#emc | Logs for 2008-04-03

[00:16:39] <tom1> NewType_: if you return... i found that one piece of hardware suited to EMC2 uses the EPP parallel port. (the 'pluto-p'). I find no other mention on the wiki, and only remember there was discussion on this irc over the last few years. So EPP is good and others are unknown.
[00:21:33] <tom1> and the PICO systems PPMC also uses EPP, so get yourself an EPP port
[00:36:29] <SWPadnos> for parallel-connected devices, there's also the Mesa 7i43
[00:37:06] <SWPadnos> EPP is useful because the hardware does the handshaking - without that, it would take several more I/O cycles from the CPU (as far as I know)
[00:44:57] <tom1> anyone have experience with 7143, as parallel port extension and maybe with it as a usb device?
[00:45:15] <cradek> seb has one (he wrote the driver)
[00:45:35] <SWPadnos> it's unlikely you'll be able to use it in USB mode for EMC
[00:45:48] <SWPadnos> but I'd love to be proven (or prove myself) wrong on that
[00:45:53] <cradek> you could sure use it as HID
[00:46:02] <cradek> given the right firmware of course
[00:46:10] <SWPadnos> that may depend on the USB chip
[00:46:26] <cradek> ok, sounds like you know more than I do
[00:46:27] <SWPadnos> some of them identify themselves as the USB<-> serial shim that they are
[00:46:37] <cradek> ah
[00:46:57] <SWPadnos> heh - probably a slight amount more - I'm not an expert (but I have read some datasheets)
[00:49:57] <tom1> the RPC commands sound like macros
[00:49:58] <tom1> RPC commands allow previously stored sequences of read/write commands to be
[00:49:58] <tom1> executed with a single byte command
[00:50:18] <SWPadnos> for which?
[00:51:06] <tom1> 7i43 usb interface
[00:51:11] <SWPadnos> ah
[00:51:33] <SWPadnos> that would be a single byte of payload, I imagine - using their SoftDMC controller?
[00:51:48] <tom1> didnt read SoftDMC near that
[00:52:07] <tom1> page 28 of mesa pdf
[00:52:32] <SWPadnos> oh, from where?
[00:52:44] <SWPadnos> I don't think I've downloaded the 7i43 manual yet
[00:53:18] <tom1> http://www.mesanet.com/pdf/parallel/7i43man.pdf
[00:53:43] <tom1> i was interested in the hardware waveform generator
[00:54:19] <tom1> oops, make that page 26 ( mustve hit END btn)
[00:56:00] <SWPadnos> PDF page 26 or the page numbered 26?
[00:57:29] <SWPadnos> nvermind
[00:57:31] <SWPadnos> +e
[00:57:45] <tom1> yeh, the number from 'evince' viewer
[00:59:10] <tom1> 80 to 100$ if i'm really interested ( ay there's the rub )
[00:59:36] <SWPadnos> that's referring to the register addressing "language" - you can set up a series of transfers and refer to them by "handle"
[00:59:53] <SWPadnos> not to things like "output 40 pulses on X then set DOUT6 high
[00:59:56] <SWPadnos> "
[01:00:42] <tom1> right, like load sets of outputs push 'command' val val val onto stack & hit send
[01:01:13] <tom1> but it seems to be done 'soft' and any capability is liely on my 5i20 anywho
[01:01:19] <tom1> likely
[01:01:19] <SWPadnos> no, more like "I don't want to send the write commands and addresses for this set of registers every time - just the RPC code and the data"
[01:01:40] <SWPadnos> right - that's done because USB is a serial protocol
[01:01:45] <tom1> yes, gotcha 'command has all that bundled into 1 byte
[01:01:46] <SWPadnos> the PCI cards have random addressing
[01:01:59] <SWPadnos> err - random *access* addressing ;)
[01:02:12] <tom1> i like random addressing
[01:02:22] <SWPadnos> it
[01:02:24] <tom1> hey you
[01:02:28] <SWPadnos> it's great at parties
[01:02:39] <SWPadnos> you talkin' to me?
[01:03:08] <SWPadnos> or, as one person mis-spoke: ROM = "Random Only Memory" :)
[01:12:40] <tom1> i'm a great believer in coincidence. I was listening to this today "Are you looking at me , Jimmy" http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/aod/networks/bbc7/aod.shtml?bbc7/looking_at_me_jimmy_wed
[01:14:18] <SWPadnos> and the coincidence is ... ?
[01:32:08] <tom1> SWPadnos: you talkin' to me? "Are you looking at me , Jimmy" tom1: i like random addressing same thing to me
[01:32:30] <SWPadnos> I see
[02:37:50] <eric_U> wasn't it National that issued a data sheet for write only memories?
[02:37:59] <SWPadnos> I think so
[02:38:32] <SWPadnos> ah - Signetics
[02:38:35] <SWPadnos> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Write_Only_Memory
[02:39:33] <eric_U> they have a list of practical applications
[02:39:42] <SWPadnos> yeah, sorrt of
[02:40:05] <eric_U> all of which allow reads
[02:40:13] <SWPadnos> yeah, from some point or another
[02:40:36] <SWPadnos> actually the "write-only register bits" is the closest thing to a correct usage I see there
[02:41:05] <SWPadnos> there may not even be a memory bit for something like that - the write can go directly to hardware
[02:41:44] <eric_U> they didn't tell the story the way I originally saw it, I think Bob Pease wrote it up
[02:42:02] <eric_U> someone thought any data sheet he submitted would be published and put it in
[02:42:18] <eric_U> it was in a data book before it was an april fool's day joke
[02:42:33] <jepler> http://www.national.com/rap/Story/WOMorigin.html
[02:43:51] <SWPadnos> pretty much the same as the wiki page
[02:44:06] <jepler> hm that's where the famous "number of pins remaining" graph comes from as well
[02:44:12] <SWPadnos> heh
[02:44:18] <jmkasunich> but it has the datasheet too
[02:44:51] <SWPadnos> heh - I like the "Bipolar compatibility" section :)
[02:45:43] <jmkasunich> what about input protection?
[02:45:56] <SWPadnos> heh "S.O.S. copyrighted US Army Commissary, 1940"
[02:46:35] <SWPadnos> yeah, they're all pretty funny actually
[02:46:42] <SWPadnos> 6 foot fan 1/2" from device for cooling
[02:47:06] <jmkasunich> I have a similar spec sheet around here somewhere, but in paper form
[02:47:19] <jmkasunich> I think it was from Electro-Voice, for a speaker
[03:08:57] <cradek> "All inputs and outputs are directly TTL compatible when proper interfacing circuitry is employed."
[03:09:30] <jmkasunich> 1 amp fuses
[03:12:30] <cradek> haha, Iff vs Vff is great
[03:15:33] <cradek> jmkasunich: got the pump off tonight.
[03:15:39] <jmkasunich> cool
[03:15:50] <cradek> half the time was spent looking for the gear puller, the other half was spent removing the pump
[03:15:56] <jmkasunich> started taking it apart yet?
[03:16:00] <cradek> nope
[03:16:49] <SWPadnos_> SWPadnos_ is now known as SWPadnos
[03:29:13] <skunkworks> pump?
[03:29:48] <cradek> diesel injection pump
[03:29:53] <skunkworks> is this the diesel?
[03:29:58] <cradek> I'm going to try to fix it, even though I know nothing about them
[03:30:02] <skunkworks> What is if for?
[03:30:20] <cradek> a nice 3 cylinder generator that's on the bus
[03:30:28] <skunkworks> ah - cool
[03:31:39] <skunkworks> is the bus diesel also?
[03:31:45] <cradek> yes
[03:31:49] <skunkworks> very good
[03:31:58] <skunkworks> IH?
[03:31:59] <cradek> they run from the same tank which is cool
[03:32:04] <cradek> bluebird
[03:33:26] <skunkworks> have you looked for overhauled injection pumps?
[03:33:51] <cradek> all we could find was some place willing to have one shipped from japan for over $2k
[03:33:57] <skunkworks> yeck
[03:34:21] <cradek> it's a bit old (93ish)
[03:36:06] <skunkworks> what style is is the pump? rotory?
[03:36:48] <cradek> no, linear
[03:36:52] <skunkworks> ah
[03:37:00] <skunkworks> I bet you will fix it.
[03:37:02] <jmkasunich> its a Yanmar, if that clarifies anything
[03:37:25] <cradek> if I had a rebuild kit and instructions I'd definitely fix it -- I have neither
[03:37:37] <cradek> I've rebuild plenty of carbs (and watches)
[03:37:57] <jmkasunich> this will probably have more in common with watches than carbs
[03:38:21] <cradek> heh, the whole engines on ebay are < $2k
[03:39:58] <cradek> http://i10.ebayimg.com/03/i/000/e6/3e/6faf_1.JPG
[03:40:08] <cradek> you can see half the pump on the right of this terrible image
[03:41:08] <skunkworks> yes - and 2 of the 3 feed lines to the injectors
[03:46:04] <LawrenceG> hey guys... trying to setup a new irc client.... I found #emc on freenode, but it doesnt have emc-dev.... have I got the name wrong?
[03:46:13] <cradek> emc-devel
[03:46:16] <SWPadnos> #emc-devel
[03:46:54] <LawrenceG> thankyou... for some reason search didnt find it??? I must be brain dead
[03:47:04] <SWPadnos> the # is significant
[03:47:18] <cradek> search is always iffy on irc servers, because there are a bazillion channels
[03:47:27] <SWPadnos> there are $ or @ channels or something also
[03:47:44] <SWPadnos> yeah, and don't try to list channels on this server - it always seems disabled
[03:48:08] <cradek> I think you can ask chanserv or nickserv to search for you
[03:48:11] <cradek> ... somehow
[03:48:15] <SWPadnos> heh
[03:48:15] <LawrenceG> thanks... now on emc-devel with the other 14 user
[03:48:51] <LawrenceG> fun when you think you have joined a channel and you are the only one there!
[03:49:06] <SWPadnos> hmm
[03:49:30] <LawrenceG> trying horny heron-beta
[03:57:28] <jmkasunich> castings are a PITA
[04:44:29] <toastydeath> spooooon
[06:05:00] <lerman_> lerman_ is now known as lerman
[06:27:45] <lerman_> lerman_ is now known as lerman
[07:20:16] <micges> hello
[09:46:41] <alex_joni> hi mic
[09:46:44] <alex_joni> hi micges
[11:53:33] <micges> hi
[12:03:47] <skunkworks_> logger_emc: bookmark
[12:03:47] <skunkworks_> Just this once .. here's the log: http://www.linuxcnc.org/irc/irc.freenode.net:6667/emc/2008-04-03.txt
[12:06:24] <skunkworks_> cnczone is down. What am I going to do?
[12:08:27] <archivist> get some work done
[12:08:30] <skunkworks_> Don't worry - I am good. This will keep me busy for a few http://membres.lycos.fr/mavati/classicladder/
[12:08:53] <skunkworks_> archivist: I don't understand what you are saying ;)
[12:09:03] <archivist> neither do I
[12:22:52] <alex_joni> skunkworks_: I'm sure he meant that he's going to do a better job at documenting classicladder for emc2
[12:23:16] <alex_joni> skunkworks_: oh, that was you that meant that..
[12:30:33] <skunkworks_> :)
[13:27:05] <skunkworks_> http://www.tothepointnews.com/index2.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=3114&pop=1&page=0&Itemid=76
[13:35:00] <SWPadnos> their "sound" is a little different than Lynrd Skynyrd
[13:36:29] <fenn> see, this is why the US lost the space race
[13:36:48] <tom1> the Mesa 7i43 lists "waveform generator" as an available configuration. Does the M5i20 have same?
[13:47:14] <SWPadnos> tom1, anything the 7i43 can do (with the exception of connecting to a parallel or USB port) can be done by the 5i22. Some things may not run as fast or may be too large to fit in the 5i20
[13:48:11] <SWPadnos> oh, and some clock-related functions may not work in the 5i20, since the FPGA is part of an older series
[13:48:24] <tom1> thx, I wrote Peter about it. i'd like a config file rather than the capability ;)
[13:48:40] <SWPadnos> well, you'll still need to write the PC side software to run it
[13:48:55] <SWPadnos> it should be in the "support software" link
[13:49:07] <SWPadnos> that zip file has several projects in it
[13:52:13] <cradek> skunkworks_: I found what I was looking for: http://www.mail-archive.com/emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net/msg03227.html
[13:52:17] <tom1> i cant guess from "hostmopt hostmot2 iopr12 iopr24 softdmc softdmcs" , would need to read those sources to see.
[13:52:42] <SWPadnos> hmmm. I don't think any of those are it. good thing you emailed him :)
[13:54:53] <cradek> it's strange that I can't find that same message in gmane.
[13:56:42] <tom1> can I1(no) and I2(nc) both conduct at same time?
[13:57:04] <cradek> yes if the I1 signal is high and the I2 signal is low they will both conduct
[13:57:22] <cradek> actually this condition is what triggers and latches that rung
[13:57:54] <tom1> ok, i was think-blocked... i saw them as relay contacts. not signals
[13:58:06] <tom1> as relay contacts, theyd have same coil
[13:58:29] <cradek> yes in CL all %I are input signals (hal pins)
[14:01:30] <skunkworks_> cradek: thank you. :)
[14:02:23] <cradek> skunkworks_: is it the kind of thing that is useful to you? if so it ought to be in our real documentation somewhere
[14:03:20] <skunkworks_> I will look it over.
[14:04:49] <tom1> its handier than the tutorial on the CL site ( which turns out to be for Grafcet, a good tutor but not ladder diagrams )
[14:15:55] <tom1> added to wiki, ok now? http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?ClassicLadder
[14:20:24] <SWPadnos> looks good to me
[14:20:54] <SWPadnos> all we need to do now is find a photo of real relay logic for that little history blurb :)
[14:21:16] <skunkworks_> thanks tom
[14:22:50] <skunkworks_> real relays? what the heck are those?
[14:22:52] <skunkworks_> ;)
[14:23:02] <SWPadnos> the clicky things you attach to the parport ;)
[14:23:22] <SWPadnos> http://access.remhouse.com/images/ac%20panel.gif
[14:23:35] <SWPadnos> I think that's even a "modern" panel
[14:24:05] <SWPadnos> it seems so much easier than CL :)
[14:24:12] <skunkworks_> suprisingly - the K&T which was installed in 69' has solid state relays in the control
[14:24:24] <SWPadnos> hmmm. interesting
[14:24:43] <skunkworks_> I am assuming they are scr
[14:24:51] <SWPadnos> I wonder if that was some thyristor setup or something
[14:25:02] <skunkworks_> or whatever the germanium equivilant is
[14:25:10] <SWPadnos> that must have been a very expensive control at the time
[14:25:35] <skunkworks_> I am sure it was.. It also had the 'precision' option.
[14:25:42] <skunkworks_> and contouring.
[14:25:58] <SWPadnos> well, I'm thinking of the semiconductor parts
[14:26:33] <skunkworks_> on a side note - the control doesn't run correctly under 55deg f
[14:26:36] <skunkworks_> ;)
[14:26:47] <SWPadnos> the project that developed gas phase deposition (for mass production) was being done at Research Triangle Park in the late '60s
[14:27:06] <SWPadnos> like 1966-1968 or thereabouts
[14:27:24] <SWPadnos> heh: http://www.pavenengineering.com/images/plcconv6.jpg
[14:28:21] <skunkworks_> Heh - I need to draw a circle around this.. ;) http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/conversion/rearcontrller.JPG
[14:28:39] <SWPadnos> O_O
[14:29:06] <skunkworks_> there was atleast 3 more rows of cards
[14:29:23] <SWPadnos> that looks like some military stuff I've (supposedly) had to work on
[14:29:38] <SWPadnos> only bigger
[14:29:44] <skunkworks_> heh cutting edge. ;)
[14:29:48] <SWPadnos> yeah, sure
[14:29:50] <SWPadnos> :)
[14:30:16] <SWPadnos> the M1 thermal sight was much easier to adjust than the one in the old M60A3
[14:30:17] <skunkworks_> I like the card labeled 'no good'
[14:30:31] <SWPadnos> yeah
[14:30:42] <cradek> yeah I'm sure that was the only bad part
[14:30:45] <SWPadnos> "just don't move to X=32, Y=11.9 - that's a bad spot"
[14:30:51] <skunkworks_> you can see in the lower right - the new caps
[14:31:09] <cradek> orange ones on top too
[14:31:26] <skunkworks_> yes - we did a lot of work to get it running.
[14:31:27] <skunkworks_> ;)
[14:31:35] <skunkworks_> Thank goodness for emc
[14:31:39] <cradek> it's amazing that you made it work
[14:32:09] <skunkworks_> dad is very smart :)
[14:35:57] <skunkworks_> although I don't know what he is going to do with all of emc's bells and whistles.. Like actual posistion readout ;)
[14:36:05] <skunkworks_> position
[14:36:09] <SWPadnos> ooooohhhhh
[14:36:20] <SWPadnos> well, maybe you can get a DRO to ease him into it :)
[14:36:28] <skunkworks_> heh
[14:36:54] <cradek> that machine had no position readout?
[14:37:05] <skunkworks_> nope
[14:37:14] <cradek> wow.
[14:37:28] <skunkworks_> you knew where it was by telling it to go there
[14:37:29] <SWPadnos> it's a computer. how could it make a mistake? who needs to know what it's doing? :)
[14:37:30] <cradek> how did you set a (the?) work origin?
[14:38:30] <skunkworks_> You homed it (standard grid was what it was called) from there you could do one offset.
[14:39:09] <skunkworks_> we never did - you had to use the thumbwheels. we just programmed everything off of machine coordinates
[14:39:42] <skunkworks_> so the center of the tombstone was x19y18
[14:40:02] <skunkworks_> *always
[14:40:22] <cradek> the thumbwheels didn't work? that's too bad, those are the coolest part of it
[14:40:55] <tom1> pete C sez he can add the waveform generator to the 5i20 in the future
[14:40:58] <skunkworks_> heh - they worked for the most part.. you had to wiggle them to be sure. But you really had no way of knowing that it took.
[14:41:16] <SWPadnos> Pete W?
[14:41:40] <tom1> both relays and thumbwheels can be 'bribed' ( cleaned with a dollar bill, good becuz it has rag content, great for contacts )
[14:41:50] <tom1> oops, Pete W yes
[14:42:01] <SWPadnos> ok -wasn't sure if there was some new Mesa developer :)
[14:42:12] <tom1> Pete 1 Pete 2 Pete N
[14:42:15] <jepler> yeah they have a policy only to hire guys named Pete.
[14:43:00] <SWPadnos> I think we end at Pete V now ;)
[14:43:59] <skunkworks_> Pete(x) where x=v?
[14:44:42] <SWPadnos> if only I could type set symbols ;)
[14:45:34] <tom1> integral of Pete from A to Z?
[14:45:36] <SWPadnos> (if only I still knew all those set symbols)
[14:46:53] <jepler> I wouldn't bet on the symbols coming through IRC anyway
[14:47:22] <SWPadnos> yeah - problems at every stage there
[14:47:24] <jepler> Pete ?
[14:47:34] <jepler> (anybody see an omega there? I don't)
[14:47:52] <SWPadnos> I saw a very well-formed question mark
[14:49:20] <skunkworks_> same here
[14:49:28] <jepler> too bad
[14:49:46] <jepler> Pete Ω
[14:49:52] <skunkworks_> there you go
[14:53:20] <SWPadnos> hmmm. Pete <I with accent-aigu><copyright symbol>
[14:53:49] <SWPadnos> logger_emc, bookmark
[14:53:49] <SWPadnos> Just this once .. here's the log: http://www.linuxcnc.org/irc/irc.freenode.net:6667/emc/2008-04-03.txt
[14:53:57] <jepler> that's what you'd get if you treated my utf-8 encoded omega as latin-1 or latin-15
[14:54:22] <SWPadnos> I guess that's what this Windows-2000 machine does
[14:54:27] <SWPadnos> even in Firefox
[14:54:38] <jepler> IRC doesn't *have* a defined encoding
[14:54:40] <cradek> jepler> Pete \u03a9
[14:55:00] <jepler> (it was historically not even 8-bit clean, like almost all internet protocols)
[14:55:09] <SWPadnos> heh
[14:55:29] <SWPadnos> if EBCDIC was good enough for me, then it's good enough for my grandchildren! :)
[14:55:52] <skunkworks_> ascii
[14:56:59] <SWPLinux> mmm. jepler, could you paste that in again?
[14:57:26] <jepler> Pete Ω
[14:57:36] <SWPLinux> oh, interesting
[14:57:59] <SWPLinux> it renders correctly on my Linux laptop, but the log doesn't store the unicode
[14:58:17] <SWPLinux> so I see it correctly in chatzilla but not in the log
[15:26:03] <archivist> sometimes I get blocky shite but that Ω shows nicely
[15:27:43] <archivist> hmm I seem to have ectra curls in my hair, damned turnings were flying a few minutes ago
[15:40:20] <cradek> I know, let's all argue about what encoding should be used on an irc channel where only English is spoken
[15:41:07] <cradek> first, let me say it obviously should be what my irc client does, whatever that might be
[15:44:06] <skunkworks_> 041f043e044704350442043d044b0439 043304400430043604340430043d0438043d 043a0443043b04380441,
[15:44:40] <jepler> skunkworks_: huh that doesn't work (I see inverse caret followed by 4 hex codes, repeated several times)
[15:44:41] <archivist> bah unreadable
[15:44:50] <cradek> me too
[15:44:50] <skunkworks_> ^ I am sure it has something to do with male 'enhancements' (junkmail)
[15:45:09] <cradek> I wonder why I can't type a mu anymore
[15:45:10] <skunkworks_> here it looks fine. it was just coppied and pasted out of junkmail
[15:45:54] <archivist> * archivist knibbles a cake and waits for coffee
[15:46:00] <jepler> it's cyrillic
[15:46:46] <jepler> Почетныйгражданинкулис
[15:46:55] <skunkworks_> Thats it
[15:47:29] <skunkworks_> I have been getting a lot of those emails lately
[15:48:31] <jepler> google translation just transliterates that: Pochetnyygrazhdaninkulis. I wonder what it actually means
[15:50:14] <skunkworks_> heh
[15:50:30] <skunkworks_> there should be spaces in it.
[15:50:34] <skunkworks_> let me try
[15:51:03] <skunkworks_> what language did you use?
[15:51:53] <skunkworks_> Honorary Citizen of the scenes,
[15:51:56] <skunkworks_> russian
[15:52:53] <skunkworks_> the next line in the email says I am hostile elements
[15:53:37] <skunkworks_> I was deep economy
[15:53:47] <skunkworks_> I think it is a nigerian scam :)
[15:54:59] <cradek> you can tell spamassassin what languages you read, and it will toss out everything else
[16:05:37] <alex_joni> what's a standard toolchanger size?
[16:06:09] <cradek> alex_joni: that sounds like "how long is a stick"
[16:06:20] <alex_joni> cradek: yeah, I know..
[16:06:27] <alex_joni> I mean.. are there any toolchangers for small tools?
[16:06:34] <alex_joni> like PCB mills?
[16:06:47] <cradek> oh you don't mean how many tools, you mean the tool size?
[16:06:56] <alex_joni> toolholder size
[16:07:01] <alex_joni> for an ATC
[16:07:19] <cradek> I'm sure pcb drilling machines can change 1/8" shank tools
[16:07:33] <cradek> they probably use some kind of tapered holder but I don't know what it is
[16:07:44] <alex_joni> ok, tapered holder is what I'm after
[16:07:54] <alex_joni> I think you use some on your bridgeport..
[16:07:56] <alex_joni> right?
[16:08:25] <cradek> many machine tools with ATCs are 40 or 50 taper
[16:08:26] <alex_joni> (obviously a lot bigger than what I'm looking for..)
[16:08:36] <cradek> my BP is a 30 taper
[16:08:37] <alex_joni> ok, is there a 1 taper? or something like that?
[16:09:01] <archivist> morse 1 or jacobs 1
[16:09:04] <cradek> I don't know of any small standards
[16:10:06] <cradek> I think the sherline spindle is morse 1, you can get collets up to about 1/4"
[16:10:26] <archivist> and there was a brown and sharp 1 as well iirc
[16:10:26] <alex_joni> yeah, but then you can't do an ATC .. right?
[16:10:26] <cradek> but you wouldn't use morse taper with an ATC because it is not self-releasing
[16:10:32] <alex_joni> right..
[16:13:04] <alex_joni> found these.. but still a notch too big : http://www.centaurtools.com/products/umatic/umatic.asp
[16:13:39] <cradek> a big notch if you're talking about pcb tools
[16:13:43] <cradek> what are you trying to do?
[16:17:08] <alex_joni> fitting an ATC to a small robot
[16:17:24] <cradek> and it doesn't have a spindle yet?
[16:22:16] <alex_joni> nope :)
[16:22:20] <alex_joni> but it's a small robot
[16:22:25] <alex_joni> up to 4-5kg payload
[16:22:41] <alex_joni> found this: http://www.suhner-automation-expert.com/domains/suhner-automation-expert_com/data/free_docs/TOOLholder_G5.pdf
[16:22:46] <alex_joni> which is probably the right size
[16:24:11] <alex_joni> BEM-6 looks nice
[16:26:28] <cradek> yes I thought of recommending something that takes ER16 collets
[16:26:35] <cradek> (but, you have to buy collets too then)
[16:27:54] <skunkworks_> http://www.hightechsystemsllc.com/rapid_changer.html
[16:28:35] <skunkworks_> http://www.royalprod.com/product.cfm?catID=11
[16:28:56] <skunkworks_> http://www.tools-n-gizmos.com/store/agora.cgi?cart_id=5867899.20249*bD39a4&user2=yes&user4=KS300&titttle=Universal_Kwik-Switch_300_Tooling_for_sale&ppinc=MT
[16:28:57] <cradek> consider nmtb/iso30 if you can use something that big. it's as common as dirt
[16:30:55] <skunkworks_> I don't know if the high tech systems could be use in a atc environment.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmQPOtQcLA8&feature=related
[16:36:11] <alex_joni> ok, thanks
[16:41:05] <alex_joni> * alex_joni goes away for a while
[16:41:10] <alex_joni> flying back tomorrow morning ;)
[19:46:54] <tomp2> i like the royal qwikchange system, turns a Bridgeport into a Tree ( almost )
[19:50:01] <BigJohnT> I like the quickswitch system cause it came on my bridgeport
[20:05:02] <cradek> I don't trust my QC30 so much since I had my face mill come loose once
[20:05:14] <cradek> I think I had even tightened it with the wrench
[20:05:34] <cradek> can't beat a draw bar for security, but they're a pain to use
[20:06:21] <tomp2> sounds ugly, enuf for me to stay clear of qc
[20:06:41] <tomp2> tho i never had issues with tree mills
[20:07:20] <cradek> I was pushing the face mill hard... but it should have been ok.
[20:08:13] <cradek> it didn't hurt anything but the part, and I was even able to save it
[20:10:21] <BigJohnT> the quickswitch system the more you load it the tighter it gets. even if you ram it into your work with a rapid it won't let go
[20:11:54] <BigJohnT> http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f163/johnplctech/Machine%20Shop/HPIM0598.jpg
[20:13:12] <cradek> oh I could easily do that :-)
[20:13:22] <cradek> I think the taper is even the same, isn't it?
[20:13:37] <BigJohnT> not sure
[20:13:56] <cradek> I wouldn't know for sure though, since when rapiding, I like to keep the tool above the vise :-)
[20:14:05] <BigJohnT> http://www.tools-n-gizmos.com/store/agora.cgi?user2=yes&cart_id=1905425.4183*r35MJ5&p_id=11494&xm=on&ppinc=1a
[20:14:16] <BigJohnT> normally I like to as well...
[20:14:36] <cradek> yeah it might be the same taper, just different ears/nut
[20:15:16] <cradek> $95 for used? are they always that expensive?
[20:15:30] <BigJohnT> yea, in high demand
[20:15:33] <cradek> ouch
[20:15:38] <cradek> I thought QC30 was bad
[20:15:44] <BigJohnT> I buy new endmill holders from MSC
[20:15:58] <BigJohnT> I only buy the collet holders used from fleabay
[20:16:11] <BigJohnT> I buy the collets new only
[20:16:38] <cradek> enco had really nice new QC30 for dirt cheap. I wish I had bought them up. They doubled the price last catalog.
[20:16:50] <cradek> they were poland made, excellent workmanship
[20:17:05] <BigJohnT> so how did the face mill fall off?
[20:17:26] <cradek> the nut came loose and it fell out of the taper onto the work
[20:18:32] <cradek> maybe I didn't have it tight enough. Now when I'm going to do something heavy I give it a tap with the mallet
[20:18:34] <BigJohnT> the kwik/rapid switch has a spring loaded nut, can't fall off
[20:18:51] <BigJohnT> put on and off by hand only
[20:18:52] <cradek> the nut can't fall off QC either, it only turns about 1/3 turn
[20:19:28] <BigJohnT> is it held tight with a spring?
[20:19:43] <cradek> nope
[20:20:05] <cradek> what does the spring do?
[20:20:14] <skunkworks_> ve7it sounds like a motherboard designation
[20:20:19] <BigJohnT> on mine you have to "cock" it open to remove the tool then when you insert the next holder it spins the nut up tight
[20:20:39] <cradek> sounds cool
[20:20:48] <BigJohnT> it's really fast to use
[20:21:06] <ve7it> skunkworks, ham radio callsign
[20:21:16] <BigJohnT> the only time you need a wrench to take your tool out is when you ram it into the vise LOL
[20:21:24] <cradek> heh
[20:21:29] <skunkworks_> ah - should have known that..
[20:23:00] <ve7it> skunkworks, LawrenceG is in use by the old computer.... major amount of stuff to set up again
[20:23:38] <skunkworks_> duh.. Like I said - should have known taht.
[20:23:40] <skunkworks_> that
[20:50:03] <tomp2> NewType: use an EPP port, it's all the rage. used by all the hardware that plays well with emc2 ( afik )
[20:55:16] <BigJohnT> speaking of motherboards what is a good place to start looking for a new cpu and motherboard for my cad machine?
[20:57:04] <tomp2> there is no recommended hardware list only caveats and ways to test. we need a wiki page where people can submit what works for them ( and what 'works' means )
[20:57:38] <cradek> I think the rtai team has something like that, but it may not be current enough to be useful
[20:58:12] <BigJohnT> does anyone use the x6800 chip?
[20:58:40] <jepler> using a page contributed by anyone using rtai (as opposed to only those using emc) sounds like an advantage -- you'll get more reports than otherwise
[20:58:51] <skunkworks_> hmm - looks like thunderbird might work as an email client for me.. after breaking the 7 years of emails down by years.
[20:59:15] <skunkworks_> 500000 emails in my junk folder..
[20:59:16] <jepler> BigJohnT: I beleive SWPadnos has used a Core 2 chip in a realtime / hal system successfully
[20:59:48] <BigJohnT> actually this is for my windows desktop to run my cad software SolidWorks
[20:59:50] <cradek> BigJohnT: you said "cad". do you mean realtime emc, or something else?
[20:59:54] <cradek> aha
[21:00:23] <BigJohnT> I'm real happy with my EMC2 machine VBG
[21:00:25] <cradek> I know even less about that (but I bet just about anything would work)
[21:00:30] <skunkworks_> took a good hour to train it..
[21:00:51] <tomp2> http://www.rtai.dk/cgi-bin/gratiswiki.pl?Hardware
[21:01:00] <skunkworks_> I second the 'just about anything will work'
[21:01:25] <BigJohnT> I just get tired of twiddling my thumbs waiting for a process to finish
[21:01:25] <tomp2> the 'buslockcheck' is new to me
[21:03:10] <tomp2> apparently there's some list on the rtai live cd
[21:06:02] <skunkworks_> get a nice dell quad core :)
[21:08:03] <jepler> * jepler just ordered a dell yesterday (laptop)
[21:08:08] <jepler> I hope I like it
[21:08:12] <skunkworks_> cool
[21:08:23] <skunkworks_> wait - didn't you just get one a few months ago? ;)
[21:09:20] <tomp2> mobo rated "works really well' by rtai crew http://buy.helpcom.net/pn/232592_Asus-A7m266-d-Motherboard-Dual-Amd-Socket-462.htm
[21:09:49] <tomp2> thats the only mobo with such a comment that i found
[21:09:58] <skunkworks_> here at work we got a new server and a powervault 124t. lto3 with a 16 tape autoloader. 400/800gb per tape.
[21:10:03] <jepler> skunkworks_: that was an eee, that's barely a laptop at all
[21:10:08] <skunkworks_> heh
[21:10:11] <jepler> for one thing, it doesn't weigh 7 pounds like a laptop should
[21:12:50] <skunkworks_> I am going to have to do something about mine one of these days. 1024X768 isn't cutting it. (and things are starting to not work on it - like the cdrom. - yes just a cdrom)
[21:15:37] <jepler> cdrom? what would you ever use that for, besides to install ubuntu?
[21:16:35] <tomp2> i'm waiting for the touchscreen for my eeepc
[21:18:12] <micges> hello
[21:20:39] <BigJohnT> hi micges
[21:39:16] <BigJohnT> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=350044560976&refid=store
[22:44:08] <Unit41> hookers on ebay i thought that was illegal
[22:45:24] <BigJohnT> only if u get caught
[23:10:17] <ve7it> ve7it is now known as LawrenceG