new emc2, emc2-dev, axis (1.2a2) packages in the breezy repository
cradek: I'll try them out later tonight
lerman_ is now known as lerman
SWPadnos is now known as SWP_Away
03jepler * 10emc2/tcl/bin/pickconfig.tcl: If a directory was in the list twice, it led to an error.
03jmkasunich * 10emc2/src/ (4 files in 2 dirs):
added rtapi_get_clocks() to RTAPI. It turns out that the RTAI function behind
rtapi_get_time() is dog slow. HAL was using rtapi_get_time() to measure how
long each block takes to execute, but the 'time measuring' function was actually
taking far longer than the thing it was supposed to measure. The times
displayed by HAL as .time and .tmax are now in clock cycles instead of
nanoseconds, but the speed improvement is worth it.
03jepler * 10emc2/scripts/emc.in: Make sure INIFILE is an absoulte path, because the following code assumes it. "that's probably easiest, but it hurts a bit" -- cradek
03cradek * 10emc2/scripts/emc.in: unintended consequence when run with no args
03jepler * 10emc2/tcl/bin/pickconfig.tcl: give the tree focus, so it's not necessary to tab before using up/down keys
03jepler * 10emc2/tcl/bin/pickconfig.tcl: make double click on the tree invoke the OK action
new emc2, emc2-dev, emc2-axis packages in the breezy repository (again)
alex_joni is now known as alex_joni_away
does any of you use 2.6.15... kernels ?
i dont quite get the adeos ipipe thingy. the newest patch i aplied didnt have a ADEOS option in it
... im intend to put together a new puppysit with 2.4.31 & 188.8.131.52
that patch i talk abpout, btw
anyone familiar with the way the adeos-rtai-emc work together ? does emc have to care about ipipe ?
i got http://download.gna.org/adeos/patches/attic/v2.6/i386/adeos-linux-2.6.13-i386-r13.patch
its alittle older. it has CONFIG_ADEOS. but has mucho rejects
I don't know; I wish I did.
jepler: im trying to get the rejects fixed with the above patch. lets see
hi btw ;)
jepler: could please again tell me what pythonlibs are needed ? :) i lost oit in some diskimage on some harddisk i dont remember where i put :)
i put it on the wiki. its a safe place i hope
cncuser: I had a program that mostly generated the required files .. let me see if I can find that
jepler: yes, you did that nifty tool. and also once told me some links to listings of files
you did with it
the lists I found on my website: http://emergent.unpy.net/files/sandbox/python-for-axis.files http://emergent.unpy.net/files/sandbox/python23.zip.txt
It looks like the script is there too: http://emergent.unpy.net/files/sandbox/freeze_axis.py
I haven't touched it since that day we talked about it a few months ago
jepler: yes, me neither :)
jepler: i just wanted to build some nice emccdrom and now im going to do a lfs or rocklinuxbased livecddistro with some puppy features.
jepler: is there a way to make axis detect if the gui is metric but the gcode doesnt have the required command in it and just assume it is there ?
or does this break some stuff ?
cncuser: It might be possible, but such a feature doesn't exist yet.
cncuser: I believe it's a bad gcode file that does not begin with a g20 or g21 code
jepler: ok. then, hmm. if axis is a nice gui, it should tell you about it and maybe give you the option to PREPEND it via the gui ?
axis shows theres something wrong in beautiful graphics :)
cncuser: I've committed a change that makes AXIS use the configuration option [EMC]RS274NGC_STARTUP_CODE the same way emc does. This is now in the latest snapshot, and will be in the eventual 1.2a3 release unless it creates a problem.
cncuser: this might help lazy users who don't want to write correct g-code
cncuser: right up 'till they send their file to somebody else
jepler: hmm, now i feel bad
jepler: how about a messagebox ? fullscreen, red on black background 42pt letters... ;)
FATAL SYTSEMERROR: YOU NEED TO ADD G20 OR G21 TO YOU G DATA
ALL YOU GCODE ARE BELONG TO US
I thought about that, but this is easier to do.
and there are probably a lot of things that a true "g-lint" program would check
"warning: your tool will probably break on line 333 when you g0 3 inches into the workpiece"
hehe, yes that would be great
id love to make axis know different tools and materials and you just say m-whatever plexiglas or aluminium. that + spindlespeed + power + machinespeed + power should all be calculatet so the user should not have to wporry about breaking tools :)
of course i talk about hobby machinery or minimal rapid prototyping setups, not industrialstyle
what i really miss is a godd camsoftware
i havent managed to get a eps with some curves into a usable gcode file
the beziers get broiken up into a few points and it all look like crap
i can conver6t it to svg... it looks nice in inkscape. but i have no clou on how to continue from here. cam.py doesnt produce usable output.
so i got ps/eps, svg
well, there is no gcode for bezier curves
so you have to break them up into lines
jepler: arent there circles with gcode ?
os it all points ?
there are arcs
but beziers are not arcs
ok, but arcs are round right
hmm, lets see if inkscape knows arcs
it knows it
so all there is with gcode is arcs and lines ?
so if i keep my vectordata on that objects it should easily be gcodeconvertable ?
G2 and G3 are the codes for arcs
but see http://emergent.unpy.net/index.cgi-files/sandbox/bez.c
nice if youre into math and or c ;)
this program takes a bezier defined by 4 points (two endpoints and two control points) and uses a subdivision algorithm to create a series of lines that are always within 'epsilon' of the true path of the bezier curve
perhaps you'd be happier if I re-wrote it in Python for you
jepler: hehe, thanks, not really
jepler: i think i need to rework some basics before this would be usefull.
cncuser: if you're talking about the same 'cam.py' I found in a web search, it looks like 'nverts' (set with commandline option -#) controls how many pieces a bezier is divided into. Maybe you can try giving a higher number and see if the curves improve.
jepler: i allready use -1000 but dont see any difference..
jepler: but i think its related to my datas
Hey How you doing?
not too shabby, otp w/ mfg
ok, off the phone
Called a MDF mfg asking about painting
no suggestions other than a denser core
rayh hows thing sin your neck of the woods?
Good. Lots of snow. Sunshine today so life is good.
No snow in these parts... ever!
I'll send some your way.
cool! Snow in 68 degreee weather!
alex_joni_away is now known as alex_joni
Many integrated H-bridges have a charge pump and "boot capacitor". I don't understand why a higher voltage than the drive voltage is required. Can anyone explain it to me simply?
I assume that it has something to do with making sure the upper transistors turn off completely, but isn't the drive voltage enough to ensure that?
alex_joni: Yeah, for running a bipolar stepper motor
jepler: depends on the transistur used
the more expensive way is to use p and N typed
P for low? and N for high, iirc (it might be the other way around, I tend to mix those)
but that's more expensive like I said
so usually only P-type is used (cheaper), but instead you need negative voltages to close it fully
I don't think the boot capacitor is related to that, more likely to starting a DC motor, which needs higher voltage
but I might be awfully worng :)
I can't accept that you're wrong. You clearly know more about this than me.
but I don't really ;)
I've read somewhere the Charge cap allows greater PWM speed
having higher voltage might reduce switchings, so that makes sense
* alex_joni goes to bed
wanna buy a 14 yr old boy
can he run a milling machine?
probably quite welll IF you can get him up and out in the morning
id trade for a 19 yr old girl but the wife seems to think thats NOT right
better trade her away..
i figure 1 - 38 yr old for 2 19's is a fair trade...
the math doesn't lie.
dmessier sounds fair to me
dmessier: The 14yo boy, does he come with his own cattle prod?
the wife hasnt let me use it... so i guess you can have it
dmessier: Deal... ship the kid in dry ice
that should cure his sleeping habbits for about a week.
he eats like a large MULE/ small elk.... be prepared
oats are cheap
if he's slept for a week you'll need a moderate size heafer for breakfast and 3-4 dozen eggs or the chickens they come from
he has 2 hallow legs
Nah, will put him on an all oat diet + suppliments
he doesnt mind oat meal but he IS a meat eater as his dad is..
For a treat well toss him some pig ears, snout, and chitlands!
kibbles n bits n bits n bits
what part is the chitlands???
fenn too expensive
pls say it is the nuts?
close... intestines of young pigs
why is he for sale anyway? I sense there's a story to be told
like in suasage makin's???
[23:16:52] <Jymmm> http://www.foodreference.com/html/fchitterlings.html
sale my ass... ill ship for free
dmessier: Just shut off the electricity in his room.
he's a mouthpiece whop wont pull his weight...
buy him "diet for a small planet"
thinks 24 - 7 internet access and the latest pc it his GOD given RIGHT....
dmessier I'm telling ya... kill the juice. and all that won't matter much.
ENAYTHING else is juts fackin Bshite
dmessier LOL setup a timer on the electricity... random too
he's in the basement now... and i haventreplaced the floros in 2 yrs... so he cant find my tool boxes
hell, take the door off his room and put up a curtain.
he has a lamp... his guitar... and pc.... and a clock...
no door... i biatch about the noise all the time...
but no juice, no pc, no internet, no chattiing, no email ,etc
no stereo, no tv
you coming over to play referee when i SHUT ER DOWN
call 911 at the top of the stairs....
14 yrs old 150 lbs and treined to fight by ME for the first 8 yrs.... i hate when i do that
he can hurt most ppl with 1 finger..
threatin to send him to military school
tried that already... he told me hed kill enm all and stilll escape
i believe him ; )
africa it is then
hmm - I actually thought about the bug you just fixed, but it was in the middle of something else and I forgot about it
now I just have to hope that rdtsc is implemented on all the compile farm slots
what bug I just fixed?
oh, it was jepler
duplicate dirs in configs-path
I think rdtsc exists on true pentiums, and anything newer from intel. It at least exists on K6es and newer from AMD. Not sure about oddballs.
wonder if I should make new packages now
I'd let the compile farm run thru its paces first
* jmkasunich goes to start it
sed: -e expression #1, char 0: no previous regular expression
Machine configuration directory is ''
Machine configuration file is ''
did you hit cancel or OK?
neither, this is before that
I see the problem
jepler's change has an unintended consequence when emc is run with no args
you want me to fix it
I'm already typing commit
interesting time behavior here... parport write is very consistent at about 5200 clocks, but a couple times a second it jumps to 12000 clocks or more
jmkasunich: does it sometimes do more than one outb?
it always does the same number
which is 2
one to the data port, one to the control port
HAL provides all the outputs, even if they aren't in use
emc1 would skip the outbs if those outputs had not changed
I can get flurries of the long ones when I move the mouse
one reason for things to get long during other activity is cache
if the only thing running is RT code, it remains in cache from one thread execution to the next
jepler: can you make doubleclick work while you're in there?
if lots of user space stuff is going on, cache gets overrwitten
that probably accounts for the small scale jitter
there is a hard floor at about 5100 clocks
then a distribution of runs that vary from 5100 to about 5300 (most under 5125)
then nothing between 5400 and 12000
12000 to 15000 happen maybe 1% of the time
when very active
jepler used [ file normalize ]
that isn't available on older tcl (pre 8.4)
dunno if thats a factor or not for emc
do you have any idea what tcl versions are on what bdis?
obviously it's ok for ubuntu
I'm trying to figure out what I have here
tclsh --version and similar doesn't work
% info tclversion
I'll check the farm
BDI-2.x has 8.0, BDI-TNG has 8.3, BDI-Live has 8.4
so it's fine right now?
-2.x and -TNG are on the chopping block IMHO
and it's looking worse and worse for them as work continues
quite a weekend
45 commits "yesterday" (CIA is on UTC I think)
122 so far this month
[04:23:03] <jmkasunich> http://cia.navi.cx/stats/project/emc
we've averaged a commit every 7.5 hours for almost a year and a half
new emc2, emc2-dev, emc2-axis packages in the breezy repository (again)
hope I got everything in there
compile farm is happy (two slots anyway), so my rtapi change didn't bust anything
its a shame we can't actually test on the far
I can't see any way to automate it tho
you could insert and remove a module, but that's a lousy test.
the only real test would be to start emc and run 3dchips or something
probably can't do that automated.
and even that only tests a fraction of the system - only one gui, only one config
as far as you can tell, the current HEAD will compile and run both in place and installed?
we need to make a tarball while it is pseudo-stable, before the next wild session like these last few days
and we need to communicate some changes, like --enable-run-in-place
maybe it's better to make tags
the timing bug is significant enough that I want to announce the fix
there's nowhere to put a tarball where people will look for it.
alex was/is hosting daily tarballs
but you're right, gotta point people to them
yeah, but I don't think anyone is using them unless cvs breaks
tags can be moved, right?
so we could have a tag TESTING, that always points to the latest reasonable stable thing
yes I think we could
and a wiki page that tells testers both how to get it and compile it, and what to expect
IMO that's what my debs are for
"foo is known not to work, but bar and baz should, if they don't please report it"
I make a new one when I think something important has changed, and everything's in a sane state
cradek: just fyi, make tgz is not working at the moment, we might want to add that back
HiAlex... latest debs are not working either
LawrenceG: yes they are, since last night
logo var is missing from pickconfig.tcl
and my config dirs are empty
/etc/emc2/sample-configs/stepper has NO files
if fixed logo var by adding >>set logo ""<< at line 36 of pickconfig.tcl
I seem to be missing emc2-wizard.gif as well which shoed up the logo error
Those files must not be in the debs.... I removed and installed emc2 several times even a fresh deb download
I was hoping to test the timing fixes on this old 200mhz unit
I can see the files in the deb, the config dirs get created, but the ini files are not being placed into the directories
To test, uninstall emc2 and rm -rf /etc/emc2, then reinstall deb
where did you get the debs from?
cradek: In case you didnt catch above.... latest emc2 debs contain but do not install any sample configs... /etc/emc2 has sample dirs, but no contents... a du /etc/emc2 shows only 52 blocks
from the .ro repository
dunno, not sure, probably not fully done yet
* alex_joni has a plane to catch in an hour
np.... I need to get to bed... 1am here
I had a version from a couple of days ago working
lots of changes this weekend... good show
* alex_joni goes away for a while
alex_joni is now known as alex_joni_away
LawrenceG: if you dpkg --purge emc2 and then apt-get install emc2, do you get config files?
ok I think I reproduced the problem, not sure if I understand it fully
if you apt-get remove emc2, it preserves the configuration files in /etc
if you remove them with rm, it also preserves that (?)
so ... don't do that
dpkg --purge emc2 and then reinstall should fix your problem
cradek: Thanks... that has restored the sample ini's. When running stepper-inch, /usr/bin/milltask errors out when trying to load librs274.so.. a search of my hd does not find this file anywhere
LawrenceG: I fixed that - updated packages available
cradek: Thanks... downloading now
LawrenceG: should be smooth from here on - alpha19 was the first package I made with the new build system.
cradek: np... hope I havent been a pest... the deb idea is fantastic....
not at all, I really appreciate your testing and good bug reports
you are helping make this smooth for when we make the big release
yea... the more people that can try out the new stuff, the faster its gets stable
running cds now in sepper_in YEA!!
it runs quite well on a P200.....
great, jmk made an important fix yesterday that should have made it run much faster (reduced BASE_PERIOD possible)
axis-sim seems to be another story... I get a blank axis window and 100% cpu usage forever...maybe some update is being scheduled faster than it can run... no errors on cmd line
can you run other opengl programs like glxgears?
buy faster computer
that could be the problem..... glxgears comes up, runs a few revs and stalls out... hmm this is an old matrox card
I'm surprised, but Mesa, the software GL renderer, might have trouble on such a slow machine
I get an update about every 20 seconds... xorg is the cpu hog
hmm, doesn't seem like it should be that slow.
its so slow I can see it rendering each face of each tooth!
let me check my xorg config and see what is turned on
you could try turning off DRI
hmmm I notice in the Module sectopn, that I am loading GLcore... that may be the matrox accellerator
as I understand it, that may be bad with RT?
no, that's fine I think
but try commenting out Load "dri"
if you have it
also if your screen depth is 24 or 32, change it to 16
ok its there... should I comment out the dri mode 0666 as well?
I don't think it matters
default depth is 16
strange.... tried a few more setting combinations... no real change... glxgears runs about 3 revs and thenslows to a crawl. The good news is that its not an EMC2 problem. Cheers... gotta run... doing tax stuff today... would rather be making chips :}
ok good luck with taxes
I may try another video card later
cradek: I've got both installed and rip versions of testing here. I like what I see of it. I've got a couple of questions about halconfig in relation to the "new world order."
rayh: did you make install, or use the deb?
I don't have ubuntu yet. This is 4.30 bdi
from a couple hours ago.
My vision for halconfig was that it would be able to start, without HAL or EMC running.
btw I am working on making the update friendlier - I hope to get it to show the changelog for the new version of the packages before you decide to update (like the system packages do)
does that still require a running hal and halcmd?
aside On the make install. Should there be a make uninstall?
I'm still fuzzy about how halconfig works
the problem with make uninstall is that it can't determine whether you have modified files (like configs). Typically packages do not have a make uninstall.
Details are not critical right now.
ok I'll let you ask the questions and I'll try to answer them
It's been a long time since I ran an MS system but there was a package remover.
make install is from a time before package management - if you use the deb packages, you can certainly remove them cleanly
If halconfig found am rt system it would offer to start an empty HAL
I see people using make install only on systems that don't have package management, or are so out of date there aren't packages
I guess I was thinking I'd like to remove the installed version.
you'll have to do that by hand then - /usr/local/etc/emc2, /usr/local/share/doc/emc2? a few files in /usr/local/bin, a few files in /usr/local/lib
we could write a make uninstall if we decide it's necessary
What halconfig did was start realtime or the most basic demo script.
ok so you want it to be able to do a realtime start
does it have to do anything else?
Once realtime is going, it drops into ordinary halconfig mode with tree and all.
so it needs to know two things: where is realtime, where is halcmd
But what I seem to be missing on the installed version is a way to get halconfig to start.
Isn't halconfig on $PATH when running installed?
The installed version is fairly easy to find these.
currently it knows neither of those things: the halcmd location comes from the environment
What isn't easy is to find and start halconfig.
jepler: only when a child of the emc script
jepler: oh I reread, you're right
I see two immediate choices.
rayh: if you want the user to invoke halconfig directly, it should go in the bin dir
rayh: currently it's off in some script directory
rip out the environmental testing and always start it from tkemc, mini, axis. etc.
That choice is easy.
we might rename it to emc-halconfig and put it in bin, for instance
we intend to have emc-configuration or something like that to run setupconfig
now, you do not need root privs to start realtime, so that is not a problem
I don't see any big stumbling blocks, just some playing with the installation is necessary
But if it's installed, I don't need the startup testing for things like MS and rtxx
I don't follow - what are MS/rtxx
Those are tests at the start of halconfig.
let me pull it up
I guess the real question I have is how does halconfig fit in with other scripts like setupconfig.
BTW I really like the new look of the chooser.
sounds like setupconfig and halconfig are very similar - we want the user to be able to run them without emc running
the tree widget is great.
so they will be in the path (and there will be menu entries on the system Apps menu to start them)
great, I like it too, very much
it's an elegant solution to multiple config directories
Okay. That works.
rayh: already with installed, if you copy a config into your home directory ~/emc2/configs/configname, it will show up on the chooser
rayh: setupconfig will do just that (and there is also a system-wide config directory)
your personal configs show up on top, then the systemwide configs, then the samples on the bottom
jmk was talking about user configurable things. will display color and font be a part of this like they are with other linux apps?
The color and font selections for Tk applications are customizable through the X resource database
but Tk is not "themeable" in the modern sense
Ah we we have never been very successful at keeping that location for TkEmc alive.
It does require work on the "option" database for each display.
tk is sometimes finicky when you markedly change font sizes for instance
but things like colors are easy to change
Yep. Font is better in 8.5 but ...
What I'm thinking of is a .myconfig file in the users home directory.
there is a standard X way of doing that involving a file in the home directory called .Xresources
it would then be handled without any special code in tkemc
have you had a lot of requests for this kind of customization?
Some. More like help it looks bad.
chew chew chew
maybe we need to work on the defaults a bit then
but "help it looks bad" doesn't help us much, does it
These come from several sources. One is KDE's config all apps alike.
yeah, but we won't have that kind of themability without a total rewrite of the guis.
to me, that doesn't seem like an important goal right now.
we would have to ditch tcl/tk and start over.
KDE does it now to tkemc. Mini is already close to their default colors and fonts.
KDE themes show up in tkemc?? There must be something at work I don't know about.
cradek: KDE writes some X resources
I know nothing about how it works but it does change bg, fg and some fonts.
ok, that much is easy
getting 3D buttons etc. is impossible
maybe getting rid of the blue, in favor of a more standard gray look, would help
I guess I was thinking less about hard coded stuff than an approach to user configuration.
TK has color choosers and font choosers and such.
like jepler said, that's already possible with X resources but it's hardly friendly.
you could definitely make a preferences screen and write the results to a file in the user's home directory to be read when tkemc starts
Okay. I'll salt that away for a later release.
but .. but .. the X resources database already exists!
the answer to "our GUIs look terrible" should not involve "let's write another GUI application to solve that problem"
I'm pretty sure I would duck out of any gui-improvement part of the project; I put that energy into AXIS. That's not to say I think it shouldn't/couldn't be done.
we should strategically add a few configuration options (like using a non-bold font by default, and some white backgrounds), after which Tk looks a lot more modern .. at least like a win95-era program.
yes, that might help a surprising amount.
All of that can be done in TkEmc.
I think sometimes "sensible defaults" are better than all the configurability in the world.
Then we would just need to replace snapshots of the old with the new.
In several hundred places.
including the splash screen
no problem. alex said the splash screen was a quick hack (but I think it's really good)
Would TkEmc be editable by a user in the installed emc2?
using sudo, it sure is
if a user customizes it and then installs a new deb, the deb install will give an option of keeping the customizations or using the new distributed file
alex_joni_away is now known as alex_joni
I thought you were away
* alex_joni couldn't stay away
I'm in the hotel right now, it's good that wireless works
the new config selector looks and works great
btw, you've got mail
it already did last night
cradek: got my email?
ok, eager to know what you think
I like 06
like.. like? or really like?
it looks nice
I like the globe thing
how about the logo?
it's cute but I think the pengiun should have a tool of some kind
or just safety glasses?
btw, I like 06 better too
rayh: care to look at a picture?
Sure send it on.
or send a link
link is better I think, let me put it someplace
[21:38:06] <cradek> http://timeguy.com/cradek-files/emc/linuxCNC_06.jpg
unfortnately it's huge because someone made a jpg when it should have been png
don't want to abuse the wireless here
cradek: you can convert :D
it's too late, it'll look terrible
I assume this is not the final content... the part about viruses is silly
that's taken from the current site
uh I assume this is not the final content... the part about viruses is silly
I just pointed him some URL to take sample data from
cradek: it will be a CMS, so you can fix what you don't like :P
I think putting safety goggles on the logo would be just enough of a twist to make it cute/funny
how about we collect some ideas, and I'll get back to the designer
and we'll see
but I don't care for it much
I particularly dislike the out-of-focus macintosh keyboard
I don't really like it either
I mean it's ok, but barely
I prefer 06 too
greetings from germany
nice so far, but it's dark ;)
Yes, at this time of night it probably is
you should come to the US .. it isn't dark yet, except in metaphor
Where are you in Germany, alex_joni
lol, I'm not scared of metaphor-typed dark
rayh: near freiburg (near switzerland and france)