#emc | Logs for 2008-03-30

[01:37:23] <SkinnYPupp> Cool pendant, too bad the price is made of gold http://www.ajaxcnc.com/cnc_components.htm
[01:55:09] <cradek> their software and kits are very expensive... I'm sure they don't intend anyone but their customers to buy these pendants
[01:57:42] <SkinnYPupp> How did the diesel generator turn out?
[01:58:05] <cradek> I am in the process of taking the injector pump off to tear down
[01:58:52] <SkinnYPupp> fun fun ..
[01:59:06] <cradek> we'll see...
[01:59:14] <cradek> I like fixing stuff. It would be great if I could get it going.
[01:59:45] <SkinnYPupp> Do you have the pump timing procedure?
[02:00:31] <cradek> do you mean do I know how to get it back in time (the drive gear)? if so, yes
[02:01:07] <cradek> it has marks on the timing gears
[02:01:39] <SkinnYPupp> The mount is usually slotted to turn the pump body. Mark the pump body to the plate.
[02:01:55] <cradek> yes I did that too
[02:02:22] <cradek> I didn't know to look for it, but I did notice it was adjustable
[02:02:39] <cradek> when I know I don't know what I'm doing, I'm very observant :-)
[02:03:29] <SkinnYPupp> Should be good to go with a mark, too far advanced will cause it to overrev upon starting
[02:03:42] <cradek> how do you check/adjust timing when there's no plug to hook a light to?
[02:04:32] <SkinnYPupp> Not sure on your pump, on the others you measure the pump pin lift with a dial indicator while at cylinder TDC
[02:04:52] <cradek> oh so you can't do it while running?
[02:05:00] <SkinnYPupp> no
[02:06:12] <SkinnYPupp> It sounds like you will be all good to go with gear index and a nice scribe mark
[02:07:12] <cradek> yes thanks for pointing that out, it would have been easy to miss
[02:07:32] <SkinnYPupp> Sure thing didn't want to not mention a pitfall
[02:11:39] <cradek> I need to find my gear puller tomorrow, and then I'll find that I don't have the right metric bolts for it, then I'll go get those, then maybe I'll have the pump off
[02:13:13] <SkinnYPupp> Know the feeling ha
[02:13:43] <cradek> on the bright side, I got a nice set of metric wrenches, which I'd been wanting
[02:15:41] <SkinnYPupp> Metric, can't fix much without them nowdays
[02:16:53] <cradek> I'd been making do with a mishmash of wrenches and sockets, no full set
[02:17:51] <SkinnYPupp> ;o) this disagrees with your skillset I'm certain
[02:18:46] <cradek> yes I very much like to have a nice full set of wrenches. the metrics I can even put back in order. 8 - 9 - 10 - 11 ...
[02:19:10] <SkinnYPupp> I sometimes can't belive I haven't lost a socket out of the set I bought in 95'
[02:19:26] <cradek> now you're cursed, shouldn't have said it
[02:19:47] <jmkasunich> bought mine in 1984
[02:19:55] <jmkasunich> but I think I lost one, so I'm safe
[02:20:24] <SkinnYPupp> Yeah I'll probably have one fall in an automotive black hole
[02:20:36] <cradek> a few years ago I got some of those socket rails and a metal toolbox to put them in. I've always had all the sockets since then.
[02:20:56] <cradek> the number of clips matches the number of sockets, so I can tell when they're all there
[02:21:24] <cradek> also, I can get "the next bigger" and "the next smaller" easily, compensating for my fraction disability
[02:24:11] <cradek> heh I also like the allen wrenches in the plastic holder thing with a hole for each size
[02:24:30] <cradek> (wow, I think I've discovered a fetish I didn't know I had)
[02:27:31] <jmkasunich> organization?
[02:28:06] <jmkasunich> I like those allen wrench holders too - I have them for inch, metric, and torx
[02:28:31] <cradek> not sure if it's that. but I like the tools that let you know, using clever packaging/holders, whether they're all put back
[02:28:51] <jmkasunich> btw, remember the discussion about carbide for my parts?
[02:28:56] <cradek> sure
[02:28:59] <jmkasunich> I'm running carbide now (2nd op)
[02:29:18] <jmkasunich> 580 RPM, 2 IPM, 0.025 DOC
[02:29:28] <SkinnYPupp> I hate the ones that come in thin plastic clamshells that turn into shit. I have a set of c-clip pliers like that
[02:29:53] <cradek> that's 300 sfm on steel?
[02:30:02] <jmkasunich> 425 at the corners
[02:30:20] <cradek> I'm not usually that daring - how's it work?
[02:30:25] <jmkasunich> not bad
[02:30:35] <cradek> seems like your shoptask is a good lathe
[02:31:00] <jmkasunich> the motor slows down by 10-12 RPM as its passing thru 2" dia (once it starts cutting continuously)
[02:31:28] <jmkasunich> I'd be reluctant to increase feed or DOC based on that - its too easy to slip the belts, and then things get messy
[02:31:50] <cradek> yep I bet that's a broken tool
[02:32:27] <jmkasunich> finish pass is 0.58 ipm (0.001/rev) and 0.005 doc
[02:32:29] <cradek> got the rest of my futon frame welded up and primed/painted today
[02:32:35] <jmkasunich> quite purty surface finish
[02:33:05] <cradek> for the gluing they will do, should it be smooth or a little rough?
[02:33:45] <jmkasunich> I think this will be fine
[02:34:23] <jmkasunich> I wonder how well the tip will hold up? running #2 now
[02:38:29] <jmkasunich> #3
[02:43:17] <jmkasunich> I think I'm gonna up the feed on the finish pass - the roughing passes leave a pretty nice finish, and right now the finish pass is taking as long as 3 roughs (there are only 4 roughs total)
[02:44:45] <jmkasunich> #4
[02:46:49] <jmkasunich> I love 12L14 ;-)
[02:47:00] <SkinnYPupp> Sweet cuttin stuff
[02:49:57] <jmkasunich> #5
[02:50:11] <jmkasunich> looks like 5ish minutes per part
[02:50:49] <jmkasunich> or another 75-80 mins to finish the job - should be done by 12:30
[02:55:17] <jmkasunich> #6
[03:03:06] <tom1> what rules governs speed of a motion that is linear and angular? eg: G20; G01 X1.0 B360.0;
[03:03:07] <tom1> does a B axis with .0001 resolution move slower than one with .01 degree?
[03:04:00] <cradek> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/html//gcode_main.html#sub:Feed-Rate
[03:06:34] <cradek> also good advice: http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/html//gcode_main.html#r8_7
[03:07:58] <tom1> yes, in point 1 of that description, units are inch (say .0001" linear) *and* are degrees(say .01 vs .0001) . and that seems to say that a coarse B axis will allow the command to execute quicker because its got bigger units.
[03:08:09] <tom1> and dunno bout inverse time trick...
[03:08:43] <cradek> tom1: I don't understand what you're saying about coarseness. the scale (counts/steps per unit) is irrelevant to feed rate
[03:10:25] <tom1> feed is in 'units' if x is asked to move 10000 units and B is asked to move 360000 units versus X is asked to move 10000 units and B is asked to move 36000, then the coarse B moves quicker
[03:10:57] <cradek> feed is in inches/minute or degrees/minute
[03:11:21] <tom1> and an X B motion's F is in what?
[03:11:29] <tom1> indegrees?
[03:11:36] <tom1> inchdegrees? :)
[03:12:09] <cradek> that's what is explained in that first link. you didn't read it!
[03:12:43] <cradek> an XB move is case #1
[03:12:52] <tom1> ok, re-re-reading ( yes i read it, but didnt understand what you do apparently )
[03:12:54] <tom1> F is in units per minute in the XYZ cartesian system, and all other axes (UVWABC) move so as to start and stop in coordinated fashion
[03:14:13] <cradek> right, F is inches/minute along the X part of the move. B moves in a coordinated fashion (start/stop at the same time as X)
[03:14:38] <tom1> ok, got it
[03:15:06] <tom1> now the top velocity of the B can play havoc with the F right? so thats the limiting factor to me
[03:15:32] <cradek> yes the whole move will slow down enough that X,B can stay in sync but not violate any speed limits
[03:15:50] <tom1> gotcha, thats what i'm seeing, thx
[03:15:50] <jmkasunich> #10
[03:16:02] <cradek> since moving together is more important than moving the requested speed
[04:09:05] <jmkasunich> #20
[04:14:04] <jmkasunich> all done ;-)
[04:40:23] <tom1> nice, a bit over 4 minutes each, sounds fast
[04:58:29] <toastydeath> IMMA CHARGIN MAH LAZER
[05:31:09] <JymmmEMC> jmkasunich: Um, if you are learning how to count, you really aint done, there are more numbers just to let ya know ;)
[05:32:01] <JymmmEMC> Toda'ys product (plays DIVX too) woot.com
[06:11:07] <tom1> upconverter cool, huh only 40$ !
[06:11:46] <JymmmEMC> They only seel one product a day
[06:11:49] <JymmmEMC> sell
[11:42:58] <BigJohnT_> Is there any reason not to use this line to start running a ngc file?
[11:42:59] <BigJohnT_> net remote-start halui.program.run halui.mode.auto <= pyvcp.start-button
[12:29:24] <BigJohnT_> hmmm
[12:31:56] <BigJohnT_> what do I use to do the following in hal
[12:32:33] <BigJohnT_> if pin-1 == .t. set the value of speed = 25
[12:32:53] <BigJohnT_> elseif pin-2 == .t. set the value of speed = 100
[12:37:08] <BigJohnT_> hmmm mux2 maybe...
[12:44:10] <BigJohnT_> ok mux2 it is
[12:44:32] <BigJohnT_> I think I'm talking to myself
[12:44:48] <BigJohnT_> so long as I don't start an argument with myself it will be ok
[13:33:52] <alex_joni> BigJohnT: I don't think it will work to drive both halui.mode.auto and halui.program.run from only one button
[13:34:23] <BigJohnT> but it does work
[13:34:42] <BigJohnT> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Jogging_With_Buttons_On_A_Pendant
[13:34:51] <BigJohnT> morning alex
[13:35:26] <alex_joni> hi BigJohnT
[13:35:49] <alex_joni> really? even if you're in manual or MDI mode?
[13:36:02] <awallin_emc> hi all. where is '/scripts/realtime' on a proper install? (not run in place)
[13:36:11] <BigJohnT> yes, as long as the e stop is out and the machine power is on
[13:36:13] <alex_joni> awallin_emc: /etc/init.d/realtime
[13:36:28] <alex_joni> but you obviously need sudo for that place
[13:36:40] <alex_joni> BigJohnT: nice to hear, I wouldn't have thought it's possible
[13:36:47] <alex_joni> and I wrote the stuff :)
[13:36:57] <alex_joni> well, halui at least
[13:37:06] <BigJohnT> no one told me it would not work so I tried it
[13:37:37] <alex_joni> you should have asked me :D
[13:37:41] <alex_joni> * alex_joni snickers
[13:37:48] <BigJohnT> you were away from your computer
[13:37:55] <alex_joni> ;-)
[13:38:12] <alex_joni> <- has a nasty habit of sleeping sometimes
[13:38:31] <BigJohnT> besides if you limit my thinking by telling me it won't work I might not try something
[13:38:53] <alex_joni> ok, point taken
[13:39:05] <alex_joni> I'll remember not to tell you anything anymore
[13:39:11] <alex_joni> that way you won't be limited :D
[13:39:15] <BigJohnT> no no tell me
[13:40:34] <BigJohnT> did you look at the link?
[13:40:57] <alex_joni> yup
[13:41:03] <BigJohnT> look ok?
[13:41:06] <alex_joni> didn't see any flashy pics, so I thought it's dull
[13:41:23] <BigJohnT> adding some machine porn pics now LOL
[13:41:26] <alex_joni> BigJohnT: don't take me too seriously today :)
[13:41:33] <BigJohnT> ok
[13:42:01] <alex_joni> I'm actually in a good mood atm, listening to some nice music, and thinking about some coding on emc2
[13:42:53] <BigJohnT> cool what are you listening to
[13:43:59] <alex_joni> right now eagles
[13:44:21] <BigJohnT> cool
[13:47:00] <alex_joni> johnny cash now ;)
[13:48:14] <BigJohnT> you sound like me I listen to all "good" music
[13:48:32] <alex_joni> well.. it's quite a wide range over here :)
[13:48:41] <BigJohnT> using your new headphones
[13:48:48] <alex_joni> of course
[13:51:17] <BigJohnT> with colorful pictures now http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Jogging_With_Buttons_On_A_Pendant
[13:52:50] <alex_joni> way nicer ;)
[13:52:56] <BigJohnT> thanks
[13:53:13] <alex_joni> metallica - Mama said ;)
[13:54:05] <BigJohnT> I have a new g code generator almost done that will mill a chamfer for a hole using a chamfer mill
[13:54:30] <alex_joni> BigJohnT: one day we need to figure out how to package all those generators into something easily installable
[13:54:41] <BigJohnT> I agree
[13:54:55] <BigJohnT> I wish there was a way to add them to the menu
[13:56:06] <alex_joni> which menu?
[13:56:11] <BigJohnT> axis
[13:56:49] <alex_joni> there probably is.. but I'm not sure about specifics
[13:57:36] <BigJohnT> be nice if there was a "Scripts" menu that you could add python scripts to with the ini file
[13:59:42] <BigJohnT> the other nice thing would be to have canned cycles...
[13:59:58] <alex_joni> there are a couple
[14:00:10] <alex_joni> and lerman is working on allowing users to specify their own
[14:00:21] <alex_joni> by overloading G-codes with O-word procedures
[14:00:51] <BigJohnT> cool
[14:01:16] <BigJohnT> hmmm anyway to add things like that to a pyVCP panel?
[14:01:51] <alex_joni> like what?
[14:02:06] <BigJohnT> canned cycles
[14:02:14] <BigJohnT> just thinking out loud
[14:02:20] <alex_joni> hmm.. only if you can express it as a MDI command
[14:02:27] <alex_joni> halui has support for mdi commands
[14:04:14] <BigJohnT> hmmm
[14:06:33] <BigJohnT> do you have to manually put the mdi command in?
[14:06:51] <alex_joni> in the ini file, yes
[14:07:23] <BigJohnT> hmmm
[14:08:16] <BigJohnT> I see the halui.mode.mdi pin...
[14:08:54] <alex_joni> not the mode
[14:09:27] <alex_joni> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/html//gui_halui.html#r1_2_14
[14:10:48] <BigJohnT> I just found it when you posted the link : )
[14:16:37] <awallin_emc> what's the 'net' syntax? man net gives me something on Samba...
[14:16:54] <alex_joni> net <name> pin1 pin2 ..
[14:17:09] <awallin_emc> is the => significant?
[14:17:32] <alex_joni> no, just for readability
[14:20:17] <skunkworks> heh - I don't do Window$, that's what the janitor is for -
[14:20:38] <awallin_emc> is the order in which I do 'addf' to different functions going to matter?
[14:20:39] <skunkworks> THat is funny (Neil on the list)
[14:21:13] <alex_joni> awallin_emc: depends on the functions
[14:21:25] <alex_joni> but usually it matters, they get executed in the order you specify them
[14:21:43] <alex_joni> (for example it makes sense to addf read inputs, then doing things, then writing outputs)
[14:21:54] <alex_joni> if you do it some other way you can have 1 period delays
[14:22:08] <alex_joni> skunkworks: I noticed that too
[14:22:12] <awallin_emc> right. so first read encoder counters, then calculate pid and then output dac
[14:22:40] <alex_joni> who wants to have a contest?
[14:23:00] <alex_joni> who can break emc2 harder :D
[14:23:08] <skunkworks> That is how the mazak hal is setup - actually commented saying the same thing
[14:23:49] <skunkworks> alex_joni: ?
[14:24:10] <alex_joni> skunkworks: taking a stab at some code renaming and fixing
[14:24:19] <alex_joni> I'm up to a couple hundred compile errors
[14:24:26] <skunkworks> heh..
[14:25:44] <skunkworks> I broke emc friday - but I don't think I get the credit.. :)
[14:26:10] <skunkworks> (as much as I wish it was me)
[14:32:36] <alex_joni> how did you break it?
[14:34:13] <skunkworks> there is a issue with the pci8255 driver. It locks up the computer with certain i/o settings.
[14:34:22] <alex_joni> ah, saw that
[14:35:17] <tom1> post the setting so others can avoid it ;)
[14:35:20] <skunkworks> jepler: does this make sense? http://cnczone.com/forums/showpost.php?p=432441&postcount=10
[14:35:53] <skunkworks> tom1: I think it will get fixed. I don't know if it causes other issues. I am just not going to use it until it gets looked at.
[14:36:04] <skunkworks> I have time :)
[14:36:24] <skunkworks> mainly - don't set it all to inputs. :)
[14:36:38] <tom1> thx, thats handy
[14:36:42] <alex_joni> skunkworks: how about half/half ?
[14:36:58] <skunkworks> it seems to work..
[14:37:00] <awallin_emc> should I get: "Registering server on TCP port 5005." when I don't want a simulated machine?
[14:37:11] <alex_joni> awallin_emc: yes
[14:37:23] <alex_joni> that's emcserv which runs always
[14:37:29] <alex_joni> GUI's connect to it
[14:37:35] <awallin_emc> ok so next problem is motmod.ko': -1 Invalid parameters
[14:37:37] <skunkworks> I was getting odd - issues with the card getting lost.. but I don't know if that was related to the driver or static.
[14:38:29] <skunkworks> jepler has the same card - he said when he gets a chance he will take a stab at it.
[14:39:00] <alex_joni> awallin_emc: older config?
[14:40:16] <alex_joni> usually dmesg will tell you where it fails
[14:40:31] <awallin_emc> alex_joni: I was missing num_joints=, let's see if it works now
[14:42:48] <tom1> maybe in addition to g-code: xlogo, a language suited to cnc (is about motion and is procedural ) http://xlogo.tuxfamily.org/
[14:42:49] <tom1> usually considered a 'beginners language' but is all about motion
[14:50:26] <awallin_emc> should iocontrol.0.user-enable-out be changing when I press the two leftmost buttons in AXIS? I get nothing...
[14:52:59] <awallin_emc> seems I don't quite grok the e-stop loop yet...
[14:56:44] <awallin_emc> why does user-enable-out stay high after a following error? I thought that caused an E-stop?
[15:06:13] <cradek> no, FE causes 'machine off' (amp disable)
[15:07:31] <awallin_emc> hm. I think I have a problem with the pico-systems servo drives.
[15:08:01] <awallin_emc> they won't wake up unless the PWM output is given a few pulses in each direction
[15:08:25] <awallin_emc> that's done automatically with the pico-systems parallel port hardware, but I'm using an m5i20
[15:08:52] <jmkasunich> I believe the need for those startup pulses is documentecx
[15:08:55] <jmkasunich> ed
[15:09:37] <awallin_emc> yes, just wondering how I should create them...
[15:10:08] <jmkasunich> good question
[15:10:25] <jmkasunich> Jon's answer would be to use his boards instead of the 5i20 ;-/
[15:10:40] <alex_joni> oneshot ?
[15:10:51] <alex_joni> driving a stepgen?
[15:11:06] <jmkasunich> the 5i20 is making the PWM - anything you do has to go thru there
[15:11:37] <jmkasunich> like, command 1% duty cycle fwd for 1mS, then command 1% reverse for 1mS, then start running normally
[15:12:49] <awallin_emc> jmkasunich: exactly. maybe I'll just make a pyvcp panel that runs before emc starts and does that.
[15:13:18] <jmkasunich> pyvcp? you mean do it manually somehow?
[15:13:33] <jmkasunich> (I don't see why this needs to interact with the user)
[15:13:47] <awallin_emc> hm, or just a HAL thing that runs as EMC starts up?
[15:14:07] <jmkasunich> yeah - I'd probalby make it do its thing when the axis enable pin goes true
[15:14:14] <cradek> is this a startup task, or an enabling-amp task
[15:14:17] <jmkasunich> rather than at startup
[15:14:31] <cradek> what he says :-)
[15:19:54] <jmkasunich> bbl - need breakfast
[15:20:42] <awallin_emc> hm, is it common to get oscillations when I have only Pgain in a PID loop and twist the motor by hand away from the setpoint?
[15:22:30] <cradek> yes especially if it's set a bit high
[15:23:21] <cradek> reducing P, or, if P is only a bit high, adding a little D should fix it
[15:26:05] <awallin_emc> with a little D gain the wilder oscillations stop, but it still humms when I twist it
[15:27:03] <cradek> without any mass, I hear it can be hard to tune a motor well. I've always tuned motors already on the machine.
[15:27:23] <JymmmEMC> cradek: for dampening purposes?
[15:27:32] <awallin_emc> yep, this one has no mass. maybe I'll leave tuning for later.
[15:27:35] <cradek> yeah I suppose so
[15:27:57] <awallin_emc> lot's of other things to do (jog-wheel, vfd, coolant, all needs to be integrated...
[15:27:59] <dave_1> the response and PID without a load will be quite different than loaded
[15:28:04] <cradek> awallin_emc: with a low enough P (only), it should not oscillate. at that setting it will be squishy (you'll be able to turn it pretty far)
[15:28:31] <cradek> yes I agree with dave_1 - there's little point to working on a good tuning now
[15:28:43] <dave_1> it sounds like you are close to a correct P ... but that will change when you load it.
[15:29:05] <awallin_emc> also just remembered that I am running the amp at the wrong PWM frequency, better check that too. the pico amps want 50 kHz PWM (probably analog filters in there to damp out the pwm at 50 kHz)
[15:29:29] <cradek> ah I remember hearing something about that on the lists.
[15:29:41] <dave_1> the classical way to set a starting P is increase P until you get sustained osc the .6 * P is about the right point
[15:29:43] <cradek> was there some change to the mesa firmware to allow it?
[15:30:21] <awallin_emc> cradek: yes there is a hostmot4 with a higher clock rate. if you load it manually and do the timing math yourself then it works
[15:30:56] <awallin_emc> i.e. you feed it something like 16 kHz and since it runs at 3x what the driver expects it comes out at 50 kHz
[15:31:10] <awallin_emc> on the loadrt line that is
[15:31:35] <cradek> interesting
[15:31:44] <cradek> I will be interested to hear how you come out with jon's amps + mesa
[15:32:06] <awallin_emc> it's just 32 MHz clock vs. 100 MHz clock on the fpga I guess.
[15:32:25] <cradek> that combination seems quite decent and affordable
[15:33:12] <dave_1> IIRC jon's amps don't have tach inputs so you end up torque mode; that should be interesting to tune
[15:33:26] <cradek> yep
[15:33:40] <cradek> bbl
[15:33:50] <awallin_emc> yes, I thought about doing a H-bridge myself, but jon's amps are something like 125$ so almost not worth it to mess around with a design myself...
[15:34:55] <dave_1> I think Ray and Matt used them on a lathe conversion
[15:35:36] <awallin_emc> I'll probably get to mounting the motors on the mill in around 1-2weeks
[15:36:58] <dave_1> catchya later ... enjoy!
[15:45:19] <BigJohnT> awillin_emc: I just added a couple of pages to wiki on jogging with halui if your interested...
[15:47:33] <DanielFalck> BigJohnT: good morning- nice work
[15:47:44] <tom1> tune connected to machine tool with 'typical' load ( vise workpiece clamps, tool in spindle ). i have to fill work tank with hundreds of gallons of oil on old machines that move table.
[15:47:56] <BigJohnT> Hi DanielFalck: thanks
[15:49:19] <BigJohnT> DanielFalck: I have a chamfer one almost done for milling a chamfer in a hole with a chamfer mill
[15:49:27] <DanielFalck> cool
[15:53:38] <awallin_emc> bbl
[16:19:34] <JymmmEMC> Hey, how do you get the symbol on the keyboard for the backwards 'u' as in um
[16:19:44] <JymmmEMC> uF
[16:19:46] <JymmmEMC> etc
[16:24:36] <BigJohnT> alt 230
[16:25:01] <JymmmEMC> Eh, doens't work on ubuntu, but thanks =)
[16:25:20] <BigJohnT> ok, didn't know...
[16:25:52] <JymmmEMC> BigJohnT: It's all good, that only works under windows. guees they did one thing right ;)
[16:26:10] <BigJohnT> is this in openoffice or something
[16:26:47] <cradek> JymmmEMC: if you have a multi-key defined on your keyboard, you type multi-key, /, u
[16:27:00] <cradek> many letters can be made up using two keystrokes in this way
[16:27:03] <JymmmEMC> No, just in general.
[16:27:19] <JymmmEMC> cradek: I dont have meta keys setup (I think)
[16:27:25] <cradek> multi, not meta
[16:27:41] <cradek> just pick a key you don't use and assign it as multi-key
[16:27:46] <JymmmEMC> cradek: no idea what it is then
[16:27:48] <cradek> I always use scroll-lock for that
[16:27:56] <JymmmEMC> no biggy, I copy and pasted
[16:28:05] <BigJohnT> bbl
[16:28:06] <cradek> or, one of the windows keys if I am unlucky enough to have them on my keyboard
[16:28:53] <JymmmEMC> This only goes to 0-40mil, but thought it was interesting is all... http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=95520
[16:29:46] <JymmmEMC> 0-1000 ┬Ám
[16:29:53] <cradek> what does it do?
[16:30:02] <JymmmEMC> digital thickness gauge
[16:30:23] <JymmmEMC> Like if you were silkscreening/painting a layer of coating on simething
[16:30:46] <JymmmEMC> and you wanted to veryify the thickness
[16:31:34] <JymmmEMC> While HF sucks at power tools, their electronics (IR gun and codereader) seems to be not too shabby.
[16:32:11] <cradek> I've got some crap and some perfectly good stuff from there
[16:32:26] <cradek> I got a letter punch set with two S and no R...
[16:32:47] <JymmmEMC> yeah, I need a big ass unibit and they have it on sale for $15
[16:33:04] <JymmmEMC> now to just see if the retail store has it in stock
[16:33:08] <cradek> but their cheap 1/8" parallel set is nice
[16:33:18] <JymmmEMC> HD wants $60 ouch
[16:33:41] <cradek> the digital caliper works nice enough, and I don't care if I drop it and then step on it (as I'm known to do)
[16:33:41] <JymmmEMC> I dont "need" a set of parallels (yet ;)
[16:33:49] <JymmmEMC> lol, yep
[16:33:58] <cradek> so some of it's fine, you just have to return what isn't
[16:34:29] <JymmmEMC> I bought their 115pc drillbit set, at least I now have the sizes if needed - though maybe one time use but I expect that
[16:34:47] <JymmmEMC> cant beat it for $40
[16:34:54] <cradek> I have a couple of those sets too. the drills are very poor
[16:35:08] <JymmmEMC> better than nothing at all.
[16:35:08] <cradek> they drill way oversize unless you're super careful
[16:35:18] <cradek> true enough.
[16:35:38] <JymmmEMC> Though I buy the $8 bit from the machine store if I need to tap
[16:35:40] <cradek> I often drill .020 undersize and then the actual size drill works about like a reamer. you can sometimes get a hole the right size that way.
[16:36:18] <JymmmEMC> LOL, I'll remember that.
[16:36:43] <JymmmEMC> You just cant beat this... http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=96275
[16:36:56] <JymmmEMC> for one off holes
[16:37:00] <cradek> sheet metal?
[16:37:05] <JymmmEMC> yeah
[16:37:19] <cradek> I hate those things - I always make a mess with them
[16:37:33] <JymmmEMC> I need 30mm, so this will be "close enough"
[16:38:04] <JymmmEMC> well 18ga sheet metal
[16:43:40] <tom1> gotta count the rings to do next hole, you get into a rhythm
[16:44:14] <JymmmEMC> nah, sharpie marker =)
[16:44:35] <tom1> you guys that can see beat us guys that can hear ;)
[16:45:34] <JymmmEMC> wha ya say sunny?!
[17:10:46] <skunkwork1> http://imagebin.org/15430
[17:11:47] <awallin_emc> where would I find the .bit files for the m5i20 installed ?
[17:13:07] <awallin_emc> I know where they are in a run-in-place install... but this is 2.2.4 installed properly...
[17:13:26] <renesis> hey guys
[17:13:36] <renesis> how do i do a toolchange in code?
[17:13:57] <renesis> not a real one just like, sit there and wait for user say go
[17:14:10] <awallin_emc> the wiki has a G-code cheat sheet
[17:14:31] <renesis> cuz i usually do stuff from machine manual but like wtf is a open loop taig/xylotex/emc manual
[17:14:34] <renesis> kk ty
[17:15:13] <awallin_emc> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/gcode.html
[17:15:26] <renesis> oh wow youre awesome
[17:18:20] <renesis> ok screw this im splitting the drills files
[17:21:03] <renesis> okay i will use M0
[17:21:51] <renesis> M6 will probably run some gcode someplace else?
[17:24:06] <skunkwork1> try it - if it is setup like most of the configs.. It will popup a dialog box to change the tool.
[17:30:23] <renesis> oh?
[17:30:36] <renesis> i was just gonna ask how to do a user prompt
[17:30:45] <renesis> ok i will play with it
[17:50:15] <skunkworks> oh - that isn't good
[17:55:48] <alex_joni> skunkwork1: what isn't ?
[17:58:53] <awallin_emc> should deadband be slightly more or less than one encoder count?
[17:59:52] <awallin_emc> maybe that is causing the oscillations I see
[21:29:52] <tomp> how to scroll window on emc2 live 6.06install? ( cant see whole window, some key code? )
[21:39:03] <alex_joni> what window?
[21:39:43] <tomp> on time zone now, cant get past city selection ( endless loop)
[21:40:00] <alex_joni> oh, during the installer..
[21:40:09] <alex_joni> try connecting a different monitor and restart the install
[21:40:22] <alex_joni> if that doesn't work maybe a different graphics card will
[21:40:35] <alex_joni> if that still doesn't work, you can install with the alternate CD (text mode)
[21:40:38] <skunkworks> I have just entered thru the setup when I had that issue
[21:40:47] <alex_joni> then follow the install from linuxcnc.org
[21:40:54] <alex_joni> or do what skunkworks said :)
[21:41:05] <tomp> ok ( viewsonic 19" with 4meg S3virge ) enter gives me the city list over and over
[21:41:14] <skunkworks> tab?
[21:41:34] <skunkworks> I usually pick it from the graphics.. Chicago for me..
[21:41:46] <tomp> tab also gives me city list over and over, ditto chicago
[21:42:11] <skunkworks> then what alex said ;)
[21:42:28] <alex_joni> good night guys
[21:42:49] <skunkworks> night alex.
[21:45:18] <tomp> nite alex
[22:27:27] <tomp> haha, change S3virge to Matrox mga and got a flyspeck cursor, now its hard to see, not off the screen, 1280x1024 cool
[22:28:23] <cradek> those old matrox cards are great. I snag them whenever I see them on junk piles
[22:29:25] <skunkworks> I have had bad luck with any old s3 video card.
[22:30:07] <tomp> good to know, now marked as NFG4EMC :)
[22:32:11] <tomp> i pulled apart a bad cdrom while it installed, the motor is dc brushed, drives a lead screw, 1st 'gear' is an opto wheel (for speed i 'spose)
[22:32:13] <skunkworks> * skunkworks has a ton of s3 cards for some reason
[22:35:02] <skunkworks> mini-hexipod? ;)
[22:36:48] <tomp> mini 3 axis maybe, needs outriggers to make it run sqr so hexapod would be tricky, 3 slides maybe possible
[22:37:33] <eric_U> I like the mini hexapod idea
[22:47:47] <tomp> http://imagebin.org/15446
[22:49:46] <skunkworks> Neat - I think fenn was thinking about making a hexapod from pager motors and mouse encoders.
[22:50:13] <tomp> this is like a pager motor
[22:51:49] <BigJohnT> tomp: that from a floppy drive?
[22:51:51] <skunkworks> * skunkworks is trying to get up to speed on classic ladder.. Have not done any ladder logic since college. and that was only touched on in a class
[22:52:02] <skunkworks> cdrom
[22:52:26] <BigJohnT> the rules of ladder is "last one wins"
[22:52:43] <eric_U> we never had ladder logic at all. Dunno what's wrong with the schools I've been to
[22:53:08] <skunkworks> this was a technical school- electronics.
[22:53:28] <skunkworks> it was an industrial electronics class iirc
[22:54:25] <BigJohnT> the flow is 1 update inputs, 2 solve logic, 3 update outputs, 4 do housekeeping
[22:54:43] <eric_U> tomp, that picture does look like something that might work best in a 3 axis orthogonal motion machine
[22:54:57] <tomp> right
[22:55:19] <eric_U> although a couple of the guys at work had this three axis positioning machine that was more like a hexapod
[22:55:28] <tomp> if i can get the hairpin spring back on one end to remove the lash
[22:55:35] <eric_U> the linear axes were at 60 degree angles
[22:55:45] <eric_U> it was wonderfully simple
[22:56:30] <eric_U> I need a picture
[22:58:21] <tomp> hexaglide? http://www.ifr.mavt.ethz.ch/research/hexaglide/index.html 3 axis, 3 joints ( sorry broken website but left column shows pic )
[22:58:58] <eric_U> yes, like that, only the linear axes are in a 60 degree star
[22:59:17] <eric_U> I think they use 6 rods with rod end bearings
[22:59:32] <eric_U> they also had a 5 axis version
[22:59:37] <tomp> huh, new to me, go find it!
[23:04:11] <tomp> the rack & pinion drive on the tray eject is nice too ( but sloppy and no feedback at all )
[23:17:07] <tomp> kins for hexaglide http://www.bridgeport.edu/sed/fcourses/cs460_cpe460/Lectures_Handouts/7/Nonlinear_Adaptive_Control.pdf
[23:19:02] <tomp> yeah, it was graham stabler who introduced these things on his website http://www.indoor.flyer.co.uk/kinematics.htm
[23:24:48] <eric_U> I need to post a movie of my 4 dof fatigue machine