But, is DXF 2D or 3D?
theorb is now known as theorbtwo
dxf can do 3D triangles and wireframes
but it's not too useful, as far as I can tell
jepler- is now known as jepler
[02:33:38] <alex_chally> http://i.imgur.com/1M2O7.png
so that is my current wiring setup
[02:36:13] <alex_chally> http://i.imgur.com/j9Vku.png
that is a little better
Looks like you have a permanent 5 Ohm load across the DC supply. That cant be right...
(I guess the red line between the filter capacitor and the load dump resistor is not supposed to be there)
maybe it's a combination DC supply and heater
If it were up to me, I'd put the disconnect relay on the AC side
(so you dont break DC with the relays and you don't disconnect the filter cap from the inductive load)
wth is the 50W resistor for?
Oh, load dump
It's just wired wrong
Whoever's circuit that is, the estop portion has a serious flaw in that design.
[03:10:51] <Jymmm> http://i.imgur.com/j9Vku.png
If the (Power_ON) button gets stuck, or there is a short, the E-STOP will never work.
if the estop button gets stuck then the estop will never work either ;-P
If you hold in the power button, the estop will never work too.
Get a safety relay, they are well worth it.
it seems similar to how ours is wired
but's it's a hybrid ladder schematic, parts of the wiring are just assumed :)
Yeah, latching relay. FAIL for estop purposes.
we dont use a latching relay
we use a collapsing circuit
wired in a latching method
so how is a "safety relay" different?
they only operate when conditions are met
googling safety relay just seems to turn up lots of "we make safety relay" pages
they only operate when conditions are met
For example, if you open an interlock, you'll trip the estop circuit. Closing the interlock will not reset the estop alone, usually a manual reset needs to be performed
but only after the interlocks have been closed.
some do have auto/manul reset depending on the application.
thats how ours works
the current to hold the relay on runs through all the limit switches
and is provided by the relay itself
so if you trip a limit or hit estop the circuit collapses, the relay is de-energised
if the relay welds itself closed, what happens
you size the relay such that that doesn't happen
atmega: In a safety relay, there is a dual circuit
I know what a real safety circuit does, that just sounded like a single self latching relay
atmega: what did?
the collapsing circuit not-a-latching-relay
atmega: who are you talking about?
red the front page
the welded contact was directed at Valen
if you weld the contact in a safety relay how is it different?
Valen: read that link
which is why real safety circuits are dual
yeah, it says its a relay and you feed it inputs
like every other relay
Valen: It MONITORS itself, it's alsoa DUAL circuit
so its 2 relays
Read the whole page
I should print out that page at work
that page is great
it doesn't say that there is anything wrong with a latching relay however
If (for example) an interlocked guard is opened on an operating machine, the safety interlock switch will send a stop signal to that machine. In most circumstances the machine must not restart immediately when the guard is closed. The most common way of achieving this is to rely on a latching contactor start arrangement as shown in Fig. 42 (an interlocked guard door is used as an example here but the requirements apply to other protection devi
which is exactly what we have
Do you have a load dump circuit?
I should probably put a big zener on the other side of the relay to absorb stuff
and use two sets of contacts, in series
and no sinking circuits
i still dont understand why you cant use a collapsing circuit when that seems to be an industry standard
as described on that safety page
it also says: a single component failure within the device, interface or system shall not prevent normal stopping action from taking place
which a single latching relay would violate.
yeah, so put to relays in
we have a system at work with some funky Pilz? safety relay... it requires a NO and NC pair from each interlock.
looks expensive too... actually, it looks like a small PLC which would seem to defeat a lot of the 'safety' part
I'm never happy with the STI safety relays I have, they are very slick.
roh_ is now known as roh
Anyone awake? How do most of you all splice your wires on your stepper motors? I don't like the idea of 4 individual wires going to a nice neat 4 conductor cable with a god awful splice.
Dave911_ is now known as Dave911
solder and heat shrink is what I do
hm.. use a soldering iron and heat shrinking tube afterwards (of course add the tubing before9
all in a protective tube up to the motor
heh.. same as it is on our machine
i just need to fix the 'protective tube mount' on the z motor soon. it broke so its hanging on the cable
Heh, I used 4pin molex connectors between the motor and cable (PC power connectors)
mine has a tie wrap holding to the motor
I used those 'P' shaped nylon clamps
[07:49:57] <archivist> http://www.archivist.info/cnc/works2008/P1010199.JPG
pic from a couple of years ago
[07:50:04] <Jymmm> http://www.amazon.com/Nylon-Cable-Clamp-Thickness-Center/dp/B0015HS9HI
hm. the mount was a flimsy plastic part holding the tubeing...
These are what I use, http://www.amazon.com/Nylon-Cable-Clamp-Thickness-Center/dp/B0015HS9HI
* archivist notes the Z was not covered in tube at that stage
Just use one of the motor mounting screws
Hey, I'm trying to draw a mounting hole that's oval. the overall dimensions are .485 x .585 If I draw a rectangle using those dimensions, wth is the radius of the corners?
* Jymmm never really understood radius of a curve too well.
Like this router bit has a 1/4" radius, would that be a section of a half inch circle? http://routerbitworld.com/CMT-838-254-11-1-4-Radius-X-1-2-Cutting-Length-2-p/cmt%20838.254.11.htm
Jymmm: if the tool has a 1/4 radius, that means the diameter is 1/2
if you want to mill your rectangle, it will end up with 1/4 radius corners
alex_joni: Ah, ok. thanks!
hmm.. that tool has a diameter of 1"
so your corner radius will be 1/2"
alex_joni: It's always puzzled me when you see a piece of furniture and you want to measure the round over trim piece so you can duplicate it
you can measure inside
and work from there
or on the outside edge
hey archivist quite a while ago you posted a pic of a mill that was a bit odd, was basically a big box type overhead gantry with a set of stacked rotary's that mounted off the sides
I dont spose you know what I should google to find it again
I'm desiging a mill along those lines
[10:40:05] <archivist> http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJCPD/PD/2010/2010_03_20_beichle/
was it that one
or the DMG
ooo thats sexy too http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:DeckelMaho-DMU50e-MachiningCenter.jpg
not quite, it was a cad
in a wiki as i recall
archivist: you bought that wacky thing?
no I did not
Valen, I know the pic and this machine does not have that pic bookmarked it was on wikipedia or wikimedia was a 5 axis DMG
Im trying to find
dont worry too much
izua is now known as bender
hermle not dmg
thats the one
I want to make one as well
[11:03:45] <Valen> http://www.vapourforge.com/temp/mill/
is where we are so far
10mm Al for the inner walls
back it with 10mmx70mm webbing
then back fill between the webs with phenolic basalt, (our version of granite epoxy)
then another sheet of something like 4mm over that
for the sammich construction
other option is to make it out of steel rather than Al
MarkusBec_ is now known as MarkusBec
the hermle gantry tracks are much higher to clear the rotary joints on the sides and the tool changer at the rear
bender is now known as izua
yeah, that was dads first attempt
I'm going to try and copy that hemle one more
I wonder what they drive the rotary table with
I started drawing one up in solidworks way back must do some more on it, I intend 20mm thick ally with extra webs
machine is not intended to be that big as I will use standard 5" rotary tables to get going
[11:36:15] <Valen> http://www.hermle.de/ablage/med_00000101_1225117081_C20_EN_2008.pdf
useful pdf :)
archivist: one of them in action http://www.myvideo.de/watch/4107844/5_Achs_Bearbeitung_auf_Hermle_C40U
you can really see that 6m/s acceleration
its not playing here :(
it took a while for it to start here
its not seeing my flash here
dunno i've got 10.1 on ubuntu 10.04 and it seems to work out of the box
this is still 8.04
ahh ywah that might do it
I cant download the video either sorry
[12:45:14] <archivist> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFzyBpWtcGQ
the rails + ballscrews + mounts for that machine pictured in 25mm size is $1000USD incl $340 delivery to australia
it'd quite comfertably crush you to a pulp if you got in its way ;->
I still want to know what they are using for the rotary drives
i wonder wth its making
uwe__ is now known as uwe_
[13:38:08] <Jymmm> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=euo8IKf2CuQ&NR=1
Got a robot arm? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1JcvCZFG0L0&NR=1
Use it to carve a tree! No need to cut the tree down =)
This is slick, makes a clay model, 3D scans it, upscales and CNC carves it http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKr1PUhpv5Q&NR=1
autotuning was a bust.. ;) shocker
it was more stable before
there is a at_pid hal componant - it has a tuning cycle where it oscollates the axis and tries to come up with the right pid values
Probably knows nothing about FF1
I know that servo tuning involves three elements (PID), I would think that if those values are computer controlled with proper feedback that auto tuning would be possible.
More like 5 if you include FF1 and FF2
did the autotune process itself work, even though you weren't too happy with the given results?
gene: Hey trouble!
can I use, in 2.4.3, (trouble? aw cmon) text named variables globally?
cradek: it seemed to be inconsistant - sometimes the osc was large - sometimes it was small. but still the numbers where too big
or do I still have to include them in the 0101 call 0100 linhes?
I don't know if it automatically puts 1 in ff1 when you are tuning for P,I and FF1 or if it actually came up with 1 (as it should be really close)
gene: Yeah, you're right. Trouble is WAY understated. Mayhem would be a far more accurate description.
Hey, I didn't know you couldn't do that, so I did it!
I dont know if ZN autotuning is even appropriate for the outer loop of velocity mode servos
where P is more like I
named parameter not terminated? please explain
What the hell is that shit?
gene probably likes that
its quite trashy.. but great for a moshpit^^
Eh, mot punk enough for a 'true' moshpit. More like 'lets get stupid pit'
Oh I know, more of a 'viva La BAM pit'
at least Jackass crew knew what they were getting into.
it does not have to be punk :)
wall-of-death and circle-pit do well with just trash-death-metal :P
The only TRUE moshpit is to punk, all others are just wannabe's
I still have a lot of bruises from the last swashbuckle-gig
* cpresser wont call it moshpit anymore :)
I was bouncing at a small gig. Told the lead singer no crowd diving/moshpits. When he dove, I had his ass half way to the door before the owner said let him slide this once.
hehe. the artists just love it :)
Had one partron that was all coked out. Took five of us to get him out the door. the "smallest" bouncer was 6' 200#, then he took on the cops in the parking lot
It was great, the cops came over at 2am to celebrate rooky graduation, we locked the doors and they just partied till 5am.
that may the difference to metal-people. they are only hard on the outside, but are always nice and back off when told so :)
Yeah must are that way, depending on alcohol content.
Yeah most are that way, depending on alcohol content.
that last sentence is true for all kinds of people
We were closing up and kicking ppl out. One girl (happy drunk) was sitting at a booth, and she said "Make me". I said come here, picked her up under one arm, her friend under the other arm. Carried them both to the door, she gave me a kiss on the cheek and skipped off to her car. lol
so it can be fun, being a bounce.. I see :)
Yeah, it can be. Lot of work too, very tiring.
it the gig carrys on, you cant just call it a day. that would kind of piss me off. especially when its not the kind of music I like
I never liked any of the music, all death metal.
depends.. I dont go to see a pure death-metal-gig. but one or two bands out of 5 are okay.
also, I like girls dressed in black^^
no, not goth! god help :)
just the nice ones with long hair and no make-up
brushes from a porter cable router are the same size to fit the big servos. :)
i have a acciera mill and the servo controllers are died
now i want to use some steppers and emc2
what kind of power should the steppers have?
if the servo motors are OK, get some new servo drives
i dont know
but i think its much easyer to use emc2 with steppers than with servo drives?
probably, but the performance and reliability of servos is worth the extra work/cost
but what kind of drives can i use?
there are 63V, 9.1A servos
look at mesa, and pico-systems
and you will need an interface card for the pc, mesa is popular.
i think, these are dc steppers is that possible? why not use uhu servo controllers?
cause they would use step/dir
emc2 can close the pid loop, you don't need a smart servodrive (I think UHU is a "smart" microcontroller based servodrive)
atm there are use heldt rossi servo controllers
with a step/dir control from the parallel port you loose the ability to see in emc2 where the machine actually is
but the mesa cards are expensive?
around 200 for the card
and what will i need to?
and how easy is it to use?
you get help here on irc and on the mailing list :)
you will need the mesa pci-card and then servo-drives (either mesa also, or pico systems, or maybe gecko)
so should i check, what is the problem with the heltd and rossi drives?
or are they not useable?
and the simple servo drives don't come with powersupplies, so you need to generate that 63VDC with a lot of amps yourself
if it's an old machine they might take a +/-10V analog velocity command
but why not 12Nm steppers?
is there not enough dynamic?
steppers vs servos is discussed a lot for example on cnczone
[17:05:06] <awallin> http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32221
[17:05:23] <awallin> http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17419
Hey guys, were do most of you all set your home position too? I'm thinking of using the very middle of all my axis... (also intend on using this cnc to print)
your home switch and the (0,0,0) of your machine coordinate system do not need to be in the same place
so just mount the home-switch where it is convenient to mount and where it is convenient to home the machine
when you are running a part you could/should be using work coordinate systems anyway so it doesn't matter much where the 0,0,0 of the machine coordinate system is
it's beneficial to have Z's home position and origin at the top of travel
I agree with awallin that XY don't matter much. I prefer XY origin near-left so all numbers are positive
some people do put XY origin in the middle of the table - doesn't matter one bit
Yea, I'm getting ready to try and figure out where to mount all my limits and homes..
the Z switch should be at the top - XY wherever is convenient
note that origin and home switch location don't need to be the same
That's a new one... I've heard of limit switches and home.. but not origin.
XY 0,0 is usually where you have a reference point when clamping the material to the bed.
awallin but could i use the glass measurement with steppers, too?
archivist_emc is now known as archivist
People have used step motors with encoder feedback but its a rather exotic and experimental setup
(step motors used as velocity mode servo with normal PID loop and stepgen in velocity mode))
[18:23:17] <pcw_home> http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/liverpool/hi/people_and_places/arts_and_culture/newsid_9005000/9005409.stm
I think I have most of the 2.4.3 changes figured out, but this one stumps the old man
s = 3000 returns a bad bumber format when I load it to emc, what gives?
gene only s3000
i tried that, still bitched
but i'll try again
on mine with s3000 it works
but the signal is not used
prehaps a problem in your hal file?
or try s 3000
next prob, m3, m4 are reversed????
in fact, m4 doesn't start the spindle
Hello... I'm trying to run the emc simulator on 10.04 but axis fails with the message " 'import site failed; " . My computer has no parallel port. Is there an easy way to fix this? thanks.
jepler has changed the topic to: EMC (Enhanced Machine Controller) is a linux-based opensource CNC control. | Latest release: EMC 2.4.4 | http://www.linuxcnc.org
a new release? sweet
jthornton_ is now known as jthornton
izua is now known as izua|doesnotlike
izua|doesnotlike is now known as izua
Question regarding gcode for arcs when doing a circle vs a helical path
The code I use for circles is a follows
How is a helical path different from that? Do I need I or J or K?
should i ask in CAM channel?
for EMC2 to do a helical you just add the Z to it
you are using EMC2 right?