30:37] <beebee> how can a piece of software do the same job as a piece of hardware?
[23:30:37] <andypugh> You can _replace_ that with LinuxCNC
[23:31:37] <andypugh> Well, You also need some hardware to be controlled by LinuxCNC. Anything from parallel port (yes, we know) to an FPGA IO card
[23:31:42] <beebee> andypugh: that doesn't make sense.. did that link work? it's a piece of hardware
[23:32:07] <furrywolf> I'm sure linuxcnc could be made to work with it, but I'm not aware of a driver for it.
[23:32:08] <andypugh> It is a piece of hardware with an embedded CNC controller in firmware. LinuxCNC is a CNC controller.
[23:32:45] <beebee> so is that hardware made for windows?
[23:33:02] <furrywolf> is it a full controller, or just a pulse generator?
[23:33:23] <andypugh> I am not sure. I suspect that the M401 expects to be sent G-code as text
[23:33:24] <beebee> pulse generator
[23:34:09] <beebee> it came with software called EaziCNC
[23:34:12] <furrywolf> yeah, if it has a controller built-in, then you get to hack the firmware too... :P
[23:34:59] <andypugh> No, it is more than a pulse generator as it does motion control. (Bezier curves implies multi-axis coordinated motion)
[23:35:20] <furrywolf> is this a card you have, or one you were thinking of getting?
[23:35:30] <beebee> card I have
[23:35:45] <beebee> it works with EaziCNC on windows but it stutters a lot
[23:35:50] <andypugh> So, the M401 does pretty much the same thing as LinuxCNC + Parallel Port (probably better, as the Parallel port is a very sub-optimal solution)
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[23:37:23] <beebee> would you recommend a USB controller to work with EaziCNC?
[23:37:44] <beebee> or maybe even better, with LinuxCNC
[23:38:04] <furrywolf> Mesa boards are generally suggested for linuxcnc
[23:38:06] <andypugh> If you want something that would be an upgrade from the M401 then you would be looking at installing Linux, realtime kernel, and probably an FPGA card such as the Mesa 5i25 - 7i76 combo.
[23:38:21] <furrywolf> there are no realtime usb solutions that I know of, just attempts that may not have worked...
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[23:39:21] <andypugh> beebee: You would be looking at $200 to replace that M401 with a llinuxCNC-supported equivalent. http://store.mesanet.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=83_84&product_id=215
[23:40:15] <andypugh> But it seems to me that the M401 ought to work without stuttering, and the first port of call should be the manufacturer to ask why their product doesn’t work.
[23:41:20] <beebee> andypugh: so linux + Mesa 5i25 - 7i76 would be realtime?
[23:41:30] <andypugh> Yes.
[23:41:56] <beebee> m401's motion seems stuttery
[23:42:14] <beebee> the cuts are fine, it's just not smooth
[23:42:14] <andypugh> With one caveat: You need a PC motherboard that can run well with the realtime kernel.
[23:42:29] <Tom_itx> but they're only about $60
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[23:43:22] <furrywolf> you don't need a good motherboard to use a mesa board. only parallel port is really picky...
[23:43:31] <andypugh> As a first step download the LinuxCNC LiveCD, boot from the CD and run a latency test. You can do all this without making any changes to the Windows installation.
[23:43:44] <SpeedEvil> new
[23:43:44] <furrywolf> you can run a mesa board with >1000us jitter. :)
[23:43:59] <SpeedEvil> (but it probably makes sense to get a new mb)
[23:44:01] <beebee> the computer can run ubuntu. i've also read the ethernet or usb controllers can fun smoother
[23:44:09] <beebee> *be
[23:44:35] <beebee> i think windows is interrupting the smoothness of the steps
[23:44:51] <furrywolf> if the card operates like their website claims, the smoothness is entirely in hardware
[23:44:58] <andypugh> The USB controllers (as supprted by Mach3) are very much like the M401. They are a complete motion controller in a box being sent high-level commands from the Windows software.
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[23:47:00] <andypugh> beebee: Windows shouldn’t be able to interfere with M401 steps. It is more likely that the windows software is starving the motion queue so that the motion stops ocassionally. This would fit with the parts coming out well. If the step-pulses were interrupted between moves then the motors would tend to stall and not recover. So it sounds more like the M401 is stopping and waiting between moves.
[23:47:36] <beebee> andypugh: that's exactly it
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[23:48:45] <furrywolf> or their controller has a piss-poor look ahead algorithm...
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[23:49:14] <furrywolf> brain-damaged path planning stops between every command
[23:49:18] <andypugh> So, in that case you could try to see what the problem is with the windows system. Or you could just accept that things sound worse that they are and carry on as you are and make parts :-)
[23:49:39] <beebee> the machine it's controlling is a precsix404
[23:50:12] <andypugh> LinuxCNC and 5i25 - 7i76 will work better. And you can hack it to do anything you like. But there will be a learning curve and down-time.
[23:50:42] <beebee> are there tests i run to find out where the issue is and come back with more info?
[23:50:46] <andypugh> So if you are making money from the current system it isn’t a trivial decision to make.
[23:50:47] <furrywolf> or an ethernet mesa card if you like small cables
[23:51:10] <furrywolf> beebee: you can send g-code directly to your controller with any terminal program, bypassing their included software entirely.
[23:51:49] <furrywolf> my suspicion would be poor firmware on their part, or poor g-code on yours (such as generated g-code with ten billion tiny moves, that the serial port can't send fast enough).
[23:52:24] <andypugh> If you ask on the Mach3 forums they will tell you to buy a Smoothstepper and Geckos and that you will be back up and running in a week. I will tell you that you should bet on a month to get up to speed again, either with Mach3 or LinuxCNC.
[23:52:57] <beebee> i generate smooth vectors with very little nodes created in aspire
[23:53:09] <andypugh> furrywolf: Yes, tiny moves that the machine can complete before the serial port can send them seems very likely.
[23:53:14] <furrywolf> how big is your generated g-code file?
[23:54:22] <beebee> furrywolf: 6600 lines for a silhouette of a cat
[23:54:26] <andypugh> beebee: Can you change the serial data rate? It might be instructive to halve it to see if things get worse as a diagnostic step (doubling it to see if it gets better is probably less diagnostic)
[23:54:27] <beebee> i can post the gcodfe here
[23:54:36] <furrywolf> and how long does it take to cut it?
[23:55:05] <beebee> furrywolf: 12minutes
[23:55:25] <furrywolf> ok, so g-code sending shouldn't be the limit, then... that's only a few lines a second.
[23:55:58] <furrywolf> do they have commands to switch between exact stop and any kind of trajectory planning?
[23:56:26] <beebee> i'm not sure. i can post the file here.
[23:56:53] <furrywolf> it'll be in their programming/configuration manual, which I'm too lazy to download again. :)
[23:57:52] <furrywolf> ah-ha! apparantly splines are handled by the software, the firmware doesn't natively support them. you said you were generating splines?
[23:59:11] <furrywolf> do you have your accelerations set correctly?
[23:59:27] <beebee> what are splines?
[23:59:36] <furrywolf> nevermind, you said vectors
[23:59:45] <furrywolf> andy mentioned splines earlier
[23:59:49] * furrywolf is doing too many things at once