#emc | Logs for 2008-06-26

[00:09:19] <Larks> quick question, Where is a place to get tieg mills?
[00:09:29] <Larks> or is it teig?
[00:23:23] <Larks> googling teig mills turns up nothing but pdf files. lol
[00:23:33] <ds2> uh.. Taig
[00:23:48] <Larks> aha, thanks
[00:29:14] <dmess> hi all
[00:30:05] <jepler> hi dmess
[00:30:10] <Larks> I think I am leaning more towards the grizzly G0463 rather then the Taig
[00:30:16] <Larks> any comments?
[00:30:30] <Larks> I like the larger size and I think it is still small enough to fit in my garage.
[00:38:48] <chr0n1c> hey did they get the joystick working in 8.04?
[00:40:16] <chr0n1c> ... was gone, i just tried my wired xbox360 usb controller and i can't get it working at all with ubuntu
[00:40:51] <chr0n1c> .. let alone with EMC2
[00:41:15] <chr0n1c> i did find out it flops between usb ports if i wanna access it...
[00:41:44] <chr0n1c> /dev/bus/usb/001/004 or 007
[00:54:26] <chr0n1c> is there an archive command?
[00:54:44] <jepler> logger_emc: bookmark
[00:54:44] <jepler> Just this once .. here's the log: http://www.linuxcnc.org/irc/irc.freenode.net:6667/emc/2008-06-26.txt
[00:54:53] <chr0n1c> sweet!
[00:58:38] <chr0n1c> well i guess i have to compile a driver for this xbox360 controller
[01:06:51] <chr0n1c> anyone used scons?
[01:07:41] <chr0n1c> ... the ubuntu forums says use it to build this xbox360 driver
[01:12:02] <chr0n1c> http://pingus.seul.org/~grumbel/xboxdrv/
[01:16:47] <ds2> ewwwwwwwww scons... what do you want to do with that icky build system?
[01:17:43] <jmkasunich> http://www.littlemachineshop.com/Info/minimill_compare.php
[01:17:46] <jmkasunich> pp[s
[01:17:48] <jmkasunich> oops
[01:18:03] <jmkasunich> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EyftrP6j-oc
[01:18:10] <jmkasunich> cnc workshop time-lapse
[01:18:54] <chr0n1c> ... well scons just built the xbox driver without fail
[01:19:26] <chr0n1c> my controller at least works in the console
[01:19:31] <ds2> scons is just using python to replace make
[01:19:47] <chr0n1c> i can see buttons and joystick x,z's flying by
[01:20:26] <chr0n1c> yeah... the config file is "Object(`program`) or something like that
[01:20:32] <chr0n1c> ... pretty simple
[01:20:42] <ds2> the SConstruct files are just python scripts
[01:23:08] <chr0n1c> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=825464&highlight=xbox+360 <-- tutorial for a wired/wireless controller as a joystick in 8.04 at least
[01:24:12] <chr0n1c> ... moving onto the hal testing now...
[02:12:53] <chr0n1c> root@beast:/home/chr0n1c/xboxdrv-linux-0.2# halrun
[02:12:57] <chr0n1c> halcmd: loadusr hal_joystick -d /dev/input/js0 -p joypad
[02:12:58] <chr0n1c> halcmd: WARNING: axis 6 exceeds MAX_AXIS (6)
[02:12:59] <chr0n1c> WARNING: axis 7 exceeds MAX_AXIS (6)
[02:13:35] <chr0n1c> ... i'm not sure what that means?
[02:13:45] <chr0n1c> the d-pad won
[02:13:56] <chr0n1c> the d-pad won't work but everything else does
[02:14:00] <jmkasunich> it means that hal_joystick was compiled to support a maximum of 6 analog channels, and your joystick has 8
[02:14:09] <chr0n1c> ohhh
[02:14:31] <chr0n1c> is there any chance hal_joystick would be easy to change?
[02:14:42] <chr0n1c> ... curious
[02:14:48] <chr0n1c> not asking anyone to do it...
[02:15:01] <jmkasunich> the change is trivial, there is a #define MAX_AXIS 6 in there somewhere, change it to 8
[02:15:06] <jmkasunich> but then you need to recompile
[02:15:08] <jepler> also, hal_input should work for more than 6 analog axes without compiling anything
[02:15:12] <jepler> (but pin names will all be different)
[02:15:21] <chr0n1c> all pin names?
[02:15:27] <chr0n1c> or only the controller?
[02:15:30] <jmkasunich> right - hal_input supersedes hal_joystick
[02:15:34] <jmkasunich> only the joystick pins
[02:15:43] <chr0n1c> and recompile all of emc2 or only hal_joystick?
[02:16:21] <chr0n1c> i would assum i can only recompile hal_joystick and replace the file?
[02:16:24] <jmkasunich> technically only hal_joystick, but the makefile does whatever is needed, you don't explicitly tell it what file(s) to compile
[02:16:44] <chr0n1c> ok... good info
[02:17:06] <jmkasunich> if you don't already have a CVS checkout that is set up for compiling, it is probably simpler to use hal_input
[02:17:37] <chr0n1c> ok, i saw there was two methods on the wiki
[02:17:53] <chr0n1c> _input or _joystick
[02:18:46] <chr0n1c> maybe i can get this driver to not use the thumbsticks and make the dpad work like i want without changing hal
[02:19:15] <jmkasunich> you should try hal_input
[02:19:50] <chr0n1c> so with hal_input, all of the controller should be available?
[02:20:01] <chr0n1c> .. dives into the docs
[02:21:15] <chr0n1c> if i don't use the d-pad i'll need to set deadzones on the thumbsticks... this controller is uber-sensitive
[02:22:26] <chr0n1c> -32768 to 0 to 32768
[02:23:02] <chr0n1c> if you breathe on the thumbstick it moves
[02:24:17] <chr0n1c> ten buttons and 5 axis of movement... not bad for a remote cnc pendant
[02:25:41] <K`zan_emc> Anone around tonight?
[02:26:39] <chr0n1c> oui
[02:27:43] <K`zan_emc> Got the machine into the shop! Some problems getting the wireless up reliably, but generally I can get it with some screwing around. Progress!
[02:28:20] <K`zan_emc> Now I can get a bit more serious in figuring out what to do about directing the machine to actually make parts!
[02:28:27] <chr0n1c> buy a long cat5 cable ;) you'll be happier
[02:28:52] <K`zan_emc> ~100' of cable for about 20' airline :)
[02:29:14] <K`zan_emc> Yes, the cable would be a lot simpler.
[02:29:56] <K`zan_emc> But it would make things a mess to route it - BIG job to move everything and pry up carpet. Would probably still piss off the LandNazi
[02:30:29] <K`zan_emc> He gets upset with you have 2 power strips chained for 3 wall warts...
[02:30:51] <chr0n1c> oh, i'd just route it along th ewall and be done
[02:31:12] <K`zan_emc> Getting to the walls here is a job with all the furniture.
[02:31:40] <K`zan_emc> So, we'll live with the wireless as best we can for now.
[02:32:10] <K`zan_emc> gcode files are pretty small so it shouldn't be a big issue, I hope.
[02:32:15] <chr0n1c> congrats on the new machine no doubt though
[02:32:36] <chr0n1c> er the new location?
[02:32:42] <K`zan_emc> Yes, quite pleased and in here I don't have to run it with one hand on the vacuum :-)
[02:32:54] <K`zan_emc> In the "shop" (Spare bedroom).
[02:33:14] <K`zan_emc> rock room / shop / machine shop / kitty box room :)
[02:33:58] <K`zan_emc> Next step is to figure out how to feed EMC so I actually get parts.
[02:34:06] <K`zan_emc> previous attempt was a disaster.
[02:34:47] <chr0n1c> like cam you mean?
[02:35:00] <K`zan_emc> qcad->dxf2gcode->much screwing around->worse with every iteration...
[02:35:04] <K`zan_emc> Yes
[02:35:23] <K`zan_emc> Either that or I learn enough gcode to do things.
[02:35:28] <chr0n1c> ahh...
[02:35:41] <chr0n1c> have you tried gcam?
[02:35:45] <K`zan_emc> I thought a NEMA23 mount was about as simple as it got - RUDE awakening.
[02:35:57] <chr0n1c> i never made a part with it but i have played with the program
[02:36:02] <K`zan_emc> I think I have that, some problem with it...
[02:36:46] <K`zan_emc> Oh, neither it nor I have any idea where the config (endmill.xml, etc) should be. Tried my best guesses and it never did find them :-(
[02:37:14] <K`zan_emc> Got involved with the move into here and haven't gotten back to it yet.
[02:38:00] <K`zan_emc> Was rather discouraged there for a bit...
[02:38:43] <K`zan_emc> But we subscribe to the philosophy of : "While not working, screw with it." :-)
[02:39:03] <K`zan_emc> gcode
[02:39:06] <K`zan_emc> ww
[02:39:29] <K`zan_emc> Only on the desktop box anyway.
[02:39:47] <K`zan_emc> Waddle back in there, chair is more comfortable anyway :-).
[02:40:13] <chr0n1c> http://www.imagetogcode.com/
[02:41:41] <chr0n1c> http://cnccodegen.sourceforge.net/
[02:42:59] <K`zan> Thanks, checking now - on the desktop box now
[02:43:08] <K`zan> ]oops brb
[02:47:03] <chr0n1c> ehh i can't get cnccodegen to do anything
[02:49:23] <K`zan> LOTS of missing stuff here. PITA to download too.
[02:49:49] <K`zan> Oh well, maybe later - for now "move to trash"...
[02:51:16] <chr0n1c> you have to register a database and give it a dns entry? wth?
[02:51:17] <K`zan> Sure miss that stuff I had for the Moog, draw up part and punch out a tape with the gcode, read into Moog, adjust as necessary, make part, repeat as necessary...
[02:51:43] <chr0n1c> moog?
[02:51:44] <K`zan> No *hit... :-)
[02:51:58] <chr0n1c> i thought they made keyboards?
[02:52:02] <K`zan> HUGE industrial CNC mill - absolutely ancient when I used them...
[02:52:12] <chr0n1c> ah
[02:52:18] <K`zan> Dunno if that was the same folks or not.
[02:52:42] <K`zan> Software (ran under DOS) sure made life simple as hell though.
[02:52:47] <toastydeath> moog is still big
[02:52:51] <toastydeath> well, not as big
[02:53:05] <K`zan> Good stuff if you don't have a boss who refuses to do maintenance...
[02:53:13] <toastydeath> ouchies.
[02:53:26] <toastydeath> for a second i thought you said "maag"
[02:53:29] <K`zan> Got a few nice old Z80s out of boards that were replaced :)
[02:53:32] <toastydeath> and was about to be like "wow"
[02:53:38] <K`zan> Sigh....
[02:53:44] <toastydeath> but i have seen pictures of moog machines from back in the day
[02:53:47] <toastydeath> old machines are so awesome.
[02:54:07] <K`zan> If you have one post it someplace, I never got one and it would be nice for my historical file.
[02:54:17] <toastydeath> nar =(
[02:54:19] <toastydeath> sry dood
[02:54:43] <K`zan> Oops RTM :-) seen pix...
[02:54:48] <K`zan> Sorry
[02:55:00] <toastydeath> lol
[02:55:05] <K`zan> I get a little stressed when I start on this again :-).
[02:56:33] <toastydeath> =)
[02:57:08] <chr0n1c> can i jsut do a modprobe alsa to get my sound working?
[02:57:26] <K`zan> Not sure where to go at this point. Considering just forgetting any kind of cad/cam stuff and start reading gcode.
[02:57:49] <chr0n1c> g code structure is simple, it's the math that gets you
[02:57:51] <K`zan> IIRC, you modprobe your soundcard module, but it has been a long time.
[02:57:59] <chr0n1c> ahh...
[02:58:26] <chr0n1c> i know it works on the other kernel... i should reboot and lsmod to see what's different
[02:58:28] <K`zan> Yes, so I noticed. got to plot the location to put the mill down on and THEN start computing arcs or something.
[02:58:48] <K`zan> probably a good idea, lsmod > standard_modules.txt
[02:58:51] <K`zan> for ref
[02:59:21] <K`zan> Pisseth me off that under wincrap this would be a lot less traumatic :-(.
[02:59:25] <chr0n1c> so with > i can send the output of anything to a file or another program?
[02:59:46] <chr0n1c> i'm not traumatized.. i'm learning some neat stuff with linux
[02:59:48] <chr0n1c> :D
[03:00:29] <chr0n1c> i have used it for a webserver for years but i never used it for a desktop machine until emc2
[03:00:33] <K`zan> Linux isn't the issuer here :-/.
[03:00:56] <K`zan> Did that also, but been using it as a desktop for a good while now.
[03:01:38] <chr0n1c> i'm still not weened off the dual boot with windows yet though
[03:01:53] <chr0n1c> very close.. if i had cam in linux
[03:02:49] <K`zan> I have it but would rather avoid it. For most stuff running it under vmware is preferable - if some script kiddie does get through all it eats is the VM which is backed up anyway :-).
[03:02:59] <K`zan> Never trust wincrap alone :).
[04:09:30] <K`zan> http://www.cncinformation.com/
[04:09:39] <K`zan> Might be useful ?!??
[05:53:48] <K`zan> Night folks!
[06:01:23] <ds2> how bad of an idea is to mix stainless (probally 17-4PH) with aluminum in an fresh water immersed application?
[06:19:52] <lerman__> lerman__ is now known as lerman
[08:00:58] <anonimasu> ds2: very bad..
[08:01:13] <ds2> oh
[08:01:23] <ds2> fine, I will machine a nut then :(
[08:03:01] <archivist> both materials do get a nice anti corrosion covering, but the electrolytic potential could be high
[08:03:21] <anonimasu> yep
[08:04:54] <archivist> then ally goes to a white powder
[08:07:07] <anonimasu> that's what I'd be worried about
[08:16:59] <ds2> all I am making is a bung to connect a pipe up to a tank
[08:19:57] <archivist> I was getting a similar question here yesterday, friend is making a gas producer in his back garden, stainless tank
[08:20:32] <ds2> heh I see
[08:20:58] <ds2> i am lucky.... I'm starting with a plastic container and just machining a bung (donno why MSC didn't have one)
[08:21:03] <archivist> he wanted to braze it
[08:22:43] <ds2> didn't know you can braze aluminum successfully
[08:23:53] <archivist> there are some solders, all relies on the flux to get through the oxide
[08:24:04] <ds2> i see
[08:43:57] <micge1> good morning
[12:15:40] <Guest451> Guest451 is now known as skunkworks_
[12:33:47] <JanVanGilsen> Hi guys, as promised, I made a video of my machine: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DjPCEpZybXs
[12:44:12] <pjm> JanVanGilsen thats a very nice machine indeed
[12:51:15] <JanVanGilsen> Thx
[12:51:37] <Guest451> Guest451 is now known as skunkworks_
[12:52:51] <archivist> methinks skunkworks would like to see that as well
[12:53:45] <skunkworks_> oh - the 5 axis gimble machine?
[12:53:47] <skunkworks_> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DjPCEpZybXs
[12:54:05] <pjm> i want to eventually add the 4th axis etc to my machine, just have to get the damn Z axis completed first..
[12:54:05] <archivist> JanVanGilsen, that works nicely
[12:54:21] <archivist> skunkworks, yes
[12:55:35] <skunkworks_> trunion I mean
[12:55:35] <anonimasu> JanVanGilsen: cool! :)
[12:55:38] <skunkworks_> Very cool
[12:55:47] <anonimasu> im jealous ^^
[13:01:32] <JanVanGilsen> I hope that the video helps in understanding the effect of kinematics :)
[13:02:11] <skunkworks_> Doesn't help me understand.. ;) But I get the big picture. :)
[13:02:24] <jepler> that's a great video (I'm only a minute in so far)
[13:02:50] <JanVanGilsen> I deliberately put the workpiece out of the rotation center
[13:03:37] <archivist> I liked that offset
[13:03:48] <jepler> did you see the videos from CNC workshop? jmkasunich and cradek also made an offset sphere milling gcode
[13:04:03] <archivist> yes
[13:05:16] <jepler> rendering: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_tA-W7nTNSc real thing (but low-quality): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1EYaM4FkASA
[13:17:53] <JanVanGilsen> I made some video's of other machines to but still need to edit them a bit (Bipod, 2 3-axis mills and a 4-axis foam cutter)
[13:21:37] <skunkworks_> http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?p=468439#post468439
[13:22:59] <archivist> are we adding all to a wiki page as well
[13:23:01] <JanVanGilsen> Geez I did almost the same as the others did
[13:23:34] <skunkworks_> heh
[13:23:49] <JanVanGilsen> You can add my video if you like
[13:26:37] <skunkworks_> JanVanGilsen: is the chain on the trunnion for backlash?
[13:29:37] <JanVanGilsen> No i't helps the motor, its like in a garage door, when the trunion table goos down, it saves energy in the spring, witch is released when going up
[13:30:45] <skunkworks_> ah - cool
[13:32:52] <JanVanGilsen> The sping of our garage door once broke off, i made it verry hard to open the door, and when closing the door you'd need to make a jump to prevent it from falling on your head
[13:33:16] <JanVanGilsen> *it
[13:45:00] <cradek> JanVanGilsen: that's a great demo! I like how you drew XY on the workpiece.
[13:54:19] <SWPadnos> I think the more interesting thing about these 5-axis demos is that once the kinematics are set up, the same G-code will run on all the machines
[13:54:25] <SWPadnos> (assuming I'm right about that :) )
[13:54:47] <cradek> sort of. there are AC/BC/AB machines
[13:55:02] <cradek> the way you clear the work, etc, is probably different
[13:55:04] <SWPadnos> sure - assuming the capabilities are the same
[13:55:39] <SWPadnos> I guess there's another assumption there, which is that the kinematics are set up for XYZ+orientation
[13:55:49] <SWPadnos> rather than a trivkins-like setup
[14:04:54] <skunkworks_> I think that was one of nists aims..
[14:05:14] <skunkworks_> one program - many machine shops
[14:13:11] <JanVanGilsen> its not so hard to translate i.e. AC to BC, you can make a kinematics file that simulates a AC on a BC machine
[14:15:14] <Roguish_> hey all. any linux guys there? just installed 8.04 on an older 2 processor dell workstation. how do i get both cpus to run?
[14:15:35] <Roguish_> with emc2.2.5?
[14:17:19] <archivist> I think real time only uses one iirc
[14:17:37] <cradek> if you need an smp realtime kernel you will have to build it yourself from source, and then you will also have to build emc from source, as the released packages won't work anymore.
[14:17:58] <cradek> it can be difficult to get it all working right.
[14:21:50] <chr0n1c> that is a sexy 5axis machine ;)
[14:22:10] <chr0n1c> awesome work, JanVanGilsen
[14:24:45] <JanVanGilsen> pitty i cant keep it... is it was my master disertation, it belongs to the school ...
[14:25:00] <chr0n1c> DOH!
[14:25:03] <chr0n1c> ;)
[14:28:02] <chr0n1c> are you guys using CAM for the 5 axis stuff or hand coding it?
[14:29:17] <JanVanGilsen> Thats hand coded, we don't own 5-axis CAM software
[14:29:25] <cradek> same here
[14:29:28] <chr0n1c> (.. everyone should mention emc2 or linuxcnc.org in the video imformations ;)
[14:29:36] <JanVanGilsen> thats why its a sphere, it's not to hard to program by hand
[14:30:36] <chr0n1c> awesome... hand coding 5 axis is pretty hardcore!
[14:31:03] <JanVanGilsen> not if you use parametric g-code
[14:48:03] <chr0n1c> synaptic has ZERO items if you search for gcode.. :(
[14:48:16] <chr0n1c> or g-code or cnc
[14:48:42] <chr0n1c> although it did find geekcode, whatever that is
[14:52:15] <Roguish_> cradek: thanks for the info. i got called away by the wife for a 'discussion'.
[15:11:46] <chr0n1c> http://www.teamhackaday.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=13 <- hackaday CNC forum
[19:22:32] <anonimasu_> anonimasu_ is now known as anonimasu
[19:59:34] <fenn_> fenn_ is now known as fenn
[22:49:37] <ednspace> BigJohnT: can you field another question about probeing
[22:49:59] <ednspace> I have the probe working now, G38.2 z0 f1 etc works fine
[22:50:18] <ednspace> Z stops moving when I trigger the probe
[22:50:44] <ednspace> What I need now is some Gcode to set the Z axis to 0
[22:51:08] <BigJohnT> ok
[22:51:18] <SWPadnos> G92Z0?
[22:51:28] <ednspace> I see how to set an offset from the tool-length-probe.ngc
[22:53:14] <ednspace> thanks seems like G92 moves the work to the tip rather then the tip to the work
[22:53:54] <ednspace> I think it may be possible with G92 but am unsure whats going on
[22:54:32] <ednspace> if I then 0 the axis with the home button the tip shoots down below the plane
[22:55:00] <ednspace> The probe is working great though and I am jazzed about that
[22:56:29] <BigJohnT> endspace when I do a probe with my plasma I do an incremental move a distance equal to the switch travel then do a G92 Z0
[22:56:46] <BigJohnT> in my g code I use Z0 as my material top
[22:57:15] <ednspace> yes now that I look again I think that G92 is doing what I want
[22:57:39] <ednspace> just that axis the gui still thinks home is where it used to be
[22:58:04] <ednspace> but giving command like g0 z1 and then g0 z0 works fine...
[23:01:18] <SWPadnos> if you want to probe and then set that to Z=0, I think you want G92
[23:01:37] <SWPadnos> if you want to probe and set a tool length offset, then you need to do whatever tool-length-probe.ngc does :)
[23:04:27] <ednspace> Right, thanks SWPandos I am seeing how this works now
[23:05:08] <SWPadnos> you're welcome
[23:05:34] <ednspace> I need to spend some time just driving the machine round with Gcodes
[23:06:01] <BigJohnT> ednspace: cut a bunch of air first :)
[23:06:31] <ednspace> I guess I can play "Air CNC" whaaaaahaaa haaa
[23:06:55] <BigJohnT> air is cheaper than tool bits
[23:08:11] <ednspace> you can say that again, I am just starting to tool up!
[23:24:08] <BigJohnT> endspace there is a good writeup in the user manual on G92 at 22.4
[23:26:38] <ednspace> whats 22.4
[23:26:50] <BigJohnT> the section number
[23:27:11] <BigJohnT> just look in the index under using emc2 for Coordinate systems
[23:27:36] <BigJohnT> it's on page 185 in my manual
[23:29:14] <ednspace> yes got it page 150 but I have an older manual printed out
[23:29:30] <BigJohnT> ok
[23:29:38] <ednspace> it starts G92 is the most misunderstood and maligned part of EMC programming
[23:29:45] <ednspace> yup!
[23:29:45] <BigJohnT> :)
[23:52:31] <ds2> * ds2 screams at the clocking madness between WTBU and git