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[00:03:05] <XXCoder> heys
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[00:33:16] <CaptHindsight> LeelooMinai: 64bit is experimental, Linuxcnc is 32b but work with PXE for more memory
[00:33:39] <CaptHindsight> sorry PAE
[00:34:06] <XXCoder> hey capt
[00:34:15] <CaptHindsight> howdy
[00:34:33] <LeelooMinai> Heh... I started with Ubunti 14.04 64 and now I have a sad face - I will have to use something ancient:(
[00:35:07] <CaptHindsight> 12.04 32b, I'm working on 14.04 32b mow
[00:35:44] <LeelooMinai> By working you mean working on the code or working with the suftware + cnc?
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[00:36:05] <CaptHindsight> ubuntu broke the X driver so it's really slow with virtualbox
[00:36:12] <XXCoder> ancient pc ;)
[00:36:52] <CaptHindsight> getting Linuxcnc to play well with 14.04 x86 unity
[00:36:58] <LeelooMinai> I left all the ancient pcs I had in the last millenium:)
[00:37:35] <LeelooMinai> CaptHindsight: You are part of the linuxcnc programmer team?
[00:38:18] <CaptHindsight> plus wtf does deja-dup-monitor take up 45% of the cpu, who sets this stuff up as default?
[00:38:37] <CaptHindsight> LeelooMinai: any can be
[00:38:53] <LeelooMinai> Well, ok, but I presume there are some "core" ones
[00:39:07] <CaptHindsight> I'm not one of those
[00:39:36] <CaptHindsight> I don't like the hats or the capes :)
[00:39:51] <LeelooMinai> Hmm... I guess I will have to kill that Ubuntu installation.
[00:40:27] <LeelooMinai> I already hear that Haswell Celeron crying
[00:40:56] <CaptHindsight> I don't touch Intel with 20' poles
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[00:41:12] <LeelooMinai> There's anything else? :)
[00:42:09] <XXCoder> anyone in here need a coupler thats 6.35mm to 12 mm? :P
[00:42:39] <LeelooMinai> I had to drill mine to fit them onto a bigger steppers:)
[00:42:55] <XXCoder> I cant "undrill" em so useless lol
[00:42:59] <XXCoder> ordered wrong ones.
[00:43:33] <CaptHindsight> sounds like a fleabay item
[00:44:22] <XXCoder> its pretty cheao at $8 each
[00:44:31] <XXCoder> too bad I ordered wrong ones lol
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[00:46:31] <LeelooMinai> CaptHindsight: And how is that 14.04 integration going?
[00:47:08] <CaptHindsight> LeelooMinai: I'm trying to work on it but somebody keeps interrupting me
[00:47:11] <LeelooMinai> Is there a point of trying 14.04 32-bit now?
[00:47:41] <LeelooMinai> Ok, was just wondering if it's "tryable"
[00:47:44] <CaptHindsight> compile from source
[00:48:02] <CaptHindsight> use the 3.4.55 RTAI
[00:48:39] <XXCoder> whats wrong with older os
[00:48:55] <LeelooMinai> XXCoder: What's wrong with newer? :)
[00:49:15] <CaptHindsight> or just use 12.04 but the latest RTAI kernel is 3.4.55, you probably need a newer kernel for the GPU support, so you might try making a preempt_rt kernel
[00:49:19] <XXCoder> .. nonfunctional? ;)
[00:49:43] <XXCoder> or long compile time lol
[00:49:48] <LeelooMinai> XXCoder: Well, I think 10.04 is not even supported any more for example
[00:49:55] <XXCoder> yeah
[00:50:10] <XXCoder> I dont support newer ubuntus
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[00:50:23] <LeelooMinai> So, what if I want to run some software there, not only linuxcnc
[00:52:18] <CaptHindsight> LeelooMinai: if you hosted a Linuxcnc fest in Maui and sent tickets to all the devs 14.04 would be working in short order
[00:52:44] <XXCoder> yeah 5 years. you have to keep supporting them there
[00:53:08] <XXCoder> Don't forget me either. for moral support'
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[01:03:26] <CaptHindsight> I only want to try 14.04 unity for the multitouch support, other than that I'd never touch Ubuntu
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[02:26:01] <LeelooMinai> Hmm... tried the live linuxcnc iso, but it fails:
http://i.imgur.com/jKRXfMU.png
[02:26:18] <LeelooMinai> Do I need to have anything connected to the parallel port for it to start?
[02:27:35] <LeelooMinai> I ran the test first and it reported 5μs or so of jitter in both cases
[02:27:36] <tjtr33> depends on what you choose. try a config from the 'sim' collection
[02:28:06] <tjtr33> they require no hardware
[02:28:50] <tjtr33> if you have hdwr, you should make a config or choose a config that matches
[02:28:54] <LeelooMinai> Ok, but this MB has parallel port and it's enabled
[02:29:20] <LeelooMinai> Shouldn't the software just start with it?
[02:30:28] <LeelooMinai> I have chosen driver type "other" though... Did not see parallel port there
[02:31:45] <tjtr33> your 1st error suggests a problem with the .ini ( the config ) chosen. try a sim to be sure the linuxcnc works
[02:32:26] <LeelooMinai> I do not see a sim in the CNC menu there
[02:34:04] <archivist> if you use a pastbin instead of an image I could copy paste a line to refer to it
[02:35:10] <archivist> look at the line with insmod, is this a second attempt an it is already running
[02:35:21] <LeelooMinai> http://pastebin.com/bh85f9nj
[02:35:55] <archivist> insmod: error inserting '/usr/realtime-2.6.32-122-rtai/modules/rtai_hal.ko': -1 File exists
[02:36:24] <LeelooMinai> I do not see anything running on the desktop though
[02:36:36] <tjtr33> LeeLdont you get something like this?
http://imgur.com/qraMaIJ
[02:37:02] <LeelooMinai> Yes, I got that, have chosen my config, and that got that message I pasted
[02:37:41] <LeelooMinai> Hmm... I tried again and it appeared
[02:37:59] <tjtr33> so you do get the 'sim' choice
[02:38:33] <LeelooMinai> Yes, I see them there in "sample configuratins"
[02:38:49] <LeelooMinai> Will those tell me anything interesting?
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[02:39:05] <LeelooMinai> What are they doing even if there's no hardware?
[02:39:24] <tjtr33> try sim | axis | axis that may be interesting
[02:39:39] <CaptHindsight> so you can use them when there is hardware
[02:39:47] <tjtr33> you can load and simulate running a 3 axis machine
[02:41:45] <LeelooMinai> I see. Ok, well, at least I am a bit farther now. I guess tomorrow I will wire the steppers and control board and see if I can control them.
[02:41:57] <LeelooMinai> That 5000/5000 jitter is acceptable, right?
[02:42:30] <tjtr33> if you want to make a config for your own hardware, thats another task. you need to ware and config. a stepper system can use existing configs as models.
[02:42:37] <CaptHindsight> try opening Firefox and watching a youtube and running glxgears
[02:42:51] <CaptHindsight> see if the numbers jump after an hour
[02:42:52] <tjtr33> that 5 uSec. very good !
[02:43:42] <CaptHindsight> and plug and unplug some usb devices
[02:44:06] <tjtr33> oh yeah, i run tests for a whole day. less than 1/2 hour is meaningless ( at least less meaningful )
[02:44:09] <LeelooMinai> You want to destroy that 5000, I know
[02:44:37] <LeelooMinai> Right, I ran that glxgears and youtube and it dropped to 7500
[02:45:07] <LeelooMinai> Not that I will be watching youtube on that pc when doing cnc work
[02:45:56] <CaptHindsight> it just accelerates getting a bump
[02:46:59] <LeelooMinai> Well, ok, thx for help. I will probably report progress after wiring steppers.
[02:47:27] <Tom_itx> use shielded wire on em
[02:47:51] <LeelooMinai> Yes, I have nice shielded wire for them
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[02:54:17] <Valen> I find that starting up openGL windows causes a big latency spike
[02:54:28] <Valen> but you can administrativley solve that problem
[02:54:38] <Valen> don't start glxgears whilst running emc ;->
[02:56:16] <skunkworks_> well - the preview in axis is open gl
[02:57:30] <Jymmm> Valen: And if opengl cause latency, then other things will too, run for 24hours
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[02:57:58] <Jymmm> Valen: glxgears *IS* the latency test =)
[02:58:02] <Valen> yes, but once it has started it doesn't start again
[02:58:11] <LeelooMinai> "You've got mail" and boom, a broken mill flies across the room
[02:58:14] <Valen> starting it causes a 30K latency spike
[02:58:42] <Jymmm> Valen: then randoms jobs down the line will too
[02:59:31] <Valen> why? do they start openGL windows?
[02:59:33] <Jymmm> Valen: But go ahead and justify it all you want, you've been warned =)
[02:59:46] <Valen> well I've been running it for many years without issue
[02:59:58] <skunkworks_> LeelooMinai: it isn't that bad.. if you run the latency test while loading the system for a while.. (glxgears, youtube, whatever) and it stays under 10k - you are doing great. (and won't have any problems)
[03:00:11] <Jymmm> "But Honey, I *NEED* this 14HP auto reversing $4000 screwdriver"
[03:03:15] <CaptHindsight> you can also try kernel command isolcpus=1
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[03:18:30] <Valen> i *think* thats on by default in the iso release
[03:18:40] <Valen> but yes I always run with that
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[05:27:20] <tjtr33> CaptHindsight, great full moon and clear sky tonight
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[06:46:17] <Deejay> moin
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[08:36:15] <SpeedEvil> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pay-QTXBvpQ - fun welder.
[08:36:22] <SpeedEvil> E-beam not in a vacuum chamber
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[09:17:30] <archivist> it is in a vacuum, just local
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[09:20:31] <SpeedEvil> I diddn't say it wasn't in a vacuum
[09:21:01] * SpeedEvil wonders how hard an e-beam gun is to make.
[09:21:41] <archivist> look in your average crt and scale
[09:22:11] <archivist> I wonder if the weld deposit is N type
[09:22:14] <SpeedEvil> I know the basic construction
[09:22:21] <SpeedEvil> Why would it be any type?
[09:22:35] <SpeedEvil> N type only applies if it's a semiconductor.
[09:22:36] <archivist> all the extra electrons
[09:22:53] <SpeedEvil> The electrons immediately are conducted away into ground - it being a conductor
[09:22:58] <archivist> the impurities may well be biased
[09:23:26] <SpeedEvil> And yes - I know in principle how it works - I was just wondering engineering realities of a 4kW beam.
[09:23:46] <Valen> it is still a local vacuum
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[09:23:56] <Valen> and wow, such radiation
[09:24:30] <SpeedEvil> Valen: Of course, but there is no vacuum chamber you put the whole part on.
[09:24:31] <SpeedEvil> in
[09:24:41] <archivist> but the minder was standing very near with no eye protection
[09:24:43] <SpeedEvil> Which would be 'fun' for a 5m diameter tube
[09:24:51] <SpeedEvil> No point in eye protection
[09:24:55] <SpeedEvil> there is no visible light
[09:25:03] <SpeedEvil> Now, x-ray protection perhaps
[09:25:21] <SpeedEvil> But Brave Sir Robin shielding works for that
[09:25:31] <Valen> I believe they all left the room when there was actual xrays being generated
[09:25:38] <SpeedEvil> 1/r^2 as r tends to infinity
[09:25:40] <archivist> I thing there is light because the vacuum is not total
[09:25:49] <SpeedEvil> archivist: Well - yes
[09:26:17] <SpeedEvil> archivist: But if the operator was inside the opaque local vacuum, ...
[09:26:19] <archivist> hot metal gives off rather a lot of light
[09:27:06] <Valen> again I'm pretty sure nobody was in the room when anything was "hot"
[09:28:33] <SpeedEvil> I wonder where to get tool steel powder
[09:29:55] <archivist> get a cutter and a lump of tool steel and a milling machine and make it
[09:30:20] <SpeedEvil> Powder - as in ~fewum
[09:30:53] <Valen> why would you want tool steel powder?
[09:31:17] * SpeedEvil points to above conversation about e-beam guns.
[09:31:24] <SpeedEvil> I was wondering about 3d printing.
[09:31:26] <archivist> grind it and then separate out the grind stone particles
[09:31:29] <SpeedEvil> I have a decent vacuum pump
[09:35:09] <SpeedEvil> Ah - of course - china.
[09:35:11] <SpeedEvil> http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Stainless-Steel-Powder_1443865107.html?s=p
[09:35:20] <SpeedEvil> 'minimum order 200 kiloamperes'
[09:35:42] <Valen> but tool steels properties would be basically negated by the SLS process
[09:36:32] <SpeedEvil> Not SLS - e-beam additive
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[09:36:50] <Valen> still not going to get any of the forming processes
[09:37:20] <SpeedEvil> And no - you're going to need to finish machine
[09:37:38] <archivist> the grain structure from forming and then heat treating
[09:37:58] <Valen> archivist is what i meant
[09:38:17] <Valen> all that nice rolling and such that they do before you buy it
[09:38:29] <SpeedEvil> Well - the claims are the microstructure can be greatly improved due to the massively shorter melt time.
[09:38:47] <SpeedEvil> s/melt/freeze/
[09:40:06] <SpeedEvil> (I should note the 'tool' part of that initial sentance was typed without much thought.)
[09:40:08] * Valen will believe it when he sees it
[09:41:55] <SpeedEvil> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A10XEZvkgbY e-beam plus stick.
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[13:43:26] <miss0r> the misses are having some work gettogether this evening - I am now banished to the garage for the forseable future... YAY!
[13:45:04] <archivist> result!
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[13:47:26] <archivist> I am testing a fan heater...boring and it is a warm sunny day, so the fan heater is heating the garden (with a thermocouple to see why it is melting thermal cutouts)
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[14:15:17] <Einar1> archivist: It must be working fine, both heater and fan. The temperature is nice, and the rain clouds blown away even over here. Thank you.
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[14:18:40] <archivist> that was quick, only been running for half an hour, reached 65 deg c next to the thermal fuse (105 deg)
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[15:45:04] * JT-Shop usually makes the prettiest welds when the parts are assembled wrong
[15:45:08] <ssi> :D
[15:45:13] <SpeedEvil> :)
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[15:45:53] * SpeedEvil passes JT-Shop a couple of mirror-image portals.
[15:47:00] <SpeedEvil> http://www.natureworldnews.com/articles/7559/20140613/3d-printing-space-iss-study.htm - someone should ship them a bridgeport
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[15:49:42] <ssi> JT-Shop: I found your problem
[15:49:44] <ssi> it's friday the 13th
[15:49:52] <CaptHindsight> The new NASA, where hype trumps science
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[15:52:06] <skunkworks_> and full moon
[15:52:14] <ssi> skunkworks_: aye
[15:52:18] <ssi> we're all screwed
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[15:56:32] <jthornton> lol
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[16:08:47] <Loetmichel> SpeedEvil: a bridgeport?
[16:08:55] <Loetmichel> much to bulky and heavy
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[16:20:55] <SpeedEvil> I wasn't quite being serious
[16:21:12] <SpeedEvil> Though I would strongly argue that in some ways, NASA is doing it wrong
[16:21:40] <SpeedEvil> Concentrating on vastly lowering launch costs first before trying to do anything would be much saner.
[16:22:03] <archivist> since when has "doing it wrong" stopped any idiots :)
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[16:22:27] <SpeedEvil> NASA is a welfare program, not a space program alas.
[16:22:44] <SpeedEvil> It got poisoned by 'waste anything but time' - and has never recovered
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[16:31:54] <SpeedEvil> http://www.thespacereview.com/article/2330/1 - comedically bad. SLS (the next big thing) is supposed to be able to launch payloads for $10-20K/lb - depending on how you do the accounting.
[16:32:04] <SpeedEvil> $1K/lb launches can now be purchased.
[16:32:51] <t12> yeah i mean
[16:33:07] <t12> good thing they you know
[16:33:12] <t12> developed all the rocket engineering
[16:33:13] <t12> computers
[16:33:23] <t12> logistics
[16:33:25] <t12> operatoin systems
[16:33:26] <t12> total waste of money
[16:34:14] <t12> and a whole .75% national budget! outrageous!
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[16:39:01] <SpeedEvil> Unfortunately, they are in many places not developing anything interesting.
[16:39:13] <t12> thats every large r&d org
[16:39:18] <t12> and the nature of research
[16:39:22] <t12> 90% of it goes down the drain
[16:39:33] <SpeedEvil> SLS is basically a rocket made with 30 or 40 year old technology, and the worst of military/aerospace construction practices.
[16:39:58] <t12> i agree that alot of their stuff should be done outside the bubble
[16:40:04] <t12> the actual manufacture
[16:40:24] <t12> i think people overestimate the availability of the manufacturing capacity though
[16:40:31] <SpeedEvil> It basically started from the premise 'I don't want the rocket engine plant in my patch to shut down, so you should make something with them'
[16:41:14] <t12> free marketing the manufacture contract doesnt really solve that
[16:41:34] <SpeedEvil> No.
[16:41:35] <SpeedEvil> http://www.parabolicarc.com/2011/05/31/nasa-analysis-falcon-9-cheaper-traditional-approach/
[16:42:17] <t12> are they counting the cost of training all the ex-nasa people they hired
[16:42:24] <SpeedEvil> The design was broken from the beginning as it was predicated on including specif tech
[16:42:58] <CaptHindsight> Senator Makes NASA Complete $350 Million Testing Tower That It Will Never Use
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/jan/30/golden-hammer-350-million-nasa-project-to-be-compl/
[16:43:11] <t12> comparing the political realities of a multibillionaire funding spaceX out of pocket
[16:43:18] <t12> and a fed org is somewhat unfair
[16:43:25] <t12> the fed org is always going to be a shitshow
[16:44:22] <CaptHindsight> it's going to take another FDR to fix things here, so highly unlikely
[16:46:30] <t12> we need some orson wells war of the worlds radio prank incoming death asteroid hoax
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[16:46:35] <t12> to get some real motivation
[16:46:54] <t12> combined with some hollywood armageddon script
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[16:51:44] <IchGuckLive> hi all B)
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[17:13:08] <Jymmm> Gawd FF is annoying... The Dev's spend way too much time making changes to the UI and forcing you to see it their way, instead of working on core services, like the years old memory leaks *ARGH*
[17:13:16] <SpeedEvil> :/
[17:15:42] * jthornton wonders why people use so many emoicons when they don't show up on a lot of irc clients...
[17:15:58] <IchGuckLive> ssi: i got the homing
[17:16:11] <SpeedEvil> Sure they show up, as intended
[17:17:26] <IchGuckLive> ssi: ?
[17:17:37] <archivist> because they are the original character as they were before the graphic ones existed
[17:18:08] <Jymmm> jthornton: Show up fine here, see... ┌П┐(•_•)┌П┐
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[17:24:13] <IchGuckLive> !seen h_maximilian
[17:24:13] <the_wench> last seen in #linuxcnc 2014-06-12 22:10:06GMT 20:14:05 ago, saying bye
[17:27:05] <Jymmm> jthornton: ascii art existed decades before emoticons. If some irc/im/chat clients replace them with graphical versions
[17:27:44] <IchGuckLive> ascii art is still a great advance
[17:28:32] <IchGuckLive> plc systems lie that intro artists
[17:28:41] <IchGuckLive> like
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[17:37:46] <IchGuckLive> all the USA news is now of here as the last POW is now back in the US
[17:49:52] <Jymmm> IchGuckLive: old news
[17:50:17] <IchGuckLive> news are always old
[17:50:31] <IchGuckLive> only live on twitter
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[17:51:51] <IchGuckLive> weathere here in germany is great the thunderstorm stopped 2 mil outside town ,but we bearly need some water for farming plants
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[17:56:31] <IchGuckLive> ok m off frieday chicken BBQ bye
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[17:59:17] <Jymmm> YAY status bar...
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/status-4-evar/?src=userprofile
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[18:51:52] <zeeshan-laptop> hi
[18:51:59] <zeeshan-laptop> whats that open source software someone was talking about
[18:52:18] <zeeshan-laptop> 3d vision
[18:52:21] <zeeshan-laptop> forgot the name
[18:53:14] <SpeedEvil> opencv?
[18:53:52] <zeeshan-laptop> thanks
[18:53:53] <zeeshan-laptop> thats it
[19:00:04] <SpeedEvil> http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2013/01/17000-linux-powered-rifle-brings-auto-aim-to-the-real-world/ - I wonder if they comply with GPL
[19:00:11] <SpeedEvil> (sort-of-computer-vision-related)
[19:04:16] <cradek> > There's a social media aspect, too
[19:04:21] <cradek> oh save us all
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[20:30:41] <ssi> jthornton: the growing ubiquity of Emoji is forcing the world to figure out how to be unicode compliant, which is a good thing in a roundabout sort of way :)
[20:31:04] <Jymmm> ASCII RULES
[20:31:12] <ssi> Emoji exists in the supplemental multilingual plane, ie above code point U+FFFF, which means it breaks all sorts of not-quite-compliant systems :)
[20:31:45] <ssi> makes my life difficult on a regular basis :P
[20:32:23] <Jymmm> ssi: I got your emoji right here buddy... 🐶 🐺 🐱 🐭 🐹 🐰 🐸 🐯 🐨
[20:32:37] <ssi> hilariously, that doesn't render here :)
[20:33:04] <ssi> 💩
[20:33:05] <Jymmm> ssi: then you are not unicode compliant biotch! =)
[20:33:09] <ssi> correct
[20:33:22] <ssi> at least irssi running inside screen over an ssh link is not compliant
[20:33:27] <ssi> this terminal is compliant
[20:33:30] <Jymmm> lol
[20:33:47] <ssi> that's the problem with this crap... it's hard to know exactly where in the chain is mangling the unicode
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[20:34:14] <Jymmm> ssi: Here, have some GMO 🌽 <--- wanna guess what that is?
[20:34:21] <ssi> corn? :P
[20:34:26] <Jymmm> =)
[20:34:29] <ssi> I dunno just looks like a diamond with a question mark inside
[20:34:33] <ssi> :)
[20:34:48] <Jymmm> Yeah, I know.
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[20:35:47] <Jymmm> I still like ASCII tyvm
[20:37:19] <ssi> yeah but, define ascii?
[20:37:37] <Jymmm> google it
[20:37:42] <ssi> no I know what it is
[20:37:54] <Jymmm> then dont ask dumb questions =)
[20:37:58] <ssi> but what you did above isn't ascii
[20:38:03] <ssi> ┌П┐(•_•)┌П┐
[20:38:28] <ssi> ascii is everything below 0x7F
[20:38:40] <Jymmm> ( . ) ( . )
[20:38:44] <ssi> there's chars in your delightful little emoticon that don't exist in ascii
[20:39:03] <Jymmm> ----`-,--{@
[20:39:07] <Jymmm> ascii
[20:39:27] <ssi> nice thing is, ascii is byte-compatible with utf-8
[20:39:37] <Jymmm> fsck utf
[20:39:56] <Deejay> rosebuds and yeehaw
[20:40:03] <Jymmm> lol
[20:40:32] <ssi> without utf, you have 8 bit charsets that differ depending on code page
[20:40:41] <ssi> iso-8859-1, MacRoman, etc
[20:40:46] <ssi> that scheme is a pain in the ass
[20:40:54] <Jymmm> ssi: 7bit ascii damnit, quit fscing with me =)
[20:41:07] <ssi> but usually when shit goes wrong, what you're seeing is two byte utf chars that get rendered as high-ascii chars in some codepage
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[20:42:44] <ssi> so like, ñ in utf-8 is 0xC3 0xB1
[20:43:03] <ssi> in ISO-8859-1, that'll render as ñ
[20:44:50] <ssi> in other news
[20:44:55] <ssi> I want to buy a sailboat
[20:44:58] <ssi> which is a TERRIBLE IDEA
[20:46:22] <DaViruz> me too :)
[20:46:24] <skunkworks_> A hole in the water to throw money into
[20:46:26] <DaViruz> a small one though
[20:46:40] <ssi> skunkworks_: I own two airplanes... at this point boats seem CHEAP
[20:46:51] <ssi> DaViruz: how small?
[20:47:18] <DaViruz> optimist :)
[20:49:36] <ssi> the rational part of me says buy a cheap little 14-17' sailboat that I can tow behind my car and screw around for the summer
[20:49:56] <Deejay> gn8
[20:49:56] <ssi> the idiot part of my brain found a really nice little 26' sloop for a good price that I can keep in a slip on the lake
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[20:50:50] <SpeedEvil> ssi: Do both.
[20:50:53] <SpeedEvil> ssi: Flying boat.
[20:51:16] <ssi> http://www.homebuiltairplanes.com/forums/attachments/general-experimental-aviation-questions/22564d1361202522-rlu-1-breezy-floats-breezy-019.jpg
[20:51:38] <DaViruz> i saw an rv6 with amphibious floats
[20:51:41] <DaViruz> that would be nice
[20:51:51] <ssi> nah, too slow
[20:52:06] <ssi> I'm pretty sure that rv is actually the fastest single floatplane ever
[20:52:17] <ssi> but still, wasteful to build a 170kt plane and then intentionally slow it donw to 135kt
[20:52:56] <SpeedEvil> yeah - quite tricky to do a floatplane without MASSIVE DRAG
[20:53:24] <ssi> flying boats do better than floatplanes
[20:53:29] <SpeedEvil> indeed
[20:53:47] <ssi> but no, I need a sailboat, AND a floatplane
[20:53:50] <ssi> so I can fly my plane to my boat
[20:53:57] <ssi> hmm.. I love when a plan comes together :D
[20:54:24] <SpeedEvil> Or a really big sailboat, with a catapult.
[20:54:55] <ssi> god help me I kinda really want to go look at this
[20:54:55] <ssi> http://atlanta.craigslist.org/atl/boa/4517798981.html
[20:56:12] <skunkworks_> 3 grand seems cheap
[20:56:26] <ssi> yeah it's on the cheap side, but not unrealistically so
[20:56:31] <ssi> boats in that size tend to be pretty cheap
[20:56:47] <ssi> cause they're harder to sell than smaller boats, but not as desirable by rich people as bigger ones :P
[20:56:48] <skunkworks_> almost 'send me the money western union' cheap
[20:57:05] <ssi> haha
[20:58:33] <DaViruz> ssi: have any prior boats?
[20:58:46] <ssi> no
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[21:01:12] <ssi> I need to find someone who wants to sell a sailboat for bitcoin
[21:01:13] <ssi> hahahah
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[21:09:10] <DaViruz> i found this page the other day while researching homebuilt 12V compressor refrigerators
[21:09:13] <DaViruz> http://www.wbryant.com/StellaBoat/index.htm
[21:09:22] <DaViruz> quite a lot of interesting sailboat projects/articles
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[21:49:37] <fenugrec> has anyone here installed linuxcnc on archlinux ?
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[22:01:46] <CaptHindsight> fenugrec: yes, a few years ago
[22:01:57] <CaptHindsight> the arch package is old
[22:02:37] <fenugrec> CaptHindsight: yeah, the instructions on the wiki are very outdated. And it seems no one ever installs RTAI on arch so there's that, too
[22:03:01] <CaptHindsight> too much work to support
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[22:03:18] <CaptHindsight> we maintained the package for a a year or two
[22:03:27] <fenugrec> hmm
[22:03:29] <CaptHindsight> arch always breaks
[22:04:01] <fenugrec> At what level ? the required patches no longer work after a few version changes of the core packages (ie kernel, etc) ?
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[22:06:24] <CaptHindsight> well the kernel has (or had) to be RTAI
[22:06:52] <fenugrec> Supposing I wanted to fight my way through... RTAI has to be build into the kernel or can it work with the linux-rt kernel that's already in the arch repo ?
[22:07:36] <Jymmm> fenugrec: Why arch?
[22:07:51] <CaptHindsight> well now you can use RTAI, Xenomai or preempt_rt
[22:08:31] <fenugrec> Jymmm: I'm familiar with it and I know I can get it to work on my POS computer, and it's going to be easier (for me) to trim it down to the bare essentials
[22:09:30] <fenugrec> I thought RTAI provided special API functions... so just the linux-rt preempting kernel could work ?
[22:09:31] <Jymmm> fenugrec: You can't just use a "random" computer. It has to meet a latency requirement.
[22:09:59] <Jymmm> fenugrec: It cna be a POST, but it has to be a good POS =)
[22:10:06] <Jymmm> fenugrec: It cna be a POS, but it has to be a good POS =)
[22:10:17] <CaptHindsight> fenugrec: try the livecd first and the latency test
[22:10:37] <Jymmm> fenugrec: laptops are inherintantly bad
[22:11:26] <fenugrec> Jymmm: of course. But I have one drafted for the job, has the IO I need (even has 3 ISA slots hehe). It's an intel 440BX chipset which is listed somewhere on
http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Latency-Test
[22:11:27] <Jymmm> fenugrec: Save yourself the grief and try the LIveCD first
[22:12:09] <Jymmm> fenugrec: Is it a server mobo?
[22:12:13] <fenugrec> Jymmm: I'm fighting a logistics problem. I don't have a CD drive for this computer. I've never had much success converting a live CD ISO to a live USB
[22:12:21] <fenugrec> nope
[22:12:48] <fenugrec> I would try a PXE boot but I've never done that either
[22:13:42] <CaptHindsight> http://unetbootin.sourceforge.net/
[22:13:54] <Jymmm> fenugrec: Well, send the $40 for an external USB optical drive or try Unetbootin
[22:14:20] <Jymmm> spend*
[22:15:17] <fenugrec> Friday > 6PM, no can do ! I will check unetbootin though, I wasn't aware it could re-work ISOs.
[22:16:01] <Jymmm> fenugrec: I love this external enclosure then just but cheap $16 optical drives as needed
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817392031&cm_re=vantec-_-17-392-031-_-Product
[22:16:38] <Jymmm> fenugrec: Even has an internal PS. I burned out way too many of those slim USB crapdrives
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[22:17:24] <Jymmm> and they only worked half the time anyway
[22:17:38] <Jymmm> for burning that is
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[22:18:03] <PCW> catching fire?
[22:18:17] <Jymmm> PCW: DVD-R/W =)
[22:19:02] <Jymmm> Really is a good enclosure though, recognized on all systems thus far
[22:19:09] <Jymmm> pc/mac/linux
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[22:19:37] <Jymmm> PCW: Fry's has it too
[22:21:24] <fenugrec> ugh I can't remember if I can boot from USB with this dinosaur
[22:21:30] <fenugrec> (USB 1.1 ! Bring it on)
[22:22:16] <Jymmm> fenugrec: what mobo model?
[22:24:05] <fenugrec> Jymmm: hmm, kind of embarassing.... Shuttle 661
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/440bx-motherboard-review,91-11.html
[22:24:30] <fenugrec> oops
http://www.motherboard.cz/mb/shuttle/HOT-661.htm
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[22:25:46] <Jymmm> fenugrec: Why are you trying to use such an acient mobo? What do you plan on dong with linuxcnc?
[22:25:53] <Jymmm> doing*
[22:26:17] <fenugrec> I realise I'm pushing the enveloppe but I would really like to not buy another computer if I can help it
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[22:26:50] <Jymmm> fenugrec: What do you plan on doing with linuxcnc?
[22:26:53] <fenugrec> XZ turning (software stepping), and probably modbus stuff for the spindle drive + PLC
[22:27:11] <Jymmm> running a lathe?
[22:27:13] <fenugrec> I really have a bad feeling about the software stepping but I won't know until I can get a latency test done
[22:27:16] <fenugrec> yes
[22:27:29] <Jymmm> fenugrec: where are you?
[22:27:37] <fenugrec> Canada
[22:28:21] <Jymmm> P2 400, ouch
[22:28:38] <Jymmm> I'm sure you can find something newer than that.
[22:29:48] <Jymmm> I wouldn't even try to use anythign less than a PIII at the very minimum
[22:29:57] <fenugrec> P2 450 ! Yes I can buy a better computer. But I have this one on hand, doing nothing. I figured it was worth a try
[22:30:31] <Jymmm> You figured wrong =)
[22:30:59] <Jymmm> I barely get a P2 running DOS and TurboCNC to work on a P2 =)
[22:32:04] <Jymmm> If you are bored and have all the time in the world, and you dont mind tweaking/compiling/leanring/researching all you need, then sure.
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[22:32:51] <Jymmm> fenugrec: I have no issues with POS, but it has to be Quality POS at least =)
[22:34:09] <Jymmm> fenugrec: I hold on to everything. But a coupel years ago I finally got rid of all IDE mobo's
[22:34:30] <Jymmm> fenugrec: And I had great server mobo's too =)
[22:35:08] <Jymmm> multi-core dual cpus, 16gb ram, craploads of I/O
[22:35:12] <fenugrec> Yeah, well if I can hack a bootable-something I'll at least try a latency test. It's not like I'm asking for full live 3D toolpath visualization while streaming an HD movie on a dualhead setup for those really long cycles
[22:35:28] <fenugrec> Jymmm: I understand you're not in Canada p-)
[22:35:45] <Jymmm> fenugrec: I'm talking shitty graphics, not all this 3D/HD crap
[22:36:20] <Jymmm> fenugrec: You are not in a 3rd world country =) I know a lot of canucks that find stuff
[22:37:36] <fenugrec> Jymmm: oh I can find free/cheap stuff around here, but it takes longer, and most people ask retarded prices for old crap (>100$ for P4 dumpsters, etc)
[22:38:04] <Jymmm> fenugrec: are the caps on that thing even good?
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[22:39:06] <fenugrec> Jymmm: course they are ! They hadn't invented leaky caps yet p-)) It was my shop music net-streamer until recently
[22:39:18] <fenugrec> *workshop
[22:39:34] <Jymmm> fenugrec: Uh huh =)
[22:40:26] <Jymmm> fenugrec: well, like I said if you have all the time in the world, it *might* work.
[22:40:59] <Jymmm> fenugrec: but for a couple hundred bucks you can even get a brand new system too
[22:41:16] <Jymmm> http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=4044
[22:41:47] <fenugrec> I'd rather spend the money on tooling.. I'm a cheap mofo when it comes to buying computer stuff.
[22:42:22] <fenugrec> haahahaha well I must have got a good board : it still boots fine and it's overclocked to a mad 464MHz p-)
[22:42:38] <Jymmm> time = money, your choice =)
[22:43:54] <PCW> Pentium2 450 is at least 1998 so only sweet 16 or so
[22:43:59] <fenugrec> But I hate buying computers !
[22:44:20] <Jymmm> fine, then steal them, whatever =)
[22:44:34] <ssi> p2's are over the age of consent? sweet!
[22:44:40] <CaptHindsight> Dell Dimension XPS T450 Intel 440BX 450MHz Pentium III 25170 -1mS and 16375 -25us
[22:45:06] <fenugrec> CaptHindsight: and that's good, ok, or total crap?
[22:45:11] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: Yeah, but yours is a PIII, not a PII
[22:45:29] <jdh> there isn't a lot of difference, other than an I
[22:45:39] <CaptHindsight> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Latency-Test
[22:46:03] <CaptHindsight> 1 less P
[22:46:09] <Jymmm> jdh: please tell me your kidding
[22:46:40] <jdh> compared to anything in the last 10 years, no.
[22:47:08] <Jymmm> last 10 years has been i3/5/7
[22:47:18] <fenugrec> Suppose I get this working with a reasonable latency result, where am I going to have speed problems : buggy G41/G42 circles, slow GUI, or what ?
[22:47:21] <CaptHindsight> didn't that BX chipset come out in 98'
[22:48:30] <CaptHindsight> 34uS steps = ~30k steps per second
[22:51:11] <fenugrec> My machine previously had a Mach3 on winXP setup, I don't now what the step rate was though
[22:52:56] <PCW> i7s are not 10 years old (only about 5/6)
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[22:53:19] <PCW> 10 years ago was P4 territory
[22:54:46] <fenugrec> P4 with HT is bad for linuxCNC, right ?
[22:55:22] <PCW> juts turn it off
[22:55:27] <CaptHindsight> The first AMD64-based processor, the Opteron, was released in April 2003
[22:57:45] <jdh> only 11 years after the first AXP/64
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[23:07:53] <fenugrec> ugh I won't have enough RAM to do this liveCD thing anyway
[23:09:14] <JT-Shop> will 8.04 run on that computer
[23:09:36] <fenugrec> probably ? It runs 2.6 kernels fine
[23:09:53] -!- asdfasd has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
[23:11:39] <JT-Shop> use the 8.04 LiveCD and just upgrade LinuxCNC
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[23:12:45] <fenugrec> even with 160MB RAM ?
[23:15:07] <JT-Shop> dunno what the minimum ram is for 8.04
[23:16:06] <JT-Shop> what part of the world are you in?
[23:17:35] <fenugrec> Canada, hoping to use an antique to run my CNC
[23:19:10] <JT-Shop> if you can get 8.04 to install you might be able to use a non-graphical interface like keystick
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[23:19:54] <JT-Shop> see the different user interfaces here
http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/
[23:20:45] <JT-Shop> you might even try 6.06
[23:21:35] <JT-Shop> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Installing_LinuxCNC
[23:21:41] <fenugrec> keystick looks great, and that way I don't need X11
[23:22:48] <JT-Shop> http://www.linuxcnc.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=21&Itemid=4&lang=en|Complete
[23:22:54] <JT-Shop> found the 6.06 link
[23:23:22] * JT-Shop heads out
[23:23:44] <fenugrec> But with 6.06 I think I'll "max out" at release 2.3 ?
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[23:24:10] <JT-Shop> yup
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