I need to wipe this system and install new, it's getting really slow
ick - thats not supposed to happen
well, fedora says that changing versions might not be a happy thing
I updated from 6 to 7
or 5 to 7, I forget
ok, so it takes most of 5 minutes to download a file from gmail, asks if I want to open it with archive manager, then when it does finally download, it says "archive type not supported"
there was a realllly nice CNC leblond lathe
looked like early 70's hardware
on ebay or some other site
i almost creamed my pants but cried instead when i remembered i live in an apartment
heh move to ground floor or buy lathe and sneak indoors in pieces
nah it was a pretty decently sized lathe
20" swing, 60" centers
nothing enough sheets of 4x8 ply can't solve, right? ;)
lol, truer words have never been spoken
it was a project lathe that someone ripped the control off of
everything else works
oh hey and a Fanuc 21i on ebay too
a match made in heaven =(
a leblond with a 21i hanging off it would be like owning a classic ferrari
i've been digging into the manual of a control we retrofitted onto a machine awhile back
there is some darn neat stuff in there
Hello all. Does anyone here know if the Griffen PowerMate USB Knob ever got worked out to do anything useful with EMC2/Axis?
Google shows me lot's of conversation on the subject... but nothing conclusive.
i'm not ignoring you, i just don't know anything about emc
:) why ya here then??
jk of course
actually, I recognize you from my googling on the subject
is that a good thing or a bad thing
you show up in IRC logs around the phrase
Ha! you actually brought it up...
02:26:37 <dmess> not the one im thinking of
02:26:40 <toastydeath> hm
02:28:00 <dmess> it was no bigger than a large old calculator..
02:28:33 <dmess> with the joystick in the center...
02:28:44 <fenn> well... /me gives up googling for "HID knob"
02:28:44 <toastydeath> hmm, never seen something like that
02:29:03 <toastydeath> fenn: http://www.griffintechnology.com/products/powermate
oh, i guess i did mention it
i don't think anyone looked into it beyond that
I did find this: http://axis.unpy.net/01154705314
hmm it may look nice but would it last 5 minutes in a workshop
It looks vaguely like it might do something with it
yeah, it is rather fragile. the top already came off mine.
real mpg wheels get covered in coolant on a more than uncommon basis
not sure how much coolant you use though
:) my little machine doesn't have coolant yet.... just WD-40 when I spray it...
I just spent 5 minutes de swarfing my mouse
along those lines, I have an old logitech track ball that seems pretty immune the crap getting in the works
only 5 mins?
getting faster as I do it once or twice a week
lewin1 is now known as lewing_
is it needed to make some kind of ioperm before using inports and outports?
My windows program is now successfully ported to linux :)
Now I need rewrite it as HAL driver...at least. All pieces is already here and all preparations complete.
I have a "unused" 8-bits channel used for just controlling 8 leds of front panel of controller box
first of all I should control them, isn't it?
assargadon: what's the program?
dimas_, before I get to know about EMC
I write a simple control program for my robot
I wrote it with GCC, but for windows
do you have pics of the robot?
dimas_, yes: http://headache.h1.ru/EMC/
what town are you from?
* dimas_ is in vladimir
dimas_, do you have any hardware and it's photoes as well?
not yet, I'm just started
have one L297 driver soldered, and few wide-matrix printers disassembled..
By the way, don't you are partner of Phreedom?
no, who is Phreedom?
it's guytrying to make technology for making pieso-steppers
have any links to read about that?
this guys have old-style manner of thinking
something like "no speaks, you should work!"
have not heard about him
he is never appeared here
he is on reprap site
do you ever heard about reprap?
reprap has a channel, I should have guessed about that.. :)
yeah, visited their site
what do you plan to make with your disassembled printers ?
will gather steppers and axis
dimas_, yes,I understand :)
I mean, what robot do you plan to construct
doing simple router, just to make something moving for the beginning
I have about 7 printers, could do 7-axis milling machine :)
Heh, buy the way: PWM is used to controlling this robot really ;)
dimas_, or 7 one-axis :)
7 instances, I mean :)
about 2 in each direction, so 3.5-axis machine for now
you don't need 2 of them for third axis
yes, may be so
I need to get something moving first
ok, I wish you lack ;)
I wonder how it's possible to use webcam with Dapper Drake :)
assargadon: thanks, same for you
It will be greate for russian enthuasts to overlook some working installation :)
and for non-russians too,
but russians need some kind of inspiration
all this old technics we saw yeasterday is really bother me
especially proppeler-powered airplane
hi all. Has anyone used hal-streamer to log a hal pin to disk while running a program?
milling some steel right now, will put videos online later today. The servos work quite nicely
funny sparkles, isn't it?
nah, I'm not running the machine so fast I would see sparkles and I'm using coolant
awallin_emc: any specific questions about hal sampler?
you want sampler, not streamer, if you are logging
and that is exactly what it was designed to do
what call can be used in rt modules for performing delay?
* BigJohnT got a new band saw yesterday
[13:58:40] <BigJohnT> http://www.wiltontool.com/Products.aspx?nav=ByPart&ClassID=333270&Part=7015
jkm thanks, I will look at the docs for sampler and try something with sim first at home.
I can now monitor spindle current so it would be nice to log that to a file and plot it vs. the moves to see how the spindle loads up when cutting
assargadon: you don't want to do a "sleep" type delay in realtime code
jmkasunich: I really need it
if the delay is very short (a few uS) then you can busywait, but for any longer delay you should count thread periods
the idea of RT code is that the code runs from beginning to end every period
what "u" prefix mean? 10^-3? 10^-6 ?
assargadon: take a look at the code for HAL component "oneshot" for a way to do timing
[14:03:27] <jmkasunich> http://cvs.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/emc2/src/hal/components/oneshot.comp?rev=1.4
Unfortunately I need 2-steps sending of data. Firstly I should set up value and config LPT bytes
jepler, alex_joni: I'm having some problems with emc on hardy
and then, after 1-micro- or milli- second delay
I get this error on startup: RTAPI: ERROR: Unexpected real time delay on task 1
there is a big difference between 1 microsecond and 1 millisecond - which is it?
* awallin_emc note to self: check this wrt. chart widget for pyvcp http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-list/2000-March/029214.html
and then I should set up config byte to "passive" mode
johabaar72: have you run emc on dapper using this computer?
it's making some kind of "tick" for controller
jmkasunich: yes, I know it's a big difference - I searching for details just now
jmkasunich: no, I stumbled upon this software a couple a weeks ago and got the info on how to install the test version on hardy from alex_joni
so I have never used it before, note this error came on first startup, I havent even set it up yet for my mill
the reason I asked is that "unexpected realtime delay" is not usually something that depends on the version of EMC - it comes from things in the computer
so you probably are not dealing with a Hardy specific issue
we have a wiki page dealing with that issue - hang on a sec while I get the URL'
I googled this error and actually found a log of this channel with alex_joni having having the same problem
[14:09:57] <jmkasunich> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?TroubleShooting
section 2 on the above page
yes, I've actually been browsing that page
what do you see when you run the latency test?
which value do you want
might be my motherboard that causing this, I've had serious compatability issues with in linux before
in AXIS, is there a maximum length for the history-trail (red line after cutter). I'm noting something like that with a longer program
Max jitter: 1334959
johabaar72: I had a 155ms spurious delay on one machine. nothing to do but replace it
johabaar72: did you try the smi fix? (if it's an intel board)
johabaar72: 1334959 is a huge jitter
ideally it is under 20000 or so
hmm...it's looks like 10^-3 sec. delay needed
assargadon: then you should use the technique in oneshot.comp
set the port in one pass of the thread, then reset it (or whatever) in the next pass, or 10 passes later, or whatever gives you the proper delay
yes, I understand. It will be little harder than I expect. Why not, thought :)
yes, I understand the idea :)
johabaar72: you should document your experiments here http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Latency-Test
try disabling all the stuff you don't need from the BIOS
johabaar72: also I understand that hardware graphics acceleration is bad, so you should probably run the 'vesa' X driver
I've had issues with the graphics card before. It's an inbuilt ati x1250 on an asus M2A-VM HDMI motherboard, I've been trying for quite some time to get the hdmi output working without success
and ati support in linux isn't that good :P
remind me the comand for viewing the log
our experience has been that on-board video is a problem
with description "what happens with my RT module"
(item 2.1.1 on the troubleshooting page)
johabaar72: do you have a spare video card sitting around?
johabaar72: yep you should probably try a separate pci-e graphics card
yeah, I think thats seems to be my last option. Sadly, the reason I bought this mb was to get rid of all extra cards and I thought a board with inbuilt dvi + real hdmi would be something fantastic
I guess I was wrong :P
works on the dark side though (windows)
what is hdmi?
high definition multimedia interface
I suppose google could have told me
high definition video interface or something. DVI + audio in a interface directly usable by mothern tvs
a machine good for multimedia and a machine good for machine control are probably not going to match
I'm surprised laptops haven't moved to the small hdmi connector, everyone is still using the old 15-pin d-conn
I guess but I thought I'd give it a try being my wife wouldnt like any more computers taking up space :)
always the wife gets blamed
wonder what they say about the guys when they're alone.
cradek: don't ask...
I should convert signet pin to unsigned one...hmmm
hardy ate my W2K
you're in luck- wine is up to version 1.0 : )
1) now you're free -- 2) depending on what "ate" means, you could try asking for help in #ubuntu
rayh: hi Ray
she wont boot
You shrank the w2k partition and added 8.04?
just installed in a old emc1 part
Okay so w2k is still on there just not setup right in grub.
At least that is my impression.
not to handy with grub thou
You might try mounting the w2k partition in 8.04 and grab the data you need.
At least that way you know it's still there.
its still there
Then go to Ubuntu irc and ask about how to fix grub.
isn't there an option in the grub boot loader to boot other os?
it says window 2000 but it wont boot it
Yes. Try "man update-grub"
the sadness is i ran repair console fixmbr now no grug either
reinstall the Heron or can i just load Grub somehow?
ALS: apparently modifying the partition table breaks windows boot.ini file http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-644025.html
I need to mow.. Just did that 8 days ago.
ALS: as for restoring grub once it's been overwritten, I've also found various instructions on the internet on how to use live CDs or rescue CDs for that purpose
skunkworks: get a goat
if you have a grub boot, and know the w$ partition, you can edit /boot/grub/menu.lst to something >>like<< this
# This entry automatically added by the Debian installer for a non-linux OS
# on /dev/hda1
titleMicrosoft Windows 2000 Professional
----- read the web & note... grub counts different than linux ... (hd0,0) in grub-ese is hda1 inux linux-ese
--- and c: in window-ese
steves_logging is now known as steve_stallings
anyone up for a 100 Mb cnc-video?? :)
funnily enough i was just making a youtube account to post some of my cnc build progress vids
pjm: sounds great, do post links here or on the emc mailing list.
there's also a wiki page with links to videos
ok will do, i have some vids of my X axis stepper on the table etc with some repeatability tests etc
anyway, my upload finished, so if you want you can look here: http://www.anderswallin.net/wp-content/2008/05_bulbmill/bulbmill.mp4
and the Y axis is going on a haas on monday night to have the ends machined for the Y axis bearings etc
it's going to be on google video later
I hope I'm not going to run out of bandwidth on my site...
the video is supposed to show up here once google is finished processing it http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=916833244018390029
ok my first effort uploaded to utube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVGQvPL2DjA
Martzis: check out our milling test from today: http://www.anderswallin.net/wp-content/2008/05_bulbmill/bulbmill.mp4
awallin: df / first for those who might not have enuf room ;)
gotta run, bbl.
this little cable driven table is just a bit too cource. input scale is 1256 with 2000 steps per rev. It will position within .005 or so but that is about it.
Guest265 is now known as skunkworks_
how can I bump someone that is using my nick? is that possible?
reading the faq on freenode doesn't seem helpful
there is "RECOVER Kill another user who has taken your nick"
so do a /msg nickserv help
steve_stallings is now known as steves_logging
skunkworks_: you probably want to use GHOST
skunkworks_ is now known as skunkworks
now my google video has finished processing and is online: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=916833244018390029
seems like last pass should be 'waterline' - is it actually exposed to moving water?
* fenn grumbles about golf ball dimples
:) some people have tried golf-ball like 'turbulators' on sailboats, but nobody really uses them for real
awallin: there's a new connector coming out
serial digital link for panels
it supports sound too
it will replace VGA and DVI
alex_joni: do we need something else than hdmi?
awallin: apparently yes
* alex_joni is not sure about agreeing
btw.. HDMI can be sent from DVI connectors/cards
maybe we should all go into the converter-dongle business?
awallin: this one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DisplayPort
it's royalty free.. so I guess that's a plus
"10.8 Gbit/s forward link channel supports high resolution monitors up to 2560×1600 with single cable." <- guess SWPadnos will like that
I got a 1900x1200, anything over that is still pretty pricy? 30" apple would be nice...
same here.. on a 24" .. was way cheap
even pci-e is something like 1Gb/s, so the graphics card must come up with a factor of 10 in bits?
well.. I bet graphics cards generate a lot of data :)
I think things will change radically when AMD will supply their mixed CPU+GPU
now that they got ATI they plan to integrate things again
I saw some simulations that ran in parallel on an nvidia graphics card. Pretty cool general purpose computing can be done on the GPUs.
then a single DisplayPort coming from that.. should be nice
hopefully they can come up with a standard for the multi-threading on GPUs, I'm not going to invest time in learning some nvidia specific thing just yet...
well.. this is AMD/ATI ;)
one PCI Express "lane" is 250 mega*byte* per second, so a 16x slot is 16 * 250MB/s = 4 GB/s = 32 Gbit/s.
hm. My module making something wrong with system.
[19:33:16] <K`zan> http://wrlabs.shacknet.nu/~vw/MyMachineShop/PipeDreamMill/PDM-FirstPassAndPowerSupplyInternal/
Kzan: that PSU looks scary!
ah...maybe it's becouse it named "urtk" but file named "URTK"
assargadon: thats a problem
is it possible to unloadit...somehow?
halcmd unloadrt all
or maybe halcmd -U ?
-U option reported as unrecognized
and what is rmmod?
it unloads a kernelmodule
after parsing some error output
I used " /usr/bin/emc_module_helper remove URTK"
and it helps :)
-U is a flag to halrun, not to halcmd. halrun -U is equivalent to lcmd -R; halcmd stop; halcmd unload all; $REALTIME stop
er, something like that
ok, now I know component name used for filenames determining :)
we can think about it as "valuable experience", isn't it?
The next time you are feeling down remember... if the world
didn't suck, we'd all fall off.
I now see my driver doing something with my robot :)
Unfortunately, it making something differ from planned functionality :)
I plan LEDs blinking
oh. thats bad
Instead of this, I got motors rotating :)
all 3 motors simultaneously, by the way :)
but, at least, it show me some signs of life, isn't it?
it is. also better as nothing happens
and fo sure better than some smoke :)
electronics work with smoke. if smoke comes out nothing works
by the way, documentation told me PWM should be used for speed controlling
but no additional tech info :)
it was not really "documentation", but, instead of this, description of some software for controlling same robot
accomplished in QNX
looks very same to EMC
except for modularity, universality and so on :)
and no source ;)
not sources, nor binaries, nor links
don't matter :)
"nano" means 10^-9, isn't it?
jepler: Thanks! that was it boot.ini partion number W2K lives, for what thats worth I broke by deleting a partition
awallin: nice video.. Love the pid output :)
ah...it becomes really boring, I see
(realtively) long-therm delays
ans several operations to accomplish one protocol step...
I need some kind of FIFO buffer for this
awallin: how did you generate the g-code for the milling in that video?
[20:19:43] <DanielFalck> http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=916833244018390029
DanielFalck: that g-code is generated with commercial software. The finish pass would be straightforward to generate, but the roughing paths are still far away (at least for me)
looks great awallin
alex_joni: yeah, I think it's never again steppers for me... the servos just work so much better
this is steel, but the things we plan to do are mostly in alu so that should be a piece of cake :)
awallin: you're very fond of that pyvcp it would seem :)
ha :) I would have done it in vcp had there been widgets available
my friend Jari asked if the G64 tolerance value could be made adjustable from a pyVCP widget? I guess it's not straightforward as the interpreter reads ahead?
but you can have "checkpoints" in the code
could the G64 tolerance be totally decoupled from interp, and only a hal pin in motmod?
G64 P#<forgot the number>
M66 causes lookahead to be stopped
awallin: in theory yes, not sure who would be interested enough to do it though ;)
the "naive cam detector" (segment merging) part can't be because that happens during readahead, but it's possible that the portion of it related to blending could be.
yah. now we do a couple of dry-runs with different P-values to see what gives smooth motion
hm...now it blinking by leds as expected
but with weird design, based on rtapi_delay(1000000); call
don't do that :)
especially in a RT driver
pretty fine delay ;)
heh, I thinking about how to make it correctly
and every desigh I can imagine
brokes incapsulation idea :)
is this supposed to be a HAL component?
it's supposed to be realtime driver, as alex_joni said
ok, for HAL or "normal" RTAI?
HAL I think
for HAL of course
did you try making a function and exporting it with hal_export_func()
(or however it's spelled:)
I just add this delay for testing purposes
SWPLinux, it's hard to answer
correct variant is "yes", I think
but I use comp...
so exporting is hided from me
ah, ok :)
the function should have access to the period of the thread it's run from, so you would delay by subtracting that period (time elapsed) from the delay time you want, and toggling when you go below 0
look at the timedelay component (I think)
SWPLinux, I understand the idea how it CAN be made
that's how it should be made :)
unless you need very very short delays
but then again, you know what you're doing and I don't, so there could be other solutions
SWPLinux, really not. Parameter you talking about called "period", I already looking for it :)
it's only correct if you know for sure your function is attached to one thread only
looks like it's called fperiod for the floating point value, maybe there's also period for the number in ns (don't know)
it may only be attached to one thread
in other cases you should use some time or clock measurement functions
that's the HAL rule
it making things little better
code I imagine will be very. VERY weird
if so, then you may be trying to do too many things in a single module
it's impossible to split it on functions...and so on
SWPLinux, problem is "logically" there are "write register" operation ond "read register" operations
yes - those would normally be separate read() and write() functions
every read-write operation has 1 dealy
read would be put at the start of the thread, then all the processing, then write as the last function in the thread
so you hav to write the address or something, then read back data a certain tmie later?
darned laptop keyboards
and it's not yet a problem ;)
problem is for some usefull operation
like "set motor registers"
or "read motor registers"
I need 2-4 "read register" and "write register" operations
what is the PC hardware? something like a parallel port?
parralel port itself :)
ok, and you have custom hardware connected to the port?
SWPLinux, don't you overlook my robot brief description?
I was on an airplane for most of the day today :)
* assargadon loves aeroplanes
yep, me too
I loves airplanes food espesially
you are insane
hmmm. then again, on planes where they actually give you food, it can be pretty good :)
[20:59:39] <assargadon> http://headache.h1.ru/EMC/
my robot description if you not saw it before
thanks. I was just looking through the logs trying to find it :)
I really flood everything around here with this link :)
I think there's an error in there - the extra 4 bits in cSetDvgRegs should be able to turn devices on and off, not off and off :)
yes, it's error really :)
well, good luck. I think the lack of directional encoders will make control difficult
in theory, the right thing to do is write a driver that only provides read/write functions, and HAL pins for the different functions
such as motor 1 enable and motor 1 direction
(I'd do enable/dir so a user of the driver couldn't accidentally let the smoke out)
YES, OF COURSE, IT'S THE THING i PLAN TO DO
other things like encoder pulse state and limit switches should just be exported as hal pins - use an encoder (in counter mode maybe) to count the pulses
gotta love caps-lock
I'm alredy wrote pulse_encoder
which takes pulse and direction bits
I'm pretty sure the encoder module has that mode also
the hard part will be determining the actual direction vs. the requested direction
it's not really so hard :)
it gets harder when you're trying to reverse directions
you mean inertion, loop delays...
awallin: steel for a bulb? why not lead?
I am trying to run the live CD on a P2 333MHz 192MB RAM, but after it says "loading kernel" the screen goes white
it's very likely that you don't have enough RAM
P2 is ok, 333MHz is marginal, 192M is not enough
cradek: You don't know me. I'm kind of new around here. I have been visiting axis.unpy.net and saw the 5 axis visualization/kinematics video. Very nice work. Can a simple three axis python visualization be implemented at this point?
max4096: get an Xubuntu alternate CD for 6.06
live-CDs can't use swap or write anything to disk, so they need lots of RAM
install it, and afterwards install emc2
if you have a hard disk you can install to, then get one of the alternate install discs and install EMC2 later
if you don't have a spare disk, tehn try to get some spare RAM :)
jmkasunich: live-cd's do use swap if they find any available
HighOctane: unpy.net is jepler, not cradek
HighOctane: what do you mean by 3-axis?
jmkasunich: they both blog at axis.unpy.net
the computer has ~2 GB of disk space, is that enough for a std Ubuntu 6 install?
max4096: should be
close, but enough
may be for xubuntu
alex_joni: they do? I thought cradek was at timeguy
jmkasunich: at axis.unpy.net
jeplers blog is at emergent.unpy.net
well.. I'm off to bed
good night all
noghty noghty night
jmkasunich: hope I can get back in gear to do some more stuff on joints-axes before fest
I know it's Jepler's site, but he has a video of Chris' work on his site.
didn't Stuart do the visualization?
SWPLinux: cradek did one too
HighOctane: to answer your question, yes - a 3-axis visualization can be made - the first few were 2 or 3 axis
HighOctane: basicly you can do any kind of simulation.. but you need to draw/construct it yourself
When I say three axis, I simply mean X, Y, and Z. I would like to visualize a 3d model of my machine in GUI for simulations, even watch the machine run in 3D while processing parts.
* alex_joni sticks around for a bit
HighOctane: that can be done
there is a framework, you do the coding :)
You still in de or back home?
alex_joni: construct it using python visual or what?
coding is a bit farstreched
HighOctane: yes, it's called vismach
sort of python / hal / art-form
it's in python, and you basicly construct objects with boxes/cylinders etc
there are sample guis for scara/puma/5axis/etc
rayh: back home
Interesting. Can it be set up on a virtual machine, then migrated to a production machine?
[21:35:14] <jmkasunich> http://cvs.linuxcnc.org/cvs/emc2/lib/python/vismach.py?rev=1.16
I'm trying to find the machine layout specific stuff
is it included?
you had some on your blog
I would think so
[21:37:55] <jmkasunich> http://cvs.linuxcnc.org/cvs/emc2/src/emc/usr_intf/axis/scripts/pumagui.py?rev=1.3
HighOctane: you can copy the above file, rename it, and hack on it to display whatever machine you want
Is that a rho theta machine code I'm looking at
scaragui.py and 5axisgui.py are in the same directory - pick whichever is closer to what you want
rayh: robot arm
I did see a rho grinder in china.
well, you wouldn't want your rhos to get too big
rhos by any other name? :)
this is (an early version of) pumagui
[21:40:12] <jmkasunich> http://jmkasunich.com/cgi-bin/blosxom/software/simulated-machine-02-04-07.html
I know there is a liveCD for ubuntu. Is that the latest big thing. I would like to set up a vm for testing the visualization. Is that what I should use?
HighOctane: for sim only you can use close to anything
but installation is probably easiest with the livecD
HighOctane, Either of the live CDs are great for seeing if your box will work. You can then easily move from running live to install.
Great. Thanks very much. I like virtual machines, cause I can work on them while in the IRC program.
Exactly. It's easy to pass info around. I've been running my main web box using EMC installs since early BDI.
The recent installs are very stable.
<- really off to bed
Heh...I catch a bug
port and sended value was used in wrong order....
I'm happy nothing happens to my computer :)
if REALLY nothing
it was really bad idea - incorporate delays inty RT driver :)