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[00:00:17] <Neo_The_User> thats fine
[00:00:21] <andypugh> My first instinct is to revert both those changes and try again
[00:00:25] <Neo_The_User> no no no
[00:00:53] <Neo_The_User> post all output of dmesg and and lspci and i will make a config for you
[00:01:05] <MrSunshine> haha the mobo i have supports cpus up to 95W .. and my cpu is 140W :P
[00:01:07] <MrSunshine> how nice
[00:10:30] <andypugh> http:///pastebin.ca/1647217
[00:10:57] <andypugh> Looks quite a simple system, ceratianly no sign of packet radio or token ring there :-)
[00:11:45] <Neo_The_User> so we have.. sata piix
[00:12:43] <andypugh> sata?
[00:12:50] <Neo_The_User> k i need to go back to linux brb
[00:13:06] <Neo_The_User> yes. sata is a type of bus... i think thats what sata is
[00:13:18] <Neo_The_User> brb
[00:13:40] <andypugh> His patience is astonishing, isn' it?
[00:16:54] <Neo_The_User> andypugh, so you dont have /boot as ext2 right?
[00:17:28] <andypugh> I can't say I even understand the question.
[00:17:38] <Neo_The_User> nevermind you dont ;)
[00:17:54] <Neo_The_User> making a tweaked kernel config for you now
[00:19:01] <andypugh> I do hope that this is actually your hobby and you are enjoying this...
[00:20:04] <Neo_The_User> not a hobby but i dont mind helping you
[00:20:47] <bluntz_> wow actual emc users here?
[00:21:08] <andypugh> Nah, all unix compiling geeks tonight.
[00:21:14] <bluntz_> hehe
[00:21:23] <bluntz_> ok I got 1 for ya
[00:21:30] <andypugh> Some of us can only dream of using emc at the moment.
[00:21:43] <Neo_The_User> hahaha
[00:22:10] <Neo_The_User> andypugh, you have a pci express network controller?
[00:22:30] <andypugh> (Yes, I know, I have a kernel that will run a vanilla emc install, so an easy fallback)
[00:22:34] <bluntz_> just got the new shiny 2.3.4.1 and it comes with an older RT kernel than I am running,Do I use it or the newer one?
[00:23:26] <SWPadnos> you will need to use the older kernel or compile emc2 for yourself
[00:23:27] <andypugh> I think it will have to be the one it was built on
[00:23:33] <bluntz_> older one doesnt see my sound card tho
[00:23:51] <bluntz_> as if it matters
[00:23:54] <cradek> sure are a lot of kernels floating around
[00:23:59] <SWPadnos> are you talking about the -rt kernel, or an actually realtime kernel like RTAI?
[00:24:10] <bluntz_> ummm
[00:24:11] <cradek> we haven't changed the linuxcnc kernel during the 2.3 cycle have we?
[00:24:16] <bluntz_> lemme uname it
[00:24:36] <andypugh> Neo_The_User: Possibly. All hardware is on the motherboard, it is a 1U server and the PCI slots have .75" of headroom
[00:24:38] <SWPadnos> if it doesn't say rtai or rtlinux, it's not realtime enough for EMC2
[00:24:47] <Neo_The_User> ah ok
[00:24:48] <bluntz_> 2.6.24-24-rt
[00:24:48] <bluntz_> bluntz@barter:~$
[00:25:06] <SWPadnos> that's the stock "-rt" kernel, and will not work with EMC2
[00:25:14] <SWPadnos> unless you only want a simulator
[00:25:15] <bluntz_> ok thanks
[00:25:21] <bluntz_> well
[00:25:21] <Neo_The_User> bluntz_, are you on ubuntu?
[00:25:27] <bluntz_> yup
[00:25:37] <Neo_The_User> http://neo-technical.wikispaces.com/emc2-ubuntu
[00:25:40] <SWPadnos> ubuntu has an Ingo-style -rt kernel
[00:25:43] <bluntz_> I was scared of firing it up
[00:25:52] <andypugh> Compiling EMC from source is quite easy, even I can do that (and the rest of the channel have seen how clueless I am)
[00:25:53] <SWPadnos> it will refuse to run
[00:26:09] <SWPadnos> andypugh, irrelevant here, since that kernel can't be used anyway :)
[00:26:22] <bluntz_> yea but I like to stand on the shoulders of giants
[00:26:47] <bluntz_> my knees shudder under all that code
[00:27:00] <SWPadnos> it's very heavy
[00:27:04] <bluntz_> yup
[00:27:45] <bluntz_> I've been lurking and stalking this project for years
[00:28:06] <bluntz_> time to swim
[00:28:35] <bluntz_> so many mills on youtube
[00:28:40] <bluntz_> time for me
[00:28:59] <Neo_The_User> andypugh, post output of cat /proc/cpuinfo to pastebin please so i can tweak your kernel further
[00:29:11] <SWPadnos> you could just reboot and choose the appropriate kernel when you want to do machining (or listen to music)
[00:29:23] <SWPadnos> if you want to do both at the same time, you'll need to roll your own I guess
[00:29:48] <Jymm> or just buy another compter
[00:29:48] <bluntz_> I want to hang around and pick yer brains first
[00:29:53] <bluntz_> hehe
[00:30:09] <SWPadnos> yeah, the second computer trick is handy too
[00:30:17] <SWPadnos> or fourteenth or whatever
[00:30:30] <bluntz_> nah I dont buy much of anything it takes all the fun away, Im a builder
[00:30:49] <andypugh> http://pastebin.ca/1647243
[00:31:03] <SWPadnos> well, of course. what I meant to say as buying enough parts to make another computer
[00:31:19] <Neo_The_User> would that be the older xeon or the new core i7 stuff>
[00:31:23] <andypugh> Machine the parts from solid.
[00:31:25] <bluntz_> I got lots of boxex layin around
[00:31:35] <andypugh> Very much older Xeon
[00:31:35] <SWPadnos> oh, then put another one together
[00:31:54] <bluntz_> they are waiting for me
[00:32:30] <bluntz_> I want to start small first
[00:32:47] <andypugh> Can you run your music in a VM running a different kernel?
[00:32:49] <bluntz_> like some printer steppers
[00:33:02] <bluntz_> and small gantry
[00:34:03] <bluntz_> have all you guys seen the gaspipe mill someone made for under 100$ on youtube?
[00:34:16] <andypugh> I have
[00:34:29] <bluntz_> omg it gave me wood!
[00:34:56] <frallzor> link?
[00:35:04] <andypugh> Struck me as ingenious, but silly.
[00:35:09] <bluntz_> yup
[00:35:21] <Neo_The_User> SWPadnos, should multi core scheduler support be off?
[00:35:30] <SWPadnos> uh - not sure
[00:36:35] <bluntz_> has anyone here built their own driverboard?
[00:36:36] <andypugh> I believe yes, from my previous failed attempts. SP perhaps no
[00:37:36] <Neo_The_User> ok i have the config for you
[00:37:39] <Neo_The_User> posting on my site now
[00:38:25] <Neo_The_User> save to disk
http://neo-technical.wikispaces.com/file/view/andy.config
[00:38:35] <bluntz_> somewhere it seems I read that emc was capable of running a small stepper straight out of the parport?
[00:38:53] <andypugh> Yes.
[00:38:54] <Neo_The_User> wait i need to change more stuff sorry
[00:39:02] <bluntz_> wow
[00:39:19] <andypugh> You would need a very small one, and it would need to be unupolar
[00:39:25] <bluntz_> would you be interested in helping out with the setup?
[00:39:52] <andypugh> But we had someone on here last night doing almost exactly that with a ULN2003 power driver IC
[00:40:27] <bluntz_> I have a breakout board for the parport
[00:40:32] <Neo_The_User> andypugh, do you need multi io card support for parrallell, ax88796 support, and ieee 1284 support?
[00:40:51] <andypugh> Use stepconf to create a normalconfig, edit the hal file to be a Type5 stepgen, connect the extra pins in HAL and connect this circuit...
[00:41:30] <andypugh> http://www.8051projects.net/stepper-motor-interfacing/uln2003-stepper-big.gif
[00:41:49] <andypugh> I am likely to be adding a second parallel port
[00:42:01] <andypugh> 1284 almost certainly not
[00:42:54] <Neo_The_User> and you dont have a ax88796 network controller
[00:42:59] <Neo_The_User> so leave that off too i guess
[00:43:01] <andypugh> The ULN2003 can take 500mA and 50V, so you could drive quite reasonable steppers
[00:43:29] <andypugh> I didn't mention that one for fear of exposing my ignorance
[00:43:59] <bluntz_> sweet
[00:44:27] <Neo_The_User> ok download the kernel config now
[00:44:38] <Neo_The_User> save it to .config within your kernel source tree
[00:45:18] <Neo_The_User> sudo wget
http://neo-technical.wikispaces.com/file/view/andy.config && sudo cp andy.config .config then compile
[00:46:50] <Neo_The_User> vfat is off, some usb devices are off, all other network controllers off, its pretty much going to work on your computer only so dont try it on anything else :P
[00:47:17] <Neo_The_User> you might want to look over the config first before blindly compiling
[00:47:52] <SWPadnos> and possibly make oldconfig, in case there are any mistakes or constants that need to be regenerated, etc.
[00:47:54] <skunkworks> I must say - a hdtv does make a nice media monitor
[00:48:25] <skunkworks> (computer monitor)
[00:50:04] <andypugh> I went straight to 8a and got "No rule to make target `clean'. Stop"
[00:50:06] <bluntz_> andy this is for unipolor right?
[00:50:07] <Neo_The_User> SWPadnos, i personally never run make oldconfig
[00:50:20] <Neo_The_User> i have kernel configs that go back 3 years :P
[00:50:52] <SWPadnos> in this case, it's probably not necessary, assuming that the config you made is from the exact same kernel revision as andy's
[00:50:56] <andypugh> Yes, as there is no way to get a ULN to be anyhthing other than a high resistance or a path to earth, so no scope for swapping polarities
[00:51:21] <bluntz_> I got 3 bipolar and 1 unipolar
[00:51:26] <SWPadnos> it can be useful when going to a newer kernel, since it will use old config settings for pre-existing options, but will prompt you for new ones
[00:51:51] <SWPadnos> and also it makes sure that the config is consistent with the new kernel, in case some dependenceies in the kconfig tree have changed
[00:51:55] <bluntz_> and dont we get more torque with bipolar?
[00:52:18] <SWPadnos> bipolar motors are generally better, but harder to make a driver for
[00:52:26] <Valen> skunkworks I used to use a 37" 1080P tv for my monitor for a while
[00:52:27] <andypugh> Yes. Driving a motor direct from the p-port is fun, and cool, but not sensible.
[00:52:38] <bluntz_> hehe
[00:52:53] <andypugh> No current control, no microstepping
[00:52:55] <bluntz_> specially if it gets fed back eh?
[00:53:07] <bluntz_> magic smoke
[00:53:09] <Valen> not actually as usefull as 2x 19" monitors
[00:53:15] <andypugh> There are diodes in the ULN2003 to prevent that
[00:53:21] <bluntz_> kewl
[00:53:30] <skunkworks> my computer is not outputing 1080p - (something like 1280X1024) but it sill looks great
[00:53:35] <SWPadnos> parallel ports don't have much extra smoke in them, so you can't afford to lose much
[00:53:55] <bluntz_> I found an old intel ic
[00:54:04] <Valen> what monitor are you using?
[00:54:04] <skunkworks> (one of those atom boards :))
[00:54:09] <bluntz_> says it will do pwm
[00:54:23] <bluntz_> lemme find spec sheet
[00:54:47] <bluntz_> lol 1980 or some junk
[00:55:23] <bluntz_> forget it cant find the programmer
[00:55:40] <andypugh> What's the format for make clean?
[00:55:50] <bluntz_> I been eyeballin the arduino stuff
[00:56:24] <bluntz_> make proper or somethin
[00:56:29] <SWPadnos> make clean
[00:56:48] <andypugh> I guess I am in the wrong directory. Oops.
[00:57:00] <SWPadnos> make mrproper will (theoretically) return the source tree to its original state (removing all intermediate files and stuff)
[00:58:03] <bluntz_> ahh
[00:58:27] <andypugh> No, I get "no rule to make target `clean'"
[00:58:49] <bluntz_> syntax andy
[00:58:58] <bluntz_> got a space in there
[00:59:30] <andypugh> Yes, should there be one?
[00:59:34] <SWPadnos> uh
[00:59:40] <SWPadnos> making the kernel?
[00:59:42] <bluntz_> too many
[00:59:58] <andypugh> I am not even clear if I should be in usr/src or usr/src/linux
[01:00:04] <Neo_The_User> usr src linux
[01:00:08] <Neo_The_User> sorry i was watching tv
[01:00:14] <andypugh> OK, that is where I am
[01:00:23] <Neo_The_User> sudo make clean
[01:00:28] <SWPadnos> in fact, /usr/src/<whichever-linux-version-you're-building>
[01:00:28] <andypugh> as is the new .config
[01:00:46] <SWPadnos> are you in a full source directory or a headers directory?
[01:00:56] <Neo_The_User> SWPadnos, we are doing it differently and he is in source
[01:01:01] <SWPadnos> ok
[01:02:06] <bluntz_> andy brb goin to ebay for ic
[01:02:15] <Neo_The_User> andypugh, you didnt run make mrproper did you?
[01:02:19] <Neo_The_User> if not, dont
[01:02:36] <MarkusBec> MarkusBec is now known as MarkusBec_away
[01:02:40] <andypugh> No, I didn't
[01:02:44] <andypugh> But I am a muppet
[01:02:50] <Neo_The_User> hah
[01:02:55] <Neo_The_User> did sudo make clean work?
[01:03:00] <andypugh> I was putting the .config in the wrong place
[01:03:12] <andypugh> sudo make clean now works
[01:03:15] <Neo_The_User> the config goes in the linux directory
[01:03:34] <Neo_The_User> ok now do that very long make command
[01:03:39] <SWPadnos> oh right - make oldconfig also builds the kconfig tools and other housekeeping tasks for you
[01:03:45] <andypugh> It's making now
[01:03:51] <Neo_The_User> firmware and all that?
[01:04:05] <Neo_The_User> or did you just run sudo make?
[01:04:10] <andypugh> Yes, the whole lot
[01:04:15] <Neo_The_User> ah ok awesome
[01:05:10] <andypugh> It just compiled the kernel/panic module, can't we leave that one out :-)
[01:05:22] <Neo_The_User> hehe no it needs that
[01:07:39] <bluntz_> ULN2003AN ok?
[01:08:29] <bluntz_> theres an ULN2003AG also
[01:08:49] <bluntz_> a buck a piece
[01:08:53] <bluntz_> sweet
[01:09:12] <andypugh> I am no expert. Try searching on rswww.com as that is a trustworthy non-spamming source of datasheets
[01:09:50] <bluntz_> ahh ic its an A
[01:11:21] <bluntz_> same voltz amps
[01:11:31] <bluntz_> gonna risc it wtf
[01:11:37] <andypugh> A dollar a piece is expensive, RS will deliver 10 @ 29p each
[01:11:55] <andypugh> But possibly not to the US
[01:11:57] <bluntz_> delivered?
[01:12:02] <bluntz_> ahh
[01:13:05] <andypugh> There you are:
http://www.alliedelec.com/Search/SearchResults.aspx?N=0&Ntk=Primary&Ntt=ULN2003
[01:13:20] <bluntz_> ok they will be here few days
[01:13:32] <bluntz_> hehe too slow
[01:13:50] <andypugh> I persuaded RS to give me a trade account, so pay no postage :-)
[01:14:03] <bluntz_> now lets burn up a parport!
[01:14:33] <bluntz_> got an old p3 we can abuse
[01:15:22] <bluntz_> can we wire it straight out of the port?
[01:15:24] <andypugh> Actually, have a look at that link. $0.24 each $5 handling sounds pretty reasonable for bigger orders. Minimum order quantity 1.
[01:15:43] <andypugh> p-port might only sink 10mA
[01:15:44] <bluntz_> already paid for them
[01:16:27] <andypugh> Yes, I was meaning for other stuff in future. If they are equivalent to RS they will sell everything from power tools to 1000+ ribbons of SMT resistors
[01:16:28] <bluntz_> ahhh so 10 Ma wont turn a printer stepper
[01:16:45] <bluntz_> ok will book
[01:17:03] <andypugh> More to the point a stepper printer won't just pass 10mA
[01:17:42] <bluntz_> oic it will bounce it straight back?
[01:18:07] <bluntz_> hehe fires kewl
[01:18:43] <bluntz_> we need to film it
[01:20:58] <bluntz_> wish I hadnt stripped out that 286 today
[01:21:20] <bluntz_> it wood burn pretty
[01:21:51] <bluntz_> think theres a 386 around here somewhere
[01:22:01] <andypugh> Neo_The_User: I can't help but notice that your suggested "root" parameter in menu.lst is a lot different to the other entries
[01:22:07] <bluntz_> brb lookin for firewood
[01:22:11] <SWPadnos> a 386 is unlikely to run EMC
[01:22:23] <Neo_The_User> thats fine but try my way first
[01:22:23] <bluntz_> oops
[01:22:28] <SWPadnos> you'd have to change some timer functions in RTAI I think
[01:22:45] <bluntz_> of course thanks pad
[01:22:52] <SWPadnos> the CPU needs a TSC, which I think limits it to pentiums and maybe some late '486es
[01:23:08] <andypugh> OK, rebooting. Fingers crossed
[01:23:13] <Neo_The_User> :)
[01:23:16] <bluntz_> gl
[01:23:25] <Neo_The_User> oh wait
[01:23:29] <Neo_The_User> no no no wait!!
[01:23:32] <bluntz_> hehe
[01:23:34] <SWPadnos> heh
[01:23:37] <SWPadnos> but first ...
[01:23:39] <Neo_The_User> no im serious
[01:23:39] <bluntz_> poof
[01:24:06] <SWPadnos> oh, I believe you're serious, it's just funny
[01:24:11] <SWPadnos> cut the blue wire
[01:24:12] <Neo_The_User> you need to change /etc/fstab to the actual /dev location. not just the root paramater
[01:24:13] <bluntz_> yup
[01:24:15] <SWPadnos> but first, cut the green wire
[01:24:23] <bluntz_> lmao
[01:24:30] <bluntz_> brb
[01:24:57] <andypugh> Ah, OK. Guess I need to wander out to the garage again and manually meddle with grub
[01:25:12] <Neo_The_User> write down kernel panic please
[01:25:14] <Neo_The_User> while ur down there
[01:26:03] <andypugh> Well, I guess it is going to be not finding a filesystem as I didn't meddle with /etc/fstab
[01:26:18] <Neo_The_User> lets hope its just that
[01:26:45] <bluntz_> cant just run update grub?
[01:27:16] <Neo_The_User> not with a custom kernel with no initrd the ubuntu way
[01:27:31] <Neo_The_User> not the ubuntu way i mean
[01:27:37] <bluntz_> it didnt generate a new initrd?
[01:27:52] <Neo_The_User> initrd is pain
[01:28:03] <Neo_The_User> i didnt tell him how to set one up
[01:28:24] <bluntz_> hmm my install did it from the script
[01:28:29] <SWPadnos> dod you have the sata drivers compiled in (along with all the requisite hotplug / SCSI / whatever else)?
[01:28:36] <Neo_The_User> he did
[01:28:39] <SWPadnos> s/dod/did/
[01:28:41] <SWPadnos> ok
[01:28:42] <Neo_The_User> i set the config up for him
[01:28:56] <SWPadnos> yes, i noticed
[01:29:02] <SWPadnos> are you L84Supper's son?
[01:29:09] <bluntz_> I ran the hardy script
[01:29:28] <Neo_The_User> SWPadnos: yes
[01:29:32] <bluntz_> worked fine cept for sound
[01:29:41] <SWPadnos> ah. thanks again for the DX/SM3 help
[01:29:50] <Neo_The_User> no problem
[01:29:54] <john_f_> Question: Is there away to disable the arrow jog keys in axis?
[01:30:09] <SWPadnos> it looks like the latest WINE is about 90% there - it runs Altium without any special help, but I can't see any components :)
[01:30:29] <SWPadnos> john_f_, you can remove the lines in AXIS that bind the keys to the jog functions
[01:30:31] <bluntz_> it dont run cambam for me
[01:30:59] <john_f_> SWPadnos: where?
[01:31:05] <SWPadnos> in the axis source
[01:31:24] <SWPadnos> I'm not sure where it gets installed, but you can find it with "which axis"
[01:32:57] <bluntz_> anyone building a controller?
[01:33:57] <bluntz_> gawd Im always the odd one out
[01:34:05] <andypugh> OK, so, the same panic as last time, but a bit more verbose. It said (in effect) "Cant't find sda1, but I have hda0, hda1 and hda2" so I edited the boot string direct in grub and it booted.
[01:34:14] <Neo_The_User> yay!
[01:34:24] <bluntz_> woot!
[01:34:36] <Neo_The_User> now edit menu.lst and make it a permanent solution
[01:34:46] <Neo_The_User> that way every single time you dont need to edit it
[01:34:58] <andypugh> It seems rather likely it would have booted with the previous kernel with the right root= in menu.lst
[01:35:05] <Neo_The_User> no it would not have
[01:35:24] <Neo_The_User> UUIDs dont work without the memory hogging initrds
[01:35:43] <SWPadnos> john_f_, well, I'm looking at the AXIS code, and I don't immediately see where the jog key bindings are
[01:36:33] <SWPadnos> it's also not as trivial as I thought, because the +/- keys (I think) will jog the active axis, so there's axis selection code to mess with as well
[01:37:01] <SWPadnos> and there are also dedicated jog keys for Z and A (pgup/pgdn and , . I think)
[01:37:15] <mozmck> Neo_The_User: why is initrd a pain? I haven't had trouble with it...
[01:37:39] <Neo_The_User> compare side by side your memory usage
[01:37:47] <Neo_The_User> no initrd saves up around 100MB at least for me
[01:38:17] <Neo_The_User> also making an initrd requires more work
[01:38:28] <john_f_> SWPadnos: thanks if it looks hard to do then it probably is not worth it for me now
[01:38:47] <SWPadnos> it looks hard because I don't know what to look for :)
[01:39:06] <andypugh> Neo_The_User: 12a has a cd command and no path, deliberate?
[01:39:08] <mozmck> hmm, haven't looked at that. I wonder if no initrd would let linux install on a machine with less memory then.
[01:39:12] <john_f_> SWPadnos: Then I wouldn't have a clue :)
[01:39:24] <Neo_The_User> ill check hold on
[01:39:34] <SWPadnos> heh
[01:39:41] <Neo_The_User> no its fine
[01:39:47] <SWPadnos> andypugh, that would switch to your user directory
[01:39:54] <Neo_The_User> indeed
[01:40:16] <SWPadnos> slightly easier but less readable than cd ~/
[01:40:25] <SWPadnos> (sort of)
[01:40:54] <Neo_The_User> <command> && isn't easy to read?
[01:41:59] <SWPadnos> cd with nothing may appear to be incomplete, rather than an intended switch to the home directory
[01:42:15] <Neo_The_User> oh. will change thanks
[01:42:19] <SWPadnos> whereas cd ~/ is explicitly a switch to the home directory
[01:42:22] <bluntz_> yup cd=home
[01:42:33] <andypugh> Well, I know that now.
[01:42:37] <SWPadnos> heh
[01:42:41] <bluntz_> hehe
[01:43:05] <andypugh> They say you learn a new thing every day, but I am sure I keep learning the same stuff over again.
[01:43:18] <Neo_The_User> you are learning
[01:43:38] <Neo_The_User> you know to run make <whatever> within the source tree and not while outside a source tree ;)
[01:45:04] <bluntz_> I got confused when making multiple kernels in slack it symlinked usr/src/linux to the build
[01:45:07] <andypugh> OK, rtai compiled and installed sweetly. No need to reboot for the EMC2 install?
[01:45:22] <Neo_The_User> nope your good
[01:45:45] <bluntz_> fire it up andy!
[01:45:45] <Neo_The_User> bluntz_ which is why i have andy here keeping all his source in linux and not linux-2.6.29.4
[01:46:20] <bluntz_> yes it gets cluttered if you build more than 1
[01:46:23] <Neo_The_User> refresh the guide before compiling emc
[01:46:35] <bluntz_> I always delete after done
[01:46:36] <Neo_The_User> i changed the emc prefix installation path to make it easier to run
[01:47:12] <bluntz_> good id
[01:47:54] <andypugh> Rats! it was going too well. during the EMC install I got "checking for BWidget using /usr/bin/tclsh8.4... configure: error: not found
[01:48:01] <bluntz_> I havnt built a kernel in ubu yet
[01:48:03] <andypugh> A dependency?
[01:48:05] <Neo_The_User> you need to install bwidget
[01:48:18] <Neo_The_User> sudo apt-get install bwidget i think it is....
[01:48:57] <andypugh> Indeed. Not BWidget, that would have been too easy :-)
[01:49:51] <Neo_The_User> be sure not to skip step 2a
[01:50:40] <andypugh> I tried, but it died at gettex
[01:51:00] <andypugh> But up to that point everything had already been there.
[01:51:27] <andypugh> I have compiled EMC and kernels and RTAI already, so I thought I probably had all the dependencies
[01:51:46] <Neo_The_User> gettext is it
[01:51:53] <Neo_The_User> another typo! grr!
[01:52:30] <andypugh> Yeah, given my typoing skills I am not sure I am safe to be let loose with a command line.
[01:52:48] <skunkworks> autocomplete! ;)
[01:53:12] <bluntz_> lol I know just enough to REALLY screw it all up
[01:53:23] <Neo_The_User> what do you mean?
[01:53:55] <bluntz_> A little know how is worse than none sometimes
[01:54:36] <Neo_The_User> I know what you mean. Back when I did development for mesa3d code, i kept breaking stuff severly
[01:54:44] <bluntz_> hehe
[01:55:01] <bluntz_> I blew 1/2 my face off at age 5
[01:55:36] <bluntz_> put a bottle of cough syrup on the stove
[01:55:45] <Neo_The_User> ouch
[01:55:47] <bluntz_> for the pretty colors
[01:56:03] <bluntz_> I saw some show about glass blowers
[01:56:21] <bluntz_> and waited for everyone to fall asleep
[01:56:36] <bluntz_> snuck into kitchen and BOOM!
[01:57:24] <bluntz_> kept wondering why the floor wouldnt clean up ,all red
[01:57:44] <bluntz_> knew my ass was gonna get beat
[01:58:00] <bluntz_> nobody woke up tho
[01:58:15] <bluntz_> neighbors woke them from the explosion
[01:58:20] <bluntz_> lmao
[01:59:33] <bluntz_> funniest thing tho in school nic was smiley
[01:59:36] <bluntz_> hahaha
[02:01:23] <bluntz_> anybody in here built a gantry style mill yet?
[02:02:26] <bluntz_> hell is anyone in here got any machine?
[02:03:26] <andypugh> Yes, I have a combination lathe/mill
[02:03:34] <bluntz_> kewl
[02:03:49] <andypugh> w00t! all compiled
[02:04:23] <bluntz_> need to pick yer brain about slide designs
[02:04:25] <andypugh> Not that emc runs, of course. It is upset with me for having the parport module loaded....
[02:04:44] <bluntz_> right I read that somewheres
[02:04:45] <andypugh> need to edit modprobe.d I think
[02:05:33] <SWPadnos> or specify the port by number, not address
[02:05:36] <bluntz_> youve had it run emc2 before with success?
[02:05:38] <andypugh> The irony is not lost on me that this whole chain of work has been me trying to get the parport module included...
[02:05:52] <andypugh> Yes.
[02:06:00] <bluntz_> sweet
[02:06:28] <andypugh> The issue is that 2.3.4 won't run with the parport module loaded, and 2.4-pre won't run without it loaded
[02:06:29] <skunkworks> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E0rVbVixMw8
[02:06:57] <bluntz_> that your mill skunk?
[02:07:06] <andypugh> SWPadnos: Ah, a change to the .ini file?
[02:07:16] <SWPadnos> hal file actually
[02:07:41] <SWPadnos> I don't know if you can use stepconf to do it, but try changing the parallel port address to 0
[02:07:50] <SWPadnos> that should specify the first port
[02:08:54] <skunkworks> bluntz_: no - just a random emc video
[02:09:04] <andypugh> Hmm, I have lost my CNC applications menu items
[02:09:14] <bluntz_> ahh k cuz my flash dont like it
[02:09:34] <bluntz_> lemme find that mini mill vid
[02:09:43] <mozmck> andypugh, did you make install?
[02:09:52] <andypugh> Yes
[02:10:12] <mozmck> bluntz_: I have a gantry router running emc2
[02:11:19] <mozmck> I also have emc2 running on this machine which is ubuntu 9.04 with a custom 2.6.29.4-rtai kernel with smp. Works great!
[02:11:37] <mozmck> did you do make install as root? (sudo)
[02:12:01] <andypugh> I did, aye
[02:12:28] <mozmck> hmmm, It worked for me on this machine....
[02:12:47] <SWPadnos> did you (a) reboot to the RTAI-enabled kernel and (b) recompile RTAI before rebuilding and installing EMC2?
[02:13:13] <bluntz_> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6drMZqmyXQc&feature=player_embedded
[02:13:37] <bluntz_> kewl moz
[02:13:39] <andypugh> Yes to all those questions.
[02:14:03] <bluntz_> hope all you folks hang here regularly
[02:14:14] <andypugh> It's no big deal.
[02:14:27] <SWPadnos> did you uninstall the EMC2 package?
[02:15:02] <andypugh> Yes, I did that in a fit of desperation yesterday, and I guess that was when the menu items disappeared
[02:15:10] <SWPadnos> that seems likely
[02:15:15] <bluntz_> lmao
[02:15:28] <andypugh> I am in the habit of using the desktop shortcuts anyway, so I am not too concerned
[02:15:36] <SWPadnos> I would think that make install would re-create them, but it may require you to either re-login or run the menu editor t o force a menu reload
[02:15:41] <SWPadnos> ah
[02:15:52] <bluntz_> or maybe ldconfig
[02:16:08] <cradek> doubt make install adds those. you'd need to build the package.
[02:16:35] <mozmck> SWPadnos, I don't think it should. Now that I think of it though, make install didn't create the menus.
[02:16:41] <SWPadnos> ok
[02:16:43] <mozmck> I added them by hand later.
[02:17:05] <SWPadnos> I don't know a lot about the install target - only enough to know that building packages is a better idea
[02:17:28] <bluntz_> moz looks pretty handy
[02:17:43] <cradek> make install doesn't know/care what distribution you have, so it can't do distribution-specific things like add menu items
[02:17:55] <andypugh> modprobe.d has an emc2 entry of install parport_pc /bin/true
[02:17:57] <mozmck> make install works pretty well now I believe, and for this kind of thing it is easier than building packages.
[02:18:07] <andypugh> Is that for 2.4-pre?
[02:18:08] <cradek> on the other hand, packages are for a specific distribution
[02:18:42] <mozmck> andypugh: I removed that to get the parport_pc to load
[02:19:17] <bluntz_> I like paks cause I can never remember what folder I built it in and uninstalling is easier
[02:19:36] <andypugh> Do I need to commit to either 2.4-pre or 2.3.4 on the basis of the parport module?
[02:19:54] <cradek> yes probably
[02:20:08] <cradek> well no, but you'll have to mess with it each time you switch
[02:20:22] <mozmck> cradek: I've seen other install scripts that setup menus. It should be the same for any distro with gnome I believe.
[02:20:42] <andypugh> Does install parport_pc /bin/false work?
[02:21:00] <cradek> mozmck: yes but assuming gnome is often a wrong assumption...
[02:21:18] <andypugh> When is the module loaded/unloaded? kernel boot or emc2 boot?
[02:21:39] <bluntz_> look@ lsmod
[02:21:46] <cradek> andypugh: "on demand" which means all sorts of things, including (I think) when something like lpd starts
[02:22:27] <mozmck> cradek: true, but the stuff I saw just put the files under the right directory and it didn't hurt anything if there was no gnome... except extra garbage laying around I guess...
[02:23:54] <mozmck> parport_pc loads when the computer boots for me, and I can't remove it without directing parport_pc to /bin/true and then rebooting.
[02:23:56] <cradek> mozmck: some projects try to do their own package management and support all that stuff - I don't care for the approach because I think it's fragile (and OSes already have a package manager). As far as I'm concerned, our make install target is for building debs :-)
[02:24:03] <andypugh> So, for clarification: 2.3.4 requires that parport_pc is absent, which is achieved by having an entry in modprobe.d? Or is that entry to ensure loading for 2.4-pre?
[02:24:06] <cradek> mozmck: maybe lpd is starting?
[02:24:22] <cradek> andypugh: the entry prevents it from loading for any reason
[02:24:45] <mozmck> probably so. I tried removing all the modules that seemed to depend on it but never could remove it
[02:25:03] <andypugh> Right, so that entry has just been put there by make install, and a reboot should make it take effect?
[02:25:45] <bluntz_> brb
[02:28:29] <mozmck> andypugh: yes. that line needs to be there for 2.3.4, but I don't think it matters for 2.4-pre
[02:28:54] <andypugh> Well, lsmod doesn't show the parport
[02:29:33] <andypugh> Ah, bear with me
[02:30:10] <SWPadnos> that line causes the system to run the program /sbin/true whenever anything asks for the parport module
[02:30:15] <SWPadnos> so the module never loads
[02:30:42] <andypugh> Odd
[02:30:51] <SWPadnos> but since /sbin/true always returns a success code, the system thinks everything is fine (which is intentional)
[02:31:17] <andypugh> dmesg suggests I must make sure that the parport module is unloaded
[02:31:28] <andypugh> lsmod shows that it is
[02:32:08] <Neo_The_User> so the problem is that parport isn't.... what exactly?
[02:32:12] <skunkworks> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5pv0hGBajqY
[02:32:26] <skunkworks> a little creapy at the end..
[02:33:13] <Neo_The_User> parport was compiling into the kernel
[02:33:25] <Neo_The_User> not as a module. there is no way that parport cant unload
[02:33:33] <andypugh> I think the problem is either than parport it loaded, or that parport isn't loaded. Definitely one or the other
[02:33:42] <Neo_The_User> it is loaded
[02:33:49] <Neo_The_User> its inside the kernel binary
[02:34:00] <andypugh> Ah, but not modularised?
[02:34:34] <andypugh> No worries.
[02:34:49] <andypugh> Looks like I am comitted to 2.4-pre then
[02:34:55] <mozmck> looks like!
[02:34:58] <Neo_The_User> 2.4 pre is good. i used it
[02:35:04] <Neo_The_User> clone from git master if you want it
[02:35:20] <andypugh> I have it.
[02:35:40] <Neo_The_User> then your set
[02:36:00] <andypugh> Well, give or take a compile
[02:36:58] <Neo_The_User> so it works pretty much?
[02:37:19] <andypugh> Not at the moment, as it doesn't like the kernel version.
[02:37:49] <Neo_The_User> the API shouldn't matter as long as emc was compiling against that kernel
[02:37:49] <andypugh> But that is because it was compiled on the other kernel
[02:37:55] <Neo_The_User> oh makes sense
[02:42:20] <Neo_The_User> be sure to run git pull every once in a while
[02:42:53] <bluntz_> whats that do?
[02:43:11] <Neo_The_User> it updates all the changes from upstream to your computer
[02:43:18] <bluntz_> hmm
[02:43:30] <bluntz_> Im scared
[02:43:32] <Neo_The_User> git rebase --fetch if you make changes to the source
[02:44:02] <Neo_The_User> dont be scared. run man git and you'll be set
[02:44:07] <bluntz_> oic git not get
[02:44:16] <bluntz_> er wget
[02:44:48] <bluntz_> still tho I think I got something on here from git
[02:44:58] <Neo_The_User> git is great
[02:45:06] <Neo_The_User> i tend to avoid cvs the best i can
[02:45:14] <bluntz_> never touched it after it worked
[02:45:30] <bluntz_> gimme code again
[02:45:49] <Neo_The_User> ?
[02:45:57] <bluntz_> update
[02:46:05] <Neo_The_User> git pull?
[02:46:09] <bluntz_> k
[02:46:24] <Neo_The_User> cd your/directory/that/you/cloned && git pull
[02:46:53] <Neo_The_User> to change git branches to something that might be more stable: cd /your/git/repo/thingy && git checkout -b custom origin/upstream-branch
[02:47:03] <Neo_The_User> i use git all the time.
[02:47:17] <andypugh> So, what do we think the chances are of me having a working emc install before 3am?
[02:47:25] <Neo_The_User> very high
[02:47:26] <bluntz_> nope no database
[02:47:40] <andypugh> Only 13 minutes to go..
[02:47:47] <bluntz_> musta beenmy etch build
[02:47:49] <Neo_The_User> bluntz_ post everything that you did
[02:48:21] <Neo_The_User> andy pull emc git master, cd src, ./configure --prefix=/usr, make, sudo make install, boom your done
[02:48:30] <bluntz_> bluntz@barter:~$ git pull
[02:48:30] <bluntz_> fatal: Not a git repository
[02:48:30] <bluntz_> Failed to find a valid git directory.
[02:48:30] <bluntz_> bluntz@barter:~$
[02:48:42] <Neo_The_User> you need to be inside the git directory
[02:48:50] <bluntz_> other box
[02:48:55] <Neo_The_User> like... cd mesa && git pull. or cd emc && git pull
[02:50:21] <bluntz_> whats the code to list all installed apps?
[02:50:30] <bluntz_> Im gettin old
[02:50:38] <bluntz_> senile
[02:50:42] <Neo_The_User> haha. ls /usr/bin
[02:50:44] <Neo_The_User> hehee
[02:51:49] <bluntz_> hmm source debian live mu8st be git right?
[02:52:00] <Neo_The_User> ?
[02:52:06] <andypugh> with 2.4-pre it is quitting with "PARPORT: ERROR: linux parport parport0 does not support mode 2"
[02:52:27] <Neo_The_User> that's.. not going to be solved by 3am for you i think
[02:53:38] <andypugh> I suspect not. I think I probably need to recompile the kernel with parport modularised?
[02:53:50] <Neo_The_User> i can only guess
[02:54:06] <bluntz_> sounds right
[02:54:18] <bluntz_> then blacklist as needed
[02:54:27] <Neo_The_User> or just not run modprobe until needed
[02:54:51] <andypugh> Would that require a full reinstall and compile of RTAI and the emc versions too?
[02:54:59] <Neo_The_User> not RTAI
[02:55:00] <Neo_The_User> just emc
[02:55:16] <Neo_The_User> right?
[02:55:33] <bluntz_> ever fix that bwiget thing?
[02:55:42] <Neo_The_User> he did
[02:55:49] <Neo_The_User> he needed to install bwidget
[02:56:03] <SWPadnos> oh hmm - did you use 0 or 1 for the port number?
[02:56:09] <andypugh> 0
[02:56:13] <SWPadnos> (or leave it at 378 or whatever)
[02:56:14] <andypugh> and an addres
[02:56:16] <SWPadnos> ok, try 1
[02:57:03] <SWPadnos> hmmm. that may not matter
[02:57:11] <andypugh> Just "1" or cfg="1 out "
[02:57:37] <SWPadnos> a comment in the code says "ports 1 .. 16", but the email Jeff sent says 0,1,2 ...
[02:57:43] <bluntz_> no conflicts in modules?
[02:57:46] <SWPadnos> err
[02:58:01] <SWPadnos> cfg = "1"
[02:58:09] <SWPadnos> I think out is the default
[02:58:36] <SWPadnos> but it probably needs to be 0 - the error you got looks like it's after the detection phase, where it's looking at capabilities
[02:58:45] <SWPadnos> (though I haven't inspected the code carefully)
[02:59:11] <andypugh> "linux parport 1 not found" .. looks hopeful
[02:59:22] <SWPadnos> ok, so it should be 0 :)
[02:59:55] <bluntz_> yes 0 prolly hasnt actually been tried yet,until conflict is fixed
[02:59:56] <andypugh> linux parport0 does not support mode 2
[03:00:59] <SWPadnos> unfortunately, I don't know what mode 2 is, and it's a bit late to go looking
[03:01:02] <bluntz_> permissions?
[03:01:04] <SWPadnos> I'd say it's time for bed
[03:01:26] <andypugh> Yes, that does seem a wise move
[03:01:56] <SWPadnos> one thing to look at maybe
[03:02:18] <SWPadnos> see if you have the file /proc/sys/dev/parport/parport0/modes
[03:02:43] <SWPadnos> if so, cat it (cat /proc/sys/dev/parport/parport0/modes), and paste it here or on pastebin
[03:02:44] <Neo_The_User> yeah maybe some chmod or mknod command would solve it
[03:03:19] <SWPadnos> I don't think it's a device problem, though it could be
[03:03:38] <Neo_The_User> Just throwing stuff into the air :)
[03:04:01] <SWPadnos> it may need to be an EPP port, and maybe the driver isn't compiled to do that with this chip
[03:04:04] <andypugh> I could pastebin it, but it would be silly, the file is empty
[03:04:08] <bluntz_> go into /dev
[03:04:16] <SWPadnos> ok, the description is enough
[03:04:17] <bluntz_> feel around
[03:04:22] <SWPadnos> it's not /dev
[03:04:47] <SWPadnos> the parport driver is only used, within a kernel module, to get the address of the port and to reserve the I/O addresses
[03:04:54] <SWPadnos> the device node is never used
[03:05:18] <bluntz_> no dev/parport0?
[03:05:34] <andypugh> That is handled by hal_parport, I am guessing?
[03:05:44] <SWPadnos> no /dev/parport0
[03:05:51] <bluntz_> no bus?
[03:05:53] <SWPadnos> andypugh, which "that"?
[03:06:11] <SWPadnos> no /dev/*/parport*
[03:06:31] <bluntz_> I hate change
[03:06:52] <bluntz_> im going 2 bed 2
[03:06:57] <Neo_The_User> gn
[03:07:01] <SWPadnos> it's immaterial. our kernel modules can't make use of regular device drivers
[03:07:06] <bluntz_> l8r folkz
[03:07:16] <SWPadnos> so the presence or absence of /dev nodes doesn't say much
[03:07:18] <SWPadnos> see you
[03:07:22] <SWPadnos> me too - night all
[03:07:25] <Neo_The_User> is any of this my fault that it isn't working?
[03:07:31] <SWPadnos> could be :)
[03:07:35] <andypugh> For info, there is no /dev/parport
[03:07:37] <Neo_The_User> ah sorry guys
[03:07:46] <SWPadnos> the driver may not be compiled with EPP or DMA or whatever support in it :)
[03:07:53] <SWPadnos> or ECP
[03:07:56] <Neo_The_User> no it has DMA support for sure
[03:08:01] <Neo_The_User> EPP and ECP, no clue
[03:08:30] <bluntz_> ahh mode 2
[03:09:07] <andypugh> OK, how about I reconfigure and fire off a new kernel compile and go to bed?
[03:09:37] <andypugh> with parport modularised and all options on?
[03:11:10] <Neo_The_User> i think thats what he meant
[03:11:53] <Neo_The_User> ill search for EPP or ECP Parralell port support in the kernel. dont recompile the kernel yet
[03:12:48] <SWPadnos> it looks like mode 2 is ECP
[03:13:13] <Neo_The_User> andypugh, MTD support
[03:13:39] <SWPadnos> I don't think it has to be a module, though unloading/recompiling/reloading it is easier if it is :)
[03:14:02] <SWPadnos> MTD shouldn't be necessary
[03:14:35] <Neo_The_User> device drivers > mtd suport > ram/rom/flash chip drivers > detect non-CFI AMD yada yada
[03:14:45] <Neo_The_User> thats the only thing that consists of the ECP thing
[03:15:02] <andypugh> Ah, perhaps it is a non-PCI port?
[03:15:06] <SWPadnos> where's the config you posted? (it scrolled out of my buffer)
[03:15:09] <andypugh> Winbond* 83627HF Super I/O device
[03:15:22] <SWPadnos> the port was found
[03:15:46] <Neo_The_User> SWPadnos, my config that i gave him?
[03:15:47] <SWPadnos> but it didn't support mode 2, which the HAL driver wants for some reason
[03:15:49] <SWPadnos> yes
[03:16:09] <Neo_The_User> http://neo-technical.wikispaces.com/file/view/andy.config
[03:16:12] <andypugh> I see SuperIO support is selected (and experimental)
[03:16:53] <SWPadnos> I wonder if PARPORT_1284 would help
[03:17:31] <Neo_The_User> andypugh specifically said "defintley not 1284 support"
[03:17:39] <SWPadnos> ok
[03:17:53] <andypugh> I did, but might have been wrong
[03:18:08] <andypugh> I was thinking 1384?
[03:18:23] <SWPadnos> 1394? (firewire)
[03:18:30] <andypugh> exactly
[03:18:38] <SWPadnos> yeah, you don't need that
[03:18:59] <SWPadnos> but ECP is a mode of IEEE1284
[03:19:05] <andypugh> But that doesn't mean I don't need 1284
[03:19:07] <SWPadnos> the fastest one, it seems
[03:19:32] <andypugh> So, sorry chaps, all my fault for being definitive, confident, and wrong
[03:19:37] <SWPadnos> so turn on 1284 and rebuild the kernel
[03:19:39] <SWPadnos> heh
[03:19:57] <SWPadnos> and reboot in the morning ;)
[03:19:59] <SWPadnos> see you
[03:20:08] <andypugh> Night
[03:20:39] <andypugh> I wonder if I should add macintosh device drivers?
[03:20:47] <Neo_The_User> heh why?
[03:20:58] <andypugh> I have loads of Mac kit.
[03:21:27] <andypugh> It is plugged into an Apple Airport at this moment
[03:23:15] <Neo_The_User> no ide
[03:23:16] <Neo_The_User> a
[03:23:32] <andypugh> I won't bother
[03:23:45] <andypugh> OK, it is up and running.
[03:23:51] <andypugh> (Well, compiling)
[03:23:57] <andypugh> Thanks very much for your help.
[03:24:03] <Neo_The_User> make clean first?
[03:24:09] <andypugh> Yes
[03:24:15] <Neo_The_User> :) your welcome
[03:24:18] <Neo_The_User> glad i coukl
[03:24:26] <Neo_The_User> ld help and that i caused some major delays
[03:24:33] <andypugh> In the unlikely event that you ever need any Excel VBA help, you know who to ask.
[03:24:40] <Neo_The_User> im sorry about the delay part
[03:26:05] <andypugh> Right, I really need to scoot
[08:40:52] <MarkusBec_away> MarkusBec_away is now known as MarkusBec
[09:05:57] <MarkusBec> MarkusBec is now known as MarkusBec_away
[09:07:19] <MarkusBec_away> MarkusBec_away is now known as MarkusBec
[09:25:21] <piasdom> g'mornin all
[09:26:09] <pjm__> good morning
[09:27:22] <archivist> * archivist wins nearly a lifetimes supply of tips for hit parting tool
[09:27:59] <archivist> fleabay can be useful
[13:52:38] <Dave911> It really should be called Fleabay ... a much more appropriate name. I bought a number of carbide inserts and some holders off ebay last week - can't beat the prices. Gotta be careful with ebay, I sell and buy there a lot. If you do a regular search on "carbide insert" you will get the auctions and a couple of store items- maybe 100-150 hits. If you click on buy it now and then do a...
[13:52:40] <Dave911> ...search for the same thing - you will get about 1000 hits! Why Ebay works this way I have no idea. They are a little screwed up.
[13:55:01] <archivist> I searched for the sandvik number I wanted
[14:01:04] <MattyMatt> I won't be using these shelf sliders again, no matter how well they work. bloody hidden screws are a pita
[14:02:20] <MattyMatt> it makes the final assembly into origami
[14:02:59] <skunkworks_> glue?
[14:03:42] <MattyMatt> it would be easy if I didn't want to make it dismantleable
[14:04:01] <skunkworks_> or adjustable ;)
[14:04:14] <MattyMatt> but I do, as this is an experimental machine. I'll rebuild it several times I think
[14:05:22] <MattyMatt> these sliders would work with sheet, but into wood it's a nightmare
[14:06:40] <MattyMatt> I'll have nuts showing on the table surface. with the right gcode it can destroy itself
[14:07:03] <MattyMatt> not a big problem, just a pain
[14:11:17] <MattyMatt> I saw a reprap machine aligning itself. that was quite neat
[14:13:04] <MattyMatt> I forget how it did it, but I think it involved fitting a motor to an allthread crossbrace
[14:14:36] <MattyMatt> http://blog.reprap.org/2009_02_01_archive.html
[14:16:08] <MattyMatt> I like the term "kebab" for the linear assembly :)
[14:17:40] <MattyMatt> bugger experiments. if this machine works at all, I'll sell it and buy some steel
[14:20:15] <MattyMatt> I'm not doing any original work here, except this bloody awkward way to use slides. I can look up how efficient drive systems are.
[14:22:26] <MattyMatt> allthread 30%, acme up to 60%, ballscrew 90%, belt 95%. sorted
[14:24:34] <MattyMatt> when bronze is used for bearings, does that always refer to sintered/oillite?
[14:26:26] <archivist> no
[14:26:59] <cradek> bushings you buy at the hardware store are often the oil impregnated type - but if you get an acme nut or something, it never is
[14:27:37] <archivist> I have bought solid and made whatever is needed
[14:28:25] <MattyMatt> I was thinking of acme nuts right now :) also AndyPugh's gibbs he made looked like solid bronze too
[14:28:47] <cradek> I've never seen an oil-impreg acme nut
[14:29:02] <cradek> don't know why not...?
[14:29:22] <MattyMatt> I expect it would wear v quickly
[14:30:04] <skunkworks_> plus they are very brittle.
[14:30:07] <MattyMatt> tension in the threads
[14:30:08] <cradek> one year fenn showed us a homemade tap made out of some of the extra acme rod on a project. he used it to cut the matching nuts.
[14:32:38] <MattyMatt> neat
[14:35:13] <cradek> I don't remember if he was cutting bronze though. seems like maybe it was nylon/delrin. don't know if that would be easier or harder to tap.
[14:38:20] <cradek> is bronze gummy like copper?
[14:40:22] <MattyMatt> I'm gonna try nylon first then brass I think
[14:40:34] <skunkworks_> the oillite reminds me of machining soft castiron
[14:40:46] <cradek> delrin might be the best
[14:41:08] <cradek> especially if you make it long and thin, and split it, and spring it closed with a collar
[14:41:43] <cradek> http://dumpstercnc.com/acme_leadnuts.html
[14:42:09] <cradek> (or just buy these... jeff and I have both used them on desktop machines)
[15:19:00] <cradek> yay for ebay math: $160 drill chuck + $80 JT adapter + $20 retention knob = $17 plus $12 shipping
[15:19:26] <cradek> seems like nobody wants BT stuff, and yay for that
[15:19:37] <skunkworks_> heh
[15:19:48] <cradek> it's not rare or anything, but it's less commonly wanted - the right place to be
[15:19:55] <cradek> QC30 was a big pain that way
[15:20:49] <cradek> these consistently go super cheap. I will have enough drill chucks for once.
[15:20:56] <cradek> s/will//
[15:22:35] <skunkworks_> very nice
[15:22:54] <cradek> previous one was $13 + $11 shipping (smaller chuck)
[15:23:27] <cradek> I don't understand it - you could put the chucks on anything (jacobs ball bearing)
[15:46:03] <EbiDK|AWAY> http://thechive.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/funny-random-dust-18.jpg :D
[15:46:39] <skunkworks_> heh
[15:47:04] <skunkworks_> * skunkworks_ admits he likes the twilight series...
[15:47:11] <skunkworks_> There - I said it.
[15:47:14] <cradek> I don't get it
[15:47:48] <skunkworks_> the guy in the back ground is a vampire hunter from another movie series.
[15:48:01] <cradek> ah
[15:48:23] <skunkworks_> can't think of it.
[15:48:29] <cradek> so I would have had to watch TV some time in the last 10 years to get it
[15:48:38] <skunkworks_> yes
[15:49:15] <cradek> with the name "random-dust" I was looking for some hidden thing in the image noise
[15:49:58] <skunkworks_> heh - I was thinking the same thing until I saw the photo. maybe a picture of the virgin mary in someones dust bunnies
[15:50:13] <cradek> right
[15:50:27] <skunkworks_> must just be a state of mind.
[15:52:44] <skunkworks_> for some reason - I cannot get this song out of my head.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UX0p7uAW2s
[15:53:11] <SWPadnos> thanks for sharing
[15:54:03] <skunkworks_> Heh - I have found a great station for random music - minnisota public radio has a music station now called 'the current'.
[15:54:22] <skunkworks_> they play a little bit of everything
[15:55:02] <skunkworks_> that is why ^ song is stuck in my head.
[15:56:18] <tom3p> i finally realized it was tow people , a drum ( and an orchestra and a choir )
[16:03:22] <cradek> skunkworks_: I'm not having that same problem...
[16:04:05] <skunkworks_> that's ok - we know I am a little odd. 'THATS NOT MY NAME!'
[16:04:57] <cradek> she should learn to answer to anything - it's just easier, and she would be less bitter
[16:05:15] <cradek> that's what I do.
[16:05:38] <SWPadnos> but then the song would be "Hey You", which has already been done by Pink Floyd
[16:06:03] <Jymm> can you feel me...
[16:06:14] <SWPadnos> I could, but I don't really want to
[16:09:23] <Jymm> SWPadnos: the place you do hosting, is that a virtual server?
[16:09:37] <SWPadnos> um - I don't think it's a VM
[16:09:50] <SWPadnos> "shared hosting"
[16:09:57] <Jymm> SWPadnos: I mean is it your or their hardware
[16:10:01] <SWPadnos> theirs
[16:10:08] <SWPadnos> I don't have a colo budget
[16:10:29] <SWPadnos> (well, I do but it's the same as my hosting budget, namely $10/mo or less :) )
[16:11:34] <Jymm> SWPadnos: So not interested in a coop colo sorta thing?
[16:11:46] <Jymm> co-op
[16:11:58] <SWPadnos> could be, but I'm relatively cheap for that kind of stuff, at least until next year
[16:12:02] <skunkworks_> chicken coop hosting?
[16:12:22] <SWPadnos> I may start up another business venture, which might need more of a web presence, so colo might be good for that
[16:13:20] <Jymm> SWPadnos: I'm about to lose my colo next week or so, so looking for something else
[16:16:08] <SWPadnos> ah
[16:16:12] <SWPadnos> what's the cost?
[16:17:28] <Jymm> SWPadnos: Well, I've been sub-leasing. But he's downsizing his rackspace. I'm thinking it's like $200/mo for 7u/10A/2M
[16:17:45] <SWPadnos> hmmm. that'll have to wait
[16:20:17] <archivist> I have odd serving requirements, large site but low traffic
[16:21:03] <archivist> why I currently serve on adsl
[16:22:14] <SWPadnos> oh hey - 9.10 is out today
[16:22:40] <skunkworks_> carmic kuala?
[16:22:45] <skunkworks_> (sp)
[16:23:00] <mozmck_work1> yeah, I'm going to try and get emc2 running on it this weekend ;-)
[16:23:05] <SWPadnos> Karmic Koala (has to start with a K :) )
[16:23:43] <skunkworks_> is this going to be an lts release?
[16:23:54] <mozmck_work1> nah, not until next april
[16:24:07] <skunkworks_> ah - Ok - I remember reading about that on the list. duh
[16:24:20] <mozmck_work1> mozmck_work1 is now known as mozmck_work
[16:27:21] <mozmck_work> is there any advantage to using 64-bit linux for emc2 - or will it even work?
[16:27:44] <cradek> it will work, very little or no advantage
[16:27:51] <mozmck_work> ok
[16:28:14] <SWPadnos> unless you have a machine with >3GB (or 2GB or soemthing) of RAM
[16:28:26] <SWPadnos> I believe RTAI was patched so it no longer barfs on machines with >1GB
[16:28:41] <cradek> but for running emc2 there is no advantage to having that much ram
[16:28:46] <cradek> so that does not change the answer IMO
[16:29:00] <SWPadnos> unless you also want to run other things on that machine
[16:29:07] <SWPadnos> such as CAD in a VM or WINE environment
[16:29:11] <mozmck_work> my 9.04 machine at home has 2GB ram, and it does fine with RTAI, but it's running 32-bit
[17:08:22] <EbiDK|AWAY> http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2000/01/18/MN73840.DTL
[17:11:33] <Jymm> EbiDK|AWAY: Once you get past the bullsh!t factor, interesting concept.
[17:12:05] <EbiDK|AWAY> Yeah
[17:13:49] <Jymm> filed under: dumbasses
[17:14:37] <Jymm> you jut gotta love google bookmarks!!!
[17:15:11] <Jymm> If you haven't used them, you should check it out.
[17:15:22] <Jymm> No toolbar to install
[17:15:59] <archivist> seen many on irc :)
[17:16:22] <Jymm> archivist: seen what?
[17:16:35] <archivist> over confident
[17:16:49] <Jymm> ah
[17:18:15] <Jymm> Hey, isthere a place I can post an image and text?
[17:21:09] <skunkworks_> pimagebin ? - I am here all week...
[17:26:00] <Jymm> http://imagebin.ca/view/FZRc1X.html
[17:30:21] <micges> Jymm: you did picture?
[17:30:47] <Jymm> What?!
[17:30:52] <archivist> Ive seen the picture before
[17:31:06] <Jymm> was emailed to me
[17:31:21] <micges> Jymm: I was joking
[17:31:32] <Jymm> micges: I have no idea what you said.
[17:32:41] <Jymm> sorry
[17:33:14] <Jymm> I speak typo, haven't learned gibberish yet.
[17:53:53] <Jymm> But, if you listen to me every so often, you'll see me practicing my gibberish learning skills =)
[17:58:50] <Jymm> dont know if anyone cares, but on sale for $20 (I'm thinking of getting another one)
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?function=Search
[17:59:13] <Jymm> see harborfrieghtusa.com ads for the sale price
[17:59:21] <Jymm> which is the retail side
[18:00:58] <Jymm> page 15
[18:01:37] <SWPadnos> that displays no item
[18:02:30] <Jymm> try this (damn frames)
http://www.harborfreightusa.com/usa/tabviewer/startBrowseBook.do?bookid=260&preview=&type=RET&simple=
[18:02:35] <Jymm> then goto page 15
[18:03:32] <Jymm> 1st column, 4th iem down
[18:03:37] <Jymm> 1st column, 4th item down
[18:03:37] <SWPadnos> ok, I see a blood pressure monitor, a digital safe, and an LED worklight for $19.99 each
[18:03:42] <SWPadnos> knowing you, it's the LED worklight :)
[18:03:48] <SWPadnos> yep
[18:04:06] <Jymm> It uses NiMH not Ni-Cad, a great light
[18:04:32] <Jymm> Strong magnet too on the bottom
[18:05:00] <Jymm> Off/lo/hi, and charge LED changed from red to green wen complete.
[18:05:55] <Jymm> SWPadnos: Dude, did you see the other LED light I got? AWESOME!!!
[18:06:00] <SWPadnos> nope
[18:07:04] <Jymm> http://dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.4452
[18:07:18] <Jymm> With 2x AA brighter than shit!
[18:07:32] <SWPadnos> oh yeah, I remember that one now
[18:07:38] <Jymm> can use 1x 14500 if you want
[18:07:42] <SWPadnos> snit is not bright
[18:07:47] <SWPadnos> neither is shit
[18:08:05] <SWPadnos> I really wish the driod phone would work with GSM as well as CDMA
[18:08:11] <SWPadnos> bastards
[18:08:17] <Jymm> SWPadnos: Of course it is, it comes from a smart ass,
[18:08:24] <SWPadnos> heh
[18:08:47] <Jymm> You usually dont see cdma and gsm in the same device.
[18:09:01] <Jymm> I haven't at least. you have sprint?
[18:09:09] <Jymm> verizon?
[18:09:19] <tom3p> milk?
[18:09:30] <SWPadnos> it happens from time to time, there are world phones like that
[18:09:32] <SWPadnos> yes, Verizon
[18:10:34] <Jymm> Eh, untill they have an unlimited 3G, I'll stick with what I have.
[18:10:45] <SWPadnos> they do
[18:11:11] <Jymm> can you tether it?
[18:11:40] <SWPadnos> yes, but they (like everybody) charge you more and then limit you to 5GB/month when you do that
[18:11:53] <SWPadnos> unlimited on the phone, 5GB adn $30 more to tether
[18:11:58] <SWPadnos> s/adn/and/
[18:11:59] <Jymm> Eh, untill they have an unlimited 3G, I'll stick with what I have.
[18:12:03] <Jymm> =)
[18:12:10] <SWPadnos> just like ATT, tmobile, and Sprint
[18:12:30] <SWPadnos> though tethering through android should be a little easier than with certain other phone OSes :)
[18:14:13] <Jymm> it's far too easy to exceed 5gb, and the overages... oy vey
[18:14:43] <SWPadnos> gB
[18:15:02] <Jymm> implied
[18:15:13] <SWPadnos> I don't think I'd go over too often, it's the principle of charging more and providing less that annoys me
[18:15:24] <Jymm> you can stream music and go over
[18:15:56] <Jymm> watch a TV show while waiting at the airport, and you're screwed.
[18:16:41] <SWPadnos> not so much with a mobile phone, since the resolutions are generally quite low
[18:16:43] <Jymm> You saved $200 by taking the redeye, but have to pay $400 for watching the TV while waiting during the layover.
[18:16:54] <SWPadnos> but it's true, if you watch a lot of video, it's easier
[18:17:09] <SWPadnos> that's why I lug my 17" 1920x1200 laptop along ;)
[18:17:14] <SWPadnos> I should get more batteries
[18:17:30] <Jymm> you should.... oh nevermind.
[18:17:39] <SWPadnos> and a blu-ray drive
[18:17:51] <SWPadnos> but that would have to be Sony at the moment, so that's a no-go
[18:17:57] <Jymm> I'll stick with my netbook tyvm
[18:18:14] <SWPadnos> oh hey - Panasonic has one now
[18:20:33] <Jymm> toughbook?
[18:20:46] <SWPadnos> no, just the drive
[18:20:57] <SWPadnos> they apparently made a 7mm thick BD burner (!)
[18:21:15] <Jymm> I think panasonic has been OEMing things lately, but I'm not sure.
[19:42:40] <andypugh> Huzzah! I have a working smp kernel and can run versions 2.3.4 and 2.4-pre (with a bit of modprobe tomfoolery)
[19:44:05] <andypugh> The only downer is that I seem to have a python dependency problem. I can't run latency-test or load a machine config with a pyvcp add-in
[19:44:25] <andypugh> Does this mean anything to anyone?
[19:44:28] <andypugh> File "/home/andypugh/emc2-dev/lib/python/vcpparse.py", line 24, in <module>
[19:44:28] <andypugh> import xml.dom.ext
[19:44:28] <andypugh> ImportError: No module named ext
[19:44:48] <cradek> you just need to install some package or other...
[19:44:55] <cradek> :-*
[19:44:58] <cradek> oops
[19:45:00] <cradek> haha
[19:45:06] <cradek> I think it's python-xml??
[19:45:10] <andypugh> Yes. Not one called "ext" though
[19:45:21] <andypugh> Thanks, I will give it a try.
[19:45:31] <cradek> ii python-xml 0.8.4-1ubuntu3 XML tools for Python [dummy package]
[19:45:35] <cradek> yep that's it I think
[19:45:49] <andypugh> 'Tis odd that it was working before, perhaps it was uninstalled with the rest of emc?
[19:46:01] <cradek> doubt it
[19:46:09] <cradek> maybe you built your emcs with a different python version
[19:46:34] <andypugh> Possible. Probable even, if that is the sort of thing facilitated by incompetence.
[19:47:22] <archivist_attic> and shit happens
[19:48:01] <andypugh> Would I be right in assuming that this sort of thing was a total pain in the neck before apt-get was invented?
[19:48:28] <cradek> hell yes
[19:48:34] <andypugh> And as if by magic, it all works now :-)
[19:48:49] <cradek> in the early days, what you went through was the only way to use emc
[19:48:59] <mik_> hi
[19:49:03] <cradek> and none of the software was in such good shape (so easy to build) at the time
[19:49:06] <archivist_attic> and getting apt-gets database trashed is a.....
[19:49:07] <cradek> hi mik_
[19:49:36] <cradek> andypugh: it's not magic - we work pretty hard on those packages to make it easy for everyone.
[19:49:41] <SWPadnos> and there wasn't an IRC channel for help
[19:50:43] <mik_> i am new to emc and have a little beginner problem
[19:51:14] <mik_> just trying to dust of my g-code (saw that last time in school - 10 years ago...)
[19:51:31] <mik_> and having a little problem with tool compensation
[19:51:34] <andypugh> Ooh, don't get me wrong, I didn't mean to demean the behind-the scenes work. I have had enough of a taste for how difficult it is to get stuff working on one machine this last few days to realise that making a generic install must be a nightmare
[19:51:51] <mik_> does anyone have a link to a simple example with tool compensation?
[19:51:57] <cradek> andypugh: no, I didn't take it that way, sorry
[19:52:04] <andypugh> Tool diameter?
[19:52:13] <cradek> mik_: I like to always start here:
http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/html/gcode.html
[19:52:19] <andypugh> Or length?
[19:52:21] <cradek> yes are you talking about diameter or length?
[19:52:26] <mik_> tool diameter
[19:52:30] <mik_> (i think...)
[19:52:41] <cradek> please explain what you're trying to do
[19:52:43] <mik_> g40 vs g41/g42
[19:52:44] <archivist_attic> milling?
[19:52:53] <mik_> milling, 3 axis
[19:53:04] <cradek> ok
[19:53:07] <mik_> just trying to do a simple rectangle
[19:53:07] <andypugh> I have a bit of code to mill D-SUB holes with a tool diameter from the tool table if you want to look?
[19:53:12] <cradek> start at that link, click on G41/G42
[19:53:42] <cradek> then one more click to the detailed description, and you'll find some nice up-to-date docs
[19:54:46] <cradek> brb
[19:58:02] <andypugh> www.pastebin.ca/1648277
[19:58:31] <andypugh> Mills a useful cutout for extra parallel ports using diameter compensation
[19:59:49] <archivist_attic> back of my starturn needs a D type hole
[19:59:50] <andypugh> Looks like smi.ko has unloaded itself...
[20:00:17] <andypugh> Which size? I have 9, 15 and 25 available?
[20:00:31] <archivist_attic> 25
[20:00:43] <andypugh> There you are, that should do it.
[20:01:25] <andypugh> It's for front-entry, ie connector bolted to the outside not the inside. Probably wants squeezing in a touch for internal.
[20:02:15] <archivist_attic> Im on a winbox here, will look later
[20:03:46] <mik_> hmm, looks similar to my code
[20:03:49] <mik_> http://www.pastebin.ca/1648293
[20:04:37] <mik_> all i get is "cutter gouging with cutter radius comp"
[20:04:55] <archivist_attic> andypugh, and then there are those plastic IDC sockets, they are bigger
[20:05:28] <andypugh> You need a cutter radius < 3mm
[20:05:40] <andypugh> Sorry, diameter <3mm
[20:05:43] <andypugh> For that file
[20:06:06] <mik_> ok, and why?
[20:06:35] <andypugh> I meant for my file. It has radiuses < 3mm in the profile.
[20:06:44] <mik_> oh
[20:07:24] <andypugh> As a total guess I would say that the reason yours doesn't work is that you have corners of zero radius
[20:07:25] <mik_> just tought because my length for the square is 3mm...
[20:07:53] <mik_> yes, thats right
[20:08:25] <andypugh> So the cutter can't touch the profile with a tangent at all points without going outside the profile.
[20:08:43] <mik_> but if the toolpath is outside that shouldn't be a problem, or?
[20:09:10] <andypugh> Ah, outside? Hadn't spotted that
[20:09:29] <mik_> and i tried with g41 and g42...
[20:09:44] <andypugh> Entry move?
[20:10:35] <andypugh> Don't get the impression that I know what I am on about, I have only used it once.
[20:11:23] <mik_> if i read the docs right it should be enough with G00 X11 Y-24
[20:12:34] <archivist_attic> you may need to move the compensation on (after 7 ?)and off lines
[20:13:30] <SWPadnos> where does the cutter start?
[20:13:34] <archivist_attic> dunno Ive only used it on a lathe
[20:13:43] <SWPadnos> the first XY move you have is after turning on cutter comp
[20:15:22] <mik_> cutter starts from 0,0 but i didn't specify that in the file
[20:15:27] <SWPadnos> also, the entry move (it looks like line 7 is meant to be an entry move) doesn't need to move to the compensated position - the compensation code will do that for you
[20:16:17] <SWPadnos> so lines 7 and 9 then form an inside corner, which may give you the gouging message
[20:16:21] <andypugh> would you expect sudo modprobe rtai_smi to find and insert the module, if the module exists?
[20:16:30] <SWPadnos> yes
[20:16:32] <mik_> yes, line 7 is meant to be the entrymove,
[20:17:40] <SWPadnos> try making that go to X14 Y-24 instead
[20:17:52] <SWPadnos> like line 9 (maybe just remove line 7)
[20:17:58] <andypugh> So presumably it wasn't built when I compiled rtai?
[20:18:04] <SWPadnos> no idea
[20:20:43] <archivist_attic> could the gouging error message be improved to include the lines it was working on
[20:21:13] <SWPadnos> I thought it had been. mik_ = what version of EMC2 are you using?
[20:22:51] <cradek> I was just going to ask that
[20:23:04] <cradek> you are using version 2.2. You should update to 2.3.4.
[20:25:34] <cradek> http://timeguy.com/cradek-files/emc/mik.png
[20:25:50] <cradek> I had to move the G41 down a line, but other than that it works fine
[20:26:21] <cradek> if you want to fully cut around all four corners, you need an appropriate fifth move
[20:29:35] <mik_> 2.2.8
[20:29:48] <mik_> seems like the sources.list is an old one
[20:30:12] <archivist_attic> see updating notes on the wiki
[20:30:33] <cradek> between 2.2 and 2.3 cutter radius compensation was totally rewritten. don't waste time learning how to use the old version - it was restrictive and buggy
[20:32:07] <cradek> to help convince you of that, using your original program see how much better the error message is -- it tells you what is wrong:
http://timeguy.com/cradek-files/emc/mik-error.png
[20:33:19] <archivist_attic> would be nice if we could copy paste error messages so screen grabs are not needed
[20:33:37] <cradek> they go to stdout
[20:33:55] <cradek> emc/task/emctask.cc 321: interp_error: Length of cutter compensation entry move is not greater than the tool radius
[20:43:33] <mik_> updating...
[21:03:08] <andypugh> Having got rtai_smi.ko to load my latency is now 2092 with fullscreen glxgears. That's good enough for me.
[21:04:40] <SWPadnos> let it run overnight
[21:05:09] <SWPadnos> and maybe make a script that repeatedly does disk and network access
[21:17:52] <mik_> jippi!
[21:18:20] <mik_> it works! now with 2.3.4 and a little bit code tweaking (but that was with the old 2.2...)
[21:18:54] <mik_> http://www.pastebin.ca/1648396
[21:19:41] <mik_> thanks for helping out
[21:19:53] <mik_> so tomorrow i can cut the first pieces :)
[21:41:13] <Jymm> Heh, just received my free hand-vac... works pretty good actually.
[21:51:26] <MrSunshine> yey my cnc stuff was sent to me today! =)
[21:51:32] <MrSunshine> arives tomorrow or on monday :)
[21:51:44] <frallzor> yaay
[21:51:52] <MrSunshine> haha :P
[21:51:58] <MrSunshine> din lilla lurifax =)
[21:52:20] <frallzor> * frallzor wants his bent sheetmetal
[21:56:44] <Jymm> This was a freebie, so eh.
[22:08:37] <andypugh> Is this advice still good?
http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?FixingSMIIssues
[22:09:18] <andypugh> I can fix the occasional jump from 2000nS to 350,000nS latency by installing SMI
[22:09:52] <frallzor> so can anyone recommend a nice servodrivekit? that doesnt cost an arm and a leg
[22:09:57] <frallzor> 4-axis
[22:10:12] <archivist> arm and six legs
[22:10:36] <andypugh> editing /etc/emc2/rtapi.conf worked before, but not now. In fact nothing changes which rtai_*.ko modules are loaded, even renaming /etc/emc2/rtapi.conf
[22:11:21] <andypugh> frallzor: How much do your legs cost?
http://www.dmm-tech.com/Pricing.html is the cheapest I have seen for actual servos
[22:11:23] <frallzor> http://www.granitedevices.fi/ these guys seems to make good shit, but good?
[22:11:30] <archivist> is it looking somewhere alse
[22:12:43] <andypugh> That was my question. There are other versions in emc2-dev/rtai/scripts and ~rtai/scripts/rtapi.conf
[22:12:53] <andypugh> And editing them has no effect either...
[22:13:49] <andypugh> Next question is where I can refer to a .ko for boot-time insertion
[22:14:07] <andypugh> I think I am always going to want it.
[22:14:44] <frallzor> andypugh that kit you linked, will it work with emc? since it only mentions bob with mach3 =)
[22:14:59] <andypugh> No idea :-)
[22:16:32] <andypugh> Looks like it should, it takes pulse/direction or analogue inputs
[22:17:24] <andypugh> It needs something that understands .exe files for tuning though. That is probably more of an issue in step/direction mode than analogue mode
[22:21:54] <frallzor> bah
[22:25:12] <andypugh> Possibly not the end of the world, I am guessing you could do it in an emulator.
[22:25:59] <Neo_The_User> andypugh, for your SMI question, you can do that guide or do it via the BIOS
[22:26:21] <andypugh> That guide isn't working any more.
[22:26:54] <Neo_The_User> after I get my computer all working, i'll update that guide for you and put it on my site when i have time
[22:27:12] <andypugh> I can manually insert the modules and all is well, but the .conf files seem to be ignored by both emc versions. (one installed, one run-in-place)
[22:28:03] <andypugh> Actually, that page probably needs to be changed anyway, as it makes things look a lot more complicated than they are
[22:28:54] <andypugh> The bulk of the information is only relevant to dapper
[22:30:43] <Neo_The_User> OK now I'll start working on a new way to get SMI off for you ;)
[22:32:19] <Neo_The_User> ...switching to linux again.. brb
[22:32:48] <andypugh> I have rtai_smi.ko which is a perfectly good solution. I am just already bored of manually insmodding it
[22:36:32] <andypugh> I have rtai_smi.ko which is a perfectly good solution. I am just already bored of manually insmodding it
[22:37:08] <andypugh> it seems I will have to manually inset parport whenever I want to use 2.4-pre too
[22:37:38] <andypugh> (Though I am tempted to just install 2.4 and ignore the run-in-place idea)
[22:37:47] <Neo_The_User> andypugh, what do you mean that guide doesn't work? I see those files in the rtai folder
[22:38:01] <Neo_The_User> rtai-3.7.1/base/arch/i386/calibration/smi_module.c is there
[22:38:05] <andypugh> Yes, I have the files.
[22:38:13] <andypugh> No need for the source
[22:39:09] <andypugh> the issue is that editing /etc/emc2/rtapi.conf does not result in rtapi_smi being loaded along with the other rtai modules when you run emc
[22:39:48] <andypugh> In fact, deleting the rtapi.conf file has no effect either.
[22:40:22] <Neo_The_User> oh
[22:40:33] <andypugh> It seems that neither 2.3.4 or 2.4 actually look at that .conf file, or any other.
[22:40:46] <Neo_The_User> its not that
[22:41:15] <Neo_The_User> when you add rtapi_smi into that file, several other things break. me and my dad expermineted and cant figure it out
[22:41:39] <Neo_The_User> we had the same problem. thanks for reminding me :)
[22:42:26] <andypugh> I found in the past that it only works if your rtai is in a folder named rtai-<kernel name>
[22:42:46] <Neo_The_User> is it set like that now?
[22:42:51] <andypugh> And I failed to persuade rtai to compile into the right-named folder
[22:43:37] <Neo_The_User> well if you can get it working with insmod, why not make it load at boot?
[22:43:49] <Neo_The_User> its in /etc/modprobe.d/modprobe.conf IIRC
[22:44:32] <andypugh> I have 2 rtai folders, one called "realtime" compiled last night and one called "realtime-2.6.24-16-rtaismp" which I have just moved to my root folder to see if anything misses it.
[22:45:09] <andypugh> That was the sort of thing I was looking for, let me look.
[22:47:21] <andypugh> no modprobe.conf, but I do have a file called emc2
[22:48:37] <Neo_The_User> might be /etc/modprobe.conf
[22:48:49] <Neo_The_User> since its a really ancient distro
[22:50:49] <andypugh> It seems like I could just add things to etc/modules
[22:51:13] <Neo_The_User> ...no
[22:52:07] <andypugh> "This file contains the names of kernel modules that should be loaded at boot time, one per line"
[22:52:24] <andypugh> Current entries are "fuse" and "lp"
[22:52:37] <Neo_The_User> /etc/modules is a file? not a folder??
[22:52:42] <andypugh> Yes
[22:52:56] <Neo_The_User> wow thats... messed up.. but yeah.. i guess so
[22:54:41] <Neo_The_User> I tend to use old-fashioned linux distros like slackware and archlinux which use the original directories for everything. ubuntu moves things around puts things in goofy spots so I'm not the one to ask when it comes to finding things in ubuntu :P
[22:57:25] <andypugh> It looks like it might not work...
[22:59:09] <Neo_The_User> try it and see. with ubuntu, you never know
[22:59:39] <archivist> its based on debian where the rea; blame for moving stuff lies
[23:00:35] <andypugh> A friend of mine owns the domain "debiantarts"
[23:01:59] <andypugh> Sorry, debiantart. Nothing there, just a pun on deviantart
[23:03:20] <andypugh> Anyway, no.
[23:03:41] <Neo_The_User> doesn't work?
[23:04:30] <andypugh> No, no sign of it in lsmod anyway
[23:04:55] <Neo_The_User> you could do some kernel hacking, put the smi in the kernel source, compile it INTO (Y) the kernel and.... see if that works
[23:05:02] <Neo_The_User> *smi module
[23:05:18] <andypugh> I guess so,,
[23:06:19] <Neo_The_User> the problem is that I don't know much about the correct syntax for the kernel kconfig file in arch/x86 so... i personally wouldn't be able to
[23:07:16] <andypugh> I think I might have found a clue...
[23:07:24] <andypugh> http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-1038478.html
[23:26:53] <andypugh> Is there a simple way to see if one of the rtapi.conf files is being used? For example using a line that says "echo yes I got here" or something?
[23:27:39] <andypugh> I dont recognise the file syntax, it uses "if" - "fi" for example.
[23:33:21] <Neo_The_User> what do you mean?
[23:34:27] <andypugh> rtapi.conf looks like a script
[23:34:28] <Neo_The_User> its not that its not being used. everything just breaks when you put in rtai_smi or whatever the module is caled
[23:34:40] <andypugh> It used to work
[23:35:15] <andypugh> But that was when all the kerneldir and modpath lines matched the actual paths
[23:35:33] <Neo_The_User> run depmod -ae while rtai_smi is set
[23:35:40] <Neo_The_User> after rebooting
[23:35:50] <Neo_The_User> sudo depmod -ae
[23:36:14] <andypugh> I have just found a file rtapi.conf-dpkg-dist...
[23:36:45] <andypugh> as in just insert it and run that command, or do I need to edit config files too?
[23:37:27] <Neo_The_User> just edit rtai.conf and add in rtai_smi and reboot and run sudo depmod -ae
[23:37:37] <Neo_The_User> inserting it just like that wont you or me anything
[23:37:44] <Neo_The_User> ^tell
[23:39:13] <andypugh> The question is how much I edit rtai.conf
[23:39:23] <andypugh> most of the paths are totally wrong
[23:39:49] <Neo_The_User> that might be the problem'
[23:41:38] <andypugh> But even with that file deleted, EMC still loads the modules
[23:42:15] <Neo_The_User> then i have no clue
[23:42:56] <andypugh> That was why I wanted to put a trace in the script, so that I could tell which one EMC was calling.
[23:50:07] <tom3p> maybe: if paths are wrong , and module loads with the script deleted, it isnt loading the file you think its loading from where you think it is
[23:50:30] <andypugh> I am pretty sure that is indeed the case
[23:50:49] <andypugh> The question is, which file is it using?
