#linuxcnc | Logs for 2014-07-10

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[00:39:46] <XXCoder> heys
[00:45:29] <anarchos> in my system bios, i have the option to have the parallel port as AT, PS/2, EPP, ECP no DMA, ECP DMA1 or ECP DMA3
[00:45:36] <anarchos> what's gonna be the best option?
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[00:52:24] <jdh> anarchos: for what use?
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[00:53:16] <anarchos> to interfact with my breakoutboard/drivers
[00:57:03] <jdh> for plain old steppers, it probably doesn't make much difference. My p-port stepper system is EPP
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[01:01:41] <somenewguy> does linuxcnc handle rotated axis well if they are not just rotated in the XY plane?
[01:02:41] <somenewguy> if I tilt my head on my 3axis mill, and rotate around the Y axis so that the coridnates are referenced fof the Z axis, will a move in the new XY plane cause all three axis to move properly?
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[02:45:40] <skunkworks_> somenewguy: you would have to do some sort of kins
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[06:43:49] <Deejay> moin
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[07:33:43] <Loetmichel> mornin'
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[10:06:31] <JesusAlos> hi
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[10:13:40] <JesusAlos> we are thinking to create our selve basec CAM software and foun documentation for work with algorithm about routing
[10:14:30] <JesusAlos> I want to say if somebody can sayme any information for routing algorithms
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[10:44:43] <jthornton> routing pockets?
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[11:07:18] <JesusAlos> no. routing contour
[11:07:27] <JesusAlos> letthers
[11:07:47] <jthornton> have you seen the G code generators on the Wiki?
[11:07:48] <JesusAlos> letters contour
[11:08:19] <JesusAlos> yes. Me like dxf2gcode, but the algotithm don't do that I need
[11:08:44] <jthornton> no, the one that does letters
[11:09:14] <jthornton> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Simple_LinuxCNC_G-Code_Generators
[11:09:22] <JesusAlos> I need something like this data:image/jpeg;base64,/9j/4AAQSkZJRgABAQAAAQABAAD/2wCEAAkGBxQSEhQSExQUFBQXGRcYFRYWFRcVGBUXFBYYFxgZFxcYHCggGBwnHBYVITEhJSkrLi4uFx8zODMsNygtLiwBCgoKDg0OFxAQGS0kHSQwLCwsNSwsLCwuLywsLC83LSwrNCwsLC8uKzAsLCwsLCw3Ny8sLDUsLywsLCsyLiwsLP/AABEIAMkA+wMBIgACEQEDEQH/xAAbAAABBQEBAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAgMEBQcGAf/EAEkQAAEDAQUDBAsQAgICAwEAAAECAxEABBIhMVEFQZETFSJhMjRCU3FygZKTstIGFCMzUmJjgqGxs9
[11:09:24] <JesusAlos> HT4ePwc6KDwZSjJMLUQ//EABgBAQEBAQEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAABAgME/8QALBEBAQACAAUDAwMEAwAAAAAAAAECEQMSExRhIUFiMVGRImNxBDNCoQUVMv/aAAwDAQACEQMRAD8AkbbXai+/Dm1UQ4u6GUKU2U313bhyu3bmHhx3CBbDbBdDb22FELAUrklgKQTiQCMwN0Dy1qbpx8tQALReAlu7eJJxvXb+AAy7GBvxk16cf6vUn6Yzyss2m5tQJb5Be1VK6XKX0LEdjdCYHjSahJf25rtDg5+VbbB1HD96IOo4fvXWf8hqa6eP4Tk8sWS/tvXaHBz8qcD+2dbfwc/Ktlg6jh+9EHUcP3p/2H7eP4OTyx0P7Z1t/Bz8qcD22Nbdwc/Kteg6jh+9EH
[11:09:25] <JesusAlos> UcP3p3/wC3icnlkqXtr627g5+VOJe2trbeDlatB1HD96IOo4fvU7/9vE6fllge2rrbeDlOJe2prbODlafjIy4dROvVSgKnffCHT8sxDu09bZwcpxLu0tbX/wCytLw6+H70YdfD96d98InT8s4S7tHW1/8AspxLu0NbV/vWh4dfD96MOvh+9TvfhDp+XAB2362r/enEu27W0/713eHXw/ejDr4fvU7z4Q6XlxCXLdraf96WHLbraP8Aeu0w6+H70YdfD96nd/CHS8uPS5bNbR/vTiXLXq//AL11mHXw/ejDr4fvTu/hE6Xly6XLVq//ALUsOWnV7/aulw6+H70YdfD96ndfGHS8ueSu0au/7U4Fv6u/7Ve4dfD96MOvh+9TufjDpeapkre1c/2pxK
[11:09:27] <JesusAlos> 3tXPtq1w6+H70YdfD96nc/GHR81XBbuq/tp1t1YxVfIG4XiThoKmYdfD96MOvh+9S8fc1ywnC8qRNttAScFFXQi8hYGayvBJmYLYnKR4a5zaziy6Su8FEJmcD2Cc67izvXwTEQpafMUUz9lcX7pu2XPqeomuO9ukmncO5+Wo0ul4ABPJRJUSJmDgBMkzd3RAVjMAynRifDTYVOSgeFZaVzm0XhI97qMYyFDKd0Zm6dcweqXlWp4GORmTneEJHRxOuasvk9dTYOv3UQdaBpxxXJrJF0gKjEHKYP/dQ0Wd4hEJVBPSPKq7GTCh0xjF3dvOkGxunX7KVKvlGg996hEkFZMd0tSt43E1Dsb7qiQ40ECMCFhUnDCI8PCpRJ1NeQdaBVFJg60QdaAOY8vq
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[11:10:01] <JesusAlos> jQmSGg03MGc0t3vtpW1EclySkJWv4VIUZW4UIM3lYkwB/3VtRWtMWOWaZUlAB5M3UgHpLOQ/x01ZHUuglHJEJN04rGIAMYtdYrrq8rPJHfuOJ93I2p9Ld2/wAkLxCU4uGSogDJrUinnbMSkiGsQR2S94/x11FezTkO44n3cPsRp4hxbqEoUp1xQCzCtyAo3EERCRGJwM78Og2bZJMqx1OMGDghMgEjeTGJgYgEVcUVZjI5TKzDk9hVftqxrcR8EUpcBwvYpUk4LSsb0lJOGoGUAiwoq2bmmbNzTmVsKGAIwPRKitKxGIkXCJB3yZid9W+ylqgggQIMibsmbyU3gCQIB6r0bqn0Uk06ZZ3L6mLeglpwASSlQA1MGudtZuBalLaSi+pV5SlpgLcJEg
[11:10:03] <JesusAlos> ozxAic8K6milm0xzuO9IGxLQHGr6ZgrcIkQcXFESDlU+iirPLE3r1FFFFFFFFFAUUUUETavxZ8ZH4iayz3S9sufU9RNantX4s+Mj8RNZZ7pe2XPqeomoNC2X2wfEV66auyKpNl9sHxFeumrykCeTGg4f3U8aLg0HClUVQm4NBw/ug4UcmNBwpVFAnkxoOH91PGi4NBwpVFAm4NBw/ug4UcmNBwpVFAnkxoOH91PGi4NBwpVFAm4NBw/ugo5MaDhSqKBPJjQcP7qaLg0HD+6mlUUCbg0HD+6CjkxoOH90FKooE8mNBwouDQcP7qaVRQJuDQcKOTGg4f3QcKVRQJ5MaDhRcGg4f3U8aVRQJuDQcKOTGg4f3QcKVRQJ5MaDhRcGg4f3U8aVRQJuDQcK
[11:10:04] <JesusAlos> 9SkDLCvaKCJtX4s+Mj8RNZZ7pe2XPqeomtT2r8WfGR+Imss90vbLn1PUTUHfWR4NvFSpi6oSEqVjeB7kGrPnVvVXo3PZrHV5nwmk0Gyc6t6q9G57NHOreqvRuezWN0UGyc6t6q9G57NHOreqvRuezWN0UGyc6t6q9G57NHOreqvRuezWN0UGyc6t6q9G57NHOreqvRuezWN0UGyc6t6q9G57NHOreqvRuezWN0UGyc6t6q9G57NHOreqvRuezWN0UGyc6t6q9G57NHOreqvRuezWN0UGyc6t6q9G57NHOreqvRuezWN0UGyc6t6q9G57NHOreqvRuezWN0UGyc6t6q9G57NHOreqvRuezWN0UGyc6t6q9G57NHOreqvRuezWN0UGyc6t6q9G57NH
[11:10:06] <JesusAlos> OreqvRuezWN0UGyc6t6q9G57NHOreqvRuezWN0UGyc6t6q9G57NHOreqvRuezWN0UGt7Q2i2pBAKplHcLGS0k4lNZt7oTetCz4vqJqtFUO1fjVeT1RQf/Z
[11:10:07] <JesusAlos> sorry
[11:10:09] <JesusAlos> http://www.softpedia.com/screenshots/DevFoam_11.png
[11:11:03] <jthornton> the text engraving does center line not profile of letters
[11:13:41] <JesusAlos> So we thinking in create our own CAM
[11:14:04] <JesusAlos> but looking for a documentation about this kind of algorithms
[11:14:54] <jthornton> looking for documentation on letter profiles?
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[11:58:34] <SpeedEvil> JesusAlos: 'tool path algorithms' is probably more helpful to google
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[12:06:52] <jdh> I'd think engraving text should be pretty much available for the taking/mods
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[12:07:57] <jdh> like awallins stuff?
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[12:08:51] <jdh> or even F-Engrave?
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[12:35:52] <archivist> or truetype tracer
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[13:06:58] <jdh> Connor: you around?
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[13:17:05] <Loetmichel> hmmm... anyone know if these cheap chinese USB RS485 adapters work tor a cheap chinese VFD (the 800W spindles)
[13:17:31] <Loetmichel> http://www.ebay.de/itm/USB-to-RS485-USB-485-Converter-Adapter-/221349874318?pt=UK_Computing_USB_Cables&hash=item33897b0a8e
[13:18:47] <jdh> I have a cheap chinese 232-485 I haven't tried yet.
[13:19:08] <jdh> is yours a huanyang or wtf?
[13:19:18] <Loetmichel> the vfd?
[13:19:42] <jdh> yeah
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[13:20:08] <Loetmichel> one is hy01d523b, the other i have no idea
[13:20:29] <jdh> I have read the nowforever d100 I got is better about interference than the huanyangs and the d100 does real modbus vs. teh hy modbus-like
[13:20:38] <jdh> but, I have not seen any working linuxcnc + d100
[13:20:57] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=12509&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 <- the other one
[13:21:47] <Loetmichel> hmm... i will try... do you think the cheap adapters will do?
[13:21:58] <Loetmichel> so i can try to make it work?
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[13:22:41] <jdh> I woudl guess they would work. My MB has a 232 port already though. And I have a bunch of usb-232 adapters
[13:23:08] <Loetmichel> the "unemplymetn agency" PC i have here hs serial ports
[13:23:22] <Loetmichel> but i think i will be bettter off using the usb. its cheaper ;-9
[13:23:58] <jdh> better cabling
[13:24:32] <jdh> I have a spare cut-out in the box mine came in that will hold a DB-9. I was going to use that for limit switches though.
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[13:25:08] <jdh> after I disassemble the box, take out the breakout board and solder pins in the holes for the rest of the I/O
[13:26:30] <Loetmichel> i use the PCs i got form a refurbisher
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[13:27:54] <jdh> I would have happily paid $1 more if they woudl have populated the pins on teh breakout board.
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[13:32:20] <agile_netvark> Loetmichel: itsco?
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[13:33:17] <Loetmichel> agile_netvark: pollin
[13:33:26] <agile_netvark> hehe
[13:33:59] <agile_netvark> the harbor freight of refurbishers :D
[13:34:03] <Loetmichel> jdh: and my pc on the home CNC is especially made for it
[13:34:22] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=12265
[13:34:32] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=12247
[13:34:33] <jdh> I made this one in teh day of teh cheap Atoms
[13:34:38] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=12250
[13:34:44] <Loetmichel> no room in it at all ;-)
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[13:35:14] <Loetmichel> (result of pressing an industrial c2d board into a 286's pizzabix
[13:35:18] <Loetmichel> box
[13:36:50] <jdh> ditch the HD for an SSD and get rid of teh optical
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[13:38:19] <jdh> do you know if you can typically get rpm feedback from the VFD to LinuxCNC?
[13:38:35] <jdh> and running and/or fault status?
[13:41:27] <Loetmichel> no idea
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[14:20:47] <archivist> jdh add a spindle encoder for threading the bonus is speed feedback
[14:21:45] <jdh> it's a router. spindle won't run slow.
[14:22:42] <jdh> mainly wanted 'spindle at speed'
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[14:39:12] <Jymmm> Add a mic and wait for the whine
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[14:41:17] <Jymmm> 12KHz @ 109dB = SPINDLE.READY
[14:41:32] <ssi> :P
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[14:42:15] <Jymmm> "Making the Laws of Physics your bitch!"
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[14:43:09] <ssi> speaking of which
[14:43:11] <archivist> point that at the hal input motion.spindle-at-speed
[14:43:14] <ssi> Jymmm: I'm about to start ordering laser parts
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[14:43:50] <Jymmm> "parts" ?
[14:43:55] <jthornton> jdh, your VFD may have an "at speed" output
[14:43:56] <ssi> tube, power supply, optics
[14:44:06] <PetefromTn_> Mornin' folks..
[14:44:10] <ssi> marn pete
[14:44:23] <PetefromTn_> hey man howsitgoin?
[14:44:34] <Jymmm> ssi: ah
[14:44:37] <ssi> at work, but other than that I guess it's ok :)
[14:44:51] <PetefromTn_> hey man at least you have a job right....
[14:44:52] <ssi> Jymmm: you're using a coherent rf laser, yea?
[14:45:06] <PetefromTn_> I managed to sell my Chevy Astro Van yesterday..
[14:45:21] <Jymmm> ssi: as in Coherent (tm) brand? No.
[14:45:26] <PetefromTn_> gonna miss that thing I think. It was a good truck.
[14:45:35] <ssi> ah ok I misrememberd
[14:45:54] <Jymmm> ssi: google "ULS M-300"
[14:46:40] <ssi> ah ok
[14:47:32] <ssi> do you know what the focal length of your focus lens is?
[14:48:10] <Jymmm> 2"
[14:48:16] <Jymmm> on the lens I have now
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[14:51:29] <ssi> ugh i just realized that I'm going to have to do height control via a raising/lowering bed
[14:55:48] <ssi> because the laser heads all seem to have the final bounce mirror integrated
[14:56:05] <ssi> which means that Z control can't be done with a slide on the gantry
[14:56:23] * Loetmichel just filled his holidayform for tomorrow and next week... cleaniung up the workplace... i should do that more often... things i have to take home: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=15017
[14:56:35] <Loetmichel> ... and i am sure i have overlooked something ;-)
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[14:57:10] <ssi> what's the bottle of flammable happiness?
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[14:57:29] <Loetmichel> IPA
[14:57:33] <Loetmichel> 5 liters
[14:58:10] <Loetmichel> ai i have brought a similar canister last jear to the company i have secured one canister on this delivery, so i have some at home again ;-)
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[15:02:21] <Jymmm> ssi: Are you getting a RECI tube?
[15:02:39] <ssi> Jymmm: my plan is to get the cheapest 40w chinese tube out there to start with
[15:02:48] <ssi> and then replace it with something nicer when it inevitably dies
[15:02:53] <Jymmm> k
[15:03:28] <Jymmm> ssi: Is this in an enclosure?
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[15:03:41] <ssi> I haven't built anything yet
[15:03:44] <ssi> so it can be whatever I want it to be :)
[15:04:27] <Jymmm> ssi: I'm taking about bounced/reflected invisible laser radiation from blinding your sorry ass!
[15:04:38] <ssi> yeah I'm aware
[15:05:06] <Jymmm> You might be aware, but somethng is telling me you are going to ignore that.
[15:05:22] <ssi> probably
[15:06:11] <Jymmm> You do realize these thinngs cut thru 1/4" material no problem, right?
[15:06:17] <ssi> I sure hope so
[15:06:30] <Jymmm> WTF do you think it's doing to your eyes?
[15:07:04] <ssi> so lemme start by saying, while I'm typically pretty apathetic about safety glasses, I certainly intend to wear some 10,6 filtering goggles for this particular project :P
[15:07:37] <SpeedEvil> 10.6um radiation is much, much less dangerous than visible
[15:08:21] <Jymmm> Eh, a sheet of acrylic is enough of a filter, but YOU HAVE TO ACTUALLY USE IT!
[15:08:27] <SpeedEvil> That is - you don't want to have a beam pointed at you, but glancing shots are unlikely to damage as tehy are not amplified a millionfold by the lens
[15:08:29] <ssi> I'll enclose it when it's done
[15:08:53] <ssi> I'm not super worried about the safety aspect of it :P
[15:09:08] <Jymmm> ssi: Well, good luck then!
[15:09:11] <ssi> heh
[15:10:30] <CaptHindsight> only RED lasers cut through things, haven't you seen the movies?
[15:11:05] <ssi> what I'm trying to figure out is how these heads work exactly:
[15:11:07] <ssi> http://www.ebay.com/itm/CO2-Laser-Head-Mirror-and-Lens-Integrative-Mount-/160703848537?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item256ab22059
[15:11:32] <ssi> the height adjustment in it... is it set and forget based on the focal distance of the lens? or is it adjustable to move the focused spot up and down
[15:11:44] <SpeedEvil> CaptHindsight: Did you hear that there is a massive reboot of Star-trek, with a vastly upgraded Borg menace?
[15:11:52] <SpeedEvil> This time their eye-lasers are blue.
[15:12:37] <CaptHindsight> sounds like some sort of hipster trend
[15:14:25] <CaptHindsight> without seeing the insides that looks like a 45 deg mirror and lens for final focus
[15:14:38] <ssi> yes, it is... I just don't know where the focus lens lives inside
[15:15:03] <ssi> if it's in the bottom part then I'd think it focuses to a fixed point below the nozzle, and you move the focus lens up and down to change the height of the spot
[15:15:14] <cpresser> ssi: the focus-lens and the nozzle are fixed to each other. you only hav to adjust the nozzle-distance to your workpiece for different workpiece thickness.
[15:15:22] <ssi> cpresser: perfect thanks
[15:15:27] <cpresser> that way you also move the lens
[15:15:35] <ssi> so maybe I don't need an adjustable height table after all
[15:15:39] <cpresser> thats what the set-screw in the picture is used for
[15:16:02] * cpresser has a adjustable table, but i barely use ist
[15:16:14] <ssi> the set screw is to adjust the nozzle to fine tune the nozzle to spot distance?
[15:16:53] <CaptHindsight> you want low cost parts and clearly informative documentation from China? I can't even get my partners there to ask me to proofread the docs they write in English
[15:17:22] <ssi> CaptHindsight: didn't you call me a racist for saying basically the same thing? ;)
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[15:18:16] <cpresser> ssi: no, nozzle to focus-spot is fixed (by the lens mounting inside the nozzle)
[15:18:22] <ssi> ok
[15:18:33] <ssi> is your table homebuilt?
[15:18:49] <cpresser> but perhaps there is a way to move the lens inside the nozzle. mine has internal threads and some set screws for that
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[15:19:24] <cpresser> nope, i bought mine. its china crap, but i bought it from a german distributor. so he has to worry about all the saftey issues since he did import it :)
[15:19:31] <ssi> haha
[15:20:04] <cpresser> ssi: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Vfl42K_z9A
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[15:20:08] <Connor> jdh: What's up ?
[15:20:17] <cpresser> i got almost the same machine. but without the girl :/
[15:20:34] <ssi> seems like a critical accessory
[15:21:56] <ssi> cpresser: was it a print driver type machine?
[15:22:04] <ssi> and did you do the right thing and convert it to linuxcnc? :D
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[15:22:50] <cpresser> not exactly print driver, but similar (corel-draw plugin).
[15:23:01] <cpresser> the software is crap. but it works when you get used to it
[15:23:26] <cpresser> so far i didnt convert it, because it does the job. no need to change anything
[15:23:38] <ssi> she's talking about the autofocus, but my german is nicht so gut... how does that work?
[15:24:17] <cpresser> autofocus is a bad joke. its 'probe the workpiece' with a mechanical switch nextto the nozzle
[15:24:22] <ssi> hehehe
[15:24:41] <cpresser> i didnt buy that option, since it was 500€ for one switch^^
[15:24:49] <Jymmm> My autofocus works PERFECT
[15:24:50] <ssi> eesh
[15:25:10] <cpresser> i did add some alignment lasers: https://ca.rstenpresser.de/blag/2013/10/adding-alignment-lasers-to-my-laser-cutter/
[15:26:14] <CaptHindsight> ssi: no you called yourself one :)
[15:26:48] <ssi> cpresser: nice
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[15:49:00] <ssi> so in selecting optics... I'm going to go with a 2" lens
[15:49:07] <ssi> what's the practical implication of 20mm vs 25mm diameter mirrors?
[15:51:40] <Smidge204__> Larger target?
[15:51:52] <ssi> laser bounce mirrors
[15:52:09] <Smidge204__> Yes, anda 25mm mirror will give you a slightly larger area to boucne off of
[15:52:19] <Smidge204__> And cost more, no doubt.
[15:52:23] <ssi> cost is the same
[15:52:26] <ssi> which is why I'm curious :P
[15:52:40] <Smidge204__> Interesting. They aren't special mirrors of any kind?
[15:52:50] <ssi> gold sputtered silicon mirrors I think
[15:52:54] <ssi> standard cheap chinese laser mirrors
[15:53:00] <ssi> http://www.ebay.com/itm/A-set-of-CO2-10600nm-Laser-Head-w-Mirrors-Focus-Focal-Lens-Integrative-Mounts-/230926445035?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&var=&hash=item35c449e9eb
[15:53:17] <Smidge204__> huh. Well then, can't think of a raeson not to go with 25mm unless they somehow don't fit
[15:53:24] <Smidge204__> All else being equal
[15:53:52] <CaptHindsight> if your beam has been expanded over 15mm I'd go with the 25mm vs the 20mm or if my power level was high enough to heat the 20mm too close to causing distortion I'd use the 25mm
[15:54:19] <ssi> seems reasonable
[15:54:51] <jdh> CaptHindsight: when would you pick 20mm instead?
[15:55:30] <CaptHindsight> if space was a concern, or cost (if it was different)
[15:55:53] <ssi> my only concern is whether the mounts are going to work well with either size
[15:55:58] <ssi> which with chinese stuff like this there's no telling
[15:56:00] <CaptHindsight> or possible weight if I was moving it around quickly
[15:56:25] <CaptHindsight> they are just selling you parts of a system
[15:56:45] <CaptHindsight> they probably don't have specs on the individual parts
[15:57:00] <ssi> eh whatever, at this price the only thing I really have to lose is time
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[15:59:03] <CaptHindsight> <300W DIY laser cutter, it's probably fine, for a $800K government research project I'd probably use another source
[15:59:21] <ssi> yeah I'm not concerned about it
[15:59:42] <ssi> this is a research project already, but it's a feasibility study for low cost homebuilt laser cutters :P
[16:00:18] <Smidge204__> Do you have a projected total cost so far?
[16:00:19] <CaptHindsight> if you searched around on the laser cutter sites you might spot that mirror and lens mounted on some system
[16:00:45] <ssi> Smidge204__: probably around $2k
[16:00:56] <Smidge204__> What wattage?
[16:01:00] <ssi> although that likely doesn't include all the little crap that goes into it
[16:01:02] <CaptHindsight> that seller probably knows someone that has access to that assembly
[16:01:06] <ssi> 40W, cheapest tube since cheap came to cheaptown
[16:01:39] <ssi> as far as the laser system goes, it's $180 for the tube, ~$100 for a power supply, $170 for optics
[16:01:51] <ssi> I'll need to rig something for water pump and tank
[16:02:08] <ssi> table mechanicals will be around $500 not including motors
[16:02:22] <CaptHindsight> the gamble is will you get one that is a reject, if that seller does that kind of thing
[16:02:24] <ssi> motors, drives, and electronics maybe another $500
[16:02:34] <ssi> CaptHindsight: yea it's a risk I'm willing to take at that price
[16:03:08] <ssi> so thats ~$1500, and then there'll be incidentals
[16:04:47] <Smidge204__> I don't know that much about laser cutters, but $2K doesn't seem very competitive for 40W considering all the <$500 listings on ebay.
[16:05:02] <Smidge204__> Even knowign those units will need some love to get them working, that's $1500 of headroom
[16:05:42] <ssi> perhaps, but I'm talking about building a 24x48" table
[16:05:51] <ssi> with proper mechanicals and optics that'll support higher power
[16:05:53] <Smidge204__> Okay, that helps :p
[16:06:03] <ssi> my plan is to replace the 40W tube and power supply with sometihng bigger and more reliable
[16:06:09] <Jymmm> ssi: If you ae going that route, build a 48x48 instead.
[16:06:20] <ssi> Jymmm: that just gets into space constraints
[16:07:31] <Jymmm> and by 48x48, I mean 54x54
[16:07:32] <jdh> Smidge204: I have contemplated buying one of the cheap 40w several times. It always adds up to $1800ish
[16:07:43] <ssi> yeah my plasma table is 48x48 by way of 54x54
[16:07:56] <jdh> replacing the controller, adding Z, etc
[16:08:06] <Smidge204__> jdh: Yep. Cheap can be pretty expensive.
[16:08:11] <ssi> the $500 machines look pretty terrible
[16:08:23] <jdh> and they require a dongle
[16:08:23] <ssi> the $2k machines look marginally servicable
[16:08:37] <Jymmm> If you have a plasma table already, just add the laser/optics and be done.
[16:08:39] <jdh> the 50w ones look almost real
[16:08:47] <Smidge204__> heh
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[16:09:25] <ssi> meh
[16:09:31] <ssi> the table's really not designed well for that
[16:10:07] <CaptHindsight> the $500 machines are built the HF way, they get the job done for a short while. Like a small project you make $4000K on with the use of a $500 cutter.
[16:10:20] <ssi> $4000K?
[16:10:24] <ssi> like four million bucks?
[16:10:25] <CaptHindsight> after that you don't care about the laser or use it on borrowed time
[16:10:27] <ssi> I want that project
[16:10:37] <CaptHindsight> -K :)
[16:10:40] <Smidge204__> Great return on that investment :p
[16:10:53] <ssi> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Laser-CO2-Engraving-Cutting-Machine-JQ-1525-/111402685319?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item19f01e1387
[16:11:01] <ssi> great big machine with little 60W reci tube :P
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[16:11:45] <Smidge204__> It seems cost scales alarmingly fast with higher wattages
[16:11:51] <ssi> yes it does
[16:11:54] <CaptHindsight> that's the mindset behind most of the power and machine tools there
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[16:13:25] <ssi> ok tube and optics both ordered
[16:13:30] <ssi> just have to order a power supply
[16:13:33] <Smidge204__> You could always make your own tube :D
[16:13:44] <ssi> yeah I watched a bunch of youtub vids about that last night :P
[16:13:58] <ssi> as much as I love the diy spirit, I don't think I want to bother with that right now :)
[16:17:36] <ssi> lol
[16:17:36] <ssi> K9 Mirror: Close to worthless gold coated glass (likely from re-melted milk bottles), anything much over 35 watts and a spec of dust and they break. Designed for the "Hobby" series K40 lasers (the $500 ebay junk)
[16:18:56] <ssi> and of course I go back and look at what I ordered and they're K9 mirrors I
[16:18:59] <ssi> I thought hey were Si
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[16:26:19] <Loetmichel> hmm
[16:26:59] <Loetmichel> normal laser mirros are glass ground to extreme flatness and then coated with gold for reflection
[16:27:10] <ssi> glass or Silicon
[16:27:11] <Loetmichel> that works good up to 80-100W
[16:27:39] <Loetmichel> above that its usually copper plates gold plated and sometimes watercooled from behind
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[16:27:51] <ssi> ya
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[16:32:26] <jdh> Connor?
[16:32:31] <Connor> jdh: Yea?
[16:32:56] <jdh> My mill stand is out for delivery. Any suggestions for assembly and getting the mill into the stand?
[16:33:26] <jdh> can it bolt into the stand, or does it just sit there?
[16:34:01] <Connor> It just sits..
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[16:34:16] <Connor> I used wood shims to level it in the base.. and to lock it in.
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[16:37:28] <jdh> wonder if I can tilt it up on some 4x4s and get the stand under it.
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[16:38:57] <Smidge204__> How big is it?
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[16:39:47] <jdh> grizzly g0704
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[16:40:32] <Smidge204__> Not BIG big, then
[16:40:48] <jdh> no, but more than I can pick up and put on it.
[16:41:06] <ssi> engine hoist works well for moving a g0704 without disassembling it
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[16:41:27] <Smidge204__> I was thinkign some kind of hoist operation myself
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[16:42:12] <jdh> that's how I got it on to the stand originally. But I had to go rent one.
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[16:42:29] <Loetmichel> hmmm
[16:42:41] <Loetmichel> 364 lbs shipping weight... thats easy
[16:42:45] <Smidge204__> How high to you have to lift it?
[16:42:51] <Loetmichel> get a friend and thrwo it on the base
[16:42:57] <Smidge204__> Heh
[16:43:00] <Loetmichel> throw
[16:43:01] <ssi> yeah two people can do it ok
[16:43:09] <ssi> or take the table off
[16:43:25] <jdh> or the head
[16:43:32] <ssi> head is harder to remove
[16:43:41] <jdh> nah. 3 bolts
[16:43:49] <ssi> I had a tough time with it
[16:43:51] <ssi> I forget why
[16:43:55] <Loetmichel> hrhr
[16:43:58] <Smidge204__> If you must move it by yourself, some lumber and some rope will get the job done
[16:44:05] <Loetmichel> reminds me of the time i bought my lathe
[16:44:17] <jdh> I'd go rent the engine hoist before I took the table off
[16:44:18] <Loetmichel> ... which is about 70 kg or so
[16:44:31] <ssi> rent a friend?
[16:44:38] <Loetmichel> and the seller asked "how will you get it out of the basement?"
[16:44:41] <jdh> I'd hate for it to fall on someone
[16:44:52] <ssi> rent a non-litigious friend?
[16:44:54] <ssi> like a hooker maybe
[16:45:05] <Smidge204__> Don't let people walk under it :p
[16:45:13] <Loetmichel> and i took it left and right at the bed and lifted it "if you would open the doors: this way!" ;-)
[16:46:12] <Loetmichel> "and hurry up, these thin is a bit on the heavy side!" ;-)
[16:46:16] <Loetmichel> this thing
[16:47:33] <Smidge204__> heh
[16:49:05] <jdh> looks like maybe I can put it on then assemble it
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[16:49:32] <IchGuckLive> hi all B)
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[16:50:57] <Smidge204__> Gigantic ramp of compacted earth and wooden dowel rollers
[16:51:00] <Smidge204__> :D
[16:51:07] <ssi> eheheh
[16:51:24] <Smidge204__> Gang of slaves optional
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[17:05:05] <IchGuckLive> hi Flipp
[17:05:15] <Flipp_> heya :)
[17:05:16] <IchGuckLive> and does your smd placer form
[17:06:18] <Flipp_> not running quite yet :) but I have gotten the vacuum pressure system and nozzle changer working
[17:07:18] <IchGuckLive> nice you will come over the rest
[17:08:01] <Connor> Assemble it in halfs..
[17:08:08] <Connor> and pry it up on one end.. and then the other..
[17:08:12] <Connor> you should be able to do it.
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[17:08:32] <Connor> or pry it up and put 2x4's under the center..
[17:08:48] <Connor> would have to be slightly shorter than the base of the stand..
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[17:30:48] <IchGuckLive> ktchk: ae you in typhon range
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[17:36:34] <IchGuckLive> hi fraessteuerung
[17:36:37] <IchGuckLive> German ?
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[17:40:22] <IchGuckLive> By the Way today in Pamplona at bullrun 4 Americans took a full flippover by bullhorn push
[17:40:54] <IchGuckLive> fraessteuerung: ?
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[17:43:50] <ssi> I wonder if you can take a dead or weak chinese sealed co2 laser tube and hack it to make it into an unsealed tube with external gasses and vacuum
[17:44:25] <Smidge204__> Very gentle glasswork
[17:44:36] <IchGuckLive> no you need to get it manufactured in production line
[17:44:50] <archivist> and what was the reason for dead....the mirrors maybe
[17:44:56] <Smidge204__> Actually, there's probably a melt-sealed tube sticking out the side you could cut open
[17:45:10] <ssi> archivist: I always assumed it was gas leakage or contamination that causes the cheap tubes to fail
[17:45:17] <ssi> I've read that they will die even sitting on the shelf
[17:45:52] <IchGuckLive> the mirrow coat of this lowcost is not sticky
[17:46:09] <IchGuckLive> therfor they are sold at that value
[17:46:34] <IchGuckLive> you can ask your local glass artworkers if there are some like in germany
[17:46:42] <IchGuckLive> to get expirence
[17:47:00] <IchGuckLive> first coat the ends new then fill in gas
[17:47:21] <IchGuckLive> get vaccum and seal it off
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[17:47:59] <IchGuckLive> as glas not heats in 1inch you can easy stick pipes to get filled in vaccum
[17:48:37] <IchGuckLive> bbut the output might be well below the netto tube value and the reprice will be double the new
[17:50:55] <chally_> oh, this is an area I have some experience with, I have refilled all kinds of glass tubes full of gasses
[17:51:16] <chally_> you should try making some neon signs first, its pretty similar, good practice, cheap materials and a ton of fun
[17:51:22] <ssi> that's a good idea :)
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[17:54:26] * JT-Shop wonders what to do with a ream of pin feed fan fold paper
[17:55:35] <Smidge204__> Makes halfway decent placemat/table cover
[17:55:53] <Smidge204__> If you're doing anything on a bench with paint, for example
[17:55:59] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: Makes for great templates
[17:56:17] <Jymmm> or banners
[17:56:21] <archivist> JT-Shop, tell some computer collectors you have it spare
[17:56:43] <Smidge204__> Or get a dot matrix printer and use it :D
[17:57:39] <IchGuckLive> dint get ssi to many idees he will make to many profit out of it
[17:57:51] <ssi> ha
[17:57:59] <ssi> I rarely profit from anything
[17:58:09] <ssi> I excel at turning large piles of money into smaller piles of money and clutter
[18:00:09] <IchGuckLive> ssi you may do somthing wrong
[18:00:14] <JT-Shop> not many computer collectors out in the woods of swamp east missouri I dont' think
[18:00:18] <ssi> I do most things wrong
[18:02:52] <IchGuckLive> live is not a funny workaround !
[18:03:13] <IchGuckLive> WyrM: welcome to cnc channel
[18:03:57] -!- WyrM has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
[18:04:00] <kfoltman> ssi: heh, sounds like my whole life ;)
[18:04:27] <IchGuckLive> kfoltman: your time will come
[18:04:47] -!- WyrM [WyrM!wyrm@unaffiliated/wyrm] has joined #linuxcnc
[18:05:03] <IchGuckLive> as im standing out of a long cnc life next month new people will take over
[18:05:51] -!- _abc_ has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
[18:06:25] <kfoltman> IchGuckLive: you're in Germany where some people still have money ;)
[18:06:42] <IchGuckLive> only americans belive in this
[18:07:03] <IchGuckLive> europeans think not as you money is always an issue
[18:07:24] <IchGuckLive> but as you say SOME i agree
[18:07:35] -!- _abc_ [_abc_!~user@unaffiliated/ccbbaa] has joined #linuxcnc
[18:08:00] <IchGuckLive> also lots of US people got money as they neead
[18:08:40] -!- ve7it [ve7it!~LawrenceG@S01060014d19d0b68.pk.shawcable.net] has joined #linuxcnc
[18:08:46] <kfoltman> IchGuckLive: I mean, more % of people have disposable income in Germany than in Ireland
[18:08:59] <ssi> kfoltman: are you in ireland?
[18:09:04] <kfoltman> ssi: yes
[18:09:06] <IchGuckLive> agree
[18:09:12] <IchGuckLive> and as in Grees
[18:09:24] <IchGuckLive> Portugal ...
[18:09:31] <kfoltman> IchGuckLive: I think the only people who are not broke here are software engineers
[18:09:45] <ssi> that's pretty much true in the US too :P
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[18:09:57] <kfoltman> ssi: US looks scary to me
[18:10:00] <ssi> scary how?
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[18:10:11] <Jymmm> ssi: You're here!
[18:10:13] <IchGuckLive> so get you androidstudio on your mill and prog some apps
[18:10:21] <ssi> Jymmm: yeah but it's a big place... easy to avoid me
[18:10:25] <IchGuckLive> hi anarchos
[18:10:29] <Jymmm> ssi: Eh
[18:10:46] <IchGuckLive> here it sometimes breke down
[18:11:00] <IchGuckLive> but i got nearly 20 apps runnig
[18:11:02] <kfoltman> ssi: scary as in "lots of people working very hard and barely able to pay their bills"
[18:11:07] <IchGuckLive> and owned some money
[18:11:15] <ssi> kfoltman: yeah well there's the mistake
[18:11:18] <ssi> working hard is for suckers
[18:11:27] <ssi> that's why I became a software engineer :)
[18:11:37] <kfoltman> ssi: well, me too...
[18:11:38] -!- rob_h [rob_h!~robh@2.217.96.57] has joined #linuxcnc
[18:11:40] <ssi> :D
[18:11:44] <IchGuckLive> System Admin is the best job
[18:11:47] <kfoltman> that's the only thing I don't suck that much at
[18:11:53] <ssi> nah sysadmins are mostly schlubs
[18:12:09] <IchGuckLive> get the blondes in jail and you got a ever running system
[18:12:53] <IchGuckLive> with 2-3 NERD cable monkeys you are in realy good setup
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[18:14:21] <IchGuckLive> ok im off BYE till tomorrow
[18:14:28] * kfoltman wishes there was a good Linux CAM software, but too lazy to code it himself
[18:14:29] <IchGuckLive> ;-) B)
[18:14:51] <ssi> you and me both heh
[18:14:54] <IchGuckLive> Heekscad/Cam
[18:14:54] <archivist> kfoltman, there is some that needs some luvin
[18:15:02] <kfoltman> archivist: which one?
[18:15:03] <IchGuckLive> sheetcam
[18:15:15] <IchGuckLive> all there kfoltman
[18:15:16] <kfoltman> IchGuckLive: sheetcam, that's commercial and Windows only?
[18:15:17] <ssi> I'm not thrilled with sheetcam
[18:15:22] <ssi> there's a linux version of sheetcam
[18:15:44] <IchGuckLive> for plasma you are best setup
[18:16:00] <ssi> does sheetcam do laser?
[18:16:01] <ssi> I imagine it does
[18:16:03] <IchGuckLive> i love it it workes on all plasmas i made
[18:16:41] <IchGuckLive> laser picture is linuxcnc included pic to gcode
[18:17:03] <IchGuckLive> V-grave laser post
[18:17:22] <archivist> kfoltman, if you are brave.... http://aptos.sourceforge.net/
[18:17:25] <IchGuckLive> all in linux you got to look better and try it
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[18:17:32] <kfoltman> archivist: that's the LISP one?
[18:17:42] <archivist> fortran
[18:17:54] <kfoltman> even worse (-:
[18:18:00] <ssi> haha
[18:18:19] <ssi> kfoltman: aren't you a python person?
[18:18:22] <ssi> no room to complain ;)
[18:18:23] <archivist> it is worse than that due to the original fortran not having strings
[18:19:33] <kfoltman> ssi: meh, python makes everything easy, fortran - the opposite :)
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[18:19:57] <ssi> haha yeah ok, I'll grant you that I'd rather deal with python than fortran
[18:20:01] <archivist> at least the spaces meant something in fortran
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[18:20:09] <ssi> archivist++ :HD
[18:20:11] <ssi> hahaha
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[18:20:55] <ssi> anyway I gotta run... bbl
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[18:24:24] <archivist> kfoltman, and I have been playing a long while ago with it http://www.archivist.info/apt/aptos/apt360/orig_source/apt/ABKKPR.html
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[20:15:17] <Guest46225> Can anyone help in german ?
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[20:26:22] <jthornton> German speaking people are on here a little earlier in the day... I don't see any at the moment
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[20:31:27] <CaptHindsight> Guest46225: try 2+ hours earlier than now tomorrow
[20:31:33] * jthornton was talking to my self again I think
[20:32:41] * Deejay waves his hand
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[20:37:51] <Guest46225> ok thank you i hope i find someone tomorrow
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[21:08:25] <Deejay> gn8
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[21:35:28] <Tom_itx> when you have to reinstall an installation it becomes clear how much you have modified it from stock
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[21:59:58] <zeeshan> man
[22:00:08] <zeeshan> there has to be an easy way to hold a 4"x4" sheet
[22:00:12] <zeeshan> and cut a circle on a cnc mill
[22:00:22] <zeeshan> i keep on having to move toe clamsp around
[22:02:12] <syyl> double sided tape?
[22:02:13] <Tom_itx> vacuum
[22:02:36] <zeeshan> well its not a single sheet
[22:02:38] <Tom_itx> tape
[22:02:39] <zeeshan> currently im stacking 5 sheets
[22:02:39] <Tom_itx> glue
[22:02:49] <zeeshan> and clamping it with toe clamsp on 2 corners
[22:02:57] <zeeshan> and then there is a toe clamp that i put on the center
[22:03:06] <syyl> sandwich wich a biggerm thick plate and four screws in the corners
[22:03:09] <zeeshan> and there is a solid chunk of aluminum that the toe clamp is clamping to
[22:03:27] <zeeshan> hmm
[22:03:29] <zeeshan> thatrs not a bad idea
[22:03:33] <zeeshan> 4 screws on the corners
[22:03:43] <zeeshan> i like this idea.
[22:03:44] <zeeshan> :)
[22:03:46] <syyl> :)
[22:03:58] <zeeshan> cause even if i stack like
[22:03:58] <syyl> we do this whenn we machine stacks of shimstock
[22:03:59] <zeeshan> 100 of them
[22:04:03] <zeeshan> that still works out to like 2" deep
[22:04:04] <zeeshan> lol
[22:04:10] <zeeshan> and i can drill holes in teh drill press
[22:04:28] <syyl> you can even wireEDM the stack :D
[22:04:54] <syyl> or tie it to a chicken (for whatever reason)
[22:04:56] <zeeshan> i think edm locally heat treats the material
[22:05:09] <zeeshan> i cant use plasma, waterjet or laser for that reason
[22:05:12] <zeeshan> (plus its magnesium)
[22:05:37] <zeeshan> they are lab grade specimens for my cup drawing tests
[22:05:53] <zeeshan> from what ive seen so far, milling seems to cause the least amount of edge distortion
[22:06:04] <zeeshan> and doesnt affect the base mechanical properties
[22:08:27] <syyl> thats right
[22:08:45] <syyl> but the affected zone with wedm is almost neglectable
[22:09:04] <syyl> i kinda like wedm ;)
[22:09:10] <zeeshan> i personally havent tested a specimen that has been edm'ed
[22:09:11] <zeeshan> so i cant tell
[22:09:15] <zeeshan> but i know laser cut stuff
[22:09:16] <syyl> its the hightech jigsaw :D
[22:09:19] <zeeshan> doesn't draw as nicely
[22:09:28] <zeeshan> because its already work hardened
[22:09:38] <zeeshan> well work hardened isnt the right term
[22:09:40] <syyl> yeah, laser puts a lot of heat in the corner
[22:09:43] <syyl> *edge
[22:10:04] <zeeshan> edming 100 samples might cost a lot
[22:10:05] <zeeshan> :p
[22:10:36] <syyl> stack 100 sheets ;)
[22:10:41] <zeeshan> hahaha
[22:11:02] <syyl> that works very nice
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[22:11:23] <zeeshan> i dont want any suprises when i draw :{
[22:11:27] <syyl> :D
[22:11:31] <zeeshan> i already found a nasty suprise today
[22:11:37] <syyl> me to
[22:11:41] <zeeshan> the 100 ton's servo hydraulic driven press
[22:11:45] <zeeshan> had a fucking 15 thou tilt
[22:11:49] <zeeshan> i was shimming all day
[22:11:52] <syyl> no coffee was availible in the milling dept
[22:11:53] <zeeshan> trying to get it to be flat again
[22:11:54] <syyl> :(
[22:11:56] <zeeshan> hahah
[22:12:08] <zeeshan> buy some coffee beans
[22:12:12] <zeeshan> and mill em yourself
[22:12:16] <syyl> haha ;)
[22:12:30] <syyl> and you bend your press straight :P
[22:12:38] <zeeshan> i wish i was superman
[22:12:40] <zeeshan> it'd be an easy task
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[22:13:58] <syyl> going to check my couch
[22:14:03] <syyl> if ifs still there ;)
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