#emc | Logs for 2008-06-11

[00:00:52] <dmess> why 3 or 3 .. parts... no sweat value village is a few blocks away they have stock... 8-)
[00:02:42] <dmess> too small did a quick weight analsys and eccentric cam in the middle of 4 small guide posts for drilling only...
[00:04:18] <dmess> all your need to do is move it accuratly and have sufficient power to meet the feedrate to depth
[00:04:55] <dmess> im thinking 8x17 platen
[00:24:31] <renesis> guys guys i got cnc job!
[00:24:40] <chr0n1c> way to go renesis
[00:24:43] <chr0n1c> !!!11!
[00:24:46] <chr0n1c> ;)
[00:24:46] <renesis> i think i figured this alphacam shit out
[00:25:08] <renesis> im running this bigass gantry router in a wood shop
[00:25:10] <chr0n1c> i am really missing programming/running a cnc for a living
[00:25:13] <renesis> which is exactly what i want
[00:25:24] <renesis> metal machining is dangerous!
[00:25:27] <chr0n1c> which is why i have this tiny machine at home i guess
[00:25:38] <renesis> i <3 my tiny machine
[00:25:46] <chr0n1c> i <3 mine too ;)
[00:26:00] <renesis> i think besides my little 8 tip trimmer screwdriver, it is my fav tool
[00:26:15] <renesis> that screwdriver is fooking awesome tho
[00:26:54] <chr0n1c> my fav tool has gotta be the thin 12" scale (ruler) you can make some cool noise with it on the edge of the bench while you are thinking ;)
[00:27:10] <chr0n1c> flip the end and move it in and out
[00:27:27] <ds2> launch mash potatoes with it during meals...
[00:27:29] <chr0n1c> then my mini cnc is a close second
[00:27:57] <chr0n1c> that might get messy yo
[00:28:13] <ds2> fine, apple sauce then!
[00:28:40] <chr0n1c> clap clap?
[00:28:51] <chr0n1c> ohhh applesauce
[00:28:57] <chr0n1c> i thought you typed applause
[00:29:59] <ds2> prehaps peas
[00:30:21] <dmess> my favorite tool is an old flame tower a friend will'd me.... it kicks ASS...
[00:30:31] <dmess> thrower
[00:31:16] <ds2> what's it use as fuel?
[00:31:17] <dmess> it isn't for sale either... it MINE
[00:31:25] <dmess> gasoline..
[00:32:42] <dmess> starts a camp fire with a blast...just keep ppl back...
[00:36:07] <ds2> must cost a small fortune to operate it thesedays ;)
[00:36:10] <dmess> when my TO-BE wife 1st met my family ALONE... she was hung over... and MOM started the food fight.... so she should have known or figured out what she was in for
[00:37:44] <jmkasunich> OT: anybody used a USB connected external drive with ubuntu?
[00:37:53] <jmkasunich> Western digital MyBook or similar
[00:37:59] <dmess> i have SEEN my grandma IN the house with the hose trying to stop a ruckas
[00:38:33] <ds2> hose? Hmmm guess you don't have hard wood floors? :)
[00:39:27] <dmess> she didnt give a crap what she poured it on
[00:41:36] <SWPadnos> jmkasunich, I have used all manner of external drive, including IDE drives in a USB enclosure
[00:41:45] <SWPadnos> but not SATA, I guess
[00:41:55] <dmess> i saw 3" of water flowing out the back door into the basement 1 time... the old girl was fetchin 5 gallon buckets and throwing them at US kids...
[00:43:10] <jmkasunich> SWPadnos: this is USB connected, so I don't think sata/pata would matter
[00:43:20] <dmess> \out of the tub..
[00:43:20] <jmkasunich> I'm planning to reformat it ext3
[00:43:33] <SWPadnos> well, you'd think that, but I don't know that with absolute certainty
[00:43:51] <SWPadnos> ok. are you talking about using such a drive or booting from it?
[00:44:00] <jmkasunich> using it (for backup)
[00:44:09] <SWPadnos> ok - shouldn't be a problem at all
[00:44:23] <jmkasunich> my goal is to have it spinning about 5-10 minutes a day, then unmount it and let it spin down
[00:45:01] <jmkasunich> googling "ubuntu mybook" has mixed results - some people describe problems with the system not recognizing the drive, etc
[00:45:03] <SWPadnos> one thing I've noticed with USB flash drives is that Ubuntu (and probably other Lniuxes) don't actually remove power when you unmount a drive
[00:45:03] <dmess> i was thinkin' you were trying to save someting
[00:45:40] <SWPadnos> I don't know about the mybook, all I've used are generic drives, not "backup servers" (if that is one of those)
[00:45:53] <jmkasunich> its not a backup server
[00:46:03] <jmkasunich> no "one button backup" or anything like that
[00:46:24] <dmess> mine all work perfectly.... even usb bluetooth shite
[00:46:24] <SWPadnos> ok
[00:46:58] <SWPadnos> you have the "essential edition"?
[00:47:08] <jmkasunich> SWPadnos: yes
[00:47:19] <SWPadnos> ok (the only one without automatic backup :) )
[00:48:00] <SWPadnos> damn. $219 for a 1TB model - that's a friggin great deal
[00:48:14] <SWPadnos> or it was a couple of months ago, when I last looked at hard drive prices
[00:48:21] <jmkasunich> I just paid $100 for 500G
[00:48:39] <SWPadnos> also excellent
[00:48:53] <jmkasunich> I'm backing up a 150G drive, so its a bit of overkill
[00:48:59] <jmkasunich> but that price is hard to beat
[00:49:25] <dmess> BUT... if you plug a Blackberry into MY system it charges without any external help..\
[00:50:18] <SWPadnos> I guess I should put the bathroom sink back together before my wife goes to bed
[00:51:28] <dmess> or reap the concequences
[00:53:41] <chr0n1c> i use a usb flash drive all the time jmkasunich
[00:53:56] <jmkasunich> I use flash drives for camera stuff
[00:54:08] <jmkasunich> fine for a gig or two
[00:54:11] <jmkasunich> not suitable for backup
[00:55:02] <chr0n1c> i have a usb drive case for ide drive that i use
[00:55:15] <chr0n1c> it's a generic one from compusa a few years ago
[00:55:27] <chr0n1c> it has a 100 gig in it with 4 partitions
[00:55:30] <jmkasunich> that's basically what this is - it just has the drive in it already
[00:55:32] <chr0n1c> if i plug it in it just works...
[00:55:49] <chr0n1c> in ubuntu or windows
[00:56:05] <JymmmEMC> SWPadnos: the mybooks are awesome
[00:56:35] <jmkasunich> currently formatted to FAT32
[00:56:39] <jmkasunich> think I have to fix that
[00:56:54] <jmkasunich> <cue diabolical laugh>
[00:57:02] <JymmmEMC> who gat a tb for $219 and where?
[00:57:12] <jmkasunich> swp saw that online ( I guess)
[00:57:17] <JymmmEMC> ah
[00:57:23] <jmkasunich> I just bought 500G for $100 at MicroCenter
[00:57:37] <JymmmEMC> cool
[00:57:56] <JymmmEMC> I *might* be looking at some 2.5" SAS drives
[00:59:15] <JymmmEMC> Though, I seriously doubt I really want SAS drives.
[00:59:52] <JymmmEMC> I dont need anyting that fast, just need to cram them into 1U if I can
[01:00:15] <chr0n1c> i need a box that i can plug all these random drives i have around and use them for a fileserver with raid... hmmm
[01:00:47] <chr0n1c> with like 15 ide plugs...
[01:01:21] <JymmmEMC> like the 3rd one down... http://www.supermicro.com/products/nfo/2_5HDD.cfm
[01:01:41] <jmkasunich> any thoughts on partitioning? I'm thinking one 500G ext3 partition
[01:02:21] <chr0n1c> go with one 500 gig
[01:02:35] <chr0n1c> the 100 gig i keep wishing i never did 4 25 gig partititions
[01:02:52] <chr0n1c> just use directories... it's easier and less of a headache
[01:33:00] <cradek> jmkasunich: golden rule: don't make any partition bigger than your backup tapes can hold :-)
[01:33:20] <jmkasunich> cradek: this device _is_ my backup "tape"
[01:33:31] <cradek> aha
[01:33:37] <cradek> then definitely one parition
[01:33:47] <jmkasunich> the plan is to use rdiff-backup
[01:35:28] <fenn> * fenn wonders why you need 500GB of backups
[01:35:55] <jmkasunich> I don't
[01:36:16] <jmkasunich> but the smallest available drives were only about $30 cheaper
[01:36:20] <cradek> you might, but they're no use if they're all on the same piece of media
[01:37:03] <jmkasunich> cradek: elaborate?
[01:37:30] <fenn> if you have backups from several years all stored on the same disk
[01:38:20] <fenn> if the disk fails, you lose all of them
[01:38:54] <jmkasunich> true - the idea is not to have the backup disk and the working disk fail at the same time
[01:39:15] <jmkasunich> it would be nice to be able to use multiple media and stash them in multiple places at multiple times
[01:39:30] <jmkasunich> but this will be much better than no backup
[01:39:41] <jmkasunich> and costs about what a tape drive with no media would run
[01:40:34] <cradek> yes one redundant copy is much better than nothing
[01:42:03] <jmkasunich> I figured it would be a good thing to do before I drive 500 miles with the computer in the back of the pickup
[01:43:18] <chr0n1c> when is the cnc fest? i'd would love to bring my machine someday
[01:43:24] <jmkasunich> next week
[01:43:25] <cradek> next week
[01:47:19] <jmkasunich> got it reformatted to ext3, and fstab edited so I can easily mount and unmount it.....
[01:47:30] <jmkasunich> now just have to set up the backup
[01:47:57] <jmkasunich> everything? home dir only? decisions decisions
[01:48:14] <chr0n1c> anyone driving through dayton ohio? i'm one block away from an on/off ramp to i-75
[01:48:32] <jmkasunich> sorry, I'm too far north
[01:48:47] <jmkasunich> (driving the turnpike)
[01:48:49] <SWPadnos> and I drive past JMK's house to get there, so I guess I'm too far north also
[01:49:19] <cradek> too bad you two can't share a ride then
[01:49:34] <SWPadnos> we could, if one or both of us could leave half our crap at home ;)
[01:49:37] <jmkasunich> I've offered to let swp park here and go the rest of the way with me
[01:49:45] <jmkasunich> but there are usually also timing issues
[01:49:48] <chr0n1c> so i haven't found anyone else in my general area messing with emc.. it's kinda sad
[01:49:55] <SWPadnos> timing and amount of stuff, I think
[01:50:04] <jmkasunich> well, my truck holds a lot
[01:50:09] <jmkasunich> (so does your minivan tho)
[01:50:20] <jmkasunich> this year I'm gonna be a little lighter
[01:50:22] <SWPadnos> well, I have the Jeep now, so I can't take quite as much
[01:50:24] <jmkasunich> only one computer I htink
[01:50:34] <chr0n1c> i should go around to local shop and see if they have any old machines they wanna convert...
[01:50:39] <chr0n1c> local shops*
[01:50:41] <jmkasunich> and I dunno if I'm gonna bring stuff like o-scope and soldering tools
[01:50:42] <cradek> jeff's car is half the size as before! I'll be lighter too.
[01:50:51] <jmkasunich> he got a new car?
[01:50:57] <SWPadnos> I'll be bringing scopes and stuff
[01:50:57] <cradek> yes
[01:51:03] <jmkasunich> since wicheta?
[01:51:26] <cradek> that was the green station wagon right?
[01:51:28] <cradek> if so, yes
[01:51:30] <JymmmEMC> scopes, as in plural?!
[01:51:31] <SWPadnos> yes
[01:51:48] <JymmmEMC> never heard of USB buddy!?
[01:51:58] <SWPadnos> I may bring two - one of them is considerably less costly, so I'm less nervous about connecting it to machines
[01:52:00] <JymmmEMC> </sarcastic tone>
[01:52:07] <SWPadnos> the other is faster, so it's better for doing FPGA debugging
[01:52:32] <jmkasunich> I thought about bringing my older dev box with RT and the 5i20
[01:52:46] <JymmmEMC> SWPadnos: just grab a bio led led LOGIC PROBE FOR YOU!
[01:52:48] <jmkasunich> but I haven't done anything in that area in about a year, and don't see myself starting at the workshop
[01:52:59] <jmkasunich> I'm hoping to do joints/axes stuff
[01:53:06] <cradek> I think you said the same thing last year about the 5i20
[01:53:09] <jmkasunich> and sim should be fine for that
[01:53:10] <SWPadnos> I'll be bringing two computers, one with 5i20 and the other with 5i22
[01:53:28] <jmkasunich> cradek: last year 5i20 _was_ one of my projects
[01:53:30] <SWPadnos> JymmmEMC, my eyes aren't fast enough to catch things on an LED ;)
[01:53:35] <jmkasunich> I didn't really stall till after the workshop
[01:54:15] <JymmmEMC> SWPadnos: And leave that craptop at home, doens't even have a paraport on it ;)
[01:54:28] <SWPadnos> it's too fast - a parport would slow it down
[01:54:33] <JymmmEMC> lol
[01:56:59] <JymmmEMC> SWPadnos: Here we go, something to play DOOM on... http://www.supermicro.com/products/system/1U/1025/SYS-1025TC-10G.cfm
[01:57:42] <SWPadnos> I don't think DOOM (or even DOOM 2) is multithreaded ;)
[01:58:22] <gezr> what, you must be kidding, did you load the kill Barney packs?
[01:58:31] <SWPadnos> of course! ;)
[01:58:32] <JymmmEMC> SWPadnos: Eh, will run it as a virtual machine =)
[01:59:09] <gezr> you guys going to be doing it over the weekend as well?
[01:59:14] <gezr> joplin right?
[01:59:19] <gezr> or just east of stlouis
[01:59:28] <SWPadnos> lessee, on my high-res monitor, I could have - um - 144 DOOMs on-screen at once
[01:59:31] <gezr> na, I cant leave the math book that long
[01:59:46] <SWPadnos> Galesburg, IL
[01:59:56] <SWPadnos> about a day driving from Cleveland
[02:02:34] <jmkasunich> 530 miles
[02:03:13] <chr0n1c> sweet, my cybershot digital camera shows up as a flash drive in 8.04 .. never worked right before unles it was on windoze
[02:03:39] <chr0n1c> i'll have a new pic of my machine here soon with some decent lighting
[02:04:26] <renesis> what is this lighting thing you speak of?\
[02:05:07] <chr0n1c> floro's on my ceiling
[02:05:16] <chr0n1c> ;)
[02:05:31] <renesis> i making some led plant lighting panels
[02:05:55] <renesis> like 260* 5mm led on two rails (red and blue)
[02:06:22] <renesis> but i wanna use narrow and wide white instead of red and blue on the two rails
[02:06:22] <chr0n1c> they make specific wavelengths of leds for growing plants
[02:06:30] <renesis> and put two in my cnc cab
[02:06:53] <renesis> they make prob every wavelength now
[02:07:19] <renesis> hehe you can sort by wavelength at digikey
[02:09:29] <chr0n1c> oh nice
[02:15:17] <jmkasunich> wtf?! jmkasunich@mahan:~/festcam$ rm *.png
[02:15:17] <jmkasunich> bash: /bin/rm: Argument list too long
[02:17:21] <chr0n1c> http://ohiopctech.com/dp/?q=node/135 <- nice zoom out shot of my whole mini mill i just took a few minutes ago
[02:18:15] <cradek> jmkasunich: welcome to unix
[02:18:35] <jmkasunich> there are about 15000 files in the dir that I want to delete
[02:18:44] <cradek> cd ..; rm -r festcam
[02:18:46] <jmkasunich> I'm looking at xargs, but it doesn't seem to be the answer
[02:18:57] <cradek> find . -name '*.png'|xargs rm
[02:18:58] <jmkasunich> I don't want to delete all files, just the *.png
[02:19:10] <jmkasunich> oh, xargs _is_ the answer?
[02:19:17] <chr0n1c> nautilus!
[02:19:19] <chr0n1c> ;)
[02:19:31] <cradek> yes, xargs runs rm as many times as needed, with the argument list never too long
[02:19:44] <cradek> notice that *.png never expands on the commandline. it is passed as-is to find
[02:20:03] <jmkasunich> because of the quotes, right?
[02:20:07] <cradek> yes
[02:20:21] <jmkasunich> I already had it mostly figured out, even using the quotes
[02:20:34] <jmkasunich> but man xargs doesn't specify that it overcomes the line-too-long problem
[02:20:41] <jmkasunich> and I didn't want to use rm to test it
[02:20:53] <cradek> IMO that's really the point of xargs
[02:21:04] <Rugludallur> anyone here had the good fortune to try emc2 on an Intel Atom processor ?
[02:21:17] <jmkasunich> I had that feeling - thats why I started reading the manpage
[02:21:26] <jmkasunich> but either it doesn't say so, or I missed it
[02:22:36] <jmkasunich> it worked
[02:24:49] <cradek> yay, the probe is done
[02:30:01] <cradek> chr0n1c: I'm trying to understand the image of your mill. is the table missing?
[02:30:14] <chr0n1c> yeah....
[02:30:19] <cradek> or is it that small area there, 2x2 inches?
[02:30:29] <chr0n1c> i have a vise i mount on it
[02:30:35] <chr0n1c> or fiixtures for odd shapes...
[02:30:42] <chr0n1c> fixtures*
[02:30:53] <cradek> ah I see, no traditional table, t slots, etc
[02:31:18] <chr0n1c> i haven't actually done a table yet
[02:31:37] <chr0n1c> i was going to do something like .5' alum with a buncha 1.4-20 holes
[02:32:01] <chr0n1c> i'm not sure about the weight my y can handle though so i just do the vise when i need it
[02:32:03] <fenn> what are the ways made from?
[02:32:05] <toastydeath> ZERO POINT FIXTURING
[02:32:13] <cradek> bring a slab to workshop and we'll rigid tap it :-)
[02:32:23] <chr0n1c> oh that would be fun to watch
[02:32:52] <chr0n1c> i have a fixture set up for sippos and i'm getting ready to build a pcb milling fixture
[02:32:56] <cradek> do you have a drill press and tapping head? you could do it just about as easy.
[02:32:56] <chr0n1c> zippos*
[02:33:09] <chr0n1c> yeah i have a mini drill press
[02:33:11] <cradek> will you use vacuum for pcbs?
[02:33:21] <chr0n1c> and a bigass mill at work ;)
[02:33:32] <cradek> good, you can face off a table then
[02:33:39] <chr0n1c> i'm going to do side pressure for the pcb clamp...
[02:33:49] <chr0n1c> no real forces so a light clamp should work
[02:34:02] <chr0n1c> if i find a cheap vaccum pump i may do that
[02:34:13] <fenn> it will bow the pcb outwards and you'll get uneven trace width
[02:34:15] <cradek> so far doublestick tape has worked best for me
[02:34:23] <cradek> that carpet/tile stuff
[02:34:31] <cradek> like fenn says, it's just not flat enough otherwise
[02:34:52] <chr0n1c> i used double stick tape to make some spacers that needed counterbored (delrin, .250 thick) the other day at work
[02:34:55] <fenn> clamping down with screws and maybe washers on the edges seems easiest/best
[02:35:05] <chr0n1c> on the flat part of a kurt vise
[02:35:39] <cradek> heh, easier than removing the vise
[02:35:51] <fenn> that's what its for right?
[02:36:06] <chr0n1c> i thought it was for an anvil.. lol
[02:36:38] <chr0n1c> **tip: don't use a 400 dollar vise for an anvil
[02:36:53] <chr0n1c> 400+ even
[02:37:10] <toastydeath> so true
[02:37:37] <chr0n1c> yes, i need a table for this machine
[02:37:57] <chr0n1c> i could probably get by with .375" thick aluminum
[02:38:04] <chr0n1c> about 6 x 10
[02:38:20] <chr0n1c> and a bunch 10/32 and 1/4-20's
[02:39:08] <chr0n1c> i mean i'm not building a spaceship with this thing..
[02:39:24] <chr0n1c> i probably could build a model of one
[02:39:32] <chr0n1c> ohh.. next project
[02:39:36] <gezr> table as in table top surface, or where you mount your parts for machining on?
[02:39:46] <chr0n1c> yes, gezr
[02:40:02] <gezr> what is the thickest section on your machine?
[02:40:24] <chr0n1c> i'm not sure on your q?
[02:40:38] <chr0n1c> thick like in braces?
[02:40:38] <gezr> and yeah 3/8 aluminum is a good thickness, but your not going to get a good clamping surface with that
[02:40:46] <gezr> yeah, your side rails and stuff
[02:40:50] <toastydeath> depends on how hard you clamp
[02:40:59] <gezr> yeah thats true, was thinking about that
[02:41:17] <chr0n1c> hmm... it's a cast iron base with a tube z column... the x/y slides are mounted directly to the base...
[02:41:34] <chr0n1c> the head is cast iron and the z is mounted to that
[02:41:38] <gezr> 1/2 would be more forgiving in terms of being able to put a bolt into it, and provide a bit more ridigity
[02:42:09] <PMinMO> keeping pcb's flat, have you seen my utube video?
[02:42:21] <gezr> PMinMO: Im sorry I havent
[02:42:39] <chr0n1c> nooo, PMinMO, is it about pcbs?
[02:42:47] <toastydeath> i would imagine you could just build a couple wafer chucks
[02:42:54] <toastydeath> if you wanted to hold pcb's
[02:42:56] <gezr> chr0n1c: and with 1/2 you could machine a nice plate out of your 3/8 to make a vacume table
[02:42:57] <PMinMO> yes, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhdqBrciQZU
[02:42:57] <toastydeath> not that i mill those
[02:43:16] <renesis> wat?
[02:43:19] <renesis> about pcb?
[02:43:28] <renesis> do you have alot of one size or wat?
[02:43:40] <gezr> were you just put some plugs into the 1/2 base, then machine the 3/8 like a u shape.....
[02:43:49] <PMinMO> watch the video if you want to hold pcb's easily
[02:43:51] <renesis> just do it like a real mucheenist
[02:44:11] <renesis> http://darkertechnologies.com/notes/2007/12/08/double-sided-fixture-for-pcb-milling-itll-flip-you-flip-you-for-real/
[02:44:11] <chr0n1c> i was thinking about a back rail to line up the x axis on a plate.. then a screw type jaw on the fron side to ever so slightly clamp against the backjaw
[02:44:34] <gezr> okay, ive put off doing the int(x^2e^(-2x)dx) long enough
[02:45:25] <renesis> $1 paypal to anyone who can guess the quoted movie
[02:45:46] <chr0n1c> that's a sexy fixture renesis
[02:46:05] <renesis> haha yeah even with the bites from the broken chinataps
[02:46:16] <renesis> http://darkertechnologies.com/notes/wp-content/2007/12/pcb_fix38.JPG
[02:46:21] <renesis> china HSS yay
[02:46:41] <toastydeath> dudes
[02:46:42] <toastydeath> http://eolsurplus.com/images/DicingSawChuck8inAlum.jpg
[02:46:43] <renesis> i did like 20 more holes with the bottoming tap =\
[02:46:45] <toastydeath> wafer chucks
[02:46:47] <toastydeath> use em
[02:46:58] <chr0n1c> doh! we buy expensive taps... broke too many cheap ones in the past
[02:47:00] <renesis> wtf is that
[02:47:18] <renesis> suction thing? what
[02:47:23] <toastydeath> it's a vacuum chuck, specifically a wafer chuck
[02:47:27] <renesis> also i need to hold by the edge
[02:47:29] <gezr> guys, really, the money spent on a quality tap, is well worth the cost,
[02:47:29] <toastydeath> you can turn on/off each vacuum groove.
[02:47:40] <renesis> drill thru FR4 into air, pls
[02:47:51] <renesis> will it hold on just one hole?
[02:47:54] <gezr> im not talking about osg sosner taps, but just good quality taps
[02:48:00] <renesis> hmm
[02:48:05] <gezr> renesis: yeah, if you make your air grid right...
[02:48:07] <toastydeath> depends on the groove, not the hole
[02:48:07] <renesis> i can has edge wafer chucks?
[02:48:13] <toastydeath> they make those too.
[02:48:18] <renesis> very hmmm
[02:48:19] <toastydeath> you can make your own, they're simple.
[02:48:23] <chr0n1c> i don't like vaccum personally...
[02:48:25] <renesis> who is they i can make, no?
[02:48:32] <toastydeath> look at it, it's a block of aluminum with grooves in it
[02:48:35] <chr0n1c> there needs to be a mechanical clamp i think for anything cnc
[02:48:35] <renesis> i mean its just an Al block with holes
[02:48:41] <toastydeath> chr0n1c: not true at all man
[02:48:55] <renesis> yeah alot of people use vacuum and magnets
[02:48:57] <toastydeath> renesis: correct
[02:49:03] <renesis> especially crazy production types
[02:49:05] <gezr> vacum clamp is just fine
[02:49:29] <toastydeath> the higher density the grooves and the smaller the flats, the higher the accuracy and higher holding power of the chuck
[02:49:33] <gezr> cutting force ---> is different then force required to move the work piece
[02:49:33] <toastydeath> but it also becomes fragile.
[02:49:36] <chr0n1c> have you ever seen 20# parts fly off a surface grinder?
[02:49:42] <gezr> I have
[02:49:43] <chr0n1c> all the way across the shop?
[02:49:46] <gezr> yep
[02:49:47] <toastydeath> chr0n1c: have you seen 2000 lb parts fly off a grinder?
[02:49:50] <chr0n1c> lol at terminal velocities
[02:49:55] <renesis> chr0n1c: we have holes in school shop window!
[02:49:57] <gezr> thunderstorms on non backed up magnetic tables
[02:49:58] <chr0n1c> nope toasty
[02:49:59] <chr0n1c> lol
[02:50:07] <renesis> this is why i dont want a production metal nc job =(
[02:50:15] <toastydeath> production is pretty safe, dudes.
[02:50:20] <toastydeath> the workholding works.
[02:50:21] <renesis> just protolab metal or wood shop
[02:50:32] <gezr> accidents will happen, but for the most part, things like that happen because of human error
[02:50:34] <renesis> oh i dont mean work holding
[02:50:41] <chr0n1c> just hit the cise handle with a deadblow and wear safetey goggles
[02:50:45] <chr0n1c> vise handle*
[02:50:49] <renesis> i mean shit just fuckin up because everyone in a hurry
[02:50:51] <toastydeath> chr0n1c: way to damage the vice, dude.
[02:50:55] <chr0n1c> (my c and v keys are worn off) lol
[02:50:58] <renesis> and sometimes too crowded
[02:51:03] <gezr> toastydeath: that wont hurt a good vise
[02:51:08] <toastydeath> gezr: it will, actually
[02:51:09] <renesis> omg they guy im working for has a nice big shop
[02:51:17] <toastydeath> it won't hurt a bench vise
[02:51:21] <renesis> feels totally open and non lethal
[02:51:22] <toastydeath> but it will hurt a good milling vise
[02:51:31] <gezr> toastydeath: over time sure, but not a good kurt, just a tap, not a nail driving swing
[02:51:37] <toastydeath> gezr: talk to your kurt rep
[02:51:50] <renesis> omg ow
[02:51:57] <gezr> toastydeath: maybe im thinking tapping the work piece
[02:51:58] <chr0n1c> i'm not talking about 50# sledghammer on the handle... jsut a tap like gezr sez
[02:52:04] <toastydeath> they tell you not to whack the handle
[02:52:09] <chr0n1c> * chr0n1c ran production for a few years...
[02:52:09] <renesis> just get one with finer pitch screw =(
[02:52:16] <gezr> yeah, sheet its been a long time
[02:52:35] <toastydeath> renesis: it also damages the anglelock mechanism
[02:52:37] <gezr> toastydeath: sorry, your right
[02:52:39] <chr0n1c> interesting vid PMinMO
[02:52:50] <gezr> the impact does pull the <> bits apart
[02:53:18] <gezr> toastydeath: man im retarded tonight, arn't I?
[02:53:20] <renesis> wai tapping stop jeez =\ =(
[02:53:22] <toastydeath> lol nah man
[02:53:32] <PMinMO> tnx
[02:53:44] <renesis> also yeah you maybe get rebound
[02:53:47] <toastydeath> but re: vacuum chucks, use em
[02:53:57] <gezr> toastydeath: Ive had to tap some handles down, but most not during production runs,
[02:53:59] <toastydeath> make em modular, with tunable vacuum grooves
[02:54:02] <gezr> vacuum chucks rock
[02:54:11] <PMinMO> Ever seen anybody use glue before?
[02:54:15] <gezr> yep
[02:54:22] <toastydeath> seen hot glue, yeah
[02:54:30] <PMinMO> not hot glue
[02:54:33] <gezr> banding straps, all sorts of stuff
[02:54:42] <toastydeath> i am just saying, that's what i've seen used, not that it's the only option
[02:55:30] <toastydeath> a dude i know used to hold down 4x8 sheet steel on a VTL with sticky tape
[02:56:07] <chr0n1c> i've ground alum on a surface grinder with some DS tape
[02:56:16] <chr0n1c> and engraved many a things with it
[02:56:16] <toastydeath> osha approved!
[02:57:39] <gezr> cutting force isn't the same as pushing a work piece off a table
[02:58:22] <toastydeath> indeed
[03:01:14] <cradek> I've used superglue and shellac for small work
[03:01:43] <cradek> also, wood swells when wet, you can use it to hold fragile round things
[03:02:09] <cradek> bolt it to a faceplate, turn to diameter (tiny taper), place part over it, wet the wood
[03:02:37] <PMinMO> for pcb's superglue is the ticket
[03:12:56] <cradek> 10:00! goodnight all
[03:17:24] <chr0n1c> later yo!
[03:57:09] <K`zan> Interesting, thanks folks. That double sticky tape leaves much to be desired...
[04:12:48] <tomp2> isuperglue then acetone, i gotta try that. thx PminMo
[04:14:41] <tomp2> dang I'll try that on graphite rib electrodes ( .027 at bottom with 1/4 degree per side , and 1 "long ) ( hope all the cyano comes off, its not conductive )
[04:15:15] <SWPadnos> acetone doesn't mar graphite?
[04:16:02] <toastydeath> nope
[04:25:09] <tomp2> i dont know about mar, but i saw him prying stuff off, and any nonconductive area even a pin head area would ruin an electrode. i'll keep the idea for other uses tho.
[05:18:18] <chr0n1c> later!
[05:22:17] <K`zan> Well folks, still not sure where to go on the software side, worn myself out researching it and I still ain't got a clue. Calling it a night, I'm beat!
[12:19:35] <cradek_> cradek_ is now known as cradek
[13:03:45] <micges> how many pins can I create in in hal python module ?
[13:06:09] <jepler> the number of hal items (components, functions, pins, signals) is related to the size of hal's shared memory area, defined in hal_priv.h. I think it's sized big enough for several thousand pins to exist.
[13:06:50] <jepler> the preprocessor symbol is HAL_SIZE. If you modify it, you must also modify HAL_KEY because components compiled with different sizes are not compatible.
[13:08:21] <micges> thanks
[13:13:15] <jepler> my test program encounters a limit after 1720 pins.
[13:13:25] <jepler> but this would be affected by other components that are loaded and signals that are created
[13:13:52] <jepler> http://pastebin.ca/1044841
[13:14:09] <jepler> er, 1719
[13:16:16] <jepler> bbl
[13:27:51] <micges> cool
[13:44:21] <gezr> thats a ton of pins
[13:47:36] <micges> not so many
[13:47:48] <micges> I am using 400 pins
[13:48:20] <pjm> afternoon all, i won a 'yaskawa voltage vector control module' - has anyone used one of these with EMC for spindle speed?
[13:48:39] <micges> and 170 params
[13:49:10] <archivist> pjm Ive seen the name mentioned in here before
[13:49:28] <pjm> archivist ahh ok nice, i'll have a dig around in the archives
[13:49:48] <pjm> i picked it up at the weekend for a fiver, complete with a 0.3Hp 3 phase motor
[13:51:27] <archivist> nice
[13:52:25] <micges> going home bbl
[13:53:07] <pjm> archivist http://pjm.dyndns.org/cnc/yaskawa.jpg
[13:53:53] <archivist> good find
[13:55:40] <pjm> yeah i will try to make it work with emc and if so, i can perhaps replace the motor on my mini-mill head with this one
[13:56:03] <pjm> the nice thing is the controller supports measurement stuff like torque / current output
[13:56:08] <pjm> which would be handy
[13:57:33] <archivist> yes for tool breakage/wear
[13:58:05] <jepler> http://www.yaskawa.com/site/dmdrive.nsf/link2_NewWindow/AHUG-6MUUE6/$file/TO-S606-11BCN.pdf?OpenElement -- Instruction Manual for V7 Drive
[13:58:19] <jepler> oops, it's in japanese
[13:58:39] <jepler> (or chinese?)
[13:58:48] <pjm> hehh
[13:58:53] <pjm> ah yes i have the engrish version
[13:59:14] <pjm> and there are a lot of inputs... plus pages of maths stuff about the motors etc
[13:59:32] <pjm> from what I can see, it will accept a 0 to 10V input for speed control
[13:59:43] <pjm> but i need to test that first
[13:59:55] <cradek> haha page 21
[14:00:06] <cradek> "no alien slug creatures"
[14:00:14] <cradek> "no watching old films"
[14:00:46] <cradek> "no looking closely at a picture of something dripping"
[14:00:53] <jepler> I'm not sure which one you think means "no watching old films".
[14:01:00] <cradek> bottom center
[14:01:56] <cradek> is the first column third row "no sumo wrestling"?
[14:02:04] <jepler> "don't use scented handsoaps or perfume"?
[14:02:36] <cradek> no, I think it's "do not spray shaving cream on the wall"
[14:02:44] <jepler> cradek: actually I thought that one was depecting something that mutually consenting VFD spindle controls do in prvate..
[14:03:01] <cradek> hahaha
[14:03:22] <cradek> true, I wonder what the repeated symbol means
[14:03:29] <jepler> that's the, uh, noise
[14:03:50] <jepler> "together we burn the incriminating papers"
[14:03:58] <cradek> ha
[14:05:22] <cradek> page 39 is sure inscrutable
[14:13:47] <jepler> In a manual for a different yaskawa spindle control, it seems that in configuration mode the 7-segment display shows something like that, a kind of virtual DIP switch bank
[14:17:00] <jepler> http://emergent.unpy.net/files/sandbox/bit-selection-signal.png
[14:18:42] <cradek> oh, bits
[14:18:46] <cradek> so friendly
[14:20:49] <jepler> horizontal lines are used to represent the status of internal state
[14:20:56] <jepler> (the status of state?)
[14:53:13] <dave_1> Darned! Anyone know if tomp2 is coming to fest?
[15:33:47] <skunkworks_> I am pretty sure tomp is coming to the fest.
[15:33:51] <skunkworks_> Hi tom
[15:37:33] <tomp2> skunkworks_: sorry, busy busy, hoped to get out but its not happening
[15:37:50] <dave_1> hi tom
[15:38:58] <dave_1> yep! busy, busy ... packing today
[15:39:25] <dave_1> and trying to get things ready to go to fest
[15:42:28] <skunkworks_> * skunkworks_ should work on that.
[15:43:00] <dave_1> well you are a bit closer :-)
[15:48:24] <cradek> I haven't started either. Too much stuff going on.
[15:48:57] <skunkworks_> yah - it isn 't bad at all. iirc 5-6 horus
[15:48:59] <skunkworks_> hours
[15:50:21] <dave_1> cradek ... I'm bring Cat40 ER40 plus .5, .625, .75 and 1.00 collets and a piece of 1" acme bar
[15:50:39] <cradek> excellent, thanks
[15:50:53] <dave_1> skunkworks ... try 31 hours
[15:51:14] <cradek> I can bring my full set of collets down to 1/8. I wonder if they might come in handy.
[15:51:27] <dave_1> in ER40?
[15:51:33] <cradek> yes
[15:51:41] <dave_1> just might
[15:51:48] <cradek> I will then
[15:52:02] <cradek> we were desperate last year, we had only a few metric collets, and wanted to do some stuff.
[15:52:24] <dave_1> I've gotten no feedback on the motor bracket ... so we may be swimming
[15:53:03] <cradek> I saw a plan in digital machinist. seems like it's not a difficult part except for holding it.
[15:53:21] <dave_1> Roland apparently has the holding set up on the table
[15:53:45] <dave_1> I tried to find my DM that had that dwg but couldn't .
[15:53:48] <cradek> oh ok, I could code it up in no time.
[15:54:06] <dave_1> Roland says he will code it ...
[15:54:08] <cradek> I don't remember if the drawing in there is complete. It might be.
[15:54:47] <dave_1> I thought I might bring Krall in case someone wants to code it in APT ... just for fun.
[15:55:18] <cradek> what is Krall?
[15:55:35] <dave_1> the standard reference for APT
[15:55:39] <cradek> I know what APT is, but I don't understand how "fun" can be used in the same sentence with it :-)
[15:56:03] <dave_1> I kinda agree after trying a bit of it and flopping pretty badly.
[15:56:25] <dave_1> I could write C to write G code and do better. ;-)
[15:57:03] <dave_1> from looking at the pics the tool list should be about like this...
[15:57:31] <cradek> I'm pretty effective with autocad/realize/hand editing. I haven't looked for anything better (or free) because it is very efficient/effective for me.
[15:58:26] <dave_1> .75 rougher, .75 finisher, probably 3/8 to do the slots and then the drill and tap for the threaded holes
[15:58:50] <dave_1> I kinda live with synergy ... which is way more capable than I am.
[15:59:37] <dave_1> but ... Roland said he would come up with a tool list so we'll see what he wants to do. After all he does have a bit of experience with Al
[15:59:40] <cradek> isn't there a bearing seat? We may need a boring head.
[16:00:58] <dave_1> it all depends on the tolerances ... IIRC the Mazak has about 2.5 thou backlash which will affect the roundness of the milled holes
[16:01:41] <dave_1> If they need to be dead on then we cir mill within 10 thou and clean up with the boring head
[16:02:59] <dave_1> I assume the first thing we need to do is upgrade to 2.2.5
[16:03:57] <cradek> I don't remember what we left it running
[16:04:04] <cradek> I doubt it has been used since we left it
[16:04:23] <dave_1> Indeed, it doesn't seem to get any use. too bad ...
[16:04:41] <cradek> yes.
[16:04:48] <dave_1> We've never used it with coolant have we?
[16:05:32] <cradek> I hear ray made a shower out of its coolant pump once
[16:05:45] <cradek> but no
[16:06:07] <dave_1> well, at least that says there is power to the pump ... have M8 and M9 been tested?
[16:06:17] <cradek> no idea.
[16:06:27] <dave_1> guess that goes on the list
[16:07:44] <dave_1> do you have an er20 or 25 collet holder?
[16:08:01] <cradek> nope just ER40
[16:08:31] <dave_1> Well at least the 40 will take just about anything we need for this job.
[16:08:51] <dave_1> unless I bring some 2.5" cutters ... ;-)
[16:09:37] <dave_1> actually we are going to make enough chips even if we profile with 3/4"
[16:10:38] <dave_1> gotta go make chips myself ... see ya soon.
[16:45:14] <awallin> I'm thinking about a new linux box for home-use: Intel DG33TL MB, Q9300 quad-cure, 4 Gb ram (does non-ecc matter?) and a 250gb disk. how does that sound? around 660eur
[16:46:36] <jepler> no idea about realtime but that sounds like it's quite adequate for anything else. I'm still dazzled by how fast a dual-core 2GB system can be.
[16:46:45] <jepler> I never spring for ECC RAM, fwiw
[16:47:26] <jepler> personally I think it sounds like you're skimping on hard disk space
[16:48:28] <awallin> hm, yes that disk cost around 50eur so there are probably 320 or 400g disks for around 60-80 available
[16:49:49] <jepler> building software effectively uses multiple cores when the makefiles are properly constructed, but I'm not sure what else will routinely take advantage of that parallelism.
[16:50:13] <jepler> I don't think (m)any gimp plug-ins do, and I failed at getting mencoder to run much faster through multithreading.
[16:59:08] <awallin> all modern BIOSes can boot from USB-stick right? so I don't neccesarily need a DVD-drive?
[17:03:46] <awallin> off to the shop then...
[18:17:14] <fenn> cradek: the alien slug thing intrigued me, so i looked it up: "lower humidity level"
[18:17:33] <cradek> ha, thanks
[18:18:42] <fenn> the slug is saying "lord.."
[18:19:01] <archivist> i slime over thee
[18:19:03] <cradek> what is the one in col 1 row 3?
[18:19:32] <fenn> no excessive vibration or something like that
[18:20:01] <cradek> how about above that? that's the last one I really couldn't figure out
[18:34:17] <fenn> can't find the kanji.. something like "inspect condensation" i guess
[18:34:36] <fenn> i did find this cool program "kanjipad" that lets you draw the character though
[18:34:53] <cradek> neat
[18:35:58] <skunkworks_> * skunkworks_ has no idea what is going on
[18:36:15] <fenn> skunkworks_: there were some funny drawings in a japanese VFD manual
[18:42:31] <fenn> ok kanjipad stinks
[18:43:57] <skunkworks_> ah - :)
[18:52:32] <SWPadnos> should I stick my boring head in the Fest pile?
[18:52:43] <SWPadnos> I think it has a 3/4" shank, though it could be R8
[18:54:45] <cradek> R8 is no use but 3/4 would work fine
[18:55:07] <cradek> if roland wants us to cut parts, I would assume he has everything we need. maybe we should concentrate on what we want to do instead
[18:55:15] <SWPadnos> oh well - it's R8
[18:55:33] <SWPadnos> I'm sure he has tools (though I would have been sure he had tool holders until last year :) )
[18:55:48] <cradek> I have one with 1" straight shank...
[18:56:08] <SWPadnos> I guess I do too, except for that taper at the end ;)
[18:56:35] <SWPadnos> (or whatever the straight part of R8 is)
[18:57:17] <SWPadnos> do we want a tapping head around, for thread quality comparisons or anything?
[19:01:49] <cradek> do you mean T/C or reversing?
[19:02:00] <SWPadnos> both
[19:02:20] <cradek> a T/C would be great because we don't have to change anything
[19:02:38] <cradek> I bet it would C just a tiny bit and the thread would be perfect
[19:02:43] <cradek> that would be an interesting comparison.
[19:03:17] <SWPadnos> uh - what do you mean by T/C?
[19:03:38] <cradek> tension/compression - it gives a little bit in Z
[19:03:55] <skunkworks_> we have some - but I think they are k&t shanked
[19:03:56] <cradek> some may also allow a bit of float sideways
[19:04:03] <SWPadnos> ah
[19:04:09] <SWPadnos> ok, I haev Torque Control heads :)
[19:04:12] <SWPadnos> have
[19:04:17] <SWPadnos> TC/DC models
[19:04:35] <cradek> hey I have one of those - no idea how to use it
[19:04:39] <SWPadnos> (torque control/depth control)
[19:04:46] <cradek> you can set it with a torque wrench
[19:04:54] <cradek> supposedly this allows you to tap, somehow
[19:04:59] <SWPadnos> ?
[19:05:02] <cradek> I don't buy it, personally
[19:05:34] <cradek> oh I think I see
[19:05:40] <SWPadnos> the torque control will let the clutch slip if the tap dulls or something (though I don't know what's supposed to happen with Z still descending)
[19:06:05] <archivist> I have a torque limit head with auto reverse for pull out
[19:06:06] <cradek> turn the spindle too fast. go down and the tap will turn how it wants, with the extra spindle speed going into the clutch
[19:06:09] <SWPadnos> the depth control will stop the tap once it gets to a certain depth - again I don't know how much float Z has
[19:06:14] <SWPadnos> yes
[19:06:32] <cradek> get to the bottom, reverse the spindle and go too fast, clutch spins, then move up and the tap unscrews
[19:06:44] <SWPadnos> you don't need to reverse the spindle with the tapmatics
[19:06:46] <archivist> often used with a drill press so human sees the slip
[19:06:50] <cradek> I know, but with mine you do
[19:06:55] <SWPadnos> oh
[19:07:01] <cradek> it's just a clutch, as far as I can tell
[19:07:12] <SWPadnos> so it's a "rigid tap holder" ?
[19:07:42] <cradek> I can't imagine how it works with the boss because I don't think it can reverse the spindle without user interaction
[19:07:49] <SWPadnos> I wonder if it would be a good thing to have a separate tapping cycle for Tapmatic-like heads
[19:07:54] <archivist> I have a sprung dog clutch one somewhere (I would hate to use in anger)
[19:08:07] <SWPadnos> they need 2x the feed rate backing out, or the clutch just slips
[19:09:05] <archivist> it needed taps with a groove to allow movement
[19:09:22] <SWPadnos> hmmm. now that the sink is back together, I think I'll eat
[19:09:24] <SWPadnos> bbiab
[19:10:05] <jepler> flaccid tapping
[19:12:26] <cradek> I don't see how you would use a tapmatic with cnc. I guess you would feed a bit too slow and let it slip occasionally?
[19:12:51] <cradek> it's easy on a drill press/manual bridgeport
[19:16:36] <skunkworks_> vigra tapping head?
[19:16:45] <skunkworks_> *viagra
[19:59:41] <alex_joni> 'lo everyone
[20:04:06] <skunkworks_> Hi alex - how have you been
[20:04:07] <skunkworks_> ?
[20:04:24] <gefink> hi
[20:09:25] <alex_joni> skunkworks_: busy ;)
[20:09:33] <alex_joni> and travelling.. but back home for a couple of days now
[20:13:52] <skunkworks_> nice
[20:22:16] <alex_joni> skunkworks_: 2-3 days, then I'm gone for 2 weeks again :(
[20:22:58] <cradek> oh no, you're not going to be around during workshop?
[20:23:11] <alex_joni> I'm going to try
[20:23:15] <alex_joni> but I won't be at home
[20:24:16] <cradek> that's ok; neither will we
[20:25:07] <alex_joni> I'm going to a fair ..
[20:25:18] <alex_joni> so hopefully I'll get some online time :D
[20:26:13] <cradek> good
[20:32:30] <skunkworks_> That is good.
[20:39:28] <alex_joni> cradek: you asked what software this one used.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFkLrQZVcpc#Aq2h3cbnpjM
[20:39:33] <alex_joni> it seems to be mach
[20:40:43] <cradek> interesting
[20:41:25] <cradek> every so often (every revolution of the spindle?) you can hear the motor thump and then pick a new speed
[20:41:42] <cradek> that's why I wondered what the software was
[20:55:05] <als> workshop going to be the same channel?
[20:55:24] <cradek> yes we will definitely be here
[20:55:29] <als> cool
[20:55:32] <cradek> when we're at our computers anyway
[20:55:57] <als> no web cam
[20:56:07] <cradek> possibly we will have a webcam again
[20:56:17] <cradek> it was jmk's so it's up to him.
[20:56:47] <als> I'll stay tuned
[21:00:44] <xyzee> I have just installed a pci parallel port card because I don't think the one on the computer works. Is there anything I need to do to configure it?
[21:02:23] <awallin_ubu> yay, new ubuntu box now running!
[21:05:08] <alex_joni> xyzee: http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?NetMos
[21:05:12] <alex_joni> awallin_ubu: nice
[21:22:53] <als> does anyone have a BHN or horsepower unit list for diff materials
[21:24:07] <toastydeath> nar
[21:24:21] <toastydeath> machinery's handbook does
[21:24:26] <toastydeath> but my copy is not here
[21:24:53] <als> i'll give it a look see
[21:27:26] <pjm_> btw could someone help me with a 3phase motor question?
[21:27:33] <pjm_> its relating to VFD
[21:27:55] <toastydeath> i probably can't but you could just ask and see if someone gets back to you.
[21:28:06] <pjm_> okey dokey will do
[21:29:30] <pjm_> ok i have this ABB motor, type M2AA063B but what i need to find out some how is the max frequency it can work at, I've run it up to 8k rpm and it seems to be fine and has plenty of torque
[21:29:43] <pjm_> so my question is how do I find the max operating freq for the motor?
[21:30:26] <awallin_ubu> it's probably electrically ok to run it at a high rpm, but the bearings could be rated lower
[21:31:01] <pjm_> okay, i was wondering about the losses in the coils etc as the frequency increases
[21:31:15] <pjm_> but the spec for the motors just say '50 or 60Hz'
[21:31:23] <pjm_> which isnt applicable in a VFD situation
[21:31:38] <awallin_ubu> my guess is you will just loose more and more torque at high rpm, but it will be electrically ok
[21:31:56] <awallin_ubu> we have a standard motor from ABB and we run it up to about 5400 rpm or 90 Hz
[21:31:58] <pjm_> ok thanks, I didnt want to over cook the motor
[21:32:20] <awallin_ubu> jmk would probably know more, ask him too!
[21:32:28] <pjm_> ok thanks
[21:32:50] <pjm_> well this motor / drive could be used on my mill head since it looks like the controller can be pwm'd
[21:34:10] <awallin_ubu> my vfd takes a pulse train input (FM), not pwm
[21:35:19] <JbLb_of> JbLb_of is now known as JbLb_ws
[21:36:42] <pjm_> ah yes its probably a pulse train, although it also has an analogue dc-10v input that i can derive from classic PWM with a cap and an R
[21:37:36] <awallin_ubu> ok, mine is an Omron V7, it has bot analog 0-10V and pulse train. I figured the digital pulse train will be less noisy,
[21:39:05] <alex_joni> good night all
[21:40:56] <pjm_> awallin_ubu yeah that is a good point, and u drive it direct from EMC?
[21:41:54] <pjm_> this is my controller and motor: http://pjm.dyndns.org/cnc/yaskawa.jpg
[21:50:11] <awallin_ubu> yes, the pulse train is generated by stepgen in HAL, then it goes through optoisolators and then to a transistor circuit as suggested in the vfd manual
[21:50:28] <awallin_ubu> your motor and vfd looks very much like ours, let me see if I can find a picture
[21:50:40] <pjm_> ah ok cool thanks
[21:52:19] <awallin_ubu> this is the circuit http://www.anderswallin.net/2008/03/vfd-control-board/
[21:53:08] <pjm_> excellent, thanks for that
[21:53:14] <pjm_> looks like just what I needed
[21:53:20] <pjm_> rather than reinventing the wheel
[21:54:13] <awallin_ubu> the VFD inputs float up to 24V by themselves, and then these transistors pull them to ground when I want to activate the input
[21:55:04] <pjm_> that is an interesting comment about rigid tapping
[21:55:23] <pjm_> i did some fwd/rev tests with my motor/controller and it can reverse direction pretty quickly
[21:55:35] <awallin_ubu> we did rigid tapping about one week ago
[21:56:44] <pjm_> excellent indeed
[21:57:10] <pjm_> so for the encoder on the spindle, how many counts per rev did you use?
[21:57:41] <awallin_ubu> the spindle encoder is 500ppr, we read it with the 4th encoder input on the m5i20
[21:58:19] <awallin_ubu> there's a video here http://www.anderswallin.net/2008/04/emc2-test-run/ you will see the VFD and the motor at around 20s and then again later at 1:25
[21:58:50] <pjm_> ok i'll take a look, thanks
[22:01:26] <pjm_> yes that is excellent
[22:01:43] <pjm_> the controller looks pretty much identical to the unit i have here
[22:01:56] <pjm_> except yours has the operator frequency setting knob
[22:02:11] <pjm_> where as mine doesnt, although the cut out in the panel etc is there so its probably add-able
[22:02:55] <pjm_> btw do u have the facility for a 'braking resistor' ?
[22:02:58] <awallin_ubu> this one is sold as omron but who knows where they are made...
[22:03:07] <pjm_> yeah sure..
[22:03:38] <awallin_ubu> yes there is a braking resistor connection I think. there's a cooling fan that switches on/off as the VFD feels it has to cool down. I haven't used a braking resistor
[22:04:54] <pjm_> ok yes i'm experimenting with that currently
[22:04:58] <awallin_ubu> * awallin_ubu goes to sleep...
[22:05:01] <pjm_> so i'll let you know if / when it works
[22:05:03] <pjm_> ok cul
[22:29:30] <jmkasunich> regarding top speed of a 3ph motor
[22:29:49] <jmkasunich> unfortunately, if the motor nameplate doesn't tell you, its really hard to know
[22:30:31] <jmkasunich> there are no rules of thumb that I know - too many motors, too many drives, too many manufactureres - every one is different
[22:30:43] <jmkasunich> if there _is_ a max speed on the nameplate, don't go faster
[22:30:56] <jmkasunich> some motors are speed limited by centrifugal force
[22:31:09] <jmkasunich> although that is more likely on larger motors
[22:38:04] <skunkworks> logger_emc: bookmark
[22:38:04] <skunkworks> Just this once .. here's the log: http://www.linuxcnc.org/irc/irc.freenode.net:6667/emc/2008-06-11.txt
[22:41:12] <skunkworks> we actually setup and ran the motor we picked for the spindle at 2X rated rpm for a few hours just to see.. (1800rpm motor at 3600RPM) nothing came apart. - yet.
[22:41:38] <jmkasunich> 3600 isn't so scary
[22:41:50] <jmkasunich> running a nameplated 3600 at 3x is a bit more scary
[22:41:56] <jmkasunich> 2x I mean
[22:42:00] <jmkasunich> 7200
[22:42:55] <skunkworks> I bet
[22:43:24] <skunkworks> i think the vfd on our spindle goes up to 400hz iirc
[22:43:47] <skunkworks> but we never tried it ;)
[22:50:20] <skunkworks> this is interesting
[22:50:22] <skunkworks> http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=59503
[22:50:46] <skunkworks> videos are cool.
[23:31:23] <Vq^_> Vq^_ is now known as Vq^