hi alex. Hi Anna
happy new year
I just had a seafood dinner I prepared
cod and scallops
with lemon, paprica, butter, and orange peel
HI les_w :P
fresh lemon juice
and grated orange peel
Holiday is at an end tommorow
back to some good work
les_w: wait .. K4ts want show to you a plate we eat yesterday..
[00:19:34] <Jacky^> http://digilander.libero.it/jackydgl0/capodanno2006/img003.jpeg.html
we got about 20 different plates during the dinner.. :)
Jacky^: which one is you?
mmm looks very good
alex_joni_: what? the fish ? :D
no, I mean in which picture can we see you
there are 2-3 photos in the album
with the y?
alex_joni: hes the one in the red dress
[00:23:11] <skunkworks> http://digilander.libero.it/jackydgl0/capodanno2006/img011.jpeg.html
jacky and k4ts?
[00:23:38] <Jacky^> http://digilander.libero.it/jackydgl0/capodanno2006/img002.jpeg.html
here we are
les_w: if I know vel, acc and cycle time, how many cycles does it take to accelerate to vel?
jacky and anna , you both look good!
Jacky^: you are the small one on the right, doing the kung-fu impression?
cradek: let me think a sec
vel+=d(vel) (or accel) right?
les_w: pretty good
d(vel)/d(t) , or cycle_time
yeah just start taking multiple difference equations as an approximation of differentials
so you need to calc. d(vel) or accel in a cycle, and see how many times that is needed to get added before cur_vel makes it to desired_vel
alex_joni_: I think it should be a simple division
num_cycles = (desired_vel - current_vel) / accell
not sure how simple it is :D
you need cycle time in there somewhere
Well, there are typically multiple regimes in a trajectory cycle
accelll holds it
vel / accel / cycle time
that makes the units work out so it must be right?
servo or trajectory?
traj in TP
servo is only afterwards on PID & such
I meant "starting at 0" but forgot to say it
hes anna's son, Emanuele
damn wifi .. lag :(
well, there are many schemes. In general a new set of polynomial coefficients is generated at each waypoint. A set for each axis.
IRON MONKEY... [Chinese goes here] [5 second delay goes here] [english translation goes here]
les_w:think simple, don't complicate it too much
ha hard for me I guess.
Finally, I done to fight with kde on my laptop !
cradek: I feel funny about the / cycle_time
alex_joni_: me too, that's why I'm asking
got Ion3, save alot of space in a 800x600 monitor : http://digilander.libero.it/jackydgl0/schermata1.png
let's get an example
desired speed = 10
accel = 100
cycle_time = 0.02
accel = units / s^2
so we need to convert that to units / cycle_time ^2
I just think simply this: a time parameterized path of ANY form can be represented by a set of polynomial coefficients.
so we know how much we can accel inside a single cycle_time
some sets will blend with prior or later ones with continuity in time , velocity, accel, jerk, etc.
les_w: think exact-stop trapezoidal
well, trapezoidal in velocity is quadratic in position
les_w: you're thinking of the answer to a question different from the one I asked
often called parabolic blending
if you are at zero speed, and you're starting motion
you have desired velocity, and max_accel
I want a trapezoidal profile of velocity
how much time will it take to reach that?
how many cycles
time, we convert to cycles afterwards :D
Well, blending in the sense that a parabola describes position vs time as it comes to a stop
maybe round up
LES stop blending
ok, in time, it's surely vel/acc
ha ok. I see exact stop as just a special case.
the answer is vel/acc seconds
now you need to convert that to cycles
so it's ceil( (vel/acc) / cycle_time)
I'd say so
I simply think of time....derived from cannonical distance and feed
The equations on my page cover exact stop or blended
[00:38:44] <Jymmm> http://lumbrgrip.com/
just a sec
Jymmm: was that a joke?
alex_joni no, it's a real product.
gravity hook for any lumber
[00:41:03] <les_w> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl/emcinfo.pl?Trapezoidal_Velocity_Profile_Trajectory_Planner
link to my page there
thanks to alex
oh fuck me... product $10, shipping $16.
me? what did I do :D
les_w was wondering what cha was laffin at?
anna laughibg too
les_w Ah, I thought it was the hooks
Jymmm: you got good affair!
K4ts until I get caught =)
Still using proto keyboard. I have a crate of them. the design is flawed. Lasts about 2 weeks before the keys stick.
K4ts I had an uneventful New Years eve, it was nice.
Changing the plastic composition...
les_w but you said you were on the last one two months ago
Jymmm: he's on the refurbished ones now
alex_joni ah, heh
naw still have a couple
couple hundred or couple thousand
no improvement though
vI think the ABS is too highly filled withg talc
keys quickly jam
too much gap in the key to keyboard linear bearing
but tooling is already made
so trying to fix it with special snake snot added to th abs
rather than new molds
just trying to solve this issue for a friend
I don't make keyboards, but he does.
I make suggestions, he sends crates of keyboards.
my keyboard is 20 years old and like new
les_w: my dog dead the 24 december sigh
get another one
is $75 for servo amp brand new good?
Jymmm: what kind of amp?
alex_joni SER-VO =)
cradek, We used to make very high quality saturable reactor keyboards
but sold the division
what kind? DC or AC? what kind of power, how do you control it (analog voltage or bus?), does it use a tach or encoder?
brush type, 21 to 180 VDC, 24A peak, 12A cont
yes Fenn. Magnet on key saturates a simple single turn transformer
what brand jymmm?
Cleveland Motion Controls
Anna will you get another dog?
les_w: I don't know how these IBM keyboards work - there is a non-conductive "paddle" that "touches" two pcb pads
must be some kind of capacitive effect
i thought it was conductive
the cheap ones are membrane
no mechanical contacts to wear out
les_w: no, I'm talking about 20 year old buckling spring technology
Jymmm: CMC is also Burny, maker of servos for many plasma/oxy-fuel rigs. quite well thought of, but rather old tech usually
I made an awful lot of membrane switches in the past
no membranes, no rubber parts, no contacts to oxidize
hate em...but made em.
that stuff is shit
yeah we just used a stamped matrix of simple 1 turn transformers
les MDC50 --> http://motionscienceinc.com/downloads/servo_amplifiers/ds_mdc_mdcx.pdf
a cheap magnet could easily saturate them with no contact
robin_sz I have nfc.
did it consume a lot of power?
crummy transformers are easy to make. In this case it was a feature!
no very little
but they have the PS and stuff built in to them.
just from the connector.
that was enough.
but these were expensive
ok to make this harder now, we know how long it takes to do the accel, but how far does it travel?
cost on most pc keyboards used now is a buck or two.
Saw some (maybe) 100mm NSK rail and slide about 24" long for $50 (too pricey)
seems like you have to integrate or something
Jymmm: yes I know ;)
les_w no comment?
fenn: still around?
I'm having problems understanding this translation from the continuous functions in the math world to these discrete time slice cycles
Jymmm: those amps put out a lot of power
les_w are these as useful as geckos?
need distance travelled with time for constant accel?
yes, that's one thing I want to know
I dont think I have ever even seen 100mm rail ... thats HUGE
fenn I know nothign of servo, except eventually will go to them, so...
but that could be years from now
1/2 At^2 basically
uhm.. windows sharing system fault :/
so a weight dropping at one g (9.81 m/s) goes 9.81/2 distance in one second
are servo amps "universal", or is there something I should be aware of?
ajoni is now known as alex_joni_
oops 9.81 m/s^2
so you're integrating a*t dt
Jymmm: not at all universal
because our acceleration gives v = at
fenn: I wanted to ask you about a feature request you added to SF
well consider inegrating a constant
uhm.. lemme look
alex_joni I foudn these for $75 http://motionscienceinc.com/downloads/servo_amplifiers/ds_mdc_mdcx.pdf
* alex_joni_ looks
integrate a constant twice
so again I have vel and acc
hence 1/2 at^2
Jymmm: they seem pretty nice
but you need motors with tach feedback
I want to accel from 0 at acc in/sec2 up to vel in/sec
how many inches do I traverse?
alex_joni dont all servo motors need that?
Jymmm: some take the feedback from the encoder
or maybe resolver
some only use encoders
solve the system
but tach for speed feedback is not bad (it's the older way..)
at constant accel, velocity is accel*time
ive seen that drive on some of the larger Burny controllers, its OK, but nothing amazing ...
Jymmm: just need to make sure you get motors that are compatible
they sell matching motors too
and dont most today go brushLESS if they can?
and position is 1/2 accel* time ^2
Jymmm: whole different controller for brushless afaik
brushless is AC
so, that is an initial final value problem.
thats a DC controller
alex_joni: Right, but most today go brushLESS, correct?
where initial and final value are both 0.
Jymmm: different pricerange too
the Baldor range are good for small brushless
would these be good to hide in the closet for a year or so?
cradek shouldn't you be doing it the other way around? start with inches and find out how many seconds you need for a given accel, what max velocity is etc
robin_sz: there is brushless DC too, pricier than AC
the motors at least
or just wait and see what's available in a year?
alex_joni: brushless DC? how can that work?
robin_sz: it's not really dc, it's a trapezoidal waveform motor
robin_sz: it makes the control electronics simpler
fenn: commutation within the motor?
exact stop is just a special case of the equations on my page where both initial and final velocities are zero
robin_sz: no, it's an alternating current trapezoidal waveform
oh, so just AC by another name
alex_joni: here, have this.
ok, after dinner I'll read your web page a few times until I understand everything
alex_joni_: its what I call a "working internet connection"
ok chris. It' is pretty much right out of a very old college text of mine.
robin_sz: if it works in the mountains I'll get it
1842 AD ?
les_w: I hope I'm just rusty, not dumb :-/
robin_sz: not just AC by another name, it's not 3-phase, it's 1-phase
I am not a typical engineer chris. I just do math. Everything, even hammering a nail, I think of in math terms
so .. different
if you want small servos, check out the small Baldor stuff, the drives are cheap enough and they work very nicely with their motors .. we have several in production now
alex_joni: 1 pahse, OK, so how do you make it go backwards?
you output it dephased backwards
robin_sz : No, I was just wondering if I should buy these now and store them, or just wait and see whats available later on.
robin_sz no motors are in the equation atm.
Jymmm: better wait
well, id guess "probably not" then
and get drives that suit the motors you choose/find
* robin_sz nods
or just use geckos
alex_joni yeah, just didnt know is all.
robin_sz $75/ea not too shabby.
good price ...
but not the right thing
good night anna
Hmmmm but and sell on ebay maybe?
Jymmm: check ebay first for prices
doing that now =)
You know, I don't think of eact stop much in cnc motion. It is not practical in cutting, brcause chip load goes to zero. Burned work and dull tools rapidly.
alex_joni: look sliek a 3 phase motor to me ...
yup, but a bit different I guess :)
mmm ... has a self-commutating option with "block" current drive
i thought the difference was in the magnetic flux coupling (or whatever that's really called)
the gap between the rotor and stator laminations
it's shaped so that when you spin the motor like a generator, you get a trapezoidal waveform
I think I have found a compressor :)
[01:21:55] <robin_sz> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7208012779
oh, I did that already
oh for nitrogen generation?
For that to work, the market for ntrogen/argon as a byproduct of oxygen manufacture has to be saturated?
for the compression into the storage cylinders
shrug ... i just gte fed up of buying so much nitrogen ...
its not *that* expensive ... but its easy to use a 10 cylinder pack in a day
then just having run out is inconvenient
it's almost like buying air huh
onsite generation should cost 10% of buy in price
alex_joni: what did you want to ask about my feature request? i know it's a little wrong in some places..
then someone is making obscene profits somewhere
les_w: well that swhat the notrogen PSA system sellers claim
its �100 a month just to rent a 10 pack
plus 75 a refil
plsu 20 delivery
I use so little I have not thought about it much
this will pay off in 2 months I hope ...
I think I can build it for �1000 or so
with ebay bits :)
We threw out all the LN2 each shift end at harris
just poured it on the floor
100 liters or so
well, yeah, some places have too much
other not enough
that was from liquefaction? and distilation?
werent you worried about suffocating? :)
it was from the thin film sorption pumps
Jymmm: looked at it more carefully, those are AC drives
Once a worker poured it down my pants...so I poured it down her shirt
fenn: no, he was worried about freezing his toes off
probably worth lots more than 75$
we were young...
and with freeze burns
just lots of smoke
fenn: SQ is not going to get any further development, unless someone comes along who wants that
we gave up on SQ
fenn: your feature request is mainly about TP not SQ, so it would be best if you file it under that name
remember the author came here to work on it
alex_joni: at the time i didn't know the correct terminology
you are up late ;-)
but i dont think emc has the infrastructure to support a lot of the stuff i was talking about
alex_joni: Then why would it say output voltage range : 21 - 80 VDC ??????????
hi les, Jacky
Jymmm: looks dc to me.. dunno what alex is smoking :)
yep. its a DC drive
jmkasunich - nice to see you back - good vacation?
hey alex, I have a comment about the translations stuff for setupconfig.tcl
tap, tap, is this thing on?
sure it is
try give it a little whack on the side
first, I appreciate the work, but it might be a bit premature... the prog is far from finished
fenn, robin_sz, Jymmm : look at the motor conections (U,V,W)
will changing strings or adding new ones invalidate the existing work?
jmkasunich: adding new ones won't be a problem, changing a bit ;)
let me know if you change anything, and I'll update
second, under the subject of changing
there are some messages that are one very long string
there are others that are concatenated from several shorter strings
yes, I tried to leave them as they are for now
because long ones are ugly in the editor, and I wasn't sure about the use of continuation characters
but I like concatenated better
and it's very hard to translate, because of the \n you used :)
actually, I made a mistake when I said "I agree", I think one long message is better
i think you are saying the same thing
the /n are used for wrapping, not because they are different sentences. In another language the message might be longer or shorter, or the sentences might be in a different order
yes, and the \n in a different place
that's what I meant that it makes hard to translate
if the msg in the .po is one long string, then you can translate (and wrap it) as appropriate
imho we shouldn't use \n at all (not for wrapping, tcl should take care of that)
I agree \n is ok for new lines
tcl will adjust the window size to fit the lines, and if the lines are very long, it will make a very large window, which I don't want
so I broke the messages into lines with /n
can't the window be fixed?
I doubt it doesn't have a setting for that
thats worse, because then you have to deal with things like font sizes and such
make it 1/4 of the screen
should be ok ..
that won't work, 1/4 of a 800x600 is too small
especially if you have a large font
fixed sizes in pixels are a bad thing
ok, I clearly don't know enough to say :D
think about it, one guy has a 1600x1200 screen and default font is 8 point, another has 800x600 and bad eyes, so his default font is 16 point
you can't specify a window size in pixels and make them both happy
better (IMO) to let tcl fit the window to the contents
that's why I said half the screen
well half vertically and half horiz.
why not just let the window be scaled by the user?
fenn: that brings up a nother topic :)
robin: not tkemx
jmkasunich: I'm not 100% fond of having so many windows
stupid window managers might place them all over the screen
so you'd end up chasing them :D
fenn: this is a little "wizard" that pops up and walks the user thru something, the user shouldn't need to fiddle with the window
alex: there is only one at a time
I do remember a lot of the tcl in early emc stuff was all done in very poor style with fixed positions for things in terms of pixels, so scaling them by the user drag thing was just so not going to happen
yes, but in time they are different
e.g. more than one
on my box they always appear at the same place (I suppose that doesn't mean they wouldn't be all over the place for somebody else)
jmkasunich: I know ray has complained about that. so he might be more insighted
fenn: I still think that's an AC drive
fenn: look at bottom page #4
jmk is this an ac or a dc drive? http://motionscienceinc.com/downloads/servo_amplifiers/ds_mdc_mdcx.pdf
* jmkasunich looks
it seems DC, but somethings is screwy there
HALL feedback on DC's?
named HALL A,B,C? strange
"brush type" sounds like DC to me
jmkasunich: check the bottom of the last page
it all sounded like DC; till I say that...
notice: the text describes the MDC series and the images describe the MBLX series
fenn: I think you just found the problem
fenn: that must be it..
that's probably why they're so cheap
have "magnetic amplifiers" ever been used in cnc machines?
actually nevermind, i'm interested in them for a different application
I often wonder why commutators and brushes have not vanished
simple, cheap, and they work
i often wonder how they sell brushless dc cpu fans for so cheap
those are AC
I guess power fets or igfets just are not cheap enough yet
les: its not the power devices so much (at the lower HP) its all the other crap
there must be som ereason I paid 600 bucks for an inverter...
ah...ereason...new word. sounds like a useful marketing tool.
ought to TM that
and sue the pants off of anyone who's bad at typing
you know, adjacent key typos like that could make good keywords
I mean gheh
les_w : qangle, qorry, qamp, qork, qite, qant,
I have the sudden urge to write html.
with that, I'm going to the music room!
les_w 4NO WAY
then blessed work tomorrow. I'm bored out of my gourd.
9,11 You're a poet and dont know it
9,12 You're a poet and dont know it
oh so easy to read.
green on cyan
8,3 It is, isn't it
7,1orange on black
yellow on red is the one that vibrates and triggers epileptic stuff isn't it?
13,9 AMgenta on lime green
usually I thought it was blinking stuff
amgenta...Isn't that a girl color?
Long ago, we used to mess with strobe lights in a dark room. I think it was about seven hertz that would drive anyone nuts
Bold underlined reversed
couldn't even stand up
whats special about 7Hz ?
what are you people doing?
most IRC channels I've hung out on, those special chars to do all that BS were considered bad form
djb_rh 4Shush you
* djb_rh smacks Jymmm
* djb_rh runs
I think it hit a sensory command/response nerve thing and created a pole
djb_rh SPEAK BOY, SPEAK!
don't mess with me
les_w is there anything naturally occuring at the range?
I'm personal friends with lilo, you know
djb_rh ask me if I give a shit? =)
motor sensory neural stuff is a servo right?
reverse the phase and things get REAL messed up
no clue les
7 Hz does this
7hz is awefully low.... almost a ripple on the water
we don't have very good servo update Jymmm
could you do the same thing with a less intense light source?
incadesent instead of a strobe?
perhaps. We used a xenon strobe in total darkness
couldn't even stand up.
I have a strobe for my camera, but it doesn't recycle that fast
As you can see, I am kind of well, crazy.
tell us somethign we don't know
You ahve to be a lil crazy to survive in this world.
and invent things.
The seven hertz thing was considered for things like crowd control and such, but it can cause seizures in some.
You know what... I want to engrave/carve this...but unless it's like 48" can't do it =( http://static.flickr.com/36/78131910_21ba11022b.jpg
les_w Imagien if you could have the same results with IR LED's ?!
oohh..lots of machine time. And people cannot see IR.
ppl can't, but the brain can
les_w I think the machien time would be well worth it.
Funny thing...the seven Hz thing coincides with the Nipkow color perception thing
never heard of nipkow
google nipkow disk
[02:34:42] <Jymmm> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nipkow_disk
a variant can be used to see color on a black and white tv!
Jymmm: got any more photos of signs youve done?
photo sucks (no lighting at the time) http://static.flickr.com/35/68122547_7d6160cf29_m.jpg
[02:37:41] <les_w> http://www.exploratorium.edu/snacks/benhams_disk.html
really amazing...try it.
works best at seven hertz.
oh, hold on.
can't find it now, but I saw a gif that does that
went from grey to green
oh that this pretty http://www.jewelryexpert.com/catalog/Color-Change-Sapphire-Engraved-Ring.htm
you really can use that to send color images on a BW tv!
I worked a good bit on photochromic stuff for car adapting rear view mirrors
a little different from photochroic
[02:43:37] <Jymmm> http://www.michaelbach.de/ot/col_benham/index.html
oh how convenient!
les_w bookmark this http://www.michaelbach.de/ot/col_benham/index.html
it goes too slow for good colors though
speed in the corner
couse scanning interferes
I like this one
[02:47:04] <Jymmm> http://www.michaelbach.de/ot/col_lilacChaser/index.html
oh that's very good
that's the one I was trying to find, but the one I gave was better than the one I had in mind.
I just see a green dot after a couple seconds
seems speed insensitive
eyes aren't cameras!!
the colored changed depending on speed for me, slow grn, faster blue
Jymmm: a camera for you : http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=398349&is=REG&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation
alex_joni: Not really, no places process anything alrger than 5MP as it is.
for the change you can get your own processing
Um photo processing machien is about $200K USD
I did some studies on the boeing 777 led annunciator project about using persistance of vision
once you fire pesistence, turn the led off!
for a little while.
so a pulsed led with the same rms light output can seem much brighter
we did not use it on the aircraft though
because if you turn your head you see a dotted line
huh? I hear thunder. Checking radar.
Now, THAT's a printer =)
Jymmm: seen nicer ones..
but not for home use
probably less DPI, but lots more ppm
it's a FILM printer
yeah I know
I need a new scanner
that's why I said
but I don't want a printerscannerfax
les_w: seen some nice scanners from HP
I need to look
my old one is dead because I must use win XP
it was parport
any special needs?
no, just good color and resolution
fast is good.
[03:15:00] <alex_joni_> http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/us/en/sm/WF25a/15179-64195-215155-15202-215155-214599.html
I need one of these: http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/us/en/sm/WF05a/15179-64195-215155-15202-215155-434502.html
pricey but I guess fast
would also like to do old color print negatives
for home use one of these might be ok: http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/us/en/sm/WF05a/15179-64195-215155-298148-215155-447376.html
but the easiest is to fill out a questionaire at HP's and see which fits you
yeah that looks good
needs to be good enough to get everything out of a 35mmm negative
[03:18:34] <alex_joni_> http://st.adiho.com/sy/clients/hp/us_bc_scanners.html?jumpid=re_r2515_advisors/adiipg/hmc
r u guys on all the time
dmess2: seems like it
we don't have lives.
although it makes me wonder wth am I doing here at 05:20 am :D
I should be in the music room
but then I would miss all this wsdom...
same here.. except I should be sleeping
but then again I woke up at 3PM
* alex_joni_ feels out of timezone
I'm really living somewhere else, just don't know it yet
well, I am out in the woods. Internet is my only communication medium
only a few people per square mile here
I'm in the mountains now.. but that's only a temp. excuse :D
back home I have none
in many places zero people per square mile!
used to be the farthest place I could be away from people was flying an aircraft solo at 12,000feet
My GF picked up a used HP officejet. it scans in linux with sane+hpoj, and the quality seems OK. I think it only goes to 300DPI though.
I am still a little amazed that I can run a business out here
totally internet dependent
oops, I guess I was talking to a conversation an hour or more old. oops.
* jepler scrolls all the way down
for slides...let's see...quality 35mm...at least 1200 dpi
2400 I'd say
yeah this is for documents, not slides
and 3 color alpha is so good for restoring faded ones...
just SW of course
I mean gamma
time for bed for me
10 (maybe 12)mm NSK rail and one slide, apx 24" long $50
a slide is usually more than that
just seems a lil narrow.
fine for a router
12 or 15 is fine for routers, even biggish ones
25 or 30 for serious mills, doing Bad Things (tm) to big lumps of steel
check the specs, you'll see they take WAY more load than you expected ...
I think the length won't be useful to me - too short
they might be 18" and not 24"
only one piece available?
I pay 160 USD/m for 12mm rail
40 usd per carriage
my slides are usually >150$, but they are a bit larger
don't recall what size exactly
Jymmm: is this for a new machine or to improve your existing machine?
but on 2 rails, 8 slides we got > 2 tons
make n sell
I keep thinking about that ...
but with those chinese machines at <2k ...
$27 electronic edge finder
[03:52:23] <Jymmm> http://www1.mscdirect.com/CGI/NNSRIT?PMAKA=65002206
Jymmm is now known as Jymm
Jymm is now known as MrAsshole
MrAsshole is now known as Jymmm
I'd like to mount a edge finder on my machien, but not sure how to perm mount it and be able to calibrate it
do you know how they work?
hit the edge, the led lites
but its electrical contact ...
so only works on metal things
not tiny switch?
oh, well scratch the $27 one
would work OK by ahnd and eye.
by cnc .. well, snap.
ajoni is now known as alex_joni_
hi - whats up?
* alex_joni_ is
still up :)
I was wondering - are you a professor?
one question for you regarding : http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1367192&group_id=6744&atid=106744
skunkworks: how so?
when you guys where going over the tp earlier - I could see you at a black board figureing it out.
in front of a class
ROFL.. not really
just wondering ;)
but thanks I guess ..
is that bug-tracker still valid?
wow jmk wrote a long essay on that one
I bet I've changed everything he wrote about too
well, not everything
a bit ;)
sorry - battery went dead. no warning.
skunkworks: is that bugtracker still valid?
skunkworks: bet you're running BDI :D
without ACPI :P
My problem was solved with the headroom added to the stepper.hal
ok, so the bugtracker can go..
other than I think jmk wasn't sure of a finall solution.
I know jmk doesn't want to put +5% in the stepgen
I wonder if he would mind if I would put -5% in the TP
seriously though, we would fix the problem and would not violate the requested constraints
btw - windows xp machine. every once in a while i don't get a warning - go figure
skunkworks: I won't :P
he added an extra variable for it in a later build.
probably crappy ACPI implementation
skunkworks: yup I know
(what I had added manually)
cradek: might be something, but ini defineable I think..
I'm not sure it's linear
alex_joni_: well IMO we shouldn't need the user to worry about it
alex_joni_: we should fix the problem as if it's a bug (I think it is a bug)
right, but in some cases he might want to change it.. sunno
yeah, afaik it's up to jmk
it was just a thought
jmk went to bed :D
I should change timezones with him..
when i was goofing around with it certain setups requiered over 150 percent headroom
that may be another problem then...
hrmm.. might have something else setup strange on those..
to not get following errors
so you guys are working on exact stop mode - then on from there?
it's almost done...
err, I mean to say, I'm almost ready to start testing
cradek: it's done when you are finished documenting it :P
I'm doing that as I go along
how about 'code a little, test a little' ?
oh I did that, really
I did something similar 10 or so years ago. then wanted to add look ahead. then couldn't get my head around it. ;)
then it's almost done :D
I got "plow along at the requested velocity, ignoring everything else" working first
well I have to say les's page makes trapezoidal blending look really easy.
maybe I will be able to do that (from scratch) and get it 100% right
look, but when you do the actual coding, it's not that easy
I have faith in you.
usually theory is a lot easier :D
that's why I don't really like it..
for instance I think it doesn't handle different max accels in different axes
minor detail. ;)
skunkworks: faith == belief in something without rational reason
minor detail, big difference
skunkworks: (really, I appreciate the sentiment)
cradek: I'm also having faith in you :P
how about - Going by what I have seen you do - I think you can accomplish this task
skunkworks: faith is better..
haha ok thanks
keeps you covered if he fails :D
good point ;)
cradek: we're only joking around, don't you dare failing us :D
alex_joni_: you'll cut my pay?
no, that would be too easy on you
I'll make you do it again
I say minor detail as it is the second issue I had with emc2 (different max accels per axis)
darn, I ran out of firewood.. need to get more :)
well I should go to bed. (already in bed) I should go to sleep.
yes you should.. it's getting late (early)
;) - is that all you use to heat is wood?
over here yes (vacation house in the mountains)
nice. My wife wants us to visit you. ;)
an interesting contrast - using fire to keep warm while chatting on your wireless internet
and coke to keep awake..
my parents only heat with wood.
in the morning you'll have to hunt a mastadon for breakfast
but seriously.. a big fireplace is nice
I decided I did not want to work that hard. (turns up the thermostat)
no, still scraps from the last one
skunkworks: the first day I spent about 4 hours digging snow :D
before parking the car properly :P
but it's nice..
I imagine people living here 100 years ago
what are you using for internet? dsl, dialup, satellite?
with no electricity, running water, etc
cell dialup (156 kbps over here, 2.4MBps in civilisation ;)
it's called CDMA
* Jymmm introduces alex_joni to the FOUR WHEEL DRIVE concept and SNOW TIRES
not bad. I had directway 2 way satellite for a while. until we finally got dsl
I do have those :P
Jymmm: both of them..
alex_joni Then why dig/shovel for four hours?
but if you have a road cleared by a plow, and a 70cm high snow wall, no 4W will ever help
trust me.. I tried it before..
alex_joni ok, toss on a plow on the front of yours then
I've sen them for cars
that works when it's fresh..
not like this.. melted and frosted a few times..
alex_joni get yourself a mini-phalanx then, car roof mounted --> http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/ship/weaps/mk-15.htm
* alex_joni_ goes to bed..
or good day ;)
night - I going also
alex_joni read that link first
Jymmm: firethrower is more appropiate :D
alex_joniL That's what it is, just works five miles away =)
where do I sign up for one of those?
only $8M each
ammo not included =)
Jymmm is now known as Red70sShow
Red70sShow is now known as Jymmm
swp you alive?
need a hot coffee injection?
SWP_Away is now known as SWPadnos
SWPadnos: i'm trying to convince someone on a mailing list that the no-transformer idea is a bad idea, but i forget exactly why it's so dangerous compared to say a computer or a vacuum cleaner
fenn: sounds great ^_^
hi anonimasu :)
Happy New Year
dammit why can't people be up at all hours to answer my electronics questions
fenn: thats the good side of the chat
just do a question and wait :)
happy new year to you too
Italy start the new year with a new warning today
duck and cover
Ucraine cut the gas forniture
in Italy, Austria and some other country
its not clean the reason
probably, they do not agree the price ..
just to remember who is dominating the world
well i'd rather they flex their economic muscles than pull a stunt like russia flying planes over japan
i guess that was a while ago
* fenn too
Hi Fenn...Computers have transformers...they are just small 40 KHz transformers though...
The reason its bad to go trans-formerless, is that the AC is floating with respect to ground...When properly loaded neutral should be within 10 VRMS of ground, but its not
uncommon to see it at 40 VRMS...and when there is a load surge, the neutral will jump....
Besides that, what happens if you get the neutral and hot reversed? Remember CNC s are built of metal, not metal chasis in an insulating case....
The capacitance of the drive motors to the metal would be enough to pass current that can be felt.
With a transformer, the capacitance between windings can be minimized, and even if not, the common mode AC current is grounded where the DC power supply is...
[14:00:29] <Jacky^> http://www.reactos.org/xhtml/it/screenshots.html
a windows based open source O.S ? O_O
using win32 API ..
everyone dying .. probably too much food for new years :D
how is you?
get enough wood last last night?
yeah, fire's ok :P
good - slept too long
I didn't .. got up at around 2PM
you have wierd sleeping habits
indeed.. but only during vacation (I hope)
guess I could move to hawaii and I wouldn't notice any jet-lag
anyways, guess I'll go to sleep earlier today..
but what can I do? it's pooring outside :(
melting the snow away.. bleah
Just put a fan on my Z motor....letting run to see of the dropping resistor gets too hot...alternative is to get a second fan and series em...
Little PC power supply 12 v Brushless fan...
Running it off the 24 V line to the Z brake...so when the brake comes on, so will the fan...quick and dirty....
brake gets energize, ie off actually...
wb9mjn: what voltage on the fan?
Its a 12 volt fan...had a 100 ohm 5 w resistor in the junk bin...
Fan was in the junk bin too...
heh, wot's the resistor for?
Drop the 24 v industrial controls supply to the fan...
ahh.. 24V supply..
use a 12V zenner
Yep...the brake uses 24 v....I had the 100 ohm resistor...fan sees 11.8 volts now...should be fine...
right, 5W should be plenty
After it runs an hour see if the resistor gets too hot....
Yea...1.4 watts actual disipation...
metallic? or ceramic?
I have some very nice .01 ohm, 10W metalic resistors
scrapped from some servo's :D
make great shunts..
balast resistors for output stages...
or multiple motors...
actually current sensing
for feedback control, or current limiting
Crazy weather here....2 weeks of november and december were down to 10 F or lower in the morings, sometimes as cold as -7 F (-20 C) now its in the 40's (about 5 C) and raining with
the possibility of thunderstorms.....will be really wierd if we get a tornado warning !
same here.. but no tornado's
but 5+ and raining
Just had a big thunderclap....!
and I'm 1000m altitude (in the mountains :(
We at are at 200 m above seal level here ...
damn it alex - new camera an no pictures of your view
Great Planes of the US only vary a few hundred meters...the Lake (Lake Michigan) is at 590 feet amsl ...
just releasing some fireworks pics
[16:14:22] <alex_joni_> http://dsplabs.utt.ro/~juve/blog/index.cgi/photography/01136216897
resistor is running at about 150...should be fine...
Empty coal train going by, they make more vibration the loaded ones, since they go allot faster, and rattle the ground...
thanks - nice. Real fireworks. around here they are frowned apon ;)
* alex_joni_ grew up near train lines..
skunkworks: how so?
(for personal use)
I m off the main train line that goes to Wyoming and runs all the coal into Chicago for the coal powr plants there...
pretty much anything that makes noise or is on fire is outlawed ;)
someone might hurt them selves
They had fire works in town here , for the 175 th birthday celebration...professionally done of course...
Your link is bad Alex...
worked for me
skunkworks: same here, only for new years it's allowed
stormy here...dsl is cutting out
Not for me...wierd....
Getting the peak of this thunder cells rain now....probably at about 2 inches / hour at the moment, if not more...
just raining here
wb9mjn: try http://dsplabs.utt.ro/~juve/blog/index.cgi/photography
there should be a link from there
Wierd,,,your links have worked for me in the past...not today...
Must be an internet routing problem...
seems to be working for me - both links. are they filtering in IL? ;)
Ameritech/SBC/ATT is screwed up today...
Last day of the vacation for me....back to the grind tomorrow...
morning. Powerful squall line blasting through dupage...
Got allot done on the machine....I made the plate to mount the encoder the other day...machine did a nice job on the clearance hole for the encoder drive shaft...
funny same temp and conditions here
Rain is tapering down now...
And the plate came out quite square....so that problem is fixed...
The NEMA 34 mounting holes were dead on...so the screws are reasonably accurate...
Just as long as we do not get a training storm...had 16 inches in a day once here when that happened...
They almost lost a railroad overpass due to the errosion...
I was in the salt creek flood in elmhurst
THE ? I think that happens twice a year ...
spring and fall...
almost flooded my then basement shop
Or spring then spring again...
8 feet of water in the streets
The train line here had about 3 feet of water in it...its down below grade here by about 20 feet ...
Rain drained into it...
not so bad at my house...only about 3 feet. came within inches of the basement window wells
Best to take out the glass and put in glass block on any problematic window wells...
well rain has stopped here for a minute....better check the mail in the po box
wb9mjn - does this work?
Glass wills blow out about 1/3 the way up...that was a problem at my parents house...
I'd wonder, DNS is pretty stable (never had issues with it)
Not from within MIRC...its giving me a wierd dialogue box...will type in the link...
copy and past?
bbl - need a shower
No copy and past from MIRC...have to do it the old-fashioned way...
But you can click on links from MIRC and it just brings up the browser usually...
wb9mjn: sure copy paste works, just need to select text, then paste
select takes care of copying too
Not here for some reason...
Cannot find server...
Never been a problem in the past...
Have to ask Radu (IT guy from Romania at the company Connecticut factory)...
Radu ... ?
wb9mjn: try a traceroute (if on linux), tracert (if on doze)
it should show hops, as it moves along, and it will eventually stop (timeout)..
Its only making it two hops into the Ameritech network then stopping...
Must be a router problem...
probably some routing is fscked
wb9mjn: reaching you just fine from here ..
Yep...but not getting pings back from skunk or les !
probably something is busted.. you need to wait it out
route propagation takes a while
Yep...not worrying....Yes...I used to be the network op for the local ham radio network....
ok, I'm off for a while..
gone to watch some more MASH ;)
love the show..
you can copy and paste from merc - what ever you highlight is coppied. (odd I know)
sounds like how X apps work to me
took me a while to figure that out ;)
going shopping - bbl
jmkasunich is now known as jmk_away
les_w you around?
he's a square
K4ts is now known as Jacky^
Jacky^ is now known as Jacky^cook
some weird genderchange going on there..
* Jacky^cook planning a very special dinner :D
from a woman to a man, then back to a cook.. :D
just turn around here to get a good food ;)
Jacky^cook: I have plenty of that, but thank you
what are you cooking?
fenn_ is now known as fenn
fenn: why did you kill fenn?
those come in a package usually..
no pasta Jacky^cook?
and red wine from sardinia island woow :P
yep, pasta too
barilla half pens
k4ts worked on first plate, I develop the second
kidding .. just tryng a recipe found in internet..
open source :P
now going to test the result
enjoy your meal
Jacky^cook is now known as K4ts
stuff is mostly wired on the cnc...now need a place to put the vfd
it is only ip 20 enclosed
stick it in an ip 65 cabinet
hey les_w !!
cooke hacked this evening
I think I should put it in a neama type electrical enclosurehi jacky
[21:20:01] <Jacky^> http://digilander.libero.it/jackydgl0/cena02/cena02.html
look .. at that good food :P
hello K4ts :P
i'm now hungry
what happening ?
what a well documented dinner
hahah yep :P
just working. about done for the day
looking more at your pictures
Italians doing what they do best ... eating ;)
starting on new year its a bit hard ..
Jacky and anna need to come here and feed me
sigh how i am begining to hate the ASME/ASTM lot ...
I see the laptop on the table with irc
yep, cool laptop
it must be there *
"we have set the standards for all sorts of flanges and fittings for standard pipes"
les_w, Infiniti M35 X
les_w: did you work today ?
"no, you cannot see them, its a secret"
robin, I was gonna mount the drive inside the cnc...but there are flammables like oil nearby. Giant capacitors in just ip20 boxes scare me
well - they'll show then to you after you pay $150,000 and one testicle
oh.. may youre working.. assuming fuse time :(
thats about right
Is reading mouser catalog working?
yep, good ..
I go to sing!
who stop working, lost
musica in allegria
les_w, chosen by Consumer reports as the best luxury sedan (beat out the BMW 530i)
so, I must reboot :(
hi SWPadnos :)
ok I will see you there
Happy new year
swp which car?
ajoni is now known as alex_joni_
the Infiniti M35 X
* Jacky^ reboot with xp . sigh ...
oh yeah...it's very very good
if you like jap crap ;)
I wanted an audi and will still get one if it has bumper to bumper warranty on a cpo car
the only "low" in the consumer reports rankings is "low beam headlights"
like infiniti q but can't find one
very few are made
so I am just waiting for the right CPO car to come up
when it does i'll grab it.
A 2003 audi a6 quattro CPO will be only about 22k with 4 year warranty
same for the q...if I could find one
that's less than $50k
(I is real goodly with math)
yeah both cars have 50-60k MSRP
so it looks new, has new car warranty, and less than half price. Just some miles on it. Not a lot.
Works for me.
usually a 2-year old, high mileage car is the best bet (though low mileage is also good)
I would rather have that than a new one of lower features and performance
those are usually from traveling salespeople, so all the miles are highway
mileage on modern cars is actually a good thing .. shakes out the problems
CPO programs only use low mileage I guess
yeah, with the first tune-up at 100k miles, they shouldn't be that much of an issue
CPO is ?
certified pre owned
has new factory warranty after inspections
anything that's dealer-certified, and you buy it from the dealer, is suspicious to me
regardless of warrantee
This is not dealer. It's manufacturer.
generally those are the remainder of the factory warrantee (with some minimum term)
* Jacky^ came back to Linux
damn dsl.. K4ts have a poor dsl
only one at the time
jacky can't find musica in allegria
I had to reboot in LInux ..
this connection is not enough fast for 2 paltalk connections :(
K4ts: is tryng .
still can't find
I will listen from K4ts pc .. cant run another paltalk connection here ..
capinera is mary, from florence
les_w: how she called you ?
tell her I can't speak italian!
but I will listen.
I think we have telphone service liek that here ...
you phoen some premium rate number and a girl speaks Italian at you ...
les_w: is familiar with italian :-)
the singing is great...if only I had a seat at your dinner table...
just listening K4ts Live singing
les_w: we just have about 10-12 seats here
03alex_joni * 10documents/lyx/User_Hardware.lyx: fixed typo G20/G21 inversion as stated by bug #1106249
ouch .. K4ts windoz pc seems wont let me surfing :/
robin_sz: did you started work today too ?
I just started up designing piezo stuff
got rusty after 2 weeks off
Ive some other free day yet
I could have more, but I got bored
I suppose its cold there
here we got rain all the time
IT IS MILD BUT ALSO RAINING
03cradek 07simple_tp * 10emc2/src/emc/kinematics/ (tc.h tp.c):
not quite right - freezes on very short motions, and sometimes gets the
ramps wrong. I think I'm going to have to calculate and count traj cycles
to get it right.
wow, this has got to win some kind of "best use of an animated GIF" prize: http://kadtronix.com/images/u401bb.gif
great cradek :)
jepler: yes, very useful
les_w: blue is male .. take a distance ..
ajoni: you keep choosing different names. I don't understand it.
jepler: my connection keeps trashing..
I don't have a choice
ajoni is now known as alex_joni_
Jymmm: mine is way better than that
I heard you jacky
im tryng to teach K4ts to sing :/
jepler: Maybe not animated, but hell a lot better than yours! VERY Nice eye candy.... http://www.yourdirtymind.com/xxxmas_2005/galleries/hegre-luba-tree.html
all conversation stops ...
I think that's older than 2005
I think she's younger than 2005
the gallery I mean ;)
oh about cpo....I checked a lot. it's pretty good. after the origial warranty runs out most everyting is still covered except oil changes and such.
4 yeas /100,000
...semms like a good deal.
that is pretty good
it is a nice gallery
I bought the BMW new. I was awfully expensive. Why not get the same for half?
I think she has a twin sister as well
les_w: BMW its a good choice, congrats
there are no good car as that around here
I will keep it. But it is not good for long trips
I need an old man car for the trips.
but its exensive too much
just stau away from Fiat and Alfa Romeo
get a trike
and yoll be happy :-)
I sold them parts!
I like bmw, theyre good cars
not much fantasy, but good ;P
yes very good
at this time what is good is more important then fantasy
Mine is small...a 325. I just need something bigger for the very long trips.
325 isnt small.. came on
my uncle had an 750
nice car, but too much fuel ;)
15-20l/100km in town :(
alex_joni_: al nice cars neeeded much fuel :(
ite the rule
the 325 has 189. the audi has 240
the infiniti has 340
I do not need huge horsepower
I prefer eletric cars, but Im not conventional
for me, a trip at 10km/h its regular in a big city
but its not for all
there are young peoples who want to travel at 250km/H
100 km in 5 sec .
I have. but not any more.
unless I am in an airplane
thats ok, in airplane
I had an audi before. it would go 250. the BMW will too
all I did was 210
fast enough for me..
ew got another issue
4 cars for family
naples its a caos
if you travel here you can see: 1 people for car
I have to have two
when 1 car could get 5 peoples onboard
I am very far from anything
theres someone having 2-3 cars
if car breaks, you starve.
so you need two.
les_w isn't that what the tractor is for?
goes 15 mph in high gear and is street legal!
thats is great :)
les_w But, when the end of the world is here, you can just pushing everything out of the way!
yeah. I have the urge to flip cars over when I have the forks on the bucket
hey, you wanna flip em, that's your choice, I just said move =)
* alex_joni_ goes to bed early today
G Night alex_joni_
les_w: K4ts is closing the room
she read here :P
now I must prepare dinner
Jymmm: K4ts ask, what time is it there ?
oh.. ok afternoon
This is taking forever to download.... only 19% complete =(
Jymmm: we got new dsl offers
but never fast like you :(
K4ts: dont know what bummer mean ..
bummer, too bad, sorry to hear that.
too bad - troppo cattivo
Jacky^: is a bad prompter
im a good cooke :)
I just worked 2 week to debug K4ts cooke ..
Jymmm: do you want coffee?
norton antivirus, panda, etc..
Id like to do a format c:/ all
but im not sure she agreed
K4ts: I like coffee =)
* K4ts give a coffee to Jymmm
with poison inside ??
Jacky^: If she keeps this up, I'm gonna steal her away from you!
I'm not =)
nahh.. K4ts is ok ;)
K4ts: Come run away with me! =)
Jymmm: you are too much away
K4ts: Not at all, beautiful California =)
yep, just 12.000 km from here
* Jacky^ is suggesting K4ts
K4ts: Easy, just take a bus =) lol
yep, just ask to les_w for a plane
* Jacky^ love california
I have some nice photos from there
* Jymmm too!
Jymmm: when youll come here the next time ?
2007 could be a good idea
just planning to do it :)
just back from town. Hard to drive on the mountain roads. very stormy.
In the higher areas I went into clouds
this download is taking for ev errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!
Jymmm: well find you before youll find we
Prozac for Plants
Jymmm: come here you in naples
K4ts Will Jacky^ be there?
we could get a good dinner, jymmm
that a bad weather day
bat look at the vulcan
very bad weather here. 60 dbz doppler radar returns. that usually means hail
Jymmm: the mountain at the center o the panoramic is the volcan
the second in europe :)
at the left, naples
where the pizza was born !
oh I am cooking pizza now
les_w: yeah, Etna in Sicily Island its the first of europe
Etna euprions are not rarely
les give me pizza
give me your dinner!
les_w: K4ts cam send you the recipe of 'real pizza' ;)
just wait some days yet
this is just frozen digiorno pizza
tomorrow well start to search around
I can cook
I want to find some good thing ;)
I saw you were using Barrilla pasta
I have some too!
barilla ? wow
from Parma :)
yes I can buy that here
I have some barilla angel hair
angel hair bleachhhhhh
ahh .. K4ts disagree
I had it with the codfish and scallops
end milk cream
lemon butter sauce with orange and paprika
I AM HUNGRY!
come here my home!
email me dinner
oh well...pepperoni pizza ready soon
K4ts: is looking at dictionary ..
throw lemon butter sauce with orange and paprika
les_w taqueria taco with inions and cilantro
what should I use?
trash it ?
K4ts: said wait
oh...I grow peppers