anyone fimiliar with a linux home server, that also does most of what Windows Home Server does? especially, the duplication backup elimination of files?
the program samba has all the file stuff handled.
i used to use a linux fileserver.
i vote for a preprocessor external of emc, just a C file filter, given a filename and a tool radius. filter goes thru gcode file and inserts radii as needed (or pukes with line#s & reason) creating a new file leaving orig untouched, and new ready for prevue in axis.
(digs out 'blech' a blend changer for wedm )
fenn_ is now known as fenn
tomp: you don't get votes, except by actually writing the code :-P
ybit_ is now known as ybit
ybit is now known as h2i
wow all this argument over something so obvious.. just have two modes, g43.999 "dont bitch on concave corners"
then everyone should be happy
i demand g43.998
nothing else will satisify me
AND G42533.3 TO CANCEL
i feel that is most logical.
I am careful not to vote at this time - but - I would suggest two modes of cutter compensation - configurable in the .ini file or with g code -
one that is the exact same as currently implemented
heh, stustev knows when there is danger of getting his head bitten off
one that doesn't try to radius the corners - neither the external nor the internal corners :)
stustev: next time we're together remind me to draw you some cases where what you want is impossible
cradek: I don't think you will be able to do that
stustev: you are mistaken :-)
I am looking forward to this conversation :)
cradek: maybe if we did ALL the programming in the metric system the code would be better
sqrt(x-3) * sqrt(x+2) == sqrt((x-3)(x+2))
why is that false.
i had the hunch it is, and my CAS says it is
but i don't know WHY it is false
same with sqrt(a) * sqrt(b) == sqrt(a*b)
a simple test using a=4 b=9 shows they are the same
why is this refusing to deal with it
I think the equation is true
it's the same as a^2 x^2 = (ax)^2
what is "this"?
it's a cas
open source etc
showing my ignorance (or lack of education) but what is cas?
sry, computer algebra system
does symbolic math, and should recognize something simple like that
if X = 1 then the sqrt(x-3) is an imaginary number
maybe you have to restrict the set of x
interesting, I did that restriction automatically without even considering it
I am good at imagineering :)
but, the equation is still true, isn't it??
no it isn't: consider a=b=-1; sqrt(a)sqrt(b) = sqrt(ab); you get i^2=1
(which is false)
there's got to be a command to restrict stuff to all reals
that's not really the issue
stustev: is sqrt(-1) i or +-i?
I think it's i
huh--I too thought you could distribute powers over multiplication (ab)^c = a^c b^c.
so in my example I get i^2 = +-1
which is clearly not an equivalency
jepler: for positive powers maybe?
you can distribute powers over multiplication - just not sqrt (in all cases)
a^c is only defined for a positive OR c integer
what is -3 ^ 2.5?
I think it's something around (4.7725885742620829e-15+15.588457268119901j)
but maybe I'm mistaken :-P
(hm that's almost a pure imaginary number..)
no! - I think you are right :)
toastydeath: we call this a "geek trap"
(that's the result of exp(2.5 * log(-3))
heh, gnome calc says "Negative X and non-integer Y not supported" when I tried -3 ^ 2.5
a^b = exp(b * log(a))
orpie says it's nan
maxima gets -15.58846
log (or ln) of a negative number is also undefined isn't it?
jmkasunich: no, it's just complex
toastydeath: sounds like it computed -(3^2.5)
we don't like them complex numbers
jmkasunich: tried again, and it just handed the original back to me
gimme the simple ones
which is funny considering i asked for a numerical result
this is very interesting but I'm going to bed...
[03:20:28] <jepler> http://emergent.unpy.net/index.cgi-files/sandbox/cm.c
I bought a fog machine and a motion sensor light to trigger the fog machine. Now, once triggered I need it to fire off for 0.5seconds, then wait 5 minutes before being fired again. I want to use timer relays to do this, but I haven't been able to grasp what combinations of on/off timers I need. Any thoughts?
you could read 'man cpow' but you have to be smart enough to even know what a "branch cut" is to understand it.
you could load up classicladder and experiment. there is a block that works just like a timer relay.
when you are done you'll have a nice diagram showing how to wire it
you can buy a single timer that has adjustable on/off times
I guess I'm not sure on the 5 minute "pause" if you will.
just use classicladder
(if you don't mind tying up a PC to run your fogger)
the adjustable timer will let you set the units of the on and off adjustment
Well, that was the reason for the timers, so that is all self contained. I have some uC around here, but wanted something that anyone could operate.
i would trigger the .5 sec and 5 min at the same time
unless you are asking a different question
and i guess you are
you basically want a 0.5 sec pulse when the trigger goes off, and at least 5 mins between pulses?
toastydeath: I'm using a motion sensor to trigger the fog machien when someone walks by. But it but's out such intense fog, that 1/2 a seconds is more than enough fog for 5 minutes
i would trigger both timers are the same time, and have the 5 min timer kill the triggering mechanism
I dont want the motion sensore to keep triggering the fog
you think this is possible in a single dual timer relay?
but timer relays come in many flavors
i've never worked with single dual timer relay before
so i don't know what kind of outputs or triggering they have?
if they both trigger off the same input that would be fine imho
as long as you have two seperate no/nc things
ah, a repeat cycle relay
hook the trigger into the nc on the 5 min, loop that around and latch it on both timer inputs
[03:31:19] <JymmmEMC> http://www.mcmaster.com/ctlg/DisplCtlgPage.aspx?ReqTyp=CATALOG&CtlgPgNbr=885&RelatedCtlgPgs=885,886,887,888&term=Timer%20Relays&sesnextrep=438282168662942&ScreenWidth=1600
latch each of the relays to themselves independently, and it should be done
Switch-On Initiated Interval— Also known as single-shot, you set how long i
i wouldn't want that one
you didn't really think it would be cheap did you?
because how i'd set it up, it would never turn on
not with a initial delay
$35/ea is what I thought
but you may have another idea
PIC and a relay
is this for a Halloween thing?
if its only for one night, use the PC and classicladder
end of night, PC goes back to normal PC stuff
the best idea
I build up more each year.
all you need is one relay that can be controlled by the parport, and one digital input (also parport)
you can still use the PC for whatever 364 days a year
plug in the parport on one day
you can do about 12 things with one parport
steves_logging is now known as steve_stallings
steve_stallings is now known as steves_logging
I just realized something.... The motion sensor light has a 90 second delay after power is applied before it can trigger the lights when it senses motion. I'm wondering if I can use this to my advantage somehow.
Now, the remote for the fog machine has a neon light and a momentary button. The light turns on after it's heated up and is "READY" to fire.
Hmmm, I gotta think about this some more =)
If you put a capacitor in parallel between 120VAC and one side of the coil on a relay, then removed power. Would the relay stayed closed until the cap drained?
Wait, it would need to be across the coil itself.
alex_joni: you here?
my new motorcycle http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f163/johnplctech/GW1500.jpg
BigJohnT: yeah, on and off
thanks, rides like a lazyboy on wheels
Hello All, Just found this on yourube (center finder) how easy / hard would this be to apply to EMC? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8OZNiOvetYY
hmm makes assumptions about endmill helix and circle roundness and positioning
and machine/toolholder concentricity (should be rotating to remove)
Yes it does. The reason why I am asking is that I want to make a fan / compressor wheel for an RC Heli I have. The one that comes as stock is quite fragile and I have broken two when starting the nitro engine. They use a oneway bearing and cost 20 UKP each :-(
cant you press bearing into new fan
BTW heres a picture of the fan and heli if your interested... http://www.centuryuk.com/Products/Helicopters+Spares/Nitro+Kestrel+SE?pos=24
and the heli http://www.centuryuk.com/Products/Ready+To+Fly+Radio+Control+Helicopters/item3081?startPos=10
I use a centering dti to find a hole center
hmm a friend is importing heli spares
I cant see your part in his list
I bought some 50mm dia Delrin stock which I hope to cut on my Denford Starmill once it's setup correctly. I was looking for an easy way to do repeatability with the view to making a aluminium fan eventualy. Just though it would be a good project. I have a copy of Rhino and RhinoCam that I purchased from a freind when he lost interested in CNC and have designed the fan with it. Have not cut...
...anything yet though ;-) . RhinoCam comes with an EMC post processor which is handy though I have not tested or verified it as yet.
How much is your freind charging for it archivist_ub?
BigJohnT: bastard! =)
he has not got it
Oh no probs.
I would make those on the rotary
So do you think it would be straight forward in implementing that center finder within EMC?
there is probing but dont know
I thought someone had put a center finding probe routine on the wiki
SWPadnos: !!!! Dude man, ltns
yreah - was pretty busy in Germany
just got back last night
SWPadnos: Ah, I didn't even know you got deported =)
I do not possess a 4th axis at this stage. I have been looking around for a manual rotary for conversion but not sure what to go for. The mill has the following travel x = 160mm y = 90mm Z= 120mm
BigJohnT: You heard me! (btw, nice bike)
wife even likes it
Paragon, item 230294210251on epay
BigJohnT: what's the mileage and damage on it?
if I had the cash......
I don't have the cash anymore
I'm logging. I don't understand 'thislog', anonimasu. Try /msg logger_emc help
Just this once .. here's the log: http://www.linuxcnc.org/irc/irc.freenode.net:6667/emc/2008-09-30.txt
BigJohnT: damage == $$$
98 with matching trailer 9k
BigJohnT: I hate you
is that a Gold Wing>
it's alright =)
ok, I thought it looked familiar
just bought it yesterday
archivist_ub It's looks nice
(I've only really looked at Gold Wings and some BMWs my neighbor had)
I try to close all orifices when Harleys go by, so I don't see them much
I could not find a BMW in my price range :(
what's wrong with harleys?
they're nice and quiet, I'll say that
that was for BigJohnT
hogs vibrate, noise, uncomfortable
anonimasu, Harleys are always too damned loud
bikes arnt supposed to be quiet :)
SWPadnos: I can hear my radio at 70mph with a helmet on it is so quiet
BigJohnT: We met a couple on their honeymoon once, they were touring the west half of the US on Goldwing and a trailer with a queen sized air mattress for the last 2 months. Had the trailer all setup for it.
I like things that don't brag about their capabilities. Take the Nissan 300ZX Twin Turbo
get something exciting betweent your legs....ride a motorbike
Plus they here you comming and know your've arrived :-)
SWPadnos: uh, that's like calling the porsche gt3 rs discrete.
my trailer is just a utility trailer with a fiberglas shell and painted to match the motorcycle
I've been passed by a Ferrarri Testarossa - those were pretty quiet too :)
SWPadnos: FWIW... I got Ubuntu 8.04.1 AMD64 + VMserver2 installed and running on that crapiertop
BigJohnT: This trailer was kinda like a pop-up tent.
I missed the fact that the VirtualBox package doesn't support 64-bit clients
I've seen those before they are neat
I had it running on my nephew's computer, but then he needed some dumb USB wifi stick to work, so he's probably blown away the Ubuntu install for Vista64
SWPadnos: Well, the nice thing about vmserver2 is that it's all browser based, and the remote console is just a browser plugin that you can dl from the console
I'll probably wait for the package, but maybe not
SWPadnos: I found a page that gives exact instructions. They only thing I had to do was change the g++/gcc versions from 4.1 to 4.2 and that was it.
compiling should be pretty fast with a Phenom 9850 X4 :)
cool. if you find that page again, let me know
SWPadnos: I believe this was it https://help.ubuntu.com/community/VMware/Server/AMD64
oh, that was quick :)
Yeah, I'm documenting everything anymore
BTW can you mix stepper and servo control within EMC?
SWPadnos: I still forgot how to install flash =)
I thought it should be possible. Thanks
in 8.04, there's supposed to be a firefox extension manager, but I don't remember how to get to it
you can also search for "flash" in synaptic, and install from there
it works for me
I think if you update it'll find/install it.
SWPadnos: Now I just have to figure out what all the files are under the VM. I created a BASIC install of debian, and it's 600MB as a VM
? did you do a fixed size disk image or one that grows?
(I guess I didn't understand the question)
OMG this guy built this on the same Mill I have ... http://craftsmanshipmuseum.com/tomlinson.htm
time to head out
SWPadnos: Sorry, that 600MB included a snapshot. so it's probably less than 300mb for the install
SWPadnos: The only thing I need to see if it's possible is todo some bandwidth shaping using the virtual switch
outside the VM (so it doesn't have to help)?
Paragon, if only I had the time ive been dreaming of a deltic engine model for years
SWPadnos: Yeah, that way to can set a max bandwidth and never worry about runaway processes or anythign else sucking down the whole pipe
archivist_ub: Time Time Time .... ;-)
there was a nice aero engine at Ascot
Ascot at the MEW show?
I went on the Friday
Missed the last one but was there for the previous two or three. Usualy spend time drinking tea with Steve for home and workshop LOL
BTW I bought my Starmill from him...
Last few years Ive only made it to the Tee Publishing Midlands show
Never been to that one. archivist_ub Is the a good paper on probing with EMC?
see wiki I think
Just found this ... http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Touch_Probe
I should take pics of the inside of a probe I have, but its a little large being on a size 50 taper
shines LEDs on contact to a receiver similar to Renishaw
far too big for my morse 2 taper
Yeah that is large..
Just worked out a way to use that center finder technique.. I currently use shared homeing so the homes one axis at a time. I could use the same pin for the center finder with a known offset (radius of the copper tube) and known height. So I could use the standed home procedure. What do you think?
so you're out of inputs?
No it's just that my hal command experience is not the greatest at the moment. I would not be using the center finder that often either. How could I implement it on another pin and keep my current homeing procedure?
homing and probing are separate functions. unless you have to, I wouldn't use the same pin for them
you need exactly one hal command to connect a parallel port input to the probe input. it will be something like "net probe-in parport.0.pin-##-in motion.probe-input"
or use in-not if you need it inverted
Oh I was not going to probe with it but rather find set 0,0,0 in center of round stock automaticlay.
How can I set the offset (relative) when a pin is trigered?
In the same way home is set.
I don't know if that's possible
finding the center of a hole is a multi-touch proposition. you calculate the center from the values you get probing several edge locations
So I would probably need to trigger the home pin to set Actual home and then offset from there?
you can't change the HOME_OFFSET, which is what you'd use to change the location of the "home contact"
homing and motion use different motion planners
homing is not a coordinated motion
you can change an offset like G92, but you can't home
homing is also run from HAL pins, not G-code
so you can't trip the "home input" wherever you want
Sure. Thats what I am after so emc can set cords to 0,0,0. heres what I would like to achive (if you did not see it already) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8OZNiOvetYY
that also relies on the probe moving else the cutter breaks
sure - use G92 offfsets for that
it's only held by hand - unlikely to break a tool :)
except for the depth
Im thinking accuracy
well, the accuracy is as good as your eye + parallax + probe doohicky construction
I was thinking about pluging it into my home pin so that when the finder is in use it will trip on the eges of the copper tube (Say 40mm Dia) and set x = 0 then move + or - 20mm then do the same for the y axis and finaly find height for Z. Hows that sound?
and as you (?) pointed out, it relies on the cutter being really close to a cylinder
it wouldn't work so well with a 2-flute high helix cutter
or a 1-flute ...
and a bent machine spindle
Paragon, that would only work if it were already centered
ie, you center in the tube, then move -X and set home, then -Y (or whatever)
but of course you need to know the tool diameter also
since that changes the HOME_OFFSET
I use a diacator http://www.diatest.com/index.php?id=39
to find a hole center/rotary table center
you work with a fully outfitted machine shop ;)
thats my tool, this place hasnt got
Yeah you are right I would need the probe or cutter to be in the center before starting due to using a tube right?
yes, if you want to use it as a simple HOME input
G92 is your friend though
you can do the multiple-probe/calculation in G-code, and set G92 offsets so the center acts like 0,0,0
OK thanks Chaps .. I look into G92 and probing pins.
wow I just found the new price of a diacator
heh - ok :)
archivist_ub, how many moths pay is it?
[12:53:06] <archivist_ub> http://www.measureshop.biz/en/measuring-instruments/dial-bore-and-depth-gauges/centring-devices/diacator-centring-devices.html
got mine second hand for a lot less
Not cheap ... more than I paid for my StarMill :-)
Touch Off : http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?CoordinateSystems#Touch_Off
fragalot_ is now known as fragalot
SWPadnos: This is just way too cool, been looking for this for 20 years!!! http://www.xmonad.org/
I've heard of monad before
check out the videos
looks pretty cool
how does it handle stuff like pidgin
where one window is long and skinny
I started watching one. the music got annoying and I couldn't read the text, so I stopped it :)
SWPadnos: you goober, it aint about the text, it's about the windows man!
no more anoying resize gabs futzing with everything!!!
Now, if I only had 3 32" LCD's...
too much screen real estate
Well, too much desk real estate
dual 30" setups are too big also - you can't see it all without swiveling your head all the time (which reduces the usefulness)
it seems weird, but there is such a thing as too much screen real estate
You can if you push it back though
sure, then use large text, thereby losing the benefit of a large screen ...
give and take, give and take
SWPadnos: Become one with the LCD's
with large multi-monitor setups i usually used 3 monitors, and left the rest to do other things like monitoring
not really active use
I've got 3x 19"-ish screens on this PC, and I could use a little more
I like the triple setup because you still have one "front and center"
dual-monitor setups either have one primary and one secondary, or you have a border in front of your nose :)
with six i found that i liked up, center, and left
the other three just had monitoring stuff, music, etc
probably could have done without them
never tried more than 3
it was okay.
the most i ever stood in front of was 12, and played doom 3 on 9
both at the same place
the 12 was a monitoring wall, and the doom 3 was a show box
I have three screens, and switching between them can be a pita.
I run dual at home
Anything smaller than 32" is limited to 1980 wide, and I like two-up pages which means for most websites at 1024 would need to be 2048 wide or higher, which means 32"
30" displays are almost all 2560x1600
SWPadnos: find one
apple cinema 30"
apple, please insert YOUR credit card here --> [ ]
[14:00:10] <SWPadnos> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824001098
slot not wide enough error
NewEgg has 5 models that are 30", 2560x1600
Ah, sorry... I meant single DVI
SWPadnos: I'm still looking for the "perfect" box to buy/build
you won't find it. you're too cheap ;)
get on with using
SWPadnos: I'm sorry, I can't afford $45,000 - but then it wouldn't be "perfect" now would it =)
what kind of budget would you like?
I just put together two boxes, one AMD one Intel, for $1200-$1500 each without monitors
archivist_ub: footswitch to flip between virtual desktops
SWPadnos: If it can do what I want I'm will to spend the money. But not gonna find it.
those are excellent gaming boxes, close to $500 could have been saved by going with a lesser video card and motherboard
what CPU (cores/speed), RAM, video do you need?
oh - you're going to want a rackmount server box, dual or quad-chip, big memory expansion, etc, right?
SWPadnos: quad cpu, 16gb, 8bay SATA RAID60 or 50
4 chips or 4 cores?
or 4x4-core chips? :)
4cpu, 4 core each
or dual core each if I can affrod it better
ok, then you're in the $1500 range for the MB alone
the chips aren't the problem, it's the sockets
though you'll need low-power ones for thermal management
Well, I did find a 1U box with dual systesm in it
but I want hot swap drives
does it have to be 1U, or is 2 OK?
2u ok for home
I'll toss it in the rack
1U is hard - you need stuff like angled DIMM sockets or special short DIMMs
special fans ...
maybe even 3u, which iirc allows for full system
4u is full-size, 3u is close enough since we don't use 5.25" disks any more
SWPadnos: That rack I have is 1/3 or 14U, I can fit some nice things in there
yep, it's good size
esp if I get rid of the 80p switch
6a for that alone
though it would be fun to have a lan party on it
But I saw some 24p gigabit switches with traffic shaping
and fiber uplinks for ~$50
I was gonna say
there are some pretty good ones for $325 or so (new) - managed layer 2 or layer 3 Gb switches, 16 or 24 ports
plus a couple of GBIC
so 3U for the UPS, 1u for 24p sw, still leaves 10U for other things
and I could possible mount the switch in the back
you'd probably still want a small patch panel on the front though
in the same 1u
for connecting things in front of the rack
ie, bring laptop over, plug in
you mena the racked ones that connect in the rear?
no, naturally not those computers ;)
I could run a cat5 out the back
to the front
but we're taking 24 cables too
SWPadnos: Though, what I REALLY want is mass redundant storage
Say it with me boys and girls... PETA BYTES
pet bytes, how cute
SWPadnos: BYTE ME!
No, I just want an 8 drive storage, 2 being hot spares
my only real option that I've seen is SAS
which I'm not really that familure with
mr_boo_ is now known as mr_boo
I never did find a solder bridge on that board. I now suspect I fried the microcontroller; earlier I had bridged from an I/O pin to an LED (bypassing the current limiting resistor) and then let it run for a good fraction of a minute. It was after fixing that bridge that it didn't work right again.
I'm going to re-do the board with increased distance from the ground plane to non-GND pads so that hopefully I don't screw up the board so many times getting it soldered
I hook LEDs directly to AVRs all the time
I've done it before too
but if I can't find the short, it must be the microcontroller
(my continuity meter didn't find any shorts between vcc and gnd, any I/O and gnd, or any I/O and vcc, or any pair of adjacent I/Os)
(though testing all those combinations I probably missed a few :-P)
I put a very bright light behind a board and view with magnifier to find shorts sometimes or use a low ohm meter capable of the difference in track length to show where a short is
it would be neat if someone who knows metric speeds/feeds would make a metric version of my graphs:
[15:02:48] <cradek> http://timeguy.com/cradek/01192416516
cradek: seems like it's just a matter of knowing what units are commonly referred to in metric (?)
hmm or cheat and use a sandvik calculator
cradek: what kind of bike do you have?
* archivist_ub has a Norton circa 1956 (resting)
like this archivist_ub http://www.e-d-s.co.uk/bikepics/pages/Norton%201956%20ES2_jpg.htm
similar its a 600 single
most cannot tell the difference
pull up amongst bikrs and they go oo es2, no model 50 no then they are stumped...19s
for years I wanted a BSA 441 single
the grown up starfire
which was a 250
which is what I had
never could collect enough money for one back then
had a Honda 300 Dream instead I purchased for $25
in a box
actually there were 2 complete 300's in one pile, I had to pick one out...
both were completely apart
did you get all the best bits
you bet, I went and got a manual then with the parts pages in one hand I picked out the best parts
cradek got the motor spindle motor under EMC control via ild74 opto as we discussed yeterday. Works A treat. I just need to workout spindle speed.
What HAL directive can one use to calculate RPM?
what do you mean?
well I have a magnetic pickup on the spindle which pulses on every rotation I was thinking of caounting them adn displaying RPM in EMC
Paragon37: that will take a LOT of smoothing to be useful. more pulses would be better.
consider how few pulses per second you have at low hundreds of rpm
jepler: I bet I could guess, but for choosing the best possible lines it would be nice to get advice from someone whose gut feel for speed/feed is calibrated in metric
I agree I do have a couple of encoders laying around. How does EMC determine RPM say in the case of threading etc...
Paragon37: threading uses position, not rpm
if you have an encoder counting spindle position, you can use the encoder block's velocity output for rpm, or if it doesn't have one, use a ddt block
BigJohnT: mine is just black, no stupid flames
Cradek sorry I meant tapping operation in the mill. Would you not need a precise rpm and feedrate on the Z axis?
cool, I filled up this morning and got $5 change from a $20 bill
you only need an encoder
else broken tap
emc2 has rigid tapping so the spindle rpm does not have to be closely controlled. the Z axis just follows the spindle position read by the encoder
obviously you need many counts per revolution so it can effectively follow the reversal at the bottom of the hole
cradek: what kind of mileage do you get with your 1100?
BigJohnT: about 37
120 miles/tank, looks like the tank (plus reserve) is 3.4 gals
that's why I laughed when you said you would get 50 on your much larger bike :-)
most of the goldwing owners tell me they get 45 mpg
6.3 gallon tank
huh, maybe the V twin is just inefficient
is the gw fuel injected?
mine is 6 cyl
* BigJohnT goes out to look
I know - I mean maybe mine is just unusually bad
if it's FI that could make a huge difference
but who cares - I bet you didn't buy it to save gas anyway.
my truck gets 17
nope mine had carbs
just looked on cheapcycleparts.com
emc will work for christmas lights, correct?
what have you been drinking eric_u
I read that it meets the spec for RS-374 christmas lights
yes too much eggnog
as long as you can pwm on solid state relays, I'm good
just hook it up like a stepper
oh were you asking an actual question?
as long as all I want to do is play "daisy" on my lights
I just can't tell
where's the fun in being able to tell?
I was trying to get in here last night, and pidgin wouldn't let me
I could see the motd
cradek, the guy sitting next to me is saying nice things about your web site
that's nice of him
anything in particular?
earlier today I pointed the bridgeport-mill list to my sfm/ipm graphs
the only response I got so far was "they're not in metric" *sigh*
I subscribe to that, but don't read it
that's often the case with me too
the quality of information there is ... mixed
where is the page?
what do they talk about on the bridgeport list?
low information content usually
fenn: people who don't know the basics of machining, like surface speed, ask about it over and over
fenn: occasionally there is discussion about paint color
you know, the usual
does anyone do hotrod flames or maybe yellow and green camo
pimp my bridgeport
painting the machine an appropriate color seems to be either the first, most important, or only step to "restoration" depending on who you ask
cradek, where is the sfm/ipm page?
see the front page of my website, third entry down
that's nice, too bad it's not in metric
it's gpl - the source is there - I'll happily host a metric version of the graphs if someone makes them
I generally don't use metric
I wish there was a commonly used format like pdf but that could also be edited directly with free tools
it's unlikely that as people pass these graphs around that the 'source' will stay with them
I hates pdf with a vengeance
seems like all the linux tools will edit directly
idle web sites with a link page to pdfs of brochure wear
my main problem is the reader
I stupidly installed adobe reader on my linux desktop
in theory, openoffice 3 will allow PDF editing (it already exports, they're adding an import filter)
the problem is that the PDF format separates each line of text as a separate element, and apparently the importer leaves them that way
so it would be back to the days of manual word wrapping :)
that's why I prefer latex
XP SP3 rules
since i've installed it (2 days ago) I've had 5 bluescreens.
you could embed the source in the pdf somehow maybe? how about svg instead of pdf (like this http://www.freesteel.co.uk/wpblog/2007/02/one-tapered-tool-diagram-coming-up/
we haven't seen any blue screens
eric_u: Thats because you (like all sane people) use linux all the time
yeah, but we have a batch of computers running 'doz
I has xp on my craptop
I have it on my desktops and laptops, but you have to switch grub to use it
I has a craptop on my XP
grad students don't use linux
and data acquisition is much more difficult
eric_u: I do.
I just use vmware :/
but on my home box, as it's mainly a gaming rig/entertainment system,.. It's just XP
all I need is a gameloader & video player on that box :p
I wanna set up virualbox, haven't gotten around to it
I can't seem to run EMC in virtualbox
is that me, or the cd?
funny thing is, at work our server is a windows 2k server running in vmware on a redhat 9 system
eric_u: hehe, happens more often than you'd think
makes adding a hard drive an adventure though
power it down, go to menu, hit "add HD", done.
we added a hard drive to the system, windows couldn't see it
no, because you have to tell vmware to "forward" the harddisk
I got prices for those chineese AC servo axes, motor + drive 1kW 715$
rather, it would format ok, then it wouldn't access it
have the whole pricelist if anyone is interested, those are last year prices
eric_u: haha, pwnt
dushantch: me me!! me!! :p
yes, it was a barrel of laughs
fragalot: they say that shipping is 7eu/kg by plane
[16:58:55] <dushantch> http://www.gsk.com.cn/
-largest chinese cnc drive maker
dushantch: most things where I work at is from quicktech
cheap machines, not the fastest you've ever seen, but they're a dream to fix if something breaks, uber simple guts, and they just plain work reliably
not to mention awesome support guys :p
quicktech.com.tw wants to hack your browser :P
fenn: other site :p
[17:02:33] <fragalot> http://www.quick-tech.com.my
I think it's this one
got the VMC-1070, 3 VMC 640's of which one is 5-axis, 2 XP4-42 SM lathes with barfeeders, a lil' QT-15 for "24/7 slave work" :p and 3 other lathes from DAEWOO, which tend to break down faster, and are crappy to repair
alex_joni: have you had any experience with these people? www.uranus.ro , they're importing chineese ac servo drives, not expensive, so as they're near I'm thinking of going through them and not directly to factory
they certainly look happy
"Yeah! another victim.. I mean customer!"
"DUDE, I just broke the highscore on this game!"
'I crashed..' "but.. you're our stock market?" 'Yeah,.. sorry'
dushantch: did you get a quote?
anonimasu: I got last year pricelist, very cheap
anonimasu: Now i'm writing to romanian distributor to see what they can offer, so that I don't have to buy directly from China.
* anonimasu nods
whta was the price per axis?
motor+amp: DA98(A,B)-10-110SJT-M040D 715.00$ incl 1000W, 4NM, 2500rpm, 4.5A, 110 support Servo Motor
not a bad deal
dunno, omron wanted 1600eu :)
hehe 500eur per axis is a great deal then
not to mention it's likely that replacement parts can be found in your local electronics store
If it work :)
unlike most expensive stuff, that use propretary hardware, or stuff that's hard to get
you can just buy new if it breaks..
or repair it..
it has same capabilities as omron drive, atleast those I need
with a fanuc motor it's $$$$$$$$$$
It's cheaper to buy new :)
btw. is 83$ a lot for new electric handwheel?
I'd say no
they have that too :)
I think the knob alone would cost about the same if you'd buy it seperately
dushantch: send that pricelist :(
dushantch: if it's possible to buy from them check if you can get a discount if you order more at once
they have some european distributors, I contacted the nearest and we'll see what prices will they give me
I'm thinking if they are in ro maybe working something out with alex would be possible
this pricelist I have is lastyears, my friend bought some drives from them
as he lives there :)
the dist is in ro
* anonimasu nods
btw. where to upload the pricelist?
oh and that wurth oil is like 2,5eu/l :) looks like they didn't riped me off :)
HLP viscosity 10
here's the pricelist http://filebin.ca/uyehch/GSK-QUOTATION-06-03-2007.pdf
* fragalot takes a peek
about filters in axis
dushantch: prices in USD?
I am not able to make it work
I managed once
was reading http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.2/html/config_ini_config.html#sub:%5BFILTER%5D-Section
and trying to practice with the nc_files/holecircle.py script
dushantch: that's a great deal..
Aye it is
I'm forwarding this list as we speak to my boss
but I get a tuple error
prices in US$
atleast i was told that :)
well, they are great even in euro.
not in kuvaitian dinars :)
but there's shipping, import taxes etc.
anonimasu: the currency in kuvait, the place with strongest currency :)
btw. the funny thing is that my current spindle for x axis, 600mm is 25x1mm :)
only 1 mm pitch
wow that's find pitched
yeah, but brass nut :), looks like I'm gonna change it with ball nut and screw
and the z one is 25x5mm :)
the thing is I can't squeeze any more than 120mm belt wheel there, so I'm halted at 4:1 reduction, if it can manage the power, haven't calculated that yet :)
the belt on 30mm one I mean :)
found those calculations for ball screws, looks like that screws rigidity is 4 times greater if it's axially fixed at both ends\
and it's max rpm is 45% greater (rigidity wise, as the self induced oscilation frequency is higher)
the duty on the drives may not be much ( have it marked as "repair parts" ;) and the shipping can be cheap if you can wait 6-8 weeks by boat. tho you gotta pay all when it gets to their boat.
i'm trying to find out how long is guarantee, but I think that I'll overspecify the drives so that they don't brek :)
I am attempting to install EMC2 on Hardy within vmware (simulator). I have executed the emc2-install.sh script and am being prompted to install the rtai kernel is still a necessity if one only wants to run EMC in simulator mode?
OK I am following these instruction for puresim http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?EMC2_Pure_Simulator
for using with emc2 is this a good setup: mesa 5i23 (230$)+2x7i37T(80$)+7i33T(80$)+3xKB24(15$)=515$? would be 105$ cheaper if I use plain 5i20 and rest without terminal strips. Is 5i23 supported as 5i20 is?
dushantch: I don't think 5i23 is supported yet.
jepler: thanks, it has diff FPGA but hosmot is same?
all the hostmot are fairly similar and are compiled from the same verilog source code, but it requires a different FPGA firmware binary image to be bundled with emc, and a little bit of customized setup code added.
I am pretty sure that at least in the released versions there's not yet any 5i23 support
jepler: dunno, I'm planing to buy it in next couple months, 5i20 or 5i23, but would like 5i23more as it's more advanced FPGA/design :)
dunno as no devs have 5i23 there's no hope that there will be any support :)
well the solution's simple: you buy the 5i23, become a developer, and support it.
right now in the development version with the new hostmot2 driver, there's support for 5i20 (PCI), 4i65 (PC/104+), and 7i43 (parport/epp).
then there's the older and more time-tested driver which supports the 5i20 with fewer features
(no steppers being the big one)
if I was making a servo system I'd definitely choose 5i20 since then I am free to use the existing driver now and upgrade to the new driver later when it supports everything I need
jepler: thanks for your advice
if I was building a stepper system, I'd beware that the new driver is still very much in the development stage, even though it's included in a stable release
analog out (velocity) from mesa? that'll work real nice
and back 2500ppr differential encoder input
pneumatic tool changer in future maybe
btw. I/O from mesa and from parallel port can be used simultaneously in one machine config? as I think I could be low on IO :)
dushantch: yes they can be.
btw, do you think that screw terminals are worth extra $75? (that's for 3 7i3xT)
ease of use is a + :)
otherwise what are you going to do -- chop up IDC cables?
I'm not the first that thought of that? :)
many a an IDC cable has been sacrificed
dunno, as shipping will cost me 120$ I can throw some money on those too :)
dushantch: I regret getting the version without screw terminals
but I think they weren't available back then
alex_joni: have you any experience with uranus.ro ?
none at all
alex_joni: they distribute some chinese servo drives, and I'm maybe buying 3 so I wanted to ask :)
1kW for 750$ :)
dushantch: sorry, no idea.. the webpage is .. "professional" :D
atleast in china
thanks for advice
I don't trust those addresses either
proper companies don't have their address inside a block appartment
thanks, haven't noticed that :)
it's not just one :)
LOL it looks like shipping 10kg from china by regular mail by plane costs same as shipping .5kg from USA by DHL :)
Hi, can anyone tell me how axis communicates with emc?
alanb: the communication method for user interfaces with emc is called "nml". axis uses a python module called "emc" which wraps the relevant parts of nml.
the small python program 'mdi' (installed as /usr/bin/mdi or view it online: http://cvs.linuxcnc.org/cvs/emc2/src/emc/usr_intf/axis/scripts/mdi.py?rev=1.4;content-type=text%2Fplain)
shows the very basics of how to get emc's status and control emc from a Python program
'pydoc emc' will show a summary of the commands you can send and the status information that you can read
Thanks, Ive looked at that, obviously main bit is emc module and the nml file, I want to know where to find the nml file.
I want to talk to emc from a c# app Ive written so Im interested in the python wrapper
maybe of interest (dont know of an 'nml file' ) NML neutral messaging language from NIST (tho emc is mainly C not C++) http://www.isd.mel.nist.gov/projects/rcslib/NMLcpp.html
Sorry, new to all this should I have said nml configuration file. The one that lists buffers, processes and their connection
emc.nml server.nml client.nml ? stuf like ...# Buffers
# Name Type Host size neut? (old) buffer# MP ---
# Top-level buffers to EMC
B emcCommand SHMEM localhost 8192 0 0 1 16 1001 TCP=5005 xdr
for that, best install a version and look into the source tree
you can get from cvs
I have downloaded from cvs and am slowly looking through. Havent built though, have working version from livecd and thought I should leave well alone
look into .../configs/common/emc.nml
you should be able to build a nml-using library with emc2-devel installed, but I do not know of anyone actively testing this at the moment
anyway, an nml file should be in the config directory
a proper program should get it from the inifile [EMC]NMLFILE or something like that
(there's also a python wrapper around emc's inifile parser in the emc module)
also of note is the fact that emc always changes into the config file's directory to run. that's why the nml file is always relative to the ini.
there's no reference to emc's nml interface besides the source itself. start somewhere (enough commands to do the C# equivalent of mdi.py would be one good target), then once you've proven the concept, add the rest of the stuff you need to have all the stuff needed by the user interface you envision.
Is there a dll I could import the nml stuff from? Is this relevent I have a mainly windows background and am just moving over to linux so its steep learning curves wherever I look
I am not familiar with what is required to use a C++ library from C#.
it's not too hard, but the complexity of the nml libraries alone makes it hard.
and c# wont wrap python stuff.
you might want to look at rcslib first
that still has some c++ for win in it..
C# dosent imply windows.
mono on linux works pretty much as good..
almost every action you take consists of creating a short-lived C++ object and passing it to the 'write' method of the command channel object
alanb said he wants to import a dll..
alex_joni: I suspect that's just because he's not familiar with the unix lingo
it dosent matter they work the same was as linux libraries..
I am using c# under mono on ubuntu 8.04
* alex_joni retracts what he said earlier :)
hm.. might be worthwhile to look at rcslib..
[20:35:00] <anonimasu> http://www.mono-project.com/Interop_with_Native_Libraries
alanb: unless you've already read it :)
anonimasu: for linux it'll be probably not much different from libnml
yeah, specifically this part: "Note that a C ABI is assumed. This makes it nearly impossible to directly invoke functions that are not C ABI compatible, such as C++ library functions that are not extern "C"."
what I stuck on was all the #defined stuff..
(there is no useful 'extern "C"' interface to nml; it's all C++)
sending an nml message consists of creating an instance of a C++ object, populating it, and then passing it to the method of another C++ object.
well, you can always write a c wrapper although that's a bit of a pain.
around each c++ object/method?
to create a C-linkage nml interface you could do worse than looking at halui -- there are a large number simple functions to send nml message, such as sendMachineOn(). http://cvs.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/emc2/src/emc/usr_intf/halui.cc?rev=1.60
there are a half dozen copies of xemc like that - all different, I'm sure
I think someone tried to recombine all of them once - don't remember the details
.. a few dozen of those, plus one monster function to get status buffer information and put it in a dumb C structure, and you're "done"
* anonimasu is talking to someone off the mono project about interop
cradek: it's in usr_intf somewhere..
[20:41:56] <jepler> http://cvs.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/emc2/src/emc/usr_intf/shcom.cc?rev=1.8;content-type=text%2Fplain
hm.. forget about trying to interop c++ with c#.
there seems to be something called swig for generating c# wrappers for c++
jepler: yeah, that's it
shcom.cc isn't presently available as a library, but it sure could be in a future release..
(it's just statically linked into the programs that use it)
apparently you can just wrap the libary you want with SWIG..
and use it like you would use a managed library, without any changes
shcom covers sending commands but doesn't seem to cover accessing stat buffer information
[20:47:39] <anonimasu> http://www.freeswitch.org/
uses it for generating a few thousand lines of interop code
* jepler repeatedly types and then deletes snark about how C# should have thought about C++ interoperability at its inception
the issue with that is name mangling :/
oh, I fully know that it's not just a matter of snapping your fingers
it's a very hard issue
but the language itself should have a better answer than "sorry, it has to be a C ABI and POD structures"
it's nice if there are packages like swig to try to bridge the gap
I'm going to try swig sometime this week
* anonimasu is a sucker for a heidenhain clone ui
(but I've personally never had good experience with swig (5+ years ago) and that's why the python wrapper for emc's nml interface is hand written)
* anonimasu nods
I miss the ability to do programming at the control when using emc for drilling some holes and facing(without a text editor)
well, swig might work
but I dont hold any big hopes for it :)
Im sorry if this is stupid question (ive just looked at shcom.cc) Can I not just take that file + its headers and code files and compile into a library then wrap that a la interop
alanb: that's certainly someplace to start
.. and you have to start somewhere
Thanks for the info, one more simple question. Ive looked at emcmodule.cc but do not understand what PyObject_HEAD is doing in several structs. I assume its defined in Python.h but that header is not in the emc source (or a search couldnt find it)
bye for now and thanks again for the info