huh, not even raining
is it suppost to be raining?
shouldn't ethernet switches be incredibly cheap?
Hi guys - does anyone know how to change the Axis toolpath display so it displays properly for a rear tool post lathe (slant back) ??? Hooked up EMC2 to my lathe tonight and the feed axes are working great!
I thought there was an option to flip the display, but I don't see it
cradek: turn yor monitor around
MarkusBec_away is now known as MarkusBec
Good morning everybody
Hmm, heads up for anyone pondering buying from spreadshirt.net: 20% off all long-sleeved shirts from 28th September – 11th October 2009, coupon code: "Autumn2009".
steve b seems to be a hard critic of mach also.
so - does anyone know of a source for stock carbon filled ptfe (teflon) piston rings?
still mucking with your piston rings?
wait - did I ask this alread?
I know you can get glass filled ptfe but it is stupidly expensive
you were talking about it
i forget the specifics though
what were you trying to do again?
[14:04:32] <skunkworks> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DIY-CNC/message/25322
it is an r&d project that requires a try piston.
you could try straight graphite rings
they use them in some jet engines
they are a bitch to put on though apparently
still need a source.. everyone wants to make a 10000 run. :)
graphite you can carve up your self
hoping for a company that has some in stock
its basically compressed filth though
yah - I took one of my little cheap air compressors apart (oilless) and it has a carbon filled teflon ring in it. kinda cool.
sure its carbon filled, not just carbon encrusted ;->
it is carbon something.. ;)
it is flexable and dirty. ;)
how long does it have to run?
well - I kinda want to see how long it will run.. longer the better.
I have no clue how long the cheap oilless compressors are supposed to last.
about 5 minutes?
can you say what the application is?
sounds like a dive compressor
although they need mega high pressure
no - I don't want to kill anyone.
a guy here at work wanted to build a dive tank compressor... I think he gave up after finding out what was involved.
theres 2 ways you can do it
with a really good pump
or a non insane pump and a good filter
option B is usually cheaper ;->
but then buying air is pretty cheap anyway really
spend more on beer ;->
yeah so your little problem
how much pressure are you pushing?
100psi - but around 500deg. It is for a drying application here.
500deg C or F?
carbon filled teflon seems to have a working temp of 500deg F
or so I hear
ptfe has temperature limits iirc
feels pretty high to me
260C is about where it starts to burn off the pan in non stick cookware
just going by info I have found on the web.
i was going from memory and gut geel
[14:30:14] <skunkworks> http://thirumalaipolyurethane.in/F6269/p_t_f_e_teflon_items.html
at that temp i reckon you would start to see a fair bit of creep
although if you can get plain o-rings it might be worth a shot
you can get non carbon teflon rings for a few cents
I would be looking at carbon though
what be happening pjm?
nod a lot here, just winding down for the weekend!
ready to play Mesa cards!
heh fun fun fun ey
I must say it was all rather plug and play for me
and thanks for that tip on the mesa i/o cards too
I'll probably grab one of those
Valen: do you know of any sources?
for straight graphite or ptfe rings?
there was one
people use it to make rockets out of
there are a few different grades too
[14:36:50] <Valen> http://www.aeroconsystems.com/graphite/index.htm
only thing you will need to watch for is its stupidly brittle so it'll be hard to make it expand like normal piston rings
I'd think about putting a few carbon rings in as just a press fit
>>>does anyone know how to change the Axis toolpath display so it displays properly for a rear tool post lathe (slant back) ???
Well I'd rather not rotate the screen :-) Or hang up side down. If there is a settingfor this would it be in the integrators manual - if it is possible? Or is there a lot you can do that is not in the integrators manual?
Skunkworks - where are you located - US?
I might know of a source for those rings and if they don't have them they probably know who does...
I am near lacrosse wi
OK, I forgot that was you... in WI.
I automated their last "lathe" for them - I know they make some very specialized teflon seals and if you tell them what you need - if they can't make it or have it in stock they probably know who does.
A lot of their work is for gov contracts for jet engines, and a lot of stuff that they have no idea where the seals go and they can't be told etc. Some of the seals they make are very high value.
But they are like a big mom and pop shop - very friendly folks. I think they are looking for work as some of their bigger customers have slowed down a lot. They sure know a lot about seals of all types.
cool - thanks
Anytime - if you want tell them that "Dave" the guy that did the last lathe upgrade gave you their name...
not a whole lot of 5.08mm-pitch screw terminals fit on a 80x100mm circuitboard
[Jymm(e)] Found a cheap prepad plan... $150 for 75 minutes good for 30 days
Valen so u are gonna build one of they opto cards for the mesa?
Hello, does anybody know how I can automatically estop my machine if the axis gui is inadvertently closed ?
you use a charge pump or watchdog to accomplish that
cradek: The GUI monitors the chargepump?
can I code it into axis ?
shortly after the DISPLAY program exits, emc2 shuts down. Do you mean you need it to enter estop during that time between the GUI exit and the emc script exit, or do you mean that after emc script exit your machine is not in an estopped state?
this is not a GUI issue
I mean that I want the gui to issue an estop if the axis gui is closed, but the machine is not estopped
cradek: I know, but I'm asking if AXIS freezes or crashes, would that trigger an estop?
well, I had a problem with a fuse blowing, the machine stopped from the stg watchdog, because I have it wired to stop the amps, but estop is still enabled
and the fuse was for the amps, but not the computer
then you need to improve your real physical estop chain
you should make the stg watchdog estop the machine
then the user (not me) closed the gui and the estop was still off
that would fix all these problems and many more potential problems
maximilian_h: Does your physical estop chain send a signal to EMC?
I know, than I will make a new pcb shortly
but until then I wanted to know if i can at least make a gui shutdown issue an estop to the machine
yes, my physical estop gets written to EstopSense and the gui sees the estop
sure, a gui shutdown causes a hal shutdown, which causes the charge pump to stop, which causes estop
I don't see how you could add something to the gui that would be better than this
@cradek: By charge pump you are refering to what ?
I think both SWPadnos and jmkasunich have both had the issue where GUI crashed, but the machien kept running to the end.
charge pump = watchdog
sorry I should say watchdog because that's what stg calls it
just a sec
ok i am back
does axis issue an estop when it gets closed by the big X in the upper right corner ?
No. It exits.
AXIS is not necessarily the only UI
can I change that for me ? Because for me axis is the only gui
jepler: Can it be configured to?
when the [DISPLAY]DISPLAY program exits, emc shuts down.
Jymm: no, that's not currently an option
when emc shuts down, the realtime threads stop running
IF YOUR MACHINE IS NOT SAFE WHEN THE REALTIME THREADS ARE NOT RUNNING, IT IS NOT A SAFE MACHINE
in the "axis (or all of linux userspace) crashes" case, that's what the physical estop button is for
jepler: Is there a way to hook AXIS into HAL, so if ais stops responding a trigger of some sort is sent?
Jymm: no, that's not currently an option
jepler: Is there a way for HAL to monitor AXIS? I'm not trying to be difficult here, just looking for Q&D alternatives.
Jymm: that way lies madness
maximilian_h: you are of course free to make any change to EMC2 that you like.
jepler: Since when does software ever implied sanity =)
Good morning. i have a intel chipset mother board and some times exceted realtime deley.i use ubunthu 8.04 version.how possible disable rtai_smi.ko?
I just tried to add a halcmd to the cleanup function in /usr/bin/emc
but somehow it has no effect ?
jepler: Hmmm, do you think that it might be possible for AXIS to output a "hartbeat" of sorts without effecting it's performance/functionality?
Jymm: what would that "heartbeat" mean? It wouldn't mean, for instance, that some other application has captured X key events
it wouldn't mean, for instance, that the X server is failing to repaint the screen
hm, it would probably mean that the thread with axis is dead or stuck
or the window is covered up so if you hit escape, some other application sees it
it wouldn't mean, for instance, that no other application has used /dev/input to exclusively claim the mouse, preventing the user from clicking on the so-called estop button
it wouldn't add any safety IMO
hm, watchdog but for the ui
jepler: Maybe it outputs a (I can't recall the scheme atm) bitstream and that be watched.
Jymm: talking about implementation is silly if we don't agree on what problem we're trying to solve
motioncontrol: to the best of my knowledge, rtai_smi.ko is NOT used by default. This page describes how to enable it: http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?FixingSMIIssues
jepler: What's that encoding where only a singl bit at a time changes.
if you enabled it yourself in the past, then presuambly undoing the step you took to enable it will disable it
The problem I perceived is that I cannot detect a close down of the gui
you can, because after you close the gui, hal exits
and that causes watchdogs to bite
and proper wiring will cause something in the estop chain to no longer pull in when the watchdog bites
even if you manage to set some state of outputs right after the gui closes, that state will be lost as soon as hal exits and the watchdogs bite
cradek: I think jymm wants it to stop the motion in case the ui dies without exiting
because that's he's only estop am I right?
anonimasu: it's not clear what "the ui dies" means
nonrealtime programs can and do stop responding to user input for a while sometimes
axis exits without being closed properly by the user
anonimasu: if it exits, hal exits, and then a properly configured machine estops
but if it's not a clean exit?
I don't know what that means
jepler, on my pc when i run latency test some time have the latency at 230000 micro sencond, for only one, in the next line test is normal about 9800 microsecond.Is possible the problem is SMI?
motioncontrol: might be, might be some other cause.
methinks, I better change my pcb this weekend and be done with the gui close problem
ooh lunctime here
jepler, is possible the video card on board?
cradek: a "non clean exit" where the command is not sent to hal to shut down.
@motioncontrol: The System Management Mode might hit you, but it depends on the firmware/bios
or you might have a bad driver somewhere
you might want to investigate with objdump --disassemble driver.ko | grep cli
maximilian_h, i have read the info of alex foe disable and enable the smi on hardy version:I used this to disable SMI:
sudo insmod /usr/realtime-2.6.24-16-rtai/modules/rtai_smi.ko
sudo rmmod rtai_smi
and later to re-enable:
sudo insmod /usr/realtime-2.6.24-16-rtai/modules/rtai_smi.ko smiReset=1
sudo rmmod rtai_smi
.it is ok?
It might help. I once had a mainboard that could not disable smi
then you can just exchange the mb
jepler: Ah, 'gray code' is what I was thinking.
maximilian_h, have some help for a good motherboard?
No sorry, I got my ones from ebay
I am looking for a known good one too :)
the problem is that you never know what is running in the system management mode
e.g. I got an old QDI mb that stays in smm for 250ms if you connect anything to the usb ports ;)
that one is totally unuseable for any real time job
Can somebody recommend a mainboard with low latencies that is not too expensive and that is still sold ?
maximilian_h, i thing the asus motherboard with nvia chipset?
maximilian_h, you have some idea for motherboard with 300 us dollar proce?
nvidia has issues with their drivers
but then you can always use vesa xorg drivers
but no, i don't have any good recommendation for a mb that you can still buy
because I haven't bought a new mb myself yet for emc2 use
maximilian_h, ok i buy a nvia mother board and use vesa driver for grafics card. i thing it good for low latency test
maximilian_h: I *think* tis is the one that some on here have and gets good latency under EMC... http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813121359
maximilian_h: Check with SWPadnos or jmkasunich to confirm the correct model#
it has sub 20us latency (barely) but seens to work well. Not stellar.
ah, SWPadnos lied to me!
using the stock livecd
others I think have gotten better using smp
Ah, that's right, it is a dual core atom.
I wonder if that would perform better than a celeron
(for general usenot emc specific)
I have a few running xp - they seem to work great.
I think I have said before - running one as a media pc.
skunkworks: you runing any heavy video streams?
mostly playing dvds and mpeg
:) don't really know
Hmmm, no firewire, damn.
nope or dvi
Eh, DVI I don't care abut as much right now - I can always add a video card.
s-video works well for standard def.
hey Jymm, thanks for the link
i was away at the machine 'investigating' my watchdog
skunkworks: Nice to hear, that's actually why I like that specific model.
anybody still using an old stg1 with the watchdog out there ?
Jymm: with the old tv - I could not read even large font (xp) thru the s-video - but easy to read on the highdef (thru s-video)
(but now it is hooked thru vga - 1280X1024.
skunkworks: Ah. I have a MacMini that I'm planning to replace the existing TVPC, but I need to hi thte Apple store and grab a DVI2S-Video adapter to test it out first. Then I'm thinking BT kybd/mouse, but haven't found an intergrated one yet
[17:42:07] <skunkworks> http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm/keyboards/keyboard/devices/4429&&cl=us,en
[17:42:52] <skunkworks> http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm/gaming/playstation_3/keyboards/devices/3616&cl=us,en
Skullworks: Not "desktop" sized, but more coffeetable sized
Skullworks: I have this now... http://www.bengt-martensson.de/dbox2/DBox2Tastatur.jpg
Get something with an onboard nvidia 9300 or better
you can use it to play blueray with hardware acceleration
direct through mythtv
also SMP gave me much much better latency numbers than without
with SMP i am running a hardware accelerated nvidia card and hitting ~3000 latency
oh pjm: i'm probably just going to by the opto from mesa
ah thats what I did
dual Xeon 3.06
its in the wiki
anyway 4:00 am here
what kind of accelerations do you guys use?
I got my machine pushin half a G right now
thats just crazy talk
and your point is?
I have a perplexing tshooting situation concerning hall effect switches. They should want 12v, rite? do they fail short?