#linuxcnc | Logs for 2015-01-27

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[00:42:09] <_methods> what's the best solder paste out there?
[00:42:38] <_methods> i got a bunch of smt soldering to do and i was thinking about maybe makin my life easier with some solder paste
[00:43:09] <Tom_itx> _methods i get mine from DX
[00:43:14] <Tom_itx> cheap
[00:43:52] <Jymmm> _methods: and Tom_itx pays for custom stencils, so not a complete cheap bastard =)
[00:44:24] <_methods> http://www.amazon.com/MG-Chemicals-4860P-35G-Solder-Paste/dp/B00M1RC0YY/ref=sr_1_1
[00:44:29] <_methods> i was lookin at that
[00:45:01] <Jymmm> _methods: Tom_itx was tlaking about http://www.dx.com/s/solder+paste
[00:45:45] <Tom_itx> http://www.dx.com/s/lodestar+solder+paste
[00:46:04] <_methods> ah you got stencils
[00:46:09] <Tom_itx> they used to have those 3/ less
[00:46:13] <_methods> i won't have that so i need a needle
[00:46:15] <Tom_itx> oh hell yeah
[00:46:34] <Tom_itx> druggie
[00:46:42] <_methods> or some sort of dispensing system lol
[00:46:57] * _methods shoots solder paste
[00:47:11] <_methods> slap slap
[00:48:00] <_methods> i've never used DX before i always just go straight to aliexpress or alibaba
[00:48:03] * Jymmm slaps the needle of of _methods vein http://www.dx.com/p/klt-982a-solder-paste-glue-dropper-liquid-auto-dispenser-controller-black-230312
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[00:48:17] <Jymmm> out of*
[00:49:00] <_methods> hahah that's super overkill for what i got goin on
[00:49:07] <_methods> i'm building a custom keyboard
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[00:49:23] <_methods> but i gotta put on like 100+ smt resistors and leds
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[00:49:29] <Jymmm> well, make up your damn mind already! lol
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[00:50:04] <_methods> that is a cool disp kit though
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[00:50:39] <Jymmm> lots on ebay/amazon
[00:50:43] <_methods> http://www.dx.com/p/glasses-type-20x-magnifier-with-white-led-light-2-x-cr1620-116296#.VMbg163N_UI
[00:50:46] <_methods> hahaha
[00:50:49] <_methods> i gotta get those
[00:51:14] <_methods> i don't even care if they work
[00:51:36] <malcom2073> Haha that's awesome
[00:51:37] <Tom_L> get a binocular scope instead
[00:51:45] <_methods> i'm just gonna walk around the house in speedos, a light coat of oil and those glasses
[00:51:45] <malcom2073> Tom_L: is it as cool looking?
[00:51:53] <Tom_L> 20x is too much really
[00:52:03] <Tom_L> unless it's zoom
[00:52:32] <Tom_L> i use my 7 x 45 zoom mostly in the 7ish range
[00:53:02] <_methods> what kind do you have Tom_L
[00:53:10] <Tom_L> amscope
[00:53:18] <_methods> how much was that?
[00:53:20] <_methods> $700?
[00:53:27] <Tom_L> 3 ish
[00:53:31] <_methods> hmmmm
[00:53:49] <_methods> you get it on ebay?
[00:54:38] <Tom_L> yeah
[00:55:00] <Tom_L> http://www.amscope.com/7x-45x-stereo-zoom-microscope-with-single-arm-boom-stand.html
[00:55:20] <Tom_L> you get free shipping off ebay
[00:55:36] <unfy> at $7, those .... glasses... are :D
[00:56:11] <_methods> yeah i've been eyeing one of those
[00:56:17] <_methods> it's on my wishlist
[00:56:26] <_methods> with oscope
[00:56:47] <unfy> how much you looking to spend on a scope ?
[00:58:34] <_methods> $4-500 i guess
[00:58:43] <_methods> i was looking at one of those 1054z's
[00:58:45] <unfy> rigol 1054z ftw
[00:58:47] <_methods> yeah
[00:59:08] <Tom_L> http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/scope/scope1.jpg
[00:59:13] <Tom_L> gives you plenty of room to work
[00:59:15] <unfy> i put $350 at a siglent 1102cml - and i have only two complaints there abouts.
[00:59:30] <_methods> yeah tthat's perfect
[00:59:38] <_methods> i think i'll get one of those before the oscope
[00:59:46] <_methods> i use the goggles way more
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[01:00:31] <unfy> with a decent dmm - for cnc work and stuff, i'd say the magnifier stuff is prolly more important
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[01:01:30] <_methods> yeah i think it would be better for me to get first
[01:02:11] <_methods> oscope i only need occasionally but magnification i seem to need increasingly frequently for some reason
[01:02:15] <Tom_L> http://www.ebay.com/itm/AmScope-SM-3B-7X-45X-Stereo-Zoom-Microscope-with-Single-Arm-Boom-Stand-/140927274133?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20cfeb8c95
[01:02:40] <unfy> i will say - as someone who does own pcb's and been doing embedded computer stuff... a 'real' oscope is so very handy.
[01:02:57] <Tom_L> that and a LA
[01:03:07] <Tom_L> i like those saleae ones
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[01:03:20] <_methods> i made a knock off salaed
[01:03:26] <_methods> for $6 lol
[01:03:33] <_methods> salaea even
[01:03:45] <LeelooMinai> Or even Saleae
[01:03:54] <_methods> that too
[01:04:15] <LeelooMinai> CLones are for sub $8 on ali:)
[01:04:30] <_methods> yeah i had to find a eeprom for it though
[01:04:44] <_methods> i had one that worked on an old stick of ram heheh
[01:04:45] <unfy> i tend to not use a LA and prefer looking at schematics / continuity testing and the code. but i did pick up a chinese knock off of the saleae to see what i think. if i end up using it for more than 8 hours, i'll buy a real saleae
[01:05:14] <_methods> i only use it to mess around never had to do any real work with it
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[01:05:55] <Tom_L> i got a saleae for a project that paid for it almost right away
[01:05:59] <LeelooMinai> _methods: Hmm, I think they blocked some non-Atmel eeproms in new software or something liek that - are you refering to that?
[01:06:04] <andypugh> I just remebered, I subscribed to a Kickstarter osciloscope watch and it’s now very late
[01:06:06] <_methods> yeah
[01:06:26] <_methods> they added a eeprom check to the software or something
[01:06:27] <unfy> i've built a couple hacky LA's here at work only because... well... lets not go there. but they were built for diagnosing existing stuff etc, not my own code :D
[01:06:29] <LeelooMinai> _methods: I have clones with non-Atmel ones... maybe I should mod them...
[01:06:47] <_methods> mine are cypress
[01:06:53] <LeelooMinai> In the meantime I got dslogic - it has pretty nice specs
[01:07:04] <unfy> methods: the saleae and usbee both check the eeprom and stuff yeah. there's also "speed of the eeprom" related stuff for things etc
[01:07:09] <_methods> yeah
[01:07:10] <LeelooMinai> Much better value than Saleae
[01:07:22] <_methods> tht's what i did i swapped out the eeprom with anothner and flashed it
[01:07:30] <_methods> a matching eeprom
[01:07:49] <LeelooMinai> _methods: You did that for 8 or 16 version?
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[01:08:06] <LeelooMinai> I mean 8 or 16 channels*
[01:08:13] <_methods> http://www.ebay.com/itm/AmScope-SM-3B-7X-45X-Stereo-Zoom-Microscope-with-Single-Arm-Boom-Stand-/140927274133
[01:08:16] <_methods> oops
[01:08:25] <_methods> http://sunbizhosting.co.uk/~spiral/blog/?p=117
[01:08:34] <LeelooMinai> I have a microscope that looks almost identical - got it from Chine once for $350
[01:08:36] <_methods> eeprom swap
[01:08:41] <LeelooMinai> $250 even
[01:09:00] <_methods> i did that for the 8 channel version
[01:09:37] <_methods> the 16 channel clone is still too expensive for me lol
[01:09:39] <LeelooMinai> I guess I should add that eeprom to my Mouser project basket:)
[01:09:41] <_methods> it's like $30
[01:10:19] <_methods> i just searched my junkpile and found one
[01:10:20] <LeelooMinai> Right, still fraction of the price of the original
[01:10:33] <_methods> i found a working eeprom on an old stick of ram
[01:11:04] <LeelooMinai> The stick was probably worth more than LA:p
[01:11:14] <_methods> at one time
[01:11:49] <_methods> came out of an old dell poweredge 1950
[01:12:43] <LeelooMinai> Some people still buy such old ram - for ancient boxes for strange things like CNC. O, wait...
[01:12:58] <_methods> why do you think i had it lol
[01:13:01] <Jymmm> Alright, this PS module is pretty fucking slick!!!
[01:13:15] <_methods> for your led?
[01:13:24] <Jymmm> No, for whatever
[01:13:37] <_methods> oh your little dc-dc one?
[01:13:58] <Jymmm> Yeah http://www.dxsoul.com/product/b3603-dc-dc-constant-voltage-current-step-down-module-green-901247601
[01:14:36] <_methods> ahh cool current control too
[01:15:04] <Jymmm> I have it on a 5-15vdc supply. I "set" it to 10VDC o the module, and it read the actual input voltage and not just set one
[01:16:17] <Jymmm> so even if the source changes, you'll know
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[01:18:10] <andypugh> Jymmm: My mill now uses a 2kW 24V supply (It was cheap) and a bunch of that sort of thing for other voltages.
[01:18:59] <Jymmm> andypugh: Cool, this ia digital variable cc/cv supply
[01:19:27] <unfy> i've been meaning to build my own adjustable bench power supply... just haven't done so yet. too many other projects
[01:19:45] <Jymmm> this is variable
[01:19:56] <unfy> as would any bench power supply be
[01:20:19] <Jymmm> nm
[01:21:03] <unfy> for the price, the little module is great (assuming it meets its specs), but i'm wanting something with knobs and stuff :D
[01:22:03] <Jymmm> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9YeFHQse-8o
[01:22:19] <unfy> yup, seen that :D
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[01:23:21] <andypugh> Interesting… https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1489435074/hybridcnc-and-3d-printer-combo?ref=nav_search
[01:23:28] <unfy> i loved the woodwork. not too sure about the battery power though
[01:24:03] <andypugh> So, the kid got $1400 and didn’t have to suply anything. Family thing>
[01:24:05] <andypugh> ?
[01:26:22] <Jymmm> haha awesome... hit SET, turns output off. Hit OK turns output on, and since the inrush current is higher than I have it set for 1oomA, it starts in CC mode, then flips to CV automatically when levels off at 94mA.
[01:26:26] <_methods> exploding kittens or lame 3d printer
[01:26:30] <_methods> i love you kickstarter
[01:27:01] <unfy> andy: i can smell some fraud suits being filed ._.
[01:27:03] <_methods> and he's using lash nuts
[01:27:25] <_methods> and this miracle thing called acme rod
[01:27:44] <andypugh> He is only supplying (at the moment) a 3D model at $100 to 14 people.
[01:28:06] <_methods> make that 15 i'm gettin in now
[01:28:39] <andypugh> If he was to have a single $2500 backer for an actual machine then he might end up embarassed.
[01:29:09] <unfy> also: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4fpmh-Fbjvc&feature=youtu.be
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[01:30:19] <andypugh> Are they using magnetic balls as joints? That seems inspired and I wish I had thought of it.
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[01:32:19] <unfy> Magnetic ball joints for low friction no-lash movement
[01:32:29] <_methods> heheh
[01:32:34] <_methods> no lash
[01:32:48] <Vertices> air bearings nickuh
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[01:33:17] <unfy> https://paulwanamaker.wordpress.com/2014/10/25/raptosaur-my-new-large-format-3-d-printer/
[01:33:37] <andypugh> _methods: You object to no-lash in this context? It seems to me that they definitively are
[01:34:49] <_methods> i hate lashing
[01:34:56] <_methods> i'm all in on the no lash train
[01:35:13] <unfy> i dont mind lashing, as long as there's a safe word j/k
[01:35:22] <_methods> hahah
[01:35:58] <andypugh> I just rembered that I don’t know where my bag of frictionless bearings is.
[01:36:21] <_methods> i stole them
[01:36:41] <_methods> they're in the bag with my bus tickets to hawaii
[01:37:31] <andypugh> No, really, they exist
[01:38:09] <andypugh> They used crossed leaf springs
[01:38:47] <_methods> not magnets?
[01:38:55] <andypugh> They are not zero-resistance, but they are zero-friction, so any change in force results in a change in position
[01:39:25] * LeelooMinai peeks to see who invented zero-friction bearings now
[01:39:36] <andypugh> The magnetic balls are frictional but zero-lash. Which is joly clever.
[01:40:56] <_methods> yeah i think the 3d printer crowd has been using them in those contraptions for awhile
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[01:41:47] <_methods> those kossel/rostocks i think they call them
[01:41:52] <andypugh> LeelooMinai: http://flexpivots.com (they even say “frictionless” on the home page
[01:42:36] <andypugh> A friend uses them on the seismometers he makes.
[01:43:11] <andypugh> (I wonder if he knows that they found the one he bult for Beagle2 ?
[01:43:28] <andypugh> Well, they found Beagle2 anyway :-)
[01:44:15] <unfy> see, the joint gave out, causing it to bounce real hard and crimp the antenna wire. he should be ashamed XD
[01:44:27] <andypugh> Those on a Hooke’s joint might be worth looking at
[01:45:17] <zeeshan|2> Tom_itx: shipped
[01:45:22] <zeeshan|2> CaptHindsight: thank you , got notification
[01:45:24] <LeelooMinai> There are no frictionless bearings...
[01:45:33] <zeeshan|2> yes there are!
[01:45:51] <unfy> my ex gf's legs ?
[01:46:02] <malcom2073> heyooohhh
[01:46:06] <_methods> hahahah
[01:46:08] <_methods> bazinga
[01:46:56] <andypugh> LeelooMinai: No, there really is no friction in those pivots. There are other forces, but nothing that counts as friction.
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[01:47:43] <LeelooMinai> There are losses and it's what matters, no? :)
[01:48:01] <andypugh> They act as nicely-packaged torsional springs, but are entirely elastic,
[01:49:38] <LeelooMinai> They look more like hinges to me
[01:49:53] <LeelooMinai> Can they even rotate any angle?
[01:50:35] <andypugh> They also work with no lubrication and potentially buried in diamond dust. I like them and present them as a solution to _some_ problems. I used them when I was building a 15W dynamometer for very small motors.
[01:51:55] <zeeshan|2> andypugh: when you did your pid for vfd
[01:51:55] <zeeshan|2> was it actually pid
[01:51:55] <zeeshan|2> was it dc injection
[01:52:39] <andypugh> Neither? Both? When did I do this?
[01:52:56] <zeeshan|2> :{
[01:53:44] <zeeshan|2> nm
[01:53:46] <zeeshan|2> i found the video
[01:53:51] <zeeshan|2> it was a pid loop
[01:54:12] <andypugh> ah, the lathe spindle? That was an experiment and was PID.
[01:54:44] <zeeshan|2> do you recall how precise it was? :)
[01:55:07] <andypugh> But it was very much the wrong sort of VFD and only a 50-tooth wheel. It was awful yet still surprisingly good ;-)
[01:55:24] <zeeshan|2> looks pretty good by eye!
[01:55:51] <andypugh> It didn’t follow small changes at all.
[01:56:13] <andypugh> Because the VFD refused to act on any command below 10Hz
[01:56:30] <andypugh> But it was a very ancient VFD.
[01:56:53] <zeeshan|2> yea depends on the drive
[01:57:00] <zeeshan|2> my old allen bradley one is completely garbage below 7Hz
[01:57:13] <zeeshan|2> but eaton sensorless vector can easily go down to 1hz
[01:57:24] <Tom_itx> zeeshan|2 thanks
[01:57:30] <zeeshan|2> np
[01:57:32] <andypugh> If and when I add spindle orient to the mill (with a flux-vector VFD and resolver feedback equivalent to 32k counts encoder) then I expect better results
[01:57:34] <zeeshan|2> it was like 8.90
[01:57:40] <zeeshan|2> 1.10 back
[01:57:40] <zeeshan|2> :D
[01:58:17] <Tom_itx> should have stuck it in a #0 envelope for $3
[01:58:21] <zeeshan|2> lol
[01:58:24] <zeeshan|2> it'd prolly break
[01:58:30] <zeeshan|2> i was thinking bubble wrap
[01:58:32] <zeeshan|2> but i ended up boxing it
[01:59:23] <zeeshan|2> andypugh: thats a lot of enconder counts
[01:59:47] <andypugh> Yes. I like Resolvers
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[02:02:41] <XXCoder1> wow exploding kittens reached 100k supporters
[02:02:55] <_methods> indeed
[02:03:57] <andypugh> Actually, I am not correct. The 7i49 has 12 bits of absolute accuracy and 14 bits precision, so either 409s or 16k counts depending on how you count. But the fact it is analogue sort-of gives you an oversampling efffect.
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[02:04:53] <zeeshan|2> speaking of sampling
[02:04:59] <zeeshan|2> is there a cheap pci card i can buy
[02:05:03] <XXCoder1> now second highest. THE highest is reading rainbow at 105,857
[02:05:16] <zeeshan|2> that will let me read load cells at like 6000 samples/sec
[02:05:26] <zeeshan|2> and it needs to amplify a 4mV/V signal
[02:05:31] <XXCoder1> if it keeps trucking (and theres plenty days left) kitten will be #1 soonish
[02:05:42] <zeeshan|2> at the same time, i need to monitor a temp sensor over rs232
[02:05:57] <zeeshan|2> all the stuff i see
[02:05:59] <zeeshan|2> is stupid expensive
[02:06:48] <zeeshan|2> http://www.adlinktech.com/PD/web/PD_detail.php?pid=751
[02:06:50] <zeeshan|2> basically that :D
[02:07:27] <zeeshan|2> im not paying 3800$ for that card
[02:07:27] <zeeshan|2> :P
[02:07:46] <XXCoder1> you got a cnc, engrave your own? ;)
[02:07:53] <XXCoder1> seriously dunno
[02:08:06] <andypugh> exploding kittens looks like at least as much fun as “Cards againt humanity” which sort-of failed to amuse me despite me winning by a factor fo 2 when I played it.
[02:09:16] <zeeshan|2> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813132104&cm_re=j1800-_-13-132-104-_-Product
[02:09:29] <zeeshan|2> is this faster than an athlon xp 3200+ on a7v400-mx motherboard
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[02:10:10] <XXCoder1> andypugh: dunno if it's fun or anything but sometimes I try to support webcomics I like lol
[02:10:17] <andypugh> zeeshan|2: Load cells are a Wheatstone bridge. You need an external amp (could be an op-amp but there are specialised high-stability devices) and then you need a decent A to D card.
[02:10:27] <XXCoder1> I don't always agree but I always like theoatmeat funny
[02:10:42] <zeeshan|2> andypugh: yes
[02:10:46] <zeeshan|2> i need a cheap solution
[02:10:47] <zeeshan|2> :(
[02:10:55] <zeeshan|2> the external amp also i think excites the sensor.
[02:11:00] <zeeshan|2> by passing 10V through it
[02:11:05] <andypugh> Yes
[02:11:24] <zeeshan|2> also this stuff is extremely noise sensitive
[02:11:32] <andypugh> You need a stable excitation or it all goes wrong
[02:11:32] <zeeshan|2> one article i was reading, they said the load cell is super accurate byitself
[02:11:40] <zeeshan|2> the limitation is the amplifier
[02:11:46] <andypugh> Yes,
[02:11:48] <zeeshan|2> it starts dumping noise
[02:12:09] <zeeshan|2> i just need something that isnt super crazy expensive :/
[02:12:10] <andypugh> I rather specilaised in load sensing for a few years
[02:12:28] <XXCoder1> I wonder if you can somehow split parts up and make em worktogether and cheaper
[02:12:31] <XXCoder1> doubt it tho
[02:13:01] <zeeshan|2> i have like 10000 budget
[02:13:17] <zeeshan|2> but the prof doesnt want me blowing it all on a daq.
[02:13:21] <zeeshan|2> which can easily happen
[02:13:42] <zeeshan|2> there must be a system that can do it for 500-1000
[02:13:44] <Tom_itx> so zeeshan|2, is your mill ready to cut parts now?
[02:13:52] <zeeshan|2> Tom_itx: did you see the video!
[02:13:56] <Tom_itx> no
[02:13:57] <zeeshan|2> or the marker test
[02:14:01] <zeeshan|2> *of
[02:14:24] <zeeshan|2> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_pPEL5H2_s
[02:14:25] <zeeshan|2> :D
[02:14:51] <zeeshan|2> marker is held in by tape
[02:14:55] <andypugh> zeeshan|2: http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/strain-gauge-accessories/0846171/ and a good National Instruments card
[02:14:57] <zeeshan|2> and noise is because there is no lube yet
[02:15:39] <Tom_itx> no noise here
[02:15:43] <Tom_itx> no sound :)
[02:15:46] <zeeshan|2> :)
[02:16:06] <zeeshan|2> andypugh: does something like that come already preassembled? :)
[02:16:36] <andypugh> Yes, you can buy complete amps
[02:16:52] <Tom_itx> zeeshan|2, i don't think i've ever run that program :)
[02:16:55] <XXCoder1> gonna love marker drawn
[02:17:12] <zeeshan|2> Tom_itx: its there for a reason!
[02:17:57] <andypugh> zeeshan|2: http://www.novatechloadcells.co.uk/ds/adw15.htm (only 10 samples per second, though)
[02:18:08] <andypugh> Fast costs more.
[02:18:18] <zeeshan|2> need 6000 min :(
[02:18:30] <zeeshan|2> samples are neded
[02:18:37] <XXCoder1> andypugh: can cheat with 2 or more of em with timing offsets? lol
[02:18:40] <zeeshan|2> otherwise it wont pick up the small differences
[02:19:03] <andypugh> Ah, this is a 6kHz one: http://www.novatechloadcells.co.uk/ds/sga.htm
[02:19:10] <XXCoder1> 100 samples per second is what zee needs
[02:20:17] <andypugh> Other suppliers exist, probably closer to you too. I just had quite a good relationship with Novatech when that was my game
[02:20:25] <zeeshan|2> $$?
[02:21:30] <zeeshan|2> hm
[02:21:33] <andypugh> The load cells were about £300. I never actually used their amps.
[02:21:37] <zeeshan|2> http://www.futek.com/resolutioncalc.aspx
[02:21:41] <XXCoder1> it does not state. probably means I cant afford it
[02:21:47] <zeeshan|2> if i use 5000lb, 4mV/V
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[02:21:59] <zeeshan|2> and usb530, 10samples/s
[02:22:02] <zeeshan|2> it gives me 0.04lb res
[02:22:16] <zeeshan|2> but if i choose 7500samples/s i get .93lb
[02:22:19] <zeeshan|2> what!
[02:22:25] <andypugh> I would be surprised if the amps were more than £2000
[02:23:13] <zeeshan|2> i thought, the more samples/s
[02:23:14] <andypugh> Any A to D conversion gets more vague as the sample rate increases
[02:23:15] <zeeshan|2> the better the res
[02:23:39] <zeeshan|2> ah im confusing it
[02:23:57] <zeeshan|2> more samples/s means more data points
[02:24:01] <zeeshan|2> so if i do a fast strain rate test
[02:24:02] <zeeshan|2> i can capture it
[02:24:28] <zeeshan|2> so i guess its sollely the design of the A-D converter that determines res
[02:24:56] <zeeshan|2> and ofcourse the max capacity of the sensor.
[02:24:59] <andypugh> if I was you I would just get on the phone to Instron and talk round the problem.
[02:25:38] <zeeshan|2> andypugh: i will
[02:25:51] <zeeshan|2> we do have a bunch of amplifiers
[02:25:55] <zeeshan|2> but theyre scattered, and no specs
[02:25:59] <zeeshan|2> i think i will try to find more info.
[02:26:31] <zeeshan|2> i dont understand why i can't just simply take the amplfier out of one test frame
[02:26:49] <zeeshan|2> and its daq and just put it on my bigger test frame
[02:27:02] <andypugh> I am fairly sure you could
[02:27:34] <zeeshan|2> this stuff is all new to me.. so i'm trying to get educated about it
[02:27:38] <zeeshan|2> otherwise people take you for a fool
[02:27:41] <zeeshan|2> and tell you "it cant be done"
[02:27:42] <andypugh> Schenck make some nice stuff too.
[02:28:06] <andypugh> But Instron are the “daddies” of load cells
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[02:29:14] <zeeshan|2> some of our test frames are instron
[02:29:16] <zeeshan|2> some are mts
[02:29:23] <zeeshan|2> have you heard of mts?
[02:29:36] <andypugh> yes, and Denison, and Avery :-)
[02:29:40] <zeeshan|2> hehe
[02:29:44] <zeeshan|2> i havent heard of those 2
[02:30:04] <zeeshan|2> https://www.flickr.com/photos/128539016@N05/16376478192/
[02:30:11] <zeeshan|2> https://www.flickr.com/photos/128539016@N05/15754934074/
[02:30:14] <zeeshan|2> im dealing with these load cells
[02:30:30] <zeeshan|2> sorry for upside down pic :)
[02:31:04] <andypugh> Load cells are load cells. Any fool can make them, and I have
[02:31:11] <unfy> all of the letters are gonna fall out
[02:32:18] <andypugh> You might not even need a load cell, sometimes you can just strain-gauge the machine frame
[02:32:19] <zeeshan|2> yea its just a wheatstone bridge
[02:32:39] <XXCoder1> LOL https://i.chzbgr.com/maxW500/5557993472/h07119915/
[02:32:39] <zeeshan|2> my dilema is this man
[02:32:46] <zeeshan|2> either buy a new load cells,
[02:32:57] <andypugh> The clever part is setting up 4 gauges so that you automatically compensate for temperature.
[02:32:58] <zeeshan|2> or get a more accurate daq.
[02:33:03] <zeeshan|2> yea
[02:33:16] <zeeshan|2> that is super important with my test
[02:33:24] <zeeshan|2> cause im going from 80C to 0C
[02:33:35] <zeeshan|2> and its a shape meory polymer
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[02:33:46] <zeeshan|2> which changes phases at 30
[02:35:06] <zeeshan|2> andypugh: so basically all load cells have the same # of pins
[02:35:13] <andypugh> Sounds like fun. Do you chill the whole machine or just the sample?
[02:35:23] <zeeshan|2> it will be in an environmental chamber
[02:35:27] <zeeshan|2> which is pid
[02:35:30] <zeeshan|2> controlled
[02:35:36] <andypugh> Hmm
[02:35:59] <andypugh> Do you care about strain measurment too?
[02:36:05] <zeeshan|2> yes
[02:36:08] <zeeshan|2> i have aramis 3d
[02:36:10] <zeeshan|2> optical measurement
[02:36:18] <zeeshan|2> they'll be peaking through the glass window
[02:36:26] <andypugh> Your length sensing is going to be…..
[02:36:31] <andypugh> Ah, OK
[02:37:32] <andypugh> You can contact the maker of the existing cells.
[02:37:39] <andypugh> Ask for specs.
[02:37:52] <zeeshan|2> i found them online
[02:37:57] <zeeshan|2> im just a noob lol
[02:38:00] <zeeshan|2> i dont know what specs matter
[02:38:11] <zeeshan|2> freom my understanding, the most important one is mV/V number
[02:38:33] <andypugh> Or, more pragmatically, test samples of known temperature sensitivty, or none (get an Invar spring?) and calibrate
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[02:39:10] <andypugh> mv/V/K for temperature sensitivity.
[02:39:31] <zeeshan|2> well; this one is outside the environmental chamber
[02:39:36] <zeeshan|2> hopefully itll be hanging out at ambient
[02:39:49] <andypugh> That makes it easier.
[02:40:01] <zeeshan|2> hey i have a q.
[02:40:04] <andypugh> Maybe give it a fan to be sure.
[02:40:06] <zeeshan|2> the excitation voltage
[02:40:13] <zeeshan|2> the more it is, the better the res?
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[02:40:27] <zeeshan|2> cause this thing can handle 20vdc max
[02:40:31] <andypugh> Yes, untile the gauges get hot
[02:40:38] <zeeshan|2> but we're only using a 10V amp
[02:41:25] <zeeshan|2> the spec sheet says
[02:41:33] <zeeshan|2> "compensation range -10 to 45C"
[02:41:34] <andypugh> 10V to 20V probably isn’t a huge improvement
[02:41:53] <zeeshan|2> ah okay
[02:42:04] <zeeshan|2> my prob is my samples are going to prolly see a max force of 200lb.
[02:42:13] <zeeshan|2> but the load cell is 5k lb.
[02:42:28] <zeeshan|2> so resolution is a big deal
[02:42:34] <zeeshan|2> i can tolerate .25 lb res
[02:42:37] <andypugh> Get a more suitable gauge
[02:42:54] <zeeshan|2> you think ill get crap data?
[02:43:25] <zeeshan|2> they are hesistant to change gauges
[02:43:34] <zeeshan|2> because they're like itll cost 2000$ to get it calibrated
[02:43:35] <zeeshan|2> lol
[02:43:51] <andypugh> For the price of a 1kN gauge, you would be daft not to
[02:43:54] <zeeshan|2> i thought load cells come with calibration factors.......
[02:44:08] <zeeshan|2> andypugh: i dont have an idea for price
[02:44:13] <zeeshan|2> but what would it be roughly ball park wise?
[02:44:20] <zeeshan|2> these guys dont advertise it online at all
[02:44:28] <zeeshan|2> so its hard to get an idea of how much it costs
[02:44:36] <zeeshan|2> an = no
[02:44:43] <andypugh> Novatecj were selling me gauges complete with cal certificate for hundreds of £
[02:44:51] <zeeshan|2> ha.
[02:44:59] <zeeshan|2> so all you do is bolt in the new load cell
[02:45:02] <zeeshan|2> enter the cal values in the software
[02:45:04] <zeeshan|2> and you're ready to go?
[02:45:08] <andypugh> Yes
[02:45:10] <zeeshan|2> omfg.
[02:45:21] <zeeshan|2> i dont know why this guy keeps on telling me it , instron needs to come to calibrate it
[02:45:26] <andypugh> (Actually, I always did my own dead-weight cals too)
[02:45:34] <zeeshan|2> i was even thinking, i could just hang out precise weights off the frame
[02:45:39] <zeeshan|2> aand calibrate it that way.
[02:46:03] <zeeshan|2> i'm so glad you know this stuff :)
[02:46:08] <zeeshan|2> helps a lot.
[02:47:13] <andypugh> Calibrate with weights with the gauge off the machine so the direction is right. Then there is no argument.
[02:48:01] <andypugh> It suddenly got _very_ late here.
[02:48:13] <Tom_itx> heh
[02:48:14] <zeeshan|2> thanks for the help!
[02:48:20] <Tom_itx> andypugh you never sleep!
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[02:48:50] <andypugh> Contact me privately if you need more info, I did 15 years postdoc in mechanical testing.
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[03:06:32] <CaptHindsight> zeeshan|2: your coating went out a few hours ago, you should have it by noon tomorrow
[03:11:22] <XXCoder1> capt now make me my cnc router lol
[03:11:30] * furrywolf curls up and yawns
[03:11:41] <furrywolf> meh. there's no one in this channel to curl up on.
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[03:14:02] <XXCoder1> yo
[03:23:46] * furrywolf sighs
[03:25:09] <PetefromTn_> well
[03:25:25] <PetefromTn_> I spent some time out in the shop today working on the new lathe
[03:25:37] <PetefromTn_> got some more sheetmetal stripped
[03:25:55] <PetefromTn_> and finally removed the original X axis servomotor from the carriage
[03:26:08] <PetefromTn_> I am going to try to clean it up a bit so maybe I can sell it.
[03:26:23] <PetefromTn_> it just has gunk on it but it appears to be in good shape
[03:27:16] <PetefromTn_> Now that the new spindle motor is ordered and on it's way I have to source a pulley for it
[03:27:49] <PetefromTn_> I have the ratio already figured and I THINK it will be an off the shelf cast iron pulley with adapter setup so hopefully plug and play
[03:28:07] <PetefromTn_> I am getting ready to order the new Z axis ballscrew here hopefully soon.
[03:28:21] <PetefromTn_> So I pulled the mounts off the machine and started measuring them
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[03:28:56] <PetefromTn_> looks like the driven end was designed to take angular contact preloaded pair with a 47mmOD and probably a 20mmID 14mm thick
[03:29:31] <PetefromTn_> it has a very cool clamp style pocket for the bearings that can be bolted into another housing that gets bolted to the machines base
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[03:29:56] <PetefromTn_> luckily those are relatively cheap on ebay.
[03:30:29] <PetefromTn_> the tailstock end of the screw is kind of interesting tho
[03:30:44] <PetefromTn_> there is a plain bearing that has another mount/housing at the end of travel
[03:31:24] <PetefromTn_> it has a short stub shaft in it that goes thru the bearing and stops just below flush and it is solid in the middle with a tapped metric screw hole.
[03:31:51] <PetefromTn_> the other side of the stub shaft has a 16.5mm bore with what appears to be a cross drilled pin setup
[03:32:50] <PetefromTn_> the best I can figure is that the tailstock/undriven end of the screw was machined to fit in the 16.5mm bore and then pinned to it and there must have been a washer on the other side of the bearing to hold the end of the screw from coming out of the bearing or something....
[03:33:32] <PetefromTn_> what is odd tho is that this mount for the plain bearing has no shoulder or anything just a smooth deep bore all the way thru
[03:34:07] <PetefromTn_> I know you don't ever want to secure both ends of the screw so It can expand and contract with temperature etc but I am kinda unsure how this whole setup should go together
[03:34:51] <XXCoder1> well
[03:34:58] <XXCoder1> hope you fugure it out :)
[03:35:20] <furrywolf> you should tell that to the chinese people who made my shoptask mill, with the Y axis screw held in place by a steel-on-steel "bearing" on each end, so if you adjust it so it has minimal backlash, it promptly jams or gets sloppy as soon as the temperature changes...
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[03:38:39] <PetefromTn_> it seems like if you just machined the end of the new screw to fit snug in the stub shaft 16.5mm end and then pressed that into the plain bearing and then installed the washer and shcs on the other end of the bearing it would hold the screw securely yet since the bearing is pressed into the bore on the mount it could float with temp etc.
[03:39:14] <PetefromTn_> it is interesting to see tho that the driven end is close to the headstock so the screw PULLS the carriage towards the chuck and not the other way around.
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[03:40:13] <PetefromTn_> once the new motor is here I will get it ready to be installed and modify the motor mount plate however necessary to put that beast inside the base of the machine
[03:40:43] <XXCoder1> heh classic one https://i.chzbgr.com/maxW500/7185280512/hF93B98F7/
[03:41:22] <PetefromTn_> http://www.ebay.com/itm/2-Angular-Contact-7204B-20x47x14-20mm-47mm-14mm-Ball-Screw-Spindle-Ball-Bearings-/400241199508?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5d303c0994 those should work for my angular contact pair I think..
[03:42:07] <furrywolf> xxcoder: ... huh?
[03:42:19] <XXCoder1> ever watched aliens?
[03:43:38] <furrywolf> probably, a very long time ago. don't remember any of it.
[03:44:40] * furrywolf isn't a horror movie fan
[03:45:06] <XXCoder1> lol ok. basically he was painting facehugger egg
[03:45:11] <XXCoder1> oops lol
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[04:07:07] <PetefromTn_> this ballscrew's driven end is located behind a sheetmetal cover but I am wondering if I can get some kind of rubber seal to go on either side of the angular contact bearings..
[04:07:35] <Vertices> prob
[04:07:41] <Vertices> or a brush seal, whatever those are called
[04:07:42] <Vertices> sweeps?
[04:08:32] <PetefromTn_> one of the nicest features of this CNC lathe is that the ENTIRE Z ballscrew is under an L shaped cover and the cover even goes thru a slot in the carriage so it is probably not necessary but I kinda like to protect it if I can.
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[04:09:02] <PetefromTn_> it is actually sort of a Z shaped cover really.
[04:11:04] <PetefromTn_> this is gonna be one sweet little CNC lathe once I get it going. I can't wait to see it make chips!!
[04:12:32] <XXCoder1> nice
[04:12:39] <furrywolf> I can't wait to get mine going either, but it takes time, money, and energy, and I'm completely out of all three.
[04:13:37] <PetefromTn_> I have been also thinking about a way to add a pneumatic collet closer to the machine.
[04:14:25] <PetefromTn_> I now have a set of brand new 5C collets and I know they make 5c adapters for the spindle's D1-5 internal taper which is I think MT5 or something
[04:14:54] <PetefromTn_> so I figure a tubular drawbar
[04:15:43] <PetefromTn_> some kind of bearing equipped carrier on the other end of the headstock tube
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[04:16:25] <PetefromTn_> and then some sort of floating pneumatic cylinder that can be plumbed in to a regulated air supply I will be installing on the machine.
[04:18:37] <PetefromTn_> http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/tooling-parts-accessories-sale-wanted/royal-products-pneumatic-5c-collet-closer-10ee-274320/ something like this maybe
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[04:21:27] <furrywolf> $850?!
[04:21:45] <PetefromTn_> yup
[04:21:56] <PetefromTn_> I think I can probably make something similar for pretty cheap
[04:22:06] <furrywolf> I think you can buy a new machine with toolchanger for that.
[04:22:11] <furrywolf> (new used, that is)
[04:22:17] <PetefromTn_> yeah good luck with that
[04:25:23] <furrywolf> that's more money than I've spent on every machine tool and accessory I own combined...
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[04:27:17] <furrywolf> the sherline, the shoptask, the on-vehicle rotor lathe, the brake lathe,...
[04:28:10] <PetefromTn_> yeah and I bought a CNC vertical machining cente for $1350.00 so what is the point? I am more interested in how to make one than the price for that used one...
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[04:31:55] <PetefromTn_> http://www.cnczone.com/forums/haas-mills/38031-tl1-conversion-tube-cut-machine.html interesting version
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[04:34:50] <tiwake> http://tiwake.com/20150126_002.jpg
[04:35:15] <PetefromTn_> did you make those tiwake?
[04:35:23] <tiwake> earlier today, yeah
[04:35:41] <PetefromTn_> interesting, what are they?
[04:35:50] <XXCoder1> silceniers I guess heh
[04:35:54] <tiwake> muzzle brakes for a local gun smith
[04:36:11] <tiwake> silencers need an outer housing
[04:36:29] <PetefromTn_> what machines did you use? are they linuxCNC controlled?
[04:36:48] <unfy> if you're in the states, careful about stuff. feds want stupid monies ._.
[04:36:53] <tiwake> heh, no... an old wasino LJ-6MC
[04:37:03] <PetefromTn_> it's not a silencer..
[04:37:04] <tiwake> fanuc controller
[04:37:57] <tiwake> if its not a suppressor, a receiver, or armor piercing rounds, the feds don't care
[04:38:01] <PetefromTn_> nice is that a live tooled lathe?
[04:38:27] <tiwake> yeah, it has a C-axis... not really any other way you could make that heh
[04:38:28] <furrywolf> the cops have more than frequently shown they don't care what the actual laws are.
[04:38:30] <unfy> feds do care. see also, the ddtc / itar.
[04:38:52] <tiwake> unfy: ..?
[04:39:14] <unfy> wanna sell just cast lead bullets you made ? the ddtc / itar will want $2k/year in licensing.
[04:39:18] <furrywolf> and "shall not be infringed" seems to be ignored entirely.
[04:39:20] <tiwake> and actually they don't care if its a receiver that you don't sell
[04:39:44] <PetefromTn_> that looks like a sweet little turning center
[04:39:59] <tiwake> PetefromTn_: erm... little? lol
[04:40:08] <unfy> wanna sell moon clips for shooting semi auto rounds in revolvers ? the ddtc / itar will want $2k / year in licensing.
[04:40:09] <tiwake> its a monster lathe
[04:40:26] <tiwake> unfy: link?
[04:40:29] <unfy> (the 2k figure is 'minimum'
[04:40:32] <PetefromTn_> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpusmgkrQuA its this one no?
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[04:40:53] <tiwake> PetefromTn_: yeah, thats it
[04:41:13] <tiwake> PetefromTn_: the main spindle is 30hp and the live tooling motor is 7hp
[04:41:20] <unfy> tiwake: for the ddtc / itar ?
[04:41:25] <tiwake> unfy: yeah
[04:41:46] <furrywolf> bbl
[04:41:49] <PetefromTn_> looks like a typical turning center to me man? I have seen some that dwarf that thing.
[04:41:49] <unfy> i was.... looking up the ammo stuff a while back .... http://www.pmddtc.state.gov/regulations_laws/documents/official_itar/2012/ITAR_Part_121.pdf
[04:42:04] <unfy> that should be definitions
[04:42:19] <unfy> registration requirements: http://www.pmddtc.state.gov/regulations_laws/documents/official_itar/2012/ITAR_Part_122.pdf
[04:42:19] <furrywolf> 404
[04:42:26] <unfy> fuckin damnit
[04:42:56] <tiwake> PetefromTn_: heh, alright... tiz true there are some that are quite large... that I have never used before :P
[04:43:42] <furrywolf> bbl
[04:43:53] <PetefromTn_> don't feel bad man it dwarf's my new CNC lathe heh
[04:44:11] <tiwake> PetefromTn_: I have two of those LJ-6's actually
[04:44:27] <PetefromTn_> what does it weigh do you know?
[04:44:32] <unfy> tiwake: you can use https://www.pmddtc.state.gov/regulations_laws/itar.html to get the updated ddtc/itar stuff.
[04:44:41] <tiwake> 12k lbs?
[04:44:44] <unfy> http://www.progunleaders.org/DDTC/ would be an example of the ddtc/itar in action
[04:44:49] <tiwake> or was it 14k?
[04:45:33] <tiwake> unfy: oh, thats international?
[04:45:40] <unfy> that's just it... it's NOT
[04:45:59] <PetefromTn_> web says 11700
[04:46:24] <tiwake> PetefromTn_: seems right
[04:46:29] <tiwake> 12k lbs
[04:46:52] <PetefromTn_> nice it has a powered tailstock and live tooling tho. kick ass machine... do they ever come with a sub spindle?
[04:46:54] <unfy> http://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?SID=86008bdffd1fb2e79cc5df41a180750a&node=22:1.0.1.13.59&rgn=div5#se22.1.122_11 section (a): A manufacturer who does not engage in exporting must nevertheless register.
[04:47:38] <tiwake> PetefromTn_: donno... I do want a subspindle lathe though... might be the next machine purchase
[04:47:46] <tiwake> maybe brand new
[04:47:50] <PetefromTn_> where is your shop?
[04:47:58] <tiwake> tillamook oregon
[04:48:04] <tiwake> (USA)
[04:48:05] <PetefromTn_> ok nice
[04:48:19] <PetefromTn_> I am just a home shop CNC guy getting started.
[04:48:38] <unfy> the registration fee appears to have been removed from the document and moved to a "Statement of Registration" thing (form DS-2032) and blah blah blah. in 2013 this was $2,250 for tier 1 (low volume / little guys)
[04:48:40] <PetefromTn_> I have a Cincinatti Arrow 500 and just bought this Standard Modern CNC 14x40 lathe.
[04:49:47] <tiwake> unfy: but it does not really say register for what though
[04:50:13] <unfy> as in get your name in the ddtc/itar record book.
[04:50:35] <unfy> they also have paperwork records requirements and other garbage
[04:51:07] <PetefromTn_> does that thing have constant surface speed?
[04:51:16] <tiwake> yeah
[04:51:24] <PetefromTn_> sweet
[04:51:52] <PetefromTn_> do you just manually deburr those holes or is there another op?
[04:52:20] <tiwake> uh, the outer part gets turned anyway, so there isnt much point to deburring
[04:52:34] <PetefromTn_> nice
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[04:52:43] <tiwake> the one hole on the end gets prettied up though
[04:52:48] <PetefromTn_> what rifles is this for?
[04:52:53] <tiwake> any
[04:52:57] <PetefromTn_> thread?
[04:53:18] <tiwake> 1/2-28, as is standard for threaded gun barrels
[04:53:35] <PetefromTn_> dunno never made one... thanks for the information.
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[04:55:49] <tiwake> lemme show you more pictures
[04:56:08] <PetefromTn_> knock yerself out LOL
[04:56:35] <unfy> give ya food for thought.... a bit of warning.... and now for the general statement: cool :D
[04:56:43] <tiwake> PetefromTn_: http://tiwake.com/20141023_001.jpg
[04:57:04] <unfy> (i do happen to reload ammo and stuff)
[04:57:07] <PetefromTn_> nice what diameter?
[04:57:19] <tiwake> unfy: I have no idea what it is though, and everything I read does not say what its purpose is
[04:57:39] <tiwake> unfy: I do too :3
[04:57:55] <unfy> tiwake: ddtc/itar is all about trade secrets / intel back traces etc.
[04:58:26] <unfy> and, it's supposed to be *international* trading stuff... but even if you don't do international, they still insist you register.
[04:58:34] <tiwake> PetefromTn_: 6" diameter, 5.7" long blanks if I recall
[04:58:55] <tiwake> unfy: but there are no trade secrets...
[04:58:57] <PetefromTn_> oh they looked bigger than that.
[04:59:18] <unfy> oh, and the moon clips i mention are secretive ? they don't care.
[04:59:20] <PetefromTn_> 30 HP must make short work of turning those down
[05:00:01] <PetefromTn_> those brakes were ally?
[05:00:26] <tiwake> PetefromTn_: heh yeah... use a big 2.5" spade drill.. push that thing quite hard
[05:00:32] <unfy> the definitions section of the thing define you as a manufacterer (121). and then section 122 says that you must register.
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[05:04:22] <PetefromTn_> tiwake have you ever made anything very complex contoured on the lathe?
[05:04:50] <tiwake> PetefromTn_: no cams, if thats what you mean
[05:05:14] <PetefromTn_> no not cams
[05:05:15] <unfy> a local metal head was also making / selling his own hornady lnl ap shell plates back in 2012 when EVERYTHING was in short supply :D
[05:05:36] <PetefromTn_> I am trying to wrap my head around a part I need to make once the lathe is online
[05:05:56] <PetefromTn_> it is like a 6" diameter 6061 disk with some curvy contours in its face
[05:06:13] <PetefromTn_> but the contours have back reliefs in them
[05:06:55] <PetefromTn_> so it will probably take some custom ground tools and two operations.
[05:08:22] <tiwake> PetefromTn_: https://www.dropbox.com/s/vfxg2afzdrx2465/20131023_001.jpg?dl=0
[05:08:55] <tiwake> thats two operations, the front nose end is done first
[05:10:28] <PetefromTn_> is that bronze or something?
[05:10:37] <tiwake> copper
[05:11:21] <PetefromTn_> interesting but that is not really what I am talking about.
[05:11:26] <tiwake> :P
[05:12:29] <CaptHindsight> PetefromTn_: how much power do you have into your house?
[05:12:37] <PetefromTn_> not enough LOL
[05:12:47] <PetefromTn_> why?
[05:12:51] <CaptHindsight> yeah was thinking about the new 7.5hp addition
[05:13:02] <unfy> tiwake: powder coating cast bullets is pretty neat, too btw
[05:13:10] <CaptHindsight> and you already have the big Cincinnati
[05:13:28] <PetefromTn_> big is relative
[05:13:43] <PetefromTn_> should not be a problem tho
[05:13:50] <CaptHindsight> I'm running out and I have 208V 3p
[05:13:54] <CaptHindsight> 200A
[05:14:15] <PetefromTn_> I have run my old lathe and the cincinatti and the compressor etc etc before
[05:14:44] <PetefromTn_> probably don't want to be cooking in the kitchen, running the laundry, and trying to run parts on both machines at the same time tho hehe.
[05:14:50] <tiwake> unfy: what?
[05:15:20] <PetefromTn_> honestly I have had the Cincinatti running a good bit lately and my power bills have been pretty low so far
[05:15:29] <unfy> powder coat cast lead bullets instead of using lube.
[05:15:30] <CaptHindsight> sorry kids no toast while dads milling
[05:15:33] <PetefromTn_> it must be the new AC unit
[05:15:49] <PetefromTn_> my power bill for this month believe it or not was only $85.00
[05:16:13] <PetefromTn_> last year my power was nearly $400.00
[05:16:40] <CaptHindsight> yeah old AC units can be awful
[05:16:50] <tiwake> unfy: using lube... on bullets?
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[05:17:03] <PetefromTn_> honestly as I said in here we were air conditioning our crawlspace and the emergency heat was mostly doing the job.
[05:17:03] <tiwake> unfy: why would anyone want grease on a bullet?
[05:17:10] <unfy> tiwake: i guess you don't cast your own bullets ?
[05:17:16] <tiwake> no
[05:17:33] <CaptHindsight> I had a old window ac unit a few years ago that was under 20K btu but drew the same power as something 3x the size new
[05:17:42] <tiwake> casting lead is too boring for me
[05:17:48] <tiwake> :P
[05:17:54] <unfy> ah, there will be grooves in the bullet, typically covered by the case mouth, has a waxy lube in it
[05:17:54] <PetefromTn_> I had hopes the new AC unit would be more efficient but so far it is freakin' amazing..
[05:18:15] <tiwake> ohhh... I know what you are talking about now
[05:18:19] <CaptHindsight> yeah HVAC units have come a long way
[05:18:23] <tiwake> then why not say wax?
[05:18:47] <PetefromTn_> house is always nice and warm and it seems to be running less. truth be told tho it has been a very warm winter so far here.
[05:18:53] <unfy> cause it's not wax. it's bullet lube.
[05:19:06] <unfy> (home made can be 50% beeswax, 50% lithium grease)
[05:19:20] <tiwake> uh, ok
[05:19:38] <tiwake> if I make bullets they will be from solid copper rod, turned in a lathe
[05:19:40] <unfy> lube is just the official / proper name. cause it is a lube heh
[05:20:30] <PetefromTn_> http://i.imgur.com/oyqU87E.jpg gotta turn some more of these once the lathe is online heh
[05:20:58] <tiwake> that looks pretty fancy
[05:21:10] <PetefromTn_> yeah I make a bunch of different flavors
[05:21:15] <CaptHindsight> I had the 10hp matsuura on a 30A 3P breaker and only tripped it once
[05:21:59] <CaptHindsight> I accidentally ran the Z down to fast with a large facemill into aluminum
[05:22:02] <PetefromTn_> once the CNC lathe is up and running I want to experiment with turning the shape in the disk first before CNC milling the pockets
[05:22:24] <CaptHindsight> other than that it never draws close to what the breakers are rated for
[05:22:29] <PetefromTn_> yeah I have the Cinci on a 60 amp single phase breaker and never had a problem so far.
[05:22:57] <PetefromTn_> the worst load I put it under was the other day my friend was over who is also a CNC machinist
[05:23:08] <PetefromTn_> and we were chatting while I was setting up a part
[05:23:21] <CaptHindsight> man it was trying, if it was on the 70A breaker it probably would have ripped through the aluminum
[05:23:23] <tiwake> I see where this is going
[05:23:55] <PetefromTn_> it was a 2" wide 1" thick 6061 piece and I was running a 3/8 endmill in a peel milling operation around the perimeter working my way in at full depth
[05:24:14] <PetefromTn_> only while I was distracted talking to him I forgot to cut the short piece to the correct length
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[05:24:43] <PetefromTn_> so when it came around the corner on the long end it basically went full width full depth thru the part 2" across
[05:24:57] <PetefromTn_> it slowed the spindle a bit and scared the piss out of me
[05:25:02] <PetefromTn_> but it ripped right thru
[05:25:11] <PetefromTn_> and it was just a finishing endmill really
[05:25:16] <CaptHindsight> yeah you hear the change in pitch and you start to look around
[05:25:29] <PetefromTn_> oh there was DEFINITELY a change in pitch LOL
[05:25:40] <PetefromTn_> I am amazed the cutter did not snap right off
[05:25:44] <CaptHindsight> I was milling one day with the shop door closed and a tornado passed by closely
[05:25:46] <PetefromTn_> it was going like 30IPM
[05:26:08] <CaptHindsight> I heard a rumble and could feel the floor shake so it stopped the machine
[05:26:11] <PetefromTn_> spindle was turning like 5500 RPM
[05:26:25] <CaptHindsight> it/I
[05:26:36] <PetefromTn_> is this that big matsu you bought recently?
[05:26:41] <CaptHindsight> then i realized that it was the building that was shaking
[05:26:49] <CaptHindsight> yeah
[05:26:52] <PetefromTn_> I bet you shit your jeans heh
[05:27:24] <CaptHindsight> ran to the door to watch purple rain go by sideways :)
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[05:27:44] <PetefromTn_> when I worked in the first shop down south a guy crashed the hell out of a bid HAAS turning center one day.
[05:27:48] <PetefromTn_> that was LOUD
[05:27:57] <PetefromTn_> pieces went flying
[05:28:13] <CaptHindsight> is was over 1/4 mile away but it sounded louder than the actual trains about that far from the shop
[05:28:18] <PetefromTn_> but the noise kinda went right thru everyone in the building like a cold chill
[05:28:39] <CaptHindsight> yeah, that will wake you up
[05:28:51] <PetefromTn_> yup and not in a nice way hehehe
[05:29:15] <PetefromTn_> I am kinda glad my new CNC lathe ONLY has 7.5HP...
[05:29:25] <PetefromTn_> 30 plus HP has a way of rearranging stuff
[05:29:45] <tiwake> yeah
[05:29:59] <tiwake> machine does not care about tooling so much at that point
[05:30:34] <PetefromTn_> I think also a turning center like that is one of the easiest machines to crash too lots of complex movement and clearances etc.
[05:30:38] <tiwake> ...or tool holders
[05:31:21] <CaptHindsight> I've picked up a few lathes that were crashed with sheared gears
[05:31:41] <tiwake> unfy: I asked a lawyer friend about that... see what he says
[05:32:05] <unfy> tiwake: wise.
[05:32:18] <PetefromTn_> OK angular contact bearings for the Z screw are ordered and on their way!
[05:32:37] <PetefromTn_> Time to hit the sack I think... gonna work some more on this stuff tomorrow.
[05:32:49] <PetefromTn_> tiwake thanks for sharing your pics man
[05:33:06] <CaptHindsight> I have rebuild the spindle on the matsuura, will probably go with a 10K rpm next
[05:33:23] <PetefromTn_> does it have a cartridge spindle?
[05:33:31] <CaptHindsight> i think that is why he sold it for so low
[05:33:38] <CaptHindsight> yes
[05:33:53] <PetefromTn_> thats nice at least you can just unbolt it and take it down
[05:34:07] <PetefromTn_> my machine apparenlty you have to do inside the head casting
[05:34:15] <PetefromTn_> not looking foward to that.
[05:34:37] <PetefromTn_> right now the spindle sounds pretty good so hopefully it will be awhile.
[05:34:53] <PetefromTn_> probably looking at $1k for the bearings or so.
[05:36:03] <PetefromTn_> well Gn8 folks...
[05:36:15] <CaptHindsight> g'nite
[05:36:27] <PetefromTn_> :D
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[05:36:34] <CaptHindsight> hasta banana
[05:38:03] <CaptHindsight> http://www.matsuura.co.uk/news/2013/07/24/careers-at-matsuura-2013/ the tech is wearing gloves and clean suit
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[05:56:52] <jj1212> just wonder would a 5 axis system with galvo(AB) + gantry (XYZ), if i were to use a CAM software to generate is it a must to look for a CAM software which support to up 5-axis?
[06:01:14] <archivist> jj1212, it greatly depends on what you are making and if you can do some cheating and translation of one axis to another
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[06:07:17] <tjtr33> thats 'hostile banana' btw. if any BBB user in here, Darek Malloy has a nic ebook on it (& great youtube tutorials as well )
[06:11:32] <jj1212> hmm... could not quite get the mean of "cheating and translation of one axis to another". I have a small scan area for my galvo, thus I need to use addition movement from gantry to move around my work area for sintering purpose
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[07:59:32] <Deejay> moin
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[09:28:24] <shadowjack> What is the status of s-curve acceleration in linuxcnc?
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[09:49:49] <akex2> Hy all
[09:50:22] <akex2> Can i disable a anti gouging protection on linux cnc ?
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[09:53:35] <Tom_itx> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/gcode/gcode.html#sec:G61-G61_1
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[10:38:47] <Bushman> http://cursors.io/
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[11:30:56] <anonimasu> hello
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[12:43:11] <jthornton> something reset the usage meter, it was at 9GB the other day and now it is at 1GB!
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[12:45:13] <archivist> overflowed?
[12:45:52] <archivist> did it send a carry to the control
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[13:06:43] <shadowjack__> Got my chinese frame for 6040 router. Time to start build!
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[13:09:43] <malcom2073> Piecing together your own?
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[13:20:04] <shadowjack> all stock parts from aliexpress, but not kit
[13:20:14] <shadowjack> kit controllers are crap
[13:21:24] <malcom2073> Yeah that's what I hear
[13:21:31] <malcom2073> Gecko G540 makes for a good replacement :)
[13:22:03] <shadowjack> mechanics are ballscrew
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[13:41:30] <jthornton> any docs on the EMBED_TAB_COMMAND on how it works?
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[14:50:08] <jdh> my 6040 electronics vastly exceeded expectations.
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[14:53:29] <PetefromTn_> morning LinuxCNC
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[15:02:53] <malcom2073> jdh: New or old? I've heard the new revisions have gotten better
[15:03:51] <Rab> jdh, jow about the hardware?
[15:03:56] <Rab> er, how
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[15:04:57] <malcom2073> jdh: Also, how are your rails? The one I checked out in person, if you put much force on the gantry, the rails had a decent amount of play in them as the bearings stretched out, which is what stopped me from buying one, but his was an early one
[15:05:23] <akex2> Tom_itx: If G61 is for me, don't work ..
[15:06:42] <jdh> newish from carving-cnc
[15:07:50] <jdh> havent noticed any excessive flex. only cut plastics on it though
[15:08:29] <jdh> fix your code to remove the gouging code
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[16:49:27] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/man/man9/gladevcp.9.html ?
[16:49:39] <Tom_itx> http://linuxcnc.org/lucid/emc2/index.php/french/forum/41-guis/26550-lathe-macros?start=90
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[16:52:49] <skunkworks_> http://www.cnczone.com/forums/linear-and-rotary-motion/257388-software.html
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[17:05:08] <PetefromTn_> Hey guys
[17:05:16] <PetefromTn_> quick question for you.
[17:05:40] <PetefromTn_> I am trying to design the ballscrew mounting for the Z axis on the lathe based on what the mounts are etc.
[17:06:43] <PetefromTn_> the driven end of the screw will go thru the pair of angular contacts
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[17:06:51] <PetefromTn_> and it is 20mm bore there
[17:07:26] <PetefromTn_> so I need to have a threaded section long enough to have two fine thread nuts that lock each other together locking down the preloaded pair
[17:08:30] <PetefromTn_> I was thinking of going with an M20x 1.5 mm thread there and use two of the thin threaded nuts from mcmaster
[17:09:17] <PetefromTn_> major diameter should be able to fit thru the bearings nice and snug without problems and it would allow me to put a hardened washer against the shoulder
[17:09:28] <PetefromTn_> is there a particular thread that would be better?
[17:12:29] <Connor> That sounds good to me.
[17:13:42] <PetefromTn_> OK
[17:13:57] <PetefromTn_> I am trying to make up a little drawing of the new screw so I can get it ordered here soon
[17:14:09] <PetefromTn_> already got the angular contacts ordered
[17:14:18] <PetefromTn_> removed the old X axis motor last night
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[17:15:10] <PetefromTn_> just trying to get this beotch ready for the retrofit here LOL
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[17:31:47] <anonimasu> PCW: Hey, are you active and online?
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[17:31:58] <anonimasu> PCW: I have a issue with the bldc and 8i20s
[17:32:03] <anonimasu> how would I swap a axis direction >D
[17:32:50] <pcw_home> DRO reads wrong?
[17:33:02] <anonimasu> no it jogs inverse of what I want
[17:33:13] <anonimasu> along with reading inverse
[17:34:13] <anonimasu> I have no clue exactly what I need to swap/change to make it work
[17:34:22] <pcw_home> OK so DRO reads wrong so first thing is fix that
[17:35:10] <pcw_home> (thats actually how to start any servo setup, get the DRO reading right first)
[17:35:31] <anonimasu> yeah, but what settings affects the commutation
[17:35:39] <anonimasu> (after)
[17:35:58] <anonimasu> it commutates perfectly, but the axis goes the wrong dir :)
[17:36:12] <anonimasu> this is with the abs encoders(btw)
[17:36:42] <pcw_home> arent they incremental when running?
[17:36:46] <anonimasu> yeah
[17:37:07] <anonimasu> I can swap A/B to make it go in the other dir(to match(
[17:37:22] <anonimasu> but what after with the bldc scale and output scale?
[17:37:24] <pcw_home> so to get the DRO right you invert the encoder scale
[17:37:57] <pcw_home> to get the commutation right you invert the bldc encoder scale
[17:38:20] <anonimasu> and keep the output scale set where it is?
[17:38:28] <pcw_home> you may neet to invert the PID output not sure
[17:38:38] <pcw_home> (too many coin flips)
[17:39:06] <anonimasu> mhm, that is strange.
[17:39:29] <pcw_home> so a good setup order is DRO,commutation, feedback
[17:40:29] <anonimasu> so it\s a matter of swapping the encoder scale, nothing more
[17:40:37] <anonimasu> and flipping the bldc scale..
[17:40:48] <anonimasu> (and pid)
[17:40:55] <pcw_home> yep
[17:40:58] <anonimasu> tho wouldnt that be the same as to change the output scale?
[17:41:22] <Tom_itx> would it work to swap 2 of the wires on the bldc?
[17:41:50] <pcw_home> no that mucks with the commutation angle
[17:42:00] <anonimasu> then I have to offset the commutation angle
[17:42:03] <anonimasu> :)
[17:42:13] <Tom_itx> k
[17:42:59] <pcw_home> it reverses comutation direction but adds/subtracts 120 degrees (IIKWITA)
[17:43:01] <PetefromTn_> I never messed with bldc motors I always thought they were just DC motors but apparently that is not the case as they have an ac commutation apparently. Interesting
[17:43:28] <pcw_home> they are 3 phase synchonous motors
[17:43:35] <anonimasu> I had a takeoff before.
[17:43:54] <anonimasu> it threw the sled on the x axis off the rails halfway almost into the wall.
[17:44:06] <pcw_home> Takeoff is good, it means commutation is right!
[17:44:11] <anonimasu> more then 40m/min
[17:44:11] <Tom_itx> you can't invert the SCALE on the axis?
[17:44:35] <PetefromTn_> encoder scale negative..
[17:44:44] <pcw_home> yes you can (but scale is just a INI file construct)
[17:45:32] * anonimasu wants a bldc inversion pin
[17:45:33] <pcw_home> it will change the encoder scale negative as pete says which will reverse the commutation direction
[17:45:38] <Tom_itx> heh
[17:46:11] <pcw_home> yeah its over specified so there are too many choices
[17:46:29] <PetefromTn_> sweet my new angular contacts have shipped!
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[17:46:48] <PetefromTn_> ya gotta chop down the damn three one swing at a time I always say hehehe
[17:46:53] <Tom_itx> i wonder if chicago got snowed in
[17:46:59] <PetefromTn_> we did
[17:47:00] <pcw_home> I want the spin&win BLDC parameter generator
[17:47:08] <PetefromTn_> LOL
[17:47:08] <Tom_itx> my stuff is stuck there if they did
[17:47:48] <Tom_itx> but that update was 2 days ago so who knows
[17:48:07] <Tom_itx> usps tracking sucks
[17:48:08] <PetefromTn_> right now I am trying to decide if I can get away with stripping and spraying the big sheetmetal pieces on the machine or I need to strip the whole damn thing down
[17:48:32] <anonimasu> PCW: I think I will go and try it when I run to the store later to see if I can get it sorted as soon as possible
[17:48:36] <anonimasu> :)
[17:48:46] <anonimasu> bbl dinnertime
[17:48:52] <pcw_home> is not
[17:48:54] <Tom_itx> anonimasu you been stayin busy?
[17:48:56] <PetefromTn_> dinnertime?
[17:49:13] <anonimasu> Tom_itx: insanely
[17:49:22] <Tom_itx> still at dad's shop?
[17:49:23] <anonimasu> Tom_itx: and I had a new machine day(new old(
[17:49:28] <PetefromTn_> jeez whats that freakin' like ?
[17:49:36] <anonimasu> outgrowing it :S
[17:49:40] <Tom_itx> good
[17:49:49] <anonimasu> maho mh700s
[17:49:55] <roycroft> i don't know if you're like me, petefromtn_, but i would likely strip and shoot the sheetmetal, do the rest of the machine rebuild, and then when it's all done wish i had stripped the whole thing down, and proceed to do that
[17:50:13] <PetefromTn_> heh probably
[17:50:15] <anonimasu> (pallet changer) and horizontal/vertical head and full 4th
[17:50:28] <Tom_itx> you got software to program the 4th?
[17:50:33] <anonimasu> yep
[17:50:35] <PetefromTn_> but the electronics cabinet it pretty large. might just be easier to strip and shoot in place
[17:50:38] <Tom_itx> what are you using?
[17:50:44] <anonimasu> bobcad
[17:50:48] <Tom_itx> ahh
[17:51:01] <anonimasu> I have the basic 4axis since a long time ago I planned ahead
[17:51:26] <anonimasu> its enough for all that I plan on doing
[17:51:32] <Tom_itx> most of what you cut is steel isn't it?
[17:51:55] <anonimasu> aluminium/steel/hard steel/titanium on the way
[17:52:38] <Tom_itx> well, go eat
[17:52:45] <anonimasu> I have a whole shitload of products that I couldnt make before due to half manual machine) that I will run on tombstones now
[17:52:51] <Tom_itx> almost lunchtime here
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[17:53:08] <anonimasu> laters!
[17:53:12] <Tom_itx> 2 pallet?
[17:53:15] <anonimasu> yep
[17:53:22] <Tom_itx> we had an okuma with a 2 pallet changer
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[17:53:37] <anonimasu> 36 tool mag
[17:53:47] <Tom_itx> it had 90+ iirc
[17:53:51] <Tom_itx> one had 119
[17:53:53] <PetefromTn_> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzL6f_AxQN0 Holy crap that is a neat machine..
[17:54:00] <Tom_itx> on a belt
[17:54:47] <Tom_itx> in a cage behind the machine
[17:54:47] <anonimasu> PetefromTn_: yep
[17:55:03] <anonimasu> :)
[17:55:06] <PetefromTn_> didn't know it was five axis..
[17:55:24] <anonimasu> this one I have is 4 + vertical head too
[17:55:45] <anonimasu> so 4 and 1/2
[17:55:48] <PetefromTn_> does it have that funky mechanized table..
[17:55:58] <anonimasu> no
[17:56:07] <PetefromTn_> OK
[17:56:11] <anonimasu> just a rotary
[17:56:24] <anonimasu> *on the table like that
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[17:56:46] <PetefromTn_> what year is it?
[17:56:56] <anonimasu> 1989
[17:57:18] <PetefromTn_> nice where are you located?
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[17:57:23] <anonimasu> north sweden
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[17:57:34] <Tom_itx> still with that gal from damascus?
[17:57:38] <PetefromTn_> cool go eat lunch man er dinner...
[17:57:40] <anonimasu> yep
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[17:57:52] <anonimasu> not from damascus maedonia :D
[17:57:58] <Tom_itx> ahh yeah
[17:58:03] <Tom_itx> short memory
[17:58:11] <anonimasu> same here, anyway lates
[17:58:17] <anonimasu> gotta eat
[17:58:35] <PetefromTn_> amazes me how global this forum is...
[17:59:30] <PetefromTn_> jeez man talk about an origami complex toolchanger system hehe
[18:01:36] <marmite> http://www.ebay.com/itm/171653359607?_trksid=p2059210.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT just bougt
[18:01:45] <marmite> anyone have a idea for a pump ?
[18:03:33] <PetefromTn_> there are those venturi blocks if you have a decent compressor?
[18:03:58] <SpeedEvil> Shopvac can get to ~1/3 bar in some cases
[18:07:13] <PetefromTn_> thats pretty cheap unfortunately no US shipping apparently
[18:07:28] <PetefromTn_> I need to just machine one like I have been planning to do
[18:07:42] <_methods> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vacuum-table-VT2012-CNC-Clamps-Engraving-or-Milling-/281552058255
[18:07:47] <_methods> there ya go
[18:07:50] <_methods> in the usa
[18:07:53] <Rab> SpeedEvil, does it hold up to a long session without airflow?
[18:08:15] <PetefromTn_> too small really
[18:08:47] <PetefromTn_> I have two powerful shop vacs here I wonder how much suction they could provide
[18:08:51] <_methods> i've never actually used one except one that was built into a cnc router at a cabinet shop i worked at
[18:08:52] <marmite> yeah well have found a good table allready^^
[18:08:54] <PetefromTn_> probably not too good for the vac tho.
[18:08:58] <marmite> but a good vacuum pump
[18:09:19] <Vertices> here's a better Maho vid https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bO7st-UxeY8
[18:09:23] <PetefromTn_> decent vacuum pumps are relatively cheap
[18:10:06] <marmite> yeah problem is i dont really know mutch about vacuum pumps
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[18:10:39] <PetefromTn_> dig that crazy toolchanger man...
[18:10:56] <Vertices> it's a little too smart
[18:11:17] <marmite> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Air-or-Vacuum-Pump-for-Wide-Format-Printers-24V-4-4W-US-Fast-Shipping-/300875195632?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item460d8f24f0 i dont know if this could work :D
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[18:12:14] <PetefromTn_> no way check out how that vertical head swings away like that COOOL>
[18:12:24] <Tom_itx> PetefromTn_, program that changer for lcnc
[18:12:50] <PetefromTn_> shiiiit I can't even get my damn dog simple umbrella done hehehhe
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[18:13:17] <SpeedEvil> Rab: you need to arrange some airflow - there has to be a leak
[18:13:49] <SpeedEvil> Rab: but - in the 'low flow' part of the curve - the aerofoil is mostly stalled, and not drawing much current
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[18:15:11] <PetefromTn_> that really is quite an amazing machine
[18:17:54] <Vertices> yeah but I dont trust it
[18:18:16] <Vertices> way too much complexity = way too many failure points
[18:19:16] <PetefromTn_> dunno man it looks pretty damn beefy to me and hey it's german right?
[18:19:27] <Vertices> beefy ok
[18:20:03] <Vertices> i still dont trust rube goldbergy shit
[18:20:31] <Vertices> honestly those tool changes look like they take more time than a dude would
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[18:27:25] <PetefromTn_> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B5LC8qB49HU hows that for a trunnion table hehe
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[18:35:22] <roycroft> so what's the consensus, if there is one, on buying used made in usa jacobs chucks on ebay vs. buying new chinese chucks?
[18:35:51] <roycroft> the drill chuck on my milling machine is starting to cause me grief, and it's a no-name chinese chuck
[18:35:52] <Tom_itx> if it's in good shape i'd get the jacobs
[18:36:05] <roycroft> i doubt disassembling it and cleaning it will do me any good
[18:36:15] <roycroft> a jacobs for a decent price seems like the thing to do
[18:36:29] <roycroft> as long as the rebuild kit for it is still available
[18:37:02] <roycroft> just looking around, i'm seeing 16N chucks going for $60-$75
[18:37:13] <roycroft> and rebuild kits for them are $125-$150
[18:37:21] <roycroft> a brand new chinese made 16N is about $200
[18:37:38] <roycroft> so worst case i would pay slightly more for a us-made one plus the rebuild kit
[18:37:48] <roycroft> and best case i get lucky and the $60 chuck is like new
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[18:58:21] <jdh> it is sometimes expensive being cheap
[19:02:03] <zeeshan|2> roycroft: if it worked before
[19:02:06] <zeeshan|2> it might need cleaning
[19:02:11] <zeeshan|2> unless youve got worn jaws
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[19:13:44] <MattyMatt> http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/general/jacobs-16n-chuck-259383/ it seems you just got to avoid the 2011 ones from the first year of chinese production
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[19:19:25] <MattyMatt> PetefromTn_, is that spindle pushing the carousel away on a spring? that saves a motor I guess
[19:21:48] <PetefromTn_> not sure what you are asking..
[19:23:05] <PetefromTn_> I'll tell you what for a CNC lathe that was built in Canada and uses a lot of metric components this thing sure has a TON of 1/4-20 screws on it LOL
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[19:24:11] <CaptHindsight> zeeshan|2: feel like running to fedex?
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[19:43:50] <_methods> https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1133560316/black-swift-tiny-wireless-computer
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[19:56:09] <zeeshan|2> CaptHindsight: no!
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[19:56:13] <zeeshan|2> school mail system will take care of it
[19:56:14] <zeeshan|2> hehe
[19:57:14] <CaptHindsight> guess the storms delayed it
[19:58:32] <jdh> what storms
[19:58:32] <zeeshan|2> https://www.flickr.com/photos/128539016@N05/15762754743/
[19:58:35] <zeeshan|2> trigger wheel came out good
[19:59:31] <CaptHindsight> jdh: http://www.weather.com/storms/winter/video/how-much-snow-did-you-get
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[20:13:41] <jdh> I got rained on during last nights bike ride.
[20:13:48] <zeeshan|2> jdh
[20:13:56] <zeeshan|2> that is the sign to start working on the lathe!
[20:13:59] <jdh> but, it was still 50f
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[20:14:34] <_methods> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=ly.mens.checkyourprivilege
[20:16:41] <_methods> zeeshan|2: where'd you get the ajxu?
[20:17:16] <zeeshan|2> ajxu?
[20:17:34] <_methods> yes that cutter in your flickr feed
[20:17:39] <_methods> the mitsubishi ajxu
[20:17:52] <zeeshan|2> it came with a big lot of tools i bought
[20:17:55] <_methods> damn
[20:17:59] <_methods> well you scored there
[20:18:05] <_methods> that is one bad ass cutter
[20:18:30] <zeeshan|2> ive honestly only used it in cast iron
[20:18:33] <zeeshan|2> it was okay on the bridgeport
[20:18:43] <_methods> wtf you used in the bridgeport
[20:18:46] <zeeshan|2> haha
[20:18:53] <_methods> did you even look at teh feeds and speeds for that
[20:19:05] <_methods> you might want to take a look at that lol
[20:19:07] <zeeshan|2> no
[20:19:15] <_methods> yeah well that's not a normal cutter man
[20:19:37] <zeeshan|2> know some values of the top of your head?
[20:19:39] <zeeshan|2> for like steel?
[20:20:05] <_methods> not off the top of my head you really need to look them up
[20:20:13] <_methods> http://www.mitsubishicarbide.com/mmc/en/product/pdf/b/b028g.pdf
[20:21:01] <_methods> the insert you have on there will determine your correct feeds and speeds
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[20:23:17] <_methods> with the fh7020 insert looks like in cast iron you need to be cutting with about 150m/min
[20:23:18] <zeeshan|2> looks like its a type P
[20:23:31] <zeeshan|2> so wrong insert to begin with for cast iron
[20:23:32] <zeeshan|2> haha
[20:23:37] <_methods> yeah
[20:23:46] <_methods> it will work for both i think
[20:24:01] <_methods> the fh7020 grade
[20:25:07] <_methods> hehe your bridgeport can't rapid fast enough for that thing
[20:25:32] <zeeshan|2> i wish tehse guys would tell me the cutting edge radius
[20:25:47] <zeeshan|2> cause then you can figure out what the minimum feed rate you need so you dont plough
[20:26:07] <_methods> on what?
[20:26:15] <_methods> it should be on every insert box
[20:26:22] <PetefromTn_> hey any of you guys familiar with the Heidenhain 151 control?
[20:26:35] <zeeshan|2> PetefromTn_: thats what i had
[20:26:49] <PetefromTn_> on what?
[20:27:00] <zeeshan|2> _methods it looks like theyre recommending 1.4mm doc (.050~)
[20:27:13] <zeeshan|2> i vaguely remember it wasnt happy at 100 though doc
[20:27:17] <zeeshan|2> but at 60 ish it was okay
[20:27:46] <zeeshan|2> hm that cant be right
[20:27:53] <zeeshan|2> theyre saying .059 in/tooth
[20:27:54] <zeeshan|2> lol
[20:28:31] <zeeshan|2> 70.8 ipm
[20:28:33] <zeeshan|2> ..!!
[20:28:39] <zeeshan|2> yea i was not running anywhere close to that
[20:28:43] <zeeshan|2> PetefromTn_: on the mill
[20:29:22] <zeeshan|2> okay i found the values for cutting edge radius.
[20:29:26] <zeeshan|2> it is .059"
[20:29:40] <zeeshan|2> shit, so if you go slower than 70 ipm on steel
[20:29:44] <zeeshan|2> you're pretty much ploughing
[20:30:49] <PetefromTn_> I have a friend who has asked me to work a bit in ANOTHER shop that has a bridgeport interact 1 with that control on it and I don't know anything about it.
[20:31:10] <zeeshan|2> it uses conversational programming
[20:31:35] <PetefromTn_> only?
[20:31:42] <zeeshan|2> yea
[20:31:48] <PetefromTn_> shit
[20:32:03] <zeeshan|2> you can learn it
[20:32:05] <zeeshan|2> im sure its not hard
[20:32:13] <PetefromTn_> do you know how to program fixture offsets in it?
[20:32:20] <zeeshan|2> no , sorry
[20:32:20] <zeeshan|2> http://content.heidenhain.de/doku/oma_controls/CD1/tnc/151_155a/gb/22504124.pdf
[20:32:39] <zeeshan|2> its 316 pages
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[20:32:44] <zeeshan|2> but it looks like its mostly pictures lol
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[20:33:08] <PetefromTn_> thx
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[20:33:20] <zeeshan|2> they have examples
[20:33:21] <zeeshan|2> but theyre in german
[20:33:25] <zeeshan|2> http://content.heidenhain.de/doku/oma_controls/dvd_oma_html/de/index/N12DA1/N12E50/N13C2A/N13C2A.html
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[20:35:40] <Connor> zeeshan|2: Did you buy a manual mill with power feed ?
[20:35:48] <zeeshan|2> i did
[20:35:50] <zeeshan|2> but its sold
[20:35:57] <Connor> You sold it ?
[20:35:59] <zeeshan|2> it was a column mill pos
[20:36:01] <zeeshan|2> er
[20:36:04] <zeeshan|2> round column mill
[20:36:16] <Connor> Why did you buy it ?
[20:36:21] <zeeshan|2> it was cheap
[20:36:34] <zeeshan|2> i got it for 200 bux ( i forget exact number)
[20:36:36] <Connor> you make any money on selling it ?
[20:36:38] <zeeshan|2> and i sold it for 1400
[20:36:49] <Connor> Damn, you did good.
[20:37:05] <Connor> Why in the heck did they sell it for 200?
[20:37:06] <zeeshan|2> the guy wanted something small, if he bought it brand new itd cost me 3000+tax
[20:37:17] <zeeshan|2> Connor: floor space per month was too much
[20:37:23] <zeeshan|2> im still bitter i couldnt pick up that monarch lathe
[20:37:29] <zeeshan|2> he wanted 300 for that huge lathe.
[20:37:40] <zeeshan|2> and there was an edm for 700
[20:37:41] <zeeshan|2> sodick
[20:37:50] <zeeshan|2> er 800
[20:37:56] <zeeshan|2> o well
[20:38:11] <PetefromTn_> thats funny you hated that milll and art and I liked ours...
[20:38:22] <zeeshan|2> PetefromTn_: i only needed to try it once to hate it
[20:38:23] <zeeshan|2> lol
[20:38:27] <zeeshan|2> coming from the bridgeport clone
[20:38:30] <zeeshan|2> i can hope you can see why
[20:38:42] <PetefromTn_> honestly I hated my bridgeport clone sold it.
[20:38:50] <zeeshan|2> you cant even compare the two man
[20:38:55] <zeeshan|2> the bridgeport clone is a real mill
[20:39:00] <zeeshan|2> this thing was a toy
[20:39:08] <PetefromTn_> its just a bench mill man
[20:39:12] <zeeshan|2> exactly
[20:39:18] <zeeshan|2> for that same price
[20:39:21] <zeeshan|2> i'd pick up a rf45
[20:39:31] <PetefromTn_> you would probably hate that too.
[20:42:38] <PetefromTn_> man that heidenhain looks old school
[20:42:57] <PetefromTn_> and I don't mean the GOOD old school hehe
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[20:55:44] <_methods> well you scored with that cutter zeeshan|2 once you get your cnc running you'll be able to use it to it's full capabilities
[20:55:52] <_methods> that thing is a hog
[20:56:03] <_methods> very shallow DOC but high feedrate
[20:56:24] <_methods> my favorite rougher by far and the inserts last forever
[20:56:40] <zeeshan|2> :D
[20:56:47] <zeeshan|2> thanks for forcing me to read about it
[20:56:52] <zeeshan|2> i didnt realize it needed such a high feed rate
[20:56:58] <_methods> yes scary fast
[20:57:07] <_methods> it's a blast watching them do their thing
[20:57:12] <anonimasu> PetefromTn_: yeah it\s a very complex toolchanger
[20:57:15] <_methods> you'll want a chip deflector lol
[20:58:08] <_methods> i hear the tungalloy high feed cutter will outrun the ajxu though
[20:58:15] <_methods> but either way they are very close
[20:58:31] <anonimasu> PetefromTn_: tho, they dont mess alot apparently only that they refuse to fold the arm inside if there are chips stuck
[20:58:42] <anonimasu> mhm, heidenhain is not bad(only the low range)
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[20:58:57] <anonimasu> 310 110 controls, the 3xx controls are very neat
[20:59:20] <anonimasu> I find it funny that the control on the maho does 3d contouring and everything at fast enough speed for me
[20:59:46] <PetefromTn_> anonimasu nice sounds like a good machine.
[20:59:55] <anonimasu> and has more memory then the tnc 310 on the other milling machine
[21:00:16] <PetefromTn_> trying to figure out if I want to try to learn this damn heidenhain control for a side job working at another local shop or not..
[21:00:24] <_methods> http://www.zdnet.com/article/critical-linux-security-hole-found/
[21:00:27] <anonimasu> PetefromTn_: they are very very easy compared to fanuc
[21:00:35] <PetefromTn_> which is?
[21:00:40] <anonimasu> fanuc,?
[21:00:53] <anonimasu> the standard controls :D
[21:01:20] <anonimasu> the heidenhain conversational language is very very easy and neat to learn
[21:01:22] <PetefromTn_> the heidenhain 151 control is conversational. I have not really played with much conversational everything so far for me has been hand coded or G code from CAM
[21:01:46] <PetefromTn_> thats good to hear..
[21:01:55] <anonimasu> pretty much a circle looks like this
[21:02:00] <anonimasu> CC x0 y0
[21:02:01] <PetefromTn_> the owner of the shop is apparently the only one who knows how to operate it LOL
[21:02:15] <_methods> http://www.openwall.com/lists/oss-security/2015/01/27/9
[21:02:29] <_methods> just so you know ^^
[21:03:17] <anonimasu> LP PR30 PA0 RR F100 (feed to perimetr of circle with right side cutter comp)
[21:03:26] <anonimasu> at 0 degrees start
[21:04:24] <anonimasu> and CP IPA1080 IZ-10.0 F600
[21:04:25] <PetefromTn_> oh hell..
[21:04:32] <anonimasu> for a helical circle
[21:04:36] <anonimasu> err move
[21:04:51] <anonimasu> (I have a post that does 3d arcs for the heidenhain)
[21:05:11] <anonimasu> so it works ok for contouring
[21:05:14] <PetefromTn_> not even sure if it will take it..
[21:05:32] <anonimasu> for the maho, (which does full arcs in any plane)
[21:05:50] <PetefromTn_> Sweet just got a shipping confirmation for my new 7.5HP lathe spindle motor...
[21:06:03] <anonimasu> with no plane selection before the arc.. (I had a hard time to get it sorted)
[21:06:53] <PetefromTn_> I have had a hard enough time just getting used to linuxCNC and the HAAS controls we have been using at work as well as their automatic probing routines.
[21:07:49] <PetefromTn_> maybe I should just stick to my own stuff and the place I work part time currently and let someone else worry about that bridgeport with Heidenhain 151 ;)
[21:08:20] <anonimasu> I think i agree..
[21:08:38] <PetefromTn_> LOL yeah why?
[21:09:42] <anonimasu> if it's the 1.5d control that I think about,
[21:09:45] <zeeshan|2> if they pay you good
[21:09:47] <zeeshan|2> id learn it :)
[21:10:25] <PetefromTn_> no idea yet what they are offering just heard about it this morning
[21:10:35] <anonimasu> well dosent hurt to listen
[21:10:56] <PetefromTn_> but my friend works there and he knows about what I need to get so I doubt he would have bothered me with it if they were wanting someone for cheapass prices
[21:11:19] <PetefromTn_> but ya never know!
[21:12:12] <anonimasu> the half manual machines are meant to be stayed away from too.
[21:13:48] <anonimasu> you will die changing tools :D
[21:14:11] <anonimasu> I had 6 tols on a small part that I made a run of before for my own needs :S
[21:14:22] <anonimasu> some had a 30 sec cycletime
[21:14:43] <anonimasu> the part took 8 minutes
[21:15:12] <PetefromTn_> Oh I am with you there man so far I am STILL changing tools manually on my Cincinatti since I have not gotten the orient working for toolchange yet.
[21:15:36] <PetefromTn_> http://www.ebay.com/itm/UPDATED-5-5KW-7-6HP-25A-220V-VFD-VARIABLE-FREQUENCY-DRIVE-INVERTER-/251033270542?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a72bfb90e does this look like a 7.5hp single phase input capable VFD>
[21:15:40] <anonimasu> big part for getting this machine(and the price was too good to pass)
[21:15:54] <anonimasu> 5k eur
[21:16:13] <anonimasu> (I knew the people that were selling it
[21:16:17] <PetefromTn_> you only paid 5k for that maho?
[21:16:19] <anonimasu> yeah
[21:16:25] <PetefromTn_> damn I thought I got a steal
[21:16:31] <anonimasu> same machine in germany was 35k eur
[21:16:38] <PetefromTn_> was it a working complete machine?
[21:16:41] <zeeshan|2> pete
[21:16:42] <anonimasu> yes
[21:16:45] <zeeshan|2> it says 1 or 3 phase input
[21:16:46] <PetefromTn_> nice
[21:16:47] <zeeshan|2> interesting
[21:16:53] <PetefromTn_> yeah I know right
[21:16:53] <zeeshan|2> damn chinese :D
[21:16:54] <anonimasu> they even serviced it before I got it
[21:16:55] <PetefromTn_> hard to believe
[21:17:31] <anonimasu> (this is from a service company for nc machines) as they wouldnt sell it as working with any problems)
[21:17:44] <PetefromTn_> nice
[21:18:54] <anonimasu> pride of their work I guess(I am having them help me get the tool measurement set up on the lathe and adjusting it since they fixed me up with this) and since they spent time fixing that problem before they sent it
[21:19:15] <PetefromTn_> what lathe?
[21:19:25] <anonimasu> mondialle gallic 420
[21:19:33] <anonimasu> err mondiale gallic
[21:19:44] <anonimasu> 700 eur :D
[21:19:54] <rob_h> evning all
[21:20:12] <anonimasu> arrived with dead control
[21:20:28] <PetefromTn_> hey rob_h
[21:20:33] <anonimasu> that's how I met the people I bought this from they read out the paper tapes with parameters for me
[21:20:47] <PetefromTn_> sounds like you lucked out man.
[21:20:58] <PetefromTn_> do you have work for the machine?
[21:21:02] <anonimasu> I plan to part with it tho
[21:21:11] <anonimasu> more then I want
[21:21:17] <PetefromTn_> damn thats nice
[21:21:24] <PetefromTn_> that is what I am after
[21:21:36] <PetefromTn_> hard to find good paying work around this place it seems
[21:21:39] <anonimasu> I am getting set up for running unattended)
[21:22:01] <rob_h> can never have too many machines i say :)
[21:22:23] <zeeshan|2> machine hoarder!
[21:22:24] <zeeshan|2> :-)
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[21:22:39] <anonimasu> so I can have limited production and, also do my regular stuff that is constructing stuff
[21:23:08] <PetefromTn_> I'm struggling to just get a CNC mill and CNC lathe working here.
[21:23:24] <anonimasu> PetefromTn_: I am struggling with a plasma retrofit to emc
[21:23:52] <PetefromTn_> nice
[21:23:55] <rob_h> i wanna retro a turret punch some time think that be a nice project
[21:23:57] <anonimasu> dont give up :) and finish it _completely_ dont leave it on half
[21:23:59] <PetefromTn_> well these guys can sure help
[21:24:21] <PetefromTn_> Oh I don't intend to give up
[21:24:24] <anonimasu> it's the biggest mess to have a half togther machine and then you need something you didnt before when you actually want/need to use it
[21:24:36] <anonimasu> drives me insane
[21:24:41] <PetefromTn_> but its a bitch getting the programming side of this going as I am NO programmer...
[21:25:03] <anonimasu> haha, linuxcnc is _special_ to say the least :)
[21:25:29] <PetefromTn_> yeah what I have working of it so far works great tho
[21:25:55] <anonimasu> the lathe tool forever before I had it sorted, as the factory parameters werent very good
[21:26:00] <anonimasu> took
[21:26:04] <PetefromTn_> just need to get a little bit more done on the Cincinatti and I can hopefully change tools and at the same time I will be doing the retrofit on the lathe too.
[21:26:47] <rob_h> hows that going pete did u get any where changing it back
[21:27:08] <anonimasu> the programming FAPT (not bad) if I had to work on a lther I'd like to have that for programming(the acronym is for Fantastic Amazing Programming Tool) :D
[21:27:10] <PetefromTn_> on the one hand I wish I had cash to pay someone to come in here and get it all finished but on the other hand if it freakin' breaks and someone else did it I won't know how to fix it..
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[21:27:45] <PetefromTn_> rob_h no not so far man. we tried to see it working with halscope and PCW thought the delay was too much
[21:28:18] <PetefromTn_> now I am thinking I should just go back to the analog control lines and work thru getting the thing reset for that and try the PID loop control
[21:28:54] <PetefromTn_> but PCW said he thought I should try the DC braking setup and just roll the spindle around from an index pulse and stop it on an encoder count at the orient position and brake.
[21:29:02] <PetefromTn_> not sure what the hell to do really...
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[21:29:28] <PCW> I woudl try the brake first since its a lot less invasive
[21:30:11] <PetefromTn_> yeah I know but I am kinda dubious about the part that it says it is not designed for prolonged use
[21:30:29] <PetefromTn_> the manual seems to indicate that it is more for quickly slowing the spindle down
[21:30:36] <rob_h> becasue injects the motor but ur motor is a real spindle motor yea
[21:30:40] <rob_h> fan cooled etc
[21:31:00] <PCW> Wel its not used in a prolonged manner
[21:31:00] <PetefromTn_> yeah it is a real spindle motor with seperate electric fan...
[21:31:21] <rob_h> be fine only takes what 1 sec pocket to pocket
[21:31:25] <PetefromTn_> I feel a bit more confident with doing the PID loop and analog control really
[21:31:27] <PCW> yeah I don see tha DC would be any worse than normal load
[21:32:08] <PetefromTn_> we had it working before with analog control setup and it worked fine until I insisted on switching it to Modbus
[21:32:13] <jack16> It depends on current (amps)
[21:32:13] <rob_h> i know the motors take next to zero amps to spin at 6k+ as they are super fine balanced
[21:32:33] <PetefromTn_> this motor is not your typical spindle motor
[21:32:38] <PCW> VFDs are usually pretty lousy servos
[21:32:40] <PetefromTn_> it spind up to 12k at top speed
[21:33:01] <PetefromTn_> it drives the spindle via a 2-1 ratio timing belt drive.
[21:33:07] <rob_h> whos motor did they fit on them? was it CT?
[21:33:19] <PetefromTn_> yeah I THINK it is a CT control motor.
[21:33:32] <PetefromTn_> it is a big huge tall square profile motor
[21:33:42] <rob_h> yea just like a fanuc or mitshi etc
[21:33:48] <PetefromTn_> heavy as hell just put brand new spindle motor bearings in it..
[21:34:01] <anonimasu> PetefromTn_: I have a testpart drawn up for then I get time :D http://ah.io23.net/ul/files/testpart.png
[21:34:21] <PCW> so 25% dc injection shoud be no worse than 25% spindle load (and should be plenty)
[21:34:46] <rob_h> what is it, 40/45amp motor?
[21:34:51] <PetefromTn_> I don't know jack about the motor all I know is it is quite expensive to replace..
[21:35:00] <PetefromTn_> 7.6kw
[21:35:10] <PetefromTn_> don't remember the amperage
[21:35:19] <rob_h> 7.5kw 30min 5.5kw const?
[21:39:20] <PetefromTn_> I can't remember trying to get a picture of the damn label
[21:40:07] <rob_h> prob like ours hidden by the drawbar ram
[21:40:44] <PetefromTn_> yeah it is down low in that mess
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[21:42:58] <Deejay> gn8
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[21:46:46] <zeeshan|2> rob_h: sorry if youve already answered this before, but how are you indexing your spindle?
[21:46:51] <zeeshan|2> on your machines
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[21:47:30] <zeeshan|2> bobo!
[21:47:41] <bobo_> hi
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[21:48:20] <bobo_> saw your new machine movie
[21:48:27] <PetefromTn_> http://i.imgur.com/qgZf6lh.jpg best pic I could get jammin' my cellphone in there heh
[21:49:18] <anonimasu> who's?
[21:49:28] <zeeshan|2> bobo_: the marker? :)
[21:49:49] <bobo_> marker
[21:49:59] <zeeshan|2> hey, you were asking me a while back
[21:50:05] <zeeshan|2> about those two dimples in the casting
[21:50:10] <zeeshan|2> on the left side of the machine in the base
[21:50:43] <bobo_> and
[21:50:49] <zeeshan|2> what are they for
[21:51:13] <zeeshan|2> i noticed there is a metal tube that goes from the ball screw (Z axis)
[21:51:17] <zeeshan|2> and seems to dump fluid.
[21:51:20] <zeeshan|2> lemme see if i can find a pic.
[21:51:29] <rob_h> back
[21:52:07] <rob_h> zeeshan|2, i did try with standard VFD in closed vector but was abit hit and miss... it woked but not grate..used PID from linuxcnc
[21:52:31] <bobo_> refresh my memory on dimples
[21:52:48] <rob_h> then afew years back i swicked it out for a new Yaskawa VFD A1000
[21:53:16] <bobo_> my cat wants out
[21:53:20] <rob_h> running in closed vector mode too but has spindle orienation built in so just fire it and wait for finish
[21:53:51] <rob_h> the yaskawa also has there build in CNC spindle software.. what it does other than add afew functions like spindle orienation i dont know
[21:54:15] <zeeshan|2> by hit and miss
[21:54:17] <zeeshan|2> what do you mean exactly
[21:54:18] <PetefromTn_> http://www.ebay.com/itm/1pc-Yaskawa-A1000-7-5KW-5-5KW-380V-CIMR-AB4A0018FAA-xhg07-/301506687822?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item463332f34e
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[21:55:08] <rob_h> hit and miss as in took awhile to setting... and you had to spin it before you could PIDit, to build up motor flux etc
[21:55:10] <zeeshan|2> bobo_: https://www.flickr.com/photos/128539016@N05/15761132814/
[21:55:18] <rob_h> the yaskawa is much better can position it from a stop
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[21:56:03] <PetefromTn_> is your spindle direct drive?
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[21:56:08] <rob_h> alot of the time i just Spindle orient from full speed so spindle stops at position read for tool change on the way up in the Z move
[21:56:16] <rob_h> no its belt 1:1
[21:56:30] <rob_h> its a mitsubishi motor, 8k rpm, 37amp 200v
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[21:57:28] <zeeshan|2> im trying to find a solution for my lathe
[21:57:29] <zeeshan|2> :/
[21:57:50] <zeeshan|2> i might just end up adding an electrogmagnetic brake
[21:57:54] <PetefromTn_> do you think the 2-1 ratio of the belt drive on my machine would help that?
[21:58:12] <rob_h> solution for what?
[21:58:21] <zeeshan|2> to hold the spindle in place
[21:58:23] <zeeshan|2> while i drill holes
[21:58:27] <zeeshan|2> w/ a live tool
[21:58:32] <rob_h> yea you deff need a brake or pin lock
[21:59:09] <rob_h> unless like the more current lathes they hold with the spindle motor if built in, but thats more a high speed servo than anything
[21:59:23] <zeeshan|2> well thats another option
[21:59:26] <zeeshan|2> just get rid of the motor
[21:59:29] <rob_h> i know some laths have a servo they clutch in and out
[21:59:29] <zeeshan|2> and throw a servo in there
[21:59:40] <PetefromTn_> that is what my lathe came with unfortunately it is not there anymore..
[21:59:57] <rob_h> yea but how many Nm do you need ,.. i mean our lathes are 18kw etc thats a big servo
[22:00:06] <zeeshan|2> only 2.2
[22:00:12] <zeeshan|2> kW
[22:00:25] <zeeshan|2> @ 1800 rpm
[22:00:49] <rob_h> fairly easy just change the belts if you have to and pullys as a need good drive
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[22:01:10] <rob_h> i mean our little sliding head has indexing, that index's the motor then puts a pin in place and u can power tool.
[22:01:11] <zeeshan|2> i bet i can pay for it by selling the vfd + motor
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[22:01:25] <zeeshan|2> its going to need a pretty big servo drive though
[22:01:33] <rob_h> the same on our 4 axis powerd lathe .. that has a DC spindle motor
[22:02:07] <PetefromTn_> rob_h did you see the pic I posted of my motor's plate?
[22:03:44] <rob_h> o nice they gave u the base speed
[22:04:14] <PetefromTn_> yeah it sure is an oddball motor specs
[22:04:28] <rob_h> ours dont give u that nice bit of info
[22:04:59] <PetefromTn_> I had help getting the VFD settings correct from Mike on the zone who knows a lot about this stuff.
[22:05:28] <PetefromTn_> but he has not messed with what I am doing here with the orient on my hitachi
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[22:05:57] <rob_h> yea iv seen his posts before grate bit of info he put out there
[22:06:18] <zeeshan|2> i think i will try pcw's idea first
[22:06:28] <PetefromTn_> the video you posted showing the VFD positioning looked pretty damn good to me man I know you were not happy with it but I have to wonder if it was 2-1 if it would be easier on the spindle to hold position etc.
[22:06:33] <zeeshan|2> use dc injection to stop the vfd in place
[22:06:39] <zeeshan|2> then i will engage brake
[22:06:48] <zeeshan|2> too bad its open loop :P
[22:07:45] <PetefromTn_> at even very slow speeds this motor has a shitload of torque it seems from the little tapping I have done etc.
[22:07:46] <rob_h> the VFD also did not give the motor the power it should have i found like when face milling etc , was easy to load up
[22:08:13] <rob_h> now i can facemill no problem again
[22:08:20] <PetefromTn_> what was the KW rating of that motor
[22:08:36] <rob_h> cant drill 1" holes like i can on the other VMC lol but that does have a gear box
[22:08:51] <rob_h> same as yours, 5.5 const, 7.5 30min
[22:08:56] <zeeshan|2> hm
[22:08:58] <PetefromTn_> I run a flycutter and it seems to cut whatever I need without issue even kinda deep...
[22:09:07] <PetefromTn_> in steel etc?
[22:09:11] <rob_h> ye
[22:09:14] <zeeshan|2> do you guys know why drilling requires so much force?
[22:09:24] <zeeshan|2> i learned this the other day in class lol
[22:09:35] <PetefromTn_> I have drilled a bunch of 1" plus holes in steel on the machine before without issues..
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[22:09:48] <rob_h> if back up off the feed yea its fine
[22:10:05] <rob_h> but i mean drill holes not play with it ;)
[22:10:11] <zeeshan|2> rofl
[22:10:17] <PetefromTn_> I was not playing with it believe me..
[22:10:26] <zeeshan|2> ive drilled a 2" hole
[22:10:34] <zeeshan|2> for my steam engine on the school lathe which is 7.5HP
[22:10:47] <zeeshan|2> i think i was turning at 50 rpm
[22:10:58] <zeeshan|2> it had no issues :P
[22:11:24] <PetefromTn_> well whatever the case it seemed like despite the lack of power you had the orient worked for a good while for you like that right>
[22:11:32] <rob_h> on manual lathe turning the handle takes abit
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[22:11:49] <rob_h> yea sure it did i think ull be more than happy
[22:12:11] <zeeshan|2> so for a 3/8 drill bit
[22:12:21] <zeeshan|2> tests showed that due to the stationary point @ the middle of the drill bit
[22:12:31] <zeeshan|2> (which causes it to extrude the material, not cut)
[22:12:44] <zeeshan|2> 40-60% of power is consumed by that extrusion
[22:12:59] <PetefromTn_> I really think I should at least try to do the analog control spindle orient I can always add the braking setup if it does not work..
[22:14:02] <rob_h> PID can take abit to setup... while braking is just switch it on and off
[22:14:19] <bobo_> zeeshan: my guess is your mill is using 2 connected tanks to seperate cutting fluid from drained lub oil ? maho only has seperate sheet metal tank --cutting fluid return by hose---drained lub and leaked cutting fluid drain from machine base into sheet metal cutting fluid tank tank
[22:14:43] <zeeshan|2> bobo_: okay
[22:14:46] <zeeshan|2> so its a lube catch tank
[22:15:01] <zeeshan|2> coolant take is seperate for mikron too
[22:15:12] <zeeshan|2> which i unfornately dont have :(
[22:15:32] <bobo_> bucket
[22:16:35] <rob_h> pete dont forget as u have a 2:1 spindle u double ur torque right away over us
[22:16:52] <rob_h> its a shame u dont have a 1:1 pully on there also so you can swop it over to 12k
[22:17:01] <rob_h> be nice for alli jobs etc then
[22:17:34] <rob_h> one of our machins came to us at 4k... took the cover off and it had the pully in there for 1:1 and gave us 6k then
[22:17:46] <PetefromTn_> yeah that is what I am wondering... I would love to have 12k but really all the parts I make are aluminum mostly and I just use more flutes and feed deeper works fine...
[22:18:04] <PetefromTn_> this is just one pulley range...
[22:18:05] <zeeshan|2> wut
[22:18:26] <zeeshan|2> you dont want higher speds for al?
[22:18:32] <PetefromTn_> and we have already masked the second spindle index pulse so I don't want to change it really
[22:18:33] <rob_h> yea our next VMC has to be 10k spindle and random changer etc
[22:19:12] <zeeshan|2> CAD challenge for the day, make it in the least number of steps: http://i.imgur.com/5Qg2tTp.png ; http://i.imgur.com/X9iCXXk.png
[22:19:13] <PetefromTn_> sure would be nice but I don't feel like chaning out spindle bearings all the time either. The machine goes thru aluminum pretty quick and I am being gentle really with it mostly.
[22:19:36] <rob_h> yea bearings was a problem on the early machines i know
[22:20:13] <PetefromTn_> yeah this is a 1997 machine
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[22:20:46] <rob_h> plus some earaly 12k machiens where realy bad on HP a friend had one and he always moaned about it
[22:21:16] <PetefromTn_> honestly if I could get the damn toolchanger working I would be quite pleased with the machine overall. 6k is not bad really and it has enough torque to cut steels with ease
[22:21:47] <PCW> "PID can take abit to setup... while braking is just switch it on and off"
[22:21:48] <PCW> That was my point, adding the bit in hal to brake and reprogramming the
[22:21:50] <PCW> VFD to have a brake input dont affect operation of your machine
[22:21:51] <PCW> and can be left there even if you change to PID loop orient
[22:22:11] <zeeshan|2> pcw do you write your responses in notepad before pasting? :)
[22:22:28] <PetefromTn_> I am not even sure you CAN have both modbus control and analog control input to the drive
[22:22:30] <rob_h> we just have alot of lag ;)
[22:22:36] <PCW> no, to the wrong window
[22:22:50] <bobo_> zeeshan: bucket ---- can have more than one thus several diff fluids ----smaller space needed and can with lid be stored if not using --also swap use between lathe and mill
[22:23:00] <rob_h> how many times have we all done that and wondered why no one replyed haha
[22:23:24] <zeeshan|2> ah bobo
[22:23:56] <rob_h> what is bobo talking about?
[22:24:03] <zeeshan|2> the lubrication system on my machine
[22:24:07] <rob_h> aaah
[22:24:13] <zeeshan|2> theres these two massive valleys in the casting
[22:24:17] <zeeshan|2> had no idea what they were for
[22:24:20] <rob_h> that stuff that fills up the coolant tanks
[22:24:32] <zeeshan|2> i thought it was cooalnt , but its dumping oil in there
[22:24:41] <zeeshan|2> realized im missing the coolant tank :(
[22:24:54] <rob_h> only a sheet metal box
[22:25:06] <zeeshan|2> no brake :(
[22:25:12] <zeeshan|2> but i guess i can bend it on the table
[22:25:30] <PetefromTn_> other than the basic trial and error setup what about the PID analog control is difficult rob?
[22:26:04] <bobo_> plastic bucket for home use
[22:26:06] <rob_h> getting the VFD respond etc like turning a realy laggy servo i guess is one way to say
[22:26:33] <zeeshan|2> bobo_: rofl
[22:26:35] <zeeshan|2> not a bad idea.
[22:26:50] <rob_h> pete just setup DC brake as PCW said... u have a thermal trip inside motor wired to estop or what ever so not like you can over heat the motor
[22:27:09] <zeeshan|2> his vfd has 2 terminals
[22:27:13] <zeeshan|2> where you can wire the thermistor to directly
[22:27:14] <rob_h> and just try it out if looks good you can then go on and finish the atc logic wiring up
[22:27:19] <zeeshan|2> and it'll put the vfd in overheat mode
[22:27:46] <zeeshan|2> does the thermistory get placed on the fins?
[22:27:59] <PetefromTn_> have you ever done an orient using the DC brake like that ?
[22:28:24] <rob_h> no but i can see how it would work
[22:28:48] <PetefromTn_> have you ever even used the braking for any reason this way?
[22:29:25] <rob_h> never had a need i would probly use it on a lathe ifi had a index pin to postion if VFD could not postion properly as you have to be prity close to get the pin in
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[22:29:55] <rob_h> would let you put a cheaper vfd on the lathe then too
[22:30:31] <PetefromTn_> I really have no need for positioning on my lathe but even if I did I would probably not try to use the spindle motor to do it.
[22:32:07] <bobo_> Pete I also vote for manually trying motor DC brake -------seeing what results are of turning spindle/tool holder by hand
[22:32:08] <zeeshan|2> i'm sad no one took the cad challenge :(
[22:32:35] <rob_h> of
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[22:32:46] <zeeshan|2> every tuesday should be a cad challenge day
[22:32:51] <zeeshan|2> to keep cad skills top notch
[22:32:59] <PetefromTn_> bobo thanks for the input but I really was not looking for votes hehe
[22:33:19] <rob_h> lo have a show of hands shall we
[22:33:29] <zeeshan|2> i vote for dc injection
[22:33:38] <zeeshan|2> actually itake that back
[22:33:44] <zeeshan|2> i vote for selling machine to me for $5
[22:33:56] <rob_h> u dont know to know the delivery cost
[22:34:05] <zeeshan|2> hehe
[22:34:06] <rob_h> ^want to know
[22:34:31] <zeeshan|2> bobo_: http://i.imgur.com/oMM3dbV.png
[22:34:34] <zeeshan|2> seem familiar? :(
[22:34:36] <PetefromTn_> at the end of the day there is a couple people who have spindle control via PID loop in linuxCNC and NOBODY that I know of who has used DC braking to orient before...
[22:34:44] <zeeshan|2> i am missing the quill handle, need to make one :{
[22:35:00] <zeeshan|2> PetefromTn_: they go talk to them
[22:35:02] <zeeshan|2> :-)
[22:35:11] <PetefromTn_> I am talking to them right now
[22:35:13] <anonimasu> zeeshan|2: what challenge?
[22:35:29] <zeeshan|2> [17:19:15] <zeeshan|2> CAD challenge for the day, make it in the least number of steps: http://i.imgur.com/5Qg2tTp.png ; http://i.imgur.com/X9iCXXk.png
[22:35:34] <zeeshan|2> i need one too
[22:36:36] <rob_h> just revolve the switch around middle the put in holes and key
[22:36:50] <zeeshan|2> they are not straight holes :P
[22:36:56] <rob_h> dam i cant type tonight...
[22:37:05] <rob_h> no so just put in a plane on the angle and draw
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[22:37:35] <zeeshan|2> text for cad challenge denied! :P
[22:37:46] <rob_h> lol
[22:37:56] <anonimasu> I think I have enough cad challenges at work -_-
[22:38:16] <zeeshan|2> i try to keep open minded about it
[22:38:17] <anonimasu> now for a machining challenge im up :D
[22:38:22] <zeeshan|2> can learn so much
[22:38:25] <zeeshan|2> just like machining
[22:38:27] <anonimasu> make this part in the least amount of steps
[22:38:27] <anonimasu> :D
[22:38:35] <bobo_> zeeshan: the quill handles are beyond the hill where all the lost nuts-washers-other tiny stuff went to
[22:38:36] <anonimasu> err "fixture"
[22:38:36] <zeeshan|2> look at how i'm planning to drill thjose compound holes
[22:38:41] <zeeshan|2> im sure someone can do it better/easier
[22:38:55] <zeeshan|2> bobo_: yes :(
[22:39:06] <zeeshan|2> its pretty straight forward to make though
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[22:39:17] <rob_h> put in on the mill and swing the head
[22:39:19] <zeeshan|2> ill turn them on the lathe
[22:39:28] <zeeshan|2> rob_h: never!!!
[22:39:43] <zeeshan|2> too lazy to line it back up :)
[22:39:50] <rob_h> lol does not take long
[22:40:02] <zeeshan|2> dude this is one good example where the lathe would work so good.
[22:40:04] <rob_h> or leave for the next person
[22:40:09] <zeeshan|2> you turn the hub
[22:40:14] <zeeshan|2> then just have your live tool at an angle
[22:40:16] <zeeshan|2> and drill the 4 holes
[22:40:21] <zeeshan|2> _only_ if i had indexing :(
[22:40:33] <rob_h> and a angled drilling head
[22:41:19] <zeeshan|2> ill have to go use the school shop to machine the keyway
[22:41:22] <zeeshan|2> 5 mm.. :/
[22:41:58] <anonimasu> zeeshan|2: that part seems pretty straightforward
[22:42:09] <zeeshan|2> anonimasu: make it! :P
[22:42:15] <anonimasu> draw it up=
[22:42:16] <anonimasu> ?
[22:42:18] <rob_h> if you want a box full
[22:42:20] <zeeshan|2> 3d model it
[22:42:23] <anonimasu> ok
[22:42:29] <zeeshan|2> remember, least number of steps
[22:42:42] <zeeshan|2> at the end you should be able to change the angle
[22:42:45] <zeeshan|2> and everything should work out
[22:42:47] <_methods> yeah someone do his homework for him
[22:42:54] <rob_h> lo
[22:42:56] <zeeshan|2> _methods i already made it
[22:42:57] <zeeshan|2> lol
[22:43:05] <anonimasu> it dosemt mean i'll give hime the solid :D
[22:43:19] <zeeshan|2> rob_h: you have a box full of broaches? :)
[22:43:48] <anonimasu> actually I cant right now S:
[22:43:55] <rob_h> no i whe u said make it.. i ment only if you want a box full
[22:43:56] <anonimasu> work computer's rebooted so I cant get to my cad
[22:44:17] <anonimasu> my home computer went to the shop and the laptop dose have cad :S
[22:44:26] <zeeshan|2> anonimasu: what cad do you use
[22:44:30] <anonimasu> alibre
[22:45:07] <rob_h> EDM it be much fun :)
[22:45:28] <bobo_> anonimasu: your MH700, does the vertical head have a manual operated 90 deg Pin for referance ,after rotating offof vertical ?
[22:45:32] <zeeshan|2> i wish i could store that edm i cam e across
[22:45:33] <zeeshan|2> =[
[22:45:36] <zeeshan|2> don't remind me
[22:46:01] <anonimasu> no
[22:46:07] <zeeshan|2> anonimasu: you have a mh700?! :D
[22:46:08] <anonimasu> there's a encoder
[22:46:10] <anonimasu> yeah
[22:46:14] <anonimasu> mh 700s
[22:46:15] <anonimasu> :S
[22:46:18] <anonimasu> dont forget the S
[22:46:19] <anonimasu> :D
[22:46:43] <zeeshan|2> http://www.maritool.com/Retention-Knobs-CAT40-Pull-Studs/c67_68/p1621/Pull-Stud-Hex-Head-4E-0110-%28-Deckel-,-Maho-%29/product_info.html
[22:46:46] <zeeshan|2> does it use a ott groove pull stud?
[22:47:05] <anonimasu> sandvik ones
[22:47:16] <zeeshan|2> do they look like this?
[22:47:25] <zeeshan|2> these are very distinct
[22:47:27] <anonimasu> but the holders have a maho notch
[22:47:39] <zeeshan|2> theyre like the biggest pull stud out of all cnc machines
[22:47:48] <zeeshan|2> for #40 taper
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[22:48:31] <bobo_> picture of the MH700S pull stud ?
[22:48:34] <anonimasu> mhm no
[22:48:45] <zeeshan|2> bobo_: i tried to make an educated guess on the pull studs for the mikron
[22:48:49] <anonimasu> it's BT40 I think
[22:48:51] <zeeshan|2> i stuck a 1" steel round bar in there
[22:49:03] <zeeshan|2> and it engaged :)
[22:49:23] <zeeshan|2> and this is the only .986 pull stud diameter
[22:49:28] <anonimasu> zeeshan|2: I'll post a video once I start running some production onit
[22:49:35] <zeeshan|2> anonimasu: sweet
[22:50:02] <zeeshan|2> also i looked through my notes
[22:50:04] <zeeshan|2> and found this:
[22:50:09] <zeeshan|2> http://i.imgur.com/quUGc6y.gif
[22:50:16] <zeeshan|2> pretty sure the micron is a typo for mikron
[22:50:36] <zeeshan|2> http://i.imgur.com/PAMhKL0.gif
[22:50:40] <zeeshan|2> and thats from the actual standard
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[22:53:01] <anonimasu> mhm, mine uses normal pullstuds
[22:53:04] <anonimasu> but they are quite massive
[22:53:23] <zeeshan|2> if you get a chance, try to snap apic please :)
[22:53:25] <bobo_> photo ?
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[22:54:04] <anonimasu> I can do it tomorrow
[22:54:28] <anonimasu> and I can get you the sandvik part number if you want a drawing along since I have new ones in a baf
[22:54:31] <anonimasu> bag
[22:54:39] <zeeshan|2> that works too
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[22:55:47] <bobo_> MH700S ---432 control?
[22:56:52] <anonimasu> yep
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[23:01:27] <bobo_> any idea of floor to top of machine -height for the MH700S
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[23:04:07] <anonimasu> bobo_: I have a drawing
[23:05:11] <bobo_> just a guess ---is it over 8 foot ?
[23:06:25] <malcom2073> http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-eB0xoXZYqRI/VMgD5Tlj8AI/AAAAAAAAATk/aP_LrQhNl-o/s1600/machinist.jpg
[23:06:56] <anonimasu> 2475mm
[23:07:06] <anonimasu> (precisely)
[23:07:18] <anonimasu> unless they mistanslated it
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[23:08:12] <zeeshan|2> hey
[23:08:16] <zeeshan|2> that would fit in my garage :D
[23:08:22] <bobo_> you mean .00000000 and nothing else
[23:08:36] <anonimasu> haha yeah
[23:08:38] <anonimasu> gemans.
[23:08:46] <bobo_> my garage first !
[23:09:07] <zeeshan|2> i bid $6
[23:09:12] <zeeshan|2> 1$ more than my bid to pete
[23:09:54] <bobo_> you are out of the WILL then
[23:10:00] <anonimasu> with pallet changer 6150mm wide
[23:10:24] <anonimasu> 6150x5200
[23:10:44] <anonimasu> (pallet changer and coolant filtration system)
[23:10:46] <anonimasu> I eman
[23:10:48] <anonimasu> mean
[23:10:52] <zeeshan|2> bobo_: im really impressed by the mikron
[23:10:58] <zeeshan|2> the swiss/germans really build machines good
[23:11:04] <zeeshan|2> its frigging what made in 1980 something
[23:11:09] <zeeshan|2> i did testing
[23:11:11] * anonimasu is the same
[23:11:20] <anonimasu> it's uber all over..
[23:11:20] <zeeshan|2> it has no measureable wear on the .0005 indicator.
[23:11:21] <bobo_> and the MH700S is 2 tone green---ya
[23:11:29] <zeeshan|2> i dont understand how they manage to do that
[23:11:33] <anonimasu> and 7600kg..
[23:11:41] <anonimasu> for the base.
[23:11:45] <anonimasu> and cabinet
[23:12:08] <anonimasu> they didnt cheap on anything in that time
[23:12:27] <anonimasu> what's nice with the maho is that every component is standard stuff(most anyway)
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[23:13:42] <zeeshan|2> dop you know how much they cost
[23:13:45] <zeeshan|2> back then, brand new?
[23:13:52] <anonimasu> yes
[23:13:59] <anonimasu> over 700000usd
[23:14:03] <zeeshan|2> HAHAHA
[23:14:06] <zeeshan|2> HAHAA
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[23:14:35] <anonimasu> i saw it on some forum when i were researching(practicalmachinist)
[23:14:37] <anonimasu> I think
[23:14:37] * adb own a swiss late from 1932 which do 1/100 mm precision
[23:15:08] <anonimasu> I didnt try the maho fully yet, but I expect to be able to keep 1/100's if needed
[23:15:11] <anonimasu> :)
[23:15:27] <bobo_> Standard for your side of the pond ----in US it can be a big problem
[23:16:26] <anonimasu> zeeshan|2: are you alive
[23:16:48] <zeeshan|2> im alive
[23:16:57] <zeeshan|2> im just suprised at the cost
[23:17:08] <anonimasu> zeeshan|2: the drawbar bolts are called iso/dis 7388/II type B
[23:17:38] <anonimasu> ISO/DIN
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[23:18:26] <anonimasu> and the taper is ISO 40 DIN 69871/1
[23:19:20] <zeeshan|2> interesting
[23:19:22] <zeeshan|2> it is different
[23:20:00] <anonimasu> gtg, bedtime
[23:20:01] <anonimasu> laters!
[23:23:49] <bobo_> zeeshan|2 : the spindle drive tabs/dogs ,for tool holders 2 drive slots , are the the same width ? as in not BT holder style --but CAT holder style
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[23:24:17] <zeeshan|2> yea bobo they are same width
[23:24:26] <bobo_> good
[23:24:30] <zeeshan|2> you should be able to fit a cat in there
[23:25:36] <bobo_> yes I can , but was thinking of your mill
[23:26:18] <zeeshan|2> bobo_: i remember looking it up
[23:26:26] <zeeshan|2> i think you can fit cat40 in iso40 spindles
[23:26:31] <zeeshan|2> but not iso40 in cat40 spindles
[23:26:34] <zeeshan|2> without modify the dog
[23:29:07] <bobo_> OK ---I thought it was BT vers CAT ,and iso # was just ref. of taper
[23:31:45] <_methods> call a local tooling supplier he'll come over and identify it correctly for you
[23:33:24] <zeeshan|2> http://www.kennametal.com/en/products/20478624/2664259/42041919/54480135/100023576.html
[23:33:31] <zeeshan|2> thats the pull stud anonimasu was talking about
[23:33:36] <zeeshan|2> HDD = 18.8 mm
[23:33:40] <JT-Shop> email Marris and he will tell you
[23:33:41] <zeeshan|2> thats no where clos eto the 25.00 for my spindle
[23:33:47] <zeeshan|2> whos marris
[23:33:58] <zeeshan|2> its kinda a bit late
[23:34:05] <zeeshan|2> i already spend 200 bux in nonreturnable pulls tuds :(
[23:34:14] <zeeshan|2> these better be it!!
[23:34:42] <_methods> oh well stfu about it then lol
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[23:35:12] <zeeshan|2> mean
[23:35:15] <_methods> hahah
[23:35:18] <_methods> :)
[23:35:52] <_methods> you got that ajxu you should be smilin all day
[23:36:09] <zeeshan|2> https://www.youtube.com/watch?x-yt-ts=1422327029&v=FIzgxJqpJb0&feature=player_detailpage&x-yt-cl=84838260#t=331
[23:36:09] <_methods> right pullstuds or wrong pullstuds
[23:36:15] <zeeshan|2> lol
[23:36:20] <zeeshan|2> i only have like 8 replacement inserts
[23:36:23] <zeeshan|2> are they expensive?
[23:36:35] <zeeshan|2> hopefully ebay it when the time comes
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[23:36:59] <zeeshan|2> i'm amazed by how short they kept this end mill in this video
[23:36:59] <zeeshan|2> :)
[23:37:27] <_methods> yeah they are a bit expensive because they are mits
[23:37:35] <_methods> but nothing too outrageous and they last forever
[23:37:40] <_methods> so they are well worth it
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[23:38:20] <zeeshan|2> have you use the apx series?
[23:38:27] <_methods> no never tried them
[23:39:16] <_methods> looking now
[23:39:47] <_methods> looks like a regular r390
[23:40:26] <_methods> yeah standard R390 geometry
[23:40:44] * zeeshan|2 learned something new
[23:40:48] <zeeshan|2> i didnt not know what those inserts were called
[23:41:08] <_methods> it's a sandvik R390 insert
[23:41:14] <zeeshan|2> hm
[23:41:17] <zeeshan|2> these came in a mitsu box
[23:41:20] <_methods> or a knock off
[23:41:35] <_methods> mits' version of the R390
[23:43:09] <_methods> http://www.sandvik.coromant.com/en-us/products/coromill_390/pages/assortment.aspx
[23:43:45] <_methods> sorry this link
[23:43:47] <_methods> http://www.sandvik.coromant.com/en-us/products/coromill_390/Pages/default.aspx
[23:44:41] <_methods> it's like the cutter you'll find in every shop being used in every machine
[23:44:50] <_methods> great general purpose cutter/insert
[23:45:01] <zeeshan|2> honestly ive never seen this type before other than when i got it
[23:45:07] <zeeshan|2> on the mills we used solid carbide
[23:45:13] <JT-Shop> maritool
[23:45:29] <zeeshan|2> cause theyre more accurate than indexable tools
[23:45:37] <zeeshan|2> lathe used indexable tools
[23:45:49] <JT-Shop> I just told him the make and model of my VMC and he told me what pull stud and type of holder it used
[23:46:00] <zeeshan|2> JT-Shop: he told me his best guess
[23:46:02] <zeeshan|2> which is wrong
[23:46:25] <zeeshan|2> my hyd grip thing closes with a diameter of .8 something
[23:46:37] <zeeshan|2> he recommended something with a .7" dia :P
[23:46:53] <zeeshan|2> same as what anonimasu recommended
[23:46:57] <JT-Shop> he knew what mine took is all I know
[23:47:37] * JT-Shop waits for the exothermic reaction to stop on the furnace
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[23:53:33] <bobo_> zeeshan|2 on your mill ,can you see what the grip edge shape is of the pulling 3 or 4 fingers that grip the pull stud ?
[23:54:06] <zeeshan|2> 4
[23:54:23] <zeeshan|2> jthornton: whatcha cooking
[23:55:14] <zeeshan|2> https://www.flickr.com/photos/128539016@N05/14996196844/
[23:55:18] <zeeshan|2> you can see it there bobo
[23:56:05] <JT-Shop> making a casting furnace
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[23:59:15] <bobo_> looks as if the inside shape is stright vers "C" shape . you may be getting the correct pull studs after all
[23:59:35] <zeeshan|2> bobo_: im just going based on the fact
[23:59:43] <zeeshan|2> that no other #40 taper has a pull stud this big
[23:59:43] <zeeshan|2> lol
[23:59:52] <zeeshan|2> ive looked at so many suppliers