#linuxcnc | Logs for 2015-02-01

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[00:01:02] <LeelooMinai> I wonder how it works. If they just take Linuxcnc and mod it, or just write some extensions and use the "normal" branch, or what.
[00:01:36] <PetefromTn_> I would like to know..
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[00:04:23] <andypugh> I am pretty sure that Tormach have committed _some_ code to the project. But I think they see their UI as theirs.
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[00:05:04] <PetefromTn_> oh yeah that sucks.
[00:07:56] <bobo_> Pete not to beat a old topic ,but atthe NYC-CNC open house they might let you fondle the slant bed
[00:08:23] <skunksleep> Kinda sounds like they may be a few revisions back too..
[00:08:40] <andypugh> Some Tormach guys turned up to the Wichita meetup a year and a bit ago.
[00:08:46] <PetefromTn_> don't want to fondle it man I am building a better lathe here LOL
[00:10:00] <PetefromTn_> I don't want to take anything away from them but I thought linuxCNC's open source status made having your own flavor not possible..
[00:11:13] <Jymmm> You can, you just have to make the source available. But you could limit/restrict certian aspects.
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[00:11:52] <dirty_d> I'm a little confused about homing and zeroing axes
[00:11:58] <Jymmm> Like linksys routers use OSS, but add their own stuff yto make it theirs.
[00:12:28] <dirty_d> I have a 3-axis mill with no homing switches, I used to use mach3 and id just jog to the work zero, then click a button to zero all axes
[00:12:40] <dirty_d> then run the cnc program
[00:12:51] <andypugh> Yes, so Tormach have to make the LinuxCNC source available to anyone who buys their lathe, but they don’t have to make their UI available to anyone who uses LinuxCNC.
[00:13:59] <dirty_d> heres my ini file http://pastebin.com/kmhfbd6m
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[00:14:52] <andypugh> A similar situation exists with the Pico-systems cards. The driver is part of LinuxCNC but the FPGA code on the cards is proprietary. Mesa nade their FPGA code FOSS but that was a decision of theirs, and that code is not _actually_ part of the LinuxCNC project. it is a separate but linked project.
[00:15:30] <andypugh> dirty_d: You can do that with LinuxCNC if you want.
[00:16:28] <PetefromTn_> hell I would be willing to pay a bit for the interface but I don't need the whole damn Controller PC.
[00:16:57] <andypugh> dirty_d: [TRAJ] NO_FORCE_HOMING in the INI file: http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/html/config/ini_config.html#sub:TRAJ-section
[00:18:24] <andypugh> dirty_d: Or, if you prefer, you can guve each axis a HOMING_SEQUENCE and set the homing velocity to zero, and it will home where ever it is when you press “HOME”
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[00:18:45] <andypugh> I hate it when that happens.
[00:19:05] <PetefromTn_> does the machine have physical limit switches?
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[00:19:16] <dirty_d> yikes, kernel panic
[00:19:21] <andypugh> He is probably sat there saying “those LinuxCNC guys are no help at all”
[00:19:32] <andypugh> Ah, you came back :-)
[00:19:45] <andypugh> Did you see “andypugh: dirty_d: Or, if you prefer, you can guve each axis a HOMING_SEQUENCE and set the homing velocity to zero, and it will home where ever it is when you press “HOME””
[00:19:49] <PetefromTn_> does your machine have physical limit switches?
[00:20:21] <dirty_d> i just read it im adding NO_FORCE_HOMING = 1
[00:20:28] <dirty_d> no it doesn't
[00:20:33] <andypugh> Limit switches are not that hard, and are useful.
[00:20:36] <dirty_d> it just has xyz steppers, no other control
[00:20:50] <PetefromTn_> yeah I would not run a machine without at least limit switches
[00:21:08] <andypugh> All limits and homes can share 1 pin on the parport (other IO interfaces are available)
[00:21:28] <andypugh> PetefromTn_: A stepper machine can be fine with hard stops .
[00:21:39] <PetefromTn_> you can setup linuxCNC to use a limit as a home right?
[00:21:44] <andypugh> Yes
[00:21:48] <PetefromTn_> sure but I would not want to do that...
[00:22:51] <andypugh> One nice thing about limit/home switches is that you can re-start a job, and also LinuxCNC will never hit the stops, and will warn if a job will hit the stops.
[00:23:08] <dirty_d> this computers in my apartment nowhere near my cnc machine right now, I've disabled homing. Whats actually happening when I click "Home Axis"?
[00:23:23] <andypugh> Magic :-)
[00:23:24] <dirty_d> its just zeroing the machine coordinate system right, not moving anything?
[00:23:53] <dirty_d> it moves in the 3D gui, but not in the reals?
[00:24:15] <andypugh> On a machine with homing configured it actually runs the machine to the home switches, zeros the machine coordinate system, then returns to a pre-defined position.
[00:24:24] <dirty_d> right
[00:24:59] <dirty_d> but with NO_FORCE_HOMING = 1?
[00:25:02] <andypugh> I don’t know what happens on your machine, your INI has no home info at all.
[00:25:32] <andypugh> I think with your machine as it exists you can home instantly wherever you wish.
[00:25:54] <andypugh> With NO_FORCE_HOMING you can run G-code without even pressing the home button.
[00:26:00] <dirty_d> i think so, because the cone in the gui instantly moves to 0
[00:26:34] <andypugh> I wouldn’t actually advocate NO_FORCE_HOMING.
[00:26:39] <dirty_d> i know
[00:27:03] <andypugh> You should be able to jog your machine to Sharpie marks on the bed, hit home and then run code with moderately predictable results.
[00:27:56] <PetefromTn_> sharpie accuracy hehe
[00:28:20] <andypugh> My machine homes to switches _and_ resolver zero, so I can re-start after a shut-down to within 0.001mm :-)
[00:28:45] <PetefromTn_> yeah mine does it to encoder index pulse off the home switch...
[00:29:01] <PetefromTn_> I LOVE how you cannot basically hit a limit once the machine is homed.
[00:29:09] <dirty_d> what do you do when you use an edge finder or something?
[00:29:10] <PetefromTn_> and the soft limits are really nice
[00:29:18] <andypugh> But if dirty_d is just too _lazy_ to set up his machine properly :-)
[00:29:26] <dirty_d> im mach3 i could manually enter like -0.2 on X
[00:29:32] <PetefromTn_> I use an edge finder all the time
[00:29:39] <andypugh> dirty_d: That’s “Touch off”
[00:29:48] <PetefromTn_> yeah that is totally diferent
[00:30:01] <andypugh> (the touch-off button basically runs a G10 command)
[00:30:11] <dirty_d> hey im not lazy, i just have no time, lol
[00:30:11] <PetefromTn_> you can locate your part with the edge finder and touch off the G54 or whatever coordinate system to that point
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[00:30:34] <dirty_d> ill add switches eventually, i just wanna get it working first
[00:31:01] <andypugh> There are two coordinate systems, the actual machine axes, which are physical, and the G54, G55 etc ones that you work in where the origin can be wherever you want.
[00:31:12] <PetefromTn_> and you can also do neat things like if you touch off the left side of a part, set zero on G54 and jog over to the right side of the part, touch the edge finder and then input the distance /2 to get to the center
[00:31:16] <dirty_d> right
[00:32:09] <PetefromTn_> in the touch off window tab you click the drop down menu and select the coordinate system you want and in the input window you type in the distance/2
[00:32:36] <PetefromTn_> I use that all the time now and it works great and makes things easier not having to reach for a calculator
[00:32:44] <andypugh> So, homing switches (which can also be limit switches) stop the machine hitting the end stops and let you re-start jobs after shut-down. Touch-off lets you call anywhere you want X=0 Y=0 Z=0
[00:32:45] <dirty_d> hmm
[00:33:06] <dirty_d> i thought those top left coordinates where machine coordinates though?
[00:33:10] <dirty_d> they changed to 0 when i touched off
[00:33:20] <PetefromTn_> I don't see why you cannot just open axis, NOT home anything and just touch off wherever you need but you will not have the safety of the soft limits
[00:33:25] <dirty_d> and the G54 coordinates changed to what the top left ones used to be
[00:33:45] <PetefromTn_> the top left coordinates are whatever work coordinate system you are currently in.
[00:33:49] <andypugh> dirty_d: On your machine you could just set NO_FORCE_HOMING, then jog to the edge-finder, touch-off what you want to call that point, and run your code.
[00:34:16] <andypugh> It doesn’t really matter that the machine doesn’t know where it is
[00:34:34] <PetefromTn_> you can go to the top there and select the drop down and hit show machine coordinates or work coordinates to toggle back and forth
[00:34:43] <andypugh> All that you really lose is the soft-limits, and the warning that the job is too big for the machine
[00:35:36] <dirty_d> ahh
[00:37:44] <LeelooMinai> So, I will have those 4 M8 socket screws holding the spindle bracket. Since there probably may be vibration there - would you put some split washers there too?
[00:38:09] <andypugh> When you turn on the machine it thinks is is at X=0 Y=0 Z=0 in the machine coordinate system. You can then touch-off your G54 (or whatever) coordinate system relative to that (random) origin point to call a point on your work (0,0,0) in the G54 system and the offsets of G54 from Machine will be set accordingly.
[00:39:17] <andypugh> When you home the machine it either sets the machine (0,0,0) to the current point (in your case) or runs to the switches and calls _them_ (0,0,0) in the machine system
[00:39:56] <andypugh> The (small) problem in your case us that the random machine system + constant G45 offset = random G54 origin.
[00:40:26] <andypugh> (err, that last sentence had a G45 for G54)
[00:41:01] <dirty_d> ok this is making sense now
[00:41:13] <PetefromTn_> yeah as long as you realize when you shut down all bets are off and if you hit a limit you are lost and will have to reaquire your zero to start again is the only issue. unless your machine is strong enough to damage and destroy shit when it runs into a limit LOL...
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[00:43:56] <dirty_d> oh yea, i was used to that
[00:44:09] <dirty_d> i had no notion of machine coordinates
[00:44:21] <dirty_d> id just clamp work down and zero off of it
[00:44:48] <PetefromTn_> well if you do it like andy is suggesting that will work fine I think.
[00:44:55] <andypugh> The machine coordinates are physical, and define where bad things happen at each end of travel.
[00:45:01] <dirty_d> right
[00:45:26] <dirty_d> my motors are weak enough they they just stop at the ends
[00:45:27] <andypugh> But with a weak stepper machine the bad things are not _very_ bad.
[00:45:36] <dirty_d> haven't crashed into the table yet
[00:45:44] <PetefromTn_> if you have a GOOD repeatable home switch it can make things a LOT easier for repeat work.
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[00:45:56] <dirty_d> yea, ive yet to even make anything, lol
[00:46:02] <dirty_d> just some test cuts
[00:46:12] <andypugh> I have seen pictures of big industrial machines that have ripped themselves apart. Total loss 200k badness
[00:46:20] <dirty_d> ouch
[00:46:25] <PetefromTn_> well you are moving from Mach3 to LinuxCNC so you are on the right track!!
[00:46:35] <dirty_d> heh
[00:46:49] <Tom_itx> besides we're a much better croud to hang with
[00:46:52] <LeelooMinai> Which works well, unless you live in UK
[00:47:08] <dirty_d> i was working on an external controller, but i kinda lost interest
[00:47:13] <dirty_d> i need something right now that just works
[00:47:32] <andypugh> LeelooMinai: What’s the problem with living in the UK?
[00:47:48] <LeelooMinai> They don't want to be on the right track? :)
[00:48:32] <PetefromTn_> having used Mach3 for quite awhile and now having used LinuxCNC for a good while I cannot imagine why anyone would want to PAY FOR Mach3 let alone use it over linuxCNC.
[00:48:38] <andypugh> dirty_d: You can make LinuxCNC into your own controller.
[00:49:10] <dirty_d> the controller i made didn't require a realtime host computer
[00:49:25] <dirty_d> it seems like with linuxcnc it always has to run in realtime
[00:49:52] <dirty_d> you would send the controller step and direction commands that were buffered
[00:50:22] <dirty_d> or you could send it a command to i.e. stop when it hits a limit and report the position and stuff
[00:50:38] <andypugh> dirty_d: Try doing lathe threading buffered.
[00:51:12] <PetefromTn_> or rigid tapping
[00:51:19] <dirty_d> you wouldn't
[00:51:26] <pcw_home> or probing
[00:51:40] <pcw_home> or homing
[00:52:01] <dirty_d> the controller would do it itself after you sent it the commands for the parameters etc
[00:52:07] <dirty_d> same deal for probing and homing
[00:52:26] <andypugh> But, yeah, buffering can work, Smoothstepper systems are making good parts worldwide.
[00:52:52] <pcw_home> you can move all of those things to the buffered controller but its usually not as nice or powerful an environment for complex real time tasks
[00:53:09] <dirty_d> yea i can imagine
[00:53:11] <andypugh> Realtime in the controller is only one solution, but it is our solution, and it’s no real headache.
[00:53:34] <dirty_d> for my use, a 3 axis mill building all that stuff into a controller is easy
[00:53:54] <dirty_d> but i can imagine it would be pretty damn hard on a 5-axis machine or something
[00:54:02] <andypugh> Until you want your mill to rigid-tap :-)
[00:54:45] <LeelooMinai> Ok, so what's special about rigid-tapping (whatever that is:)?
[00:54:45] <andypugh> I can see the academic interest in re-inventing the wheel, but Mach and LinuxCNC already work, so if you want to make parts, use them.
[00:55:14] <dirty_d> why couldnt the controller handle that?
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[00:55:23] <andypugh> LeelooMinai: The Z-feed is hard-linked to the spindle encoder feedback
[00:55:32] <dirty_d> you could just send it a commadn to do a coordinated movement of the 2 axes
[00:55:50] <dirty_d> you send high level commands to the controller, not individual steps and stuff
[00:55:52] <andypugh> The controller can handel that, but it needs to be programmed in to the controller.
[00:56:05] <dirty_d> unless its regular milling where you dont need feedback from servo motors like with ridig tapping
[00:56:23] <andypugh> The Z-move _depends_ on the spindle encoder feedback.
[00:56:46] <dirty_d> right
[00:57:05] <dirty_d> the controller would be coordinating that
[00:57:09] <LeelooMinai> Yes, well, to be honest I always had some problems with understanding why anyone would do control inside OS and hardware that is not really meant to handle anything real-time. Moving it out to external controller always made more sense to me, especially now when we have microcontrollers, fpgas, etc. with super-low prices and a lot of power.
[00:57:21] <PetefromTn_> when the spindle hits the work with the tap the speed is Not consistent and slows down even so you have to have the real time feedback to get the Z axis to match the feedrate..
[00:57:29] <dirty_d> without any intervention from the PC
[00:57:32] <pcw_home> eventually you will rebuild linuxcnc on a less capable platform
[00:57:36] <dirty_d> the PC would have just told it what to do beforehand
[00:58:02] <andypugh> So, yes, you can take the spindle encoder counts to your real-time layer in your buffered system, and that’s all fine. But then how about my hobbing system that gears A to spindle in a fixed ratio? You need to re-program your buffered system again.
[00:58:19] <LeelooMinai> pcw_home: But aren't your mesa boards following that philisophy already? You have fpga there makind a lot of work, no?
[00:58:28] <LeelooMinai> making*
[00:59:10] <pcw_home> It a necessary evil so they do as little as possible
[00:59:22] <LeelooMinai> Why evil?
[00:59:53] <pcw_home> eventually you will rebuild linuxcnc on a less capable platform
[01:00:26] <PetefromTn_> you mean making linuxCNC just a frontend for a dedicated motion controller?
[01:00:42] <dirty_d> thats basically what you'd be doing
[01:00:59] <pcw_home> well its already done
[01:01:06] <andypugh> There are lots of ways to do this. None are right or wrong. When LinuxCNC was “invented” by NIST the move was to take the real-time parts out of expensive proprietary systems into cheap, readily-available PCs. Now there are even cheaper real-time platforms and you can put the controller there. The Reprap guys do that with super-cheap Arduinos.
[01:01:06] <LeelooMinai> Well, there could be some protocole between the motion part and os part.
[01:01:12] <LeelooMinai> protocol*
[01:01:28] <LeelooMinai> As long as the protocol was standard, the hardware part could be implemented in many ways.
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[01:02:01] <LeelooMinai> andypugh: Right, I guess situation reversed itself.
[01:02:32] <DaViruz> you'd be hard pressed to make it as powerful and flexible as linuxcnc is on some microcontroller
[01:02:36] <pcw_home> Q: why do cards like the smooth stepper have trouble implementing things that linuxcnc can do easily?
[01:02:39] <LeelooMinai> Ale those powerful cheap microcontrollers can do a real good real-time job.
[01:02:47] <andypugh> So, yes, there are other ways to do it, and sometimes they might be better, but there is no point trying to squeeze LinuxCNC into that shape. LinuxCNC is defined as real-time machine-control in something vaguely PC-like.
[01:03:30] <LeelooMinai> pcw_home: THey do? I don't know:)
[01:03:30] <pcw_home> well not PC like but os like with files, dynamic loading of modules etc
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[01:03:58] <andypugh> If you want to run your real-time motion controller somewhere else than in the PC, then feel free,
[01:04:32] <pcw_home> as soon as you implement the features needed to make all that easy, you end up with a OS and linuxcnc on your micro
[01:04:52] <PetefromTn_> not sure what if any advantage that has really. My Cinci works great and rigid taps happily with just an atom board and SSD
[01:05:03] <andypugh> The Mesa cards don’t do motion control.[1] They simply do as little as possible to help with the really fast-moving low-level layers.
[01:05:25] <furrywolf> surprisingly successful day of yard sales, being january... got two 100W solar panels for $100, a pile of Craftsman and S+K tools for $20, a new-in-box comealong for $5, a complete metalbestos chimney (everything from just above the stove to the cap) for $20, and other fun things.
[01:05:33] <andypugh> [1] Mesa cards can do motion control, and do, but that’s separate from the LinuxCNC drivers
[01:06:11] <andypugh> furrywolf: The $5 was the best part.
[01:07:26] <LeelooMinai> I bought two $200 watt solar panels for $300 not so long ago - new ones too.
[01:07:32] <LeelooMinai> 200 watt*
[01:08:06] <LeelooMinai> Will play with them this summer hopefully.
[01:08:47] <andypugh> I might install water turbines in my fallpipes for summer :-)
[01:08:56] <dirty_d> i see what you mean
[01:10:34] <furrywolf> fallpipes? I assume you don't mean the ship...
[01:10:54] <LeelooMinai> Maybe waterfall pipes...
[01:11:20] <andypugh> I think that is what you call the pipes from gutters to drains?
[01:11:55] <LeelooMinai> RIght, I don't think you will get much return from those turbines there:)
[01:12:35] <furrywolf> we call those downspouts here...
[01:13:11] <furrywolf> and I think if you do the math, the potential power available is extremely tiny.
[01:13:41] <LeelooMinai> Could be ok if the house was directly iunder some waterfall:)
[01:13:48] <DaViruz> i would imagine andypugh is making a joke on uk climate.
[01:15:02] <pcw_home> ~75F here today
[01:15:14] <LeelooMinai> Right, I guess not the best place for solar panels.
[01:15:17] <furrywolf> You have: 1in/hr * 800ft2 * 12ft * gravity * 1kg/l
[01:15:17] <furrywolf> You want: watts
[01:15:17] <furrywolf> * 18.8091
[01:15:39] <LeelooMinai> Probably would be fine if not the clouds:)
[01:15:51] <furrywolf> so if you have a very heavy rain (1 inch per hour), on an 800 square foot roof, 12ft high, you only get 18 watts available energy. actual generating capacity would only be a few watts.
[01:16:32] <andypugh> Yeah, not sure I would see 18W of insolation on my roof :-)
[01:16:40] <bobo_> peaking plant
[01:16:40] <furrywolf> lol
[01:17:21] <furrywolf> or, if you like all metric...
[01:17:22] <furrywolf> You have: 2 cm/hr * 75m2 * 3m * gravity * 1kg/l
[01:17:22] <furrywolf> You want: watts
[01:17:22] <furrywolf> * 12.258313
[01:17:37] * furrywolf loves the units program
[01:17:57] <LeelooMinai> Since I live in Canada, I was convinced that solar panels here would be fail, since snow, and all that, but when I checked data, it actually turns out that Ontario is pretty decent place for solar panels.
[01:18:40] <furrywolf> short version: despite all the people who occasionally claim it's a great idea, generating hydro from rainfall on your roof is not a useful idea.
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[01:19:05] <andypugh> Yeah, I am playing to a stereotype, I admit. They work OK here too.
[01:19:17] <LeelooMinai> Unless you have some fission reactor that can work with water:)
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[01:19:50] <andypugh> The UK isn’t where you would build your ideal solar plant, but filling your roof with them pays back eventually,
[01:19:52] <PetefromTn_> I got two of those here
[01:19:59] <DaViruz> i use rainwater from the roof to cool my BWR in my basement.
[01:20:03] <furrywolf> I live in an area that's pretty bad for solar, but I don't have any other potential energy here.
[01:20:20] <PetefromTn_> methane?
[01:20:31] <LeelooMinai> Drill a hole to the mantle:)
[01:20:34] <andypugh> Fusion is closer.
[01:20:37] <PetefromTn_> hot air ;)
[01:21:03] <andypugh> They are now building an actual fusion plant that should produce (some) poer.
[01:21:04] <DaViruz> last time i checked, with swedish climate, solar panel power would end up costing about twice grid power whhen you factor on power derating over time
[01:21:05] <furrywolf> I'm not near any abundant source of hot air... DC is way on the other side of the country...
[01:21:16] <DaViruz> factor in*
[01:21:43] <PetefromTn_> sure you are... YOU LOL
[01:22:12] <andypugh> DaViruz: You have all those hot blondes. Can’t you arrange an array of Hot Blondes on one side of a Peltier device and Snow on the other
[01:22:43] <DaViruz> hot blondes don't stay hot forever though, not even here
[01:22:44] <PetefromTn_> andypugh you holdin' out on us man? heh
[01:22:59] <DaViruz> the snow seems eternal though :/
[01:23:36] * furrywolf is not blonde, which isn't much of a problem, but isn't hot either...
[01:24:23] <andypugh> DaViruz: My colleagues working in Lapland at the moment are finding things inconveniently warm. They wanted -30 and have -3
[01:24:32] <furrywolf> lol
[01:24:36] <furrywolf> F or C?
[01:24:40] <andypugh> C
[01:24:46] <DaViruz> yeah this winter has been strikingly warm
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[01:29:23] <bobo_> Sweden has given the world Jo-Blocks ABBA Ice Hotel , sounds like a great place
[01:29:53] <Jymmm> or hell.
[01:30:28] <andypugh> I spent 2 weeks in Sweden, it was very dull
[01:30:46] <DaViruz> i like dull
[01:30:54] <andypugh> But I don’t blame Sweden for that. I blame Jokkmokk and January.
[01:31:22] <DaViruz> maybe jokkmokk isn't that representative
[01:32:02] <andypugh> I got that impression.
[01:32:14] <andypugh> Or you would have all left.
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[01:43:09] <DaViruz> sometimes i wonder why we came here in the first place
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[01:43:39] * furrywolf can't afford to travel
[01:43:39] <andypugh> if you lived in Jokkmokk you would just walk.
[01:43:39] <andypugh> (actually, Jokkmokk is a bog town, but I never spotted a local who wasn’t serving me food in the Pizza place or the Chinese place)
[01:43:39] <andypugh> (bog == big, typo)
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[01:43:40] <furrywolf> I mean the travel to and from sweden, the costs of being there, and the lack of income while I'm away...
[01:43:40] <andypugh> furrywolf: Ah, I thought you were saying you were already there and couldn’t afford to leave.
[01:43:40] <furrywolf> heh
[01:43:40] <andypugh> DaViruz: I actually like Sweden. I had the best meal I have ever eaten in Göteborg.
[01:43:40] <furrywolf> I had a really good meal today at the local indian restaurant.
[01:43:41] <furrywolf> chicken kadhi, samosas, rice, roti.
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[01:45:21] <furrywolf> computer repair question: I had a laptop that worked fine three weeks ago. now won't power up. the battery charge light comes on when the ac adapter is connected, but it won't power up (no signs of life at all - no fan, no leds, no dcdcs whining, nothing) with either the ac adapter, battery, or both.
[01:45:23] <furrywolf> any ideas?
[01:45:36] <furrywolf> leaving the battery out for a day didn't help, so not something needing to reset.
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[01:50:53] <furrywolf> reseated ram, no change. popped cover off, power button pcb is connected.
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[01:50:53] <andypugh> furrywolf: What happens with the battery removed but on AC power
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[01:50:53] <furrywolf> nothing at all, just like with the battery but no ac, or both.
[01:50:53] <furrywolf> the only sign of life I've gotten from it is that if both the ac adapter and battery are in, the battery seems to be charging.
[01:50:53] <andypugh> Sounds like an excuse to buy a Macbook Air to fondle.
[01:50:53] <furrywolf> no, I like real computers.
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[01:50:53] <andypugh> Macbooks are nice objects even when they won’t boot, like yours.
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[01:51:02] <andypugh> But the whole “real computers” thing makes no sense to me. I was joking anyway. But the hardware in question can run Win, Linux or Mac, so how is it not a real computer?
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[01:52:09] <LeelooMinai> Because it comes from a sleazy source:)
[01:52:12] <XXCoder> furrywolf: battery probably dead
[01:52:12] <XXCoder> however, try this. plug it in, leave plugged a full day or night, unplug, attempt to turn on, if it dont boot, plug in and repeat
[01:52:15] <renesis> reseat rams, shrug
[01:52:16] <renesis> it should post beep, tho
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[01:52:51] <furrywolf> on this laptop, if I want to change the hard drive, I press a button and it pops out the side. same for the battery. same for the ram. same for the wifi card. and it's covered in i/o ports on all sides. and it's waterproof.
[01:53:08] <furrywolf> xxcoder: tried
[01:53:13] <furrywolf> renesis: tried reseating ram
[01:53:20] <XXCoder> strange
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[01:53:47] <renesis> heh
[01:53:50] <renesis> press on it
[01:53:52] <XXCoder> the worse I had to do cycle 6 times before my laptop decided to work
[01:54:08] <renesis> squeeze it, twist it, etc, keep hitting the power button
[01:54:39] <furrywolf> I think the laptop might have liquid damage of some kind... when removing the covers to see if anything obvious was wrong, there's a large amount of dried white residue on parts of the case, under the keyboard, etc. I don't see any of it on electronics, showing the semi-waterproof design worked, but there sure is a lot of it...
[01:54:44] <renesis> if its bad connection, bad solder joint, itll be intermittent
[01:54:54] <furrywolf> my other laptop is entirely waterproof, this one is only semi-waterproof. heh.
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[01:56:05] <furrywolf> not sure what the residue is, kind of a mixture of clay and elmers glue in properties...
[01:56:06] <renesis> shrug, clean the boards and connections with alcohol if nothing obvious comes up
[01:56:13] <renesis> thats nasty
[01:56:28] <renesis> why is their liquids in your laptops
[01:56:30] <XXCoder> is it conductive?
[01:56:50] <furrywolf> ebay. heh.
[01:57:08] <LeelooMinai> Must be memory leaks
[01:57:16] <renesis> usually white stuff from water = mineral bits = conductive, but if its sticky who knows
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[01:57:40] <norias> hmpf
[01:57:46] <furrywolf> no, it's WAY too thick to be just mineral residue... it's something that was viscous and hardened.
[01:57:48] <renesis> even if all the caps blew i dont thyink there would be that much electrolyte goo
[01:57:57] <renesis> milk maybe
[01:58:30] <norias> i'm agreeing with memory leaks
[01:58:37] <andypugh> A couple of weeks ago I efficiently elbowed a complete large cup of coffee off the arm rest onto a laptop and then onto the passenger seat of a car, on a motorway servoce station. Before I could even formulate a plan it had soaked through both,
[01:58:38] <XXCoder> or "milk" :P
[01:58:53] <furrywolf> it was dumped on the keyboard from the looks of it.
[01:59:02] <XXCoder> strange
[01:59:13] <renesis> dissassemble, get some 99% alc and a soft nylon brush, go nuts, reassemble
[01:59:35] <furrywolf> andy: buy a Toughbook. the cf-30 is getting quite affordable on ebay. I washed my cf-29 in the driveway with a garden hose, with it turned on. :P
[01:59:37] <PetefromTn_> Damn..
[01:59:53] <PetefromTn_> still can't decide which rubber chord to get for this vacuum fixture
[02:00:17] <PetefromTn_> http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-rubber-cords/=vpldjc
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[02:00:48] <renesis> buna-n is nice, neoprene prob wont last long
[02:00:55] <furrywolf> andy: by far the best part was that the mailman showed up to deliver a package while I was washing it... the look on his face was utterly priceless. he kind of stuttered for a bit and said "umm, are you sure that's a good idea?". I then showed him it was still on, and working. :)
[02:01:34] <PetefromTn_> thats funny you say that because the Tormach vacuum chucks use neoprene
[02:02:03] <andypugh> furrywolf: Fnny you should say that, my Dell is due to be replaced by a Toughbook on Friday. But given that the Dell survived fully functiional, and is 3 years old, I don’t see that my employer paying 10x as much for a Toughbook is a great deal for them. I just use what I am given, but the Toughbook screen is horrible.
[02:02:17] <renesis> petefromtn_: do they consider it a consumable?
[02:02:48] <renesis> petefromtn_: and yeah, im pretty sure the cords on the bigass vacuum table i worked with on a router were some kind of dense foam
[02:02:48] <furrywolf> hrmm, the screens on mine are fine.
[02:02:49] <PetefromTn_> no idea probably as it is used I would think so.
[02:02:55] <renesis> so prob safe to ignore me
[02:03:12] <renesis> latex is kind of in between
[02:03:15] <furrywolf> I'm tempted to gut this one to fix my other one... got one with a bad backlight inverter and no wifi card.
[02:03:26] <PetefromTn_> I know when I used to do laminations work on high end cabinet work we used some stuff that looked like foam backer rod for the seals
[02:03:40] <furrywolf> andy: which model toughbook?
[02:04:00] <PetefromTn_> but I was not sure it would be the best choice for aluminum and plastic sheet work here.
[02:04:01] <renesis> with the big routers, youre just sealing to a spoil board that never moves so that kind of best case application for foam
[02:04:19] <furrywolf> the cf-30 cf-31 etc are fully rugged, and the screen is behind a couple extra layers of plastic. the cf-52 cf-53 etc are "business rugged" and have a bare lcd like other laptops.
[02:04:25] <andypugh> furrywolf: I will be swappping a nice 1200x for a 1024x with a resistive touch thing that blurs the image and has poor contrast
[02:04:51] <PetefromTn_> this will be an aluminum fixture with grooves holding down an aluminum plate.
[02:04:54] <renesis> petefromtn_: your thing is for a fixed application, wont be pulled out of the groove ever?
[02:05:03] <furrywolf> sounds like a cf-31 series then...
[02:05:09] <andypugh> Yeah
[02:05:20] <PetefromTn_> well not unless it gets damaged or a part rips out during a cut
[02:05:31] <furrywolf> ask about a cf-53 instead... you can get 1920x1200 on the 15" lcd, no touch. :P
[02:05:33] <renesis> right thats what i mean
[02:05:52] <PetefromTn_> whaddahell is santoprene rubber?
[02:05:53] <andypugh> 3k rather than $300 for the Dell. I do not wreck 10 Dells in the 3 year renewal, so I do not see the point
[02:06:08] <renesis> pretty sure its a foam rubber
[02:06:22] <renesis> im not sure if its always foamed tho, its used in speaker surrounds a lot, good stuff
[02:07:02] <furrywolf> the one I might fix with parts from this now-broken one has the 1920x1200 lcd... it's quite nice, at least as far as I can tell. right now the backlight just whistles louder instead of gets brighter over half brightness. it's got a lot of hours on it (can't remember which laptop has which, but it might be 15k hours or so), hoping it's just the inverter, not the ccfls.
[02:07:25] <renesis> petefromtn_: looks like mcmaster has both
[02:07:32] <PetefromTn_> Ooh santoprene rubber if it is the stuff used in speaker surrounds would probably be a good choice. pliant
[02:07:46] <furrywolf> the newer ones have led backlights, and don't have age-related issues like ccfl backlights.
[02:08:05] <renesis> yeah buna-n in 1/8" sheets was very tough, not pliant, maybe not good for this
[02:08:06] <andypugh> The logic is that the Toughbooks that they give us match the docking stations in the cars. Except that they don’t actually put docking stations in the cars in Europe. It’s classic Enormo-business cock-up
[02:08:08] <PetefromTn_> what sucks is they come in 1/8 and 1/4 inch and not 3/16 thick at mcmaster carr.
[02:08:09] <furrywolf> the only santoprene I've used is on shurflo pump parts, and it's STIFF.
[02:08:12] <renesis> santoprene is floppy
[02:08:31] <furrywolf> andy: lol
[02:08:57] <furrywolf> andy: at least you'll have a laptop that you can dump coffee on (or a bucket of water, etc) and it'll keep running.
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[02:09:25] <renesis> petefromtn_: im pretty sure silicone rubber would work but its $$$
[02:09:26] <andypugh> But the Dell kept on running. It is still running,
[02:09:49] <furrywolf> andy: look up toughbook torture tests if you're bored... there's videos of them running in a sink of water, being ran over with a truck, being tossed through the air onto the ground, falling out of windows, etc...
[02:09:55] <renesis> 6x more than the santoprene
[02:10:02] <andypugh> (I lost the “Ins” key, big deal
[02:10:20] <furrywolf> oh, you cleaned all the coffee out of it?
[02:10:23] <PetefromTn_> http://www.mcmaster.com/#9808k21/=vpo3hq
[02:10:47] <andypugh> No, I just hoped for the best, and nothing bad hapened
[02:11:02] <Rab> A friend of mine is crazy about the General Dynamics GoBook, it's comparable to the Toughbook and they go for about $100 on eBay. Pretty nice, Core2Duo/touchscreen/etc.
[02:11:09] <furrywolf> heh, there's a few videos of toughbooks being strapped to the hood of a car, open, and ran through automatic carwashes. :)
[02:11:10] <PetefromTn_> ooh and its orangish red color LOL
[02:11:25] <renesis> rab: orly
[02:11:26] <Rab> We're running our LPKF with one since the desktop PC died.
[02:11:58] <Rab> renesis, really good stuff, and apparently it's standard cop issue because there are tons of them out there.
[02:12:10] <PetefromTn_> the question is then 1/8 inch or 1/4 inch thick..
[02:12:16] <renesis> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Lot-of-2-General-Dynamics-Itronix-IX270-GoBook-XR-1-Core-Duo-1-83GHz-2GB-80GB-L3-/121554982888?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c4d3dd7e8
[02:12:19] <andypugh> That’s my point, the Dell was Tough Enough for 3 years of may abuse and cost $300 on the contract. The Toughbook costs $3000 and won’t actually be more reliable. It’s a waste
[02:12:24] <renesis> wtf two for $140! haha cool
[02:12:41] <renesis> rab: nice, cop computers last forever
[02:12:42] <furrywolf> yeah, I got my toughbooks used, cheap...
[02:13:32] <Rab> Also standard gas/oil industry issue, which I imagine is why those are coming from Houston.
[02:13:50] <renesis> whats typical res?
[02:14:15] <Rab> Varies, some are pretty crummy (1024x768).
[02:14:16] <renesis> i have a 1920x1200 hp core2duo, dunno how much longer it will last
[02:14:30] <renesis> need backup!
[02:14:36] <furrywolf> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yvd0tYxX9II toughbook in a carwash
[02:15:06] <andypugh> 1024 x 768 + resistive touchsceen blur + -40 temp rating lack of contrast.
[02:15:24] <renesis> rab: youre doing linuxcnc on it?
[02:15:43] <renesis> or lpfk has some windows controller setup
[02:15:55] <andypugh> furrywolf: Yes, but, seriously, I don’t carwash my laptops
[02:16:24] <Rab> renesis, nah, LPKF CircuitCam/BoardMaster under XP. Might try LinuxCNC if it has a parport, I don't remember.
[02:16:28] <furrywolf> lol
[02:16:42] <furrywolf> mine was grimey... I scrubbed it with a sponge and hosed it off in the driveway.
[02:16:49] <renesis> hard to find specs
[02:16:51] <Rab> But there are cardbus and expresscard slots, so could easily add one.
[02:17:07] <renesis> screen mode XGA wtf does that mean
[02:17:09] <furrywolf> I got to use while working on cars, so it gets covered in greasy fingerprints, etc.
[02:17:16] <renesis> oh, 1024x768
[02:17:38] <furrywolf> xga is 1024x768... you can get the semi-rugged toughbooks (not fully waterproof) with wuxga screens, which are 1920x1200.
[02:17:59] <renesis> theyre the only ones left
[02:18:06] <renesis> that still sell 1920x1200
[02:18:18] <renesis> new at newegg, at least
[02:18:27] <furrywolf> I don't like the new whateverx1080 screens... too wide.
[02:18:35] <renesis> sucks for docs
[02:18:39] <andypugh> Yeah, and that would be fine, but we got the ones meant for war zones with all those compromises
[02:18:39] <Rab> renesis, Lenovo might have an option.
[02:18:56] <furrywolf> absolutely no reason computer screens should emulate tv screens.
[02:18:59] <renesis> i kind of like the idea of the general dynamics thing
[02:19:02] <andypugh> What we reallly need is Pixels. We have 40,000 variables to look after and monitor.
[02:19:36] <furrywolf> andy: ebay your fully rugged one and buy a semi rugged one with the features you need? :P
[02:19:41] <renesis> new lenovo stuff doesnt seem as tankish as old stuff
[02:19:48] <renesis> it still looks cooler than everything else, tho
[02:20:32] <furrywolf> I went laptop shopping a few months ago, and was very disappointed with the keyboards on most new laptops. make sure you test-type before buying anything.
[02:20:42] <andypugh> furrywolf: Not mine to sell, it’s on contract from someone laughing all the way to the bank.
[02:20:44] <furrywolf> the little-flat-keys-with-lots-of-space-around-them design is just fucking awful.
[02:21:01] <Rab> Yeah, Lenovo has kinda screwed the keyboards up as well.
[02:21:02] <renesis> its apple
[02:21:20] <renesis> apple design sells, so stock holders demand you copy apple design
[02:21:28] <renesis> law requires it
[02:21:38] <furrywolf> they were the worst to type on of any keyboard I've ever used.
[02:21:57] <andypugh> Have you tried the Apple keyboards? They are lovely.
[02:22:03] <furrywolf> no
[02:22:08] <renesis> theyre not so horrible to use compared to super cheap scissor spring ones
[02:22:26] <andypugh> Copies may not be, but the Apple ones are nice.
[02:22:31] <furrywolf> I want a laptop with clickyswitches... unfortunately msi wants like $8000 for theirs.
[02:22:54] <PetefromTn_> Okay I give up.
[02:23:06] <PetefromTn_> I am gonna break down and order three different types
[02:23:19] <furrywolf> yes, you can get laptops with a genuine individual mechanical switch per key... if you're rich, and don't mind it being more of a portable than a laptop, since they stuffed it full of other desktop components as well.
[02:23:28] <CaptHindsight> furrywolf: we are using the T60 keyboards, but we might make a cheery switch keyboard for the laptops
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[02:23:31] <PetefromTn_> FDA-Compliant Silicone Rubber, Cord, 1/8" Diameter, 36" Length, 40A Durometer
[02:23:34] <furrywolf> aka a "gaming laptop".
[02:23:46] <PetefromTn_> Weather/Chemical Resistant Santoprene Rubber, Cord, 1/8" Diameter, 55A Durometer, 10 ft. Length
[02:23:58] <PetefromTn_> Medium-Strength Rubber, Cord, 1/8" Diameter, 36" Length, 40A Durometer
[02:24:15] <CaptHindsight> furrywolf: http://openlunchbox.com/
[02:24:16] <furrywolf> silicone is resistant to many chemicals, but not diesel fuel nor strong bases. tried both. :P
[02:24:33] <andypugh> A friend was convinced he wanted something like the classic clicky IBM until I suggested he try the Apple chicklet style, and he changed his mind. It’s not inherent to the the design, it is how you make it work.
[02:24:53] <furrywolf> andy: I think flat keys with minimal travel are inherently crap.
[02:25:07] <furrywolf> I love the ibm clicky. :)
[02:25:19] <CaptHindsight> people like the trackpoints as well
[02:25:23] <furrywolf> I can still type faster on a model m than anything else...
[02:25:44] <andypugh> I just decided I don’t care enough to argue
[02:25:51] <furrywolf> clitmouse! trackpoint is probably a brand name. :P
[02:26:10] <CaptHindsight> the "nub"
[02:26:45] <andypugh> Goodnight opinonated wrong people.
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[02:26:59] <furrywolf> lol
[02:27:02] <PetefromTn_> Goodnight andy
[02:27:25] <andypugh> http://xkcd.com/386/
[02:27:28] <CaptHindsight> everyone is entitled to their own opinion even if it's wrong
[02:28:06] <andypugh> Why are 123 and 386 the best XKCDs?
[02:28:16] <furrywolf> capt: but what if you are, in fact, wrong that even wrong people are entitled to their own opinion? are you still entitled to that opinion?
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[02:28:41] <unfy> hmmm
[02:28:42] <PetefromTn_> actually I don't want to pay for three types gotta narrow it to two..
[02:28:51] <unfy> the kitty proximity one is pretty good
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[02:29:12] * furrywolf has never found xkcd particularly interesting
[02:30:00] <PetefromTn_> so it's either the medium strenth neoprene or the FDA compliant silicon rubbber..
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[02:30:31] <furrywolf> fda silicone isn't particularly pliable. check the shore a hardnesses of the materials and see what you need...
[02:30:33] <XXCoder> furrywolf: can always retrofit old keyboard to use then use it on laptop
[02:30:40] <Rab> furrywolf, goatkcd is way better.
[02:31:12] <unfy> furry: there are nuggets here or there that will resonate - the rest is 'meh'. same with most things
[02:31:32] <PetefromTn_> they are both 40 durometer which should be pretty damn soft really
[02:31:35] <CaptHindsight> furrywolf: what if I'm wrong but not in fact, but only in opinion?
[02:32:08] <unfy> ya know, i should have known better when loading goatkcd
[02:32:12] <XXCoder> goatse.cx. anyone who seen it is marked for life
[02:32:22] <CaptHindsight> I forget do we vote on facts in here or not?
[02:32:31] <furrywolf> rab: my first thought was "you know, that could be xkcd with the characters replaced with goats... but, no, it's going to be goatse". and I was right.
[02:32:38] <PetefromTn_> facts? what facts?
[02:33:09] <XXCoder> goatkcd wee good thing I was already immunized from that first time :P
[02:33:15] <furrywolf> xxcoder: that seems a little excessive. nothing that odd about someone's ass...
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[02:33:43] <XXCoder> lol
[02:33:51] <PetefromTn_> I'm lost... WTF are we talking about here?
[02:34:27] <CaptHindsight> the art goatse contest was hilarious
[02:34:32] <furrywolf> pete: laptops, webcomics, the philosophy of opinion vs fact, and anal sex.
[02:34:59] <CaptHindsight> especially the view out from the inside
[02:35:01] <_methods> basically Jymmm's everyday life
[02:35:02] <PetefromTn_> no that is what YOU were talking about..
[02:35:06] <renesis> http://www.bash.org/?37390
[02:35:12] <renesis> relavent ^
[02:35:27] <furrywolf> oh, and rubber seals.
[02:35:50] <renesis> yeah always wear your rubber to anal sex
[02:36:06] <furrywolf> renesis: anal sex does NOT hurt, even at first, unless you're doing something wrong. usually not enough lube, or going to quickly.
[02:36:07] <PetefromTn_> Okay I can get enough of all three types from Mcm for like $25.00 plus whatever they kill me for shipping.
[02:36:09] <furrywolf> s/to/too
[02:36:40] <renesis> furry is into anal sex and hasnt been with very thick guys before
[02:37:03] <renesis> mcmaster shipping is pretty fair
[02:37:09] <renesis> i hate how you order blind, tho
[02:37:12] <PetefromTn_> usually
[02:37:13] * furrywolf has never been with any guys
[02:37:25] <unfy> last night - i complained about forgetting some cheap board to put under main table board of electronics workbench am making - tonight went and got some. in mushy wet snow. gottal love going completely sideways for 25-30 feet even in 4WD :D
[02:37:53] * furrywolf only likes women... and has some plenty well-endowed strapons.
[02:37:56] <unfy> but - i have it. it's in the other room drying... will chop up later. tonight i build!
[02:38:07] <XXCoder> heh yeserday we had heavy fog. all day
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[02:39:56] <furrywolf> mcmaster's prices are always high enough that I've never gotten to the point where I'd see a shipping quote, because I'm already shopping elsewhere.
[02:40:41] <Rab> McMaster is like Grainger, great for spending other people's money.
[02:40:55] <furrywolf> I don't get to spend other people's money, only my own.
[02:41:09] <Rab> That is a tragedy.
[02:41:51] <zeeshan|2> theyre okay for rare stuff
[02:42:16] <zeeshan|2> why is firefox such a shitty browser
[02:42:26] <zeeshan|2> since when do browsers need 500mb of memory to operate
[02:42:33] <furrywolf> all browsers are shitty.
[02:42:50] <furrywolf> dillo is nice if you're not trying to load any page that depends on javascript... which is about half the internet these days.
[02:43:11] <unfy> qtweb can be okay. if you don't care aobut anything beyond html4 or javascript - dplus is insane
[02:43:12] <furrywolf> only 500mb? try letting it run for a couple more days. :P
[02:43:37] <unfy> hmmm dplus is a descendant of dillo i think :D
[02:43:38] <_methods> lynx
[02:43:40] <Rab> zeeshan|2, they were actually the cheapest source of steel 1/2-10 acme nuts.
[02:43:50] <Rab> Below eBay.
[02:44:29] <unfy> also, if you avoid video streams - you should be able to get a lighter browser. so far, for me, qtweb is a hair away from becoming my primary browser.
[02:44:35] <furrywolf> ebay is often not the cheapest. figure 15% in ebay fees... which get passed on to you.
[02:44:53] <zeeshan|2> yea not so every day stuff
[02:44:56] <zeeshan|2> is decent price
[02:45:02] <zeeshan|2> still can find it cheaper locally though
[02:45:06] <zeeshan|2> gotta find the right connections!
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[02:45:23] <furrywolf_> grrr, stupid fucking crappy net connection.
[02:45:24] <furrywolf_> > ebay is often not the cheapest. figure 15% in ebay fees... which get passed on to you.
[02:45:24] <furrywolf_> > ebay is great for used items, however.
[02:46:08] <bobo_> CaptHindsight you live in chicago , so we only get 1 vote to your many
[02:46:14] <RyanS> so why are big old lathes necessarily better than new chinese--surely Chinese manufacturing has improved since the 1970s western equivalent made their lathes?
[02:47:22] <Rab> RyanS, heavier castings, better quality cast iron, better rigidity.
[02:47:29] <unfy> the chinese lathes are built to a price. the older american/european ones weren't.
[02:47:34] <furrywolf_> ryan: manufacturing might have, but integrity sure hasn't.
[02:47:43] <furrywolf_> and I don't mean of the materials.
[02:47:49] <Rab> And better machining.
[02:48:50] <furrywolf_> as far as I can tell, either chinese culture doesn't value honesty and integrity, or they simply despise the rest of the planet.
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[02:48:57] <PetefromTn_> http://blog.cnccookbook.com/2012/02/18/fixturing-with-vacuum-tables-vacuum-chucks-and-vacuum-clamping-systems/ INTERESTING!
[02:49:57] * furrywolf_ is still waiting for someone who actually lives in china to answer whether chinese sell the same shoddy goods to themselves that they do to others
[02:50:04] furrywolf_ is now known as furrywolf
[02:50:12] <Rab> furrywolf_, they are doing exactly what they are paid to do. China is perfectly capable of producing quality for a premium price and spec.
[02:50:27] <unfy> furry: yes, yes they do
[02:50:30] <furrywolf> for example, in china, is your 100% solid copper wire aluminum?
[02:50:32] <Rab> Just like Japan, which used to be synonymous with cheap trash in the '60s.
[02:50:53] <furrywolf> rab: my '60s japanese audio equipment is of excellent quality
[02:51:12] <unfy> the difference is... that cheap chinese couch that may cost $200-$300 here in the USA costs only $6-$10 in china if you buy it close to the factory etc
[02:51:19] <XXCoder> anything besides electrics he meant I guess
[02:51:50] <Rab> furrywolf, that's because it was the expensive stuff that lasted.
[02:52:04] <Rab> Most everything else is in the landfill.
[02:52:55] <furrywolf> I like how my pioneer amps put out MORE than their rated power, unlike modern chinese amps, where every number on them was pulled out of someone's ass.
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[02:54:48] <furrywolf> that reminds me, I really need to fix my kenwood monoblocks.
[02:55:25] <unfy> if you know what it is that you're buying and understand the situation -- the chinese stuff can be appropriate. i have a haako knockoff solder station that will suit me just fine
[02:56:32] <furrywolf> http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-STEREO-PAIR-KENWOOD-L-07M-MONO-BLOCK-AMPLIFIERS-AMPS-/351300154766 I got a pair of those from an electronics repair guy... neither works. one blows the control fuse, the other the line fuse.
[02:58:26] <furrywolf> DC to 600Khz (+0 / -3dB).... because your audio amp NEEDS to double as an am radio transmitter. :)
[02:58:30] <XXCoder> did you return
[02:58:42] <unfy> metal housing? nuh uhhhhh
[02:59:48] <furrywolf> seriously. kenwood built an audio amp that'll quite happily transmit the lower end of the am radio band. why? who knows. lol
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[03:09:38] <LeelooMinai> All those endmills, so many weird shapes...
[03:10:31] <LeelooMinai> Is there some small subset of most useful ones, or one needs some scary collection of them and use exotic ones for each different project?
[03:11:03] <zeeshan|2> just get 2 flot slot end mills
[03:11:11] <zeeshan|2> flute
[03:11:30] <furrywolf> you should have both flat and ball nose
[03:12:01] <LeelooMinai> Well, I saw some videos and I can see how sometimes other ones may be needed - like when the guy was making a beveled edge, he had an endmill that had "negative" curve or something like that
[03:12:40] <LeelooMinai> Or was it filleted...
[03:12:41] <furrywolf> for cnc machining, you can do most things like that with software.
[03:12:44] <RyanS> compact http://www.espmach.com.au/images/LATHE%20Photos/Lathe-Heyligenstadt-Resized.jpg
[03:12:50] <furrywolf> it won't be as clean, but it doesn't need a special cutter.
[03:12:51] <LeelooMinai> The one that is curved finish on the edge
[03:13:16] <XXCoder> RyanS: too small
[03:13:28] <furrywolf> flat endmills are good for flat things, ball nose is much better for 3d profiling, curves, etc.
[03:13:35] <LeelooMinai> furrywolf: Right, that's what I thought - that having dedicated endmill would leave better finish
[03:13:38] <unfy> get a couple sizes of flated, and a couple sizers of ball shaped. play with a bunch and then you'll see the reasons for different ends and decide if you really need them or not etc
[03:14:13] <LeelooMinai> Right, I guess I will try to buy at least one of those ball-ended ones
[03:15:33] <PetefromTn_> http://www.microsystemsgeorgia.com/Vacuum_Fixture_Part_1of2.pdf what do you think the thickness of those two plates are I can't seem to see any information on that unless I am missing something.
[03:16:11] <zeeshan|2> 3/4"
[03:16:17] <zeeshan|2> and 3/16"
[03:16:37] <zeeshan|2> im g oing based on the very last pic
[03:16:38] <PetefromTn_> yeah that is what I was thinking
[03:16:40] <zeeshan|2> with the quick connect fitting
[03:16:46] <zeeshan|2> to get scale
[03:16:51] <LeelooMinai> 0.7458538mm by the looks of it
[03:16:54] <PetefromTn_> probably an 1/8 inch tube fitting
[03:17:06] <zeeshan|2> looks bigger
[03:17:27] <zeeshan|2> might be 1/4
[03:17:30] <PetefromTn_> the last picture?
[03:17:42] <zeeshan|2> yes
[03:17:55] <zeeshan|2> if you assume the small plate is 3/16
[03:18:07] <zeeshan|2> it looks bigger ;P
[03:18:14] <PetefromTn_> the small plate on top or underneath?
[03:18:19] <zeeshan|2> top
[03:18:43] <zeeshan|2> PetefromTn_: when in doubt oversize! :P
[03:18:44] <PetefromTn_> it says that top plate is .156 material it is the workpiece
[03:18:56] <zeeshan|2> oh
[03:18:57] <zeeshan|2> lol
[03:18:59] <zeeshan|2> i didnt see that
[03:19:38] <PetefromTn_> the very top picture looks like 3/4 main plate and then maybe 3/16 to 1/4 for the sealing plate underneath it.
[03:19:46] <PetefromTn_> that is a pretty damn nice fixture tho
[03:20:39] <PetefromTn_> http://www.microsystemsgeorgia.com/Vacuum_Fixture_Part_2of2.pdf
[03:25:27] <furrywolf> grrrr. taking apart the lcd bezel on this laptop is not working. I'm mushing it rather than popping any snaps.
[03:26:43] <PetefromTn_> https://www.youtube.com/watch?x-yt-cl=85114404&v=oW9TJIiFx58&x-yt-ts=1422579428#t=139 LinuxCNC lathe kickin' ass again!!!
[03:27:58] * furrywolf is starting to get frustrated
[03:28:21] <PetefromTn_> dafuk is that last tool that holds it for parting? Pretty sweet.
[03:31:12] <zeeshan|2> dude
[03:31:15] <zeeshan|2> that is such a cool tool
[03:31:19] <zeeshan|2> a dedicated part off tool
[03:31:24] <zeeshan|2> bolted right to the head
[03:31:33] <zeeshan|2> very little deflection
[03:31:46] <PetefromTn_> yeah those CHNC machines are slick as hell... lots of neat stuff. I love the pneumatic part catcher too.
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[03:33:53] <furrywolf> argh! obviously I'm doing something wrong. I found a video online that just shows the bezel popping off. I'm prying so hard I've mushed not just the plastic, but the magnesium.
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[03:35:13] <furrywolf> making a total fucking mess of my previously flawless laptop
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[03:36:42] <LeelooMinai> Hmm, say I buy an endmill like this one: http://www.ebay.ca/itm/6MM-R3-X-50MM-2-FLUTE-HRC45-CUTTING-AlTiN-TiAIN-CARBIDE-BALL-ENDMILL-/181576782840?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a46d1d3f8
[03:37:00] <LeelooMinai> and will use it for alu work - how long can I expect it to last?
[03:37:31] <_methods> depends on how fast you crash
[03:37:39] <LeelooMinai> Crash what?
[03:37:59] <furrywolf> the cutter into something.
[03:38:24] <LeelooMinai> I am just wondering if endmills are something that one replaces often or they last long time if not abused
[03:38:52] <_methods> they're consumables
[03:38:56] <_methods> much like drill bits
[03:39:18] <_methods> it's life depends on many variables
[03:39:58] <furrywolf> cut too fast, you snap it. crash it into the piece, the vise, etc, you snap it. cut too slowly, it chips. etc...
[03:40:13] <furrywolf> plan on breaking a fair number of smaller size ones on a new machine...
[03:40:40] <LeelooMinai> I imagine... but say if I use it for one hour milling 6061 and do not "crash" anything - is the mill to be considered in much worse state then at the beginning?
[03:41:18] <furrywolf> also, skilled people sharpen their endmills.
[03:41:51] <furrywolf> aluminum likes sticking to the cutter and making it not cut, resulting in randomly broken cutters. lubrication helps.
[03:41:53] <_methods> well you'll never feed it fast enough on your mill to get it at correct feeds and speeds so you'll probably see excessive wear for that time period
[03:42:56] <LeelooMinai> _methods: I will not? Why? :)
[03:43:10] <_methods> you can't feed fast enough on your machine
[03:44:25] <_methods> your rapids probably won't be fast enough lol
[03:44:36] <furrywolf> eh, on my sherline, I always have the other problem... I can't spin it fast enough.
[03:44:46] <_methods> there is that too
[03:44:47] <LeelooMinai> So to mill aluminum correctly I need a machine from NASA? :)
[03:44:52] <_methods> not enough spindle rpm
[03:44:55] <RyanS> What do i need look for in VFD compatibility; ability to change the terminals between star, delta?
[03:45:00] <_methods> no you need high rpm and feed
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[03:45:11] <LeelooMinai> _methods: Like what?
[03:45:13] <_methods> and a machine not from a garbage can
[03:45:26] <LeelooMinai> Ouch...
[03:45:26] <_methods> not one from nasa
[03:45:47] <furrywolf> I have to make stupidly slow cuts when using little endmills because the spindle rpm is too slow, and a fast feed just snaps the cutter right off.
[03:45:51] <LeelooMinai> _methods: Ok, then illuminate me - what rpm do I need? :)
[03:45:56] <_methods> go read
[03:46:18] <unfy> it'll depend on size of mill and stuff
[03:46:31] <_methods> there are formulas for this
[03:46:49] <LeelooMinai> _methods: Well, since you know my machine that well, it would be nicer if you just tell me whar rpm I won't be able to reach.
[03:47:10] <unfy> much like speeds for drill bits have formulas etc ... mills have same thing
[03:47:33] <_methods> well last pic i saw of your machine it couldnt do any rpm since it had no spindle
[03:48:36] <_methods> does it have a spindle now?
[03:48:37] <LeelooMinai> Yes, I did not plan to mill without a spindle though
[03:48:55] <LeelooMinai> Yes, I got a spindle for it
[03:49:12] <_methods> so what is the spindles max rpm?
[03:49:23] <LeelooMinai> 20k
[03:49:40] <_methods> well you should have enough spindle rpm though
[03:49:51] <_methods> if your tool doesnt fly out of it lol
[03:50:02] <LeelooMinai> You see... so you were wrong in other words...
[03:50:45] <LeelooMinai> Anyways, thanks for nothing:)
[03:50:46] <furrywolf> no, he said you wouldn't be able to FEED fast enough. I was the one who complained about having a mill with too slow of a spindle.
[03:50:57] <_methods> your welcome
[03:50:59] <unfy> rawr
[03:51:36] <LeelooMinai> furrywolf: Not really: <_methods> not enough spindle rpm
[03:52:47] <_methods> i definitely got that wrong
[03:52:56] <furrywolf> finally got the bezel off... seems the secret is to get out a big fucking screwdriver and mash harder.
[03:52:58] <XXCoder> woof
[03:53:04] <_methods> will those 20k spindles even do 20k?
[03:53:40] <furrywolf> after how much work it was, I'm going to buy a new inverter, not to salvage the one from the other laptop. the other one still has a complete, non-broken, nice-looking lcd...
[03:53:49] <_methods> did you get one of those chinese water cooled 20k spindles?
[03:54:07] <LeelooMinai> No, I got Chinese air cooled spindle
[03:54:42] <furrywolf> I still want to mount a 60k die grinder to my sherline for engraving/pcb milling.
[03:55:08] <_methods> you got an air cooled version that does 20k?
[03:55:38] <furrywolf> 20k isn't THAT fast....
[03:55:40] <LeelooMinai> Yes
[03:55:52] <furrywolf> if you back the bearings off until they flop around, just about anything will run cool. :P
[03:56:34] <LeelooMinai> From what I read air cooled are fine - they are bit noisier, but not louder than the cutter working, so I don't care. And certainly less mess then with water cooling.
[03:56:58] <furrywolf> 20k should be fine. consider a car alternator can spin at that just fine...
[03:57:13] <furrywolf> and only bmw felt the need to water-cool their alternators.
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[04:05:00] <XXCoder> water cooled alt
[04:05:27] <furrywolf> yes
[04:05:38] <furrywolf> because bmw needed to find a way to make a part that should cost $80 cost $800.
[04:06:03] <Jymmm> I don't care for radiators on MC's
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[04:08:52] <furrywolf> they put them on cars, and from what I've seen, they have a sub-100k lifespan.
[04:08:58] <furrywolf> and they run $800-$850
[04:09:39] <furrywolf> someone I knew sold his bmw when it went out the second time, at 80k miles...
[04:11:05] <furrywolf> heh, googling for more reports on them failing... fun things like "mine seized and put so much tension on the belt it ripped the PS pump off its mounting bracket. This happened at 85K."
[04:14:46] <unfy> 1920's Singer sewing machine - running at 4000rpm via motor - it purrs along happily. that is why you buy the good old shit <3
[04:14:55] <unfy> (er, was a hand sewing machine)
[04:15:16] <XXCoder> ouch
[04:15:19] <XXCoder> jeez
[04:15:29] <furrywolf> I fixed an old singer tradle machine once... fixing consisted of oiling everything and spinning it over a few times.
[04:15:32] <furrywolf> treadle
[04:15:38] <unfy> indeed :D
[04:15:46] <unfy> my mom had one. that thing was drool
[04:16:40] <unfy> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXIRbazT2Rs <- for those curious (sewing machine)
[04:17:40] <furrywolf> http://www.meeknet.co.uk/E38/Alternator/E38_Alternator_Replacement.htm and, being a bmw, something simple like changing the alternator is a day project, so even a competent shop will get you $500 in labor...
[04:19:12] <RyanS> http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Colchester-Bantam-600-Lathe-/311072669201?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item486d603e11
[04:19:44] <furrywolf> and that's for an older one, I've heard the newer ones (like my friend had) are even worse.
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[04:29:28] <furrywolf> hrmm, I didn't realize they were brushless... that opens up interesting renewable energy applications, assuming they survive longer outside of the car than in their intended application.
[04:29:29] <PetefromTn_andro> Like a moth to the flames I return for more hehe
[04:30:31] <furrywolf> the whole point of bushless alternators is they're supposed to last much much longer than brushed ones... but with them failing at 1/3rd the miles...
[04:30:45] <PetefromTn_andro> It's some kind of rare sickness to which there is no cure..
[04:32:17] <XXCoder> furry I always wanted to try use car alternator for wind power but it needs minium rpm greater than wind can provide.
[04:34:10] <furrywolf> yes, you need to belt or gear it up.
[04:34:32] <furrywolf> car alts are a good match for high-head microhydro, however.
[04:34:45] <XXCoder> whats high head microhydro
[04:36:06] <furrywolf> microhydro is small hydroelectric systems. high head is where you have water from a substantial height, like a small pipe running way up a hill, rather than high flow, which is where you have a lot of moving water, but not a lot of height change.
[04:36:31] <furrywolf> high head AND high flow tends to put you into the non-micro category, where you need a real generator. :)
[04:36:42] <XXCoder> ahh cool
[04:36:59] <XXCoder> I really should try make something, backyard has LOT wind
[04:37:06] <XXCoder> its small space but damn lot wind
[04:37:09] <furrywolf> high head systems tend to have a lot of rpm and not a lot of torque, while high flow systems tend to have a lot of torque but not much rpm.
[04:37:44] <XXCoder> interesting
[04:37:54] <furrywolf> (yes, you can build them other ways... but that's "tend to")
[04:38:00] <XXCoder> oh did you read about new "bladeless" wind power
[04:38:16] <XXCoder> its certain cone shape that moves back and forward
[04:38:20] <furrywolf> no
[04:38:31] <furrywolf> bah, that's still a blade. :P
[04:38:43] <XXCoder> http://www.treehugger.com/wind-technology/new-bladeless-wind-turbine-claimed-be-twice-efficient-conventional-designs.html
[04:38:47] <furrywolf> how about electrostatic effects or something? now that'd be bladeless. :)
[04:38:52] <XXCoder> well saw blade maybe lol
[04:40:07] <furrywolf> so looks like it's designed to nutate rather than rotate, with some funky aerodynamic effects.
[04:40:21] <XXCoder> yeah it goes over limit of wind power
[04:40:30] <XXCoder> 59% thereabout
[04:40:47] <furrywolf> or so they claim.
[04:40:51] <XXCoder> indeed
[04:40:59] * furrywolf will wait for results from independent testing agencies, not pr firms.
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[04:41:14] <XXCoder> https://www.metabunk.org/threads/is-the-saphonian-bladeless-wind-turbine-for-real-or-a-scam.1672/
[04:41:16] <XXCoder> details
[04:42:26] <furrywolf> that design isn't going to scale well
[04:42:39] <XXCoder> perfect for home use I would say
[04:43:00] <XXCoder> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdcmShRcyfk
[04:43:02] <furrywolf> will put really annoying cyclic torsion forces on the tower, too...
[04:43:06] <XXCoder> around 3:10
[04:44:29] <XXCoder> http://www.saphonenergy.com/site/en/evolution-pace.60.html ah that explains blades in video
[04:44:53] <furrywolf> nutation tends to involve lots of bearings that will need greasing, large thrust bearings, and a lot more parts than a simple rotating system.
[04:45:14] <XXCoder> interesting. always wanted to ask engineer
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[04:45:55] <furrywolf> their constant comparrisons to sails seems irrelevant to me
[04:45:59] <pcw_home> sounds like a tin building in a hurricane just before it blows away
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[04:46:37] * furrywolf wants text, not videos
[04:47:29] <bobo_> Hay Pete you ever hear of the cast iron foundry in ,i think central Penn. ? run by amish family
[04:48:55] <bobo_> cat tail ---catreal ?
[04:49:23] <furrywolf> I don't really like that design... I don't see why it can capture a higher percentage of the energy, I think it'll have a lot higher losses between the "sail" and the generator, I think it won't scale well, I think it'll need a much more expension tower, and I think it'll be much less reliable.
[04:49:30] <zeeshan|2> bobO
[04:49:40] <zeeshan|2> did you see my downgrade
[04:49:48] <bobo_> no
[04:50:05] <XXCoder> possibly but same time sometimes design really is counterituitive
[04:50:29] <Tom_itx> zeeshan|2, did you get that thing apart yet?
[04:51:01] <furrywolf> right. the efficiency I'm not qualified to analyze. however, as to the other problems, it has a LOT more moving parts.
[04:51:20] <PetefromTn_andro> bobo. No I didn't not sure I would want to
[04:51:32] <bobo_> zeeshan should I get some very dark glasses ?
[04:52:23] <zeeshan|2> Tom_itx: yes
[04:52:29] <zeeshan|2> hence the downgrade! :{
[04:52:37] <Tom_itx> what happened?
[04:52:38] <PetefromTn_andro> So I think I finally have all the shite I need to get this vacuum clamping system put together finally.
[04:52:40] <furrywolf> it has a ball joint in the middle. that is an evil grease-requiring part. it has a multitude of linkage rods with heim joints on each end, again needing maintenance and adding losses. this presumably (since there's no picture of the inside I've seen) is driving a swashplate to convert the nutation into rotation, adding a large thrust bearing. then you have all the rotating parts... just like you'd have with a standard rotating blade system, without a
[04:52:48] <zeeshan|2> http://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8608/15793018804_2b7ffca222_h.jpg
[04:52:57] <zeeshan|2> see a problem? :)
[04:53:21] <XXCoder> furrywolf: invent your own design?
[04:53:21] <PetefromTn_andro> Did you make chips yet
[04:53:29] <zeeshan|2> no
[04:53:31] <Tom_itx> wtf happened?
[04:53:32] <zeeshan|2> you know why?
[04:53:33] <zeeshan|2> LOL
[04:53:39] <zeeshan|2> i went to put the t-nuts i have
[04:53:41] <XXCoder> zeeshan|2: yes I see a problem. it's not in my garage. LOL
[04:53:41] <zeeshan|2> they dont fit :(
[04:53:42] <zeeshan|2> so close.
[04:53:44] <PetefromTn_andro> No idea
[04:53:47] <zeeshan|2> but no dice
[04:54:00] <furrywolf> the nutation is going to twist the tower cyclically, needing a much more expensive tower.
[04:54:06] <zeeshan|2> Tom_itx: my drawbar is worn out
[04:54:09] <zeeshan|2> so i just made a manual one
[04:54:10] <Tom_itx> so you got the cylinder off but it's held up with allthread now?
[04:54:12] <PetefromTn_andro> Jeez man grind down a bolt or something
[04:54:21] <zeeshan|2> no
[04:54:25] <Tom_itx> how ghetto is that!
[04:54:25] <zeeshan|2> im gonna return this all thread
[04:54:29] <zeeshan|2> when my cylinder comes
[04:54:29] <XXCoder> wrong diameter?
[04:54:29] <zeeshan|2> hahaha
[04:54:51] <furrywolf> note how they made the tower for their extremely small prototype out of really heavy industrial piping...
[04:54:53] <Tom_itx> did you find a good cylinder?
[04:55:02] <zeeshan|2> Tom_itx: im getting a quote for how much itll cost to rebuild
[04:55:14] <Tom_itx> what's worn out in it?
[04:55:15] <zeeshan|2> the guy whos the dealer for this
[04:55:24] <zeeshan|2> says that its not just springs when the clamp force is around 600lb
[04:55:35] <zeeshan|2> he's like youve got a worn wedge plate
[04:55:41] <zeeshan|2> and balls
[04:55:46] <zeeshan|2> i told him i'm not 85 yet
[04:55:54] <furrywolf> realizing the problem with lots of bearings and such, they claim their new version is all hydraulic... yay having reciprocating hydraulic seals. the life of that can't be good...
[04:55:59] <Tom_itx> do you have a diagram of it's innards?
[04:56:00] <PetefromTn_andro> Ooh worn balls that sounds really bad
[04:56:04] <zeeshan|2> Tom_itx: yes
[04:56:11] <zeeshan|2> PetefromTn_andro: lol
[04:56:27] <zeeshan|2> they'll replace em and certify it
[04:56:32] <Tom_itx> watched the interview a bit ago...
[04:56:54] <PetefromTn_andro> I thought it was pretty funny actually
[04:57:29] <Tom_itx> they'll charge you for all that too :)
[04:57:39] <zeeshan|2> yea
[04:57:42] <Tom_itx> yeah it was funny...
[04:57:48] <furrywolf> the actual efficiency of the non-blade I can't judge, but I don't like all the supporting hardware needed to make it work. :)
[04:57:48] <zeeshan|2> but i think if its under 500 bux its ok
[04:57:51] <zeeshan|2> if its more f it
[04:57:56] <zeeshan|2> manual drawbar! :)
[04:58:04] <PetefromTn_andro> I liked the part with the tiger
[04:58:09] <Tom_itx> heh
[04:59:01] <zeeshan|2> any of you guys have a curtain around your machine(s)?
[04:59:09] <Tom_itx> no
[04:59:13] <Tom_itx> mine's in a box
[04:59:23] <PetefromTn_andro> That freaking guy probably is that crazy too huh..
[04:59:31] <Tom_itx> i've seen some with a plexiglass surround
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[04:59:45] <zeeshan|2> PetefromTn_andro: i am really curious if that people really think he doesnt crap
[04:59:50] <zeeshan|2> or if that was just a joke
[04:59:51] <zeeshan|2> :D
[05:00:02] <XXCoder> furrywolf: seems complex to be that effecient
[05:00:03] <zeeshan|2> Tom_itx: i want to put like certains around the machine
[05:00:11] <zeeshan|2> but i dont know what the best way would be :)
[05:00:14] <PetefromTn_andro> Mine is in a full enclosure of course but I made a plexiglass enclosure for the rf45
[05:00:16] <furrywolf> whether flutter on a nutating disc extracts more energy than a turbine is a job for an aerodynamics wolfy, which I am not. :)
[05:00:26] <XXCoder> lol
[05:00:47] <zeeshan|2> ill eventually make an enclosure i guess :P
[05:01:21] <PetefromTn_andro> That is a good question but according to the movies he does indeed have an asshole that works.
[05:01:31] <zeeshan|2> LOL
[05:01:33] <zeeshan|2> haha
[05:01:44] <PetefromTn_andro> Hehe ;)
[05:02:06] <furrywolf> "The Saphonian is a sailboat that opens its sails but it forgets to pull up its anchor" lol
[05:02:23] <zeeshan|2> hey at least he doesnt use a pink razor to shave! :)
[05:02:29] <zeeshan|2> :D
[05:02:35] <PetefromTn_andro> Doh!
[05:03:01] <PetefromTn_andro> I am loving the Damn pink razor man
[05:03:17] <zeeshan|2> haha
[05:03:29] <zeeshan|2> just grab a knife
[05:03:31] <zeeshan|2> and do it rambo style
[05:03:33] <PetefromTn_andro> It's the best razor I have ever used
[05:04:05] <PetefromTn_andro> Wonder if I can cnc mill off my facial hair.
[05:04:21] <zeeshan|2> hahah
[05:04:22] <PetefromTn_andro> Crashing would be a bitch
[05:04:29] <zeeshan|2> youd have to stand pretty still!
[05:04:41] <furrywolf> now, if it were a bit more sapphic than saphonian...
[05:05:23] <PetefromTn_andro> I really like that vacuum fixture I posted link to before
[05:06:01] <PetefromTn_andro> It had dowel pins and bolt hold downs and everything
[05:06:17] * furrywolf is finding no actual information, just press releases spammed to everyone that would post them
[05:06:21] <XXCoder> PetefromTn_andro: sure! just program, find X, Y, Z on somewhere on your face, and run and hold very very still ;)
[05:06:37] <PetefromTn_andro> Kind like the shop built version of the vm300 I was drooling over hehe
[05:07:03] <XXCoder> PetefromTn_andro: you probably will want jig for your head ;)
[05:07:21] <PetefromTn_andro> Yeah man you need to build a freaking machine so you can try it...
[05:07:31] <bobo_> zeeshan your table has holes on the sides---could bolt enclosure frame from them ----brass nut at top of all thread ?
[05:07:39] <zeeshan|2> bobo_: i have an attachment
[05:07:40] <furrywolf> "The Saphon is at best a sign of deluded principals and at worst a sign of intent to delude investors. "
[05:08:18] <PetefromTn_andro> Zeeshan are you going to make a table enclosure for the beast
[05:08:19] <bobo_> attachment ?
[05:08:39] <zeeshan|2> PetefromTn_andro: honestly i just wanna make chips now lol
[05:08:53] <PetefromTn_andro> I hear that
[05:09:17] <PetefromTn_andro> But if it was my machine that is exactly what I would be doing
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[05:09:31] <zeeshan|2> i have one , trying to find a pic
[05:09:33] <XXCoder> been using a mill machine at work for a week now. interesting learnign experence
[05:09:37] <zeeshan|2> that i am hoping to make it work
[05:10:03] <XXCoder> it has what I call automatic manual where I program basic stuff then it does it
[05:10:09] <PetefromTn_andro> A nice big table enclosure with steel welded frame and removable front panel or some doors.
[05:10:12] <XXCoder> but I set z, and spidle manually
[05:10:23] <unfy> if it's "alternative energy breakthrough" or whatever, 99% of them are just scams
[05:10:31] <XXCoder> unfy: usually
[05:10:51] <unfy> which is just so wonderful when so many gov'ts keep dumping money into them
[05:11:18] <PetefromTn_andro> Zeeshan MAKE FUCKING CHIPS DUDE!!!!!
[05:11:56] <XXCoder> obey PetefromTn_andro and use saw to cut something
[05:11:59] <XXCoder> chips!
[05:12:12] <zeeshan|2> http://www.mullermachines.ch/MachineImages/Large/17162_1.jpg
[05:12:17] <zeeshan|2> my enclosure kinda looks like that
[05:12:24] <zeeshan|2> but the back side isnt covered
[05:12:37] <zeeshan|2> and im missing the bottom chip pan thingy
[05:12:37] <PetefromTn_andro> Oh okay that's nice too
[05:12:49] <zeeshan|2> im thinking of modifying it
[05:12:52] <zeeshan|2> to have a cover towards the bad?
[05:12:54] <zeeshan|2> *back
[05:13:02] <PetefromTn_andro> Tweak it to perfection
[05:13:17] <XXCoder> literal perfection is waste of timne
[05:13:25] <zeeshan|2> knowing me
[05:13:30] <zeeshan|2> im gonna just put a blanket up
[05:13:32] <zeeshan|2> and start machining haha
[05:13:36] <zeeshan|2> i need these t-nuts!
[05:13:37] <XXCoder> it should be place to get close to but not try to actually arrive
[05:13:50] <PetefromTn_andro> A lot of table mounted ones have soft clear rubber back pieces so if it hits something it just gives
[05:14:02] <zeeshan|2> ah
[05:14:13] <zeeshan|2> a stationary one would be so nice! :(
[05:14:36] <furrywolf> I got 9/16 t-nuts when I need 14mm.... one of these days I'll clamp them and machine a hair off each side.
[05:14:46] <zeeshan|2> furrywolf: just send them tome
[05:15:46] <PetefromTn_andro> Gotsta Gotsta make freaking chips...
[05:15:48] <furrywolf> only if you send me some 14mm ones. :P
[05:15:59] <zeeshan|2> mm chips !
[05:16:15] <PetefromTn_andro> And I don't mean freaking nachos
[05:16:45] <zeeshan|2> furrywolf: i actually need 14mm t-slots myself.
[05:17:13] <furrywolf> ah, so you have the same problem I do.
[05:17:20] <PetefromTn_andro> Don't you have a knee mill still?
[05:17:20] <furrywolf> you have 14mm slots but bought 9/16 nuts.
[05:17:28] <zeeshan|2> nah i got 1/2" t-sluts
[05:17:35] <zeeshan|2> :)
[05:17:39] <zeeshan|2> no PetefromTn_andro
[05:17:45] <zeeshan|2> and i sold that column mill LOL
[05:17:49] <furrywolf> ... so get some 1/2 nuts. what's the problem?
[05:17:58] <zeeshan|2> er.
[05:18:02] <zeeshan|2> i have a 1/2" clamping kit
[05:18:06] <zeeshan|2> but i have 14mm t-slots
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[05:18:16] <PetefromTn_andro> Aah see if you had kept the piece of Shit mill drill you could whittle some up
[05:18:21] <zeeshan|2> er. im specifying stud size
[05:18:22] <zeeshan|2> my bad
[05:18:24] <furrywolf> that'll work fine as long as you don't tighten them too much. :P
[05:18:57] <zeeshan|2> okay the 1/2" stud kit i have is for .625" t-slots
[05:19:06] <PetefromTn_andro> Bitching about the machine the whole time hehe
[05:19:14] <furrywolf> aka 5/8
[05:20:06] <furrywolf> 15 pages of google results and I'm not finding any more information on the wind disc thingy... time to give up.
[05:20:50] <PetefromTn_andro> So does that threaded drawbar hold the Damn tool in there nice?
[05:20:54] <zeeshan|2> yea dude
[05:20:59] <furrywolf> way way way too many articles of the variety "it's got to be superior because it was invented by downhome africans instead of white people".
[05:21:00] <zeeshan|2> much nicer than the hyd bar for sure
[05:21:03] <zeeshan|2> hyd cylinder
[05:21:12] <zeeshan|2> i shaved down the key a bit
[05:21:15] <zeeshan|2> that shit was HARD
[05:21:19] <zeeshan|2> file wouldnt touch it
[05:21:22] <zeeshan|2> carbide ate through it
[05:21:40] <PetefromTn_andro> I am sure it will not be hard to fix that drawbar yourself somehow
[05:22:00] <zeeshan|2> i honestly dont want to mess with the internals
[05:22:05] <zeeshan|2> if it wasnt safety critical
[05:22:06] <zeeshan|2> i would
[05:22:21] <zeeshan|2> i'd hate to drop a tool at 3000 rpm
[05:22:24] <PetefromTn_andro> I understand
[05:22:37] <furrywolf> I got some strips of flat steel from the scrapyard a while ago, to use to cut up to make gussets and stuff. most of them worked fine... went to cut one, and nothing happened. looked at sawzall, it was dull. grabbed a new blade... nothing. wtf? realized that it was HARD. got out a file... it took the teeth off the file. I don't know what alloy it is, or what to do with it. lol
[05:22:44] <zeeshan|2> if it was something i designed
[05:22:51] <zeeshan|2> from scratch i'd feel more confident
[05:22:53] <Tom_itx> zeeshan|2, it'd only bounce around a while
[05:23:02] <zeeshan|2> Tom_itx: on my face yea
[05:23:04] <PetefromTn_andro> Hehe
[05:23:06] <Tom_itx> duck
[05:23:07] <bobo_> using home depot all-most thread and a brass nut for draw bar ------and all the worry wart stuff from peenut gallery
[05:23:20] <zeeshan|2> bobo_: that isnt home depot all thread
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[05:23:29] <zeeshan|2> thats grade 5 all thread and a grade 8 nut
[05:23:31] <zeeshan|2> by hillman
[05:23:40] <Tom_itx> i feel much better knowing that
[05:23:42] <PetefromTn_andro> Kickass
[05:23:47] <furrywolf> hillman is generic hardware store garbage.
[05:23:47] <bobo_> Oh good
[05:24:06] <Tom_itx> wait til you fire it up and that allthread starts whipping around
[05:24:14] <zeeshan|2> i did fire it up
[05:24:15] <Tom_itx> or is it stationary?
[05:24:20] <PetefromTn_andro> That would be fun
[05:24:44] <zeeshan|2> ill cut it down if i have to
[05:24:51] <Tom_itx> i certainly would
[05:24:55] <zeeshan|2> rather save it if i dont
[05:24:55] <PetefromTn_andro> Have you messed with the horizontal spindle
[05:25:02] <zeeshan|2> PetefromTn_andro: no not at all
[05:25:12] <Tom_itx> or keep it under 10k rpm
[05:25:21] <PetefromTn_andro> That's the coolest part of the machine man.
[05:25:21] <zeeshan|2> Tom_itx: max speed is 4k
[05:25:22] <zeeshan|2> :)
[05:25:49] <zeeshan|2> whoops 3150 rpm
[05:25:53] <bobo_> we want to see the horz spindle ! now
[05:25:54] <Tom_itx> heck, my sherline does 5k
[05:25:57] <Tom_itx> :)
[05:26:11] <zeeshan|2> your sherline is young too
[05:26:11] <PetefromTn_andro> So much neat Shit you can do with the two spindles
[05:26:13] <zeeshan|2> this thing is ancient
[05:26:32] <zeeshan|2> this machine was prolly concieved during ww2
[05:26:47] <Tom_itx> i've run lots of that era equipment
[05:27:01] <zeeshan|2> i wish i was alive for the cold war era
[05:27:02] <bobo_> 1989 isn't old come on !
[05:27:08] <zeeshan|2> haha
[05:27:18] <zeeshan|2> i dont remember what year it is
[05:27:20] <zeeshan|2> 80 something :)
[05:27:50] <PetefromTn_andro> I must say that I would love to find a good used horizontal and vertical knee mill for a manual machine for the shop
[05:27:53] <zeeshan|2> i found a funny post on practical machinist
[05:27:59] <zeeshan|2> "haas is tl-1 is shit"
[05:28:14] <zeeshan|2> "ask them to do a 1" doc with a 3" wide face mill at 300 ipm"
[05:28:15] <bobo_> cold war believe me -----you didn't anything
[05:28:16] <zeeshan|2> who the hell does that?
[05:28:16] <Tom_itx> well about the only difference was that we didn't have tornado warnings in school.. we had bomb shelter warnings
[05:28:41] <zeeshan|2> lol Tom_itx
[05:28:41] <Tom_itx> all meet in the hall, cross your legs, put your head down between them and kiss your ass goodbye
[05:28:47] <PetefromTn_andro> You must mean tm1
[05:28:52] <zeeshan|2> tm1 yea
[05:28:56] <zeeshan|2> i think 30hp spindle
[05:29:14] <PetefromTn_andro> 30hp???
[05:29:33] <Tom_itx> PetefromTn_andro, those machines i ran had 25-30hp sitting on em
[05:29:39] <zeeshan|2> i think i screwed up the model
[05:29:42] <zeeshan|2> its the haas w/ a 30hp spindle
[05:29:46] <PetefromTn_andro> I thought theTM1 was a small cnc tool room mill
[05:29:47] <zeeshan|2> the machine im talking about -- a vmc
[05:30:14] <zeeshan|2> forget it :P
[05:30:17] <furrywolf> bbl, wolfy bedtime
[05:30:22] <zeeshan|2> the point is they were giving dumb machinining parameters
[05:30:25] <zeeshan|2> and asking the machine to handle it
[05:30:29] <zeeshan|2> who cares if the machine can handle it or not
[05:30:36] <PetefromTn_andro> Tom yeah I know man I have run some machines like that here
[05:30:37] <zeeshan|2> that kind of cut is just abuse
[05:31:02] <XXCoder> 2 spidles??
[05:31:05] <XXCoder> on same machine?
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[05:31:13] <zeeshan|2> yea XXCoder
[05:31:18] <Tom_itx> XXCoder, the ones i ran had 6 & 8 spindles
[05:31:32] <XXCoder> does it make 2 parts at once as you mill one?
[05:31:43] <XXCoder> or do they perform sperately or something
[05:31:47] <zeeshan|2> seperately
[05:31:51] <zeeshan|2> you gotta take the vertical head off
[05:32:01] <zeeshan|2> but tom is right
[05:32:08] <zeeshan|2> theres a lot of flexible machining cells
[05:32:12] <zeeshan|2> that have multiple spindles
[05:32:18] <bobo_> take it OFF
[05:32:19] <zeeshan|2> cause those poor things will be drilling holes all day long
[05:32:27] <PetefromTn_andro> There are tracer mills that do that.
[05:32:30] <XXCoder> interesting. place I work dont have anything like that
[05:32:42] <zeeshan|2> PetefromTn_andro: yea but its a flexible machining cell
[05:32:49] <zeeshan|2> you want to be able to do a quick change over
[05:32:49] <XXCoder> just basic mills (various eras, from ww2 one to fairly recent one)
[05:32:51] <zeeshan|2> in less than 10 min
[05:33:01] <XXCoder> and one weird horzional drill thingy
[05:33:17] <XXCoder> we usually use it to scape off one side of bars
[05:33:19] <PetefromTn_andro> Horizontal boring machine
[05:33:26] <XXCoder> thanks
[05:33:28] <zeeshan|2> XXCoder: theyre more common in large productions
[05:33:31] <zeeshan|2> of the same crap
[05:33:39] <XXCoder> ok
[05:33:54] <XXCoder> staretd "convential mills" dept last monday
[05:34:01] <XXCoder> probably there for 3 to 5 more weeks
[05:34:09] <XXCoder> then back to router dept
[05:34:21] <zeeshan|2> good that you are getting experience :)
[05:34:45] <XXCoder> yeah my internship has been on hatius for few weeks as they had to find someone experenced enough to teach me
[05:34:58] <XXCoder> skill to use vs teach is quite whole different level
[05:35:10] <zeeshan|2> oh yea :P
[05:35:30] <zeeshan|2> to be a good teacher, you really gotta know it well
[05:35:41] <XXCoder> yeah guys been milling for 20 years
[05:35:51] <XXCoder> guy looks younger than me and might actially be lol
[05:35:52] <bobo_> XXCoder sounds as if you are getting the rounds sounds good
[05:36:23] <zeeshan|2> PetefromTn_andro: do you run all your program in air
[05:36:27] <zeeshan|2> before you actually machine away
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[05:36:32] <XXCoder> bobo yeah I started at mills (cnc mills) dept, then router, then convenional. ass-backwards to their standard internship plan LOL
[05:36:45] <PetefromTn_andro> Not so Much anymore
[05:36:58] <zeeshan|2> i guess you're confident in the cam simulation
[05:37:16] <XXCoder> first convential to learn basics, then router for cnc basic (2d is easy) then finally mill
[05:37:25] <PetefromTn_andro> I will if it is a complex programs or if there is some kind of clearance issues
[05:38:24] <PetefromTn_andro> But yeah I got kinda used to running and gunning in the shops they usually don't give you much time to mess around
[05:38:53] <PetefromTn_andro> They want it done usually faster than I can make it LOL
[05:39:13] <PetefromTn_andro> Shit makes me get nervous tho
[05:39:56] <PetefromTn_andro> So I try to stick with machining strategies that I know work and don't mess with the fancy Shit
[05:40:08] <Tom_itx> we'd test run the first article and prove the program but after that they would run
[05:40:08] <bobo_> XXCoder sounds as if you are fitting into their plan-------hang in there
[05:40:28] <XXCoder> PetefromTn_andro: LOL yeah sometimes there's bad programs! I remember one that cut right at bottom edge of sheet material
[05:40:32] <XXCoder> so it is not clampable
[05:40:46] <PetefromTn_andro> I can spend time with my own parts more and experiment on my machine on my time
[05:41:04] <XXCoder> so I had to alter program to make it hop over clamps AND stop before it cut part perperity so I can adjust clamps so it dont cut em
[05:41:22] <XXCoder> it was ugly hack so job can move on. they should have fixed it by now
[05:41:40] <XXCoder> bobo_: thanks
[05:42:03] <PetefromTn_andro> That's the bitch about job shop work it is almost always the first part heh
[05:42:07] <zeeshan|2> PetefromTn_andro: yea i know what you mean
[05:42:32] <zeeshan|2> ive never worked in a job shop before
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[05:42:44] <XXCoder> lol yeah. I remember one I almost failed to complete job because sheet was so flexable it went up high enough for bit to tag it while it moved to second part
[05:42:46] <zeeshan|2> just producing same crap over and over
[05:42:46] <Tom_itx> that's why they require real machinists
[05:42:48] <XXCoder> it destroyed part
[05:42:57] <zeeshan|2> so they care more about less errors
[05:43:00] <zeeshan|2> so you can take your time
[05:43:07] <XXCoder> zeeshan|2: heh theres always bigass jobs
[05:43:15] <PetefromTn_andro> I am still not all that confident and sometimes I get nervous especially when the material is expensive and they want it yesterday
[05:43:24] <zeeshan|2> PetefromTn_andro: scrap it
[05:43:26] <XXCoder> I had to make 500 parts, I finisged bit over half of it then night shift finished it
[05:43:26] <zeeshan|2> take it home
[05:43:28] <zeeshan|2> :-)
[05:43:44] <bobo_> jo shop is like short order cook -----waffle house
[05:43:50] <zeeshan|2> XXCoder: i gues i should define big
[05:43:55] <zeeshan|2> 1 million parts
[05:44:10] <XXCoder> lol yeah largest one I ever made was bit over thousand
[05:44:27] <zeeshan|2> basically when you see SPC quality control
[05:44:31] <PetefromTn_andro> Yeah Like a precision short order cook heh
[05:44:54] <XXCoder> longest and mind breaking job I ever did was one part = almost 20 min runtime AND there was 320 parts
[05:45:11] <PetefromTn_andro> I broke some taps and scrapped a few parts along the way but not too bad.
[05:45:14] <XXCoder> tooling hardening a tiny steel part
[05:45:25] <Tom_itx> those automatic lathes i ran would put out 5-6k a shift
[05:45:29] <Tom_itx> or more
[05:45:35] <XXCoder> it auto-loads?
[05:45:38] <zeeshan|2> poor machines
[05:45:40] <zeeshan|2> so much abuse! :()
[05:45:41] <XXCoder> well besides whole rods
[05:45:44] <Tom_itx> depending on the material and part
[05:45:53] <Tom_itx> 20' rods
[05:45:58] <Tom_itx> x 6 or 8
[05:46:00] <PetefromTn_andro> Swiss lathes
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[05:46:25] <XXCoder> man I wish I knew whats wrong with me, I can work at work but at home im fuking lazyass
[05:46:26] <zeeshan|2> to be honest with you
[05:46:30] <zeeshan|2> i hate repetitive crap :(
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[05:46:47] <Tom_itx> life is kinda that way
[05:46:48] <XXCoder> cncs tend to be zee
[05:46:56] <PetefromTn_andro> I like short run repetitive crap
[05:46:58] <XXCoder> unless you do thousands few-off parts
[05:47:04] <XXCoder> pete me too
[05:47:07] <zeeshan|2> PetefromTn_andro: yea, thats why i think a job shop would be cool
[05:47:25] <zeeshan|2> when you walk into a place making ford parts
[05:47:29] <PetefromTn_andro> Where you are making a good bit of cash for each part
[05:47:32] <zeeshan|2> their grandma was making that same part
[05:47:33] <zeeshan|2> too!
[05:47:39] <zeeshan|2> :)
[05:48:44] <PetefromTn_andro> I would love to get some 500-600 parts runs jobs in here right now that pay good for each part and have orders coming in on a regular basis
[05:49:04] <XXCoder> heh place I work at is crazy
[05:49:13] <XXCoder> there can be anywhere from 1-2 parts to 500
[05:49:19] <XXCoder> rarely over 1,000
[05:49:31] <Tom_itx> when my bud was doing work for experimental, we'd make 6 parts of everything and that was it
[05:49:34] <PetefromTn_andro> But I would also like a night out with Angelina Jolie and that's not Gonna happen either hehe
[05:49:34] <Tom_itx> all for test
[05:50:35] <PetefromTn_andro> Shit I can dream right...
[05:50:46] <XXCoder> go for it indeed
[05:51:16] <bobo_> Zeeshan go watch the cook at a Waffle House restruant some Friday night . it's somewhat like a job shop
[05:51:45] <PetefromTn_andro> I am really hoping that the part we are designing for the race shop guys works out and they sell a shitload of them that would be amazing
[05:52:11] <XXCoder> good luck :)
[05:52:30] <PetefromTn_andro> Yeah crossing fingers and toes
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[05:53:28] <PetefromTn_andro> I gotta get the sheet metal spraying going on the cnc lathe here soon.
[05:54:11] <bobo_> Pete as men get older they tend to talk in their sleep Angelina Jolie--right big boy -talk it up
[05:54:45] <PetefromTn_andro> Still waiting on some tax preparation doccuments to get here so I can file. Hopefully I get a nice return and I can order the rest of the parts for the lathe
[05:55:32] <PetefromTn_andro> Hello I am just 43 man gimme a break. Besides I can dream all I want
[05:56:16] <PetefromTn_andro> And you have never met me lemme tell ya brad pit is not NEARLY AS HANDSOME AS I AM LOL
[05:57:47] <PetefromTn_andro> If you believe that I have a little bridge I wanna sell you.
[06:00:21] <bobo_> a " Y " bridge ?
[06:02:05] <PetefromTn_andro> Golden gate
[06:02:17] <bobo_> sold
[06:02:33] <XXCoder> https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/elanlee/exploding-kittens/
[06:02:36] <XXCoder> damn
[06:03:11] <PetefromTn_andro> Wtf who cares about the Damn exploding kittens
[06:03:48] <PetefromTn_andro> I need to make a kickstarter for my shop hehe
[06:03:48] <XXCoder> just amazed how far it went lol
[06:04:15] <XXCoder> if one of say $300 tiers is to make router table hardware, I'd support it lol
[06:04:21] <XXCoder> small one
[06:05:14] <PetefromTn_andro> Everyone and their brothers uncle is making cnc tables now
[06:05:41] <XXCoder> not that cheaply lol
[06:05:58] <PetefromTn_andro> And the Chinese are undercutting the craps out of it
[06:06:52] <bobo_> Pete zeeshan thought this was interesting , the mill is a deckel fp1000 ,i think http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/machine-reconditioning-scraping-inspection/when-grinding-spindle-taper-how-do-you-inspect-298154/
[06:06:57] <PetefromTn_andro> It's not that easy to come up with something truly unique anymore but people do it every day
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[06:11:33] <XXCoder> yeah
[06:11:37] <XXCoder> I gonna work on mine
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[06:17:35] <PetefromTn_andro> Well goodnight folks.
[06:17:46] <XXCoder> night
[06:17:54] <bobo_> good nite
[06:18:06] <PetefromTn_andro> :D
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[08:07:49] <Deejay> moin
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[08:30:25] <CaptHindsight> bobo_: it's only fair
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[09:05:51] <CaptHindsight> shoot, moin already
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[09:15:06] <skunkworks> only barely...
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[12:47:13] <RyanS> hmm i wonder, purchase a solid old lathe for wrecking, as a base for a cnc lathe....feasible ?
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[12:58:11] <jthornton> /j #reprap
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[13:58:45] <jthornton> tjb1, you around?
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[14:07:44] <_methods> Tom_itx: you have an x2 converted right?
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[16:09:28] <Tom_itx> _methods x2 what?
[16:09:33] <Tom_itx> mine is a sherline
[16:09:36] <_methods> x2 mini mill
[16:09:37] <_methods> ahh
[16:10:16] <_methods> was just wondering if it was worth it to put angular contact bearings in to replace the thrust bearings on the x axis on the x2's
[16:10:35] <_methods> but they're cheap on ebay so i'll just drop in angular contacts
[16:11:31] <Tom_itx> i wish i could make the axis' more rigid
[16:12:00] <_methods> yeah that's why i wasn't sure if it was even worth droppin in angulars
[16:12:12] <_methods> but i'm going to anyways
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[16:13:30] <PetefromTn_> angulars FTW
[16:14:02] <_methods> yeah i'm used to real bearing prices
[16:14:13] <_methods> i wasn't going to drop in $800 bearings in my POS mill
[16:14:26] <_methods> but i can get good enough for like $20 on ebay
[16:14:39] <_methods> and it will be better than the chinese thrust bearings that come with it
[16:14:50] <PetefromTn_> I just bought some for my CNC lathe retrofit that are 46mm OD and they were pretty damn cheap prices on ebay
[16:15:04] <_methods> yeah
[16:15:12] <_methods> i've never priced real bearings on ebay
[16:15:17] <_methods> but i'm finding some damn good deals
[16:16:20] <_methods> hoping to get lucky and find a matched pair for dirt cheap
[16:16:41] <PetefromTn_> for the relatively low RPM and load you will be seeing even a POS chinese angular contact bearing will be more than adequate
[16:16:48] <_methods> yeah
[16:17:02] <_methods> no i want some abec9's in there lol
[16:17:32] <PetefromTn_> Knock yerself out man heh
[16:17:51] <_methods> heheh
[16:17:53] <_methods> nm
[16:17:58] <_methods> chinese bearings it si
[16:18:11] <_methods> $16
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[16:25:21] <PetefromTn_> man I need to get some lat long in Florida I am over this freakin' cold and it has not even been that cold yet LOL....
[16:25:49] <JT-Shop> well crap onecnc won't open a 2015 SW file
[16:26:21] <_methods> stl, iges?
[16:26:22] <PetefromTn_> I guess they change the filetype AGAIN?
[16:26:24] <_methods> stp?
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[16:26:40] <JT-Shop> SolidWorks part file
[16:26:56] <JT-Shop> I guess they did, onecnc said read error
[16:27:16] <_methods> well no i was saying did you try importing one of those other types
[16:27:28] <_methods> unfortunately you shouldn't have to
[16:27:41] <_methods> since it says on their site it works with solidworks
[16:27:42] <JT-Shop> had to save it as a parasolid then open it up in 2014
[16:28:13] <_methods> that sux
[16:28:28] <JT-Shop> yea, I won't use 2015 now
[16:28:57] <_methods> how much is onecnc
[16:29:19] <JT-Shop> I don't remember, I've had it for a few years now
[16:29:43] <JT-Shop> I have version 21.39
[16:30:15] <_methods> you like it better than mastercam?
[16:30:49] <JT-Shop> I like it better than bobcrap
[16:31:00] <_methods> hahah
[16:31:22] <_methods> i don't think ive ever met anyone that liked bobcad
[16:32:19] <_methods> hmm managed to pick up 2 nachi angulars for $38
[16:32:36] <_methods> not a matched pair but beggars can't be choosers
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[16:39:33] <XXCoder> onecnc has no price on site. it means I can't afford it.
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[16:41:40] <humble_s3a_bass> bobcad is a nonstop punch to the face
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[16:41:45] <PetefromTn_> that's okay you don't have a CNC machine to run it on anyways hehe
[16:41:57] <XXCoder> lol
[16:41:57] <humble_s3a_bass> it is windows 3.1 of cam software
[16:42:04] <_methods> wow bobcad must be horrible
[16:42:09] <_methods> i'm glad i've never had to use it
[16:42:12] <JT-Shop> no, it's worse
[16:42:13] <PetefromTn_> Its funny I hear comments like that a lot
[16:42:26] <XXCoder> is it bad that first non-pdf result I found on bobcad is keygen? lol
[16:42:30] <PetefromTn_> but I have a couple local shops that use it daily and like it
[16:42:49] <_methods> i've never had anyone defend bobcad
[16:42:52] <humble_s3a_bass> bobcad forces the borders of the window to be plastic shiny blue, so when you're done using it your eyes hurt too
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[16:43:19] <XXCoder> $495
[16:43:41] <XXCoder> thats for express. rest isnt price therefore I cant afford
[16:44:02] <PetefromTn_> one guy has a small shop that he runs by himself and he has two CNC's. he said it may not be the best out there but for the price he is very pleased with it. makes his living with it.
[16:44:07] <humble_sea_bass> look into rhinocam, i think they have hobby pricing
[16:44:43] <_methods> as much as i find fusion360 annoying the cnc part is pretty damn impressive
[16:44:50] <humble_sea_bass> i used to have a table saw that took a guys finger off
[16:44:52] <_methods> and it's free for startups and hobbyists
[16:44:56] <humble_sea_bass> and kicked like a mule
[16:45:06] <humble_sea_bass> i l;iked it because I made my living with it too
[16:45:12] <_methods> hahah
[16:45:23] <PetefromTn_> gee thats so funny man
[16:45:34] <PetefromTn_> did ya think of that all by yourself?
[16:45:52] <humble_sea_bass> true story pete
[16:46:25] <_methods> i've never used it so i have no idea
[16:46:27] <PetefromTn_> I am just saying that just because some people say it sucks does not necessarily mean it is true. I am just relaying what factually others have told me about their experiences with it.
[16:46:31] <_methods> but i do hear many bobcad horror stories
[16:46:32] <humble_sea_bass> we gloss over deficiencies when it gits er done and pays the bills
[16:47:06] <PetefromTn_> some people do not have the funds for mastercam or others and yeah it works for them and pays the bills
[16:47:10] <humble_sea_bass> i think we should all be saying "there is better"
[16:47:23] <PetefromTn_> OF COURSE there is better
[16:47:28] <humble_sea_bass> agreed
[16:47:33] <PetefromTn_> but better typically costs WAY more money
[16:47:41] <_methods> tru dat
[16:47:42] <humble_sea_bass> agreed
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[16:48:47] <humble_sea_bass> i mean, these are all opinions on irc of all places
[16:48:58] <XXCoder> http://mecsoft.com/freemill/
[16:49:00] <humble_sea_bass> so if it works
[16:49:09] <XXCoder> needs visualcad though
[16:49:38] <XXCoder> oh thats free too
[17:04:45] <CaptHindsight> humble_sea_bass: howdy
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[17:07:54] <CaptHindsight> Blizzard here today
[17:08:20] <CaptHindsight> 12 to 16 inches
[17:09:49] <Tom_itx> yeah, the wind about knocked me off the back step this am
[17:10:05] <PetefromTn_> jeez that sounds like TONS of fun...
[17:11:03] <CaptHindsight> yeah in the city, out here it's kind of nice
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[17:16:22] <tjb1> JT-Shop: ?
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[17:17:37] <humble_sea_bass> yo cap.
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[17:25:56] <anonimasu> pcw_home: back into buisness with the plasma.. about a jog encoder, can I run a 9v encoder straight into the 7i47?
[17:27:01] <pcw_home> 9V... thats rather odd, what are the high/low signal levels?
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[17:27:49] <anonimasu> a htl encoder
[17:28:31] <anonimasu> 0http://www.whp.cz/files/ds_msi301_eng.pdf
[17:28:55] <anonimasu> err 9-2v is the high signal level
[17:29:11] <anonimasu> 7v and low is < 1.15v
[17:30:34] <anonimasu> _methods: I'd defend bobcad.. it woks for me. for the price.
[17:30:47] <pcw_home> ( OK with 10ma load so probably close to 9V and 0V no load)
[17:30:49] <_methods> WELL RIGHT ON
[17:30:51] <_methods> oops
[17:30:52] <_methods> hehe
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[17:31:10] <_methods> glad to hear someone defend it
[17:31:20] <anonimasu> defenetively I am upgrading when I have funds, but Id' rather buy a better lathe for that cash :D
[17:31:37] <anonimasu> edgecam.. but 10k eur.. -_-
[17:31:56] <_methods> i've heard good stuff about esprit
[17:32:02] <_methods> supposedly pretty cheap too
[17:32:06] <anonimasu> cheap?!
[17:32:10] <anonimasu> like how cheap
[17:32:20] <_methods> no idea
[17:32:29] <_methods> i've never asked for a quote
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[17:32:50] <_methods> some cnc manufacturers used to give it out with machines though
[17:33:16] <anonimasu> I think it's up at the same with mastercam and solidedge..
[17:33:27] <anonimasu> err edgecam..
[17:33:42] <pcw_home> so to use a 9V SE signal on a a 7I47, disable termination, and connect RXN- to +5V and RXN+ to your encoder output
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[17:34:20] <anonimasu> brb, testing!
[17:34:21] <anonimasu> :)
[17:34:50] <pcw_home> (5v is close enough to 1/2 way up for good noise immunity)
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[17:44:39] <dirty_d> I have an add on pci parallel port card, lspci -vv shows http://pastebin.com/5hVuJLKn
[17:44:50] <dirty_d> the address i should use in stepconf is 0x1030?
[17:45:24] <dirty_d> also dmesg shows "lp: driver loaded but no devices found"
[17:45:31] <pcw_home> I would use 0 or 1
[17:46:09] <dirty_d> is this what i need to do? http://www.comptechdoc.org/os/linux/manual3/modules.html
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[17:47:40] <pcw_home> try o or 1
[17:47:56] <pcw_home> 0 or 1 (first or second parallel port)
[17:48:10] <dirty_d> the card only has one parallel port
[17:48:29] <pcw_home> is there one on the MB?
[17:48:40] <PetefromTn_> LMAO I just saw an ad posted to a used machine tools forum where a guy posted a picture of a couple starrett micrometers and a depth mic etc.. The caption read....For sale some used C clamps and thingamabobs.....LMAO Had to be a joke but I laughed anyways.
[17:48:44] <dirty_d> i tried the 0 address and it didnt work, but that might be because of the "lp: driver loaded but no devices found" right?
[17:49:01] <pcw_home> Might be, and thats strange
[17:49:05] <dirty_d> pcw_home, no onboard parallel port
[17:49:09] <_methods> man my buddy was lookin all over for his mic's one day
[17:49:15] <_methods> he goes over to the weld shop
[17:49:21] <_methods> and they were using them as c clamps
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[17:49:35] <PetefromTn_> DAMN I'D BE PISSED!!
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[17:49:38] <_methods> he had weld spatter all over his starret mics
[17:49:43] <_methods> oh it was a fight instant
[17:49:44] <dirty_d> a parallel port card seems like something that should "just work" on linux in the year 2015
[17:49:48] <pcw_home> so then try 0x1030
[17:50:00] <PetefromTn_> the shit's on man... put up yer dukes!!
[17:50:12] <dirty_d> 0x1030 is the one i used
[17:50:19] <_methods> yeah
[17:50:23] <pcw_home> tell that to Moschip
[17:50:24] <_methods> it was a good one
[17:50:36] <_methods> the owner didn't even fire my buddy
[17:50:48] <_methods> hehe
[17:51:03] <PetefromTn_> hehe thats funny if it were not so tragic.
[17:51:30] <_methods> well the funny part is we used to joke about how stupid welders are
[17:51:43] <_methods> and how they would use mic's for clamps if you didn't keep an eye on them
[17:51:58] <dirty_d> im gonna try that alias, rebooting
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[17:52:15] <PetefromTn_> ya know honestly if you had NO IDEA what a micrometer was it pretty much looks like a high quality C clamp huh..
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[17:52:44] <_methods> these same welders grabbed me one day
[17:52:55] <_methods> asked me to come over to teh weld shop
[17:53:01] <_methods> they were having a problem with an "angle"
[17:53:12] <_methods> i get over there and they were tryin to cut the miter for a 45
[17:53:21] <_methods> they were like what angle does it need to be?
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[17:53:27] <_methods> i said 22.5
[17:53:35] <_methods> and they were like how do you know that...........
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[17:53:45] <PetefromTn_> Cracks me up
[17:53:46] <_methods> had to draw it on the table with soap stone
[17:53:52] <_methods> before they would believe me
[17:54:05] <CaptHindsight> trial and error lol
[17:54:09] <_methods> yeah
[17:54:37] <CaptHindsight> two 90's a grind the part that sticks out
[17:55:01] <_methods> it's brutal some days
[17:55:12] <_methods> it's usually teh welders making me giggle though
[17:55:23] <PetefromTn_> life is hard....harder if you're stupid.
[17:55:35] <_methods> that's why welders look the way they do
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[17:55:48] <_methods> sure isn't because life was easy on them hehe
[17:56:22] <PetefromTn_> hey man I tig weld....you are kinda insultin' me here hehe
[17:56:37] <_methods> hahah i mig weld but i'd never call myself a welder lol
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[17:57:11] <_methods> i can tig steel but alum still kicks my ass
[17:57:54] <_methods> i need to get a tig rig so i can practice at the house
[17:58:17] <PetefromTn_> I can do steel, stainless, etc. AND aluminum but I would not call the aluminum beautiful when I am done. Not like some guys can do...
[17:58:26] <PetefromTn_> I bought mine used
[17:58:35] <PetefromTn_> it is a Commercial 350 amp machine
[17:58:39] <PetefromTn_> Made by L-tec
[17:58:45] <PetefromTn_> its kind of a beast
[17:58:50] <_methods> we just picked up 4 syncrowave 350's at auction for like $400
[17:58:51] <PetefromTn_> but it works really good
[17:58:53] <moorbo_> I miss my helistar
[17:58:55] <_methods> tryin to get the owner to sell me one
[17:58:57] <CaptHindsight> there are some great welding videos on youtube
[17:59:08] <PetefromTn_> you can get some good deals on used commercial machines nowadays
[17:59:20] <CaptHindsight> they cover how to correct your poor style well
[17:59:27] <PetefromTn_> since they don't have pulsing and other neat new fangled features
[17:59:29] <_methods> man i went to the welding supply store teh other day
[17:59:44] <_methods> and they had what i thought was little fake plasma cutters
[17:59:44] <CaptHindsight> but yeah, it's about practice and a good machine
[17:59:48] <_methods> they were so tiny
[17:59:58] <_methods> i was like oooooh look at the cute little plasma cutter
[18:00:02] <PetefromTn_> yeah these new inverter machines are amazing
[18:00:11] <_methods> i was like what you gonna do with them when you get rid of them
[18:00:18] <_methods> the guy was like WTF are you talkin about
[18:00:19] <CaptHindsight> the Chinese have perfected the cheap ones
[18:00:22] <_methods> that's a plasma cutter
[18:00:30] <_methods> i was like @wut
[18:00:33] <CaptHindsight> all that construction
[18:00:49] <_methods> plasma packs are so small now i thought they were all fake
[18:00:57] <_methods> like diplay things heheh
[18:00:58] <CaptHindsight> and they need to go from job to job and carry them on the bus or on a scooter
[18:01:10] <PetefromTn_> yeah right
[18:01:16] <PetefromTn_> you could do that with these new ones
[18:01:20] <PetefromTn_> they are so small
[18:01:43] <PetefromTn_> I think we are still where you need at least a 220 volt input one tho
[18:01:44] <CaptHindsight> and they only expect them to last a year
[18:01:49] <PetefromTn_> or they are kinda weak
[18:02:00] <PetefromTn_> but they have come a LONG way
[18:02:13] <CaptHindsight> I went shopping for them there a year ago
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[18:04:01] <CaptHindsight> http://photo.sf.co.ua/g/177/8.jpg
[18:04:25] <PetefromTn_> LOL that is precious...
[18:04:34] <XXCoder> good idea. lol
[18:04:35] <PetefromTn_> I love the fake ray ban welding mask
[18:05:37] <PetefromTn_> How can you even do that for more than a couple arcs and not realize that is NOT a good idea is my question...
[18:06:04] <XXCoder> probbly guy is half blind already so it looks normal
[18:06:14] <PetefromTn_> don't they make the best cheap auto darkening helmets in the world over there?
[18:06:55] <PetefromTn_> I have one and I STILL close my eyes when I strike an arc just to be sure LOL...
[18:07:02] <CaptHindsight> yeah
[18:08:18] <PetefromTn_> just noticed the rubber garden gloves welding gloves too.....classic!
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[18:17:55] <Tom_itx> _methods just tell them it's all in a circle
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[18:22:40] <_methods> hahah
[18:22:47] <_methods> wow that pic is classic
[18:23:25] <_methods> that one just got emailed to everyone at work lol
[18:26:21] <CaptHindsight> http://photo.sf.co.ua/g/177/16.jpg who needs an electric wheel chair when you have a population of 1.3B
[18:26:36] <_methods> welders even have their own math books
[18:26:48] <_methods> they come with a full 128 pack of crayons
[18:27:01] <CaptHindsight> lol
[18:27:34] <_methods> hehe that's just mean
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[18:41:59] <dirty_d> this made the parport work http://www.asix.com.tw/FrootAttach/driver/MCS98xx_Linux_Driver_Installation_Guide_v100.pdf
[18:42:17] <dirty_d> modprobe parport_pc io=0x1020 irq=21
[18:42:32] <dirty_d> 0x1020 was the 3rd io port
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[18:50:53] <PetefromTn_> http://i.imgur.com/uUYd4j8.jpg Check out this vacuum clamping/pallet changer fixture..
[18:51:50] <PetefromTn_> I understand that they put the bigass water filter in there to keep the coolant from getting into the vacuum pump
[18:51:56] <t12> that welding picture is great
[18:52:03] <_methods> that thing looks like it sucks
[18:52:04] <PetefromTn_> but did it need to be RIGHT IN FRONT of the worktable?
[18:52:09] <_methods> literally lol
[18:52:29] <PetefromTn_> I really like that heavy duty fixture tho
[18:52:55] <PetefromTn_> I am thinking more and more that I will be wanting something similar for my VMC and I want to eventuallly build one.
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[19:10:04] <ssi_> peeet
[19:10:07] ssi_ is now known as ssi
[19:10:14] <zeeshan|2> hi ssi
[19:10:15] <zeeshan|2> :D
[19:10:18] <ssi> hey z
[19:10:20] <zeeshan|2> youre too busy for us
[19:10:25] <ssi> yuh
[19:10:39] <ssi> I'll be back around starting a week from tomorrow
[19:10:51] <ssi> have a new job and I'll have to start going in every day D:
[19:10:52] <zeeshan|2> still working on the plane?
[19:11:00] <zeeshan|2> ah cool
[19:11:01] <ssi> yeah
[19:11:12] <ssi> haha I just went flying in the cherokee with another guy out here
[19:11:25] <ssi> on takeoff, I saw kevin and st clair shooting down at the end of the runway
[19:11:29] <ssi> st clair is a police sniper
[19:11:31] <ssi> so I buzzed them hard
[19:11:40] <zeeshan|2> lol
[19:11:42] <ssi> we went and screwed around for 30m or so, and I came back and landed
[19:11:52] <ssi> when I did, they came out and chased me in his unmarked car, lights and siren going
[19:12:11] <ssi> buncha shenanigans
[19:12:23] <_methods> you get a charge of wreckless flying lol
[19:12:46] <_methods> johnny chimpo approves
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[19:13:25] <PetefromTn_> hey ssi
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[19:13:39] <ssi> couple other guys out here built an RV6, finishted it up last week
[19:13:43] <ssi> I got to fly it yesterday
[19:13:46] <ssi> touchy little bastard
[19:14:00] <ssi> I did some dutch rolls, steep turns, and stalls before I landed it
[19:14:19] <ssi> first stall I used a moderate amount of forward stick to break the stall, and ended up negative 3G, and wadded myself up in the canopy
[19:14:44] <_methods> heheh
[19:15:13] <_methods> the pilot where i used to go skydiving had a standing bet with everyone that if you beat him to the ground he'd buy you a case of beer
[19:15:38] <_methods> as soon as the last person was out he'd roll it over until he could only see one dial
[19:15:38] <ssi> yea jump pilots are good at that crap
[19:15:59] <_methods> needless to say NO ONE ever failed to jump lol
[19:16:09] <ssi> anyone ever take his keys on the way out?
[19:16:11] <_methods> it was safer jumpin out than flyin down with mike
[19:16:18] <_methods> hahah
[19:16:40] <_methods> no never stole the keys
[19:16:48] <ssi> if you ever decide to become a jump pilot, carry a spare key, cause that's a common hazing for new jump pilots :P
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[19:17:30] <_methods> i know i always tried to get in the batches with chicks cause if they showed their tits he'd go up an extra couple grand
[19:17:42] <ssi> haha
[19:17:53] <_methods> extra sky time lol
[19:17:56] <_methods> and free boobies
[19:18:57] <jack16> What do you think, 135 mm/s rapids with 650 mm/s acceleration on 6040 router is decent result?
[19:19:36] <ssi> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B8yCBxLIYAAkjwO.jpg:large
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[19:19:44] <ssi> gluing up the drag wire blocks on the top wing of the pitts
[19:19:48] <ssi> lower wings are already done
[19:20:10] <ssi> I got that tailwheel nonsense I was working on friday sorted out
[19:20:32] <ssi> I ended up having to buy a couple of $40 solid carbide straight flute drills to crossdrill the tailspring
[19:20:38] <ssi> hard ass spring steel
[19:20:45] <_methods> yeah that stuff is nasty
[19:21:00] <ssi> those drills worked BEAUTIFULLY tho
[19:21:05] <ssi> cut quickly, left a polished hole
[19:21:49] <ssi> I need a close tolerance bolt for it though
[19:21:52] <_methods> gotta love carbide
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[19:23:10] <ssi> here's something curious
[19:23:10] <ssi> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B8yC4T8IQAA81K2.jpg:large
[19:23:29] <ssi> the one on the right I cut with the world's dullest non-center cutting 5/8" four flute endmill
[19:23:36] <ssi> it's something I had lying around and it's about as sharp as a butter knife
[19:23:49] <ssi> it took AGES to cut, and I had to plunge and step over in like .040" steps
[19:23:59] <ssi> so I went and bought a brand new 3 flute endmill
[19:24:01] <ssi> sharp as hell
[19:24:09] <ssi> still have to plunge in steps, but now it leaves that nasty finish on the left
[19:24:36] <CaptHindsight> what types of wood are in those wings?
[19:24:39] <_methods> diggin in
[19:24:52] <ssi> CaptHindsight: spruce, mahogany plywood
[19:25:01] <_methods> i've seen that happen sometimes with alum
[19:25:02] <ssi> and the drag wire corner blocks are ash so they don't crush
[19:25:06] <_methods> a new endmill will gall up
[19:25:25] <ssi> I went and bought two more endmills, a 2 flute and a 4 flute, adn this time got tin coat
[19:25:28] <ssi> haven't tried them yet
[19:25:29] <_methods> so sharp it galls it
[19:25:40] <_methods> i prefer 2 flutes myself
[19:25:49] <_methods> for alum
[19:25:54] <ssi> I have $100 in endmills for this stupid job
[19:26:05] <ssi> 5/8" 2.5" loc
[19:26:05] <CaptHindsight> mahogany ply! I thought that was no longer available, nut maybe that was just the Honduran
[19:26:29] <ssi> CaptHindsight: I don't know what species of mahogany it is, all I know is it meets the AC 43.13 specs and is certified plywood :)
[19:26:39] <ssi> and it's balls expensive
[19:27:03] <ssi> yeah it's african mahogany, which is still available
[19:27:21] <CaptHindsight> the furniture grade stuff i had 10 years ago was ~$125 a 4x8 sheet
[19:27:31] <ssi> for 3/4?
[19:27:52] <CaptHindsight> 5/8-3/4 range
[19:27:57] <ssi> this stuff is 1/4", and 4x8 is $$232
[19:28:07] <ssi> 1/2" is the thickest they carry, atd it's $310/sheet
[19:28:12] <CaptHindsight> ply in general has gone up
[19:28:13] <ssi> fucking mil-spec plywood
[19:28:17] <ssi> MIL-P-6070
[19:28:36] <ssi> the bias stuff is even worse
[19:28:51] <ssi> grain runs 45 degrees across the sheet, 1/8" 4x8' is $252
[19:29:18] <CaptHindsight> more than aluminum or close
[19:29:27] <ssi> the leading edges are made of 1/32" baltic birch plywood, two sheets laminated together
[19:29:33] <ssi> I formed it over another wing
[19:29:43] <ssi> glued two sheets together and compressed it over the form
[19:30:20] <ssi> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B8yEiVUIIAESRrW.jpg:large
[19:30:21] <CaptHindsight> hard to see from that angle, whats the wingspan?
[19:30:27] <ssi> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B8yEkQIIQAAJXrU.jpg:large
[19:30:30] <ssi> 16' :){
[19:30:57] <ssi> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B7zVj0NIIAAr1Eg.jpg:large
[19:31:09] <ssi> top wing is 96" along the sweep angle from centerline to wingtip
[19:31:18] <ssi> bottom wings are 85.5" long
[19:31:54] <CaptHindsight> looks great
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[19:32:07] <CaptHindsight> whats the engine?
[19:32:12] <ssi> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B8yE-jWIgAAduWf.jpg:large
[19:32:18] <ssi> it's an AEIO-320
[19:32:31] <ssi> 150hp nominal, but it's had some performance work done and makes about 175hp
[19:32:50] <ssi> AEIO means it has the solid flange and upgraded front bearing, for gyroscopic loads for aerobatics
[19:32:53] <ssi> fuel injected
[19:32:57] <CaptHindsight> getting it ready for summer flying?
[19:33:05] <ssi> yeah I'd like to have it airworthy by summer
[19:33:12] <ssi> I have to do a lot of training before I can fly it :P
[19:33:21] <ssi> that's the hardest airplane to land there is :P
[19:34:05] <CaptHindsight> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wOCmoYU6h1Q this kind of training? :)
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[19:34:44] <ssi> hahahah yessss
[19:34:46] <CaptHindsight> do you train in a similar plane or a simulator?
[19:34:51] <ssi> similar plane
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[19:35:03] <ssi> there's a guy with a two seat S2B near me
[19:35:16] <ssi> it doesn't fly anything like the same, but it's enough similar that I can get the confidence to fly this one
[19:35:36] <[cube]> i've flown as a passenger in an s2b
[19:35:42] <[cube]> one of the best days of my life ;)
[19:35:49] <ssi> yeah they're a pile of fun
[19:36:27] <[cube]> after about 45 mins i was going to hurl tho
[19:36:30] <_methods> hehe the ultimate roller coaster
[19:36:43] <[cube]> pilot wasn't holding back
[19:36:45] <ssi> yeah I got a little queasy yesterday flying that RV, doing dutch rolls
[19:36:55] <[cube]> this was like 7 years ago
[19:36:58] <ssi> I kept unloading it accidentally and going negative
[19:37:04] <[cube]> he's now a red bull air race pilot
[19:37:10] <ssi> I need a lot of practice in twitchy light airplanes :P
[19:37:51] <ssi> I don't purport to be any kind of good aerobatic pilot
[19:37:55] <ssi> but I would like to be someday :)
[19:38:04] <[cube]> the worst part of the flight
[19:38:10] <[cube]> was an INVERTED roll
[19:38:12] <PetefromTn_> you got balls as big as church bells going up in that stick built contraption..
[19:38:18] <[cube]> i felt liek my head was in a vice from all directions
[19:38:37] <ssi> yeah negative stuff is hard
[19:38:51] <[cube]> got a bit of tunnelvision from that one
[19:39:22] <ssi> PetefromTn_: you're rigth, but not for the reason you think :)
[19:39:25] <ssi> the airplane is plenty strong
[19:39:45] <ssi> WAY stronger than most certified airplanes
[19:40:15] <PetefromTn_> hehe just bustin' yer chops man...
[19:40:35] <JT-Shop> ssi, got a photo of the bird?
[19:40:46] <ssi> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B8yE-jWIgAAduWf.jpg:large
[19:40:47] <ssi> that one?
[19:41:17] <zeeshan|2> wheres all your machines!!
[19:41:21] <zeeshan|2> in anot her hanger? :)
[19:41:25] <ssi> yeah
[19:41:31] <ssi> these two are adjacent
[19:41:41] <ssi> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B8yCBxLIYAAkjwO.jpg:large
[19:41:45] <ssi> you can see the mill handle on the right there
[19:41:50] <ssi> all the machines are off to the right
[19:42:17] <zeeshan|2> yes
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[19:49:39] <PetefromTn_> http://s.hswstatic.com/gif/bungled-personal-flight-attempt-1.jpg Here's SSI on his first flight attempt!
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[19:53:30] <zeeshan|2> anyone speak finnish ?
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[19:55:48] <XXCoder> hey ssi been a bit
[19:55:50] <XXCoder> hows ya
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[20:11:14] <Tom_itx> 23�F and blowing like nobody's business
[20:11:29] <anarchos2_> the age old question, what do i build with my now semi-working mill? :P
[20:14:21] <Tom_itx> a turner's cube
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[20:15:11] <Tom_itx> http://www.cnccookbook.com/img/TurnersCubes/P1011486.JPG
[20:15:39] <anarchos2_> oh wow
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[20:23:48] <PetefromTn_> Got some Kleen Strip aircraft remover and it seems to be taking off the paint on the encloser parts I have not stripped yet
[20:23:59] <JT-Shop> wow the burner and furnace work good
[20:24:05] <JT-Shop> need a lid and stand now
[20:24:12] <PetefromTn_> works pretty good. I hope to get MOST of it off here and then break out the air drill and wire cup brush
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[20:28:14] <tjb1> JT-Shop: need something?
[20:28:26] <furrywolf> anyone have a mt3 bullnose lathe center they want to sell?
[20:32:18] <JT-Shop> tjb1, just wondering which J head you build if you had the means? He is up to MK8
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[20:33:33] <tjb1> I am using an MK8 now but I don't think he released it yet
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[20:33:37] <tjb1> I am beta tester
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[20:35:38] <JT-Shop> the description is there for the parts
[20:36:26] <JT-Shop> I see he only sells the MK 5, so what do you think of the MK 8
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[20:38:59] <tjb1> Well it works fine with PLA
[20:39:08] <tjb1> Haven't tried ABS yet but I am printing Ninjaflex with it now
[20:39:29] <JT-Shop> I plan on using PLA for my casting
[20:39:41] <JT-Shop> what extruder are you using?
[20:39:58] <tjb1> Delta uses Bulldog XL, new printer uses Printrbot Dual Gear
[20:40:17] <[cube]> i've got an xl
[20:40:21] <[cube]> 2 of them
[20:40:42] <tjb1> They work good just a bit expensive
[20:40:53] <[cube]> yeah, its a bit slow imo
[20:41:09] <tjb1> JT-Shop: You could build a Bulldog XL
[20:41:12] <[cube]> if i push it too hard it skips
[20:41:23] <tjb1> The XL?
[20:41:29] <[cube]> yeah
[20:41:37] <[cube]> have you had that problem?
[20:41:41] <tjb1> I've never had mine skip but I have motor current up pretty high
[20:41:55] <tjb1> https://www.dropbox.com/s/ixxbkht9zrfwg79/2014-05-06%2020.36.41.jpg?dl=0
[20:42:11] <[cube]> i've done a lot of tweaking and speed adjustment always fixes the skipping
[20:42:30] <tjb1> JT-Shop: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:215457
[20:42:52] <[cube]> i'm also pushing 3mm filament into a 0.3 mm nozzle
[20:43:01] <[cube]> tha tmight have something to do with it
[20:43:45] <tjb1> [cube]:
[20:43:46] <tjb1> https://www.dropbox.com/s/lkorxyzmu3zelqe/FLIR0099.jpg?dl=0
[20:43:59] <JT-Shop> tjb1, burner test a few minutes ago http://gnipsel.com/images/casting/
[20:44:03] <[cube]> lol
[20:44:04] <[cube]> nice
[20:44:16] <[cube]> just a few days ago I bought a seek thermal cam!
[20:44:27] <[cube]> i've yet to try it on the printer, good idea
[20:44:40] <tjb1> That picture is from an Flir E4(E8)
[20:44:50] <[cube]> nice
[20:44:55] <tjb1> I had a lense on it but I don't remember the focal length
[20:44:55] * furrywolf wants a thermal imager
[20:45:01] <[cube]> the seek cam i got is a phone attachment
[20:45:06] <[cube]> but its actually really nice
[20:45:08] <[cube]> does video
[20:45:14] <[cube]> cost me $250
[20:45:17] <tjb1> I've been following that on EEVBlog
[20:45:21] <JT-Shop> tjb1, what size stepper is on the XL?\
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[20:45:29] <[cube]> nema17
[20:45:30] <tjb1> seems the concensus is that they aren't updating the software enough
[20:45:37] <tjb1> JT-Shop: its a geared stepper
[20:45:39] <[cube]> but its custom nema17
[20:45:48] <[cube]> with metal gearbox
[20:45:49] <tjb1> http://i.imgur.com/BeLXggi.gifv
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[20:46:19] <[cube]> nice
[20:46:42] <tjb1> Whole bunch of MK8 here - https://www.dropbox.com/sh/h0fcrk7ao6bh0sz/AAAftfo8Ew1Vsvx9mz3osQzUa?dl=0
[20:46:58] <furrywolf> ... why the heck would you tie something like an ir camera to a phone?
[20:47:01] <[cube]> i don't think motor current is the issue in my case
[20:47:24] <tjb1> furrywolf: a lot cheaper than what I have
[20:47:25] <[cube]> furrywolf: least expensive option for me
[20:47:35] <tjb1> E4 is $999
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[20:47:37] <[cube]> and works surprisingly well
[20:47:46] <furrywolf> why not make it a generic usb device?
[20:47:53] <[cube]> i have a Note 3 phone that's capable of recording in 4k
[20:48:08] <tjb1> requires their app furrywolf unless you want to roll your own
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[20:48:17] <tjb1> also Flir One which works on Android/iPhone
[20:49:10] <furrywolf> I mean why, if you're a company developing a thermal imager, would you make it only work with smartphones, rather than just making it a generic usb device that'll work with anything?
[20:49:37] <[cube]> technically it is
[20:49:46] <[cube]> it'll work on anythign with andorid and microusb
[20:50:16] <[cube]> http://www.thermal.com/
[20:50:44] <[cube]> i use a little usb extension cord
[20:51:03] <[cube]> so im not bound by the sensor being stuck to the base of the phone
[20:51:07] <furrywolf> also, they seem to have one of the worst websites ever designed.
[20:51:12] <[cube]> goign to 3d print a mount for it
[20:51:19] <tjb1> http://www.flir.com/flirone/
[20:51:26] <[cube]> lol yeah
[20:51:49] <tjb1> Not bad if you have Iphone -
[20:51:49] <tjb1> <tjb1> http://i.imgur.com/BeLXggi.gifv
[20:51:53] <tjb1> wow hexchat...
[20:51:55] <[cube]> http://www.amazon.com/Seek-UW-AAA-Thermal-Imaging-Connector/dp/B00NYWAHHM
[20:51:57] <tjb1> http://www.amazon.com/FLIR-ONE-Thermal-Imager-iPhone/dp/B00K0PXFB6/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1422823894&sr=8-1&keywords=flir+one
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[20:53:57] <JT-Shop> tjb1, did you see the burner test photos?
[20:54:07] <tjb1> JT-Shop: Yes, looks good
[20:55:23] <JT-Shop> the stl file looks weird in SW
[20:55:49] <furrywolf> if I were designing a low-priced thermal camera, I'd make it report as a generic usb webcam, so it magically works on every OS...
[20:56:14] <tjb1> https://www.dropbox.com/s/yn5y2a8rhvylpjv/FLIR0102.jpg?dl=0
[20:56:16] <JT-Shop> the stp works better
[20:56:49] <furrywolf> even if it has >8 bits/channel, it could just use two channels, and let software process it.
[20:57:04] <[cube]> tjb1: what's the size of your nozzle?
[20:57:16] <tjb1> [cube]: .35 on the MK8
[20:57:35] <[cube]> hm
[20:58:03] <[cube]> the bottleneck with my bulldog seems to be only during long infill extrusions
[20:58:13] <[cube]> which is really weird
[20:58:18] <[cube]> because it does perimeters flawlessly
[20:58:24] <tjb1> what hotend
[20:58:29] <[cube]> merlin
[20:58:39] <tjb1> your issue is not enough heat
[20:58:47] <[cube]> hmm
[20:58:59] <[cube]> i've been extruding pla at 230
[20:59:14] <tjb1> dont think you have enough molten plastic
[20:59:24] <tjb1> I run into that problem when I was trying to do 2 layer infill
[20:59:36] <tjb1> skip 1 layer and it would double the second layer to fill
[20:59:39] <[cube]> i'll try higher
[21:00:00] <tjb1> I dont know what Merlin is made of
[21:00:06] <tjb1> probably cant get much higher than 235 or so
[21:00:08] <_methods> unicorns
[21:00:25] <[cube]> its a nice hotend
[21:00:40] <JT-Shop> what gear ratio is the stepper?
[21:00:54] <tjb1> 5:1
[21:01:02] <tjb1> http://forums.reprap.org/read.php?94,263985
[21:01:37] <_methods> http://www.hottug.nl/index_en.html
[21:01:51] <JT-Shop> thanks
[21:02:08] <[cube]> http://reprap.org/wiki/Merlin_Hotend
[21:02:33] <[cube]> http://reprap.org/mediawiki/images/d/d9/Merlin_example8.jpg
[21:02:43] <tjb1> does it have PTFE inside?
[21:03:02] <[cube]> yeah which supposedly helps with heat preservation
[21:03:56] <[cube]> creator's site: http://merlin-hotend.de/
[21:04:43] <tjb1> yeah 240 is rough max for those style
[21:04:46] <tjb1> same with jhead
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[21:06:38] <[cube]> yeah at 230 i can sense the pla curling
[21:06:43] <[cube]> much more and it'll burn
[21:09:07] <JT-Shop> is this useful http://www.reprapdiscount.com/electronics/49-ramps-basic-wiring-kit.html
[21:11:33] <[cube]> i have the second bulldog xl
[21:11:40] <[cube]> that i was going to use exclusively for infill
[21:11:55] <[cube]> it'll be hooked up to a ramps1.4
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[21:12:56] <[cube]> the 'perimeter' extruder i'll keep at 0.3mm and the 'infill' extruder i'll put the 0.5mm nozzle
[21:13:05] <[cube]> im hoping that'll significantly speed up my prints
[21:13:06] <furrywolf> maybe one of these days I'll build a 3d printer, but still haven't found a use for one. I'd probably just stick an extruder in my mill's spindle instead of building a whole new machine...
[21:13:20] <[cube]> furry
[21:13:29] <[cube]> look at those 3d printing 'pens'
[21:13:37] <[cube]> might be a cheap option to test out
[21:13:41] <furrywolf> url?
[21:13:55] <[cube]> ehhh actually i duno
[21:14:12] <[cube]> but you'll need some kind of software to step the filament feed precisely
[21:14:21] <[cube]> you're better off with a ramps/hotend
[21:14:45] -!- Komzzzpa has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
[21:14:46] <[cube]> but for the record here's one of those pens:
[21:14:51] <[cube]> http://lixpen.com/
[21:15:15] <furrywolf> I'd just drive the stepper off the A output...
[21:15:50] <[cube]> yeah i'm not familiar with that
[21:16:18] <tjb1> JT-Shop: yes
[21:16:26] <furrywolf> a 4-axis milling machine has X, Y, Z, and A, where A is rotation about the X axis... no reason to add new hardware when you already have all of it.
[21:16:35] <[cube]> you probably need to retract the filament when moving around the print
[21:16:49] <furrywolf> since the rotation isn't going to be useful for a 3d printer, I can use its stepper driver for the extruder.
[21:17:20] <[cube]> ah yeah could be cool to try
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[21:19:23] <furrywolf> I wonder if I could do something clever like a variable size nozzle, and make use of the greatly increased horsepower a real mill has over a 3d printer to do much more rapid printing...
[21:19:26] shurshur_ is now known as shurshur
[21:20:42] <[cube]> i think the bottleneck is the extruder and how fast it can push out plastic
[21:21:10] <furrywolf> that can be improved. :)
[21:21:10] <[cube]> for example i can speed up my printer to a point where tis blazing fast
[21:21:19] <[cube]> an di dont even come close to straining the steppers
[21:21:35] <[cube]> but the extruder can't handle pushign all that plastic through
[21:22:04] <[cube]> its a really tiny nozzle
[21:22:12] <[cube]> so im sure there's some physical limit there
[21:22:24] <furrywolf> yeah, hence why I just mentioned building a variable size nozzle.
[21:22:46] <[cube]> the hoteend i have has variable nozzles
[21:22:49] <[cube]> it uses airbrush nozzles
[21:22:56] <[cube]> 0.2, 0m3 and 0.5 mm
[21:23:18] <[cube]> anything larger than 0.5 you won't get fine detail
[21:23:31] <[cube]> whichi stotally fine if thats wha tyou're going for
[21:23:46] <furrywolf> I mean variable under machine control... so you can do fine detail and very fast infill.
[21:23:50] <[cube]> and you will get much faster with a larger nozzle
[21:23:57] <[cube]> hmm
[21:24:01] <[cube]> like a tool changer?
[21:24:07] <JT-Shop> thanks
[21:24:36] <furrywolf> like a camera iris, but with long jaws like a jacobs chuck, or similar...
[21:24:46] <[cube]> now that would be cool
[21:25:07] <[cube]> i'd love to tsee that if you come up with it
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[21:26:03] <[cube]> i think the software you use to generate gcode would also need to be programmed to play well with that
[21:26:07] <furrywolf> if rectangular was ok, so it printed a strip instead of a round opening, that'd be much easier.
[21:26:14] <furrywolf> yes
[21:26:25] <[cube]> the perimeter width generated by the variable nozzles would hav eto be accoutned for
[21:28:03] <furrywolf> the simplest design would be squishing a bit of silicone tube, but I don't know if you could get the required precision.
[21:28:32] <[cube]> yeah you could also get a large syringe
[21:28:42] <[cube]> and threaded rod connected ot the plunger
[21:28:44] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, these are popular among reprappers: http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/5pcs-NEMA17-78-Oz-in-CNC-stepper-motor-stepping-motor-1-8A/704350_554160664.html
[21:29:29] <furrywolf> I mean for the nozzle.
[21:30:00] <[cube]> hmm
[21:30:17] <[cube]> nozzle has to be metal
[21:30:34] <Tom_itx> yeah but insulated just above it
[21:30:34] <[cube]> to withstand high temps
[21:30:45] <Tom_itx> good thermal brake there
[21:31:59] <Tom_itx> DRV8825 seem to be the drivers you want to look for
[21:32:01] <[cube]> i could see using like 'steps'that you swap in and out
[21:32:03] <[cube]> like a step drill
[21:32:29] <CaptHindsight> maybe a nice bakelite nozzle
[21:32:37] <furrywolf> a tool changer design will solidify between changes, and suck.
[21:32:56] <[cube]> yep
[21:33:03] <Tom_itx> someone has a really thin stainless one that apparently works good
[21:33:08] <CaptHindsight> or maybe a nozzle that opens and closes like an iris
[21:33:18] <CaptHindsight> shaped like a funnel
[21:33:20] <furrywolf> > like a camera iris, but with long jaws like a jacobs chuck, or similar...
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[21:34:09] <_methods> e3d
[21:34:13] <[cube]> this is a totally new approach that came out recently
[21:34:15] <[cube]> http://www.arburg.com/en/products-and-services/additive-manufacturing/akf-process/
[21:34:26] <[cube]> that machine is $100K
[21:34:44] <[cube]> apparently the plastic parts are 80% the strength of an injection molded part
[21:34:47] <malcom2073_> Most people either use dual extruders, or don't worry too much about it. The big thing a bigger nozzle gets you, is larger layer heights, so you can do infil every other outside layer
[21:36:23] <CaptHindsight> SLA can produce parts equal to or stronger than injection molded
[21:36:34] <CaptHindsight> it depends on the resin formulation
[21:36:43] <[cube]> yeah
[21:36:58] <[cube]> the benefit to this machien is it takes a bunch fo different plastic pellet substrates
[21:37:08] <CaptHindsight> I don't have a filament fetish :)
[21:37:34] <[cube]> well if you're an injeciton molding shop
[21:37:39] <[cube]> and a client wants 20 parts
[21:37:43] <[cube]> in delrin
[21:37:59] <[cube]> having this machine would beat having to build the mold, etc
[21:38:14] <[cube]> charge a bit less and capture all that profit from charging as if you had a mold
[21:38:44] * furrywolf tries a google image search for a naked woman wrapped in filaments, but doesn't find anything for capthindsight
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[21:51:55] <jdh> I don't believe that.
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[21:56:11] <furrywolf> you're welcome to try. I stopped caring after about one screen of results.
[21:57:56] <Deejay> gn8
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[22:00:31] <furrywolf> I really, really hate sae connectors.
[22:01:14] <furrywolf> the new panels I got have them. which is positive? which is negative? why is the red wire negative and the black positive? what idiot designed a hermaphroditic connector that swaps the polarity?
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[22:19:36] <hetii> Hi :)
[22:20:24] <jack16> Anderson Powerpoles are cool connectors. Very customisable.
[22:20:25] <hetii> I wonder how precision I could get from hdd head. The idea is to use such head as a part or CNC machine to get enought precision to be able to make lqfp packed on PCB
[22:20:33] <hetii> at the end of the day there will be biger area to control whole board and small that will calibrate it for small footprint
[22:28:00] <furrywolf> jack: yes. I like powerpoles. however, the things I'm working with have built-in sae connectors.
[22:28:19] <furrywolf> what's the best way to clean black copper wire to get a good crimp and/or solder joint?
[22:31:28] <Tom_itx> acid
[22:31:34] <Tom_itx> and rinse
[22:31:44] <Tom_itx> just like copper pipe
[22:32:05] <Tom_itx> but you don't want the acid to remain
[22:32:27] <furrywolf> insulated stranded wire has a remarkable ability to suck up things, like acid.
[22:32:43] <furrywolf> I'm thinking electrolysis or something...
[22:33:14] <furrywolf> the wires on this solar panel seem to be corroded pretty far back, as I chopped off 4" already with no change in color...
[22:33:20] <Tom_itx> it was a trick question if you knew the answer
[22:34:16] <_methods> flux
[22:34:38] <furrywolf> only flux I have in bulk is acid plumbing flux... see above. :)
[22:34:42] <furrywolf> (about acid being bad)
[22:34:43] <Tom_itx> flux may not get it if it's badly coroded
[22:36:09] <furrywolf> hrmm, one forum post suggests hydrogen peroxide... to remove oxides? hrmm
[22:39:02] <furrywolf> Results of my tests:
[22:39:03] <furrywolf> 1. hydrogen peroxide (3%): no effect
[22:39:09] <furrywolf> yeah, that's what I figured. internet people!
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[22:39:56] <furrywolf> that poster finally gave up and used phosphoric acid.
[22:40:41] <Tom_itx> it is possible that the corrosion caused the plastic jacket to ooze onto the copper too
[22:41:17] <Tom_itx> i suggested acid...
[22:41:22] <Tom_itx> you didn't care for that
[22:42:03] <furrywolf> I'm worried acid will cause further corrosion later, as it'll wick up into the wire.
[22:42:41] <Tom_itx> that's why i suggested you rinse it good
[22:43:08] <Tom_itx> a better solution would be to replace the wire
[22:43:28] <Tom_itx> seal it with that silicone stuff the phone co uses on their crimps
[22:43:42] <furrywolf> the wire goes into a silicone blob to a solder joint to the bus strips on the cells. can't replace wire once panel is laminated...
[22:45:29] <Tom_itx> there is really no one good answer
[22:47:12] <_methods> sand each individual strand
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[22:47:19] <_methods> lol
[22:47:19] <jack16> I'd scrape it good and crimp
[22:47:54] <furrywolf> I'm going to try electrolysis. it's a solar panel and it's sunny out. brb...
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[22:50:16] <zeeshan|2> when setting up a vfd , dc braking frequency
[22:50:19] <zeeshan|2> 0 - 60 hz
[22:50:33] <zeeshan|2> for some reason the default value is 0.5hz
[22:50:44] <zeeshan|2> wouldnt that mean motor would have to naturally slow down to 0.5hz
[22:50:49] <zeeshan|2> before the brake activates?
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[23:00:00] <jack16> I think yes, if by "nanurally" you mean ramping frequency down. I do not think it's coasting.
[23:00:29] <furrywolf> and, of course, the second I walk outside, the sun goes away.
[23:04:29] <Rab> zeeshan|2, could be the default setting is for a holding brake, rather than dynamic braking.
[23:05:09] <furrywolf> reduction takes place at the negative electrode, right? my chemistry is more than a little rusty... (no pun intended)
[23:05:33] <zeeshan|2> "The frequency at which DC braking activates during decel"
[23:05:45] <zeeshan|2> so basically when i command a decel
[23:05:49] <zeeshan|2> and say im at 60Hz
[23:06:01] <zeeshan|2> itll free run to 30Hz
[23:06:07] <zeeshan|2> and then bam brake will activate
[23:06:19] <zeeshan|2> there is another parameter which limits the max brake time
[23:06:23] <zeeshan|2> so i dont burn the motor down
[23:06:32] <zeeshan|2> im gonna try 30Hz activation, and 0.5s duration
[23:06:35] <zeeshan|2> lets see how strong that is :)
[23:07:36] <PetefromTn_> get er done!!
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[23:10:27] <zeeshan|2> man my other drives didnt have this cool function
[23:10:30] <zeeshan|2> "jump frequency"
[23:10:39] <zeeshan|2> so say you try to command 31.6 hz
[23:10:49] <zeeshan|2> and you know your spindle resonates at the frequency
[23:11:00] <zeeshan|2> you can set it so it jumps the frequency to something else :)
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[23:15:22] <furrywolf> low-power electrolysis (sun has gone away) seems to be working... the wire has gone from dark black to brownish.
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[23:15:42] <furrywolf> and I have a cup of the most pretty blue liquid.
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[23:16:19] <andypugh> Don’t drink the pretty blue liquid
[23:16:45] * LeelooMinai notices two Smurf hiding behind furrywolf'
[23:16:50] <LeelooMinai> 's blender
[23:17:30] <furrywolf> no, I don't plan on drinking it. copper isn't very healthy in quantity...
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[23:18:46] <andypugh> LeelooMinai: http://estaticos01.ocholeguas.com/imagenes/2013/07/26/espana/1374836653_0.jpg
[23:19:05] <PetefromTn_> OOh I wanna live there!!
[23:19:26] <andypugh> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Júzcar
[23:19:40] <_methods> thats where that band the blue men came from
[23:19:42] <LeelooMinai> YOu can live there, just don't buy a blue car:)
[23:20:59] <PetefromTn_> ya think they have nude beaches there?
[23:21:18] <furrywolf> where doesn't have nude beaches? (that has beaches)
[23:21:22] <_methods> down at the blue lagoon
[23:21:27] <PetefromTn_> I'm gonna be needing a BIGASS telescope
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[23:21:39] <PetefromTn_> preferrably a blue one
[23:22:59] <furrywolf> as long as you're not drunk or wanking, you can sun bathe nude at all the beaches here...
[23:23:59] <_methods> so do you know about the latter limitations from previous experience?
[23:24:40] <furrywolf> from reports in the local paper. :P
[23:24:44] <_methods> heheh
[23:24:50] <_methods> peewee herman was in town
[23:24:52] <JT-Shop> Tom_itx, that's only $14 each lol
[23:25:14] <furrywolf> I'm sure it's illegal and considered public nudity or something, but as long as you're not being a pest, no one seems to care.
[23:26:56] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, yeah those are pretty cheap but strong
[23:27:26] <Tom_itx> you can get the avr2560 board with the ramps 1.4 with it there too for real cheap
[23:27:38] <Tom_itx> but i hear you want the TI drivers
[23:27:44] <_methods> yeah a mega is like $13
[23:27:44] <Tom_itx> more robust
[23:27:49] <_methods> and ramps is like $15
[23:28:00] <_methods> just make sure you get one with the right caps on the ramps
[23:28:14] <_methods> if you're going to run 24v
[23:28:16] <Tom_itx> the drivers plug into the ramps board
[23:28:19] * furrywolf still is annoyed at religious whackjobs for claiming nude people are evil
[23:28:23] <Tom_itx> it's basically a carrier board for them
[23:29:17] <_methods> some of those ebay vendors put under spec caps on the ramps boards
[23:29:41] <Tom_itx> well why is that not surprising
[23:30:47] <furrywolf> kinda like my "mach3 breakout board" with exploding caps?
[23:31:16] <_methods> i just bought one of those nema23 kits with the chinese driver board
[23:31:20] <_methods> i can't wait to blow that thing up
[23:31:52] <furrywolf> http://fw.bushytails.net/bbcaps/bbcap02.jpg chinese caps, yay.
[23:34:09] <_methods> how bad are these dq542ma stepper drivers?
[23:37:12] <_methods> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Best-3Axis-Nema23-Wantai-stepper-motor425oz-in-3A-4-Leads-CNC-single-shaft-115mm-/271520259443
[23:39:12] <PetefromTn_> wonton stepper motors? are they meat filled?
[23:39:54] <andypugh> I manged to explode a resistor so violently it punched a hole through the aluminium case.
[23:40:32] <_methods> mmmmm wontons
[23:47:45] <CaptHindsight> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCMPOY0nQgY Solidscape 5000dpi printed wax molds for casting
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[23:49:18] <CaptHindsight> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gM86qxW7vP8 wax inkjet
[23:52:12] <andypugh> Would it be fair to assume that that is not inexpensive?
[23:53:37] <PetefromTn_> if it is so damn good how come they had to show the whole thing in CG? does the real thing look shitty?
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[23:53:52] <_methods> yeah i was wondering the same thing
[23:53:57] <CaptHindsight> I bet they mark that up >$50K but you could DIY one using a xerox for far less
[23:53:57] <_methods> very light on actual footage
[23:54:43] <CaptHindsight> inkjet is the most controlling and paranoid industry that there is next to recreational drugs
[23:57:11] <CaptHindsight> http://www.office.xerox.com/printers/color-printers/colorqube-8570/enus.html it's the heads from this only on a flatbed with a Z axis for either the head or the platform
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[23:58:07] <CaptHindsight> any of the solid (wax) ink version printers
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[23:59:39] <furrywolf> wire clean enough, lightly wire brushed, coated in oxgard, and crimped.