#linuxcnc | Logs for 2015-02-10

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[00:00:36] <fluffybitchx> now to wire up my third motor... it's a different brand and pinout, need to figure it out and make jumpers.
[00:08:09] <fluffybitchx> hrmm. the wiring compartment on this motor smells interesting.
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[00:08:51] <fluffybitchx> also, they give you NO room to work. bleh.
[00:13:30] tjb11 is now known as tjb1
[00:13:37] <fluffybitchx> grrrrrr. the photocopied manual it came with gives the wiring by wire color code. mine has identical-colored wires to numbered terminals.
[00:15:29] * fluffybitchx tries to figure out how to reverse-engineer an 8-lead stepper
[00:16:55] <fluffybitchx> the four coils are easy to find, but I have no idea which are which, and their relative polarities. spin it and watch them on my 'scope? or assume there's only so many ways to hook it up wrong? :)
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[00:21:13] <_methods> buwhahahah
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[00:21:26] <_methods> that armor plate just wrekt my whirligig blade
[00:21:30] <_methods> after like 2 swipes
[00:21:47] * fluffybitchx wonders what a whirligig blade is
[00:22:06] <_methods> slang for deburring tool
[00:22:23] <fluffybitchx> yay, found the wiring in an appendix to a parker stepper drive manual, listing how to wire it to different brands.
[00:23:57] <PetefromTn_> how hard is it?
[00:24:26] <fluffybitchx> my wiring or his plate? (and do we want to know how hard his tool is?)
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[00:28:44] <_methods> haha i don't know i don't have a tester here
[00:28:48] <_methods> i think it's armox500 though
[00:29:14] <_methods> http://www.ssab.com/en/Brands/Armox/Products/Armox-500T/
[00:29:39] <_methods> 480-540 hbw
[00:29:59] <_methods> but i'm probably work hardening it too since i can't feed or cut enough
[00:30:08] <PetefromTn_> hehe
[00:30:23] <PetefromTn_> outta be hard as diamonds then huh
[00:30:36] <_methods> yeah i won't do that on the x2 again
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[00:30:51] <_methods> note to self don't grab armor plate for any home projects lol
[00:31:27] <_methods> unbelievable all the flutes are good to go
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[00:31:35] <_methods> it was cutting like crap though
[00:31:56] <PetefromTn_> do you do a lot of stuff with that material in your shop?
[00:32:28] <_methods> yeah
[00:32:54] <_methods> i found a chunk in the trash can about the size of the spacer i needed i thought it felt heavy for regular steel
[00:33:00] <_methods> hehe
[00:33:37] <PetefromTn_> nice
[00:34:16] <_methods> i don't think the plastic gears liked it much
[00:34:43] <PetefromTn_> never thought I would hear a milling machine with plastic gears hehe
[00:35:55] <_methods> yeah :(
[00:35:58] <_methods> not for long though
[00:36:02] <anarchos2> man I'm going insane with this...my y home switch is doing weird things, not sure if hardware or if software...seemed to started doing it when i added debounce in, but still does it if i turn debounce to 0 or 200, doesn't make a difference
[00:36:06] <_methods> especially with what i'm doing to it lol
[00:36:25] <LeelooMinai> I ordered some HSS 2-flute 3mm endmills from China and they send me a "gift" 1 flute endmill for cutting acylic - isn't that nice? :)
[00:38:28] <fluffybitchx> wow, speaking of work hardening. I need to make a couple jumpers for wiring the stepper motor. I found some scrap copper sheet that was bent. I took the bend out by hitting it with a hammer several times. I then wire brushed it with a stainless brush. the part I didn't hammer was scratched deeply by the stiff bristles, while the part I'd hammered didn't scratch.
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[00:41:34] * fluffybitchx didn't realize copper work-harened that hardly
[00:41:37] <fluffybitchx> hardened
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[00:43:35] <_methods> yeah copper is horrible aboutthat
[00:43:49] <_methods> i hate working with copper and brass
[00:43:52] <_methods> bronze too
[00:44:06] <_methods> any of that cu stuff is just a nightmare
[00:44:40] <fluffybitchx> now if only I can find the right drillbit. bleh.
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[00:49:57] <roycroft> copper work hardens quite easily but it's also quite easy to anneal
[00:50:05] <roycroft> just heat it up and quench it
[00:50:08] <roycroft> or don't bother quenching it
[00:50:16] <roycroft> depending on how much time you have
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[00:59:50] <_methods> oh i love the way it looks but man it can be a real PITA some times
[01:00:00] <_methods> especially trying to get a good surface finish some times
[01:02:03] <fluffybitchx> meh. these jumpers are going inside the wiring box on a stepper. they look like crap, but no one will ever notice. lol
[01:02:52] * fluffybitchx is more of a welder than a machinist at times
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[01:17:45] <unfy> the fireman will notice >_>
[01:23:23] <fluffybitchx> bbl, work
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[01:34:44] <gene80> Anybody home?
[01:35:16] <XXCoder> _methods: wouldnt it evenually after long while green up?
[01:35:29] <XXCoder> or is it after heavy exposure to elements
[01:39:30] <PetefromTn_> I'm home...watchin' TV LOL
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[01:40:45] <XXCoder> I'm pretty sure im at home
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[01:44:17] <unfy> currently at work
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[01:58:12] <zeeshan-> man this is driving me insane
[01:58:23] <zeeshan-> any of you guys have multiple comps connected through ethernet and wifi
[01:58:27] <zeeshan-> and setup homegroup bs sharing
[01:58:38] <zeeshan-> the computers on the ethernet connections configure homegroup fine
[01:58:43] <zeeshan-> but the wifi ones are being a pain in the as
[01:58:45] <zeeshan-> i hate windows
[02:03:08] <roycroft> i have all of that except the windows bit
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[02:15:29] <zeeshan-> lol
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[02:15:34] <zeeshan-> this is being such a pain i nthe ASS
[02:15:40] <zeeshan-> i wanna go home and machine
[02:15:42] <zeeshan-> not do this bs
[02:15:54] <PetefromTn_> :D
[02:18:09] <EO_> What are some good gerber -> g-code generators? I know of CircuitCAM but that's really expensive. I just tried pcb2gcode but it disengages from the workpiece a lot.
[02:18:13] <EO_> Any other good commercial ones?
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[02:40:58] <_methods> nothing that i know of
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[02:41:10] <_methods> pcb2gcode is pretty wonky too
[02:41:27] <_methods> it's what i use unless it's a simple pcb
[02:41:45] <_methods> then i'll just make the pcb in solidworks and path it like a normal part
[02:42:25] <_methods> if i could get the solidworks electrical import part working good i'd do it all in solidworks
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[02:43:00] <anarchos2> when i do a G0 X3, for example, it goes at the MAX_LINEAR_VELOCITY speed, can i make it go at the DEFAULT_LINEAR_VELOCITY speed somehow?
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[02:45:08] <EO_> _methods: yeah, I tried to do the solidworks + hsm path
[02:45:34] <EO_> _methods: but it seems only IDX 3.0 / IDF 4.0 do actual copper trace import. And basically no EDA packages support those exports right now.
[02:46:31] <EO_> _methods: STEP also supports copper traces and IS supported by EDA, but Solidworks crashes when trying to import a Cadence STEP. I got it importing into Autodesk Inventor so I can still take advantage of HSM, but I haven't figured out all the details in Inventor yet. It's refusig to extrude.
[02:46:51] <_methods> yeah i've never gotten it to work very well
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[02:47:04] <EO_> Did you ever try the STEP -> Inventor path?
[02:47:17] <EO_> I also wanna try SW 2014 in case the STEP import there doesn't crash the thing
[02:47:17] <_methods> no havne't tried that one
[02:47:43] <EO_> it's amazingly hard to use normal CNC tool pathing software on PCB copper
[02:47:46] <_methods> sux having to use pcb2gcode
[02:48:02] <EO_> yeah, it spends 1/2 its time in rapids
[02:48:13] <_methods> the pathing shouldn't be a problem if i could just get a good model of the copper
[02:48:26] <_methods> but all eda software seems to output garbage
[02:48:42] <_methods> using lines that are just diff thickness and whatnot
[02:48:59] <_methods> instead of actually drawing the traces
[02:50:00] <_methods> but i have made some simple pcbs in solidworks by just importing the components i want to use and placing them on a pcb and making all my own traces manually
[02:50:26] <_methods> real pain in the sack but it works for maximum control of toolpaths
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[02:52:52] <EO_> yeah, that's butt though
[02:53:05] <EO_> Need proper gerber -> gcode generation
[02:53:12] <EO_> And I wish I knew of others aside from CircuitCAM
[02:53:27] <EO_> cuz it doesn't even spit gcode, it spits some internal LPKF format that feeds their CNC controller, BoardMaster
[02:53:38] <jdh> anarchos2: no, but that's probably not what you really want.
[02:56:56] <anarchos2> just read about F codes :P
[02:57:14] <jdh> yep
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[02:59:36] <fluffybitchx> grrr, stupid fucking crappy internet connection.
[03:00:20] <_methods> EO_: if you find a good way please let me know
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[03:08:51] <EO_> _methods: well, I was hoping folks would know things other than CircuitCAM in here that do CircuitCAM-like-things
[03:09:03] <EO_> I could see about acquiring some of those other approaches
[03:10:22] <EO_> And I don't actually want somtehing that does isolation milling
[03:10:31] <EO_> If I want isolation milling, I'll specify copper pours
[03:10:38] <EO_> I just want something that clears the non-copper regions
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[03:11:18] <EO_> FlatCAM and pcb2gcode are all about isolation milling though
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[03:16:35] <_methods> yeah
[03:18:00] <_methods> i want more control over the toolpaths and what gets removed
[03:18:32] <_methods> the toolpaths for pcb2gcode are horrible
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[03:28:18] <EO_> heh, Allegro PCB allows you to rotate the Gerber output by 90 deg for manufacturability, but you can't also rotate the drill output to match
[03:28:51] <CaptHindsight> the DXF to Gcode tools work pretty well
[03:29:12] <CaptHindsight> maybe Gerber to DXF and then to Gcode?
[03:29:40] <_methods> everytime i do gerber to dxf it just outputs lines with diff line weights
[03:29:47] <EO_> does it? I've only ever seen DXF save the trace outlines...not sure what to do with that in terms of creating solids and extrusions. I'd have to click on every trace individually no?
[03:29:51] <_methods> for trace thickness
[03:30:16] <CaptHindsight> are you really going from Allegro to milling pcb's?
[03:30:23] <EO_> ya
[03:30:32] <EO_> well, trying to
[03:30:42] <CaptHindsight> don't really need plated vias?
[03:31:11] <EO_> you can plate vias, but no, I can wire the few vias I have
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[03:35:25] <gene80> EO: you might want to google for voroni, which generates milling code that only isolates the path, but does not trim to conductor widths.
[03:36:48] <gene80> Because it doesn't follow a fixed path like the artwork shows, it is supposed to be faster, and on a mill with limited spindle rpms, it can get the job done a little quicker.
[03:37:57] <EO_> I need the shapes to be exact
[03:39:53] <EO_> a lot of the stuff I do is migh frequency, so it accounts for copper and non-copper regions at design time, so fab time needs to respect it.
[03:40:05] <EO_> migh=high
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[03:41:39] <gene80> EO: in that case, eagle to pcb2gcode gets it done, I can't say as I'd fuss about pcb2gcode traces though, to this now ancient C.E.T., they look pretty good and are so accurate that my slightly shakey hands have a hard time controlling the bridging.
[03:43:06] <EO_> yeah but it's just isolation milling
[03:43:11] <EO_> not full rubout of non-copper regions
[03:43:12] <gene80> EO: Yeah, I now about how stripline math is supposed to work but thats not something eagle is ultimately going to be good at.
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[03:43:32] <EO_> PS: not using eagle
[03:43:42] <EO_> I can spit the right gerber
[03:43:49] <EO_> just need something to translate it to proper g-code
[03:44:40] <EO_> ideally something like HSM could pencil with 10mil endmills, then work up to 20mil, then do larger area rubout with 60mil or something
[03:44:48] <EO_> using those 3 sizes it'd be really fast
[03:45:34] <EO_> CircuitCAM also supports this strategy
[03:47:22] <gene80> I saw that before I piped up. Someone else may be aware of a gerber to cgode translator, yes it would be much faster. I cannot comment on that productively as what I've done so far wasn't all that fancy, just the photo-interupter board for an encoder on my lathe spindle
[03:48:21] <fluffybitchx> yay! all three motors running.
[03:48:23] <gene80> and if I need to make another, that 1.2 x 2.1" board will still take 5 or so hours to carve
[03:48:51] * fluffybitchx is listening to the sound of the splash screen demo gcode being cut... or, at least, moving the motors as if it were being cut.
[03:49:14] <gene80> double sided, too many thru hole vias buried under stuff to make it a quick assembly.
[03:50:16] <gene80> What's the asking price for circuitCAM?
[03:50:19] <skunkworks> fluffybitchx: figure out your current problem?
[03:50:20] <fluffybitchx> next step is to grind flats on shafts, then start putting the machine back together. need to finish fixing the x leadscrew.
[03:50:36] <fluffybitchx> skunksleep: no. everything works perfectly if I keep the current limit set lower.
[03:52:25] <EO_> gene80: it's like $1-2k, but it doesn't even spit g-code, just some intermediate format for BoardMaster (their linuxcnc equivalent)
[03:53:50] <EO_> I bugged the FlatCAM guy a bit to improve support for things like microstrip and RF layout in general
[03:53:51] <gene80> Ahh, thats way above my pay grade then. I'm the old man of this group, so I watch the sheckles carefully.
[03:54:02] <fluffybitchx> having all three motors working makes me happy. the wiring isn't near done, but it means all the main components are present and working. it needs an enclosure, motor plugs, etc, etc... but it works!
[03:54:10] <EO_> we'll see what comes of it :)
[03:54:24] <EO_> right now the only workaround in FlatCAM is to use a crazy # of passes
[03:54:39] <EO_> but that also starts cutting the outside of the board really thick too, so you have tons of spoil
[03:54:47] <XXCoder> random thought.. is there anywhere I can buy tungsten ingot haped like gold bars
[03:54:53] <XXCoder> trapezoid I think
[03:55:08] <fluffybitchx> XXCoder: not exactly gold bar shape, but look for bucking blocks for riveting.
[03:55:16] <XXCoder> drat
[03:55:31] <XXCoder> I wanted em to show people how heavy gold really is
[03:55:37] <XXCoder> and how fake movie ones tend to be
[03:56:04] <fluffybitchx> you want DU instead. it's more impressive.
[03:56:33] <XXCoder> DU?
[03:57:01] <gene80> Is it the right color? Depleted Urainium
[03:57:26] <XXCoder> fluffy tungsten is very close to gold in density
[03:57:36] <XXCoder> uranium is definitely heavier if I recall
[03:57:50] <fluffybitchx> http://www.ebay.com/itm/ETBB05-Tungsten-Bucking-Bar-5-5-60-lbs-/221534260602?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3394788d7a a very small gold bar?
[03:58:32] <XXCoder> lol
[03:58:48] <fluffybitchx> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Tungsten-block-6-block-34-4-pounds-tapped-NICE-Late-Model-Nascar-ARCA-/121562995039?pt=Race_Car_Parts&hash=item1c4db8195f&vxp=mtr
[03:59:27] <gene80> yes, I've handled a rod of 235, definitely not something you would want to drop on a toe. Or leave out of its lead casket for more then the 5 seconds it takes to notice the klatter the counter 10 feet away is making.
[03:59:31] <fluffybitchx> so how much money do you want to spend on this? :P
[04:00:01] <XXCoder> right now, not much LOL just curious more than anything
[04:00:16] <XXCoder> I always wanted the movie style "gold bar" made from tungsein
[04:00:24] <XXCoder> I dont plan to cover it in gold or anything
[04:00:34] <t12> i found a bunch of 1kg copper ingots
[04:00:42] <t12> in very perfect ingot shapes
[04:02:29] <t12> is dpu actually purchasable retail
[04:02:34] <t12> i've heard its used for elevator counterweights
[04:02:42] <XXCoder> its gray legally
[04:02:49] <XXCoder> its legal to own
[04:03:12] <XXCoder> I always wanted titirium (mispelled) too
[04:03:20] <t12> thats pretty purchsable
[04:03:33] <XXCoder> not in usa
[04:03:39] <fluffybitchx> tritium is perfectly easy to get from other countries.
[04:03:46] <XXCoder> illegal to sell, can;'t import, but legal to own
[04:03:50] <XXCoder> yeah figure that out
[04:03:56] <_methods> definitely ITAR
[04:04:29] <t12> you can buy tritium exit signs retail
[04:04:37] <_methods> http://counsel.cornell.edu/ITAR/ITAR-summary.html
[04:04:41] <_methods> item45
[04:04:50] <_methods> section 3
[04:04:57] <fluffybitchx> many of the chinese crap stores sell tritium keychain lights and such
[04:05:31] <XXCoder> checking out aliexpress
[04:05:33] <_methods> purchasing large quantities of tritium will definitely win you some attention from certain agencies
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[04:06:18] <XXCoder> definitely not doing that
[04:06:21] <XXCoder> smallone and thats t
[04:06:22] <fluffybitchx> why? there's not much you can do with it.
[04:06:30] <XXCoder> just keychain
[04:06:45] <_methods> it's critical component in night sights and other weapon systems
[04:07:00] <gene80> g'night all
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[04:07:19] <t12> In general, possession of more that 15 lbs. of uranium requires a license from the U.S. NRC or authorized Agreement State. However, users are exempt from this requirement for the following applications:
[04:07:28] * fluffybitchx doesn't have any glowing sights
[04:07:56] <_methods> The United States Nuclear Regulatory Commission
[04:07:57] <_methods> (NRC) requires any person to have a license to
[04:07:57] <_methods> manufacture, process, produce or transfer products
[04:07:57] <_methods> containing tritium. Devices containing high levels of
[04:07:57] <_methods> tritium must be handled and disposed of within the
[04:07:59] <_methods> requirements of the NRC license and regulations.
[04:08:02] <_methods> (see 10 CFR 32.51 and 10 CFR 31.5 at
[04:08:04] <_methods> www.nrc.gov)
[04:08:32] <CaptHindsight> 1) Paint for children toys.
[04:08:50] <CaptHindsight> oh I thought you meant from China
[04:09:38] <fluffybitchx> hrmm, this isn't good. my battery meter is reading 70% based on coloumb counting, but current voltage is 23.0v.
[04:10:24] <_methods> tritium is a key element in nuclear weapons too i believe
[04:10:28] <CaptHindsight> http://www.amazon.com/Original-Nite-Tritium-Glowring-keyring/dp/B00F3887YK
[04:10:39] <_methods> a yield enhancer
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[04:11:12] <XXCoder> thats why when I ever buy tritium, it will be small
[04:11:19] <fluffybitchx> do I want to go poke at my batteries to see which one is failing, or do I want to ignore it since I can't do anything about it anyway?
[04:11:34] <XXCoder> multimeter that shit
[04:11:48] <CaptHindsight> what battery chemistry?
[04:11:55] <fluffybitchx> lead-acid
[04:11:58] <fluffybitchx> flooded
[04:11:58] <fluffybitchx> old
[04:12:21] <fluffybitchx> I had one reading weak before... my guess is it now reads weaker.
[04:12:40] <CaptHindsight> are they sealed?
[04:12:57] <fluffybitchx> <fluffybitchx> flooded
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[04:15:04] <XXCoder> http://www.aliexpress.com/item/1piece-1-5x6mm-Tritium-vials-keychain-fluorescence-stick-Free-shipping/2009460082.html
[04:15:06] <XXCoder> crazy
[04:15:14] <XXCoder> I'd not order any without protection
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[04:15:48] <_methods> you can purchase it fairly easily
[04:15:57] <_methods> but if you buy alot expect a visit lol
[04:16:06] <XXCoder> yeah but I wouldnt order any without plastic case
[04:16:12] <XXCoder> one I linked to dont
[04:16:44] <fluffybitchx> 1.5x6mm? tiny!
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[04:20:48] <XXCoder> that one is
[04:21:14] <fluffybitchx> seems pretty expensive to me
[04:21:24] <XXCoder> tritium tend to be
[04:21:33] <XXCoder> you need reactor to make em if I recall
[04:21:55] <XXCoder> its awesome on watch because can read anytime
[04:22:42] <XXCoder> example http://www.aliexpress.com/item/New-Luxury-Brand-TVG-50ATM-Waterproof-Multifunction-Quartz-Men-Sports-Military-Watches-Tritium-Luminous-LED-Digital/2047900240.html
[04:23:21] <XXCoder> bit tempted, looks nice
[04:24:13] <EO_> does linuxcnc have any ability to do a 90 degree rotation on a g-code ?
[04:24:19] <fluffybitchx> I'd imagine they get it free out the back door of a power plant.
[04:24:41] <XXCoder> possibly but Im pretty sure its not that easy
[04:25:07] <EO_> it's basically a matter of swapping X and Y
[04:26:13] <fluffybitchx> from what I can tell, you can get just about anything out the back door in china...
[04:26:34] <XXCoder> including china. ;)
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[04:27:58] <CaptHindsight> I actually have a backdoor from China
[04:28:06] <EO_> oh...maybe there's a G-code for rotating the coordinate system
[04:28:17] <XXCoder> backdoor carried out of backdoor in china
[04:29:05] <EO_> G68 X0 Y0 R90
[04:29:07] <EO_> 1 liner!
[04:30:18] <cradek> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.6/html/gcode.html
[04:30:24] <cradek> search for rotation
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[05:00:48] <EO_> bah
[05:00:52] <EO_> linuxcnc doesn't support G68
[05:01:45] <EO_> G10 L2 P1 R90 should be supported tho
[05:02:44] <EO_> and indeed that worked like a charm
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[05:16:06] <fluffybitchx> bbl, sleep
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[05:38:48] <EO_> eo@cnc:~$ cat rotate_ngc.sh
[05:38:48] <EO_> sed -i '1s/^/G10 L2 P1 R90\n/' *.ngc
[05:38:48] <EO_> eo@cnc:~$
[05:38:55] <PetefromTn_> ?
[05:38:56] <EO_> #JustHackyThings
[05:39:13] <EO_> rotates by 90 degrees any .ngc files you have in the directory you run it from
[05:43:32] <EO_> ok, deep breath
[05:43:39] <EO_> first time drilling @ 50kRPM
[05:43:44] <EO_> and going @ 10in/min
[05:43:53] * EO_ hopes this is acceptable to the drilling gods
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[05:46:33] <anarchos> 50krpm??
[05:46:34] <anarchos> wow
[05:46:46] <anarchos> engraving?
[05:47:27] <EO_> 52k actually. 50k had a resonance with this drill bit
[05:47:38] <EO_> no, not engraving. drilling! :)
[05:47:59] <anarchos> crazy
[05:48:17] <EO_> yeah, that was FAST
[05:48:17] <anarchos> i'm still waiting on my tachometer to show up from china, but I think i'll be lucky if i break 4k :P
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[05:48:27] <anarchos> what kind of machine do you have?
[05:48:33] <EO_> this spindle I installed recently goes up to 60kRPM
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[05:50:13] <EO_> awww
[05:50:20] <EO_> drill change height was programmed too low
[05:50:25] <EO_> damn this won't clear!
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[05:54:48] <PetefromTn_> what is the material... 50k rpm at 10 IPM sounds like burn city to me but I have no idea what you are doing.
[05:55:22] <toastydeath> that sounds like a jig grinder rather than a milling machine
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[05:59:10] <EO_> yeah, I'm not sure if the feed per tooth is right :/
[05:59:14] <EO_> it's 63mil FR4
[05:59:18] <EO_> double sided 1oz copper
[05:59:29] <EO_> and the drills were 25mil and 30mil
[06:01:06] <EO_> it did produce good looking swarf though
[06:01:18] <Rab> That's the type of feed and speed you want for drilling FR4.
[06:03:17] <EO_> I should really calculator this
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[06:11:43] <EO_> hmmm 10mil @ 52k is only 136SFM
[06:12:05] <LeelooMinai> tiny radius, tine sfm I guess
[06:12:11] <LeelooMinai> tiny*
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[06:14:27] <LeelooMinai> EO_: You need 1 Mega RPM:)
[06:14:52] <zeeshan|2> yea baby
[06:14:53] <zeeshan|2> makin chips
[06:16:20] <EO_> .0004615384 <-- feed per tooth @ 52kRPM, in inches
[06:16:29] <EO_> errr 1/2 that
[06:16:37] <EO_> that's feed per rotation. 2-flute end mill
[06:17:11] <EO_> which seems to be in line with sanity
[06:17:46] <EO_> LeelooMinai: sadly 1 mega would be really expensive. 120k is the best I've found.
[06:18:02] <EO_> but that starts getting into exotic air motors with air bearings
[06:18:17] <EO_> too much of a hassle
[06:18:47] <LeelooMinai> I wonder what speed are those brushless motors they use in quadcopters:)
[06:19:54] <LeelooMinai> Hmm, they can do 20k it seems - this could actually work for pcb drilling, kind of maybe
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[06:22:12] <LeelooMinai> Some can do 40k even
[06:23:12] <XXCoder> ah lost 5.7 million men
[06:23:34] <XXCoder> even so, they had resistance
[06:23:38] <LeelooMinai> EO_: btw, why do you want to drill pcbs? It's so cheap to order them from fabs now
[06:23:56] <XXCoder> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_I_casualties#Casualties_by_1914_borders
[06:25:21] <EO_> LeelooMinai: cuz I value quick-turn
[06:26:06] <EO_> LeelooMinai: it's for fast turn-around prototyping. really good when you're doing RF PCBs and you're battling parasitics. Or if you just suck in general and need to do things 10x over.
[06:26:50] <LeelooMinai> You need holes for RF? :)
[06:28:18] <LeelooMinai> I would think most components will be SMD
[06:28:35] <LeelooMinai> So just some isolation routing and prototype done?
[06:29:01] <LeelooMinai> Unless you make vias somehow
[06:29:04] <EO_> yeah, but you often needs lots of stitching to the ground plane underneath
[06:29:18] <EO_> this particular PCB tonight isn't RF though
[06:29:24] <LeelooMinai> But how do you do vias?
[06:29:36] <EO_> for non-rf you can just wire them
[06:29:38] <EO_> for RF you can plate them
[06:29:46] <EO_> there's videos out there
[06:29:57] <EO_> LPKF has a pretty easy system
[06:29:59] <LeelooMinai> Right, plate - a bit of pita at home.
[06:30:13] <LeelooMinai> all those chemicals and stuff:)
[06:30:23] <EO_> Doing anything but watching TV is a PITA at home.
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[06:31:14] <LeelooMinai> There are all sorts of degrees of pita though:) Dealing with lots of chemicals is just not fun imho - but I guess some people are into that, not sure:)
[06:31:23] <PetefromTn_> I make parts WHILE watching TV LOL
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[06:33:50] <EO_> hmmm well that didn't work :(
[06:34:11] <LeelooMinai> Bye bye drill bit? :)
[06:34:43] <EO_> no, bye bye traces
[06:34:48] <EO_> 1/2 the traces are missing
[06:34:56] <EO_> I think I set it to cut too deep
[06:35:15] <LeelooMinai> If only 1/2 maybe it's not level too
[06:35:29] <LeelooMinai> DO you have some negative air pressure to level the pcb?
[06:39:48] <EO_> no it's being held in a vise
[06:39:52] <EO_> so there's 2 problems
[06:39:58] <EO_> 1) I think it was too deep
[06:40:19] <EO_> 2) pcb2gcode spat out really sloppy g-code. it doesn't follow the contours of these fine features precisely at all
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[06:43:37] <EO_> oh, no it didn't!
[06:43:45] <EO_> I bet the motion controller in linuxcnc caused these errors
[06:43:46] -!- MacGalempsy has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
[06:44:01] <EO_> cuz my acceleration was too low for the speed I was running
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[06:47:07] <EO_> also, a piece of copper has wrapped itself around the endmill
[06:47:17] <EO_> that probably cleared more copper than it should have
[06:47:19] <tjtr33> this small spindle is fast, an outrunner, https://s3.amazonaws.com/ksr/assets/002/602/614/c7529d6f7fe1f198a3ef288f73cc3755_large.gif?1411026484
[06:47:33] <tjtr33> was part of a kickstarter
[06:47:49] <EO_> that looks menacing
[06:48:15] <tjtr33> heh 'exterminate'
[06:48:25] <EO_> sentry guns
[06:48:38] <EO_> PS: OpenSCAM is awesome @ visualizing g-code paths
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[07:12:44] <Loetmichel> EO_: i use target 3001 to generate my isolation mill paths
[07:13:10] <Loetmichel> works well so far: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14504
[07:13:18] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14507
[07:13:49] <Loetmichel> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jMXxjT4nNxg
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[07:16:07] <PetefromTn_> Nice Loetmichel
[07:18:16] <EO_> k why is LinuxCNC doing this: http://bartk.us/dump/Screenshot-5.png
[07:18:29] <EO_> it has a nice clear white path defined, but it instead takes the red path which is gross
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[07:19:06] <Loetmichel> insert a G64P0.05 in the code header
[07:19:11] <Loetmichel> and try again
[07:19:32] <Loetmichel> (or similar if using inch)
[07:20:10] <Loetmichel> you are using constant velocity i would think, not exact stop
[07:21:46] <EO_> ah, G61
[07:21:47] <EO_> I see
[07:22:10] <EO_> G64 P0.00500 ( set maximum deviation from commanded toolpath )
[07:22:13] <EO_> I had this
[07:22:13] <Loetmichel> G64 is exact stop mode, while the p0.05 allows for 0.05mm deviation for acceleration (makes the movements smoooter)
[07:22:15] <EO_> that's 5mil!
[07:22:22] <EO_> which is a huge deviation when you're milling 10 mil traces
[07:22:23] <EO_> heh
[07:22:49] <Loetmichel> i am using mm
[07:23:09] <EO_> 1mil = 0.025mm
[07:23:23] <EO_> a reasonable deviation value
[07:24:04] <Loetmichel> <. has to run to the compayny now, already 20 minutes late and not even sitting in the car....
[07:24:35] <EO_> yay irc! :)
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[07:26:11] <renesis> lowering productivity since 1990
[07:26:56] <EO_> this G64 crap totally wiped out my other traces I bet. chewing 5mil off a 10mil trace.
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[07:40:38] <MacGalempsy> I try to start taking it easy on teusdays, so the rest of the week isnt so stressful
[07:42:08] <PetefromTn_> why wait til tuesday?
[07:42:58] <Loetmichel> soo, arrived at the company. yay vnc! ;-)
[07:43:24] <EO_> double
[07:43:24] <EO_> NGC_Exporter::get_tolerance( void )
[07:43:25] <EO_> {
[07:43:25] <EO_> return 5.0/this->board->get_dpi();
[07:43:25] <EO_> }
[07:43:33] <EO_> ^^^ hardcoded G64 into pcb2gcode
[07:44:03] <Loetmichel> and tested yet?
[07:44:13] <EO_> yeah, the improve G64 did the trick
[07:44:32] <EO_> but it turns out the vise method still has Z problems.
[07:45:13] * Loetmichel uses target, which has its own builtin gcode exporter... and a nicer interface than eagle ;-)
[07:46:19] <Loetmichel> <- is firing up the mill to do some Noteboock psu Enclosures
[07:46:24] <Loetmichel> notebook
[07:46:58] <Loetmichel> like these: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14778
[07:47:05] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14595
[07:48:15] <Loetmichel> these are paid their weight in gold because about 3h milling time per enclosure for the cooling ribs made of 4mm sheet aluminium
[07:48:29] <Loetmichel> :-)
[07:48:58] <Loetmichel> but since we do small militars computers runs we are good, the other companys charge the same insane amounts ;-)
[07:53:14] <PetefromTn_> WOOHOO I finally found my lost parallel
[07:53:25] <PetefromTn_> Been looking for the damn thing for months now heh
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[07:58:09] <Deejay> moin
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[08:00:56] <PetefromTn_> Good morning deejay
[08:01:10] <Deejay> hi PetefromTn_ \o/
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[08:07:22] <PetefromTn_> :D
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[08:16:00] <PetefromTn_> Gn8 all
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[08:20:36] <EO_> I think I need to design a vacuum table
[08:20:41] <EO_> cuz this double sided tape stuff is butt
[08:21:30] <EO_> something with a loosely attached spoilboard I can re-level and replace regularly
[08:22:53] <Loetmichel> e0: thats easy
[08:23:19] <EO_> yeah, it sounds not too bad
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[08:24:01] <Loetmichel> bit of spae wood...
[08:24:03] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=4035
[08:24:12] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=4038
[08:24:12] micges_ is now known as micges
[08:24:14] <EO_> yeah, perfect
[08:24:17] <Loetmichel> ... done ;-9
[08:24:21] <Loetmichel> spare
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[08:25:02] <Loetmichel> or do it bigger in PVC:
[08:25:14] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14676
[08:25:26] <EO_> sexy
[08:25:34] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14682
[08:25:34] <EO_> I'll just make a small one for now
[08:25:40] <EO_> I have some spare 2x6 lumber :)
[08:25:42] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14685
[08:25:58] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14688
[08:26:02] <Loetmichel> :-9
[08:26:12] <Loetmichel> :-)
[08:26:27] <EO_> haha nice junction @ the bottom!
[08:26:49] <Loetmichel> ?
[08:27:01] <EO_> all the PVC lines taped into the vacuum hose
[08:28:22] * EO_ wonders if round columns would offer any benefit over square columns
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[08:33:42] <Loetmichel> ah
[08:34:21] <Loetmichel> they are lust taped together, sealed with loads of hot melt glue and then plugged into the hose ;-)
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[08:40:25] <EO_> 7" x 12" (17.78cm x 30.48cm) sounds like a good vacuum table for small PCBs
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[08:54:19] <Jymmm> You guys have any idea on how I could turn a 6"ft bamboo pole into 3x 2ft sections? I thought like a pool cue threaded insert, but I need to maintain strength of the pole nad hot have t spit out where each insert is expoied in
[08:54:30] <Jymmm> six foot
[08:54:46] <Jymmm> exposed*
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[09:20:54] <EO_> http://i.imgur.com/9e3eGNs.png
[09:20:55] <EO_> BAM
[09:20:57] <EO_> vacuum table!
[09:22:10] <FrozenCow> does anyone know whether it is possible to put a trigger on a component-pin instead of needing to poll it once every x seconds? (when creating a user-space component in python)
[09:27:40] <Loetmichel> Jymmm: use some glass rovings on the outside of the insert
[09:27:47] <Loetmichel> around the bamboo
[09:27:51] <Loetmichel> so it cant split
[09:28:15] <Loetmichel> will be nearly invisible if you are careful with the amount of epoxy
[09:29:02] <Loetmichel> e0: dont forget some plywood as the top plate!
[09:29:09] <Loetmichel> EO_
[09:29:19] <Jymmm> glass rovings ?
[09:29:58] <EO_> Loetmichel: yeah, those are separate pieces. still gotta figure out the vacuum entry port
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[09:31:14] <Loetmichel> use some small pvc tubes and join them like i did
[09:31:19] <Loetmichel> its the easiest way
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[09:31:23] <Jymmm> oh it's like FG strings
[09:31:27] <Jymmm> FG
[09:31:31] <Loetmichel> Jymmm: yes
[09:31:50] <Jymmm> pvc tubes for what now?
[09:32:01] <Loetmichel> that was for e0
[09:32:07] <Jymmm> oh heh
[09:32:11] <EO_> Loetmichel: nah I think I'd rather do a single hose inlet. Just had the wife buy me a $20 vacuum from walmat. It has a 1.5" hose. might work.
[09:32:42] <Loetmichel> EO_: as my CNC only has 80mm z movement i would frown on that
[09:32:55] <EO_> PCBs don't need Z!
[09:32:55] <EO_> heh
[09:33:35] <Loetmichel> my vacuum table is there all the time
[09:34:06] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=15256&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
[09:34:13] <Loetmichel> even when i do work with a vice
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[09:34:35] <EO_> how do you keep that vise down?
[09:35:17] <Loetmichel> CA gluie ;-)
[09:35:20] <Loetmichel> -i
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[09:36:03] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=15259&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
[09:39:55] <EO_> hmm stock is 1.5" tall, air hose is 1.25" OD...gettin tight in here
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[09:44:41] <EO_> I suppose just a hole saw in the side of that prior to drilling ought to do the trick
[09:44:50] <EO_> s/drilling/milling/
[09:50:44] <EO_> drat, that'll crash into the spoilboard
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[10:16:26] <EO_> http://i.imgur.com/M5nNEWp.png <-- BAM! 1.25" inlet port!
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[10:26:16] <Loetmichel> EO_: as i said: use smaller hoses adn join them
[10:26:27] <Loetmichel> it also distributes the cvacuum better
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[10:31:15] <EO_> too complicated
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[13:28:57] <zeeshan|2> zz
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[13:34:56] <jdh> sure
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[14:36:49] <GMendez> Hi, is 0.05 mm for FERROR acceptable ? I'm using a MESA
[14:37:19] <JT-Shop> is that acceptable to you?
[14:40:05] <archivist> it is a small amount but a barn door to an electron, we do not know your machine or needs
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[14:40:34] <ssi> lol
[14:41:42] <archivist> ssi see derivation of the unit called barn
[14:42:08] <ssi> A barn is defined as 10−28 m2 (100 fm2) and is approximately the cross sectional area of a uranium nucleus
[14:42:41] <_methods> but what about the door
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[14:43:27] <pcw_home> GMendez: are you talking about ferror limits or magnitude of actual actual following errors
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[14:43:32] <Jymmm> Bamboo rod thread wrapper, I kinda like it (other than the squeel) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eCQUQIfnNqM
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[14:45:04] <Jymmm> I'm just not sure what defines the tightness of the wraps, the weight?
[14:46:58] <Jymmm> or the rod's feedrate
[14:47:40] <_methods> steps/mm lol
[14:54:58] <ssi> I've thought about adapting my g0602 to be a coil winder
[14:55:15] <GMendez> pcw_home: ferror limits software. Stepper motor. NEma 23. 1/128microsteps. belt driving
[14:55:48] <GMendez> looks acceptable for me but wanted a different view. 440*440*440mm working size
[14:56:27] <pcw_home> that should be fine (it depends on latency and how the stepgens are used)
[14:58:17] <pcw_home> that is, jitter in the servo thread will show up as ferrors so you may need to widen the limist if you have substantial jitter
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[15:06:20] <GMendez> okay
[15:06:22] <GMendez> thanks :)
[15:06:36] <GMendez> no latency trouble, mesa generation
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[15:08:44] <pcw_home> Servo thread latency can still be an issue
[15:10:30] <pcw_home> since the step generation runs in a a feedback loop where every
[15:10:32] <pcw_home> servo thread the current stepgen position is sampled at the servo thread time
[15:10:33] <pcw_home> and corrections are made
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[15:46:50] <fluffybitchx> the dead battery is the one I thought it was... bleh. will need to try tracking down some batteries today.
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[15:52:27] <ssi> I bought a little spartan6 dev board from a company called Scarab
[15:52:45] <ssi> mostly because it has USB jtag and they have an open source IDE to program it, arduino style
[15:52:59] <ssi> come to find out that their IDE still relies on the xilinx ise tools being installed
[15:53:03] <ssi> D:
[15:53:08] <ssi> I'll never get free from ISE :(
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[16:00:16] <_methods> is ise that bad
[16:00:32] <ssi> it's not good
[16:00:36] <ssi> and it doesn't run on my platform
[16:00:38] <ssi> so it's a huge hassle for me
[16:00:41] <_methods> ahh
[16:01:41] <_methods> http://www.cnet.com/news/bitcoin-trader-mycoin-shutters-taking-387m-in-investor-funds/
[16:01:48] <_methods> oops sorry
[16:01:49] <_methods> wrong room
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[16:21:21] <_methods> http://shop.actonglobal.com/collections/rocketskates/products/rocketskates-r10
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[17:29:53] <s1dev> will a 14.5PA gear mesh with a 20PA gear? I have to get a gear today and I can't find a gear locally that's 20PA
[17:30:11] <archivist> not well at all
[17:30:15] <s1dev> as I understand it, there will be more noise and wear, but will it physically work
[17:31:01] <archivist> it may jamb, certainly will be lumpy, depends on clearancees
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[17:37:00] <archivist> and are you comparing like with like, 14.5 are often DP designed, and metric gears are 20deg
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[17:37:57] <archivist> measure OD and count teeth
[17:41:55] <archivist> temporary repair of one or two teeth is probably just as easy
[17:49:14] <archivist> s1dev, other trick, make a flycutter to match old gear, cut new one, will be good enough for a while
[17:49:58] <s1dev> unfortunately, I'm dealing with being out of time with no access to any significant amount of machinery
[17:51:07] <archivist> what damage to the gear as inserting a tooth a filing it up is a hand job
[17:52:37] <archivist> there are stockists if you can measure up properly
[17:53:47] <archivist> and there are people who can make at short notice if you ask and give enough detail
[17:58:18] <s1dev> thanks, I think I found a gear locally
[17:58:55] <archivist> where is local anyway
[17:59:55] <s1dev> Dallas
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[18:01:00] <archivist> I am in the uk and make gears :)
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[18:01:40] * s1dev really wants to get some gear cutters :(
[18:02:08] <archivist> a full set is....impossible
[18:16:14] <marmite> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B9gJpEJCcAI85qs.jpg v2
[18:16:47] * SpeedEvil imagines the appropriate scene from the Matrix.
[18:16:58] <SpeedEvil> With the racks of gear-cutters sliding in.
[18:16:58] <Connor> marmite: what is that ?
[18:17:10] <marmite> vacuum pump
[18:17:20] <marmite> with 2 12v pumps and a chamber
[18:17:31] <marmite> outlet for vacuum and a onoff switch
[18:17:34] <Connor> what sort of pumps are those ?
[18:18:00] <marmite> those are vacuum pumps from a volvo v70 for the cruise controll
[18:18:13] <Connor> rofl
[18:18:17] <marmite> :D
[18:18:22] <marmite> they work really good
[18:18:36] <Connor> how loud are they?
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[18:18:51] <marmite> not so mutch
[18:18:58] <marmite> my router sounds more:P
[18:19:56] <marmite> i have the board hanging on the wall next to my mill
[18:22:30] <_methods> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0073HI94M/ref=as_li_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=B0073HI94M&linkCode=as2&tag=hothard-20
[18:22:34] <_methods> only one left
[18:22:39] <_methods> better buy it now lol
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[18:24:30] <marmite> love teh review
[18:24:49] <marmite> It started as a soft, perfect note. A pureness beyond the normal comprehension. Only true sound engineers and audiophiles can have any hope to sense how great the fullness and exactness of that note is.
[18:24:54] <marmite> Ever since then, unicorns have been springing, fully formed, from my butt. No joke! And better, each unicorn has the same, perfect, innocent clarity that that first note did.
[18:25:57] <_methods> hahah
[18:26:01] <_methods> the reviews are awesome
[18:26:04] <marmite> :D
[18:29:14] <archivist> someone linked to a more expensive version of that junk the other day
[18:32:57] <_methods> the $10k one?
[18:33:41] <archivist> something like that price 9k?
[18:33:48] <_methods> yeah lol
[18:33:51] <_methods> insanity
[18:34:40] <renesis> mogami w/ neutrik ends ftmfw
[18:35:41] <_methods> audiophiles..........
[18:35:44] <renesis> ?
[18:36:02] <renesis> audiophile is a deragatory term, i work in audio gear R&D
[18:36:13] <_methods> yes it has become derogatory
[18:36:18] <_methods> unfortunately
[18:36:22] <renesis> my whole life
[18:36:37] <renesis> mogami is reasonably priced and awesome, and if youre not in neutrik is have little respect for your opinions
[18:36:55] <renesis> *"into neutrik, i"
[18:37:30] <renesis> also SOOW 12/2 makes the best speaker cable ever
[18:37:50] <renesis> fuck that clear plastic, quick-oxidizing copper bullshit
[18:39:28] <_methods> those neutrik connectors are nice
[18:39:54] <renesis> xlr or speakon? (answer in both cases is yes)
[18:40:06] <_methods> i'm looking at their industrial connectors
[18:40:14] <_methods> i just use cheap chinese shit for stereo stuff
[18:40:15] <renesis> but yeah, i cant stand switchcraft/canon style XLR
[18:40:18] <_methods> i could care less
[18:40:30] <renesis> their industrial stuff is neat
[18:40:35] <_methods> yeah
[18:40:39] <_methods> the nanocon connectors
[18:40:50] <renesis> they have a panel usb i kind of like except that its an adapter on both sides, no pinout
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[18:41:31] <renesis> anyway bbl
[18:41:45] <renesis> (neutrik ftw!!1)
[18:41:50] <_methods> hehe
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[18:48:45] <zeeshan1> hi guus, what size varistor would be sufficient for a brake solenod tgat cobsumes 1a at 24vdc
[18:49:14] <zeeshan1> sorry for typos, i am on mobile :)
[18:52:08] <marmite> hmm about 1 inch
[18:52:22] <marmite> :P
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[18:53:35] <zeeshan1> lol
[18:53:54] <pcw_home> approximately this:
[18:53:56] <pcw_home> http://www.digikey.com/product-search/en?pv604=231&FV=fff4000a%2Cfff8003f%2Cfffc000a%2C8b40025&k=varistor&mnonly=0&newproducts=0&ColumnSort=0&page=1&quantity=0&ptm=0&fid=0&pageSize=25
[18:55:39] <SpeedEvil> I'd use a snubber.
[18:56:05] <SpeedEvil> Something like 10uF (film) and 24 ohm resistor in parallel
[18:56:09] <SpeedEvil> err
[18:56:11] <SpeedEvil> series
[18:56:14] <SpeedEvil> 22 ohm
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[18:56:53] <pcw_home> hard to size a snubber without knowing the coil inductance
[18:58:09] <SpeedEvil> It can't be more than a few millihenries
[18:58:12] <SpeedEvil> err
[18:58:18] <SpeedEvil> actually - i'm thinking relays
[18:58:30] <pcw_home> no way could easily be 1 henry
[18:58:33] <zeeshan1> also the solenoid sees current in both directions
[18:58:45] <zeeshan1> id need a non polarized cap
[18:58:54] <SpeedEvil> yes - i said film.
[18:59:15] <zeeshan1> oh
[18:59:48] <zeeshan1> these guys have a 36 vrms 22mm mov, but has no other specs than that
[19:00:04] <pcw_home> That should be fine
[19:01:15] <zeeshan1> next size up is 63vrms 16mm
[19:01:18] <zeeshan1> i guyess physical size is proportional to energy absorbed capacity?
[19:01:26] <pcw_home> Yes
[19:01:58] <pcw_home> but 63V VRMS is 100 V which is too high
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[19:02:39] <zeeshan1> ok ill grab the 36vrms one
[19:02:43] <pcw_home> ( well it would be a big improvement on no MOV/snubber )
[19:03:03] <pcw_home> yes thats ~ 50VDC
[19:03:38] <zeeshan1> next size down is 18vrms 21 mm
[19:04:12] <pcw_home> I would say that was too low
[19:04:22] <zeeshan1> kinda on the edge at 25vdc
[19:04:29] <zeeshan1> ok thank you!
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[19:04:53] <zeeshan1> be back soon
[19:04:55] <pcw_home> yeah too low ( they are _not_ precise devices )
[19:06:16] <zeeshan1> actually before i go, to convert to pull up on the encoder signal at 7i77, 1/4watt resistor is ok?
[19:06:32] <zeeshan1> 2000 ohm
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[19:11:29] <zeeshan1> whoops, 200 ohm
[19:12:18] <Tom_itx> i haven't done alot with varistors.. if it's 50v does it clamp at 50v?
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[19:12:46] <pcw_home> Probably about 65V or so
[19:13:14] <Tom_itx> wouldn't be such a good thing for a 5v supply... better off with a zenner?
[19:13:53] <pcw_home> Yes MOVs are not suitable for low voltages
[19:13:59] <Tom_itx> zenner-resistor with the gate of a triac tied between or something
[19:14:16] <pcw_home> Yeah TVRs or crowbars are better
[19:14:34] <zeeshan1> lagg
[19:16:00] <Tom_itx> are mov's more for transient spikes on the supply?
[19:16:42] <pcw_home> Yes (at higher voltages)
[19:18:18] <pcw_home> also inherently bipolar and cheap
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[19:21:37] <Tom_itx> pcw_home thanks for the 'abs' suggestion. I got the delay working nicely after that: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/temp/logic1.jpg
[19:21:54] <Tom_itx> although i'm not sure how much i need yet
[19:22:48] <Tom_itx> the inhibit circuit gets about a 50ms pulse
[19:23:34] <pcw_home> probably even 25 ms will not make any noticeable performance difference
[19:23:58] <Tom_itx> i just need to make sure the relays flip long enough to make contact
[19:24:04] <pcw_home> (reversals on rigid tapping would be the test)
[19:24:08] <Tom_itx> yeah
[19:24:54] <Tom_itx> i'd use a small mosfet or something but the whole drive rides above GND by 60 some volts
[19:26:37] <pcw_home> yeah (shows how old I am, reminds me of hot chassis series 5 tube radios)
[19:26:43] <Tom_itx> heh
[19:27:05] <Tom_itx> i'll check and see if the isolation board i'm getting for it has a spare io on it, i'm not sure it does
[19:27:53] <pcw_home> an OPTO on a project board would do also
[19:28:18] <Tom_itx> i got some of those cheapo relay boards for arduino coming
[19:28:27] <Tom_itx> i'm gettin lazy the older i get
[19:28:56] <Tom_itx> i swore i had some little relays but the only thing i could find were some omron latching relays
[19:29:11] <Tom_itx> i know i have some hamlin HE101 around here somewhere
[19:29:16] <ssi> Tom_itx: I use those in a stereo attenuator I built
[19:29:25] <Tom_itx> which?
[19:29:32] <ssi> the omron latching relays
[19:29:36] <Tom_itx> ahh
[19:29:58] <Tom_itx> somebody traded me something for a dozen of em several years back
[19:29:59] <ssi> miniature latching DPDT relay
[19:30:00] <ssi> Omron G6JU-2P-Y-DC4.5
[19:30:02] <ssi> those specifically
[19:30:13] <ssi> there's sixteen of them in one attenuator
[19:30:22] <ssi> er no I guess there's 8
[19:30:24] <Tom_itx> G5AK 237P
[19:30:25] <ssi> cause they're DP
[19:30:30] <Tom_itx> if you ever need one...
[19:30:34] <ssi> lol k :)
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[19:31:12] <Tom_itx> i don't think they have protection diodes on them where the hamlin one did
[19:31:32] <ssi> http://www.amb.org/audio/
[19:31:36] <ssi> that guy's stuff is pretty fun
[19:31:51] <Tom_itx> i was gonna fiddle with one to see if i could wire half of the DPDT to trigger the 2nd 'reset' coil so i could get just a short pulse from it
[19:32:04] <ssi> oh that'd be neat
[19:32:05] <Tom_itx> i bet it would work
[19:32:09] <ssi> like a mechanical one-shot
[19:32:09] <ssi> heh
[19:32:19] <Tom_itx> it would burn up if left on but all i need is a pulse
[19:32:42] <Tom_itx> and they're DIP size so pretty tiny
[19:33:24] <Tom_itx> i'd still need a couple diodes across them
[19:33:52] <Tom_itx> i wonder if signal diodes would be big enough
[19:34:19] <PetefromTn_> heh maybe I should have reconsidered champfering these things in the machine LOL
[19:36:38] <Rab> Tom_itx, I was browsing around your website and noticed the pulley upgrade project. What's the highest speed you've run with that configuration?
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[19:39:21] <_methods> hahah always chamfer in the machine
[19:39:27] <_methods> it's worth the extra programming time
[19:40:41] <PetefromTn_> yeah well this part really would be still needing to be done on the second side by hand if you wanted any real accuracy of the cut...at least not without further fixturing and whatnot and there is not enough money in them to justify. So I just gotta sit here and suffer LOL...
[19:40:53] <PetefromTn_> BRB
[19:41:21] <_methods> trim router?
[19:41:30] <_methods> with guide bushing?
[19:41:36] <_methods> s/bushing/bearing
[19:41:46] <PetefromTn_> hm that is not a bad idea
[19:41:59] <_methods> too late now though you're probably already 3/4 done hehe
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[19:44:03] <Tom_itx> Rab i think it will go up to about 5000 rpm
[19:44:37] <Tom_itx> i generally run it around 3k
[19:45:20] <Tom_itx> i haven't really used it since i changed belts over from the vbelts, just enough to see what rpm i was getting
[19:45:39] <Rab> Tom_itx, thanks. Planning a belt-drive spindle with either GT or MXL belts, but I'd like to do 10K or even higher and I'm not sure about safe range with toothed belts.
[19:47:13] <Rab> Round belts might be better for high speed low torque, but I have a bunch of toothed pulleys and belts on hand.
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[19:53:13] <Tom_itx> these were GT2 9mm wide
[19:53:24] <Tom_itx> plenty big for this thing i'm sure
[19:54:01] <Tom_itx> you could probably find a data sheet for that i bet
[19:54:31] <PetefromTn_> _methods thanks for that idea man I never considered it.
[19:54:39] <Tom_itx> i got stock 1/4" bore and made them fit myself
[19:54:46] <PetefromTn_> I have done that TONS of times with wood working stuff not sure why I did not
[19:55:29] <Tom_itx> Rab, mine figured out to be around 1.2:1 iirc
[19:56:48] <Rab> "For GT2 belts, the maximum permitted speed is 7500 feet per minute (38 m/s)."
[19:56:49] <Tom_itx> i could look it up but yours will be different anyway
[19:57:04] <Rab> Tom_itx, most likely.
[19:57:34] <Tom_itx> what mill / spindle?
[19:57:52] <Tom_itx> better make sure the bearings are up for it too
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[19:58:59] <Tom_itx> i figured mine would be ok since they make a high speed kit for it and doesn't include changing any bearings
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[20:00:02] <Rab> Homemade spindle with 3x alleged "ABEC 7" bearings: http://reboots.g-cipher.net/ghettocnc/8mmspindle.jpg
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[20:00:26] <Rab> Micro tooling, 1/8" 2-flute end mills and smaller.
[20:00:36] <Tom_itx> nice
[20:00:52] <Tom_itx> those get expensive
[20:01:17] <Rab> They do. I have a pretty good stock from eBay.
[20:01:48] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/etching/mills1.jpg
[20:02:00] <Tom_itx> those were about 20 bux ea locally
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[20:02:11] <Tom_itx> the small one is 1/8" shank all carbide
[20:02:49] <Rab> You get what you pay for. I have some official LPKF micro tooling and it's really nice. Also no-name chinese which is rather poor.
[20:03:18] * LeelooMinai got two endmills from China today in the package too 6mm carbide ones - they look pretty good
[20:03:47] <LeelooMinai> Looked at them under a microscope:)
[20:04:33] <LeelooMinai> I hope to use them to mill aluminum
[20:05:18] <Rab> I have a bunch of conical carbide cutters which are terrible. I don't know how they screw up a conical cutter.
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[20:06:00] <Rab> LeelooMinai, coolant/lube will probably help a lot.
[20:09:15] <Rab> If the 7500 ft/m figure is correct, assuming a 1.5" drive pulley, the safe maximum would be 19,000rpm...that's pretty good.
[20:10:02] <LeelooMinai> It's one of those spindles that need a motor to the side, right? Like that, what's the name, Tiag, Tieg, forgot:)
[20:10:17] <Rab> Taig, and yep!
[20:11:03] <LeelooMinai> I have small 800watt Chinese one, ER11: https://www.flickr.com/photos/100017731@N03/16272619078/
[20:11:14] <LeelooMinai> Kind of small collet, but it's for hobby only
[20:11:48] <LeelooMinai> So I am limited up to 7mm diameter endmills
[20:11:58] <Rab> Yeah, mine has ER11 too.
[20:12:40] <Rab> I looked at ordering one of those 800W spindles, but got spooked by horror stories. Seems like a $300+ gamble.
[20:12:42] <LeelooMinai> I would get bigger ones with ER16 at least, but I cannot get enough power for them from normal 110V socket in my room.
[20:13:03] <Rab> Are you using chinese VFD too?
[20:13:28] <LeelooMinai> I don't have VFD yet, but the spindle looks ok - rolls nicely and supposedly has 4 bearings inside, air cooled
[20:13:39] <LeelooMinai> I plan to buy VFD from automationdirect
[20:14:10] <JT-Shop> the GS2 can be controlled via modbus with LinuxCNC
[20:14:17] <LeelooMinai> It's more expensive but has modbus and nice documentation, etc. so I figured it's worth extra money over CHinese ones. It's still only $186 I think
[20:14:24] <JT-Shop> don't forget the serial cable and the braking resistor
[20:14:53] <LeelooMinai> RIght, that's the one I plan on buying. I bought cheap resistors from ebay as the automation direct ones are kind of expensive
[20:15:28] <LeelooMinai> Drives have ok price, but accessories seem to be costly:)
[20:17:03] <LeelooMinai> Rab: That 800watt spindle was not $300+ - they are under $200 if you search a bit
[20:17:12] <jdh> it is chinese
[20:17:33] <LeelooMinai> Right, they are not that expensive
[20:19:36] <jdh> the vfd feom keling will be the same chines vfd
[20:19:38] <Rab> LeelooMinai, that's for a spindle+VFD package. I haven't searched for solo spindles.
[20:21:57] <jdh> why would you buy them separate?
[20:23:47] <LeelooMinai> jdh: In my case I wanted to pay some extra for GS2 - as I wrote, it seems to have nicer features and good documentation.
[20:23:58] <jdh> my 1.5kw spindle runs off a 15amp circuit along with the steppers, computer, monitor, vacuum cleaner.
[20:24:30] <LeelooMinai> jdh: Normal 110V socket?
[20:25:00] <LeelooMinai> The VFDs that run from 110V can handle 750watt spindles max
[20:25:06] <zeeshan|2> man i hate going to that electronics store
[20:25:13] <zeeshan|2> everytime i get out of there, i spend 3x what i was supposed to
[20:25:13] <ssi> which
[20:25:18] <zeeshan|2> a local place
[20:25:19] <zeeshan|2> lol
[20:25:21] <ssi> o
[20:25:24] <zeeshan|2> i went to go buy irfp250
[20:25:27] <zeeshan|2> and varistor
[20:25:34] <zeeshan|2> they were supposed t obe like 12 bux or something
[20:25:39] <zeeshan|2> for a few of them
[20:25:49] <zeeshan|2> ended up spending 160
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[20:25:52] <zeeshan|2> so i guess a lot more than 3x
[20:25:57] <zeeshan|2> i saw a lcr meter, esr meter
[20:26:00] <LeelooMinai> No one buys those things from "local places":)
[20:26:01] <zeeshan|2> had to have it
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[20:26:34] <zeeshan|2> LeelooMinai: i get out of my house
[20:26:35] <zeeshan|2> unlike you
[20:26:37] <Rab> Damn, dogg: http://www.digikey.ca/product-detail/en/IRFP250MPBF/IRFP250MPBF-ND/2354106
[20:26:38] <ssi> lol
[20:26:39] <zeeshan|2> stay in your bubble.
[20:26:48] <zeeshan|2> and keep trying to figure out how to run a vfd off 110
[20:27:05] <LeelooMinai> jdh: So? How do you run that 1.5kW spindle from normal socket?
[20:27:06] <zeeshan|2> rabi bought 6 of them
[20:27:13] <zeeshan|2> they were 2 bux each locally
[20:27:22] <zeeshan|2> the varistors were like 50 cents
[20:27:26] <Rab> zeeshan|2, oic, that's good.
[20:28:12] <zeeshan|2> i actually prepared this text for when someone else brings up vfds:
[20:28:28] <jdh> normal 110v 15amp wall socket
[20:28:41] <zeeshan|2> I talked to a few people regarding using single phase 240V@15A MAX [3600VA] power to generate 3 phase [240v] using an inverter. The question was, what is the maximum amount of current output you can get out on the 3phase side. Knowing that _apparent_ power must remain the same in both and also the fact that apparent power in 3 phase systems is S = sqrt(3)*V*I, you can see that I = S/[sqrt(3)*V] =
[20:28:41] <jdh> with a few cascaded power strips
[20:28:42] <LeelooMinai> jdh: With what VFD?
[20:29:02] <zeeshan|2> 3600/[sqrt(3)*240] = 8.66A. Another way to think about it is compare a 1 hp single phase vs 1hp three phase motor. Assume perfect power factor (pf=1), then you can deduce that both motors require 746VA of apparent power. In the case of a single phase motor winding current is 746/240 = 3.1A, while the three phase winding current is 746/[sqrt(3)*240] = 1.8A. In both cases power remains the same.
[20:29:08] <zeeshan|2> What's the point of this conversation? If you indeed want to run a 3 phase motor using an inverter to go between single phase to three phase, you know that for a given voltage, you need sqrt(3) times the three phase motor current. Why the sqrt(3) factor? This comes from working out the math behind the fact that there are 3 current & voltage waves in a given period for three phase instead of just s
[20:29:14] <zeeshan|2> ingle as in single phase.
[20:29:16] <zeeshan|2> flood alert :-)
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[20:29:48] <zeeshan|2> rab any updates on your massive haul?
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[20:31:30] <Connor> What are you doing with the irfp250 and stuff zeeshan|2?
[20:31:41] <zeeshan|2> connor replacing them on the power supply for the drives
[20:31:43] <zeeshan|2> from the burnt drives
[20:31:49] <zeeshan|2> theyre the only things burn on it
[20:31:51] <zeeshan|2> *burnt
[20:31:54] <LeelooMinai> jdh: All the VFDs I looked are end at 1HP if you are using 110V/15A
[20:31:54] <Jymmm> archivist: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MKikHxKeodA
[20:31:56] <Rab> zeeshan|2, been super busy. Built a breakout "cape" for the BBB with Machinekit, spent several days messing with that. I'm almost ready to give up and either find a dedicated PC or keep using FleshCut for the time being.
[20:32:04] <Connor> The drivers themselves aren't toast ?
[20:32:11] <zeeshan|2> Connor: they are
[20:32:19] <zeeshan|2> but replacement drives without the ac supply
[20:32:20] <zeeshan|2> are dirt heap
[20:32:22] <zeeshan|2> like 50 $
[20:32:26] <zeeshan|2> used
[20:32:27] <Connor> ah
[20:32:32] <fluffybitchx> he's fixing the power supplies, or at least trying to with the assumption that there's no other damage, even though he doesn't have any drives to power with them.
[20:32:34] <zeeshan|2> but with ac it shoots up to 150-200
[20:32:55] <zeeshan|2> fluffybitchx: i knew these power supplys were working
[20:33:00] <zeeshan|2> till i plugged em into a shorted driver board
[20:33:05] <zeeshan|2> that fried the mosfet instantly
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[20:33:28] <zeeshan|2> and if i dont play around with this stuff, ill never learn
[20:33:32] <zeeshan|2> so ill take a "chance"
[20:33:43] <zeeshan|2> the only thing on the power supply board i couldnt check was the ic on there
[20:33:52] <LeelooMinai> jdh: The only way I can think of would be, I don't know, somehow underpowering that spindle, but then you would not get high RPMs (that is close to 20k)
[20:33:55] <zeeshan|2> everything else checked out ok except the irfp250
[20:34:00] <jdh> leelo: it says nowforever d100s1r5b 16amp
[20:34:11] <fluffybitchx> thing is, plugging them into a short shouldn't have caused them to burn out the mosfets.
[20:34:24] <zeeshan|2> well thats what it erxactly did
[20:34:26] <jdh> I get 24k rpm unloaded
[20:34:31] <fluffybitchx> I'd expect the bridge to go first.
[20:34:36] <zeeshan|2> i had them powered up without the drives attached and they were outputting fine
[20:34:47] <zeeshan|2> the bridge is rated for 35A
[20:34:53] <zeeshan|2> it also was on a massive heatsink
[20:35:02] <zeeshan|2> in comparison to the mosfets
[20:35:12] <fluffybitchx> right, and the mosfets should have had ZERO amps going through them.
[20:35:22] <fluffybitchx> they're a shunt regulator, that only has current flow on overvoltage.
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[20:35:37] <zeeshan|2> shrug we'll see
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[20:36:37] <zeeshan|2> fluffybitchx: did you figure out why your drives are faulting?
[20:38:04] -!- shaun415 has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
[20:38:42] <fluffybitchx> no. if I set the current lower, they work.
[20:39:25] <zeeshan|2> overheating?
[20:39:34] <fluffybitchx> 2-3 seconds after power on and ice cold.
[20:39:44] <zeeshan|2> lame
[20:40:27] <fluffybitchx> my motors are reasonably low inductance, but still well over what the minimum for the drive is. I'm wondering if it isn't some little footnote the manual should have had, that you can't get the full current rating into a low-inductance motor, or something...
[20:41:07] <pcw_home> Maybe they didn't actual test that case
[20:41:42] <zeeshan|2> on my manual it says this:
[20:41:53] <zeeshan|2> If the drive is operated below the maximum rated voltage, the minimum load inductance requirement may be reduced.
[20:41:59] <fluffybitchx> the motors are 2.3mH, the drives rated for 0.5mH... so I'm not THAT close to it.
[20:42:05] <pcw_home> sort of expected since the ripple current goes up with decreasing inductance
[20:42:16] <fluffybitchx> I'm running them off 58V idle, 54V all three axis going.
[20:42:33] <pcw_home> and the overcurrent trip may be fast to protect the MOSFETs
[20:42:41] <zeeshan|2> pcw_home: i want to double check with you about wiring the encoders as pull down
[20:42:56] <zeeshan|2> i put a 200 ohm resistor in series with the signal?
[20:43:30] <zeeshan|2> fluffybitchx: be glad you have drives that dont self destruct
[20:43:31] <zeeshan|2> :-)
[20:43:37] <pcw_home> no, you connect it in parallel with the input
[20:43:38] <fluffybitchx> you rarely put resistors in series with signals.
[20:44:01] <zeeshan|2> okay so between gnd and signal
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[20:45:39] <fluffybitchx> zeeshan|2: they're centent drives, built by mariss at gecko... he seems competent...
[20:46:36] <zeeshan|2> oh its between input and vcc
[20:46:44] <zeeshan|2> whoopz
[20:46:46] <zeeshan|2> fluffybitchx: nice
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[20:48:22] <zeeshan|2> that guy dave @ eevblog
[20:48:27] <zeeshan|2> he's a pretty competent guy too
[20:48:33] <zeeshan|2> i was following his videos on diagnosing faults
[20:48:41] <tjb1> poor kid at work had a design review with 4 manufacturing engineers
[20:49:26] <zeeshan|2> lol
[20:50:29] <tjb1> got torn apart on stuff his boss should have taught him
[20:50:42] <tjb1> tapped hole depths within .050 of drill depth
[20:52:32] <_methods> lol
[20:52:41] <_methods> engineers know not to do that?
[20:52:55] <_methods> i've not seen many engineers that can actually make a real world part
[20:52:56] <fluffybitchx> blind-as-a-bat tap, instead of a usual blind tap?
[20:53:07] <_methods> real good at making imaginary parts
[20:53:10] * fluffybitchx can make parts!
[20:53:35] <zeeshan|2> _methods i hope thats somewhat changing
[20:53:48] <Tom_itx> pcw_home, should i email support to get a RMA to swap this 7I47 for the 7I47S or is that something you take care of?
[20:53:54] <_methods> not that i've seen
[20:53:59] <LeelooMinai> Yes, it's changing, now they make imaginary parts and 3D print them in ABS:)
[20:54:02] <_methods> cad has done nothing too help
[20:54:25] <_methods> it used to be you thought greatly and long before you put a drawing to print
[20:54:26] <zeeshan|2> do yuou know whats pathetic?
[20:54:32] <zeeshan|2> they spend 2 weeks teaching you gd&t
[20:54:49] <_methods> and you still don't know how to use it
[20:55:05] <zeeshan|2> you cant learn gd&t in 2 weeks
[20:55:05] <_methods> i sat in a clinic on gd&t with a company
[20:55:05] <fluffybitchx> gd&t?
[20:55:09] <_methods> it was hilarious
[20:55:16] <zeeshan|2> in college
[20:55:24] <_methods> it took the guys in there 6 hours to tolerance a block with 4 holes in it
[20:55:26] <zeeshan|2> we got 2 semesters of gd&t
[20:55:42] <_methods> funniest thing i think i've ever seen
[20:55:58] <zeeshan|2> you have clinics 6 hours long?
[20:56:01] <zeeshan|2> id be toast after that
[20:56:08] <_methods> it was week long
[20:56:10] <_methods> 8 hours
[20:56:13] <zeeshan|2> wtf
[20:56:17] <zeeshan|2> that'd own me
[20:56:39] <_methods> they flew the trainers from ford in to teach a gd&t clinic lol
[20:56:47] <zeeshan|2> lol
[20:56:48] <_methods> for a company i was doing contract work for
[20:57:12] <zeeshan|2> the worst is when EE's try to design mechanical parts
[20:57:18] <_methods> gd&t isn't really that difficult if you follow the damn rules
[20:57:28] <zeeshan|2> i have like a 60 page handbook
[20:57:36] <zeeshan|2> the ones i get confused on
[20:57:46] <fluffybitchx> I'm a jack of all trades. what does that count as?
[20:57:55] <zeeshan|2> is when you do profile geometric tolerancing
[20:58:01] <zeeshan|2> i always have to refer back to an example for that
[20:58:14] <_methods> assymetrical profile lol
[20:58:59] <_methods> gd&t really kills the old timers out on the floor though
[20:59:04] <zeeshan|2> man i cant wait to work back in industry again
[20:59:05] <_methods> you want to hear some moaning and groaning
[20:59:11] <zeeshan|2> so tired of this masters research bs
[20:59:13] <zeeshan|2> i wanan do some real work
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[20:59:38] <zeeshan|2> yea a lot of machinists dont understand it fully
[20:59:42] <zeeshan|2> nor do the engineers
[20:59:45] <zeeshan|2> so i dont blame em
[21:00:02] <zeeshan|2> the guys who really seem to understand it well are in quality control
[21:00:22] <_methods> yeah it really is better than standard dimensioning for clearing up tolerance errors
[21:00:39] <_methods> cause they deal with it all day
[21:00:39] <CaptHindsight> heh, or ME's trying to assemble electrical parts :)
[21:00:48] <zeeshan|2> CaptHindsight: exactly!
[21:00:49] <_methods> and some measurements can't even be made on the floor
[21:00:54] <zeeshan|2> look me and my circuit problems :-)
[21:00:58] <_methods> some of those profile tolerances need a cmm
[21:01:07] <zeeshan|2> but im forcing myself to lear nit, so i have more clue about it than the average ME
[21:01:25] <zeeshan|2> _methods: yes
[21:01:32] <_methods> everyone knows an EE is smarter than all the other engineers
[21:01:40] <fluffybitchx> I know a bit of EE, ME, CE, CS, BA,... umm...
[21:01:42] <zeeshan|2> haha hahahaha hahaha
[21:01:44] <zeeshan|2> hahhahaha!
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[21:02:09] <_methods> it's the last question on yoru ME exam
[21:02:18] <_methods> who's the smartest engineer
[21:02:21] <_methods> dah EE
[21:02:24] <ssi> nope
[21:02:28] <ssi> software engineer
[21:02:31] <ssi> because it's the only career that pays
[21:02:45] <_methods> i hate it when they attach engineer to the end of software
[21:03:19] <_methods> unless you're programming assembly
[21:03:32] <_methods> then feel free to attach lol
[21:03:36] <ssi> that's a pretty arbitrary distinction :P
[21:03:48] <LeelooMinai> I don't see why assembly would make the difference
[21:03:52] <CaptHindsight> a software engineer also has to be able to follow the confused minds of the developers before them, with most other engineering fields it's dictated by logic and scientific facts
[21:04:11] <_methods> logic and scientific facts
[21:04:17] <_methods> key words lol
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[21:07:11] <LeelooMinai> Enginner is someone who uses knowledge to make design something useful - that covers a lot of areas.
[21:07:35] <LeelooMinai> s/make//
[21:08:55] <CaptHindsight> social engineer
[21:09:03] <_methods> lol
[21:09:13] <_methods> custodial engineer
[21:09:39] <_methods> hmm now that i think about it maybe software engineer is fitting
[21:11:21] <zeeshan|2> to be honest there's real no good answer to the question "whos the smartest engineer"
[21:11:33] <zeeshan|2> anyone who says its a specific one is just being a tard
[21:11:37] <_methods> no it's the EE
[21:11:38] <CaptHindsight> define smart and engineer
[21:11:39] <_methods> everyone knows
[21:11:45] <LeelooMinai> Silly question. SIlly answers.
[21:11:51] <zeeshan|2> ive seen some of the shit chem eng do
[21:11:52] <_methods> you know it's not the civil engineer lol
[21:12:00] <zeeshan|2> i'd never want to do that non sense
[21:12:03] <zeeshan|2> their mixing problems are retarded
[21:12:10] <zeeshan|2> and process control
[21:12:24] <zeeshan|2> i actually took a civ eng grad course last semester
[21:12:31] <zeeshan|2> gave me a huge respect for civ eng
[21:12:37] <zeeshan|2> their mechanics might be the same
[21:12:45] <zeeshan|2> but how they apply it is quite different
[21:12:47] <CaptHindsight> zeeshan|2: it's very different from electronics and mechanical engineering
[21:12:52] <zeeshan|2> they have things like shear wall
[21:13:01] <tjb1> _methods: I am a ME
[21:13:05] <zeeshan|2> elevactor shaft buckling etc
[21:13:05] <tjb1> I think I do pretty good :P
[21:13:09] <_methods> hahah
[21:13:15] <CaptHindsight> it's filled full of secret sauces to make things work well
[21:13:17] <zeeshan|2> tjb1: high 5 me too
[21:13:17] <LeelooMinai> I am ME, myself and I too:)
[21:13:20] <_methods> i'm just stirring
[21:13:40] <tjb1> I try to drop it to .00 whenever I can
[21:13:41] <zeeshan|2> CaptHindsight: yes
[21:14:21] <zeeshan|2> i used to think it was the ppl who graduated with barely passing that made engineers look bad
[21:14:26] <fluffybitchx> the worst engineers are cost engineers
[21:14:31] <zeeshan|2> i have a friend who has a 3.95 gpa
[21:14:38] <CaptHindsight> very few CE's cross over into EE or ME, it's interesting since they tend to look at machines and controllers as magic boxes
[21:14:41] <zeeshan|2> he refuses to step into the machine shop to build his capstone project
[21:14:49] <zeeshan|2> cause he thinks machining is useless
[21:14:53] <zeeshan|2> he doesnt need to it design fluid systems
[21:14:54] <zeeshan|2> LOL
[21:15:02] <tjb1> CaptHindsight: What is a CE?
[21:15:05] <zeeshan|2> he makes his group members do the machining
[21:15:11] <_methods> civil engineer
[21:15:18] <LeelooMinai> CaptHindsight: Strangely there's a lot of people that went from CE into playing with EE and ME on irc
[21:15:21] <_methods> the dumbest of the engineers
[21:15:31] <tjb1> I'm just a CAD slut
[21:15:39] <tjb1> I don't get to do any machining :(
[21:15:49] <zeeshan|2> you wont likely
[21:15:50] <_methods> they're so dumb they still use autocad for everything
[21:15:54] <zeeshan|2> but you need a good base for it
[21:16:00] <zeeshan|2> at eaton , even though iwas making enclosures
[21:16:07] <zeeshan|2> i asked my boss if i could spend a week on the floor
[21:16:09] <CaptHindsight> tjb1: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chemical_engineering
[21:16:10] <zeeshan|2> he let me
[21:16:12] <tjb1> eaton eh, zeeshan|2 horseheads?
[21:16:28] <zeeshan|2> got to talk to the workers, see the processes
[21:16:37] <zeeshan|2> the dies they had for their punching turret pressses
[21:16:50] <zeeshan|2> the tolerances they could hold on brake press, flanging tolerance
[21:17:26] <zeeshan|2> horseheads?
[21:17:31] <tjb1> zeeshan|2: guess not
[21:17:33] <zeeshan|2> hehe
[21:17:34] <tjb1> there is an eaton here
[21:17:36] <zeeshan|2> eaton the electrical company
[21:17:40] <tjb1> horseheads/elmira/corning
[21:17:47] <_methods> eaton is a large company lol
[21:18:08] <zeeshan|2> ive worked at like 5 different places
[21:18:16] <zeeshan|2> won't name them, but two of them were also fortune 500
[21:18:22] <zeeshan|2> eaton is an amazing place to work for
[21:18:41] <zeeshan|2> i've never worked at ap lace where people are so crazy nice
[21:18:47] <LeelooMinai> I think it's the accesability/ppopularity of microcontrollerls and the infamous Arduinos that made CS people (and others) interested in EE, kind of indirectly as you need EE knowledge to built devices around them.
[21:19:46] <zeeshan|2> tjb1: do you do any stress analysis?
[21:19:57] <tjb1> zeeshan|2: Kind of
[21:20:06] <tjb1> I look at the pictures but dont really understand most of the numbers
[21:20:13] <CaptHindsight> LeelooMinai: do to the easy to use dev tools and the relative low cost of the *duinos?
[21:20:26] <zeeshan|2> tjb1: i mean not fea completely
[21:20:33] <zeeshan|2> but like say good ol bending of beams
[21:20:39] <tjb1> no
[21:20:40] <zeeshan|2> or trying to size bolts
[21:20:43] <zeeshan|2> or bolt patterns etc
[21:20:54] <tjb1> I have no training in Inventor
[21:21:10] <tjb1> unless you count that week in college of "read the packet and make this block"
[21:21:16] <zeeshan|2> LOL
[21:21:18] <CaptHindsight> do/due
[21:21:26] <LeelooMinai> CaptHindsight: It all kind of exploded at some point, so everything: low cost, lots of projects on the web, information, "hacking", robots, quadcopters, etc. - gets people interested in electronics
[21:21:29] <zeeshan|2> tjb1: ive done both technical college and university
[21:21:37] <zeeshan|2> its crazy how different they are
[21:21:43] <zeeshan|2> i had 6 semesters of CAD
[21:21:49] <tjb1> zeeshan|2: I have a bachelors in manufacturing engineering but they didnt do any Solidworks/Inventor training
[21:21:50] <zeeshan|2> univ was 2 course lol
[21:21:56] <zeeshan|2> er 1 course i mean
[21:22:04] <tjb1> I signed up for one but it got canceled because it didnt have enough people
[21:22:27] <fluffybitchx> everything
[21:22:34] <fluffybitchx> everything I know is from having to do it. heh.
[21:22:41] <CaptHindsight> LeelooMinai: I see more that they are interested in MakerStuff vs elelctronics
[21:22:44] <tjb1> I am self taught Inventor
[21:22:45] <LeelooMinai> To build, say, a quadcopter you need knowledge from CS area, electronics, some mechanical engineering needs to be done
[21:22:46] <zeeshan|2> tjb1: you can follow tutorials and stuff
[21:22:50] <zeeshan|2> and learn it yourself
[21:22:58] <tjb1> zeeshan|2: I am pretty good with it but stuff like surfaces is beyond me
[21:23:00] <zeeshan|2> but what makes you get the edge is when you watch a super user
[21:23:03] <zeeshan|2> do it
[21:23:09] <zeeshan|2> you pick up so many things you can do faster
[21:23:19] <tjb1> I dabbled a bit in dynamic simulation for an unknown force
[21:23:28] <zeeshan|2> im not talking about the packages :P
[21:23:33] <zeeshan|2> im talking strictly modeling
[21:23:35] <zeeshan|2> and assembly
[21:24:03] <CaptHindsight> tjb1: jesus, satan, oprah etc?
[21:24:06] <tjb1> All of surface modeling in Inventor is beyond me
[21:24:10] <LeelooMinai> CaptHindsight: Not everyone goes nto details in the same degree, but still - it's a golden age for this due to many factors. Having internet and access to all the info you won't is not bad either:)
[21:24:12] <_methods> hahahahha
[21:24:17] <_methods> oprah
[21:24:43] <LeelooMinai> want*
[21:25:24] <tjb1> https://www.dropbox.com/s/9j10cradgdnxh9p/Autodesk%20Inventor%20Professional%202012%20-%20%5BBENCH%20ASSEMBLY%20%28LevelofDetail1%29%5D_2014-06-04_16-44-44.png?dl=0
[21:25:28] <tjb1> Force for shocks on that hood
[21:25:48] <CaptHindsight> I haven't looked at Inventor in several years. Whats the surface modeling like? Compared to Creo, NX, Catia etc?
[21:26:10] <zeeshan|2> tjb1: what is that
[21:26:15] <zeeshan|2> i see a motor
[21:26:21] <zeeshan|2> on a shock absorber :D
[21:26:27] <zeeshan|2> or a heim joint
[21:26:28] <zeeshan|2> cant tell
[21:26:29] <tjb1> zeeshan|2: bolt headstocks to it
[21:26:34] <tjb1> to run bearings in before grinding
[21:26:54] <tjb1> https://www.dropbox.com/s/m1dpp9eno8y0s5c/2014-10-30%2016.00.33.jpg?dl=0
[21:27:20] <JT-Shop> tjb1, I have two thermocouples that came with the ramps board
[21:27:23] <zeeshan|2> nice
[21:27:29] <tjb1> JT-Shop: thermocouples or thermistors?
[21:27:39] <tjb1> zeeshan|2: something like 22 different headstocks bolt to that base
[21:27:40] <JT-Shop> thermistors sorry
[21:27:43] <_methods> inventor surface modeling is horrible
[21:27:54] <_methods> i still think you can't even open 4 viewports
[21:27:58] <JT-Shop> and 5 little heat sinks that I assume go on the driver chip?
[21:28:07] <tjb1> JT-Shop: correct
[21:28:10] <zeeshan|2> how do you like that routing package on inventor
[21:28:14] <zeeshan|2> i think its pretty sweet!
[21:28:17] <tjb1> zeeshan|2: well its a bastard
[21:28:34] <tjb1> probably because I have no idea how to use it
[21:28:52] <zeeshan|2> if you interface with autocad electrical
[21:28:58] <zeeshan|2> er autocad mechanical
[21:29:08] <zeeshan|2> you can take a drawing and link it to the model :D
[21:29:17] <zeeshan|2> and auto route and fix up the issues
[21:29:29] <zeeshan|2> ive seen it done, but never did it myself. only did it for electrical
[21:29:48] <tjb1> zeeshan|2: I didnt use inventor coupling though
[21:29:52] <tjb1> those are all from mcmaster
[21:30:21] <zeeshan|2> thats okay, i think you just have to define a pin/port for the part
[21:30:29] <zeeshan|2> that needs to match with the drawing
[21:30:38] <fluffybitchx> I need to learn a CAD program. so far the only cad I've done is 2-d for a plasma cutter, and I wouldn't say I was entirely competent.
[21:30:47] <tjb1> zeeshan|2: https://www.dropbox.com/s/ia6epzt9agz0e6r/2014-10-30%2016.01.05.jpg?dl=0
[21:30:57] <fluffybitchx> plasma cutters rock, by the way.
[21:31:02] <zeeshan|2> thats a pretty damn thick plate
[21:31:04] <zeeshan|2> for mounting :)
[21:31:13] <tjb1> zeeshan|2: cheaper than the thin stuff :P
[21:31:28] <Connor> tjb1: What is that ?
[21:31:30] <tjb1> yes I know its stupid
[21:31:40] <tjb1> Connor: which part?
[21:31:42] <zeeshan|2> hey, if thats whats cheaper
[21:31:43] <zeeshan|2> hell yea!
[21:31:47] <Connor> The whole thing
[21:31:48] <tjb1> Its actually nifty bar too...
[21:31:57] <fluffybitchx> any suggestions for a free cad program? right now I mostly want simple 3-axis stuff, no need for full CSG...
[21:31:57] <tjb1> Connor: run in bench for headstocks
[21:31:58] <zeeshan|2> i see 2 regulators
[21:32:08] <zeeshan|2> a vvalve
[21:32:16] <zeeshan|2> i dont know what that blue thing with the brass filter is
[21:32:21] <zeeshan|2> solnoid ?
[21:32:23] <tjb1> another valve
[21:32:29] <Connor> okay... Why do you need that? and why the pneumatics ?
[21:32:29] <CaptHindsight> FreeCAD
[21:32:30] <tjb1> controls rod lock on cylinder
[21:32:43] <tjb1> Connor: distributes the grease in the bearings
[21:32:51] <tjb1> and the pneumatics are to tighten the belt on the motor
[21:32:59] <tjb1> https://www.dropbox.com/s/t32vn1mkwqz79ak/2014-10-30%2016.00.43.jpg?dl=0
[21:33:17] <tjb1> the linear rail was "free"
[21:33:18] <fluffybitchx> I installed freecad the other day. I've found it very buggy, and I couldn't find out how to make it do what I wanted, which was draw a simple diagram with heights of each part specified...
[21:33:30] <tjb1> fluffybitchx: I think Inventor Fusion is free
[21:33:39] <zeeshan|2> ilegal downloads
[21:33:40] <zeeshan|2> !
[21:34:17] <fluffybitchx> in order to do that, I had to make a bunch of separate sketches, and subtract each of them from an extruded first one.
[21:35:08] <tjb1> fluffybitchx: http://www.123dapp.com/design
[21:35:30] <zeeshan|2> thats the difference between inventor fusion
[21:35:37] <zeeshan|2> and inventor pro
[21:35:40] <fluffybitchx> ... and runs on pleasant operating systems.
[21:36:03] <tjb1> zeeshan|2: valves have backflow
[21:36:11] <tjb1> flow valves on the back to control cylinder speed
[21:36:20] <tjb1> rod lock is integrated with e-stop on control
[21:38:24] <zeeshan|2> nice
[21:39:16] <tjb1> built it, turned air on, motor wouldnt lift
[21:39:19] <tjb1> about had a heart attack
[21:39:34] <tjb1> flow valves were closed :)
[21:39:57] <zeeshan|2> haha
[21:42:41] <fluffybitchx> I guess my next project is to grind flats
[21:45:53] <fluffybitchx> I don't know where either of my angle grinders are. bleh.
[21:46:12] <zeeshan|2> file it
[21:46:13] <zeeshan|2> :-)
[21:46:20] <zeeshan|2> i thought you were bad with a grinder!
[21:47:00] <fluffybitchx> I'm worse with a file. and way, way too lazy.
[21:47:35] <fluffybitchx> I have three angle grinders. a makita, a harbor freight, and an ancient b&d big one. I know where the last one is - on loan to someone who might never return it...
[21:48:00] <fluffybitchx> I could just give HF the $10 for another one...
[21:48:12] <zeeshan|2> file is cheaper
[21:48:13] <zeeshan|2> !
[21:48:58] <fluffybitchx> ... have you tried buying a good file lately
[21:48:59] <fluffybitchx> ?
[21:49:09] <zeeshan|2> yea
[21:49:14] <zeeshan|2> homedepot sells nicholson files
[21:49:18] <fluffybitchx> also $10. :P
[21:49:21] <fluffybitchx> no home despot here
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[21:50:11] <fluffybitchx> hrmm, I should have plugs between my drives and the breakout board. think molex is good enough?
[21:50:36] <fluffybitchx> having to dick around with a bunch of tiny screws to move things around is annoying.
[21:50:49] <TekniQue> molex sells a wide range of different connectors, surely some of them are good enough ;)
[21:51:02] <fluffybitchx> think the cheapo ones waldom sells kits of are good enough? :P
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[21:53:03] <zeeshan|2> amps / voltaghe?
[21:53:18] <fluffybitchx> .02 amps, 5 volts.
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[21:54:04] <fluffybitchx> "good enough" in this case more refers to the lack of shielding and reliability, not ratings.
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[21:56:59] <bobo_> zeeshan the nicholson files of today an't the same as they were when i was your age
[21:57:10] <zeeshan|2> they work! :P
[21:57:38] <bobo_> so do HF ones
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[21:59:29] <Deejay> gn8
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[21:59:59] <fluffybitchx> yay, found my makita. and it even has a good wheel!
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[22:00:40] <bobo_> zeeshan connect that MOV up at the brake not out at end of some extension cord
[22:01:55] <fluffybitchx> spacex trying again in less than an hour. what do you think will hold up the launch this time? heh
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[22:03:07] <bobo_> zeeshan glad to hear your moving the drives to L1 is working
[22:03:22] <CaptHindsight> I've been busy, whats the latest on the mystery of the exploding zeeshan|2 drives?
[22:03:50] <zeeshan|2> l2 to l1 seemed to fix it
[22:04:14] <fluffybitchx> he thinks moving it to the other line has fixed it, but he refuses to perform a neutral resistance test.
[22:04:34] <CaptHindsight> interesting, I'd like to see what a storage scope has to say about the power on those legs
[22:04:41] <bobo_> so what is now on L2 to Com ?
[22:04:55] <zeeshan|2> everything is on l1 to n now
[22:05:02] <zeeshan|2> except hydraulic vfd
[22:05:05] <zeeshan|2> thats still only l2 to n
[22:05:30] <zeeshan|2> im gonna finish up wiring my spindle encoder
[22:05:36] <zeeshan|2> hook up this varistor
[22:05:40] <fluffybitchx> I need to build a spindle encoder...
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[22:05:41] <zeeshan|2> and make some chip videos! :P
[22:06:36] <bobo_> varistor ? i thought you got a MOV ?
[22:06:57] <zeeshan|2> a mov is a varistor :)
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[22:09:57] <bobo_> not in my world but they may have changed
[22:11:02] <fluffybitchx> ... a metal oxide varistor was ever not a varistor?
[22:11:24] <bobo_> to me a MoV is a clamp device zener
[22:11:50] <fluffybitchx> a MOV is a Metal Oxide Varistor.
[22:11:54] <fluffybitchx> that's what MOV is.
[22:14:45] <bobo_> varistor changes ohm value over longer time constant than MOV, and recover time is longer than MOV
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[22:15:59] <fluffybitchx> ... MOV is an acronym. It means Metal Oxide Varistor.
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[22:16:19] <fluffybitchx> by definition, a MOV is a Varistor.
[22:16:20] <zeeshan|2> i kinda see bobo's point
[22:16:35] <zeeshan|2> its like oh henry vs turk chocolate
[22:16:43] <zeeshan|2> both are chocolate, but one is completely shit
[22:16:50] * zeeshan|2 ends troll mode
[22:17:55] <fluffybitchx> I think he's confusing a MOV with a TVS. I have a box of old transorbs somewhere...
[22:19:26] <bobo_> you may be correct transorbs
[22:21:50] <bobo_> when they first came out , they were red on outside and exploded a lot
[22:24:16] <fluffybitchx> anything that has to disspiate a large amount of energy in a hury is prone to that.
[22:24:28] <fluffybitchx> hurry
[22:24:38] <zeeshan|2> well this mov is oversized
[22:24:43] <zeeshan|2> it was the biggest body one i could find
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[22:28:18] <bobo_> got the lub pump and lub lines hooked up ? or still wating on those dumb fittings ?
[22:28:49] <fluffybitchx> meh. I should be grinding shafts, but I'm tired, and a nap sounds much nicer...
[22:29:37] <zeeshan|2> bobo_: still waiting o n them
[22:29:39] <zeeshan|2> im gonna nap
[22:29:43] <zeeshan|2> i woke up way too early today
[22:29:46] <zeeshan|2> :D
[22:29:51] <fluffybitchx> 4am here. heh.
[22:31:43] <Tom_itx> yeah that's two of us
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[22:36:15] <PetefromTn_> _methods hey man ya there?
[22:36:20] <_methods> yo
[22:36:40] <Tom_itx> i wonder if a 1N914 would work across a 5v relay coil?
[22:36:41] <PetefromTn_> Jeez man I could give you a big freakin' sloppy kiss for this idea
[22:36:46] <_methods> hahahhaha
[22:36:47] <Tom_itx> or if that's too lightweight
[22:36:54] <PetefromTn_> I probably would have never thought of using the router
[22:37:00] <_methods> well glad i could be useful somehow lol
[22:37:03] <PetefromTn_> and it is not only making this go WAY faster
[22:37:07] <_methods> yeah works ok on alum
[22:37:15] <_methods> LOUD
[22:37:17] <_methods> but it works
[22:37:17] <PetefromTn_> but it is allowing me to make an equal champfer on both sides perfectly
[22:37:31] <PetefromTn_> meh the cut is so slight it is not really any louder than the router itself...
[22:37:39] <PetefromTn_> I can't thank you enough my friend....
[22:37:45] <_methods> oh yeah if you try and do a heavy chamfer it's loud
[22:37:48] <_methods> np man
[22:37:53] <PetefromTn_> I was NOT looking forward to doing this with the whirlygig
[22:38:00] <_methods> hope you make some more money this way
[22:38:23] <_methods> get your lathe going
[22:38:26] <PetefromTn_> well hell yeah if it takes less time and makes the parts look better it is definintely going to help
[22:38:35] <PetefromTn_> YOU DA MAN!!!
[22:38:40] <PetefromTn_> ;)
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[22:39:12] <PetefromTn_> I can finish one of these things on both sides now in under a minute and it looks as good as if I had run it on the machine
[22:39:18] <_methods> you use a pilot bearing bit?
[22:39:21] <PetefromTn_> yeah
[22:39:24] <_methods> cool
[22:39:40] <PetefromTn_> I have a little quarter inch 90 degree champfer bit I used for woodworking
[22:39:45] <_methods> yeah
[22:39:47] <_methods> perfect
[22:40:00] <PetefromTn_> It just barely has enough room under the bearing to make the champfer exactly how I would have wanted it.
[22:40:19] <PetefromTn_> It's a beautiful thing man..
[22:40:28] <_methods> hahah well good deal
[22:41:38] <PetefromTn_> I need to rig up some kinda blower to blow the tiny chips away so they don't get caught under the part while I am doing it and kinda scratch it. These are getting a brushed finish anyways but I want to avoid it as much as possible.
[22:41:49] <_methods> heh if you do one side in the machine you'll only have to do one side with the router
[22:42:07] <PetefromTn_> naah this is way faster
[22:42:17] <PetefromTn_> and saves me a toolchange during the program
[22:42:20] <_methods> heheh
[22:42:20] <_methods> right
[22:42:27] <_methods> oh yeah i forgot tool changer
[22:42:39] <PetefromTn_> if I had known it would be this easy I would have been doing it during the program runs
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[22:43:00] <_methods> well hopefully you'll get the job again
[22:43:10] <PetefromTn_> I know I must sound like a wanker here but I really appreciate the idea and I will be doing it from now on on similar jobs.
[22:43:28] <PetefromTn_> yeah I am sure once they see these they will want to buy more when they run out hopefully. They look really cool.
[22:43:29] <Tom_itx> wanker
[22:43:33] <_methods> hahahah
[22:43:43] <Tom_itx> :D
[22:44:03] <PetefromTn_> :D
[22:44:18] <PetefromTn_> You just saved my bacon from a bunch of hand work
[22:44:34] <_methods> thank god i hate scut work
[22:44:39] <_methods> especially deburring
[22:45:01] <PetefromTn_> yeah me too...little stuff like holes I kinda enjoy doing while the next part is running
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[22:45:13] <PetefromTn_> but the whole part both sides like this would have been no fun at all
[22:46:09] <_methods> i'll do anything to avoid manually deburring
[22:46:10] <PetefromTn_> I figured I was actually going to use a deburring wheel on a bench grinder but after using a die grinder by hand and with a loc pad made from red pad it was not looking that nice really
[22:46:14] <_methods> can't stand it
[22:46:42] <PetefromTn_> this is so much easier it is not even funny
[22:46:54] <PetefromTn_> I have a large plywood base plate I made for my router
[22:47:05] <PetefromTn_> clamped upside down on the workbench
[22:47:13] <PetefromTn_> it is kind of like a little router table
[22:47:17] <_methods> ahh you just made it a router table
[22:47:18] <_methods> yeah
[22:47:25] <_methods> good idea
[22:47:28] <PetefromTn_> and I just stuck the bit in there and can move the parts quickly and easily
[22:47:32] <PetefromTn_> yeah
[22:47:32] <_methods> that will be way more consistent
[22:47:39] <PetefromTn_> it is SO consistent
[22:47:42] <PetefromTn_> and fast
[22:47:54] <_methods> now that is a good idea
[22:48:02] <PetefromTn_> I should be done with all of these damn parts this evening for sure now...
[22:48:05] <PetefromTn_> WOOHOOooo
[22:49:01] <PetefromTn_> so again my thanks I am gonna get back to it here... talk later guys!
[22:50:12] <PetefromTn_> Oh wait are they launching the space X rocket here in a bit or did I miss it?
[22:51:16] <_methods> hahahha605
[22:51:18] <_methods> oops
[22:51:21] <_methods> 605 est i think
[22:51:35] <_methods> 1805 EST
[22:51:37] <PetefromTn_> yeah that is in like ten minutes
[22:52:03] <PetefromTn_> http://www.spacex.com/webcast/
[22:52:59] <PetefromTn_> T minus 13 minutes
[22:54:23] <PetefromTn_> well apparently high altitude winds were too high so they scrubbed the launch again.
[22:55:05] <_methods> damn
[22:55:19] <PetefromTn_> they're gonna try again tomorrow
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[23:17:49] <tjb1> PetefromTn_: any pictures of these sexy parts?
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[23:36:20] <fluffybitchx> yay/meh. yay, I got a bunch of yardwork done. meh, that distracted me from grinding flats.
[23:41:40] <farbro> Hi, I'm gonna build a CNC bottle engraver and I will probably need some kind of pressure control on the Z axis. Is this a common feature among CNC machines? Some kind of mechanical spring solution or force control on the linear motion motor?
[23:42:43] <CaptHindsight> it's not common on machines that cut
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[23:44:49] <PCW> Dont engravers often have a shoe that maintains spindle height
[23:44:54] <CaptHindsight> farbro: why do you want to measure the force in the Z axis? are the bottle shapes very irregular?
[23:47:16] <farbro> CaptHindsight: Yes, they are very often not perfectly cylindrical. So the easiest way would be to have the Z axis follow the bottle.
[23:47:46] <CaptHindsight> https://www.ishor.com/images/Images26/26-370.gif mounts the tool using spring pressure
[23:47:56] <CaptHindsight> http://pepetools.com/engraving/horizontal-engraving-machine
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[23:49:22] <CaptHindsight> farbro: whats is going to move on your machine, the parts, the tool, some of each?
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[23:50:13] <farbro> PCW: Hmm, yeah that's one solution. But it still needs to know how far to push...
[23:50:28] <PetefromTn_> farbro https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HOiBB3xEphk
[23:51:39] <PetefromTn_> tjb1 working on em right now but I will try to get some finished pictures for ya. I do have this photo I took the other day of three of them just off the Cincinatti.... http://i.imgur.com/uXD5hKe.jpg
[23:52:06] <PetefromTn_> already buzzed thru champfering both sides and the holes in about half of them thanks to methods LOL
[23:54:41] <CaptHindsight> if the depth of the cut is not precision then mounting the spindle on a spring is easiest and lowest cost
[23:55:10] <farbro> CaptHindsight: Ah, yeah springs it is then. My machine doesn't exist yet, it's still in sketching state. :) One solution would be to just have a push/pull solenoid, but if I had a stepper motor and threaded rod instead it would give the machine much more potential than just bottle engraving. So I'm wondering how to combine them in some way
[23:55:39] <CaptHindsight> we print onto irregular surfaces and have to control the distance from the nozzles to the surface to a few microns
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[23:55:58] <farbro> PetefromTn_: Ah, interesting video
[23:56:00] <CaptHindsight> we either probe and profile the surface or use a laser micrometer
[23:58:46] <CaptHindsight> http://www.rolanddga.com/products/engravers/egx360/ $18,995 US
[23:59:47] <CaptHindsight> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cOMFK2IJuHM Wine Bottle Engraving Machine