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[00:47:19] <XXCoder> wow q1uiet channel today
[00:47:29] <jdh> and then you ruined it.
[00:47:51] <XXCoder> ojh sorry for making idlequest noisy
[00:48:24] <tjtr33> wow, ordered 400W Yask motor & driver from Korea on 8th, its here now (Chicago)!.
[00:48:24] <tjtr33> and the guy threw in the pendant trainer too.
[00:51:30] <XXCoder> pendant trainer?
[00:51:37] <XXCoder> like training wheels on bicycle? ;)
[00:51:54] <tjtr33> like programmer/ manual mover
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[00:52:38] <tjtr33> you can set param, and can jog with it
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[00:55:18] <XXCoder> hmm ok
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[01:04:58] <CaptHindsight> tjtr33: linear servo?
[01:05:25] <zeeshan> what do you guys think of this circle cutting jig
[01:05:28] <zeeshan> to be used with a cnc mill
[01:05:32] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/cSmEPBz.png
[01:05:36] <zeeshan> i made it adjustable
[01:05:47] <zeeshan> so i can cut anywhere from 4" to 7" discs
[01:06:00] <zeeshan> and various thicknesses of sheet metal
[01:06:13] <jdh> you think that one clamp will hold for the last part?
[01:06:19] <zeeshan> the long clamp moves is shifted
[01:06:31] <zeeshan> what do you mean for the last part
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[01:06:42] <jdh> when the circle breaks free
[01:07:05] <CaptHindsight> won't the clamp be in the way of cutting circles in the center?
[01:07:21] <tjtr33> CaptHindsight, no, they're rotary, and they are positioning controls so i can set the vel curve and positions in the drive itself, just making it a slaved device with a plc trigger.
[01:07:22] <jdh> clamp it on during the last part of the cut
[01:07:25] <jdh> ?
[01:08:15] <zeeshan> yes i clamp it
[01:08:18] <zeeshan> at the last part of the cut
[01:08:32] <zeeshan> otherwise the middle clamp isnt used
[01:09:16] <CaptHindsight> tjtr33: I use Parker Servos and drives like that, did they DHL it?
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[01:09:17] <zeeshan> this is pretty much how i've been cutting it right now
[01:09:18] <zeeshan> without a jig
[01:09:24] <zeeshan> this jig just helps in the sense
[01:09:28] <tjtr33> jdh today i saw a water jet pump in rear of factory. asked where the machine was and they guy points to a drill press. the head was on the drill press above that little table, he sez "works fine for hand cutting small stuff" :)
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[01:09:36] <CaptHindsight> is the jig up? :)
[01:09:37] <zeeshan> i dont have to keep on aligning the spindle of the mill every time
[01:09:51] <jdh> ouch
[01:10:14] <tjtr33> CaptHindsight, FedEx from Hwasung 4459868
[01:11:11] <CaptHindsight> tjtr33: now you got me wanting to go back to Korea, thanks :)
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[01:12:06] <tjtr33> 445958 haha great clothes, nice machines, but i cant stand the food
[01:17:08] <tjtr33> archivist, i was just using dotty to look at your APT360 archive. very nice, thanks. has this been done on the linuxcnc code body? ;)
[01:18:28] <CaptHindsight> I guess 3TB should be a larhe enough drive to build a Linuxcnc test box with multiple distro'ss
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[01:22:21] <tjtr33> i got .easm files this morning, for a new design. now i gotta run windows to use some viewer. some xml format for solidworks
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[01:26:19] <CaptHindsight> heh, e-drawings file
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[01:30:15] <jdh> I have a vendor that has been submitting in-process design ideas via e-drawings. It's pretty nice for that.
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[02:10:37] <XXCoder> jdh: two steps, do half of circle, move clamps there in then do it on other side? would that work?
[02:11:15] <XXCoder> same design rig as you linked to, just has a hold in middle for yuou to move that center holder to other side
[02:11:28] <jdh> wasnt' me.
[02:11:33] <XXCoder> oh
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[03:44:41] <anarchos> any tips on creating a bootable USB stick to use as a live "cd"?
[03:45:09] <anarchos> mine boots but then can't find/mount the ramfs (iirc) fs
[03:45:20] <somenewguy> skunkworks_ so you are saying no, linuxcnc can't handle that?
[03:46:44] <somenewguy> I want to tilt my head on my mill a few degrees off axis, then rotate my cooridnate system so my moves in XY are perpendicular to my twisted Z axis, meaning a move from x0y0z0 to x1y0z0 in the rotated coordinates would requrie a move in both X and Z
[03:47:26] <somenewguy> if you are just doing a liveCD and not a real install, would a VM work just as well?
[03:47:55] <anarchos> i just wanted to try it out before commiting to a real install :P
[03:48:23] <somenewguy> ok, I doubt you could move a machine in a VM, but you could do a sim atleast
[03:48:47] <somenewguy> anarchos I thought I'd seen u around here before, do you not use linuxcnc already?
[03:49:14] <anarchos> negative, using mach3 atm
[03:49:21] <anarchos> i've been around for a week or so though
[03:49:23] <anarchos> :P
[03:49:23] <somenewguy> I would say makehte switch
[03:49:36] <somenewguy> I used mach3 for about 2-3 months
[03:49:38] <somenewguy> on a mill
[03:49:50] <somenewguy> then I tried linuxcnc and love it way more, machine 3x more reliable
[03:49:58] <anarchos> cool
[03:50:08] <somenewguy> I don't think the issue was mach3 as much as windows, but still it fixed a lot of odd problems
[03:50:38] <somenewguy> namely my parallel port would spaz out every now and then and send commands onits own, couldn't nail the issue down, it happended rarly but it happened
[03:50:53] <somenewguy> ngcgui is worth the price of admission
[03:50:57] <anarchos> i 'spose if i can't get the USB live mode to work I could just do a real install
[03:51:09] <somenewguy> how long u been using mach3?
[03:51:11] <anarchos> I assume it's possible to non destructivly partition a disk from the installer?
[03:51:22] <somenewguy> yes it should be
[03:51:25] <anarchos> i'm pretty sure redhat 6 had that ability :P
[03:51:29] <anarchos> like a week
[03:51:33] <anarchos> i'm very new to CNC :P
[03:51:36] <somenewguy> iirc you can only really install linux after windows, not hte other way around
[03:51:45] <somenewguy> I reccomend just ditch mach3 and start learning linuxcnc
[03:51:59] <somenewguy> they are not all that different, but I belive linuxcnc is just better
[03:52:16] <anarchos> yeah
[03:52:30] <somenewguy> between the reliability of linux vs windows, and the ease of customization and the better community (in my experience) linuxCNC has just worked out better for me
[03:52:39] <anarchos> i'm a linux/mac guy, but have been forcing myself into windows recently :P
[03:52:46] <anarchos> all the CAD/CAM stuff I use are windows
[03:52:47] <somenewguy> I'm sorry
[03:52:51] <somenewguy> you should see help
[03:52:54] <somenewguy> oh
[03:52:56] <somenewguy> well
[03:52:58] <somenewguy> yeah
[03:53:02] <somenewguy> if yo uhave good/real CAD software, I can't fault you
[03:53:13] <somenewguy> the only reason I have a windows partition is I used to have a solidworks license
[03:53:15] <anarchos> and then all the "hobbiest" type stuff seems to revolve around mach3, so i figured i'd do that
[03:53:35] <somenewguy> I haven't nuked it yet, in the bizzare hope I will get it back someday
[03:53:39] <somenewguy> what kind of stuff you make?
[03:53:47] <anarchos> i
[03:53:55] <anarchos> i attempt to make bike parts :P
[03:54:22] <somenewguy> oh cool, just got into mtb myself, its the reason im behin the comptuer today instead of in the shop, can't stand lol
[03:54:43] <anarchos> lol
[03:54:47] <anarchos> it'll do that to ya
[03:55:06] <somenewguy> but its about the same price as a gym membership, and about 100X more fun
[03:55:21] <somenewguy> although I must say trees can be real jerks
[03:55:33] <anarchos> i live in the greatest place on earth, so it's nearly impossible to not be into mtb'ing
[03:55:40] <somenewguy> utah?
[03:55:40] <anarchos> :P
[03:55:42] <anarchos> Whistler
[03:55:48] <somenewguy> whistler?
[03:55:54] <anarchos> Jah
[03:56:27] <somenewguy> so the german side of canada?
[03:56:38] <anarchos> i guess?
[03:56:41] <anarchos> we have a german side? :P
[03:57:32] <somenewguy> i assumed from the jah
[03:58:23] <anarchos> that was my attempt at being jamaican :P
[03:58:42] <somenewguy> basically the same thing
[03:59:39] <somenewguy> so what kind of mill you got?
[03:59:44] <anarchos> X2
[03:59:49] <somenewguy> its nice having a bigger newb than me on here lol
[04:00:17] <anarchos> i live in an apartment so not much room for anything bigger
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[04:01:42] <anarchos> omg it booted!
[04:01:43] <anarchos> cool
[04:01:46] <somenewguy> congrats
[04:01:58] <somenewguy> nice looking mill, I only have a Taig so we are in the same league
[04:02:13] <somenewguy> my excuse is my 140 yo work shop floor won't support the weight of real equiptment
[04:03:37] <somenewguy> I have a circuit to finish trying to design so I can try milling aPCB on the mill tomororw, but I'll be lurking so good luck and feel free to ask questions
[04:04:07] <somenewguy> also look at the examples for how to make NGCGUI subroutines, its so stupid easy I feel dumb for not notcing for like 4 months
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[04:08:32] <anarchos> awesome, thanks
[04:08:45] <anarchos> i just took the plunge and have repartitioned my disk in half
[04:09:04] <anarchos> we'll see how it works out. Ubuntu is surprisingly very nice, the installer was slick.
[04:09:11] <anarchos> i'm used to text mode debian installs :P
[04:09:51] <somenewguy> yeah, ubuntu nailed the installer in like 08, Iactually think the newest ones starting in like '12 or so are worse, they offer less fine control
[04:10:02] <somenewguy> ubuntu is turning more and more into a mac product sadly
[04:10:14] <XXCoder> yeah
[04:10:30] <somenewguy> i reccomend linuxmint for flks that are new to linux now, but thats just me
[04:10:37] <XXCoder> I left ubuntu when they added call home software on any and all searches you do on pc
[04:10:46] <XXCoder> including local files
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[04:11:07] <somenewguy> and giant hard to customize icons on thelft, and re-arranged the settings menues as well as moving the damn buttons from top right to top left
[04:11:19] <XXCoder> somenewguy: try xbuntu
[04:11:31] <somenewguy> not that one side is better than the other, but swapping a fundamental layout item like that for 0 good reason is not a good sign about a projects aim
[04:11:39] <somenewguy> I am on arch now
[04:12:05] <somenewguy> although it has turned out to be a touch too tricky to keep running 100%, so I have a debian partition just in case lol
[04:12:19] <somenewguy> but now that I have oracle VM up and running, I haven't booted into that in a while
[04:12:32] <somenewguy> I have a linuxcnc VM that has heeksCAD/CAM running in it, and life is good
[04:12:40] <somenewguy> slic3r is working in arch again, so I can do all the things!
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[04:18:38] <anarchos> hmm
[04:18:49] <anarchos> i don't even know how to tell if it's going to work
[04:19:03] <anarchos> can i see somehow if linuxcnc is talking to my controllers?
[04:21:31] <somenewguy> what is ur controller?
[04:21:49] <anarchos> well, keling 4042D
[04:21:59] <anarchos> well, it's the chinese version that keling rebrands
[04:22:04] <anarchos> so exactly the same
[04:23:13] <somenewguy> ok
[04:23:22] <somenewguy> so go to the menu and launch stepconf
[04:23:40] <somenewguy> this will basicly hold your hand thru setting up your configuration files
[04:23:46] <somenewguy> namely the .hal and .ini files
[04:23:55] <anarchos> ah, cool
[04:24:14] <somenewguy> you can pick from teh drop down list ur controller, and it will pre-select a bunch of settings that SHOULD be good enough to get yo ustarted
[04:24:20] <somenewguy> your estop works right ?
[04:24:44] <anarchos> ya
[04:24:51] <anarchos> hehe
[04:25:00] <somenewguy> cool, cause near the end of the stepconf wizard it will let you try and jog ur axis
[04:25:25] <somenewguy> so you will know quick if its working
[04:25:58] <somenewguy> basically it will take the default configureaton packed w/ linuxCNC, and copy it to ur desktop w/ your changes added to it, and from there on that little folder contains everything that makes your machine your machine
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[04:28:06] <somenewguy> welcome back
[04:28:55] <somenewguy> forgot to mention, you shoudl do a latency test prior to doing stepconf
[04:29:52] <somenewguy> if u aren't already aware, that will just check how good ur computer is for running a cnc, checks how quickkly it can actually control its outputs. run the latency test, it suggests abusing ur computer, browse the web, watch some youtube, etc etc to geta worst case value
[04:30:03] <somenewguy> that value will llet you set ur max settings in stepconf
[04:34:08] <anarchos> yeah i did that
[04:34:16] <anarchos> got a max jitter of 14k
[04:34:24] <anarchos> is that good/bad? :P
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[04:35:54] <somenewguy> i can never remember
[04:36:00] <somenewguy> a quick goolg will tell you
[04:36:17] <somenewguy> do you have a graphics card or integrated?
[04:36:40] <anarchos> If your "Max Jitter" number is less than about 15-20 microseconds (15000-20000 nanoseconds), the computer should give very nice results with software stepping
[04:36:45] <anarchos> woohoo
[04:36:55] <somenewguy> nice, then ur all set
[04:37:18] <anarchos> i believe it's has integrated graphics
[04:37:27] <somenewguy> normally that makes for really bad jitter
[04:37:30] <somenewguy> but since ur fine, no worries
[04:38:42] <anarchos> i didn't really do much, tho, they say to try and max it out, but since it has no network connector all i could do was load a bunch of stuff at once and move windows around
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[04:39:56] <somenewguy> ur probably fine, but let it run for as long as you canbe bothered to just to be sure
[04:40:46] <somenewguy> my pc had an issue like every 18 minutes or so there would be a big jump in jitter, slapping a trash video card in fixed it
[04:41:41] <anarchos> i see
[04:41:46] <anarchos> maybe i'll let it run all night
[04:41:56] <anarchos> i'm not really in the mood to jump into this fully tonight :P
[04:41:59] <somenewguy> thats not a bad plan
[04:42:25] <somenewguy> once you have that number, try out the stepconf, its self explanatory
[04:42:31] <somenewguy> just be careful when you do a test jog of the axis
[04:42:51] <somenewguy> sometimes it defaults to a higher value than you may expect and try and jog ur axis 12 inches back and forth lol
[04:43:24] <anarchos> heh
[04:43:28] <anarchos> thanks for the help
[04:43:58] <somenewguy> np, hopefully you'll enjoy it as a big plus over mach3
[04:45:08] <anarchos> it does look much more streamlined, and not to amateurish looking, from just a visual standpoint :P
[04:47:29] <somenewguy> when i started I had trouble telling where to click w/ mach3 lol, was very akward and 80s themed
[04:47:42] <somenewguy> i prefere the simplicity of linxucnc
[04:51:02] <anarchos> yeah, it's surprising with the popularity of it that they haven't hired a UX designer :P
[04:51:14] <XXCoder> or they hired a hack
[04:52:16] <anarchos> i'm guessing the owner is the programmer, and started off making it as a hobby
[04:52:19] <anarchos> then it got popular
[04:52:29] <anarchos> and he wasn't a pro, but kept giving 'er
[04:52:36] <XXCoder> ubuntu was designed to be supported and designed by community
[04:52:39] <XXCoder> hence word ubuntu
[04:52:47] <XXCoder> but now its ubuntu no more.
[04:52:55] <anarchos> oh no?
[04:53:16] <anarchos> i always thought ubuntu was a "commercial" debian, so to speak :P
[04:53:22] <XXCoder> nah
[04:53:38] <XXCoder> they did get lots donations and such. that is why it had such a great start
[04:54:44] <anarchos> i see
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[05:52:09] <ssi> I wish there were decent sources for relatively inexpensive servo motors :/
[05:52:33] <ssi> I would try the keling servos if they came with encoders mounted
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[05:53:50] <Jymmm> ssi: tread mill
[05:54:09] <ssi> I don't want anything nearly that large
[05:54:22] <ssi> honestly I'd love to see nema17 servos but they're not terribly common
[05:54:31] <Jymmm> Thats not what you asked for
[05:54:52] <ssi> also "treadmill" isn't a source
[05:54:53] <ssi> heh
[05:55:10] <Jymmm> Every gym in the country has at least 5
[05:55:25] <ssi> they get cranky when you cannibalize them for parts
[05:55:46] <Jymmm> You dont know that for sure
[05:55:57] <Jymmm> dumb jocks, remember
[05:56:53] <ssi> true
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[05:57:37] <ssi> I guess I should order one or two of the keling nema23 servos and see how they do
[05:58:14] <ssi> eh not today
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[06:17:34] <CaptHindsight> http://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/products-page/ac-servo-motors/ac-brushless-servo-motor-and-driver his AC servos come with encoders
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[06:38:04] <archivist> there is something a bit over the top with servo pricing
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[07:00:14] <Jymmm> !!! FREE SLURPY DAY !!!
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[07:18:36] <Deejay> moin
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[07:19:28] <Jymmm> you're fired!
[07:21:13] <Deejay> oh no!
[07:21:20] <Jymmm> lol
[07:21:21] <Deejay> am i too late?
[07:21:26] <Deejay> hi Jymmm ;-)
[07:21:29] <Jymmm> 20m
[07:21:32] <Deejay> hehe
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[09:23:23] <mattrobbo10> mach3?
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[09:26:36] <chris33> Im planning to build my own cnc router to cut 6mm plywood and plexi glass cutting size will be 400mm x 400mm and want too know if i can get away with 16mm gantry rails
[09:28:06] <chris33> Im planning to use support linear rail not the rail you clamp each end
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[09:33:49] <Jymmm> Doesn't seem unreasonable for 400mm
[09:34:40] <Jymmm> In your 400mm travel, be sure to add extra length for clamping, etc.
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[14:34:39] <ssi> aaaargh
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[14:35:02] <jdh> yep.
[14:35:24] <ssi> I ordered the tube I did specifically cause it ships from US warehouse
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[14:35:38] <ssi> and said guaranteed delivery by wednesday
[14:35:43] <ssi> got tracking number.... damn china post
[14:35:44] <ssi> D:
[14:35:57] <jdh> guaranteed or what?
[14:36:00] <jdh> or you get it the next day?
[14:36:05] <ssi> no clue
[14:36:11] <ssi> I don't think china post is that quick tho
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[14:56:01] <markager> Speaks anyone german ?
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[15:00:05] <jdh> markager: try again a little later. There are several germans here usually.
[15:00:14] <markager> ok
[15:00:50] <ssi> yeah we're overrun with them
[15:00:51] <ssi> :D
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[15:36:19] <Markus_> Iám searching for Mr. Magic33de which is his Nickname on youtube Have some Questions about new Zero Point specificly mirrored Zero Point
[15:39:32] <jdh> I have zero clue what you are talking about.
[15:41:05] <kfoltman> magic33de = IchGuckLive?
[15:41:23] <h_maximilian> Frag mich
[15:42:10] * kfoltman takes a Big Fragging Gun
[15:42:11] <h_maximilian> ich bin zwar nicht magic33de, aber vielleicht kann ich helfen ?
[15:43:57] <Connor> jdh: You get your cabinet mounted on the base yet ?
[15:44:48] <kfoltman> Loetmichel: I got to f2000
[15:45:16] <Markus_> IchGuckLive könnte stimmen.
[15:45:18] <Markus_> Ich frage mich, ob mit Linuxcnc eine Nullpunktverschiebung möglich ist, die ein Achse (z.B. bei einer 3-Achsen Maschine die x oder y Achse) spiegeln kann.
[15:45:53] <h_maximilian> Hallo Marcus
[15:46:11] <Markus_> Hallo Maximilian
[15:46:16] <h_maximilian> nein, eine Spiegeln in X oder Y ist nicht möglich
[15:46:28] <h_maximilian> ich habe mal sowas angefangen mit 2.3
[15:46:44] <h_maximilian> aber das war dann nur in der X Y Ebene
[15:47:03] <Markus_> was meinst du mit 2.3
[15:47:17] <h_maximilian> kannst Du es nicht in der Programmierung des CNC Codes abaendern ?
[15:47:26] <h_maximilian> 2.3 ist eine alte Version
[15:47:45] <h_maximilian> 2.6 ist gerade aktuell, bzw. wird stabilisiert
[15:47:50] <h_maximilian> 2.5.4 ist stabil
[15:48:00] <h_maximilian> 2.3 ist schon ziemlich alt
[15:48:09] <Markus_> 2.5.4 hab ich aufgespielt
[15:48:52] <Loetmichel> kfoltman: nice
[15:48:57] <Loetmichel> and it works better?
[15:49:05] <h_maximilian> also mit 2.5.4 geht es nicht
[15:49:47] <h_maximilian> ein Drehen ist soweit ich weiss möglich, aber kein Spiegel an X oder Y
[15:50:00] <kfoltman> Loetmichel: yes and no
[15:50:37] <kfoltman> Loetmichel: out of 3 attempts, two (HIPS and ABS) went extremely well, another (letters in 1mm ABS) broke the endmill
[15:50:44] <h_maximilian> war dies Deine Frage ?
[15:51:15] <kfoltman> Loetmichel:
http://i.imgur.com/6VqlXs3.jpg this is a successful one
[15:51:37] <kfoltman> the top cover for a box for my PSU
[15:51:48] <markager> Hallo ich habe ein Problem mit einem tb6560, ich finde nicht die passenden Einstellungen für die pins
[15:52:36] <h_maximilian> tb6560 ? Was ist das für ein Gerät ?
[15:53:07] <Markus_> auch nicht wie in dem Video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZscmAYtPGvE gezeigt, dass man in die ini (bei Minute 5.30 im Video) etwas macht mit negativ?
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[15:53:43] <Loetmichel> kfoltman: nice
[15:53:59] <Loetmichel> o would have made the box by bending a flatted out part
[15:54:08] <JesusAlos> hi
[15:54:11] <Loetmichel> looks better and is more sturdy i think
[15:54:11] <kfoltman> Loetmichel: no more melting anyway, which is great
[15:54:25] <Loetmichel> like the aluminium ones i do
[15:54:31] <kfoltman> Loetmichel: this is 1mm ABS, so very flexible, alas
[15:54:44] <kfoltman> will need to use two or three layers and glue them together or something
[15:54:44] <Loetmichel> that will work with abs also
[15:54:51] <Loetmichel> or with 3mm pvc foam
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[15:54:55] <Loetmichel> or with styrol
[15:55:02] <Loetmichel> (when heated at the bends)
[15:55:08] <JesusAlos> jthornton: sorry, yesterday I must go out like strom
[15:55:11] <kfoltman> Loetmichel: 1mm abs is basically very floppy
[15:55:38] <h_maximilian> Das Video zeigt um 5:30 wie man einen Nullpunkt setzt, dies hat aber mit Spiegeln nichts zu tun-
[15:55:45] <markager> das ist ein controller
http://www.amazon.de/SainSmart-TB6560-Schrittmotor-Steuerung-Stepper/dp/B0090XB8MC/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1405094128&sr=8-1&keywords=tb6560
[15:55:50] <h_maximilian> das ist eine Nullpunktverschiebung
[15:55:54] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14160
[15:56:02] <Loetmichel> kfoltman: like these for example
[15:56:15] <Loetmichel> especially then the material is very floppy in itseld
[15:56:27] <Loetmichel> the bends stiffen it up a great deal
[15:57:34] <h_maximilian> @markager: Steht was im Handbuch, was die einzelnen Pins ansteuern ?
[15:57:54] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=13015 <- made by hand, there you see the flattened surface
[15:57:54] <Markus_> soweit habe ich das verstanden, wenn nun dabei eben die z.b. X-Achse (i.d.Fall grüner Pfeil) auf die Gegenseite zeigte, könnte ich das Bohrbild des Werkstückes spiegeln, oder?
[15:57:57] <Markus_>
[15:57:59] <kfoltman> Loetmichel: well, I should probably shut up until I have a proper, *even* bed - I can't even engrave anything because the thickness is all over the place
[15:58:03] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=13018 <- and the result
[15:58:34] <kfoltman> Loetmichel: sure, I'm taking hints :)
[15:58:56] <kfoltman> Loetmichel: what's the perforation for?
[15:59:38] <Loetmichel> perforation?
[15:59:39] <kfoltman> Loetmichel: I need a 45 degree V-bit for this, or can I get away with 30 or 60?
[15:59:43] <kfoltman> the holes on the sides
[15:59:51] <Loetmichel> thats the screws
[15:59:58] <Loetmichel> i tend to overdo it a bit ;-)
[16:00:00] <kfoltman> stiffening?
[16:00:18] <kfoltman> as in, piece of extra support screwed to the sides?
[16:00:18] <Markus_> bzw. wenn das Programm von diesem neuen Nullpunkt abgearbeitet werden würde hätte ich eine Spiegelung
[16:00:34] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14595
[16:00:37] <Loetmichel> you see?
[16:01:06] <kfoltman> what's that corrugated stuff? alu extrusion?
[16:01:34] <Loetmichel> 4mm aluminium sheet material, just milled down to have more surface
[16:01:36] <h_maximilian> @Markus_: Wäre mir neu, dass dies ginge. Hast Du es versucht ? Die Doku zu G10 spricht eindeutig davon, dass für ein Koordinatensystem der Ursprung verschoben wird, nicht mehr
[16:01:47] <Loetmichel> because that specific PSU has extended tempaerature range
[16:02:08] <kfoltman> Loetmichel: ok, so it's a milled heatsink basically?
[16:02:22] <kfoltman> milled out of flat bar
[16:03:04] <markager> Nein leider nicht ich habe mir auch schon mal die Einstellungen runtergeladen wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?TB6560h_maximilian aber beim starten kommt eine Fehlermeldung
[16:03:06] <Markus_> Bisher nicht, deshalb wollte ich mich hier erstmal umhören, ob ich hier auf dem flaschen Weg bin
[16:03:26] <Loetmichel> kfoltman: if you call 4mm sheet aluminium "flat bar": right
[16:03:36] <h_maximilian> @Markus_: Ich denke, es geht nicht so.
[16:03:41] <kfoltman> Loetmichel: :)
[16:04:11] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=13528 <- here you can see how the enclosures work
[16:04:44] <Loetmichel> the top (u-profile) has the holes, the bottom has the threads for the M3 screws
[16:04:58] <Markus_> das ist sehr bedauerlich
[16:05:00] <Loetmichel> and the mass of screws is because they have to be RF sealed
[16:05:20] <h_maximilian> @markager: fange mal mit halrun ohne den Rest an und puzzle Dich dann vorwärts
[16:05:22] <Loetmichel> so i can have no "slot" longer than 20mm, regardless how thin
[16:05:33] <h_maximilian> dann siehst Du, was geht und was nicht
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[16:09:05] <Loetmichel> kfoltman: the screw thing can go to some extent... our thin client with 24" tft has 143 screws on the back ;-)
[16:09:27] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14412
[16:09:29] <Loetmichel> :-)
[16:09:30] <kfoltman> Loetmichel: great - again, I'll have more questions when my machine is reliable :)
[16:09:42] <jdh> what about springy copper stuff between instead of so many screws?
[16:10:02] <kfoltman> Loetmichel: it looks great
[16:10:19] <Loetmichel> js; too expensive
[16:10:20] <Loetmichel> :-)
[16:11:17] <kfoltman> springy copper stuff?
[16:11:28] <Loetmichel> also the number of screws serve as a security measire because it takes time to open the box to put a bug in it... time the usual agent dont has ;-)
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[16:11:50] <kfoltman> Loetmichel: but from what I see, 20x20cm work area is going to be a major limitation and I should probably aim at enlarging it
[16:12:15] <Loetmichel> kfoltman: he meant these:
http://hollandshielding.com/134-Fingerstreifen_Fingerstreifen__Reihe-de.htm
[16:12:46] <Loetmichel> kfoltman: dint i said that from the start?
[16:12:58] <kfoltman> Loetmichel: probably :D
[16:13:03] <markager> was meinst du mit "halrun ohne den Rest an und puzzle Dich dann vorwärts
[16:13:07] <markager> ?
[16:13:14] <kfoltman> Loetmichel: you have 6040, much better :)
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[16:16:32] <Loetmichel> kfoltman: i build an even bigger one for my ex-boss:
http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=4935
[16:16:44] <Loetmichel> 1500mm*1020mm*160mm travel ;-)
[16:17:00] <Loetmichel> and even that had proven way to small on the first job ;-)
[16:17:33] <kfoltman> ouch :)
[16:17:39] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=4588
[16:17:47] <Loetmichel> had to do the 12mm carbon plates in 2 runs
[16:17:59] <kfoltman> monstrous!
[16:19:12] <Loetmichel> each of the 4 carbon plates was 2400 eur
[16:19:42] <kfoltman> cost of material or finished product? or price for the job?
[16:19:43] <Loetmichel> ... and then the customer didn pay because some holes were 0,04mm out of alingment
[16:19:45] <Loetmichel> :-(
[16:19:50] <Loetmichel> material
[16:19:58] <kfoltman> !!!
[16:20:09] <kfoltman> 0.04mm is about the resolution of 5mm ballscrews?
[16:20:36] <Loetmichel> ahem: basllscews have no resolutions
[16:20:39] <Loetmichel> steppers have
[16:20:48] <kfoltman> you know what I mean
[16:20:54] <kfoltman> the combined steps/rotation + mm/rotation
[16:21:18] <Loetmichel> no, the machine could position to 1/200mm
[16:21:40] <kfoltman> also taking into account microstepping, spindle deflection and accuracy of screw threads if we have to be pedantic ;)
[16:21:59] <Loetmichel> i thin i was a bit to fast milling or the carbon had some impuritys that deflected the mill bit
[16:22:36] <Loetmichel> i said "could psoition to" not "has an accuracy of"
[16:22:53] <kfoltman> accuracy is hard
[16:23:01] <Loetmichel> i.e: it had 200steps/mm
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[16:23:23] <kfoltman> any tiny amount of deflection in any part of mechanism and accuracy is gone
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[16:23:54] <Loetmichel> richt
[16:23:56] <Loetmichel> right
[16:24:55] <kfoltman> anyway, so how did you deal with it? by not taking job demanding that knd of accuracy, or adjusting settings?
[16:25:13] <kfoltman> *jobs
[16:25:15] <kfoltman> damn, my typing
[16:26:20] <Loetmichel> you could reach an accuracy of 0,02mm in 3mm FR4 (glass fibre plastic) if you had time... i also made plates for selling out of big sheets... whith less than 1mm accuracy.. where i was in a hurry. (F4200 and a 2mm mill bit in 3mm FR4 seems to be a bit much ;-)
[16:26:30] <Loetmichel> i didnt deal with it
[16:26:32] <kfoltman> 4200!
[16:27:10] <Loetmichel> the insurance dealt with it
[16:27:28] <Loetmichel> was easier to get the company to pay by court
[16:27:36] <Loetmichel> "let the insurance handle it"
[16:27:47] <markager> Linuxcnc startet nun aber die Schrittmotoren drehen sich nicht
[16:28:00] <kfoltman> Loetmichel: no more complaints from further customers?
[16:28:14] <Loetmichel> the requirements at order were 0,1mm accuracy
[16:28:20] <kfoltman> dealing with tricky customers is always an interesting subject :)
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[16:28:39] <kfoltman> ok, so they complained about inaccuracy within acceptable limits? bastards
[16:28:48] <Loetmichel> ...but the engineers who wanted to fit that plates to an aluminium plate didnt knew tat ;-)
[16:29:22] <kfoltman> ah, then it's purely their problem :D
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[16:29:44] <Loetmichel> classic miscomunicatoon because of intermediate "non-productive staff" at the customer
[16:29:49] <Loetmichel> yeah
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[16:41:02] <kfoltman> what's the least bad depth gauge to use in a home CNC machine?
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[16:41:49] <kfoltman> preferably something I can mount in the spindle to measure the landscape of the table
[16:42:19] <cradek> you can't measure the flatness of a table in that way
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[16:43:03] <kfoltman> cradek: what's the better way then?
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[16:43:21] <cradek> it seriously depends on your goals
[16:43:27] <kfoltman> I think the main use would be to shim the table mounts
[16:44:09] <cradek> I didn't read back so maybe I shouldn't comment
[16:44:34] <Jymmm> touch probe and a routine?
[16:44:56] <kfoltman> Jymmm: the electric one?
[16:44:57] <cradek> sure you can measure with a touch probe, but you can't tell from your measurements whether the table is flat
[16:45:26] <Jymmm> You can sample heights and plot the results
[16:45:33] <kfoltman> cradek: if I have the table mounted to the base with screws, I at least need to know if I need to put some extra shims on each of the screws
[16:45:56] <cradek> Jymmm: yes but that tells you very little about the shape of the table
[16:46:04] <cradek> kfoltman: what is "table" and "base"? is this a fixture you're mounting?
[16:46:36] <kfoltman> cradek: table = t-slot, base = the piece of MDF or whatever that is connected to the carriages and the ballnut
[16:47:05] <Jymmm> cradek: They sampling can be whatever resolution they want it to be; be it every 2mm or every 2 inches.
[16:47:07] <kfoltman> I'm assuming the t-slot table is relatively straight, but it may be mounted incorrectly
[16:47:08] <jdh> you should fix that.
[16:47:12] <jdh> <urk
[16:47:46] <cradek> Jymmm: no. imagine a knee mill with the X ways worn in the center, so the table moves in an arc (every bridgeport does this). now imagine flycutting the table. you will match the arc of the table to the arc of the movement - it will now read utterly flat in your test.
[16:48:38] <Jymmm> cradek: Ah, well I was assuming the motion was "straight", not arced.
[16:48:57] <cradek> Jymmm: sure, but you can't tell with your test, right?
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[16:49:09] <IchGuckLive> hi all
[16:49:25] <Jymmm> cradek: if the motion wasn't straight, no.
[16:50:05] <cradek> kfoltman: if you're talking about a MDF machine, maybe none of this matters... you'll be clamping a flexible part to a flexible fixture on a flexible machine...
[16:50:24] <kfoltman> cradek: mostly ply, but the table is MDF
[16:50:39] <kfoltman> should probably invest in at least some aluminium, if not steel
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[16:52:03] <cradek> kfoltman: check out mic6 cast tooling plate. it will be a fairly nice flat starting point
[16:52:24] <kfoltman> cradek: I don't need *super* flat, the current table is like 3mm curved
[16:52:39] <kfoltman> completely unacceptable of course
[16:52:45] <cradek> depends on your goals
[16:52:57] <kfoltman> well, PCBs/engraving is out of the question
[16:53:26] <cradek> I'd think PCBs are out of the question on any wood machine
[16:53:34] <IchGuckLive> Loetmichel: ist dieser markager der typ der sich ständig bei mir beschwert zu wenig deutsch
[16:53:45] <kfoltman> cradek: it almost copes
[16:53:54] <Loetmichel> hmm?
[16:54:02] <Loetmichel> no idea, IchGuckLive
[16:54:06] <cradek> you only want to cut .1mm deep or less
[16:54:08] <Loetmichel> i dont talk german here
[16:54:17] <IchGuckLive> the logs say he is only communicating in german
[16:54:31] <kfoltman> cradek: I think .2 - .3 mm would still be passable
[16:54:36] <kfoltman> cradek: but not 3mm obviously
[16:54:43] <IchGuckLive> and i got daily mails here from someone trying to get a german info
[16:54:50] <Markus_> Hello @Ich Guck Live, can i ask some questions
[16:54:56] <cradek> bbl
[16:55:14] <Loetmichel> IchGuckLive: this guy?
[16:55:31] <IchGuckLive> no
[16:55:51] <Loetmichel> hmm, still no idea ;-)
[16:56:11] <IchGuckLive> NP
[16:57:55] <Deejay> ah, the krauts take over the channel today ;)
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[17:14:06] <kfoltman> meh, fuck it all, I bought a 60cm screw for the X axis
[17:15:28] <IchGuckLive> kfoltman: leadscrews are fine
[17:15:41] <IchGuckLive> in ypour hands it may be tricky
[17:16:14] <kfoltman> if I upgrade the rails, I get about 450mm stroke
[17:17:37] <kfoltman> should be well worth it
[17:23:53] <IchGuckLive> oh you are starting to go big ;-)
[17:24:24] <IchGuckLive> i ended up at 15meters X 7,5m Y and 5m Z
[17:24:48] <IchGuckLive> to get concret molds
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[17:26:19] * kfoltman -> home
[17:26:24] <IchGuckLive> kfoltman: what pitch
[17:26:28] <kfoltman> IchGuckLive: 5mm
[17:26:37] <IchGuckLive> ballscrew
[17:27:06] <IchGuckLive> trapezional 20x5
[17:27:06] <kfoltman> yes
[17:27:11] <kfoltman> ballscrew
[17:27:14] <IchGuckLive> nice shot
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[17:27:28] <kfoltman> anyway, I'm out
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[17:40:59] <ktchk> sliptonic_away: hello
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[17:42:10] <IchGuckLive> hi ktchk
[17:42:19] <IchGuckLive> did the typhoon hit you
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[17:42:35] <ktchk> sliptonic_away: want to chat about heekscad
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[17:42:55] <IchGuckLive> you can ask me about it
[17:43:09] <ktchk> IchGuckLive: no, ohly japan
[17:43:30] <IchGuckLive> ok here igot some vids for you on heeks
http://www.youtube.com/user/magic33de/videos
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[17:43:55] <ktchk> sliptonic_away: I install the linux heekscad 1.0 the screen will go black
[17:43:55] <IchGuckLive> i make also vids on request if needed
[17:44:15] <IchGuckLive> you need to use the 0.18
[17:44:47] <IchGuckLive> you can also use a ppa from neomill
[17:45:05] <IchGuckLive> https://launchpad.net/~neomilium/+archive/ubuntu/heekscnc-devel
[17:45:20] <IchGuckLive> here we daily build the new depencies
[17:45:32] <ktchk> sliptonic_away: 0.18 for 10.04 is ok, but 12.04 is ready for linuxcnc so have to move
[17:45:56] <IchGuckLive> there is a build for it
[17:46:21] <IchGuckLive> use the 0.20
[17:46:27] <ktchk> IchGuckLive: the heekscad 1go black.0 at neomilium is the same screen
[17:46:30] <IchGuckLive> then you get the awallin benefit
[17:46:46] <IchGuckLive> did you install the depencies
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[17:46:56] <IchGuckLive> opencamlib
[17:47:00] <ktchk> IchGuckLive: all
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[17:47:58] <IchGuckLive> what is the error on terminal heekscad
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[17:48:16] <ktchk> IchGuckLive: every thing is working, only when move the curser over the screen it goes black
[17:48:53] <IchGuckLive> oh thats the python interface
[17:49:03] <IchGuckLive> what python version is on your system
[17:49:14] <ktchk> IchGuckLive: 2.6
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[17:49:17] <IchGuckLive> 2.6 is requirerd
[17:49:58] <ktchk> IchGuckLive: did you test the win heekscad 1.0?
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[17:50:48] <IchGuckLive> no i got no microsoft mashie
[17:51:05] <IchGuckLive> im only on the linux devels
[17:51:29] <ktchk> IchGuckLive: is the 1.0 working in your machine?
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[17:51:40] <IchGuckLive> yes
[17:52:02] <ktchk> IchGuckLive: which ubuntu?
[17:52:02] <IchGuckLive> 10.04
[17:52:21] <ktchk> IchGuckLive: what about 12.04
[17:52:31] <IchGuckLive> i do not have that system
[17:52:55] <ktchk> IchGuckLive: linuxcnc is working with 12.04 now
[17:53:26] <IchGuckLive> i got 200 mashines on 10.04 and 2month worklive left so im not changing at all
[17:53:38] <IchGuckLive> sorry
[17:53:51] <IchGuckLive> connect DAn at the heeks irc chat
[17:54:22] <ktchk> IchGuckLive: I will test it with 10.04 first
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[17:54:44] <IchGuckLive> why dont you take the 0.18 packet
[17:54:56] <IchGuckLive> it is better then the 1.0
[17:55:30] <IchGuckLive> witch seams to be very buggy as nowone of the windevels jump in prog
[17:55:48] <IchGuckLive> it is onlly desined on win use
[17:56:18] <ktchk> IchGuckLive: the 0.18 is working in my machine, but trying to move on to 12.04
[17:56:56] <IchGuckLive> ok up to you i can not help you then
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[17:57:34] <ktchk> IchGuckLive: ok see you later
[17:57:44] <ktchk> sliptonic_away: bye
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[18:15:59] <IchGuckLive> im off BYE
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[18:20:37] <JesusAlos> by
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[18:23:24] <anarchos2> so I ran the latency test all night with three copies of glxgears going, and a bunch of apps open, got 22k
[18:26:08] <archivist> usable but not the best
[18:26:46] <ssi> well I have enough 20mm extrusion to choke a horse now
[18:26:50] <ssi> and/or build a laser table
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[18:30:04] <Smidge204__> It's been my experience that horses choke rather easily
[18:31:23] <ssi> well good, perhaps i overdid it :)
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[20:06:55] <andypugh> I just realised that you can use a mux as a sequence generator.
[20:07:01] <andypugh> http://www.linuxcnc.org/index.php/english/forum/27-driver-boards/27595-robot-using-already-existing-servo-amplifiers?start=10#48664
[20:07:36] <andypugh> Each entry contains a valua and the address to the next value :-)
[20:08:32] <JT-Shop> andypugh, is having too much fun
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[20:27:57] <jfigie> andypugh: That brings back memories. Another engineer showed me that technique using TTL logic and UVPROMs about 35 years ago.
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[20:31:08] <andypugh> I forgot to mention that he needs to set steplen and stepspace very long indeed (2.5 base threads for the three steppers he has)
[20:33:11] <kfoltman> guys, 6mm mild steel, is that a good enough material for an X axis base of a home CNC machine?
[20:33:45] <kfoltman> or overkill?
[20:34:07] <cradek> is a 13-inch stick long enough?
[20:34:20] <kfoltman> long enough for what? :P
[20:35:09] <kfoltman> Or, maybe let me rephrase
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[20:36:07] <kfoltman> How do I calculate a maximum amount of deflection of a sheet of steel of size X x Y from a milling spindle of maximum power P?
[20:36:21] <kfoltman> X x Y x thickness
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[20:37:11] <Deejay> gn8
[20:37:34] <kfoltman> there's probably a torsion load(?) from the spindle, + another load from the Z axis motor
[20:38:20] <jfigie> kfoltman: I would look at an existing machine similar in size to what you want and start from there.
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[20:41:16] <andypugh> There are standard equations, or you could do some FE analysis.
[20:41:50] <jfigie> for forces due to machining:
http://www.kennametal.com/en/resources/calculators/end-milling-calculators/force-torque-and-power.html
[20:42:36] <andypugh> http://www.engineersedge.com/beam_calc_menu.shtml
[20:43:05] <andypugh> 6mm sounds OK for a machine 150mm square, but too small for one 15m square.
[20:43:22] <kfoltman> let's say 500x300mm
[20:44:00] <kfoltman> but, I should probably pick up some mechanical engineering book and understand the principles
[20:44:05] <andypugh> HSM of titanium. or wood-routing?
[20:44:27] <kfoltman> let's say milling aluminium (worst case scenario)
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[20:48:14] <kfoltman> is Young's modulus what I'm interested in?
[20:48:45] <kfoltman> (as a property of the specific material)
[20:49:56] <andypugh> Yes.
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[20:50:23] <andypugh> But 215GPa of steel is only exceeded by exotica like boron, carbide and diamond.
[20:51:50] <kfoltman> I'm definitely NOT thinking of making my X axis support from solid carbide ;)
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[21:29:30] <cncformywife> hi
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[21:48:41] <cncformywife> hellllllooooo someone here????
[21:48:55] <cncformywife> what is 4 S1 thread?
[21:49:33] <jdh> ?
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[21:53:34] <cncformywife> jdh
http://i00.i.aliimg.com/img/pb/134/023/408/408023134_713.jpg
[21:53:54] <cncformywife> jdh
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/31FopQOdEcL.jpg
[21:54:20] <cncformywife> you see on the top there is 4 threads...
[21:54:22] <jdh> look for the other pic
[21:54:42] <jdh> it will have dimensions on it.
[21:55:07] <cncformywife> what is the size of the screw that i need?
[21:55:31] <jdh> it is on a different picture
[21:55:32] <cncformywife> SC12UU - this is ths rail block
[21:55:50] <cncformywife> what do you mean?
[21:56:06] <cncformywife> you can google in google images SC12UU
[21:56:23] <kfoltman> I think the 12mm ones (the ones I use) are 5mm diameter
[21:56:50] <cncformywife> but in all the images i see 4 S1 in the thread
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[21:56:58] <jdh> if you google images for SC12UU, you will see the other picture taht has the dimensions
[21:57:11] <kfoltman> S1 = M5x12
[21:57:21] <jdh> http://i795.photobucket.com/albums/yy240/silvers-123/sc12UUspecsWMSMALL.jpg
[21:57:54] <kfoltman> cncformywife: it's in the table
[21:58:42] <cncformywife> hooo i seeee
[21:59:06] <cncformywife> i feel sooo stupid now..
[21:59:21] <jdh> think chinese.
[21:59:45] <cncformywife> what do you mean..
[22:00:12] <jdh> they can have one pic for all parts that way.
[22:00:20] <jdh> they are excellent at getting cost out of things.
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[22:02:29] <cncformywife> i cant find a design for cnc the you can build without a cnc...
[22:02:36] <jdh> there are lots
[22:02:44] <cncformywife> or a table saw..
[22:02:53] <cncformywife> give me one..
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[22:07:25] <kfoltman> cncformywife: can you not get pre-cut timber from some local shop?
[22:07:41] <kfoltman> many places will cut to size if you ask them
[22:08:34] <kfoltman> how do I calculate an axis force? motor torque divided by ballscrew radius?
[22:08:53] <kfoltman> (maximum of course)
[22:09:14] <cncformywife> i need to do the same calculations...
[22:09:17] <cncformywife> :(
[22:09:29] <cncformywife> i hav 100Ncm motors.
[22:09:32] <kfoltman> cncformywife: have you looked at solsylva plans?
[22:11:41] <cncformywife> yes.. and without table saw you cant do it...
[22:11:49] <kfoltman> ??? the 13x13 can be done with a cutoff saw
[22:11:52] <kfoltman> or access to one
[22:11:57] <kfoltman> or a nearby DIY shop with one
[22:12:11] <jfigie> something like: torque of motor * ball screw pitch radius * (2*pi / pitch )
[22:12:23] <andypugh> kfoltman: screw radius (unexpectedly) isn’t important. It falls out of the equations.
[22:12:52] <ssi> ugh windows is so terrible
[22:14:14] <kfoltman> well, but then the result is torque, not force?
[22:14:19] <kfoltman> or, rather
[22:14:20] <kfoltman> moment?
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[22:14:53] <kfoltman> momentum, rather
[22:14:58] <kfoltman> errrr
[22:15:03] <andypugh> I think force is 2 x pi / pitch. Imagine pushing with 1N force round a 1m circle and having the work move 5mm. That’s your lever ratio :-)
[22:15:21] <andypugh> Nm / m = N
[22:15:58] <andypugh> Torque * 2 * pi / pitch (pitch in the same units as your torque used)
[22:17:52] <kfoltman> well, intuitively it makes sense that the screw radius doesn't matter
[22:19:10] <jfigie> yes andypugh has the correct equation
[22:19:37] <andypugh> That’s a relief, I used to be a Mech Eng lecturer :-)
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[22:20:12] <jfigie> also mechanical efficiency of maybe .9 or so
[22:20:16] <kfoltman> fortunately in my case the screw radius and pitch are the same number, but the 2 * pi factor was indeed missing :S
[22:22:48] <cncformywife> what is the best place to bay 50 M5X25 machine scrwes?
[22:23:06] <andypugh> Which country?
[22:23:19] <kfoltman> and if I'm using this
http://www.roymech.co.uk/Useful_Tables/Mechanics/Plates.html correctly, then deflection of a 42x57cm 4mm thick steel plate under maximum torque of my Z motor (3Nm), at theoretical 100% efficiency, would be 8mm (worst-case), is that plausible?
[22:23:38] <kfoltman> cncformywife: you don't have DIY stores in your place?
[22:23:48] <kfoltman> cncformywife: try ebay
[22:24:28] <cncformywife> i have
[22:24:33] <cncformywife> lowes..
[22:24:41] <andypugh> I buy metric from Screwfix (or B&Q) and other stuff from eBay.
[22:24:52] <kfoltman> andypugh: UK?
[22:24:59] <cncformywife> but they want 0.92$ for 2 screws...
[22:25:00] <andypugh> Indeed
[22:25:02] <cncformywife> NY
[22:25:13] <kfoltman> cncformywife: are you sure it's not for 2 boxes? :D
[22:25:17] <jfigie> ACE hardware?
[22:25:25] <andypugh> I was moderately impressed by the selection of metric fasteners at ACE in San Francisco
[22:25:48] <cncformywife> http://www.lowes.com/pd_138455-37672-880739_1z0yjfg+1z0yjfi+1z0yk3h__?productId=3012863&Ntt=machine+screws&Ns=p_product_price|0&pl=1¤tURL=%3FNs%3Dp_product_price%7C0%26Ntt%3Dmachine%2Bscrews%26page%3D1&facetInfo=5mm|25.0
[22:26:10] <cncformywife> Package Quantity 2.0
[22:26:31] <jfigie> the ones by me have a very large selection of metric Including SHCS
[22:26:37] <jfigie> ACE that is
[22:26:45] <andypugh> Buy 2 from Lowes to get you started, and buy 200 from eBay
[22:27:13] <cncformywife> i need 50.. (48)
[22:27:29] <andypugh> That Lowes one looks like a very nasty quality of screw too.
[22:27:59] <andypugh> You need 50 now. Unless you plan in dying soon, you will need 200 eventually :-)
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[22:28:30] <jfigie> Also a good selection form MSC
[22:28:41] <jfigie> *from
[22:29:18] <cncformywife> http://www.ebay.com/itm/50-pcs-M5-25-Screw-Machine-screw-Cross-Head-Screw-screws-screws-/270872008253?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f113ad63d
[22:29:41] <andypugh> It’s a great way to justify buying stuff, thinking about how many years you will have it available to use for ;-)
[22:29:41] <cncformywife> US $3.12 free shipping!!
[22:30:02] <andypugh> No! Get nice ones
[22:30:28] <cncformywife> what do you mean by "nice ones"
[22:31:24] <andypugh> High tensile, preferably socket head.
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[22:31:57] <andypugh> Or maybe stainless if you prefer.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/111162114665
[22:32:30] <cncformywife> http://www.ebay.com/itm/100pcs-Stainless-Steel-Socket-Cap-Allen-Key-Bolts-Hex-Screws-Head-HE-/360774329186?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&var=&hash=item53ffd36362
[22:33:10] <cncformywife> i like the black ones in 3$..
[22:33:31] <cncformywife> i need it for the rails blocks..
[22:34:17] <andypugh> Closer to home:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/350897682548
[22:34:30] <andypugh> (more expensive)
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[22:34:52] <kfoltman> andypugh: why socket head?
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[22:35:18] <cncformywife> they made from aluminum, and i need it to go thro wood plate..
[22:35:49] <jfigie> http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PMAKA=327-5103&PMPXNO=22537219&PARTPG=INLMK32
[22:36:14] <jfigie> socket head screws are typically made from the strongest materials
[22:36:30] <jfigie> Class 12.9
[22:36:34] <cncformywife> so hex head - is to small.. the crossed head is with bigger surface area..
[22:37:18] <cncformywife> i will need a washer with the SOCKET HEAD CAP SCREWS
[22:37:36] <cncformywife> $19.42...
[22:37:44] <andypugh> Use these then, grade 12.9 button head:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/301231598555
[22:38:29] <andypugh> Actually, they are cheap too.
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[22:39:16] <kfoltman> cncformywife: be prepared to spend a fortune on fasteners/hardware :(
[22:39:19] <kfoltman> I know I did
[22:40:21] <cncformywife> why??
[22:40:29] <kfoltman> you need lots of them
[22:41:01] <cncformywife> why do you think like that?
[22:41:09] <kfoltman> every axis times (every linear rail + every carriage + ballnut mount to ballnut + platform to ballnut mount)
[22:41:27] <kfoltman> count the holes on your rails
[22:41:44] <kfoltman> are you scared already? ;)
[22:41:53] <jfigie> http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PMAKA=325-3469&PMPXNO=5808434&PARTPG=INLMK32
[22:42:17] <jfigie> cheaper import screws but still grade 12.9
[22:42:28] <cncformywife> 48
[22:43:35] <kfoltman> cncformywife: there's a hole every 100mm of the axis, and two rails, so 4 x (L / 100mm) per axis, for rails alone... then, 16 for the carriages, per axis
[22:43:52] <kfoltman> not all of them need are supposed to be 25mm though
[22:43:57] <kfoltman> *-need
[22:44:10] <kfoltman> but still, plenty of screws
[22:44:14] <cncformywife> but the cnc going to made from wood... the head with the hex socked is with small surface area
[22:44:56] <kfoltman> do those screws go in wood or in the top side of the steel rail?
[22:44:57] <cncformywife> only the blocks use metric.
[22:44:59] <kfoltman> ah
[22:45:05] <kfoltman> are you sure?
[22:45:17] <cncformywife> all the other i'm use imperial.
[22:45:48] <cncformywife> imperial are easy and cheap
[22:47:07] <cncformywife> you prefer the metric system? kfoltman
[22:47:21] <kfoltman> cncformywife: I'm in Europe, we don't do imperial ;)
[22:48:28] <cncformywife> but the imperial it's easy..
[22:48:45] <andypugh> kfoltman: The ones I listed were high tensile, and large head. You probably want heavy washers on wood anyway.
[22:49:47] <cncformywife> i dont need "heavy washers"
[22:50:10] <cncformywife> it is only 50 X 50 cnc
[22:50:21] <andypugh> Imperial is not easy. It isn’t even easy to tell which screw is bigger than the next one. Is 15/32 bigger than 3/8?
[22:50:26] <cncformywife> the base is 70 X 70
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[22:51:54] <cncformywife> 15/32 is bigger..
[22:52:05] <andypugh> Is 5mm smaller than 6mm?
[22:52:12] <cncformywife> 16/32 = half..
[22:52:24] <andypugh> Yeah, I can do the maths, but I have to do maths.
[22:52:35] <andypugh> And you don’t even say how big small screws are.
[22:53:11] <cncformywife> but it is not the common system here.
[22:53:14] <andypugh> What’s the clearance size for 3x32 UNF?
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[22:54:38] <cncformywife> this is the common system
[22:54:39] <cncformywife> http://www.bosunsupplies.com/images/var/ScrewThreads.gif
[22:55:01] <cncformywife> loot the the "screw size"
[22:55:02] <andypugh> I can even tell you what the tapping size is for those M5 x 0.8 screws you are looking for. It’s 4.2mm, because you just have to subtract the pitch from the diameter to get it.
[22:55:52] <andypugh> it isn’t that I can’t find the sizes, I just refuse to accept that it is a rational or well thought-out system.
[22:55:58] <cncformywife> but all the american use imperial..
[22:56:35] <andypugh> And if you want a thread table, here is the one I have on my web site, with nearly every screw size ever used:
http://www.bodgesoc.org/thread_dia_pitch.html
[22:56:56] <cncformywife> what screw is bigger #0 or #3
[22:57:05] <andypugh> Yeah, Imperial, invented by the British, and even we abandoned the system :-)
[22:58:11] <cncformywife> ok..
[22:58:45] <cncformywife> but the washer and nuts are work with the imperial system..
[22:59:29] <cncformywife> washer #10 will seat perfect on #10 screw.. with #10 nut.
[22:59:44] <andypugh> BA was a rational system. 0BA is 6mm x 1mm pitch. 1BA is 10% smaller. 2BA is 10% smaller than that :-)
[23:00:10] <andypugh> Yeah, you will find that an M5 nut fits an M5 thread too.
[23:01:05] <cncformywife> but 5mm washer need to be a bit bigger to fit on the screw...
[23:01:25] <cncformywife> so it's 5 point something..
[23:03:31] <cncformywife> so.. the metric is not perfect.
[23:04:09] <cncformywife> mm is to small for working..
[23:05:17] <cncformywife> the cm is closer to the inch in size.. so it easy
[23:05:47] <cncformywife> kfoltman: andypugh ^^
[23:06:19] <andypugh> You get used to it. In practice you typically use just as many digits in either system. 38mm is 2 fewer keystrokes than 1 1/2”.
[23:08:59] <cncformywife> 38 screw..
[23:09:38] <cncformywife> http://www.lowes.com/pd_6005-99899-6005_0__?productId=3604680&Ntt=studs&pl=1¤tURL=%3FNtt%3Dstuds&facetInfo=
[23:09:41] <cncformywife> look
[23:09:49] <andypugh> I haven’t used anything bigger than M25, but M36 is a size.
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[23:09:58] <cncformywife> 2 by 4 by 96 in.
[23:10:52] <cncformywife> but the real size is 1 1/2 by 3 1/2 by 96..
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[23:10:58] <andypugh> Yeah, we call that 2 x 4 x 2438mm
[23:11:23] <andypugh> (No, really, wood tends to be imperial section and metric length)
[23:11:48] <cncformywife> O_o
[23:12:13] <cncformywife> i need to grab a cup of tea.
[23:12:56] <andypugh> Retail stores sell 38 x 63 x 2400, but it’s 2x4 to my generation.
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[23:13:42] <andypugh> (actually, maybe the generation older than mine, I was metric from the first day at school)
[23:15:09] <andypugh> The USA would be metric now were it not for the fact that the 1m platinum standard bar donated to you by Napoleon was stolen by a British privateer during the war of 1812.
[23:17:44] <cncformywife> hehe..
[23:18:10] <cncformywife> i'm looking for cad of 5M 25mm
[23:18:47] <kfoltman> o.O
[23:19:54] <cncformywife> or dimensions..
[23:20:06] <cncformywife> cad = 3d model..
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[23:28:17] <anarchos> anyone know off the top of their head how much a 7i43 costs?
[23:34:37] <andypugh> $80
[23:35:26] <andypugh> Not off the top of my head
http://store.mesanet.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=83_85&product_id=67
[23:35:53] <anarchos> yeah sorry i didn't even realize they had a store!
[23:35:56] <anarchos> thanks
[23:36:14] <andypugh> cncformywife: I tend to leave fasteners out of my CAD.
[23:36:33] <andypugh> (unless I am worried about head clearance)
[23:37:09] <andypugh> What CAD system are you using? Mine has them built in as standard parts.
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[23:38:20] <andypugh> anarchos: The $80 was a number I knew (frightenigngly) It was the URL I didn’t know. Unlike www.xkcd.com/123 which is a URL I _do_ know.
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