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[00:14:20] <zeeshan`> ssi you there
[00:14:48] <ssi> yeah
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[00:15:50] <zeeshan`> i got the drives
[00:15:56] <zeeshan`> i didnt hoko up any wires except power wire
[00:16:01] <zeeshan`> and fault led is in on
[00:16:11] <zeeshan`> think it might be cause the last person who used em had it in hall mdoe
[00:16:26] <zeeshan`> how to fnid out what causing the fault
[00:16:40] <zeeshan`> i havent tried setting the drive up yet at all
[00:16:45] <ssi> well first of all, they need to be enabled in order to go green
[00:16:51] <zeeshan`> oh
[00:16:58] <zeeshan`> so i gotta short between the 5v supply
[00:17:01] <zeeshan`> and inhibit
[00:17:11] <zeeshan`> in drive 5v supply that is
[00:17:13] <ssi> second, if they're in hall mode then they won't enable unless the hallstates are correct
[00:17:20] <ssi> no, pull inhibit low
[00:17:31] <zeeshan`> i forget is there a ground on the drive
[00:17:37] <zeeshan`> so i short between inhibit and ground
[00:17:43] <ssi> signal ground
[00:17:46] <ssi> it's another pin on the connector
[00:17:48] <zeeshan`> btw, these drives might be floating at 0V.
[00:17:52] <zeeshan`> and expecting 5v
[00:17:55] <zeeshan`> they're inverted
[00:18:09] <ssi> are you holding them upside down?
[00:18:20] <zeeshan`> im not home yet
[00:18:21] <zeeshan`> will be in a bit
[00:18:27] <zeeshan`> http://i.imgur.com/m8yGFjn.jpg\
[00:18:29] <zeeshan`> http://i.imgur.com/m8yGFjn.jpg
[00:18:30] <ssi> don't let all the bits leak out
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[00:18:50] <zeeshan`> what bits
[00:18:56] <ssi> the digital bits
[00:19:01] <ssi> if you hold it inverted all the bits will run out
[00:19:06] <ssi> then it'll only be an analog drive
[00:19:37] <zeeshan`> ?? what are the digital bits
[00:19:37] <zeeshan`> ahha
[00:19:58] <ssi> never mind
[00:20:05] <zeeshan`> are you trollingm e
[00:20:12] <ssi> me? never
[00:20:15] <zeeshan`> haha
[00:20:28] <zeeshan`> what are you going to tell me next
[00:20:35] <zeeshan`> "put a scrwe diver ebtween motor phases"
[00:20:36] <zeeshan`> :D
[00:20:42] <ssi> you said they were inverted
[00:20:51] <zeeshan`> i think the inhibit is inverted
[00:21:04] <ssi> ok there's two things going on here
[00:21:05] <zeeshan`> so instead of shorting to ground
[00:21:07] <zeeshan`> you need to provide 5v
[00:21:12] <ssi> one is they're active low inhibits
[00:21:20] <ssi> it says /INH, that means it's active low
[00:21:31] <ssi> so you pull down to activate the pin
[00:21:33] <zeeshan`> i forget, when its active low that means you gotta give it 5v
[00:21:36] <zeeshan`> to bring it to high right
[00:21:37] <ssi> no
[00:21:44] <ssi> means you need to pull it to ground to activate
[00:21:47] <zeeshan`> i always confused the two
[00:21:50] <zeeshan`> okay
[00:21:53] <ssi> second thing is
[00:21:53] <zeeshan`> and when it floats to 5v
[00:21:59] <ssi> by default it's a inhibit pin
[00:22:03] <ssi> but you want it to be an enable pin
[00:22:15] <ssi> it may already be set up as an enable
[00:22:24] <zeeshan`> think you might have a time to go over the settings with me later tonight?
[00:22:29] <ssi> maybe
[00:22:30] <zeeshan`> i was goin through the manual
[00:22:30] <zeeshan`> and it keeps going
[00:22:34] <zeeshan`> "READ THE DATASHEET"
[00:22:36] <zeeshan`> i read the datasheet
[00:22:37] <zeeshan`> no info there
[00:22:38] <zeeshan`> haha
[00:22:44] <ssi> it's really not hard
[00:22:50] <zeeshan`> unless they're asking me to decode it from the block diagram
[00:22:52] <ssi> you got BE25A20AC right?
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[00:22:59] <zeeshan`> ACG
[00:23:04] <zeeshan`> i dunno what the G is for
[00:23:08] <ssi> nothin
[00:23:17] <zeeshan`> look at the pic i posted
[00:23:20] <ssi> I saw it
[00:23:24] <zeeshan`> i got 4 rebranded drives
[00:23:31] <zeeshan`> that are apparently reverse inhibit
[00:23:35] <zeeshan`> of what its typically in the drives
[00:23:38] <ssi> good, that's what you want
[00:23:49] <zeeshan`> okay, so when i short
[00:23:53] <zeeshan`> it changes state
[00:23:57] <ssi> yes
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[00:24:10] <ssi> and if it's reverse inhibit, that means you pull it down to ENABLE
[00:24:11] <zeeshan`> btw i know those dip switches you were talking about now.
[00:24:15] <zeeshan`> what a piece of crap
[00:24:15] <ssi> by default, it's low to inhibit
[00:24:24] <zeeshan`> what do you have to be a nano bot
[00:24:26] <zeeshan`> to switch them
[00:24:31] <ssi> haha yeah I used smd tweezers to do it
[00:24:38] <ssi> that's what bit me
[00:24:47] <zeeshan`> you were switching em live?
[00:24:50] <ssi> no
[00:24:59] <ssi> but I didn't wait long enough for the dc bus to bleed
[00:25:07] <zeeshan`> when the led goes off
[00:25:08] <zeeshan`> its off right
[00:25:14] <ssi> should be!
[00:25:19] <zeeshan`> =D
[00:25:26] <ssi> stick a fork in it and find out!
[00:25:36] <zeeshan`> haha
[00:25:41] <zeeshan`> so first thing is
[00:25:46] <zeeshan`> setup the dip switches ocrrectly
[00:25:50] <zeeshan`> then second is limit the current
[00:26:06] <zeeshan`> then ensure inhibit pin is grounded
[00:26:13] <zeeshan`> and then turn on drive and it should go green
[00:26:23] <ssi> power up the drive first
[00:26:26] <ssi> then pull inhibit low to enable
[00:26:35] <zeeshan`> but if its in hall mode
[00:26:37] <zeeshan`> it'll still error?
[00:26:39] <ssi> probably
[00:26:47] <zeeshan`> thats why im thinking setup those dip switches
[00:27:03] <zeeshan`> counterclockwise on the gains
[00:27:04] <zeeshan`> = 0?
[00:27:04] <ssi> yeah by "first" I meant before inhibitingc
[00:27:07] <ssi> yeah
[00:27:15] <zeeshan`> okay ill set those to 0 too
[00:27:30] <zeeshan`> i really wanna see this thing jog some motosr!
[00:27:35] <zeeshan`> using a pot
[00:27:48] <zeeshan`> you used the internal 10v suplpy
[00:27:51] <zeeshan`> to test motors?
[00:27:58] <ssi> you can
[00:27:59] <zeeshan`> this keyboard is messed up
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[00:28:53] <ssi> lol insurance is going to have to pay for my bitcoin miners :D
[00:28:59] <ssi> I wonder what they'll say about that
[00:29:13] <zeeshan`> !
[00:30:00] <zeeshan`> do you have reciepts
[00:30:03] <zeeshan`> and burned remenants?
[00:30:12] <ssi> yeah
[00:30:16] <zeeshan`> good:D
[00:30:19] <ssi> what sucks is they want to start tearing out the house this week
[00:30:20] <zeeshan`> if they dont you can take em to court
[00:30:26] <zeeshan`> why
[00:30:33] <zeeshan`> what do you mean by tearing out
[00:30:34] <ssi> if they throw crap away and then ins pitches a fit about wanting to see something like that
[00:30:36] <zeeshan`> start recontructing?
[00:30:39] <ssi> they're gutting it
[00:30:46] <ssi> and whatever I don't move is gonna get thrown away
[00:30:53] <zeeshan`> go take pictuers
[00:30:53] <zeeshan`> of every corner
[00:30:56] <zeeshan`> or make a video
[00:31:00] <ssi> oh it's been done
[00:31:05] <ssi> and I've got before pictures of everything too
[00:31:06] <zeeshan`> okay then you have enough proof
[00:31:10] <ssi> and reciepts sorta
[00:31:21] <zeeshan`> most important is linking that you actually owned those things
[00:31:24] <ssi> i have receipts for the chips, $6500 worth
[00:31:24] <zeeshan`> reciepts arent as good
[00:31:27] <zeeshan`> cause you could have sold it
[00:31:36] <zeeshan`> if you have remenants, you can't deny it was there
[00:31:37] <ssi> yeah there's documentation that they're in there
[00:31:45] <zeeshan`> insurance will try to fuck you
[00:31:45] <ssi> dude we found pieces of the laser
[00:31:49] <zeeshan`> for every penny if they can.
[00:31:56] <ssi> the output coupler, the laser tube and the water jacket
[00:32:02] <ssi> the outer gas tube was in shards
[00:32:31] <zeeshan`> ps you wont be getting insurance anytime soon again!
[00:32:31] <zeeshan`> lol
[00:32:35] <zeeshan`> or it'll be too high
[00:32:40] <ssi> meh
[00:32:46] <zeeshan`> who caers as long as you get $$ for this
[00:33:21] <zeeshan`> why are they in such a rush to gut the place/
[00:33:48] <ssi> cause they want to pay me as little as possible in associated living expenses
[00:33:49] <ssi> ie rent
[00:35:29] <jdh> guy I used to dive with a lot burned his house in atl
[00:36:16] <jdh> hmm.. and he has a plane
[00:36:25] <ssi> did we used to dive together? :P
[00:36:42] <zeeshan`> jdh what happened
[00:36:46] <zeeshan`> did he get full money back
[00:36:48] <zeeshan`> or get screwed
[00:36:52] <jdh> don't think so. he has a 172
[00:36:59] <XXCoder> or get 10x more money lol
[00:37:00] <ssi> yeah definitely not me
[00:37:01] <jdh> self-insured
[00:37:05] <ssi> I hate 172s ;)
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[00:39:02] <zeeshan`> whats a 172
[00:39:14] <XXCoder> 2 1/2 wheeled car
[00:39:23] <zeeshan`> huh
[00:39:36] <ssi> it's a dumpy, slow airplane that every flight school in the universe uses
[00:39:48] <zeeshan`> ah okay
[00:39:54] <zeeshan`> i thought it was an insurance policy clause
[00:39:55] <zeeshan`> lol
[00:39:55] <ssi> and tons of people pay overinflated prices for them because it's the only thing they've ever known how to fly
[00:39:58] <jdh> actually I think it's a 182, but pretty much teh same?
[00:40:11] <ssi> yea 182 is a 6cyl 172 with more room
[00:40:18] <jdh> RG
[00:40:24] <ssi> and flappy wheels :)
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[00:50:23] <Tom_itx> do they even still build them?
[00:50:30] <XXCoder> likely
[00:50:33] <ssi> sure
[00:50:46] <Tom_itx> the plant used to be here but i think they moved it to Independecnce Ks
[00:50:46] <XXCoder> if peoples paying peremium and airplane flying classes keep using em
[00:51:04] <ssi> ooo
[00:51:04] <ssi> http://cessna.txtav.com/en/single-engine/turbo-skylane-jta
[00:51:07] <ssi> turbo skylane
[00:51:19] <ssi> that's the modern 182
[00:51:21] <XXCoder> I'd love to fly a plane but frankly its a hassle
[00:51:29] <Tom_itx> my bud's dad used to restore stearmans
[00:51:33] <jdh> pricey hobby
[00:51:39] <Tom_itx> had the biggest supply in the US for them
[00:51:42] <ssi> nice
[00:51:45] <XXCoder> there'd be interpeters all time and plane would need minium of 2 guys, myself and interpeter to use mike for me
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[00:51:57] <Tom_itx> used alot of radial engines from tanks
[00:52:02] <jdh> The 180 hp 172S, referred to by Cessna as the 172-SP, goes for $307,500; the 160 hp 172R sells for $274,900
[00:52:25] <ssi> new plane prices are stupid
[00:52:41] <Tom_itx> i think all they build here now are the citations
[00:52:52] <jdh> that would be a much cooler toy
[00:52:54] <XXCoder> make a plane by cnc
[00:52:55] <ssi> where's here, wichita?
[00:52:58] <Tom_itx> yes
[00:53:05] <jdh> I'm sorry.
[00:53:15] <Tom_itx> i'm not
[00:53:17] <ssi> I want to come through wichita sometime soon and go to the surplus stores
[00:53:19] <ssi> if any still exist
[00:53:23] <Tom_itx> it does
[00:53:33] <Tom_itx> not nearly as cool stuff as years ago though
[00:53:38] <ssi> yeah
[00:53:46] <Tom_itx> they moved alot of it to another warehouse
[00:53:49] <ssi> I want more of the boeing quickchange drillbits
[00:53:52] <Tom_itx> i've not been it that one yet
[00:53:54] <ssi> I love those things
[00:54:10] <Tom_itx> boeing used to have a surplus here too until they pulled out of wichita
[00:54:34] <ssi> I wonder if they'll have surplus in south carolina soon
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[00:55:05] <Tom_itx> what surplus are you looking for?
[00:55:12] <ssi> I dunno, whatever I can get
[00:55:18] <ssi> any aviation related tools
[00:55:21] <ssi> and material
[00:55:24] <Tom_itx> yeah
[00:55:40] <ssi> I have a full set of sheetmetal tools, but I'm still always looking for interesting crap
[00:55:43] <Tom_itx> like i said, most of the cool stuff is long gone there now
[00:56:13] <Tom_itx> there's another guy here that has surplus tooling too
[00:56:21] <Tom_itx> near where they had the linuxcnc fest
[00:56:36] <Tom_itx> even he's scrapped alot of it now
[00:56:41] <Tom_itx> sold by the pound
[00:56:48] <ssi> baw
[00:57:11] <Rab> I almost bought an aviation countersink from eBay, they look super sexy. But apparently they're almost universally 100-degree, and my fastener stock is 82-degree.
[00:57:14] <Tom_itx> i still get my small carbide cutters from him
[00:57:21] <ssi> yeah we use 100 degree
[00:57:32] <Tom_itx> he likely has both of those
[00:57:36] <ssi> and I have countersinks in all flavors
[00:57:49] <ssi> and dimpling dies
[00:57:53] <ssi> all sorts of fun stuff :)
[00:58:31] <Tom_itx> he used to have tons of rivets and all sorts of fasteners
[00:59:13] <Tom_itx> since his brother died he's kinda been clearing it out
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[01:55:27] <zeeshan|2> ssi
[01:55:30] <zeeshan|2> whered you buy dimple dies from?
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[02:11:54] <EW57> are you out there PCW?
[02:15:31] <Rab> zeeshan|2, what are some applications for dimple dies?
[02:16:17] <zeeshan|2> sheet metal reinforcement
[02:16:22] <zeeshan|2> and lightening
[02:16:26] <Rab> Hmm, I guess like this:
http://www.crankshaftcoalition.com/wiki/How_to_make_%22speed_holes%22_using_dimple_dies
[02:16:52] <zeeshan|2> yes
[02:17:07] <zeeshan|2> makes the sheet metal stuffer
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[02:17:13] <zeeshan|2> similar to how if you rolled a bead in it
[02:17:15] <zeeshan|2> to make it less flimsy
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[02:23:39] <Rab> Neat!
[02:26:04] <Rab> Looks like the small dies are fairly cheap. That might be a nice effect in front panels for tube amps etc.
[02:28:44] <zeeshan|2> i can never find em cheap
[02:28:51] <zeeshan|2> for 1" to 3 " holes
[02:28:56] <zeeshan|2> theyre in the hundreds
[02:29:03] <Rab> Yeah, I see that.
[02:29:12] <zeeshan|2> ill prolly make some
[02:29:13] <zeeshan|2> one da y
[02:29:13] <zeeshan|2> :D
[02:29:39] <Rab> eBay has 0.5/0.75/1.0 sets for around $80.
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[02:42:53] <XXCoder> So that is how they do it
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[02:53:51] <zeeshan|2> ssi u there
[02:53:58] <zeeshan|2> 4 of the drives say enable
[02:54:08] <zeeshan|2> 1 of the drive says inhibit
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[03:17:17] <pcw_home> zeeshan|2: I think theres an option for enable or disable inputs on some AMC drives (maybe a solder jumper option inside)
[03:17:29] <zeeshan|2> nm i read it wrong
[03:17:40] <zeeshan|2> based on the part number, its "INV"
[03:17:45] <zeeshan|2> so that means if i ground enable
[03:17:47] <zeeshan|2> it should enable
[03:18:07] <zeeshan|2> im setting up the current limit
[03:18:11] <zeeshan|2> so i dont burn my servos :P
[03:18:29] <pcw_home> that's better tha having to ground to disable
[03:18:38] <zeeshan|2> yea
[03:18:43] <zeeshan|2> much easier to run it through a relay
[03:18:45] <zeeshan|2> to kill the drives
[03:18:50] <zeeshan|2> or in e-stop loop
[03:19:06] <zeeshan|2> it drove me insane on the kl8070d
[03:19:10] <zeeshan|2> to implement drive killing
[03:19:24] <pcw_home> estop shoud remove drive power, ferror should remove drive enable
[03:20:24] <zeeshan|2> do you have a diagram of a "typical wiring" diagram for a 7i77
[03:20:27] <zeeshan|2> for a mill
[03:20:33] <zeeshan|2> including safety circuit
[03:21:02] <pcw_home> well the enable are easy (if gnd for enable)
[03:21:09] <pcw_home> enables
[03:21:12] <zeeshan|2> yes
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[03:22:01] <pcw_home> so ENAX- --> GND
[03:22:02] <pcw_home> ENAX+ --> DRIVE ENABLE
[03:22:27] <pcw_home> (for ENA0 through ENA4)
[03:22:30] <zeeshan|2> so if watchdog detects loss of signal
[03:22:37] <zeeshan|2> drives automatically disable
[03:22:59] <pcw_home> Yes or linuxcnc detects a following error
[03:23:03] <zeeshan|2> enax- -> gnd of servo drive?
[03:23:11] <pcw_home> Yes
[03:23:13] <zeeshan|2> okay
[03:23:18] <zeeshan|2> perfect nice and simple! :D
[03:23:45] <pcw_home> whatever they suggest connecting enable to
[03:23:59] <zeeshan|2> yes im lookin g for that right now
[03:24:07] <zeeshan|2> i only see 1 gnd pin in the set of pins where enable is
[03:24:13] <zeeshan|2> just making sur eit is it
[03:25:14] <pcw_home> the ENAX pins are just OPTO coupler outputs so just a switch that off unless enabled by linuxcnc
[03:25:16] <pcw_home> you do need to pay attention to polarity
[03:26:35] <zeeshan|2> im going to do it one step at a time
[03:26:39] <zeeshan|2> first try to figure these drives out
[03:26:41] <zeeshan|2> then interface with mesa
[03:26:48] <zeeshan|2> i dont wanna blow either of em up :0)
[03:27:10] <pcw_home> Yes better to undestand waht the drives do before connecting things up
[03:28:01] <pcw_home> also better to disconnect the motors from the screws for initial testing (if its easy)
[03:28:19] <zeeshan|2> yes theyre all off
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[03:28:29] <pcw_home> (a runaway should be expected)
[03:28:41] <zeeshan|2> how fast a run away typically
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[03:28:47] <zeeshan|2> 10 rpm?
[03:28:54] <zeeshan|2> or can be very aggressive?
[03:29:11] <pcw_home> full speed is possible and likely
[03:29:14] <zeeshan|2> wow
[03:29:18] <zeeshan|2> scary!
[03:29:44] <pcw_home> (all you need is tachometer or encoder backwards)
[03:30:09] <pcw_home> so you have a 25% chance of no runaway :-(
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[03:31:06] <EW57> PCW, are there any plans to support sscnet?
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[03:31:27] <zeeshan|2> if motor spec is 12.5A
[03:31:28] <zeeshan|2> er
[03:31:33] <zeeshan|2> 7.5A
[03:31:40] <zeeshan|2> should i current limit to 7.5A
[03:31:43] <zeeshan|2> or 7.0A?
[03:31:50] <zeeshan|2> have a small safety factor?
[03:32:33] <jdh> why not start low until things work well.
[03:32:47] <zeeshan|2> ok
[03:33:18] <pcw_home> is sscnet full documented?
[03:33:48] <EW57> I havent found much, but then again, I've just started searching
[03:34:39] <pcw_home> also be careful with bare motors (a sudden accell can flip them and damage things)
[03:38:01] <renesis> you mean unmounted?
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[03:38:09] <renesis> heheh
[03:39:48] <zeeshan|2> http://www.a-m-c.com/download/datasheet/be25a20ac.pdf
[03:39:54] <zeeshan|2> page 2 plz
[03:40:04] <zeeshan|2> p1-11 on my drive says ground
[03:40:17] <zeeshan|2> p1-9 (top left) is 'enable'
[03:40:37] <zeeshan|2> ive never see thsi triangle simple before for ground
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[03:40:52] <zeeshan|2> lemme highlight
[03:41:49] <jdh> op amp?
[03:42:08] <zeeshan|2> http://i.imgur.com/JEuvVHe.png
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[03:42:29] <jdh> I don't see a triangle there
[03:42:45] <jdh> 5k pullup to 5v
[03:42:55] <zeeshan|2> p1-11
[03:42:57] <zeeshan|2> bottom right
[03:43:01] <zeeshan|2> theres a triangle
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[03:47:33] <jdh> oh, I quit looking after the top one. Looks like a floating ground
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[03:47:43] <jdh> see lower left corner
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[03:48:12] <zeeshan|2> hm
[03:48:16] <jdh> s/floating/signal/
[03:48:18] <jdh> vs. earth
[03:49:09] <zeeshan|2> well this sucks
[03:49:18] <zeeshan|2> i shorted out ground and enable
[03:49:23] <zeeshan|2> still in fault mde
[03:50:29] <jdh> where are you getting the ground?
[03:50:35] <zeeshan|2> #11
[03:50:38] <zeeshan|2> p1-11
[03:51:33] <jdh> same as p1-2 ?
[03:53:16] <zeeshan|2> i didnt try p1-2
[03:53:49] <jdh> you are grounding P1-9?
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[03:54:40] <zeeshan|2> yes
[03:54:56] <zeeshan|2> i measured voltge between p1-9 and p1-11
[03:55:00] <zeeshan|2> says 5V
[03:55:25] <jdh> does it enable when you let p1-9 float?
[03:55:38] <zeeshan|2> no
[03:55:57] <jdh> did you read the desciption for pin 9 on page 4?
[03:56:45] <zeeshan|2> yes
[03:56:55] <zeeshan|2> remember that manual is slightly wrong
[03:57:08] <zeeshan|2> these drives have inverted pins.
[03:57:25] <zeeshan|2> so if you ground that pin, itshould enable
[03:57:38] <jdh> this isn't the manual for your drive?
[03:57:49] <zeeshan|2> it is.
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[03:57:55] <zeeshan|2> theres a note down there
[03:58:17] <zeeshan|2> that says -inv model drives are work like i said above
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[03:59:43] <skunkworks> just signifying 2 different grounds
[04:01:50] <skunkworks> zeeshan|2: if you don't have the switches setup correctly or the commutation of the hal sensors - it won't come out of error
[04:02:12] <skunkworks> (or too high of input votage..)
[04:02:47] <zeeshan|2> thhat was it man
[04:02:53] <zeeshan|2> i had to change 120 deg to 60 deg
[04:02:55] <zeeshan|2> for hall mode
[04:03:04] <zeeshan|2> cause i have no hall sensors
[04:03:07] <zeeshan|2> its enabled now!
[04:03:07] <zeeshan|2> D:
[04:03:10] <skunkworks> ah - great!
[04:03:20] <zeeshan|2> thank u
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[04:15:31] <jdh> my amc drives came with a wiring/tuning manual
[04:18:04] <zeeshan|2> im a bit confused on this step
[04:18:07] <zeeshan|2> so after enabling
[04:18:16] <zeeshan|2> it says measure the voltage at the motor pins
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[04:18:26] <zeeshan|2> first of all do i meassure them at motor a and motor b?
[04:18:29] <zeeshan|2> and ignore c?
[04:18:41] <zeeshan|2> second thing is when i am in test mode
[04:18:44] <zeeshan|2> and i turn the knob
[04:18:48] <zeeshan|2> it goes from -170 to +170vdc
[04:18:52] <zeeshan|2> all the sudden
[04:18:57] <zeeshan|2> thers no values in between..
[04:19:04] <zeeshan|2> the manual wants me to set it to a low voltage
[04:22:12] <zeeshan|2> ssi!!
[04:22:14] <zeeshan|2> wake up!! :D
[04:23:33] <renesis> figure out your tool holder knuckle?
[04:23:48] <zeeshan|2> kind of
[04:24:03] <renesis> like you figure out what it really is, or whats wrong
[04:24:15] <zeeshan|2> i have a good lead
[04:24:22] <zeeshan|2> on what the tool holder in it should be
[04:24:26] <zeeshan|2> i ordered some pull studs
[04:24:31] * zeeshan|2 crosses fingers
[04:24:40] <zeeshan|2> fkn 100 bux in pull studs
[04:24:42] <zeeshan|2> for 5
[04:24:45] <zeeshan|2> lol
[04:24:57] <renesis> you have holders with the right taper tho?
[04:25:08] <zeeshan|2> i borroed some from school
[04:25:13] <zeeshan|2> we have cat40 there
[04:25:15] <renesis> uhohz
[04:28:47] <zeeshan|2> ok manual says "motor a and b" only
[04:28:49] <zeeshan|2> :p
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[04:42:12] <zeeshan|2> ah
[04:42:14] <zeeshan|2> its hjappening
[04:42:16] <zeeshan|2> cause its not in voltage mode.
[04:42:42] <zeeshan|2> according to my drive specs i can only have current, duty cycle, encoder velocity and tachometer velocity mode
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[04:42:50] <zeeshan|2> theres no voltag emode :(
[04:42:55] <zeeshan|2> so how do i test this out
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[04:43:08] <zeeshan|2> if i try to hook up amotor
[04:43:12] <zeeshan|2> its gonna want to go at full speed!
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[04:43:59] <Connor> don't you want it in encoder velocity mode ?
[04:44:06] <zeeshan|2> i have tachometers
[04:44:32] <Connor> okay.. so, tachometer velocity mode then.
[04:44:35] <zeeshan|2> yes
[04:44:40] <zeeshan|2> but righjt now im only trying to test the motors
[04:44:51] <zeeshan|2> to see if they will spin and speed up and slow down
[04:44:57] <zeeshan|2> without hooking up the 7i77
[04:45:21] <Connor> okay.. so you need it in tach velocity mode.. and need to give 0-10v
[04:45:25] <Connor> to the driver.
[04:45:30] <Connor> for speed control.
[04:45:35] <Connor> tach should be wired up to the driver.
[04:46:29] <Connor> and, I would suggest uncoupling the motor from the ballscrew
[04:46:37] <zeeshan|2> theyre off
[04:47:16] <Connor> so, what the issue then ?
[04:47:28] <zeeshan|2> i want to spin the motors
[04:47:31] <zeeshan|2> without hooking tachos
[04:47:32] <zeeshan|2> :{
[04:47:50] <Connor> then it's going to spin the at full speed because it has no feed back.
[04:47:53] <Connor> Duh.. :)
[04:47:57] <zeeshan|2> lol
[04:48:08] <Connor> or fault.
[04:48:10] <zeeshan|2> this thing has a built in -10v 3ma out
[04:48:14] <zeeshan|2> +10v 3ma out
[04:48:17] <zeeshan|2> and signal gnd
[04:48:21] <zeeshan|2> i was thinking of hooking a pot there
[04:48:47] <Connor> signal gnd ?
[04:48:53] <Connor> should be a input..
[04:48:56] <zeeshan|2> http://www.a-m-c.com/download/datasheet/be25a20ac.pdf
[04:49:01] <zeeshan|2> plz see page 4
[04:49:05] <zeeshan|2> pin 1 2 3
[04:49:50] <Connor> I think it's REF IN
[04:50:08] <Connor> and it must be differential...
[04:50:11] <zeeshan|2> cant i put a pot between
[04:51:07] <zeeshan|2> does 7i77 output differential?
[04:51:08] <Connor> pot on pin 1 and 2, whiper on pin 4
[04:51:35] <zeeshan|2> i hope 3mA is enough
[04:52:03] <Connor> why would they supply it if it wasn't ?
[04:52:12] <zeeshan|2> hehe i dunno :)
[04:52:17] <zeeshan|2> i gotta find a pot
[04:52:22] <Connor> 5k
[04:55:46] <zeeshan|2> hm
[04:55:55] <zeeshan|2> when i measure from pot pin 1
[04:55:57] <zeeshan|2> to middle pin
[04:55:58] <Jymmm> zeeshan|2: car stereo
[04:56:01] <zeeshan|2> it goes from 0 to 47k
[04:56:10] <zeeshan|2> Jymmm: i stoll one from a foot pedal :D
[04:56:17] <Jymmm> ok that works
[04:56:43] <Jymmm> sounds like a 50K pot to me
[04:56:51] <Jymmm> linear or audio taper?
[04:57:37] <Jymmm> half-way point should read around 25K if linear taper
[04:57:48] <zeeshan|2> yea its about linear
[04:57:54] <zeeshan|2> 270 degree
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[04:59:29] <PetefromTn_andro> Evening folks
[04:59:42] <PetefromTn_andro> Night whatever
[05:01:17] <PetefromTn_andro> So I spent some of the afternoon removing the old air conditioning condenser and wiring from the side of my house
[05:01:52] <zeeshan|2> connor are you sure putting the wiper on one end of a differential input would work? :P
[05:01:57] <PetefromTn_andro> Then tomorrow if the weather is cooperating I plan to get under the house and remove the old air handler
[05:02:20] <zeeshan|2> nm
[05:02:26] <Connor> I'm thinking so.
[05:02:36] <PetefromTn_andro> So I was gonna remove the squirrel cage fan to play with for a shop fan
[05:02:39] <Connor> I hold NO responsibility if you blow stuff up.
[05:02:43] <zeeshan|2> haha
[05:02:58] <zeeshan|2> if the pot is at 100 ohm
[05:03:02] <zeeshan|2> wont it draw too much current
[05:03:29] <PetefromTn_andro> Is there anything else in there inside the condenser or the air handler worth salvaging?
[05:03:48] <Connor> PetefromTn_andro: Contactor ?
[05:03:48] <zeeshan|2> motor and fan
[05:03:49] <zeeshan|2> :D
[05:04:01] <zeeshan|2> i thin theyre 2 hp
[05:04:06] <zeeshan|2> or maybe even more
[05:04:20] <zeeshan|2> connor answer my noob q! :D
[05:04:21] <PetefromTn_andro> I was thinking about that I guess the handler might have some kinda contactor
[05:04:29] <zeeshan|2> when im turning the knob, it goes from 47k to 0
[05:04:31] <Connor> zeeshan|2: I have no idea.
[05:04:36] <zeeshan|2> so hypothetically itll hit 100 ohms
[05:04:44] <Connor> So ?
[05:04:54] <zeeshan|2> 10V/100 = 0.1
[05:04:55] <zeeshan|2> A
[05:05:02] <zeeshan|2> 3mA is max
[05:05:04] <PetefromTn_andro> The new system came with a nice programmable thermostat
[05:05:34] <zeeshan|2> PetefromTn_andro: how come youre replacing the ac
[05:05:36] <Connor> What you have with the pot is a voltage divider.
[05:05:59] <PetefromTn_andro> But I guess I will have to rip the bastards apart to see if there is anything worth having
[05:06:25] <zeeshan|2> <Connor> pot on pin 1 and 2, whiper on pin 4
[05:06:28] <zeeshan|2> pin 2 is ground.
[05:06:31] <zeeshan|2> thats why i got confused
[05:06:38] <zeeshan|2> i think +10v should go to 1 leg of the pot
[05:06:41] <PetefromTn_andro> Got a brand new higher efficiency system
[05:06:47] <zeeshan|2> -10v to the other leg and wiper to +ref in
[05:07:07] <Connor> We're just testing with +10 and gnd for now.
[05:07:21] <zeeshan|2> wont that make it work in one direction only?
[05:07:26] <Connor> correct.
[05:07:31] <Connor> baby steps
[05:07:37] <zeeshan|2> :P
[05:07:43] <PetefromTn_andro> Was hoping that the coil was all copper but alas it's an aluminum piece of Shit. Not worth a damn heh
[05:07:45] <zeeshan|2> i gotta solder some wires to thsi thing
[05:08:07] <Connor> PetefromTn_andro: Sounds fun. :.
[05:08:09] <Connor> :/
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[05:08:59] <PetefromTn_andro> Actually I'm quite excited about it. The old system was not worth a Shit looking forward to a nice warm winter in the house
[05:09:22] <Connor> I'll be happier next time I'm over and it's warm. :)
[05:09:33] <PetefromTn_andro> I was playing with the cnc lathe today.
[05:10:07] <PetefromTn_andro> Hell you know I always keep it warm out in the shop
[05:10:28] <Connor> Yea.. I know .. :(
[05:10:36] <PetefromTn_andro> I despise being cold
[05:11:08] <PetefromTn_andro> Oh yeah I forgot about your overheating last time
[05:11:51] <PetefromTn_andro> Maybe you need a new thermostat too LOL
[05:12:09] <Connor> That or a new circulatory system.. or both.
[05:12:18] <PetefromTn_andro> Jeez
[05:12:24] <PetefromTn_andro> That bites
[05:12:50] <Connor> yea. Type 2 sucks.
[05:13:32] <PetefromTn_andro> I am still cleaning and stripping the lathe down
[05:13:57] <Connor> I REALLY need to get this stuff over to your place..
[05:14:09] <PetefromTn_andro> I figured out the x screws is .2", 5mm
[05:14:12] <Connor> Just not been up to it past few weekends.
[05:14:55] <Connor> OKay.. so 5.08mm so, a 5mm pitch on the Z would work.
[05:15:15] <PetefromTn_andro> 5.08?
[05:15:25] <Connor> .200" = 5.08mm
[05:15:41] <PetefromTn_andro> Oh sorry I forgot about that
[05:15:54] <PetefromTn_andro> Had the same thing on the rf45
[05:15:58] <Connor> Not exactly ==
[05:16:41] <PetefromTn_andro> Would you believe the factory x motor was 750 watts basically 1 hp and it was only408
[05:16:59] <Connor> 408 ?
[05:17:00] <PetefromTn_andro> 408 oz in at 2400 rpm
[05:17:06] <Connor> Oh.
[05:17:10] <Connor> Yea.
[05:17:15] <Connor> Not much needed.
[05:17:44] <PetefromTn_andro> That bigass motor I thought was a lot torquier than that
[05:18:08] <PetefromTn_andro> The original belt drive was 1-1
[05:18:25] <Connor> You probably could put nema 34 steppers on that machine. :)
[05:18:31] <PetefromTn_andro> Musta hauled ass I guess
[05:18:48] <PetefromTn_andro> Yeah probably could heh
[05:18:52] <Connor> Being 1:1 is a bit odd for it being a servo..
[05:19:31] <PetefromTn_andro> I think it was just to be able to tuck it up underneath the x body
[05:19:46] <Connor> yea. I'm sure it was.
[05:20:19] <PetefromTn_andro> I swear the tool post mount is freaking massive
[05:20:43] <PetefromTn_andro> The ballnut mounts take 47 mm angular contact bearings
[05:21:17] <Connor> Hmm.
[05:22:30] <PetefromTn_andro> The driven end mount is pretty cool and it has turned bearing mounts that clamp together for preload and the whole assembly gets bolted into a heavy iron mount that itself bolts to the side of the casting
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[05:23:10] <PetefromTn_andro> For a machine that is not exactly huge it is overbuilt like crazy
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[05:24:28] <Connor> http://www.vxb.com/page/bearings/PROD/Single-Row-Angular-Contact-Bearings/Kit8889?gclid=Cj0KEQiA7NyiBRCOhpuCm9Dq6b4BEiQA9D6qhYtLIX_MLDCNIwOHyRXm75ZxL7fau7_6OCdMrh6DLIcaAjo-8P8HAQ
[05:24:30] <PetefromTn_andro> Been trying to find pictures of the rear of the enclosure on the net so I can figure out how the damn thing goes back together and what pieces may be missing
[05:25:16] <Connor> http://www.vxb.com/page/bearings/PROD/ANGULAR_CONTACT/Kit20640?gclid=Cj0KEQiA7NyiBRCOhpuCm9Dq6b4BEiQA9D6qhXqj2iGA1c-oyIHFQ5SHyMFzCe1-ECLle6gdXzx-bZYaAmfT8P8HAQ
[05:25:20] <PetefromTn_andro> That's close but they are actually 20 mm ID by 14 mm wide
[05:25:27] <Connor> 25mm ID and 20mm ID
[05:25:39] <Connor> You already have the bearings ?
[05:26:22] <PetefromTn_andro> I found the original floating end plain sealed bearings for the z in the box of stuff I got with it
[05:26:25] <Connor> Trying to figure out if you need 25mm or 30mm Z Screw
[05:26:55] <Connor> that 2nd link is for 20x47x14
[05:26:56] <PetefromTn_andro> I'm going with the 32 mm z screw
[05:27:04] <Connor> from LMB ?
[05:27:15] <PetefromTn_andro> Not sure yet
[05:27:54] <Connor> http://www.ebay.com/itm/1-backlash-ballscrew-3205-Ball-Screw-L1000mm-1pc-Single-Ballnut-/251388398602
[05:28:18] <PetefromTn_andro> Can't wait to see this machine make chips
[05:28:20] <zeeshan|2> connor
[05:28:25] <zeeshan|2> when trying to use the pot
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[05:28:28] <zeeshan|2> do i need tachometer hooked up
[05:28:38] <zeeshan|2> ]cause its not doing anything by itself
[05:28:40] <Connor> I wonder if he has those in double nut
[05:28:44] <zeeshan|2> still outputting 170vdc
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[05:28:55] <Connor> zeeshan|2: I have NO idea.
[05:29:16] <Connor> andy and pcw probably be able to help you more.
[05:29:19] <Connor> or ssi
[05:29:25] <zeeshan|2> damn ssi
[05:29:26] <PetefromTn_andro> Yeah it's going to be around 1600 mm or so and got to be zero backlash double preloaded ballnuts
[05:29:31] <zeeshan|2> i thought hed be here
[05:29:32] <zeeshan|2> :{
[05:30:06] <Connor> 32mm ~ 1.25"
[05:30:08] <Connor> funny.
[05:30:14] <PetefromTn_andro> Yup
[05:30:14] <zeeshan|2> wiw
[05:30:19] <zeeshan|2> he mades 32mm ball screws?
[05:30:21] <zeeshan|2> nice!
[05:30:27] <zeeshan|2> *makes
[05:30:38] <Connor> Yup. He has 3205
[05:30:45] <Connor> 32mm by 5mm pictch
[05:30:52] <zeeshan|2> good to know for future
[05:30:58] <PetefromTn_andro> That would work
[05:31:13] <zeeshan|2> i wonder if he has 1.5
[05:31:19] <PetefromTn_andro> Wonder if they are any good
[05:31:21] <zeeshan|2> thats what the milll uses
[05:31:46] <Connor> Doesn't look like it..
[05:31:52] <zeeshan|2> ;/
[05:31:53] <Connor> I think 3205 is as big as he goes.
[05:32:00] <zeeshan|2> well it was 25 before
[05:32:04] <zeeshan|2> i guess things have changed
[05:32:14] <zeeshan|2> dude
[05:32:16] <zeeshan|2> look at that list
[05:32:20] <zeeshan|2> it goes all the way upto 80mm
[05:32:24] <zeeshan|2> he has 40mm
[05:32:26] <zeeshan|2> thatd work for me
[05:32:44] <Connor> Didn't look at the list.
[05:32:56] <Connor> that doesn't mean he carries them.
[05:33:06] <zeeshan|2> If you want to order other items,please inquire! We can cut any length that you want! Combined order is welcomed.
[05:33:12] <zeeshan|2> he has a lot more that we dont know about
[05:33:15] <zeeshan|2> like thsoe double ball nuts
[05:33:23] <zeeshan|2> youre the one who told me
[05:33:28] <zeeshan|2> they werent on his ebay account
[05:33:35] <Connor> yea.
[05:33:37] <Connor> I know.
[05:34:10] <zeeshan|2> so its pretty safe to say he can get em :P
[05:34:18] <zeeshan|2> for the right amount of $!
[05:35:25] <Connor> Probably.
[05:35:34] <PetefromTn_andro> I can't wait to get this machine moving it is gonna be freaking awesome.
[05:36:14] <Connor> PetefromTn_andro: Yup. Going to be another fun conversion.
[05:36:27] <PetefromTn_andro> Been watching YouTube cnc lathe vids like some kinda demented pron LOL
[05:37:40] <PetefromTn_andro> Art's been helping me work out the best motor options and I am starting to work on the wiring scheme
[05:38:01] <Connor> Cool
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[05:39:15] <PetefromTn_andro> It came with some relays and a low voltage transformer so I just need a contactor or two and some terminal blocks
[05:39:33] <Connor> I've got some DIN mounted terminal blocks.
[05:39:38] <Connor> to spare.
[05:39:40] <PetefromTn_andro> And I can start some preliminary wiring
[05:40:11] <PetefromTn_andro> Oh yeah sweet the cabinet has a couple din rail runs inside it
[05:41:22] <PetefromTn_andro> I wish I did not have to blow my spare change getting it here and buying the air conditioner unit now I gotta wait until I can afford the new electronics
[05:41:43] <Connor> yea. That kinda sucks
[05:41:59] <PetefromTn_andro> Yeah man but it's all good
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[05:42:21] <PetefromTn_andro> I am going to have a sweet cnc lathe here soon
[05:42:53] <Connor_iPad> Yup.
[05:43:15] <PetefromTn_andro> Need to figure out what kind of encoder is on that spindle
[05:44:00] <zeeshan|2> motor spins
[05:44:01] <zeeshan|2> !
[05:44:12] <zeeshan|2> at full speed
[05:44:12] <PetefromTn_andro> Maybe I can ask Santa Claus for new servos and drivers ;)
[05:44:13] <zeeshan|2> lol
[05:44:17] <Connor_iPad> At full speed?
[05:44:21] <zeeshan|2> haha yea
[05:44:28] <zeeshan|2> cause its outputting 172vdc
[05:44:38] <zeeshan|2> scared the shit out of me
[05:45:13] <PetefromTn_andro> I clamped the motors down to my workbench
[05:45:22] <zeeshan|2> thats a good idea
[05:45:26] <PetefromTn_andro> When testing them
[05:45:29] <zeeshan|2> this is definitely no stepper!
[05:45:32] <Connor_iPad> Hopefully santa can bring them.
[05:45:36] <zeeshan|2> it was aggressive
[05:45:46] <zeeshan|2> im gonna throw them in the vises
[05:45:46] <zeeshan|2> lol
[05:45:58] <PetefromTn_andro> They have a Shit load of torture even without a pulley and can spin
[05:46:18] <zeeshan|2> im so happy
[05:46:24] <zeeshan|2> i paid 240$
[05:46:29] <zeeshan|2> for 5 amc servo drives
[05:46:32] <zeeshan|2> and they all work
[05:46:36] <zeeshan|2> at least in test mode
[05:46:44] <PetefromTn_andro> spin and rip the damn wires out or worse
[05:46:49] <zeeshan|2> thank you ssi!
[05:48:20] <PetefromTn_andro> Would be sweet to get a pair of nema 34 ac servos and buy some of those amc drives for this lathe
[05:48:44] <PetefromTn_andro> Would probably save me a lot of money
[05:49:42] <PetefromTn_andro> Well gn8 heading to bed..
[05:49:52] <Connor_iPad> Good night
[05:50:13] <PetefromTn_andro> Lemme know when you want to get together man
[05:50:24] <Connor_iPad> Will do.
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[07:50:46] <Deejay> moin
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[12:47:06] <ssi> lol
[13:05:47] <asdfasd> anyone here having co2 laser? I want to know if possible to cut alupanel/dibond with 90 or 120W co2 laser
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[13:13:35] <Loetmichel> asdfasd: i had no luck with an 80W one
[13:13:46] <Loetmichel> until i painted the top layer black
[13:14:50] <Loetmichel> ... and then it melted the PE core badly so the cuts were about 2mm "hiollow"
[13:14:52] <Loetmichel> hollow
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[13:32:30] <Tom_itx> Connor how did you handle the relay on your spindle reverse?
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[13:54:50] <JT-Shop> what's up Tom_itx
[13:55:08] <Tom_itx> just waiting for spindle timing pulleys
[13:55:39] <Tom_itx> PCW the 'Back to home page' links at the bottom of your pages is broken...
[13:56:22] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, looking forward to one day having reverse on it
[13:56:58] <JT-Shop> nice
[13:58:26] <Tom_itx> i've been going thru alot of belts so i think it's time to go with timing pulleys / belts
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[14:17:36] <Tom_itx> i didn't realize
http://designatronics.com/ was part of sdp-si.com
[14:23:19] <asdfasd> thanks
[14:23:32] <asdfasd> Loetmichel: thanks
[14:26:39] <asdfasd> Loetmichel: it must be something strange with ally, only 1 video found on youtube, they blow nitrogen through the nossle instead of air
[14:40:41] <jdh> cutting Al with a small co2 laser seems unlikely?
[14:41:29] <cpresser> asdfasd: you need more power :)
[14:42:03] <jdh> like, 1000 more watts
[14:42:42] <cpresser> i tried aluminium foil with a 150W. it only makes dangerous reflections
[14:44:14] <jdh> I found with a fiber fed yag you need to be offset with shiny metal
[14:44:22] <jdh> or you buy a new fiber
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[14:47:12] <Tom_itx> playing with fire...
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[14:50:54] <gonzo_> you now have some pretty patterns burnt on the ceiling?
[14:51:50] <Deejay> :D
[14:52:13] <Tom_itx> gives new meaning to hologram
[14:52:26] <Deejay> nice idea. a cnc machine to burn patterns on the ceiling (instead of painting)
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[15:00:17] <gonzo_> It could have saved Michelangelo a hell of a lot of work
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[15:02:55] <jdh> then what would he have done all day
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[15:52:00] <zeeshan|2> mornin
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[16:06:11] <Jymmm> zeeshan|2: Ug
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[16:43:57] <Zewwy> holy crap ther eis an EMC channel!
[16:44:05] <Zewwy> Woooo!
[16:44:19] <Zewwy> or wait...
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[16:45:03] <Zewwy> linuxcnc..
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[16:48:30] <zeeshan|2> :D
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[16:48:42] <zeeshan|2> woohooo finally got the motor to speed up and slow down
[16:49:09] <zeeshan|2> i guess next step is building the control cabiet
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[16:49:30] <jdh> Zewwy: EMC will be happy to sell you a support contract.
[16:49:36] <Zewwy> have one
[16:49:42] <Zewwy> have an SR open too
[16:49:51] <jdh> we are more fun.
[16:49:58] <Deejay> :D
[16:50:05] <Zewwy> tried to renew teh SSL cert on UniSPhere
[16:50:13] <Zewwy> lets just say the article on their site was lacking
[16:50:54] <Zewwy> and I broke UniSphere pretty bad, their normal fix of chaning teh MGMT IP and back again, which should regenerate a new self signed cert failed.... and it got pushed up to "engineering"
[16:51:22] <Zewwy> Came back to me with 17 steps... which requires elevated root permissions... which for some reason I can access
[16:51:29] <Zewwy> can't
[16:51:42] * jdh hands Zewwy some CNC
[16:52:08] <Zewwy> I should have got into CNC stuff when I had the chance
[16:52:11] * cradek hands Zewwy freebsd with zfs
[16:52:24] * Zewwy has no freebsd experience :S
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[16:52:35] <jdh> but, then you wouldn't be locked in to a proprietary storage 'solution'
[16:52:58] <Zewwy> yeap... not a big fan of propriatary
[16:53:07] <Zewwy> Cisco...
[16:53:15] <cradek> ugh let's not talk about emc the company
[16:53:25] <cradek> have had plenty of that for one lifetime
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[16:53:40] <Zewwy> ahhh so whats this EMC stand for.. sorry
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[16:54:12] * Zewwy shuts about EMC Corp
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[17:13:09] <Tom_itx> Evolved Monkey Combat
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[17:13:26] <Tom_itx> ... it was on the list of acronyms
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[18:34:36] <Connor> Man. It's DEAD in here today.
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[18:36:16] * archivist knibbles a cheeeeeez roll
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[18:47:32] <roycroft> folks, i have some polished ss tubing that i need to support
[18:48:05] <roycroft> i found some nice ss support brackets, but the finish on them is not that great, and they would likely mar the finish on the tubing
[18:48:20] <roycroft> i need some kind of pads to put on the brackets so that does not happen
[18:48:36] <roycroft> this needs to handle temperatures up to 100c
[18:48:47] <_methods> asthetic?
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[18:48:53] <roycroft> i was thinking of silicone straps, but i'm having trouble finding such stuff
[18:48:53] <_methods> or function?
[18:49:01] <roycroft> for the pads?
[18:49:03] <roycroft> both
[18:49:22] <roycroft> the tubing will be disassembled and reassembled frequently
[18:49:27] <roycroft> i don't want to scratch it all up
[18:49:52] <_methods> PVDF (Polyvinylidene Fluoride)?
[18:49:52] <roycroft> i'm afraid rubber would start getting gooey at that temperature over time
[18:50:12] <_methods> delrin?
[18:50:33] <roycroft> is that stuff available as a "tape"?
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[18:50:46] <_methods> hmmm
[18:50:52] <_methods> you need it to be tape form?
[18:50:55] <roycroft> i basically need thing strips about 12mmx80mm
[18:51:03] <roycroft> i don't need adhesive backing
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[18:51:16] <roycroft> but if it came with an adhesive backing that's rated to 100c that would be fine
[18:51:17] <_methods> ah just thin bars
[18:51:19] <roycroft> yes
[18:51:30] <roycroft> i just want to line the brackets so there is not a metal on metal connection
[18:51:34] <_methods> yeah
[18:51:40] <roycroft> a little cushion
[18:51:50] <roycroft> 1mm thick would be fine
[18:52:05] <roycroft> a little thicker would be ok, but not too much, or the brackets would not fit
[18:52:27] <roycroft> if it were lower temperature i'd just get a bicycle inner tube slice it up, and glue it on
[18:53:04] <Connor> kapton tape ?
[18:53:08] <_methods> http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-pvdf-sheets/=ug8ud8
[18:54:15] <roycroft> kapton is probably not the right thing
[18:54:22] <_methods> the other high temp plastics get kinda expensive
[18:54:27] <roycroft> the pdvf product might work
[18:54:31] <_methods> pvdf is fairly cheap
[18:54:33] <roycroft> yes, and it's not really high temp
[18:54:36] <roycroft> it's more like medium temp
[18:54:39] <_methods> yeah
[18:54:46] <roycroft> 100c is really as hot as it will get
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[18:54:56] <roycroft> it will handle boiling liquid, but never steam
[18:55:02] <_methods> 200c is a good safety cover
[18:55:41] <_methods> i think polysulfone is kinda cheap too
[18:55:47] <_methods> and might be more durable
[18:55:56] <roycroft> pvdf is rated to 130c
[18:55:58] <roycroft> which is fine
[18:57:04] <_methods> thinnest mcmaster has of polysulfone is 3/8"
[18:57:21] <roycroft> polysulphone sheets are thick
[18:57:21] <roycroft> yeah
[18:57:24] <roycroft> that's too thick
[18:57:29] <roycroft> pfdf would be just fine though
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[19:07:03] <roycroft> thanks, _methods
[19:07:07] <_methods> np
[19:07:59] <_methods> let me know how it works out
[19:11:13] <roycroft> sure
[19:11:19] <roycroft> it will be a while
[19:11:45] <roycroft> i just ordered one of the brackets, as the vendor isn't very communicative, so i thought i'd just try one
[19:11:49] <roycroft> and it's coming from china on a slow boat
[19:11:55] <roycroft> i should have it by year's end :)
[19:11:58] <_methods> yeah
[19:12:03] <_methods> i love my random chinese gifts
[19:12:15] <_methods> i order stuff all the time and forget about it
[19:12:25] <roycroft> yup
[19:12:32] <roycroft> i usually have several projects going at once
[19:12:50] <roycroft> so i order what i need when i'm in design/procurement stage, then move on to the next project until stuff arrives
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[19:14:03] <roycroft> there's going to be a special car talk episode saturday - a tribute to ray magliozzi, hosted by tom
[19:14:57] <roycroft> or the other way around :)
[19:15:00] <roycroft> a tribute to tom, hosted by ray
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[19:15:14] <roycroft> it was click who died, not clack
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[19:37:04] <jdh> I really can't stand that show.
[19:37:20] <jdh> not to speak ill of anyone, but they are annoying
[19:37:26] <Connor> Which show ?
[19:37:31] <jdh> car talk
[19:37:34] <Connor> Oh
[19:37:38] <Connor> I never listened to it.
[19:37:46] <roycroft> i find it entertaining
[19:37:53] <jdh> you probably did for a few minutes. that's all it takes.
[19:37:57] <roycroft> i'm supposed to hate it, because i own vw buses
[19:38:06] <jdh> maybe if you are a yankee
[19:38:13] <roycroft> and tom and ray really maligned vs buses unfairly
[19:38:41] <roycroft> but i listen to it as entertainment, not as an informational show
[19:38:46] <jdh> well, they are butt ugly with crap drive trains
[19:38:52] <jdh> but, if that's what you like, go for it.
[19:39:41] <roycroft> yup
[19:39:47] <roycroft> different strokes for different folks
[19:40:19] <jdh> it's america damnit, you are free to collect stamped sheetmetal rustbuckets if that is your desire.
[19:40:41] <roycroft> you're talking about japanese cars now, right?
[19:41:20] <roycroft> although out here, even japanese cars are remakably rust-free
[19:41:26] <roycroft> remarkably
[19:41:44] <roycroft> on the rare occasion that it snows here, we apply sand to our streets
[19:42:07] <jdh> here too.
[19:42:11] <jdh> we have lots of sand.
[19:42:43] <roycroft> if youn live in minnesota your car starts rusting as you drive it off the dealer's lot
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[19:43:33] <jdh> if you live in minnesota, you have other problems.
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[20:01:02] <theorbtwo> Surely, japanese cars have too much plastic to do much rusting?
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[20:49:11] <SolarNRG> hi all
[20:49:19] <SolarNRG> Can I share some pics?
[20:49:54] <CaptHindsight> desalinator?
[20:50:18] <SolarNRG> yep
[20:50:19] <SolarNRG> http://imgur.com/HA9G3hJ,e5ulJ2X,s2lIfe3 ,
http://imgur.com/HA9G3hJ,e5ulJ2X,s2lIfe3#1 ,
http://imgur.com/HA9G3hJ,e5ulJ2X,s2lIfe3#2
[20:50:49] <SolarNRG> 1st image is the ec meter the pic didn't show it but the 10x indicator blinked on and off adn the camera snapped it on the off blink so that's acutally 1090 ppm
[20:50:55] <SolarNRG> the 2nd image is the distilled water
[20:51:52] <SolarNRG> I did a pre-boil with no lid for a good half an hour before locking the lid on, linking up the tube oh and I coiled a copper wire round the stainless pipe seemed to make the water leave the hot end about 5 degrees coooler
[20:52:05] <SolarNRG> just wish I could bend copper pipe to like 12mm inner diameter round
[20:52:18] <SolarNRG> that copper pipe is 8mm diam and the stainless pipe is about 12mm diam
[20:52:26] <SolarNRG> the 3rd image shows the entire setup from above
[20:52:34] <SolarNRG> what do u guys think?
[20:52:53] <SolarNRG> when its done I'll photo what's left from the tap water so u can see what u've been drinking
[20:53:19] <SolarNRG> The pre-boil seems to have even furhter lowered the ppm count
[20:53:25] <CaptHindsight> that's where the flavor comes from
[20:54:23] <SolarNRG> I dunno but I dread the idea that one day I'm gonna have no water in my tap, tomorrow I'm gonna try the thing again with seawater because I'm going to the beach with grandma tomorrow
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[20:55:04] <JT-Shop> a pre-boil will raise the ppm of solids in water
[20:55:29] <jdh> since you boil off the water (and other volatiles)
[20:55:48] <SolarNRG> jt ur right, but it will get rid of some of the volatiles before distillation, i.e. boil other substances with boiling points below 100 degrees in the water
[20:56:07] <SolarNRG> the water in the cooker sure that ppm is gonna be loads high
[20:56:47] <SolarNRG> but today I demonstrated a further 60% reduction in ppm count in the condensed water by doing a pre-boil
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[20:58:42] <JT-Shop> do you mean things like chlorine? at 4 ppm in city water
[20:58:59] <SolarNRG> Would I be better off just putting one big copper pipe jacket all the way around the stainless pipe?
[20:59:22] <jdh> what are you leaching out of the condensor? You should go for all glass.
[20:59:28] <JT-Shop> are you making moonshine?
[20:59:34] <Zewwy> lol..
[20:59:39] <_methods> hehe
[20:59:51] <SolarNRG> I have no idea what's in the water I'm just working on a way to turn seawater into drinkable water and I'm using some dirty tap water cos it's all I got to work on right now
[21:00:03] <JT-Shop> ah ok
[21:00:35] <SolarNRG> jt-shop, I COULD make a moonshine dispenser and I got the PID controller, maybe after the seawater u can tell me how to rig it up to the cooker so it clicks on and off and stays at 65 so I can condense off the methylated spirit
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[21:01:13] <SolarNRG> I spoke to a lawyer today, in this jurisdiction there's no issue moonshining for personal use
[21:01:43] <SolarNRG> bit concerned about ethanol vapour tho, heard its flammable
[21:01:56] <jdh> what jurisdiction?
[21:02:00] <SolarNRG> might need to hook up cooker wire out to the shed
[21:02:01] <jdh> certainly not .us
[21:02:05] <JT-Shop> can you say proof testing
[21:02:15] <SolarNRG> nah I'm not in that dictatorship run by an african certainly not
[21:02:34] <SolarNRG> yeah proof testing for xmas
[21:02:36] <SolarNRG> make some moonshine
[21:02:36] <JT-Shop> yea, it's only illegal here if you get caught
[21:02:44] <SolarNRG> hahahaha
[21:02:51] <CaptHindsight> oligarchy not dictatorship
[21:03:06] <SolarNRG> the finest government in the world money can buy :)
[21:03:42] <_methods> https://www.dropbox.com/s/v6r8jjjgb97igd8/distillersketch.jpg?dl=0
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[21:05:12] <SolarNRG> aww brilliant never thought of that but u get a much higher surface area to vol ratio that way
[21:05:28] <_methods> kinda ghetto
[21:05:30] <SolarNRG> that stainless pipe was a b***h to bend
[21:05:53] <SolarNRG> I got a cooking element and a pid controller and a k type thermocouple
[21:05:56] <SolarNRG> no idea how to wire them up yet tho
[21:05:59] <_methods> but it looks fairly effective in an end of the world way lol
[21:06:58] <_methods> run the distilled water through an activated charcoal filter and boom
[21:07:15] <CaptHindsight> yes, ethanol and methanol vapor make great fuels
[21:07:23] <SolarNRG> I got one today for 17 quid problem is its like got a hollow tube running through the middle and the water's supposed to go outwards
[21:07:36] <SolarNRG> can I put methanol in my car?
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[21:08:14] <SolarNRG> well ethanol I want to drink at xmas, methanol umm lighting the barbeque?
[21:08:28] <SolarNRG> I think the PID method would be great for separating meths from eths
[21:08:51] <SolarNRG> hang on I'll dig out the pid and take a photo maybe u can tell me what I got to wire up to where
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[21:17:25] <roycroft> i think dumping the first runnings is just as good a way
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[21:23:00] <JT-Shop> sop
[21:23:28] <SolarNRG> ok guys I got my PID just uploading the images now
[21:23:39] <SolarNRG> and I found the cooker wire and the kapton tape even the k-type thermocouple
[21:26:39] <SolarNRG> http://imgur.com/qOnEfH9,bVGub9b,DT8YzeE ,
http://imgur.com/qOnEfH9,bVGub9b,DT8YzeE#1 ,
http://imgur.com/qOnEfH9,bVGub9b,DT8YzeE#2 first image is the pid ktype cooker wire kapton tape all togehter, 2nd tape is a close up of the strange diagram on the side of the pid, 3rd image is the front of the pid
[21:26:58] <SolarNRG> any ideas how to hook what up to what?
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[21:32:01] <roycroft> the programming guide for your pid will tell you how to connect the wires and program it
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[21:32:38] <SolarNRG> I'll take that as a no then
[21:32:50] <roycroft> although if that picture of the connectors were clear enough to read i'd be able to figure it out
[21:32:52] <CaptHindsight> http://www.nuffieldfoundation.org/practical-chemistry/test-distinguish-between-ethanol-and-methanol
[21:33:03] <SolarNRG> roycroft, I got the PID off ebay, don't even come with a manual
[21:33:10] <roycroft> but you need to program the thing for your particular temperature probe, at the very least
[21:33:15] <roycroft> go back to ebay and look at the listing
[21:33:19] <roycroft> there will be a link to a manual
[21:33:36] <roycroft> it looks like 1 and 2 are power in for the pid
[21:33:45] <roycroft> 8 9 and 10 are for the temp probe
[21:33:57] <SolarNRG> all I can tell you is its a REX-C100FK02-M*AN range 0-400 degrees C output relay no 12a051006 supply 100to250v.ac 50/60hz rkc instrument inc made in japan
[21:34:03] <roycroft> 3 and 5 look like a nc out
[21:34:07] <roycroft> and 3 and 4 a no out
[21:34:17] <roycroft> 6 and 7 are probably an alarm out
[21:34:22] <SolarNRG> are k type thermocouples polarity fussy?
[21:34:29] <roycroft> but you need to know how to program it in order to use the outputs
[21:34:34] <roycroft> their use varies depending on the programming
[21:34:42] <roycroft> so go find the programming manual
[21:34:49] <roycroft> you can't just figure it out
[21:35:06] <roycroft> there will be like 20 modes, from 01 to 19
[21:35:17] <roycroft> you pick one and it behaves in a certain way
[21:35:40] <roycroft> it's not just non-intuitive without the programming guide, it's impossible to configure
[21:35:45] <roycroft> you won't and can't have enough information
[21:35:58] <SolarNRG> it looks like you can have it in neutral by having 4 disconnected or you can have 4 activate something that makes it get cooler like a fan or something
[21:36:21] <roycroft> if you want to be an idiot fine
[21:36:33] <SolarNRG> i think the first port of call would be to look for rkc instrument inc's website
[21:37:01] <SolarNRG> hey I was warned this PID can KILL if not used properly hence why I mothablled it for ages
[21:37:05] <roycroft> if there's not a link to the manual on the ebay listing, i would recommend that in future, you make sure there is before you buy one
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[21:37:22] <roycroft> i always download the manual and read it first so i know if the thing will work for me
[21:37:26] <SolarNRG> hurray they have an english page
[21:37:27] <roycroft> i don't know how to buy things otherwise
[21:38:01] <roycroft> if there's not an online manual, or the seller promises to send one with the product, i pass
[21:38:16] <SolarNRG> spec sheet downlooad or manual download? found the c100
[21:38:32] <roycroft> you need to have the access code to even begin programming it
[21:38:38] <roycroft> which is in the manual
[21:38:48] <roycroft> and you'll likely never guess
[21:38:57] <roycroft> there can be up to 9999 choices
[21:39:10] <roycroft> set->0001
[21:39:16] <roycroft> set->002
[21:39:21] <roycroft> set ->003
[21:39:26] <roycroft> ...
[21:39:30] <roycroft> set -> 9999
[21:39:36] <roycroft> which one of those puts it in programming mode?
[21:39:52] <SolarNRG> Here's the manual from the manufacturers web site:
http://www.rkcinst.com/english/pdf_manual/imnzc22e1.pdf
[21:40:01] <roycroft> great - have a good read
[21:40:02] <SolarNRG> in english :)
[21:40:04] <SolarNRG> or would u prefer japanesE?
[21:40:07] <ssi> zeeshan|2: you get those drives figured out?
[21:40:22] <roycroft> i would prefer that you read it and ask questions as they come to you instead of asking someone else to read it and explain it to you
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[21:47:28] <SolarNRG> ok just to clarify on 3. on that document it says with the C100 which I think this model is that I should be putting the + ok the Ktype into 8 and the -ve of the ktype into 9 despite the diagram on the side of the PID, do u agree?
[21:47:38] <SolarNRG> page 3 of
http://www.rkcinst.com/english/pdf_manual/imnzc22e1.pdf
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[21:50:22] <roycroft> it looks like 8 and 9 would be correct for a voltage-type probe, and a k probe is voltage type
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[21:51:05] <roycroft> if you connect the probe backwards it won't hurt anything
[21:51:10] <roycroft> it will just give you the wrong reading
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[21:52:22] <roycroft> i also agree that the sticker on the pid and the manual differ
[21:52:31] <roycroft> i have no idea which is correct
[21:52:36] <roycroft> connect the probe to 8 and 9
[21:52:45] <roycroft> if it gives you an incorrect reading swap the wires
[21:52:51] <roycroft> if you get an error try 9 and 10
[21:54:42] <SolarNRG> ok at this moment in time I have brwon (live) hooked up to 6, blue neutral up to 7, ktype +ve on 8 and ktype -ve on 9, if I plug it in and switch it on will it act as a basic temperature reader?
[21:54:58] <roycroft> it should
[21:55:04] <roycroft> if the probe connections are correct
[21:55:10] <roycroft> turn it on
[21:55:24] <roycroft> and if you get a reading that seems remotely reasonable, hold the probe in your hand
[21:55:25] <SolarNRG> ok testing
[21:55:31] <roycroft> if the temperature goes up you connected it correctly
[21:55:37] <roycroft> if it goes down you have the wires swapped
[21:57:01] <roycroft> if the pid does not default to using a k type probe you'll need to program it first to get a reading
[21:57:22] <SolarNRG> ok it booted up, the top leds went red 400 then wend red 0000 the green at the bottom said green 0 all the time and there was a red light saying alm that went on
[21:57:24] <SolarNRG> on the left
[21:58:22] <roycroft> ignore the alm light
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[21:58:56] <roycroft> move the wires from 8 and 9 to 9 and 10 and see if you get a reading
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[21:59:14] <roycroft> if not, check the programming
[21:59:26] <roycroft> sl1 needs to be set to 0000 for a k probe
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[22:00:36] <SolarNRG> so how do I set sl1?
[22:00:40] <SolarNRG> what keys do I press in what order?
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[22:00:53] <roycroft> the manual explains it
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[22:01:07] <roycroft> you need to go from parameter setting mode to pv/sv mode
[22:01:08] <SolarNRG> ahha set for 5 seconds
[22:01:18] <roycroft> go to section 7, page 6
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[22:03:59] <SolarNRG> ok I het set for 5 secs then went set set set set and I can't make the top red bar go to sl1
[22:04:01] <SolarNRG> what do?
[22:05:49] <roycroft> i don't have one of those pids
[22:05:55] <roycroft> it looks like you're well on your way to sorting it out
[22:06:00] <roycroft> i need to leave it to you to do that
[22:06:13] <roycroft> i have to get back to work and i don't have one in front of me, which makes it hard to figure out
[22:06:24] <roycroft> welcome to chinese electronics!
[22:06:29] <SolarNRG> ahem japanese
[22:06:38] <SolarNRG> one eats cat the other eats dolphin ;)
[22:06:40] <roycroft> only slightly better
[22:06:50] <SolarNRG> anyways thanks v much 4 ur help
[22:07:08] <roycroft> you'll get there eventually
[22:07:11] <roycroft> now that you have the manual
[22:16:11] <Deejay> gn8
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[22:16:27] <CaptHindsight> and they think that the west is a bit wacky for eating fermented cow juice
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[22:18:59] <roycroft> i've never had fermented cow juice, but yuk
[22:19:02] <SolarNRG> ahha cheese
[22:19:48] <roycroft> cheese is not really fermentation
[22:20:06] <roycroft> there is some fermentation in some cheese
[22:20:17] <roycroft> but it's mostly coagulation
[22:20:48] <CaptHindsight> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-xLUEMj6cwA Blessed are the cheesemakers
[22:21:54] <CaptHindsight> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fermented_milk_products
[22:22:04] <SolarNRG> god I can't get to sl1 while that alm2 is still red
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[22:26:26] <SolarNRG> some dude on this vid I'm watching claims the c100 can only handle 3amps which I suspect is insufficient for a cooking hob so he's using the PID to trigger a solid state relay that I don't have yet which I suspect can handle a lot more current, am I right?
[22:26:47] <CaptHindsight> probably
[22:27:27] <CaptHindsight> depends on the PID
[22:28:12] <CaptHindsight> SSR's are cheap and easy to find
[22:29:06] <SolarNRG> this is the vid I'm looking at:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2NpcMycHDvk
[22:29:14] <SolarNRG> same make and model as what I got
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[23:54:47] <SolarNRG> well I managed to get the PID to act as a basic thermometer, guess I gotta get that solid state relay next, oh btw I had a look at the bottom of the pressure cooker, full of white crystals smells gross
[23:55:50] <SolarNRG> NEway, I'm off 2 bed thanx 4 all ur help guys!
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