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[00:56:30] <CIA-12> 03jmkasunich 07HEAD * 10emc2/docs/src/code/Style_Guide.lyx: fixed formatting
[01:19:35] <cradek> you scared ray away
[01:22:15] <jmkasunich> not me
[01:23:05] <jmkasunich> I'm not scary at all
[01:27:45] <CIA-12> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/bin/.cvsignore: new item
[01:29:19] <jmkasunich> I guess he's not _that_ detached from the net...
[01:42:21] <CIA-12> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/src/emc/usr_intf/axis/Submakefile: define DEFAULT_NMLFILE so that in many cases you can use the emc module without setting emc.nmlfile
[01:57:16] <jepler> no, I'm in a cushy B&B with decent 'net access
[01:57:34] <CIA-12> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/src/emc/iotask/Submakefile: replace echo'd commands with descriptive messages
[01:57:34] <CIA-12> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/src/hal/user_comps/vcp/Submakefile: replace echo'd commands with descriptive messages
[01:57:34] <CIA-12> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/src/module_helper/Submakefile: replace echo'd commands with descriptive messages
[01:57:34] <CIA-12> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/src/emc/rs274ngc/Submakefile: replace echo'd commands with descriptive messages
[01:57:35] <CIA-12> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/src/libnml/Submakefile: replace echo'd commands with descriptive messages
[01:57:37] <CIA-12> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/src/emc/task/Submakefile: replace echo'd commands with descriptive messages
[01:57:40] <CIA-12> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/src/hal/user_comps/devices/Submakefile: replace echo'd commands with descriptive messages
[01:57:42] <CIA-12> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/src/emc/nml_intf/Submakefile: replace echo'd commands with descriptive messages
[01:57:45] <CIA-12> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/src/emc/usr_intf/axis/Submakefile: replace echo'd commands with descriptive messages
[01:57:48] <CIA-12> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/src/hal/Submakefile: replace echo'd commands with descriptive messages
[01:57:50] <CIA-12> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/src/hal/classicladder/Submakefile: replace echo'd commands with descriptive messages
[01:57:52] <CIA-12> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/src/hal/utils/Submakefile: replace echo'd commands with descriptive messages
[01:58:19] <CIA-12> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/src/libnml/inifile/Submakefile: replace echo'd commands with descriptive messages
[01:58:19] <CIA-12> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/src/emc/usr_intf/Submakefile: replace echo'd commands with descriptive messages
[02:07:07] <CIA-12> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/docs/src/code/Style_Guide.lyx: markup fixes; remove reference to 'make indent' since it no longer exists
[02:28:03] <Jymmm> * Jymmm new drivers
http://www.mpja.com/productview.asp?product=8413+KT
[02:29:30] <Jymmm> Look Ma, no computer!
http://www.mpja.com/productview.asp?product=8409+KT
[02:30:01] <Jymmm> Now that might actually be useful
[02:50:38] <Jymmm> MY new air compressor -->
http://www.mpja.com/productview.asp?product=15958+MI
[04:46:29] <Jymmm> cradek up late?
[04:53:56] <lilo> [Global Notice] Hi all. We've lost contact with one of our main rotation servers....affected users, about 3000. We're removing it from rotation. Apologies for the inconvenience, and any additional information will be sent to wallops ("/quote mode yournick +w").
[04:54:20] <lilo> [Global Notice] Have a good morning. Thanks for your patience, and thank you for using freenode!
[05:12:30] <A-L-P-H-A> man... is bush a fuck'n idiot. How do you elect morons into office? Why not people with real leadership and people skills?
[05:18:13] <A-L-P-H-A> neat.
http://blog.scifi.com/tech/archives/2006/08/17/microwave_drill.html
[06:33:29] <alex_joni> morning
[06:33:43] <Jymmm> howdy alex
[06:33:43] <alex_joni> Jymmm: Netsplit calvino.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: A-L-P-H-A,
[06:33:44] <alex_joni> cradek, Jymmm
[06:34:07] <Jymmm> We've lost contact with one of our main rotation servers....affected users, about 3000.
[06:34:23] <alex_joni> right, but you came back a bit faster than cradek
[06:34:35] <alex_joni> so I bet it's only an autojoin.. he's not around this late
[06:34:45] <Jymmm> ah
[06:47:49] <alex_joni> hmm.. I spotted a ncie flash
[06:47:55] <alex_joni> http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=WishList.jsp&A=details&Q=&sku=352109&is=REG
[06:48:09] <alex_joni> Jymmm: what do you think of it? I know you have some flashing experience :D
[06:55:17] <Jymmm> As they say, it's an economy speedlight
[06:55:32] <Jymmm> lil slow on the recycle times
[06:55:35] <alex_joni> should be enough for me..
[06:56:12] <alex_joni> I probably can't justify a 600$+ speedlight
[06:56:28] <Jymmm> maybe try ebay instead
[06:58:01] <Jymmm> and mine was $350 for the SB800
[06:58:54] <Jymmm> Eh, not as slow as I though
[06:58:57] <Jymmm> t
[06:59:45] <alex_joni> I think it's pretty good for 150$
[06:59:49] <alex_joni> TTL2 and all
[07:00:09] <alex_joni> 4 seconds recycle (with fresh batteries)
[07:00:47] <alex_joni> I like this: "Flash can be tilted 90° upwards and 7° downward for close-ups. Also can be swiveled 180° to the left and 90° to the right"
[07:01:07] <Jymmm> Mine does that
[07:01:22] <Jymmm> plus remote control too...
http://www.kenrockwell.com/nikon/ittlslave.htm
[07:01:54] <Jymmm> oh, much chepaer now... $200
[07:02:28] <Jymmm> oh, that's the sb600, but still; I'd liek to get two of those as well.
[07:05:31] <alex_joni> * alex_joni gets to work :(
[07:11:10] <anonimasu> * anonimasu too
[08:15:37] <Lerneaen_Hydra> 'lo
[08:47:32] <Bo^Dick> if i need a 0.33µF cap could i just connect three 1µF in series?
[09:02:06] <Lerneaen_Hydra> paralell
[09:02:13] <Lerneaen_Hydra> or
[09:02:15] <Lerneaen_Hydra> wait
[09:02:17] <Lerneaen_Hydra> or
[09:02:18] <Lerneaen_Hydra> oh
[09:02:31] <Lerneaen_Hydra> I'm not sure
[09:02:44] <Lerneaen_Hydra> had it been the other way around it would have been paralell
[09:12:12] <alex_joni> paralel they sum up
[09:12:34] <alex_joni> you want series
[09:12:52] <alex_joni> it's just the reverse from resistors (series sum up, paralel = divide)
[09:28:52] <alex_joni> bbl..
[11:03:36] <Bo^Dick> when working with cadsoft eagle it's possibly to check consistency between the schematic and board layout. let's say that i want to add another component in the schematic and does so, how do i update the board so the new parts will appear in the board?
[11:16:35] <Lerneaen_Hydra_> Lerneaen_Hydra_ is now known as Lerneaen_Hydra
[12:25:29] <jepler> Bo^Dick: with both the board and schematic loaded, "erc" will check consistency and report on any problems. if you always work with both files loaded, it should prevent you doing anything that breaks consistency
[12:33:20] <alex_joni> hi jeff
[12:47:38] <Lerneaen_Hydra> 'lo alex_joni, jepler
[12:47:49] <Lerneaen_Hydra> oh harty too
[12:50:12] <ValarQ> hello Joni, Epler and Hydra
[12:51:00] <Lerneaen_Hydra> http://www.hackaday.com/entry/1234000880073478/ <-- doing the same thing with EMC should be a trivial matter, take a 1-3 channel midi (1 channel per axis), and apply a transform from tones to a certain feedrate
[12:51:10] <Lerneaen_Hydra> it would only work for steppers though
[12:51:18] <Lerneaen_Hydra> ValarQ: 'lo there
[12:51:41] <SWPadnos> I hate LabView
[13:02:19] <alex_joni> * alex_joni goes away
[13:02:27] <alex_joni> sunny day :)
[13:02:30] <alex_joni> later guys
[13:08:12] <Lerneaen_Hydra> bye
[13:37:13] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> 'lo again
[13:37:23] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> cradek: I'm connecting the encoder now ;)
[13:39:02] <harty> Lerneaen_Hydra2: make sure you set the encoder resolution right makes it work better:-)
[13:45:23] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> I can imagine ;)
[13:51:50] <mocki> hello
[14:45:40] <mocki> alex_joni: are you there?
[14:56:49] <mocki> does emc2 use LXRT ?
[14:57:04] <cradek> no
[14:58:04] <mocki> cradek: ic, thanks
[14:59:10] <mocki> so the meopryallocation is done by the emc realtime kernelmodules
[15:00:41] <cradek> yes
[15:00:55] <Lerneaen_Hydra> ooh, cradek's here
[15:00:59] <Lerneaen_Hydra> * Lerneaen_Hydra pokes cradej
[15:01:01] <Lerneaen_Hydra> err
[15:01:02] <cradek> uh-oh
[15:01:03] <mocki> hmmm
[15:01:06] <Lerneaen_Hydra> * Lerneaen_Hydra pokes cradek
[15:09:58] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> looks like I scared him away
[15:10:39] <cradek> eh?
[15:11:54] <Didier> hello everybody
[15:11:58] <cradek> hi
[15:12:20] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> hi there
[15:13:06] <Didier> somebody could explain me how to create my user interface ?
[15:13:58] <Didier> jepler may be ?
[15:14:12] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> how do you mean?
[15:15:46] <Didier> i want to have something like axis but for a touch screen
[15:16:06] <cradek> axis works nicely on a touch screen, I've seen it
[15:16:14] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> oh, just axis or with virtual jogwheels and buttons and so on?
[15:16:34] <Didier> with big buttons...
[15:17:03] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> cradek: do you know how to interface touch-screen to *nix? does it appear as a standard pointing device, so you don't need special apps?
[15:17:23] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> except fot the drivers of course
[15:17:27] <cradek> Lerneaen_Hydra2: I've only seen one setup (it was SWP's) and it appeared that the touchscreen just worked like a mouse
[15:17:58] <cradek> tapping or dragging on the screen worked like the left mouse button
[15:18:09] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> nice!
[15:18:28] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> I wonder how hard it is to set it up initially
[15:18:46] <cradek> probably depends on the particular hardware.
[15:18:54] <Didier> it's not possible to develop something special ?
[15:19:20] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> Didier: I heard jepler talk about something like that
[15:19:23] <cradek> touch pads on laptops typically talk PS/2 mouse protocol, it seems very sane to do the same thing for a touch screen
[15:19:33] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> with virtual hardware like buttons, jogwheels, lights, and so on
[15:19:46] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> cradek: I see, maybe something worth looking into
[15:20:18] <cradek> I'm not really interested - I run axis almost completely with the keyboard only
[15:20:38] <cradek> if I wanted a non-keyboard interface I would use real buttons and halui before I tried a touchscreen
[15:21:03] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> oh, I was thinking touchscreen as mouse replacement rather than hardware replacement
[15:21:24] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> hmm, you use keyboard when machining?
[15:21:48] <cradek> yes almost completely just the keyboard
[15:21:50] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> I found it rather impractical to look at the cutting area and reach behind and press certain keys
[15:22:11] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> to do stuff, like jogging, or changing the feedrate
[15:22:31] <cradek> I think a jogwheel is nice but the next best thing is definitely the keyboard
[15:22:41] <cradek> jogging with the mouse (or a touchscreen) would be terrible.
[15:23:03] <cradek> you can run a keyboard by feel, but not a mouse or touchscreen - you have to look at them.
[15:23:22] <cradek> also with the keyboard you can jog several axes together.
[15:23:48] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> yeah
[15:24:07] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> feed override with mouse is better than keyboard though, IMO
[15:24:36] <cradek> I use the number keys to change FO while running
[15:24:43] <Didier> sorry, i have open an hot question....
[15:24:54] <cradek> I guess I hardly ever use the mouse
[15:25:11] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> oh? ok, I used the mouse with the standard feed slider
[15:25:25] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> I found the latency with the keyboard too much, something like 1s or so
[15:25:36] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> hmm, maybe more like 500mS
[15:27:09] <cradek> there was a bug that made the keypresses sometimes be ignored, maybe your axisi is old
[15:29:00] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> hmm, maybe, I was running a mid-may cvs release for some time
[15:29:03] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> might have been that
[15:29:20] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> I haven't tried with keyboard recently
[15:29:43] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> ignored keypreses I recognise though
[15:29:55] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> I had to press 0 many times to get 100% feed
[15:30:00] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> and f3 f5 and so on
[15:30:19] <cradek> yeah that stuff is fixed
[15:32:16] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> nice
[15:52:47] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> cradek: I'm soon done with the hardware, are you going to be here for a while?
[15:53:06] <cradek> yes off and on
[15:53:31] <cradek> you are using cvs checkouts right?
[15:53:46] <Lerneaen_Hydra> yep
[15:53:57] <cradek> updated recently?
[15:54:05] <Lerneaen_Hydra> a week or two
[15:54:13] <Lerneaen_Hydra> I can update today if needed
[15:54:17] <cradek> maybe you should
[15:54:19] <Lerneaen_Hydra> I have my script that does it
[15:54:24] <cradek> axis is now in the emc2 cvs
[15:54:35] <Lerneaen_Hydra> oh, yeah I heard that
[15:54:38] <Lerneaen_Hydra> nice :)
[16:01:00] <cradek> hahahahaha "Practical Encyclopedia of Good Decorating and Home Improvement (1970)"
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mikelove/216401704/in/set-72157594238584883/
[16:01:57] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> err, bbl, dinner
[16:02:38] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> 30 minutes or so and I'll be done with the encoder
[16:03:06] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> ... nice room...
[16:03:15] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> worst wallpaper I've seen
[16:03:38] <cradek> http://www.flickr.com/photos/mikelove/216401992/in/set-72157594238584883/
[16:05:26] <cradek> very funny photoset.
[16:21:25] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> :|
[16:21:28] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> strange items
[16:22:21] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> heh, machining the plastic owl shouldn't be all too hard with an xyza mill :D
[16:22:35] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> as long as you have a 3d model and CADCAM
[16:33:19] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> meep
[16:33:28] <A-L-P-H-A> denied. :)
[16:33:36] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> huh?
[16:35:37] <A-L-P-H-A> lh, no worries. :)
[16:38:01] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> * Lerneaen_Hydra2 is even more confused...
[16:38:23] <A-L-P-H-A> * A-L-P-H-A gives Lerneaen_Hydra a cookie
[16:41:06] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> ooh!
[16:41:09] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> a cookie!
[16:41:38] <Lerneaen_Hydra2> * Lerneaen_Hydra2 eats the cookie with great speed
[17:15:18] <alex_joni> hi all
[17:17:54] <Lerneaen_Hydra> hi there
[17:18:28] <Lerneaen_Hydra> oh, btw, do you know how much current the parport sinks when used as input?
[17:19:06] <alex_joni> very little
[17:19:48] <Lerneaen_Hydra> any idea of how much?
[17:19:54] <Lerneaen_Hydra> semi-exactly?
[17:20:00] <Lerneaen_Hydra> is it in the µA range?
[17:21:43] <ValarQ> a quick googlesearch gave this
http://www.elec.canterbury.ac.nz/PublicArea/Staff/hof/p50-win/p10-parport/p010-circuit.html
[17:22:35] <ValarQ> another page says: "The Data Out pins were orginally driven by a 74LS374 octal latch, which could source 2.6 mA and sink 24 mA."
[17:23:04] <Lerneaen_Hydra> uh, this is data in right now I'm doing
[17:23:18] <Lerneaen_Hydra> oh
[17:23:44] <Lerneaen_Hydra> by data out do they mean the pins that were reversible?
[17:24:21] <ValarQ> i guess so, but on the otherhand i don't think the "original" parport did input :/
[17:24:30] <ValarQ> hmm
[17:24:48] <Lerneaen_Hydra> oh, that's right, they were all output right?
[17:24:56] <alex_joni> a few mA
[17:25:27] <Lerneaen_Hydra> hmm, that much eh
[17:25:38] <Lerneaen_Hydra> I was hoping they didn't take that much
[17:25:44] <Lerneaen_Hydra> this complicates matters
[17:26:20] <alex_joni> well.. it depends what you connect to it
[17:26:27] <alex_joni> basicly it's up to a few mA
[17:26:41] <alex_joni> if you have something that is easily brought to 0, then it will sink less
[17:27:13] <alex_joni> er... I'm thinking output again :/
[17:27:17] <Lerneaen_Hydra> as it is now I have an input from my lathe to the PC, and I have an optocoupler at the end, and would very much rather not have to amplify or have a pullup resistor after the optocoupler
[17:27:28] <alex_joni> optocoupler should be fine
[17:27:39] <Lerneaen_Hydra> So I'm hoping that the optocoupler can give enough power
[17:28:14] <Lerneaen_Hydra> I also hope that it falls fast enough without a pullup
[17:28:19] <mocki> hello
[17:28:24] <mocki> hi alex
[17:28:31] <Lerneaen_Hydra> hi
[17:28:32] <alex_joni> hey
[17:29:11] <alex_joni> mocki: I saw trouble with the usrcram_fs unpacking in ramdisk then beeing overwritten by the RT stuff
[17:29:23] <alex_joni> and I also saw that puppy has an option to leave it compressed
[17:29:30] <alex_joni> and uncompress it on the fly
[17:29:31] <mocki> alex_joni: yes, i validated this and came to the same conclusion
[17:29:43] <alex_joni> how about you try that?
[17:29:56] <alex_joni> I suspect the unpacking to the ramdisk causes the problems
[17:30:00] <mocki> alex_joni: that could save enough memory to not let the memorychaos happen
[17:30:07] <alex_joni> right..
[17:30:19] <mocki> alex_joni: but the problem as i see it. lays in rtai or emc
[17:30:24] <alex_joni> rtai
[17:30:30] <alex_joni> emc has little to do with that
[17:30:43] <mocki> alex_joni: for, it should not be possible to simply overwrite another processes memoryspace.
[17:30:47] <alex_joni> emc requests shared memory from rtai, and rtai allocs it
[17:30:50] <mocki> things like that i know from dos :)
[17:31:02] <mocki> #ok, so the shared memory allocation is buggy
[17:31:07] <alex_joni> mocki: we discovered a big problem with kernel and memory over 1GB
[17:31:26] <alex_joni> that was because of the way the kernel handles memory over 1 GB
[17:31:35] <mocki> yes, highmem
[17:31:48] <alex_joni> I have no idea how the kernel handles a ramdisk, but I suspect rtai has no clue about that
[17:31:59] <alex_joni> which causes all the trouble
[17:32:02] <mocki> yes
[17:32:40] <alex_joni> mocki: try making a disk which doesn't uncompress the usercram_fs, even if there's enough room (as puppy says)
[17:32:44] <mocki> well. if the compression thingy works it could work. but its a workaround. and if someone writes coolcnc to harddisk, ads some programs and does a remaster to cd. he would have the same problem again
[17:33:14] <alex_joni> mocki: if someone takes any distribution, and makes a ramdisk I suspect he'll have the same problems
[17:33:24] <mocki> alex_joni: shure
[17:33:59] <alex_joni> so.. what can I say.. if someone wants to make a new cd, they need to know a little bit
[17:34:04] <Lerneaen_Hydra> alex_joni: RTAI doesn't like over 1gb?
[17:34:11] <mocki> alex_joni: well, thanks for the hint. ill try that next. today i tryd to remove all the things not really necessary... got a 30mb iso. but it still crashed after afew restarts of emc and loading of gcode...
[17:34:36] <alex_joni> Lerneaen_Hydra: the default RT ubuntu kernels have memory over 1GB disabled
[17:34:48] <alex_joni> there's a bug in the rtai code to alloc memory unfortunately
[17:35:09] <alex_joni> mocki: if that fails, maybe we can look at the old iso and see why it's not failing
[17:35:16] <mocki> alex_joni: btw. what kernelversion/rtaiversion/adeos version do you run ?
[17:35:18] <alex_joni> mocki: maybe even backport the bugfixes to that
[17:35:31] <Lerneaen_Hydra> ugh
[17:35:37] <mocki> alex_joni: yes, that would be possible
[17:35:37] <alex_joni> mocki: 2.6.15-magma, rtai-magma (CVS a couple months ago)
[17:35:44] <mocki> hmmm
[17:35:47] <alex_joni> there is no adeos anymore
[17:35:51] <mocki> ok
[17:35:53] <alex_joni> it's called something else now
[17:35:58] <alex_joni> the patch at least
[17:36:03] <mocki> vulcan,adeos,magma :)
[17:36:11] <mocki> crazy
[17:36:24] <alex_joni> vesuvio..
[17:36:29] <mocki> the rtai sites documentation looks the same
[17:36:32] <alex_joni> and there are a lot more
[17:36:36] <mocki> a vesuvio, you are right :)
[17:36:55] <mocki> today i tried rtai3.3
[17:37:01] <mocki> had no luck :)
[17:37:16] <mocki> with an adeos patched kernel
[17:37:32] <alex_joni> that's what I have, but the CVS version
[17:37:49] <alex_joni> I remembered, it's called IPIPE
[17:38:20] <mocki> yeah, the ipipe thingy
[17:38:37] <alex_joni> there's also Comedi :)
[17:38:52] <mocki> i dont wanna know
[17:39:00] <alex_joni> and quite a few more rtai-related names.. crazy stuff :D
[17:39:27] <alex_joni> kinda like the new Intel processor names
[17:39:52] <Jymmm> Mornin Gents (yes, that includes you too SWPadnos)
[17:39:57] <mocki> btw. i hate rtai. its so badly documented. and wrong documented too. also you have to work yourself throu google for hours to find the right patches...well.
[17:39:59] <mocki> :)
[17:40:05] <mocki> i hate computers generally
[17:40:31] <alex_joni> mocki: :D
[17:41:08] <alex_joni> mocki: how come you changed your id?
[17:41:16] <alex_joni> I almost didn't recognize you :D
[17:41:21] <SWPadnos> Jymmm, screw that - it's still yesterday for me
[17:41:32] <mocki> alex_joni: tahts because im no cncuser anymore. i sold my cnc
[17:41:36] <SWPadnos> have I mentioned recently how much I hate LabView?
[17:41:42] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: yup
[17:41:52] <SWPadnos> good - it pays to do that frequently
[17:41:55] <mocki> alex_joni: no space to use it. software problems, and at least no money
[17:41:59] <alex_joni> logger_aj: bookmark
[17:41:59] <alex_joni> See
http://81.196.65.201/irc/irc.freenode.net:6667/emc/2006-08-18#T17-41-59
[17:42:02] <Jymmm> Computers suck, rtai sucks, internet sucks, irc sucks, emc sucks, emc2 sucks, cnc sucks, vacuums suck, hookers suck, everything sucks! =)
[17:42:12] <bill2or3> don't forget operating systems.
[17:42:24] <mocki> Jymmm: yeah
[17:42:25] <Jymmm> OS'es sucks too
[17:42:30] <Jymmm> mocki =)
[17:43:37] <mocki> maybe i cnc again. but with roland software on a small roland cnc a pal of mine got. you can mill things up to postercardsize with it :)
[17:43:38] <Jymmm> But have you ever gotten a milkshake and it's so thick that you can't suck it through a straw! I hate when that happens!
[17:44:01] <alex_joni> Jymmm: you need more practice :D
[17:44:08] <Jymmm> alex_joni lol
[17:44:12] <mocki> well. gotta go, my beer is getting hot :)
[17:44:21] <alex_joni> mocki: ok, let me know how it goes
[17:44:22] <Jymmm> mocki beer sucks too!
[17:44:23] <mocki> cu next time folks. nice evening
[17:44:31] <mocki> Jymmm: i agree
[17:44:40] <Jymmm> =)
[17:44:46] <mocki> alex_joni: yes i will. or hotair, whoever comes first :)
[17:45:02] <Jymmm> SWPadnos when will it be tomorrow for you?
[17:45:44] <alex_joni> irc.freenode.net:6667/emc/2005-05-30.txt:02:30:54 <SWPadnos> I hate LabView, and so do most real programmers.
[17:45:47] <alex_joni> irc.freenode.net:6667/emc/2006-06-07.txt:21:15:23 <SWPadnos> (have I mentioned recently that I hate LabView? ;) )
[17:45:50] <alex_joni> irc.freenode.net:6667/emc/2006-06-08.txt:14:47:25 <SWPadnos> hmmm - I think you may have said that more recently than I mentioned that I hate LabView
[17:45:53] <alex_joni> irc.freenode.net:6667/emc/2006-06-08.txt:14:47:42 <SWPadnos> thanks. I hate LabView
[17:45:56] <alex_joni> irc.freenode.net:6667/emc/2006-08-18.txt:12:51:41 <SWPadnos> I hate LabView
[17:45:59] <alex_joni> irc.freenode.net:6667/emc/2006-08-18.txt:17:41:36 <SWPadnos> have I mentioned recently how much I hate LabView?
[17:47:15] <Lerneaen_Hydra> I get the feeling SWPadnos doesn't like labview
[17:47:16] <SWPadnos> Jymmm, once I go to sleep and wake up
[17:47:19] <Lerneaen_Hydra> I'm not sure though
[17:47:25] <Lerneaen_Hydra> SWPadnos: care to elaborate?
[17:47:27] <Lerneaen_Hydra> :p
[17:47:42] <SWPadnos> only 6 times in the last 3 months - I'm slacking off
[17:47:50] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: kinda lame..
[17:47:53] <Jymmm> SWPadnos: Ah, then if today is yesterday, and tomorrow is when you wake up, then it'll be today for you.
[17:48:03] <alex_joni> but I only looked for hate.. no other levels of dislike
[17:48:04] <SWPadnos> yeah. I hate LabView!
[17:48:12] <SWPadnos> right - exactly
[17:49:56] <Jymmm> * Jymmm ponders why he can only remember half of ohms law, never the power related items
[17:50:13] <SWPadnos> strange, since the power part is PIE
[17:50:14] <alex_joni> Jymmm: what do you remember?
[17:50:18] <SWPadnos> (P=IE)
[17:50:32] <alex_joni> juve@proxy:/var/www/irc$ grep -r -e "SWPadnos" * | grep -i -e "labView" | grep -i -v -e "hate" | wc -l
[17:50:36] <alex_joni> 55
[17:50:42] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: that's NOT good
[17:50:58] <SWPadnos> excellent - I haven't been slacking as much as I thought :)
[17:51:13] <alex_joni> yeah.. but notice teh "-v" in there
[17:51:18] <Jymmm> alex_joni: I can never remember these: SQRT(P*R), I^2*R, E^2/P, SQRT(P/R)
[17:51:20] <SWPadnos> whassat mean?
[17:51:29] <alex_joni> these are times that you didn't hate LabView
[17:51:47] <SWPadnos> oh - hmmm. maybe I just didn't mention it on the same line
[17:51:51] <alex_joni> -v = invert results (match lines without the word)
[17:51:55] <SWPadnos> right
[17:52:02] <alex_joni> juve@proxy:/var/www/irc$ grep -r -e "SWPadnos" * | grep -i -e "labView" | grep -i -e "hate" | wc -l
[17:52:06] <alex_joni> 23
[17:52:23] <SWPadnos> so ~1:2 hate vs not specified
[17:52:34] <SWPadnos> I guess that's still a pretty solid negative
[17:52:52] <SWPadnos> for a reason why I hate LabView - look at this really cool hardware:
http://www.ni.com/compactrio/
[17:53:02] <alex_joni> mind if I don't?
[17:53:13] <SWPadnos> the chassis has a 3M gate FPGA in it (that's 6x the size of the Mesa board)
[17:53:21] <SWPadnos> go ahead and not
[17:53:34] <alex_joni> phew.. thanks.. lazy to move my mouse that far
[17:53:49] <alex_joni> I just got home from a pool :)
[17:53:55] <SWPadnos> the RT Controller on the left side has a ~1GHz processor, and 64M flash (or more - I forget)
[17:54:22] <SWPadnos> all I want it to do is filter some A/D readings, and calculate *one single stinking PID loop"
[17:54:34] <SWPadnos> with at least a 1 KHz rate
[17:54:51] <SWPadnos> and provide me the ability to see and tune the loop via ethernet (built in as well, of course)
[17:55:09] <alex_joni> "ou can implement multiloop analog PID control systems at loop rates exceeding 100 kS/s."
[17:55:15] <SWPadnos> and the stupid thing, with all that nice hardware, can't even manage a 200 Hz loop
[17:55:17] <alex_joni> you can..
[17:55:33] <alex_joni> that's a paste from that page :D
[17:55:40] <SWPadnos> yeah - sure, if there's only one A/D channel to read, and one D/A to write
[17:55:56] <SWPadnos> I know - it sounds fantastic, and I'm sure there are a lot of things that can be done with it
[17:55:58] <Jymmm> SWPadnos So is it a SW thing or HW thing?
[17:56:07] <alex_joni> Using the embedded RIO FPGA hardware, you can implement multiloop analog PID control systems at loop rates exceeding 100 kS/s. You also can implement digital control systems at loop rates up to 1 MS/s and evaluate multiple rungs of Boolean logic using single-cycle while loops at 40 MHz (25 ns). Due to the parallel nature of the RIO core, adding computation does not necessarily reduce the speed of the FPGA application. CompactRIO offers four and eight-slot
[17:56:11] <SWPadnos> the only problem is that the only interface to that nice hardware is LabView (hate)
[17:56:16] <alex_joni> Jymmm: the SW that runs on the HW
[17:56:26] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: do you hate Labview ?
[17:56:32] <SWPadnos> I do hate labview
[17:56:41] <alex_joni> oh.. SWPadnos hates labview
[17:56:53] <Jymmm> SWPadnos Then call them and bitch; SW can be changed.
[17:56:54] <SWPadnos> yep - he sure hates labview all right
[17:57:13] <alex_joni> Jymmm: it's software written by SWPadnos
[17:57:24] <alex_joni> but he can't write it better because there's no other medium for it
[17:57:33] <Jymmm> alex_joni SWPadnos didnt write LabView
[17:57:36] <SWPadnos> har har - this software is like many graphical programming systems - it does whatever they thougt of very easily and quickly, but making something else is a nightmare
[17:57:52] <alex_joni> Jymmm: call LabView ?
[17:58:01] <alex_joni> lol
[17:58:09] <Jymmm> alex_joni I thought you were too lazy to move your mouse that far
[17:58:12] <alex_joni> they will say if you don't like it.. use something else
[17:58:20] <alex_joni> Jymmm: he made it sound too good
[17:58:22] <SWPadnos> I'm not sure they'll care. and the amazing thing is that the software to develop for this thing is about $5500, as an upgrade
[17:59:06] <Jymmm> SWPadnos Ask for an eval copy
[17:59:16] <SWPadnos> I have a licensed copy, from my client
[17:59:21] <SWPadnos> it still sucks
[17:59:23] <alex_joni> those don't produce code usually
[17:59:38] <Jymmm> SWPadnos ah, that just bites.
[17:59:51] <SWPadnos> the amazing thing is that just the filtering and the interface to the I/O takes up about 1.5 million gates
[18:00:11] <SWPadnos> all it does is shift, add, and subtract (and do whatever they make it do behind the scenes)
[18:00:32] <SWPadnos> and it takes up 5x the total gate count ofa 5i20 FPGA
[18:00:47] <alex_joni> that's bogus
[18:01:02] <SWPadnos> I agree completely - that's one reason why I hate LabView ;)
[18:01:27] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: I start to see why you hate LabView
[18:01:58] <SWPadnos> it's too bad, because that hardware really looks great, and the physical packages are excellent