* jt-plasma wonders what would stop ubuntu from completing the boot up from the LiveCD?
the disk checks ok... doing a mem test now
sorry, major distraction with kids/dogs, etc.
Also my browser hung
So, video BIOS settings....
I am in the bios now, in Advanced: Video Configuration.
My choices are DVMT Mode (set to DVMT) with choices of DVMT, FIXE, BOTH
jt-plasma: you still are having issues?
IGD DVMT Memory (set to 128MB) with choices of 32MB, 64MB, 128MB, Maximum DVMT
how much memory do you have installed?
Well, yes but I may have missed some of the conversation a bit ago
what livecd are you using? latest from linuxcnc.org?
Yes, 8.04 from linuxcnc.org
I would boot off of it agian and see if you can run the latency test...
danimal_garage: still trying to get something up and running to progress along till my gift arrives
yes, I will try that next.
I just changed two bios paramters.
I set the IGD DVMT memory to Maximum DVMT
I set graphics from Auto to Int IGD
jt-plasma: bummer, wish i got it out on Sat for ya
heh, I put a different video card in and now it works :)
Hmm, I found this on the wiki info for the latency test for my motherboard: HyperThreading? is disabled from BIOS
I am trying that....
my cycle time timer works awesome now
thanks for the idea jt-plasma
did it work like you wanted?
* jt-plasma reads up one whole line
not sure what to do next
flight to outer space?
I wish I graduated to space flight :-(
i thought about adding a number block to my pyvcp that displays the difference between current home position and previous home position
in case i accidentally hit home
So, to ask a stupid question....
I booted from the LiveCD
then i can just do a little math instead of having to re-indicate my fixture
if I want to run from the livecd do I select Try Ubuntu without any change to your computer?
might be hard to do though
Guest835: i think so
ok, here goes...
danimal_garage: I think that is in 2.4 a nag to warn you of re-homing if your all ready homed
maybe only in dev...
oh awesome, they're putting that in??
i know it was requested and i think it's a good idea
saw that the other day
since i just hit it today by accident
hmmm, it is installing
one thing that would be REALLY nice is a coolant override
to turn it off?
so you can turn it on or off with the program running
i suppose i can do it in ladder though
do that in HAL
Does Axis always complain about zero feed rate when you do anything (like clear the backplot) in feed-per-rev mode with the spindle stationary, or is that a feature of my slightly odd setup?
it doesnt allow me to do it when the program is running
andypugh: any feed move without F set to above 0 is an error
I am not sure what F is.
f= your feedrate
It is read from an analogue input wired to a pyVCP control.
your quick tonight Dan
jt-plasma: i have a halui button for coolant, it's greyed out while the program is running
Oh, I know what F means, not the value it has at any one time.
jt-plasma: that's because i ran out of beer
I never run out... I make it 10 gallons at a time
i can make it run out
is the button on a pyvcp panel?
i have a physical button
on my front pannel
My Lathe G-code runs in G96 with F read from a textbox. Even when the textbox is non-zero I get the dialog box, and I suspect it is actually because the spindle is stationary at the time.
andypugh: a box in pyvcp?
you have to jump through hoops to make a text entry work you have to use the up or down arrow once
I have a general-purpose semi-manual lathe setup. Textboxes for surface speed, finish Z and finish X, cut and feed and then face/turn/bore/groove options.
or number thingy
Yes, I know about that aspect. The feed box is definitely non-zero.
is it a spinbox?
Well, same behavior running off LiveCD (with my sata disk attached).
Trying again without the sata disk plugged in...
odd - I have never had an issue with the the atom
I guess I need to investigate more carefully. I thought perhaps it was a known issue with G96, but perhaps it is that M66 isn't actually acted on in preview?
Guest835: I got mine to work with a different video card :)
were you using the onboard video?
Guest835: different mobo
Aye, it's a spinbox. I have a patch for the pyvcp widgets file that I need to get round to installing.
what video card did you change to?
gotta use the the spin buttons once affter typing in a number
But even allowing for the values not updating when you type them in (I habitually type the number I want then click up, then down to make the value stick) I still get the error.
cheap 3dforce fx 5200tv
that is different then
Guest835: I have bios version LF94510J.86A.0140.2008.1231.0012
so many folks have used this mbord with onboard and had no problem.
jt-plasma: did you know of a way to make the halui coolant button overide the program when it's running?
At run-time there is no error, just when I load the file, or clear the backplot, ie when Axis runs its preview. I suspect it just doesn't bother reading analogue inputs at that stage.
hmm, I will look at my bios version....
i get an error saying i cant turn on or off the coolant when in auto mode
gotta put a kid to bed, back in a bit
danimal_garage: Add a pyvcp button instead? That won't have any such interlocks.
I have not tried it danimal_garage but are you using halui.flood.off and on with a pyvcp button
or a physical button
not a pyvcp button, i'm using an actual button on the front of my machine linked to the halui pin
my bios is different: LF94510J.86A.0171.2009.0403.0118
Perhaps you need to net that through an and-block in HAL?
It is a new board, just got it...
This one is a month or 2 old.
But that is just a guess... Don't take it too seriously unless someone else with more of a clue concurs.
for shits/grins - do you have a 1gb stick of ram you could put in it?
I have never tried it with 2.
* skunkworks is looking for differences
andypugh: might work for getting around the block, but it would go around the entire halui pin
I don't think I have another stick that is compatible
I also set the bios to 'optimal defaults' and is seems to run still..
Looking through the doc, there are halui pins for coolant, and iocontrol pins that show the program coolant status. I suspect that it comes down to how those are wired.
the halui coolant pins are worthless when it auto mode
i'd basically have to wire around them to override the coolant
So ignore them. I they aren't in HAL then I don't think they will even appear on the screen.
true, i can just wire to the iocontrol pin
Then take iocontrol.0.coolant-on and the logic signal from your physical button through an AND block and connect to the relay output.
or a pyvcp button
i'd like to avoid using pyvcp buttons
For extra fun, do something clever with latches so that it is button edges that are detected so that the io pin can over-ride the button on program start...
andypugh: that's how i need it
use a physical button then
yea, i got a physical button
Make the button a momentary, with an independent light connected to the coolant relay.
use a selector switch and when it is off the coolant is off no matter what EMC wants
well i'd like to have it so the button overrides the program, and the program overrides the button, depending on what's on/off first
There is a flipflop in HAL, I am not sure if that does what you need.
[00:55:40] <andypugh> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/html//man/man9/flipflop.9.html
cool, thanks, i'll check it out
Ah, no. Toggle is what you want. Possibly.
i have a toggle for the coolant
thanks guys, i'll play with it a bit
i think i can get it working
I know you can
I am sure there is some magic combination of edge detectors, latches and toggles that will do the trick :-)
jt-plasma: it might just take me 3 weeks lol
andypugh: yea, i'm just gunna to it in ladder
easier for me that way
better than me I've had this lathe how long :?
jt-plasma: i bet i got more hours into mine
jt-plasma: 17 years, 8 months, 12 days, 14 hours, 49 minutes, and 33 seconds
probably a month, full time
ok you got me beat lol
Jymmmm: That sounds like my current sleep-deficit. Time to do something about it.
Jymmmm: is that how old you are?
i wish i was 17 again
danimal_garage: Yeah, that means I join here when I was like 7yo
you've been doing this for 10 years?
boy, you got me beat by like 9 years, 5 months
you guys are nuts sometimes
jt-plasma: all the time.
I started unbuilding machines in 1955
my first was a toaster
jt-plasma: they had electricity back then?
jt-plasma: what abot a wheel?
I had to mush a dog sled to school
nope just sleds
no wonder you smoke everything
and whale blubber and salmon sandwiches
I was born in the territory of Alaska
was the whale blubber ball your only friend?
named 'Wilson' by chance?
I had a pet seal
till we ate him
i started running machines when i was 15, and working nearly full time in a machine shop when i was 16
(I saw that coming)
(the seal steaks that is)
i bet they were smoked
it's either eat or be ate up there
yep and brown bears
Well, to be perfectly honest I took apart my first TV when I was 3yo, and it was still plugged in as I was told.
when did Alaska become a state?
so technically you're an immigrant?
if your born in a territory your a US citizen 100%
like puerto ricans?
that is how Puerto Rico squeeks by
i went there once
yep my wife is Puerto Ricoen
ah, so you werent kidding, she does speak spanish lol
time for chow guys
if your late you go hungry
(have your wife translate)
I know a couple of words LOL
and can count to 10 I think
Guest835: updated to LF94510J.86A.0229.2009.0729.209 (latest) still boots and runs latency/emc
thks, but with another graphics card, right?
no - onboard
I wonder if I should load the latest
maybe it is just the one I am using...?
btw, how do you update the bios?
heh - I burned the iso from intels website.
to a dvd?
Question... If you have to paint with a 3" roller, so maybe once or twice a week. How could you do it without having to clean out the roller all the time? I considered a sprayer, but this is narrow stuff and would be painting more of the floor that the actual item.
plastic wrap and the fridge
why the frig?
keep it from evaperating.. (I really don't know - wife does it all the time)
does it work? and for how long?
i use plastic bags and i tape them shut
but i never left them for longer than overnight
a long time...
skunkworks: define long time? hours? days? months?
really. Does she use a platic bag, or actual wrap so it comes into contact with the roller so it doens't build up a film?
ok, cheap enough. does she bag it after that?
Guest835: I booted off the livecd just to make sure - ran latency test.
Guest835: you are using the hardy livecd?
Jymmmm: no - we had a 'paint' drawer for a long time.
Comcast apologizes for error that led to callers being connected to phone sex line
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skunkworks: what video setting are you using in the BIOS?
I managed to update the bios to LF94510J.86A.0229.2009.0729.209 but am still having the problem
The Update Manager says there are 198 updates to install. I am really tempted....
what was the problem again?
latency test doesn't run... get the X Error...
let me check - but like I say - I am using the 'Optimal Defaults'
dvmt, 128mb, 256mb, auto
I don't see "Optimal Defaults' anywhere...?
ok, using Optimal Defaults, and trying again...
Just to be sure I am not crazy...
I should be able to just select Latency-Test under the EMC menu within Ubuntu, right?
and I can have a login that is may name (it doesn't need to be anything special - like emc or anything)?
well - you are booting off the livecd - for now - right?
I went back to my sata disk just now....
did you do any of the 198 updates that the update manager wants to do?
but did you update?
it should work without updating.
Is it hardy?
(is the livecd you are using 8.04 Hardy Heron?)
weird... - I wonder if it is something to do with the 2gb.. I could try it but it won't be until tomorrow.
I don't know what else it could be :-(
sweet, got the coolant override working great
optimal defaults didn't help?
no (I am now a different username - browser crash)
I am using optimal defaults but no change
I made burned the ISO dvd on my Mac
Even though the MD5 checksum checks out, I wonder if something could be amiss....?
skunkworks, Guest923 maybe compare glxinfo... it sounds like there may be a problem with the video device
glxinfo spits out a pile of stuff, anything specific to look at?
LawrenceG: same motherboards - livecd also doesn't work on Guest923 motherboard..
I hope this isnt the old issue of problems with >1GB ram for the rtai kernel... with onboard video it will be using the top block for video buffer
at boottime is there a 'check the cd' option? (that checks the cd not the image used to burn the cd)
its painfully slow but not as slow as several reboots
There are MD5 checksums for all the files. I checked about 90% of them (till my eyes ached) and they were identical.
skunkworks, so what is different between your board and guests?
he has 1G and I have 2G
not ,md5 thats before the cd is created this test is after the cd is created
burn the iso at 4x speed
that could be the problem.... do you have a smaller ram stick?
we now have the same bios also...
My mac burned it a 2X speed!
No, I don't think I have a 1G stick around of that ilk
2x CD speed, not 2x DVD speed
yes, 2x dvd
No, 4x CD Speed
seems to me there is a boot option to force it to use only 1GB
did you burn it to a DVD or a CD blank?
I would have used a cd but I don't happen to have blanks so I used a dvd-r
that won't work
SWPadnos: (when you have a moment)
it's a CD ISO, not a DVD ISO
awwww - jeepers ;)
you need a CD-R or RW
it's an iso what does it matter?
the media type is different
I used the dvd iso to update the BIOS for god's sake
which DVD ISO?
the iso file at intel, and burned it to a dvd (is what I meant).
The media shouldn't matter at all
well, I can say that others have had a problem booting from our ISO when it's burned to a DVD
I don't buy it, but I am willing to try anything after all the time I have spent
so maybe something in the Ubuntu 8.04 init just doesn't work from DVD
maybe it is just plain broq ;)
I am going to Meijers to get a CD, gummit
If this doesn't work I'll try not to hate you all for making me go to Meijers at 10pm :-)
I would never go to Meijers at 10PM :)
unless I needed ice cream or something
get some cds and ice cream, always have a plan 'B'
hey SWPadnos how did it go in Dallas?
crappy, more or less
long days, hardware failures, weird weather
did the snow make things worse?
hello! this is steve 10778 i have my computer in the house trying to get it setup for a bridgeport. I did a machine a while ago, but know i am trying to use more functions with axis and postgui panel. im having a problem trying to get me keyboard linked up to my panel, when i open emc i get an error page. on the bottom it says"no input devices could be opened. this usually indicates a misconfigured system....... hal_input exited withou
only when I had to clear 5 inches of snow off the car without a brush
:) That's the most I've ever seen around here.
yeah, broke a record set in 1962
that was before me :)
so did you get the job done? or did the hardware fail too badly?
anybody on here that can help with that? i didnt post anything on the forum yet i thought i would ask here.
Guest923: I think I had the same problem with my machine. There is some additinal information on the man page for hal_input that may help. I am not near my machine right now so I can't looK to see exactly what I did.
is this john with the heidenhain interact?
type "man hal_input"
well was a heidenhain interact
hi john, this is steve. im trying to put my stuff together with some of your stuff.
now is EMC2
mozmck, we got 9 of the 12 slam dunks, so it was so-so successful
so i can yank my tnc 145 off of there, haha. having some trouble getting going though.
SWPadnos: well, that's better than nothing anyhow. sorry it didn't go better.
Guest923 see http://forum.wareseeker.com/limit-the-ram-size-on-ubuntu-t56765.html
mem=1G on the boot line will restrict ubuntu to using less than installerd ram
yeah, it was a bummer
I would have contacted you, but the night I went in to start working at midnight, I finished at 5:00 PM the next day
and then went in at 6 AM the next day, and worked 12 hours (and then another two, starting at 10:30 PM)
that was my off day
haha, i thought that was me for a sec.
Thanks, after I try it with a Genuine Meijer CD-R I will look at memory
SWPadnos: ouch! that gets old fast! Maybe you can come out next time you're in the area.
john, if you can let me know how i can fix it send me an email.
Ok next time I am in my shop I will look to see if I wrote anything down in my notebook. Did you look at the man page?
cant make sense of what the problem is. i tried less /proc/bus/input/devices to get a name, and tried entering it like i said above with the name given rather than just "keyboard" no luck.
Guest932, did you have an extra keyboard attached, or just one?
i ll have to dig in some more.
i have just one
ok, I'm not sure how well that will work
what do you mean?
there is an option to have hal_input open the device for exclusive use
well, the keyboard you use to type with may not be an ideal device to use with hal_input
SWPadnos: I think we had a similar convesation about 3 months ago I also had trouble getting my keyboard to work with hal_input.
yep, I recall the conversations
I think you said that you wouldn't be using the keyboard for anything else or something like that
in exclusive mode, it gets taken away from X, so you can't type with it
do i need to have the name, phys and the id on my hal_input line?
in non-exclusive mode, I think both X and hal_input may get the events
which could be very confusing
no, just some part of the name should do it, as long as it's unique
Well, here I am back after a fine trip to Meijers. I have CD-R, burnt a new LiveCD and booted it. Same result. Can't run latency-test. :-(
the ID will change
Will try modifying the max memory parameter in Grub next.
oh, sorry for the trip. I didn't realize that it booted OK but some software didn't work - I thought it wouldn't boot at all
hmmm. could you do me a favor as long as you have it booted up
It boots fine.
open a terminal, and run halcmd
well, now I know.
I just can't run EMC or latency test
did you get some ice cream? :)
No, the people there scared me too much
halcmd wants some options
swpad, should i try to write a new rule in /etc/udev/rules.d subsystem==
ok, that's good - at least it's there
hmmm. yes, it may be necessary to change the permissions for keyboard devices
the hal_input manpage has the correct incantations
Time for bed. I get up early. Steve, let me know if you get it to work - send an e-mail.
'input", mode="0660", group="plugdev" and if i do this, do i need to be root or something like that? im a noob, dont know how to do it.
ok john, im going soon. thanks
hmmm. I wonder if he meant me, since I'm Steve also :)
After I try running latency-test and it fails, if I try running it again (from the command line) I get: Realtime already running. Use 'halrun -U' to stop existing realtime session.
you never know!
so, in a terminal run "halrun -U"
then from the same terminal, run the latency test
and tell us the error, or paste the terminal output to http://pastebin.ca
steve im going to logout and login as steve10778
Ok, I will paste it hang on a min....
I have to wait for it to finish being hung....
wait a minute
did you run the latency test from the CNC menu the first time?
how do i login to have permission to save a change in udev/rules.d folder ?
pasted output is at http://pastebin.ca/1797997
Yes, ran from cnc menu first time.
use sudo, and when it asks for a password, use the one for your user
thank you., let me give that a shot.
please paste the output of "uname -a"
[03:53:54] <Guest923> http://pastebin.ca/1798001
at the bottome
im not able to do what i think i want to do.
thanks for the help steve, looks like you are busy im going to read up on it some more tomorrow and see what i come up with. im out!
I've got to get to bed soon anyway. good luck with it
SWPadnos: how much snow do you have over there?
a couple of inches on the ground maybe, from weeks ago. we got a dusting last night
for real snow, I had to go to Dallas :)
yea, looks like the south got it all
I flew through both Chicago and Washington DC in the last week, and didn't really encounter much
we got a heat wave going on now, and last week the snow like was like 2,000 feet
we are driving to Charleston next week for winter break. Not very spring like there!
line, not like
i was sweating in the garage today, it was over 80 in here
We're headed for Orlando. I'm just hoping it stays above 60 or so
never been to florida
who knows, could warm right up...
anything interesting in the pasted info?
i better insulate the garage before it gets too warm, i dont wanna be sweating while dealing with fiberglass up in the rafters
not to me anyway
can you paste the output of dmesg
at least the last hundred lines or so
I booted off my original install on the sata disk and set the Grub file to use only 1GB. Didn't have any effect that I could tell (same problem).
I think the manifestation of the 1GB problem would be a relatively rapid crash, but I'm not sure of that
Full dmesg output at: http://pastebin.ca/1798013
looks like it is still using 2GB line 51
Yes, this is the LiveCD version
ok... still looking
I can boot to my sata version (where I limit to 1GB) and show you that
but it probably looks the same
For grins, dmesg output from sata install (limited to 1G) at http://pastebin.ca/1798024
this is just booted, before trying to run anything at all (in case that makes a diff).
Guest923, any chance you have an old pci video card?
I looked, and no I don't.
I am tempted to go buy a cheapo one tomorrow.
But I had hoped to run this thing without a video card as I wanted to actually run it full time headless just logging in via VNC from a laptop.
I havent tried running the lateceny test over ssh.... wonder if that would eleimate the onboard video?
not sure how to enable ssh on it yet....
can anyone try that... ssh -X 192.168.0.???
However, it needs to generate the video to send it over VNC, so I think this is still an issue
I tried that, but apparently ssh is disabled (or something)...
you might have to install sshd sudo apt-get install sshd
do you have it networked on a local network and do you have another computer on the network ?
yes and yes
worth a try
apt-get says Couldn't find package sshd
nevermind, found package ssh
ok I think its called openssh-server
This package provides the sshd server
above is response to latency-test over ssh
so it wants to set display to me
I just ran latency test over VNC and am running top over the ssh session. Xorg is running at 99.4% CPU and machine appears hung...
now it stopped and all appears normal but have the usual error.
any suggestions for a cheap and known good video card I can get locally (best buy, etc)?
isnt there a hardware list somewhere on the linuxcnc website?
Yeah, that's where I got the motherboard that doesn't work! ;-)
well if it's hanging up on something to do with xorg, then it's probably hardware/driver related, isnt it?
i would assume you removed every card but the neccesary?
browser crash again
i would assume you removed every card but the neccesary?
There is nothing on it at all, and I mean nothing
It is a bare board, sitting on 4 standoffs on my desk
using integrated video?
I use a little jumper connector to short the power leads.
1 ethernet, 1 sata, 1 ide and that's it.
no weird mice or keyboards?
Yes, weird to some....
I have an Apple Mac USB keyboard and mighty mouse connected
try a regular keyboard and mouse for shits and gigs
you dont have much to loose
I could try no keyboard and mouse, but I don't have a "regular" one....
a different keyboard and mouse?
i always keep a generic ps2 keyboard and mouse around
I will try none and see what happens. Once the machine boots I should be able to VNC into it....
here goes nothin'
let the smoke out!
nope, didn't work. I mean it worked, but I got the same errir
darn is right
long shot, but how about the monitor?
i tihnk someone had a monitor causing issues in here earlier today
even mine had issues before i straightened out my xorg conf. But not nearly as bad as yours it seems like.
I will give that a try too.. thanks for all the help. Got to get some sleep...
gaah stupid car has claimed my nail!
the blue is just rising and rising
will loose it :(
"halcmd setp parport.0.pin-02.out 1" - This sets physical pin 2 on thefirst parallel port to high, right?
nix that question.... apparently a pp port issue
danimal_garage: wake up
ries_ is now known as ries
why doesnt emc have built in tool zero finding from the beginning .. with a button that is :)
zero finding against workpiece?
[12:30:28] <Valen> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2N910jNOnE
motor is doing ~2500 RPM there
its cool at 5000 ;->
jt-plasma: the number of times you got laid before you turned 18?
jt-plasma: The number of hairs on your head?
the approximate number of digits on the line
The length of the line?
obviously the length of . is 0.625 8)
[14:35:25] <skunkworks_> http://www.shopping-headquarters.com/shop/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=6335
[14:35:44] <skunkworks_> https://www.4x4parts.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=165_400_25
[14:35:59] <skunkworks_> http://www.ancorp.com/line.aspx?id=213&catid=17
MrSunshine: what do you mean?
Just this once .. here's the log: http://www.linuxcnc.org/irc/irc.freenode.net:6667/emc/2010-02-16.txt
cradek, to check the tool length when tool changing =)
and set offsets
hm, I still don't understand what you are asking
I thought there was automatic touch-off?
he wants to not have to cinfigure emc for it
he wants it to just work
I don't think that would work too well on my machine :)
wants WHAT to just work
the automatic touch off
what do you mean automatic?
change tool length from a switch
thats what i understood anyways
I do that all the time... works great!
appears that it's too hard to set up
assuming we are talking about sensing tool length by poking a switch, you can do that
there is example gcode in the distribution
the example gcode sets a transient tool length offset
cradek: he doesnt want to have to set it up is what he's saying
you could also easily change it to write a tool table entry
meaning configure EMC for it.
you hook up the switch and run the example gcode. I'm not sure which of those two steps could be avoided.
probably also have to read the instructions
cradek: it's supposed to autodetect the machine, so that no integrator setup si involved. put CD in, press run
i know this. he doesnt.
Danimal-office: lots of choices available: read the docs, get someone to read the docs, move on
IMO you are all guessing what he means - I'm still waiting for an actual clear question
* alex_joni agrees with cradek
alex_joni: i am not asking for this, someone else was, i was just clearifying
i have no problem configuring my machine
then you might have very good mind reading skills ..
well i dunno about no problem, but i can figure it out eventually
saying that something (we don't know what) is not automatic enough is not the same as a question
Eric_K, using some hal script right?
but not integrated into the axis gui
MrSunshine: explain exactly what you want to do, maybe someone can help you do it
alex_joni: i am a noob myself, so i can understand other noob comments questions easier
Danimal-office: aww.. shucks, too bad. was just gonna ask you where I left my 13 socket wrench
noobish is an easy language to forget :)
alex_joni: it's on the floor
cradek, tool touch of to set the tool offsets when chaing tools =)
that's not specific enough
but integrated into axis gui
there is a touch-off button that you can use to set the tool length
cradek, but then i have to enter the numbers myself right ?
so you want to run a program until a tool change, then change the tool and move the machine around, then hit a button and have the length applied based on the new machine position?
I was in some store, and I was just waiting for one of their annoying salesmen to ask me if I needed any help so I could ask them what I was there for
SWPadnos, no, the machine should go down Z until contact with a plate, set the offset and go back up waiting for me to click ok for it to begin to mill again =)
ok now we are getting somewhere
you ARE talking about using a tool length probe of some kind
ok, that's easier, and is accomplished by using the technique in tool-length-probe.ngc
i thik there is a hal script with in emc but then you have to run that yourself as a subroutine or someting
like I said earlier, there is sample gcode that does that
yea, thats what i was getting at 20 sentences ago lol
and you don't have to hit a button to confirm it
it has nothing to do with hal
but you can make it do that if you really want (hit a button)
Danimal-office: you get the "good guess" prize
that and 4 bucks will get you a nice drink at starbucks
it has nothing to do with HAL, except that you have to have the probe input connected, which is done by selecting "probe input" for an input pin in stepconf, or adding one line to a HAL file
any kind of probes scare me. reminds me of that time with the aliens.
[16:51:35] <alex_joni> http://thewarfields.com/cnccookbook/img/OthersProjects/Tools/BlumNanoTouchsetter.jpg
that's one nice looking switch
goes nicely with this: http://thewarfields.com/cnccookbook/img/OthersProjects/SoManyTools.jpg
I should set up a tool length probe - I could just tell it to measure all the tools in the carousel.
that would be very cool.
Danimal-office: I finally got EMC installed in the temp computer last night :)
alex_joni, too many tools
I wish I had room for a cabinet like that, I have almost as many toolholders
cradek, that would be like a 6-line loop, wouldn't it?
(including the two O-word lines)
SWPadnos: it's supposed to work automatically !
alex_joni, don't be ridiculous! :)
SWPadnos: yeah it'd be easy - load tool - move and probe - whatever math - G10 - repeat
speaking of repeat, is the repeat count available during a repeat loop?
now THOSE are drawer slides
SWPadnos: no, you'd have to use a 'do' loop or whatever instead
ok, I thought I remembered something like that
but I'm never quite sure :)
if you do o100 repeat , you don't get the count anywhere in #vars
is the lathe running yet?
downloading 198 updates I think atm
cabinet probably costs more than my mill did
it's too clean in there
the "too many tools" cabinet w/ toolholders
see it now
198 updates?? how old is your cd?
latest one AJ13
wowsers, didnt think i had that many
[17:34:40] <skunkworks_> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2RFX2b5otcA
I saw that last night cool vid from Robh
thats his lathe?
one of them yes
not being a lathe person, i guess the sequence on that vid was face, ctr drill, drill, bore3x, fine bore, single point thread 11x?
he did a thread relief before the threading
if you have a fast connection http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=W6tB8Lf7YoU
:) my fat cookie? as that the name on the 1st jet
wah! see em get in line, musthave inter-video
any comment on that is an understatement
haha major pat cooke ( in cambodean font)
well - I booted the atom 330 board with 2gb ram - ran the livecd - no issues. (latency test worked.)
skunkworks_: the 1GB limit should be long time fixed
I thought so.. Someone was on here last night with atom issues... The only thing different that we could tell was he was running 2gb ram.
must have been something else.
anyone knows alot about the mesa cards?
PWC does :-)
I think Geo01005 has one, too.
im going to order two mesa cards
one for the cutting machine(oxyfuel) with stepper drivers
I have one myself, so I know a little bit about it.
and the servo drive card 7i33
Why get a servo card for a stepper machine?
i have one on my stepper machine :)
well, I have two different machines
danimal_garage: on your stepper machine did you use any daughter cards?
the lathe which which I have servos laying around for
Ah, do 2x 7i43 and a 7i33?
i use it for the analog output and encoder whatnots
hm, im thinking of the 5i20 or something
jt-plasma: yes, both machines have a 5i20, 7i42, 7i37, and 7i33
I was too tight-fisted so made my own breakout and PWM-voltage convertors
im not sure about the size of the card I need
* JT-Work jumps up and down and waves at danimal_garage
jt-plasma: look up a couple lines lol
Every current EMC-supported config fits in the 200k chip.
I'm running my plasma right from the 5i20
he is not there I'm here
you're gunna have to live with the jt-plasma lol
I ordered the 200k chip version of the 7i43 and got the 400k version though, so I am happy either way.
i dont feel like typing 4 characters
i chicken peck
so typing isnt my strong point
what do I need to run geckos from a 5i20?
I have to type 8 for your name LOL
anonimasu: Wires. That's all
you can just type dan, i'll know you mean me
unless he means me
yea but you're barely ever chatting lol
true ... but I'm watching ;)
too many Dan's
and I need optoisolator cards.. too
My 7i43 connects direct to the stepper drivers. (which have opto-inputs, as I think do Geckos)
i can just change my nick to ass
that would be only two letters for tab completion then LOL
I decided that the 7i43 was cheap enough to risk blowing up without opto-isolation.
how do i change it?
danimal_garage is now known as ass
but then we would not know where you are
sure you would
I have ULN2003 buffers as a layer of protection between the Mesa card and the power relays and VFD FWD/REV buttons though.
hmm.. now im curious
err can I use 7i43 instead if 5i20..
I need 3 axes with encoders..
and a spindle encoder input
and a output for the vfd
You can. It's cheaper but you get fewer IO pins. It probably has other disadvantages due to using P-Port for comms, but then it can live in the controller box rather than the PC case, so the wiring is easier.
how many io pins?
My 7i43 is running 3 stepper axes, 2 encoders (mill spindle and lathe spindle) and controlling a VFD using PWM and a few GPIO lines to switch the VFD inputs.
sounds like what I need
It is certainly more than adequate for the machine you described.
well, I can buy encoders for the difference between the 5i20 and the 7i43
ass is now known as artist-formerly-
feels like a better choice
artist-formerly- is now known as AA-Danimal-Garag
You might still need an encoder interface card, depending on what your encoders produce. Mine are home-made and were designed with 5V logic in mind.
AA-Danimal-Garag is now known as AA-Danimal-shop
It has taken me all this time to find tap-completion!
well, I'll be ordering encoders with as much resolution as I can count...
If the PC is not inside the same box as all the drivers etc then a 7i43 will probably give an easier wiring solution.
Either MESA card can follow encoders up to quite ludicrous speeds.
and what about interface card?
that's the only thing I'm wondering about now
Depends wahat you need. I _think_ that in either case the actual encoder counting is done by the FPGA on the main card, and the daughter cards are just voltage-conversion and connector breakout.
there, now you only have to type 1 letter
My interface card is a bit of stripboard with the correct headers soldered to it.
skunkworks_ is now known as AA-skunkworks
AA-skunkworks is now known as skunkworks_
JT-Work is now known as AA-JT-Work
yea, mine is still forst
A not-very-good-picture of my 7i43 installation. http://picasaweb.google.com/bodgesoc/Gibbs#5435328062697386514
AA-JT-Work is now known as A3-JT-Work
this is how I think it'll go
2 x 7i43
and 2 7i37ta
AA-Danimal-shop is now known as a1-danimal-shop
a1-danimal-shop: hey that works
a1-danimal-shop is now known as a0-danimal-shop
[19:21:31] <andypugh> http://picasaweb.google.com/bodgesoc/Gibbs?pli=1#5438923441932523602
Shows it a bit more clearly. The wires are terminated in individual female connectors and plugged on to header pins.
In the middle are the ULN2003 chips for the buffered outputs. (they switch 24V in some cases)
what about 7i47?
7I47 12 Channel motion oriented RS-422 interface
why do you need that one if you have geckos?
Easy wiring and buffering?
andypugh: is that one of those x2/lathe combos?
for the stepper machine sure..
how do you like it?
but for the servo one?
I wouldn't buy another.
im a bit perplexed
I need relay outputs too
I didn't want to dismantle and throw away half of a good quality old machine. I rather wish I had been less squeamish now. There isn't a lot of the machine that doesn't deserve to be thrown away.
guy here at work does't want to buy a separate mill/lathe - just thinks one of those things would be great. I keep pushing him though ;)
anonimasu: What do you want to switch with the relays?
my mill was already gutted for the most part
skunkworks_, those things?
toolchanging and stuff
mill/lathe combo machines
and power to drives
I am switching my main power relay and the VFD relay with the ULN chip you can see lurking under the wires in the second photo.
That is directly connected to 7i43 GPIO pins.
I thought if I stick an 7i37 I wont have pins I can use
as they will all be full of the connector
The ULN will switch seven outputs of 500mA/50V controlled by a logic-level signal.
are they OC?
andypugh: i havent seen anyone lace a loom since the turn of the century, looks good
* skunkworks_ should look it up.
and it 500mA total, they will blow at 500@ all 8 at once just too many watts per sqr mm of die
* anonimasu nods
skunkworks_: The ULN? No, Darlington pairs. Basically switch a voltage of your choice to earth.
so, 7i43 and 7i37 for the stepper machine
good sirs, i need a bigger mill. i currently have an MF70 and the Y axis is only 2"
anonimasu: I think that the 7i37 only uses half of your 48 pins.
cradek: yes. its tiny. i need a bigger one, was going to ask what poeple suggest
jackc: I agree. That is pitiful :-)
6" y travel would be nice
what do you do with it?
andypugh: wayyyy too big :-p
andypugh: if he does engraving, a bridgeport is going to be a very poor choice
cradek: circuit boards and various AL parts. i need to be able to lift it and move it
Mine has 130mm travel and that is not enough.
Hmm, possible bargain on that eBay....
yeah ive been trolling ebay for a week now but nothing looks both small enough and still good
i imagine a harbor freight mill would be a POS?
jackc: unfortunately I bet there's no one machine that's ideal for both those tasks - for PCBs you need a super high speed spindle but really no power
for Al you need slower and quite a bit more power and stoutness
cradek: right, the one i have now does 60k. im willing to sacrifice board speed to do more metal parts
I doubt there's any machine you can lift that's actually *good* at cutting metal :-/
the current spindle has *no* power so AL is hard
right, but I bet it's great for PCBs
haha, i dont need to hold 0.0001" - what part do you think is bad about small mills?
hm looks good for boards but not much else
itd be nice to be able to hold a 1/2 EM
if you use the 7i37 card can you still hook up steppers through it?
Sorry, my eBay comment was about a particular machine that I can't now find
you can't cut Al with a 1/2" EM on any machine you can lift
It was in the UK anyway.
ive cut boards on HAAS machines what can only spin 6krpm and it wasnt bad
if you need to be able to carry it.. that limits you a bit..
cradek: lol point taken
[19:40:20] <Jon_geo01005> http://www.rolanddg.com/product/index.html
i guess i need to remove some of my contraints
I lifted my machine onto the bench. It's probably only 150kg
thats not bad, what machine is it?
jackc: or maybe you need two machines
cradek: true, could keep the current machine for boards running and do real work with another machine
It's the one I was not recommending before you logged on :-)
ah lemmy scroll up
yes but it would have to be bigger
[19:41:31] <Jon_geo01005> http://www.rolanddg.com/product/3d/3d/mdx-20_15/application.html
cradek: are there bigger mills that are still (1) easily moved with my 150oz steppers and (2) affordable or have a used market?
The school just got a MDX-20. I haven
't seen it work yet.
jackc: I guess I don't know
cradek: i recall seeing your site some years ago, your mill is farily smal right?
150oz steppers sound awfully small for any mill...
fine for the current one heh
I think this size of mill is the smallest you'd want to use to regularly and easily cut metal: http://www.tormach.com/Product_PCNC_main2.html
* jackc observes
I have a tiny desktop mill for engraving type work, and a vmc for metal
thats quite a machine
prolly costs more than my car :-p
yeah it probably takes as much floor space as a knee mill
sigh, i guess ill just keep trolling craigslist and ebay and see if i see anything workable
I'm thinking of converting a manual lathe to cnc, mainly for turning wood. My thought is to use chinese servos with a mesa card and some sort of amps.
jackc: i know of a small sony circuit board mill/drill for sale
oh, in case i use servos for the new mill - is the rapid speed limited by how quickly the parallel port can read the encoders?
what amps and mesa card should I look at? or other suggestions?
a0-danimal-shop is now known as aa-danimal-shop
i mean clearly it is, but how much of a restriction is that for quatrature encoders
aa-danimal-shop: oh, link?
no link, it's for sale locally
jackc: you don't generally read motor encoders directly with the parallel port, you use some external hardware like mesa/pico
fully working machine
cradek: ah ok. i was hoping to just build some H bridges and make it go, drat
they were asking 800, but i bet they'll take 500
mozmck_work: if it's small, maybe you can use mesa's dumb H bridge cards
aa-danimal-shop: where is local for you?
San Diego, CA
i'm sure it can be shipped
jackc, I think that's correct for servos, or you can use a mesa card for faster encoder speed.
oops, my connection is flaky so I'm lagging a bit :)
aa-danimal-shop: do you have any more info about it?
jackc: sorry, no, but i can find out more if you want the next time i go there
or i can give you their number so you can call
it's a business
aa-danimal-shop: any chance you could just drop them my email addr next time youre over there? email@example.com
has the spindle, control, and everything. i thought about buying it for engraving
cradek: the servos I can get easily (we sell them) are 850 oz/in nema 34 motors.
hm, sounds like it might be a bit small for what im thinking but id be interested in hearing at least
mozmck_work: thats quite a motor, damn
[19:51:36] <aa-danimal-shop> http://maps.google.com/maps/place?hl=en&source=hp&oq=&um=1&ie=UTF-8&q=escondido+electrical+surplus&fb=1&gl=us&hq=electrical+surplus&hnear=escondido&cid=17392963653239608699
that's the place, give them a call
not bad, actually now that I think of it, we also have a smaller one that may be big enough
how many watts is that?
aa-danimal-shop: thank you, i will
that's where i got cradek's resistors and vfd :)
mozmck_work: for a lathe maybe you could run both motors and encoders on a 7i27
well you need a spindle encoder too...
(if they're < 400W each)
andypugh: it says it's a 50 pin header connectoe
jackc, why not build it?
i_tarzan: from scratch? cuz i would never get it 100% square and without movement
i mean a router for wood fine, but its not gonna hold 0.001"
esp. under cutting load
cradek: I don't know the watts, I'll have to check that out. I shouldn't need a spindle encoder for what I'm wanting to do I don't think...
machined steel ?
hm, so I can have a 5i20
mozmck_work: that says 10A 40V...
can you pick any combination of daughter cards for it?
like a 7i37ta and a servo card on the different connectors
[20:26:51] <LawrenceG> http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?cm_mmc=Email-_-021610-_-NA-_-prospect&PMAKA=SZ505-6544
anyone need a hold down set?
I think that's the set I have - it's actually decent
hm, nobody has a clue?
your question is whether you can plug 7i37 and 7i33 into a 5i20?
if so, then yes, that's surely the most common configuration
LawrenceG: i ordered a similar set from Enco.. it was the same thing, just came in a red case instead of grey. They're decent enough. I think i chased some of the nut's threads with a tap, but well worth the $30
and the next question is if I can drive 2x200w motors off a 7i32
or if there's a better option for driving 2 servos
yeah not 7i32
I need 24v and 8A
wow 7i29 is 22.5A 165V
maybe you mean 7i27
um why am I reading mesa documentation for you?
[20:35:38] <cradek> http://www.mesanet.com/pdf/motion/7i27man.pdf
because I dont quite get what to use
is mesa the cheaper/better?
If you don't know what to make for your next project, try this : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rZR8Xd2YTw
wonder what motor-sense is
7i27 is pretty expensive
Hello... I am back.
Thanks to the suggestions yesterday, I have determined the parallel port on the MB is foobar'ed
now I have an odd problem... I can only move in +X, +Y... no motion when -X/-Y is attempted... any pointers? (this is in stepconf)
have you checked the limit switches?
there are no hardware enforced limit switches
what's your setup?
and/or the direction pin on the stepper driver.
ISA parallel port card - stepper driver
maybe what you think is the direction input is really the enable
bill2or3: not sure what to check for... the step and dir pins are configured per the docs I have
cradek: let me get the link for the docs..it is a 1 pager
perhaps disconnect the limit pin, and try manually switching it.
that'd tell you if it was the direction pin.
or put an o'scope on it, if you have one.
s/limit pin/direction pin/
this is the docs I have: http://www.fullspectrumengineering.com/laser
bill2or3: you recommend a hw O-scope instead of halscope in this case?
only because I'm not familiar with halscope, but I am familiar with an o-scope. :-)
I am trying to avoid physical problem as that means I have to rig up a DB-25 break out
you could even just stick an LED on the direction pin, and see if it goes on/off.
how about I do this - unconfigure the X direction pin and then use halcmd setp parport.0.pin-XX-out true to force it to a state
and repeat with it set to false... is that a good test?
sounds good to me.
are you building a diy laser cutter?
bill2or3: I acquired it
neat, lucky you.
would I see those symptoms if I had X step and X dir swapped?
I saw a buildlog recently that mentioned that fullspectrum site.
you shouldn't, since the 'step' pin would never actually move.
I donno exactly how jogging is implemented in step conf...i.e. are both X dir and X step pulsed or just X step until X dir needs changing?
FWIW, I believe the board is an allegro chip setup
I think the dir pin is held static until it changes.
dumb tip of the day - plugging in the right power cord makes things work a lot better :D
the unit is 220V powered and the cord it came with are a mess so I have 3 different 220V power cords side by side... only 1 of which is actually used :D
got any pics of the machine?
from me? no... this is the "demo"/proto unit they were using
using at fullspectrum?
you can see bits of it on their youtube videos
would I see consistant problems like this if I am underpowering their optoisolator?
the opto setup apparently is powered off 1 of the digital I/O pins on the par port
yeah, you'd never see the pin go 'high' if the opto was underpowered.
they're all powered off a single pin?
if that's the case, I dont know why 'step' would work, but not 'dir'.
the wierd thing is I can get it to move in 1 direction
and it happens on both X and Y
wonder how bad of an idea is it to splice in 5V on the pwoer line
I wouldn't splice it, but you could replace the power to the optoisolators with an outside source.
or even tap off a spare molex from the PC.
don't think there is a good tap point for that besides the cable
that's what I mean... cut the pin off on the parallel port cable and inject 5V from a HD power connector
oh, I see.
so you can't really get to the motor drivers directly?
not w/o cutting other things
before resorting to that I'd somehow test the pin output & verify the problem.
even if you just have a multimeter you can stick on the "dir" pin, that would work.
* bill2or3 is waiting for laser cutters to comedown < $1k
which pin is powering the opto's?
&how is it configured in stepconf?
what is messing things up for me is stepconf seems to only load rtai if I am testing the axis
the pin marked VccPort.. pin 16 I think... I have it setup as a digital output
that is correct behavior
if I invert it, nothing works so I am reasonably sure that's what it should be
SWPadnos: is it possible to get it to keep rtai loaded for testing purposes?
that's how I configured mine, fwiw.
only if you leave the "test this axis" window up
you could also use halrun -I
which just loads RTAI and puts you at a halcmd prompt
(halrun -I <somefile.hal> will run that hal file, then leave you at a halcmd prompt)
it will unload RTAI when you exit from that halcmd "shell"
and as long as I am in the halcmd shell, the pins will not change w/o me running a command?
if you haven't loaded anything, then nothing will change
you should make a hal file with a minimal set of commands - loadrt the parport driver, make some threads, add the read and write functions to the threads, and start threads
can I ask hal to generate step/dir signals directly or do I need to manually toggle lines?
you can also start using halcmd -kf
you could optionally add some nets connected to some parport pins, so it's easier to turn them on and off
you can loadrt stepgen
load stuff, add functions, etc
and then use it the same way EMC does
then halcmd save will save it
there's nothing wrong with stepgen - you've got a hardware/wiring problem :-)
if you do it in v mode, you just change the velocity command pin to something nonzero to get step output
I don't suspect anything with the code itself... I suspect it is a config issues or a problem parallel port out
what's a velocity command pin?
ds3: "testing" the output sounds like stepconf...
you may need to read a little about HAL components, pins, and parameters :)
maybe you should describe what you're after?
alex_joni: I just want a way, as close as possible to the final thing, to set the pins in a known state so I can physically probe it
SWPadnos: I did... I am still very confused by the "pin" nomenclature... it doesn't always seem to be a physical entity I can probe
uhm, EPP vs SPP setting in the bios?
* bill2or3 guesses randomly.
it is, if you probe it with halscope/halmeter
bill2or3: this exact same port works with another control
it's just like ICs and schematics - they have pins which are connected to each other by signals
SWPadnos: that doesn't clarify it.. I want to know if I can probe it with a physical O-scope or a DMM or a logic analyzer
you can probe the physical port pins, yes
clearly, you can't probe an internal (software) signal with a physical scope
maybe I should ask this: are all parport.N.pin-X-out physical pins on the DB25 of a parallel port?
you can connect a signal to multiple physical outputs though
they're numbered according the DB25 pin number
then everything else is an internal test point that I cannot necessarily touch physically?
so not all parport.0.pin.xx-out will be there
you can connect those internal signals to other parallel port pins though
if you have some spare output
think that clarifies it a bit... I am used to looking at say a PLD where there are internal signals I can't touch.. I don't call those pins though
right... same idea with PLDs
there is definitely a difference between physical pins and HAL pins
PLDs in this context is something like a 22V10
and the other confusion is that the HAL pin that represents a physical output is actually an input in HAL
this makes some sense now. pin originally in my mind is something physical
yes, that is the same idea as RX/TX UART signals :D
those I can sort out... it is the use of the word pin that has me going in circles
for people familiar with FPGAs, PLDs, etc... a pin is a very specific resource
it's the same in HAL, it's just that the pin is inside a software model that looks similar to a PCB with chips on it
now that I have manage to build a foundation... am I correct in guessing that hal does not let me create conflicts? i.e. hook up a physical pin as X_Step AND use setp on the physical pin?
not really... a better analogy is a pin inside is more like a signal inside an FPGA
no, that would be a signal in HAL :)
(the thing that moves data between blocks)
anyway, I think you get it, it's just a semantic difference now
yes, I think so
you can setp a pin that's connected to a signal, but it will not change the pin state
I think that setp on a pin sets the default value, but when a pin is connected to a signal, the value is taken from the signal
I must be doing something wrong... halcmd gave me an error when I tried
ok, it may be disallowed
take a quick look at the structs in hal_priv.h (I think)
a pin has a dummy value and a pointer
when the pin is not connected to a signal, the pointer points at the dummy value
setp on a pin sets the value of this dummy data
a signal actually is the object with the storage data member
when a pin is connected to a signal, its data pointer is pointed at the data member of the signal instead of the dummy data
I think what everyone has suggested so far really means is I should get a DB25 breakout board/box setup
I think I made a pyvcp panel that looks a lot like a parallel port
it should be pretty easy to make a hal file that loads that and the parport driver, and makes the necessary connections
but that's still hiding behind what I assume to be working software
the parport driver and pyvcp are pretty mature, if you can't toggle bits that way, then nothing else matters
the wildcard here I think is the stepper control/driver
it is possible (but seems unlikely) that the parport driver just doesn't work correctly with your hardware
after I replaced the parallel port, I had it working with the taig control just fine
somehow ALL the pins were floating on the built in parallel port :(
ok, that's a little weird
[21:34:11] <alex_joni> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/02/16/silicon_wire_solar_cells/
any dmesg output or lspci -vvvvvvvvv ?
nothing unusual with the dmesg
it is an old MB... maybe the port is fried... I much rather not think about it now that I have a solid dual parallel port ISA card in there :D
anonimasu: Sorry, I went to do some milling. The 7i43 has 2x 50 pin connectors, each has 24 signal pins, 25 ground pins and 1 +5V pin. I think the 5i20 has 3 such connectors. So, the 7i27 only uses 24 signal pins from half of the 50 pin conectors.
I'll try the things based on what everyone suggested. thanks
Jymmmm is now known as Jymmmmm
TomE is now known as Guest8213
Still having problems with my D945GCLF2 motherboard. I am building a new kernel according to this info: http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/emcinfo.pl?EMC_With_Custom_Kernel
hello all, i need some basic linux help. trying to get my keyboard to be recognized for a pyvcp panel, but im not linux oriented, i think i need to add a rule in udev/rules.d so that SUBSYSTEM=="input:, mode="0660", group="plugdev" as per the permissions and udev section of the HAL_INPUT section of the man page. my problem is i cant create a text file and save it there because i dont have permission. im guessing i need root access.
Guest8213: I booted a atom board off the livecd with 2gb. No issues.
steve10778 start the editor with sudo
password is your own
steve10778: In the terminal type sudo gedit
ok, let me try that. not comfy with term window. ;)
Though I am surprised that pyvcp can't see the keyboard?