#emc | Logs for 2008-07-10

[00:08:07] <dmwaters> {global notice} Good day all, I have a fairly large rotation server that needs to be restarted, about 6000 users. This won't take long, but it will be a bit noisey. I apologize for the inconvenience. Thank you for your patience, and thank you for using freenode!
[00:09:36] <SWPadnos_> SWPadnos_ is now known as SWPadnos
[03:24:22] <chr0n1c> howdy!
[03:25:58] <chr0n1c> if anyones around that would know... what would replacing the speed control pot in my dremel with emc speed/off/on control? is it something like a few transistors or more involved?
[03:28:23] <jmkasunich> it would require some electronics skill, or documentation for the dremel control
[03:28:33] <chr0n1c> m'kay...
[03:28:53] <jmkasunich> it could very well be a matter of one or two parts
[03:29:04] <jmkasunich> the trick is knowing what parts and where to hook them
[03:29:05] <renesis> you need to reverse it or post a schema for anyone to give you help
[03:29:21] <chr0n1c> i have some electronics skill, though i am not a practicing EE, i did take 1 year of EE vocational school...
[03:29:24] <renesis> if its a signal level control pot, you can do almost anything
[03:29:53] <chr0n1c> the second year is what i'm missing i think ;0
[03:29:53] <renesis> if its a mains pot, then you have to build a high power switch controller module thinger
[03:30:03] <jmkasunich> but keep in mind that a dremel control is not isolated from the line
[03:30:07] <renesis> school doesnt matter
[03:30:17] <renesis> besides the big plastic knob
[03:30:20] <jmkasunich> renesis: exactly
[03:30:34] <renesis> its prob an scr with an RC pot controller
[03:30:43] <jmkasunich> a PhD in electrical engineering would be totally useless for the project at hand
[03:30:51] <renesis> thats really the only thing that small can handle that kind of power
[03:30:55] <chr0n1c> ok, so it's a knob, goeds from 5 to 10.
[03:30:58] <chr0n1c> goes*
[03:31:00] <renesis> oh
[03:31:00] <jmkasunich> a decent tech with a schematic of the circuit on the other hand.....
[03:31:04] <renesis> yeah school doesnt matter
[03:31:10] <renesis> doing this shit until its 2nd nature does
[03:31:37] <chr0n1c> i may tear it apart when i am bored and see how it's wired up
[03:31:40] <renesis> phd in engineering dont mean you can use a scope or a dmm or reverse a circuit or solder or even do design
[03:31:44] <jmkasunich> crap, it got late when I wasn't looking
[03:31:52] <renesis> sucks
[03:31:58] <chr0n1c> i know how to use a scope and own a nice dmm
[03:31:59] <jmkasunich> I officially hate Nautlis
[03:32:12] <chr0n1c> and i can cnc my own circuit boards...
[03:32:21] <renesis> then youre prob worth more as a tech than 80% of engineers
[03:32:29] <chr0n1c> but i'm not big on jumping in on a mystery dremel speed control
[03:32:40] <renesis> google for docs
[03:32:49] <renesis> im sure someone else has posted a dremel teardown
[03:32:59] <renesis> if you can find pics at least, people can offer more help
[03:33:30] <chr0n1c> i remember seeing one somewhere, now the trick is combing the entire internet and finding it again
[03:33:46] <chr0n1c> * a tear down that is
[03:34:12] <chr0n1c> i'd look but i got a 22 mb gcode file running
[03:34:15] <chr0n1c> :D
[03:34:59] <chr0n1c> irc is pretty low cpu using, firefox on the other hand isn't....
[03:36:00] <chr0n1c> 1"x1"x.032 is the limits of this code and it's 22 mb?
[03:36:53] <chr0n1c> a reverse image of a sunflower on the backside of lexan in 3d with a .003 tipped v engraving cutter!
[03:38:24] <chr0n1c> i have lots of free time to come up with wild ideas like the speed control thing while this kinda code is running
[03:39:37] <dgar> what depth of cut do you make in the lexan for that engraving? how many passes?
[03:41:16] <chr0n1c> 1 pass between +.003" and -.029", .003" in y per pass from x0" to x1.0"
[03:42:09] <chr0n1c> with 0.0 in Z being the top of the stock
[03:43:18] <chr0n1c> it's just going back and fourth in X and moving up in y each pass .003 and z is moving on the fly
[03:43:53] <dgar> like a raster scan -- what feed rate and how long total does it take?
[03:47:29] <chr0n1c> too long, about 3-4 ipm, because i am running the dremel really slow, because it's almost quiet this slow.
[03:48:34] <dgar> i know the problem -- hearing protectors with built-in-radio is my solution. What dremel spindle speed?
[03:48:37] <chr0n1c> it should be a really nice cut.
[03:49:20] <chr0n1c> it's at 5, it MIGHT be 8,000 rpm
[03:50:31] <dgar> Any photos of finished engravings?
[03:53:47] <chr0n1c> http://ohiopctech.com @ http://ohiopctech.com/cpg/ & http://flickr.com/ohioptech
[03:53:52] <chr0n1c> :D
[03:54:40] <chr0n1c> hmm...
[03:55:41] <chr0n1c> i haven't really done any engravings in a while
[03:55:55] <chr0n1c> nothing serious anyways...
[03:56:47] <tomp2> http://members.cox.net/berniekm/dremel.html some insights to the dremel by looking at a hack
[03:57:56] <chr0n1c> thanks tomp2, bookmarking now.
[03:59:21] <chr0n1c> so apparently this brand name small rotary tool knockoff doesn't have much torque at 8,000 rpms so i can't push it much faster.
[03:59:28] <chr0n1c> 3-4 ipm max
[04:00:13] <tomp2> forget dremel, get a Dumore ( what's found in machine shops )
[04:00:31] <chr0n1c> word, we got a tool post grinder
[04:00:43] <chr0n1c> *lathe
[12:30:24] <archivist> I was waiting for you to wake anonimasu :)
[12:30:34] <anonimasu> howcome?
[12:30:49] <archivist> help promote in there
[17:40:01] <Roguish> helllllpppppp me please. new install of hardy, screen locks up after login before desktop appears.....
[17:40:36] <Roguish> been thru everything i know. even reinstalled ubuntu-desktop.
[18:01:55] <dgar2> I did more tests on delayed response of joypad in hardy-rtai described:
[18:02:00] <dgar2> http://pastebin.ca/1068287
[18:02:00] <dgar2> Event responses seem to be quantized on a large interval of 248 mS
[18:02:00] <dgar2> Wondering if anyone else is using a joypad/joystick on hardy-rtai?
[18:24:08] <BigJohnT> I'm using joysticks on 6.06 sorry, I can't help
[18:24:19] <BigJohnT> gotta love new things :)
[20:18:21] <alex_joni> dgar2: sounds like a real pita
[20:29:51] <dgar2> it is -- but i relearned how to compile a kernel module and other things
[20:30:12] <dgar2> i will post a question to the rtai mail list next
[20:38:51] <alex_joni> dgar2: did you find anything?
[20:39:17] <alex_joni> btw, you said this happens even if you don't load any rtai modules.. right?
[20:44:03] <dgar2> I found the joypad event timing quantized in units of 248 mS on my machine
[20:44:03] <dgar2> http://pastebin.ca/1068287
[20:44:03] <dgar2> I don't start emc2 for these tests so i think that means no rtai modules are loaded(?)
[20:44:03] <dgar2> I can't check now as I am running dapper on the machine at the moment
[20:52:09] <chr0n1c> i got an xbox360 joypad working in hardy, but i haven't set it up to jog EMC2 yet... it seems uber-sensitive like just breathing on the joysticks sends a number
[20:52:24] <chr0n1c> so i might not be in the same ballpark as you, dgar
[20:56:14] <dgar2> I test without running emc:
[20:56:14] <dgar2> In a terminal window:
[20:56:14] <dgar2> $ alias tjs='cat /dev/input/js0|dd ibs=1 obs=1 count=20000|xxd -c 8'
[20:56:14] <dgar2> $ tjs
[20:56:14] <dgar2> then push buttons or move sticks to see response/delay (/dev/input/js0 is the joystick device on my machine)
[20:57:04] <chr0n1c> so you're just getting uS's of delay?
[20:57:12] <chr0n1c> (microseconds)
[20:57:33] <chr0n1c> or bigger #'s like whole seconds
[20:58:03] <dgar2> 248 mS (millisecond) quantization. if you press and realease in less than 248mS the event isn't seen
[20:58:22] <dgar2> all slower presses appear at intervals that are integer multiples of 248 mS
[21:00:13] <alex_joni> * alex_joni is off to bed
[21:00:16] <alex_joni> good night all
[21:00:42] <dgar2> alex_joni: If no rtai modules are loaded, does that mean the behavior is due to something in the kernel config file? or could it be related to the rtai patch?
[21:00:57] <dgar2> alex_joni: good night
[21:01:12] <alex_joni> dgar2: I somehow doubt it's the rtai patch
[21:01:17] <alex_joni> it's rather a config issue
[21:01:32] <alex_joni> but I'll be building a new CD sometimes soon.. maybe next weekend
[21:01:37] <alex_joni> with a new rtai+patch
[21:01:49] <alex_joni> (hopefully it'll work :D)
[21:02:23] <alex_joni> dgar2: thanks for looking at this in such detail ..
[21:02:33] <alex_joni> * alex_joni is spent.. see you tomorrow
[21:02:50] <chr0n1c> see ya alex
[21:03:50] <chr0n1c> i don't really have a clue as to what may be causing the delay... i did play a couple games with my xbox360 wired controller it seems to be working as it should.
[21:04:27] <chr0n1c> i mean everything from the shortest button tap you can give it to holding the button down for a whole minute all act as they should
[21:05:59] <chr0n1c> on a side note: mixing yellow and blue dishsoap together makes some neato green coolant for cutting lexan ;)
[21:06:17] <chr0n1c> it's like ectoplasmic in color
[21:06:28] <anonimasu> lol
[21:06:32] <anonimasu> I buy mine already green
[21:07:10] <chr0n1c> right on, we use yellow stuff in the grinder at work... and some nasty brown stuff for the mills
[21:07:27] <dgar2> chr0n1c: your tests are on hardy, running 2.6.24-16-rtai ?
[21:07:30] <anonimasu> the stuff I use at work is oil + water based coolant
[21:07:36] <chr0n1c> dgar2, yes
[21:08:05] <chr0n1c> dgar2, it's not using the normal joypad drivers though, i am using an xbox360 driver that i compiled myself
[21:08:14] <chr0n1c> so that may be the difference
[21:08:34] <dgar2> ok , thanks -- what is the module name?
[21:08:45] <chr0n1c> uhh 1 sec...
[21:09:57] <chr0n1c> cd /home/chr0n1c/xboxdrv-linux-0.2
[21:10:11] <chr0n1c> sudo ./xboxdrv --id 0
[21:10:27] <chr0n1c> that's the script that starts it up
[21:11:14] <chr0n1c> so i guess it's called "xboxdrv" i have to run that script before i can use the xbox360 usb joypad
[21:11:28] <chr0n1c> there is another called xpad (but it's the suck)
[21:12:19] <chr0n1c> i jsut got a box from mouse with a bunch of sexy little parts in it ;)
[21:12:23] <chr0n1c> mouser*
[21:12:44] <dgar2> i'm not familiar with it, looking in google i see an xboxdrv referenced as userspace. do you know if there is a kernel module associated with it?
[21:13:15] <chr0n1c> no, it's just userspace as far as i know...
[21:13:38] <chr0n1c> i am lucky to have even compiled it, but it would be nice if it could be a kernel module
[21:13:56] <dgar2> does it show up if you do $ lsmod | grep xbox ?
[21:14:03] <chr0n1c> lol, i don't have a whole lotta luck compiling things on this 64 bit machine
[21:14:18] <chr0n1c> lemme plug it in and try
[21:20:31] <chr0n1c> ... i need to add modprobe joydev & modprobe uinput to my script...
[21:20:52] <chr0n1c> can i just add this script to /etc/init.d/ ?
[21:21:36] <chr0n1c> dgar2, it does NOT show up when i grep
[21:24:04] <chr0n1c> it does give you a fancy readout of every number that the controller sends in the terminal though.
[21:24:33] <chr0n1c> it's instantly displayed when i do anything with the controller
[21:26:09] <chr0n1c> i've gone as far as to test it with hal, but never finished setting it up because of mass confusion with .hal files and decided i would put it down and come back another time
[21:26:49] <dgar2> so that is different behavior than mine, i imagine uinput is handling the device, a useful clue perhaps
[21:28:02] <ds2> anyone machined 17-4PH (the stuff in the hardware store "Stainless fasteners")?
[21:29:18] <chr0n1c> nope, i used to do a lotta parts in A-514 (sucked)
[21:29:45] <chr0n1c> only stainless i played with is 300-400 series
[21:30:07] <ds2> all I want to do is add some holes to them and hw store stainless seems to be the least work (easy to find, has most of the features already)
[21:30:24] <ds2> I can find reports on machining 300/400 series stuff
[21:30:34] <chr0n1c> it should cut like butta with a sharp HSS cutter
[21:30:47] <chr0n1c> or go carbide if you have a lotta work
[21:31:00] <ds2> nope, just 4 holes in 4 peices
[21:31:21] <ds2> sounds like you think it should be fine with stock HSS drill bits?
[21:31:27] <chr0n1c> stainless gets hot quick! so use coolant
[21:31:39] <chr0n1c> coolant or oil
[21:31:43] <chr0n1c> for drilling
[21:32:24] <ds2> Hmmm so no hand held drills?
[21:32:50] <chr0n1c> sure, just don't hold close to the holes
[21:32:53] <ds2> my only experience with SS is 416 and that stuff machines almost like 12L14
[21:32:54] <chr0n1c> ;)
[21:32:57] <ds2> haha
[21:40:18] <chr0n1c> so i made some blade guides for the bandsaw we had sitting in the middle of the shop for a year and never turned on. it'a do-all with an adjustable compound angle table. so that is sweet that we can use it now.
[21:40:54] <chr0n1c> it took a whole 30 minutes to finish the deal and because of that it had sat un-used for a year
[21:42:44] <ds2> those are nice, is this the variable speed model?
[21:44:18] <chr0n1c> yes! although i will need to be making a new knob for the adjuster since the casting is broke off and it takes forever to turn it with NO knob
[21:45:17] <ds2> does the variable speed mechanism work? the local JC has one of those but the variable speed stuff is so worn that we were told to not adjust it
[21:45:48] <chr0n1c> yup, i played with it today after i got her running
[21:46:07] <ds2> very very nice
[21:46:31] <ds2> what's the main use for it now that it isback in service?
[21:47:26] <chr0n1c> uhhh, my home projects? lol... or maybe some stamping dies.
[21:47:52] <ds2> Oh this is YOUR shop, not the shop you work in?
[21:48:04] <chr0n1c> i even said... "i think we should get this bandsaw running today. i have some projects at home i wasnt to use it for."
[21:48:24] <chr0n1c> nooo.. it's not my shop...
[21:48:31] <ds2> wasn't sure if it was a work saw that you will get to use or ....
[21:48:42] <chr0n1c> but it's like a 5 minute walk from my house and i work there.
[21:48:56] <ds2> oh so the work folks don't really need it
[21:49:09] <chr0n1c> they do need it
[21:49:19] <chr0n1c> nobody ever took the time to fix it though
[21:49:33] <ds2> fun
[21:49:43] <chr0n1c> we have another old bandsaw for cutting bars and big plates...
[21:50:12] <chr0n1c> it's a pain to cut anything small with tough
[21:51:45] <chr0n1c> so if it had a .375" blade on it instead of the 1" it would be even better
[21:52:19] <chr0n1c> the blades are 13 feet long and it has a built in welder that i haven't tried yet
[21:54:48] <chr0n1c> OH! i could cnc the compund angles on the table of the bandsaw.
[21:55:12] <chr0n1c> compound?
[21:55:53] <ds2> are you having a pool on when the bandsaw automatically converted to a friction saw?
[21:57:38] <chr0n1c> hmmm... you want in? we could make a pool for who is going to break the first tooth on the brand spankin' new expensive 13' bi-metal die blade.
[21:57:47] <ds2> :)
[21:58:23] <ds2> the JC burns out blades rapidly just cuz the students are too lazy to move the step pulley to match the material speed
[21:58:52] <ds2> one guy cuts aluminum and sets it for aluminum then the next one cuts tool steel w/o changing speeds
[22:00:23] <chr0n1c> my boss made this awesome file out of a stack of pcs of an old blade about 12" long and some duct tape for roughing in die blocks
[22:01:03] <chr0n1c> stack the pcs. about 1 inch wide then duct tape them at both ends wide enough for your hands
[22:07:20] <tom1> nice visual for how 3 ball screw types recirculate. Yes, he's speaking Chinese, but the animation is good :) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OuP_1xT2BV8&NR=1
[22:14:37] <lerman> How do I bookmark the log in emc-devel?
[23:08:27] <tom1> so the russian space walker has a knife and has hacked a chunk of the insulation off SoyezII and now is hacking the explosive bolts...
[23:08:36] <tom1> stay tuned rtsp://a1747.l1856745839.c18567.g.lr.akamaistream.net/live/D/1747/18567/v0001/reflector:45839
[23:16:43] <fenn> omg what are they doing to that poor spaceship?
[23:18:14] <noel> noel is now known as Roguish
[23:19:21] <Roguish> hey all, how do i remove a trunk run-in-place install? cleanly and completely????
[23:19:39] <Roguish> just delete the directory?
[23:19:45] <fenn> yep
[23:19:51] <Roguish> thanks.