freaking 20 amp diode in there for reverses
theres one in every computer PSU :)
L84Supper want the schemo for it?
its easy to make
and if you need more power just add more transistors I stopped at 3 it semed enough to me
pfred1 : thank you but no, I was just wondering
pfred1, what is the big cilynder in the box?
the cap seems huge
anyone wanna go in on this with me, I have a $100 or so http://cgi.ebay.com/Large-5-Axis-Gantry-mill-50X-x-18Y-x-10Z_W0QQitemZ120481163021QQcmdZViewItemQQptZBI_Mills?hash=item1c0d3ca70d
who sells this on ebay?
look at the size of the digitizer probe
not a particularly large gantry as large gantries go
mills the entire hull of a ship from a solid block of steel
50' could be extended fairly easily
I wonder how many items like this actually sell on ebay or if it's just good advertisement
woow it can mill foam =)
why don't they mill something more interesting in the video
I bet its not very rigid
the worlds largest chunk of cheddar or something
what is it with you guys and machining food?
It says you can make an offer - see if they'll take your $100
I wonder if the repeatability is any better than 1mm on that gantry
L84Supper, 5 axis ? I never have seen more than 3 axis needed on machines
they probably would be happy with 1mm
if you're milling a car body without moving the part, you need 5
a large number of things need 4 and 5 axis machines
milling a new head for the car
now if it could also walk to the part....
or combine the mill with a 3D printer nozzle to deposit plasticized concrete, you could pour a house and finish with the same machine
L84Supper done much concrete finishing have you?
that I'd like to see a machine finishing concrete!
pfred1 : the concrete used is more resin than cement since it has to be able to dry quickly, it's poured without the use of forms
I see not concrete like we use then sometimes we use it with plastiscizer in it or kitty hair
[00:51:43] <L84Supper> http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/02/16/business/realestate/main2487598.shtml
[00:52:20] <L84Supper> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contour_Crafting
L84Supper you know what we all say?
A robot will never replace me until it learns how to drink!
but seriously in construction we got a long way to go before robots on jobs
fascinating, but stupid
that POS behind that guy would be in little pieces all over the jobsite before morning break I'm afraid
the "pleasurebots" will probably roll out first
much less harsh environment
sometimes I see other people's research, and am cowed by its brilliance
in this case, not so much
eric_unterhausen notquite ready to become a charter member of the open dildonics society are you?
the on-site is not so practical, but in the factory for prefab it has potential
where sourcecode ain't the only thing open!
there are factories all over the U.S. that can build you a wall
[00:57:43] <L84Supper> http://www.instantrimshot.com/
L84Supper factory fab is all CNC
my boss' house has a house built on prefab concrete walls
his house has a house, nice...
that didn't come out quite right
must be rich
the only problem with it is that the people who put it together have to be reasonably competent
eric_unterhausen yes I've worked on jobs that used precast
the point of cnc pouring concrete is to eliminate the forms
eric_unterhausen made by a bunch of mexicans in Arizona I was told
eric_unterhausen that'd ake it what MCN ?
I think most of the plants are fairly local
robot building a house , c'mon
tarzan_ in modular consrtuction there is a lot of CNC
all the wood cutting is CNC
I even saw a guy on TV that has a timberframe company and he CNCs that stuff
concrete and t-slot
yeah you can get higher tensile strength off site
onsite we don't look for more than say 2,500 maybe 3,000 PSI
offsie you can achieve 5,000
bank vaults are precast offsite
and man they're a bitch to tear down let me tell you!
L84Supper you'd have loved the gadget they brought onto one job to tear apart a bank vault it was like a robot
L84Supper like a jeep with a big mechanical arm on it with a jackhammer on the end
heh was picturing a 10' dia circular saw on the end of a crane
nah couldn't get anything big to this vault was inside a building
or they'd have just used a ram on it
this was like a mini ram
but it looked so cool
it tore up that vault in 45 minutes where as a whole crew of guys working the day before barely put a dent into it
I donno I'd say the whole crew was noiser
just less effective
and were beat up and bruised pretty badly themselves by the end of the day
running jackhammers up walls seriously sucks
you get as beat up as what you're beating up
it is sort of a 50 50 deal
if there's a trick to it I've never figured it out
trick is don't do it
imagining what it would be like having to explain what the thing is if pulled over by the police
well cured concrete is very strong
eric_unterhausen concrete never fully hardens
eric_unterhausen it is a crystal just keeps getting stronger and stronger as it ages
there must be some point...
but old concrete is bad
but I've heard that after 40 years it's incredibly tough
yeah, then it starts to crumble
you heard right
prestress crmbles when the rods rot
the oron is a slow explosion inside the concrete
big business there
I've busted up more than my fair share of concrete thats for sure!
my personal best is 7 feet down
and my advise to anyone busting concrete is just this, Go big!
they took out an older building near my work recently
trying to do it neatly is just a lot more work
getting rid of the slab took quite a while
in fact they just left the outside foundation and made it into a wall
eric_unterhausen sometimes you're just better off hiring the cutters
they can do it fast
I don't remember how they got rid of the slab, they had some pretty cool machines to get rid of the upper part of the building
I've seen cutters take apart a floor faster than you could pour one
yeah when i had to go 7 feet down it was into a foundation
I think it took longer because the guy with the machine was sorting out the steel beams as he went
yeah no such thing as landfill anymore
and if there was one that was too long, he'd snip it with the claws of the machine
it all gets sorted
I think thats called a shear
i woulda paid to do that job for a day
operators make good money
it's my childhood dream
you say that til you've been up in one of them machines
you take quite a beating
all that slamming around
when you see the machine move he's in there moving with it
those things got no shock absorbers
trust me I been in them it like a harsh amusement park ride
all day long
it adds up
just something outside you don't think abou
I can live with it to fulfill one of my childhood dreams
but you get jostled running a machine
I never knew til I got inside one never thought of it
but I was like damn this sucks!
before that I was always jealous of the operators sitting there all day long
but they sitting there taking a royal beating
operators are all drunks
eric : I didn't know those Shunk servo finger grippers were so pricey, do they work well?
Stroking Motor: 1/6hp (40 in-lb torque). Variable power.
$70k is 2x the price of the robot I was considering mounting it on
man the Internet is sick
that hand is amazing
I don't work with it, I just helped buy it
there are youtubes of it working
when it was first introduced, it went for twice that much
I've seen them at the trade shows, actually Fabtec is here starting Monday
I should try to get a small table space at Fabtech or the Automation show next year to demo EMC
L84Supper just don't bathe for like a month and run around the parking lot wild eyed trying to hand out home burnt CDs of it :)
yeah, been there
that'd be how Linux would be promoted most likely
shame too because it is such good stuff
man i can't believe people run anything else
I'm trying out EMC in some new 3 axis inkjet printers
L84Supper you're not that guy are you?
L84Supper on CNCZone?
oh OK good
because they're cracked
I'll have to look now
they made theirs to diredt apply resist to PCB
UV resist is pretty simple
eric_unterhausen a thread I read on CNCZone a guy made a machine to direct apply resist to PCB
we are printing conductive traces directly by inkjet
L84Supper that is all I could think of while I was reading the thread!
just get the UV board
active components as well
but nooo this guy had to make this crazy machine
went through all kinds of troubles wit hthe ink
yeah, read the patents as well
UV and solvent resins resist cuperic and ferric chloride as well
yeah, the USPTO approves just about anything these days
huh, PCB printing is a popular subject at cnczone
mostly printing resist and hacking desktop TIJ's to do so
only reason I can see to build PCB at home is convenience
it can be cheaper
than a board house
but I've had spotty results with toner transfer method
I doubt it's cheaper
the current tech is for RFID and simple single use throw away applications
for one board?
you doubt its cheaper?
the marginal cost for one board might be less
getting to the point where you can make one board may not be cheaper
cheapest board houses I see are $25
and if I set out today to make one board how much would it cost me?
using synthetic paper for the boards
eric_unterhausen what method?
I have nothing, have to buy it all
board itself say $5 a sheet of toner transfer $2 etchant $7
you need to buy the drill too?
that could run you
laser printer $100?
could go to a copy shop
but you should have laser printer anyways inkjets blow
inkjet printed doesn't use solder, leaded parts are sonic welded
color lasers are pretty expensive
last laser printer I bought cost me $10
or conductive adhesive
at a garage sale HP L4+
eric_unterhausen but the thing is most people who want to etch a PCB already have things
I think most of them are just fooling themselves
past that I don't want to hire someone else to do my hobby for me
I mean where's the fun in that?
I etched my first PCB when I was 13
used that rub on transfer stuff
what! no sharpie?
nope not sure if there were Sharpies back then
I used paint pens
least I'd never seen one
this was in the 70s
MEK + nigrosine + resin
the rub on stuff wasn't too bad
I still have that board
just a 7490 + 7447 + 7 seg LED counter with a 555 timer clock on it
but hey I was only 13
I need to get some training on the t-tech machine I have access to
I did the same with my Craftsman drill press and #60 bits that I'd break every 10 holes or so
my last pc board was fun, I drilled a hole in my hand
L84Supper I had a Dremel talk about breaking bits
I'd end up drilling half the holes with a bit 1/4" long
I was convinced it couldn't be done!
I have a mini high speed drill press now
eric_unterhausen past that I know I want more PCBs at a later date
so investing in some tooling can be spread out over more boards
with inkjet we are getting below 1 mil trace and space, <1/3 UL spec right now
L84Supper what ink conducts?
Methode 9101 is aqueous
[02:14:32] <L84Supper> http://www.methodedevelopment.com/whatsnew.aspx?newsitem=30
better link http://www.methodedevelopment.com/whatsnew.aspx?newsitem=29
L84Supper little out of my price range
the dev kit is pricey
The price of the kit is $1,850
that'd be an awful lot of PCBs before I saw any payoff there!
heh, in a year or two the ink price will be down, it's just coming out
you should see what we pay for semiconductor ink
L84Supper lets hope a little dab will do ya
3pL will get you a transistor
thats a pretty little dab
yeah I could see some peoples time being worth enough to justify it
just not mine I do this stuff to pass the time
hobby = pass the time as cheaply as possible
MarkusBec is now known as MarkusBec_away
take up reading then
eric_unterhausen I do
it just gets pricey when I add the single malt to that
eric_unterhausen but for some reason beyond my coprehension I enjoy electronics
I hate to think how much money I've wasted on hobbies
eric_unterhausen you don't want to hear the quote I've coined for that
I have a wood lathe I was thinking about selling, so I looked for one like it on ebay
found one, in the metalworking lathe section
told the guy it was a woodworking lathe, it didn't sell and he relisted in the metalworking section again
eric_unterhausen less to be learned never volunteer
that goes for information too!
I learned long ago don't pay to try to educate
kinda annoying since I would like to see it sell
can't search completed auctions?
thats how I price stuff
I guess you can't then
you have to keep an eye on the item now
I had this teapot once I was like how unique looked on Ebay there were three being sold
I was like not so unique after all!
"watch this item" to see what it sold for
L84Supper they did but it didn't sell
that's interesting, I did find one, sold for 700
I'm suprised ebay hasn't sold another sometime
yeah ebay has probably already sold the freaking Holy Grail by now
these things show up occasionally, no doubt
they seem to have sold everything that ever was
the one that sold even has a tool holder just like mine, I thought it was homemade
I'm surprised they don't let people bet on what items will sell for just like credit defaults
Electro-Harmonix Holy Grail Plus + Reverb Sold For:US $140.00
ebay is a money making machine!
they're just sitting back letting it all roll in
it's everyones online garage sale
L84Supper worse than that I'm afraid I am a garage sale junky
L84Supper and ebay is something else entirely
too bad businesses have discovered the motion control sections
ebay is always top dollar
you're often better off going somewhere else to get it
I still come across linear positioners and servo drives for cheap
but I've seen lots go for way more than it is worth too
considering how much most servo drives go for retail, ebay is cheap
picked up 2 Parker motion 1 micron repeat. 1m positioners with drives for <$1k together
eric_unterhausen to me second hand should be 10 cents on the dollar or better
for it to be a good deal
so $1000 going for $100 is a good deal, right?
eric_unterhausen yes depending on if it is obselete or not
electronics can be a special case
the real good deals tend to be listed with typos or in the wrong sections
electronics goes obselete more than say fine china or silver might
servo drives tend to last a while
yes * finds a lot
eric_unterhausen thing is is there better technology available today?
sorvo drive, steeper moter
some stepper motors on ebay look out
they're medical pulls from radiation environments
radation plays hell with magnets
lots with no specs, just nema23 servo
as is can mean as if
no label and frayed wires :)
yes all of that has to be taken into account for rice the risk factor
for risk exposure you should be handsomely rewarded
and i just ain't seeing it all the time on ebay
Chernobyl military surplus
I wish the safety ninnies at work hadn't locked up the brake and shear
you to can scan your own brain http://cgi.ebay.com/Philips-MRI-Head-Coil-3T-QHC-T-R-4522-131-94501-unused_W0QQitemZ350270928719QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item518dc6374f
Flerb combines flanging with spatial reverb for a unique ethereal sound
eric_unterhausen the real question is did the safety ninnies at work lock up the demolition saw?
I could dismantle the locks, but I'm waiting for an emergency
some idiot unbolted the hasps once, and stupidly left them unbolted
so they made it a lot harder
yea my optoisolator works at 5.7 ma input!
tha should be safe with a parallel port no?
worst case I've heard of there is 6 ma
in halrun, following the hal user manual page13, should save all saved.hal save the parameters?
in the example page13 a param was changed (setp siggen.0.amplitude 5), but it didnt show up after restoring from the hal file ( halrun -I -f saved.hal).
amplitude was back to 1
to get hold on the McBSP2 signals on the beagleboard.
They now go from ball to ball on the board as I2S tracks.
micges1 is now known as micges
MarkusBec_away is now known as MarkusBec
I need a brake & shear. those magnetic ones that work in a vice look OK
I bet once you get one of them in the workshop, you immediately need a roller to flatten it all again
ah, flat jaws of vice will press ctl-Z on a bend gone wrong
hello Boon_. quiet in here today
Could anyone please recommend me something as simple as possbile for 2.5d milling (all i want to do is jus engrave text ) , that would generate EMC compatible g code?
EMC has ... JT goes to look
I've been trying to make sense for two days now , the closes i've gotten to anything is with engravelab
but i think engravelab's 2d
since it wont lift up while moving between letters ,creating big scratches and in the end making the text barely readable
by 2.5D do you mean on a curved surface?
I mean that i want to be able to controll the depth
[12:42:13] <jthornton_> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Simple_EMC_G-Code_Generators#Text_Engraving_Software
wow , thanks alot
Lawrence wrote that one
VM has too much delay to be usable , so I'll boot to livecd , hope it works and thanks again for the help.
engravelab must have a tool up command
even if it's a binary switch
ah he gone
I tried some win32 software called 'deskengrave'
seems pretty good for writing txt
Jymmm thanks! looks like some interesting stuff to play with there
MarkusBec is now known as MarkusBec_away
MarkusBec_away is now known as MarkusBec
pjm emc has 'cp1' and it had some engraving, reticles, rules, ( so text wrapped around graduated knobs for xmpl ) and LawrenceG wrote more text extensions
pjm_: this looks cool, input is svg ( from many grfx apps like inkscape ) , output is .ngc gcode, AND you can run it from online, no software to install http://machinetouch.appspot.com/svgEngraver.py
( from hugomatic )
sorry wrong winder
mebee not, looks like cad/cam stuff here in #emc
in halrun, following the hal user manual page13, should "save all saved.hal" save the parameters?
[15:59:34] <alex_joni> http://workcycles.com/workbike/bicycles/accessories/antitheft-spray.html
neat. I found shelf sliders with a very short stiff slider, and balls much closer together in the race so plenty of points of contact, and with a short piece of angle welded across the slider
one pair will do my Z
and they'd make a nice X too, as it doesn't extend
pocket slider for doors, it's described as
12 quid per pair
The only problem is they'll work with either Z at the ends of X, or Z in the middle. I was hoping this shopping trip would decide that for me
wow they got B&Q in taiwan, about shelf sliders, the kind used in tool drawer are very strong, you can stand on the extended shelf, made for loads
45kg it says
and I'm sure much less than that would affect their accuracy
built for load perp to length, ok for vert?
dunno where to get tool drawer ones. the kind I started with were intended for filing cabinets
these ones I got today are OK vertically too. the filing cabinet ones were springy so I used 2 pairs at 90deg
googled 'heavy duty drawer slide' lotsa hits, 500lbs 22" http://www.amazon.com/Drawer-Slide-Extension-Heavy-Capacity/dp/B0009ODZMM
put UK in there and you double the price
heh, they are the logical step up from mine :) I could make a heavy duty version without switching to proper rail
in Britain http://shop.comdir.co.uk/Products.aspx?intGroupID=999
the 2 opposed pairs work great under the table
if you stumble on a 'Lista' tool cabinet, it will have great slides
heh the first ones I looked at from the UK place were 300 quid each :) they are proper slides tho, not pressed
so, I can translate my design into expensive+accurate too
maybe I'll mill new channels and use these races from the cheap ones, when I upgrade
so I should do that before the pressed ones go sloppy, although I reckon they could be revived in a vice once or twice
drawer slides are built to extend, eliminate the extending, and they are fully supported, and will last longer ( no idea how to achieve that, but it sounds like long frameworks )
yeah 2 opposed pairs. when the vertical supports are fully extended, the horizontal are fully retracted, &vv
on 2 long beams. it was going to be 4 but it was easy to align 2 sliders per beam
and there's 120mm zone in the middle which is always supported, and the X is right in the middle of that
seems like .par and .stl are the prefered file formats for parts directories. at least that's what reprap uses
hmmm Mesa 7i33 only has single +/- 10VDC servo output, not differential out?
looks like it
it would need double the circuitry to make it bridged
or a relay for the crossover
hmm forget that
that would be to sneak +/- out of a single +
acemi is now known as Guest63764
pjm is now known as Guest34011
_Poincare is now known as poincare
poincare is now known as Poincare
if it isnt complimentary, make it so with a single op http://focus.ti.com/lit/an/sloa099/sloa099.pdf
was just surprised since this is to control motors and other noisy electromechanical components
or you can just hook the - input up to ground
or just spin a better board altogether
machine controls are rarely elegant.... unfortunately
I need to go play with my mesa board, I still don't know if it even works
I see that TI still makes you look at two different data sheets for mechanical and electrical specs rather than just one like almost every other semiconductor company
hey they are combining them now!
if it was AC you could use an isolation transformer
sorry :) irrelevant
heh... controlling some dumb Parker Motion servo drives
in a cheapo dremel, what's the first thing that'll wear out?
bearings id say
brushes are consumables, if I can get new ones
so it could be worth the effort of rebuilding the plastic one in a metal case with servicable bearings?
or just buy a good one instead of the hassle =)
good ones arent that expensive
yeah least hassle is just burn through these 19.99 ones
is there a heavy duty Dremel available?
and then I've got an old cast 1/4" D&D drill with no hammer action so nice bearings
as in usable by hand?
a heavy duty dremel is called a foredom
a proper spindle is where I'll go when this one melts
hm.. differential output with mesa should be easy if it can do +-10V
or maybe the B&D will have a go first
the proxxon looks fairly nice
just use 2 outputs and feed it with the same signal, just one time negated
I've had a proxxon
how did it work?
900-6000rpm is pretty ok
beats B&D 900+2400
we just got a proxxon as second spindle. not installed yet, but it does up to 20krpm, which is much better for small stuff than our 3krpm spindle
I've decided to put my Z at the ends of the X, so I have much more freedom in spindle mounting now
X motion is simply the ballscrew actuator, the strongest part in my machine
dammit, I've just worked out I'm free to hacksaw these slides shorter, so Z on X is back in the hat
L84Supper: 7I33 is single ended because servo amplifiers almost always have differential inputs
nothing in particular is gained by differential outputs in this case.
as long as your noise is common mode
( and of course if you dont have differential inputs, differential outputs wont help)
am I a wuss for thinking the biggest advntage is reduced rfi emissions? :)
only in theory
no RFI from audio frequency analog...
square waves have harmonics
the power-outputs generate noise, the control cables are no problem there..
no square waves...
7i43 has PWM for servo out, more noise there
pwm doesnt neccessarily mean noise. only if you dont put the fitting filters behind it
usually a cap + coil combination
I'm was looking at using the 7i33 to get the 10VDC +/- differential out
and yes.. motor coils do the same
yeah, depends on slew rates and how you terminate
Would would need a unitiy gain inverter and scale by/2, to get +-10 differential, but if you have a differential input amp
theres no real gain
is the amp attached to the motor, or close to the driver?
it's the long wires which should be differential twisted pair
if twisted pair is still fashionable for power cables
speaker cables all seem to be ribbons these days
maybe that's just to get them under the carpet
a heavy duty dremel is called a foredom or du-more or just die grinder ( made for metal, made for lateral forces, made to keep rpm at load )
and shielded twisted pair may/maynot be fashionable but its a damn good idea
yeah I looked at die grinders but they were very expensive
used, with all the shops closing...
esp one that polished moulds
I don't need long & skinny. a fat router would do
this one says "Professional" http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=40457
long & skinny is often the bearing set which is good
if this one breaks in the middle of a job, I can run down to the high street and get a new one
10x "professional" vs 1 proxxon
1/4" collet would suit my machine better I think, esp once I convert Y to belt drive
1 proxxon is about 80-100E here.. for a 100W one
I wonder how many you could return under warranty before they'd start to complain?
that one is 30$ which is about 20E
and it doesnt note any wattage
yeah mine was 20gbp
11k to 36krpm
[19:16:45] <roh> http://proxxon.de/en/28481.html
that one we just got
target use is milling pcb
and we got a http://proxxon.de/en/28500.html
to be used 'by hand' in the workshop.. if thats not enough i got another one of the latter. they are quite cheap (50-60E or so
MattyMatt where did you get a machine that speced for 20pound?
Wilkinsons, the discount shop with half decent tools & hardware
ah.. so its some no-name spindle?
i guess china (like most stuff nowadays)
it's badged Draper, which was a quality British make but they rebadge some dodgy imports these days
got a picture?
same here ;)
only one think i am sure about: old 'green painted' machinery from local vendors i'd take anytime
if i can afford the space
[19:21:48] <L84Supper> http://www.kdntool.com/_sgg/f10000.htm
proxxon and mini-mills
i was recommended kress spindles, but it seems one needs some kind of special parts to make it fit smaller diameter tools
[19:22:33] <MattyMatt> http://www.drapertools.com/b2c/b2citmdsp.pgm?pp_skmno=40967
looks like Harbor Freight toys + a cnc kit installed
yeah 1/8" collet max approx (3 supplied)
there was no flexible drive in my kit
eric_unterhausen : how well do the flexible shafts hold up on the Foredom units?
I don't know
the price has stayed the same for the last 10 years, so there may have been corners cut
I like the different handpieces
I really need to get a decent compressor so I can use die grinders
my friend has an unused one sitting next to his unused MIG welder. big dreams that man
[19:33:23] <L84Supper> http://cgi.ebay.com/INGERSOLL-RAND-100-HP-ROTARY-SCREW-AIR-COMPRESSOR-99_W0QQitemZ140357748868QQcmdZViewItemQQptZBI_Air_Compressors?hash=item20adf94884
giant thing looks like a harley
don't think I have the power to make air with that
but a bargain at ~$2K ;)
I'm a little afraid to buy a used one
get a new certified tank
lotta bids on the rotary screw ones that are home usable
and the rattiest pump you can find
quiet would be nice
a company I'm doing design work for got a new one that lasted 1 day before the cast housing cracked
Has anyone ever tried to used a National Instrument PCI-DIO card with EMC? It's supposed to be 8255 compatible
have documentation bout it?
coldelectrons: I've seen discussion about it
eric_unterhausen: So have I, but I haven't seen anyone come back and say "Success!"
I think that's because ppt are so cheap and standard
Too busy making chips, I guess :)
I argued against it because nobody would maintain the driver
there was some pushback on that idea, but nobody wrote one either AFAIK
I know one problem with that is what gets attached to a 8255 isn't necessarily standard
first LPT were 8255 iirc
ibm pc used up intels overstock of 8080 support chips
no they were discrete ttl
ls373, in a socket for when you burnt it out :) yeah seen that too
pretty sure you can't build a pc compatible ppt with an 8255
first parallel ports weren't bidirectional iirc
if you hard wired it to LPT1 or LPT2 ports (assuming they are available on pci) it should work
yeah I keep forgetting they are now :)
I assume 8 out and 4 in
so yeah making it bidir & compatible with a PIO would be trickier
unless of course, the first bidir ports followed 8255, which isn't unlikely
pure conjecture. nfi
anyone know of a nice jog pendant compatible with emc? all I find just seems to work with mach3
logitech psx clone
frallzor i built my own
roh works fine with emc?
[19:49:49] <roh> https://m21.hyte.de/blog/jogbox
there's one shown plugged into my board with DRO, in the manual
nfi where to buy one
its consisting of a plastic case, 7 holes, 6 encoders, one parport cable where i removed one plug and a few pullups
roh got schematics and stuff to share?
the rest is just emc config and a extra parport
frallzor nope.. just soldered if freely.. i can do one
[19:51:11] <SWPadnos> http://www.cnc4pc.com/Store/osc/product_info.php?products_id=158
[19:51:25] <SWPadnos> http://www.cnc4pc.com/Store/osc/product_info.php?cPath=40&products_id=162
I believe someone (like jthornton_ ) made EMC2 configs for those, which might be on the wiki
someone here uses a Logitech successfully
say I get a cheapo from ebay, shouldnt be that hard to make them work in emc then?
anything that plugs into a parallel port or other I/O and works with Mach will likely work with EMC2, once you do the configuration
if it has a serial or ethernet connection or something, then more work is necessary
he wanted something more professional looking, so I suggested rebuilding the logitech in a square box
the Logitech game controllers suffer from userspace problems
[19:53:52] <roh> http://pastebin.ca/1672481
ie, they are not actual encoders, and they can only do things that are controlled by the userspace USB input component
thats the essence of my config for manual jogging
so smooth jogging like a good MPG is not possible with them
manual pulse generator
Manual Pulse Generator (an encoder wheel_
ah yeah. jog shuttle in video editing speak
no, just the jog
I can have Z & Y handwheels at the front of my machine easily. X could be tricky
SWPandos : thanks for that link! 26pin LPT to db25 ribbon cable $3
oh cool. I need some of those :)
I kept all mine when the 486s went in the skip
I knew they'd come in handy
actually I need the opposite - I want to connect an LPT port to a PCB
I think warp9td has those for $2.00
(the maker of thte SmoothStepper)
Man, I wish I could get XL or MXL gearbelt by the spool. I'm sure it exists, but for finding who distributes it in my area
hmmm "Usually ships in: available with purchase of smooth stepper" maybe they don't sell them separately
Oh no. I'm going to make motor to screw connectors out of wood, against my better judgement
it's either that or grind the shaft on these Workmate vice jacks
they have stamped lugs to retain the washer that acts as the axial bearing
MattyMatt: Are you planning on doing a nice job, or is this something that would show up on thereifixedit.com?
a saw wooden blocks before. they were as wide as the motor and looked daft
I can't throw stones - I have a computer rack made of 2x4s.
these screws are too good to ignore tho. 12mm wide 5mm pitch twin start 2off 150mm threaded + nuts for 10 pound + 0 postage
chinese clone of B&D Junior Workmate
nice set of fold out legs for free
I want 8" travel, not 6", but I'll live with that until 1st overhaul
these have a good 6" of thread on a 12" shaft, so I can have the shafts connected by belt under the table
for safety, or running on 1 motor
with 2 good motors I reckon it could lift a 10kg tool easily
I've tried to think how to use the channels they come in, but I'll just use the screws for mk1
I suppose the unrolled part of the shaft will still be turnable?
dunno anyone with a lathe, so it's irrelevant
4mm pitch sorry, 2mm acme thread and twin start
ive written down some documentation:
[20:44:44] <roh> https://m21.hyte.de/wiki/JogBox
roh: so the box is 6 encoders? (looked like rotary switches or pots)
got the for 1E a piece or so from a surplus dealer
pollin.de if youre in europe
i will make a picture of the box open and from the pyvcp ui snippet in action and add it later
hmm, is it posible to buy servos etc on ebay like you do stepper motors? .. cant find any servos suitable for cncs
servos... like radio controlled ones?
oPless like motors
oPless motors with encoders
pfred1, [21:27] <sys2> hmm, is it posible to buy servos etc on ebay like you do stepper motors? .. cant find any servos suitable for cncs
motors with encoders for the axises of a cnc machine
I'm sure someone sells servo motors on ebay
ye, but its ALOT of those for radio cars etc
try refining your search some
* oPless asserts that the only ones he's seen cost $lots
theres lots of reasons lots of low end users opt for steppers
[21:40:16] <MattyMatt> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Fanuc-AC-Servo-motor-from-Colchester-2000L-CNC-lathe_W0QQitemZ330376648878QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_BOI_Industrial_Automation_Control_ET?hash=item4cebfb98ae
how stupid to sell it off...
"I'm rebuilding with mach3"
how stupid to do that..
haha, serves him right
I hear mach3 has high speed
how can you be so stupid..
peole say it is easy to setup too
replacing a good motor that's mounted...
with a stepper!
* anonimasu shakes he's head
yeah steppers can work great..
but.. not like servos..
did anyone machine anything nice?
I've machined a few nice things
I cut the flaps for the throttle bodies I made in friday
no metalwork today
anonimasu: certainly not like an AC servo
alex_joni: indeed :)
I cant wait to throw the steppers away from my lathe
you can match an older DC servo with a modern stepper
atleast the old servos are silent
hear of some people getting great performance from steppers them people ain't me though!
mabe someday I'll make a super drive haven't yet though
my best to date is like 2,000 RPMs
if it was actually moving anything other than the motor shaft, 2000 RPM is very good
SWPadnos dream on :)
no afraid I was just getting the shaft with that one
SWPadnos really screws don't like going that fast
ok, so divide by 5 or 6 for actual work, maybe more
gears don't mind, so you could have been driving a belt reducer or whatever :)
well I can reverse at 250 RPM and get some torque up to say 1000?
I mean for a unipolar driver I don't think I can expect much mre from what I've read
oh - for unipolar that's even better
I can up the voltage some
I'm only runing like at 23 now
my driver chip I'm using claims it is good to 46
so with that I could get better flux change
seems to be my big limiting factor with steppers changing the flux like collapsing the field
I guess tha is where bipolar shines
slamming reverse polarity into the coil
eventually I'll make a bipolar drive to check it out
they're expensive the parts
just the H bridges will cost me $26
might as well get Gecko G250's at that point
i have two bipolar 42V 1.5A drivers from printers, i guess they could do quite high speeds
but i don't have anything to feed them data fast enough
mGcodeGenerator is now on 0.1.41 (~300 time faster) 3d cam optimalization
they're serially controlled
celeron55_ you mean a sequencer?
oh them junks
you feed them +5V, 12-40V power and serial control data (at up to very fast speeds) and connect a stepper directly to them
yoyoek1: cool - have you cut anything more?
celeron55_ they're obselete I think all new stuff has built in sequencers
oh wait bipolar not my thing
skunkworks: only work stuff. it is boring.
i think they'd be fairly good, if i could make something to feed the data to them
parallel to serial encoder maybe?
I have a circuit using an AVR but the speeds you can get with it are ridiculous
skunkworks: you use mgcode ?
celeron55_ TTL typically good to 50 MHz
hmm, i think they're LB1946
the datasheet is a bit obscure but i think they can take a 500kHz serial clock, and they need 12 bits of data, so that'd be 41kHz step clock
OK if I have a 35.5 uS clock how many HZ is that?
hmm... that's 208 revs/s = 12400rpm on a 200 steps/rev motor, if i didn't mess anything up
like too many decimal places for me to figure out :)
OK that is fastest I ever ran my stepper driver
74ls192 motorola works on 40Mhz
but .. it was with a .9 degree motor half stepping it
it is only a step up / down counter bat using ands ors and so on you can maka a driver working on 40Mhz
the 191 has easier up/down input
worst 191 could be would be 25 MHz
i think i can do that fast serial data on the AVR... maybe it's figuring out what to send which consumes most of the processing time on the AVR
yoyoek1: 300x! sheesh, nice work
i'm not actually very sure about this, it might also be a problem with the external interrupts, as i'm not using the fastest one
tom3p: it generate at present time monki from blender in a blink of the eye :P
not so easy to debug an mcu :P
well, anyway, i've clearly messed something up with the mcu
yyy pfred1: what with the mos and theirs capasity ? on that resolution ?
yoyoek1 what is who what?
yoyoek1: i can imagine a lot of the monkeys covering a wall, each with different expressions
yoyoek1 my motors?
pfred1: if you building a driver working on a 20-40Mhz how do you make power part? mosfets hawe a problem to work on heigh frequency
yoyoek1 oh I'm not my best speed is 35.5 uS clock
yoyoek1 but the chip is that fast
ooh mgcodegenerator works in blender? neato
MattyMatt: yes it is a script for blender
yoyoek1 my stepper motors resonate
any good solutions for manual tool change to get the right depth etc of the tools to continue milling with
sys2 use a contact to move up to to check length
my idea was to set a cam up so it looks at a silhouette of the fitted tool
archivist_emc I thought typically tools were preset into collets?
MattyMatt, you need a telecentric lense for that /me does not like the price of them
deep mike tip to carriage
calbrate the fisheye
pfred1, only if you have loads of holders
archivist, a contact ?
archivist_emc well yeah or don't run many different tools
but i dont get it how to "use a contact to move up to check length" ?
see docs for probing
or move the tool down until it earths a (sprung) contact
having preset tools is far better though
archivist_emc I'd imagine a lot of the power of CNCis being able to make a lot of cuts wit hthe same tool letting software compensate
i was thinking as imple tool, like L shaped that i put next to the say endmill, and push it up until it hits the mill holder then just tighten it...
and use the tool table
sys2, in the sample G-code directory with EMC2, there is a file called something like tool-length-probe.ngc
yep, a flip up hard stop
archivist_emc like I love how people mill out holes
you need a switch that the tool can contact, probably mounted on the table
SWPadnos, well stuff like that i would have to add manualy to the gcode generated by programs right? :)
yes, but it's a simple subroutine call
archivist_emc whenever I drill any hold over an inch in steel I need to use a holesaw
Firefox can't establish a connection to the server at cvs.linuxcnc.org.
archivist_emc so seeing a CNC machine mill say an 1 1/2 hole is pretty exciting for me
we use git now
3" dia drills rrr rrr rrr rrr BIG chips and sloshy white water, got torque at low rpm?
tom3p my machine tops out an an inch
easy to sharpen :0
SWPadnos, anyhow, its like i just put it after each tool change, it will probe the length and set offset or what? :)
read it - I don't know it well, I only know it exists and works :)
tom3p you should see what I did to make a cam with a holesaw once
pfred1: using the slug?
tom3p yup left the center drill out :)
tom3p welded two of those to 4 standing up nuts
tom3p it is my tablesaw fence lock
but then i would have to know the exact height of the switch off the table of the cnc right? :)
pfred1: uh, nuts off ctr? is that the camming part
sys2, yeah. the posh probes return by spring to set position. by posh I mean they are more $5 on ebay
tom3p once it was welded up I was like what are the odds I'll get the hole centered?
* sys2 does not order stuff on ebay yet ... first of all its all outside my country (sweden) and 2nd of all i might have to wait months for it to arive :P
tom3p you know when I drilled through it
* archivist_emc is doing an ebay pickup tomorrow
tom3p I couldn't have if I wanted to ;)
* celeron55_ has ordered lots of small stuff from ebay to finland with no problems so far
archivist_emc: Stop by I'm oly a few blocks away.
but in general its like a pipe with a spring and a plate in that say GND one of the parport lines ?
or pull them low atleast
sys2 whatever you order will probably arrive by sun up
Jymmm, Cardiff south Wales to pick up a lathe base for a friend
cant be to hard to make yourself .. :P
sys2: more like 2 weeks :)
sys2 do you live in the artic circle?
not realy ... sweden
sys2: I'm a swede too
sys2 I thought some of sweeden was in the artic circle
and usaly the shipping from ebay costs ALOT more then $5
as far as ve seen
pfred1: I'm fairly near it..
anonimasu yeah i always thought my car was built in the artic circle
anonimasu I have an old Volvo
ah.. though sweden's a long country
* pfred1 has a 1966 P1800S
pcb test contacts are similar, but only 20mm long
but that's good, if you want in on your table
and one more problem is my stupid stepper driver board, only gives me as far as i can tell 4 inputs ... might be enough tho (its for limit inputs realy but should be usablye for tool probing also ? as i need 3 of them for the limiting switches im left with 1 open ...
sys2 I think standard parallel port is only 5 inputs
I want 6 for limit switches, so I'm looking at multiplexing mine
pyvcp and more photos ar eup now
eh up.. for the jogbox
MattyMatt yes the thought has crossed my mind
pfred1, well thats only 4 so :P
[22:40:11] <sys2> http://www.brundin.biz/images/datasheets/4-axisdriverboard.htm
its that driver board
giving 4 limiting inputs 1 for each axis
sys2 4 could get you 16
pfred1, eh ?
a 4 to 14 multiplexer
4 to 16
or just use one to interrupt emc, and fetch which limit from serial or usb
4 in 16 out
pfred1, but still i wouldnt need more then 4 inputs :P
3 for the limits and 1 for the tool probe
limits can be home siwtches at the same time ?
for 3 axis don't you need a limiter on each side making 6 switches?
no reason why not, if adjusted nicely
or you'd never know which side you were limited on
yeah but I think they're usually paralleled
it only really matters if you power on
yeah not so sure i am going to go that route myself
that is what I'm doing now is making my BOB
pfred1, have same line say limit .. depending on what way the axis is going emc should be able to know what limit it hit imo :P
sys2 OK so each pair is serial?
but if it is in a hitted-limit state when powered on
like on each axis
then it doesn't
celeron55_ leave machine parked in the middle I guess?
(or over limit)
celeron55_, jog it outside of it and home it ? :)
celeron55_, well if its over limit then even if you have 2 limit switches it wont know where it is :P
well, of course, but wouldn't it be nice if it didn't matter? :P
sys2 this is where I found how I am setting mine up http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.3/EMC2_Getting_Started.pdf
I want an asychronous link eventually for things like error codes, temperatures, spindle speed settings etc
there it states that a input pin can be "Both limits & Home X"
the machine should eventually be fairly idiotproof
for a machine tool
MattyMatt there is always a bigger idiot
make it smart but self destructive. call it Amy
I need a "guard lifted" switch, now I'm building a cabinet
I sure hope the minimum system requirements are a bit high
all I have for the project right now is a 500MHz machine
I'll run like a weak WM
I won't run gnome
k6-2 is dead, but my coppermine celeron is 500Mhz too
yeah I had an athlon 800 but it got hit by lightning
it'll run Gnome, whether it can run emc2 at the same time is another matter
so the 500 is the best I think i have right now
I found an athlon 1.3 at the dump, but it's not playing anymore
yeah all my systems are dumps finds
still, 512MB sticks of pc133 are scarce :)
yeah I lost one of those too
and it had a good burner
I don't get much more than a year out of a burner it seems
they just drop dead
mine don't, but I don't use them much
I try and avoid using them for reading disks, only burning clean new ones,, but I never manage that
once i get my homemade machine going I have to work on CNCing my mill
I might just upgrade mine axis by axis
well I have a benchtop mill but I don't want to CNC it first
I want to do a homemade machine first
get all the bugs worked out
because the mill is going to be harder
i shoulda made a toy one, like a reprap, first
stepconf looks nice compared to the old hand editing
* MattyMatt doesn't know. still not installed emc
MattyMatt I've run it in the past just looking at the docs now there are screenshots
I noticed there's a a simulator verion for debian
so I could play with it on this machine
I'm glad emc moved to ubuntu
I think that is what it used to be based on
ah cool :) I thought my current beau had been rejected
I love debian
never did tried to plenty of times
but people are free to choose
haha, he was a few keystrokes from needing a new root pw there :)
I don't get into the politics.
I do just not over OSes
I've never pushed for any changes. I guess that's where it starts
man I am stoked to see this all put together
it's getting a slog for me now. it's taking far longer than I planned
pfft I dropped this project for like 4 years
had to do other things just found time now to finish it
so I'm like whats the rush?
I'm running out of time. need a job asap
well CNC isn't going anywhere do what you have to do
that is what I had to do
yep, I was kinda hoping to generate income with a working machine before xmas
heh that was my mindset the first time around and it didn't go well
I wanted it done asap
in the end things just got messed up
this time I am being careful about every detail
yeah I coulda cut the slots for the sliding gantry this afternoon, but I held back for another think
two things totally messed up my last attempt
I'm pretty sure I'm decided on putting the Z in the pillars, at least
this time I'm going one piece at a time
was going to say one step
* pfred1 is stepper happy!
what 2 things?
one the power supply I was using had a glitch in it
something that to this day I don't understand
and two I was unable to squelch the noise in my motor drivers
together they made my motor drivers really raggy
I was putting them together when they were really two different problems
drivers are pretty much commodity items now
so I wasn't solving either of them
I'm not interested in someone elses work
I'm happy to use quality tools
I'm happy to make quality tools
I gave up electronics as a hobby when it became hard to match the quality for the price
you should be, it's the reason why we have open source, too - just copy, paste and edit a bit 8)
my 3 axis drivers will cost me $60
(should be interested in someone elses work, that is)
celeron55_ not for something I can do myself
as newton said, if I see further it's because I stand on the shoulders of giants
long as he giants do't have their hands out that [#emc] long as he giants do't have their hands out that
well, i mean that you should google everything you can find about what you're doing and see if you can benefit from that, first
eah good for newton
when making electronics or software
or probably anything
oh sure i get datasheets
I'm not cracking the chips open to see what makes them tick
well unless I blow one up
asics spoiled the hobby, but now with fpga it's fun again, once you've tooled up for smt
I looked a lot for a good BOB schematic I didn't find aything that suited me
I had to do SMT at work so I choose not to do it for fun
well, then indeed you have to design one for yourself :P
celeron55_ from what I've read a lot you buy can be crap too!
I want to wind my own motors eventually :)
linear steppers for a start
they look easy
celeron55_ my BOB is optically isolated then there is a driver
i've been designing and building a fighting robot which is so exotic you can't find much information on the designing of such... it's fun because you simply have to do it yourself, because the stuff needed isn't commercially available :P
celeron55_ you mean battlebot?
that stuff http://www.assembly.org/summer09/asm/gallery/robosota
they're remote controlled aren't they?
practically all of them, yes
I didn't think any weren't
it's not necessary, though, in finland you can use 2x the weight if it runs on its own
glorified radio control cars if you ask me
technically some of them are just that
once some popular shaped were developed I thought it was all pretty cut and dried in it
wedge shaped was becoming prevalent in UK robot wars
yes they seemed successful
usually with hydaulic fork lift
I guess it depends on the competition
we've been having really boring fights in the 6kg and 13,6kg classes in here, because we've had an arena with no walls, though the 150g and 450g fights are very fun to watch
dunno. they were small and I dunno if co2 cyl was legal
the robots really break each others in pieces sometimes
I like robocup. that's no-holds-barred
bipeds win in nature
MattyMatt not in the middle of a 4 lane they don't ;)
i'm doing a translational drift robot. that's a kind of robot that spins the whole of itself very fast and moves at the same time
my cat is so fast its amazing
weight for weight they do. try crashing into an elephant (on its hind legs, to comply with bipedality)
that'd probably be a draw
i only know of something like two of this kind around the world
biped is a lousy form of locomotion
it's great for fighting while locomoting tho
arachnoid should be good too
MattyMatt tell it to Siegfried
actually he was the one who got away
wheels are only best for high speed, and in a small arena you can't get that
celeron55_ there was one in robot wars that did very well but met a wedge+forklift in the final
are you sure
it tipped the top
MattyMatt yeah I thought once that one design came out it pretty much wiped all other designs out
most people confuse these robots to ones that just spin the top
unless the operator was a total geek
and have normal drive system at the bottom
this was 2 wheels
i know that in robot wars there has been one that used a lawn mover engine
that is just a basic FBS robot
nothing like what i'm building
down boy! http://www.rd.com/images/rdmag/people/27650SiegfriedRoy.jpg
nice kitty ...
I said weight for weight :) tigers can be 800lb
or 800kg even, I forget
MattyMatt what you gonna do throw ultra slim fast at it?
MattyMatt and there is no possible way you gonna win a foot race with my house cat
a 200lb man would beat a 200lb cat in a faceoff
yeah with an elephant gun
give the man a pair of shoes
without a weapon you're meow mix
well yeah OK, cats are armed and we're not, so we'd get lacerated. the cat would lose unless it got lucky bite tho
I'm pretty sure the Romans have tested this theory out throughly
we can use our knees to crush etc
as you can't use projectile weapons in these robot contests, I still say limbs are better than wheels
MattyMatt seems like the spinners are the best weapons
though i saw once with a carbide circular saw blade that did some damage
a flat scoop can flip it
I wonder if they'd allow a hopping robot?
that could be nasty hop up and crush
mount my 14" saw flat with a "come & get me" sign
wonder how well would a few inches of HDPE with embedded diamond dust fair against a carbide saw blade
that thing wants to eat my fingers, I can tell
HDPE fibre? like that starlite body armour?