#emc | Logs for 2011-07-26

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[00:00:40] <L84Supper> so you can use it to toggle a laser or printhead on/off in real time without it effecting movement of it waiting for the next position or commnad
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[00:20:22] <danimal_garage> hmmm i want to measure the load on my power drawbar so it knows when to turn it off.
[00:20:23] <danimal_garage> in classicladder
[00:21:10] <danimal_garage> think that would be hard to do?
[00:23:16] <IG-garage> this would be geeky
[00:24:03] <IG-garage> How about to send one machine to a poor country, to me :)
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[02:50:13] <elmo40> is there another command similar to G70 or G71?
[02:51:12] <toastydeath> what is g70 and g71 in emc
[02:51:31] <toastydeath> either boring or drilling cycles?
[02:54:28] <elmo40> sorry, for lathe. they are canned cycles on a fanuc machine
[02:54:36] <elmo40> roughing and finishing.
[02:55:28] <elmo40> you give it a depth of cut, the X,Z locations and how much to leave for finish pass and it will auto figure out the number of passes.
[02:55:35] <elmo40> the the finish pass is one smooth cut
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[03:05:17] <toastydeath> g70, 71, 72, 74, 76
[03:05:20] <toastydeath> on fanuc
[03:05:20] <toastydeath> iirc
[03:05:59] <toastydeath> g70 finishing, g71 rough turning, g72 rough facing, g74 rough contouring, g76 custom threading
[03:06:06] <toastydeath> or was it custom drilling
[03:06:08] <toastydeath> i forget
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[03:08:56] <elmo40> somnething like that
[03:09:07] <elmo40> is there another canned cycle for g71?
[03:09:12] <elmo40> in emc or otherwise?
[03:09:46] <elmo40> I have a lathe at work, Fagor. Italian thing. it doesn't like G71. not much info on it otherwise.
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[03:14:20] <Tom_itx> http://books.google.co.nz/books?id=-2ev3yYwvq0C&pg=PA186&lpg=PA186&dq=g73+contouring+fanuc&source=bl&ots=LE-7tT2qD0&sig=b291-wZIBCQoKM4gQAKO--DLOm0&hl=en&ei=bl8aTePbE5S0sAPgw7ywAg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CBUQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q&f=false
[03:14:32] <Tom_itx> sorry for the length, i hope it pasted ok
[03:16:36] <Tom_itx> may have to scroll up a couple pages to the beginning of it
[03:17:50] <elmo40> ok. G73 is older
[03:17:54] <elmo40> will try that
[03:18:35] <toastydeath> elmo40, all those numbers i listed
[03:18:38] <Tom_itx> hmm, that looks rather informative really
[03:18:39] <toastydeath> should be in your fanuc manual
[03:19:02] <elmo40> who reads manuals :P
[03:19:10] <toastydeath> haha i read the fanuc manual cover to cover
[03:19:13] <toastydeath> several times
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[03:19:37] <toastydeath> the section on how it deals with cutter comp cornering was tremendously informative
[03:24:16] <Valen> how is rough turning different to regular turning in terms of a G code
[03:24:36] <toastydeath> you feed the cycle your finished profile
[03:24:46] <toastydeath> and position the cutter so that it is free of interference
[03:25:08] <toastydeath> the machine will then rough out, from that position of safety, the volume down to the finished part plus some allowance
[03:25:17] <elmo40> it is nice
[03:25:27] <elmo40> and you have total control over speed and feed
[03:25:29] <toastydeath> you then run g70, and it takes a final cut along the exact profile
[03:25:32] <elmo40> shape and everything
[03:25:42] <Tom_itx> you specify the depth of cut as part of the command?
[03:25:45] <elmo40> you can use same tool or diff tool. whatever.
[03:25:51] <elmo40> before hand
[03:25:59] <Valen> fairy nuff
[03:26:06] <toastydeath> yes tom
[03:26:19] <Valen> I'm just used to mill stuff spewing out assloads of G1's to do everything lol
[03:26:35] <toastydeath> fanuc's later controls also have milling canned cycles
[03:26:41] <elmo40> G71 U.25 (depending on controller) makes cuts .250" deep
[03:26:43] <Tom_itx> i've done more with mills than lathes but i did work on an okuma kadet for a while
[03:26:44] <toastydeath> which are so sexy i think i'd date them
[03:27:02] <toastydeath> they do the same thing the lathe cycles do but there's a ton of them
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[03:42:05] <Tom_itx> Jymmm,
[03:42:14] <Tom_itx> http://iteadstudio.com/store/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=19_20
[03:42:19] <Tom_itx> was the other board house
[03:43:06] <Jymmm> ty
[03:43:25] <Tom_itx> smaller sizes but cheaper
[03:45:18] <Jymmm> cool
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[06:39:38] <alex4nder> hey
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[07:25:24] <nicko> ello all
[07:25:38] <nicko> just after a couple of sanity check answers:
[07:26:10] <nicko> throw me some typical rapid IPM speeds
[07:26:33] <nicko> what speed to most people use as their default linear velocity ?
[07:26:42] <archivist> depends how big the machine is etc
[07:27:20] <nicko> something between a desktop and possibly bordering on a VMC
[07:27:35] <nicko> do you talk imperial or metric ?
[07:28:06] <nicko> say for a bridgeport style mill ...
[07:28:58] <archivist> someone with an old interact on steppers will have a different speed to a well sized servo machine
[07:29:36] <archivist> Im not sure there are any standard values
[07:31:14] <nicko> yup
[07:31:36] <nicko> for a well sized servo machine
[07:31:59] <nicko> there might not be any standard values - but EMC does actually ask you for one ;)
[07:32:26] <nicko> I'm trying to build a CNC mill with hardly any CNC experience myself
[07:32:37] <archivist> there is a page somewhere to help you work it out, mass acceleration etc
[07:33:00] <Loetmichel> mornin'
[07:33:05] <nicko> evening
[07:33:11] <archivist> also set a speed see how it performs, increase as far as you can with experience
[07:33:21] <nicko> yeh sure, thats the plan
[07:33:46] <nicko> I just thought I'd get it to within something... well, something not silly
[07:34:00] <nicko> I dont have *any* number
[07:34:31] <archivist> irrc the default files have a starting value
[07:34:37] <nicko> yeh
[07:35:12] <nicko> but they seem really slow
[07:35:25] <nicko> purposefully ?
[07:35:42] <archivist> probably to suit a stepper machine
[07:36:18] <nicko> or to stop over eager people from destroying their machines ?
[07:37:33] <nicko> I have 600W 3000RPM BLDC servos on 8mm ballscrews - running Mesa cards so speeds should be quite fun
[07:37:34] <Loetmichel> hihi, $me had some end stops flying around in the workshop....
[07:38:10] <nicko> got some 16mm pitch screws also !
[07:38:13] <archivist> excess speed can also cause whipping in the screws if long
[07:38:24] <nicko> but not for the chunk of steel that is the mill - no way
[07:38:50] <nicko> the screws have a length to dia ratio that seems sane to me
[07:39:11] <nicko> and are supported at both ends
[07:39:13] <Loetmichel> ... after miscalculating the travel of a big grinding machine... 1000mm travel with half a ton table on it in less than 1 second from left endt to right end +10mm...
[07:39:40] <Loetmichel> 3kw ac servos on 50mm ballscrew...
[07:39:42] <nicko> what happened there ?
[07:39:50] <nicko> oooh
[07:40:00] <nicko> servos plural ?
[07:40:36] <nicko> hang on - 50mm pitch or 50mm dia ?
[07:40:41] <Loetmichel> made "BONK", the two m8 8.8 screw were cut like made out of glass... and the stop block gon airborne
[07:41:00] <Loetmichel> 50mm dia, 20mm pitch
[07:41:04] <theorbtwo> Loetmichel: Keep your limbs away until the ride has come to a complete stop!
[07:41:09] <nicko> something to aspire to - 'what I broke' stories
[07:41:44] <nicko> 50mm pitch would be an interesting looking thing
[07:41:52] <Loetmichel> nicko: i simply miscalculated the travel by 10 or so mm
[07:42:15] <Loetmichel> and gave the machine the order to move from left to right... g0
[07:43:04] <nicko> worst I've done is drive a nice new carbide 16mm special something or other Dormer bit into a chunk of work waaaaay to fast feed for the RPM
[07:43:11] <nicko> 'croink' was the noise
[07:43:33] <nicko> 'vab vab vab'
[07:43:41] <nicko> 'wooo wooo wo woooo'
[07:43:43] <nicko> then
[07:43:45] <nicko> "shit"
[07:43:47] <Loetmichel> workshoplights wennt dark, half a second later very bright, one coud hear "uuuuUIIIiiiuuuuPOCK" and the stop block was flying around
[07:44:30] <Loetmichel> maximum speed of that axis: about 2000mm/s, ramps are about 50mm... ;-)
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[07:45:16] <Loetmichel> remember: with a 500kg round table on top
[07:45:28] <nicko> the other day I was standing by a machine - bit of work comes flying off the cutter and hits my goggles square in the middle of the lens then bounces off onto the ground - boss who it missed his right ear by 50mm didn't even see it
[07:45:58] <nicko> so if that bit that went flying hit you in the goggles youd be fine huh ?
[07:46:52] <nicko> protective eyewear:1 flying daggers:0
[07:46:59] * Loetmichel had cut the g0 speed to more reasonable 1000mm/s and made the ramps a little less steep ;-)
[07:48:25] <nicko> hey so throw me a typical rapid RPM for a fastish CNC machine - bridgeport size-ish
[07:48:35] <nicko> ands a default jog speed
[07:49:02] <nicko> I never look at the numbers...
[07:49:02] <Loetmichel> its also impressive if you seee a 3kw ac servo with about 40kg jumping from its pallet 30cm into thin air just because one has commandet it to accelerate and stop at maximum rate and do ONE turn ;-)
[07:49:29] <nicko> yup, chase the cats around the room with that trick
[07:49:45] <nicko> I can only muster a 2.2Kw Ac servo though
[07:49:51] <nicko> 40Kg ??
[07:50:14] * Loetmichel had slight shivers run down his neck for testing the used servos
[07:50:29] <Loetmichel> nicko: 3kw continous
[07:51:27] <Loetmichel> 190V 28A peak
[07:51:32] <nicko> realted question: why RP M ?
[07:51:37] <nicko> why per minute ?
[07:51:37] <Loetmichel> threee phase servo
[07:51:57] <nicko> a minute is something hard for a human to grasp
[07:52:02] <nicko> seconds aren't
[07:52:38] <nicko> so, in terms of torque - at a guess... 20~30nM ?
[07:52:47] <nicko> peak
[07:54:16] <nicko> what affect does the 'minimum linear velocity' in the .ini file have on anything ?
[07:55:11] <nicko> your machine wont go slower ... so if you need that speed to create a profile - what happens? it clamps at that speed and the other axes speed up to account for that ?
[07:55:25] <theorbtwo> nicko: I'd bet it has a lot to do with tachos in cars being in kRPM.
[07:56:01] <nicko> but people have been spinning things at revolution per time period for longer than cars
[07:56:13] <nicko> not saying you're wrong though !
[08:02:19] <Loetmichel> maybe it hast to do with the point that man is longer able to measure minutes accuratlely and count revolutions than seconds and let a machine do the counting
[08:02:46] <Loetmichel> longer in times of invention
[08:03:18] <nicko> not quite getting you there ...
[08:05:04] <theorbtwo> Ah, I am. If you count out revolutions over a minute, you get a more accurate number then if you count out revolutions over a second.
[08:05:28] <Loetmichel> i meant: man have a longer history of being able to count minutes accurately than seconds, and rev/second would not be easy counted by hand
[08:05:43] <Loetmichel> yeah, thats what i meant
[08:05:47] <nicko> sure, but you hardly ever do that
[08:05:57] <nicko> you want to know the speed now ... now
[08:06:02] <nicko> not in a minute
[08:06:13] <Loetmichel> but at the time the RPM was fixed it might have been so
[08:06:44] <nicko> I hear ya ! but am not so convinced ...
[08:07:26] <Loetmichel> might
[08:07:46] <Loetmichel> i was jut#st reaching for an explanation
[08:08:30] <nicko> yeh sure - best way to find an answer if all there is is tumbleweed and held in fart sounds ;)
[08:08:37] <nicko> heh - shucks
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[09:09:25] <aitalmac> hello everyone, how can i setup a pin bit in value to be a float number to then put to the speed of an axis?
[09:09:32] <aitalmac> I'm connecting my mpg
[09:09:43] <aitalmac> and i see that you use 2 pins
[09:09:46] <aitalmac> and mux them
[09:09:53] <aitalmac> but i want to use 3 pins
[09:09:58] <aitalmac> for 3 different speed
[09:10:02] <aitalmac> is that possible?
[09:13:26] <psha[work]> mux + mux?
[09:14:04] <aitalmac> what you mean?
[09:15:33] <aitalmac> setp mux4.0 in0 0.1
[09:15:33] <aitalmac> setp mux4.0.in1 0.01
[09:15:33] <aitalmac> setp mux4.0.in2 0.001
[09:15:33] <aitalmac> net scale1 mux4.0.sel0 <= parport.1.pin-09-in
[09:15:33] <aitalmac> net scale2 mux4.0.sel1 <= parport.1.pin-10-in
[09:15:34] <aitalmac> net pend-scale axis.0.jog-scale <= mux4.0.out
[09:15:36] <aitalmac> net pend-scale axis.1.jog-scale
[09:15:38] <aitalmac> net pend-scale axis.2.jog-scale
[09:15:40] <aitalmac> this is how it works now
[09:16:11] <aitalmac> i want 3 pin to set the three different value 0.1-0.01-0.001
[09:16:43] <aitalmac> pin-9 pin-10 and pin-11
[09:18:23] <aitalmac> i can use a mux8?
[09:25:50] <Tom_itx> there is a default value as well
[09:26:10] <Tom_itx> so with 2 pins you would be getting 3 actually
[09:38:34] <anonimasu> I got my mesa boards today ^_^
[09:39:09] <Valen> anonimasu: wewt
[09:39:11] <anonimasu> Tom_itx: how fast can i toggle io with a avr?
[09:40:41] <Tom_itx> good q
[09:40:55] <Tom_itx> 16mhz possibly 20mhz xtal
[09:41:04] <Tom_itx> depending on the avr
[09:41:11] <Tom_itx> interrupt?
[09:41:34] <Tom_itx> then your prescalar which can be 1
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[09:47:06] <Valen> you could do 8mhz at best with a 16mhz clock
[09:47:12] <Valen> i believe
[09:47:47] <Valen> i don't think xor a port pin is a single instruction is it Tom_itx?
[09:48:04] <Tom_itx> i'm not sure
[09:48:38] <psha[work]> Valen: i bet you first need to read it, no?
[09:48:47] <psha[work]> or it's mapped to register space?
[09:50:30] <Valen> it does vary with the AVR i rember reading something about being able to do some shortcut on some of them
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[09:50:50] <Valen> writing a 1 into some special register did an XOR in one instruction or somehting on the output pin
[09:51:13] <Tom_itx> eor is 1 cycle
[09:51:43] <Tom_itx> it would need to be read in.. correct
[09:53:12] <Tom_itx> unless the port is considered a register
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[12:06:50] <IG-garage> Hello electronic MCs, hello psha[work] and Loetmichel
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[14:16:51] <JT-Shop> I love it when I finally get something done I've put off for years
[14:17:29] <Spida> you should do that more often :-P
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[14:38:53] <skunkworks> well - a few weeks of light running and no following error issues. I looks like the servo amp was the issue.
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[14:59:02] <JT-Shop> one more roll of itch to go
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[15:11:05] * skunkworks hates fiberglass. Always gets slivers
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[15:15:46] <JT-Shop> I love it once it is installed :)
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[15:28:47] <IG-garage> skunkworks WHAT, ADROID IS RUNNING?
[15:29:25] <skunkworks> IG-garage: ?
[15:30:13] <IG-garage> light running with no error messages can only be made by a mechanoid human-alike creature
[15:30:21] <skunkworks> heh
[15:31:01] <skunkworks> IG-garage: this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39q6kvrSBSk
[15:31:53] <IG-garage> there's a speedometer implanted into the display
[15:32:06] <skunkworks> spindle rpm
[15:32:33] <IG-garage> is it someone's shop, or it's a firm?
[15:32:44] <skunkworks> hobbyshop
[15:32:47] <syyl_> oh
[15:32:52] <syyl_> serious machine
[15:33:07] <skunkworks> Yes - from the late 60's
[15:33:39] <skunkworks> http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/oldkandt.JPG
[15:33:58] <syyl_> arr
[15:34:07] <syyl_> pretty rigid looking
[15:34:14] <IG-garage> that bigger drill bit is bent
[15:34:28] <syyl_> the machine makes it fit ;)
[15:34:44] <syyl_> but a bit low on feed
[15:34:47] <syyl_> as it sounds
[15:34:50] <syyl_> *squeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeek*
[15:35:06] <IG-garage> skunkworks hobby shop as of the entrepreneur who sometimes takes orders to make some details?
[15:35:24] <skunkworks> sometimes
[15:35:29] <syyl_> oh
[15:35:34] <syyl_> the big tap is nice :d
[15:35:56] <syyl_> what kind of encoder does the main spindle have?
[15:35:59] <syyl_> for rigid tapping
[15:36:22] <skunkworks> It is a 1024 line encoder
[15:36:29] <syyl_> ah ok
[15:36:31] <skunkworks> it was added
[15:36:32] <skunkworks> http://youtu.be/1a0YpKfSGE8
[15:36:55] <syyl_> i like that machine ;)
[15:37:16] <skunkworks> syyl_: http://youtu.be/5vvP4L_hr90
[15:37:21] <IG-garage> skunkworks it is converted to CNC, right? Some powerful AC servo motors are used, or whole conversion was how to plug it to the computer with EMC?
[15:37:53] <syyl_> encoder ist coupled via a belt?
[15:37:59] <syyl_> is it accurate enough?
[15:38:02] <skunkworks> syyl_: yes
[15:38:05] <skunkworks> syyl_: yes
[15:38:29] <syyl_> thats good news
[15:38:43] <syyl_> i was still looking for a encoder with a 30mm tru-hole
[15:38:48] <syyl_> for my spindle :D
[15:39:04] <syyl_> but with a belt, everything is easyier
[15:39:11] <skunkworks> IG-garage: it was NC initally. Hydraulic servos. We converted it on the cheap with 80's era brushed servos.
[15:39:16] <IG-garage> than with gears?
[15:39:28] <syyl_> than directly mount it to the spindle
[15:40:12] <IG-garage> skunkworks motors spin a hydralic pump, which linear move is controlled by encoder?
[15:40:41] <skunkworks> this http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/conversion/hyservo.JPG was converted to http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/conversion/yaxis/yassembly.JPG
[15:41:02] <skunkworks> IG-garage: originally - yes - but Scales - not encoders
[15:41:06] <IG-garage> if it will be on the spindle, it will probably be more precise
[15:41:25] <IG-garage> "Scales" ?
[15:41:57] <IG-garage> they measure amount of the oil in hydro system or what?
[15:42:22] <skunkworks> linear scales
[15:42:48] <IG-garage> and after conversion there's a screw, not hydraulics?
[15:43:08] <skunkworks> the hydraulic servos spun ball screws - yes
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[15:45:03] <IG-garage> so, some powerful motor creates pressure, and hydraulyc servos decide wether to spin the screw or not, correct?
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[15:46:37] <skunkworks> yes - there was a proportional valve that controled the hydraulic servo. It was pretty much like dc servos but using hydraulic fluid instead of voltage.
[15:47:09] <IG-garage> ok
[15:47:26] <IG-garage> we had hydraulic surface grinder
[15:47:47] <IG-garage> and how to, par exampele, rotate A axis to its 90 degrees if it is angular? 'g01 A90' ?
[15:48:35] <IG-garage> f90 will mean '90 degrees per minute' in this case?
[15:50:47] <skunkworks> Yes - if only the rotory axis is commanded.
[15:51:16] <IG-garage> ok, never thought of it actually.
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[16:21:44] <anonimasu> anyone made their own gear cutters?
[16:22:53] <JT-Shop> I think archivist does
[16:23:20] <anonimasu> im pondering buying some cutters off ebay, but I dont know what module to look for
[16:24:18] <syyl_> hm
[16:24:23] <syyl_> home made gear cutters?
[16:24:32] <syyl_> look for müller nicks video on youtube
[16:24:43] <anonimasu> im thinking if there's any use in buying them..
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[16:25:45] <syyl_> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJQtx80euGM
[16:25:47] <anonimasu> or should I chuck up a 0.5mm ballnose and cut them..
[16:25:51] <syyl_> noooo
[16:25:54] <anonimasu> (gears
[16:26:00] <syyl_> that will take years :D
[16:26:12] <anonimasu> i dont watch my big mill :)
[16:26:49] <syyl_> he can do gears, racks and bevel gears with the same tool
[16:27:18] <anonimasu> but I dont have a cutter grinder..
[16:27:26] <anonimasu> im thinking if I can use my cnc to grind the cutters..
[16:27:27] <anonimasu> :D
[16:27:36] <syyl_> thats the spirit!
[16:28:23] <anonimasu> my spindle is 5k-rpm.. possibly if I go slow I could contour a hss cutter
[16:28:31] <syyl_> yes
[16:28:33] <syyl_> that will work
[16:28:47] <syyl_> gearotic can generate gcode for such an application
[16:28:54] <anonimasu> I dont like _guessing_ and hand grinding since I dont have the skill to do so
[16:29:18] <syyl_> build a bonelle or quorn cutter grinder ;)
[16:29:36] <syyl_> mine is allmost finished ;D
[16:29:50] * anonimasu has servos for a machine like that
[16:29:50] <anonimasu> :D
[16:30:29] <syyl_> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/bonelle_74.jpg
[16:30:44] <anonimasu> after the lathe is odne perhaps
[16:30:59] <anonimasu> I could build one i gues
[16:31:00] <anonimasu> s
[16:31:10] <anonimasu> i cut some slots for a guy at work today
[16:31:25] <anonimasu> he wanted them 25mm, and I were like are you sure 25.. you need 25.05 or something so it'll be smooth
[16:31:28] <anonimasu> "no. 25mm"
[16:31:44] <syyl_> hr
[16:31:50] <syyl_> and you cut it 25 dead on?
[16:31:53] <anonimasu> yeah
[16:32:04] <syyl_> and it got stuck? :D
[16:32:33] <anonimasu> he was like, "it's very tight"
[16:32:50] <tom3p> syyl did you make the engraved degree ring at base of column?
[16:32:56] <syyl_> jep
[16:33:11] <tom3p> very nice stuff, i only now the quorn tho
[16:33:16] <tom3p> k
[16:33:28] <syyl_> the bonelle is pretty similar, but completely built from bar stock
[16:33:41] <anonimasu> syyl_: i beleive when the weather's a bit colder it will be _TIGHT_
[16:33:47] <syyl_> hihi
[16:35:15] <anonimasu> I had to bite my tongue to keep from laughing when he said that it's very tight
[16:35:53] <anonimasu> it was a tool for removing injectors from a tractor
[16:36:09] <syyl_> oh, that needs to be pretty precise :D
[16:36:23] <anonimasu> indeed, like +0.10/+0.20
[16:36:37] <syyl_> i could chisel that :D
[16:36:43] <syyl_> we have a saying over here, like "no air, no living"
[16:36:59] <syyl_> in reference to mechanics
[16:37:42] <syyl_> and its true...
[16:37:50] <syyl_> to tight tolerances are often a problem..
[16:38:21] <anonimasu> im amazed how it just got that way from calling up a pocket cycle
[16:38:40] <anonimasu> with a like 2*2mm finish pass
[16:38:54] <syyl_> luck
[16:38:56] <syyl_> ;)
[16:39:06] <tom3p> the bonelle dwgs and docs http://homepage.ntlworld.com/j.b.d.willis/bonelle_tcg.htm
[16:39:11] <anonimasu> it does it constantly
[16:39:21] <anonimasu> but not on circles though since there's stick/slip I think
[16:39:40] <syyl_> when luck gets constant, its called skill
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[16:40:44] <anonimasu> I wish I had more of that
[16:41:00] <anonimasu> because it's so funny when people ask you for dead on tolerances
[16:41:12] <anonimasu> and complain things wont fit, when you advice them to add a bit
[16:42:29] <syyl_> thats what fits are made for...
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[16:42:48] <syyl_> fitting and interchangeability
[16:43:06] <anonimasu> indeed, but it's so funny
[16:43:06] <anonimasu> :D
[16:43:12] <syyl_> jep
[16:43:32] <syyl_> some of our engineers add ridicioulus tolerances to plastic parts...
[16:43:37] <syyl_> +-1/100mm
[16:44:11] <anonimasu> im pondering if i should take my screws apart and see what it costs to refurbrish them so I can keep under 0.01 on contours..
[16:44:40] <anonimasu> but most of the stuff I do is heavy milling of steel plates and making a few holes
[16:45:00] <syyl_> i plan to put oversized balls into my ballscres
[16:45:17] <anonimasu> or see if i can do it myself like your planning
[16:45:33] <syyl_> not an elegant solution
[16:45:50] <syyl_> but one guy over at practicalmachinists does it with sucess
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[16:46:14] <anonimasu> if sending them off to be fixed is not too expensive that'd be nicer
[16:46:46] <syyl_> yeah
[16:46:57] <syyl_> and they know what they are doing
[16:46:57] <anonimasu> re-ground and loaded with fresh balls
[16:47:07] <syyl_> thats the propper way to do it
[16:47:11] <anonimasu> I have linear scales so pitch error dosent matter as much
[16:47:32] <anonimasu> just backslash and heidenhain cant comp that before it happens
[16:47:32] <syyl_> but backlash can be very annoying
[16:47:36] <anonimasu> only with rotary encoders
[16:47:37] <archivist> syyl_, I need a cutter grinder
[16:47:59] <syyl_> everyone needs a cutter grunder :D
[16:48:12] <archivist> anonimasu, use rack form then generate
[16:48:26] <anonimasu> archivist: how?
[16:49:11] <archivist> in the same way a rack passes a gear
[16:49:29] <Loetmichel> re @ home
[16:49:42] <archivist> its what hobbing cutters do
[16:50:02] <syyl_> yep
[16:50:14] <anonimasu> but I dont know where to find that kind of cutters
[16:50:18] <syyl_> thats what müllernick simulates with his flycutter
[16:50:36] <syyl_> you can mill the cutter from hss
[16:50:41] <syyl_> with a carbide endmill
[16:50:45] <archivist> rack is a simple form to grind
[16:51:27] <syyl_> i think one could do it on a benchgrinder with some fences
[16:51:52] <anonimasu> I like syyl's idea alot, I could contour that
[16:52:36] <archivist> there is no contour with rack form
[16:52:47] <anonimasu> but I could generate one by gearotics..
[16:52:52] <anonimasu> demo only -_-
[16:52:56] <anonimasu> crap.
[16:53:08] <syyl_> hrhr
[16:53:21] <syyl_> then you need to do the math on paper
[16:53:23] <anonimasu> but at 75$ i could just buy it..
[16:53:27] <syyl_> and handwrite the cgode.. ;)
[16:53:32] <anonimasu> I hate that part.
[16:53:42] <anonimasu> we did a 75 page paper for a gearbox at school
[16:53:43] <archivist> just to it in g code, no cost involved
[16:53:59] <syyl_> hihi
[16:54:23] <anonimasu> take it apart and calculate everything based on measuring gears
[16:54:33] <archivist> just mod the number of passes for quality v speed
[16:54:52] <syyl_> but you will need a rotary axis
[16:54:58] <syyl_> no way to get arround that
[16:55:02] <anonimasu> or I could take a picture of the gear, and generate g-code from that..
[16:55:12] <anonimasu> for making a rack..
[16:55:20] <alex4nder> hey
[16:55:36] <syyl_> yes, for a rack
[16:55:45] <syyl_> mill it as a circular part
[16:55:50] <syyl_> then bend it straight
[16:55:54] <anonimasu> haha
[16:55:58] <syyl_> *duck&run*
[16:56:14] <anonimasu> yeah, it'll make nice and smooth gears :D
[16:56:26] <anonimasu> or simply order cutters.
[16:56:27] <anonimasu> :D
[16:56:32] <syyl_> thats way to simple
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[16:56:41] <anonimasu> issue is that I have no clue what gears are in my lathe
[16:56:56] <anonimasu> and I have a broken one to fix...
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[16:57:07] <anonimasu> brb
[16:57:08] <anonimasu> dinnertime
[16:57:16] <Loetmichel> aehm... isnt a rack gear simply a trabezoid ?
[16:57:22] <Loetmichel> trapezoid
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[16:57:59] <Loetmichel> since the rounding of the teeth is caused by the meshing of rotating gears?
[16:58:08] <IchGuckLive> Hi all around the world
[16:58:10] <syyl_> yes
[16:58:45] <anonimasu> really i'd like a cnc grinder so i could grind gears.
[16:58:56] <anonimasu> profile the wheel to tooth form leave it for a day or 2
[16:58:58] <Loetmichel> i have a similar problem: i use the other gear generator
[16:59:26] <syyl_> flat milling small gears in steel is not to much fun
[16:59:32] <syyl_> as you need a very small cutter
[16:59:42] <syyl_> for a correct profile
[16:59:58] <Loetmichel> and have to make some inside gears for the wheelchair of my wife.... with 500++ teeth... nut geargenerator allows only 255
[17:00:05] <syyl_> or wire edm, anonimasu :D
[17:00:15] <syyl_> just cut the gear out of a plate
[17:00:22] <syyl_> even hardened...
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[17:04:30] <IchGuckLive> Loetmichel: http://mechmo.de/preagerad_low.mpg
[17:06:21] <Loetmichel> what will that be?
[17:06:32] <Loetmichel> cutting wheel for pizza?
[17:06:43] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[17:06:47] <IchGuckLive> ledder not pizza
[17:07:00] <IchGuckLive> 2500 pices
[17:07:01] <Loetmichel> leather?
[17:07:08] <IchGuckLive> "LEDER"
[17:07:15] <Loetmichel> leather
[17:07:24] <IchGuckLive> B)
[17:07:29] <Loetmichel> hmm, shouldnt that be sharpened?
[17:07:40] <IchGuckLive> 0,3mm
[17:07:58] <IchGuckLive> karden out of 1.2080
[17:08:06] <IchGuckLive> Harden O.O
[17:08:16] <Loetmichel> could cut
[17:08:34] <IchGuckLive> no fload in 4 rotatians
[17:08:38] <Loetmichel> i KNEW i had seen this wheels somewhere ;-)
[17:09:06] <Loetmichel> must be in my mothers sewing box ;-)
[17:09:35] <IchGuckLive> i made a other option with a standard cutter on 45 Deg it will be aforth of the price
[17:10:38] <IchGuckLive> trouble is to bring the 5th axis along the part
[17:10:45] <archivist> Loetmichel, internal gears of any number can be generated with a gear shaper, would be simple with emc
[17:11:22] <archivist> the hard part is your cutter
[17:11:39] <Loetmichel> archivist: i intend to cut the gears out of flat plate
[17:11:48] <Loetmichel> with an 0,8mm end mill
[17:11:51] <archivist> same applies
[17:12:11] <archivist> well .8 end mill is just silly
[17:12:19] <Loetmichel> is it?
[17:12:41] <archivist> yes it wont last long
[17:12:50] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=11711
[17:12:56] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=11714
[17:13:05] <Loetmichel> i didnt say Steel plate
[17:13:07] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[17:13:43] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=11702
[17:13:51] <archivist> the job you are making for requires some strength and reliability
[17:14:24] <Loetmichel> yes, i was goung for 10mm POM
[17:14:28] <Loetmichel> going
[17:14:44] <anonimasu> syyl_: im working on getting one
[17:14:56] <syyl_> hehe
[17:14:59] <syyl_> look
[17:15:04] <syyl_> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/trog_1.jpg
[17:15:06] <syyl_> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/trog_2.jpg
[17:15:08] <anonimasu> syyl_: i'll rough machine everything on the mill then finish cut it on the mill :D
[17:15:08] <syyl_> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/trog_3.jpg
[17:15:13] <anonimasu> err edm
[17:15:14] <syyl_> did that today at work...
[17:15:33] <anonimasu> nice
[17:16:04] <Connor> What is that?
[17:16:09] <anonimasu> syyl: and i'd offset it permanently to -0.002
[17:16:19] <syyl_> hihi
[17:16:21] <anonimasu> so they can warm stuff with their hands to make them fit(like a guy here does)
[17:16:33] <syyl_> part of a ground fault interruptor, Connor
[17:16:39] <anonimasu> you keep the shafts he makes by hand for 30 seconds and they wont fir
[17:16:55] <syyl_> i would hit him with the shaft
[17:17:00] <syyl_> until it fits again
[17:17:12] <anonimasu> he delivers exactly what you ask for
[17:17:22] <anonimasu> +/- whatever micron
[17:17:23] <anonimasu> :D
[17:18:11] <Loetmichel> anonimasu: overengineered for MOST parts
[17:18:45] <Loetmichel> even gears dont need to be THAT precise, a little running time with toothpaste and all is well ;-)
[17:19:48] <syyl_> thats the difference between a german and a chinese mill...
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[17:20:06] <syyl_> the chinese sounds like a nearby running train at 2000rpm
[17:20:29] <syyl_> the german one like a breeze
[17:20:32] <Loetmichel> syyl_: maybe, but its also the difference between sufficient and seriously overpriced
[17:20:54] <syyl_> or good & bad egineering
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[17:21:33] <Loetmichel> that will be a point of view-discussion
[17:22:59] <Loetmichel> to be lesss precise isnt necessarly bad engineering... it can just be economical or simply made to shine, not to work
[17:23:44] <Loetmichel> i have seen Harddisks where the landingzone was SO slick the heads woud coldweld to the platter...
[17:24:02] <Loetmichel> just as an example
[17:24:10] <syyl_> in a geartrain thats not applicable
[17:24:20] <syyl_> think of a lathes headstock
[17:24:43] <syyl_> the machinist will do suicide, if the machine rattles the whole day like hell :D
[17:25:04] <Loetmichel> who said anything of rattling?
[17:25:08] <syyl_> or a geartrain in a car
[17:25:44] <syyl_> there are applications where you have only the choise between tight and tight tolerances
[17:25:56] <Loetmichel> i said anything more than needed pecision is only overexpensive
[17:26:22] <Loetmichel> i didnt say "put some square stock in instead of gears"
[17:26:51] <syyl_> use triangular stock
[17:26:58] <syyl_> that rattles one time less per rev
[17:27:00] <syyl_> Oo
[17:27:05] <Loetmichel> one less bump per rotation`?
[17:27:09] <syyl_> jep
[17:27:15] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[17:28:31] <IG-garage> Loetmichel: This online magazin which will have probably written of my two motorcyles, has made a custom, Pipeburn writes about it: http://www.pipeburn.com/home/2011/7/24/1993-yamaha-xjr-400.html
[17:28:50] <IG-garage> Loetmichel: can you give me a hint on one thing?
[17:28:56] <Loetmichel> which?
[17:29:57] <IG-garage> How to arrange my time on the project and stop working at night or simply early in the morning in the garage? How to get patience maybe?
[17:30:11] <Loetmichel> syyl_: what i meant: selfbuild gears which ar less than zero tolerance in a gearbox are normally no problem
[17:30:28] <Loetmichel> just put in some polishing agent and let it run a while
[17:30:33] <syyl_> depends on the application
[17:30:34] <Loetmichel> and then CLEAN
[17:30:48] <Loetmichel> so it will run like a charm
[17:30:48] <syyl_> i would not do that on fast running gears
[17:31:11] <Loetmichel> fast running gears should be weighted anyway
[17:31:20] <IchGuckLive> Loetmichel: dimand 32µm
[17:31:45] <Loetmichel> IchGuckLive: depends on the material of the gears ;-)
[17:31:45] <syyl_> that would embed itself pretty well in the gears
[17:31:55] <IG-garage> "fast running gears should be weighted anyway" <-- what does it mean? Is it some kind of quest which I must understand and apply to my problem, Loetmichel?
[17:31:59] <syyl_> in most materials, even hardened steel
[17:32:10] <Loetmichel> that was for syyl_
[17:32:15] <IG-garage> oh...
[17:32:19] <syyl_> so you get constantly grinding gears
[17:32:27] <syyl_> not what you want
[17:32:44] <IG-garage> but with those words i have understood something, anyway
[17:32:49] <syyl_> even grinding compound could be a problem
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[17:33:07] <Loetmichel> syyl_: right, i would go for simple toothpaste if the gears are made of brass or plastics
[17:33:22] <syyl_> i would run brass dry
[17:33:27] <syyl_> maybe in a oilbath
[17:33:44] <IG-garage> in water
[17:33:53] <IG-garage> with soap
[17:33:57] <syyl_> or beer Oo
[17:34:00] <IG-garage> no
[17:34:05] <Loetmichel> IG-garage: fot the patience: wrong guy, i have time management issues myself ;-)
[17:34:06] <syyl_> whats good for me
[17:34:11] <syyl_> cant be bad for gears
[17:34:44] <IG-garage> Loetmichel: have you ever tried to schedule your project, or it is always like a haze?
[17:35:03] <syyl_> a hobby project?
[17:35:40] <IG-garage> syyl_: two almost finished motorcycle, plus some parts which should be finished
[17:35:54] <syyl_> so it should stay hobby, so just go for it, when you have spare time..
[17:36:01] <IG-garage> handmade.
[17:36:33] <IG-garage> i thought of 30 minutes each day, which though can turn out to one or one and half an hour.
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[18:13:48] <danimal_garage> hi
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[18:21:16] <JT-Shop> Hi Dan
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[18:39:06] <KimK> skunkworks_: Hi Sam, are you around?
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[18:56:24] <danimal_garage> hi John
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[19:31:49] <danimal_garage> yawn
[19:32:29] <danimal_garage> trying to find a computer for my mini router cnc, not a ton of really cheap ones on craigslist
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[20:12:13] <Loetmichel> danimal_garage: i had just to grab some parts of my spareparts-box
[20:12:15] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[20:12:43] <danimal_garage> i'm out of those
[20:13:15] <danimal_garage> every pc in the house is from my spare parts box
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[20:23:52] <JT-Shop> I have a D510 with broken Ethernet you can have
[20:27:33] <danimal_garage> ha, thanks.... i'm pissed off enough at my 510 though
[20:27:52] <danimal_garage> i still get real time delay errors with it
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[20:29:24] <MOGLI> can anyone guide me , which THC is fully compatible with EMC2 and what price , where to buy???\
[20:29:58] <JT-Shop> do you have HT off and isolcpu=1?
[20:30:13] <JT-Shop> THCAD Mesa
[20:30:19] <JT-Shop> is what I use
[20:31:05] <danimal_garage> yes JT-Shop
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[20:34:14] <andypugh> MOGLI: right at the bottom: http://www.mesanet.com/aiodaughter.html
[20:34:56] <danimal_garage> i should have all the parts to get my mini router running this weekend
[20:35:08] <andypugh> MOGLI: $69
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[20:44:39] <MOGLI> thanks andypugh .. m checking it...
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[20:46:57] <JT-Shop> MOGLI: you should use something faster than a parallel port to use the THCAD
[20:48:03] <MOGLI> i am using 7I43 and i have one spare 5I20 if needed.. plasma is Hypertherm Powermax45
[20:48:30] <JT-Shop> danimal_garage: I have an Asus M4A87TD EVO that I changed out to get a motherboard with a floppy header
[20:48:45] <JT-Shop> MOGLI: you should be ok then
[20:48:55] <MOGLI> i read the manuals for plasma .. i think my plasma has in built voltage divider and it gives 0-7v '
[20:49:17] <JT-Shop> the THCAD outputs a freq that changes based on the voltage read
[20:49:50] <MOGLI> sorry for silly question but i am not electronic guy. so THCAD is 10v will it work with 0-7v range??
[20:50:14] <MOGLI> or do i need any other connection from Plasma/electrode
[20:50:15] <MOGLI> etc
[20:50:17] <JT-Shop> yea, just will have less resolution
[20:50:43] <MOGLI> any sample config for THCAD or wiki page .. how to connect etc??
[20:50:56] <JT-Shop> if you have an arc ok contact that is nice
[20:51:14] <MOGLI> yes it is there in manual of hypertherm..
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[20:52:17] <MOGLI> JT-Shop, can you suggest any wiki or sample config for using THCAD
[20:52:47] <JT-Shop> looking for link
[20:52:55] <MOGLI> ok..thanks..
[20:55:28] <JT-Shop> http://git.linuxcnc.org/gitweb?p=emc2.git;a=tree;f=configs/plasma-5i20;h=5f9e4c3de565c5ac8744406e6c6390f7a5f27a1e;hb=HEAD
[20:56:21] <JT-Shop> hmmm, for some reason it is not in 2.5
[20:58:51] <MOGLI> ok ... thanks JT-Shop. any guideline for wiring?
[20:58:57] <MOGLI> m checking mesa manuals
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[20:59:33] <MOGLI> i need 10v version right???
[21:00:03] <JT-Shop> this is my plasma http://gnipsel.com/shop/plasma/plasma.xhtml
[21:00:25] <JT-Shop> if your plasma puts out 0-10vdc or less yes
[21:02:45] <MOGLI> JT-Shop, i read pagesfrom your link...why Paraport and Mesa Both???
[21:03:49] <JT-Shop> started with parallel port only then when PCW made the THCAD card I switched most over but not all until I do an overhaul of the cabinet when I move it to the new machine shop
[21:05:33] <MOGLI> you mean Parallel port only THC?? how its possible??
[21:05:59] <JT-Shop> I did not have a THC then
[21:06:04] <MOGLI> oh ok..
[21:06:24] <JT-Shop> I was very careful to make my sheets level
[21:07:18] <JT-Shop> wow 3200 users on the forum now and almost 12k total messages
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[21:20:10] <andypugh> Yeah, but 25% of them are by you or me :-)
[21:24:29] <Loetmichel> hihi
[21:27:35] <Loetmichel> looks like the german CNCboard i am in. 30k users but only 5 with more than 10k messages posted
[21:28:38] * Loetmichel has only 1354 posts... ;-)
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[21:29:29] <JT-Shop> LOL
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[21:34:37] <danimal_garage> yawn
[21:35:35] <Loetmichel> btw, danimal_garage: my next CNC pc will be a little over-sophisticated:
[21:36:04] <danimal_garage> i just want a cheap p4 like i have in my lathe
[21:36:09] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=11864
[21:36:14] <danimal_garage> an old dell optiplex
[21:36:49] <Loetmichel> its a c2d 2,8ghz with 64gb ssd in a "286-pizzabox"
[21:37:20] <Loetmichel> danimal_garage: if you were in germany i would have recommendet www.itsco.de ;-)
[21:37:45] <andypugh> Seems very much overkill for EMC2.
[21:37:48] <JT-Shop> here is an Asus A7A266 motherboard
[21:37:57] <andypugh> 1GHz and 8GB SSD is planty
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[21:38:13] <Loetmichel> andypugh: will be tripleboot: emc2, mach3 and pcnc-dos
[21:38:28] <andypugh> Eeeew!
[21:38:46] <Loetmichel> mach3-demo
[21:38:58] <danimal_garage> i'll stick with EMC2
[21:39:10] <danimal_garage> been using it for over 2 years now
[21:39:19] <danimal_garage> little to no problems
[21:39:20] <Loetmichel> (just so that i can move the machine with windows running)
[21:39:25] <andypugh> And it's nearly finished :-)
[21:39:45] <danimal_garage> andypugh: if you mean my machine, hardly!
[21:39:54] <andypugh> No, I meant EMC2
[21:40:01] <andypugh> But I was joking.
[21:40:05] <danimal_garage> i don't believe that!
[21:40:23] <Loetmichel> emc2 is open source, and so by definition never finished ;-)
[21:40:41] <danimal_garage> i'm sure it will never be finished.... it's a group of constant improvers
[21:41:27] <Loetmichel> i confess: for all "normal" 2.5d i use PCNC-dos
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[21:41:43] <Loetmichel> because it has HPGL-capability
[21:42:08] <Loetmichel> only for true 3d i boot emc2/ubuntu
[21:42:28] * JT-Shop goes back to playing with itch :/
[21:42:40] <danimal_garage> get the cream
[21:42:43] <danimal_garage> it'll go away
[21:43:07] <Loetmichel> and win/mach for the occasionaly "have to hack some gcode in "interactive"
[21:43:33] <Loetmichel> JT-Shop: bah! now that you mentoin it:
[21:44:00] * Loetmichel goes searching for the hand crema against rough skin...
[21:44:04] <Loetmichel> *ITCH*
[21:48:12] <Loetmichel> *ahhhh* better... to much cleaning ethanol and acetone and to less grease @ work today....
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[21:58:25] <JT-Shop> I'm going to be a bit short of itchulation darn it
[21:58:58] <danimal_garage> sounds like a problem
[21:59:48] <JT-Shop> yea, I just need about 8sq ft and don't want to buy a whole bundle for one piece
[22:00:40] <danimal_garage> ah insulation
[22:00:57] <danimal_garage> a roll is only like $9
[22:01:01] <danimal_garage> isn't it?
[22:01:05] <Loetmichel> JT-Shop: mineral wool?
[22:01:42] <Loetmichel> than itchulation IS the correct term ;-)
[22:03:58] <Loetmichel> danimal_garage: for your computer: isnt there a company like itsco in america?
[22:04:19] <Loetmichel> which recycles old government/industrial PCs?
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[22:07:20] <JT-Shop> LOL $40
[22:08:04] <Loetmichel> ?
[22:09:01] <JT-Shop> Loetmichel: fiberglass insulation
[22:09:13] <Loetmichel> ouch
[22:09:19] * JT-Shop runs to town to fill the tank on the BlueWing
[22:09:44] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: tank refill?
[22:10:56] <danimal_garage> Don't you have enough gas?
[22:11:06] <Jymmm> never enough
[22:14:24] <Loetmichel> hmmm
[22:14:58] <Loetmichel> i love my Opel Omega: 1,75 tons but only 8-9liters/100km diesel
[22:15:58] <Loetmichel> (26-29mpg)
[22:16:01] <andypugh> Diesel? In a Car? You will be confusing the Americans with that concept
[22:16:29] <Loetmichel> turbocharged 2.5liters 6cyl
[22:17:05] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=12135
[22:17:13] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=11975
[22:17:17] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=11969
[22:17:19] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[22:17:50] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=11684 <- american-friendly, automatic, no stickshift ;-)
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[22:18:12] <Jymmm> Whats an Opel? <ducks>
[22:18:18] <Jymmm> diesel?
[22:18:56] <Jymmm> stick shift? Is that like the shift between swing and graveyard?
[22:18:57] <andypugh> It's a GM with a different badge. Or is that Vauxhall?
[22:19:33] <Loetmichel> you may know it as vauxhall
[22:20:09] <Loetmichel> and no, the gm/vauxhall is the different badge. the car is designed by opel
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[22:21:45] <Loetmichel> (the company that was nearly killed because mama GM had to be bailed out and left the child no money to pay its workers ;-)
[22:22:52] <Loetmichel> Jymmm: manual shifting the gears. isnt that called stick shift in america?
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[22:33:33] <Loetmichel> ah, and btw, andypugh: its a BMW engine and gearbox in the opel ;-)
[22:34:22] <andypugh> I work on a Peugeot engine. Which is made by Ford, Assembled by Volve, and sold back to Peugeot.
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[22:34:57] <Loetmichel> nice one ;-)
[22:35:26] <andypugh> There is another engine designed and built by Ford, and only used by Jaguar, Landrover, and Citroen.
[22:40:30] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: Yes, it was a joke - like nobody knows what a manual transmission is ;)
[22:40:37] <Loetmichel> ah, found it: fo our american friends: there the Opel Omega was called Caddilac catera
[22:41:51] <Jymmm> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cadillac_Catera
[22:43:14] <Loetmichel> yes
[22:43:49] <Loetmichel> but obviously i drive a version without trunk
[22:43:58] <Loetmichel> whats that called in america?
[22:44:30] <DaViruz> andypugh: volve?
[22:44:32] <andypugh> I think they call it a Station Wagon.
[22:44:36] <andypugh> Volvo
[22:44:38] <Loetmichel> jeah
[22:44:40] <DaViruz> sorry, could not lat that one pass
[22:45:10] <andypugh> It's an Estate Car in the UK.
[22:45:31] <DaViruz> or a Kombi in sweden
[22:45:56] <DaViruz> or Herrgrdsvagn (pretty much a direct translation of estate wagon)
[22:46:01] <Loetmichel> if you flip tha back seats : 2.05m by 1.6m plain loading space
[22:46:20] <Loetmichel> DaViruz: in germany its also called kombi
[22:46:21] <DaViruz> how two dimensinal
[22:46:36] <DaViruz> my german car is called avant though
[22:46:39] <Loetmichel> ... and about 80cm height
[22:46:48] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[22:47:40] <Loetmichel> it is tested: 3 persons in sleeping bags can sleep in the car without hurting in the morning ;-)
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[22:49:42] <DaViruz> and without suffocating?
[22:49:54] <Loetmichel> sure
[22:51:17] <Loetmichel> one good thing about that car: i was hit last month in a roundabout by a VW polo.
[22:51:46] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: jthornton http://www.dogwork.com/relp8/
[22:51:53] <Loetmichel> my car: come chipped laquer on the back bumper and a fallen in distance sensor
[22:52:07] <Loetmichel> his car: 10cm shorter front
[22:52:30] <Jymmm> heh
[22:52:36] <DaViruz> der panzer wagen
[22:52:42] <Loetmichel> (bumper in shreds, coller leaking, both headlights broken ;-)
[22:52:53] <Loetmichel> cooler
[22:53:14] <danimal_garage> i can fit many bodies..er people.. in my van
[22:54:04] <Loetmichel> danimal_garage: van is bigger and needs PLENTY more gas ;-)
[22:54:27] <Loetmichel> but i even cam have my CNC mill working IN the car:
[22:54:38] <danimal_garage> i can fit your car in my van
[22:54:50] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=12129
[22:54:53] <DaViruz> that says alot more about your cnc mill than your car
[22:54:56] <DaViruz> :-)
[22:54:59] <danimal_garage> ha
[22:55:09] <Loetmichel> DaViruz: you may be right
[22:55:22] <DaViruz> ooh weller ws81
[22:55:25] <Loetmichel> only 200by 110by110mm travel
[22:55:27] <danimal_garage> my cnc mill weighs twice as much as your car
[22:55:50] <DaViruz> clearly you have great taste in soldering tools
[22:55:57] <Loetmichel> danimal_garage: possible, but not so transport friendly ;-)
[22:56:08] <danimal_garage> that's why it's not moving
[22:56:12] <Loetmichel> DaViruz: its my companys soldering iron
[22:56:17] <DaViruz> oh.
[22:56:26] <Loetmichel> (one of many)
[22:56:33] <DaViruz> clearly you work for a company which have great taste in soldering tools
[22:56:40] <DaViruz> :)
[22:56:41] <danimal_garage> i love my car, 12mpg, and a change of rear tires in between oil changes
[22:56:44] <andypugh> Weller TCP is cleverer
[22:56:58] <Loetmichel> yes, privately i use a cheap 80 watts soldering station
[22:56:58] <DaViruz> TCP/IP?
[22:57:19] <andypugh> It's the only use I know of the Curie temperature.
[22:58:08] <Loetmichel> danimal_garage: harha, no traction control? i get a blinking light if my foot is to far down and the street is wet/icy
[22:58:09] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[22:58:56] <Loetmichel> andypugh: click.......clack........click...... its like a mantra ;-)
[23:00:03] <JT-Shop> danimal_garage: is it 5 o'clock yet?
[23:00:04] <Loetmichel> i have my cnc placesd in the company at the moment to do some company work...
[23:00:12] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=12180&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
[23:00:20] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=12177&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
[23:00:55] <Loetmichel> (sometimes i ask mysel if i am completly mad, to lend the company my private tools...)
[23:01:49] <Loetmichel> ... but in the workshop si better milling than in the back of my car.
[23:02:10] <Loetmichel> AND the chips are easier to dispose of ;-)
[23:05:47] -!- MOGLI has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
[23:08:57] <Loetmichel> brrr... 1 o'clock already... if my wife would stop snoring i would go to bed, get smoe sleep before in 7 hours i have to work again....
[23:09:27] <Loetmichel> (pleeease, wife?!?)
[23:09:29] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[23:09:46] <IG-garage> Plus three more hours into the work, two wheels are almost made.
[23:09:50] <JT-Shop> raise up the head of your bed tomorrow about 5"
[23:10:05] <IG-garage> Loetmichel: why sleep in bed? ;)
[23:10:20] <JT-Shop> snoring may go away...
[23:10:23] <IG-garage> Loetmichel: sleep at work, feel yourself young!
[23:10:25] <Loetmichel> IG-garage: 'caise the car is full of litter ;-)
[23:10:30] <Loetmichel> cause
[23:10:40] <IG-garage> full of what?.. car?..
[23:10:52] <Loetmichel> IG-garage: garbage
[23:11:00] * IG-garage assumes litter is somewhat like ginger ale
[23:11:16] <IG-garage> so, anyway, don't sleep in bed
[23:11:20] <IG-garage> ah!
[23:11:28] <IG-garage> no,, don't sleep in car
[23:11:46] <Loetmichel> JT-Shop: not possible
[23:11:53] <Loetmichel> waterbed
[23:13:15] <IG-garage> 'motorized' bed, yay, digly-digly
[23:14:33] <Loetmichel> IG-garage: its not the ton of water to lift. its the 2mm PVC foi that encloses it
[23:14:53] <Loetmichel> if you rise one end: water goes to the other
[23:15:05] <Loetmichel> foil
[23:15:11] <IG-garage> i understand, i slept on such a bed once, at my kins
[23:15:31] <IG-garage> og, no, that was air bed
[23:16:42] <Loetmichel> IG-garage: imagine a 2by2meters airbed filled with water... 30cm high
[23:17:21] <Loetmichel> resting on a wood plate about 50cm above the ground.
[23:18:37] <IG-garage> oh, but could be filled with air the same way
[23:18:45] <Loetmichel> you cant move that without a forklift ;-)
[23:19:00] <IG-garage> Loetmichel: imagine a 2by2meters airbed filled with air... 30cm high
[23:19:03] <Loetmichel> no, because it isnt "pressurized"
[23:19:14] <IG-garage> pressurized?
[23:19:23] <Loetmichel> the water can flow freely inside tha big pvc bag
[23:19:50] <IG-garage> if it doesn't let water to leak out, it will keep the air inside
[23:20:04] <Loetmichel> so you dont lay ON the matress, you float in it
[23:20:15] <IG-garage> so does air, only imagine an air there.
[23:20:17] <JT-Shop> that does increase the complications
[23:20:36] <Loetmichel> IG-garage: air hhas no lift capacity
[23:20:38] <IG-garage> you also can float on the air, like Alladin
[23:20:43] <Loetmichel> not for human bodies ;-)
[23:20:49] <IG-garage> maybe
[23:21:11] <Loetmichel> so airbeds have to be under pressure to work
[23:21:21] <IG-garage> 6:25 AM
[23:21:27] <IG-garage> yeah
[23:21:35] <Loetmichel> but ypu cant pressurize a waterbed matress.
[23:21:47] <IG-garage> but their middle shall not be more high than its perimeter
[23:22:06] <IG-garage> because its middle will have lifted up?
[23:22:31] <Loetmichel> it will lift if a body lays in it
[23:22:42] <Loetmichel> as much as the body "dunks in"
[23:23:44] <Loetmichel> maybe the feeling is mor like you put a pvc foil on the surface of a swimmingpool and than ypurself on the surface of the foil
[23:24:05] <Loetmichel> you will sink in sole centimeters until the water is carriing you
[23:24:12] <Loetmichel> carrying
[23:24:58] <Loetmichel> and around you the foil will slightly bulge
[23:26:12] <IG-garage> well, i slept once on the bed of some construction. air filled, wasn't bad
[23:26:44] <IG-garage> never slept on water bed, although slept and sometimes sleep on the wood due to certain circumstances
[23:28:27] * IG-garage plays to play with /configs/sim/axis_9axes.ini, plans to rotate the axis B (the one around 0Y)
[23:29:56] <Loetmichel> anyways, my wife has just stopped snoring, so i'll ue my chance and go to bed ;-)
[23:30:04] <Loetmichel> gn8
[23:30:07] <IG-garage> ok
[23:30:14] <IG-garage> what gn8
[23:30:29] <IG-garage> ah, gnnight
[23:30:41] -!- AC-130U has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
[23:31:07] <IG-garage> ok, good night. I'm at the tomorrow (6:30 AM and ya watchin' for everything to be all right)
[23:32:56] <danimal_garage> traction control is for pussies
[23:33:31] <danimal_garage> sideways is fun :)
[23:34:09] <danimal_garage> no ice here, i'm in the desert
[23:35:16] <IG-garage> danimal_garage: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4I6QoJoC44
[23:35:36] <danimal_garage> cant watch stuff on this pc, it's too slow
[23:36:00] <IG-garage> too slow like 512 kbps?
[23:36:16] <danimal_garage> just too slow
[23:36:23] <IG-garage> 'Icon Fall 2010 Motorcycle Gear at RevZilla.com '
[23:37:58] -!- The_Ball has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
[23:38:07] * IG-garage is about to get some belief in something and avoid any beer 'n' such anymore. 'll believe in 'love is the answer' maybe
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[23:45:02] <IG-garage> why "g01 c90 f90" hasn't rotated the EMC2.4/AXIS text
[23:45:59] <IG-garage> uh, C is on the spindle
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