#emc | Logs for 2011-11-29

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[00:21:10] <danimal_laptop> sweet got another touch screen for my other mill
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[01:39:42] <Danimal_garage> yawn
[01:40:00] <Tom_itx> agreed
[01:40:09] <Danimal_garage> how goes it
[01:40:29] <Tom_itx> i think i borrowed an assmagnet from jt
[01:41:47] <Danimal_garage> whats that?
[01:42:00] <Danimal_garage> making dinner for the MIL?
[01:42:23] <Tom_itx> i've been stuck to this chair for some time now
[01:43:48] <Danimal_garage> ha
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[03:19:12] <garage_seb> PCW, pcw_home, thanks, that latest firmware file fixed my encoders
[03:19:16] <garage_seb> mill runs well now
[03:19:18] <garage_seb> you rock
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[03:32:23] <danimal_laptop> yay!
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[03:33:02] <garage_seb> the shop is: OPEN
[03:33:03] <garage_seb> :-)
[03:33:13] <Danimal_garage> what machine was it?
[03:33:30] <garage_seb> said the guy with more than one machine ^^^^^
[03:33:33] <garage_seb> my mill
[03:33:49] <Danimal_garage> fanuc encoders?
[03:34:23] <garage_seb> BEI encoders on a bridgeport series 1
[03:34:28] <Danimal_garage> ah
[03:35:06] <garage_seb> standard rs-422 encoders, but i'd run out of encoder inputs on my 7i33 and switched to a 7i48, and the muxed encoder firmware for my 5i22 was out to lunch
[03:35:43] <Danimal_garage> ahh. i am about to put a 7i48 into my new mill as well
[03:35:51] <Danimal_garage> i have a 5i20 though
[03:36:01] <Danimal_garage> shouldnt have any issues hopefully
[03:36:10] <MattyMatt> does anyone enjoy sharpening drill bits? http://www.ebay.com/itm/PILE-VINTAGE-DRILL-BITS-GREENFILED-CLEVELAND-MORSE-MACHINIST-LATHE-MILL-/220899708713
[03:36:31] <Danimal_garage> i barely even use drills lol
[03:36:45] <garage_seb> "drilling? is that like helix-milling?"
[03:36:50] <Danimal_garage> lol
[03:37:06] <garage_seb> Danimal_garage, skunkworks has a 7i48 and a 5i20 and it's running well for him
[03:37:08] <Danimal_garage> i just pulled the last enclosure off my new mill, NASTY behind it.
[03:37:16] <garage_seb> what'd you get?
[03:37:27] <Danimal_garage> i'm gunna freshen it up with some paint
[03:37:33] <Danimal_garage> a kasuga
[03:37:44] <Danimal_garage> knee mill, almost a clone of my shizuoka ans
[03:37:56] <Danimal_garage> maybe a little bigger
[03:38:14] <Danimal_garage> had a bandit on it with a quickdraw toolchanger
[03:38:21] <ssi> lol I have a drill doctor :P
[03:38:29] <garage_seb> heh, first hit on a google search for "kasuga mill" brings up a page about an emc2 conversion :-)
[03:38:38] <Danimal_garage> yea, same mill
[03:38:44] <Danimal_garage> mine's a little newer
[03:38:56] <Danimal_garage> and i have a toolchanger
[03:39:13] <garage_seb> cool :-)
[03:39:38] <Danimal_garage> works out, same toolchanger as on my shizuoka, so i can use the same ladder :)
[03:40:17] <Tom_itx> i use drills like those in my hand drill to fix farm trailers etc
[03:40:23] <Tom_itx> nothing that matters
[03:40:40] <Tom_itx> hammer em straight again and drill away
[03:41:20] <Danimal_garage> "vintage" lol
[03:41:37] <Danimal_garage> another word for old and worn out
[03:41:46] <Tom_itx> i've got a box full of 'vintage' drills too
[03:41:57] <ssi> I have a box full of vintage harbor freight drills! :D
[03:42:01] <Danimal_garage> me too, i keep meaning to throw them out
[03:42:23] <Danimal_garage> or at least consolidate them
[03:42:52] <ssi> I bought a crapton of assorted quickchange drills off ebay a couple months ago
[03:43:00] <ssi> aircraft drills
[03:43:09] <Tom_itx> most of those are usually shot
[03:43:29] <ssi> not in my experience... cause they're usually only used for aluminum
[03:43:34] <ssi> and most of them are piloted and reaming
[03:43:39] <ssi> they're awesome for aircraft work
[03:43:57] <Tom_itx> the surplus guy here sells those by the pound to the scrap yard
[03:44:05] <ssi> where's here?
[03:44:11] <Tom_itx> central US
[03:44:16] <ssi> wichita? :D
[03:44:20] <Tom_itx> yup
[03:44:22] <ssi> heheh
[03:44:33] <ssi> one of these days I intend to come out to wichita and go salvage hunting
[03:44:35] <Tom_itx> where are you?
[03:44:37] <ssi> atlanta
[03:44:53] <Tom_itx> better hurry up before they all dry up
[03:44:58] <Tom_itx> nothing like it used to be
[03:45:02] <ssi> yeah, so I've heard
[03:45:17] <Tom_itx> W coast is probably better
[03:45:25] <ssi> yeah, but wichita is feasible
[03:45:32] <ssi> trying to borrow a 310 and fly out and load the fucker up
[03:46:05] <ssi> 1500lb of surplus tools and metal would make me a happy individual
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[03:46:56] <Tom_itx> the one still has a decent assortment of aluminum
[03:47:24] <ssi> I'm building an airplane, so the specialty tools are worth more to me than scrap value
[03:47:43] <Tom_itx> my friend's dad restored stearmans
[03:47:48] <ds3> ssi: what kind of plane are you building?
[03:47:51] <ssi> rv7
[03:47:56] <Tom_itx> probably had the biggest supply of them in the us
[03:47:58] <ssi> like everyone else in the free world :P
[03:48:18] <ssi> and a pitts S1-11, but that's sorta on hold til the RV is done
[03:48:32] * ds3 googles
[03:49:01] <Tom_itx> was down that way a couple weeks ago
[03:49:07] <Tom_itx> thru atlanta
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[03:49:29] <ds3> ssi: in your garage?
[03:49:36] <ssi> initially, yes
[03:49:38] <ssi> it's in a hangar now
[03:49:49] <ds3> I see
[03:50:10] <ssi> http://a4.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/377448_723640392402_71107655_35146120_852433944_n.jpg
[03:50:45] <Danimal_garage> i know someone parting one out
[03:50:51] <ssi> an RV?
[03:50:55] <Danimal_garage> need a spare wing? lol
[03:50:58] <ssi> haha
[03:51:03] <Danimal_garage> looks like that, not sure if it is
[04:25:11] <jdhNC> what do you clean Al with before anodizing?
[04:31:30] <Tom_itx> acid?
[04:31:58] <Tom_itx> http://anodizing-process.blogspot.com/
[04:32:29] <Danimal_garage> first i etch it with sodium hydroxide, then a desmut mixture, which is an acid of sorts
[04:33:14] <A2Sheds> Danimal_garage: what brand of dye do you use?
[04:33:22] <Danimal_garage> caswell
[04:33:24] <ssi> I had a brief foray into anodizing
[04:33:27] <ssi> I didn't have good luck with it :/
[04:34:08] <ssi> a couple of my black parts came out ok
[04:34:11] <ssi> most came out purple
[04:34:26] <ssi> I had a really hard time getting good current transfer into the part
[04:34:42] <ssi> and the damn acid ate holes in all my clothes :)
[04:36:29] <A2Sheds> did much dye wash out during sealing?
[04:37:40] <jdhNC> I don't really care what color they end up. They are currently flaking off powder coat and they need something for protection from salt water.
[04:38:04] <ssi> I couldn't get the dye to penetrate in the first place... it wasn't the sealing. If you can't put current into the part, you won't build up a porous oxide layer that'll take dye
[04:38:06] <jdhNC> I can't seem to find any place that will do anodizing for random people.
[04:38:25] <ssi> there's supposed to be a shop near me that'll do it, and they have a minimum order price of like $150
[04:38:33] <ssi> they'll do one part for you, but it's $150
[04:38:48] <A2Sheds> minimum batch price
[04:38:51] <ssi> right
[04:39:03] <ssi> I haven't tried them out yet though
[04:39:11] <Tom_itx> the trick would be to find someone running a batch and toss it in with the batch
[04:39:33] <A2Sheds> heh, thats not how they make $$
[04:39:34] <Tom_itx> i had a friend that got alot of stuff done for nothing that way
[04:40:47] <Danimal_garage> man this enclosure was nasty. i should have gotten another one and chucked it
[04:40:52] <Tom_itx> but he represented large clients too
[04:41:24] <ssi> hah weird... I searched for "g0602 steady rest" to see what people have done to make them not suck
[04:41:30] <ssi> and I got a video that someone JUST PUT UP
[04:41:39] <ssi> date is today, view counter is 0
[04:43:49] <jdhNC> did you make a new holder for your g0602?
[04:49:53] <ssi> holder?
[04:50:09] <jdhNC> cross slide, but I was thinking of a 9x20
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[04:50:30] <ssi> I took the compound off and replaced it with a fixed block that has a shoulder on the top and bottom
[04:50:46] <ssi> the bottom shoulder snugs up against the cross slide
[04:51:02] <ssi> the top is T-slotted for a QCTP, which can snug up against the top shoulder
[04:51:08] <ssi> so everything is square and repeatable
[04:51:32] <ssi> my only regret is I wish the block were taller... i run out of up adjustment on my toolholders frequently, especially for boring bars
[04:51:50] <jdhNC> make a new base?
[04:52:01] <ssi> the first one was a lot of work ;)
[04:52:28] <jdhNC> teh one I have on my 7x is like that, but I think it is because the tooling is just oversized
[04:52:45] <ssi> what I've done in the past is turn a collar that can go on the height adjustment screw, under the lockring
[04:52:52] <ssi> and I mill across it so it has a little tab that hangs over
[04:52:57] <ssi> that gives me some extra adjustment height
[04:53:04] <ssi> hard to describe, I'd have to take a picture
[04:57:13] <ssi> http://p.twimg.com/AfZISiwCIAEYNn-.jpg
[04:57:16] <ssi> that's my riser block
[04:57:47] <ssi> http://p.twimg.com/AfZIXOjCQAMGxJd.jpg
[04:57:49] <jdhNC> 1" steel?
[04:57:59] <ssi> 2" I think
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[04:58:08] <ssi> 4x4 square bar, 2" thick
[04:58:13] <ssi> http://p.twimg.com/AfZIaN-CEAEVtQJ.jpg
[04:58:15] <jdhNC> looks good
[04:58:20] <ssi> that's how I fix the height issue :)
[04:58:32] <jdhNC> what are the cutouts for?
[04:58:33] <ssi> I need to make a handful more of those
[04:58:55] <ssi> at max +X travel, the riser bumps up against the stepper mount
[04:59:02] <ssi> and the cutouts are for the SHCS heads
[04:59:05] <ssi> that bolt the stepper on
[04:59:17] <jdhNC> nifty
[04:59:47] <jdhNC> my 9x20 cross slide is pretty flimsy, just two bolts holding it on
[05:01:12] <ssi> http://p.twimg.com/AfZJRt-CQAADEk7.jpg
[05:01:15] <ssi> my x stepper mount
[05:01:42] <jdhNC> is that a solid chunk of Al or hollow?
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[05:02:03] <ssi> http://p.twimg.com/AfZJi78CIAA8miw.jpg
[05:02:04] <ssi> Z
[05:02:12] <ssi> it's milled from solid
[05:02:18] <A2Sheds> Parker won't sell me a $50 integral encoder/hall sensor for an AC servo, they will only sell the complete $1k servo motor (size 23 140oz/in)
[05:02:20] <ssi> but it's hollowed out where the couplers are
[05:02:45] <jdhNC> mine won't look that neat, if I ever get around to it
[05:02:47] <A2Sheds> anyone know who sells parts for Parker servos?
[05:03:23] <jdhNC> CimTec
[05:03:24] <ssi> I basically just made copies of the stock bearing blocks, that happened to have stepper flanges attached
[05:03:33] <jdhNC> and any of 100s parker dealers
[05:04:13] <A2Sheds> the dealers don't carry the parts
[05:04:21] <A2Sheds> only complete motors
[05:04:42] <jdhNC> oh, I've never ordered anything but complete motors.
[05:05:07] <jdhNC> I got a set of replacement cables for a Fanuc servo, $600
[05:05:20] <A2Sheds> sounds about right
[05:05:33] <jdhNC> is it a generic part? I have dead motors at work
[05:05:37] <A2Sheds> it's like they sell parts at an airport
[05:06:07] <ssi> economies of scale are a bitch when you're the small end of the scale :D
[05:06:10] <A2Sheds> along with $5 sodas
[05:06:38] <jdhNC> the fanuc cable failed because there wasn't enough cable in the connector to allow any flex
[05:07:45] <ssi> I need to draw up some bearing blocks for my G0704
[05:07:55] <ssi> having trouble with the motivation
[05:08:03] <jdhNC> draw them up, make two sets, send me one
[05:08:06] <ssi> :D
[05:08:23] <jdhNC> or pay $35 for Hoss's DVD with drawings
[05:08:33] <ssi> I've already paid for hoss's drawings
[05:08:42] <ssi> sadly they're not as helpful as I might like
[05:09:19] <jdhNC> http://www.ebay.com/itm/280778984342
[05:09:22] <jdhNC> those look better
[05:09:47] <ssi> spendy
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[05:10:18] <jdhNC> I guess
[05:10:37] <jdhNC> I imagine that by the time I get done with mine, buying those would have been cheaper
[05:11:04] <ssi> is he making those out of solid barstock?
[05:11:11] <ssi> cause that's a lot of damn swarf if so
[05:11:23] <jdhNC> no clue
[05:11:38] <jdhNC> looks like 3-piece mounts
[05:12:35] <Eartaker> is it better to so with high or low spindle speeds when using a cutoff tool on steel?
[05:12:48] <ssi> Eartaker: parting blade?
[05:12:57] <Eartaker> im getting alot of chatter at 210rpm
[05:12:59] <Eartaker> ssi yeah
[05:13:13] <ssi> low speed I'm pretty sure
[05:13:20] <Eartaker> hmm
[05:13:27] <danimal_laptop> the stepper motor is not incloded!
[05:14:37] <ssi> http://www.ebay.com/itm/280733878041?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1558.l2649#ht_601wt_1413
[05:14:51] <ssi> he definitely makes nice stuff
[05:15:04] <ssi> but if I had that kind of money I wouldn't have bought a 704 ;)
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[05:16:24] <danimal_laptop> i dont know why he sandblasts them like that. looks like crap
[05:16:37] <ssi> I also have one of the D71C 1hp 3 phase motors from surpluscenter.com that I want to put on the mill
[05:16:58] <ssi> but I figure motion is probably the priority :P
[05:18:22] <danimal_laptop> you make airplane parts with that little mill?
[05:18:42] <ssi> I don't make anything with it yet... it's never cut a chip
[05:18:49] <danimal_laptop> ah
[05:19:00] <ssi> I have a 9x42 manual
[05:19:15] <danimal_laptop> b-port? or clone?
[05:19:17] <ssi> clone
[05:19:19] <ssi> enco I think
[05:19:21] <ssi> 80s vintage
[05:19:25] <danimal_laptop> ah
[05:19:30] <ssi> in very good shape though, it's treated me well...
[05:19:33] <ssi> have an anilam 411 on it
[05:19:37] <danimal_laptop> they work fine
[05:19:45] <danimal_laptop> control or dro?
[05:19:48] <ssi> dro
[05:19:54] <danimal_laptop> cool
[05:20:01] <ssi> I doubt I'll ever convert that mill... having a manual is too handy
[05:20:07] <danimal_laptop> yea
[05:20:22] <ssi> I built my 4x4' plasma table specifically to cut instrument panels
[05:20:34] <danimal_laptop> i have 2 cnc mills and a manual... i couldnt imagine getting rid of the manual
[05:20:39] <ssi> but I kinda hate the cut edge on aluminum
[05:21:13] <ssi> have a 13x36 clausing manual lathe that's worn slap out
[05:21:15] <ssi> and my g0602
[05:21:23] <ssi> which is converted and working nicely
[05:21:29] <ssi> and a reid 2c surface grinder
[05:21:40] <danimal_laptop> craftsman type lathe?
[05:21:51] <ssi> the clausing? it's a colchester type
[05:21:54] <ssi> clausing 6300
[05:22:12] <ssi> it's a 12x36, sry
[05:22:13] <danimal_laptop> ah. clausing made the benchtop lathes for craftsman for a while
[05:22:15] <ssi> http://www.lathes.co.uk/clausing/page2.html
[05:22:31] <danimal_laptop> yea, same thing
[05:22:33] <ssi> ok
[05:22:39] <danimal_laptop> i had one of those
[05:22:41] <ssi> mines probably 60s vintage
[05:22:49] <danimal_laptop> yea
[05:23:02] <ssi> spindle is in good shape but the ways are very very worn
[05:23:04] <danimal_laptop> atlas and clausing made them
[05:23:08] <ssi> I'd like to scrape it in... but it's daunting
[05:23:14] <danimal_laptop> not worth it
[05:23:19] <ssi> probably not
[05:23:28] <danimal_laptop> you can buy them cheap enough
[05:23:33] <ssi> I want to get a new manual lathe
[05:23:38] <ssi> something that I can use for gunsmithing work
[05:23:40] <danimal_laptop> me too
[05:23:43] <danimal_laptop> ah
[05:23:47] <danimal_laptop> hardinge
[05:23:55] <ssi> I don't think a hardinge would be ideal
[05:24:00] <danimal_laptop> no?
[05:24:08] <ssi> what's the spindle bore on them?
[05:24:11] <danimal_laptop> i met a gunsmith who used one for rifles
[05:24:20] <ssi> I need something that's at least 1-3/8
[05:24:24] <danimal_laptop> it was a sharp, but same difference
[05:24:36] <danimal_laptop> it's at least that i would imagine
[05:24:45] <danimal_laptop> a collet draw bar has to fit
[05:24:45] <ssi> hrm
[05:24:49] <ssi> true
[05:24:57] <ssi> other than that, I really like hardinges a lot
[05:25:00] <danimal_laptop> what are those, 1.5"? i can measure mine i guess
[05:25:11] <danimal_laptop> yea they are nice
[05:25:23] <danimal_laptop> i have an hnc running on emc2
[05:25:54] <danimal_laptop> i have an old 14x42 manual lathe, rockford machine tool co., about 100 years old
[05:26:13] <danimal_laptop> works ok, but im not a fan of the babbit bearings and overhead belt drive
[05:27:18] <danimal_laptop> i'd like a similar sized leblond or something
[05:27:19] <ssi> yeah
[05:27:37] <ssi> any clue how much something like an hnc can be had for?
[05:27:45] <danimal_laptop> cheap as hell
[05:27:53] <ssi> how cheap? :D
[05:27:55] <danimal_laptop> controls are junk
[05:28:02] <ssi> yea they go in the trash anyway
[05:28:07] <danimal_laptop> i got a creame puff for 1200
[05:28:18] <danimal_laptop> i've seen them on ebay for less
[05:28:31] <ssi> hrm
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[05:28:52] <danimal_laptop> the turret might be in the way for longer parts
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[05:29:02] <ssi> have your collet closer automated?
[05:29:14] <danimal_laptop> not so much for boring, but for od turning
[05:29:23] <danimal_laptop> yes but it's disconnected
[05:29:26] <danimal_laptop> i never use it
[05:30:00] <danimal_laptop> i dont even own collets lol
[05:30:12] <ssi> haha
[05:30:18] <ssi> I love collets
[05:30:24] <danimal_laptop> i use a fixture or chuck for my parts
[05:30:37] <danimal_laptop> i take that back, i have some 5c collets for the surface grinder
[05:30:39] <ssi> I made a MT4.5 to 5C sleeve for my clausing's spindle nose
[05:30:43] <ssi> and a homemade drawbar
[05:30:57] <ssi> and I have a CDCO 5C chuck for the 602
[05:31:31] <danimal_laptop> nice
[05:32:30] <ssi> god yes that's exactly what I nee
[05:32:34] <ssi> hnc
[05:32:43] <danimal_laptop> they're pretty nice
[05:32:49] <danimal_laptop> already has servos
[05:32:54] <danimal_laptop> and usable drives
[05:33:00] <danimal_laptop> and a toolchanger
[05:33:26] <danimal_laptop> only drawback is it has resolvers
[05:33:32] <danimal_laptop> not a big deal though
[05:33:51] <danimal_laptop> 200ipm rapids
[05:33:57] <ssi> can they be swapped for encoders?
[05:34:13] <danimal_laptop> not too fast, but good acceleration
[05:34:16] <danimal_laptop> eh
[05:34:27] <danimal_laptop> it would be more of a hassle than its worth
[05:34:28] <ssi> 200ipm is plenty
[05:34:33] <ssi> I do 180 on the g0602
[05:34:46] <danimal_laptop> yea for as small as it is, 200 is fine
[05:34:47] <ssi> what are the travels on the hnc?
[05:34:51] <ssi> yea that's what I was thinking
[05:34:55] <danimal_laptop> i dont remember
[05:35:01] <danimal_laptop> 8x12?
[05:35:05] <ssi> can do 600ipm on my plasma table, but 50" is a lot more ground to cover
[05:35:39] <danimal_laptop> i dont recall the swing
[05:35:50] <danimal_laptop> same as a manual hardinge i would imagine
[05:37:22] <danimal_laptop> i few of us have them
[05:37:29] <danimal_laptop> good little machines
[05:37:59] <ssi> yeah... I need to keep my eyes open for one
[05:40:05] <ssi> not so much for gunsmithing, but for small parts production, I think it'd be ideal
[05:40:29] <danimal_laptop> thats what they're made for
[05:40:38] <ssi> yeah
[05:40:54] <danimal_laptop> they even have barfeeder options and an automatic part chute
[05:41:17] <danimal_laptop> and a 3rd axis part off tool
[05:41:23] <ssi> yeah
[05:41:33] <ssi> on the backside, right?
[05:41:44] <danimal_laptop> on top
[05:41:49] <ssi> ah k
[05:42:02] <ssi> know anything about the AHC?
[05:42:17] <danimal_laptop> no
[05:43:26] <ssi> hrm, there's a CHNC in north carolina for $2750
[05:43:57] <danimal_laptop> those are eveb better
[05:44:03] <danimal_laptop> even
[05:44:04] <Eartaker> got my part cut... drooped to 120 rpm
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[05:45:12] <danimal_laptop> nice
[05:45:57] <ssi> chnc is 1-3/4" bar capacity, 14" swing
[05:45:59] <ssi> that'd be awesome
[05:46:32] <danimal_laptop> the workpiece can't go past the turret, just so you know
[05:46:41] <ssi> yeah I understand
[05:46:46] <danimal_laptop> ok
[05:46:50] <danimal_laptop> just making sure
[05:46:54] <danimal_laptop> its annoying at times
[05:47:04] <ssi> even for gunsmithing that's ok, because you'd typically want a rifle barrel through the headstock
[05:47:08] <ssi> that's why you want the bore
[05:47:10] <danimal_laptop> right
[05:47:30] <ssi> do you have an idea of what the length of the spindle is?
[05:47:37] <ssi> ie how long a bar has to be to come out the back side?
[05:47:44] <ssi> on your machine, I mean
[05:47:55] <danimal_laptop> i can measure when im done eating
[05:48:15] <danimal_laptop> same as a manual hardinge i would imagine, the iron is about the same
[05:48:25] <danimal_laptop> maybe 18"?
[05:48:56] <ssi> sounds about right
[05:49:48] <ssi> you running the stock servos that came on it?
[05:49:54] <danimal_laptop> yea
[05:49:58] <ssi> mesa gear?
[05:50:07] <danimal_laptop> brushed dc
[05:50:16] <toastydeath> uh
[05:50:19] <toastydeath> chnc
[05:50:23] <danimal_laptop> yes, pico resolver converters though
[05:50:24] <toastydeath> don't believe the 14" swing
[05:50:31] <ssi> haha ok
[05:50:46] <toastydeath> in reality that entire family of lathes has a hard time working on anything longer than two inches and wider than three
[05:50:52] <danimal_laptop> the swing on the hnc is the same as the chnc
[05:51:12] <ssi> because of the turret?
[05:51:16] <danimal_laptop> i turn 8" diameter stuff everyday
[05:51:19] <toastydeath> yes, and the machine is not rigid
[05:51:26] <danimal_laptop> bs
[05:51:39] <danimal_laptop> its pretty rigid
[05:51:48] <toastydeath> sorry, I've used a shitload of those machines and they're one of the flimsiest machines in that form factor
[05:52:11] <danimal_laptop> i cut 8" 6-4 ti on a regular basis
[05:52:25] <danimal_laptop> including trepanning at that diameter
[05:52:39] <toastydeath> sure, and people cut Ti and SS and all sorts of other shit on grizzly 8x12s
[05:52:55] <toastydeath> that something can be done doesn't mean the machine is good at it
[05:53:35] <danimal_laptop> we'll have to agree to disagree, mine works fine. my only issue is spindle belt slippage
[05:53:49] <toastydeath> i didn't say it doesn't work fine or that it isn't a good machine
[05:53:49] <danimal_laptop> im about to put on a cogged belt
[05:54:40] <toastydeath> what i am cautioning about is be aware that the machine has unusual limitations and requires a bit more planning and forethought as a result
[05:55:06] <danimal_laptop> it's not a mori seiki sl6, but i don't really see any issues with it, i've been more suprised by what it can do rather than what it cant
[05:55:48] <danimal_laptop> but mine's not some clapped out POS either, it was barely used
[05:55:50] <ssi> I can see what you mean though
[05:55:56] <ssi> 4.5" x travel
[05:56:05] <danimal_laptop> more than that
[05:56:14] <danimal_laptop> 8" i think
[05:56:18] <ssi> that's what this video I'm looking at is claiming
[05:56:24] <ssi> http://www.wismet.com/buy/detail.cfm?inventoryid=8535
[05:56:40] <danimal_laptop> maybe, i'll have to look. maybe im thinking diameter
[05:57:01] <ssi> yea 4.5" x travel would get you max diameter of 9"
[05:57:09] <ssi> and it claims to be able to turn 8" max
[05:58:11] <ssi> none of this is a dealbreaker :)
[05:58:15] <danimal_laptop> i have 5" x travel
[05:59:13] <danimal_laptop> and the distance is about 18-22 inches for the spindle, depending on if you take of the mount for the collet drawbar
[05:59:22] <danimal_laptop> i just measured
[05:59:39] <ssi> gotcha, thanks
[05:59:45] <danimal_laptop> the chnc is a bit faster
[05:59:51] <danimal_laptop> maybe 600-700ipm rapids
[05:59:55] <danimal_laptop> servo spindle
[06:00:01] <ssi> how hard was it to get toolholders for the turret?
[06:00:07] <ssi> or expensive, rather
[06:00:17] <danimal_laptop> easy, they came with the lathe lol
[06:00:37] <toastydeath> they're very common toolholders
[06:00:38] <danimal_laptop> i think they're easy enough to get, i've seen them fairly cheap on ebay
[06:00:44] <toastydeath> and they're really easy to make, too
[06:00:45] <ssi> http://www.flywheelmachinetools.com/TOOLHOLDINGHARDINGE.html
[06:02:45] <ssi> oh well, I'm off to bed
[06:02:59] <ssi> I should probably finish the conversions I already started before I spend money on new machines to convert :D
[06:03:35] <danimal_laptop> lol
[06:03:44] <ssi> actually one more question before I sleep
[06:03:52] <ssi> you use any sort of cam for your lathe?
[06:04:42] <ssi> I haven't found any cam that was worth a crap, been hand-coding everything
[06:04:59] <ssi> JT set me up with the ngcgui stuff, and I wrote some subs and use it conversationally a lot
[06:09:52] <toastydeath> the only cam worth a damn at the moment is commercial
[06:09:56] <toastydeath> and you know where/how to find that
[06:10:11] <ssi> that's what I figured
[06:10:32] <ssi> and the commercial stuff that I was able to try was obtuse
[06:10:36] <ssi> mill cam seems much more polished overall
[06:11:05] <toastydeath> lathe cam isn't popular because most lathe controls have turning cycles that remove 90% of the work of coding it by hand
[06:11:12] <ssi> right
[06:11:17] <ssi> and emc is missing the important one
[06:11:19] <ssi> G70/71 :(
[06:11:35] <toastydeath> I saw some modern controls recently that blow even that out of the water
[06:11:49] <toastydeath> and mill controls are catching up, it's pretty neat
[06:12:29] <ssi> I finally have threading figured out
[06:13:01] <ssi> I had to learn more about the unified standard than any man should ever have to before it finally all clicked
[06:13:27] <toastydeath> hahaha
[06:13:39] <ssi> what I ended up doing was writing an iphone app thread calculator
[06:13:53] <ssi> and in order to make that work, I had to get scary deep into ASME B1.1
[06:13:55] <toastydeath> the secret to a perfect thread, fyi, is to leave .001 on the diameter
[06:14:11] <toastydeath> turn to .001 over, thread, turn off that .001, and then make one final skim pass with no depth increase
[06:14:25] <ssi> hrm
[06:14:59] <toastydeath> it gets rid of all tearing and burrs
[06:15:05] <toastydeath> leaving a silky smooth finish
[06:15:12] <toastydeath> with no sanding or other polishing to be done
[06:15:20] <ssi> the final skim pass you mean a final threading pass?
[06:15:29] <toastydeath> yes
[06:15:49] <ssi> and do you change tools to cut off that last .001, or do you use the threading tool with a slow feed?
[06:16:35] <toastydeath> nope, you just re-run the threading cycle verbatim at full depth
[06:16:39] <toastydeath> don't change anything
[06:16:45] <toastydeath> except one pass, full depth
[06:17:02] <Jymmm> he probably spits on it to bring up the depth
[06:17:29] <ssi> how's that different from using an H term to cut spring passes?
[06:17:56] <toastydeath> you have to re-call the threading cycle because you had to call your finish turning tool, take off that last .001 from the diameter, and then re-call the threading cycle
[06:18:04] <toastydeath> you don't want spring passes, you only want one pass
[06:19:01] <ssi> do you use the exact same cycle, so you get all the passes where it's cutting air, or do you have a way to program a different line that just makes the single full depth pass?
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[06:19:26] <toastydeath> no, you just tell it take whatever the full depth is per pass
[06:19:34] <ssi> in the I word?
[06:19:35] <toastydeath> rather than .050 or whatever
[06:19:42] <toastydeath> I'm not sure what emc uses?
[06:20:28] <ssi> well like, if I want to cut a 5/8-24 thread, i move to X .630, and I call the cycle with I .005, telling it that my driveline is .630 but I want it to start cutting at .625
[06:20:43] <toastydeath> if I is your infeed per pass
[06:20:51] <ssi> J is infeed per pass I think
[06:20:52] <toastydeath> then you want to make your infeed the full thread depth
[06:20:58] <ssi> ah ok, gotcha
[06:22:04] <ssi> J A positive value specifying the "initial cut depth". The first threading cut will be J beyond the "thread peak" position.
[06:22:10] <ssi> K A positive value specifying the "full thread depth". The final threading cut will be K beyond the "thread peak" position.
[06:22:16] <ssi> so basically J = K is what you're saying
[06:22:33] <toastydeath> yes
[06:22:42] <ssi> I'll give it a shot
[06:23:12] <ssi> anyway, the other bit of magic that I learned from studying the spec is that if you mic your thread with wires and your PD is out of tolerance on the large side
[06:23:18] <ssi> infeed / 4 = change in PD
[06:24:45] <ssi> I was able to cut threads that are almost exactly on the high side of class 3A tolerance
[06:24:51] <ssi> for minimum clearance threads for mounting suppressors
[06:24:53] <ssi> worked out pretty well
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[10:27:37] <Loetmichel> re @ work
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[11:55:30] <mrsun> abandon all hope he who enters here?
[11:55:34] <mrsun> or how is it? :P
[11:56:53] <Jymmm> Abandon hope all ye who enter here
[11:58:08] <Jymmm> All hope abandon ye who enter here
[11:58:58] <toastydeath> the first one
[11:59:11] <toastydeath> it's from the divine comedy
[11:59:20] <Jymmm> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inferno_%28Dante%29
[11:59:29] <toastydeath> *the first of Jymmm
[11:59:30] <toastydeath> 's
[11:59:37] <toastydeath> I hated the divine comedy
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[12:00:04] <Jymmm> http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/abandon-hope-all-ye-who-enter-here.html
[12:02:19] <mrsun> ye ... =)
[12:02:30] <mrsun> yeye =)
[12:02:56] <mrsun> gonna put that on the top of my machineroom door i think :P
[12:03:32] <mrsun> maybe put in an hour or two of scraping today so i might be able to assemble the mill today =)
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[14:45:13] <ssi> too much morning :(
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[14:58:23] <IchGucksLive> hi all
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[15:07:11] <IchGucksLive> cradek: ? on git
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[15:13:02] <skunkworks> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_37KlPpGCE
[15:13:32] <IchGucksLive> B)
[15:15:18] <cradek> less impressive: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6CZgMAhFnI
[15:15:25] <IchGucksLive> someone shoudt fix al this kernel.org links in the WIKI.linux...
[15:16:16] <IchGucksLive> cradek: on git ? can you help
[15:16:42] <cradek> just ask your question and someone will help if they can. it might or might not be me.
[15:16:45] <IchGucksLive> 7.1 "git checkout $(git merge-base origin/v2.4_branch origin/master) done
[15:17:11] <IchGucksLive> "git checkout -b descriptive-bugfix-branch-name not to be done cause no fix
[15:17:32] <IchGucksLive> "edit/compile/test/commit <- what is this to do
[15:17:53] <cradek> are you making a bugfix for 2.4?
[15:17:59] <IchGucksLive> no
[15:18:11] <IchGucksLive> xyuv plane view
[15:18:31] <cradek> a new feature should be based on master
[15:18:56] <IchGucksLive> i did all the stuff and made it to the 7.1 step
[15:19:21] <IchGucksLive> next to be " git checkout master
[15:20:22] <IchGucksLive> You are in 'detached HEAD' state
[15:21:24] <jthornton> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wI7uj-6KgyE
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[15:29:34] <IchGucksLive> jthornton: i postet this to the devels list 5min ago
[15:30:10] <jthornton> that's were I got the link :)
[15:30:35] <jthornton> pretty neat way to get bitmap to vector to g code
[15:30:43] <jthornton> I can use that for my plasma
[15:31:12] <IchGucksLive> i go insted of pycam to heekscad gives me better gcode
[15:33:14] <IchGucksLive> ok by till 19:00 Paris time !
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[15:59:22] <JT-Shop> anyone have a favorite print to pdf that you use with windoze?
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[16:07:14] <jdhNC> pdfforge?
[16:07:17] <jdhNC> something like that
[16:07:44] <JT-Shop> found it, thanks
[16:08:00] <jdhNC> watch the questions on the install
[16:08:56] <JT-Shop> lol, ok
[16:09:07] <A2Sheds> "Would you like the Malware taskbar installed on your browser?"
[16:09:21] <danimal_laptop> ha
[16:09:22] <JT-Shop> yea, I hate that crap
[16:11:05] <syyl> and also read the question carefull ;)
[16:11:13] <syyl> "no, i want that crap to be installed"
[16:12:13] <danimal_laptop> JT-Shop: did you get the pics?
[16:13:38] <JT-Shop> yep, finally got connected this morning
[16:13:48] <JT-Shop> looks kinda rough?
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[16:22:08] <Loetmichel> re @ home
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[16:40:50] <danimal_laptop> JT-Shop: yea, a little
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[17:07:48] <mrsun> ough, scraping hurts my back :(
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[17:10:10] <jdhNC> you need a hand
[17:10:59] * danimal_laptop claps
[17:11:40] <mrsun> hehe =)
[17:11:58] <mrsun> getting tired of this table, one side has developed niceley, the other has not ... its still looks like when i started :P
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[17:14:45] <danimal_laptop> maybe because you're not ambidextrious
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[17:15:04] <danimal_laptop> find someone who writes with the opposite hand to do the other side
[17:20:14] <jdhNC> me either
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[17:21:40] <danimal_laptop> i assume most of us are lefties
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[17:22:24] <jdhNC> I saw a lefty once, looked awkward
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[17:27:55] <danimal_laptop> we're usually smarter
[17:28:08] <danimal_laptop> although im not quite sure what happened to me
[17:28:25] <jdhNC> I guess that makes up for the smaller manhood.
[17:29:30] <danimal_laptop> leave Jymmm out of this
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[18:06:02] <IG-garage> Hey! It's about me in on-line magazine! www.motocafe.ru
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[18:28:50] <danimal_laptop> sweet, i got a bunch of SSr's and a timer relay on ebay for the new mill.
[18:29:13] <danimal_laptop> i think i got mostly everything i need now, aside from some wire which i can get locally
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[18:54:00] <ssi> I bought a big batch of (rather pricey) SSRs awhile back
[18:54:12] <ssi> I was originally going to do my spindle control with SSRs, and then I broke down and bought a VFD instead
[18:54:25] <ssi> funny thing is the SSRs cost me almost as much as the damn VFD
[18:54:39] <Danimal_garage> lol
[18:54:47] <Danimal_garage> yea vfd's are cheap
[18:55:03] <ssi> yeah, and awesome :D
[18:55:05] <Danimal_garage> i got a nice mitsubishi 5hp for like $75
[18:55:57] <Danimal_garage> i got 10 Omega SSR's for $7 each
[18:56:06] <Danimal_garage> not too bad
[18:56:14] <Danimal_garage> new
[18:56:27] <ssi> what are you doing with them?
[18:56:47] <Danimal_garage> i need a bunch for the toolchanger
[18:56:52] <ssi> gotcha
[18:57:11] <Danimal_garage> and for turning on and off the main power, coolant pump, etc
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[18:57:19] <Danimal_garage> plus a couple spares
[19:12:45] <tom3p> has anyone successfully used dual riser cards in the dm150? http://www.logicsupply.com/categories/accessories/pci_riser_cards
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[19:21:38] <danimal_laptop> interesting. wonder if it'll work
[19:31:21] <JT-Shop> well hell I finally got file sharing to work between my ubuntu computers and my winblows computer
[19:32:29] <mikeggg> webmin is helpful if you're using samba - I think..
[19:32:57] <JT-Shop> I had to do sudo smbpasswd -a myusername
[19:34:03] <Danimal_garage> JT-Shop: mine just worked out of the box
[19:34:20] <Danimal_garage> but i guess i can only access shared folders
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[19:37:18] <JT-Shop> winblows kept bugging me for a password to see files on "some" of my Ubuntu installs
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[19:42:18] <Loetmichel> JT-Shop: that is a effect i know the other way round: if the Win-user which has shared the directorys has no PW then you cant see the files from Linux
[19:42:54] <Danimal_garage> i use windows 7, maybe that helps
[19:45:12] <JT-Shop> I'm on win 7
[19:53:24] <Danimal_garage> finally got the old enclosure cleaned up and painted on the mill, it was almost not worth it.
[19:53:40] <Danimal_garage> but its done
[20:05:02] <skunkworks> did you hear that our spindle encoder sort of fell apart? The shaft through the double race bearing got loose. We think it was glued in and could not handle it. (it supposidly could take 80lbs of side force)
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[20:06:42] <Danimal_garage> glue wasnt so hot back then, huh
[20:07:02] <skunkworks> it wasn't that old... maybe 4 years (repurposed ;))
[20:08:11] <tom3p> my sable 2015 has a brushed ac motor for spindle. how might i control the speed? (25000rpm)
[20:08:35] <Danimal_garage> ah, i thought you meant it was original stuff from the machine
[20:09:06] <Danimal_garage> whats the difference between brushed ac and brushed dc?
[20:09:14] <Danimal_garage> as far as the motor goes
[20:09:25] <Danimal_garage> cant it run on dc?
[20:10:04] <Danimal_garage> probably a stupid question but im curious
[20:10:15] <tom3p> on the 'universal motor' there is no diff and you can use ac or dc. but i'm not sure mine is a universal, trying to find out how to identify
[20:10:34] <Danimal_garage> a servo amp would probably work
[20:11:09] <Danimal_garage> i have one that will do both ac and dc
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[20:21:40] <Loetmichel> tom3p: universal motors have brushes and a rotor and stator wining connected in series
[20:22:49] <tom3p> Loetmichel, thans, now i can check with ohmmeter !
[20:23:17] <tom3p> i think i can push pwm into this box ( where the pot is ) http://manuals.harborfreight.com/manuals/43000-43999/43060.PDF
[20:26:42] <Loetmichel> tom3p: one caveat: universal motors designed to run with 110V ac woll run with dc. but usually onla up to 80V dc because on dc the inductane of the windings does not limit the current
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[20:29:11] <tom3p> "In fact, it will run quite happily on DC. However, unlike a permanent magnet motor, a universal motor will always turn in the same direction, regardless of which way round it’s connected to the DC source. Knowing this simple fact can sometimes enable you to win bets involving small amounts of money."
[20:29:27] <Loetmichel> hihi
[20:30:34] <mrsun> gah i nees shims for the lathe and cant find any of those like a fork :/ (want it preferably in sweden as that goes fastest :P )
[20:30:44] <Loetmichel> yes, right. to change the direction of a universal motor you have to change ONE of the windings in direction
[20:31:22] <Loetmichel> no both
[20:32:07] <danimal_laptop> i have an electric impact gun on my cnc mill for the power drawbar, and it runs on both ac and dc. switching the dc reverses it
[20:33:13] <A2Sheds> whoohoo getting sub-micron accuracy on this stage now
[20:36:27] <alex4nder> gah
[20:37:39] <alex4nder> my Z axis stepper motor's ears cracked
[20:38:00] <A2Sheds> danimal_laptop: permanent installation or ?
[20:38:20] <danimal_laptop> thats how they come from the factory
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[20:38:40] <danimal_laptop> almost all knee mills with a power drawbar use one, or a pneumatic one
[20:38:58] <A2Sheds> I use a pneumatic one on my Bridgeport
[20:39:38] <danimal_laptop> i have 2 machines with electric ones
[20:39:49] <tom3p> A2Sheds, whats the feedback? is the stage peizo?
[20:42:31] <A2Sheds> tom3p: @25 deg C, over 10 minutes, linear motors, measured with a laser.... probably ~3-5 microns over time
[20:43:54] <danimal_laptop> what are you making?
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[20:44:44] <A2Sheds> industrial flatbed printer for printing circuits with conductive inks and semiconductor polymers
[20:45:21] <tom3p> linear, cool, laser interferometer too, you got a heck of a workshop ( temp control too )
[20:46:31] <A2Sheds> I'd like to have every machine run with EMC
[20:47:25] <A2Sheds> I'll have to write a printer scan to G-code converter
[20:47:36] <tom3p> Loetmichel, could you peek at figure 9.5.4 , is that what i want to check for with the meter? http://www.howeverythingworks.org/supplements/electric_motors.pdf
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[20:59:47] <Loetmichel> exactly
[21:01:38] <Loetmichel> hmmm... there is no dc motors and no ac ascynchronus in that PDF, but great stuff, very clear for beginners. is that a school book?
[21:03:43] <tom3p> Loetmichel, yes, i think so ( a course book on line ) and thanks for the help.
[21:03:51] <Loetmichel> np
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[21:05:06] <tom3p> simpler ( suits me :) http://imagebin.org/186246
[21:05:17] <Loetmichel> hmm, i still have pressure on my teeth. i hop the dentist is right saying that will be gone by tomorrow. expensive enough for a few grams gold and some work was it, though...
[21:05:46] <Loetmichel> 700++ eur for this: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=12476
[21:06:12] <Loetmichel> (inserted and glued in this morning)
[21:06:46] <mrsun> would a cogged V belt be better then a standard V belt at taking turns around pulleys?
[21:07:26] <Loetmichel> mrsun: by cogged you meand wir "teeth" on the inside?
[21:07:37] <mrsun> yeah
[21:07:46] <Loetmichel> yes, they tend to have a smaller minimal radius to go round
[21:07:49] <mrsun> not those toothed belt but like a V belt with teeth on :P
[21:08:17] <Loetmichel> not necessarily easier but longer living with small diameters
[21:08:35] <Loetmichel> i know
[21:09:35] <tom3p> Loetmichel, i'm having same done now at uni chicago, and the pressure usually disappears in a few days. but it looks like you've also lots of experience
[21:10:06] <tom3p> i've pulled crowns off by myself whenit got bad ( in taiwan, many miles from home )
[21:10:49] <tom3p> haha tooth talk time
[21:11:15] <Loetmichel> tom3p: there is nothing to go bad
[21:11:28] <Loetmichel> the teeth below the crown are dead to the root
[21:12:02] <Loetmichel> and yes, its ONE crown
[21:12:14] <tom3p> hehe and loads of root canals too, but you can still have pain from sinus and other things
[21:12:16] <Loetmichel> the dentist called it "blocked crowb"
[21:12:25] <Loetmichel> crown
[21:12:46] <tom3p> well best of luck & thanks
[21:13:16] <Loetmichel> tom3p: thx
[21:13:50] <Loetmichel> ... one thing i cant get over: 700 eur for such a little part...
[21:14:09] <tom3p> i bought one of the flexi dual pci risers will report its success
[21:14:10] <Loetmichel> ... and the medical insurance covers about 230 eur of it :-(
[21:16:03] <tom3p> Loetmichel, got a local uni with dentistry dept? ( i was considering trip to Thailand after 32000$ estimate by local 'dentist' maxilmumblemumble specialist )
[21:16:46] <tom3p> ok, off to HGR for simple router speed controller
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[21:17:23] <Loetmichel> tom3p: i have payed my part already... 2 more sessions for minor repairs and then agail 15 years of no dentist... (i hope so) ;-)
[21:17:29] <Loetmichel> again
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[21:18:53] <Loetmichel> the dentist was amazed how few problems are there as i told him that that was my first visit to a dent. in 15 years.
[21:19:01] <Loetmichel> i must be a lucky guy ;-)
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[22:17:16] <Nick001-Shop> Got some dumb questions about enc - how do I backup the entire system to a D: and then remove C: and boot and operate from the backup drive?
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[22:27:47] <A2Sheds> Nick: do you want to move the installed system to another system?
[22:28:25] <A2Sheds> clone it and run it?
[22:29:11] <Nick001-Shop> no - just to have the system etc on another drive in case of a drive failure
[22:29:25] <Nick001-Shop> clone it and run it - right
[22:30:58] <A2Sheds> dd is the most reliable
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[22:31:44] <A2Sheds> dd will an exact bit for bit copy
[22:31:50] <A2Sheds> will make
[22:32:45] <A2Sheds> http://www.backuphowto.info/linux-backup-hard-disk-clone-dd
[22:34:32] <Nick001-Shop> will it work for different size drives - 120 gig HD and a clone on a 16 gig compact drive
[22:36:13] <Nick001-Shop> ok - found it - got some reading to do - thanks
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[22:38:42] <A2Sheds> be sure you enter the commands in correctly since you could clone the empty drive to the drive you want backed up :)
[22:39:08] <A2Sheds> making recovery very difficult
[22:39:51] <Nick001-Shop> the hard disk clone looks like it's what I want
[22:47:05] <Danimal_garage> i HATE 6-32 taps, why do they even make them?
[22:47:20] <Danimal_garage> it's too course of a thread for that diameter
[22:47:58] <Nick001-Shop> they don't strip as easy in alum
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[23:00:54] <Nick001-Shop> Another EMC question - I have a test program on my lathe. How do I call it X # of times?
[23:05:04] -!- Calyp has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
[23:05:36] <JT-Shop> a loop
[23:06:19] <JT-Shop> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/html/gcode_main.html#r3_2
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[23:06:50] <JT-Shop> O103 repeat [5]
[23:07:24] <JT-Shop> will run 5 times the code between the beginning and the O103 endrepeat
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[23:18:09] <Nick001-Shop> Found it - thanks - have some head scratching with that one. After I go blind for awile hopefully I'll get it -)
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[23:37:38] <Nick001-Shop> Got it to work after I read down to 3.4 Thanks again
[23:37:53] <JT-Shop> np
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