#linuxcnc | Logs for 2012-06-17

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[00:00:13] <andypugh> It exists in a RIP system
[00:00:30] <JT-Shop> yea, just looking at the git tree and I see it
[00:01:05] <pfred1> find / -name "*" | grep -i axis would spit out every file in the /usr/share/axis directory just because the word axis is there
[00:01:29] <pfred1> so it is a terrible search
[00:01:43] <pfred1> you can pipe it to another grep though
[00:02:23] <pfred1> like this is legal find / -name "*" | grep -i axis | grep py
[00:02:41] <andypugh> Maybe the file doesn't exist on an installed system? Is that possible?
[00:02:48] <pfred1> then you'd see every python file in the axis directory though
[00:02:59] <Tom_itx> Jymmm i could stuff an atom in that box
[00:03:39] <Tom_itx> andypugh how do you like that new generation atom board so far?
[00:03:45] <JT-Shop> andypugh: it is in usr/bin
[00:04:12] <andypugh> Tom_itx: it seems good. The only drawback is the lack of PCI slot
[00:04:13] <pfred1> oh man you could have just issued which axis.py
[00:04:29] <JT-Shop> but it does not have the .py extension
[00:04:33] <JT-Shop> just axis
[00:04:34] <alex4nder> andypugh: axis.py becomes axis
[00:04:37] <pfred1> you can use which to show yo uwhich command you are executing
[00:04:57] <andypugh> Oh. Bother!
[00:04:58] <pfred1> which searches your path
[00:05:03] <Tom_itx> andypugh are you gonna try the pcie card for it?
[00:05:19] <andypugh> Tom_itx: I have a 6i25 in it now.
[00:05:19] <pfred1> but it is handier than it sounds
[00:05:39] <pfred1> like if you have multiple versions of a program installed
[00:06:39] <pfred1> alex4nder with a shell script?
[00:07:17] <pfred1> like is there an executable shell script called axis that calls axis.py?
[00:07:53] <pfred1> then yes you would just issue the command which axis
[00:08:13] <pfred1> then you could do this file `which axis`
[00:08:26] <pfred1> which would tell you it was a shell script
[00:08:35] <andypugh> No, axis is a #! /usr/bin/python executable.
[00:08:41] <pfred1> then cat `which axis` which would display it
[00:09:03] <pfred1> still a shell script but it just uses python
[00:09:56] <alex4nder> pfred1: it gets processed as part of emc/usr_intf/axis/Submakefile.. the #! gets fixed up, and then it's copied in place
[00:10:19] <pfred1> #! is a shell script bang
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[00:10:30] <alex4nder> #! is a kernel command. ;)
[00:10:41] <pfred1> yeah but all shell scripts start with it
[00:11:12] <alex4nder> it's got nothing to do with the shell.. it tells whoever is responsible for starting it, who is repsonsible for interpreting it
[00:11:22] <alex4nder> shell scripts use that facility to run
[00:11:28] <pfred1> yes
[00:11:29] <alex4nder> but you could do that with any interpreter
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[00:12:17] <pfred1> which is why I call them al lshell scripts whether it is right or not it still aids me in how I think about it
[00:12:36] <pfred1> I guess technically it is a python script
[00:12:46] <alex4nder> yes, technically it is not a shell script, unless python is your shell. ;)
[00:12:59] <pfred1> well when you run that python is your shell
[00:13:16] <alex4nder> not really
[00:13:28] <alex4nder> but whatever, andypugh got what he needed.
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[00:14:25] <pfred1> yerah to search for a command you can execute without a full path to it which can do that the best
[00:15:20] <pfred1> which even has a man page :)
[00:16:12] <pfred1> it has to be the simplest man page I've ever seen I never knew which had a switch
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[00:36:33] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: Actually, I think TWO atoms would fit if a bracket was made
[00:37:17] <pfred1> two atoms? would that be a molecule?
[00:39:06] <Jymmm> H, N, O, F, CL, Br, I actually
[00:40:37] <Jymmm> pfred1: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diatomic_molecule
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[00:47:22] <andypugh> night all
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[01:02:25] <JT-Shop> for you late nighters http://imagebin.org/216725
[01:02:35] <JT-Shop> say goodnight Gracie
[01:09:19] <Tom_itx> aww but it's the weekend!
[01:10:45] <Tom_itx> looks good JT-Shop
[01:18:47] <alex4nder> hey
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[01:23:37] <pfred1> good luck lining those rods up
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[01:41:58] <r00t4rd3d> so i broke down and made a mount:
[01:41:59] <r00t4rd3d> http://imgur.com/a/Lcudx
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[01:42:20] <alex4nder> r00t4rd3d: nice
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[01:45:27] <pfred1> this is my clamp http://i.imgur.com/dHlY6.jpg
[01:45:39] <pfred1> it was hard to drill that hole
[01:45:49] <pfred1> really really hard
[01:47:11] <pfred1> another picture of it http://i.imgur.com/zWNB9.jpg
[01:47:39] <r00t4rd3d> i went and spent 40 bucks on a hole saw
[01:47:58] <pfred1> it'd have still been hard it was periphery speed in the material
[01:48:11] <pfred1> my mill only goes down to 80 RPM?
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[01:48:28] <pfred1> so I was burning the steel of the bit
[01:48:39] <pfred1> couldn't use water lube
[01:49:04] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.ebay.com/itm/170849511325?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649
[01:49:04] <pfred1> phenolic is just hard to work with sometimes
[01:49:12] <r00t4rd3d> who ever posted that link thanks, i ordered :)
[01:49:47] <pfred1> now whenever I machine phenolic i air cool it it makes a mess but I'm burning up less bits
[01:50:35] <pfred1> but I hadn't worked the stuff so much when I drilled that hole so I hadn't come around to air cooling it then
[01:50:42] <darthrake> hey, is there anybody with linuxcnc python module experience?
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[02:04:14] <Thetawaves> i like phenolic as a material
[02:04:22] <Thetawaves> very heat resistant
[02:04:45] <Thetawaves> i have heard it is kind of toxic, as in people become allergic over time
[02:06:11] <r00t4rd3d> just dont lick it
[02:06:16] <r00t4rd3d> youll be fine
[02:06:49] <r00t4rd3d> or breath the dust from it or put the shavings on your salad
[02:13:05] <Jymmm> I have some 1/8" phenolic, there really isn't any shavings to speak of
[02:13:42] <Jymmm> It will dull carbon tooling faster than hell though
[02:14:55] <Jymmm> it took forever cutting in on a table saw, and reeked too, outside no less.
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[02:18:20] <pfred1> it does stink to the high heavens when it starts to burn
[02:18:55] <Jymmm> I took a map gas torch to it, never really burns, just smolders.
[02:19:05] <pfred1> yeah it blackens
[02:19:13] <Jymmm> that it did =)
[02:19:18] <pfred1> I've had it smoke
[02:19:35] <Jymmm> it did a bit, but I was outside too
[02:20:01] <Jymmm> I was also being conservative with it, as it was the only piece I had.
[02:20:11] <pfred1> I have a couple nice chunks of it
[02:20:52] <Jymmm> It's just too expensive to use on just anything =)
[02:21:15] <pfred1> yes it is expensive if you have to buy it
[02:21:30] <pfred1> but i have a couple of nice chunks of it
[02:21:42] <r00t4rd3d> http://youtu.be/MShbP3OpASA?t=49m45s
[02:21:44] <r00t4rd3d> awesome
[02:21:48] <pfred1> one buddy of mine had the coolest stuff
[02:21:51] <Jymmm> I buy my polymers from a wholesale house, so I just asked one of the warehouse guys for a sample =)
[02:22:13] <pfred1> he had a sheet of the plastic they make gun handles out of
[02:22:29] <pfred1> he knew the guy who made the stuff
[02:22:38] <Jymmm> cool
[02:22:39] <pfred1> like a 4x8 sheet
[02:24:05] <Tom_itx> Jymmm what was your interest in century?
[02:24:11] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: I dont' care for your cnc router design, but I can't put my finger on it. I do have an idea for a inexpensive one, but startup costs would be around (I'm guessing) $50,000 USD.
[02:24:24] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: Have them make something for me.
[02:24:36] <pfred1> it'd be impossible to expect the rods to be aligned
[02:25:41] <Jymmm> pfred1: I dont think that was it, at least nto for me.
[02:26:00] <pfred1> well that is why it'd never work
[02:26:11] <Jymmm> ?
[02:26:27] <pfred1> I'm not into that whole overhead gantry design although that does work after a fashion
[02:26:49] <pfred1> you'd never get those bars just aligned
[02:27:00] <pfred1> there is no allowence for adjustment
[02:27:14] <Jymmm> Oh, no. I'm talking somethign more basic flaw(s)
[02:27:18] <pfred1> in practice it'd never happen
[02:27:27] <Jymmm> way before straightness
[02:28:45] <Jymmm> pfred1: See, I like to follow a KISS method of things. and this just has too many pieces in not the right way/layout/configuration - more or less it jsut doens't give me that warm fuzzy feeling.
[02:29:05] <Jymmm> pfred1: And I've learned to trust my gut instincts.
[02:29:21] <pfred1> well to think that all those supports would be in the right places is asking for a lot
[02:29:52] <pfred1> I'm not saying it is impossible but it is extremely improbable
[02:30:06] <Jymmm> where does the X leadscrew go?
[02:30:26] <Jymmm> how does it connect to the gantry?
[02:30:36] <pfred1> those usually drive under the table if you don't run them side by side
[02:30:57] <pfred1> not any other places I think you can put them
[02:31:00] <Jymmm> Sure, but where in the drawing?
[02:31:07] <pfred1> they're not depicted
[02:31:19] <Jymmm> but there's no plae for them either
[02:31:21] <Jymmm> place
[02:31:30] <pfred1> a drawing does not have to have every single part in order to be correct
[02:31:54] <pfred1> many drawings are in fact a single part of a multipart mechanism
[02:32:04] <Jymmm> there's still no place for them though.
[02:33:17] <Jymmm> not that I can see anyway
[02:36:38] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: BTW, that $50K is mostly in tooling, and could yield 100 routers initially. After that probably around $5000 per 100, or $50/each at cost.
[02:37:10] <pfred1> MDF is cheap
[02:37:35] <Jymmm> and you still have to fabricate it
[02:38:04] <Tom_itx> they were put on the outside
[02:38:28] <Jymmm> What I'm talking about is pre-fabed ready to be assembled.
[02:38:31] <Tom_itx> taken from an exhisting desigh
[02:38:42] <Jymmm> Sold in IKEA! (kidding)
[02:42:14] <Jymmm> Collapse of shark tank at the Scientific Center in Kuwait http://i45.tinypic.com/2119mpt.jpg
[02:43:00] <Jymmm> Escalator Snacks!
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[03:35:43] <mrsun> hehe ive soo destroyed my friend ... told him that iscar upside down says juda .... now he cant look at iscar in the same way anymore :P
[03:35:57] <mrsun> and so cant his boss :P
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[03:47:35] <Jymmm> huh?
[03:48:54] <r00t4rd3d> I fix dirt bikes and four wheelers on the side. I received this gem today:
[03:48:56] <r00t4rd3d> http://i.imgur.com/5UOCL.jpg
[03:49:51] <r00t4rd3d> check out the bottom of the air box. Im not sure exactly what all that is.
[03:52:01] <pcw_home> marijuana seeds?
[03:52:20] <r00t4rd3d> lady bug carcasses
[03:52:21] <Jymmm> nope, too big and too red
[03:52:29] <Jymmm> and wrong shape
[03:52:37] <r00t4rd3d> some bees and grass/hay
[03:52:58] <r00t4rd3d> 1/4" of mud
[03:53:29] <r00t4rd3d> "it dont run right and leaks gas" was the main complaint
[03:53:43] <r00t4rd3d> one screw on the carb is half way out lol
[03:54:38] <r00t4rd3d> its for a friend, i think iam going to restore the whole thing
[03:54:57] <r00t4rd3d> 87 Yamaha Moto4 350
[03:59:35] <r00t4rd3d> The Moto4 is what lead to the current line of atvs, one of the first ones made.
[04:00:34] <r00t4rd3d> or the first model made i guess
[04:03:05] <mrsun> Jymmm, ever looked at the iscar logo upside down ?
[04:03:29] <mrsun> http://helixtools.co.uk/images/logo_iscar.gif
[04:03:32] <mrsun> look at it upside down
[04:03:37] <mrsun> world will never be the same :P
[04:19:45] <pcw_home> Hmm, looks roughly the same here, rather disappointing
[05:00:30] <mazafaka> What is wrong with it being written upside down?
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[05:02:13] <mazafaka> http://i.imgur.com/5UOCL.jpg <-- 'Maria's and Juan's seats'
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[05:03:17] <Jymmm> mrsun: Never heard of the company before =)
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[05:03:27] <mrsun> never heard of iscar ?
[05:03:32] <Jymmm> mrsun: It's more like "Juda!"
[05:04:36] <Jymmm> mrsun: so they make Kosher Tooling huh?
[05:04:55] <mrsun> do not know what kosher means but they make tooling yes
[05:05:04] <mrsun> and from what i understand quite high quality tooling
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[05:06:11] <Jymmm> mrsun: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kosher_foods First paragraph, last sentence.
[05:06:59] <mrsun> gah im to tired to understand what you are saying
[05:07:10] <mrsun> half of the words feel like jibberish today :P
[05:07:26] <Jymmm> mrsun: "...or the use of non-kosher cooking utensils and machinery."
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[05:11:24] <mrsun> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E68dYHzYuBQ&feature=g-vrec <-- OMG mrpete222's face! .... "childhood" destroyed :/
[05:11:39] <mrsun> i did not imagine him looking like that :P
[05:24:49] <alex4nder> yoh
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[05:56:42] <r00t4rd3d> lo
[05:56:51] <alex4nder> yoh
[05:59:55] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=6d2_1339862818
[06:02:04] <alex4nder> wtf
[06:02:36] <alex4nder> fear
[06:03:58] <Jymmm> Pretty creative use of old tires =)
[06:04:05] <Jymmm> shock absorber =)
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[07:00:03] <mrsun> hehe =)
[07:00:22] <mrsun> those excevators need to get used to be abused ALOT :P
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[07:02:54] <DJ9DJ> moin
[07:04:44] <DJ9DJ> mornin' Loetmichel :)
[07:04:44] <Loetmichel> mornin'
[07:04:45] <Jymmm> Ok, I need to reel string (without using spools). So, I initially (one time) thread the line on a winder, wind a designated length, (heres the trick part) prepare the NEXT start the next winding, cut, remove the wound string, begin winding the next reel, repeat.
[07:05:00] <Jymmm> How do I do the tricky part?
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[07:07:13] <Jymmm> What I'm sorta thinking is reverse the winding, it catches/threads into a slot or whatever somehow.
[07:08:03] <Jymmm> While still maintaining some tension on the existing reel
[07:08:13] <Jymmm> so it doesn't unravel
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[07:14:16] <mrsun> hmm, how to fix up a spindle taper that is out of center? :P
[07:14:21] <mrsun> about 0.05mm out of center
[07:14:33] <mrsun> maybe have asked before but dont remember :P
[07:16:02] <Loetmichel> grinding it "in situ"
[07:16:55] <mrsun> hmm, but do not have grinding tools that can reach that deep :P
[07:17:24] <mrsun> just using the wtf is it called, the slide highest up :P
[07:17:25] <mrsun> ?
[07:17:53] <mrsun> using a sine bar to set the taper also i guess, or a morse taper to check the angle against
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[09:34:49] <DJ9DJ> re
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[10:41:19] <DJ9DJ> re
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[11:29:45] <r00t4rd3d> tard
[11:30:51] <archivist> andypugh, that wikipedia article on BA threads misses "based on the Thury thread" http://www.bhi.co.uk/aHints/bathrd.html
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[11:46:45] <r00t4rd3d> http://youtu.be/MShbP3OpASA?t=49m45s
[11:46:58] <r00t4rd3d> what Linus thinks of nvidia
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[12:47:19] <mrsun> i wonder if my lathes oil supply likes mdf dust :P
[12:51:03] <syyl> it likes it so much, that it will build a nice slurry mix ;)
[12:52:04] <mrsun> yeah i guess :P
[12:52:16] <mrsun> had to make a flat disk for a casting project :P so ... :P
[12:52:29] <jthornton> fuelly.com
[12:52:32] <mrsun> ALOT of mdf ... even tho i used vacuum cleaner :P
[12:52:38] <syyl> i hate wood on the lathe...
[12:52:51] <syyl> on the milling machine you can get rid of the dust easy
[12:52:54] <syyl> but on the lathe...
[12:53:00] <mrsun> yeah ... but sometimes you have no choice :/
[12:53:05] <syyl> right :(
[12:53:14] <mrsun> or i did have a choice ... to be outside in the rain with the wood lathe :P
[12:53:21] <andypugh> archivist: Have you ever worked out the Holtzapfel threads? As far as I can figure out the pitches are not integer in pitch or TPI, and might be chosen purely on convenient changewheels.
[12:53:21] <mrsun> (yes the wood lathe is outside getting destroyed) :P
[12:53:32] <syyl> :(
[12:53:54] <mrsun> still runs tho ... impressivly with an open motor and everything, been standing outside for a good 3 years or so :P
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[13:07:37] <r00t4rd3d> http://imagebin.org/216775
[13:07:57] <r00t4rd3d> pretty sure there is not suppose to be chunks of stuff in a carb
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[13:13:29] <aircraft> seems like your carb have became somebody's home
[13:13:29] <WillenCMD> so i have finially finished the gui for the customer's machine i designed. Alot of thanks to Andy. The controller only uses hal components. does anyone know of i could compile it all in one archive with the hal components or are they linked to other files or scripts?
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[13:16:08] <JT-Shop> Tom_itx: I don't think pfred1 likes Loetmichel's design even if it is a proven design...
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[14:24:07] <JT-Shop> what the heck is snow leopard and lion in a mac?
[14:25:59] <archivist> versions of the os iirc
[14:26:15] <JT-Shop> ok, what is the latest one?
[14:26:33] <archivist> no idea Im a mac free zone :)
[14:26:39] <JT-Shop> like leaping leper in ubuntu then
[14:26:46] <JT-Shop> me too
[14:26:57] <archivist> this naming is silly!
[14:27:00] <darthrake> lion ist latest ;)
[14:27:06] <JT-Shop> I have a mac laptop but the HD is doa I thing
[14:27:16] <JT-Shop> think
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[14:33:52] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: When you turn it on, does an icon of a question mark appear?
[14:34:04] <tjb1> Mountain Lion is coming : D
[14:34:17] <JT-Shop> I forget, but I can plug it in
[14:34:21] <tjb1> I feckin hate Lion...
[14:36:03] <JT-Shop> it's a powerbook g4
[14:36:18] <Jymmm> that aint lion =)
[14:36:25] <JT-Shop> the battery may need to charge a bit, nothing happens when I press the power button
[14:36:26] <syyl_ws> not so powerfull anymore, ha? ;)
[14:36:44] <Jymmm> remove the battery and power on
[14:37:31] <JT-Shop> nothing happens
[14:37:48] <tjb1> It may require battery to power on
[14:38:05] <JT-Shop> I think last time I had to let it chage a while
[14:38:08] <tjb1> What color is led?
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[14:38:33] <JT-Shop> which led?
[14:38:39] <tjb1> charging cable
[14:38:45] <JT-Shop> green
[14:38:55] <tjb1> Not good...
[14:39:15] <tjb1> Did it change yet?
[14:39:19] <JT-Shop> if I mess with the plug a bit it goes red
[14:39:32] <tjb1> Make it red/orange
[14:39:42] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: Look inside the jack, see if there is any debre
[14:40:39] <JT-Shop> clean
[14:40:51] <tjb1> Green means full/not-charging
[14:40:56] <Jymmm> well, let the battery charge for 30m and see what happens
[14:41:09] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: did you remove the battery ?
[14:43:09] <JT-Shop> yep and put it back
[14:43:17] <Jymmm> k
[14:43:28] <JT-Shop> it turned red/orange on it's own
[14:43:38] <JT-Shop> so it is charging now?
[14:44:20] <tjb1> yeah
[14:44:35] <tjb1> Mine is never red/orange as soon as I plug it in
[14:44:40] <JT-Shop> ok, I'll let it charge while I weld up the trailer
[14:44:49] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, alignment could be an issue
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[14:44:59] <Tom_itx> especially with MDF
[14:45:10] <JT-Shop> yea, I am a bit misaligned some times
[14:45:23] <Tom_itx> booze will cure that
[14:45:39] <JT-Shop> I've tried but I fall asleep first
[14:45:49] <JT-Shop> alignment in what plane?
[14:46:04] <Tom_itx> any
[14:46:16] <Tom_itx> ever tried to glue a chair together?
[14:46:32] <JT-Shop> no
[14:46:50] <JT-Shop> I'm not following your thoughts
[14:47:03] <Tom_itx> well it's hard to get things aligned just right
[14:47:24] <Tom_itx> in the chair example using a strap clamp
[14:47:57] <Tom_itx> and on those parallel bars it wouldn't take much misalignment to make it bind
[14:48:07] <Tom_itx> partial reason for the spring idea
[14:48:08] <JT-Shop> all the verticals will be doweled to each other and the long parts doweled to the base and held together with barrel nuts and bindig screws
[14:48:26] <JT-Shop> binding screws
[14:49:06] <Tom_itx> and also alignment in Y for parallelism
[14:49:15] <JT-Shop> I could imagine the problems with the chair and a strap clamp
[14:49:18] <Tom_itx> with the other set of X bars
[14:49:34] <JT-Shop> alignment will be fixed by the dowels
[14:49:37] <Tom_itx> we're only talking thousands
[14:49:40] <Tom_itx> ths
[14:50:09] <Tom_itx> it's worth a prototype shot
[14:50:33] <JT-Shop> yea in that case I assume it will be out of alignment a few thousands for sure as it is wood
[14:50:45] <Tom_itx> i'm always looking forward to a more rigid machine since i know what's out there
[14:50:47] <JT-Shop> but for a router how close do you need to be for most stuff
[14:51:03] <syyl_ws> 1/10mm is always ok
[14:51:10] <syyl_ws> for most router work
[14:51:18] <JT-Shop> I would thing you have to move up to a metal machine to get more rigid than that
[14:51:43] <Tom_itx> i considered the same design in aluminum
[14:51:48] <Tom_itx> 3/4" or so
[14:51:51] <Tom_itx> maybe 1"
[14:52:23] <JT-Shop> that would be as close as you can get to linear rails like the ones that mount on top of support rails
[14:52:35] <Tom_itx> yeah
[14:52:51] <tjb1> Any thoughts on this theme? http://bennett-built.com/
[14:52:53] <JT-Shop> that is also the reason I'm not making a huge one first lol
[14:52:59] <Tom_itx> made me sad when i was at the salvage and found a nice linear rail stuck in the mud in their drive
[14:53:19] <JT-Shop> tjb1: kinda dark for me
[14:53:52] <JT-Shop> I have a few nice linear rails laying about but I've not decided what to do with them
[14:53:52] <tjb1> check again, any thoughts on that one MINUS the stupid background
[14:54:10] <Tom_itx> i could give you a hint :)
[14:54:41] <Tom_itx> wordpress is vulnerable
[14:55:01] <tjb1> Already been told.
[14:55:03] <JT-Shop> oh we were supposed to click on the hello world
[14:55:20] <Tom_itx> it took down not only a friend's site but the whole server
[14:55:34] <JT-Shop> the background is ok the banner with the HOME in it is too busy for me and distracts my attention
[14:55:37] <tjb1> My site doesnt get much if any traffic
[14:56:04] <Tom_itx> you got traffic counters on it?
[14:56:10] <JT-Shop> I thought the same thing and withing hours of having wordpress up the spammers started flooding in
[14:56:23] <JT-Shop> shut that crap down in a flash
[14:56:41] <tjb1> I dont have anything on it
[14:56:44] <tjb1> I just moved it
[14:56:54] <tjb1> yesterday morning
[14:57:33] <Tom_itx> i had a 'leave a messae' thing on mine for a while but the bots found it so i removed it
[14:57:35] <JT-Shop> I mean I shut mine down in a flash
[14:57:52] <Tom_itx> message*
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[14:58:17] * JT-Shop wanders over to the welder for a bit
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[14:58:28] -!- mode/#linuxcnc [+v SWPadnos] by ChanServ
[14:58:34] <Jymmm> will the real SWPadnos please stand up
[14:58:47] <SWPadnos> no, I prefer to remain seated
[14:59:06] * Tom_itx puts SWPadnos on a bar stool to make him look taller
[14:59:20] <SWPadnos> wheee - these things spin!
[14:59:23] <Jymmm> SWPadnos: Nice to see you're still alive. (You are, aren't you? Not a zombie or living dead)
[14:59:28] <SWPadnos> yes
[14:59:30] <SWPadnos> or no
[14:59:37] <tjb1> Got a traffic counter now :D
[14:59:55] <Tom_itx> i used google analytics for a while
[15:00:18] <Jymmm> SWPadnos: So what you've been doing with your bad self?
[15:00:32] <SWPadnos> lots of work
[15:00:37] <SWPadnos> just got back from Manila
[15:00:40] <SWPadnos> that's a long haul
[15:00:50] <tjb1> my domain is through godaddy and its hosted on 000webhost
[15:00:59] <Jymmm> SWPadnos: did ya get injected before you leave?
[15:01:05] <SWPadnos> nope
[15:01:11] <SWPadnos> not in either direction :)
[15:01:11] <Jymmm> SWPadnos: seriously?
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[15:01:16] <SWPadnos> seriously
[15:01:23] <Jymmm> SWPadnos: Why the fuck not?
[15:01:39] <SWPadnos> it wasn't required, AFAIK
[15:03:35] <Jymmm> SWPadnos: Not required, but some nasty stuff there. Especially the mosquitos
[15:03:57] <SWPadnos> oh, well if I had expected to spend any time outside, I might have gotten inoculated
[15:04:16] <SWPadnos> as it is, I saw the airport, the hotel, the factory, and one restaurant (in the 2 days I was there)
[15:04:25] <Jymmm> SWPadnos: factory?
[15:04:36] <SWPadnos> yep, I was setting up a test system
[15:04:53] <Jymmm> for?
[15:05:02] <SWPadnos> for testing :)
[15:05:13] <Jymmm> for testing what specifically
[15:05:18] <SWPadnos> it's a new product that hasn't been announced, so I can't tell you
[15:05:41] <Jymmm> SWPadnos: you said that in January, so give it up, overdue now
[15:05:52] <SWPadnos> different new product ;)
[15:06:02] <SWPadnos> but I'm still not telling
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[15:07:07] <Jymmm> bah
[15:09:50] <JT-Shop> SWPadnos: is it working well?
[15:10:11] <SWPadnos> I think so. we tested 60 units and they all worked
[15:10:19] <JT-Shop> nice
[15:10:20] <SWPadnos> after tweaking the test system a little
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[15:14:10] <YAGO> Hello all,I am new here. I am setting up a XYUV foam cutter and I was directed here as the main gathering place. m I at the right spot ?
[15:16:54] <SWPadnos> YAGO, yes, this is the place
[15:17:26] <YAGO> Super,
[15:20:17] <YAGO> I was sent here by Sammel lothar. I understand that he has modified the current Linuxcnc main branch source code (I believe the version is 2.6) so as to have a better UI for foam cutting
[15:20:22] <YAGO> He has sent me a patch, I suppose I should git the source, apply the patch and recompile.
[15:20:26] <YAGO> Right ?
[15:20:52] <SWPadnos> sounds like a good plan
[15:21:09] <SWPadnos> unless he has set up a git repository that you can pull from (which would change the patching step)
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[15:22:15] <YAGO> Any general docs available about compiling emc2 ?
[15:22:18] <YAGO> Any special thing to watch out for ?
[15:22:30] <Jymmm> gremlins
[15:22:40] <Jymmm> dont feed after midnight
[15:22:52] <SWPadnos> wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Installing_LinuxCNC
[15:22:57] <SWPadnos> gah
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[15:23:01] <SWPadnos> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Installing_LinuxCNC
[15:23:14] <Jymmm> dont ya hate when that happens
[15:23:25] <SWPadnos> I don't know what specifics might have changed with 12.04
[15:23:46] <Jymmm> SWPadnos: Collapse of shark tank at the Scientific Center in Kuwait http://i45.tinypic.com/2119mpt.jpg
[15:24:03] <SWPadnos> going ... down
[15:24:15] <Jymmm> escalator snacks!
[15:24:45] <SWPadnos> imagine the sign at the top of the escalator
[15:24:57] <Jymmm> sushi below?
[15:24:59] <SWPadnos> Out of order. Sharks below.
[15:25:11] <Jymmm> fresh sushi?
[15:25:20] <SWPadnos> hmmm. never had shark sushi
[15:25:33] <YAGO> I installed on 10.04 not to take a chance. Ok thank you I am off to the wiki
[15:25:34] <SWPadnos> and luckily, no shark has had me sushi either
[15:25:34] <Jymmm> It's like a REALLY dense steak
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[15:26:55] <Jymmm> could you imagine if that was an elevator instead ?!
[15:27:58] <SWPadnos> yeah. it might actually still work, since the motors are often on the roof
[15:28:14] <SWPadnos> the escalator probably wasn't working
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[15:40:47] <JT-Shop> Jymmm: the lower left corner of the powerbook is REALLY HOT
[15:41:09] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: that's usually where the hdd is
[15:42:44] <JT-Shop> still won't power up... last time I had to do some funky head hunter dance and press some secret keys to get a prompt IIRC
[15:44:18] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1379
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[15:47:22] <JT-Shop> what is the "command" key?
[15:47:37] <Jymmm> cloverleaf looking thing
[15:47:49] <JT-Shop> ok
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[15:52:49] <Tom_itx> how quaint
[15:53:41] * JT-Shop gives up on the G4
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[16:04:47] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: Try G6 http://thissongissick.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/01-Like-A-G6.mp3
[16:10:07] <Loetmichel> re @ home
[16:10:38] <JT-Shop> Jymmm: I'm tired of screwing with already
[16:10:52] * JT-Shop wanders off for a well needed nap
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[16:14:48] <IchGuckLive> Hi all
[16:15:10] <IchGuckLive> roycroft: ?
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[17:19:04] <roycroft> yes?
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[17:30:26] <IchGuckLive> roycroft: it does not compile there are to many changes to be done heekscad sorry
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[17:42:32] <Jymmm> what is something that is as thing as a hacksaw blade but won't flex/bow/bend easily?
[17:42:37] <Jymmm> thin
[17:44:26] <Sunnyday> glass
[17:44:32] <Sunnyday> delrin
[17:44:39] <Sunnyday> tungsten carbide
[17:44:43] <Sunnyday> clay
[17:44:55] <Sunnyday> a cd
[17:46:23] <Sunnyday> sheet inconel
[17:47:13] <Jymmm> Nuh uh on the glass. delrin as thing as a hacksaw blade and not flex? CD - maybe. Heh, nichrome sheet, oh gawd I gotta wonder the cost on that =) Nickle?
[17:47:44] <Sunnyday> inconel would be the best I think but you'd have to buy an offcut from an aerospace metal merchant
[17:47:53] <Sunnyday> Very hard material they make turbine blades from
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[17:48:02] <Sunnyday> a bugger to weld and machine
[17:48:11] <James_Cole> hi
[17:48:41] <Jymmm> Well, if I find a place that even has it, I'd just ask them to fab it for me too =)
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[17:49:41] <Jymmm> thanks for the ideas =)
[17:50:42] <IchGuckLive> jimm you can get harden steel that thinn this wont flex
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[17:51:00] <IchGuckLive> are we talking on 2mm thick or thinner
[17:51:13] <Jymmm> thinner
[17:51:21] <James_Cole> does anyone know a way of making axis report the deviation before/after homing; in case of lost steps?
[17:51:22] <IchGuckLive> some numbers
[17:51:33] <Jymmm> hacksaw blade
[17:52:03] <Jymmm> I dont know numbers, can't find my calipers =)
[17:52:08] <Jymmm> saw 1mm
[17:52:10] <Jymmm> say
[17:52:24] <Jymmm> or 1.5mm
[17:52:34] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: you can count your steps with a encoder and linuxcnc tels you if you are wright or stops emidetly
[17:53:00] <Jymmm> IchGuckLive: right, not wright. =)
[17:53:22] <James_Cole> thanks, but sorry, i don't understand
[17:53:38] <IchGuckLive> Jymmm: in Germany you can get Böhler Regulit K on 40-80mm 1mm thick 500mm long
[17:54:13] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: the mashine Motor needs to be talkiing to the controler
[17:54:17] <pcw_home> I guess you could use the tri-state comp to sample the step count until home is hit
[17:55:53] <James_Cole> if i have completed a milling job and i home all axes, is there no direct way to report "old home VS new home"?
[17:56:24] <IchGuckLive> there is a EMC.bak
[17:56:34] <IchGuckLive> this holds the old
[17:57:10] <cpresser> IchGuckLive: that was not the questions.
[17:57:19] <cpresser> assume you lost 10 steps on the x-axis.
[17:57:38] <IchGuckLive> you can make yourself a pyvcp button that collects the numbers
[17:57:59] <IchGuckLive> after the job colect another tome and see if it is diferent
[17:57:59] <James_Cole> yeah, that sounds like it
[17:58:01] <cpresser> as soon as you home again, emc2 could tell you 'i expected to arrive there in 10000steps, but it took me 10010 steps to hit the home switch'
[17:58:38] <James_Cole> "could" or "can"?
[17:59:03] <cpresser> i dont know how to do that. but i cam quite sure its not that hard to implement :)
[17:59:12] <cpresser> ~s/cam/can/
[17:59:23] <cpresser> ~s/cam/am/
[17:59:35] <Jymmm> spam/can/I/Am
[17:59:52] <James_Cole> i think so, but i don't know if it is possible with pyvcp or similar, or if it needs to be implemented into emc2
[18:00:13] <pcw_home> Its doable in Hal
[18:00:19] <cpresser> i think it can be done in hal
[18:01:07] <pcw_home> Probably needs the last home phase slow enough so you dont miss stepgen counts
[18:01:24] <James_Cole> yes
[18:01:37] <James_Cole> can you give me a hint where to start?
[18:01:50] <IchGuckLive> Hal_manual
[18:03:02] <James_Cole> can this (assumed) hal sequence then be integrated into axis?
[18:03:09] <James_Cole> via pyvcp?
[18:03:28] <cpresser> take a look at the different pins in hal. "motion..." and "stepgen..." while homing
[18:03:39] <pcw_home> sure it would end up as a HAL pin
[18:03:52] <JT-Shop> James_Cole: are you concerned that you are loosing steps?
[18:03:57] <James_Cole> yes, i am
[18:04:28] <JT-Shop> have you done any testing to see if you are losing steps?
[18:04:58] <cpresser> thats what he is aming for with this setup!?
[18:05:08] <James_Cole> thank you :-)
[18:05:14] <JT-Shop> http://linuxcnc.org/docview/html/common/Stepper_Diagnostics.html#_testing
[18:05:55] <JT-Shop> once you extablish that your settings are correct and you won't lose any steps there should be no worries unless you run your machine too close to the edge
[18:06:29] <James_Cole> well, sure, but i'd like to use the homing switches for testing
[18:06:32] <JT-Shop> in that case just mount a test indicator and check the actual postion to the test indicator
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[18:06:53] <cpresser> on of the questions is also 'where is close to the edge' of you machine
[18:07:06] <James_Cole> that's what i'm trying to find out
[18:07:35] <JT-Shop> much easier to just run a stepper test on the axis...
[18:07:49] <cpresser> why not do it all in software, if its possible to do. acutally i bought a dial indicator to check if i was losing steps.
[18:08:03] <cpresser> JT-Shop: not if you are only losing steps in high torque situations
[18:08:04] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: any numbers on the Mashine setup Steppers Drivers mounting to the leadscrew pitch
[18:08:51] <James_Cole> sorry?
[18:09:01] <JT-Shop> cpresser: you mean running a stepper machine outside of the proper envlope of the design?
[18:09:30] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: what steppers are you using
[18:09:46] <IchGuckLive> what Volt is supplyed
[18:10:08] <cpresser> JT-Shop: kind of. a lot of people dont know the mechanical limits of the setup. like forces, torque, speed, acceleration
[18:10:19] <IchGuckLive> what stepperdrivers are the Stepper motors connected to
[18:10:21] <JT-Shop> how likely is a stepper to lose steps and not stall?
[18:10:21] <James_Cole> the steppers are built by nanotec
[18:10:30] <Jymmm> cpresser: 200mph
[18:10:32] <IchGuckLive> Thats Gread
[18:10:48] <cpresser> for example, i own a gantry, but i am not aware of the mass of the portal it moves. so i am not able to proper calculate the max accelleration of the axis. its trial and error
[18:10:50] <IchGuckLive> nanotec offers datasheed
[18:10:59] <James_Cole> yes, i know
[18:11:11] <James_Cole> but the drivers are kind of diy
[18:11:21] <James_Cole> not built by me, without any documents
[18:11:27] <IchGuckLive> the Drivers are Gecko Leadshine TB6560 ?
[18:11:37] <James_Cole> i have absolutely no idea
[18:11:39] <JT-Shop> sure I've the same a gantry that I don't care about how much force it takes to move so I ran stepper tests to find the breaking point
[18:11:51] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: Bad on that
[18:12:00] <James_Cole> can't change it
[18:12:05] <JT-Shop> then backed off 25%
[18:12:23] <Jymmm> James_Cole: what voltage to the drivers?
[18:12:25] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: Vlt 24 48 80 Maybe
[18:12:37] <IchGuckLive> B)
[18:12:54] <James_Cole> i have no idea
[18:12:58] <cpresser> JT-Shop: and thats the reason why we people want to count steps and compare them, as a diagnostics tool :)
[18:13:08] <James_Cole> yes, thank you
[18:13:10] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: Bad on that 2
[18:13:11] <James_Cole> :-)
[18:13:12] <JT-Shop> is it possible to lose steps with a low voltage driver and not stall?
[18:13:17] <Jymmm> James_Cole: Huh? What power supply are you using?
[18:13:29] <James_Cole> i would have to look that up
[18:13:33] <cpresser> i had results like this: http://ca.rstenpresser.de/~cpresser/tmp/pictures/milling/GbR_Gefr%e4st.jpg
[18:13:36] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: micro stall maybe?
[18:13:44] <JT-Shop> wtf is that?
[18:13:53] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: is the mashine compledet on the web ?
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[18:13:58] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: like a 10mS stal
[18:14:01] <Jymmm> stall
[18:14:05] <James_Cole> completed on the web?
[18:14:10] <James_Cole> what do you mean?
[18:14:20] <cpresser> it should read 'GbR', but since the machine lost steps it turned out like shown on the picture
[18:14:26] <IchGuckLive> is there a Reseller of your Router
[18:14:26] <Jymmm> James_Cole: then could you look it up please
[18:14:44] <Jymmm> James_Cole: or provide specific links to what you have?
[18:15:03] <James_Cole> there are no links as it is all custom built
[18:15:08] <James_Cole> or so i think at least
[18:15:41] <James_Cole> the power supply is a computer psu
[18:15:45] <Jymmm> James_Cole: Your telling us your car makes a noise, but not what the car is. We can't help without information.
[18:16:13] <Jymmm> Then thats 12VDC and low for most steppers. do you have photos?
[18:16:22] <James_Cole> not yet
[18:16:25] <Jymmm> of the whole thing? LEGIBLE ones
[18:16:40] <James_Cole> i can make photos
[18:17:26] <Jymmm> in focus and large enough resoution to see details would be best.
[18:17:31] <JT-Shop> cpresser: lost steps on a rapid move?
[18:17:48] <James_Cole> that's no problem
[18:17:52] <James_Cole> focus etc
[18:17:58] <James_Cole> what do you need photos of?
[18:18:12] <James_Cole> driver wire mess?
[18:18:16] <James_Cole> steppers?
[18:18:18] <James_Cole> psu?
[18:18:24] <James_Cole> all of it, i guess? :-)
[18:18:31] <Loetmichel> cpresser: looks like lost steps
[18:18:33] <cpresser> JT-Shop: actually i cant tell you where exactly those steps got lost. its even possible that this picture was made when i was using another controller than emc2^^
[18:18:36] <Jymmm> James_Cole: machine, boards, ps, etc
[18:18:37] <mrsun> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VnhMF4NHcug&feature=g-vrec beautiful anvil =)
[18:18:57] <James_Cole> ok, i'll be back
[18:19:01] <JT-Shop> looks like the R was cut twice
[18:19:01] <Jymmm> motors, leadscrews, etc
[18:19:41] <IchGuckLive> mrsun: i had to made one of this in the 1960th
[18:19:46] <JT-Shop> so running the stepper test would have shown that you are losing steps as well
[18:19:57] <Jymmm> what is the SIMPLEST way to achive linear motion?
[18:19:59] <IchGuckLive> as i bean a student to Toolmaker
[18:20:11] <JT-Shop> pull the trigger Jymmm
[18:20:16] <Jymmm> lol
[18:20:26] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: but but but it's smooth bore =)
[18:20:42] <mrsun> IchGuckLive, cool =)
[18:20:47] <JT-Shop> or in my case light the fuse
[18:21:02] <IchGuckLive> shoudt i make a photo its downstairs
[18:21:11] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: Yeah, I put all the fuse I got away till I have a BIGGER area to play in
[18:21:27] <IchGuckLive> mrsun: shoudt i make a photo its downstairs
[18:21:34] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: damn thing flew across the yard like a fucking rocket!
[18:21:42] <mrsun> i want to fix up my anvils, get the rust of them, paint them up .. oil them in =)
[18:22:09] <IchGuckLive> use the real "HAMMERSCHLAGOPTICEFFECT"
[18:22:13] <JT-Shop> cpresser: what kind of drives made the GbR?
[18:22:50] <IchGuckLive> mrsun: hammertone effect
[18:22:57] <mrsun> hammertone effect ?
[18:23:03] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: Ok, what is the simplest MECHANICAL way to achive linear motion?
[18:23:07] <Jymmm> =)
[18:23:09] <cpresser> JT-Shop: those are leadshine stepper-drivers; however that issue has been fixed. the picture is from 2009 :)
[18:23:17] <mrsun> Jymmm, a screw? :P
[18:23:26] <mrsun> you pulling a rope ?
[18:23:44] <JT-Shop> Jymmm: not enough information to process your request
[18:23:48] <cpresser> JT-Shop: i guess the error was in the controller software (it was some french made windows-program, cant remember the name)
[18:23:51] <IchGuckLive> mrsun: google image "hammertone effect"
[18:24:10] <mrsun> ohh hammerpaint :P
[18:24:11] <Jymmm> mrsun: No, ejecting something from a mold of sorts
[18:24:27] <mrsun> an air cylinder?
[18:24:31] <Jymmm> mrsun: but about a 4" stroke
[18:24:57] <JT-Shop> cpresser: so even with the bad software running a g code to test the axis would show the missing steps?
[18:25:12] <Jymmm> mrsun: pneumatics are a tad out of budget right now.
[18:25:16] <syyl_ws_> what?
[18:25:18] <mrsun> or its something similiar IchGuckLive that paint was nice =)
[18:25:32] <mrsun> Jymmm, a lever and a pivot then ? :)
[18:25:34] <syyl_ws_> its by far the cheapest variant to get linear motion for that kind of work, Jymmm
[18:25:47] <syyl_ws_> get a cylinder and valve from ebay
[18:26:12] <Jymmm> syyl_ws_: it's not singular, it's multiple
[18:26:15] <mrsun> just a guide bushing, a shaft going to a lever that pivots at like half of it, press the other half, push the rod up and voila
[18:26:24] <mrsun> simplest posible solution and lowest cost =)
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[18:27:17] <Jymmm> mrsun: I might have to try that, I have steppers and drives already
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[18:27:58] <Jymmm> If I could dynamically control the stroke, that would be great
[18:28:34] <mrsun> dont push the lever so far :p
[18:28:36] <mrsun> there dynamic
[18:28:37] <Jymmm> If I get this ghetto machine working, then I can make another the right way =)
[18:28:37] <mrsun> :P
[18:28:47] <Jymmm> mrsun: and how do you push the lever?
[18:29:00] <mrsun> Jymmm, with your hands? :P
[18:29:09] <Jymmm> mrsun: heh, noooooooo
[18:29:36] <mrsun> if even air cylinders was out of budget then all thats left is your hands i guess :P
[18:29:47] <JT-Shop> cpresser: I guess you could look at motor position cmd after jogging into the limit switch and note the number down
[18:29:51] <Jymmm> mrsun: if that was the case, then I'd use JT-Shop's suggestion
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[18:30:21] <JT-Shop> my soft limits stop me from trying...
[18:30:45] <YAGO> Hello lothar ?
[18:30:49] <YAGO> I am sorry i am new to this were is the buildbot were I get the patch file from ?
[18:30:53] <YAGO> Jacques
[18:31:04] <IchGuckLive> hi
[18:31:08] <cpresser> JT-Shop: i am not sure if you can read the step-count from stepgen; buf if yes; one could compere the count if you run "G53 G0 X0" and after re-homing the x-axis
[18:31:28] <cpresser> that would give you the number of lost steps
[18:31:35] <IchGuckLive> YAGO: http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/
[18:31:54] <mazafaka> Cruelty (which actually exist around anytime): http://www.animalabusersspotlight.com/pending-abuse-cases-2011.php
[18:31:56] <IchGuckLive> [20:14] CIA-116 jepler master * r970427ca8939 /src/emc/usr_intf/axis/scripts/axis.py: foam: fix backplot on mm configs
[18:32:15] <IchGuckLive> YAGO: so it is in now
[18:33:39] <IchGuckLive> yago -> Querry thewre is a frame on the bottem of chatzilla hit it
[18:34:03] <YAGO> I am usinh empathy
[18:34:54] <YAGO> So the only file I need is the revised axis.py from the jeppler git ?
[18:35:06] <JT-Shop> cpresser: if you do a G53 G0 X0 then you will get sent to the position and the cout will always be the same, however if the physical position is wrong then you know you lost steps
[18:35:20] <JT-Shop> s/cout/count
[18:35:33] <Jymmm> mazafaka: http://www.pet-abuse.com/
[18:35:42] <cpresser> JT-Shop: thats is exactly what i am aiming for
[18:35:47] <IchGuckLive> YAGO: no just pull the master from buildbot to your mashine
[18:35:57] <IchGuckLive> no git anymore
[18:36:36] <IchGuckLive> get the DEB into your packetsource and remove the standard emc #
[18:36:49] <YAGO> Ok so the master 2.6 now has your mod ?
[18:37:06] <JT-Shop> cpresser: perhaps if you could swap the home switch with probe input and check the count after the probe move that might work
[18:37:16] <IchGuckLive> YAGO: yes
[18:37:39] <cpresser> that would require some kind of MUX in hal, but that sounds like a good idead
[18:37:45] <YAGO> I still download the source one and compile or just use the packaged one ?
[18:37:47] <JT-Shop> yea
[18:38:01] <IchGuckLive> mrsun: buildbot deb
[18:38:09] <JT-Shop> I think that would work actually
[18:38:30] <IchGuckLive> YAGO: buildbot are you on lucid Realtime
[18:38:38] <cpresser> i acutally have some freetime next week; i will try to implement that :)
[18:38:48] <YAGO> Yes I am lucid RT
[18:39:31] <IchGuckLive> YAGO: "deb http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/ lucid master-rt" into the sources and remove emc2
[18:39:53] <IchGuckLive> then install linuxcnc
[18:40:00] <IchGuckLive> from synaptic
[18:40:20] <YAGO> ok I will try it right now Thank you Sammel
[18:45:05] <JT-Shop> cpresser: actually you don't need to fool with steps as the position result of the probe move will be different if you lost steps
[18:46:06] <JT-Shop> so if by testing you know X-0.12345 is a good probe result then make that the number you compare the probe result to
[18:47:08] <IchGuckLive> YAGO: dont forget to save your configs
[18:48:00] <YAGO> I added the repository to synaptic it shows emc2 as not installed altough it is and I can run it. So I cannot uninstall it with synaptic
[18:48:31] <YAGO> should I just go ahead and install linuxcnc ?
[18:48:33] <cpresser> YAGO: this might be due to the namechange. the new package name is linuxcnc
[18:50:14] <cpresser> JT-Shop: still i think investigatin the step-count is the better way of doing this. it wont require probe movements and can be done completely in hal
[18:51:33] <JT-Shop> if you trip the home switch during a move is that not an error?
[18:51:34] <James_Cole> here i am again
[18:51:44] <James_Cole> @cpresser: i'd like to have this diagnostics tool, too
[18:51:52] <James_Cole> i'll think about and work on it
[18:51:59] <James_Cole> AND i have made photos :-)
[18:52:07] <cpresser> JT-Shop: not the home-switch; but the limit switch
[18:52:38] <cpresser> since most people habe shared limit-home-switches on cheaper machines its the same in that cases
[18:52:47] <YAGO> When I start synaptic I get
[18:52:51] <YAGO> E:Malformed line 57 in source /etc/apt/sources.list (dist parse) and then it crashes.
[18:52:55] <YAGO> apt_get update returns the same error
[18:55:32] <JT-Shop> I guess that was crossing my mind when I suggested the probe move
[18:56:22] <cpresser> if you disable the switch with a mux this wont be a problem; but its quite a bit of tinkering in hal to archieve the desired results
[18:56:34] <cpresser> that why i think working on the counts is easier :)
[18:58:15] <James_Cole> this is the machine:
[18:58:15] <James_Cole> http://www.imagehousing.com/image/1032400
[18:59:03] <James_Cole> do you know an image hoster that displays images in full resolution?
[18:59:13] <James_Cole> usable without registration=
[18:59:14] <James_Cole> ?
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[19:02:28] <IchGuckLive> YAGO: without the "
[19:03:18] <IchGuckLive> yago did you remove all the other 3rd party sources
[19:05:37] <James_Cole> Z axis: http://www.imagehousing.com/imageupload.php?id=1032403
[19:05:39] <YAGO> ok I fixed the problem by editing the source list file. It had an entry for emc 2.4 ?? I will try again
[19:06:06] <IchGuckLive> YAGO: there is a 1hour delay
[19:06:30] <IchGuckLive> i see only the 2nd last modification please wait
[19:07:21] <IchGuckLive> YAGO: HEAD is now at 2368c21 foam: not a TODO item not the last
[19:07:55] <IchGuckLive> YAGO: you need the alst asthere its all in
[19:08:03] <James_Cole> driver case, right side: http://www.imagehousing.com/imageupload.php?id=1032404
[19:09:22] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: that does not look very good for good performences
[19:09:40] <IchGuckLive> if you need precision BAD at all
[19:09:47] <James_Cole> how bad?
[19:09:55] <James_Cole> top side: http://www.imagehousing.com/imageupload.php?id=1032406
[19:10:08] <IchGuckLive> at least 100RPM to the Steppers is good for this for no steplos
[19:10:25] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: Halfsteppping ?
[19:11:20] <James_Cole> don't think so, how do i recognize?
[19:11:21] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: WHOW Coils in the PC
[19:11:47] <IchGuckLive> 200steps got the Stepper so pitch and stepcound
[19:11:59] <JT-Shop> James_Cole: most use imagebin.org
[19:12:04] <James_Cole> ok
[19:12:11] <IchGuckLive> halfstepp means you need 400steps per 1Rev
[19:12:31] <YAGO> ok I was able to cleanly uninstall linuxcnc 2.5 installed from live cd so first step ok
[19:12:38] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: can you meter the Volt out of the Coil to the Drivers
[19:13:11] <James_Cole> ok
[19:13:22] <IchGuckLive> YAGO: Finnland you are
[19:13:29] <IchGuckLive> oh no Canada
[19:13:29] <James_Cole> i like imagebin
[19:13:36] <James_Cole> left side: http://imagebin.org/216807
[19:13:50] <James_Cole> 36v, i guess :-D
[19:13:57] <YAGO> Sammel,
[19:14:24] <IchGuckLive> im in Germany
[19:14:45] <IchGuckLive> at the French boarder towards Luxemburg
[19:15:12] <IchGuckLive> James thats nice
[19:15:24] <IchGuckLive> so its getting better
[19:15:30] <IchGuckLive> 150RPM
[19:15:32] <JT-Shop> well it has 36v
[19:15:45] <IchGuckLive> what Steppers of nanotec do you got
[19:16:22] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: got a image of the router
[19:16:31] <James_Cole> what's the router?
[19:16:39] <IchGuckLive> Millingmashine
[19:17:01] <James_Cole> you mean this?`http://www.imagehousing.com/image/1032400
[19:17:20] <James_Cole> this is X axis with nanotec stepper: http://imagebin.org/216808
[19:17:22] <IchGuckLive> so portal
[19:17:49] <James_Cole> X+Y is nanotec, Z axis not
[19:17:50] <IchGuckLive> i see TRapezional or ballscrew leadsrew
[19:18:11] <James_Cole> wait a moment
[19:18:43] <IchGuckLive> the liniar is on standard bearing nit liniarrails
[19:18:55] <IchGuckLive> eighter liniarbearing LM
[19:19:10] <James_Cole> http://imagebin.org/216809
[19:19:53] <IchGuckLive> Ballscrew thats the best but the liniar system is not
[19:20:21] <James_Cole> what's liniar?
[19:20:23] <IchGuckLive> can you discover the pitch as there is also a Timebelt 1/2 system
[19:20:42] <JT-Shop> Jymmm: car jack
[19:20:44] <James_Cole> can you say this in german, please? :-)
[19:21:44] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: it will fit your need But 100% on leadscrew 10% on axis movement precission
[19:22:25] <IchGuckLive> james if you turn the Ballscrew one REVolution the Axis move ? inch
[19:22:39] <James_Cole> 160 steps is 1mm
[19:22:43] <IchGuckLive> or even mm
[19:22:59] <IchGuckLive> oh you already done this
[19:23:08] <James_Cole> but i don't know the gear ratio
[19:23:34] <James_Cole> or better transmission ratio, i guess
[19:23:40] <IchGuckLive> no problem if you got the SCALE to 160 Already
[19:23:47] <James_Cole> yes
[19:24:25] <JT-Shop> finally got that whordeal done http://imagebin.org/216811
[19:24:52] <JT-Shop> http://imagebin.org/216812
[19:25:14] <James_Cole> does this mean the leadscrew is driven exactly, but the milling tool is not?
[19:25:20] <James_Cole> to a certain amount?
[19:25:43] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: so i calculate at min 375mm/min is your savest velocity of the AXIS
[19:25:52] <James_Cole> wow
[19:25:58] <James_Cole> how do you do that?
[19:26:27] <James_Cole> what's the basis of this calculation?
[19:27:15] <mrsun> yey might be two castings made tomorrow =)
[19:27:17] <mrsun> me like =)
[19:27:22] <IchGuckLive> Motor 200steps HalfStepping Times 2 Times ratio Times Pitch -> SCALE
[19:28:39] <YAGO> Sammel
[19:28:43] <YAGO> Ok I have 2.6.0-pre0-3388-ga3719bd installede and running
[19:28:47] <YAGO> If I load your foam-XYUV.ngc, I still see only X Y axis ?
[19:28:53] <IchGuckLive> Max Save Rev of the Steppers out of nanotec Datasheet Nema23 times Stepping Divided by scale -> max velo
[19:29:27] <James_Cole> ok
[19:29:35] <James_Cole> that's pretty slow
[19:30:11] <IchGuckLive> YAGO: witch mashine config didd you use SIM-> AXIS -> AxisFoam
[19:30:30] <James_Cole> do you recognize the producer of this stepper? http://imagebin.org/216809
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[19:32:17] <James_Cole> X and Y are nanotec sh5618c2908
[19:32:21] <James_Cole> i have the datasheet
[19:32:38] <James_Cole> but i don't find "max save rev" or something similar
[19:32:50] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: dont go faster then the 2.5NM line
[19:33:05] <James_Cole> 2.5NM line?
[19:33:28] <YAGO> Sammel,
[19:33:32] <YAGO> Ok now it works perfectly. Thank you very much for your patience :-)
[19:34:23] <IchGuckLive> YAGO: NP Dont forget to get GEOMETRY = XY;UV and FOAM =1 into your config
[19:35:02] <James_Cole> what is the 2.5NM line? newton meters?
[19:35:13] <YAGO> Ok I will
[19:35:26] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: let me see the datasheet for the wright numbers
[19:35:39] <James_Cole> wait a moment, i'll search the link
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[19:36:25] <James_Cole> http://de.nanotec.com/downloads/pdf/1409/SH5618C2908.pdf
[19:37:13] <IchGuckLive> they only pull 1.84Nm max
[19:37:17] <James_Cole> here's something different:
[19:37:17] <James_Cole> http://de.nanotec.com/schrittmotoren_sh5618.html?attribute_id=12&option_id=249
[19:37:26] <James_Cole> a different page, i mean
[19:37:40] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: http://en.nanotec.com/images/graphik/big/133_neu.png
[19:38:02] <James_Cole> cool
[19:38:21] <IchGuckLive> i see the Limit at 400RPM
[19:38:33] <James_Cole> so you say don't go below 2.5nm? ;-)
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[19:39:04] <James_Cole> you mean the limit of 1nm?
[19:39:13] <IchGuckLive> i expected 3Nm Nanotec
[19:39:14] <andypugh> Note that that is a logarithmic scale, 48V is twice as fast as 24V at the 1Nm level.
[19:39:20] <James_Cole> yes
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[19:39:39] <James_Cole> i think they are driven by 36 volts
[19:39:44] <James_Cole> if that's possible
[19:40:09] <IchGuckLive> the savest is to stay between 150 and 200
[19:40:22] <andypugh> Yes, you can probably go to hundreds of volte before the varnish flashes over.
[19:40:26] <James_Cole> ok
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[19:41:42] <IchGuckLive> so calculate your own mark the connector screw and go 1REV of the motor see what you got in the Axis number and time by 160 scale
[19:42:07] <James_Cole> sorry, haven't understood that
[19:42:27] <IchGuckLive> 150-200RPM max on the Stepper
[19:42:36] <andypugh> Tomorow I am going to expunge the RCDs from my system.
[19:42:47] <IchGuckLive> you do not know howmany steps /rev the stepper makes
[19:43:03] <James_Cole> 200 according to datasheet
[19:43:11] <James_Cole> step angle = 1.8
[19:43:14] <IchGuckLive> but your system
[19:43:29] <IchGuckLive> you can have lots of more by the drivers
[19:43:31] <andypugh> It is just too tedious walking back to the house to turn the lights and power back on when the contactor makes contact.
[19:44:03] <andypugh> I have realised I can swap the incomer RCD for a switch, and then put RCBOs on the shower and outside sockets.
[19:44:07] <James_Cole> even if the motor step angle = 1.8 there can be other than 200 steps per rev?
[19:44:31] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: yes Leadshine makes 16000 of it
[19:44:49] <IchGuckLive> or profesional even more
[19:44:51] <andypugh> Which is actually _closer_ to the requirements of the regulations, as there is meant to be discrimination so that a trip leaves the lights on.
[19:44:58] <James_Cole> ok
[19:44:59] <Loetmichel> James_Cole: man microstepping
[19:45:18] <James_Cole> i'll test it
[19:45:22] <James_Cole> but not today
[19:45:26] <IchGuckLive> hi Loetmichel Soccer count is ?
[19:45:26] <andypugh> no manual entry for microstepping
[19:45:31] <James_Cole> i know
[19:45:37] <Loetmichel> but you cant use microstepping to enhance resolution because microsteps are not gureed to be positoion stable
[19:45:41] <James_Cole> but i'll test the steps
[19:45:45] <Loetmichel> IchGuckLive: no idea
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[19:46:03] <Loetmichel> guranteed even
[19:46:20] <IchGuckLive> Thanks
[19:46:21] <James_Cole> ok, now i know a lot more than before ;-)
[19:46:40] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: Thats why we are here fore
[19:46:49] <James_Cole> that's great :-D
[19:47:06] <Loetmichel> so microstepping is good for spoothig out the moitor run and maybe egalize "stairs" in the moves, but not for precision work
[19:47:12] <James_Cole> ok
[19:47:13] <James_Cole> thanks
[19:47:28] * Loetmichel has to sort his fingers again ;-)
[19:47:33] <James_Cole> so once i know the steps per rev, i'll calculate the max vel.
[19:47:58] <Loetmichel> maybe its the 40 drops if metamizol... (bad back, may have dislocated a rib tonight)
[19:48:24] <Loetmichel> James_Cole: the max vel cant be calculated
[19:48:27] <James_Cole> assuming 200 steps per rev. this makes 150 rpm max makes 150*1,25 = 187 max vel
[19:48:27] <Loetmichel> only tested
[19:48:31] <James_Cole> is that correct?
[19:48:43] <James_Cole> can't be calculated?
[19:49:01] <Loetmichel> the mechanics and masses are the main reason for slow or fast machines
[19:49:03] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: it may go lots of faster but not save without steploss
[19:49:12] <Loetmichel> followed by the stepper troque and the drivers
[19:49:14] <James_Cole> sure, it goes a lot faster
[19:49:18] <James_Cole> but with steploss :-D
[19:49:40] <James_Cole> of course, router design counts into it etc
[19:49:49] <James_Cole> but that's a starting point
[19:50:03] <Loetmichel> 150 RPM on a stepper?
[19:50:23] <Loetmichel> what drivers have you that a stepper has any torque left tuning so fast?
[19:50:33] <James_Cole> probably steps per minute, not rounds
[19:50:36] <Loetmichel> ah, sorry, rotations per MINUTE
[19:50:39] <IchGuckLive> James_Cole: calculate (Stepper Steps per Rev TIMES 150RPM) Divided by 160steps/mm
[19:50:44] <James_Cole> ok
[19:50:55] <James_Cole> yes
[19:51:07] <Loetmichel> so 600 should be the theoretical maximum of std steppers with std drivers, more or less
[19:51:21] <James_Cole> cool
[19:51:23] <Loetmichel> 600 rpm
[19:51:46] <Loetmichel> BUT: at tis speed a normal stepper with a normal <40V drive has NO troque left
[19:52:11] <James_Cole> yes, i do understand know
[19:52:13] <Loetmichel> depending on how much torque your setup needs to move you have to de-rate it ;-)
[19:52:15] <andypugh> I think my miling machine is going to need a speed-up head.
[19:52:25] <IchGuckLive> Loetmichel: ha got ballscrews with 0.2NM
[19:52:37] <andypugh> It has gears from 45 to 1000 rpm.
[19:52:40] <Loetmichel> IchGuckLive: and how much masses on the axes?
[19:52:52] <Loetmichel> and ho much friction in the linear ways?
[19:53:02] <andypugh> With the VFD the 45rpm speed can turn at less than one RPM. Implacably and with huge torque.
[19:53:03] <James_Cole> i'll go watch soccer know
[19:53:09] <IchGuckLive> around 80-100N
[19:53:13] <James_Cole> thank you all very much, vielen dank euch allen
[19:53:32] <IchGuckLive> Kein Problem
[19:53:40] <JT-Shop> andypugh: need a 1:10 speed increaser
[19:53:42] <Loetmichel> no problem
[19:53:48] <James_Cole> see you ;-) :-D
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[19:54:17] <andypugh> JT-Shop: Indeed. And I have an idea how to make one.
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[19:54:33] <Loetmichel> JT-Shop: maybe its simpler to fit a kress or a cinese HF-spindle to the main spindle of your machien?
[19:54:36] * JT-Shop only imagined that it was possible to coil up the sheet stock without any blood letting
[19:54:43] <alex4nder> hah
[19:54:57] <Loetmichel> its cheaper and less work than buiold a stepup-gear in the main spindle
[19:55:04] <JT-Shop> andypugh: belt drive?
[19:55:37] <Loetmichel> oh, its for andypugh.
[19:55:38] <Loetmichel> sorry
[19:55:39] <andypugh> JT-Shop: Yes, in fact one option might be to leave the gearbox in neutral permanently and connect the motor directly to the main shaft.
[19:55:59] <JT-Shop> 3600 RPM motor?
[19:56:02] <Loetmichel> andypugh: what mill?
[19:56:06] <Tom_itx> or pull a gear to minimize drag?
[19:56:30] <Loetmichel> are the spindle shaft bearings made for 3600 rpm?
[19:56:33] <IchGuckLive> andypugh: did you go with the MY1020
[19:57:06] <andypugh> Loetmichel: http://www.lathes.co.uk/harrisonmiller/index.html with the vertical head
[19:58:09] <Loetmichel> do you have a vertical head for that?
[19:58:11] <IchGuckLive> andypugh: is the 4th tiltshift in
[19:58:38] <IchGuckLive> so X can do C within some degree
[19:59:35] <Tom_itx> ok i wonder if i should mount my heatsink to the outside of the box and punch a hole just for the drivers or mount it from the inside cutting out for all the fins as well
[19:59:46] <andypugh> Loetmichel: The actual machine: https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/UE3bN_sKz-J_6xtRQep60NMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=directlink
[20:00:03] <andypugh> Yes, the head does swivel.
[20:00:04] <alex4nder>
[20:00:41] <Loetmichel> andypugh: looks nice but the collet is a bit rusty ;-)
[20:00:54] <andypugh> Reading that lathes.co.uk page it says that you could order it with a higher speed range, and that was done by changing the pulley sizes. So I think I will :-)
[20:01:16] <Loetmichel> what i wanted to know: if you use a direct drive: are the bearings of the spindle up to the task?
[20:01:53] <andypugh> That collet is one my dad had lying around. It will only be useful in the horizontal spindle now, because the vertical is now BT 30 with a pneumatic drawbar.
[20:02:06] <Loetmichel> I would use the vertical head like it is and use for high speed milling a seperate electricals spindle mounted beside it
[20:02:23] <Loetmichel> maybe wit a "glasses" type holder
[20:02:24] <IchGuckLive> ok im off
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[20:02:42] <andypugh> Loetmichel: There was a 1500rpm variant, whoich was 2800 on the vertical.
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[20:03:05] <Loetmichel> one ring gripping the original spindle and the other ring grippeng the chinese one and the two connected by some steel
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[20:03:26] <andypugh> Loetmichel: There is no quill to clamp around, but a modified bottom bearing cap might allow that.
[20:04:11] <Loetmichel> anyway: thats would be the way I would go
[20:04:24] <Loetmichel> not gearing um the vertcal head
[20:04:51] <andypugh> It is the way I would go, were I sensible. But my idea for a speed-increaser is interesting and I want to try it :-)
[20:05:25] <Loetmichel> maybe aditional using a vfd to get the motor up to 120 Hz
[20:05:29] <Loetmichel> but not more
[20:05:54] <andypugh> yes, I already upped the speed to 75hz
[20:08:22] <andypugh> Knowing that the machine was available with a 1500rpm top speed makes me entirely happy using the VFD to get the same effect.
[20:09:49] <andypugh> The slow speed make more sense in a Horizontal machine. You could twirl some very big cutters.
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[20:14:05] <andypugh> That's interesting. Lathes.co.uk says that the vertical head has a speedup factor, but just testing mine it appears to be exactly 1:1
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[20:16:36] <andypugh> Aha! There were high-speed and low-speed vertical head options.
[20:17:04] <andypugh> So I have the slow-speed horizontal option combined with the slow-speed vertical option :-)
[20:20:00] <andypugh> Which gives me a top speed ot 1000rpm, rather than the optional 2800
[20:20:32] <anonimasu> http://ah.io23.net/ul/files/PA110053.JPG
[20:20:37] <anonimasu> how the ballscrew ended up :)
[20:21:41] <andypugh> Seems to have worked out well.
[20:21:41] <anonimasu> no tapers just counter nuts.
[20:22:05] <anonimasu> there's a 2mm sleeve outside to bring it to the dia of my couplers and preload the bearings
[20:22:23] <anonimasu> though, gotta machine a hex on the end of that part on the right..
[20:22:51] <andypugh> It took me ages to work out what was wrong with my lathe when the screwed-on extension came loose. It's now a glued-on extension.
[20:23:04] <anonimasu> hehe, i figured the same
[20:23:08] <anonimasu> hence the counter nut :p
[20:23:32] <anonimasu> locktite for final assembly, though that's a bit off still.. gotta drop it into the parts cleaner first and clean out the nut
[20:23:43] <anonimasu> and get that damn oiler off.
[20:24:07] <anonimasu> gotta stick a central lube point there instead.
[20:24:44] <anonimasu> err hookup to the central oiler there will be later.
[20:25:23] <anonimasu> :)
[20:27:55] * JT-Shop takes a short break before welding up the bases for the unstuckers
[20:30:40] <anonimasu> tho no tapered bearings yet, they are at the desk, but i need to machine a preload spacer before i stick them there.
[20:32:13] <JT-Shop> http://users2.ml.mindenkilapja.hu/users/raptortuning/uploads/armored-boss-hoss-mow.jpg
[20:32:39] <syyl_ws_> let me gues
[20:32:53] <syyl_ws_> it doesnt have a reverse, so they added the dual gatlings...
[20:33:25] <JT-Shop> lol
[20:33:42] <JT-Shop> who needs to back up with that?
[20:33:50] <syyl_ws_> lol
[20:35:09] <JT-Shop> and for the farmers http://ginormasource.com/photos/
[20:35:37] <syyl_ws_> no gatlings :(
[20:35:43] <DJ9DJ> gn8
[20:35:53] <Tom_itx> that one needs a plow
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[20:37:25] <JT-Shop> there are 3 or 4 of the v-8 bikes around this area
[20:43:15] <andypugh> JT-Shop: But no actual coreners?
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[20:47:35] <tjb1> JT-Shop: did you get the computer on?
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[20:55:29] <JT-Shop> tjb1: gave up
[20:56:06] <JT-Shop> andypugh: can you rephrase that?
[20:56:46] <andypugh> JT-Shop: I can re-type it to make it clear that I mean "corners" and not "coroners" if that helps?
[20:56:59] <JT-Shop> ah ok
[20:57:02] <tjb1> JT-Shop: What did it do?
[20:57:23] <JT-Shop> tjb1: nothing but get hot on the left lower end
[20:57:34] <tjb1> Anything show up on screen?
[20:57:42] <JT-Shop> nada
[20:57:54] <JT-Shop> no blinky lights nothing
[20:58:05] <JT-Shop> only light was on the charge cord
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[20:59:12] <tjb1> What kinda computer is this again?
[20:59:12] -!- Thetawaves has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep]
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[20:59:42] <JT-Shop> something book G4
[21:00:21] <tjb1> Powerbook or iBook?
[21:00:38] <JT-Shop> powerbook
[21:00:44] * JT-Shop just went to look
[21:01:26] <archivist> I added an anti backlash nut to the horizontal today, now I know how worn it is, 5 thou backlash in the middle and tight at the ends
[21:02:05] <tjb1> JT-Shop: remove battery and leave it plugged in for at least 5 hours
[21:02:43] <tjb1> Wait
[21:03:32] <andypugh> JT-Shop: No noises on startup? That's a bad sign.
[21:03:38] <tjb1> http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1781
[21:03:40] <tjb1> Try that
[21:04:18] <JT-Shop> andypugh: too much background noise to tell when I tried
[21:04:19] <andypugh> tjb1: You mean http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1431?viewlocale=en_US
[21:04:58] <tjb1> Ah yes, clicked a little too far :)
[21:05:02] <tjb1> And failed to scroll down
[21:05:52] <JT-Shop> now I'm confused
[21:06:38] <tjb1> What screen size?
[21:07:21] <JT-Shop> 9 3/4 x 7 1/4
[21:07:51] <tjb1> diagonal :)
[21:07:53] <JT-Shop> ok I have the computer on my desk
[21:08:05] <JT-Shop> 12'
[21:08:09] <JT-Shop> "
[21:08:18] <tjb1> computer off
[21:08:28] <JT-Shop> yea and unplugged
[21:08:41] <andypugh> 12"? Did they ever make screens so small?
[21:08:44] <tjb1> press Shift-Control-Option-Power at the same time and then release
[21:08:53] <tjb1> wait 5 seconds
[21:08:54] <JT-Shop> ok
[21:09:12] <andypugh> You are allowed t use your nose.
[21:09:31] <tjb1> then press power see if anything happens
[21:09:37] <JT-Shop> should the power be plugged in?
[21:09:41] <tjb1> doesnt matter
[21:09:45] <tjb1> wouldnt hurt ;)
[21:10:15] <JT-Shop> nothing seems to happen
[21:10:34] <tjb1> is there a light on the front side of the laptop?
[21:10:41] <JT-Shop> last time I messed with it I could get the dos prompt
[21:10:54] <andypugh> Dos prompt?
[21:10:55] <JT-Shop> don't see any
[21:11:07] <JT-Shop> ok, mac prompt
[21:11:14] <tjb1> terminal ;)
[21:11:30] <andypugh> Yeah, but they don't really have one
[21:11:30] <JT-Shop> yea
[21:11:30] <tjb1> Not sure which powerbook you have...
[21:11:52] <tjb1> Is there a latch between Esc and F1 keys?
[21:11:56] <andypugh> There was a command-line boot environment, but uf you get that, it's not a good sign.
[21:12:06] <tjb1> and F11-F12
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[21:12:24] <JT-Shop> model A1010
[21:12:54] <JT-Shop> no latch
[21:13:25] <tjb1> There a reset button between external video and modem port?
[21:14:39] <tjb1> And your keyboard doesnt look like this? http://img.ehowcdn.com/article-new-intro-modal/ehow/images/a06/hi/01/replace-powerbook-g4-keyboard-800x800.jpg
[21:14:45] <JT-Shop> I don't see any reset button
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[21:15:01] <JT-Shop> no
[21:15:15] -!- maximilian_h [maximilian_h!~bonsai@130.255.104.157] has joined #linuxcnc
[21:15:27] <tjb1> Well only one more option left...
[21:15:33] <tjb1> Take battery out and unplug it
[21:15:39] <tjb1> hold power button for 5 seconds
[21:15:52] <tjb1> put battery back and plug it in and try to start it
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[21:17:50] <JT-Shop> it looks like this http://imagebin.org/216824
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[21:18:23] <tjb1> odd screen…dont think I have ever seen a square laptop screen
[21:18:48] <tjb1> Well the one above is last way to reset the pmu
[21:18:56] <JT-Shop> it's not square but the camera angle makes it appear so
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[21:19:32] <tjb1> Id love to have the new one
[21:19:38] <tjb1> With the retina screen
[21:20:04] <JT-Shop> nothing when I press the power button
[21:20:23] <tjb1> Well next option is unplug battery and leave it plugged in for at least 5 hours
[21:20:35] <JT-Shop> ok
[21:20:59] <JT-Shop> battery has green leds on it
[21:21:14] <JT-Shop> power level?
[21:22:12] <JT-Shop> what do I do after 5 hours?
[21:22:12] <tjb1> Yeah
[21:22:18] <tjb1> How many light up?
[21:22:30] <JT-Shop> 4 were lit and the 5th was blinking
[21:22:39] <tjb1> oh well….let me do some research
[21:22:48] <JT-Shop> ok, thanks
[21:22:51] <tjb1> oh, well.
[21:22:59] <tjb1> It appears it isnt a battery problem then
[21:23:38] <JT-Shop> it has been dropped a few times, I can see the results on the corners
[21:24:01] <tjb1> Any startup chimes, fan or power button lights?
[21:24:02] <JT-Shop> I wonder if something has shaken loose
[21:24:08] <JT-Shop> nope
[21:24:34] <tjb1> try opening hdd area and see if its plugged in
[21:24:55] <JT-Shop> cover on bottom?
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[21:26:10] <tjb1> That involes taking the whole bottom cover off
[21:26:22] <tjb1> If you want to try that to see if anything is broken/un-hooked
[21:26:40] <tjb1> Other option is the backup battery could be dead and not letting it start
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[21:26:54] <JT-Shop> found the memory
[21:26:54] <tjb1> That requires taking the battery out and leaving computer plugged in for 5-18 hours
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[21:27:27] <JT-Shop> in the battery compartment there is a hatch with something under that looks like some kind of card
[21:28:10] <tjb1> No clue
[21:28:28] <tjb1> http://www.ifixit.com/Guide/PowerBook-G4-Aluminum-12-Inch-1-1-5-GHz-Hard-Drive-Replacement/548/1#.T95L5ytYtXI
[21:28:32] <tjb1> look something like that?
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[21:30:19] <tjb1> That thing looks like an absolute prick to tear apart
[21:30:25] <JT-Shop> no, the second photo down the vertial slot is a hatch
[21:31:03] <JT-Shop> that is the same computer
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[21:31:17] <tjb1> http://www.ifixit.com/Device/PowerBook_G4_Aluminum_12%22_867_MHz
[21:31:19] <tjb1> Try that
[21:31:53] <tjb1> That one ^ says model A1010
[21:33:51] <andypugh> JT-Shop: WiFi card
[21:34:01] <JT-Shop> ah ok
[21:35:37] <JT-Shop> wow, I'll have computer parts scattered all over the place
[21:35:56] * Tom_itx wonders how many will be left when done
[21:36:15] * JT-Shop goes to set up the mill to make a hole for the hard drive to fall out of...
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[21:45:42] <tjb1> If someone goes here www.bennett-built.com
[21:45:58] <tjb1> go to the store please, add the item to the cart and try to checkout and see if it quotes you for shipping please
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[21:48:37] <JT-Shop> doesn't ask for a zip to calculate shipping
[21:49:33] <JT-Shop> when I click calculate shipping someting flys off to the left and it says 0
[21:49:51] <tjb1> Yeah thats what it is doing to me
[21:50:27] <archivist> you probably need a non compliant M$ browser :)
[21:50:30] * JT-Shop back to the mill
[21:50:51] ybit2 is now known as ybit
[21:52:20] <tjb1> This is why I never worked on the website before
[21:52:31] <tjb1> The shipping for that hitch changes dramatically from area to area
[22:02:52] <tjb1> I hate places that make you have a stupid password
[22:02:55] <tjb1> 8-26 characters
[22:03:03] <tjb1> Must contain capital, lowercase adn numbers
[22:12:15] <andypugh> so you need to write it down.
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[22:13:19] <tjb1> Yep...awesome
[22:13:27] <tjb1> Just what I like to do, keep passwords written down somewhere
[22:13:42] <tjb1> Whats better is not being able to pick a username
[22:14:23] <ReadError> gj tjb1
[22:14:28] <ReadError> you broke the site!
[22:14:37] <tjb1> Down for maintenance?
[22:14:39] <ReadError> Briefly unavailable for scheduled maintenance. Check back in a minute.
[22:14:40] <ReadError> lol
[22:14:49] <tjb1> Yeah I am having that problem too lol
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[22:16:35] <tjb1> Well damn...
[22:18:29] <tjb1> and its back :)
[22:18:42] <tjb1> Try that update one more time
[22:23:04] <ReadError> still down for me
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[22:32:25] <tjb1> It broken again?
[22:39:26] <tjb1> Filezilla takes so long to delete files off the server
[22:39:36] -!- FinboySlick has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
[22:41:11] <tjb1> broken again...
[22:44:00] <ReadError> i dont see a zipcode option
[22:44:26] <tjb1> im updating that plugin right now
[22:45:49] <tjb1> 220 files left
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[22:47:19] <ReadError> go with magento for ecommerce :)
[22:47:45] <tjb1> wp?
[22:48:15] <ReadError> nah
[22:50:24] <tjb1> http://www.magentocommerce.com/magento-connect/wordpress-integration.html
[22:52:45] <ReadError> alot of large ecommerce sites use magento
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[23:01:20] <tjb1> its $15 a month
[23:03:53] <ReadError> for what?
[23:04:09] <ReadError> magento?
[23:04:18] <ReadError> magento community edition is free
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[23:08:16] <Sunnyday> Beddy Byes For Snoozey Poosey Woosey pies!
[23:08:45] <tjb1> oh
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[23:09:17] <andypugh> Who was that?
[23:09:44] <tjb1> who was who
[23:12:24] <tjb1> I got the other store plug in working
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[23:13:40] <tjb1> Works with 2nd day and next day air too :D
[23:16:02] <ReadError> what you sellin?
[23:16:12] <ReadError> you should get an SSL cert also
[23:17:01] <ReadError> https://www.cheapssls.com/geotrust-ssl-certificates/
[23:17:04] <ReadError> best price there
[23:17:08] <ReadError> get the rapidSSL
[23:17:30] <ReadError> or quick
[23:17:36] <ReadError> but when you submit it, get it for www.domain.com
[23:17:42] <ReadError> and they will give you domain.com free
[23:17:49] <ReadError> if you just put domain.com, you wont get the www
[23:18:31] <tjb1> I dont do the ssl stuff
[23:18:33] <tjb1> too expensive
[23:19:01] <ReadError> if you have a login page
[23:19:03] <ReadError> you should
[23:19:11] <ReadError> its 15 ;)
[23:19:58] <tjb1> a month?
[23:20:12] <tjb1> I dont handle any credit cards or anything
[23:20:14] <tjb1> I use paypal
[23:20:15] <ReadError> no
[23:20:16] <ReadError> per year
[23:20:37] <ReadError> im hesistent about loggin into anything w/o ssl enabled
[23:20:52] <tjb1> well no payment information gets entered at my site
[23:21:09] <ReadError> oh, 7.99 per year
[23:21:12] <ReadError> not bad at all
[23:23:16] -!- rob_h has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
[23:25:02] <tjb1> So yeah not needed :)
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[23:33:45] <r00t4rd3d> what site?
[23:34:03] <tjb1> one im workin on
[23:34:07] <tjb1> wanna see?
[23:34:10] <r00t4rd3d> ya
[23:34:42] <tjb1> www.bennett-built.com
[23:35:23] <r00t4rd3d> now i will deface it
[23:36:02] <tjb1> oh yeah
[23:36:04] <r00t4rd3d> is this on a home server?
[23:36:10] <tjb1> no
[23:36:14] <r00t4rd3d> oh
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[23:36:31] <tjb1> lol
[23:36:34] <tjb1> scared now?
[23:36:51] <r00t4rd3d> i peed myself alittle
[23:37:01] <tjb1> Ill send danica after you.
[23:37:09] <r00t4rd3d> what
[23:37:12] <andypugh> Not having a keyboard is a bit awkward
[23:37:12] <tjb1> patrick
[23:37:24] <r00t4rd3d> andypugh, onscreen!
[23:37:34] <andypugh> I can sort-of VNC into the machine, but it asks for a password.
[23:37:35] <r00t4rd3d> you go through godaddy?
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[23:37:46] <tjb1> they just have the domain
[23:37:52] <andypugh> I have installed an onscreen password, but I can't start it, without a keyboard
[23:38:06] <andypugh> (onscreen keyboard, I mean)
[23:38:07] <r00t4rd3d> use the handicap onscreen keyboard
[23:38:17] <andypugh> Which is where?
[23:38:23] <r00t4rd3d> have it start with the os
[23:38:27] <r00t4rd3d> what os
[23:38:32] <andypugh> Ubuntu
[23:38:50] <tjb1> poobuntu :)
[23:38:50] <r00t4rd3d> in the admin tab there is like start up applications or services?
[23:39:08] <andypugh> Probably. How do I add soemthing I can't type?
[23:39:28] <r00t4rd3d> ssh
[23:39:37] <r00t4rd3d> and use putty or something
[23:39:49] <tjb1> or you know…just go buy a keyboard
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[23:40:31] <andypugh> I have an ssh connection, but that's no good for dialogs which pop up on the native screen
[23:40:45] <andypugh> Like the "allow remote desktop" one
[23:40:47] <r00t4rd3d> remote desktop connection
[23:42:06] <andypugh> Yes, when I try to Remote Desktop a dialog box opens on the remote screen saying "Type in the password to unlock the keyring"
[23:42:31] <r00t4rd3d> delete the keyring
[23:43:07] <r00t4rd3d> its under your user name in user accounts
[23:43:26] <andypugh> And I can delete it without a password?
[23:43:44] <r00t4rd3d> oh wait
[23:43:56] <r00t4rd3d> Applications > Accessories > Passwords and Encryption keys
[23:43:57] <r00t4rd3d> maybe
[23:44:03] <r00t4rd3d> not sure with old stuff
[23:44:13] <r00t4rd3d> and im not on ubuntu atm
[23:44:59] <r00t4rd3d> shit you need a keyboard to enter a blank password for the keyring
[23:45:22] <andypugh> It's fun, isn't it?
[23:45:54] <r00t4rd3d> goto the machine and set it to auto login
[23:46:03] <tjb1> Hey r00t4rd3d http://www.cnczone.com/forums/open_source_cnc_machine_designs/101878-electronic_home_switches_made_easy.html
[23:46:05] <andypugh> I have a bluetooth keyboard in the same room as the machine. The one I am typing on now, but that is no help.
[23:46:23] <andypugh> I have a spare keyboard in the garage. It is PS/2
[23:46:46] <tjb1> I have a ps/2 to usb converter :)
[23:46:49] <tjb1> doesnt do you much good
[23:47:21] <ReadError> andypugh,
[23:47:21] <ReadError> synergy
[23:47:24] <ReadError> use it, love it
[23:48:21] <andypugh> synergy?
[23:48:29] <ReadError> ya
[23:48:42] <ReadError> i use it with 3 computers
[23:49:04] <andypugh> Excellent.
[23:49:07] <andypugh> What is it?
[23:50:02] <tjb1> http://synergy-foss.org/
[23:50:03] <ReadError> basically, 1 computer is the host
[23:50:54] <ReadError> you connect the others to it
[23:50:55] <ReadError> and you can share the same kb/mouse across all of them
[23:50:55] <ReadError> and copy/paste between them
[23:51:09] <tjb1> copy and paste too?
[23:51:10] <tjb1> hmm
[23:51:12] <ReadError> ya
[23:51:14] <ReadError> its awesome
[23:51:23] <tjb1> And its free??
[23:51:34] <andypugh> And it runs on a Mac?
[23:51:43] <tjb1> Ubuntu, Windows and Mac
[23:51:55] <tjb1> Debian, Fedora and Red Hat
[23:52:12] <andypugh> i guess I need a keyboard to install it though. :-)
[23:52:26] <tjb1> Well you need a keyboard to use it...
[23:52:51] <andypugh> I have a keyboard. Quite a nice one. It just can't connect to the machine in question.
[23:53:10] <tjb1> Why not?
[23:53:20] <andypugh> Because it is Bluetooth
[23:53:27] <tjb1> Ah.
[23:53:39] <tjb1> Those dongles are $0.50 on ebay :P
[23:53:52] <andypugh> The PS/2 Keyboard in the garage has a different problem.
[23:54:00] <tjb1> Only thing you can do is download it and try
[23:54:09] <tjb1> http://synergy-foss.org/download/
[23:54:25] <andypugh> I am actually planning on giving up and going to sleep.
[23:54:42] <andypugh> I have a small USB keyboard on the way from eBay
[23:54:55] <ReadError> andypugh,
[23:54:57] <tjb1> China?
[23:54:58] <ReadError> set it up over vnc
[23:55:03] <ReadError> bam
[23:55:09] <ReadError> ya it works on linux/osx/windows
[23:55:13] <ReadError> i use it on all 3
[23:55:20] <ReadError> for OSX, grab synergyKM
[23:55:42] <andypugh> I thought we had already mde it clear that I can't VNC because I can't type in the VNC password
[23:56:07] <ReadError> ah
[23:56:09] <tjb1> Can you use the virtual keyboard, copy it and then paste it?
[23:56:19] <ReadError> set it up via CLI :)
[23:56:24] <andypugh> Which virtual keyboard?
[23:57:01] <tjb1> You trying to login to ubuntu?
[23:57:28] <alex4nder> yoh
[23:57:31] <andypugh> I have fogotten what I was trying to do.
[23:58:01] <tjb1> I dont remember where you needed the keyboard either :)
[23:58:18] <tjb1> May be of assistance - http://superuser.com/questions/122647/ubuntu-on-screen-keyboard-without-typing
[23:58:26] <andypugh> This looks handy http://www.amazon.co.uk/Wireless-Keyboard-Removable-Adjustable-Touchpad/dp/B004TQL3YS/ref=sr_1_11?ie=UTF8&qid=1339977352&sr=8-11
[23:59:26] <andypugh> Yes, it is helpful in that it says that is can't be done.
[23:59:28] <tjb1> Thats freakin sweet
[23:59:45] <tjb1> Now to find it in the US :)