that's big, but it's the kind of thing I'm talking about
How big would I need?
depends on the power you want to interrupt
if you plan on running 10HP of total motor load, you should get one that can handle 10HP
there are a dozen kinds of ratings, and I'm not an expert on all of them - read up on it a bit :)
I will do. thanks for the advice.
incidentally, there are two major types of contactor, IEC and NEMA. IEC is probably more common over there
Found a 4 pole 230v 3KW contactor
Guess what I think I have one that I got with a job lot of odds and end though not sure of the quality of it. I wondered what it was. I thought it was a relay of some kind but now I know. :-)
"If the bar for the contacts doesn't look like a 4 foot crowbar... it aint big enogh!" =)
Gawd I *LOVE* these cutters =)
they don't make these anymore, let me see if I can find a pic...
Well, these are what they sell now... http://www.wolfcraft.com/images/photographs/4197-NewEasyCut-InUse-WickerBasket.jpg
I like mine better.
They use a standard drywall blade
or box knife blade
great for cutting tubing or small parts
no vias yet.
wow - I see one crossed trace.
I bought one of these, and the loop is a bit flimsy. So, I thought Hey let me toss on some heat shrink tubing to re-enforce the loop. The few seconds that I had the heat gun on it the fucking loop melted and also most of the opening to insert the micro SD card!
[01:40:55] <JymmmEMC> http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.11294
I have more on the way though.
think it would be easy to make a tool touch off?
like a digital probe?
more like sumthing that measures tool sizes...
[01:57:56] <JymmmEMC> http://www.brusselsprout.org/CNC/1P-Probe/
ah, heres's the one I was looking for... http://www.indoor.flyer.co.uk/probe.htm
did you get anywhere with the kins today?
sorry for the delay - not with the kins - I worked on the white board to try to define exactly what I need to do
I have make a tremendous amount of positive progress in the last few days with the kins - I hope this is the last little hitch
I have an idea - I will work on it in the morning and see what happens - anything I get I will let you know
I am pretty sure I can get it to work
the rest of the kins is working very good - the machine is looking soooooo good - I was hoping to get the adjustments all done today - ah well - I will get it tomorrow - thanks
I am thinking about trying to assemble a matrix using variables. I have worked with matrices before. This seems to be an appropriate problem looking for that type of solution.
sometimes I get solution before the problem and never find a problem to apply it to. :)
hm, I've done that too.
we are just too smart for our own good :)
a set of matrices would be pretty universal (if I can qualify universality)
remember the kins have to be predictable and fast - might be best to avoid an iterative thing like newton-raphson if you want to run a fast servo cycle
for my machine using the SCR amps at approx 60 hz the speed is not too important
uh, wrong names
I mean the matrix reduction for solving a system of equations - whatever you call it
did you hook your tachometers back up? :-)
I did not recognize them anyway - my education is not formal - OJT as needed
yes the tach is hooked up
steve convinced me that project was doomed to failure from the concept
if I matched the tach to the ref then the amp would never put any power out
hey, it's not my fault!
oh, maybe it is ;)
yeah you should have jumpered the tach input (to ground), not hooked it up the other input
SWPadnos: right, gaussian
* SWPadnos looked it up
the object was to remove the amps' tuning
I will continue to try - unless I can install a dumb amp (or a dumbed down amp)
if these were torque mode amps, then jumpering the feedback to ground should make the current output proportional to the command input
but I'm not so sure with velocity-mode
I ran one of mine that way for a while - performance was bad
I got very good tuning once I got the amps in shape - you seem to think velocity mode is a curse - I think it's a good thing
no, I think it's great
sorry, you = stustev1
but I think it also makes it harder to trick the amp into being stupid
bad velocity amps are a curse :)
ha that's true.
but it was only one resistor...
(that's what eventually fixed mine)
although I suppose the part that fixes it is always the last one you replace
I get a lot of jitter - they had jitter before the MDSI control and with the MDSI control and now with EMC2 - sometimes the buzzing is very loud
I am sure they could be a lot better if I had the schematics or tuning instructions
there are a lot cards in slots and a lot of pots on the cards
I am sure the years (more than 25) have taken a toll on the adjustment
(I had a schematic)
one card has 12 pots (I think)
if they are oscillating, I bet unhooking and grounding the tach input will make them stable - but whether you can tune the external (emc) loop is another question
I will try that tomorrow (maybe - if I get the kins to working) - not if, when
you might get (something like) proportional torque/current, or you might get saturation
darn, I should go to bed
I always forget to do that
It would be good if we never needed sleep
we'd just whine about something else then, like going to the bathroom
good night gentlemen - see you tomorrow
hello, i have some parallel data to transmit about 4 meters, know of any commercial units for db37 cables?
oops, 25 pin ( easier :)
Just this once .. here's the log: http://www.linuxcnc.org/irc/irc.freenode.net:6667/emc/2008-11-21.txt
i think i'll make the parallel data 'repeater' with 2981's or 2903's, no commercial units will allow the pinout i have :(
see you later guys
tomp: if the pinout doesn't work out, why not make an adapter?
need clean signals over long distance, any extra connection is a place for noise to enter.
imo, any plug connector is really a single point, and a problem in noisy envirnmemt
i do 'edm' the noisiest environment ;)
any luck with the kins?
alex_joni: not done yet - just getting started this morning - I have a better understanding of what I need to do
stustev: that's always best :)
a god night sleeps is worth soemtimes more than 3 days staring at the same things
yes - very much so
or a week or year off something
many time I have the problem of trying to run ahead of the solution
well.. a year is probably way worse.. as you forget all the details
then not bogged down by said details on restart
how do I get the g43 tool length into the kins? - I need to use that do calculate the t value in the inverse Zcomp function
I think :)
I should be able to use joint in this
is there a site to see where an ip is located?
yes, but inaccurate
heh - I just one close.
someone got into the wifes yahoo email. They sent 1 email spam too all her people in her address book.
but didn't change her account password
looks like it was from china
we where able to get right in and change her password no issues. odd.
a lot of spoofing goes on
I thought someone had spoofed it - but the sent email was in her yahoo account. :)
are you sure that was the route, did they get in your box
no computers where on this morning when it was sent
to get password.... etc
I guess it depends on where they can extract it from. This computer was on - but It wasn't logged into her email account.
and was it via yahoo at all, did they get addresses from a cc header
the email had all her contacts from her address book. she never sends out emails to everyone like that.
the header on the email in her sent folder was 'from [184.108.40.206] by web30301.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 04:46:32 PST '
the searching I did - the ip adress is from china
yahoo needs to know of the compromised security
I can see maybe why they didn't change the password.. yahoo makes you sign in twice.
ive never got on with yahoo
in yahoo - when you go to change your account settings - it makes you log in again. If they where brute force hacking the passwords.. They may not have known what it was to re-enter it. (just a thought)
My yahoo acnt got hacked once, just change your password and move on
yes - we did. A bit unnerving though
was for me too, but got over it.
dont mean to be insensative, but kinda a sore point with yahoo as they really didn't care (I called them), well they did but they serve *SO* many ppl
jymm: did you ever see where it originated?
nah, I have paid service with yahoo so I have a 2nd level key to get into my account
I think alex_joni's yahoo email also got hacked.. Although I don't thin he recovered.
I think the exploit is via other services, like IM and such, not directly email, then copying the credienital
hmm - wife doesn't do that though.. (not that I know anyways. ;))
Just change your password on a regualr basis and make it a strong one
yah. will do
at least 12 characters and include puncuation mixed case and numeroic
skunkworks: well, you know now... better look out for strangers when you arrive/leave home :-p
did he really put the screenshot up at 2:15 in the morning?
2:15 thats early
wouldn't 14:15 UTC be 8:15 CT and 9:15 ET?
something like that
Ah the good old days. When I first started goofing around with emc2 - you had to build it on the bdi
well, you didn't HAVE to
it was just a lot easier
because the realtime kernel was already there
right, BDI had the RT kernel and the compilers and stuff
it was actually easier to compile EMC on BDI, because the dev tools were there from the start
the downside was that it wasn't a liveCD (except for a short period when it was Morphix based)
yah - I don't remember it being too long before there was a ubuntu script
oh, it's easy on Ubuntu, don't get me wrong ;)
I think that Morphix was the first one I booted, and when I was satisfied that emc would do what I wanted, I built rtlinux on redhat 9 to modify and use emc
cradek: yeah, but you're hardcore
I used to build kernels often. then I stopped using Gentoo
I think I avoided bdi because I never wanted to use kde
(not that there's anything wrong with that)
thank you, Seinfeld ;)
I bet windowmaker is still good. I stopped using it when firefox would fight with it (not sure whose bug it was)
open/close windows, drag them around, dock them ...
it was pretty impressive
I also like NextStep (and I'm bummed because I'm pretty sure my copy of NextStep 3.x won't run on any modern hardware)
collect old hardware :)
maybe in qemu/virtualbox/vmware. (or is that one of the non-x86 ones?)
done that ;)
particularly qemu can still run as an isa machine
no, I have the Intel version - never did manage to get that Alpha workstation
yeah I have to run freedos that way (isa)
alpha? I thought they were 68k
* archivist admits to an Alpha with debian on it
this NextStep supports at least PCI and maybe even AGP
the next machines were, but the OS ran on PA-Risc, PPC, Intel, and 68k
so I guess my lack of an alpha workstation is irrelevant ;)
SWPadnos: huh I didn't know there were so many supported arches
they even had "Fat binaries", which contained the code for any subset of arches, so you could distribute one program and have it run on any machine
SWPadnos, pick one up next time you are in the UK I use two for shelf supports
there was a version of EMC that ran on Alpha
they were free
not sure if any distros still support alpha
[16:47:32] <SWPadnos> http://www.alphalinux.org/
looks like the distros may be a couple of years out of data
looks like debian still build for it: http://www.debian.org/ports/alpha/
less push for alpha now :((
yeah, it's a bummer
most of the technology ended up in the Athlon though
well, some of it anyway
seems like alpha was one of those things that intel killed with ia64
I think it was killed by the promise of the Itanium
not by the chips themselves, since they'r relatively dog-ish for many applications
well, they somehow bullied or tricked hp into throwing in with them and letting alpha die through lack of development
I just wonder if it's "we're intel, and we're here to talk about patents" or 'we're intel, and wer're here to talk about wheelbarrows full of hundred dollar bills"
or both, depending on who they're talking to
was it HP bought Compaq bought DEC, and so HP was already stuck trying to decide whether to use HPPA or Alpha in their proprietary unix machines?
that's been ages ago
err, I don't remember
there was some PA-RISC in there too
yeah that sounds familiar
hmm I have a couple of HP PA-RISC boxen as well
I miss the 2 inch thick 'computer shopper'
Hello Folks.... What would about the right price to pay for a 3hp 3ph motor to be used as an idler here in the UK (secondhand)?
The 'hard edge' column
well you have to try
yeah, 0 to maybe 20 ($, UKP, whichever)
go to a local motor repair shop and ask them if they have any sitting around, like the customer forgot to pick them up
that's what I did, $20 later, no receipt, I had a 5HP idler
About 20 squids sounds good. Just looked on ebay but not much there unless new.
with a fancy-looking repair tag
yah- no one wants 3 phase motors around here.
shipping kills you with ebay
Paragon, heh did you see the pallet of 20 motors
No I didn't...
cheap used http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/3-PHASE-MOTOR-3-HP-USED_W0QQitemZ200277934412QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET?hash=item200277934412&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1298|66%3A2|65%3A12|39%3A1|240%3A1318
The first one was a single phase...
The second one looks promissing .... A bit of paint will go along way ;-)
silly :) http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/3-HP-Motor-X-20-loaded-on-a-pallet-new_W0QQitemZ190266422265QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET?hash=item190266422265&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1298|66%3A2|65%3A12|39%3A1|240%3A1318
archivist: They are single phase motors are they not?
Still, not a bad price for twenty of the suckers....
just the thought of that many motors in one go
I note the one negative is complaining of the newness! but at that price...shop soiled
heh, 2 available :)
I can't tell if the boxes on them are for connections or if they're run caps
ive seen that lot often, probably a warehouse or something
Clean them up and knock em out for say 20-30 quid each. Nice little profit!
look at the end, there is a special on the shaft
3HP is pretty big for single phase
it's ~10A at 240V
I think they are from a machine upgrade/mod
for our purpose we dont care about the shaft could be worth an email...and profit...
I hate fleatbay low res pics
archivist: They cant be used for an 3ph idler as they appear to be single phase motors. If the plug is anything to go by.
connection box is large enough to be hiding a run cap for single phase
last company I worked for modded standard stuff and sold off the parts we took out
archivist: With regards to the run cap on the afore mention motors. Does this mean that they maybe 3ph motors which have a run / start cap in one unit?
3ph dont have caps
unless you are power factor compensating, or using in a 1 to 3 phase converter
I am confused. What is the cap used for in the single pahse motor?
create a false phase for the start/run winding to set direction
OK I see... I need to read up some more on motors I think. :-)
it's an esoteric subject
a single-phase AC motor has an equal chance of turning forward vs. backward
starting currents are... interesting
you have to get into phasor diagrams and imaginary numbers to know why
so the cap tilts the probability in favor of one direction
well is guarantees the rotation of the field
if I remembered more from EE 113, I'd explain further :)
no, the field rotates anyway, but at a standstill no power being output), the imaginary and reaal compoonents have equal power, but opposite rotation
or something like that
So does the cap power a smaller winding which gives it a nudge in the direction commanded and then the single phase takes over continuing in the same direction?
no, it's not a 3-phase induction motor with a static phase converter in it :)
here we go .... LOL :-)
hmm full explanation wont fit irc
[18:32:14] <SWPadnos> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AC_induction_motor#Single_Phase
needs phasor drawings
[18:32:35] <SWPadnos> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_motor
heh, yep :)
No worries... I'll do a google on it .... Oh hold that... wikipedia..
* archivist stabs that rotating animation for missing a few details
[18:33:54] <SWPadnos> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AC_motor
Paragon, note the rotor has shorted turns that get magnetised by the outer field, hence the slip between 1500 revs calculated from uk mains and actual full load 1425
Sorry archivist I just bookmarked those pages for review. So have not had a change to go through them just yet...
motors take time to learn :)
I was just viewing http://www.lathes.co.uk/beaver/page5.html
as I have one arriving tomorow as mentioned previously. Got love the name Beaver by the Balding Engineering... lol ;-)
I know someone who has one
archivist: How does he rate it?
dont think he uses it properly
not seen any sensible work from him yet
Are they quite rare? I have never came across this mill before.
one on fleabay a week or two ago
Really? Can you remeber how much did it go for?
omg my english has gone ascrew... lol
not in my watch list any more, cant remember
no worries :-)
bugger bridgeport interact series 1 £800
hmm hardinge at a sensible start price http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:VRI&item=370117240598
been watching that for a few weeks, slowly dropping his price
It's a biggee..
sigh. if only there were something like that in my area
nice tape drive
probably still way out my price range
Dam I used to work on the old IBM mainframes 327X that used those ... lol
Tape drives that is ;-)
Gotta dash ... Catch U all later..
guys, if you needed to make a welder robot for cylinders, how would you do the tracking system? currently it's done mechanically with 2 tracking wheels, but the manual welds done first to keep the caps on seem to rarely pull the wheels sideways, messing the weld up
i'm thinking of using 4 magnetic sensors and some electronics.. any better ideas?
are the rollers a sharp V
cant you move either the tacks or the rollers away from each other
done that, it still happens sometimes
so the cylindr is walking axially.. or climbing up the rollers??
the cylinder is laying on a set of rollers that roll it arround
yes.. i got that
then above that theres a welding robot, powder welding, the cylinder itself doesn't "shift", if that is what you're asking, but the caps on it can be a bit off
^ like that
was it tacked that way??
the machine has to cope with that if it happens
the 'bot cant SEE the part
as it is, it's fully mechanical, there is a 3 to 6mm "level shift" between the 2 parts it welds together which the wheels now follow
but if it rolls over the tacks, it SOMETIMEs (read: rarely) skids off
and its ok to weld it like that?? croocked that is???
it's just a big storage tank
(and the crooked part is only ~5mm off, which is enough to miss the weld..)
program the robot to whip and weave over all of them regardless of gapping
it's a fully mechanical one as it is
there is too much tolerance in your assembly to use a precision robot
dmess: and that's a waste of time & welding wire.
yes i understand that..
fragalot: seam tracking
anonimasu: yeah, but with which type of sensors would I do that
just 4 magnetic sensors, and a motor to slide the welding tip sideways ?
anonimasu: "optical" + welding could be entertaining
fragalot: you arent reading much stuff about what they do in the industry today do you?
maybe if i put a cover over the sensor..
anonimasu: nope :)
I'd go for a inductive analog sensor.
but I have no idae how they handle welding.
k, i was thinking the same
ultrasonic would work but they cant handle heat.
a camera and a threshold filter would surely work
it doesn't have to be fast :p if it responds within 1-3 seconds it's good (thats the time it takes to go over the tacks)
and keep track of the vector of the weld..
(like prepared surfaces should be another color then the rest)
I might be way off :p
but I doubt it
thresholding work super when you have differences between surfaces
both are steel, only difference is the distance :/
you will still have a | where you have the seam
atm, it's got a seat ontop of the machine, and a steering wheel to assist it if it flies off, lol
or shine a line laser over the weld
and use a camera with a filter..
illuminate at a steep angle fromthe lower side, and the higher surface will appear dark
shame I dont work up the road any more, they had a submerged arc welder
or just illuminate from the low side, close to the camera (with camera and light close to the work)- again, the high side won't be able to reflect as much as the low side even if they're identical materials
SWPadnos: you're assuming that no light from the weld goes trough
is it a continuous weld?
archivist: it's a powder welding
well, optical is cheap to experiement with..
I mean, is the welding done in a continuous burst, or is it pulsed
it's all algorithm-stuff
obviously the seam has to be continuous :)
you should ask alex about optical seam tracking
SWPadnos: it's a semi-automatic welding gun just strapped onto the "robot"
so, yeah, it sortof pulses rapidly as the wire melts and new is fed in...
ok - I wasn't sure if the process could allow for short pauses when the camera/tracking algorithm is activated
usual welding pulse rates are at around 1-300 HZ
don't think you can work with that
and inbetween pulses you still have an active arc
just with a small current (usually 60-90A)
alex_joni: that depends on the machine
the idea is to not let the arc burn out
fragalot: on any machine
that'd explain a few things
the only (very recent) difference is on cold metal transfer (and the like)
where you have a negative current phase
basicly you're doing AC MIG/MAG
but that's as an aside
usual seam tracking is done (afaik) in 3 ways
1. tactile with some thingie dragging along the weld (sucks the most)
^ thats what it is doing now :p
2. inductive/capacitive near the sides (also sucks, cause it's very process depending, so you need to reconfigure sensors based on the weld)
not really applicable to general robotics
3. using arc measurements (for instance current) <- the most used method, also one of the cheapest
alex_joni: it's sole purpose is to weld sides to cylinders to create storage tanks
4. using vision (usually a laser beam gets projected on the workpiece, and a high performance camera scans the line)
so inductive should work
fragalot: if it's the same application over an over again 1 & 2 are also applicable
3 you usually only do on robots, cause you need weaving
1 skids off sometimes like i said before, thus i'l do 2
3 seems like the nicest
the weaving is built in mechanically
you need to measure the current at the extremities of the weaving
and compare the values
3 is ok for 90% of the welds, it doesn't work on butt welds for example
4. is problematic for shiny parts, and is expensive
I'll go for 2.
yeah, for automatic welding 2 is probably the sanest
hm, maybe you could weave the sensor too
anonimasu: ... Aye :D
as you'd know where the seam goes off to..
anonimasu: you don't want to do that usually :)
it depends how much processing power you have for the sensor analysis, but usually you have a simple PID that drives a DC motor
don't need much processing power
like I said, it's got 3secs to respond..
but moving the sensor has other implications(wiring ones)
anonimasu: weaving is usually < 2-10mm so that's not a problem for wiring
alex_joni: evaluating a ~ to keep the period of lows constant wouldnt take much power
if the weaving isnt ~2khz
it's pretty slow
weaving is usually up to 3-4Hz
but that's for really small amplitudes
dead slow :)
usually you run < 1.5Hz
on any recent plc that still gives you about 1ms between capture points
try welding at it
more for some
anonimasu: yeah, with a plc it's no biggie..
but as I said.. usually you have some analog pid feeding into the servo drive
expensive PLC vs cheap-ass in-stock µC's ... :p
an uC would probably suffice aswell
but you need coding..
a PLC's a lot more than a microcontroller
you need to program a PLC aswell........
for PLC you just drag&drop some symbols and call it programming :D
* anonimasu cries
alex_joni: or use STL, which is, imho, a LOT easier and faster
I mean, it a PLC's not just a microcontroller
STL? the STL I'm familiar is OT
jepler: yeah, but for this purpose, if you need to chose between something that costs about 2 euro, VS a PLC.. ?
fragalot: I'd choose the solution that works long term
a PLC has well-defined I/O characteristics, and is conditioned for industrial use
anonimasu: no reason a well designed uC doesn't work longterm
holy crap my UTF8 kicked in
alex_joni: yeah, and homebrew stepper drives are easy to make and get performance outof..
anonimasu: I did say well designed :)
anonimasu: performance isn't really a big concern, lol
it just has to work,..
perhaps i can hardwire it >.<
it was just analogy
it's just that making electronics work flawlessly is nontrivial
ie, "well designed"
anonimasu: I didn't say it was easy/fast nor cheap :D
i just spent half an hour looking at an error in my code.. Always looked over the typo "myqsl" vs "mysql"
"class myqsl not found" .. what do you mean class not found? it worked the line above!
* archivist has not seen fragalot in #mysql whining why wont my code work :)
archivist: mainly because it was no mysql error, nor did i seek help online
fragalot, Im in there all the time
i used to be
then i powered my server down, after a nice 3 years of uptime, replaced it, went back in, after 6 months powered new server down, and just reconnect everytime now,.. I must admit, i really really miss the backlog
somebody just tried to explain to my what happened to the canadian dollar
this is what he came up with: http://www.ccserver.net/yeah/economy.jpg
well, that's one way to look at it
good night all
but the stock market is back up 500 points.. ;)
the stock market is what got us into this mess inthe first place
well, technically it's the derivatives market, but what the heck
we need to get back on the gold stardard, but we're so in debt it's pathethic
I seriously doubt Ft Knox is THAT big
It could be, LOTS of land out there, but I'm just not seeing it.
moving 2 palets worth of retaining wall blocks is hard on the knees
that's what she saisd
the "dollars" we have today are just meaningless. one idea to get back to a gold standard is to take all the gold and silver in our reserves and make up "new dollars" that are backed by metal. There would be a one-time hit when new dollars are traded for old dollars (probably at around 100:1), but then we'd be set
or maybe it was 1000:1, I don't remember
ugh - made zero progress kins today - the viper bridge B axis broke - we have the head off and are looking for parts - found a tapered roller with a broken roller - broken into 4 pieces axially - hopefully will find all six bearings locally this afternoon - if so will be assembling the B axis tomorrow
credit default swaps and commercial paper are the big problems - people manipulating the CDS's with the credit rating companies complicity and
commercial paper is the equivalent of a payday loan
but much lower interest ;)
using the CDS's - when the CDS's are not available the interest rate is MUCH more
Payday loans can be 30% or more, I think you need a pretty bad credit rating to get that kind of rate with commercial paper
if you have that bad of a credit rating then commercial paper is not available to you - it is the very same concept
its all.. going to crap.... and i'm yelling jump you bastages... jump...... hahaha
stustev, have you read "The Creature From Jekyll Island"?
* jymm pushes dmess
(I know I keep mentioning it, but it's a very fascinating look at money)
GE Capital has 72 Billion dollars on an average maturity of 3 days - that means they must pay back and borrow (roll over) 72 Billion (with a B) dollars every three days. WOW
im at the BOTTOM of the crap pile.. lookin up my friend.. its all tanked..
SWPadnos: I have not read that book
im in the basement under the crap pile
it is amazing isnt it... and it isnt REAL $$$
see if you can find it. The autohors name is G Edward Griffin
tells how the Fed works
or doesn't, as the case may be
I will try to find it.
are there other countries that ARE on the gold standard today?
that is not real money until you have to pay it back the the lender will not roll it over - then it stinks
Iran just converted to gold
archivist: at least you have air...
oh interestng - I didn't know that any country was on a boullion-backed standard
many will and soon in my opinion.. or pounds sterling
Iran converted last week (or just finished converting last week)
only way it would have any thing to stand on
pounds sterling haven't been sterling since the late 1600s
i know.. you know.. but that what they still call it
tradition, I assure you
any suggestions for a program to compare 2 binary executables in linux.... like diff for binaries???
any of the debuggers do that?
are you trying to compare byte by byte, or effective program load?
im from a small gold mining town... and we have moved tonnes of gold from our local bowels... go gold and we BOOM
SWPadnos, I have 2 executables that I want to explore the code differences.... so disassembler would be nice
that's different :)
gold is only worth what the market says it is - it has no intrinsic value - the value can be adjusted by the authorities at any moment (for their pleasure)
that's only true when you don't have real money
ie, not on the gold standard
the gold standard is no more REAL money than a Federal Reserve Note
LawrenceG, xdelta looks like the app on Ubuntu
but it doesn't do code-related stuff, just binary diffs
correct... but ppl will settle wars over gold.. and NOT paper $$
over what they think the value is
yes, a boullion backed standard is far more real than notes
SWPadnos, thanks... I'll give it a try
sure, though I don't think it'll help much :)
Heh, Ft Knox is empty!
can't eat or drink gold
you may be better off loading the two programs in gdb
can't drink paper etiher (but you might be able to eat it)
stustev: No, but you can pay someone gold to GET you food and drink
not if it his last food or drink
in the '30 s england borrowed a bunch a $$ from the mahraj of India... he later repaid it in english note... the Maharaj.. lit a fire with then and served his sevents tea from it
stustev: Ok, then maysomeone gold to kill the person with the food and drink
stustev: Never underestimate the power of greed
now you are talking power
stustev: it's one and the same =)
we have been discussing the value of "money" until now
well, there are two discussions
money is just a tool to get power
he who has the GOLD wins.... all the time..
one is whether money is useful for trading items of actual value (commodities)
Well, you should have been discussing when zombies talk over the world.. we already did and formed a plan.
that is the golden rule - he who has the gold 'rules;
the other is whether the monetary system we have is effective
He who has the bugger guns rules =)
band bigger guns too =)
what IS the world coming to??
mad max - road warrior ?
stustev: not far off
EMC2 for my jeep and machine gun :)
there isnt a company out there that hasnt said.. WaiT,,,
stustev: That's SO lame
as long as it's not "The Day After", we may be OK
stustev: Phalanx baby!!!
or "A Boy And His Dog"
a boy and his stick
my vans already got the hard points mounted for s/w
Homie dont play! Phalanx ftw!!!
what oil a barel for you guys... a yo-yo??
12,500 pounds - takes a big backpack
stustev: I used to work on them actually, always wanted a mini version of car roof mount
the sling will have to be very wide or it will cut into your shoulder
I want a Barrett 50 cal with a flash suppressor and as much of a silencer as I can get
that would not leave enuf room in the van for the family... and would probably draw mor attention than i really want
[22:15:44] <jymm> http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=phalanx&ie=UTF-8&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&sa=X&oi=video_result_group&resnum=4&ct=title#
[22:17:13] <jymm> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgpQBZF2sZQ
stustev I think you want a recoil suppressor instead of a flash suppressor unless you only plan on firing it once...
doesn't barrets recoil supressor do flash supressing (sortof) too?
Lerman_____ is now known as Lerman
also, their smaller round (forgot which it was) is far more awesome ( massive range, same impact damage ) .473 or something I think.. no muzzle flash from that round either
BigJohnT: one shot one kill is the mantra
stustev: 50cal without recoil supressor should be fun to fire
also, wrt the "big guns", they are downsizing. *points at big bertha*
A friend of mine just got a 50 cal S&W pistol. I haven't shot it. He says the smaller rounds are not bad but the big rounds are very bad (recoil that is)
if the government would not help anyone during this market correction it would end late next year - with the government help it will last until 2014
that counter active???
stustev: lol, yeah
"so, we just spent 400billion pumping it into businesses, and now we're 300billion in red."
what I don't get is.. where the hell did all that money go?
insted of just shutting the taps... like most are
poof... its not money...its equity... expected $$$
till you sell it isnt $$
banks should try living without any borrowing
you can be potentially worth 1 M$ but have NO liqiudity
the $$ went to "hyperspace" and the us government now owns 50 % of the homes in the US
[23:50:20] <dmess> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zTOVaXHX-8&feature=related
for when your all stressed.... just listen to that