aa-danimal-shop : Yes, I think so, last night. I don't know how to use IRC and I'm fumbling a bit.
Kirk_Wallace join the club
Kirk_Wallace, good going, no need to compile :)
tom3p : my scale value is off, so I get more output than the limits allow. It makes it so the knob position, let's say 50%, is different if I turn clock wise from when I turn counter-counter clockwise.
andypugh, great vid
yea, all i know is type letters and hit enter
It all felt so wild and wacky back when we were young :-/
lol that video is weird
some alcohol involved in that i net
Yes, really rather a lot, most of the time.
sounds like college to me
If you look carefully you can spot SImon Singh, who went on to write books (about Codes, Fermat's last theorem etc)
Yes, Imperial College London.
i wish i went to college
drinking without college really just seems like alcoholism
i told nephews not to do stupid things around cameras, maybe i was wrong
that waa great
tom3p today that'd be everywhere
tom3p : I set the scale to match 0 to 1024 input to 0 to 120% or actually 0 to 1.2, AXIS still starts at 100% and increments or decrements until I cross the 1024 , 0 border.
done EVER use ipower for web hosting or domain names. My domain was up for auto renewal, and i told them i did NOT want it renewed, twice. They auto renewed it anyways, and seized the domain when i called them and wanted a refund, even though it wasnt expired yet. When i asked why, they just said it was their policy.
tom3p : I think I need to have AXIS set the spin override to the encoder at start up, some how.
aa-danimal-shop they really took their name literally didn't they?
pfred1, i guess so
aa-danimal-shop I power you weakling all your domain belong to us!
they're trying to force me into paying for it
they think i still want that domain
aa-danimal-shop what part of cancel didn't they understand?
pfred1, they do it intentionally
i found that out after the fact
if you google them, there's miles of complaints about this
my fault i guess
aa-danimal-shop least if they double your bill its still 0
aa-danimal-shop i just heard about it its what a lot of people use
aa-danimal-shop you can have a dynamic IP and it still resolves
cool, i dont know what that means, but it sounds good
aa-danimal-shop I've heard a lot about it seen it in Linux howtos maybe there's a catch but it is worth looking into
[00:30:34] <pfred1> http://www.dyndns.com/services/dns/dyndns/
Get five (5) hostnames in 88 available domains for free.
aa-danimal-shop I don't know how bigtime you are but it may work out for you
Query volume up to 648,000 queries/month
lol i'm not big time at all
thanks for the info
aa-danimal-shop then this might be a great fit for you
i'll check it out
i only get like 120 hits a day
I got no-ip.com in order to host sites from a dynamic IP, it turns out it comes in handy for static hosts too.
aa-danimal-shop that times 31 still doesn't come close to 648,000 but it might be every page load I don't know
aa-danimal-shop I mean these guys don't host it just resolves an Ip to a domain name
That's what no-ip.com does too. It would be more convenient if they hosted, but ces't la vie.
Kirk_Wallace running apache on Linux is trivial
Yes, but my Internet connection keeps changing. I had a dynamic wifi connection, then T1 for a while, now wifi that won't map through to me.
aa-danimal-shop reading the readme its almost like this place is a crack dealer the first hit is free anything else costs
AFAIK your DNS would only be queried apon first connect
And possabley not even that often with the way ISP's cache DNS values and shit
BlackMoon you know the poop on htis place?
BlackMoon i just heard about it like a million places
the noip services? iv heard there pertty good
Don't bother with 'free' ones, theres allways a nasty catch
like, holding your domain name rasom the second you get popular enough to get 1 single complaint
(godaddy does that)
Littarly they lock your domain name and refuse to release it without some 'processing' charge to confirm the complaint was illigitimant or some BS like that.
BlackMoon that seems to be what just happened to aa-danimal-shop
yea except i didnt have any complaints
aa-danimal-shop it was just your time to pay
they locked it without reason
i paid for it in the first place
oh? who where you being serviced by?
aa-danimal-shop no, they locked it because everyone loves money
and by serviced I mean the euphemism
wtf is ipower
pretty big web hosting company. they own a good majority of other hosting companies too
aa-danimal-shop: Heh, godaddy will lock any site with the complaint of porn without even looking at the site.
BlackMoon whoever can run bind thinks they have da powah!
aa-danimal-shop: to bad its not worth taking such scum to coart.
BlackMoon, i'm planning on fighting it as much as possible, just out of principle
aa-danimal-shop thats the thing dyndns doesn't host anything all they do is resolve a dynamic IP to a URL
i already filed a complaint with my bank for fraudulant charges
aa-danimal-shop: sounds good.
actualy what you shoulda done was paid them the money to get control of your DNS name back
THEN reverse the charges on your credit card
Don't forget the BBB if they have bothered to list with them, Not that they ever did shit when I complained about a website selling 100% fake audio products and removing my negative reviews of them
BlackMoon whats a fake audio product?
worse case scenario, i'll be flying into their town in August, and i'll pay them a friendly visit
(like stupid plastic boxes you stick ontop of your stere to make it 'infinately' better
Not even fancy cables and shit.
those at least in thoery could do something.. if you listened to RF and not AF
find the guy with the nicest car in a reserved parking spot and fuck him up
too bad they have your billing information and shit
i'm flying out there for a family reunion, so it's on my to-do list
if it was just paid via paypal you coulda like spraypainted the domain name on the CEO's car
'RELEASE XYZ.COM OR YOUR TIRES GET IT'
BlackMoon, it's strictly for my entertainment, they wont even know who i am. It's not like they dont pull the same crap with everyone
'Stop stealing domain names or your tires get it!'
aa-danimal-shop whoever runs the company goes no where near it I'm sure
Actualy did you ever see that pyrolysis video on car tires?
i wasnt going to mess with the car, i was going to go after the owner of the car
Apparently if you induce some localised heating in a car tire, about 2 mins later its pressure will have risen to over 500psi and explode as the inside of the tire reacts and breaks down due to pyrolysis
500psi over the area of a car tire is enough to basicly remove whole fenders/wheel wells with ease
how much heat do you need for that?
apparently only a couple seconds with a stick welder was all that was needed
just get a lock and a chain and boot the guys car
like lock the chain through the rim
[00:54:31] <BlackMoon> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBUVzgCHHuA&feature=player_embedded#
do it onthe passenger side rear so they don't see it ant take off
video about the danger
but i bet the place had razor wire power gate for parking
I bet there isent even a place.
couple fat stinky geeks working from home with a couple colo servers
company address is thier PO box on the corner of nowhere and hicksvill
BlackMoon yeah just try to find 1 microsoft way on a road map
microsoft does a little more the host websites but whatever.
its still a bogus mail drop address
did you hear some loan nutjob tryed to assult the pentagon recently??
maybe ther eis one now but when i looked years ago the road didn't exist
I guess bluring out all those google map photos of it was not effective after all :(
I do like his spirit though. Go right to the top!
people are nuts
No, people are made nuts. theres a diffrence.
Well, some just go nuts on thier own more or less, but having some services funded to deal with them sure would help.
last time they closed a mental institute here, most of the paitents where just.. set free.
off to roam the streets!
because a bean counter decided keeping them away from the rest of us was not profitable enough :(
find me a sane person and I'll show you a real screwball
yadayada, but im talking about the REAL crazys
so am I!
the ones who think god is talking to them on a 2 way radio and instructing them on how to make <insert rival religion of the day> into hamburgers
BlackMoon hey I'm sitting here trying to make a CNC machine out of junk who am I to judge?
pfred1: as long as your not trying to CNC your imaginary friends likeness into the forhead of the non believers, your ok my my book.
though that would be one of the more intresting things a religious nutjob could do.
BlackMoon hey if when i get this thing done is can scribble randomly on a piece of paper I'll be thrilled!
* pfred1 aims low ...
I wonder if there is a non inverting schmitt buffer?
yes there is but its not likely i just happen to have one laying around!
Keep your expectations low and you will never be disappointed.
oh boy I guess its use 7414s and run the out to an in I suppose ....
hey emc can invert logic can't it?
like emc doesn't care if something is high or low just the change of states
* BlackMoon shrugs
I just came here cause renesis told me you guys knew CNC shit. iv never used EMC.
I'm doing the inputs now on my buffer board
and they're going to be different than all of the outputs
I'm starting to come around to the idea that I shouldn't evne use a 74245 in this part
its sort of redundant
you only need schmitt inputs if you have a slow slew rate signal (ie sine wave or something) to a digital input
or if you have some serious noise problems, combined with an RC filter they can be effective
On thier own they won't be much better then standard input logic given a digital signal
And typicaly an RC filter to a standard digital input works well enough.
yeah i like them because you're guaranteed states I used them effectively behind optocouplers that output not too squared up
Yea optocouplers are pertty slow output
and I'm definately coupling these
you can get digital ones but they probley arnt much more then an analog+schmitt anyway
el computero is not getting electrically coupled to this part of the circuit
Note, if you don't have a strong pullup on an optocoupler output, its turn off can be very slow and delayed
(couple mS anyway)
ie like 1k to 5v = strong.
100k = piss weak
(of course, more led current is required with stronger output pullup)
Make sure to really saturate the output transistor too, because optocouplers are known to lose gain with age.
And you don't want I/O's suddenly not reaching proper levels after a few years due to a optocoupler losing gain
I used this circuit effectively to decouple the controls of my stepper motor drivers: http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/6928/optoschemo.png
before i put that in running two together they ran bad
afterwards it cleared them right up
you know you can just as easily invert the input to an optocoupler
Or the output
swap the trasistor and output resistors positions from gnd/vcc, and its output is now inverse
Also, if you move the led from gnd to VCC, the output will also invert
(digital outputs can often sink and source current, though some logic series won't sink and source with the same current limits, Most do)
yeah I'm starting to gel how I'm going to do this part of my circuit
most sink more than they can source
Of ones that are uneven yes, but most modren logic is balanced
but here its not an issue really I'm only driving the parallel port ofthe PC
see: 74HC series
yeah I'm using HTC mostly
aa-danimal-shop: got the belt changed
you really don't need the T
HC series chips are more flexable
its what I have
wider voltage range.. more standard I/O levels, and will interface just about anything TTL 99% of the time
Yea, but in the future buy HC over HCT
was it a pita?
Theres really no reason to buy HCT unless you have some REALLY old 74XXX series logic (origional TTL) with really loaded outputs you gotta interface
BlackMoon that is an accurate description of what I'm usually doing
even HC will interface 74xxx series logic no problem if the 74xxx series outputs are not heavily loaded
BlackMoon did you ever see my homemade motor driver?
[01:29:54] <BlackMoon> http://www.datasheetcatalog.org/datasheet/philips/74HCU.pdf
some good generic logic reading :)
[01:30:01] <pfred1> http://img683.imageshack.us/img683/6498/stepproto1.jpg
includes some intresting specs like the typical 74HC chip is only rated for 50 or 75mA through VCC or ground
srs breadboarding hehe
BlackMoon the next one i make won't have that dopy daughter board floating on top of it
PS take it from me, breadboards, not good for more then an amp, unless you like melting contact rows outta your breadboard
aa-danimal-shop: kinda at first but once I got it all apart it got easier
I think if you melted a breadboard you were either running more thn an amp or had a very bad connection
Why so many IC's?
way more then an amp, but yea :P
BlackMoon step sequencer
JT-Hardinge, i'm not looking forward to it
the pulleys were somewhat corroded
pfred1: lol discreat logic.
does your look like mine?
ya know they make IC's for that.. and microcontrollers.
i just had to pull the spindle out of my manual lathe. it keeps seizing up in low gear
aa-danimal-shop: shitty :(
BlackMoon but why bother for a dollars worth of logic?
JT-Hardinge, i dont know, did you take any pictures of that area?
BlackMoon, tell me about it.
yea just a sec
pfred1: Cause its only a dollars worth of uC? and you used $20 worth of breadboards and wire? :P
it is 100 years old, i suppose it lived a good life
iv wanted to make logic monstrositys but never gotten around to it, too much work
though making FPGA stuff is very similar and close and fun
[01:36:08] <JT-Hardinge> http://s47.photobucket.com/albums/f163/johnplctech/Hardinge/?action=view¤t=x-axis-encoder.jpg
BlackMoon like this? http://img708.imageshack.us/img708/7615/p7100104.jpg
Dan, your look like that?
BlackMoon that whole board drew like 5 amps running
pfred1: I blame your floating inputs :)
BlackMoon the displays aren't in the picture
JT-Hardinge, it looks pretty similar
BlackMoon that hooked up to the connectors that are floating in the air of the breadboard
might be the same
JT-Hardinge, wow get some shrink wrap on those connectors or close the door. that looks scary for an encoder connection
I made a 4x7 segment led display once
but mine was all discreat transistors
tom3p, they get covered by a big cover
little pcb with 12 TO-92's cramed onto it
all siliconed up
and like 24 resistors or something
I allways love to stand my resistors on end..
then loosen the encoder coupling and remove the encoder then the encoder mount
lets you get insane density.. unless you need to jump over something
loosen the tacho coupling and remove it
take the motor mount bolts out (next to motor pulley) and pull the motor back enough to remove the coupling
change the belt and reverse
icaro_ is now known as icaro
doesnt sound too bad
i had it down to the point you're showing in the picture
aa-danimal-shop sacrifice a virgin to the PB Blaster God!
but i put it back together
wow thats a lot of open connections in that X axis box.
OK I got to ask what is that clear tube running out of that spray can cap looking yellow thing?
im betting $5 on coolant return from the table
BlackMoon machinists should stay away from wiring!
yea someday im gonna watch some lathe turnings of mine fly into the power bar behind the lathe and short out my shoplights, then watch my lathe crash in the dark as I stumble for the controls
spin motor exhaust
your motor has a tiny exhaust tube?
JT-Hardinge that tube is an air duct?
the turret motor exhaust. it's a pneumatic motor
oh, to direct the stray oils and shit
well hopefully no shit, or you got bigger issues
heh, well, stray oil that makes it through
aa-danimal-shop reminds me of when i was doing my pool strainer and I was like no I don't want to go in the pool with electrical tools so I grabbed a pneumatic drill
and washs the motor out in the process..
pfred1: haha cool.
pfred1, pussy! lol
aa-danimal-shop hey it worked pretty good under water
[01:48:48] <BlackMoon> http://www.failblog.biz/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/pool-fail.jpg
see its all safe..
Even in europe where they use 240v!
[01:49:24] <pfred1> http://img191.imageshack.us/img191/4994/pooldone.jpg
got my homerolled kernel built to find out isolcpus is broken in 126.96.36.199.... ah
clytle374 welcome to the bleeding edge bandages are in the corner ...
Done it long enough I'm used to it, but this has been excessively ugly.
clytle374: PS: mind the sharp corner.
clytle374 I let the other guy beta test new code
I'm scrapping this one 74245 I think i was getting chip happy when I threw it on the schematic
It isn't a new kernel either. Just getting a string of bad luck. I can build and use stable kernels for normal desktops in my sleep.
clytle374 not me they just get more and more confusing I don't know what a tenth of al lthe options mean anymore
And I've found a contradiction in the yaskawa manuals on the encoder cables.
clytle374 I read the help and just get more confused!
* JT-Hardinge thinks he better connect the limit switches before he forgets
So one page of the yaskawa book shows 5V on pin 4,5,6 and 0V on pin 1,2,3 and another shows 5V on pin 5 and 0V on 1,2,3,4,6
* JT-Hardinge wonders what the difference is between axis.0.neg-lim-sw-in and axis.0.neg-hard-limit?
maybe it throws it into estop with the hard limit
never mind I know now
hard-limit is an outty
clytle374 you're just missing the errata page is all
Yep, the newer manual has it corrected.
I was using a howto off the net, glad I double checked the guy
Shorting the encoder output power supply probably wouldn't be good on the amp.
aa-danimal-shop: sweet it works!
same tuning numbers as z?
mine are the same at least
dunno, I'll approach it slowly :)
go for the gold
I'm going for HOME now
Houston, we have a fully functional lathe atm :)
needs some gaskets and tuning but all systems are go
even the turret?
yea, by buttons atm but the parts for that came today too but too late to try and solder today
the X axis limit switch works LOL
kernel patched and working properly now, very good latency. Connectors unsoldered. good night all.
that didnt take you long JT-Hardinge
to test the limit switch?
to get it running
the X is a little different in the tuning requirements
hmmm, the conversion started 3 months ago
well you really just started though
99% of the work was this year, right?
finally got my spindle unfrozen. It was definitely welded together
I started in mid December but took a long time to get past some hurdles
i think i can clean it up good enough
100 years old and finally decided to weld itself together
just needs a lick of paint and it will be as good as new
aa-danimal-shop machine shop I worked in had a horizontal mill from 1856 man it was cherry!
lol i already repainted it JT-Hardinge
aa-danimal-shop they had it rescraped
aa-danimal-shop like I said it was cherry
skip it I'm leaving off one of the parallel port inputs for now
* JT-Hardinge has a "Home All" button now so time to flick on the magnetass switch
my lathe: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v20/danielwilcox/DSCN0015.jpg
doesnt need paint :)
aa-danimal-shop the tailstock is nice but what happened to the rest of the machine?
ok the tailstock needs paint
aa-danimal-shop no, thats how machines are supposed to look!
aa-danimal-shop could probably use a touch more black grease on it here and there but other than that ....
least thats what I used to that oil softened battleship gray look
aa-danimal-shop its so nice and dreary
puts me in that relaxed state of mind ...
i hate that color
reminds me of work
well i got the spindle pretty smooth
luckly it isnt a high rpm area
still not sure how it seized
maybe it's been slowly friction welding for the past 100 years
you polish it with like sandpaper?
a fine stone and oil
i think maybe the belt was too tight, it really shouldnt be contacting there
I saw a guy do it with the emery roll stuff on a car crankshaft once and I was thinking the whole time no way it'll work he slapped it back otgether and the guy who's car it is was like damn better than when I had it rebuilt!
looked like he was shining shoes under there to me
lol i did that once with my honda
lasted about a month, but it was long enough to find a new crank for cheap
yeah he just dropped the pan and went for it
I don't know how long it lasted
I was amazed it even ran at all
not long probably. the tollerance for bearing clearance is pretty tight
LOL idiots put a press fit dowel in a blind hole
they werent that smart back then
aa-danimal-shop: how does something slowly friction weld? :)
Nice lathe btw.
heh at all the oil cups
aa-danimal-shop: Is that one of those lathes with the clutchs for the power feeds?
BlackMoon, , there's barely any rpm difference between the 2 parts
Yea but friction welding is like, super high temp
ie you actualy gotta get to welding tempature :)
iv seen friction cause wear of parts untill the contamination sticks them togethor..
at slow speeds over time
but never slow speed welding
aa-danimal-shop: Are the clutchs annoying at all?
no it works well
I got straight gear engagement for my power feed and its a little annoying in that you gotta wait for the next gear engagement to come around, sometimes takes a second or two at low rpm with light feed rates
slides outta engagement very easily and reliabley though
yea, this is instant
takes a little getting used to though
iv heard of people using a light clutch engagement + carriage stop as a feed stop, lol
sounds kinda.. evil to me though
the clutches are pretty bullet proof
i'll slip mine a little to controll the feedrate if needed
if the lathe is getting overwhelmed
iv kinda wanted to convert my lathe to electronic feed
it's only 1hp, so it sometimes bogs
that would be cool
especialy since its got like a feedrod/leadrod selector
as long as you still have the threeading capability
so I could allways have mechanical feed override the motor at the flick of a switch
well thats the other thing
is id love to add a spindle encoder and control the threading rod too hehe
or just control the input to the gearbox itself
Even if my electronic box was only 1:4 and 4:1 ratio it would really fix my lathe
because I got a QCGB.. except one thing
its got 2 ranges that are NOT quick change but gear change
like 2~16 tpi and 17~52 tpi
at that point just emc it lol
and the fine feed setting coursest feed is well.. Well its pertty course but id love a little more.
I actualy like using my lathe manualy cause its all power feed hahah
i thought about converting a manual lathe, but it just made more sense to buy a cnc lathe and convert it. it was much cheaper
its like just enter the coords and flip the lever
well i got my lathe for less than what most ballscrews cost
you can get a nice cnc lathe with a bad controller for dirt cheap
much less than a decent manual lathe would go for
or even a cheap manual lathe for that matter
might even get paid to take one lol
gotta run, time to eat! adios
anyone have experience moving an industrial machine, say 5000lbs, 500 miles?
i moved my mill, it was 6000-7000lbs
i moved it almost exactly 500 miles
so i guess i can say "yes"
although the way i did it was sketchy. wouldnt reccommend it
aa-danimal-shop: ah, good point.
i wondered wgat costs there might be, id have it skidded, but would need a tilt bed to lower it to my driveway, then id take over with rollbars and johnsons
what kinda driveway?
a number of 2x4's make wonderful cheap tracks on gravel/soft ground. Or incase you don't want any marks on the ashfault.
asfault but not sure of thickness, have had dump trucks on it with a couple yards of dirt
yeh, i think 2.5 yds took care of garden
but its the long distance cost i worry about.
hi,is anybody notice CLARAty software by nasa?
nmen is now known as numen
also a good reuseble software platform
do i have to write the  in this o200 call   ? is it need to have the feed work ?
yes or modify the subroutine
but i don't see where  are 4 and 8 ... which are the feed i used
what's wrong is i don't know what is doing what and when
[10:47:56] <BlackMoon> http://www.sandia.gov/media/diamond.htm
mmm diamond coating tech.
piasdom, we cant know without seeing the code
i didn't write this (tom3p) just can't see what and when. i can see the sub defined, but it's he end P L and never used g10
first two lines in o200 replace incoming values see comment on line 25
man im bored
write a "how to tune a servo velocity drive" that will keep you busy
archivist; he just had the comment,i added the #1#2#3 . i didn't know how to set global feeds
JT-Dev: theres all sorts of docs about that online
set global before the subroutines and use them in the call line
just buy the $200 osilliscope and get it over with
i looked all over for the definition of #1#2#3 but couldn't fine them anywhere so i add them
* archivist rents ascope to jt for 199$
I'll use the free scope in EMC
piasdom, they are not global in the old code, they were constanst set on the call line
archivist; i tried to write the globally, but they didn't work til i set them IN the sub
bah cheapskate jt :)
* JT-Dev looks for a $200 scope that works and can't find one
piasdom, because they need to be seen on line 109 etc
I got lucky and got an 8 chan HP digital for less :)
should be able to get at least a 200mhz 2 channel or a 100mhz 4 channel for $200
+ maybe 30~50 s/h
[11:43:01] <JT-Dev> http://cgi.ebay.com/HP-1740A-OSCILLOSCOPE-DUAL-CHANNEL-100MHz-SCOPE_W0QQitemZ390166261089QQcmdZViewItemQQptZBI_Oscilloscopes?hash=item5ad7b8ad61
'This auction is sold on an "AS-IS" basis for Repair/Parts only. No Return or Refund is accepted. '
thats a little old
thats a little not even showing a trace.
Find a scope that idealy displays 2 square waves
at very least 1
* JT-Dev keeps looking
square waves are the hardest for a scope to display properly
archivist; so which is which? what is and  ? 200 is #1 and 400 is #2 and so forth ?
because of all the harmonics, you need perfict freqency responce or you get under/overshoot
[11:44:51] <JT-Dev> http://cgi.ebay.com/TEKTRONIX-TDS-320-2-CH-DIGITZING-100MHz-SCOPE-TESTED_W0QQitemZ310204090914QQcmdZViewItemQQptZBI_Oscilloscopes?hash=item48399aca22
(idealy a square wave should display just like _-_-_-_ with no vertical lines inbeween)
that looks OK if you want digital
piasdom, yes, so replace with [#33] some l
piasdom, yes, so replace with [#33] some global var
LOL, I don't even know what I want/need for a scope
JT-Dev: don't worry, buy it anyway.
Typicaly the analogs are a little better bang for the buck unless you really want storage of one shot events that you can't make repeat easily
(But there are also analog storage scopes, they are kinda cool)
stores the trace on the screen of one shot or multiple events by a weird static storage mesh inside the CRT
can store 1 image nearly indefinately or have an adjustable fade out and/or blanking interval
even stores the image with the scopes power off for weeks!
archivist; one more thing......why does the z axis go to .5 at startup ..... no matter where z starts .. i see it reading #3 when it does that
[11:49:16] <JT-Dev> http://cgi.ebay.com/Tek-Sony-336-50Mhz-Dual-Ch-Digital-Storage-Scope-w-prob_W0QQitemZ370306564846QQcmdZViewItemQQptZBI_Oscilloscopes?hash=item5637fdc2ee
id look at 100mhz min really
even if your only working with like 20mhz microcontrollers tops and stuff, you really need more bandwidth then what your doing to actualy 'see' it correctly
and it will help you see supply noises and stuff from logic.
piasdom, line 108
200mhz is really nice. much more then that starts becoming questionable for a first time scope
digital scopes can be much slower then 'stated' too
they should have at least 5x the mega samples/s as bandwidth
the '140 KHZ STORAGE BANDWIDTH' seems really odd on that ebay url
really, low end digital scopes are not that great and will cost you a lot more like $300 as you have seen
for a decent one
archivist; so the program start at line 107.....Thanks again
a similar speed/capability analog will be $200
and about the only diffrence will be the storage capability and maybe some cursors that let you readout exact voltages/freqencys a little easyer (reading an analog scope is still reasonabley accurate, and digital scopes usally only use like a 10bit ADC so they are not exactly very exact on voltage readouts anyway)
piasdom, it starts before that
what do I gain by using an external scope vs the Hal Scope?
archivist; thanks...i'll study some more
JT-Dev: you can scope other circuits.
that you see a real voltage
and see the actual waveform, especialy important when dianosing noise/surges
eg an open collector output missing its pullup
or having a weak pullup and it taking forever to go high
or it overloaded by some fryed equipment connected to it.
[11:58:34] <JT-Dev> http://cgi.ebay.com/Tektronix-2465BDM-4-Channel-400MHz-Analog-Scope_W0QQitemZ250589861418QQcmdZViewItemQQptZBI_Oscilloscopes?hash=item3a5851d62a
In the electronics world, if a DMM was your sense of smell, an oscilloscope would be your eyes
I see :)
Thats a pertty awsome scope.
possabley a wee bit expensive but not bad.
yea, no bids
at $500 you can start getting into the nicer digital scopes however.
maybe not 4 channel 400mhz digital, but likey a 2 channel 400mhz.. maybe a 4 channel 200mhz
also note that scope does not have additional volt/div knobs for every input
So not sure how you get all 4 channels to display, or if each can be attinuated
some 4 channel scopes really just display the other trigger inputs so its not really fully useful as a channel
a true 4 channel scope will actualy have seperate inputs for trigger
I have a 4 channel scope that can display 7 traces at once! A B C D A+B C+D exttrigger
gets crowded :)
looks like most scopes on fleabay are 100Mhz
its about all you'll need for most hobbiest work
[12:12:34] <JT-Dev> http://cgi.ebay.com/Tektronix-465-100MHZ-Oscilloscope-Calibrated-2-probes_W0QQitemZ280474679847QQcmdZViewItemQQptZBI_Oscilloscopes?hash=item414d97fa27
really if you wanted a serious upgrade from 100mhz you'd be wanting like a $700+ scope so don't consider it like buying a cheapo one, just one suitable for most hobbiest
tektronix is a good scope and many people have that 465 its a good durable model
one down side is he doesnt display a square wave anywhere
old yes, but tektronix where really built to last, industral equipment
I have a 465 :)
the controls get a little scratchy but they are still very usable
Ive had the psu caps fail
but for 30 years old thats ok
that sucks, but fixable
i should open up my 2230 and look for broke shit again
i wish it would just fail
its some temp related drift or IC failure, the vector display generator spazzes out after awhile but itll be fine after letting it cool down
theres more of them on ebay for parts/repair now than working ones
pisses me off those itll work for months almost daily, no issues
anywat if youre not going to use the scope all the time
get a rigol or a uni-t or some other china DSO
like maybe 1/4 cost of non china solution for comparable feature set
but yeah a (mostly) working tek scope is never really a bad purchase
[13:15:11] <renesis> http://cgi.ebay.com/TEKTRONIX-2230-100mhz-DIGITAL-STORAGE-OSCILLOSCOPE_W0QQitemZ160378697575QQcmdZViewItemQQptZBI_Oscilloscopes?hash=item255750b767
[13:15:23] <renesis> http://cgi.ebay.com/Tektronix-2232-100MHz-Storage-Oscilloscope-RS232-Nice_W0QQitemZ270540982351QQcmdZViewItemQQptZBI_Oscilloscopes?hash=item3efd7fc84f
still convinced this is he cheapest usable scope for general purpose use
straight analog sucks ass at anything non repetitive
second one has 100% positive feedback
its nice to have, though
tose two scopes are always on ebay
theyre analog with a diital storage mode built in
te display for the storae uses the trace to draw out the data dn measurement values
[13:19:10] <renesis> http://i.ebayimg.com/22/!BngHyp!BWk~$%28KGrHqIOKjIEtkoKdqeuBLjtfvvk,Q~~_35.JPG
renesis: thanks for the links
* JT-Dev heads out to work
stupid question.. Is there hal componant or even in classic ladder that takes and interager and outputs binary (say 16 would output 1111)
like a BCD output?
has to be binary - not binary coded decmal
sort of a demux - if I have it right
I've done that in GE/Fanuc ladder, no idea about emc though
if we have one, I doubt we have one that outputs 1111 for 16
sorry - 15 ;)_
skunkworks_: you can easily do this with ladder: -[Var%1]---()-, -[Var%2]---()-, etc for 4 and 8
skunkworks: how exactly do you expect digital stuff to not be using binary in the first place?
I assume he wants to split a S32 out into bits
hmm - really? %1 tells it to use the first binary bit? and%2 second?
our transmission is actually 4 bit binary. 1st gear is 0000 2nd is 0001 third is 0010... and so on.
no, it's too early, I meant Var&1, Var&2
ah - ok. will play with it. that would be easy.
ladder is cool ;)
does g54 cancel g55....g56...67...... ?
Only one of them can be activated at a time
i know ...but i want to cancel to get back to machine coor
nmen is now known as numen
cancel g55.56.57 and os forth offsets
g53X0Y0Z0... / g10l2p1x0y0z0 (or something like that)
G53 moves in machine coordinates, so go to zero (or some other spot), then set the F54/55/56... coordinate however you want
(g53 only works on the line it's on, it doesn't set the machine to a different coordinate system)
I'd suggest you use G92 for the "two pockets 1.4" apart in Y" program
now i'm on this http://pastebin.ca/1830072
these are special words... 'machine coordinates' is G53 while 'user coordinates' are positions you want to measure from, like g54,56,56... you cannot change G53 and all G54,55.. are related to g53 (offset from g53)
g53 is like Paris, G54 is like 'from the bakery' ;)
ok .... i'm trying cancel the offsets how do i do that ?
or DO i neeed to cancel them .... i have no idea and the doc don't show
I didn't notice you changing to the other coordinate systems in that program
to cancel the offset (im not sure thats what you want to do), to cancel just G10 P2 L?? X0 Y0 Z0... (as many as up to W0)
you don't need to cancel them, just select a different coordinate system
however, I believe those offsets are stored in the var file, so the next time you run EMC2, they'll still be there
it may be good practice to go to machine zero with G53 and zero out the other coordinate systems at the end of your run
that's what i wanted just didn't know how to ask
but you can always put g10 p2 l?? in your program (despite the saved values), yes be specific in what you wnat to have happen, dont assume
i wanted to get rid of them so the next time i ran mach they wouldn't be there
tom3p; AFTER all programing
you can do that, but i dotn see people doing it, in many years of programming,
its like throwing away the pad of papper where you wrote how to get to the bakery
just make sure what you use is defined
SWPadnos; what's the code to use g53 ... go to XYZ zero using g53 instead of g0 or g1 ?
no. G53 would be used in addition to the movement code (g1, g0)
G53 G0 X0 Y0 Z0
else you'd see a block of code that wiped all the G5x in every program used in emc... you dont see that happen
tom3p; thanks... i won't use that then
i think g53 is not modal... only effective on one line, while g54 55 et al are modal , meaning they stay in effect until another G5x is used
i was thinking it was like g92
g53 is a bit dangerous ( you think more like g54,5,6... than you think like g53... you think more like, i am near the bakery than i am at 123.456latitude 45.764longitude)
i dont know the difference between G54 G92 blah blah and G10 P2 L1 blah blah, and it'd take a bit of study and experimenting to discover any difference.
what you need is somethign that works and repeats ;)
ooh G92 is strong juju, "Thus all nine coordinate systems are affected by G92." http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.2/html/gcode_main.html#sub:G53:-Move-in
right - it's an additional, usually temporary, offset
think of G5x as the locations of the vises or other stations on a machine, and G92 is like a "temporary variable" used to offset things (like multiple pockets of the same shape) at a single station
what happens if the program is stopped while offset for that 3rd detail on vise #2 ? what does G91 X1 mean?
G91 is relative vs incremental (G90/G91) - was that a typo?
(or the 1mm jog button)
to answer the question though, the G92 offsets are preserved, even across runs
they can be easily cleared or unapplied though
no, i mean it IS relativem, but relative to what ( i aborted a prorgam that had offsets)
stopping a program has no effect on the offsets, AFAIK
ok, so the jog 1mm button is from the G92 position, ok
if you come in tomorrow and start running something on station 4, just make sure you set the offsets as necessary for station 3, instead of station 2 where it was stopped :)
i run into that stuff especially in probing, i want the probed value in terms that make sense, not usually in G53 terms
nmen is now known as numen
tom3p, i rented a penske and moved it myself
then rented a forklift to take it off the truck when it got here
m0 doesn't work in osub ?
i need it to pause at a point
[16:16:21] <JT-Work> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/html//gcode_main.html#sec:G4:-Dwell
never used g4 ... i'll look thanks
I think if you put P0 it will wait forever (at least that is what I'm used to with other controls
i need it to pause til i say restart ... i need measure a depth
can't check it out here only Windoz
i've always used m0 works great
i'll try p0 thanks
i need to get a faceplate for my HNC
definitely would have been easier for boring out this gear
tom3p: Hi are you here?
[17:00:49] <Jymmm> http://www.tequipment.net/Fluke233.html
"where's my meter?"
"where's the other part of my meter?"
"Jesus, I'll just buy some longer leads!"
These are some nice probes http://www.tequipment.net/Pomona5676A.asp
can penetrate conformal coating easily
bill i buy everything here http://www.reichelt.de/?ACTION=3;ARTICLE=81989;GROUPID=;SID=263CNtU6wQARoAAFYVMcM1b5da9a590fcc373c81000f893b89541
off vause i'am german
piasdom, do you want it to stop for a manual tool change?
aa-danimal-shop, thx i'll look into renting a forklift local and drive the forklift over here
piasdom nm i see "m0 (CHECK DEPTH)"
i dont see m0 working in o-word subs
tom3p, i had a tow truck get it for me
piasdom, try this "To exchange pallet shuttles and then stop a running program temporarily (regardless of the setting of the optional stop switch), program M60"
flat bed tow truck
aa-danimal-shop, oh, like a tilt bed tow truck? (me old skool, thinks crane & chain:)
tom3p: It works the mashine moves from the start yesterday nothing workt today its fine
tom3p: you told me yesterday that ther is a button for homing wherever it is WHERE is this button
sealive, i think i know what you want, but dont know of a 'here' button in emc2 (i do know where it is in heidenhain), so going to archives to see what i said ;)
aa-danimal-shop, good idea, i'll look into tilt bed idea
it homes wherever you are if you have home search velocity set to zero
home search velocity and latch velocity
coudt someone eplain me this http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/2.3/html/config_stepconf.html#r1_5_1
sealive, 5 in 1?
dont go faster than you can. :-|
simply my english is not good enov to understand what this does
its' for testing the motor speeds of your machine.
my mashin is in mm and i got 100mm of maximum way
so that you can set an upper limit to the speed they will be driven at.
iam for testing in the midel of the max track
it's not for testing the distance/length of the axis's, but for the speed at which they move.
set the "test area" to 1 inch, and click 'run'.
if it moves too slowly, increase the 'velocity' value, and try again.
ok i'am new to emc ! and i understand that te config is all about for emc
sealive i read all of yesterday and today, i dont see myself or anyone talking about a 'here' button with you
keep repeating until you get it travel at speeds you're happy with.
tom3p: we takt about homing all axes where the mashine is right now
thats what i make for now 5Years with NC-FRS loding the prog tool to the Programm zero and start
my driver is L297/298 24V 2A per phas on 3 Steppers
Steppers are 2,4V 1.6ohms sA 1,3Nm torch
Steppers are 2,4V 1.6ohms 2A 1,3Nm torch
i tryd L297 but nothing only some steps are done the others are missing
so i went to other
BUT as always want to find the Best config i need to understand how all this configs come together
ther shoud be more then 3inch per minit with this amount of torch
the axis are all with liniar ball-bearing so there run with simply littel tourch ! the motors of the cnc3(same maschine) have only 0,3Nm and run under windows with 250mm/10inch per minute without losing any step
SWPadnos, i was looking for a sim or stepper config that homed after jogging, and home wherever the machine was at that point in time.(for sealive to study)
[17:59:28] <SWPadnos> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/2.3/html/config_ini_homing.html
oh im sure it can be done i thought a visual example would help more than text explanation
yep, it would
I don't know which if any config has an example of that
i read it
it's not exactly recommended practice
it looks like configs/stepper/sim_inch.ini uses no homing
these sim are these virtual mashine with no output to the ports?
that one appears that way
it doesn't load the parport module at all
it connects the stepgens to a PC speaker driver, which makes it sound like you have a machine attached :)
no sount on the px
then you won't hear it. that's not important though
it won't mess with your actual hardware, and it has an example of setting up a machine so that home does what you asked for
no wonder why this thing seized, the bores werent centrifical
is ther a tool for testing the switches
halmeter will show you the state of a single signal (you connect it to whichever pin you want to monitor)
i will give it a try tomorrow
for my anderstanding F1 is the STOP at all time key
unfortunately, it's a toggle
ESC will abort motion as well
i will conecct the switch its a closer/not an obener to thew parallelport and let the mashie run simply press the switch and the mashine shoudt home! if not F1 will stop the motion
hmmm. actually, F1 will always stop motion. even if you toggle e-stop back off, you would still have to hit F2 to enable motion again
and hal -meter will show me at any time the state of the parallelport pin
yes, once you select the pin you want to look at
so i see tru hal-meter if the switch works and thru stepconf the writh config invert or non invert
you should look at the home signal with halmeter. that will show you what the emc motion controller is seeing
it will already be inverted if you have selected that
SWPadnos: thank you for your help
is anyone on icq or maybe skype so i will bring the mashine up to the internet pc tommorow and someone can help me in a live video chat
looks like more to learn... stepper_mm.ini sets up the 3 data for what the logic diagram identifies as 'Homing Type NONE', the ini allows jogging before home, yet the HOME btn (labeled 'empty') moves the tool (a HERE home wont move the tool)
in AXIS, i see the tool cone move
ok i got to go shift starts at 4:30
I'am tecnical tool maker master chife
working on mold's for plastics wirer channel system
i specialize in edm
wire channel like panduit?
panduit is this the product or the manufacture
mfctr of a plastic wireway
does m30 activate a pin through task?
[18:31:52] <sealive> http://www.panduit.com/Products/ProductOverviews/WiringDuct/index.htm
[18:31:57] <tom3p> http://cableorganizer.com/panduit/wire-duct.html
i make the tools for cutting the holes in the channel in the max speed thats available
working for SIEMENS
ive built molds for panduit and thomas&betts
SIEMENS good co.
That animated gif is stupid.... they moved everything over from being evenly spaced
[18:33:53] <Jymmm> http://www.panduit.com/stellent/groups/marketing-corp/documents/websiteimage/cmscont_035366.gif
the 1inch canel with 2inch hight is the most eficient in that case
ok, how to stop the gif so i can see the great advantage?
but its most complicatet to punch!
the atvanced is that chanel 1inchby2
tom3p: You can't. you are stuck in animated gif hell forever! MUHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
tom3p: close the window
time to save & kill in gimp
the punching speed is up to 4meters per minute with 12 punches
the punchplate will hold at this speed at least 4weeks
with calculated 23hr a day
the mashine i rund by 24/7
hmm well my manual lathe spindle is back in the machine and seems to spin nicely now. Hopefully it'll hold up for another 100 years
your grand child will see it
i would need to have kids in order to have grandchildren
hmm more wires in less space = harder to get at what you want ( and in gimp you can view the layers)
aa-danimal-shop: what was it?
what was what? the problem? a gear friction welded itself to the spindle
the gear wasnt running concentric to the pulley it was bolted and doweled to
so i lightly bored it, then bolted it to the pulley and indicated it in, and line reamed it and doweled it
cleaned out the oil grooves
lapped it a little
how do you configure emc for a digital I/O card instead of p-port?
load the driver for the digital I/O card instead
note: you may have to write it first
(there are drivers for several 8255-like cards, so it should be relatively easy)
heh... I assume the stepconf wizard only works with p-ports?
wonder what kirk wallace actually means
there's another one called pncconf (in the works) that also helps with mesa cards, but nothing I know of for generic digital I/O cards
any hooks for serial stuff?
cradek: I wonder too
like a uC with digital I/O via serial?
not really anything for communicating with a "smart" device over serial (or any other) bus
jepler did something like that some time ago, but I don't know
if the code still exists
that's conceptually easy, it's just userspace software that talks over the serial port and has HAL pins
but it's not realtime
I was thinking like a pendant
as long as you don't expect it to be realtime (ie, no e-stop button through the serial port), that should be fine
Yeah, i reserve the USB port for that
the E-stop that is
in fact, the I/O system was designed with the specific intent of using microcontrollers for I/O expansion (but the I/O system wasn't designed to be RT either)
you can always run a separate wire through the cable, and connect that to a hardware input that's sampled in realtime (or even better to a physical estop chain)
There's nothing like a finger about to be cut out and you hit the PC controlled EMERGENCY STOP and it doens't
OH GAWD.... gMaps now shows points with coupons *sigh*
so, (sorry for the stupid questions) could you use a microcontorller for some combo of 20 or so in/outs, run one uC output pin to a p-port pin that requests a serial I/O for any more determinancy? or use it as an interrupt?
HAL doesn't support hardware interrupts - it's timer periodic only
you wouldn't need to have an extra wire to tell HAL that there's data ready - just write a userspace program that reads (and writes - don't forget the blinky lights :) ) data and updates HAL pins
any guess on latency for overhead + 2 bytes ?
the transfer time is not much, but you never know when a userspace process will be interrupted
assuming you use something like 19200 baud, that's about 1000 updates a second (neglecting overhead and synchronization)
a little over 1mS for 19200
I think the code jepler made used a 2-byte packet. the high bit was 1 for the start of packet and 0 for the remaining byte(s). that gives you only 14 bits (or 3 bytes), but it lets you resync if something goes awry
(or maybe he didn't do that, and I just thought it up - I don't remember)
Dumb question.... If EMC is a Cnc controller, what do you all the box that houses all the relays, I/O boards, etc ?
Dumb question.... If EMC is a Cnc controller, what do you call the box that houses all the relays, I/O boards, etc ?
could you do one pport pin for all homes, one for all limits, pause on that, then query via serial for the actual one?
Jymmm, the control or electronics cabinet?
SWPadnos: what's the restriction that prevents that kind of muxing?
well, you could do it, but it would effectively make all the limit switch inputs go through a userspace program
ah I see
the motion controller has no facility for sensing something and then asking what it was
atmega: newegg has parallel port cards for $7.99. This would give you 13 more inputs.
and some outputs
that's 61 cents per input line...
oh, nevermind :)
don't forget the blinky lights
I like blinky lights
I realize that... so I was thinking.. make the 1 input a estop then have on stop ask a userland program
estop isn't the same thing as a limit switch
cradek: are they really PCI parallel port cards?
SWPadnos: normally yes, but it should accomplish halting motion til further action can be taken
ds3: no, I just made it up, and I challenge you to use google to prove me a liar
cradek: no no... the reason I asked is I bought such a thing... it turns out to be a USB controller + USB parallel port chip :(
wow, that's sucky, and I haven't seen that kind of device
wow. how singularly stupid a design
if you have a confirmed true PCI parallel port, I'd like to get the P/N for it
do you have a url for the piece of shit you bought?
[19:43:03] <SWPadnos> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16815104211
er, I mean the card you bought?
that's pretty much the same as my uC + serial
ehci_hcd: Unknown symbol usb_hub_clear_tt_buffer
the more expensive ones are better then the cheap ones
it was a store, let me see if it is on their website
you can see in the photo of the one SWPadnos pasted that it's a netmos chip, like all of those standard parports
so that one will be fine
ds3, something like this: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16815124044
that one is USB+parallel, so I might be suspicious of it
I just gave link to a DUAL
yep that is suspicious
[19:45:21] <ds3> http://www.microcenter.com/single_product_results.phtml?product_id=0277551
Jymmm, those are more expensive per port, from what I'm seeing
ds3: thanks, good to know those exist (and don't work)
but they do have somewhat better density
SWPadnos: $15 for a dual pci paraport?!
SWPadnos: yes, your link points to one that don't work :( I think it is the same one i got locally
oh, I see a $15 one now :)
dual, $15: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16815166007
that's pretty competitive :)
Mine comes with a 5 year warranty =)
and supprts linux =)
SWPadnos: that looks like a MOS chip thing and I saw complaints about it
I think the complaints are only relevant to parallel-port-connected "smart cards" - mesa, pluto, pico
for dumb I/O I don't think there are any issues
they don't work for EPP, but they're fine for IO and software stepgen
(as long as Linux recognizes and enables the card)
why are several ports needed?
but are they true TTL drivers or higher current CMOS drivers?
some people have IO fetishes
only if you (a) want more I/O than one port has and/or (b) you want to protect your motherboard
(yes, I have an annoying driver that tries to yank power off a data line against the specs)
you just toss the card and put another one in if something happens, rather than potentially trashing a motherboard
as a BTW, I got a hand ful of 2P, 4S ISA cards sitting around
sounds like ByteRunner :)
I have lots of isa junk
person, company, or ?
[19:51:01] <SWPadnos> http://www.byterunner.com/
more specifically: http://www.byterunner.com/byterunner/new_frontpage=serial_parallel_cards
mine are different; they came out of a surplus pile ages ago
yay my lathe works again
what was wrong with it?
a gear frixtion welded to the spindle
OH WHAT A FEELING, TOYOTA! http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/03/08/california.runaway.prius/index.html?hpt=T2
[21:34:54] <Jymmm> http://www.cnn.com/2010/OPINION/03/09/mullins.beyond.disability/index.html
I got my turret encoder working, but when I plug it into the 7i37 the off lines cause a red light on the 7i37... I'm a bit confused atm
im gonna buy a toyota
jt-plasma: red light means you've got it hooked up backward
and then when the cops pull me over for doing 120 in a school zone i'll all be like 'accelerator stuck officer, did'nt you see me wave you down to try and stop me???'
cradek: that is what I thought
when I check it at the terminal board it reads the same as my limit switch with the DMM
Now, why couldn't they just turn off the ignition is my question.
he did when he reached 50
actualy I tryed it on my truck, just parked
its really diffacult to turn off the ignition in my truck without going to steering lock
Like theres no detent beween 'run' and 'locked'
you just gotta carefuly turn it a little behind run
Heh, I should offer an ignition kill switch installed for $100
the real scary thing is as I understand it, some modren engines don't even have a throttle plate
they just inject fuel to adjust throttle.. And if the wrong gasket goes.. well, you got constant injection
I have -22v on the pin I thought was on and +24 on the pin that I thought was off
Id like to see something 'new' in all these flybywire cars
my car has no throttle plate - if it ever accelerates out of control, I fully intend to push in the clutch and/or shut it off
like a mechanical pushlever that flips something in the fuel mixing chamber or air intake to forcabley idle the engine
all you'd really need is like a baffold over the air intake and you could easily take a 200hp motor down to 15hp
cradek: just dont forget the locking steering wheel
priuses are extra scary because I bet braking is completely under computer control
still enough to idle and run the accessorys (power steering/brakes) but no way in hell of accelerating anything
Jymmm: on my correctly-designed car, the wheel doesn't lock unless you pull the key completely out
cradek: on mine it locks about the instant your key goes to 'off' :(
it even seems to have more steering pawl lock positions then most cars
like, I recall growing up you could often get a half turn in or something before the steering locked up
cradek: what is it?
my car is like, 10 degrees and it locks up
I've never seen a car that would lock unless it was in park (autos) or until you did a special thing like push a button or pull the key out (manuals)
Jymmm: a vw
Toyota has always had fscked up ignition switches
I think it was in park at the time
BlackMoon: maybe it's just busted?
I'll have to try it in gear next time
BlackMoon: oh sure, well you probably wouldn't put it in park while it's moving :-)
why not? it makes a cool sound
iv heard of people puting it in park to stop the vehical before
clankity clankity clankity clankity clankity clankity clankity rattle SKID
usally resulting in some nasty ass sounds and the car.. eventualy stoping.. or the back wheels locking :)
reverse works better
reverse is locked out in a lot of cars over 10kph or so
that little pin in the transmission will shear off before it stops a car at speed
especially when the axel drops then you have a physical anchor
Danimal-office: unless it succeeds in locking the back tires
and then your traction goes way down
it's usually only about a 3/8" pin
and they're spring loaded so it usually wont even engage unless the car is moving pretty damn slow.
it'll just skip across the holes
[21:49:36] <skunkworks_> http://imagebin.ca/view/LrdKg5Mb.html
cradek: do you have any hardinge floating tap holders for your lathe?
I have one sorta floaty thing but I don't know what it is or how to use it
when I tap, I just rigid tap in a drill chuck
Gasp! not a drill chuck! ;)
you make do with what you've got...
my tool guy has one he showed me today... pretty nice looking
I loose tap in a drill chuck
but i dont think i can justify the $120 he wants for it
just manauly turn the drill spindle over while pushing the quill down
why would you rigid tap a drill chuck?
as soon as the chuck slips on the round tap shank I take the chuck off and finish with a wrench
that way it never gets broken (by power taping) yet starts off perfictly straight
I don't hand tap much anymore :-)
BlackMoon, no drill spindle or quill here, we're talking lathes
thats the only thing my mill is missing besides servos
[21:53:47] <cradek> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9HLKXeWqTF0
yea yea, i saw it lol
nice, i'm jealous
did you get the resistor mounted yet?
heh, nope :-)
you know how it is
yea, i still havent mounted the lathe one either
not sure where to put it
hmm maybe inside the base
what do you think
lol it wont get warm
i gotta swap out all that ultra lite oil and put in the lite
the pail just came in
Danimal-office: Ok well, tailstock and lathe spindle then :)
no tailstock here
turret lathe :)
Ok then use your carriage and set it to threading mode of the right TPI and a BXA MT2 holder
or whatever holders you use
allways making shit diffacult
its just taping man really!
* BlackMoon hands Danimal-office a boring bar with a HSS threading bit mounted
i prefer indexable carbide
i havent used hss in years lol
Yea yea I havent gotten around to buying one of those
HSS is still great :)
although hss has its uses
Mainly for plastic and form tools IMO... :)
Try and find a 45degree+ rake supersharp carbide insert
(Yea you can get 25~ degree supersharp aluminum inserts but..)
i can grind one
one company actualy makes HSS inserts for carbide stuff
haha.. I don't try and regrind inserts
i'll grind one if i need special geometry
probley because I don't have a grinder for my diamond wheel
yea, i just throw the diamond wheel on my surface grinder
I got the diamond wheel.. but returned my toolroom grinder
(it was overpriced KBCtools filth not 1/10th as good as horrorfreights grinder)
it was like, it was made by a near sighted chinese farmer who only once saw a blury low res photo of one in a magazine somewhere
i just got a Harig Super 612 surface grinder
I can hook the signals to either plus or minus on the 7i37 and no red light... when I connect the opposite terminal to my 4 into 1 wire and plug it in I get a red light
everything that could possabley be wrong was wrong
harig 612 good tool
it did'nt have holes taped/drilled for the diamond wheel on the right side, it did'nt reverse, its tables could not get within 3/4" of the diamond wheels due to the way they mounted the back plates (with 1" nuts!)
tom3p, yea, it's the grinder i learned on.. simple and solid
and a dime a dozen
JT-Hardinge, i dont follow
it had no starter relay or switch of any kind, just a pittafuly undersized starting cap to prevent burning out the windings
mitsuis got popular, pretty good, low price, hurt harig
resulting in the grinder taking 30+ seconds to spin up to speed and often blowing deticated 15A slowblow brakers in the process
like id have to give it a flick to get started if I wanted it to start before the braker blows
JT-Hardinge, whats a 4 into 1 wire
I'm hooking up the turret encoder and I have 24+ on two lines and 22- on the other two in the current position
and what are you pligging it into
I e-mailed the CEO that if they wish to continue selling such trash, they will need to make a longer return reason form because I ran outta room
I tie the 4 positive posts to my 24v rail for everything else
tom3p, you can score a 612 for dirt cheap
all of em too damn low for 6'4" dude, you vstood with feet about 50inches apart or spent the Day bent over
JT-Hardinge, if you give me a few, i'll look to see what i did
so it is not a simple "I hooked it up backwards" issue
I tried both ways LOL
tom3p: buy some large blocks of steel
tom3p, yea, i'm about 6'2 so i hear ya
JT-Hardinge, i had an issue too, but i forgot how i fixed it. lemme go look
need the walker chuck, herman schmidt vise and one of those sliding dressers
like, an I beam and chop it up
maybe weld plate on top
tom3p, i got a walker chuck, they are nice
instant taller lathe!
Alternatly, just dig a hole in the ground. :)
JT-Hardinge, why + and -? sounds like telephone power.. is the - of the +24 the same as the plus of the -22? (tele are 'stacked')
tom3p: I don't have a clue... there are 6 wires from the encoder 0v buss, 24v buss, and 4 signal lines that give you 1 - 8
the wires have a weight of 1, 2, 4, 8 so if 1 and 2 are on your in position 3
JT-Hardinge, i have all the positive input terminals going to the + on the power supply, and the signal wires going to the negative terminals
but mine is 12v
aa-danimal-shop: that is how I have all the rest of mine
I must need some kind of flywheel gizmo diode or something
[22:14:59] <JT-Hardinge> http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f163/johnplctech/Hardinge/TurretEncoder02.jpg
Thats cute, what are those 4 pin IC's? hall sensores?
JT-Hardinge, how are you supplying power to it?
maybe there's an issue there
the little black thingies with 4 legs?
there is a magnet on an arm above them
not in the photo
hall effect switches
yea likey hall effect then
Theres other techs of course, but its usally hall :)
maybe I need some pull sideways resistors or something...
Theres hall effect with built in magnets now and processing hardware that works on just (ferrous) gear teeth and such too.
JT-Hardinge, stupid question, but you are connecting power to the encoder, right?
no stupid questions at this stage Dan
the signal wires are grounding to the negative wire that powers the encoder
so you should see a closed circuit between signal and - when that bit is active
I don't understand
they detect, there seems to a 6vwire cable and 2 of those are likely power and 8 sensors, thats leaves the 1 2 4 8 weighted lines... what do you see when sensor #1 is near the dog , measured to the - of this pcb's power?
your 7i37 is not supplying the power to the encoder, there is a seperate power connection on it
tom3p: yes one is 0v and one is 24v and the other 4 are signals
I'm in position 3 atm and two wires read +24v and two read -22v
when the magnet is over a given hall switch, it will be 0 ohms or close to it between 0v and signal for whatever signal wires are active from that hal switch
and what do you see from weight1 to 0V when dog is near sensor1?
i think you got something backwards
the whole -22 is goofy
you shouldnt see voltage.... it shorts to 0v
aint no -22 going in, isolate this thing
maybe you got the power wires to the encoder reversed
the two that are on show 22v to ground the two that are off show 0.002somthing to ground
the power wires were all ready connected in the X axis encoder box to a buss there
they are almost perfect rail to rail
ok then you need to change your setup... hook your signal wire to the positive input on the 7i37, and the ground wire goes to the negative terminal
yours is backwards of mine
tried that and I get a red light
ok, what did halmeter say?
I have not got past a red light on the 7i37 yet
JT-Hardinge: does it have removable screw-terminal connectors?
if I connect the + lead of the DMM to the 24v buss and read each lines two are +24v and two are +2v
Jymmm: the 7i37?
the two that read +24 are 4 and 8 so that is not a good combination
JT-Hardinge: unpowered, unplug them one at a time and see if the red led clears.
did that and the red light only clears when I don't have the "other" side tied together
JT-Hardinge, i swear i had the same problem
I can connect all 4 signals to either + or - so long as the opposite is not connected to anything
Does limit3 exist in EMC2 2.3.5? Debug file information: insmod: error inserting '/usr/realtime-2.6.24-16-rtai/modules/emc2/limit3.ko': -1 File exists
what does your hal look like for those pins?
Kirk_Wallace: I see it in the automagiclly generated man pages
yes, it's been there for quite a while
guess that doesnt matter
maybe since the first EMC2 release
Okay, I'll keep looking. Thanks
what are the last few lines of dmesg?
(dmesg | tail -20)
Kirk_Wallace: I'm trying to connect my turret encoder to my 7i37 and am not getting what I expect
Kirk_Wallace, put the output of that command on http://pastebin.ca
got any time to jabber about it?
JTH : I used the parallel port for my changer encoder.
On a divorce case that I was once working on, my client, who was a journeyman auto technician, owned an extensive set of Snap-on tools, probably close to $50K worth at retail. Wife wanted half the value.
Upon valuation by a professonal appraiser to whom both sides had agreed, they were considered to be worth less than 30% of retail for purposes of dividing the value. The reason was, that the tools were kept in a shop with other technicians and all were marked with my client's initials. Had they been unmarked, they would have been worth far more.
with a breakout board
JT-Hardinge what danimal said: you need to connect the -in pins on the 7I37 to ground, and the +in pins to the signals
JTH : I used opto-isolators to change the +12V sinals to 5.
JT-Hardinge, wish i could help but i'm stumped
JTH : See http://www.wallacecompany.com/cnc_lathe/HNC/00013-1a.jpg
Turret Input Conv
pcw I have them that way now and if I connect an on pin and an off pin to ground I get a red light
i think yours is pnp, mine is npn i believe
if I only connect the two on pins or the two off pins to ground no red light
and what happens if you reversed the polarity of the inputs on the 7i37?
+24 to pcb, pcb output to + of 7i37, -of 7i37 to 0(24vdc)
what is this red led (aint in the manual for 7i37)
A red light means you have reversed input, perhaps an input wiring error like an input wired across two signals
JTH : The 7i37 has opto-isolators on their inputs with a + and a - terminal?
right topm3p there should be no way to get - inputs that way
danimal (nothing except red light goes on)
and the reverse protection diode is a red LED
could the encoder board be leaking enough voltage to cause the issue?
PCW, i know what happens if it's incorrect, i was asking JT-Hardinge what happens when he reverses it from the way he has it when the red lights are on
isolate the sensor pcb, isolate thge 7i37, dont have any extra/other gnds or power
Each + and - terminal float, don't they?
I can connect the 4 signals to either + or - as soon as I connect the opposite terminals together I get a red light
JT-Hardinge what are you up to?
Maybe your ground isn't
"I can connect the 4 signals to either + or - as soon as I connect the opposite terminals together I get a red light"
actually thats just what I would expect if the -inputs were not all returned to ground
* pfred1 wishes he knew what was being discussed
Maybe the - terminal wire doesn't ground to the senser board power supply ground?
gots to be an open ground
pfred1 : JTH is trying to get his 7i37 inputs working.
if I connect the + lead of the DMM to the 24v buss and read each lines two are +24v and two are +2v
I've seen voltages register that dissapeared when loaded too
i dont know why they even have it into 4 bits. why not just come directly off each of the 4 hall effect switches?
There are eight.
JT-Hardinge, can you get other combinbations too ( not just 2hi 2lo)?
aa-danimal-shop doesn't 4 signals give you 4 bits?
if I connect the - lead of the DMM to the 0v rail two lines read +22v and two read -.02
ah, the -.2 thats an open
0000 0001 0010 0011 0100 ...
always msr related to the gnd, ok good
are all the 7I47 -inputs connected to the 0V rail?
pcw use pull ups?
all the other ones are wired + pin to 24v rail and - pin to sensor and then on to 0v rail
on the 7i37
tom3p PCW is potty trained!
But for the encoder the - inputs need to be wired to 0 rail, no 24V involved
PCW thats how I'm doing mine
pcw it is not a real encoder
[22:57:23] <JT-Hardinge> http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f163/johnplctech/Hardinge/TurretEncoder02.jpg
JT-Hardinge looks real enough to me
Well it looked like that encoder uses a LM324 which will swing to ground but not VCC so the OPTOs need to sense relative to ground
yep a lm324m
Doooh. I put "addf limit3..." in twice (hitting head).
hence 4 7I37 -in pins tied to common 0V rail, 4 corresponding +inputs wired to signals
The LM324 will sink or source a few or more mA won't they?
Kirk_Wallace its stone age tech so sure
PCW, thats the opposite of mine
I think the encoder originally used 12V.
yes push pull but better sink that source IICRC and swings close to ground but not vcc rail
my positives are tied together going to the 12v+ on the power supply, and the signals go to the negative terminals on the 7i37
heh you got to love when they flag it obsolete product no recommended replacement
yea, our encoders are 12v Kirk_Wallace
p3 is plus and p12 is gnd and reads ok on the chip?
pcw I got a red led if I had not yet connected the -'s to the 0v rail
well it is good to 32V the LM324
once I connect the -'s to the 0v rail no more red led
Kirk_Wallace looks like it'll out 50 ma too
JT-Hardinge, go on
Yep thats expected (if the common - floats you will have two inputs in series across two signals: one normal, one reversed)
LOL I didn't expect that :)
and those 4 use the in's not the in-not's
aa-danimal-shop: if your encoder has LM324 output driver JTs way would be slightly better noise immunity wise
PCW, mine only worked this way
i went through the red light issue too, so i swapped things around a bit
thanks for helping me muddle through this guys
hold on , what happened how is is solved now?
Well if the outputs swing from ground to +12 or +24 it should always work JTs way
PCW, my signal wires grounded to the negative lead of the power supply when active
is the red lite off now? is it hooked up like "+24 to pcb, pcb output to + of 7i37, -of 7i37 to 0(24vdc)" ?
tom3p: I had to connect the -'s to the 0v rail and not just let them be connected together
JT-Hardinge good job!
tom3p floating ground (-ins tied together but not to 0V rail) so 24V input got split between two 7I37 inputs one with +12 the other with -12
yep hanging in air!
ahh, Peter saved the day again :)
so it is dual supply?
I'm just a techno monkey
we get good support fromPCW & Mesa
err, techno monkey redneck
best thing is NO SMOKE was released during this phase of conversion :)
stiil a favorite http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4Wy7gRGgeA
but i am NaM (notamonkey)
aa-danimal-shop as long as the outputs swing to +12 or +24 it should work either way
JT-Hardinge LM324a are worth about a nickel on the open market :)
my concern was that with LM324 output devices (that swing only up to 22 V) the opto input would see 2V
when the PS voltage was used as a common instead of 0V
glad you got it figured out JT-Hardinge
pfred1: the spares cost me about $1.22 each
JT-Hardinge : So are you getting nibbles?
Half a byte
JT-Hardinge a half a byte
* JT-Hardinge has a confused look on his face atm
JT-Hardinge 4 bits is a nibble
encoder data nibbles
yes I have nibletts
aa-danimal-shop those usually come in pairs
I'm sitting on position 3 atm and wsum says so
Kirk, Way Cool... all I had to replace was the tan pointy thingy on the encoder board
lol technical terms
JT-Hardinge it was a nice capacitor too!
was pointy thing across 24V supply ?
there is so much chicken scratch on the encoder part of my drawings it ain't funny
tom3p: I can't tell at this point
12 V supply?
the marconi confetti generator (an old electrolytic hang across ac :)
JT-Hardinge the chicken scratch is piling up for my port buffer board here too!
But the original cap was rated at 24, you need a safety zone?
tom3p I made some 120VAC steppers run once by making a phase shifting capacitor out of a string of electrolytics
I got the 35v one you linked to
oh, they were $1.22 and the LM324 was $0.46
JT-Hardinge if you want to get really fancy you can connect the 4 - inputs to 12V
Kirk_Wallace is there really a 24V capacitor rating, 25 is common but 24?
JT-Hardinge you could probbaly beat that LM 324 with a hammer and it'
JT-Hardinge you could probbaly beat that LM 324 with a hammer and it'd still do what it does
pcw, I think I'll leave it be as it seems to be working now :)
i was thinking it was 329, didnt catch that
I'm a liitle nervous about the sensors rated at 20V.
now what did this thing do? decide dr.pepper vs pepsi?
I don't remember the actual cap rating, 24 or 25 is what I remember.
tom3p it is for a gaming table fix
[23:23:45] <tom3p> http://wapedia.mobi/en/The_Eudaemonic_Pie
Dan did you email me your latest ladder?
PCW : The 7i37 inputs work down to something like 4V?
so, does anyone want to see my latest schematic?
pfred1 : Whatcha got?
Kirk_Wallace it is a parallel port buffer I am working on
pfred1 : How far along are you?
weel good stuff JT-Hardinge one step closer
Kirk_Wallace well it is done except i want to change the connector to match a dual header like comes off DB-25 ribbons
yep, one small step for JT... one giant leap for Cocoa (my girlfriend)
she likes to jump up in the air
Kirk_Wallace I've already run a breadboarded model of the output section and it ran my motor driver fine in stepperconf wizard axis test
Kirk_Wallace the input part I haven't tried yet I guess I should though
Dumb question - why are some of the user names red on my screen?
Kirk_Wallace is your name first on the line?
I don't think so.
so my last line wasn't red?
this line 18:33 < pfred1> Kirk_Wallace is your name first on the line?
Just your "pfred1"
yes its a highlight if someone refferences you in the channel
some IRC channels have hundreds of people all chatting at once it can get a bit confusing
Oooh. Yes see. Dooh.
type jt then hit the tab button
thats nick completion
I just copy paste with a mouse
can you nick complete yourself?
pfred1: ha you can!
Not in THIS client
yeah i htought that was pretty lame why would you message yourself?
Jymmm next we'll teach Kirk_Wallace what a/s/l means :)
pfred1: OH NO WE WONT!
Is this some secret handshake?
Kirk_Wallace: No, just some lame ass shit
Kirk_Wallace bit more than a handshake
Kirk_Wallace a/s/l is age/sex/location for people that cyber on IRC
pfred1: I should kick you for that
Jymmm well one should be aware of some things .... birds and bees of IRC in effect
pfred1: bullshit, that's AOL speak
THIS AINT AOL MUDDER FSCKER!
Jymmm donno i never been to AOL but i seen that plenty on IRC
pfred1: then stay out of the lame chanels
heh i would've looked at the line above thinking it was a vi-guy correcting spelling
tom3p: Shall I translate ?
Kirk_Wallace: Also, using "A/S/L" in many channels can/will get you booted much of the time.
which is why is dumb of pfred1 to be teaching such crap
* Jymmm beats pfred1 with a AOL CD, all 100,000 of them!!!!
/msg Jymmm *rasberry!*
* Jymmm sets mode: +goober pfred1
do you think he took my kidding around a lil too serious?
Kirk_Wallace Yes ~3-4V
cradek: I don't think (or I am clueless on the way it works) but I tried to have a contact that was triggered by %C0.V&1 - which I thought would be a the first bit of the word. I also assigned the %CO.V to a %W0 then tried to trigger a contact using %W0&1 (but it says that I must select a boolean variable)
and having a hard time finding info on this.
a "boolean variable"??? Is the variable your using NOT boolean (on/off) ?
I want to convert a number to 4 bit binary
(to control 4 outputs
using some compares?
well - I could - but I thought that I could (by using the &1, &2, &3 and so on - I could extract the bits from the word) But like I said - I must not be doing it right
or it isn't possible ;)
I suppose I could do it in hal - making a little comp that does it.
but what fun would that be ;)
that sounds easier
I don't know if you can use the bit of a word like that in classicladder
I can in most plcs I deal with or just use a function in them
ladder decoder http://openbookproject.net/electricCircuits/Digital/DIGI_9.html
tom3p: good link