#linuxcnc | Logs for 2014-03-28

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[00:03:34] <R2E4_> The spindle drive looks like I hae to tell it which direction and the analog input. I get back from the drive when it is at zero and when it is at speed, not sure what the "spindle certain speed signal" output is.
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[00:23:54] <R2E4_> With a spindle forward and spindle revverse input along with analog vcmd, Would think that with both spindle forward and reverse input is false, the brake would be on on the spindle.
[00:27:00] <R2E4_> I could use the hal pin Spindle forward for input to spindle drive SP forware input. thoughts?
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[00:40:22] <Connor> Is there a way to run a .ngc file via gladevcp ?
[00:40:32] <Connor> Thinking I'll have to use remap to do it...
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[00:52:11] <XXCoder> mn 3d printing is everywhere.
[00:52:27] <XXCoder> docyor printed up a skull top and replaced lady orginial with it
[00:52:41] <XXCoder> she has this rare skull growing condition
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[00:53:17] <XXCoder> hey
[00:55:16] <R2E4_> What gcode file is loading when Lcnc isstarted and where is it configged at?
[00:56:06] <PetefromTn_> you mean the lcnc logo code?
[00:56:46] <R2E4_> yeah, I read it but cant remember which manual
[00:57:01] <R2E4_> I want to change it.
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[01:02:51] <R2E4_> Pete, did you finish the rifle guide?
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[01:03:29] <Connor> OPEN_FILE=
[01:03:45] <Connor> PetefromTn_: Getting close on the toolchanger code...
[01:04:12] <R2E4_> In the ini?
[01:04:28] <Connor> I have Ram In, Ram Out, and have it seeking the pockets correctly.. just finished up the get_tool
[01:04:34] <Connor> grep for it.. but.. Yea..
[01:04:58] <Connor> now need to do put_tool.. and the string it all together correctly.
[01:04:58] <PetefromTn_> R2E4 No not yet ben working for the other shop more lately...
[01:05:37] <Connor> PetefromTn_: Having to simulate all these sensors via gladevcp is a task.. Forget one little sensor in the proper sequence and it aborts out...
[01:06:12] <PetefromTn_> Connor No shit man you are awesome dude.. I cannot wait to see this monster change tools. Running those Haas machines all day and watching the toolchanger work is like being in a Candy store and not being able to eat any Chocolate ;)
[01:06:25] <Connor> I bet.
[01:06:32] <XXCoder> did I miss link by connor?
[01:06:45] <Connor> Link for what ?
[01:06:52] <PetefromTn_> I actually ran that VF8 today... Damn that thing is hube.
[01:06:59] <PetefromTn_> huge.
[01:07:01] <XXCoder> your tool changer on progress? guess havent linked? heh
[01:07:04] <R2E4_> Thanks, got it.
[01:07:17] <PetefromTn_> The travels are like 64x40 or so...
[01:07:22] <Connor> linked? Still working on it in simulator
[01:07:48] <XXCoder> to video or something. lol ok. cant wait to see it too. :)
[01:08:05] <Connor> That'll be PetefromTn_'s thing to do after I get it finished.
[01:08:16] <PetefromTn_> I machined a piece of 2" thick UHMW plastic plate into 48 inch disks with holes and pockets and counterbores on them. weigh a bunch..
[01:08:24] <Connor> PetefromTn_: A few things about the tool table and editor.
[01:09:01] <Connor> 1) The pocket field, is only useful for Random Tool changers..
[01:09:19] <Connor> 2) the Pocket is actually the ROW that the tool is in the tool changer when not in random mode.
[01:09:44] <PetefromTn_> huh what do you mean row?
[01:09:59] <Connor> Just that.. it's a grid layout.. right ?
[01:10:14] <Connor> first row may have tool # 4, but, since it's in the first row, that's pocket 1
[01:10:25] <PetefromTn_> you talking about the tool editor from File etc.
[01:10:30] <Connor> next row, would be the 2nd pocket..
[01:10:51] <Connor> editor OR file.. the pocket is the row # of the tool
[01:11:07] <Connor> the POC field isn't used in non random tool changers.
[01:11:19] <PetefromTn_> it has tool number then next column is pocket numbr..
[01:11:39] <Connor> right, that pocket number isn't used in non-random tool changers..
[01:11:46] <Connor> the row # is.
[01:11:47] <PetefromTn_> whaddya mean non random, my toolchanger goes both directions.
[01:12:08] <Connor> apparently some tool changers can place a tool in a random pocket...
[01:12:21] <Connor> and it keeps track of which pocket it put the tool in via that field.
[01:12:35] <Connor> your tools will always go into the same pocket.
[01:12:43] <PetefromTn_> actually yeah the Haas VF8 with side mount changer does that...
[01:13:00] <PetefromTn_> that is interesting because.
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[01:13:46] <PetefromTn_> I was running the VF3 today and thinking about the differences between the VF3, the VF8, and how my machine will run.
[01:14:05] <PetefromTn_> In this shop when they setup a job ( and they setup a LOT of jobs)
[01:14:38] <PetefromTn_> They actually just make a small list of the tools necessary with the type of cutter, the diameter, and tool material type.
[01:14:54] <PetefromTn_> Then they setup the order in the list from first to next to last tools.
[01:15:08] <Connor> That makes sense...
[01:15:10] <PetefromTn_> Then they go to the machine and load the tools into the pockets in that order.
[01:15:20] <PetefromTn_> So tool one is first tool in pocket 1.
[01:15:25] <PetefromTn_> and so forth and so on.
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[01:16:13] <Connor> right.. Well.. that's all incidental to this.. I was just wanting to make sure you knew that the POC field had nothing to do with the actual pocket your tool will be in in your configuration.
[01:16:14] <PetefromTn_> Which is actually quite nice because it is easier to keep track of things when you are running the code especially when you have to rerun part of the code which happens quite often.
[01:16:49] <PetefromTn_> however I will have to change my current tool thinking somewhat.
[01:17:06] <PetefromTn_> I have TRIED to always keep certain tools loaded in their holders whenever possible.
[01:17:29] <PetefromTn_> I have setup my Cam to use those tools and whatever numbers assigned to them.
[01:17:42] <Connor> You can't have it ask for a tool that's not in the tool table.. and if it's in the tool table, it'll have a pocket...
[01:18:44] <PetefromTn_> So when I do a cam program a part and the tools are already assigned numbers I will need to somehow assign the order of the tool instead of just selecting the tool
[01:18:54] <Connor> right
[01:19:17] <PetefromTn_> if I ask for a tool that is not in the table it puts up a dialog saying there is no such tool or something currently.
[01:19:28] <PetefromTn_> on my machine.
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[01:19:43] <Connor> Now, You could have tools in pockets above 20, which *I* might be able to program it to ask for the tool manually.. but.. we'll see..
[01:20:25] <PetefromTn_> I am very curious as to how this is going to work on the toolchanger compared to how the haas works.
[01:20:30] <PetefromTn_> For instance.
[01:20:32] <Connor> I might look at the random-toolpocket stuff.
[01:20:43] <PetefromTn_> When you load a new tool on the haas.
[01:21:28] <PetefromTn_> you basically hit a button that says tool fwd or tool rev which basically rotates the carousel to that pocket.
[01:21:40] <PetefromTn_> If there is a tool in it say tool one which is also pocket one.
[01:22:13] <PetefromTn_> Then you press the PDB button and release the tool manually
[01:22:21] <PetefromTn_> and load your new tool.
[01:22:34] <PetefromTn_> You can then touch off the tool with the handwheel.
[01:22:48] <PetefromTn_> They happen to touch off all tools to the workpiece in this shop.
[01:23:11] <PetefromTn_> I would use the G59.3 setup I currently use and once our tool probe is finished I will use that.
[01:23:44] <Connor> Well.. right now, just trying to get the "basic" tool change part done..
[01:23:49] <PetefromTn_> Once the tool is touched off you just press tool fwd button and the machine automatically raises the head up to toolchange height and changes that tool to the next pocket.
[01:23:54] <Connor> the loading of tools and touching off will be next..
[01:24:16] <PetefromTn_> Oh I know man I was just wanting to tell you what these machines do.
[01:24:47] <Connor> yea. Might have to stop by one day and take a look at one being loaded.. not saying we'll be able to match it..
[01:24:47] <skunkworks> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qp0ZpxsgxVs&feature=youtu.be
[01:24:59] <PetefromTn_> so then it loads the tool in the next pocket
[01:25:05] <PetefromTn_> into the spindle.
[01:25:23] <PetefromTn_> You can then manually load another tool or touch off that tool if it is the one you want.
[01:25:34] <Connor> What is that skunkworks? Looks like a tiny knee mill
[01:25:47] <PetefromTn_> Then continue until all tools are loaded into the pockets for the program.
[01:27:42] <Connor> Okay.. going to go watch some TV for a bit.. been hard at this.. just have the put_tool command left.. and then some logic in the main core of the program..
[01:27:52] <Connor> simulating all the sensors is a b!tch
[01:27:59] <PetefromTn_> I am sure man...
[01:28:01] <XXCoder> skunk will bit be above? the platform movements would make it inverse height cut? or am I wrong
[01:28:14] <PetefromTn_> Skunkie man that little bitch hauls ass huh..
[01:28:15] <Connor> if I forget one or get them out of order.. it aborts out.. which is good.. but still..
[01:28:44] <PetefromTn_> I would like to see the simulations run so I can understand what is SUPPOSED to happen here...
[01:31:52] <PetefromTn_> I would love to see a video of a linuxCNC machining center with toolchanger loading tools and changing tools etc...
[01:32:08] <PetefromTn_> To be able to see how others machines are setup.
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[01:32:48] <Connor_iPad> Ok. On ipad on couch.
[01:33:02] <PetefromTn_> The shop I work in they all use Mastercam.
[01:33:15] <PetefromTn_> They are encouraging me to learn to use it.
[01:33:26] <Tom_itx> do it
[01:33:47] <PetefromTn_> I am apparently able to take a copy home to play with but they gotta talk to them about it first or something.
[01:34:14] <Tom_itx> no hardware dongles on it?
[01:34:23] <PetefromTn_> Some of the guys apparently have thier own copies ..
[01:34:30] <PetefromTn_> I did not ask how LOL.
[01:34:39] <PetefromTn_> No apparenlty there is no dongle.
[01:34:50] <Tom_itx> there used to be on mine
[01:35:12] <skunkworks> it is a little trainer we got from a local high school
[01:35:20] <PetefromTn_> They have it on three machines in the building and I never saw a dongle in there.
[01:35:25] <skunkworks> it kinda looks like a small knee mill
[01:35:48] <PetefromTn_> yeah it is cool man..
[01:35:53] <Connor_iPad> skunkworks: That's what I said.
[01:36:06] <PetefromTn_> what does the millhead look like.
[01:36:11] <Connor_iPad> Where do you find all these machines at in schools?
[01:37:09] <PetefromTn_> They are using Mastercam X7 or X9 or something.
[01:37:26] <Tom_itx> i've seen it but never used it
[01:37:51] <PetefromTn_> They kinda overwhelmed me a bit today..LOL
[01:37:58] <Tom_itx> how so?
[01:38:08] <PetefromTn_> They had two parts that cost 2k each in the shop.
[01:38:22] <PetefromTn_> they had already put a bunch of hours of machine time into them.
[01:38:28] <PetefromTn_> Very tight tolerances..
[01:38:38] <Tom_itx> sounds like most of what we ran
[01:38:45] <PetefromTn_> a bunch of bored holes and pockets at wierd angles
[01:38:59] <Tom_itx> those Ti parts were probably 25k
[01:39:01] <PetefromTn_> They were then ground for a fine finish on all sides.
[01:39:27] <PetefromTn_> They wanted me to do the final operation drilling and rigid tapping several holes into the sides.
[01:39:51] <Connor_iPad> Man they're brave. :)
[01:39:58] <PetefromTn_> I was scared shitless of screwing it up and lunching several days worth of work,
[01:40:29] <PetefromTn_> I got it done tho but on the last one the damn tap broke off down in a hole...
[01:40:37] <PetefromTn_> I was crushed..
[01:40:47] <PetefromTn_> I almost walked out the door......
[01:40:56] <PetefromTn_> They were surprised me
[01:41:07] <PetefromTn_> They were like Oh man that's okay shit happens...
[01:41:22] <PetefromTn_> Then they used some space age drills and machined out the tap right before my eyes...
[01:41:52] <Connor_iPad> Nice.
[01:41:55] <PetefromTn_> We hand finished that hole and got the parts done just about a half hour before time to go home.
[01:41:57] <XXCoder> indeed
[01:42:02] <Valen> probably carbide
[01:42:34] <PetefromTn_> The main guy they have there has been a pro for over thirty years and KNOWS HIS SHIT...
[01:42:47] <PetefromTn_> I feel like a kindergartner...
[01:42:59] <XXCoder> some things cannot be taught in class
[01:43:24] <Tom_itx> most things worth remembering aren't
[01:43:29] <PetefromTn_> I honestly feel fortunate to be able to work alongside them and learn and get paid pretty well for it...
[01:43:53] <PetefromTn_> I cannot say it is not without stress tho LOL.
[01:43:57] <XXCoder> skunkworks: was I wrong? from what I see, if bit was at fixed Z, it would make pocket shaped like teddy bear?
[01:44:14] <XXCoder> I bet. :)
[01:44:18] <PetefromTn_> Its the linuxCNC penguin...
[01:44:23] <PetefromTn_> Lying on his back...
[01:44:40] <XXCoder> ahh yea didnt look closely to what object was, just looking at Z movements.
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[01:45:06] <PetefromTn_> I was looking at some sweet motors and drivers setup LOL
[01:45:35] <PetefromTn_> I did screw up today at work tho about an hour after I got there LOL... I mean besides the broken tap.
[01:45:48] <PetefromTn_> When I was running that HUGE VF8 machine.
[01:45:59] <PetefromTn_> And cutting those 48" disks.
[01:46:23] <PetefromTn_> You basically have to get INSIDE the machine to load and unload parts and clamp stuff down.
[01:46:36] <PetefromTn_> Well like a meat head I crawl in there
[01:46:53] <XXCoder> m,achine not off?
[01:46:58] <PetefromTn_> and I am concentrating so much on where things need to line up and how they get clamped down.
[01:47:02] <Tom_itx> don't hit your head on the spindle
[01:47:16] <skunkworks> XXCoder: http://electronicsam.com/images/emco/terco.JPG
[01:47:16] <PetefromTn_> I basically bumped my head into the friggin
[01:47:26] <PetefromTn_> 1" cutter in the spindle..
[01:47:35] <XXCoder> ow
[01:47:39] <PetefromTn_> Cut my head and bled like a stuck pig...
[01:48:05] <PetefromTn_> I thought I was gonna need to go to the hospital and the chinese owner lady looked VERY worried LOL...
[01:48:17] <skunkworks> I split my head open once.. first time I found out blood had a smell...
[01:48:23] <PetefromTn_> Funny thing is it was just a nick and it bled like crazy,.
[01:48:33] <Tom_itx> depending on what it was, i'd sometimes manually pull the tool outta the spindle
[01:49:03] <PetefromTn_> I just got a damp rag and held it on there for like ten minutes and the bleeding stopped finally and I went to work.
[01:49:33] <PetefromTn_> The machine is so HUGE I guess I figured the cutter was much higher than it appeared.
[01:49:49] <PetefromTn_> but actually no we do not power down the machine.
[01:49:55] <Valen> head wounds bleed a whole bunch
[01:50:06] <PetefromTn_> You can lockout any movement tho before you get inside there.
[01:50:14] <Valen> mechanically?
[01:50:26] <PetefromTn_> yeah it bled like freakin' crazy..
[01:50:34] <PetefromTn_> No electronically in the control.
[01:50:45] <PetefromTn_> Plus there are places you can stand safely..
[01:51:01] <PetefromTn_> It actually has like foot treads inside there so you don't slip.
[01:51:02] <Valen> mmm, not too sure how i feel about that
[01:51:16] <Tom_itx> some are so big you can't avoid it
[01:51:22] <PetefromTn_> Yeah I know I was not either but they do it all the time...You pretty much have to..
[01:51:28] <Valen> oh going in sure thats fine
[01:51:47] <Valen> I'd just want some big switches to physically remove power from the motors
[01:51:56] <PetefromTn_> You have to touch off stuff tools, fixtures etc...
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[01:52:20] <PetefromTn_> Usually you just grab the MPG and climb inside there...
[01:52:22] <Valen> i mean a comsic ray hitting a transistor and turning it on is not how you want to die yaknow
[01:53:39] <PetefromTn_> Like I said I agree it is probably not that great an idea but the machine IS designed to work that way...
[01:53:57] <Valen> if there are safe places to stand sure stand in em
[01:54:13] <PetefromTn_> Oh believe me I do..
[01:54:13] <Valen> its just transiting there is something that would concern me
[01:54:39] <PetefromTn_> The table is bigger than my kitchen table LOL...
[01:54:55] <PetefromTn_> There is just no way you could setup anything from outside the machine.
[01:55:15] <Tom_itx> that big 8 spindle bar machine was like that
[01:55:35] <PetefromTn_> Even standing inside you have to reach way over just to get to the back side of the table...
[01:56:08] <PetefromTn_> Would you believe it is only Cat40 tho LOL
[01:56:21] <Tom_itx> high speed spindle?
[01:56:24] <PetefromTn_> They told me the shop they bought it from went out of business...
[01:56:27] <PetefromTn_> Nope
[01:56:44] <PetefromTn_> They said they used it strictly for making plastic parts that were quite large.
[01:56:59] <PetefromTn_> When I asked why NOT a high speed spindle they just shrugged their heads..
[01:57:13] <PetefromTn_> It does have 20 Haaspower tho LOL...
[01:57:30] <Connor_iPad> How fast?
[01:57:42] <PetefromTn_> It has 1000 IPM rapids...
[01:57:49] <Tom_itx> kinda an awkward machine it sounds like
[01:57:51] <PetefromTn_> 7500 RPM spindle.
[01:58:11] <Tom_itx> spindle for steel with feeds for aluminum etc
[01:58:12] <PetefromTn_> yeah kinda... but it can make very large parts tho...
[01:58:56] <PetefromTn_> Honestly this is the second shop I worked in temporarily that had all HAAS machining centers in it..
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[01:59:15] <PetefromTn_> I am always hearing people bitch about how light duty and shitty they are...
[01:59:30] <PetefromTn_> But from what I have seen they make ACCURATE parts day in and day out...
[01:59:36] <Tom_itx> they're more or less like fadals
[01:59:50] <PetefromTn_> Many parts they make they need to hold tenths on and they do it quite easily...
[02:00:59] <Connor_iPad> 7500RPM isn't so low speed.
[02:02:03] <PetefromTn_> I made 400 parts from 4140 Preheat eariler this week and held plus or minus .0005 on an internal pocket easily. In fact I hardly had to adjust anything.. I could have held .0003 easily
[02:02:22] <XXCoder> heh scalp heads always are bleeder
[02:02:55] <PetefromTn_> three of the seven or eight machines has 10k spindles on them.
[02:03:05] <PetefromTn_> have
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[02:04:10] <skunkworks> Tom_itx: ^ new tp running actual hardware...
[02:04:21] <Tom_itx> nice
[02:04:26] <Tom_itx> oh that little test mill?
[02:05:00] <XXCoder> skunkworks: awesome machine, but if platform rises isnt that like -Z?
[02:05:08] <skunkworks> yes
[02:05:13] <XXCoder> ok
[02:05:25] <Connor_iPad> Mini knee mill. :)
[02:05:33] <skunkworks> right - like you said ;)
[02:05:46] <skunkworks> it doesn't matter what moves...
[02:05:53] <skunkworks> table, spindle...
[02:06:01] <PetefromTn_> Is that the same company that makes the sweet little tabletop VMC with toolchanger?
[02:06:16] <Connor_iPad> Looks like it would make a nice engraving machine.
[02:06:16] <PetefromTn_> terco?
[02:06:32] <XXCoder> it looks tough enough to do that for steel
[02:06:44] <skunkworks> terco
[02:07:19] <skunkworks> it is like 7"X3"X2.75" movement
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[02:07:31] <skunkworks> no huge - but usable
[02:07:38] <skunkworks> *not
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[02:07:57] <Connor_iPad> Yea. Like I said. Good for engraving.
[02:09:31] <Connor_iPad> skunkworks: Where do you find those machines? You look for schools upgrading or something ?
[02:09:33] <PetefromTn_> damn It looks larger than that in the video...
[02:10:33] <PetefromTn_> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ol_sFbcKekM
[02:10:45] <PetefromTn_> Sweet little table top mill...
[02:10:55] <skunkworks> Connor_iPad: dad just happened to see an auction at a local school.. (high school even) also where he got the emco lathes.
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[02:14:00] <Connor_iPad> Cool
[02:14:20] <XXCoder> very nice
[02:15:43] <Valen> i so want an atc
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[02:16:32] <PetefromTn_> I tell you what I can't wait to have mine working LOL.... Using them at work they are SWEET!!
[02:16:48] <Tom_itx> Valen, anonimasu made one for his
[02:17:05] <PetefromTn_> Something else I found interesting on the Haas machines...
[02:17:16] <PetefromTn_> They have a G154 offset system.
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[02:17:48] <Tom_itx> that's a machine unique gcode
[02:18:02] <XXCoder> heh I can't wait to actually start building my machine lol. very slow gathering of parts
[02:18:11] <PetefromTn_> Basically like we have G54-G59 they have G154 and up 200 offsets possible in addition to the typical ones.
[02:18:34] <Tom_itx> i'm not real sure why you'd need so many
[02:18:58] <PetefromTn_> I wonder why we cannot have G54.1 .2 .3 etc like G59.3...
[02:18:59] <Tom_itx> even if you're doing part scheduling
[02:19:12] <PetefromTn_> You probably never would....
[02:19:20] <PetefromTn_> but it is nice to know they are there.
[02:20:00] <PetefromTn_> I especially like the Operator coordinate system where you can locate fixtures etc without using an available offset
[02:20:01] <Tom_itx> i mean, the only machine i've ever seen that may use that was one with 8 toumbstones on a conveyor and 190 tool changer
[02:20:20] <Tom_itx> and they didn't use it to it's potential
[02:20:52] <PetefromTn_> Horizontal machining centers with tombstones can KICK ASS in production that is for sure.
[02:21:31] <PetefromTn_> Palletized parts and fixtures etc...when you gotta make parts real fast and run lights out...
[02:22:19] <PetefromTn_> Ya know there are things I do like about linuxCNC over the Haas control too tho...
[02:22:42] <PetefromTn_> For instance the graphical display is way nicer in multi colors on linuxCNC..
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[02:23:48] <PetefromTn_> Haas has a graphical but it is very simple for program prerun to check stuff and it runs thru it very quickly... I am sure there are ways to slow it down but every time I have seen them use it the program is drawn in a couple seconds and the toolpaths are all that is visible...
[02:25:06] <PetefromTn_> The Haas has a jog lock feature where you can select an axis and setup a power feed using the jog buttons quickly.. Comes in real handy for manual milling or facing etc.
[02:25:29] <PetefromTn_> Not sure if you can do that in lunuxCNC without an MDI command.
[02:25:38] <Tom_itx> i think some of the trees did that
[02:26:01] <zeeshan> <- needs cnc like school
[02:26:03] <zeeshan> interface
[02:26:09] <zeeshan> http://imgur.com/XTODa0K
[02:26:21] <zeeshan> i like how you can mill all these different features
[02:26:25] <zeeshan> right on the touch screen
[02:26:39] <PetefromTn_> Never heard too many good things about prototracks...
[02:26:49] <zeeshan> why
[02:26:49] <PetefromTn_> Other than they are simple to program.
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[02:26:56] <zeeshan> it does everything you want it to
[02:27:01] <zeeshan> for a 3 axis
[02:27:02] <PetefromTn_> Just very conversational
[02:27:43] <XXCoder> oh yeah. I saw some machines has some game controller. is it for moving router around on cnc router manually?
[02:27:58] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/vKDC8qo.jpg
[02:28:08] <PetefromTn_> Yeah you can setup some game controllers as a MPG kinda sorta...
[02:28:34] <Connor_iPad> Not sorta. You can. I hade it on my router.
[02:28:35] <PetefromTn_> Is that a trak DPMS bedmill>
[02:28:47] <zeeshan> no idea
[02:28:52] <PetefromTn_> I mean there is no MPG.
[02:28:53] <XXCoder> cool. dunno if would do it though lol
[02:29:18] <Connor_iPad> Pendant.
[02:29:31] <zeeshan> do you guys store your drills
[02:29:34] <zeeshan> in a drill index case like this
[02:29:36] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/M2q7CHU.jpg
[02:29:37] <PetefromTn_> What kinda bike are those jugs from?
[02:29:50] <XXCoder> more chanes I see zee
[02:29:52] <PetefromTn_> Similar but larger.
[02:29:57] <zeeshan> i have a full index
[02:30:00] <zeeshan> too
[02:30:05] <zeeshan> but i cant fit it on the shelf
[02:30:07] <XXCoder> you sure its secure? I guess its screwed direct to beams
[02:30:09] <zeeshan> cause the stupid cases are retarded
[02:30:15] <PetefromTn_> I need to buy some BETTER drills...
[02:30:16] <Connor_iPad> I have harbor freight ones.
[02:30:27] <zeeshan> my 'nice' set is the m42 irwin set
[02:30:32] <XXCoder> zee well you can always make custom low profile drill bit holders
[02:30:36] <zeeshan> but i rarely use it
[02:30:39] <zeeshan> unless im drilling out taps
[02:30:49] <zeeshan> XXCoder: pics
[02:30:53] <PetefromTn_> The shop uses some of those guhring drills and they are AMAZING....
[02:31:09] <zeeshan> i was hoping to remove the index from the case
[02:31:14] <PetefromTn_> EXPENSIVE..
[02:31:16] <zeeshan> and screw it directly to the bench
[02:31:47] <zeeshan> PetefromTn_: what kind of drills
[02:31:52] <PetefromTn_> They use some of the Norseman drills too and they are reasonably priced but great quality. I may try to swing an index full of those at some point soon.
[02:32:25] <zeeshan> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hanson-Irwin-29-Piece-Industrial-Cobalt-Steel-Drill-Bit-Set-1-16-1-2-M42-/160944682144?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item25790cf4a0
[02:32:27] <zeeshan> thats my special set
[02:32:28] <PetefromTn_> Also use Chicago Latrobe or something like that...
[02:32:38] <XXCoder> Zee cant find it but it isnt complex, get a wood beam, drill holes in it using very drill bits you plan to insert in em
[02:32:43] <zeeshan> they've have excellent runout
[02:32:47] <XXCoder> bolt it on wall, done.
[02:32:50] <zeeshan> can drill through stainless like butter
[02:33:04] <zeeshan> and can even drill out taps
[02:33:12] <zeeshan> though i have some carbide bits for that
[02:33:14] <XXCoder> if drills is for metal use metal U beam, drill one side and other side will hold drills up
[02:33:19] <zeeshan> but they're easyto break when using a hand drill
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[02:33:54] <XXCoder> bolt U beam, bottom of "U" towards wall. done
[02:34:13] <zeeshan> M42 is less prone to chipping or breakage than conventional M2 on tougher applications. Rockwell "C" scale hardness for M2 is 61 to 64; M42 is up to 68. - See more at: http://www.woodweb.com/knowledge_base/M42_high_speed_steel.html#sthash.UZIy8AG6.dpuf
[02:34:45] <PetefromTn_> http://www.ebay.com/itm/29-Pcs-Super-Premium-Drill-Bit-Index-Ultradex-Case-CTD-Norseman-SP-29P-/380830446311?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item58ab4372e7
[02:35:07] <PetefromTn_> Some of the guys have that set in a full index... they are nice drills..
[02:35:34] <zeeshan> why are they nice
[02:35:57] <PetefromTn_> They just plain cut like butter thru whatever we put them in...
[02:36:14] <XXCoder> like tough steel?
[02:36:18] <PetefromTn_> Hold their edge
[02:36:37] <zeeshan> thats fairly cheap
[02:36:42] <zeeshan> i wonder how well they are compared to m42
[02:36:50] <zeeshan> buy me a set
[02:36:51] <zeeshan> :-)
[02:36:53] <zeeshan> !!
[02:36:53] <PetefromTn_> I machined a dozen pieces of a2 drilled and rigid tapped yesterday morning with one 4-40 and it was a breeze.
[02:37:15] <zeeshan> PetefromTn_: got a new job?
[02:37:24] <PetefromTn_> four holes in each piece 5mmx5mmx36mm
[02:37:32] <zeeshan> Drills are heat treated at 2185� F and then nitro-carburize finished at 950� F to be measurably harder than high speed steel.
[02:37:35] <zeeshan> this information is so useless
[02:37:45] <zeeshan> just tell me the rc hardness!
[02:38:10] <Tom_itx> not the whole story
[02:38:12] <PetefromTn_> No just working temporarily in a local job shop..
[02:38:16] <Tom_itx> toughness it part of it
[02:39:02] <PetefromTn_> They are not top of the line drills but for the money I was surprised at how good they are... I will probably buy some here when I get some cash.
[02:39:05] <zeeshan> yea but as you get a harder drill bit
[02:39:08] <zeeshan> it'll decrease toughness
[02:39:10] <zeeshan> thats given
[02:39:13] <PetefromTn_> Right now I need some better tooling for the shop tho.
[02:39:26] <zeeshan> just means you need a more rigid machine/process
[02:39:34] <zeeshan> can't use with a regular hand drill :p
[02:40:03] <PetefromTn_> Today we drilled a hole with a number 60 drill in the VMC>...
[02:40:20] <PetefromTn_> TEENY TINY bit smallest hole I ever drilled..
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[02:40:25] <Connor_iPad> So, drill chuck or collets ?
[02:40:26] <zeeshan> today i broke 4 1/16 end mills
[02:40:27] <XXCoder> unobtainableium drill bits heh
[02:40:30] <zeeshan> ;D
[02:40:35] <Connor_iPad> For drill bits
[02:40:52] <PetefromTn_> Aparently it is a drill made for PCB work,,
[02:41:00] <PetefromTn_> Oh collets man...COLLETS
[02:41:33] <zeeshan> btw guys
[02:41:34] <Connor_iPad> I've got to get some ER collets and holders.
[02:41:41] <zeeshan> CHECK OUT MY rotary valve
[02:41:46] <PetefromTn_> They have a bunch of ER16 collet holders in the shop there they use for all the small stuff.
[02:42:34] <Connor_iPad> I'm thinking of getting ER20's
[02:42:59] <PetefromTn_> I like my ER20 and ER32 holders and I am glad I got the ER20s for the smaller stuff but those ER16s are tiny...
[02:43:35] <PetefromTn_> On my Rf45 I had all ER20 holders and the rest setscrew holders. worked fine.
[02:43:42] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/n74UpDJ.jpg
[02:43:48] <PetefromTn_> Not sure if you can get ER16 tts holders or not.
[02:43:56] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/R5uyaLF.jpg
[02:44:00] <zeeshan> a little close to the jaws =]
[02:44:43] <zeeshan> dividing head is a pain in the butt to use
[02:45:07] <PetefromTn_> I liked my Yuasa Super spacer wish I never sold the damn thing
[02:45:30] <Connor_iPad> Tormach does both 20 and 16
[02:45:59] <PetefromTn_> Then thats cool you can have both..
[02:46:21] <zeeshan> er collets are cheap :P
[02:46:26] <PetefromTn_> I would probably get some 20s first and get a collet assortment or a buncha typical sizes.
[02:46:27] <zeeshan> buy 16, 20, 32
[02:46:29] <zeeshan> :P
[02:46:45] <Connor_iPad> No 32 in TTS
[02:46:55] <PetefromTn_> there is now apparently..
[02:47:23] <zeeshan> http://www.tormach.com/store/index.php?app=ecom&ns=prodshow&ref=33266
[02:47:34] <PetefromTn_> http://www.santacruzelectronics.com/tormach/Tormach.cfm?do=detail&q_part=ER32-TTS&q_StartRow=1
[02:48:11] <PetefromTn_> Damn it is windy as hell outside....
[02:48:33] <zeeshan> that just looks so unsafe to use
[02:48:36] <zeeshan> the er32
[02:48:37] <zeeshan> lol
[02:48:42] <PetefromTn_> and I got a lump on my head where I bashed my fat head into that cutter LOL...
[02:49:10] <Valen> take a close look at it, make sure theres nothing in it
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[02:49:14] <PetefromTn_> my wife gave me a tetanus shot this afternoon just in case..
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[02:50:35] <PetefromTn_> we did besides the cutter was clean just cutting plastic UHMW all day..
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[02:51:00] <PetefromTn_> I think I felt it poke my brain hehe
[02:51:25] <PetefromTn_> what a jackass LOL
[02:51:42] <zeeshan> tetanus shot is a good idea
[02:51:46] <zeeshan> when working around with metals and soils
[02:51:48] <zeeshan> ;p
[02:52:05] <PetefromTn_> I was more embarassed than hurt tho.
[02:52:59] <PetefromTn_> Tell you what I found the next DTI I am getting. Several of those guys have the Interapid ones. They are SWEET!!
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[02:54:21] <PetefromTn_> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Interapid-Test-Indicator-Model-312B-2-Resolution-0005-/321356381968?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ad2553f1
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[02:56:13] <PetefromTn_> http://www.ebay.com/itm/INTERAPID-312B-1-DIAL-INDICATOR-0005-made-in-SWITZERLAND-D-/351017619846?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item51ba47d186
[02:56:20] <PetefromTn_> actually more like that one.
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[02:56:36] <PetefromTn_> I like the larger dial and the angle of the face makes it easier to view.
[02:56:41] <Tom_itx> this job is gonna cost you money
[02:56:49] <PetefromTn_> Plus they are very well made and precise.
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[02:56:54] <zeeshan> meh
[02:56:58] <zeeshan> mitutoyo ones do the same shit
[02:56:59] <zeeshan> ;p
[02:57:08] <PetefromTn_> LOL yea man but I want to do this for aliving so I need to get this stuff..
[02:57:12] <tjtr33> 8 phase stepper under linuxcnc http://youtu.be/L9lKrHAsM70
[02:57:16] <Tom_itx> mine's mitutoyo
[02:57:25] <zeeshan> i has both fowler and mitutoyo
[02:57:28] <Tom_itx> plenty accurate
[02:57:29] <zeeshan> 0.001 and 0.0005
[02:57:55] <zeeshan> if you have some already
[02:57:57] <zeeshan> why buy more!
[02:57:59] <PetefromTn_> Yeah those are all top quality units unlike my Chinko POS..
[02:58:09] <zeeshan> don't underestimate your chinko pos
[02:58:21] <zeeshan> i've got respect for some chinko tools :)
[02:58:27] <zeeshan> i told you what i did the other day right?
[02:58:27] <PetefromTn_> You have never used my Chinko POS and I have used their Interapid...
[02:58:37] <PetefromTn_> Believe me there is a measurable difference...
[02:58:40] <zeeshan> i tested my mastercraft (chinko) calipers
[02:58:49] <zeeshan> on starrett gauge blocks
[02:58:54] <PetefromTn_> Calipers are NOT precision tools....
[02:59:05] <zeeshan> +/-0.001" is pretty precise enough.
[02:59:10] <zeeshan> for 90% of applications
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[02:59:32] <zeeshan> which is the resolution of both the mitutoyo digimatic and mastercraft calipers
[02:59:38] <tjtr33> get a good solid indicator holder like Noga
[02:59:48] <zeeshan> tjtr33: too much $!
[02:59:58] <PetefromTn_> I do the same thing with my chinese calipers and on standards they hit the mark but .001 is wide open when it comes to machine work really and the .0005 is just somewhere in the middle LOL.
[03:00:03] <zeeshan> https://www.shars.com/products/view/1408/Hydraulic_Magnetic_Base
[03:00:05] <zeeshan> that works just as good
[03:00:06] <zeeshan> :)
[03:00:19] <PetefromTn_> NOGA are excellnt love the hydraulic ones..
[03:00:28] <zeeshan> this ones hydraulic too ;p
[03:00:50] <PetefromTn_> really have you compared them to a real Noga?
[03:00:57] <zeeshan> don't need to
[03:01:00] <zeeshan> it holds a frigging indicator
[03:01:02] <PetefromTn_> That is CHEAP if they are even close...
[03:01:03] <zeeshan> i'd see if its flexing
[03:01:09] <zeeshan> :P
[03:01:17] <zeeshan> i have its baby brother too
[03:01:54] <zeeshan> http://www.shars.com/products/view/1456/Test_Indicator_Holder_Arm_Only
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[03:02:03] <Tom_itx> all our first off articles went thru the cmm
[03:02:07] <zeeshan> i don't know if this ones hydraulic
[03:02:19] <Tom_itx> with a printout
[03:02:23] <zeeshan> but it works great than those typical zero sets
[03:02:42] <zeeshan> but the only thing i like about the typical zero set holder is
[03:02:43] <zeeshan> the fine adjust
[03:02:49] <zeeshan> but its really not that big of a deal for me
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[03:03:15] <Connor_iPad> I have a zero set.
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[03:03:29] <PetefromTn_> WTF man...
[03:03:30] <Connor_iPad> And a dti. Both are cheap Shars.
[03:03:44] <PetefromTn_> what did I miss.
[03:03:48] <zeeshan> PetefromTn_:
[03:03:51] <zeeshan> http://www.shars.com/products/view/1456/Test_Indicator_Holder_Arm_Only
[03:03:54] <zeeshan> indicator's little bother
[03:03:59] <zeeshan> just was mentioning
[03:04:04] <zeeshan> they don't have 'fine adjust'
[03:04:06] <zeeshan> like noga
[03:04:10] <zeeshan> i'd prolly say thats the biggest difference
[03:04:47] <PetefromTn_> Yeah that fine adjust is nice and tight too... Played with it today.
[03:05:09] <PetefromTn_> ALtho those shars models look pretty decent especially for the price.
[03:05:21] <zeeshan> the big base the red one
[03:05:22] <zeeshan> i posted
[03:05:24] <zeeshan> has fine adjust
[03:05:26] <zeeshan> just not the blue one
[03:05:32] <Connor_iPad> So, is it common practice to have dti mounted in its own tool holder all the time ?
[03:05:44] <zeeshan> thats how we do it at school
[03:05:53] <zeeshan> cause you usually are using 3/8 collets
[03:05:57] <zeeshan> for your end mills anyway
[03:06:19] <jdh> mine lives in one like that, but it has a spindle clamp
[03:06:31] <zeeshan> i really dislike the spindle clamp one
[03:06:36] <Connor_iPad> Spindle clamp?
[03:06:38] <jdh> send it to me
[03:06:39] <PetefromTn_> I need to pickup a nicer DTI, a depth micrometer with different anvils, a better starret model edgefinder, a set of standards shop grade and a few other things so I am not borrowing other guys shit.
[03:06:42] <zeeshan> no
[03:06:51] <zeeshan> its nice cause you can keep your end mill in
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[03:07:12] <PetefromTn_> Spindle clamp ones are nice and lots of the other guys have them there...
[03:07:14] <tjtr33> get a blase deep mike, handy for narrow spots
[03:07:16] <jdh> or a chuck, or a edge finder
[03:07:18] <tjtr33> blade
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[03:07:36] <zeeshan> jdh we're not production machinists :P
[03:07:37] <nnnn> is there a way to empirically find out the gear ratio from a robot arm- its not as easy as the encoder lead screw pitch thing
[03:07:38] <PetefromTn_> you like the blade ones huh...
[03:07:40] <zeeshan> stop being lazy!
[03:07:47] <tjtr33> ask any moldmaker
[03:08:05] <PetefromTn_> got a link?
[03:08:13] <zeeshan> http://store01.prostores.com/servlet/accusizetools/the-956/HE20-dsh-1501%2C-UNIVERSAL-INDICATOR-HOLDER/Detail
[03:08:16] <zeeshan> thats the 'clamp style'
[03:08:31] <zeeshan> fits on a typical bridgeport spindle
[03:08:55] <PetefromTn_> No the ones they have are more like the blue one you posted and fit on ANY spindle almost.
[03:08:58] <tjtr33> http://www.judgetool.com/starrett449seriesdepthmicrometerwithnon-rotatingblades.aspx
[03:09:15] <zeeshan> PetefromTn_: i think thats an interapid one
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[03:09:24] <Connor_iPad> So touch probe or camera for edge finding etc?
[03:09:50] <zeeshan> heres name brand one
[03:10:00] <zeeshan> http://www.use-enco.com/1/1/8206-20-757-1-spi-holder-test-indicator-attachments-accessories.html
[03:10:03] <zeeshan> these are quite famous
[03:10:13] <zeeshan> http://www.use-enco.com/1/1/45658-13-167-2-spi-holder-test-indicator-attachments-accessories.html
[03:10:16] <PetefromTn_> Touch probe is sweet but we use edgefinders in the shop all day long...they do not have spindle probes...
[03:10:51] <PetefromTn_> SPI makes decent stuff I think..
[03:11:00] <zeeshan> spi is swiss right?
[03:11:10] <tjtr33> hehe old school, super accurate http://www.titantoolsupply.com/Low_Cost_Centering_Projector
[03:11:24] <PetefromTn_> That depth mic is very nice. I need to get one like that maybe try to find used one.
[03:11:44] <zeeshan> tjtr33: lol
[03:11:54] <tjtr33> lotsa old moldmakers , they'd like their tools used
[03:11:58] <Connor_iPad> I'm just departing which one would be best to use. Camera or touch probe
[03:12:09] <Connor_iPad> Debating.
[03:12:14] <jdh> probe
[03:12:15] <zeeshan> is camera accurate?
[03:12:21] <zeeshan> doesn't sound too accurate
[03:12:44] <tjtr33> more automatic for sure, no human needed
[03:12:46] <PetefromTn_> Depends on how well the probe is made some are amazingly accurate.
[03:12:53] <Connor_iPad> They can be after you calibrate them.
[03:13:26] <zeeshan> well i've never seen a camera mounted inspection system in a quality control room
[03:13:32] <zeeshan> its always cmms with digital probes
[03:13:42] <zeeshan> camera mounted i've seen for quick inspection at the end of the line
[03:13:44] <PetefromTn_> They have a LARGE older starrett CMM machine at work there and it has a very precise touch probe on it. Probably costs more than my house LOL...
[03:15:00] <Connor_iPad> Things I need to buy. Ball screws, CNC vise, touch probe, more TTS tool holders
[03:15:18] <PetefromTn_> Its a sickness man..
[03:15:18] <nnnn> is there a way to empirically find out the gear ratio from a robot arm- its not as easy as the encoder lead screw pitch thing
[03:15:24] <zeeshan> PetefromTn_: trust me rofl
[03:15:36] <zeeshan> if i show you guys a video of a walkaround of the garage and basement
[03:15:45] <zeeshan> youll see im a hoarder
[03:15:46] <zeeshan> =[
[03:15:53] <zeeshan> my basement is full of metal
[03:16:07] <zeeshan> from my 50$ for 500lb of steel type of kijiji finds
[03:16:12] <PetefromTn_> Most folks crap their pants when they step down into my shop/garage LOL...
[03:16:27] <zeeshan> i've been organizing my stuff
[03:16:32] <zeeshan> anything not being used -> sell
[03:16:37] <zeeshan> no more hoarding
[03:16:37] <nnnn> is there a way to empirically find out the gear ratio from a robot arm- its not as easy as the encoder lead screw pitch thing
[03:16:55] <PetefromTn_> People are not expecting to see a machining center in the garge typically LOL.
[03:16:57] <zeeshan> nnn you can rotate it in joint mode
[03:17:05] <zeeshan> at certain degrees? :p
[03:17:26] <nnnn> yeah i can, but its off since my calibration in lcnc is off
[03:17:31] <nnnn> but i can rotate it in joint mode
[03:17:38] <nnnn> i feel like im so close to getting this thing to work
[03:18:45] <PetefromTn_> if you can rotate it can you not measure the angles it turns and figure the error from there?
[03:18:59] <nnnn> not really that easy because the error accumulates
[03:19:17] <nnnn> so i have to get the angle exactly right
[03:19:23] <nnnn> or else ill eventually be off
[03:19:30] <nnnn> by alot
[03:19:38] <PetefromTn_> yeah but can you not move it some small increment and compare the commanded to the actual?
[03:20:05] <zeeshan> you need a fancy protactor
[03:20:27] <PetefromTn_> maybe exxagerate the angle with a long arm and pointer
[03:21:08] <nnnn> yeah not a bad idea
[03:21:09] <PetefromTn_> We used to draw large radii on the floor of the woodshop all the time and swing large accurate arcs with a long board and pointer.
[03:21:45] <nnnn> i think i can draw radii with the arm itself...
[03:22:04] <zeeshan> tomorrow is going to be an awesome day
[03:22:08] <zeeshan> i got my iron ring
[03:22:11] <zeeshan> => engineer!
[03:22:17] <PetefromTn_> measure the length of the arm, command some movement, measure the distance traveled at the end...
[03:22:46] <PetefromTn_> Oh jeez so you will be one of those that knows everything and nothing at the same time LOL...
[03:23:07] <PetefromTn_> Congrats man.. Jealous.
[03:23:16] <Valen> is an iron ring actually a thing?
[03:23:17] <PetefromTn_> ;)
[03:23:41] <PetefromTn_> I seen a guy make a cool titanium ring that had gears in it....LOL
[03:24:03] <XXCoder> heh I wonder if theres a way to find scrap thick alum sheet parts
[03:24:13] <PetefromTn_> http://gearhungry.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Kinect-gear-ring.jpg.jpg
[03:24:27] <Valen> I mean my wife made me a stainless wedding ring
[03:24:32] <XXCoder> pete someone 3d printed a large version of it. it worked.
[03:24:42] <zeeshan> PetefromTn_: haha
[03:24:47] <PetefromTn_> yeah but it is not NEARLY as cool...
[03:24:50] <Valen> but "iron ring" sounds more like something you get from eating too much chilli
[03:24:51] <zeeshan> i try my best not to have a know it all attitude
[03:24:54] <XXCoder> one shot printing. none of building lol
[03:25:04] <XXCoder> yeah not as cool but hey single print lol
[03:25:15] <zeeshan> http://www.eng.mcmaster.ca/news/news2008/images/iron_ring.jpg
[03:25:19] <zeeshan> thats what it looks like
[03:25:22] <zeeshan> its actually stainless
[03:25:42] <PetefromTn_> I like the geared one better LOL
[03:26:15] <zeeshan> iron ring is just a ring that symbolizes the responsibility we're taking and oath we've taken
[03:26:20] <XXCoder> lol wont it bind though?
[03:26:38] <zeeshan> and to remind us that our decisions can have negative impact on others
[03:26:47] <zeeshan> negligence has heavy consequences
[03:27:04] <PetefromTn_> Connor http://greenville.craigslist.org/tls/4384570565.html Here is your granite plate man...Local.
[03:27:14] <zeeshan> damn thats cheap
[03:27:15] <tjtr33> PetefromTn_, sometimes you have to measure a depth near a wall and the base of the deep mike wont let you get close, so there's 1/2 base deep mikes http://www.guardiancatalog.com/Starrett-52173-p/86417458.htm
[03:27:20] <zeeshan> $125!
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[03:27:48] <XXCoder> I gonna ask a question - why is ispection table always grante?
[03:27:59] <PetefromTn_> Damn man no pic...
[03:28:14] <zeeshan> XXCoder: flat!
[03:28:16] <XXCoder> I went with my friend to his machinist class shop and they had table
[03:28:21] <zeeshan> to like 0.000005"
[03:28:22] <PetefromTn_> Some are steel but granite are ground flat and stay that way
[03:28:31] <XXCoder> flat that dont alter with temperete and such I guess
[03:28:36] <PetefromTn_> regardless of temp changes.
[03:28:44] <tjtr33> sorry http://www.use-enco.com/1/1/63540-52173-starrett-mechanical-depth-micrometers.html
[03:28:50] <Connor_iPad> Too big for my shop
[03:29:02] <zeeshan> oh give me a break
[03:29:04] <XXCoder> I guess thats why its important - to test other stuff you need good surface
[03:29:04] <zeeshan> go buy that!
[03:29:21] <Connor_iPad> Think 18 x 24 is good size
[03:29:31] <PetefromTn_> I have one already..
[03:29:45] <zeeshan> PetefromTn_: find me a nice set of brown and sharp v-blocks
[03:29:45] <zeeshan> sets
[03:29:48] <zeeshan> for cheap!
[03:29:54] <zeeshan> or starrett
[03:30:35] <Connor_iPad> Dude. I have a 7' x 11' room for my shop.
[03:30:42] <PetefromTn_> I want some collet closer and 5c sets for my shop too...
[03:31:18] <Connor_iPad> With a 34" x 7' stainless steel elevator door for a work bench.
[03:31:21] <PetefromTn_> They use them a bunch at the shop and they are really easy to setup on the mill.
[03:31:53] <PetefromTn_> that'll fit on it....LOL
[03:32:24] <zeeshan> haha
[03:32:25] <zeeshan> thats awesome
[03:32:33] <zeeshan> i never thought of using an elevator door as a bench
[03:32:34] <Connor_iPad> You need to come by and visit my tiny workshop.
[03:32:45] <PetefromTn_> I do actually..
[03:33:04] <PetefromTn_> Make me stop whining about how small my own shop is for a minute or two...
[03:33:15] <zeeshan> BIGGER IS BETTER!
[03:33:20] <Connor_iPad> zeeshan: It's on a I beam rack that was used to hold bombs in the air force.
[03:33:24] <zeeshan> need 1000000 sq ft shop!
[03:33:35] <zeeshan> Connor: haha
[03:33:40] <Connor_iPad> Was my dads.
[03:33:55] <zeeshan> we all need to take some panoramic photos
[03:33:58] <zeeshan> of our work shops
[03:35:08] <PetefromTn_> zeeshan You learning Mastercam there?
[03:35:53] <CaptHindsight> http://imagebin.org/302139 http://imagebin.org/302136 http://imagebin.org/302145 I found a webcam with this res at a focus of ~1"
[03:35:55] <Connor_iPad> I've got to start cleaning my office. Everything has to be picked up. Pulling out the carpet.
[03:36:58] <PetefromTn_> CaptHindsight Hard to tell without knowing how big those parts are
[03:37:00] <CaptHindsight> it should be good enough for auto zero +/- 0.001"
[03:37:07] <zeeshan> i learned masteram in college
[03:37:11] <zeeshan> nx in university
[03:37:20] <zeeshan> help me decide
[03:37:24] <zeeshan> black shirt grey pants
[03:37:28] <zeeshan> dark blue tie? ;p
[03:37:33] <zeeshan> striped
[03:37:33] <zeeshan> hm
[03:37:33] <CaptHindsight> PetefromTn_: http://imagebin.org/302145 there's an inch scale on the top
[03:37:41] <PetefromTn_> Do you think you can make a working post for my LinuxCNC machine?
[03:38:03] <zeeshan> i think if you just use the standard post processory
[03:38:14] <PetefromTn_> How fine a crosshair can you put in that viewport?
[03:38:15] <zeeshan> and remove all circular references
[03:38:17] <zeeshan> it should work
[03:38:28] <CaptHindsight> http://imagebin.org/302139 the traces are in mils 0.001"
[03:38:54] <PetefromTn_> They want me to learn mastercam at work so I can do more stuff for them and I want to learn it so when I move to Florida I can get a good job in MOST shops if I need to.
[03:39:07] <XXCoder> isnt mastercam very expensive
[03:39:13] <zeeshan> i have a video tutorial set
[03:39:14] <zeeshan> if you want
[03:39:21] <zeeshan> its a dvd
[03:39:24] <PetefromTn_> REALLY that would be great..
[03:39:26] <toastyde1th> mastercam is really expensive, yes
[03:39:28] <CaptHindsight> mastercam is ~$10k and up
[03:39:31] <toastyde1th> it's also terrible software
[03:39:39] <zeeshan> toastyde1th: terrible if you dont know how to use it
[03:39:41] <CaptHindsight> at least for the 5 axis we have
[03:39:45] <PetefromTn_> yeah it is actually stupid expensive but it is what most of the pro shops around here use.
[03:39:48] <XXCoder> interesting. ok
[03:39:56] <tjtr33> CaptHindsight, is the lighting tricky at 1"? use a ring of leds or what?
[03:40:29] <zeeshan> PetefromTn_: what version
[03:40:34] <zeeshan> mastercam X3 x4r?
[03:40:36] <zeeshan> x4
[03:40:38] <toastyde1th> no, it's pretty much terrible but it's one of the only options that isn't bound to a particular cam package and it has a bunch of features
[03:40:43] <toastyde1th> er, cad
[03:40:47] <CaptHindsight> tjtr33: yeah, those pics were from the green led inside and a white led flashlight I was holding in my hands
[03:40:47] <PetefromTn_> X7 I think...
[03:40:58] <zeeshan> mastercam multaxis tool paths
[03:41:04] <zeeshan> are the best
[03:41:15] <toastyde1th> the software itself is like driving nails into your forehead, but it gets the job done in complex machining situations
[03:41:22] <PetefromTn_> They have some really clever toolpath strategies that much is clear.
[03:41:23] <toastyde1th> that it can do the job doesn't mean it does it well, just that it's done
[03:41:35] <CaptHindsight> http://imagebin.org/302133 Logitech C270
[03:41:37] <XXCoder> well glad I dont plan complex macgune setup. thanks/
[03:41:59] <CaptHindsight> ^^ 8mm ID bearing
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[03:42:14] <zeeshan> PetefromTn_: the videos are only for mastercam mill
[03:42:38] <PetefromTn_> yeah that is all I really need it for right now anyways.
[03:42:59] <CaptHindsight> tjtr33: http://imagebin.org/302203 the keiling after cleanup and anodize
[03:43:03] <PetefromTn_> They have a bunch of turning centers but they got one guy who programs all of them.
[03:43:14] <zeeshan> how can i send you a 272 mb file
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[03:43:48] <tjtr33> CaptHindsight, bring one over, i bet we can powder coat it for you
[03:43:57] <CaptHindsight> tjtr33: http://imagebin.org/302200 they are machined well, just shoddy assembly
[03:44:05] <PetefromTn_> did you make that?
[03:44:35] <PetefromTn_> Maybe an image? file?
[03:44:45] <zeeshan> no its a zip file
[03:44:54] <XXCoder> can't wait to see it complete capt lol
[03:44:55] <zeeshan> the .exe pops up the different tutorial videos
[03:44:58] <PetefromTn_> Dunno the limit on zips...
[03:45:18] <zeeshan> oh
[03:45:19] <zeeshan> dropbox!
[03:45:26] <CaptHindsight> tjtr33: do you have a gun a oven?
[03:45:32] <CaptHindsight> a/and
[03:45:37] <XXCoder> that pic gives me ideas on my cnc design too
[03:46:13] <PetefromTn_> yeah dropbox, I have that too..
[03:46:14] <zeeshan> 17 min to upload
[03:46:18] <zeeshan> sec
[03:46:23] <XXCoder> dopbox is nice yep
[03:46:55] <PetefromTn_> CaptHindsight Did you build that?
[03:46:55] <tjtr33> CaptHindsight, they do car parts all the time, like up to 24x12x6 , the oven looks bigger
[03:47:29] <tjtr33> CaptHindsight, this is my Sable 2015 http://grabcad.com/library/sable-2015 taiwanese
[03:47:32] <CaptHindsight> PetefromTn_: I'm reworking the routers by Keiling/automation technologies
[03:47:36] <XXCoder> capt is rails SBR? I dont see rod supports
[03:48:24] <CaptHindsight> PetefromTn_: they are machined well but assembled poorly, the one of the left has 1/8" of play in the Y axis out of the box
[03:48:53] <tjtr33> CaptHindsight, yours moves gantry. mine moves Y table
[03:49:02] <CaptHindsight> XXCoder: yes, they are anodized black
[03:49:24] <XXCoder> no wonder couldnt see em. Nice!
[03:49:36] <PetefromTn_> http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/photos/2006models/2006-Ducati-Superbike-999d.jpg DROOLLL........
[03:49:53] <CaptHindsight> XXCoder: http://imagebin.org/302200 you can see it better here
[03:50:15] <XXCoder> yep
[03:50:20] <PetefromTn_> http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/photos/2006models/2006-Ducati-Superbike-999c.jpg
[03:50:30] <Connor_iPad> Not side mounted ?
[03:50:56] <PetefromTn_> Is that rail supported or unsupported Cannot tell from the pics?
[03:50:57] <CaptHindsight> I just got the X to have too little lash for me to measure
[03:51:08] <CaptHindsight> bottom mounted
[03:51:27] <CaptHindsight> bottom mounted supports
[03:51:42] <XXCoder> how do you test lash?
[03:51:44] <PetefromTn_> Does the gantry rock front to back?
[03:51:51] <zeeshan> dial indicator
[03:52:01] <PetefromTn_> DTI
[03:52:02] <tjtr33> PetefromTn_, at the WeatherTech floormat office, the owner has a bike collection, has a Vincent Black Shadow http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vincent_Black_Shadow
[03:52:24] <Connor_iPad> Yea. That sucks. My DIY bottom mounted. Has issues with the gantry.
[03:52:26] <PetefromTn_> The superbike before there were superbikes LOL.
[03:53:01] <PetefromTn_> I LOVE Ducati's ... That black monster is my dream bike. Like a two wheeled Enzo X....
[03:53:04] <CaptHindsight> PetefromTn_: I'm using these for non-contact printing and deposition. If I was using it for cutting that gantry would be much thicker
[03:53:11] <Connor_iPad> Ballscreew keeps it from rocking. Not ideal.
[03:54:08] <PetefromTn_> Yeah but I meant does the linear bearings have play on the rails allowing the gantry to rock forward and backwards?
[03:54:19] <CaptHindsight> PetefromTn_: I'd say for aluminum plate/sheet up to 1/8" it's ok as is for cutting
[03:54:27] <Connor_iPad> Split bearings. Yea.
[03:54:33] <Connor_iPad> Not ideal.
[03:54:46] <CaptHindsight> PetefromTn_: nope they are tight
[03:54:57] <CaptHindsight> Connor: yeah not the best for cutting
[03:55:02] <tjtr33> CaptHindsight, we got one AGie moving under linuxcnc, oughtta be precise & good for non-contact http://youtu.be/L9lKrHAsM70
[03:55:08] <PetefromTn_> How much is something like that?
[03:55:14] <PetefromTn_> and what are the travels?
[03:55:39] <CaptHindsight> PetefromTn_: 45cm x 30cm ~$700 with steppers and no controls
[03:56:34] <PetefromTn_> Holy crap what the hell do you work at nasa or something... what a shop!
[03:57:13] <CaptHindsight> heh, yeah I build for Nasa and JPL at times
[03:57:44] <PetefromTn_> Is that video tjtr33's or yours?
[03:57:53] <tjtr33> mine
[03:57:54] <CaptHindsight> tjtr33's
[03:58:35] <tjtr33> was that coment to me? haha its an EDM graveyard hahaha
[03:58:49] <PetefromTn_> Are those EDM machines repurposed or something?
[03:58:49] <CaptHindsight> looks impressive
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[03:59:23] <PetefromTn_> They have a couple EDm machines at the place I am working now. One of them can drill and feed the wire automatically... Pretty damn sweet.
[03:59:45] <tjtr33> we make 'em do whatever you want. i got a 4 axis 32tool toolchanger sink cnc next to that, rebuilding now
[04:00:29] <CaptHindsight> tjtr33: let me know before you junk anything, suddenly everyone wants custom machines
[04:00:36] <tjtr33> but my buddy wants to make that wedm into a reprap, he bought a head tonite
[04:01:27] <PetefromTn_> Sinkers are nice...
[04:01:33] <tjtr33> my specialty
[04:01:50] <PetefromTn_> Do you machine your own electrodes?
[04:02:09] <CaptHindsight> http://imagebin.org/300638 there was 1mm of play around both bearing mounts
[04:02:10] <PetefromTn_> or whatever you call them?
[04:02:29] <tjtr33> i make machines, dotn run 'em much. but i do grind my own electrodes
[04:02:32] <PetefromTn_> Did you bush them or something?
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[04:03:05] <Connor_iPad> I think some of the ebay ones are side mounted gantry rails
[04:03:08] <tjtr33> i use 3R, Hrischmann or Erowa holders
[04:03:31] <PetefromTn_> Typical Chinese stuff, buy it, take it all apart, fix the bullshit, put it back together right LOL...
[04:03:41] <CaptHindsight> yup
[04:03:52] <CaptHindsight> still cheaper than starting from scratch
[04:03:58] <nnnn> ayways to find out passwork to lcnc computer
[04:04:05] <PetefromTn_> yeah if the overall package fits your needs.
[04:04:24] <CaptHindsight> I wouldn't use them for cutting
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[04:05:07] <PetefromTn_> They need to make a machine about the size of the IH/RF45 mill with a belt driven spindle like the tormach only beefier with 30 taper holders and comes with good quality ballscrews...
[04:05:32] <PetefromTn_> and not screw it up or price it too high.
[04:05:33] <Valen> I'm not wedded to belt driven spindle
[04:05:38] <CaptHindsight> PetefromTn_: I looked over all the other sizes at keiling as well
[04:05:40] <Valen> what does that net you?
[04:05:49] <CaptHindsight> they all need some TLC
[04:06:02] <PetefromTn_> timing gear drive and higher speed...
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[04:06:36] <PetefromTn_> preferrably dual range timing belt setup with high speed bearings.
[04:06:36] <CaptHindsight> I wish they didn't paint them, they are all overspray or full of mop streaks
[04:06:56] <PetefromTn_> Oh don't get me started about chinese mop paint jobs man... LOL
[04:07:11] <PetefromTn_> I wonder if they just dip them in the stuff and hang them out to dry...
[04:07:33] <PetefromTn_> after they baste them in Bondo...
[04:07:55] <CaptHindsight> it's probably a mop or genuine grass brush
[04:08:04] <tjtr33> heh yeah its amazing how the bondo evens out the crappy castings
[04:08:18] <PetefromTn_> My RF45 had enough bondo on it un-necessarily to build a dozen old hotrods..
[04:08:49] <PetefromTn_> actually my casting was decent they screwed it up with the Bondo...believe it or not.
[04:09:08] <PetefromTn_> I got some pics of that somewhere in my thread on the zone LOL...
[04:09:50] <PetefromTn_> They even bondoed and painted the base and the column together and covered the four tram bolts in it so you could not tram the damn mill....
[04:10:00] <XXCoder> lol
[04:10:07] <CaptHindsight> PetefromTn_: http://cindyrosstraveler.files.wordpress.com/2013/01/china-624.jpg probably something like these
[04:10:19] <XXCoder> I guess first thing you did was strip every bondo and paint
[04:10:32] <PetefromTn_> I had to take a die grinder with a ziss wheel to it to cut a groove around where the two meet.
[04:11:18] <PetefromTn_> Let me put it this way I spent a weekend COVERED in white Bondo dust from all the grinding and sanding to get down to bare metal..
[04:12:06] <PetefromTn_> Then I sprayed some industrial epoxy primer on it and painted it with some nice industrial machine paint I had tinted to a cream color I liked.
[04:12:55] <CaptHindsight> http://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/products-page/cnc-router all the large routers look pretty rough up close and in person
[04:13:24] <tjtr33> hell money! the bike trolley is fulla hell money. burn it, it goes up to heaven, and down comes real money
[04:13:53] <CaptHindsight> http://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/products-page/cnc-router/kl-6090-cnc-router the opening on the Y axis looks like it was done with a radio Shack nibbling tool
[04:13:53] <PetefromTn_> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Ha-3hzgFiQ&list=UUFCopiUpaDrS5VBkrYFuGFQ Here it is right after I got it painted and working.
[04:14:42] <CaptHindsight> sorry I meant the opening on the X axis gantry
[04:16:16] <CaptHindsight> I wonder what the molds look like for those castings?
[04:16:19] <tjtr33> PetefromTn_, nice little machine , dovetail too, nice rebuild
[04:17:52] <tjtr33> wow 5K$ i wont ask about the 4'x8' size then
[04:17:53] <PetefromTn_> Thanks.., God I can't believe all the work I did on that little mill... Freakin' crazy. Sure wish I had used LinuxCNC and gone with some DMM servos or something I would probably still own it.
[04:19:18] <PetefromTn_> You think that floating bridged table design is worth a damn? Looks like a long span of nothing support under the force of the cutter no?
[04:19:28] <CaptHindsight> Connor_iPad: the split bearings aren't the greatest either, they are pretty noisy the first 1K actions
[04:20:04] <CaptHindsight> I'd pay more for them if they actually used some better parts
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[04:22:27] <Connor> So, how many tools in a tool changer for a G0704 ? Need to figure out the diameter of the carousel..
[04:22:37] <Connor> 8, 10, 12, 16 ?
[04:23:11] <PetefromTn_> Probably eight or ten.
[04:23:30] <CaptHindsight> http://www.g0704.com/ tool changer for these?
[04:23:31] <PetefromTn_> I have a start of a drawing I did for the RF45 but there is not much there yet.
[04:23:38] <Connor> CaptHindsight: Yes
[04:24:59] <Connor> I was thinking 10 or 12..
[04:25:15] <CaptHindsight> http://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/KL-6090-h.jpg look closely at the spindle and fasteners
[04:25:27] <Connor> I guess I need to draw up one of each.. and figure out the diameter size.. and see how well they look on the machine ..
[04:25:57] <CaptHindsight> looks like they used a new brush to paint this one :)
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[04:25:57] <Connor> CaptHindsight: Yea..looks like they messed one of the holes up..
[04:26:42] <CaptHindsight> that how they all look, like HS shop projects
[04:26:59] <PetefromTn_> ROFL...
[04:27:13] <CaptHindsight> from the C students
[04:27:54] <PetefromTn_> Hell my RF45 looks better than that after I worked it over some....
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[04:28:45] <XXCoder> heh mine would probably end up look like shpop reject student's reject ;)
[04:29:07] <CaptHindsight> http://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/6090-Z-axis_.jpg
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[04:29:25] <Connor> No bearing block ?
[04:29:30] <Connor> that sucks
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[04:29:38] <XXCoder> SBR rails work on top and side but not upside down right?
[04:29:45] <XXCoder> any con on sideways?
[04:29:50] <nnnn> so im having an interesting problem
[04:29:53] <nnnn> my arm is working now
[04:30:00] <nnnn> but all of he motions are inverted
[04:30:07] <nnnn> it isnt getting the tracking error which is good
[04:30:09] <Connor> XXCoder: correct
[04:30:19] <nnnn> but when i do plus on the z axis it moves in the negative direction
[04:30:23] <nnnn> and same with angles
[04:30:25] <CaptHindsight> they probably figure it's only 3-4 inches for Z, so why not
[04:30:26] <Connor> On side is better in most cases..
[04:31:15] <XXCoder> Ok. I was thinking upside for X, Y sideways. Z well rail up/down. dont think has choice
[04:31:35] <PetefromTn_> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3XqZoaWKv2k#t=70 What a jackass LOL...
[04:31:42] <CaptHindsight> http://imagebin.org/300374 this one doesn't do any cutting
[04:31:55] <nnnn> anyone?
[04:31:59] <XXCoder> pete yeah saw it. laughed my ass off
[04:32:03] <Connor> Up/Down okay.. UPSIDE down isn't
[04:32:16] <XXCoder> okay
[04:32:42] <nnnn> all of my axis are inverted but they are tracking
[04:32:49] <Connor> On my router, the blocks are stationary, the rails move up and down.
[04:33:23] <CaptHindsight> nnnn: what type of motors?
[04:33:32] <nnnn> dc encoser
[04:33:34] <nnnn> encoder
[04:33:37] <nnnn> servos
[04:34:37] <CaptHindsight> nnnn: which servo amps? what type of input? analog 10V +/_ ?
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[04:34:59] <nnnn> servo amps?
[04:35:27] <nnnn> its a mesa 7143 hooked into two mesa 7125
[04:35:30] <CaptHindsight> nnnn: are you using STEP and DIRECTION?
[04:35:33] <PetefromTn_> http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_fP1y4T5-DFE/TPnKO-4dUqI/AAAAAAAAEYU/_3C-py-n1Rk/s1600/Black_Ducati_999_3156.jpg I'd put it in my bedroom and rub it with a daiper whispering...MY PRECIOUS,,,,LOL
[04:35:45] <nnnn> no using step and direction
[04:35:53] <nnnn> umm i dont think i am
[04:36:50] <Connor> http://www.ivdc.com/cnc/cnc3.jpg
[04:37:09] <Connor> http://www.ivdc.com/cnc/cnc1.jpg
[04:37:58] <nnnn> if i reverse the dir in the hal file i get a following error
[04:38:50] <CaptHindsight> nnnn: I never used the 7i25's I'm looking at the data sheet, they have DIR inputs for each motor
[04:39:38] <nnnn> hmm so i should wire that up?
[04:40:03] <tjtr33> nnnn explain the machine you are using. is it standard XYZ cartesian or some more complex kinematics?
[04:40:03] <CaptHindsight> PCW: you around?
[04:41:25] <tjtr33> CaptHindsight, nnnn called it his 'arm' so his upside down Z motion maybe many motors moving at once
[04:42:35] <tjtr33> so it'd be kins, not inverting a signal ( i think )
[04:43:17] <CaptHindsight> nnnn: have a pic of the machine?
[04:43:25] <nnnn> i can get a pic of it
[04:43:29] <nnnn> give me a second
[04:44:02] <tjtr33> tomp humms jeopardy tune
[04:44:04] <nnnn> its a scara arm
[04:45:08] <PetefromTn_> you got a scar on your arm...;)
[04:45:11] <tjtr33> is Z moved by just one motor? (in scara i think thats true)
[04:45:17] <nnnn> http://imgur.com/bBSHgj9
[04:45:21] <PetefromTn_> you got a scary arm?
[04:45:39] <PetefromTn_> Hey look he works at Nasa too!!
[04:45:50] <nnnn> lol
[04:46:04] <CaptHindsight> the Viking project :)
[04:46:13] <Connor> PetefromTn_: Do we need to actuate the PDB twice ? or just once? when changing tools ?
[04:46:23] <PetefromTn_> Is that in your living room,,, You are MY HERO man...
[04:46:45] <Connor> I think twice, because I don't think we can check tool present with drawbar active..
[04:47:04] <Connor> Do you remember how it use to work on the old controller ?
[04:47:05] <CaptHindsight> PetefromTn_: how long have you not been single? :)
[04:47:12] <PetefromTn_> No actually it goes up, ram swings in...
[04:47:21] <PetefromTn_> power drawbar fires,
[04:47:31] <PetefromTn_> head raises up with drawbar held open.
[04:47:38] <PetefromTn_> carousel rotates,
[04:47:46] <PetefromTn_> head comes back down atop tool
[04:47:55] <PetefromTn_> Drawbar releases locking tool into spindle.
[04:47:59] <Connor> okay, so, only fires once.
[04:48:14] <PetefromTn_> CaptHindsight A LONG TIME....
[04:48:22] <nnnn> yeah that is my room lol
[04:48:24] <Connor> I may have too many sensor checks..
[04:48:26] <nnnn> u should see my desk
[04:48:53] <PetefromTn_> I did have a manual mill and lathe in a rented house in a spare room once in a previous life LOL.
[04:48:56] <Connor> *IF* I remember correctly.. the tool present sensor doesn't change until after the PDB is released..
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[04:49:15] <PetefromTn_> Dunno would have to check.
[04:49:24] <PetefromTn_> your room at Nasa?
[04:49:27] <Connor> I need you to when you can..
[04:49:29] <CaptHindsight> nnnn: interesting, it hard to see from that pic, there's a drive belt under the arm where I would expect the Z to be
[04:49:41] <Connor> you'll need to open up hal config and bring all the I/O pins up.
[04:49:47] <Connor> remember we made a map..
[04:49:53] <nnnn> the z is the tower
[04:50:22] <PetefromTn_> How does the Z work?
[04:51:10] <PetefromTn_> you mean the pin mapping file on desktop...
[04:51:20] <PetefromTn_> Okay gotta do it tomorrow. In bed now LOL.
[04:51:34] <CaptHindsight> nnnn: the square column? black post inside the orange base?
[04:51:41] <nnnn> zep
[04:51:44] <Connor> PetefromTn_: yea
[04:51:47] <nnnn> so there is a motor at the bottom of it
[04:51:54] <nnnn> here is my desk lol http://imgur.com/dcvsNFt
[04:52:20] <PetefromTn_> Wow look at all that Repcrap errr... reprap...
[04:52:29] <PetefromTn_> ;)
[04:52:30] <nnnn> hahahaha hey
[04:52:38] <CaptHindsight> you have to start somewhere
[04:52:56] <PetefromTn_> yeah but do you HAVE to start there?
[04:53:31] <CaptHindsight> nnnn: so just your Z goes the wrong direction?
[04:53:35] <PetefromTn_> Just kidding man at least you HAVE a 3d printer I can only dream of one..
[04:54:16] <PetefromTn_> Or borrow my pal Connor's ;)
[04:54:24] <tjtr33> nnnn is the Z moved by just one motor? if so, then try invert the hal DIR signal
[04:54:55] <tjtr33> ooopps, wait, is it stepper or servo? (open or closed loop ?)
[04:54:57] <CaptHindsight> tjtr33: when he flips HAL he gets a following error
[04:55:00] <PetefromTn_> I wanna make a little Yoda head..
[04:55:06] <nnnn> tjtr33: i tried that and once i do that i ge tthe following error
[04:55:06] <nnnn> lol
[04:55:19] <CaptHindsight> BLDC motor
[04:55:42] <CaptHindsight> http://www.mesanet.com/pdf/motion/7i25man.pdf driven by this
[04:55:54] <nnnn> yeah
[04:56:42] <CaptHindsight> 17 MOTOR1DIR, 19 MOTOR0DIR
[04:57:15] <PetefromTn_> What the hell is that thing on top of your mantle?
[04:57:48] <PetefromTn_> Right under the righteous IRON MAN poster?
[04:58:00] <CaptHindsight> nnnn: flip the motor drive outputs on Z
[04:58:24] <nnnn> from the mesa board?
[04:58:47] <nnnn> pete: its a robot gripper
[04:59:01] <CaptHindsight> nnnn: which output is Z on the 7i25?
[04:59:24] <nnnn> its gonna take me a while to find it
[04:59:24] <PetefromTn_> Looks like you and my pal Connor would get along famously hehehe
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[04:59:26] <nnnn> one second
[05:00:39] <nnnn> oh!
[05:00:40] <tjtr33> CaptHindsight, flip the motor AND the encoder ( dont they have to agree?)
[05:00:47] <nnnn> oh ya,....
[05:00:53] <nnnn> i would have to flip both motor
[05:00:55] <nnnn> no
[05:00:55] <nnnn> wait
[05:01:01] <nnnn> i could flip motor and then flip the hal
[05:01:28] <tjtr33> slow down and think, right now it doesnot eorror, just moves wrong way
[05:02:29] <PetefromTn_> Nasa's Abandoned Viking III scara Robot looks to have been mothballed due to cost constraints and wound up in this guys bedroom. He plans to use it for WORLD DOMINATION!! NOBODY IS SAFE!!
[05:02:58] <CaptHindsight> flip motor and encoder, leave HAL alone
[05:03:32] <tjtr33> to make it move right way, reverse the 2 motor wires, BUT that would cause the encoder to ... read in the new diretion, i agree, just flip the motor wires
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[05:05:32] <CaptHindsight> tjtr33: is there anything else on the 7i25? other setting jumpers, I've never touched one
[05:05:39] <PetefromTn_> He's gonna use it to 3d print a gaggle of plastic automaton minions and unleash them on the world to do his dastardly bidding. Run for your lives!! Damn It must be late I gotta get to bed now.
[05:06:15] <tjtr33> Capt i dont use one either.
[05:06:38] <tjtr33> haha, well try just the motor then also change he encoder if it doesnt work. ( sorry i cant imagine it well, its too late )
[05:06:46] <PetefromTn_> GN8
[05:06:52] <tjtr33> GN*
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[05:11:45] <tjtr33> (headslap) reverse the encoder AND the motor leads , and good nite
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[05:12:10] <CaptHindsight> lol
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[05:22:14] <nnnn> hahahahah pete what the hell
[05:23:41] <nnnn> flipping the hal and the motor pos and neg worked!
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[05:24:54] <Connor> nnnn: What kind of arm is that? and where did you find it?
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[05:26:29] <Connor> I think I have a tool changer script for Pete's machine... Been testing it on my sim.. looks to work..
[05:26:40] <Connor> Just need to go over all the sensor inputs..
[05:26:59] <CaptHindsight> nnnn: \0/
[05:27:26] <nnnn> its a seiko epson
[05:27:29] <nnnn> scara
[05:27:37] <nnnn> i found it at a lab clean out for free~
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[05:27:53] <Connor> DAMN, How do you all do crap like that...
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[05:29:05] <nnnn> so now i just need to calibrate the joints?
[05:29:35] <nnnn> if i have motion in linuxcnc in the correct direction but not the correct amount can i still try to run the default program?
[05:29:48] <nnnn> will it work in cnc mode if i can move it with the plus minus signs in the right direction
[05:30:22] <CaptHindsight> it should
[05:30:55] <CaptHindsight> just move it slowly
[05:31:10] <CaptHindsight> the scale might be off by 100x
[05:31:14] <CaptHindsight> wham
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[05:33:27] <CaptHindsight> http://imagebin.org/302253 I'm rebuilding this beast now
[05:33:41] <nnnn> so i dont have the limit switches hooked up yet
[05:33:52] <CaptHindsight> nearly 2m envelope
[05:33:59] <nnnn> no way! thats awesome
[05:34:02] <nnnn> how did u get it?
[05:34:08] <CaptHindsight> fleabay
[05:34:23] <nnnn> how much?
[05:34:28] <CaptHindsight> heh $300
[05:34:56] <CaptHindsight> ~150lbs
[05:34:58] <nnnn> awesome!
[05:35:34] <nnnn> so when i try to run the program on the arm it says can not run program axis not homed
[05:35:41] <nnnn> but i home the axis before every try
[05:35:56] <Connor_iPad> Ow you going to fix the broken arm?
[05:36:05] <CaptHindsight> yes, new arm
[05:36:14] <CaptHindsight> better than new
[05:36:48] <CaptHindsight> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Adept-scara-type-robot-with-controls-wiring-base-model-841-/121305083769?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c3e58af79
[05:36:59] <CaptHindsight> look at this beast
[05:37:23] <nnnn> thats awesome
[05:37:30] <nnnn> personally im more of a puma guy
[05:39:33] <CaptHindsight> I build custom but sometimes use Staubli
[05:40:20] <CaptHindsight> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kajzYZVxkkA or similar
[05:41:11] <CaptHindsight> they have 2 SCARAS !
[05:41:40] <nnnn> that thing is sick
[05:41:47] <nnnn> capt: i have a question
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[05:45:20] <tjtr33> you wanna see puma's ? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lX6JcybgDFo
[05:45:25] <CaptHindsight> tjtr33: it worked
[05:45:31] <CaptHindsight> nnnn: yes?
[05:45:54] <tjtr33> i heard! but what was changed in hal?
[05:46:08] <CaptHindsight> no hal change
[05:46:19] <nnnn> tjtr33: i almost worked for the people who made box this summer but chose another place instead
[05:46:26] <CaptHindsight> just flipped motor polarity and encoder
[05:46:32] <nnnn> no
[05:46:39] <nnnn> it was ini change and motor polority
[05:46:45] <tjtr33> nnnn thats way cool I love that project
[05:46:59] <nnnn> yeah its awesome
[05:47:02] <tjtr33> oh ok ini & motor wires
[05:47:13] <nnnn> the best one in my opinion they made is the graffiti one
[05:47:40] <tjtr33> ok back to study thai Sawatdeekrup! ( hektor? the grafiti robot? ) bye!
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[05:48:26] <nnnn> capt: so i dont have the limit switches wired yet and it wont let me run the program
[05:48:30] <nnnn> it says error homing
[05:49:12] <CaptHindsight> well you can change the ini for the home signal
[05:49:51] <CaptHindsight> have to see your ini, can you just zero all the axis?
[05:50:15] <nnnn> is there a way i can show u my ini?
[05:50:23] <nnnn> i can paste it somewhere from another comp
[05:50:24] <CaptHindsight> pastebin
[05:50:32] <nnnn> ok one minute brb
[05:51:02] <CaptHindsight> I actually forget, I try not to touch code
[05:53:34] <nnnn> http://pastebin.com/ifvFYuze
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[05:57:08] <CaptHindsight> nnnn: will it let you jog?
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[06:01:37] <nnnn> yep it will let me jog in all directions and the scara sim follows and the numbers follow in lcnc
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[06:02:48] <CaptHindsight> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEUGbagf5-4 this make the Chinese routers look like Swiss clocks
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[06:09:03] <nnnn> sweet
[06:09:11] <nnnn> capt: any ideas?
[06:14:04] <CaptHindsight> nnnn: whats the question, I thought you have it moving
[06:14:34] <nnnn> right i have it moving but the program wont work
[06:14:42] <nnnn> it is jogging though and the sim is moving at the same rate
[06:14:52] <nnnn> the program when i try to get it to run it says error homing
[06:15:37] <CaptHindsight> I'll have to look tomorrow
[06:16:10] <CaptHindsight> it might be the polarity of your home switch
[06:16:56] <nnnn> the home switches arent wired yet
[06:17:04] <nnnn> do i need home switches to run the program?
[06:17:19] <CaptHindsight> if the ini file is expecting them
[06:18:02] <CaptHindsight> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Homing_And_Limit_Switch
[06:18:11] <CaptHindsight> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/config/ini_homing.html
[06:18:31] <CaptHindsight> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/config/ini_config.html
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[06:24:49] <nnnn> wierd so i did that and set the search velocity to zero
[06:24:51] <nnnn> for all
[06:24:55] <nnnn> and it already was all at zero
[06:25:01] <nnnn> which means its not looking for switches
[06:25:04] <nnnn> so that can be it
[06:25:06] <nnnn> cent
[06:25:08] <nnnn> cant
[06:25:12] <nnnn> it still didnt work
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[06:25:20] <nnnn> it said "cant run a program when not homed"
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[06:27:25] <CaptHindsight> there is a way to have it ignore that
[06:28:39] <nnnn> for sure?
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[06:57:39] <ReadError> disable the always home
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[07:15:27] <nnnn> where is that at
[07:16:02] <nnnn> readerror:
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[07:30:21] <nnnn> ReadError: u there
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[07:41:17] <Deejay> moinsen
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[09:31:40] <archivist_herron> !later nnnn http://www.linuxcnc.org/index.php/english/forum/10-advanced-configuration/9468-disable-homing
[09:31:41] <the_wench> will tell nnnn when he/she joins next
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[11:13:20] <skroon> hi all
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[13:13:48] <Loetmichel> gnah... came this morning to the company, co-worker called me "michel, come up to the office please, it smells like burning here..." found it: chinese NIC... -> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14796&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
[13:15:21] <Loetmichel> ... btw: the PC is up and running again, changed the two PCI slots and cleaned the board and the gpu ;-) (was less hassle than re-registering the hardware-bound software on that box)
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[13:19:01] <skunkworks> wow
[13:19:09] <skunkworks> what actually burned up?
[13:19:53] <skunkworks> on the board
[13:20:03] <humble_sea_bass> that would be funny if it wasn't kind of terrifying
[13:20:32] <skunkworks> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qp0ZpxsgxVs
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[13:22:03] <Loetmichel> skroon: seems tha cap on the nic had developed a short
[13:22:09] <Loetmichel> skunkworks
[13:22:18] <skunkworks> ah - poof
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[13:23:08] <Loetmichel> and it actually burned
[13:23:34] <Loetmichel> the whole case was full of big flakes of soot
[13:23:55] <Loetmichel> just got some compresed air in before making that photo
[13:24:41] <Loetmichel> amazingly after changing the two burned up slots, the Cap that bulged above it and a new bio battery it runs like nothing happened
[13:24:48] <Loetmichel> with a new nic of course ;-9
[13:26:10] <Loetmichel> (BTW: desoldering a opci slot without desoldering anything beside it is a not so easy task ;-)
[13:26:16] <Loetmichel> -o
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[13:27:17] <skunkworks> Loetmichel, wow - never gone that far.. (replaced blown caps - not pci plugs..)
[13:27:50] <Loetmichel> skroon: on that machine was some special software taht binds to the hardware
[13:28:10] <skunkworks> sure - makes sense..
[13:28:28] <Loetmichel> so if i changed that board it would need new registering at the software company. which is a PITA because its an Very old version and they are reluiuctant to support ist
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[14:11:27] <CaptHindsight> are you sure it isn't a Realtek Self-Destruct-On-Lan feature?
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[14:15:09] <archivist_herron> Firewire :)
[14:19:12] <humble_sea_bass> y2k bug in y2k14
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[14:28:49] <Loetmichel> CaptHindsight: more like the you get what you pay for"... weh bought a few 100s of these cards for 5,6 eur each ;-9
[14:29:43] <CaptHindsight> Loetmichel: somebody found a home for some leftover cheap capacitors
[14:32:11] <Loetmichel> chiensee quaitly . nuff said ;-)
[14:32:18] <CaptHindsight> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdqRH7_EOD8 this is where the parts for many boards like that get purchased, you don't now what you're getting
[14:36:10] <humble_sea_bass> I used to have a 30 inch dell monitor/tv that blew a bunch of caps
[14:36:20] <humble_sea_bass> turns out there was a recall
[14:42:02] <CaptHindsight> it's the number one reason LCD's die
[14:43:32] <CaptHindsight> the trick is to design a product that last just beyond the warranty period and not before
[14:45:37] <CaptHindsight> cheap caps and poor thermal management, I get some devices to live for years by just adding proper cooling. We had an original PS3 that lived for several years by just opening up larger slots fr airflow
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[14:46:13] <humble_sea_bass> my coworkers PS3 just dides
[14:46:23] <humble_sea_bass> it was a first generation one
[14:46:50] <archivist_herron> back in the 1970's when out repairing TV sets electrolytic caps were a regular fault
[14:48:39] <CaptHindsight> http://www.digikey.com/product-search/en/capacitors/aluminum-capacitors/131081 notice column 8 "Lifetime @ Temp"
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[14:49:27] <humble_sea_bass> heh, i've never noticed that column
[14:49:46] <CaptHindsight> 500 Hrs @ 85C is a joke
[14:51:03] <Loetmichel> CaptHindsight: you mean like in this (hannsG) 19" tft psu? -> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=5675
[14:51:10] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=5678
[14:51:19] <CaptHindsight> http://www.edn.com/design/components-and-packaging/4326347/Determining-end-of-life-ESR-and-lifetime-calculations-for-electrolytic-capacitors-at-higher-temperatures
[14:52:21] <CaptHindsight> caps go bad in products so often I see kits in bags on ebay based on model numbers
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[14:53:58] <CaptHindsight> I've never met an EE that had any training in thermal management in school
[14:53:59] <Loetmichel> thats really great desing for hannsg: every haldf a year the caps go (_) ... so i have tio change them
[14:54:54] <CaptHindsight> can you fit in larger and longer life caps?
[14:55:02] <Loetmichel> i did and i have
[14:55:13] <Loetmichel> doesent help other than elongate the period to a year
[14:55:26] <Loetmichel> they are simply to neat to the heatsik
[14:55:39] <Loetmichel> .. and it looks likt that is by design, not by error ;-)
[14:55:45] <CaptHindsight> sure
[14:55:59] <CaptHindsight> can you fit a fan in there?
[14:56:07] <Loetmichel> in a tft?
[14:56:25] <Loetmichel> no, i will change them one last time and then look for two 24" fukllHD tfts for cheaop
[14:56:38] <CaptHindsight> I've drilled holes in the rear of the enclosures to add fans
[14:56:54] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=12727
[14:57:13] <Loetmichel> no ideay how i will fit them there in the space of the 19"... but we'll see ;-9
[14:57:54] <CaptHindsight> I've kept a Broadcomm sat receiver alive buy just propping open the case 1"
[14:58:10] <Loetmichel> (thats my desk at home btw ;-9
[14:58:21] <CaptHindsight> no heatsinks on the BGA's, they run so hot you'll burn your fingers
[14:58:39] <jdh> I have a 486 with a funky old framegrabber that has teh case tilted open 45 degrees and a 6" fan blowing on it.
[14:59:00] <jdh> I've been meaning to fix that for 6 or 8 years
[14:59:16] <Loetmichel> jdh: like my blitecoin mining rig?
[14:59:45] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14553
[15:00:11] <jdh> except my fan looks prettier
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[15:00:30] <Loetmichel> hrhr, taht was temporary
[15:00:34] <jdh> it's an ISA combo framegrabber/vga
[15:00:36] <Loetmichel> that is what it looks now:
[15:00:37] <jdh> mine was temporary also
[15:00:46] <jdh> well, it still is temporary
[15:01:00] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14673&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
[15:01:09] <jdh> the hard drive died 4 or 5 years ago so it runs off a floppy
[15:01:31] <jdh> does teh fan not mind running at that angle?
[15:02:07] <Loetmichel> why should it?
[15:02:16] <Loetmichel> ist a bb fan
[15:02:37] <jdh> yeah, just seems like it woudl be happier flat or upright
[15:02:45] <jdh> but, I'm not a fan.
[15:02:50] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14728 <- have some decent heatsinks on the bitcoin miners now ;-9
[15:03:26] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14736
[15:03:28] <Loetmichel> :-)
[15:03:37] <CaptHindsight> every 3 months we take compressed air and blast the inside of every PC around here
[15:03:41] <CaptHindsight> works wonders
[15:09:23] <CaptHindsight> my USB microscope arrived to the US from China 3 days ago, now it's bumping around to different post offices :(
[15:09:51] <jmasseo> i use my shopvac
[15:09:52] <jmasseo> first on vacuum
[15:09:53] <jmasseo> then on blow
[15:09:55] <jmasseo> then on vacuum
[15:10:12] <jmasseo> but i only do one or two
[15:10:15] <jmasseo> and it's usually more than 3 months
[15:10:16] <jmasseo> heh
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[15:27:18] <Loetmichel> CaptHindsight: i have used my whole workday to cover Servers with filter felt on the front
[15:27:26] <Loetmichel> to prevent dust from coming in
[15:28:13] <humble_sea_bass> my computer is on a wall mounted medical transport chest with a grill and ac filter
[15:28:22] <Loetmichel> because we measure them and "do not open" seal them , so noone can clean them without voiding the Sdip 27 certification
[15:28:22] <CaptHindsight> archivist: you reminded me of a former life, 6GH8 was the most often bad part
[15:28:34] <humble_sea_bass> when not in used i clip on the other half of the medical chest so it is air/watertight
[15:29:44] <CaptHindsight> Loetmichel: don't you just trade blowing/vacuuming for replacing filters every 90 days?
[15:30:06] <CaptHindsight> in your situation I understand
[15:30:09] <Loetmichel> CaptHindsight: yeah, but the filters ARE replaceable from the outside ;-)
[15:30:17] <Loetmichel> the case is labeled shut
[15:32:26] <CaptHindsight> just seal them up completely and add http://www.3m.com/product/information/Fluorinert-Electronic-Liquid.html
[15:32:56] <CaptHindsight> if it wasn't $200/gal
[15:34:23] <Loetmichel> CaptHindsight: we sell them
[15:34:34] <Loetmichel> cant do that with soldiers
[15:34:43] <Loetmichel> ti change the filters is an easy task
[15:34:51] <Loetmichel> to maintain the cooling fuid wouldnt be ;-9
[15:35:28] <CaptHindsight> it would have to be completely sealed and have large fins
[15:35:31] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=13450&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
[15:35:44] <Loetmichel> these are the workstations for that order
[15:35:51] <Loetmichel> have no pics of the servers though
[15:36:44] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=13447&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
[15:37:42] <Loetmichel> have done that last year on 600 of these cases ;-9
[15:38:09] <CaptHindsight> ever use these? http://us.getac.com/notebooks/index.html
[15:39:38] <Loetmichel> have 17 right here
[15:39:43] <Loetmichel> just packing them ;-9
[15:39:57] <CaptHindsight> any problems?
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[15:40:04] <Loetmichel> s400
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[15:40:09] <Loetmichel> none that i know of
[15:40:27] <Loetmichel> in fact the supplier is very helpful and has made modifications for us
[15:40:43] <Loetmichel> (different powerr plug, no touchscreen)
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[15:47:19] <humble_sea_bass> THAT's a read little laptop
[15:47:41] <humble_sea_bass> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/like/281290349812?hlpht=true&ops=true&viphx=1&lpid=95&device=c&adtype=pla&crdt=0&ff3=1&ff11=ICEP3.0.0&ff12=67&ff13=80&ff14=95&ff19=0
[15:47:55] <humble_sea_bass> I want this for entirely irrational reasons
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[15:51:52] <nnnnnn> anyone know how to disable the always home
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[15:53:13] <skunkworks> nnnnnn, http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/2.5/html/config/ini_config.html#sub:TRAJ-section
[15:54:27] <nnnnnn> thanks!
[15:55:28] <skunkworks> np
[15:56:27] <nnnnnn> so in my ini in the traj section i have all of the things in the traj emc info page but i dont have the no force homing part. should I just add it in?
[15:57:13] <CaptHindsight> "The default behavior is for LinuxCNC to force the user to home the machine before any MDI command or a program is run. Normally, only jogging is allowed before homing. Setting NO_FORCE_HOMING = 1 allows the user to make MDI moves and run programs without homing the machine first. Interfaces without homing ability will need to have this option set to 1. "
[15:57:43] <CaptHindsight> "Warning
[15:57:43] <CaptHindsight> Using this will allow the machine to go beyond the soft limits while in operation. It is not generally desirable to allow this."
[16:02:12] <nnnnnn> so i wonder if i should just go for it and just keep my hand on the estop?
[16:02:30] <nnnnnn> it i max the axis out it will throw and error and give a following error
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[16:07:04] <nnnnnn> so that worked and the home is off
[16:07:28] <nnnnnn> but it said linear move in line 9 would exceed joint 2's max positive limit
[16:11:29] <nnnnnn> whoa it worked, but the default program that comes with lcnc has too high of a z
[16:11:33] <nnnnnn> is there a way to change that?
[16:11:52] <archivist> edit it
[16:12:03] <CaptHindsight> you mean the g-code or the ini file?
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[16:16:03] <nnnnnn> the gcode
[16:16:11] <nnnnnn> the default one the comes with lcnc
[16:16:15] <nnnnnn> i need to edit it
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[16:19:14] <nnnnnn> got it, so i can just edit it with gedt right?
[16:22:41] <nnnnnn> is there a way to edit to scale down all of the gcode at one?
[16:22:42] <nnnnnn> once
[16:29:42] <archivist> depends how the gcode is written
[16:30:25] <skunkworks> the 3dchips gcode is scalable in gcode..
[16:30:57] <skunkworks> gcode
[16:31:23] <pcw_home> gcode
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[16:31:50] <nnnnnn> 3d chips?
[16:32:03] <nnnnnn> im just trying to use the default lcnc one that comes with it
[16:32:39] <skunkworks> pcw_home, heh. Did you get rt_preemt working on the gigabit with ethernet?
[16:32:45] <pcw_home> Yes
[16:32:55] <skunkworks> nnnnnn, there are a bunch of sample gcode files that come with linuxcnc
[16:33:05] <nnnnnn> the one that writes out linuxcnc
[16:33:08] <skunkworks> pcw_home, working well?
[16:33:08] <pcw_home> 3.12.5 kernel
[16:33:10] <nnnnnn> is the one im using
[16:33:33] <pcw_home> Yes 2 KHz servo thread and flash videos a once
[16:33:40] <pcw_home> at once
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[16:34:30] <skunkworks> nice!
[16:34:36] <nnnnnn> is there a better program to try out that comes with lcnc or one that doesnt use the z axis?
[16:35:08] <pcw_home> using on board RTK 8168? for RT and some usb ethernet adapter a found at Goodwill for net
[16:35:12] <Tom_itx> dig thru the example directory to see
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[16:36:54] <Loetmichel> *HA* got some e-cig-juice and a few new t3s tanks(e-cig heads)... i think its starting to get a bit out of hand... ;-) -> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14799
[16:40:55] <nnnnnn> so i found one and ran it but it instantly get a joint following error
[16:40:59] <nnnnnn> no idea why
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[16:44:18] <CaptHindsight> nnnnnn: just write a few lines of G-code yourself (yes this comes from the guy that hates to code)
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[16:45:17] <nnnnnn> i think the g0 is making it go to fast
[16:45:18] <nnnnnn> ?
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[16:46:08] <Tom_itx> rapid move
[16:46:26] <Tom_itx> not a feed move
[16:46:31] <Tom_itx> G1 is a linear feed move
[16:46:48] <pcw_home> skunkworks: the dual MAC/quad core one is starting to show up also:
[16:46:50] <pcw_home> http://www.superbiiz.com/detail.php?name=MB-1900D3V
[16:47:52] <nnnnnn> G0 rapid move
[16:48:08] <nnnnnn> makes it initally go really fast and loose tracking
[16:48:31] <pcw_home> How is your tuning?
[16:49:10] <nnnnnn> i havent done pwm tuning yet
[16:49:16] <nnnnnn> is that the problem?
[16:49:19] <nnnnnn> probably....
[16:49:24] <pcw_home> likely to be
[16:49:43] <nnnnnn> that would totally make sense
[16:49:43] <Connor> PetefromTn_: I have the Tool Changer script finished I think.
[16:49:52] <Connor> with exception to spindle orintation.
[16:49:54] <nnnnnn> is the right way to do the tuning the zeiger nichols way?
[16:50:02] <Connor> orientation.
[16:50:09] <pcw_home> no
[16:50:11] <CaptHindsight> nnnnnn: just move it slowly for now until you have time to tune it
[16:50:45] <pcw_home> or widen the following error limits
[16:51:09] <Connor> pcw_home: Nice board, had me till I read it was a Celeron..
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[16:51:25] <pcw_home> celeron is just a name
[16:51:40] <pcw_home> its really closer to a core Dou
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[16:52:34] <PetefromTn_> Connor Wow totally awesome man. I am off today and just got back from Knoxvegas with a big chunka aluminum barstock for more of those parts I am making.
[16:52:43] <Connor> Cool.
[16:52:51] <pcw_home> 2-3 x as fast as the atoms, great latency and lower power
[16:52:57] <PetefromTn_> I am going to try to machine the encoder mount I designed this weekend hopefully.
[16:53:07] <Connor> Cool.
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[16:53:25] <pcw_home> But... need new kernel to support the Intel HD graphics
[16:53:38] <Connor> Ick. Figures
[16:53:57] <PetefromTn_> I am quite happy with my Atom board thus far.
[16:54:17] <pcw_home> but have no trouble running 1080P and linuxCNC at the same time
[16:54:25] <nnnnnn> interesting i dont have a joint 3 in my gcode but got a joint 3 following error
[16:54:29] <pcw_home> and 4 KHz servo threads
[16:54:39] <PetefromTn_> So we can view our toolpaths in High Definition video?
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[16:55:11] <CaptHindsight> heh we were gaming while running Linuxnc in 1080p
[16:55:35] <Connor> PetefromTn_: We STILL need to decide on handling the 180 out. If the MESA card is going to do it, then pcw_home needs to tell us how to do it exactly and get us the firmware..
[16:55:42] <Connor> No CLUE how to do it in hall..
[16:55:50] <CaptHindsight> PetefromTn_: high res simulations
[16:55:51] <Connor> I mean HAL
[16:56:06] <PetefromTn_> sure..
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[16:56:21] <CaptHindsight> PetefromTn_: auto ZERO and HD video while cutting
[16:56:29] <nnnnnn> how can i get rid of joint 3 in my gcode?
[16:56:38] <nnnnnn> i dont have it in my gcode but it said i got a following error
[16:56:40] <Connor> and hardware solution is good.. but, not sure how to figure out differential signal for it.. pcw_home Do we have to have differential signal for the index ?
[16:56:44] <nnnnnn> is there a way to disable it in the ini
[16:58:25] <pcw_home> I think a hal comp can do this but its a bit tricky because index_enable is bidirectional
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[17:00:29] <nnnnnn> weird
[17:02:07] <Connor> pcw_home: That's just the thing.. making a new component requires coding.. I've never made a component..
[17:02:57] <Connor> I can build the hardware solution easy enough.. I just need to know if you can have differential inputs for A and B, and not for Z
[17:03:17] <pcw_home> Yes
[17:04:03] <PetefromTn_> Man I think LinuxCNC maybe NEEDs a better component for this type of toolchanger that can be altered for ones needs.
[17:04:08] <Connor> then, easy enough.. tie the +24v to the input side of opto, tie the Z+ into the +5vcc side of opto and tie output to MESA card
[17:04:13] <pcw_home> you would need to take the 24V prox signal level shift and mask the encoder Z signal with it
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[17:04:57] <Connor> when prox + Z high = high on output.
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[17:05:41] <pcw_home> Yeah just a transmission gate (though you will probably need a pullup or pulldown resistor in the index input)
[17:05:56] <pcw_home> on the index input
[17:06:05] <Connor> on the mesa side?
[17:06:13] <pcw_home> Yes
[17:06:19] <Connor> probably a pulldown
[17:07:02] <pcw_home> The 7I77 has a pullup on the TTL input so you may want to choose the active low encoder Z pin
[17:07:03] <Connor> I can bread board the circuit and test it.. and check the output with my digital o-scope.
[17:07:20] <Connor> Z- ?
[17:07:30] <pcw_home> probably
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[17:09:55] <pcw_home> a more general solution for this kind of thing would be a software
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[17:09:56] <pcw_home> index mask input (a hm2 driver change)
[17:09:57] <pcw_home> so you would have hm2_5i25.0.encoder.03.index_mask
[17:10:19] <pcw_home> and just wire than in HAL to the prox pin
[17:10:28] <PetefromTn_> that sounds nice and easier to wire up LOL...
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[17:13:05] <Connor> well, who can make the change to the hm2 driver ?:)
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[17:13:44] <Connor> and, would that be a GPIO pin or another encoder pin ?
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[17:14:59] <pcw_home> it would be a HAL input pint to the hm2 encoder comp
[17:15:05] <pcw_home> pin
[17:15:23] * skunkworks would like a pint right now...
[17:15:35] <pcw_home> :-)
[17:15:36] <Connor> okay.. so, then we could tie what ever hardware pin to that then..
[17:16:02] <pcw_home> yes all in hal (as long as 1 KHz or so sampling is OK)
[17:16:13] <PetefromTn_> zeeshan|2 Ya there man?
[17:16:31] <Connor> which is typically okay on Atom PC's
[17:17:10] <Connor> who maintains the hm2 comp ?
[17:17:16] <PetefromTn_> how would the 1k affect the performance of the machine?
[17:17:56] <pcw_home> 1 KHz is usually for good velocity mode drives
[17:18:05] <pcw_home> usually fine
[17:18:23] <R2E4_> What do you have to change in the firmware. IS it for the toolchanger?
[17:18:32] <PetefromTn_> well we are running the spindle in velocity mode apparently. so it is all good then?
[17:18:42] <pcw_home> no firmware changes
[17:19:33] <R2E4_> whew, Cause I am going to probably do somethiung similar for my tool changer as i need Y movement during a tool change.
[17:19:37] <pcw_home> unless the spindle is a servo, the thread rate is pretty much dont care for it
[17:20:05] <PetefromTn_> Huh what does that mean?
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[17:21:00] <R2E4_> Is that wuestion aimed at me?
[17:21:21] <PetefromTn_> No what do you mean the thread rate pretty much don't care for it?
[17:22:00] <Connor> okay.. found the drivers in /src/hal/drivers/mesa-hostmot2
[17:22:06] <Connor> wow.. I have NO idea where to start...
[17:22:30] <PetefromTn_> Jeez man if YOU don't have any idea where to start I would say we are screwd LOL....
[17:22:37] <Connor> Nah.
[17:24:01] <Connor> This would be probably 4-10 lines worth of code in the driver to handle this.. add new pin (1 or 2 lines.. ), and a few lines to tie that new pin into the index to AND the two values together.. 4-6 lines maybe ?
[17:24:30] <Connor> I just not comfortable doing it..
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[17:26:53] <Connor> pcw_home: Wouldn't we need some sort of pin or parameter to enable z-index mask ?
[17:27:34] <pcw_home> it could default to enabled
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[17:28:04] <Connor> so, default it to high.. then no need to have a enable pin..
[17:30:07] <pcw_home> but its a bit tricky since the drive would have to enable and disable
[17:30:09] <pcw_home> the hardware index enable bit in the CCR and not report index detected status if masked
[17:30:14] <CaptHindsight> PCW: what kinds of motors can we control now over GbEthernet to 2Khz?
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[17:30:53] <pcw_home> any the HM2 can control (though its just 100BT)
[17:31:24] <CaptHindsight> great
[17:31:50] <Connor> pcw_home: Now you lost me.
[17:32:09] <CaptHindsight> pcw_home: how are they connected? point to point or multiple through a switch?
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[17:43:26] <Connor> 01:40:48 PM) seb_kuzminsky: hmm, dont we already have that? i'm looking at the hostmot2 manpage, encoder section, and it describes what i think i said above
[17:43:26] <Connor> (01:41:18 PM) seb_kuzminsky: (bit r/w) index-mask
[17:43:26] <Connor> (01:41:19 PM) seb_kuzminsky: If set to True, the Index input pin only has an effect if the Index-Mask input pin is True (or False, depending on the index-mask-invert pin below).
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[17:44:14] <Connor> (01:42:32 PM) seb_kuzminsky: i think that feature needs special firmware support that's maybe not present in all the hm2 firmwares we ship currently
[17:44:15] <Connor> (01:42:40 PM) seb_kuzminsky: peter might know about that part
[17:44:17] <Connor> pcw_home: ?
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[17:48:07] <pcw_home> Thats if you use a external mask input pin
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[17:50:07] <IchGuckLive> hi all B)
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[17:50:47] <Connor> okay... which.. th 7i77 doesn't have ?
[17:51:35] <pcw_home> thats another possibility (use a spare 7I77 encoder input pin as index mask) but I'm pretty sure that needs driver work
[17:51:36] <pcw_home> (though its simpler than adding the software index mask)
[17:52:48] <pcw_home> The reason it needs driver work is thats a muxed index mask so the driver needs to accept a muxed_index_mask_ pin
[17:53:40] <pcw_home> (I have a feeling it will bail with an unknown pin error now but I guess it could be tried)
[17:53:58] <Connor> Well.. both of those solutions require help from the community / driver maintainer.. so.. I'm kinda stuck..
[17:54:55] <pcw_home> I can build a config with a couple muxed index masks and see what the driver does
[17:55:06] <Connor> Would you?
[17:55:24] <Connor> please.. This is the finial step.. I just finished up the tool changer remap code..
[17:55:33] <pcw_home> you would still need to level shift the 24V down to TTL for the encoder input
[17:55:43] <Connor> we can test that.. but will have to orientate the spindle manually...
[17:55:53] <Connor> crud..
[17:56:07] <Connor> which means.. a opto...
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[18:00:14] <pcw_home> well you could cheat and connect the prox to a field input, hal wire the prox signal to a GPIO bit on P2
[18:00:16] <pcw_home> loop the GPIO bit on P2 back to the adjacent bit (which I setup as index mask in the firmware)
[18:01:23] <Connor> Will we have any issues with the read frequency on the GPIO? Will it be fast enough ?
[18:01:27] <pcw_home> so the hardware consists of a 0.1" slider on two P2 pins
[18:01:54] <pcw_home> I dont think so
[18:01:55] <Connor> or a bit of wire..
[18:02:35] <pcw_home> not that your are going to be orienting/treading at 6KRPM
[18:02:57] <Connor> Wait, he's field voltage is 24v
[18:03:17] <Connor> I don't think he has a 5v field voltage.
[18:03:27] <pcw_home> Thats fine
[18:04:01] <PetefromTn_> We will probably never rigid tap above 1k RPM and indexing spindle will be done probably below a couple hundred or lower I would assume.
[18:04:12] <Connor> so you can take a 24v GPIO and loop it back into a encoder input ?
[18:04:21] <pcw_home> PROX --> 24V Field input --> HALpin --> GPIO bit --> INDEXMASK
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[18:04:57] <pcw_home> nothing connected to P2 just a jumper between two pins
[18:05:55] <Connor> okay.. one sec.. let me get this.. prox into 24v GPIO input pin.
[18:06:12] <pcw_home> NO NO NO
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[18:06:27] <Connor> ok
[18:06:35] <pcw_home> 24V prox into 24V field input
[18:07:12] <Connor> okay. let me grab pdf of the 7i77 board..
[18:07:18] <pcw_home> this gives you a hal pin thats is the index mask signal
[18:08:15] <Connor> okay, what are you clling a 24v field input? the IN 0..15 and IN 16..32 ?
[18:09:00] <pcw_home> Yes
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[18:09:19] <Connor> okay.. I was calling that a GPIO
[18:09:38] <pcw_home> since they are already designed for 24V IO
[18:09:54] <pcw_home> GPIO are bare FPGA pins
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[18:10:27] <Connor> OH. Okay.
[18:10:35] <Connor> Sorry.
[18:10:46] <PetefromTn_> SO wiring this up would be simply encoder in on spindle axis inputs and prox in on an I/0....
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[18:11:20] <Connor> okay..so, once into that pin.. use hal to cross connect the Field I/O pin to the encoder pin used for mask_input
[18:11:22] <PetefromTn_> We already have the prox switches wired into inputs on the 7i77 and it is working in software.
[18:11:29] <pcw_home> Yes (and a 2 pin slider on P2 say from pin 1 to 2)
[18:11:46] <Connor> okay, what does THAT do ?
[18:11:49] <PetefromTn_> what is a 2 pin slider?
[18:12:13] <IchGuckLive> switch i asume
[18:12:15] <pcw_home> like the ones used to set encoder mode
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[18:12:22] <Connor> right.. Jumper
[18:12:33] <Connor> like you find on motherboards, hard drivers etc..
[18:13:55] <PetefromTn_> what is P2?
[18:14:04] <pcw_home> so in hal you wire the prox signal to an output on P2 pin1 (GPIO17)
[18:14:05] <pcw_home> and i make firmware that has index mask for (what channel) on P2 pin2 (GPIO18)
[18:15:02] <pcw_home> P2 on the 5I25
[18:15:14] <Connor> Yea, I JUST figured that out.
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[18:16:05] <PetefromTn_> So we have to run the signals to the front of the machine then that kinda sucks...and may also be a signal loss issue no?
[18:16:07] <Connor> So, jumper Pin1 and Pin2 in the P2 (the 26 pin connector) on the 5i25 board
[18:16:14] <pcw_home> sorry I swim in this stuff so forget that not everyone does
[18:16:20] <pcw_home> Yes
[18:16:30] <Connor> PetefromTn_: Kinda, it's internal though.
[18:16:34] <Connor> no signal issue.
[18:16:52] <pcw_home> the wire is 0.1" long
[18:17:00] <Connor> exactly.
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[18:17:40] <PetefromTn_> yeah but you said the prox signal needs to get there...
[18:17:59] <pcw_home> well it does but through HAL
[18:18:07] <Connor> Prox signal will be on a Field I/O pin on the 7i77 board.. just like it is now..
[18:18:13] <PetefromTn_> but the prox will be on the 7i77
[18:18:28] <PetefromTn_> and the encoder inputs as well.
[18:18:36] <Connor> I the hal wire the pin to the GPIO pin on the 2nd connector on 5i25
[18:18:54] <pcw_home> all nasty wiring in HAL
[18:18:56] <Connor> then jumper that to GPIO pin 2 in second connecotr.
[18:19:04] <PetefromTn_> then yeah a simple jumper on the 5i25 is simple enough LOL.
[18:19:35] <Connor> he makes custom firmware that uses P2 Pin2 s mask-input
[18:19:52] <Connor> that way, you don't end up using a encoder input on the 7i77
[18:19:59] <Connor> and you have your mask. :)
[18:20:07] <Connor> pcw_home: I following correctly now ?
[18:20:22] <PetefromTn_> Oh really I do not need to use an encoder input? How?
[18:20:30] <pcw_home> a little M^2 but should work fine
[18:21:05] <PetefromTn_> M2?
[18:21:25] <pcw_home> Micky-Mouse
[18:21:35] <PetefromTn_> Amazing to me how I NEVER understand what the hell you guys are talking about hehe
[18:21:41] <Connor> couldn't we just hal wire the Field IO pin straight to the P2 Pin2 I/O and loose the jumper?
[18:22:03] <Connor> not understanding why we have to use 2 GPIO
[18:22:07] <Connor> not that it matters...
[18:22:21] <pcw_home> you cannot set a input pin (like index mask) to output mode
[18:22:54] <pcw_home> (if its enabled and that encoder needs to be enabled)
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[18:23:09] <PetefromTn_> What is Mickey Mouse about this? I don't like the sound of Mickey Mousing something that will affect the safety of my toolchanger movements guys.
[18:23:55] <Connor> okay, so.. to toggle the pin via hal, it has to be in output mode?
[18:24:26] <pcw_home> I just mean It would be nicer if the HM2 encoder had a software index mask for this kind of problem
[18:25:33] <pcw_home> looping it back through I/O is a workaround (though its not any kind of reliability issue)
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[18:26:02] <PetefromTn_> How difficult is it to do it the right way?
[18:26:07] <pcw_home> if you worried about it you can verify its working
[18:26:17] <pcw_home> driver work
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[18:27:08] <Connor> and this 2nd solution we just talked about.. would require a firmware update too? Or was this a way to get around that ?
[18:27:12] <pcw_home> I mean there nothing wrong and long as you dont need to use P2
[18:27:30] <Connor> I don't think he'll ever need P2
[18:27:41] <Connor> although.. I forgot you had that peat..
[18:28:06] <PetefromTn_> What the hell is P2? I am so lost
[18:28:34] <PetefromTn_> Is this the connector on the 5i25 that will accept another board we are talking about?
[18:28:37] <pcw_home> The 5I25 has 2 daughtercard connnectors, you are just using one (P3)
[18:29:28] <Connor> PetefromTn_: You mean the pendant card? No.. that's used off of the 7i77
[18:29:41] <Connor> P2 is so you could hook up another 7i77 card
[18:30:39] <PetefromTn_> The only additional hardware short of making the toolchanger and spindle feedback work is I was considering adding that card Pete spoke about that runs off the 5i25 that allows lots of additonal I/0 for buttons on the control pendant up front...
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[18:31:25] <pcw_home> you can do that with a 7I73 or 7I84 running from the 7I77 Sserial expansion port
[18:31:59] <Connor> yea, that's the pendant card.
[18:32:11] <Connor> though, you could use a simple breakout on the P2
[18:32:18] <PetefromTn_> what was that card you were talking about that runs off the 5i25 up front in the pendant for more I/0 buttons without tons of more wiring.
[18:32:21] <Connor> or just run wire straight the I/O
[18:32:47] <Connor> 7i73
[18:32:57] <Connor> http://www.mesanet.com/pdf/parallel/7i73man.pdf
[18:33:17] <Connor> 7I73 supports up to four  50KHz encoder inputs for MPGs, 8 digital inputs and 6 digital outputs and up to a 64 Key keypad. If a smaller keypad is 
[18:33:33] <Connor> gotta go get lunch
[18:33:35] <Connor> back in a few
[18:34:27] <PetefromTn_> I really do not need a special keypad I was gonna just get some buttons and machine a new pendant faceplate.
[18:34:32] <PetefromTn_> Okay enjoy.
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[19:04:04] <Connor_iPad> PetefromTn_: if you want to use a cheaper break out connected to P2 then we need to use the software solution.
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[19:04:28] <Connor_iPad> If you use the pendant card. It plugs into the 7i77.
[19:04:55] <Connor_iPad> Or you can just run wires back the I/O on the 7i77
[19:09:24] <IchGuckLive> im off bye
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[19:11:11] <PetefromTn_> Okay man I suppose either the pendant card or the wires will be fine I don't plan on adding tons of buttons maybe a dozen or so down the road at most and there is ample I/0 available already back there. Maybe I can get a many strand shielded cable like we used for the Modbus control to do it.
[19:11:33] <PetefromTn_> Watching Videos on mastercam on youtube right now. Trying to figure out this damn program.
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[19:18:34] <humble_sea_bass> Pete, there is little logic behind it. Even the current one has that 1980's UI feel
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[19:20:24] <PetefromTn_> Yeah totally right but it is what ALL the local shops use and I am working temporarily in a shop that uses it. They want me to be able to do my own programming of parts so I am more useful to them with it.
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[19:21:21] <PetefromTn_> Hopefully if I can learn the basics of it and start doing some simpler stuff for them I will be able to do that and possibly get paid more for it as well. Mostly I want to be able to say that I can use it for when I move back to Florida so if I need to work for someone else I can have that in my toolkit.
[19:21:27] <CaptHindsight> humble_sea_bass: put in the values and then you turn the crank on the screen?
[19:22:28] <PetefromTn_> actually it sticks out the back of the monitor...
[19:23:26] <humble_sea_bass> CaptHindsight: That ain't too far off. Those cats at Mastercam don't seem to know that you;'re no longer bound to DOS like prompts and workflows
[19:24:21] <humble_sea_bass> I have no idea how mastercam got to be so popular given its esoteric workflow
[19:25:06] <CaptHindsight> they are everywhere
[19:25:16] <PetefromTn_> I know but it does have some of the best toolpath strategies around and they have Mastercam X7 or 9 or something so it is pretty recent.
[19:25:21] <CaptHindsight> pretty aggressive sales team
[19:26:09] <CaptHindsight> i think the robot simulation package brings the price >$20K
[19:27:03] <PetefromTn_> just freakin' nutz...
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[19:28:54] <CaptHindsight> http://www.robotmaster.com/
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[19:37:41] <humble_sea_bass> my college is still holding on to mastercam 9 (not X lics)
[19:37:59] <humble_sea_bass> if you think X is bad, hoo boy
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[20:01:55] <Connor> PetefromTn_: I need you to confirm the Tool present sensor only works AFTER the PDB is closed.. I don't think it can sense the tool when the PDB is open.
[20:02:22] <Connor> also, See if you can figure out the safe height and tool change height..
[20:02:43] <Connor> best way to do that is to probably manually move the ram in.. and slowly bring the head down after homing.
[20:05:56] <PetefromTn_> Connor define open or closed...
[20:08:01] <PetefromTn_> actually I can just jog the head to a position close and adjust with the MPG until I can seat the toolchanger ram onto the tool with the pocket fingers. I actually had to do that already when I first got the machine working we had to reinstall the software as the parameters were lost due to a bad Cmos battery.
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[20:09:09] <PetefromTn_> I will try to do that this evening. I am having to go to the store for shopping here now.
[20:09:56] <PetefromTn_> You are really ready to try this out once we get the spindle feedback and orientation working huh.. Eggcelent Egor the Monster will LIVE SOON!!
[20:11:03] <CaptHindsight> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RPvxShlrm58 "3D Printing: The Business Opportunities" it ignores much of the FDM junk
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[20:12:28] <XXCoder> "I feel so tight" gonna love autocapotion
[20:12:38] <XXCoder> "sweetie printing" lol
[20:12:58] <XXCoder> "lazy talent" I think I got that
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[20:15:28] <XXCoder> some autocaptions is good enough for me to follow. not this one unfortunately.
[20:15:56] <CaptHindsight> maybe it's his thick British accent
[20:16:24] <CaptHindsight> can you tweak your settings to UK English?
[20:16:46] <XXCoder> probably? dunno. nah only one, autocaption english
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[20:28:14] <Connor> Open = PDB active i.E. Clamp Opened / Closed - PDB not active, Clamp Closed
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[20:29:25] <PCW> Connor: which encoder needs the index mask?
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[20:38:27] <PetefromTn_> Connor How about simply clamped or unclamped clamped being air pressure to drawbar is off and tool is locked in or unclamped and tool is out air pressure to PDB is on.
[20:40:36] <Connor> PCW which ever one is normally used for spindle..
[20:40:55] <Connor> Clamp On and Clamp Off are sensors, PDB is output..
[20:41:10] <Connor> So, PDB ON = Clamp Off
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[20:43:02] <alex001> Hello... it is possible somehow from the python linuxcnc api to change some global variables prior to running a program file ?
[20:44:00] <andypugh> alex001: mdi(“#100 = 100”) ?
[20:44:04] <Connor> PCW: hm2_5i25.0.encoder.05
[20:44:11] <Connor> looks to be the one we're using for spindle
[20:44:35] <PetefromTn_> Yeah I think there are six starting with zero so yeah the last one is for spindle input.
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[20:46:00] <PetefromTn_> Jeez man this Mastercam is WAY complicated to generate a simple pocket. Just lots of options that can get confusing.
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[20:46:51] <humble_sea_bass> did you know that mastercam has a lucrative educational business called mastercam U
[20:48:22] <Connor_iPad> CamBam is just dirt simple. I like it.
[20:49:37] <PetefromTn_> yeah Cambam is quite simple yet has some neat stuff included. Mastercam is another level of complexity from what I am seeing in these videos.
[20:50:17] <PetefromTn_> yeah so they make it difficult to understand then they sell schooling for it for profit....Devious....
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[20:52:23] <Connor_iPad> What features does MC have that would be useful to hobbiest?
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[20:55:08] <alex001> andypugh, I will try that.. I was wondering if there was a way where I did not had to change between auto and mdi mode
[20:55:34] <PetefromTn_> TONS of stuff... but no hobbyist could afford it LOL... It has some crazy pocketing toolpaths, trochoidal milling. a bunch of 3d toolpaths and each toolpath has WAY more options for the cut
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[20:56:38] <PetefromTn_> it also has a bunch of HSM toolpaths and adaptive clearing most of which even the pro shop I am working in never gets used.
[20:56:57] <Connor_iPad> HSM?
[20:57:17] <PetefromTn_> Quite honestly while I have not worked there so far too long most of the stuff they are doing is quite boring LOL.
[20:57:22] <PetefromTn_> High speed machining
[20:57:38] <PetefromTn_> The vast majority of it could easily be done with camBam.
[20:58:39] <PetefromTn_> I showed them the part I did for that scope rail pictures on my phone and they were like WOW that is a sweet part LOL.. Mostly they make fixture parts and custom brackets etc for industry.
[20:58:52] <PetefromTn_> The Lathe work however is a different story...
[21:00:08] <PetefromTn_> The guy who runs the lathes is VERY skilled and the parts that come out of that side of the shop are gorgeous and are everthing from simple threaded shafts to large diameter turnings with crazy angles and precision bores to teeny tiny parts that I dunno how the hell they made them..
[21:00:51] <PetefromTn_> One thing is for sure they are beautiful looking parts with unbelievable finishes I would die to be able to reproduce on my POS chinko lathe LOL.
[21:01:35] <PetefromTn_> I tried to talk to that guy but he is a very large quiet reserved man and while he was friendly he did not enjoy discussing the particulars of how he programs them.
[21:02:25] <PetefromTn_> Refreshingly the Mill guys are very open and enjoy discussing options and strategies for parts I think it helps them get their head wrapped around a project like me.
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[21:03:14] <Connor_iPad> Wonder why he didn't want to talk about how he programs his stuff ?
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[21:07:32] <PetefromTn_> Well the other guy there is a manual mill guy and he has a bunch of CNC lathe experience from a previous employer and he was willing to talk about it. I have shown my interest to all of them in learning to program the lathes so perhaps in time they will give me a walk thru of a pre programmed part that I can run like some kinda production and maybe then I can learn what is going on.
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[21:09:21] <PetefromTn_> If nothing else working there will help me get back on track with my bills a bit and I will learn a BUNCH of new stuff about how the Pro's work.
[21:09:28] <CaptHindsight> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IA5BTD-aelo Build a $10 USB visible-light spectrometer
[21:10:33] <PetefromTn_> I think the sheer volume and differences between the parts being made there puts you in a position to learn many different ways to do things and what works and what does not. It is already quite interesting if not stressful to understand what is going on as things move quickly.
[21:11:23] <PetefromTn_> You quickly see what is important to do and what is just a time waster. I found lots of things I was doing on a simple setup that are just kinda stupid as well as picking up offsets etc...
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[21:12:37] <PetefromTn_> When they are showing me something new I often have to ask them to do it again they move so quickly thru settings and mashing buttons on the control I kinda feel like I am a kindergartner in High school.
[21:13:30] <PetefromTn_> So far they are very cool about it and are always saying they would MUCH rather I ask a question and understand what the hell I am doing then try to guess and screw something up. That is refreshing but I try to NOT waste their time as much as possible.
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[21:29:43] <andypugh> I seem to be able to get really god finishes on my Chinese lathe, I think it comes down to tweaking the surface speed.
[21:29:58] <andypugh> The lathe is dreadful, I can parely part for chatter.
[21:31:00] <PetefromTn_> Oh don't get me wrong I love my lathe but it does not compare to the machines or the tooling they have there...
[21:31:04] <andypugh> As an example, that ballscrew is straight off the lathe, no polishing or grinding. https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/fwkHFH8rDfnhI4TpUL4EGtMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=directlink
[21:32:13] <andypugh> But every time i use a proper lathe (like the Colchesrer Student I sometimes use) I start to hate my Chinese thing.
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[21:35:57] <andypugh> I still prefer lathe work to mill work. I wonder if it is because you rarely have to spend time thinking about setup?
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[21:48:46] <Deejay> gn8
[21:49:13] <CaptHindsight> ballscrews with threads on the end!? you could probably set preloads on the bearings that way :)
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[21:51:41] <andypugh> Surely using the couplings would be better :-)
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[22:16:59] <CaptHindsight> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Staubli-RS60-Linear-Motion-Articulating-Arm-4-Axis-Robot-w-BOSCH-Controller-/360817594206?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5402678f5e $899.95
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[22:50:59] <gene78> puzzle, parport.17.out-invert and parport.17.invert are both illegal. what is proper syntax?
[22:52:11] <gene78> puzzle, parport.0.pin-17-out-invert and parport.0.pin-17-invert are both illegal. what is proper syntax?
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[22:54:27] <PCW> halcmd show pin
[22:55:35] <CaptHindsight> http://www.amonstar.com/photo/d3040cty/d5.jpg heh, this version gets the ballscrews right but uses unsupported bearings
[22:56:14] <gene78> segfault Peter
[22:57:11] <PCW> while linuxcnc is running?
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[23:07:06] <XXCoder> just got calipers. of course its bit dirty
[23:08:25] <XXCoder> dunno why but chinese stuff tend to be, expecially if tools
[23:12:54] <gene78> Peter, no. It won't run with the syntax the manpages claim
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[23:15:21] <gene78> but my back is fini, so after gooping the cable anchor on my encoder board because it wont work with the cover (it is not touching), I am headed for the house
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[23:22:20] <PCW> conner: freeby.mesanet.com/5i25_7i77x1_IMS.bit
[23:22:47] <PCW> works for me (but linuxcnc has to be running)
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[23:24:29] <Connor> pcw: has to be running ?
[23:24:38] <Connor> why wouldn't it be running?
[23:25:41] <PCW> that was for gene
[23:25:52] <Connor> Oh.
[23:26:05] <PCW> (halcmd wont run unless rt/linuxcnc is running)
[23:26:10] <Connor> right.
[23:26:29] <Connor> okay.. so.. how do we load this firmwre?
[23:26:57] <PCW> mesaflash
[23:27:50] <PCW> sudo ./mesaflash --device 5i25 --write 5i25_7i77x1_IMS.bit
[23:28:11] <PCW> (then power cycle. reboot wont do)
[23:28:47] <Connor> okay.. downloaded the utils for the 5i25
[23:28:50] <Connor> what's mesaflash3 ?
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[23:52:17] <andypugh> Connor: Newest Mesaflash. I think that is the one that does ethernet cards too.
[23:52:49] <andypugh> gene78: Still there?
[23:53:51] <PCW> Ethernet and 7I90 via EPP
[23:55:02] <PCW> mesaflash3 currently wont run on 10.04
[23:55:33] <andypugh> That seems a bit unfortunate
[23:57:42] <PCW> I guess you can build it on 10.04