BRB, I need to get my cats in
The rack will have some backlash. Belts have none, but stretch. That's why they both get used. different compromises
that price surprised the shit out of me :)
they seem to work great and are cheat
Has anyone used two racks and a long pinion, and adjusting screws to slide one rack relative to the other to take iup backalsh?
I use two timing belts on my plasma
Sorry, perhaps I failed to state how very expensive that $275 motor seemed to me
shouldn't backlash be adjustable by the distance between the rack and pinion?
MarkusBec is now known as MarkusBec_away
thats why they are springloaded
I like the system I have seen of two belts face-to-face with one bonded to the machine frame. Seems like the best of both worlds
to keep it pretty ok
might aswell get 5 of then like ries said for a future indexer
I guess you _can_ push the pinion into the rack, it just isn't how the gears are cut to work. I suppose in practical terms it isn't important
at least a hypoid rack and crown set is designed to be adjustable in that fashion
crown and pinion
I just spent my childhood listening to my dad telling of how they check the correct backlash in geraboxes by dropping bits of lead through the mesh and measuring the thickness of what comes out
But then David Browns make gears up to 14 metres diameter, and power transmission optimums are not the same as positioning optimums.
wow, i'm trying to tink of a use for a 14 meter gear
radio telescope rotation? maybe bridges
I have just remenered, another rigid, cheap, low-backlash drive is chain and sprockets.
Ball mills, mainly.
[00:08:40] <andypugh> http://www.davidbrown.com/girth-gears.php
So, how much is a 3m rack then?
* jt-plasma listens to Jelly Roll Morton - Billy Goat Stomp
14m gears hm.. someone's up to something no good
lilalinux is now known as lilalinux_away
on the oil rig we had 400' rack gears
12 of them
In one piece?
Not that racks are that hard to make, as the tooth flanks are flar.
they were in about 20' sections and welded on the legs and welded together
they were flame cut
it was the only thing that kept us from falling into the sea
I am guessing they were not 10DP then
about 6" thick and maybe two teeth per foot
You would need a pretty big stepper for that Machmate
hmmm my input on my 7i37 isnt changing my pin from fale to true
Aye, that's an easy way to get vast mechanical reductions.
andypugh: So, how much is a 3m rack then? <= if that was a question for me... I bough it in Japan, for 10USD/meter
I bough 10 meters
Ah, that seems cheap enough
At that price I would probably choose it over belts myself.
danimal_garage: which pin
buying these racks in Italy is a other story though :)... racks bough locally did go for 300USD/meter (most expensive quote, cheapest 150usd/meter).... crazy Ecuadorians
danimal_garage: Is that an electrical input to the card not being seen in logic?
the reset wire from my toolchanger is supposed to go to an input on my i/o board, but it isnt changing the pin from false to true
andypugh: why belt over rack/pinion... you need both to be more accurate and have more torque... Currently I run direct drive though
jt-plasma: pin 039, input pin 15 on the 7i37.
Not seeing true to false is a puzzle, I had the reverse, and that was due to the actual contacts being absent from that cavity of the IDC connector
i think maybe it isnt fully closed, i'm not seeing 0 ohms across the 2 input wires
ries: You can use a belt tethered at each end and running over rollers and a sprocket as a drive system.
andypugh: Ahh ic ic... no, what the MM peopel do is keep the racks, but use a belt drive to create a 3.2:1 reduction
to keeps backslash slow
i think it pulses on and off, but maybe too fast for my meter to read correctly
Have you seen the all-MDF gantry router?
it's a 100ms signal, should be slow enough
One iteration of that used chains and sprockets as the linear axes (chain tethered and tensioned at each end, running through a system of 2 idlers and a drive sprocket. Looked rigid and cheap.
try connecting it to a latch and watch that in hal
andypugh: Me yes, but it's not advised but only for a hobbyist, t
the encoder inputs?
toolchanger on the mill
* ries would love to have a tool changer, like this : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XYakTeQahA
it has one wire as feedback to the control
that wire pulses after each operation is complete
pulse each time a station goes by?
hook it to a counter in your ladder or something so you can see it
so i have it so when it's homing and it reaches home position, it latches another coil on
Does any of you guys use a V203 gecko stepper motor driver?
it's not doing anything, i watched it on the scope
* jt-plasma listens to Amish Paradise by Al Yankovic :)
ries: I have three in my plasma cuter
jt-plasma: How warm do they get?
I have heat sinks and fans on them and they stay no more than warm to the touch
for me doing some simple jobs they get pretty warm, still touchable on the cooling plate but you would say, 'pretty warm!
what amps do you limit it to?
can't remember...., you talk about the resitor, right?
Of the belt drive systems, I think this is the cleverest. (though probaly not compatible with wood chips): http://www.bell-everman.com/servobelt.html
There is a link on that page to a video. It seems to perform well.
hehehe, that looks funny indeed
ries: I run these to the limit like this with cpu heat sinks and fans http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f163/johnplctech/Plasma%20Cutter/Plasma005.jpg
hehehe, that is massive :)
dug them out of the scrap pile :)
you know.. i wonder if the input on the 7i37 needs actual voltage
I have 4 attached to a alu plate, + heat conducator paste and one 110V ventilator
* jt-plasma looks at his 7i37 manual
it says 4-24v
I think that the inputs are pulled high, but perhaps not.
thats my problem
jt-plasma: no such thing as scrap in Ecuador..... But as I can still touch them, I am well within my savety margin..
* jt-plasma puts the manual back
yea, if you can hold your hand on them they are ok
hmmm so how am i gunna do this, it just closes the connection to ground
I only know anything at all about the 7i43, and precious little about that
Just put a 3k pullup to +5V at the 7i37 end
danimal: connect 7I37+ in to 4..24V power, -in to switch
so a 3kohm resistor between 5v+ and the + input of the 7i37's input pin?
the signal comes from a logic board, is that safe?
There is probably +5 on the board that is the same as the interface board sees.
the rest of the control wires use 24v
but this is the only input to the mesa
danimal you can wire the +24 to the 7I37 +in
(and the -in to the switch)
then pass 0vdc through your switch to -in right pcw_home
But if the switch is just grounding the pin, a pullup is as good a way as any (as long as it is the same ground, of course, that is important)
pcw_home: i know the 7i37 can handle it, i just didnt wanna connect 24v to the toolchanger without knowing what it'll do/fry
Well then use 5V
Is the 7i47 a daughter board to a 7i43 or similar?
ok thanks, i'll give it a shot
7I37? yes its an isolated I/O card
If so, then there is a +5 on one of the 50-way connector pins.
pcw_home: are all the inputs and outputs isolated from each other?
That is the mother board reference voltage and (I think) is absolutely safe to connect to any pin
7I47 is differential I/O
5I20 has a 5V output tap as well (terminal block)
on the 7i37?
Err, if in doubt believe nothing I say, and everything PCW says about his cards. :-)
in other words if I had a 12v device on in15 and a 24v device on in 13 would that be ok?
jt-plasma: i tihnk so, or my lathe wouldnt work
The 7I37 has a 5V aux INPUT or output
( yes all inputs are isolated from one another so they can even have different grounds)
* jt-plasma goes to write that down somewhere so I can loose it :)
Guessing that they are opto-isolators, all that matters is that current flows from the high pin to the low pin. So you could connect +24 to the + terminal and +12 to the - and it would work.
danimal: If you connect +24 to the 7I37 input+ the maximum current from the input- to ground would be ~5 ma - not likely t hurt a switch
(yes the inputs are optos with series resistors)
So if you have a switch that grounds a wire, you could have + some volts to the + connector and the grounded wire on the - or you could have the - grounded, then a pullup to +5v on the + which is effectively shorted out by the switch. The first arrangement makes the most sense for an opto-isolated input. My pullup suggestion would work, but is more appropriate to a digital input.
say goodnight Gracie
(I'll shut up now, I just like to chime in when I think I can possibly explain something that I barely understand at an appropriate level)
(one of our sheep is named Gracie but I dont tell her goodnight))
scared to ask what you tell her :)
Oh I talk to our sheep all the time
Right, e-stops to wire tomorrow, than I might actually start the project that I started 18 months ago, then decided I needed a CNC machine for...
Do you still remember what the original project was?
[01:28:10] <skunkworks> http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/conversion/xaxis/plate1.JPG
[01:28:17] <skunkworks> http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/conversion/xaxis/plate2.JPG
[01:28:21] <skunkworks> http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/conversion/xaxis/plate3.JPG
[01:28:29] <skunkworks> http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/conversion/xaxis/plate4.JPG
[01:28:33] <skunkworks> http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/conversion/xaxis/plate5.JPG
now the reset is working
[01:28:53] <skunkworks> http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/conversion/xaxis/plate6.JPG
[01:28:58] <skunkworks> http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/conversion/xaxis/plate7.JPG
* Jymmm hands skunkworks a gallery script
nice work skunkworks
have to bore out 2 more of the holes of these bearings.
modding it to accept your servomotors?
* I need to bore out 2 more holes for the same bearings.
yes - need to extend the shafts out of the gearbox to be able to get power to them.
so that endcap will have 3 shafts coming out of it - x,z,b
(they all used to be run with 1 servo
these 3 shafts.. http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/conversion/xaxis/stripped.JPG
i thought i had this right, but apparently i dont, how do i make it so the counter's value sets the value of an s32 out pin?
nm, i got it
kevinh_ is now known as kevinh
Jymmm, you around?
[02:51:26] <LawrenceG> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250496218673
do you know if anyone has bought from these guys?
that is a very complete package of parts for a machine... add steppers/servos and drives plus a little Al
I have an old marble table top that might be useful as a stable base for a machine
yea... it weighs a bit
LawrenceG: I like his response to the negative he got this month
LawrenceG I could ship a pallet of bricks for cheaper!
LawrenceG which is to say it doesn't weigh nearly enough to justify that kind of cost!
I could use some bricks
one neutral was due to shipping - bullshit
payed 5, received 4. No comunication after my complain.Buyer:
esilviu_2007 ( 19 [Feedback score is 10 to 49] )
Reply by linearmotionbearings2008 (Oct-23-09 23:00):
Sorry for late reply & inconvenience to you! Send it soon by air! Sorry again!!
LawrenceG: This is his other negative, you can't beat this kind of service...
LawrenceG: I see a lot of seller that get negative and just whine and bitch
I had some steel laser cutouts shipped from England... was like $300 for 50lbs
LawrenceG: Ask them a question and see what you get for a reply.
I have talked to them and they will make a custom package with any length screws/guides so one doesnt have to make a fixed size machine
I would like a 2'x4'x6" work area.. so about 3'x5'x12" for guides
does anyone here know anything about 1-2 phase half stepping drives?
LawrenceG: there must be another way to do business with TianJing. The shipping costs dont vary when I change the destination to China!. So if you can get the real business, you might set up real shipping by boat, have it marked 'used parts' :)
ok i am confused here..... in my ladder, i have -[%i1]---[%i2]----[timer]------(%q1)-
%i1 isnt active, but %i2 is.... i thought both had to be active in order to fire %q1?
is that wrong?
%i1, %i2, and %q1 are all normally open
when %i2 is closed, %q1 activates, even though %i1 is still open
maybe some other code affects q1? do you have q1 anywhere else? (as an rvalue, a receiver, on the right side of the ladder rails )
tom3p: q1 is actually a b14, which triggers the "up" pin on the counter
the up and down are triggering at the same time, so maybe something is going on at the counter?
LawrenceG: Consider elbow room for the 2'x4' like clamps, or edge guides
yea... would be nice to slide a 4x8' sheet through... cutting a 2x4' area at a time
LawrenceG: Yeah, so add extra for "pass thru" too
you might clamp at 30"
LawrenceG: it's theone thing that annoys me about mine - no elbow room
I see a 5' long bridge gantry
it's 24.5" period - you can't even clamp at that
maybe even a bit longer if you consider motor, limit switches, and nut itself
and whatever bracket you're goung to fasten the nut to
it would be a shame if it was an inch tto small
LawrenceG: and if you wanted to bevel that 48" edge - you're fscked
LawrenceG: These are things that *I* came across and kicked myself for not considering them
LawrenceG: Just a edge guide alone would have saved me a lot of grief, but no room for it.
kevinh_ is now known as kevinh
who knows, can emc control this machine? http://www.atax.it/sony/robokids/bot.html
EbiDK is now known as EbiDK|AWAY
athlocatle: sure, if you replace its stepper controllers with stepper controllers supported by EMC
L84Supper: and if i'll not replace?
helllo can anyone help me with encoder and threading??... my spindle moves at around 1000 RPM but pyVCP panel shows it 0.2RPM ONLY :(
MOGLI, geared up, the encoder isnt connected right ?
encoder is hollow shaft and directly connected....
its 250PPR encoder...freq meter shows perfect speed of 960RPM
encoder.0.position-scale is 250
i am using only one wire.. not all 3
if you are just using one wire wont you have 1/3 of the resolution for one ?
as i know encoders are offsetted on each wire
to make the right resolution
250 is the right resolution...it gives 250 pulses on one revolution.. i checked it on freq meter :(
i created config from stepconf... is it errornous??
dont know =)
not so into this yet, and never used encoders
just trying to help as far as i can :P
anyother idea/hardware for Threading...
but where is the encoder put on ?
on the spindle or on the motor before all the gears etc?
or well, i guess it should show 960 if you put it on the spindle atleast :)
MOGLI, have patience and i guess someone will help you, if it gives the pulses and you have connected it right to the PC i guess its a config problem
how is it connected to the pc ?
just directly into it ?
cause i think the inputs needs to be grounded on "signal"
and either + voltage or floating on no signal
cause if it just goes +5V then floating then +5V etc i guess you wouldnt get what you want into the pc
you could check with some simple parport program that you cansee the state of all the parport pins in
encoder is connected to spindle directly... and yes i use transistor to gound th printer port NPN..;)
i think its config problem only.. coz i tested setup with SCOPE and freqmeter both
ok then i also guess its a config problem =)
MOGLI, but can you in any way check so you get the right signal to the pc? :)
windows? linux ?
linux i guess :P
and with emc installed no parport drivers with the rt kernel
new to linux..... and for windows i need to change whole setup
a small program to poll on the parport pins maybe, but dont know how to read them :/
Valen1 is now known as Valen
MOGLI: can you post your hal file?
use pastebin.ca or similar
btw. for threading you will need at least 2 lines (one phase, and index)
otherwise emc2 won't know how to synch the different passes
[10:26:55] <alex_joni> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/html/man/man9/encoder.9.html
thanks alex_joni.. i was reading the same...
you also need to set counter-mode to 1 if you don't use both phaseA and phaseB
how to use pastebin.ca?? can i upoload it somewhere inthan post link over here??
i read it.. counter mode is 1
scale is 250
got o pastebin.ca, paste your file, hit upload
ok just a min....
[10:32:37] <MOGLI> http://pastebin.ca/1763792
should i paste custom_postgui.hal file????
it has only 4 lines...
[10:37:00] <MOGLI> http://pastebin.ca/1763794
this is custom_postgui.hal... i think gain parameter is awkward....
u there alex_joni???
helllo mr. alex_joni.. u there???
MOGLI: custom postgui also
ah yes you posted it also
try to set gain to 1 and see what happens
hey micges.. i think gain parameter in custom_postgui.hal is wrong.. i made it 1 and got nearby RPS speed ...
than i made it 60 ... and i got around 840 RPM
according to documentation what it should be??? i mean gain param in custom_postgui.hal
MOGLI: you have 840 and it should be 960?
it varies.. so 50-60 doesnt matter...
but it's close or not?
yaa if i put 60 in gain parameter inplace of 0.1667 than result is much near...
may be the accurate..
so leave it at 60
doest it effect threading???
custom_postgui is for easy reading only
ok.. and is it possible to thread using only one phase???
I have no idea
alex_joni was telling that minimum 2 phase should be there..
no I didn't ;)
I said you need one phase + index
oh sorry my mistake...
MOGLI, I use one phase for threading
alex_joni please read both the files...
i made change in custom_postgui.hal and result is very good... extremly near..
and u sure i need index pulse also?? i need to do wiring once again... :(]
archivist_emc, you sure??
as micges said, only the display in VCP can be wrong because of the scale.0.gain
i change the gain parameter in custom_postgui.hal
emc2 uses RPS internally
but the VCP readout you usually want in RPM
hence the abs and scale
i changed gain parameter to 60.. before it was something 0.1666
is it fine???
open a halmeter and look at encoder.0.velocity
if that reads fine in RPS, then it's dandy
from where i can open halmeter?? any command??
sorry but i am new to all this..
Is it possible (or a good idea) to try tapping without a VFD, just on/off control?
well its possible to try
but would it work?
it's probably not a good idea, but you can try it
yaa halmeter shows the velocity in RPS
on/off is not enough though
you need on/off fwd/reverse at least
hmmm, can probably do reverse with a double poll relay
nah, probably going to break many taps
Valen: do a couple of dry runs first
lots of backlash in the spindle gear train
well, then it probably won't work
and we can tap most of our holes with a drill
The next question was how to put an encoder on the quill
it all moves is the problem
perhaps a VFD and a belt drive
bah worry about it another day
anybody have any pointers on what they use for limit switches?
I backed out ries :P
do the mesa servo drivers work with emc?
do is correct
got any idea?
doesnt most stuff works as long as you can make it work? =)
hal-editing etc etc
well, I want to pay for stuff that will work without figuring out how to make it work for the first time myself
lots of nice people here though that probably would help though =)
* - 1x though _Å
im looking at the 7i40h
yep.. it's supported
most painless part of the process
[13:38:47] <Valen> http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Milling-Machine_W0QQitemZ270517854458QQcmdZViewItemQQptZAU_BnI_Woodworking_Metalworking?hash=item3efc1ee0fa#ht_600wt_1167
what you think?
nice manual mill, looks like it has a power knee
you gotta love this "but if something goes wrong, the servos stop and the virtual tool continues.."
cool the latest forum member makes custom harmonicas http://www.builderofstuff.com/
jthornton: hm where does that happen?
"but if something goes wrong, the servos stop and the virtual tool continues.."
I think he means this
yea, I think he means that he did not connect the error pin from his drive to EMC
is it step/dir or something?
emc will fault pretty quick if the real motion stops, if it has feedback
I think it is a Mesa set up
not sure if it is step and direction setup
EbiDK is now known as EbiDK|AWAY
well today is the official day for the retirment of the last brontosaurus-crt
hey frallzor I was sleeping when you pages me :)
what you mean with backed out?
started cutting but I backed out :P
did some surface cutting along a meter or so to see how straight it was
I'll get the ppl that helped me with the base to do these too if possible
higher cost, waaaay better result if they can do it =)
is anyone familiar with the dxf format? i'm actually looking for a way of evaluating arcs (the bulge type, not the x/y/radius type)
but the thing I was not so satisfied with today was odd, the disc was lower than the cut when not running, so I could have continued and get a constant height, but I didnt know that then =)
izua: you might try over in the #cam channel
frallzor: I found a thread taling about the whole rail cutting thing
izua: REALIZE converts those bulge-arcs (in polylines) to gcode: http://timeguy.com/cradek/autocad
izua: the arc decode is in the defun cut-to
yeah I've seen that thread
thats where the machining idea came from =)
frallzor: any photo's of the work?
nah didnt come so far its worth taking photos
stopped in time to not make a mess
ill ask around first then if they cant do it Ill continues
the issue wasnt an issue as I thought, but better safe than sorry
strange that you have some much troubles with that...
who knows, maybe I got too high demands? :P
maybe it perhaps is as good as it is supposed to be
we need a picture to see ;)
My rails are far teh worst from what I have seen on teh forum...
one day I am plaiing to cit them 2-3mm and re do them
but the reason why I stopped to today is nothing
the disc didnt slide into the cut when not spinning
sorry for teh typos, I had a bad night... there was a party close that lasted untill 6AM, didn't sleep :S
but it was 100% constant along the cut, so it fits when its spinning
cradek, i hope i'm not bugging, but my (auto)lisp skills are nil.
what's the general idea when evaluating bulge-arcs? i've tried some high school geometry, basically trying to determine the center of the circle on which the arc resides, but haven't succeded
maybe it's not the good approach?
frallzor: so, what's holding you back? you are still in cutting phase, or trying to make the 45degrees angle?
a bit unrelated, congrats on all the stuff you made on your site :)
holding me back, evening and snow =)
and the fact I rather pay for a 1:1 result :P
frallzor: the cutting portion is really not that critical, as long as it's even enough you are fine
The top mainly functions as a distance for the grinding, but is not used in the V roller setup
brb going outside to cut of a piese of the first pair of failed rails =)
here is a picture : http://www.mechmate.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3276&postcount=56
dang, I'll be able to push my computer desk 2 feet closer to the wall when I remove the brontosaurus-crt
jthornton: i'm having a bit of trouble with the ladder..
probably a simple one
ries that I understand, but if its not even when using the jigg it wont be even when grinding =)
what you got dan1mal ?
frallzor: when need a video then :)
how do i have the %c0.v set the value for %QW1?
thats why im picky on cutting too =P
all the time or only when something is true?
all the time
lol you gotta know :)
with an assignment statement I think
i thought it was ---------------[%C0.v=%QW1]--
but that locks it up
gimmy a min and I'll see
no lower case for the v
yea i had no lowercase
use the assignment block and %C0.V=%QW1
did you use an assignment block?
and you can't have any spaces either
ries btw, allready got answer from motionking =)
frallzor: good, and ?
well they told me what I wanted to know :P
frallzor: you are from denmark, right?
frallzor: 50USD/each still? what about transport?
Denmark... such an insult!
Ahh... up north....
south of sweden
I knew it was above holland... not sure the distance anymore ;)
dan1mal: does it lock up Axis?
like 70km from denmark
they could provide fedex
all in all it would be $400
it just keeps the modmath component from telling the turret which way to go
the %QW1 is the s32 output that goes to the modmath component's actual tool position input
frallzor: nice price....
waiting for pmdx quote now
they got a nice package with bob and 4 203V
I just did one and can watch the s32out-01 in the Hal Configuration window chane
each time I increment the counter that I showed you yesterday
frallzor: I liek the fact that they are short circuit protected... I did short circuit one once.... hehehehe
The V203 I mean
yea i'm using your counter now
which seems to work
open the hal config watch window and watch it there
till i put that assignment block in
it's not even moving, so it wont trigger the counter
when i put the asignment block in, it stops telling the ladder which way to go
so it doesnt move
[16:05:26] <jt-dev> http://imagebin.ca/view/BRcRfef.html
yours look like this?
yes, except i dont have a %Q0 or %Q1
that was just for testing
is your ladder long?
not horribly long
trying something now
the only thing I know for sure is the computer desk has not seen a dust rag in a long long time
and sunlight in longer than that
well i had the turret max value in the modmath parameters set at 23, and since your conter goes from 0-23, i think it was causing an issue
in your assignment statement you can make it 0-23
or 1-24 I mean
the counter wont down past 0
no, it should wrap around back to the preset value
what do you need to compare it to?
just the modmath actual position'
what kind of number is that?
hey i have -[b1]-------[i1]------[timer off]--------(b13)-
whenever the -[i1]- triggers, it triggers the -(b13)--, even when the -[b1]- isnt active
why would that be?
somewhere else in your ladder b1 is on perhaps
the golden rule for ladder is "last one wins"
if you have the same output twice the last one is the one that updates the image
can you imagebin the ladder?
two mircles just happened, I got in that tight hole and got the screw out and I got back out :)
b1 isnt an output though
well i guess it is in a different rung, but it isnt on
and when i look at the ladder, b1 isnt pink
you have something crossed up for sure
but everytime i1 is, it triggers the b13
can you imagebin the ladder?
or better yet email me the clp file
it's a bit of a mess though, i was gunna clean it up first
lol clean it up and it might work :)
this might take me a bit, but i'll email you it when it's done
Is there a way to run a run-in-place emc2 without having to type the . ./scripts/emc-environment line? For example, can I put that line in a startup script somewhere?
Ideally I would like the desktop icons for the mill and the lathe to open emc2 v2.4-pre with the different configs.
is it work if you doesn't type . ./scr... stuff?
No, if I do that it starts the 2.3.4 version.
andypugh: put this instead of emc in your launcher /home/jet/emc2-trunk/scripts/emc with your name where jet is
* jthornton wanders off to take a nap
I don't think I have an emc2-trunk...
put there your absolute path to your rip directory
Never mind, I just remembered I have to insmod parport_pc too before it will run, so I might as well leave it as it is and only use 2.4 when I need to.
Aloha - got the cnc controller ya'll helped me pick on ebay- pretty excited...
Have you wired anything up yet?
i've got two dc adaptors one at 12v 1a, another at 24V 1.5A - the controller is said to handle 12-36V up to 3.5A - remembering that i know nothing.... does this mean that worst case scenario it just doesn't work?
no - i'm in giddy awe still
planning on treading VERY slowly.... :)
i'm clearly in over my head in many areas - knowing very little about electronics and next to zilch about cnc
it's honestly one of the most exciting times i've had in ages :)
i guess another question is how to read xa+, xa-, xb+, xb- etc....
i mean - it's clearly labeled on the card....
just not certain which wire is which out of the motors
having some issues seting up my servo driven mill
using mesa boards
cant get the axis to go any faster than 2400mm/min
did a voltage check on the signal when its running at 2400 its coming up at 1.6v
so not even 20% of the servo drives capability
colbq200: paste your config at www.pastebin.ca
ill have to go get it off the machine with my usb stick
[18:43:05] <colbq200> http://www.pastebin.ca/1764233
colbq200: you must set max_velocity on each axis_n section to value you want
now it's 40x60=2400
also in [TRAJ] section
if i set the max velocity any higher than it is it ferrors
yeah i set them to that as that seemed to be the highest speed it would run
if i set it higher i had to keep dropping the velocity down to 2400 on the slider to stop it ferroring
colbq200: increase both ferror values to few mm and try to tune your PID to achieve higher speeds
iv tried that
not sure if its the servo drive fighting against emc sometimes
colbq200: pastebin.ca hal files also
they are unchanged from standard
i have added the motion.hal to the pastebin link i gave you
also with the pid stuff i was getting massive ferrors whatever i tried, then i set ff1 to 0 and the errors got much smaller
ff1 is typically very very small, I have read (here). 0.0001 or thereabouts
But I have not tried tuning a PID yet
colbq200: have you tried hostmot2 driver for mesa?
andypugh: on one of my machines I have ff1=11
There you go then, I should learn to keep quite
colbq200: first try to see on halmeter pid.n.output from ferroring axis
back to using dxf2gcode, after dissabling the arch/gouging/toolsize error
jthornton: i'm sending over the ladder stuff now
i'll send a pdf of the ladder, the clp, and my hal
flbmtlnc: What was the solution? Or isn't there one?
whats the diff with hostmot?
and what driver am i using?
I was wondering the same thing, as I thought that PID ran in EMC, and only encoders and PWMs run in Hostmot on the FPGA. But I could be wrong.
you're using hal_m5i20 and hostmot2 is never version
andypugh: did you figure out your servo issue?
is there a sample config for hostmot?
Ah, now I understand the question.
Danimal-office: Which servo issue? The not-going-round or the noisy bearings when it does go round?
whats the difference between hal_m5i20 and hostmot2?
i guess either
Well, it goes round now, after I rewired the driver PCB to not use a proprietary commutation pattern, but it sounds like both servos could use new bearings
well thats a start at least
did you try greasing them yet?
They are shielded bearings, so it isn't trivial.
colbq200: hostmot2 is rewrited and improved driver
I think using hostmot2 might just be a simple case of changing the lines in the HAL file.
so i change loadrt to the hostmot2 driver?
But I am not sure that it will help with the problem.
colbq200: changing driver is left for later
I've asked you to check pid.n.output value of ferroring axis
ok ill go look now
it only feerrrors if i take them beyond 2400mm
check it as it is now
ill go see what it does in hal meter brb
OK, I have expunges all remnants of 2.3.4 from my system, and have a brand-new git pull of 2.4-pre.
Now I need to figure out how to auto-load parport_pc
is it something like editing a file in /etc/modules?
huh, didn't know I could drill a 123 block
It's now a 122.9 block?
running the arc spiral program
the pid.0.output figure varies from 0-9.something
and -0 to -9. something
that would be impressive
it is but a scratch!
What are the threaded holes in 123 blocks for?
colbq200: along with MAX_VELOCITY try increase MAX_OUTPUT to let say 20, and see what happens
i think iv tried that before
ill give it another go
also iv increased p to 250 and d to 1.1
its tightened up the ferror in halscope
and increase ferrors a bit
man i didnt realize how flakey my tyoolchanger is
this thing needs alot of work
andypugh, we did this, and dropped the cam software that did bad lead in moves this = http://bit.ly/7A30iB
but it appears my ladder is right, i can change tools now
i changed the velocity to 20 and as soon as i incresed the velocity to over 2400 it flaked out
sorry i meant max output not velocity
ill try it again with looser ferror settings
even with the ferror param set to a big figure
you can see the axis is lagging the commanded possition
the z axis is worse
it will only do 1200mm/min
the x and y will do 2400mm
so that doesnt make much sense as they all have the same motors and combined 3 axis servo drive
the servo drive does have a signal gain pot
but iv been hessitant to use that
colbq200: can you disconnect the motors from the leadscrew?
danimal_garage: cobalt. it really cut it pretty well. the drill and 123 block took about equal damage.
chineese 123 block?
yep, glad I was using the cheap ones
I would first verify if you can get +10 and -10 out of the 7I33 at your AMP terminals
and what speed your motors run with +10 and -10V ( by using HAL to directly set the DAC output)
yea that makes more snese
(or whatever its called on m5i20, I forget)
probably 50rc, tops
if it was a b&s, it'd be a different storry :)
andypugh: mostly, the holes are there to taunt you and make you wish they were a different size or thread
andypugh: sometimes they also taunt you by making you wish you could use them to bolt one 123 block to the other one
pcw i can yes
how do i set hal directly ?
Yes, I have occasionally wondered what thread the holes were, certainly none that match any bolts I own.
colbq200: You can probably set it in the "Show Hal Config" screen by typing setp commands in the box at the bottom.
ill try that with the servo drive powered down
First you need to make a copy of your HAL file, edit the copy to disconnect the PID components output
(or you cant setp)
what setp command do i need?
Look at signal the PID component drives
do i want the gain thing?
setp m5i20.0.dac-00-value number[1-10]
ill give that go
back in a bit
Amps off or motors disconnected!
i tried it with amps off
iv got no voltage on the signal wires when i try to do it with setp
you can see in the hal pin is set to whatever number
but nothing on the voltmeter
one common reason for seeing that is not setting the corresponding enable too
im sure i checked the enable and it said true
ill try again
it was set true
enable needs to be disconnected from whatever drives it as well
Hardware wise theres only the DAC=PWM and enable needed to get analog out
i managed to just load up my normal hal file
and just tweaked the encoder a bit with the amps off
so emc wanted to correct
the hal values read between -5 and -20
but still only see 1.6 v
ries here? =)
yes I am
having some trouble with my isp so I cant browse mechmate
how many teeth are you using on your pinions?
You should be able to "dial" a voltage from -10 to +10 with the motors off and turning the motor shaft
I would try disconnecting the amps at the 7I33 and reading the output directly from the 7I33
maybe theres an overload on a 7I33 output
Hello I'm just thinking about buying some linear slides for a home made cnc. The SEB12WA (http://www.nb-linear.co.jp/english/download/pdf/a.pdf)
do you think they are strong enough ?
pcw_home ok ill try that
flexxxv, we dont know your machine, also note the frame they are mounted on gives rigidity
(turn off any integral term and make the P term small and you should be able to adjust the output voltage precisely)
ah right. So I'm working on a portal milling machine. I think I'll use aluminum profiles for the constrction.
for positionating I'll use a trapezoidal screw.
Do you need more informations?
the dynamik basic load rating is: 3.64 kN .So about 364 kg :D
just unshure if this is strong enugh to hold a mchine and to cut aluminum
the rails may be ok but ally for the frame may be too light, make it rigid (I had to close the pdf it was too big for my memory)
iv figured it out
i just plugged in the little 5v connector from the pc into the 7i33 board
and guess what
cradek: i use those holes alot... they're handy when you need to clamp something nonferous to a surface grinder
im now seeing +- 10 v
you must have had a jumper wrong
i tihnk there's a jumper for that
i could be wrong though
Ok so with a non alu frame this will (probatly) work?
MarkusBec_away is now known as MarkusBec
Also, if you have older encoders they may draw too much power for the single 28 gauge wire in the flat cable
so you need to supply PC 5V to the 7I33
now you tell me :)
the 7i33 is the one which i actually did read the directions for :)
yeah i have but not for some time
im just flapping a bit today got a big customer coming tommorow morning
yea its hard to remember everything
i'm horrible with directions
but least now i can actually take on work with a fighting chance of it finishing before next xmas
what kind of machine?
just ran the axis to see if it works
its screaming along now :D
hurco md1 i think it is
yea i think i've seen those
[21:13:15] <colbq200> http://www.lynka-cnc.de/bilder/fraes-6-klein.jpg
one of those
good sized mill
good candidate for emc
how much do you have working on it?
not even attempted the toolchanger yet
just the axis so far
have to start the spindle manually on the servo drive too
working on my toolchanger now
i can live without the toolchanger
your spindle is a servo?
ill look into doing that come summer
sorry i meant spindle drive
its geting late
yea i lived without it for some time now
so i can set the speed on the drive anyway
what model mitsu?
somthing 200 i think
i could go check
gimmie a mo
probably similar to mine
its a little white box
with a removable keypad
and a red lcd for the numbers
and external brake pack
doubt it will be difficult to wire it up
iv got the manual for it
the brake works bitchin
yea it was easy
iv got to fit some extra home switches
the limits that are on it are linked into the servo drive
when i try to share them with emc it freaks the drive out and makes it think its on a limit and makes the servo limited to one direction
[21:21:31] <Danimal-office> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9Z6Dkx8YeI
so I'm still worried if these linear slides are enough. :( Anyone here with experiences with such kind of linear slides and cutting alu?
I have linear slides, they work for me
this size? or bigger ones?
I cannod load the pdf
it expands to 600 meg on evince
ok thanks for the help tonight
time for me to go home
flexxxv, but the cut size also affects requirements
@archivist_emc: I also opened it with evince... yeah some kind of big but wait i have an alternative pdf...
my box went into swap and was unusable
[21:29:47] <flexxxv> http://www.nb-linear.co.jp/japanese/download/pdf/slideguide/SEB-WA.pdf
yeah japenese but think it is some kind of self explaining...
got the english one
[21:30:48] <flexxxv> http://www.31992640.com/cpjj/nb/pdf/seb-wa.pdf
(this one is much smaller)
I only have the option to buy the SEB12WA (not the others)
how many carriages will you have
2 each axis
2 each linear slide :D
there is another maker who explains how to load share
I have smaller rails and do cut ally
but my column is not to still for a good cut
do you use a trapezoidal spindel?
yes but they backlash and I want to change to ballscrew
they have backlash
I thought trapezoidal are better :-O
yay toolchanger ladder seems correct
just gotta fix some air leaks
it'll be weird not having to change tools manually on the mill
Is there a way to limit the rate of change of spindle speed? In G95 mode EMC is overvolting my VFD when it backs out.
vfd setting ?
there are limit1, limit2, limit3 components
but yeah better to fix it on the vfd
or add breaking resistor :)
yes, or a braking one :-P
The VFD has a stop-time setting, but that doesn't seem to be quite the same as a decel time setting. I will look at the settings, though. I came in as my feet were freezing.
its late on a sunday speelin not reqrd
archivist: Does that mean you're on the 2nd bottle/12pack/poison of choice?
cradek: those are rt components to use to filter motion.spindle-speed-out?
Jymmm, one can but freezing fingers in here
archivist_emc: fingerless gloves @ dollar store = AWESOME
archivist_emc: white with black dots are the warmest
andypugh: they are components that limit the value and/or first and/or second derivatives of a float value
If you have a trackpad.. http://www.gizmag.com/etip-gloves-for-touch-screens-from-north-face/13687/
Great, if I can't sort it out in the VFD I will do it there. I am slightly puzzled why it didn't happen before, but that could have been the larger capacitor in my previous PWM to Voltage converter
hello, is anyone familiar with AUTOCAD's DXF format?
Dollar Tree, these are what I'mwearing right now... http://reviews.photographyreview.com/files/2008/12/glove_fingerless.jpg
i'm trying to evaluate the bulge component of an arc, but i can't find any info, and my math isn't that great
Mine aren't wool, but kinda thick like that
I am not even clear what you mean by "bulge component"
izua: what for?
You mean the distance of the middle of the arc from a line between the start and end points?
DXF defines arcs between 2 cartesian points. the 'bulge' component or factor is basically the angle of the arc (angle = 4 * atan(bulge) )
nope, it would have been easy that way. I think what you refer to is called 'sagitta'
archivist_emc: Here ya go... http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.30366
They work pretty good.
micges: i'm trying to evaluate points on the arc, so i can represent the arc using a number of lines, depending on the machining resolution
izua: but I already pointed you to code that does exactly what you want
uhm, sorry, i tried figuring it out to no avast
is it supposed to run in autocad?
oh you're trying to break it into lines?
can't do arcs on a cartesian cnc
I was assuming you were trying to generate gcode, sorry
can't do lines on a polar cnc
well, oyu know, exclusively cartesian/exclusively polar
if you were using emc you could :-/
if you can't move in a circle
you'll always approximate it in lines
unless you have both cartesian/polar degress of freedom
oh? how come?
The interpreter chooses the axis velocities every millisecond, but the motor speeds can't change instantaneously
But even if they could change instantaneously, millisecond straight lines is darned close to continusous curves
yeah, but you're always drawing on a matrix
determined by either the encoder's resolution or the microsteps/steps in the stepper motor
so you're basically approximating curves
anyway, this isn't really my issue :)
i'm trying to solve this bulge problem
you're controlling a physical system with mass
the motion is continuous
wouldn't you lose resolution following that train of thought?
That's what following error limits are about.
Anyway, you say that you have two points an the included angle of the arc?
it's how dxf stores arcs
And what are you wanting?
position of points on the arc
you can interpolate arc to get points on it
either using the circle's formula, or some other smart formula involving bulge - which i haven't been able to deduce yet
Find the centre of the arc, then iterate round in small increments of angle?
yes - but _how_ ?
pointx = centerarcx + radius*cos(anglerad)
pointy = centery + radius*sin(anglerad)
micges: dude, i don't know the center of the arc
hmm, well, i've tried a few approaches
if you have dxf then you know center
but i can't end up with O
at type 10 and 20 of ARC entity
there's a specific type of arc, in AcDbPolyline
which is composed only out of vertices
and one vertex has a 42 component - that's the bulge
you could say that earler
i said arcs with bulge component..
this is polyline with bulge
this is python but it's easy to figure out
yeah, python isn't an issue
I will stop thinking now then :-)
bx - beginx of arc, and so on
and v is the center i assume?
distance2d is pythagoras?
hmm, kind of makes sense
v is structure ignore it
good night all
holy jesus on a moped
micges gave me the right thing
i've been playing with various solutions for hours, all failures
MarkusBec is now known as MarkusBec_away