nobody but us chickens
Does emc2 use floating point or integer math?
floats for "continuous" numbers, ints where appropriate
I'm toying with the idea of trying to run it on an embedded processor.
Just researching and looking at what's out there.
apparently there aer ARM chips with FP units - cirrus has some that are < $20
you know :)
What I was wondering is if an FP unit is necessary?
that depends on what you're planning to put on the embedded chip
My idea is nothing but linux and emc2.
if you want the interpreter there, then I'd say FP is essential, since the input language uses floats (and arcs, and has math functions)
then again, if you're using a 200MHz ARM chip that can do a few thousand FOPS/sec, it may be enough to get by, the rest being done in fixed point
fixed point (32.32) on a 32-bit chip would be more precise than floats, which only have 24 bits of mantissa
the interp uses doubles, when it gets to the RT parts, it's all single-precision floats
I've seen these small SBCs and thought it would be interesting to run emc on one.
(though we'd like to use doubles there as well - the 24-bit mantissa isn't enough in some cases)
Why don't you?
well, it's not impossible, but it may not be easy :)
we need atomic updates, and 64-bit loads/stores aren't atomic on 32-bit CPUs
Just some day-dreaming right now :-)
can't be interrupted
ah, single instruction...
no, uninterruptible ;)
SWPadnos: blame the compilers
JymmmEMC, no, blame the CPUs - let's not get into that again ;)
which would mean it would have to be a single instruction wouldn't it?
there are single instructions that may take a long time - like REP stosb - that could be hundreds of thousands of cycles (it's a repeat loop), but unless you LOCK first, it's interruptible (IIRC - been a while for '386 assembly)
I see. I don't know assembly but I'm learning some low level stuff programming microcontrollers these days.
microcontrollers are much simpler environments than modern virtual-memory general purpose CPUs
on a microcontroller, it's very likely that a single instruction is uninterruptible :)
ah, yes - REP stosb is interruptible
I see :-)
EMC used to run on very slow (by today's standards) CPUs - like high end 486es and low end Pentiums (100 MHz range)
those all had FP units though
and way back then, EMC didn't do the PID (or step generation, at least at first)
Atmel has a 32 bit chip that does 210 MIPS at 150 Mhz - about equivalent to an ARM9 at 200 Mhz
that's a cool chip
I went to a seminar they did on it in Dallas and that got me thinking about it.
yeah - I got the STK1000 shortly after it became available
it's a nice chip, but I have the concern that it's a one-chip wonder - there are no compatible chips from anywhere else, and it's a new line that may go nowhere
Ah. Do you work with that stuff for a living?
the peripherals are all based on the same bus they use in their ARM chips (like the AT91RM62xx)
heh - yeah :)
I like the chip, and I hope it stays around long enough for me to use it in something
I'm doing a bit of it now and it's fascinating.
no two days alike for a consultant
that's the fun part
?? a reference listed by the Portugese students using EMC whazzdis?  HENRY DAN FALK, W. S. R. The Enhanced Machine Control - Developer Handbook. New York: [s.n.], 2003.
site is http://www.pucrs.br/feng/mecanica/laboratorios/gp4c/proj-cnc.php
I've never been to new york
no prob Dan, was wondering if someone of that name was in the orig NIST crew
probably mixed up Ray Henry and my name somehow
oh, like me reading Portugese, gotcha
but I noticed all the refs were in New York too
which was really weird
maybe someone did a bit too much cut copy past : )
where does AXIS get the Vel: number from?
from TP (as I can see)
is motion.current-vel only for the X and Y axis, there is nothing in the manual for it
yup, actually TP puts it in stat, and AXIS gets it from there
ok I found the parameter
BigJohnT_: what do you need it for?
to tell when the X and Y axis is changing velocity
I found motion.current-vel and it is 1/60 of the vel of all axis
doing a watch window on all the tc items and nothing changes values as I run
BigJohnT_: is the option Override Limits of AXIS working on your axis ?
micges: dunno let me check
yes it works when you are on a limit switch to allow you to get off of the switch
ok, confused me too at first
I must have bug on my config :P
how is that?
you have to trip a limit switch before you can check the override limits box
Im not sure but It seems to
where do you find the TP pin in hal for X and Y velocity?
* BigJohnT_ bolts on the Z axis componets on the machine
re: tp velocities... if hal can see it, then i'd guess you can see it with 'halcmd show pin' and if not, then hal wont/cant see it.
i take that back, might be 'halcmd show' (dunno if its a pin)
in the hal config window I see tc.0.acc and vel and pos but the number doesn't change when I run
BigJohnT_: you don't have it in HAL by default
look at the sim configs
they implement a couple of ddt's to generate vaelocity
out of the current position
iirc Xvel, Yvel, etc
gotta run now
ok like the Dallur config
ok, so posn diff & time generate vel
I did a Ddt on xpos-fb and out to xvel and that works
bbl breakfast calls
clever guy that Rugludallur
server slow or all busy ? :)
just putting in my z gecko drive
what's a gecko ?
Gecko is a popular stepping motor drive.,
[15:18:40] <skunkworks> http://www.geckodrive.com/
* BigJohnT_ loves my gecko 203v's
stepper better then servo ?
for some applications yes
for others no
Heh - that is a interesting argument..
203v ????????? how big is your machine
50" x 50"
new to cnc
travels at 450IPM in rapid
your going to have fun then
DAMN :) (excuse my french)
what did you have in mind for CNC?
i read that wrong ...read 4501 imp
450 inches per minute
i know just read wrong
so what are you thinking about for CNC?
we got a sherline tabletop mill....trying to learn codes
cool, what kind of codes?
making small parts for computer components
g and m
Are you using the emc1 bdi? or emc2?
i'm trying to install emc2 on my home computer for over two months :(
ok, you only have to know a few to get going G0,1,2,3
can you not get it to install or can't get it configured
got emc at work and trying to get emc2 here
What problems are you having?
i'm starting to think it's my sata drive
i donwloaded a bunch of isos, but non get to install
I tried to install it on a windows box and finally just put a new hard drive in and it's been smooth sailing more or less since then
do the live cd
i downloaded that also no good
Does it try to boot off of the livecd?
i ordered the live cd from ubuntu....but not here yet
yes, i can never get the ms5sum right
what are you using to burn the cd?
did you just copy the live cd to a disk?
used poweriso in win and k3 in unbutu
skunkworks we are heading in the same direction I see LOL
i'm in ubuntu 6.06 now
The iso is like a zip file - the burning software needs to extract the information and burn the actual directorys to the cd.
i got the kubuntu 7.1 live cd but cn't install emc...either one
i get the files on the disk...i look after burning....files not just iso
but i never boots to the live disk
what burning software?
been inside my comp at least 3 times....alls good
[15:35:01] <skunkworks> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BurningIsoHowto
used k3d in ubuntu...kubuntu....debian and poweriso in winxp
do you have another computer that you can boot up the live cd on?
tried that :(
So - you have 6.06 running right now?
i get it installed here....but can't run it
is there a promission some where ?
you get it installed but can't run it? what does that mean? it installes - but won't boot after that?
ubuntu is installed but can't get emx2 to work
i'v used adept manager...csv...
did you install ubuntu 6.06 with the live cd?
i ordered that one
waiting for it
when i use csv, i get c compiler can't use executables
when i look at the emc files..they're all read only
sorry but I don't know anything about the csv install...
i can't get pass -./configure --run-in-place --enable-simulator
tha's ok...still appreciate the help
do you have the cnc menu
what is that ?
don't sound like you have it installed correctly
looking thru the files now and it doesn't look like it's completely installed..
did you follow the instructions on this page http://www.linuxcnc.org/content/view/21/4/lang,en/
downloading live cd
that is the easy way!
what do ya'll use to burn ?
I have nero
I had to start from a windoz machine
i don't...i'll try k3d again
i have winxp and ubuntu on this machine
what is your start string in application ?
I'm a hillneck so no one calls me sir anymore...
that's a hillbilly redneck
i'm coonass........we say sir
get over it :)
really, where from?
I knew that part but what town
I used to live in LaPlace
and Kenner and Metairie...
about a hour and a half from here
now I live in south east Missouri
we're at the west end of the long bridge
cold up there ?
not at the moment
just off 10
last of our cold fronts
anyhow when you get it downloaded and burned you should be able to boot from the CD and play with EMC or install it
i hope it installs it by itself ... not good at installing
the biggest thing I miss is french bread, I had to learn how to make it myself
yes it is real easy
so easy I did it
have you looked at the emc wiki site?
think i saw it
lots more info there, let me get the link
[16:03:46] <BigJohnT_> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl
case studies has info about lots of converstions and builds
ya..been there also
dang near nap time here Jymmm
not a half bad idea
busy i guess...John's workin on steppers and i started on a shampooer for my wife
* BigJohnT_ is going to get his Z axis going, take a nap and rebuild the master toilet but not in that order
pretty fast kenneth
hahha good luck and thanks for the help John
I think a nap sounds good
dial up here with two cups and a string
hahahhaha been there...don't think i could go back
archivist: when I saw this I thought of you: http://www.hgrindustrialsurplus.com/search-products/product-detail.aspx?id=30-513-054&searchtable=1&sortExpression=&SortASC=&pageSize=50¤tPageIndex=0
archivist: I didn't know you were a leprichon
kenneth: CNC shampooer?
noope :) carpet
would be nice though
clean the house from her computer
just map out the house to lat/lon coordinates and there ya go!
ya...the dogs would have to fend for themselves hahaha
lojack the dogs =)
Get RFID chips installed in the dogs and sensors aorund the home
maybe put a camera on the thing
hahhahahaha even better
she already wants yo chip her dog
well, you're half way there =)
so Jym..what do you do ?
Just place a RFID proximity sensor on the shampooer... then if the dog is close, make it wash the dog too =)
mmmm roombas and scoobas
our friend already has a roomba
it's a start
got the bluetooth accessory for it?
has a bumper
but with a little tweaking ..................
jmkasunich: typically when using a square D typ chassis that has a backer plate in it... are items fstened using self-tapping screws? threaded? nut & bolts?
that's the old/original roomba
self tappers or threaded holes
jmkasunich: ok, self tapping screws it is =) TY
this is fairly old....self tapper
might suck though, I dont have the underside clearance I'd liek to have =(
these caps are just too freaking tall
you want to be able to change stuff without having to take the whole panel out to retrieve fallen nuts
I've used rivnuts before, also studs
jmkasunich: I stripped out a HP ProCurve 4000 56p 10/100 switch for the chassis. I'm trying to setup a "L" so that I can slide everything out.
[18:30:34] <JymmmEMC> http://www.mcbia.com/auction/randy/HP-ProCurve-4000M.jpg
17" w 6.5" tall and 13.5" deep
(19" rack mountable actually with ears on it)
I gutted the whole thing already, drilled out the rivets, will take photos later.
hmm.. is anyone using wireless on ubuntu?
i did at one point then gave up because i couldn't get it to work reliably
SWPadnos: any hints setting up wpa_supplicant ?
I mean, did you do anything special?
I couldn't get it to work at home, but that was due to my setting up the router wrong
during that time, I installed a bunch of stuff, though I think none of it was needed
since then, it has worked flawlessly at several airports, hotels, and other places - including ones with WPA enabled
I managed to enable it manually..
using iwconfig :)
but if I have wpa_supplicant running, it somehow keeps insisting in not using encryption, and then the association fails
I didn't need that, but I did try doing stuff with it for a while (when I didn't realize I didn't need it :) )
I actually set up connection sharing last week, so two of us could use the one wireless connection to the hotel network -shared with a crossover cable between laptops ;)
it worked great once I stopped fiddling around at the command line
(used FireStarter - worked nicely)
anyways.. it's working now, so I won't sweat it
heh - that's what I said :)
it's worked great -the only problems I've had occurred when everyone else had problems as well, so it wasn't the laptop
Yea! the Z axis is alive...
time to fix the toilet now I guess...
shitty job I guess
[20:17:53] <cradek> http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1360/546122555_23973a4df9_b.jpg
Silly Q re VSR circuits?
Will a light buklb in place of the fuse affect thyem so as to make them go into faut mode?
Answered that question, yes it will, replaced the fuse and it now drives the spindle at full speed both ways.
BUT, even though I can see the voltage, 0 to about 8.9 volts, going into the vsr from trhe PMDX-106, the spiondle speed is not being controlled, its wide open all the time.
a light bulb is meant to use energy - it's a resistor. a fuse is meant to use no energy until the current is too high, at which time it uses enough energy to melt
gene_, do you have to disconnect the pot on the VSR to use an external control signal?
try turning the VSR knob all the way "the other way" and see if the PMDX-106 can control it
I have the PMDX-106's output connected exactly as the VSR's now disconnected pot would be connected, its actually plugged into the vsr on the same socket.
do you know that the VSR uses a voltage reference instead of a current reference?
No effect from the PMDX's pot, except the voltage going into the VSR
hmmm - can you post a link to the VSR manual?
no I don't
The pot removed from the vsr is 4.5K ohms
It has a switch on the back off it that is closed when turn 'off'
And I have a reed relay, switched by the run relay, that sjorts that connection when stopped.
Its the rest in case of overlaod switch I guess.
uh - is the manual available online?
sort of, its the last two pages of the Central machinery micro-mill, sold as the 47158 by harbor freight
I'll assume it isn't really meant to have external controls attached ...
no but there isn't any reason not to if one can dup all the switching in the fwd-off-rev switch, which i now have
that should be true :)
I think anyway, although not all the sequencing is exactly in order. it is now possible to have AC power applied while it is in the stopped/off mode
So Its running exactly as it would be if it was turned on, but the pot truned off.
I downloaded this manual and printed it myself, from HF's site, so its there if someone wants to see it.
I'm looking at the schematic now
I don't see P2 or P3 on it though
I have the PMDX-106 set to use the VSR's own voltage as the reference
ah - the two knobs are high/low range and fwd/rev/off
p2 and p3 are pins on a 4 pin mini plug with p1 being the CW end of the pot, p2 being the arm of the pot, and p3 being the CCW end of the pot
hi-low is a mechanical gear changer in the powwr head, not on the schematic
figure B on page 7 says there's a high-low speed knob, separate from the variable speed knob
yes, nothing to do with the electronics
and that mechanical drawing is as bogus as a$3 bill
oh - there are two switches on the diagram on page 15, labeled with a dotted line as "forward/off/reverse switch"
so is the schematic, unless they decided to short out the AC input
all that stuf it shows on the heads sled, is actually up in the box under the motor.
page15, the upper left switch is the ac power, is on in eithe position but off
and it looks like they're running AC directly to some extra terminals on the pot (the "shutoff" you mentioned I guess)
hello John...got your plasma hooked up ?
the upp right set of contacts are also on in eithe on position
ken_: is that lerman ?
no, it isn't
the switch on the back of the pot is on when the pot is off, and off when its turned up, its the fault reset.
he just said a plasma utter
I did hook up a short on the backside of the run relay, and lemme tell y6a what, that puppy is dead stopped well withon a rev when I turn it off.
you might not want to do that
hmmm - I can't concentrate on that schematic at the moment. there are several places where it looks like they added "jumper dots" where there shouldn't be (like where P1 and P4 connect)
Now if I could just make the speed control work.
you will get a load of current when you stop that fast, and it risks demagnetizing the motor
fenn__ is now known as fenn
oh, how much r should i use then?
see page 16 for a probably inaccurate schematic: http://www.harborfreight.com/manuals/47000-47999/47158.pdf
and there is nothing actually connected to p4 anyway, SWP
I saw that, but wasn't sure they should be shorted together on the schematic (with a couple of resistors that end up being in parallel)
I haven't traced the PCB itself. There was a black wire installed in the plug, anbd then clip[ped off flush atr the factory.
I would have been nice if they had called out p2 & p3 on that schematic. Jerks
I'd assume it shouldn't run at all if I unplug the pot? Or can you tell
I think be lucky that you have a schematic at all.... it is HF afterall
chuckle, yeah, I'm spoilt that way :-)
Nope, runs wide open with the pot unplugged.
I REALLY miss RS products no longer having schamtics in their manuals.
Yup, Ed Judge isn'y running that floor in FW anymore BUMMER
heh - and to think I only met the advertising people instead of the technical people there
err "marketing" that is
marketing, thats too many letters, ots only a 4 letter word
though there are 7-letter and other variants
I cut the short, so it coasts to a stop now
it was fun shooting commercials for them, but only slightly
gene_, look at the voltage at max speed and the max current rating of the motor, then pick a resistor that would give you around that current at the voltage for max speed
unless jmkasunich says there's a better way :)
Somewhere around 50 ohms then, at beaucoup wats
Its supposedly a 400 watt motor, but the fuse is only a 2 amp fast
1.8 amps at up to 110 DC volts.
no, sounds more 200-watt-ish
Heh, drawing is bass ackawards
P3 is max CCW, p1 is max CW
OTOH, I did have it hgoked up right, so thats not it.
I blew some swarf out of the keyboard, but I doubt if it will help my typing.
hmmm - have you tried measuring the actual voltage at the pot terminals? (without the PMDX-106 connected)
there's no guarantee that's a 0-10V input
I guess the next thing is to hook their pot back up, ahh, its about 8.9 volts, and the voltage at p2 goes up and down as expected, just no effect.
that's what you get with the pot? *not* the PMDX board
No, thats with the PMDX board's pot
it turns that voltage up and down nicely, just no effect
ok - I just figured it would be good to check that the VSR actually wants to see what the PMDX-106 puts out
Thats next, it will take a few to warm up the nirn and test it though
if the VSR goes to full speed at 0.5V, or some unspecified current, it's hard to control it with 0-10V
heh - gotta get to work. good luck
well that crappy job is done...
The VSR's own pot, hooked back up, doesn't work, damn!
Looks like I better get that 29 dollar one from surpluscenter, but it won't fit in this box, double damn
your cutter John ?
Or I'm still missing a jumper someplace.
no I rebuilt the toilet LOL
no nap then ?
Damn... The switch I gutted has dual (redundant) 24VDC power supplies.... except their switching, so I cna't get 48VDC out of them =(
oh yes a nice one
you get the live cd ok?
* JymmmEMC kicks SWPadnos in the shins!
didn't take long then
the toilet i mean :)
about 30 minutes
now to work
took more time to get out and put back all my tools
it's 5 o'clock somewhere
i did get to load emc2 from that live cd
now the fun begins
drinking a cold one now...here's to you
Hay, its after 5 here, and that means I'm one behind
gene your more than one behind
I didn't start that shitty job without one
anyhow the Z axis is alive and moving now too
z was last
cool....now get to work
nope early dinner and relax and watch beetlejuice, bosses orders
dinner and a movie
I love tim burton
that damn boss always wants to have fun
yep and I help
here's to you again
I keep her in homemade wine and she keeps me in clean underware
makes me want to brew some beer, it's almost nice enough outside to do that
Now that sounds like a good deal to me.
homemade ? a lot of work ?
the beer, wine or the underware
you can do it on the stove
Cuz I can't tqke the fabric softener, I've been doing my own laundry for about 15 years now.
with minimal equipment
to brew or ferment?
so quit yakkin and teach!
you have something fermeted already ?
brewing takes about 3 hours on a lazy saturday and depending on the style of beer it takes from 2 to 6 weeks for an ale to ferment
I do up to 20 gallon batches and have an 8 tap kegerator
that can hold 40 gallons of beer
so you can make some today,but will have to wait 2 or 6 weeks
much faster than wine
you gonna be thirsty by then
let me get you the link to my web site it tells you all
[21:40:47] <BigJohnT_> http://suburb.semo.net/jet1024/BeerHome.htm
more stuff there than you can read in a day on beer, wine, and even CNC
outta hewre guys, maybe better luck on my speed next time.
crap.... anyone need a matched set of dvd beer coasters.... dvd burner died
BigJohnT: maybe good for target practice?
cool, we love to shoot things here
and blow things up
we blew up a tree last weekend
can you launch them with a skeet launcher?
cool.... need to figure out how to make a potatoe type gun that shoots cd/dvd disks... skeet.. now your talking
If you need info on a simple igniter design....
JymmmEMC: you about?