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[06:32:33] <Loetmichel> re @ firma
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[06:47:50] <nicko> woohoo
[06:48:16] <nicko> got into a Masters of Engineering (by coursework) in mechatronics next year
[06:48:27] <nicko> should be done in 2 years
[06:48:37] <nicko> no more 4 years to a Bachelors ;)
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[08:00:46] <Valen> cool
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[10:30:13] <elmo40> very cool.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1p-nTYKPo_I
[10:30:30] <elmo40> first they scan then they machine, with the same machine.
[10:33:16] <elmo40> seems like the flood coolant doesn't even make it to the tip of the tool :P
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[10:34:22] <elmo40> seems like it is programmed for 4-axis, though. I don't see the C changing from its 90deg location.
[10:42:32] <RyanS> hmm what's the hardest, thickest material a DIY CNC laser cutter could successfully cut?
[10:43:20] <awallin> the laser and focusing lenses are not easy to DIY. depends totalyy on what power you have..
[10:44:41] <elmo40> its all about power ;)
[10:45:54] <RyanS> hmm I'm just thinking that it's easier to DIY the mechanics as compared to a milling machine because you're not dealing with rigity, and yo Steppers only really need to support the head of the laser??
[10:46:45] <RyanS> or the cost of the laser blows the budget anyway?
[10:47:14] <awallin> the common design for cheap CO2 cutters is that the laser is stationary and the beam directed around with mirrors
[10:47:43] <awallin> you are right that the mirrors and focusing optics are quite light, and the cutting forces are zero. compared to e,g. milling..
[10:48:22] <RyanS> really?? does that mean you get less power to the cutting surface with mirrors rather than direct beam out of the laser?
[10:48:38] <awallin> 100W co2 for $750
http://www.ebay.com/itm/2pcs-100W-co2-laser-tube-power-supply-water-cool-/120711310139
[10:48:52] <cncbasher> but any vibration felt at the mirrors and your beam goes all to hell and back
[10:48:56] <awallin> if the mirrors are any good they will reflect 97% or 99% or something
[10:49:38] <RyanS> $1,500 + 650 postage???
[10:50:05] <cncbasher> mine are adjusted with micrometers and you just need to breath on them and their off by a mile
[10:50:24] <awallin> that ad was for 2pcs, but if you search ebay for other co2 lasers it seems they are 500-700$ for a barebone 100W co2
[10:50:35] <awallin> now you won't cut 10mm steel with 100W I think...
[10:50:55] <RyanS> What do you think it could come from aluminium?
[10:51:04] <cncbasher> nope no chance 10mm 2kw min
[10:51:19] <awallin> cncbasher: yeah, laser optics needs slightly better mechanical parts than the MDF-routers... :)
[10:51:48] <cncbasher> yea and a good water cooler so that rules out mdf
[10:52:08] <awallin> $5k for something like this?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/laser-machine-laser-cutting-machine-CO2-1290-100w-/160648528817
[10:52:46] <cncbasher> good for 1/4 balsa or acrilic and thats about it
[10:53:46] <cncbasher> for 1mm steel you need at least 350w
[10:54:07] <cncbasher> 4mm steel around 550 - 600
[10:54:17] <RyanS> ok what what sort of power for hmm 2mm aluminium and other light alloy
[10:54:41] <cncbasher> brass or aluminium around 2Kw
[10:55:22] <RyanS> huh? more power for alloys?
[10:55:23] <cncbasher> my 1 kw laser just about acts as an engraver on Aluminium
[10:55:53] <cncbasher> need it up at around 2.2kw for 6mm Aluminium
[10:57:03] <cncbasher> non ferrous materials need huge amounts of power , due to the heat absorbtion
[10:57:18] <RyanS> copper?
[10:57:30] <cncbasher> i can cut 6mm steel all day with 600w
[10:57:54] <cncbasher> copper around 3Kw as an engraver and 6Kw to cut
[10:58:14] <RyanS> Because copper is a good heat conductor?
[10:58:16] <cncbasher> and use a spray on coating to
[10:58:27] <cncbasher> to stop the reflections
[10:58:34] <cncbasher> yes mostly
[10:59:25] <cncbasher> for plastics i can cut 1" thick perspex with 200w
[10:59:58] <RyanS> hmm that's interesting you need a more rigid and therefore more expensive mill for steel, but laser cutter is essentially directly opposite
[10:59:59] <cncbasher> 1/8" perspex with 100w
[11:00:39] <RyanS> As far as metal is concerned
[11:00:41] <cncbasher> needs to be very ridgid , any movement at all in the beam and the cut suffers
[11:01:23] <cncbasher> even just leaning on the laser cabinet for example can move the beam
[11:01:54] <RyanS> yeh but you don't have cutting forces
[11:02:15] <RyanS> Like with a mill
[11:02:25] <cncbasher> yes but you have vibration forces from the servos and frame etc
[11:02:59] <RyanS> true
[11:03:34] <cncbasher> for example with the z axis fully extended i can move the head enough with my hand to stop the beam cutting
[11:04:09] <RyanS> wow
[11:04:23] <RyanS> What if you stay right away from the thing?
[11:04:56] <cncbasher> ok thats an extreme example
[11:05:13] <cncbasher> but gives you an idea on the rigidity needed
[11:05:36] <cncbasher> it's not cutting forces you need to worry about
[11:05:43] <cncbasher> as their is none
[11:05:59] <RyanS> if I was under the impression that laser cutters are a cheaper option for hobby cutting metal than mill I would be really mistaken?
[11:06:01] <cncbasher> it's more natural movement
[11:06:37] <cncbasher> each season weather change i need to re adjust the beam and mirrors
[11:06:51] <RyanS> wow
[11:06:52] <cncbasher> to account for climate
[11:07:30] <cncbasher> ok it's not much admitted , but enough to give you a bad cut
[11:09:51] <cncbasher> 100w is good enough for engraving etc , or plywood / plastics
[11:10:21] <RyanS> is a 1kW laser crazy expensive?
[11:10:55] <cncbasher> my 3Kw was 186,000 pounds second hand
[11:11:23] <RyanS> ghaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaassssssssp
[11:11:52] <cncbasher> the first one i bought second hand and 20 year old , which is still going strong , i picked up for £35,000
[11:12:06] <cncbasher> which was a 600w
[11:12:41] <awallin> at some point you might need cooling for mirrors and focusing optics too?
[11:12:55] <RyanS> Is this for professional use?
[11:13:04] <cncbasher> yea got a water cooler feeding it
[11:13:32] <cncbasher> all the mirrors have a water cooling jacket on the rear
[11:14:16] <cncbasher> and nitrogen blowing across the front face
[11:14:27] <RyanS> I couldn't imagine it being for home use :)
[11:14:40] <cncbasher> haha yea you'd need a big home !
[11:15:02] <cncbasher> the 600w laser is in a 8 foot cabinet on it's own
[11:15:32] <RyanS> So not a multimillionaire with an expensive hobby? :P
[11:15:49] <RyanS> Do you run a laser cutting business?
[11:17:08] <RyanS> no wait your a James Bond villain, and no James Bond villain can do without his own high-power laser
[11:17:51] <cncbasher> we laser cut our own parts
[11:18:12] <cncbasher> but we'll cut for others if they ask
[11:20:15] <RyanS> ok....... actually how much would it cost me (although Im in Oz) to get 645 x 645mm stainless steel sheet laser cut, are we talking $50 (about 25pds) or $500
[11:20:40] <RyanS> 1.5mm
[11:20:50] <RyanS> thick
[11:21:11] <RyanS> A rough guess?
[11:21:13] <jthornton> cncbasher: do you charge by the inch + setup charge
[11:22:45] <RyanS> oh and does it depend on the size of the sheet or how many cuts the design involves ?
[11:23:24] <jthornton> it does for me when I cut with my plasma cutter
[11:23:30] <RyanS> bbl, let me know I'm curious..
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[11:37:04] <cncbasher> sry , had a phone call .. usualy costs are calculated by a setup charge and time
[11:37:43] <cncbasher> and if any special changes needed to be made etc
[11:38:06] <jthornton> so thicker takes longer and cost more I assume
[11:38:12] <cncbasher> yes
[11:39:59] <cncbasher> setup costs are sometimes absorbed if it's a production run
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[12:57:55] <cncbasher> RyanS:mostly based on running costs , down to cost per running minute of time
[12:58:10] <cncbasher> as costs of gas etc
[12:58:36] <RyanS> ah ha..
[12:59:04] <RyanS> What sort of gas, argon?
[12:59:21] <cncbasher> lens costs etc as they break down, consumables etc
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[12:59:50] <cncbasher> nitrogen, heilum , co2
[13:00:47] <cncbasher> be back in about an hour
[13:00:59] <RyanS> night
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[15:44:39] <Loetmichel> re @ home
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[17:53:44] <stillme> Can someone advice me on software i can use for CAM ?/
[17:54:05] <stillme> am using emc2 but i dont know what software to use generate g-codes
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[18:01:53] <syyl> gedit ;)
[18:02:52] <syyl> i rund sheetcam/qcad on my emc machine
[18:03:33] <stillme> is sheetcam linux app?
[18:04:18] <syyl> there is a linux version, but it doesnt work very well
[18:04:24] <syyl> i run the windows version in wine
[18:04:37] <syyl> without any problem
[18:04:39] <syyl> s
[18:05:08] <stillme> how much is sheetcam??
[18:05:28] <syyl> i paid ~150eur
[18:05:47] <syyl> http://www.sheetcam.com/register.shtml
[18:05:59] <stillme> i tried cambam the trial version and it switches off the spindle when i load it to emc2
[18:06:13] <syyl> thats bad ;)
[18:06:24] <stillme> but if i try to cut the EMC2 logo the spindle stays on and works
[18:06:32] <syyl> heekscnc is also free
[18:06:35] <syyl> and works a bit
[18:06:44] <syyl> has a few issues
[18:06:50] <stillme> yea it is bad am thinking of a replacement for cambam
[18:07:10] <stillme> heekscnc seems to be lacking developement
[18:07:20] <stillme> thats what i feel though i may be wrong
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[18:10:04] <stillme> it would have been nice to have a linux CAM just like emc2
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[18:15:20] <syyl> since i use emc i try to write most of my code by hand :D
[18:15:52] <stillme> really??
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[18:16:03] <stillme> write it by hand?? that sounds scary
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[18:16:35] <syyl> bot most of my parts are not very complicated
[18:17:26] <stillme> ok
[18:17:42] <stillme> am looking at using blender with a script
[18:17:59] <stillme> sounds like a good idea cause i can already use blender
[18:19:17] <syyl> i have to supress the urge to run and scream in panic when I see blender ;)
[18:19:31] <stillme> lol
[18:19:50] <stillme> just same here when i see actual g-code file
[18:19:58] <syyl> hrhr
[18:19:59] <stillme> thought of writing it makes my hairs stretch
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[21:47:06] <Mendelbilld> i calculated steps pr unit here, works fine in 1/2 step mode but for microstepping mode 1/16 numbers are way off. any ideas ? TB6560 3 axis board with nema 17. i should have about 2560 but i had to set it at 1277 to get it right.
[21:47:33] <Mendelbilld> same thing on all three axis
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[21:52:19] <JT-Shop> are you sure you calculated it correctly and that your actually micro-stepping @ 1/16?
[21:53:13] <Mendelbilld> the board was set to 1/16 and yes we calculated here several times
[21:53:19] <JT-Shop> 1/16 with 200 steps per rev is 3200 microsteps per rev
[21:53:46] <Mendelbilld> hmm ill check my notes here
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[21:54:46] <Mendelbilld> board is now set at 1/16 and 1277 microsteps its consistent "right" now
[21:55:28] <Mendelbilld> anything over 1277 causes it to move too far
[21:56:13] <Mendelbilld> its a direct drive system with 8mm 1,25 threads
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[21:57:22] <Mendelbilld> since it works on 1/2 with calculations i wonder if the stepper isnt capable of 1/16
[21:58:07] <JT-Shop> does it lock up?
[21:58:20] <andypugh> 200*16/1.25 = 2560. If the board is _actually_ doing 8x microstepping because one of the jumpers isn't working (or something) then you get 1280.
[21:58:34] <Mendelbilld> JT-Shop:runs very smoooth
[21:59:29] <JT-Shop> I think Andy is on top of it...
[21:59:35] <Mendelbilld> yeah sounds very right
[22:00:06] <Mendelbilld> so then if i set it now to 8x it should be correct as well
[22:00:13] <Mendelbilld> with the current settings
[22:00:20] <Mendelbilld> well almost
[22:00:22] <andypugh> Aye, should be
[22:00:22] <Mendelbilld> im 3 off
[22:00:30] <Mendelbilld> ;) ill try that tomorrow
[22:00:42] <Mendelbilld> sounds like a good thery
[22:00:50] <andypugh> Can you measure to 0.002mm?
[22:01:27] <Mendelbilld> andypugh: i doubt it ;)
[22:01:28] <andypugh> (by which I mean that 3 out of 1280 is a small margin to measure.
[22:01:37] <Mendelbilld> true
[22:01:45] <Mendelbilld> but this thing occurs on all axis
[22:01:48] <Mendelbilld> not just only one
[22:01:56] <Mendelbilld> its separate jumpers for all
[22:02:02] <Mendelbilld> or actually its switches
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[22:09:14] <andypugh> Well, the TB6560 does do 1/16 microstepping.
http://www.toshiba-components.com/motorcontrol/pdfs/TB6560AHQ_AFG_E_2003_20080407.pdf
[22:10:06] <Mendelbilld> yeah
[22:10:57] <andypugh> You should be able to tell with a multimeter if the switches are pulling up/down the correct pins in the correct way. Section 1 on Page 9
[22:11:42] <andypugh> For some reason they seem to call 1/8th 2W1-2-phase and 1/16th 4W1-2-phase
[22:12:17] <Mendelbilld> http://www.zappautomation.co.uk/pdf/steppermotors/SY42STH47-1684A.pdf this is the motors
[22:12:19] <Mendelbilld> omgh
[22:12:22] <Mendelbilld> says 1/2 step
[22:15:45] <Mendelbilld> andypugh:ill look into it thnx for advice
[22:16:33] <Mendelbilld> but if motor specs says 1/2 step does it mean it cannot do 1/16 ?
[22:17:04] <andypugh> No, it just means that that was what was used to create that curve.
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[22:17:45] <Mendelbilld> ah oki :)
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[22:18:32] <andypugh> I bought my steper drivers from Zapp after getting bored of fixing the TB6560 board.
[22:19:24] <andypugh> They seem particularly cheap for ballscrews too.
[22:19:51] <Mendelbilld> oh :D
[22:20:03] <Mendelbilld> yeah that board was cheap
[22:20:12] <Mendelbilld> 46 dollars or something including shipping
[22:20:45] <Mendelbilld> i have a zen toolworks kit
[22:20:55] <Mendelbilld> wanted to learn the basics
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[22:21:44] <Mendelbilld> got a multicam machine but i figured out id do the learning on a smaller thing
[22:30:25] <andypugh> They do go wrong less expensively.
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[22:57:21] <andypugh> Night all.
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