#emc | Logs for 2008-05-11

[04:12:30] <toastydeath> thundercats, ho!
[12:25:12] <lerneaen_hydra> awallin; hey there, I just saw the steel bulb video on your page, any reason to make it from steel rather than lead?
[12:25:28] <lerneaen_hydra> lead being easier to machine and all
[12:26:41] <awallin> We've made lead bulbs by casting. In aluminium moulds. Don't know where we could find a big enough chunk of lead for milling
[12:30:37] <lerneaen_hydra> oh, why can't you cast ingots of lead in roughly the right shape?
[12:31:23] <lerneaen_hydra> and then machine them to the right shape
[12:31:33] <lerneaen_hydra> you can even recycle the chips
[12:34:30] <awallin> we could try that. but perhaps we'll do the prototyping in steel and when we find a good shape we make a mould in aluminium and can cast lots of that shape bulb in lead. ofcourse the volume's aren't going to be the same if we want the same weight bubls
[12:37:00] <lerneaen_hydra> awallin; hmm I see, how does the mill cope with steel? is it still based on the BF20 (the milling column and XY table)?
[12:39:33] <awallin> just the column and the base are original. new table, spindle, linear rails, ballscrews
[12:41:04] <lerneaen_hydra> oh. that's not a whole lot left. how stable is the base? I've found that when doing relatively heavy work that it deflects a bit too easily
[12:44:31] <awallin> I don't know it deflects. we usually work in aluminum
[12:44:41] <lerneaen_hydra> hmm ok
[15:12:21] <pcnc> pcnc is now known as SWPadnos_
[15:12:55] <SWPadnos_> hi folks - got a question about estop enables, charge pumps, and stepconf
[15:13:00] <SWPadnos_> maybe 2 questions
[15:13:31] <alex_joni> dataja
[15:13:39] <SWPadnos_> was that Romanian?
[15:13:46] <alex_joni> nope.. english/IRC :P
[15:14:00] <SWPadnos_> so, I set up a machine with stepconf, with charge pump on a pin
[15:14:01] <SWPadnos_> heh :)
[15:14:07] <alex_joni> well.. actually DATAJA.. but too lazy to push Shift
[15:14:21] <SWPadnos_> but for some reason, the charge pump never gets enabled
[15:14:33] <SWPadnos_> there's an ESTOP input, which appears to be correctly connected
[15:14:47] <SWPadnos_> unless estop-ext==TRUE means "estopped"
[15:14:59] <SWPadnos_> but the machine is in the on state, so that seems to bo OK
[15:15:02] <SWPadnos_> s/bo/be/
[15:15:30] <SWPadnos_> I'm looking at estop-ext (connected to iocontrol.0.emc-enable-in)
[15:15:30] <rayh> It may well be that true is estopped. Some board makers don't know the truth.
[15:16:20] <SWPadnos_> iocontrol.0.user-enable-out connects to charge-pump-enable, which I think may be wrong
[15:16:48] <SWPadnos_> isn't that iocontrol output only "on" when the user is pressing the F/machine on button?
[15:16:57] <SWPadnos_> (user-enable-out)
[15:17:49] <SWPadnos_> so the status right now is that axis shows that the machine is on (and I can jog around), but iocontrol.0.estop-out is false, as is ...user-enable-out
[15:18:19] <rayh> I've not looked very close at the output of stepconf for this. I do know that a fellow in portland, OR got his going with a pmdx131 using stepconf.
[15:18:37] <SWPadnos_> and nothing changes when I hit F2 (at least none of the signals change), but it does change whether I can jog or not
[15:19:48] <rayh> F2 is machine on in axis?
[15:20:03] <SWPadnos_> yes
[15:21:01] <SWPadnos_> ok, interesting
[15:21:10] <SWPadnos_> I need to check this once more, but here goes
[15:21:35] <SWPadnos_> (note that the charge pump is not relevant to the external enable input, it only disables the spindle/coolant)
[15:22:29] <SWPadnos_> hit external estop, but don' treset it - that turns off the estop-ext signal (connected to iocontrol....emc-enable-in
[15:22:55] <SWPadnos_> reset the external estop, so the machine looks ready, no charge pump
[15:23:27] <rayh> charge pump is on a pin of it's own?
[15:23:50] <SWPadnos_> there's a "machine ready" input to EMC
[15:24:23] <rayh> Okay. What turns that off/on
[15:24:51] <SWPadnos_> there's a charge pump output to the machine
[15:25:06] <SWPadnos_> just an interlock: big red button and start button with a contactor
[15:25:42] <rayh> Okay. So that is an external estop.
[15:25:45] <SWPadnos_> yes
[15:26:08] <SWPadnos_> I'm trying to get the charge pump to turn on when I have machine on
[15:26:24] <SWPadnos_> for some reason estop-out isn't reliably turning on
[15:27:15] <SWPadnos_> which is iocontrol.0.user-enable-out
[15:29:21] <rayh> f2 has no effect on iocontrol.0.user-enable-out
[15:29:40] <rayh> that I can see here.
[15:30:19] <SWPadnos_> it almost looks like iocontrol.0.user-enable-out is inverted
[15:30:23] <rayh> With a loopback it does reliably show the status of gui estop
[15:30:42] <rayh> That's with mini. Let me start it with axis.
[15:31:05] <SWPadnos_> with the external estop activated (emc-enable-in false), iocontrol.0.user-enable-out is on
[15:31:41] <JanVanGilsen> Hi guys
[15:32:25] <JanVanGilsen> I wanted to show off my almost finiched cnc machine :)
[15:32:30] <JanVanGilsen> http://imagebin.org/17793
[15:32:32] <JanVanGilsen> http://imagebin.org/17794
[15:33:24] <SWPadnos_> ok, here's the pattern
[15:33:34] <rayh> WOW that is great work JanVanGilsen
[15:34:21] <SWPadnos_> with the external system "ok" - which puts EMC in "estop reset" state, if I ever hit F1 to stop EMC, I can never get the charge pump back
[15:35:04] <SWPadnos_> with external estop "not OK", I can hit F1 to turn the charge pump on, but never off
[15:35:32] <SWPadnos_> well, at least there's a pattern :)
[15:35:58] <rayh> SWPadnos, That third estop pin user-request-enable might be what you are looking for.
[15:36:16] <SWPadnos_> that never activates when the external estop is "ok"
[15:36:26] <rayh> Look at the way it's used in the demo step cl
[15:36:40] <SWPadnos_> I'll do that
[15:36:44] <rayh> It's a very short reset.
[15:36:57] <SWPadnos_> I'm not sure this machine is so different from others though
[15:37:07] <rayh> In fact the fourth row in run 1 shows it.
[15:37:11] <SWPadnos_> there's a machine ready input, and a charge pump
[15:37:13] <JanVanGilsen> rayh, thx
[15:37:52] <JymmmEMC> p-stop ftw!
[15:42:36] <SWPadnos_> it seems that this setup shouldn't need CL, but maybe it does
[15:42:50] <SWPadnos_> there doesn't seem to be a machine on HAL bit
[15:43:23] <rayh> No it wouldn't need cl just an or between enable-in and user-request-enable
[15:43:54] <JanVanGilsen> Is there somebody who made/converted a tilting rotation table machine with EMC? Else I'll just hope that my kinematic calculations will work.
[15:44:35] <rayh> I believe you are the first, JanVanGilsen
[15:45:21] <JanVanGilsen> arrg.. but its also nice to be first
[15:45:54] <rayh> There are folk who can help with that kinematics if you find issues.
[15:46:50] <rayh> I've though about that exact configuration quite a bit over the years.
[15:46:52] <JanVanGilsen> thats nice, I'm hoping to test it this (or next) week
[15:47:53] <rayh> Fantastic. What are you using for motor drives?
[15:48:21] <rayh> SWPadnos, halui has machine on and off and status.
[15:48:58] <JanVanGilsen> SMD microstepper drives (8 microsteps)
[15:49:18] <rayh> Got a link for those?
[15:51:06] <JanVanGilsen> http://www.jvl.dk/files/pdf/lb043gb.pdf
[15:51:56] <rayh> thanks
[15:54:30] <SWPadnos_> machine on is available in emc.status, but apparently not in HAL
[15:54:58] <rayh> SWP you can find it in halui.
[15:55:15] <SWPadnos_> yes, true :)
[15:55:31] <rayh> You could also use halui for the estop stuff if you wanted to.
[15:57:01] <rayh> Fascinating
[15:57:36] <SWPadnos_> it does seem strange that I can only set user-enable-out when emc-enable-in is off, and I can only reset user-enable-out when emc-enable-in is on
[15:58:57] <rayh> I started halui-halvcp
[15:59:17] <rayh> and see that when the machine is out of estop and on
[15:59:39] <rayh> halui.estop.is-activated shows false
[15:59:57] <rayh> but iocontrol.o.user-enable-out is true
[16:01:21] <SWPadnos_> and if you toggle what would be the external estop (connected to iocontrol.0.emc-enable-in), then iocontrol.0.user-enable-out will go false
[16:01:42] <rayh> and not come back to true?
[16:01:52] <SWPadnos_> which you can turn on with F1 (but can't turn off again until user-enable-in goes true)
[16:03:33] <rayh> I think I'd edit a copy of demo-step-cl to match your estop pinouts and ins.
[16:03:42] <SWPadnos_> yep, that may be the trick
[16:03:47] <SWPadnos_> plus add the charge pump
[16:03:55] <SWPadnos_> or just add halui :)
[16:03:58] <rayh> Then start it up and select the fourth row in the estop rung
[16:04:12] <rayh> and try the external estop.
[16:04:33] <rayh> That momentary signal from user-request-enable might do the trick.
[16:06:05] <SWPadnos_> it doesn't seem to activate when emc-enable-in is true
[16:12:27] <alex_joni> SWPadnos_: that's the intended behaviour
[16:12:52] <JymmmEMC> alex_joni: explain
[16:13:02] <SWPadnos_> yeah, explain! :)
[16:13:04] <alex_joni> read emc2/src/emc/iotask/IoControl.cc
[16:13:22] <JymmmEMC> alex_joni: whats the reasoning behind it?
[16:13:22] <SWPadnos_> :P
[16:13:41] <alex_joni> JymmmEMC: about 2 days of work
[16:14:15] <alex_joni> jmkasunich and myself worked a lot of doing this right, but it was 1-2 years ago, so I'm not up to speed about details
[16:14:20] <alex_joni> it's documented there though
[16:16:59] <JymmmEMC> Mind if I ask a OT question?
[16:17:13] <JymmmEMC> Mind if I ask a OT (programming) question?
[16:17:29] <toastydeath> ?
[16:17:42] <alex_joni> JymmmEMC: never
[16:17:45] <toastydeath> oh, an ot computer programming question
[16:17:47] <toastydeath> not a g-code thing
[16:17:49] <toastydeath> lulz
[16:18:52] <SWPadnos_> alex_joni: I remember the conversations, nut also don't re,e,ber the details
[16:18:57] <SWPadnos_> s/nut/but/
[16:19:36] <SWPadnos_> I guess the motor-enable outputs could be used in place of machine-on, since they more or less reflect that
[16:20:10] <JymmmEMC> I'm writing a function to give duration of time, but only using a single UOM (130 minutes), instead of multiple UOM (2 hours, 10 minutes). But I'm not sure where the breakpoints should be between each UOM? Example:
[16:20:33] <alex_joni> what's an UOM?
[16:20:34] <SWPadnos_> what's the input?
[16:20:38] <SWPadnos_> unit of measure
[16:20:42] <JymmmEMC> 90 seconds
[16:20:42] <JymmmEMC> 180 minutes
[16:20:42] <JymmmEMC> 96 hours
[16:20:42] <JymmmEMC> 90 days
[16:20:42] <JymmmEMC> 18 weeks
[16:20:43] <JymmmEMC> 36 months
[16:20:45] <JymmmEMC> 4 years
[16:20:51] <JymmmEMC> UOM == Unit of measurement
[16:21:01] <alex_joni> so you always want only one?
[16:21:06] <JymmmEMC> correct
[16:21:23] <SWPadnos_> so the input might be the string "90 days"?
[16:21:47] <JymmmEMC> that would be the output
[16:21:49] <alex_joni> so you need to find the highest UOM where it still fits?
[16:21:53] <JymmmEMC> yes
[16:22:06] <alex_joni> switch and a series of MOD's ..
[16:22:07] <JymmmEMC> now - timestamp == single UOM
[16:22:13] <SWPadnos_> that will almost always end up as seconds, due to floating point rounding error
[16:22:35] <JymmmEMC> now - timestamp == duration
[16:22:57] <SWPadnos_> duration will rarely be an exact multiple of seconds, minutes, hours ...
[16:23:16] <SWPadnos_> so without some fuzz factor, you'll end up using the smallest unit all the time
[16:23:31] <JymmmEMC> well, it'll be epoch, but convert to single UOM for readability
[16:25:16] <JymmmEMC> Do you think 3x the value would be about right?
[16:27:30] <JymmmEMC> I guess what I'm saying is WHEN does the significance begin to dwindle? Saying something happened 95 minutes ago provides enough accuracy, but saying it occured 1.5 hours ago doesn't (assuming you round off to 1/10's of an hour)
[16:28:00] <JymmmEMC> I'd rather not use decimals if at all possible
[16:28:07] <JymmmEMC> just whole UOM
[16:28:22] <SWPadnos_> silly question: if I press "home", will esc abort that?
[16:28:49] <jmkasunich> I believe so
[16:29:01] <jmkasunich> but if you break the machine trying it, I will deny saying that
[16:29:11] <SWPadnos_> damn. I'm not logging ;)
[16:29:26] <JymmmEMC> SWPadnos google is
[16:30:09] <SWPadnos_> yes, it does :)
[16:30:42] <alex_joni> jyjylolol
[16:30:50] <alex_joni> sorry ;)
[16:30:59] <alex_joni> logger_emc is logging
[16:34:46] <JymmmEMC> 1) '179 seconds ago', add one but display '3 minutes ago' instead of '180 seconds ago', sound about right?
[16:35:01] <alex_joni> JymmmEMC: kinda..
[16:35:05] <alex_joni> but it sounds strange
[16:35:11] <alex_joni> what timespans do you expect?
[16:35:41] <JymmmEMC> seconds, minutes, hours, days, weeks, months, and years.
[16:35:52] <alex_joni> (I would always go to a higher UOM if it goes over some treshold)
[16:36:08] <alex_joni> so instead of 210 minutes, maybe display 3 hours
[16:36:15] <alex_joni> or 3.5hours
[16:36:16] <JymmmEMC> alex_joni: Exactly, but I'm trying to determine what that threshold is/should be
[16:36:19] <alex_joni> or something like that
[16:36:26] <alex_joni> it's UOM dependent
[16:36:28] <SWPadnos_> I'd make an array that holds the relationship between each unit (ie, a minute is 60 seconds, an hour is 60 minutes ...)
[16:36:30] <jmkasunich> the threshold depends on what you are using the information for
[16:36:31] <JymmmEMC> alex_joni: Right, but whole units only, no decimal
[16:36:41] <alex_joni> but generally something like 2 times the UOM
[16:36:48] <alex_joni> 120 minutes turns to 2h
[16:36:52] <SWPadnos_> you build another array with the number of base units (maybe seconds) for each larger unit
[16:36:54] <alex_joni> 48h turns to 2 days
[16:37:01] <jmkasunich> the issue is when you have 150 minutes
[16:37:09] <alex_joni> 7xx days turns to 2 years
[16:37:09] <jmkasunich> do you want to round that down to 2 hours?
[16:37:22] <JymmmEMC> jmkasunich: That's why I was thinking 3x
[16:37:27] <SWPadnos_> for each input, start at the largest unit, and search until you find one that's less than the input value (in seeconds or whatever)
[16:37:44] <alex_joni> JymmmEMC: yeah, but 1214 days might be a bit hard to parse by people
[16:37:49] <SWPadnos_> once that's done, find the largest unit where input mod (unit size) == 0
[16:37:58] <JymmmEMC> alex_joni: that would be months or weeks
[16:38:06] <alex_joni> err.. right
[16:38:30] <SWPadnos_> or where input mod (unit size) is < unit_size/something - ie 183 minutes is close to 3 hours
[16:38:32] <JymmmEMC> 2) 72 hours ago + 1 == 3 days ago
[16:38:32] <SWPadnos_> )
[16:38:43] <jmkasunich> I was thinking the other way - convert to the finest UOM (seconds) - that will be a big number. then start converting to larger units until the number is less than your threshold
[16:39:02] <JymmmEMC> s/72/71/
[16:39:07] <SWPadnos_> but 6000 seconds mod 1 == 0
[16:39:17] <SWPadnos_> you'll always get a perfect fit for the smallest unit
[16:39:43] <SWPadnos_> so you want to find the largest unit for which the fit is close enough to perfect
[16:39:44] <jmkasunich> SWPadnos who are you talking to? I'm not talking about doing any mod stuff
[16:40:18] <JymmmEMC> Days get tricky as it's between weeks and months I think.
[16:40:50] <jmkasunich> actually. I'd probably have a different threshold for each UOM
[16:40:54] <JymmmEMC> 60*60*24*7*12*365
[16:41:16] <jmkasunich> "if more than 20 days, convert to weeks" "if more than 7 weeks, convert to months", etc
[16:41:17] <JymmmEMC> jmkasunich: Yeah, I dont think a single therhold will do at all
[16:42:00] <JymmmEMC> ok, what about this.... the higher UOM will never be less than 3?
[16:42:30] <jmkasunich> 3 seems kind of low, but again, this depends on YOUR application
[16:42:50] <jmkasunich> do you need to be within 50%, 20%, 10%?
[16:43:12] <jmkasunich> the problem is NOT periods that convert exactly (or near exactly)
[16:43:29] <jmkasunich> 21 days can expressed as 3 weeks with no loss of accuracy
[16:44:16] <jmkasunich> but what about 18 days? calling 18 days "3 weeks" is an error of 15%
[16:45:57] <JymmmEMC> Lets look at it.... 90sec = 3 minutes, 180 min = 3 hrs, 72 hrs = 3 days, 21 days = 3 wks, 90 days = 3 months, 36 months = 3 years.
[16:46:35] <JymmmEMC> ooops, I forget weeks in there... 21 days = 3 weeks
[16:46:44] <jmkasunich> weeks is in there
[16:47:03] <jmkasunich> the tricky part is that you go from days to weeks, and from days to months, instead of days->weeks->months
[16:47:29] <JymmmEMC> my bad
[16:47:39] <jmkasunich> also, you got the first one wong - 180 secs = 3 mins
[16:48:00] <JymmmEMC> oley, 180 sec is fine though.
[16:48:09] <jmkasunich> 4.2857 weeks in a month, isn't exactly a natural conversion
[16:48:15] <jmkasunich> but for this purpose it works fine
[16:48:34] <jmkasunich> 12.857 weeks = 3 months
[16:48:55] <JymmmEMC> lets round it off to 13 weeks
[16:49:06] <JymmmEMC> 13 wks = 3 months
[16:49:09] <jmkasunich> I wouldn't
[16:49:21] <JymmmEMC> why's that?
[16:49:24] <jmkasunich> do the computations with full precision, and round off only the final answer
[16:49:41] <jmkasunich> the algorithm is:
[16:49:44] <jmkasunich> convert time to seconds
[16:49:53] <jmkasunich> then compute minutes (div by 60)
[16:50:03] <jmkasunich> if less than 3, use seconds
[16:50:15] <jmkasunich> else, compute hours (div minutes by 60)
[16:50:20] <jmkasunich> if less than 3, use minutes
[16:50:26] <jmkasunich> else, compute days (div by 24)
[16:50:30] <jmkasunich> if less than 3 use hours
[16:50:32] <jmkasunich> etc
[16:51:21] <jmkasunich> since you need to store the division ratios for each UOM, you could also store independent thresholds for each UMO
[16:51:29] <JymmmEMC> it's the weeks threshold that I'm still not sure about (not the math) limit at which it goes to months.
[16:51:44] <jmkasunich> if months < 3, use weeks
[16:52:00] <JymmmEMC> but is 3 months "good enough"
[16:52:13] <jmkasunich> so make it 4
[16:52:30] <DanielFalck> jmkasunich: I think I found the 'whitelist' request page at my isp for the mailing list
[16:52:34] <jmkasunich> thats my point - each UOM can have its own threashold
[16:52:38] <DanielFalck> we'll see how it goes
[16:52:41] <jmkasunich> DanielFalck: cool
[16:53:30] <jmkasunich> btw, I don't have data on the number of outgoing messages, so I can't easily answer that
[16:53:48] <jmkasunich> I think the archives page shows mail volume by day tho
[16:54:28] <DanielFalck> thanks for looking at it for me. I'll let you know how it turns out.
[16:54:28] <JymmmEMC> jmkasunich: I get that, it's WHAT the threshold should be for each UOM. Just not sure about the weeks to months aspect, be it 3, 4, or 5 for that matter. If you wanted to see how old something was, does '11 weeks ago' give you enough information compared to '3 months ago', would you rather see a higher 'weeks' value?
[16:55:03] <jmkasunich> and I keep telling you, it depends entirely on the context, which only YOU know
[16:55:24] <JymmmEMC> jmkasunich: ticket/job/odering system.
[16:55:29] <JymmmEMC> oreding
[16:55:33] <jmkasunich> pregnant women count in weeks, because they care about +-/ 1 week even after nine months
[16:55:34] <JymmmEMC> ordering
[16:56:42] <JymmmEMC> right, but is that the only exception you can think of by chance?
[16:57:00] <cradek> DanielFalck: a dozen verizon.net users got their subscriptions disabled today. not sure if it's verizon's or sf's fault but something "new" is happening
[16:57:09] <jmkasunich> I'd probably use 3 as the threshold for every UOM except weeks to months - switch to months after 4
[16:57:33] <jmkasunich> cradek: I told dan that by email earlier today
[16:58:07] <cradek> ok then
[17:13:35] <SWPadnos_> ok, more "interesting" behavior :)
[17:13:43] <SWPadnos_> I'm sure this is known
[17:13:55] <SWPadnos_> (but not to me, because hey - I don't have a CNC yet :) )
[17:14:18] <SWPadnos_> star ta program with radius comp, and some concave corner somewhere later on
[17:14:37] <SWPadnos_> dialog pops up more or less immediately telling you about the problem
[17:15:01] <SWPadnos_> then the machine runs until it gets to the segment that errored, and stops there
[17:15:14] <jmkasunich> thats probably the motion buffer
[17:15:17] <SWPadnos_> makes sense, but still a little surprising for an operator
[17:15:20] <jmkasunich> the interp runs 200 segments ahead
[17:15:22] <SWPadnos_> yep, queued motion
[17:15:45] <SWPadnos_> yes - it stopped on line 192 :)
[17:15:49] <jmkasunich> actually I'm surprised you don't get the message when you load the program, while axis is doing the preview
[17:16:12] <SWPadnos_> I think axis does something to cutter comp
[17:16:20] <SWPadnos_> when it's generating the preview
[17:27:47] <cradek> I'm surprised by that too
[18:06:22] <toastydeath> shooooop
[18:06:25] <toastydeath> da whoop
[18:06:47] <JymmmEMC> woot.com
[18:12:15] <gefink> I have a G61 "remarkableness"
[18:12:19] <tomp2> woot.com temperature monitor Voice alert tells you "Your stepper is almost toast" and "your stepper is an ex-parrot"
[18:13:01] <JymmmEMC> they sell a different item each day.
[18:13:45] <tomp2> yeh, since you showed me i check once i a while ( you a bot? thats exactly the same reply!)
[18:14:43] <JymmmEMC> sometimes I feel like it, latelt feel like it a lot. Got Oilcan?
[18:15:07] <gefink> If i use g61 i got 1-time an axis following error. after that g61 looks enabled but dont work
[18:15:45] <gefink> The config is from stepconf-wizard
[19:10:15] <alex_joni> DanielFalck: still there?
[19:11:13] <alex_joni> I noticed a "Bounce action notification" from 11.05.2008 (dfalck AT verizon..) Subscription disabled, Reason: Excessive or fatal bounces.
[19:28:15] <fenn> JymmmEMC: i think you should just switch to a metric day - 100ksec is close enough
[19:28:55] <fenn> then you only have to keep the last three digits (unless you want to use scientific notation)
[19:29:16] <fenn> first three digits*
[19:33:13] <fenn> JymmmEMC: i even made a clock for you: watch -n 1 'date +%s; echo "G M k s"'
[19:34:44] <fenn> good for the next 275 years at least
[19:35:54] <DanielFalck> alex_joni: thanks. I figured that was going to happen
[19:36:39] <DanielFalck> I am trying to get the mailing list added to a verizon whitelist for my account
[19:38:28] <JymmmEMC> fenn: lol
[19:40:56] <JymmmEMC> fenn: we'll just use swatch time instead.
[19:42:43] <dmess> BUT WHATS A SECOND AFTER ALL
[19:42:46] <dmess> opps
[19:43:02] <JymmmEMC> one mississippi
[19:43:11] <dmess> in metric??
[19:43:41] <JymmmEMC> one estabol
[19:43:52] <JymmmEMC> one transilvania
[19:43:56] <JymmmEMC> ?
[19:44:00] <dmess> naw will never sell
[19:44:13] <JymmmEMC> ask alex_joni
[19:44:37] <toastydeath> why do VTLs look like they're so much fun to use
[19:44:42] <fenn> because they are
[19:44:43] <JymmmEMC> Dracula's Castle is for sale.... 3.2 Million USD
[19:44:52] <alex_joni> JymmmEMC: not the real one
[19:44:54] <alex_joni> it's a fake :P
[19:45:02] <JymmmEMC> alex_joni: It is?
[19:45:16] <JymmmEMC> where's the real one?
[19:45:21] <dmess> toast... look up the cl 84 by canadair... and it was easy to use
[19:45:30] <alex_joni> JymmmEMC: I'm not telling :P
[19:45:40] <JymmmEMC> lol
[19:46:01] <dmess> that would be a steal....
[19:46:06] <JymmmEMC> Egor... "heh heh heh yeeeees master"
[19:46:54] <alex_joni> JymmmEMC: actually there are a couple which are accounted for as "dracula's castle"
[19:47:00] <dmess> toast it was vstol
[19:47:13] <JymmmEMC> alex_joni: did he have multiple castles?
[19:47:14] <toastydeath> dmess: vertical turret lathe, not vertical takeoff and landing
[19:47:30] <alex_joni> JymmmEMC: depends what you undestand by "he"
[19:47:42] <JymmmEMC> Count Dramucal
[19:47:50] <alex_joni> you do know that dracula is a fiction character.. right?
[19:47:57] <toastydeath> i want multiple castles
[19:48:04] <toastydeath> that would be so excessive.
[19:48:09] <dmess> oh hell they are ALOT of fun to run too.. especially the toshiba MPF.. that milled too
[19:48:18] <JymmmEMC> alex_joni: I suspect it's based upon RL
[19:48:32] <toastydeath> dracula came from vlad the impaler
[19:48:32] <alex_joni> rl?
[19:48:37] <JymmmEMC> alex_joni: a tyrant or something along those lines overembelished
[19:48:38] <alex_joni> toastydeath: most likely
[19:48:42] <JymmmEMC> RL real life
[19:48:53] <alex_joni> yeah, but no vampire really :)
[19:49:06] <SWPadnos_> hmmm - is freqgen deprecated, or just not meant to be used for velocity control of steppers?
[19:49:08] <JymmmEMC> alex_joni: metaphorically perhapse
[19:49:12] <alex_joni> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vlad_III_Dracula#The_vampire_legend_and_Romanian_attitudes
[19:49:21] <alex_joni> SWPadnos_: both I think
[19:49:26] <dmess> vlad the impler is real in Romania.... he masacred many
[19:49:35] <dmess> sp sorry
[19:49:37] <SWPadnos_> hmmm
[19:49:54] <SWPadnos_> it doesn't look like ctrl-type=v really does the same thing as freqgen
[19:50:44] <alex_joni> dmess: right
[19:50:52] <alex_joni> some with good reason
[19:51:06] <alex_joni> (and the need for a modern version is also quite debateable ;P)
[19:52:15] <alex_joni> JymmmEMC: the most likely castle one can refer as Dracula's Castle is : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bran_Castle
[19:52:23] <alex_joni> and I really doubt that one is out for sale
[19:52:34] <alex_joni> and even if it would be.. it would be 10-20 times the price at least
[19:53:15] <alex_joni> "Michael Gardner, Chairman and Chief Executive Officer of Baytree Capital, the New York investment firm which has been retained to create a plan for the castle and to sell it, predicted it would sell for more than $135 million, .."
[19:53:48] <JymmmEMC> http://www.usatoday.com/travel/news/2007-07-02-draculas-castle-for-sale_N.htm
[19:55:03] <alex_joni> right.. $135 million is something more like it
[19:55:15] <JymmmEMC> for that dump....forget it
[19:56:32] <SkullWorks_PGAB> Dude if the mold in the dungeons is less than a few hundred years old than it isn't ripe yet.
[19:57:55] <dmess> still a steal.... pass 15 million ppl thru the doors as is at 25 e per head... you kick thit in the head fast...
[19:58:15] <SkullWorks_PGAB> Property taxes?
[19:58:30] <dmess> bribery???
[19:59:25] <dmess> you could make a viable 5 yr plan with a recoverabe return on investment in 7 yrs or less
[20:00:24] <alex_joni> "Some 450,000 people visit the castle every year, Gardner said."
[20:00:25] <dmess> its DRACULA's castle after all... it would be world wide visitors... ; )
[20:00:55] <alex_joni> dmess: don't forget royalty fees for filming & events
[20:01:23] <dmess> weddings and funerals would be worth a mint
[20:01:28] <alex_joni> ha
[20:02:00] <dmess> im good for moving to Romania
[20:02:17] <dmess> any where but home.. ; (
[20:03:10] <dmess> havent heard about my Russian connection..
[20:06:24] <SkullWorks_PGAB> I had a friend buy me SolidWorks in Russia while he was there - only problem is the support contract requires me to send any help issues thru the russian distributer :~
[20:06:47] <dmess> full blown??
[20:06:55] <SkullWorks_PGAB> yep
[20:07:07] <dmess> cool... how much??
[20:07:11] <alex_joni> http://www.popgive.com/2008/05/fireman-on-marijuana.html
[20:07:31] <SkullWorks_PGAB> Was like $1200 USD
[20:07:38] <SkullWorks_PGAB> at the time
[20:07:54] <SkullWorks_PGAB> favorable exchange rates then too.
[20:08:42] <dmess> nice..
[20:09:03] <dmess> that video... is a blast... LOL
[20:09:45] <SkullWorks_PGAB> the installer just noted that the existing O/S was set for english so it loaded it in English - so I have tonnes of help files on the CD's which are in russian.
[20:10:29] <dmess> I'll see what i can do about getting ya english ones
[20:10:51] <SkullWorks_PGAB> Oh all the english ones are there too
[20:11:03] <dmess> oh ok...
[20:11:29] <SkullWorks_PGAB> its just that my set came with extra CD's that the US release doesn't bother to include.
[20:12:22] <SkullWorks_PGAB> as crazy as it is - 5 axis software is a controlled export item.
[20:14:56] <dmess> LOL
[20:15:25] <alex_joni> wait for it to be open source first :D
[20:15:26] <dmess> im cleared quit high... could i carry it...??
[20:16:21] <jmkasunich> is that still true (I remember the incident that started the restriction, but that was years ago)
[20:17:44] <SWPadnos_> hmmm. isn't motion.spindle-on supposed to be on whenever either spindle-forward or spindle-reverse is on?
[20:19:28] <SkullWorks_PGAB> was still true in 2002 - but that was the last I had to officially deal with export controls
[20:20:15] <alex_joni> SWPadnos_: and speed > 0
[20:20:23] <SWPadnos_> yep, got that
[20:22:26] <SkullWorks_PGAB> I like AWallin's newest video, what was the original base machine?
[20:23:34] <SkullWorks_PGAB> http://video.google.com/googleplayer.swf?docid=916833244018390029&#038
[20:35:21] <dmess> very nicely done... drop an INTERNATIONAL MINI_CUT tool in there.. double ALL feedrates... leave the rest the same... and BARK
[20:38:03] <dmess> theres a litle hysterysis to be seen in the finished model... but after all thats why we program to +.005" and polish/blend to make it pretty... we do it all the time
[20:39:22] <dmess> or you feed it a smaller dia cutter with YET finer resolution..
[20:49:01] <SkullWorks_PGAB> he noted on his blog that for a good part of the front he had it at 150% FO.
[21:03:50] <dmess> ROCK & ROLL.... ;)
[21:05:11] <dmess> that mini-cut throws a rooster tail that is SWEET... and catchable... been there done that..
[21:06:08] <dmess> .006"-.010" per tooth.... she loved it... ; )
[23:58:59] <fenn_> fenn_ is now known as fenn