#emc | Logs for 2008-08-09

[00:15:38] <owad> Rather than MDF, I ended up getting five 6' pieces 1" square steel tube, for the router table
[00:21:12] <anonimasu_> robin: depends on your drive
[00:21:57] <anonimasu_> robin_sz: if it's a drive with tach feedback there's a tach feedback loop too.. I think
[00:38:22] <jmkasunich> owad: is 1" gonna be stiff enough?
[00:38:49] <jmkasunich> I suspect that you could set the ends of one of those on blocks, step in the middle, and get an inch of deflection with not even your entire weight
[00:39:46] <owad> I'll try that
[00:41:26] <jmkasunich> it is very easy to get into a "how stiff is stiff 'enough'" mode, and I'll be the first to admit I don't know how stiff a router table needs to be
[00:41:37] <jmkasunich> I have a tendency to overbuild things
[00:41:42] <ds2> build it on a surface table
[00:41:47] <ds2> that ought to be 'stiff' :P
[00:41:57] <jmkasunich> ds2: its already built
[00:42:05] <owad> I can. But if I stand on two, I get almost no deflection. I'm going to have 5, and will only be putting wood on top of it
[00:42:06] <jmkasunich> it just needs the worktable
[00:42:22] <ds2> then use one granite table from an old CMM
[00:42:28] <jmkasunich> owad - that kind of hands on test is worth more than an hour of me talking ;-)
[00:42:59] <ds2> be sure to get a precision level on one end and check for deflection by pushing on the far end ;)
[00:43:54] <owad> and since it's steel, I'll be able to tap holes, rather than trying to use those threaded inserts
[00:44:00] <owad> I think this'll last a lot longer
[00:44:04] <jmkasunich> yeah
[00:44:22] <jmkasunich> are you going to put MDF on top, or just use the rails by themselves as your table?
[00:44:24] <ds2> but steel can only be so stiff ;)
[00:44:46] <owad> I can't decide.
[00:45:15] <jmkasunich> how thick is the wall of your steel tubes?
[00:45:37] <owad> I'm going to have _some_ sort of sacrificial material betweent the steel and the workpiece, so probably a full sheet of MDF
[00:45:40] <jmkasunich> I'm remembering some 1" home depot tube that had less than 1/16" wall
[00:47:55] <owad> this measures .068"
[00:48:41] <jmkasunich> not a lot of thread
[00:49:02] <owad> I was thinking I'd go through both layers
[00:49:15] <jmkasunich> you won't get any strength from the far side
[00:49:41] <owad> hmm
[00:49:45] <jmkasunich> two sheets of metal with air between them, when you tighten the second sheet bends a tiny bit, and the first one takes all the load
[00:50:57] <ds2> riv nuts!
[00:51:00] <ds2> pem nuts!
[00:51:02] <jmkasunich> exactly
[00:51:21] <jmkasunich> I was just looking in mcmaster - $8.02 for 25, 1/4-20
[00:51:58] <jmkasunich> 2 boxes would let you put 10 nuts in each of 5 rails, that would mean a nut every 4.8"
[00:52:48] <owad> I've never used riv nuts. Are they difficult to install?
[00:52:59] <jmkasunich> with an installer tool, not at all
[00:52:59] <ds2> depends
[00:53:12] <ds2> if you have a tool, easy.. if you use a bolt and wrench, it could get tricky
[00:53:16] <jmkasunich> they can be a pain to install without the tool, by inserting a screw and tightening
[00:53:50] <owad> another thing I was thinking about is steel piping
[00:54:04] <ds2> 25 1/4-20 with stuff left over for $9.99 @ harbor frieght
[00:54:20] <ds2> (assortment pack of 6-32,8-32.10-24. and 1/4-20)
[00:54:20] <jmkasunich> stuff?
[00:54:23] <jmkasunich> oh
[00:55:02] <ds2> or get the tool with 10 1/4-20's for $16.99!
[00:55:36] <owad> which one? I'm seeing a lot of rivetrs
[00:55:48] <ds2> 1210 is one
[00:56:03] <ds2> 94100 is the combo one that claims to also do rivets
[00:56:28] <ds2> fwiw, the 6-32's tend to strip instead of set with the tool :(
[00:58:39] <owad> ds2: with which one?
[00:58:58] <ds2> I have the 1210; so that one... donno about the 94100
[00:59:03] <ds2> the bigger ones seems to work okay
[01:02:40] <fenn> dont get hardware from harbor freight
[01:03:02] <fenn> it's made of chewing gum
[01:03:20] <jmkasunich> get the $16.99 tool from HF, then get the rivnuts from mcmaster
[01:04:33] <owad> Is something wrong with the HF rivets?
[01:04:48] <ds2> if it is important, don't use the HF rivnets
[01:05:02] <ds2> they will hold up initially...just further on down...
[01:05:32] <jmkasunich> owad - their steel has more in common with cheddar cheese than real steel
[01:05:40] <jmkasunich> * jmkasunich <- fastener snob
[01:05:52] <ds2> stop insulting chedder cheese.. ;)
[01:06:29] <owad> Think any place local is likely to have them? I can't find them in Lowe's catalog
[01:06:42] <jmkasunich> have rivnuts?
[01:06:56] <owad> yes
[01:07:04] <jmkasunich> hard to say - dunno where you are, but unless you are very impatient, just order from mcmaster
[01:07:07] <ds2> I've seen it at some industrial surplus places
[02:20:11] <cradek> jmkasunich: can this kind of motor run safely at a range of rpms? It doesn't have a "max" marking. http://timeguy.com/cradek-files/emc/spindle-motor.jpg
[02:21:15] <jmkasunich> within limits ;-)
[02:21:32] <skunkworks> you might need external cooling..
[02:21:42] <jmkasunich> the low end is limited by cooling - as built, the motor is cooled by a shaft mounted fan, if you slow it down you will lose cooling
[02:21:52] <cradek> ah
[02:21:53] <jmkasunich> as sam says, you can fix that with a external constant speed fan
[02:22:02] <jmkasunich> at the high end, the limits are mechanical
[02:22:28] <jmkasunich> from zero to "base speed" (the nameplate 60Hz speed) you have constant torque, so HP is proportional to speed
[02:22:36] <jmkasunich> above base speed, you have constant HP
[02:22:45] <jmkasunich> how far above base speed you can go depends on two things
[02:23:01] <jmkasunich> 1) mechanical limits (balance, flying apart, etc)
[02:24:23] <jmkasunich> 2) breakdown torque - as speed goes up, the nominal torque drops, to maintain constant HP - but the breakdown torque (the torque at which the motor "stalls") drops even faster
[02:24:45] <jmkasunich> you should be able to get 2:1 constant power range without much trouble, 4:1 is not uncommon
[02:25:06] <jmkasunich> since the motor is low RPM to start with, you most likely won't hit mechanical issues for at _least_ 2:1 as well
[02:25:17] <skunkworks> 1) mechanical limits (balance, flying apart, bearings etc)
[02:25:35] <jmkasunich> right, forgot bearings
[02:26:21] <jmkasunich> you probably will want to _remove_ the shaft mounted fan and rely on an external fan for cooling, at least if you are going above base speed
[02:26:37] <jmkasunich> shaft mounted fans consume HP (and generate noise) as the cube of the speed
[02:26:55] <cradek> whoah
[02:26:56] <jmkasunich> so it provides inadequate cooling below nominal speed, and turns power into noise above base speed
[02:27:17] <jmkasunich> the original design was constant speed, so it wasn't an issue
[02:27:25] <cradek> the two gear ratios I have are 4:1 with each other
[02:27:35] <jmkasunich> you're golden then
[02:28:27] <cradek> so if I want 3000 rpm top (original spec), I should set the varispeed so it's 3000 when the motor is at about what - 1500?
[02:28:29] <jmkasunich> you can go for 2:1 constant power and 2:1 constant torque, which will give you 1HP at the bottom of each range, going to 2HP and the middle of each range, and remaining constant up to the top where you shift
[02:28:38] <jmkasunich> hmm
[02:28:58] <jmkasunich> you aren't planning to increase the nominal top speed (probably a good idea)
[02:29:13] <cradek> no, 3000 is fast enough
[02:29:24] <jmkasunich> but you can increase the motor speed (don't have to, but if you use the vfd to _decrease_ the motor speed, you lose HP)
[02:29:29] <jmkasunich> so, what to do....
[02:29:57] <jmkasunich> the varispeed was about 4:1 range?
[02:30:18] <jmkasunich> so overall you had 4:1 in low, then shift and 4:1 in high, total 16:1?
[02:30:27] <cradek> the ranges were 150-750, 600-3000
[02:30:33] <cradek> so varispeed was 5:1
[02:30:42] <jmkasunich> ok, and they got some overlap
[02:31:00] <jmkasunich> you are content with the existing range, right?
[02:31:24] <jmkasunich> but you don't want to use the varispeed because you want EMC to be able to control the speed
[02:31:27] <cradek> yes. in fact I doubt I will use low range much.
[02:31:31] <cradek> right
[02:31:53] <jmkasunich> how did the old control vary speed? actuators for the varispeed? or was that manual?
[02:32:10] <cradek> it ran the varispeed with a ballscrew
[02:32:31] <jmkasunich> is that mechanical stuff (including motor) still there?
[02:32:44] <cradek> yes
[02:32:48] <jmkasunich> why not use it?
[02:33:06] <cradek> I want css
[02:33:12] <jmkasunich> yeah, so?
[02:33:23] <skunkworks> sounds like a job for hal.. ;)
[02:33:25] <cradek> bleh
[02:33:28] <jmkasunich> EMC should be able to control that
[02:34:22] <jmkasunich> ok, enough of that
[02:34:52] <jmkasunich> you'll have to decide how much of the 4:1 speed range you want to get by going below base speed, and how much by going over
[02:35:13] <jmkasunich> (also, how much, if any, overlap between ranges - that will increase the range the VFD needs to provide)
[02:35:51] <jmkasunich> then you run the motor at whatever you intend its max speed to be (say 2200), and adjust the varispeed till the spindle is doing 3000, then leave it
[02:36:27] <jmkasunich> note that increasing the motor speed will increase the speed of everything in the drivetrain that used to be constant speed - belts included
[02:36:50] <jmkasunich> that means more power loss to belt friction, and more belt wear, not that either of those should be too severe
[02:37:24] <jmkasunich> you really will get more power at the spindle if you use the varispeed in addition to the VFD, but that can be a later enhancement
[02:39:48] <cradek> brb
[02:40:03] <jmkasunich> ditto - time for another round of scrapinf
[02:40:04] <jmkasunich> g
[03:23:01] <jmkasunich> goodnight
[03:54:07] <cradek> jmkasunich: a big problem with varispeed is it has to be running to change. that means no starting at a slow speed if you were previously at a fast speed. I think it would be enough of an ongoing pain in the neck that it's worth even losing some range and/or power.
[03:54:32] <cradek> for an unusual setup I could still always change it.
[03:54:34] <jmkasunich> ah
[03:54:42] <jmkasunich> yeah
[03:54:46] <jmkasunich> one thing I meant to bring up
[03:54:58] <jmkasunich> you said "I don't think I'll even use the low range"
[03:55:00] <jmkasunich> don't be so sure
[03:55:13] <cradek> I might just leave it as-is and have a hardwired switch to change it.
[03:55:14] <jmkasunich> lathes sometimes spin big stuff (far bigger than any milling cutter)
[03:55:31] <cradek> yes definitely true.
[03:55:32] <jmkasunich> if you are working on something 6-8" in diameter, you won't want to be spinning too fast
[03:56:41] <jmkasunich> 200 RPM at 6" is 314 SPFM - HSS in steel would be toast, HSS in aluminum would be pushing it - that is well into carbide territory
[03:57:50] <cradek> interesting that the slowest speed (150) is still pretty fast. I think this lathe is meant for pretty small stuff.
[03:57:57] <cradek> it is a chucker after all
[04:00:22] <jmkasunich> goodnight for real now (last time was going to walk the dog)
[04:00:26] <cradek> goodnight
[04:01:02] <mozroute> I'm setting up my first emc2 machine now
[04:01:48] <mozroute> latency-test gives me a max jitter of 26484 on the servo thread
[04:02:58] <mozroute> now it just jumped to 39143
[04:03:53] <mozroute> I'm using a 1.8 GHz motherboard with an old ATI Rage II+ video card
[04:04:17] <mozroute> What should I look at to decrease the jitter?
[04:04:44] <cradek> did you turn off all the power saving options in the system bios?
[04:05:07] <mozroute> Hmmm, I don't remember. I'll check that in a minute
[04:05:49] <cradek> what video driver are you using?
[04:06:23] <cradek> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?TroubleShooting#RTAI_Latency_test
[04:06:41] <cradek> some stuff here, some is more up to date than other
[04:06:50] <mozroute> I'm not sure. Xorg.conf doesn't say! I haven't seen that before...
[04:06:58] <mozroute> I'm using Xubuntu 8.04 BTW
[04:07:02] <cradek> yeah that's a new "feature" of xorg
[04:07:16] <cradek> I bet you can find in /var/log/Xorg.log
[04:07:22] <mozroute> Guess I'll look in the log file...
[04:07:28] <cradek> it might be worth it to try forcing Driver "vesa"
[04:08:39] <mozroute> Looks like it's using ati_drv and mach64_drv
[04:08:48] <mozroute> the card is a mach64
[04:09:05] <mozroute> Can vesa do resolution over 1024?
[04:09:09] <cradek> I'm a little surprised there's still a driver for those
[04:09:16] <cradek> sure
[04:09:39] <cradek> vesa is generally slower. it will be an interesting data point if nothing else.
[04:10:28] <mozroute> ok. I'll try changing the driver and check the BIOS. I'll have to reboot to do that, so I'll see you later. Maybe tomorrow since it's pretty late here
[04:10:42] <cradek> here too. goodnight.
[04:25:19] <mozroute> Looks like the jitter went down to 13283 with the vesa driver
[04:25:51] <mozroute> but the screen doesn't look near as good. It's darker and grainier
[04:26:44] <mozroute> I did have power save disabled in the BIOS
[05:15:14] <toast> durrr
[05:16:11] <fenn> wot
[05:16:20] <toast> tru
[16:43:46] <cradek> so hostmot2 does have step generation?
[16:50:05] <fragalot> untill i'm able to fetch a 24DC psu, i can just use a computer PSU to drive 12V steppers,.. it 'l just be slower,.. right?
[16:51:00] <archivist_ub> basicly depends on the motors
[16:51:25] <fragalot> 12V .4A 4-lead bipolar 4W 1.8° stepper motor
[16:51:44] <fragalot> brant is ITC model ITC-CNC-1 (only found a french datasheet of it)
[16:52:09] <fragalot> silly bugger costed me 30 euro,.. expensive stores :'(
[18:01:07] <mozmck> hello
[18:36:45] <alex_joni> http://fantasticcontraption.com/
[18:51:55] <dushantch> alex_joni: thanks for the great link, your fault if I don't get no work done today
[18:52:21] <alex_joni> dushantch: yeah, I know how it is :D
[19:14:47] <jmkasunich> alex_joni: evil
[19:28:52] <dushantch> I can't pass stairs :(
[19:31:29] <alex_joni> * alex_joni is at big ball
[19:32:48] <dushantch> * dushantch is on big ball too after some hair pulling ofc
[19:43:13] <anonimasu> hm.. I'm not there yet
[19:43:16] <anonimasu> what stage is that?
[19:46:58] <dushantch> * dushantch passed it now :)
[19:47:23] <dushantch> dunno, doesn't say :)
[19:47:36] <dushantch> after stairs
[19:49:37] <jmkasunich> I just got to big-ball
[19:50:07] <archivist_ub> hmm seems a good job it didnt work on my pc
[19:50:18] <alex_joni> finally ..
[19:50:28] <alex_joni> * alex_joni passed big ball
[19:52:31] <dushantch> alex_joni: these 4 balls sre tough :)
[19:54:23] <anonimasu> im at around the bend
[19:55:26] <anonimasu> passed it
[19:55:27] <anonimasu> :)
[19:56:41] <alex_joni> dushantch: indeed.. did you pass it?
[19:57:20] <dushantch> alex_joni: not yet, now trying to make a carriage for them :)
[20:01:13] <anonimasu> mission to mars im at now
[20:05:21] <dushantch> anonimasu: just 2-3 more to hair pulling
[20:06:03] <anonimasu> heh
[20:06:08] <anonimasu> i think this one is hard enough
[20:08:18] <alex_joni> dushantch: wanna see something fun?
[20:08:29] <dushantch> alex_joni: yep
[20:08:57] <dushantch> alex_joni: I got them to the second side but can't get them in lake
[20:09:30] <alex_joni> http://imagebin.org/23899
[20:11:04] <dushantch> alex_joni: congrats, I'm cursed that I want the least clicks solution, also known as lazy
[20:11:12] <dushantch> alex_joni: does it work?
[20:12:06] <anonimasu> LOL
[20:12:07] <alex_joni> nope
[20:12:10] <alex_joni> not yet
[20:12:50] <anonimasu> up the staiers..
[20:12:52] <anonimasu> stairs..
[20:13:27] <alex_joni> I have one in the lake :D
[20:14:06] <dushantch> great
[20:14:31] <alex_joni> yes.. it worked !!!!
[20:14:35] <dushantch> mine is funnier, a beer whoever gets how it works :) http://imagebin.org/23900
[20:14:45] <alex_joni> * alex_joni already got it to work :D
[20:15:56] <anonimasu> heh
[20:18:16] <alex_joni> next is down under
[20:41:28] <dushantch> alex_joni: I had to do it my way: http://FantasticContraption.com/?designId=331059
[20:41:37] <dushantch> funny thou that it works
[20:41:49] <alex_joni> dushantch: bad paste?
[20:42:42] <dushantch> alex_joni: works for me, that's what you get when you register
[20:43:09] <anonimasu> works for me too
[20:43:11] <anonimasu> I didnt register
[20:43:44] <dushantch> I meant you can save position like that when you register
[20:49:10] <alex_joni> hmm.. didn't work for me :)
[20:52:14] <dushantch> alex_joni: http://imagebin.org/23901 this?
[20:57:25] <alex_joni> dushantch: nice
[20:57:30] <alex_joni> got to awash yet?
[20:57:44] <dushantch> nope, still down under
[20:58:06] <dushantch> trying to build a pendulum
[20:58:31] <jmkasunich> dang - I just managed to finish 4balls
[20:59:31] <archivist_ub> hmm not much going to be machined today
[20:59:42] <jmkasunich> nope
[20:59:56] <alex_joni> dushantch: hint: you need to make a moving pendulum
[21:00:06] <archivist_ub> I was only taking pics of my bits today
[21:02:41] <dushantch> alex_joni: am trying
[21:03:13] <dushantch> alex_joni: thank god I don't have much work today or this would really upset me
[21:03:56] <anonimasu> :)
[21:06:34] <alex_joni> it's close to midnight here :)
[21:10:36] <dushantch> alex_joni: here too
[21:13:31] <BigJohnT> time to go play with guns
[21:14:17] <BigJohnT> say goodnight gracie
[21:15:01] <dushantch> alex_joni: I've got 1/2 ball in but can't get further :)
[21:17:54] <alex_joni> in awash?
[21:19:16] <jmkasunich> I beat down under
[21:21:21] <dushantch> congrats
[21:21:49] <dushantch> I'm always close, but can't get the whole ball in, just a part
[21:21:49] <alex_joni> * alex_joni thinks awash is harder
[21:22:04] <jmkasunich> nah
[21:22:06] <jmkasunich> done
[21:22:11] <alex_joni> jmkasunich: really?
[21:22:13] <jmkasunich> yep
[21:22:17] <alex_joni> hrmm
[21:22:42] <jmkasunich> want a hint?
[21:23:17] <alex_joni> sure
[21:23:30] <alex_joni> not anymore :D
[21:23:38] <jmkasunich> dig like a worm - yellow wheels on bottom, pink ones on top
[21:24:28] <alex_joni> http://imagebin.org/23902
[21:24:31] <jmkasunich> oh boy, "handling" looks tough
[21:24:32] <alex_joni> that's what I had
[21:24:55] <jmkasunich> I had about 6 pink wheels on top, otherwise similar
[21:26:35] <dushantch> cmon I'm still on down under
[21:30:02] <dushantch> I couldn't get more elegant than this http://FantasticContraption.com/?designId=331774
[21:34:44] <jmkasunich> ha, beat handling
[21:35:16] <alex_joni> jmkasunich: cool.. I'm still struggling
[21:35:54] <alex_joni> jmkasunich: only 3 levels left
[21:40:16] <alex_joni> jmkasunich: how did you do handling?
[21:40:31] <jmkasunich> two cars, one going right, one left
[21:40:50] <jmkasunich> the right one had a wooden floor that caught the falling thing that I had to carry
[21:41:04] <jmkasunich> both had chains tied to corners of the thing
[21:41:17] <jmkasunich> when the chains came tight they pulled it upright again
[21:41:31] <jmkasunich> had to tweak lengths to get it upright at the same place
[21:48:04] <JymmmEMC> what game is that?
[21:48:24] <jmkasunich> http://FantasticContraption.com/
[21:48:36] <JymmmEMC> ah cool.
[21:48:57] <JymmmEMC> Ironically, I JUST found (MS-DOS) Increadable Machine last week
[21:50:03] <JymmmEMC> Well, got the safe moved over... now too tired to even look at it =)
[21:50:07] <dushantch> jmkasunich: 1 car stupid but works solution http://FantasticContraption.com/?designId=332094
[21:50:38] <alex_joni> finally :D
[21:50:55] <alex_joni> dushantch: those links don't work for me
[21:51:04] <jmkasunich> or me
[21:51:37] <anonimasu> but me
[21:51:48] <dushantch> :)
[21:51:57] <dushantch> I use firefox
[21:52:03] <jmkasunich> so do I
[21:52:17] <alex_joni> hmm.. tube seems hard
[21:52:54] <jmkasunich> it is
[21:53:44] <dushantch> I tried and works in other browser, copy/paste :(
[21:57:07] <jmkasunich> I get a screen complaining about flash version, when I bypass that it just starts the game again, without showing me your thing
[21:57:38] <a-l-p-h-a> anyone know anything about solaris?
[21:58:46] <Dallur1> a-l-p-ha: I know some solaris, whats up ?
[22:01:26] <alex_joni> jmkasunich: so far all I managed was to get it out of the house zone
[22:01:29] <alex_joni> just barely
[22:01:35] <dushantch> me too
[22:02:42] <alex_joni> dushantch: tube?
[22:02:51] <dushantch> yep
[22:02:52] <jmkasunich> ha, I got it!
[22:03:36] <alex_joni> jmkasunich: how?
[22:03:55] <alex_joni> ah, don't tell me
[22:03:58] <alex_joni> I think I know
[22:04:10] <jmkasunich> two yellow wheels against the right wall, two pink against the left, brace the bottom yellow against that lump down there
[22:04:21] <a-l-p-h-a> Dallur, trying to ssh to a solaris box, with putty, and the home and end keys are giving me ~
[22:04:35] <jmkasunich> vertical links, and angled cross links, such that weight develops side force
[22:04:40] <jmkasunich> it crawls up the walls
[22:05:55] <Dallur1> a-l-p-h-a: what shell are you using on the solaris box ?
[22:07:12] <Dallur1> a-l-p-h-a: here is a detailed guide on how to rebind keys depending on which shell you are using:
[22:07:29] <dushantch> I tried with only 3 wheels
[22:10:59] <Dallur1> a-l-p-h-a: that link might not have the exact solution but essentially you might need to rebind the keys although if memory serves me right if you have bash on the solaris box everything should be passed through
[22:11:48] <Dallur1> a-l-p-h-a: that is if you have bash and are using it
[22:21:28] <alex_joni> jmkasunich: any luck with back and forth?
[22:21:36] <jmkasunich> not really
[22:21:49] <jmkasunich> I managed to grab the ball, but I can't carry it far
[22:21:55] <jmkasunich> and now I can't even grab it
[22:22:30] <a-l-p-h-a> Dallur, yeah, it's bash
[22:23:26] <a-l-p-h-a> Dallur, that link is for csh
[22:23:27] <a-l-p-h-a> not bash
[22:23:37] <Dallur1> alpha:
[22:23:53] <a-l-p-h-a> ? I could be wrong...
[22:23:58] <Dallur1> just edit ~/.bashrc and put in the following line:
[22:24:08] <Dallur1> bindkey "\e[1~" beginning-of-line
[22:24:13] <Dallur1> bindkey "\e[4~" end-of-line
[22:24:21] <Dallur1> those two lines should map end and home
[22:24:29] <alex_joni> I managed to get it to the right of the green.. but not up the slope
[22:25:04] <Dallur1> bindkey "\e[2~" overwrite-mode
[22:25:05] <a-l-p-h-a> bindkey doesn't exist on the server
[22:25:06] <a-l-p-h-a> wtf.
[22:25:08] <Dallur1> bindkey "\e[3~" delete-char
[22:25:19] <Dallur1> thats end and delete
[22:27:08] <a-l-p-h-a> hmm.
[22:27:09] <a-l-p-h-a> sec.
[22:28:55] <Dallur1> a-l-p-h-a: just use bind
[22:29:36] <a-l-p-h-a> just figured that out
[22:29:37] <a-l-p-h-a> hahaha
[22:29:37] <Dallur1> bind '"\e[4~":end-of-line'
[22:30:01] <Dallur1> a-l-p-h-a: all sorted out ?
[22:30:15] <a-l-p-h-a> trying
[22:32:05] <jmkasunich> got it!
[22:32:27] <a-l-p-h-a> no
[22:32:31] <a-l-p-h-a> jmkasunich, I'm stuck on higher
[22:32:56] <alex_joni> jmkasunich: I managed to throw the ball in the hole to the right
[22:33:08] <jmkasunich> higher? is that a level?
[22:33:15] <jmkasunich> I just got to umpossible
[22:33:24] <a-l-p-h-a> higher is a level.
[22:33:37] <jmkasunich> oh, I mixed you up with alex
[22:33:42] <alex_joni> got it too :)
[22:35:20] <a-l-p-h-a> Dallur, hmm... if after bind '"\e[4~":end-of-line'; and then I type "^" and then hit end it works.
[22:36:00] <Dallur1> a-l-p-h-a: but not loaded from .bashrc ?
[22:37:11] <a-l-p-h-a> is it now.!
[22:37:14] <a-l-p-h-a> Dallur, thank you!
[22:37:54] <Dallur1> a-l-p-h-a: np :)
[22:39:15] <a-l-p-h-a> this page is wicked. http://www.geocities.com/h2428/petar/bash_bind.htm
[22:42:40] <a-l-p-h-a> boo!!! alt-backspace didn't owrk
[22:42:53] <a-l-p-h-a> neither did backward-word/forward word
[22:46:59] <JymmmEMC> There's a reason for my hatered of electronic locks, and that just proved it!
[22:48:54] <anonimasu> jymm: what did?
[22:49:32] <JymmmEMC> Like most electronic locks, they have the battery compartment on the outside so you can change it if it's low.
[22:50:12] <JymmmEMC> Ok, if you enter in the wrong combination, there's a 2 second delay untill you can try it again.
[22:50:31] <JymmmEMC> If you enter in the wrong combination three times, it locks oyu out for five minutes.
[22:50:35] <JymmmEMC> with me so far?
[22:50:41] <anonimasu> yes
[22:52:27] <JymmmEMC> Now, if you open the battery compartment, it's a 9V battery. If you unclip the battery and just hold it in your hand you can hold the contact together with your fingertips
[22:53:10] <JymmmEMC> Noe, if every time you enter in a wrong combination, the second it says error, release the contacts and the 2S delay is removed, and completely voids the 5 minute lockout
[22:53:41] <JymmmEMC> what a piece of shit lock
[22:54:17] <JymmmEMC> I can get this thing open in a couple of hours if I had something to push the buttons for me.
[22:54:37] <JymmmEMC> it only has 100,000 possible combinations.
[22:56:08] <alex_joni> jmkasunich: any ideas?
[22:56:15] <jmkasunich> not really
[23:11:52] <jmkasunich> tried a catapult and a ramp - nothing seems able to get on top of the green platform
[23:14:12] <alex_joni> I got the ball ontop of the green platform
[23:14:22] <alex_joni> with a catapult like thingie
[23:14:35] <alex_joni> but I can't get it around the edge
[23:14:48] <alex_joni> and adding a chain makes it too heavy
[23:15:09] <anonimasu> jymm: well, locks can be picked..
[23:15:16] <anonimasu> normal ones too..
[23:27:52] <jmkasunich> well, I was able to lauch a "car" onto the roof
[23:28:01] <jmkasunich> of course it went flying off the far end
[23:29:48] <alex_joni> how did you launch it?
[23:30:15] <JymmmEMC> anonimasu: But you can't remove the two exposed screws, exposing the electronics, then look up the datasheets online in 10 minutes =)
[23:30:19] <jmkasunich> with a complicated ramp arrangment
[23:30:43] <jmkasunich> wheels don't have enough traction to climb the ramp
[23:30:55] <JymmmEMC> jmkasunich: url?
[23:31:04] <jmkasunich> so I put a pink wheel on the roof, and a second upside down ramp with weights on it
[23:31:12] <jmkasunich> http://FantasticContraption.com/?designId=331774
[23:31:13] <anonimasu> jymm: no, however it'd still take a few tries..
[23:31:53] <JymmmEMC> anonimasu: Yeah, but not minutes.
[23:32:09] <anonimasu> you are forgetting that they still need to guess.
[23:32:59] <JymmmEMC> anonimasu: With the electronics removed, there are three wires leaiding inside the safe. I'm just looking up the pinouts so I don't short out anything.
[23:33:30] <anonimasu> ok
[23:33:40] <anonimasu> :)
[23:34:33] <JymmmEMC> I'm not sure if you guys noticed, but you can connect to the outside of the pink wheels, and then it acts like a rotary piston sorta thing.
[23:34:46] <jmkasunich> yeah
[23:34:48] <JymmmEMC> k
[23:43:30] <alex_joni> argh
[23:44:27] <alex_joni> http://imagebin.org/23905
[23:44:51] <jmkasunich> heh
[23:45:28] <alex_joni> YES!!!!!!!!!
[23:45:31] <alex_joni> it worked :D
[23:45:41] <alex_joni> shorter wheels on the car :D
[23:46:07] <alex_joni> hmm.. there is nothing else after this
[23:46:09] <alex_joni> :/
[23:46:09] <jmkasunich> the car climbs the ramp while the other wheels are making the ramp go up?
[23:46:14] <alex_joni> yes
[23:46:24] <alex_joni> and the car is fastened to the end of the ramp
[23:46:27] <alex_joni> with the chain
[23:47:32] <alex_joni> * alex_joni just wasted 3h :(
[23:47:41] <jmkasunich> thats all?
[23:47:49] <alex_joni> yes
[23:47:51] <jmkasunich> 5+
[23:47:57] <alex_joni> if you say :D
[23:48:03] <jmkasunich> you posted the URL at 14:35, its now 19:35
[23:48:08] <jmkasunich> 19:46
[23:48:45] <alex_joni> 5:10
[23:48:54] <alex_joni> lets say 2h were justified