#emc | Logs for 2011-07-20

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[00:13:50] <JT-Shop> http://www.linuxcnc.org/component/option,com_kunena/Itemid,20/func,view/catid,38/id,10241/limit,6/limitstart,30/lang,english/#11664
[00:14:25] <JT-Shop> is backlash compensation done in stepgen, trajectory planner, motion???
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[00:29:28] <KimK> JT-Shop: I don't know from looking at the code, but it can't be stepgen or it wouldn't work with servos, so that's out. It has to be trajectory planner or motion.
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[00:38:38] <tom3p> motion.c mentions the word a few time, and ins in a struct there and on axis.mumble pins
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[00:45:59] <tom3p> and the diagram on page 5/76 of the dev handbook place it sequentially
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[00:52:22] <tom3p> see control.c, the top of the file explains the individual functions used in calculating and compensating for the value
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[01:35:51] <danimal_garage> hi
[01:36:21] <danimal_garage> JT-Shop: i got the little cnc machine
[01:36:38] <danimal_garage> it's actually pretty nice
[01:36:50] <danimal_garage> it has ball screws too
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[01:44:46] <danimal_garage> Hi John
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[01:46:43] <alex4nder> cool, my steppers, G540,. and power supply showed up .
[01:46:50] <danimal_garage> nice
[01:47:02] <danimal_garage> is tge machine running yet?
[01:47:52] <alex4nder> tge?
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[01:48:17] <danimal_garage> the
[01:48:58] <alex4nder> oh,. it's a 'cnc ready' taig, with handles installed
[01:49:21] <alex4nder> so yes and no
[01:50:08] <danimal_garage> ah
[01:50:36] <alex4nder> but this is My First Mill (tm) so I'm learning a lot as I go
[01:51:12] <danimal_garage> steppers arent too bad to set up
[01:51:29] <alex4nder> cool
[01:51:45] <danimal_garage> my mill used to be stepper
[01:52:07] <alex4nder> I thought about going stepper, but I didn't want to spend all my time focusing on servos rather than making a working mill
[01:52:11] <Valen> then he came to the light side ;->
[01:52:24] <alex4nder> er about going servo
[01:52:29] <Valen> servos aren't particularly difficult
[01:52:45] <danimal_garage> as long as you get the right kind
[01:52:50] <alex4nder> I've set them up before (on engine dynos, and for automotive throttle control)
[01:53:16] <alex4nder> but like I said, this is my first mill.. so I made a judgement call.. that, and my steppers ended up costing $30/each
[01:53:41] <Valen> thats where the steppers are good
[01:53:43] <Valen> cheap cheap
[01:53:48] <danimal_garage> i just picked up a litttle desktop cnc mill
[01:53:55] <danimal_garage> it has servos
[01:53:58] <alex4nder> cool
[01:54:00] <alex4nder> which one?
[01:54:17] <danimal_garage> http://sandiego.craigslist.org/csd/tls/2499091693.html
[01:54:34] <danimal_garage> just got it, it's still in the van
[01:54:48] <alex4nder> haha
[01:54:53] <danimal_garage> needs a spindle
[01:55:07] <alex4nder> for $100 that's pretty damn good, no matter what you got
[01:55:25] <danimal_garage> pretty solid actually, it's got nice linear rails and ball screws
[01:55:56] <danimal_garage> yea, i paid a little more since he got too many calls
[01:56:23] <alex4nder> werd
[01:56:25] <danimal_garage> i got a heavy duty bag sealer, an lcd monitor, and the machine for $220
[01:56:30] <alex4nder> nice
[01:57:24] <danimal_garage> im going to use it to mark the parts i make
[01:57:44] <alex4nder> you going to start building parts for something specific?
[01:57:56] <danimal_garage> already do
[01:58:18] <danimal_garage> www.homebrewedcomponents.com
[01:58:36] <danimal_garage> my company
[01:58:37] <alex4nder> ah sick
[01:59:29] <alex4nder> I'm thinking about building a bike, I'll have to hit you up
[02:00:07] <danimal_garage> cool, SB is a great place to ride
[02:00:19] <danimal_garage> did some mtb races there
[02:00:37] <Valen> ey danimal_garage where do you get yer 7075 from? if i ask for it here they look at me like i've grown an extra head
[02:01:01] <danimal_garage> cal mesa steel, it's a local place
[02:01:07] <Valen> :-<
[02:01:30] <danimal_garage> it's hard to get, they order it specifically for me
[02:05:33] <danimal_garage> bbl, adios
[02:05:50] <alex4nder> late
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[08:29:45] <Loetmichel> mornin'
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[10:23:09] <anonimasu> did anyone of you find a pressure transducer for acetylene/oxygen?
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[11:28:12] * jthornton needs to quit beliving people on the forum when they say something doesn
[11:28:14] <jthornton> 't work
[11:28:29] <jthornton> believing
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[12:17:17] <jthornton> a bit more done... http://gnipsel.com/shop/inside/inside.xhtml
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[13:45:48] <mazafaka> Gave been in the garage, and my neighbor gifted me some potato and sauerkraut! And some tiny-salted lart, but it's for cats and dog, they have eaten it already.
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[13:47:02] <mazafaka> Gas tank of my second motorcycle is like sand blasted after this small angle grinder and brush with 0.5 wires. I will left this brush for welding, not for paint works.
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[15:33:14] <Jymmm> Hi Everybody!
[15:34:56] <Jymmm> HAHAHAHAHAHA, imagine getting one of these just to find the next morning it's been stolen and recycled... http://shapesaluminumfence.com/
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[15:41:17] <mazafaka> yhey would better produce bicycles for poor kids and we will use rows of bushes as a fence
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[15:46:00] <mazafaka> mazafaka's 'fortune': "Have just found happiness in a simpler life. Producing bikes for poor steampunkers.'
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[15:58:42] <Loetmichel> re @ home
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[16:03:24] <danimal_garage> hi
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[16:19:48] <danimal_garage> ha, i just called the people who made that little cnc machine i baught, they want to buy it back
[16:20:05] <archivist_emc> hehe
[16:20:12] <archivist_emc> prifit!
[16:20:16] <danimal_garage> haha
[16:20:18] <archivist_emc> profit!
[16:20:24] <danimal_garage> only problem is i'd have to buy another one
[16:20:30] <Loetmichel> danimal_garage: do you have photos?
[16:20:37] <archivist_emc> there is always a downside
[16:20:51] <danimal_garage> http://www.jetec.com/brochures/lms_series.html
[16:20:52] <skunkworks_> danimal_garage: how does it look?
[16:20:56] <danimal_garage> good
[16:21:02] <danimal_garage> nice quality
[16:21:08] <danimal_garage> it had ball screws
[16:21:17] <Loetmichel> danimal_garage: use the cnc to build your own (better suitable) CNC, THEN sell it to the original builders ;-)
[16:21:40] <skunkworks_> nice - and servos - only way to go.. Are they brushed or brushless?
[16:21:40] <danimal_garage> it weighs probably a couple hundred lbs
[16:21:45] <danimal_garage> brushed
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[16:22:04] <danimal_garage> http://sandiego.craigslist.org/csd/tls/2499091693.html
[16:22:05] <skunkworks_> we have used quite a few of the amc drives - like them
[16:22:11] <archivist_emc> sounds like you got lucky
[16:22:23] <danimal_garage> that shows the drives, they say brushed so i am assuming they are
[16:22:35] <danimal_garage> i totally got lucky
[16:22:54] <danimal_garage> he threw in a bag sealer for $50, i found the same one on ebay for $600
[16:23:28] <danimal_garage> i'm going to throw it up there for $300
[16:23:53] <archivist_emc> or keep and bag up your products
[16:24:07] <danimal_garage> that'll pay for the spindle i need
[16:24:29] <danimal_garage> archivist_emc: i would, but it's way overkill, i can get away with a little $40 one
[16:24:41] <danimal_garage> this one is 24" long and 1500 watts
[16:24:53] <archivist_emc> ah proper size
[16:25:17] <danimal_garage> it has a little foot switch, the thing closes by itself
[16:26:55] <danimal_garage> http://cgi.ebay.com/24-Impulse-automatic-Sealer-5mm-Heat-Seal-Plastic-Bags-/190440574131?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c57248cb3
[16:26:59] <danimal_garage> it's that one
[16:29:07] <danimal_garage> anyone have any experience with those cheap spindles on ebay?
[16:29:09] <syyl_> as i said :D
[16:29:14] <syyl_> ball screws
[16:29:30] <danimal_garage> yep!
[16:29:37] <syyl_> and what kind of ways?
[16:29:41] <syyl_> linear bearings?
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[16:30:50] <danimal_garage> http://cgi.ebay.com/2-2KW-WATER-COOLED-SPINDLE-MOTOR-ER20-INVERTER-DRIVE-/250748327119?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a61c3d4cf
[16:30:56] <danimal_garage> yes, linear bearings
[16:31:12] <danimal_garage> pretty nice machine
[16:31:35] <syyl_> :)
[16:31:49] <danimal_garage> it'll be plenty fine for engraving
[16:32:03] <danimal_garage> i just gotta get a spindle
[16:32:23] <syyl_> 2,2kW is a bit on the large side, hm? :D
[16:32:48] <danimal_garage> what do you suggest?
[16:32:52] <syyl_> i bet, the 0,8kW is more than enough
[16:33:03] <danimal_garage> are those any good?
[16:33:19] <syyl_> at work we have two datron machines with 0,6kW spindles, they are ok up to 6mm endmills
[16:33:33] <syyl_> if those chinese spindles are any good, i dont know
[16:33:42] <syyl_> and my space key squeeks
[16:33:46] <danimal_garage> interesting
[16:34:17] <syyl_> there are a lot of people that have those air/watercooled chinese spindles
[16:34:25] <danimal_garage> i wonder how much milling this could do in aluminum
[16:34:38] <syyl_> and are pretty pleased with it
[16:34:39] <syyl_> but
[16:34:47] <syyl_> no long term experience
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[16:35:17] <syyl_> i think, that you will reach the limit of the machine itself pretty fast in aluminum
[16:35:25] <danimal_garage> i figured it would probably be fine for just engraving
[16:35:48] <syyl_> but "highspeed machining" could work...little cutting depth, high feed
[16:36:14] <danimal_garage> i've never used a little mill like this before, my smallest machine is over a ton
[16:36:21] <danimal_garage> thats what i was thinking
[16:36:21] <syyl_> hihi
[16:37:27] <syyl_> for engraving it should be more than adequate
[16:37:41] <syyl_> just from the pictures told
[16:39:16] <danimal_garage> yea
[16:40:00] <danimal_garage> it would be cool to put a laser engraver on it
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[17:10:43] <Loetmichel> hmm, even smaller machines are capable of steel and aluminium milling
[17:10:58] <mazafaka> steel?
[17:11:04] <Loetmichel> just use more spindle RPM and lesser cutting depth
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[17:11:34] <mazafaka> cutting depth like 0.5 mm with rpm about 5000?
[17:11:56] <mazafaka> uh... need to build one from plywood.
[17:12:02] <Loetmichel> mazafaka: http://www.cyrom.org/hajo/stempel2.avi
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[17:12:12] <mazafaka> i'll see
[17:12:25] <Loetmichel> 2mm carbide bit in silver steel
[17:12:43] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/hajo/stempel.avi <- 3mm end mill carbide
[17:14:10] <mazafaka> i'm downloading with 'wget'
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[17:17:43] <syyl_> [1911:34] <mazafaka> cutting depth like 0.5 mm with rpm about 5000?
[17:17:52] <mazafaka> yeah?
[17:18:00] <syyl_> 0,5mm would be the upper limit for a 2mm endmill in steel
[17:18:35] <mazafaka> and what if the spindle is 125 W mini-drill?
[17:18:41] <anonimasu> then you are screwed
[17:18:44] <Loetmichel> 0,2mm depth, 5000 rpm
[17:18:45] <syyl_> jip
[17:19:12] <Loetmichel> the spindle can be a mini-drill but only for drive
[17:19:27] * anonimasu did some slotting at 5000rpm the other day
[17:19:34] <Loetmichel> minidrills are to "bend-able" for steel milling
[17:19:55] <mazafaka> "only for drive"?
[17:20:02] <syyl_> will ruin a endmill in a few seconds
[17:20:11] <syyl_> cutting edges break away
[17:20:25] <mazafaka> why? the speed is adjustable
[17:20:44] <anonimasu> 12mm cutter :D and 12mm deep..
[17:20:45] <syyl_> but the vibrations from the not-so-sturdy bearings
[17:21:00] <syyl_> will kill the tool
[17:21:44] <syyl_> anonimasu, sounds like a bit more serious mill :D
[17:21:52] <anonimasu> like a 5hp cut :)
[17:21:59] <syyl_> hrhr
[17:22:05] <Loetmichel> mazafaka: the bearings and spindle are WAX to weak
[17:22:08] <Loetmichel> WAY
[17:22:36] <Loetmichel> you coud however use a ER11 stub and drive it with the motor of a minidrill
[17:22:42] <anonimasu> tho, I like lower chiploads and lower doc and and higher speed/feed
[17:22:59] <mazafaka> that's what i think about, could use flexible shaft to somewhat like hub with larger bearings, rigid one.
[17:23:00] <Loetmichel> er11 stub ++ two or three GOOD bearings
[17:23:18] <anonimasu> I tried my seco MP2500 inserts today ^_^
[17:23:23] <anonimasu> they cut very nicely without coolant
[17:23:40] <syyl_> i'm more the low speed, bigger cut guy :D
[17:23:41] <Loetmichel> mazafaka: just a few weeks ago i got my ER11 stub to make my owb spindle
[17:23:52] <syyl_> roughing cutter is my friend
[17:24:02] <Loetmichel> two fully ceramic bearings are in stock here...
[17:24:10] <syyl_> full flood cooleant :D
[17:24:20] <Loetmichel> and a 2kW brusless motor from a model plane ;-)
[17:24:26] <mazafaka> and set of CNC stuff is about USD 700 I guess...
[17:24:49] <Loetmichel> mazafaka:
[17:24:51] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=11998
[17:24:58] <mazafaka> And if this all will be quite cheap, and the size of the machine will be little.
[17:25:15] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=10468
[17:25:33] <mazafaka> spindle with collets
[17:25:48] <Loetmichel> will look like this when finished:
[17:25:49] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=436
[17:26:00] <mazafaka> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=10468 <-- what, ceramic bearings?
[17:26:17] <Loetmichel> yes
[17:26:39] <Loetmichel> AlO2 for the rings and Si for the balls
[17:26:55] <mazafaka> I can use whatever 220 V motor for the spindle actually
[17:26:59] <Loetmichel> can run dry with about 80000 rpm
[17:27:47] <mazafaka> maYBE aluminum nitride or something, AlO2 is simply very rough
[17:28:42] <Loetmichel> it says alo2 and Si on the package (sorry, lost it)
[17:28:53] <mazafaka> idea of high-sped machining is better than big heavy-weight machines made of cast iron
[17:29:00] <Loetmichel> and 80kRPM maximum dry running
[17:29:08] <mazafaka> it's chinese authors say
[17:30:05] <syyl_> you cant do all machining via highspeed cutting
[17:30:18] <syyl_> there is still need for big humps of cast iron :)
[17:32:51] <anonimasu> hm..
[17:32:51] <anonimasu> but you know, high speed cutting wont cut alot of steel
[17:32:58] <anonimasu> try that on the hardox 400 of mine :D
[17:33:04] <mazafaka> I actually think of 380 W spindle with a chuck, and somewhat like this little spindle instead of cutter, or something like this. need some turning, like tight bolts.
[17:33:04] <Loetmichel> mazafaka: i stand corrected: the manufactirer website says: rings ZrO2 and Balls of Si3N4
[17:33:28] <Loetmichel> and 60krpm maximum
[17:33:55] <mazafaka> Zirconium oxide or something.... directly from the meteors in the space... :)
[17:35:33] <syyl_> yeah anonimasu
[17:35:38] <mazafaka> oh, could be usual mill with a horizontally-spinning lathe chuck, indexed.
[17:35:49] <syyl_> thats where the iron beasts stand out :D
[17:36:12] <syyl_> and sometimes you just want to hog steel away with a big cutter...
[17:36:27] <anonimasu> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1K5QjR3hyU&feature=related
[17:36:29] <anonimasu> inconel milling :D
[17:36:50] <syyl_> inconel looks always like hell to machine :D
[17:36:55] <Loetmichel> mazafaka: made a test lately with a little 300W Brushless and a Proxxon FBS230 spindle...
[17:36:56] <anonimasu> I never cut any yet..
[17:37:10] <anonimasu> I hope it wont show up :D
[17:37:27] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/pce/alex_spindel2.MOV
[17:37:33] <mazafaka> anonimasu: high-speed will rather engraving it, but with different depth each time, so will have to use correct pathes, especially with g41 / g42 tol diameter compensation when initial cut starts somewhere not at the endpoint of the primitive.
[17:37:46] <syyl_> try alubronce
[17:38:01] <anonimasu> mazafaka: what?
[17:38:03] <syyl_> doesnt look like much
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[17:38:26] <syyl_> but its pretty wear-proof while machined ;)
[17:38:43] <anonimasu> mazafaka: engraving spindle?
[17:39:00] <Loetmichel> syyl: iconel is a beast because of the work-hardening it does
[17:39:31] <anonimasu> you need a rigid enough machine to rip that away :)
[17:39:56] <mazafaka> anonimasu: with traditional milling the end mill can touch relatively large amount of metal, with high-speed machining or thin end mill, you will have to cut only a tiny amount of material at each moment, or reduce feed rate to very tiny speed, say, 50 mm/minute for the end mill to stay not broken. Or maybe I'm wrong.
[17:40:58] <anonimasu> yes but work hardening steels dosent work with that strategy very well
[17:41:23] <anonimasu> since you need torque and rigidity to rip up the work hardened parts of the material
[17:42:10] <mazafaka> with g41 or g42 used without initial arc on a closed contour, the end mill in the end of contour and new, more deep cut, will have encountered the material which is left because initial move was 'compensated' and has left some material
[17:42:38] <mazafaka> anonimasu: yeah, but i am about the hobby machine
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[17:43:15] <mazafaka> torque and rigidity reminds me manual mill and lathe I worked at (only little amount of time)
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[17:45:13] <anonimasu> hsm is all nice and dandy specially for non ferrous stuff...
[17:45:28] <anonimasu> but once you get into hard stuff even hsm toolpaths require torque and rigid machines
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[17:48:11] <IchGuckLive> the mashine prices are comming down week by week
[17:48:38] <IchGuckLive> as okuma starts the USA market sweep all manufactures are tickin on the prices
[17:49:06] <IchGuckLive> Haas VF-5 new with 4th axis ready for less then 30.000USD
[17:56:26] <danimal_garage> wow
[17:56:38] <danimal_garage> wonder what a vf0 is going for
[17:56:41] <mazafaka> Friend has advised to make only a tiny corners at the cutter on lathe. 0.05 mm or 0.1, just to touch the edge with diamond clad wheel to avoid risk of cracks at random places because of its brittle structure.
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[17:58:24] <danimal_garage> IchGuckLive: where'd you find that price?
[17:58:45] <IchGuckLive> local dealer
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[17:59:04] <IchGuckLive> shoudt be in Augest at yours to
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[18:00:27] <danimal_garage> dont see any special pricing
[18:00:51] <danimal_garage> oh well i cant buy right now anyways
[18:01:07] <IchGuckLive> if your shop got more then 4 mashines you will be informed automaticly
[18:01:07] <danimal_garage> pesky mortgage gets in the way of all my fun
[18:01:50] <syyl> i want the haas om-2 :D
[18:02:23] <alex4nder> hey
[18:02:32] <danimal_garage> hey
[18:03:31] <danimal_garage> time to walk the dogs, bbl
[18:04:29] <MrSunshine> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CjU4tfVRsNc&feature=related <- is it just me or is that tool bit bending like hell ? :)
[18:04:30] <mazafaka> Loetmichel: http://www.cyrom.org/pce/alex_spindel2.MOV <-- is it a stepper motor?
[18:04:50] <mazafaka> be right back
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[18:06:50] <IchGuckLive> by for me 2
[18:06:53] -!- IchGuckLive [IchGuckLive!~chatzilla@95-89-104-26-dynip.superkabel.de] has parted #emc
[18:09:18] <alSMT> Problem: Tool length compensation not compensating? emc-users mail list just think someone should ask if he used the reload from the menu I'm not on my email machine or I would send him one
[18:12:42] <anonimasu> mhm, maybe it's time to sell the car and buy a vmc.
[18:17:34] <alex4nder> damn, I'd really like get a centroid console screen/case/buttons..
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[18:32:21] <danimal_garage> i'd really like $1,000,000
[18:32:54] <Jymmm> danimal_garage: Done, where would you like it delivered to?
[18:33:26] <alex4nder> danimal_garage: can I get a gold toilet rolled in with these wants?
[18:34:15] <danimal_garage> Jymmm: where did you get your laser?
[18:34:43] <danimal_garage> alex4nder: sure, although i don't think it would work well. I suggest $100 bills
[18:35:51] <danimal_garage> more absorbant
[18:36:32] <danimal_garage> Jymmm: i picked up a little desktop 3 axis cnc, debating if i should order a spindle or a laser
[18:36:47] <danimal_garage> i just want to use it for part marking
[18:37:57] <anonimasu> tho, vf0 is too small for me
[18:38:12] <danimal_garage> perfect for me
[18:38:23] <anonimasu> and belt driven spindle..
[18:38:41] <anonimasu> the stuff I read is that it's a vf-1 light
[18:39:34] <syyl> danimal_garage, go for a spindle
[18:39:47] <syyl> its more universal
[18:40:13] <danimal_garage> the laser would be easier
[18:40:47] <danimal_garage> i don't really need universal, all i will ever do with it is mark parts
[18:41:12] <danimal_garage> i have a full size cnc mill for machining
[18:41:32] <syyl> damn it :D
[18:42:00] <danimal_garage> my concern with the spindle/engraving is variances in part thicknesses
[18:42:53] <danimal_garage> it would be a major pain since i have a ton of different parts, and not much for flat surface area on them
[18:43:02] <anonimasu> danimal_garage: just a idea, what about measuring spinde load?
[18:43:02] <syyl> thats true
[18:43:10] <anonimasu> for the initial plunge
[18:43:19] <syyl> datron can do this
[18:43:25] <anonimasu> and wait for it to reach a treshold and then start cutting?
[18:43:37] <danimal_garage> can emc do that?
[18:43:39] <anonimasu> yes
[18:43:49] <danimal_garage> hmm
[18:44:07] <anonimasu> i'd go in place, hoook up a comp to my probe routine that redirects the spindle load to a threshold trigger
[18:44:45] <danimal_garage> still wouldnt follow a contour, would it?
[18:44:56] <danimal_garage> so i'd have to 3d program it anyways
[18:45:02] <anonimasu> yeah
[18:45:12] <anonimasu> you just add a extra line to probe at start
[18:45:39] <anonimasu> just feed until the spindle stops freewheeling
[18:46:10] <anonimasu> err freewheeling/free-spinning
[18:46:41] <danimal_garage> if the load increases, will it retract the z to follow the contour?
[18:46:43] <anonimasu> or electrically connect your parts, and measure current
[18:46:55] <anonimasu> mhm, that's more complex
[18:47:06] <danimal_garage> anodized aluminum, no current
[18:47:16] <anonimasu> your cutting through the anodizing right?
[18:47:23] <syyl> http://www.datron.de/en/products/machine-tools/sample-videos/videos-front-panels.html
[18:47:24] <anonimasu> i think with tomp's stuff (for moving axes while in motion) you could do that based on spindle load
[18:47:25] <danimal_garage> yea
[18:47:35] <danimal_garage> hmm
[18:47:48] <anonimasu> or the thc, stuff for plasma..
[18:47:54] <syyl> thats in my opinion the best way to engrave parts with various thickness
[18:47:56] <anonimasu> just wire up spindle load instead
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[18:48:10] <syyl> have two of those machines at work, and its realy nice
[18:48:13] <Loetmichel> hmmm, somethin completly offtopic, but this is the only international channel i am in: is there a expression in english for "you are blocking my sight"? (like in german we say: "dein vater war kein glaser" meaning "your Father wasnt a glazier")
[18:48:49] <Loetmichel> hat a discussion with my wife about it, she (teacher german/english) thinks there is none
[18:48:51] <PCW> Should be a little drive torque peak when you hit the material, I think EMC2.5 can grab the Z coordinate
[18:49:07] <Loetmichel> had
[18:49:20] <alex4nder> Loetmichel: what is the intent of the saying?
[18:49:24] <PCW> Please move, I can't see through you
[18:49:37] <Loetmichel> for "you are blocking my sight"?
[18:49:41] <danimal_garage> pcw, the problem would be following a surface that isnt flat
[18:49:56] <alex4nder> Loetmichel: I mean, is it actually about someone blocking your vision, or is there some subtext?
[18:50:11] <Loetmichel> no subtext
[18:50:19] <alex4nder> oh, then just: you're blocking my view
[18:50:22] <alex4nder> or whatever
[18:50:23] <Loetmichel> if someone standing in the way
[18:50:23] <PCW> Yeah, Either 3D model or laser/inkjet
[18:50:42] <newbynobi> Is it posible to change the color of an hal_button (GladeVCP) using Python code? I tried a lot, but I can't find a solution.
[18:50:55] <Loetmichel> (mostly if someone is tanding in front of the tv ;-)
[18:51:31] <newbynobi> Loetmichel: Just screem "Out of my View"
[18:51:36] <Loetmichel> hihi
[18:51:37] <alex4nder> Loetmichel: get out of the way, if you're telling someone to move
[18:52:05] <danimal_garage> i havent found much in the way of inkjet, but then again i don't know what i'm looking for
[18:52:16] <Loetmichel> i was just cuious if the english language has such expressions which are "around the corner"
[18:53:01] <Loetmichel> like saying "you fahter wasnt a glacier" when meaning "you are not made of glass, i cant look through you, get out of the way!"
[18:55:21] <archivist_emc> yes it does, loads of them like you would make a good barn door...huh from the idiot....I cant see though you.. get out of the way
[18:55:48] <Loetmichel> hmm, nomally following the contour in engraving machines is made by loosening the ballnut in Z and using a PTFE shoe around the engraving bit which glides over the Workpiece
[18:56:42] <Loetmichel> archivist: oh, the barn door is nice. have to remember that ;-)
[18:56:48] <Loetmichel> thanx
[18:57:28] <archivist_emc> as thick as two short planks, an idiot
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[18:59:39] <Loetmichel> archivist_emc: i may noch be the sharpest pencil in the box, but i think i get it ;-)
[18:59:50] <newbynobi> To All : No Idear? Is it posible to change the color of an hal_button (GladeVCP) using Python code? I tried a lot, but I can't find a solution.
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[19:00:52] <psha> newbynobi: color?
[19:00:56] <psha> text color or button color?
[19:01:07] <psha> hal_buttin is GtkButton with some extra attributes
[19:01:15] <psha> so solution is same as for GtkButton
[19:01:21] <newbynobi> psha: Button color
[19:01:27] <psha> wait a bit
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[19:07:57] <psha> newbynobi: you should create your own style object
[19:08:05] <psha> and then call button.set_style(s)
[19:09:48] <newbynobi> psha: Sounds dificult for me, I am just a beginner in this. I will search the internet for an example Thanks.
[19:11:42] <psha> newbynobi: http://psha.org.ru/tmp/gtk-button-color.py
[19:11:47] <psha> this may serve as example
[19:11:53] <psha> oops
[19:12:00] <psha> sorry, not yet uploaded
[19:12:52] <newbynobi> Thanks I will take a look. This may help to avoid a lot of hal_led in my GUI.
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[19:14:11] <psha> you may try to set theese properties in glade
[19:14:15] <psha> but i've not tried this
[19:14:27] <psha> or just instead of captions use icons
[19:14:39] <newbynobi> I'll give an Info if it work.
[19:15:43] <psha> wait a bit, i'll restore my connection and upload
[19:15:51] <newbynobi> yepp
[19:16:25] <psha> try to download
[19:16:52] <psha> example button has 3 colors - faded/normal red for non-pressed state and green for pressed
[19:16:57] <psha> i hope that'll help you
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[19:34:01] <newbynobi> psha: It is working under an GladeVCP GUI. Now I will try to conect the hal_button with an digital in, whitch should then change the color. This is a Button to open an ToolChanger Cover and whenn this cover is opened the button should be red, otherwise grey. Thanks again!
[19:34:44] <psha> hm
[19:35:03] <psha> hal_button is _output_ widget
[19:35:09] <psha> you press it - pin value changes
[19:35:23] <psha> if you change pin value - button state is not changed
[19:35:38] <psha> hal_led in controrarry is input widget
[19:35:45] <psha> change pin - changed state
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[19:36:36] <newbynobi> I know, the input is connected through an digital in and hal and should only change the color. I will try to use an toggle button I gues
[19:37:40] <psha> same fault
[19:37:47] <psha> togglebutton is output widget too
[19:38:01] <newbynobi> But I can set through hal the state of the toggle button, or not?
[19:38:18] <psha> you may drive it from hal pin but you need to hook on value-changed signal of pin and change (set_active) button accirdingly
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[19:38:32] <psha> newbynobi: no, you can not directly
[19:39:00] <psha> but you can using extra pin (input) and some glue code (connect('value-changed', lambda s: button.set_active(s.value))
[19:40:24] <newbynobi> That what I was trying, the input should change the active status of the toggle button.
[19:41:00] <psha> do you want to press it?
[19:41:04] <psha> or leave it just as indicator?
[19:42:17] <newbynobi> Both can happen. If the cover don't close well, the button should remain pressed. And if I preee it, the cover should open so I am able to put tools in the changer
[19:43:17] <psha> hm
[19:44:21] <psha> so you'll end up with 2 pins and one toggle button
[19:44:25] <psha> hal_togglebutton
[19:44:40] <psha> it's output pin triggers open/close mechanism
[19:44:57] <psha> which in turn signals it's state through input pin back to button
[19:45:11] <psha> so when input pin state changes it triggers togglebutton state
[19:45:25] <psha> however you need to be accurate not to fall into loop
[19:45:37] <psha> you may take a look on hal_actions.py file
[19:45:46] <psha> at ToggleAction wrapper
[19:47:03] <newbynobi> hal_actions.py, has no URL, where can I find it?
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[19:49:37] <danimal_garage> yawn
[19:50:08] <syyl> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/CIMG0755.JPG
[19:50:13] <syyl> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/CIMG0753.JPG
[19:50:25] <syyl> my rotary axis makes some progress
[19:51:42] <danimal_garage> nice!
[19:51:51] <danimal_garage> did you make everything aside from the bearings?
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[19:52:29] <syyl> aside from the bearings and the harmonic drive in the middle
[19:52:44] <newbynobi> syyl: is the housing out of ALU?
[19:52:54] <syyl> yes
[19:53:10] <danimal_garage> how big is it going to be?
[19:53:19] <newbynobi> I don't think thats an good Idear, because of thermic reason
[19:53:29] <syyl> outside diameter is 80mm
[19:53:41] <syyl> dont think its going to heat up very much
[19:53:50] <danimal_garage> whats that in american?
[19:53:55] <syyl> uhm
[19:53:58] <syyl> 80/25,4
[19:54:02] <danimal_garage> a little over 3"?
[19:54:11] <syyl> 3,14"
[19:54:39] <danimal_garage> cool
[19:54:53] <danimal_garage> a lil guy
[19:55:11] <syyl> bit overengineered maybe..
[19:55:18] <danimal_garage> i've been keeping my eyes peeled for one
[19:55:32] <danimal_garage> looking for like an 8-12" one
[19:55:46] <syyl> first i wanted to convert my 6" rotary table
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[19:55:56] <syyl> but...its chinese precision :D
[19:56:00] <danimal_garage> yea
[19:56:05] <danimal_garage> i need something decent
[19:56:25] <syyl> ok for manual work, but with cnc, i think it wont live that long
[19:56:35] <danimal_garage> right
[19:56:41] <psha> newbynobi: in emc2 source or if you've installed emc2 deb package from buildbut just do dpkg -L emc2 | grep hal_action
[19:56:45] <syyl> mine will run in oilbath
[19:56:50] <danimal_garage> nice
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[19:57:19] <danimal_garage> lunch time! bbl
[19:57:26] <syyl> :)
[20:02:39] <newbynobi> psha: I got it.
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[20:03:23] <psha> if you thing it would be useful use case maybe we should add generic toggle action
[20:03:34] <psha> with input pin driving button state
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[20:05:18] <newbynobi> I thinhk it is an good Idear, because there are many reasons an toogle button should change through an hal pin. As Emergency Exit also toggles the coolant flood and other reasons.
[20:05:50] <psha> emergency is driven by emc state, not hal pin
[20:06:00] <psha> as power and puse/resume buttons (actions) does
[20:06:02] <newbynobi> I do switch off colling during toolchange and this is handles through digital in and out pin
[20:07:05] <newbynobi> And if I got an error during tool change, also some button should be resetet
[20:09:17] <newbynobi> Wife got home, so I have to leave.
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[21:29:02] <danimal_garage> I wonder if JT-Shop is all moved in yet
[21:30:21] <mazafaka> G-code for 9-axes machine can, for example, make use of local coordinate systems which are at some angle to the absolute coordinate system?
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[21:33:10] <andypugh> I think so, yes. I think it works for any number of axes.
[21:34:08] <mazafaka> and I can make software to keep the end mill perpendicular to the surface I'm milling?
[21:35:25] <mazafaka> So, is it true MasterCAM can create standard G-code as in NIST RS274NGC? I have to edit G-code from commercial software I use.
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[21:37:12] <andypugh> mazafaka: I think that the angle can only be a rotation about the Z axis, if we are talking about the same thing.
[21:37:35] <andypugh> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/html/gcode_main.html#sub:G10:-Set-Coordinate
[21:38:31] <andypugh> As well as the XYZ offsets of the coordinate system to the machine coordinate system, you can have a Z-rotation. (And I imagine that could get very confusing)
[21:39:16] <toastydeath> mazafaka, it's because you don't have your post correct
[21:39:51] <toastydeath> mastercam generates an APT-like intermediate language which is then sent through a compiler with machine-specific flags set defined in a postprocess
[21:40:09] <mazafaka> no, I'm not about the offsets this time. I'm about the capabilities of these 6- or 9-axes machines.
[21:41:27] <mazafaka> yeah, postprocessors are different. I'm using one (it's not for EMC) and have to edit it a bit (delete H00 H01 instead of tool changes, remove M18)
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[21:45:55] <mazafaka> What is more common, to use tool diameter compensation (g41 or g42), or to create the g-code in CAM software where this diameter is chosen in options?
[21:46:21] <mazafaka> Or all this isn't matter if the result is successful?
[21:47:12] <toastydeath> by far the former
[21:47:39] <toastydeath> for most tasks, the latter is a sign of a novice operator
[21:48:26] <mazafaka> so, g41 and g42 make good use at trained professional? :) (it's me)
[21:49:32] <toastydeath> yeah, because who cares what tool size you use for most conditions
[21:49:59] <toastydeath> the setup sheet should note the max and min tool radius the program can accomodate
[21:50:16] <toastydeath> if i decide i want to use a 1" tool instead of a 7/8"
[21:50:21] <toastydeath> who cares
[21:50:42] <mazafaka> it's ok now, but i still don't understand how would g-code look like if I assign end mill to be normal to the curvy surface...
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[21:54:39] <mazafaka> "if i decide i want to use a 1" tool instead of a 7/8" <-- you can compensate this with some imaginary 1/8" tool, which for the program for 7/8" will make a compensation as for a 1" tool
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[21:58:47] <andypugh> Tool diameter compensation means you can use reground tools with the same G-code, but only if the G-code is written for tool diameter compensation.
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[22:00:44] <mazafaka> yeah, but if it is already compensated, you still can edit it, and use some tool (G10 L1 P- R-) of certain diameter, which depends on the actual tool used and the one for which the program is created
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[22:12:23] <JT-Shop> danimal_garage: I'm moving all the stuff from the west side to the east side now lol
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[22:17:05] <danimal_garage> JT-Shop: Good luck!
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[22:59:14] <tom3p> scary scary, installed 8.04 on laptop for info, then it seemed the old 10.04 was lost.
[22:59:14] <tom3p> not lost ;) 8.04 uses a grub that cant see ext4... fixed with 10.04 live cd phew!!
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[23:03:46] <mazafaka> oh, reinstalled windows, cd-rom was bad, nor linux does not find the partitions. Now in new linux with windows in virtual box
[23:04:41] <tom3p> re-instllaed windows? didnt it hurt enough the first time? :)
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[23:09:46] <danimal_garage> lol
[23:10:07] <danimal_garage> yea windows sucks unless you need to run programs
[23:11:21] <mazafaka> well, have to use Windows
[23:12:08] <mazafaka> because of those your... programs, or how are they called...
[23:13:22] <mazafaka> HeeksCAD's SVN installation script creates 400 mb of some files in $HOME, and it lasts some long time
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[23:23:07] <mazafaka> I can do my favorite now and in Linux, too: defragment the HDD, imaginary one
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[23:40:41] <tom3p> mazafaka, i should apologize, i just had to check the system and boot into Vista which i use for chip programmers and AutoCad MDT !
[23:41:12] <mazafaka> What do you do with mechanical desktop?
[23:41:44] <tom3p> fixture & electrical cabinet design
[23:42:55] <mazafaka> uhu
[23:44:06] <mazafaka> i'll go sleep, I now see them both, windows and linux in one screen.
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[23:46:21] <mazafaka> usin seamless mode after Guest Additions installed, windows of the system from virtual box appear at the desktop along with other windows, with normal screen resolution. plan to use SprutCAM and EMC in one linux Mint
[23:46:37] <mazafaka> *'Right Control + L'
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