#emc | Logs for 2005-08-26

[00:00:32] <Jacky^> rated current
[00:00:43] <robin_sz> ahh,
[00:00:46] <robin_sz> right thats easy
[00:00:58] <robin_sz> turn the current up and run them fast and hard
[00:01:12] <robin_sz> when they get too hot to touch, thats about right
[00:02:25] <Jacky^> so, tehe current can be measured with an ampmeter ?
[00:02:45] <robin_sz> eh?
[00:02:57] <Jacky^> :(
[00:02:57] <robin_sz> yes the ACTUAL current can be measured with an ampmeter
[00:03:07] <Jacky^> ah,ok :)
[00:03:24] <robin_sz> the RATED current is derived by seeing how much curren t you can push before it gets too hot
[00:04:01] <Jacky^> interesting ..
[00:04:20] <robin_sz> or .. you can ask the manufacturer for the rated current
[00:04:22] <robin_sz> easier
[00:04:27] <robin_sz> and wont burn your fingers
[00:04:32] <Jacky^> yeah, i know ..
[00:05:01] <Jacky^> i was thinking, many years ago
[00:05:14] <robin_sz> yeah? why did you stop
[00:05:17] <robin_sz> ??
[00:05:21] <Jacky^> i was building box fro speakers
[00:05:30] <robin_sz> ah, ok
[00:05:35] <Jacky^> before calculate the box,
[00:05:51] <Jacky^> we was checking all possible parameters
[00:05:58] <Jacky^> on speaker
[00:06:03] <les> theile small?
[00:06:12] <Jacky^> like resistence, resonance frequency, etc etc
[00:07:00] <Jacky^> les big box ..
[00:07:00] <robin_sz> * robin_sz vaguely remembers thielle-small params and lots of hard maths
[00:07:17] <les> heh
[00:07:24] <Jacky^> for motors seem hard to check real values parameters
[00:07:32] <Jacky^> like curve or others..
[00:07:51] <robin_sz> good manufacturers provide that
[00:07:57] <Jacky^> sure
[00:08:19] <Jacky^> but check it by hand could be interesting
[00:08:22] <les> servo motors behave very much like loudspeakers
[00:08:47] <Jacky^> les yeah..
[00:09:14] <les> I have seen speakers that use rotary servo motors...
[00:09:31] <Jacky^> ah..
[00:09:43] <Jacky^> nice :P
[00:09:45] <les> and I have made xyz machines using large loudspeaker voice coils!
[00:10:07] <Jacky^> uh ?
[00:10:17] <Jacky^> got a picture ?
[00:10:19] <les> voice coil drive
[00:10:35] <les> no picture unfortunately
[00:10:47] <Jacky^> for speakers there are many software,
[00:11:03] <Jacky^> to draw frequancy response, and other
[00:11:15] <les> but many large low frequency loudspeakers can apply a force of several hundred newtons
[00:11:58] <Jacky^> interesting
[00:12:17] <les> in fact the speaker term BL product
[00:12:32] <les> is simply newtons per amp
[00:13:16] <les> 20-30 is common
[00:15:02] <Jacky^> i've an impedance meter
[00:15:16] <Jacky^> with variable frequency ..
[00:15:32] <les> handy to have
[00:16:32] <Jacky^> i used it to measure impedance of speakers with different frequency
[00:16:45] <les> yes
[00:16:46] <Jacky^> 20 hz-20 khz
[00:17:04] <Jacky^> then draw the curve
[00:17:10] <Jacky^> manually ..
[00:17:15] <les> I use signal analyzers to do that
[00:17:28] <Jacky^> on pc ?
[00:17:53] <les> you can buy software that uses pc sound card to show impedance curves
[00:18:05] <Jacky^> ah,, yeah
[00:18:35] <Jacky^> I doubt on how accurate is..
[00:18:58] <Jacky^> probably, it depend on sound card quality
[00:19:01] <les> I am having to measure impedances of piezo acoustic stuff these days
[00:19:20] <les> it can be pretty accurate if the sound card is good quality
[00:19:28] <Jacky^> :)
[00:20:43] <les> right now i am having to add inductance to a piezo element to get an impedance match
[00:21:12] <Jacky^> good
[00:21:44] <les> best match if load is the exact complex conjugate
[00:22:14] <les> in my case 1000 ohms plus 3 milliHenry
[00:23:17] <les> same math as motors really
[00:24:04] <les> I measure and model impedance of cnc machine tools similarly
[00:24:37] <Jacky^> nice
[00:25:02] <Jacky^> first time i eard that
[00:25:03] <les> it works!
[00:25:17] <Jacky^> i believe :)
[00:25:36] <les> We can design very optimal systems that way
[00:25:44] <les> just like loudspeakers
[00:26:19] <Jacky^> great
[00:27:18] <Jacky^> i will try to find some doc about
[00:27:33] <les> There is plenty on the web
[00:28:15] <les> lots of math.
[00:28:20] <les> I like math.
[00:28:53] <les> Robin does plenty of math, but I am not sure he likes it!!!
[00:29:09] <Jacky^> i dont' like too .. but sometime is useful
[00:29:14] <les> heh
[00:32:03] <AchiestDragon> anyone see any problems using this router bed design ? http://www.whipy.demon.co.uk/cncv2-1.dxf
[00:32:54] <les> looking
[00:33:08] <AchiestDragon> the vertical sides need some extra support i think
[00:35:00] <paul_c> * paul_c looks around for Jymmm
[00:35:10] <Jacky^> hi paul_c
[00:35:24] <Jymmm> * Jymmm waves
[00:35:29] <paul_c> Why are you not in bed ?
[00:35:39] <Jacky^> Jymmm: was waching redshow :)
[00:35:48] <Jymmm> it's 16:30
[00:35:52] <cncuser> hi paulc :)
[00:36:10] <les> I am not greatly fond of bb rollers on a round shaft
[00:36:12] <paul_c> Hellooooo everyone.
[00:36:17] <les> point contact.
[00:36:25] <les> hey paul
[00:36:32] <cncuser> im about to finish a puppy linux emc2 livecd :)
[00:36:34] <les> I have a question!
[00:36:43] <paul_c> Jymmm: 4.23 being uploaded to servers as we speak.
[00:37:10] <les> Where is the auto tool change stuff in emc?
[00:37:28] <cncuser> emc.run doenst work quite well with busybox builtins ;)
[00:37:48] <paul_c> cncuser: If you distribute it, you will end up being the "expert" and have to give support to all and sundry.
[00:38:23] <cncuser> paul_c: hehe, notime ;)
[00:38:29] <paul_c> les: Tool change logic or commands to implement it ?
[00:38:52] <paul_c> cncuser: No, you misunderstood.....
[00:39:01] <les> logic and comms...looks like I may score an HSD auto change electrospindle
[00:39:07] <cncuser> paul_c: but i hope there will be downloads available for testing within the next hours, im fiddling with libtcl right now :) non grapical it works allready
[00:39:24] <paul_c> You will end up providing support whether you want to or not.
[00:39:44] <cncuser> paul_c: hehe, well see :)
[00:41:11] <paul_c> les: The comms consist of a couple of simple messages - prep tool & load tool (/me checks)
[00:41:48] <les> hmmm
[00:42:03] <paul_c> and tool unload
[00:42:39] <les> M06 Txx needs to send the spindle to a place where the tool is and do the logic to change it...
[00:42:49] <les> could be via external plc...
[00:42:52] <paul_c> The logic to handle tool changes is all within bridgeportio
[00:43:41] <les> I think there is no function to send the end effector toa specific location?
[00:43:56] <les> kinda out of io to do that?
[00:44:19] <paul_c> In the NIST model, M06 initiates the tool change, but does not involve any motion.
[00:44:30] <les> hmmm
[00:44:50] <paul_c> bridgeportio assumes the spindle is in the correct location for a tool change.
[00:45:47] <les> ok so Mo6 needs to be followed with a corresponding xyz move to get to where it needs to be?
[00:45:47] <paul_c> Having said that, there is some hackery that allows you to define the tool change position from within the ini....
[00:46:10] <les> well, I need to study it
[00:46:25] <paul_c> and an M06 will take you there (I think...) Ray would be the best one to ask about that detail.
[00:46:33] <les> the turkey call stuff involves 24+ manual tool changes a day
[00:46:38] <les> it gets old!
[00:46:58] <cncuser> cu later (reboot)
[00:47:40] <paul_c> At the end of the day, it depends on how you implement the mechanics of a tool change....
[00:48:09] <paul_c> Do you use a pick'n'place tool change or...
[00:48:19] <les> simplest would be just a row of tools in the work envelope
[00:48:39] <paul_c> Right - What I call pick'n'place
[00:48:55] <les> tool xx corresponds to position xyz
[00:49:01] <paul_c> rather than having an arm swing round to load the tool.
[00:49:23] <les> but I see no facility for that in bridgeportio
[00:49:46] <paul_c> There isn't - Bridgeportio has no way of commanding motion.
[00:49:54] <les> k
[00:50:21] <paul_c> what you need is a small toolchange macro in your g-code
[00:50:43] <paul_c> go to T1 - Unload tool - Go to T3 - Load tool
[00:51:04] <les> well the quick and dirty way is to post process 274 files to add to an xyz
[00:51:05] <les> yeah
[00:51:35] <les> detect M06 and add the motion g code
[00:51:59] <paul_c> the current interpreter model makes those sorts of macros messy to implement.
[00:52:11] <les> pity one can't put it in the tool table
[00:52:35] <les> I would have to process the g code file withan external program I guess
[00:52:52] <les> not hard
[00:54:00] <Jymmm> Hey les, I got a mini grease gun last night, but the ONYL cartridges they had were lithium grease. Kinda a carmel color (not white). Should that be ok?
[00:54:05] <paul_c> A pick'n'place toolchanger needs to remember to unload the old tool in the correct slot before loading a new one.
[00:54:32] <les> anyway, I hope to do this. I have turkey stuff coinciding with engineering stuff. I want to do both.
[00:54:48] <les> The key is to up the productivity of the machine.
[00:55:09] <les> like one day of cnc time keeps the sanders busy for a week.
[00:55:28] <les> I can do this now thanks to your bugfix
[00:55:36] <Jymmm> * Jymmm pokes les.... look up ^^^
[00:56:00] <les> I can use more power because I can run faster.
[00:56:08] <Jymmm> paul_c: and what were you screaming to me about earlier?
[00:56:23] <les> I have to look at the keyboard...I can't type!!!
[00:56:30] <Jymmm> lol
[00:56:32] <paul_c> * paul_c needs to check all the tp fixes made it in to cvs.
[00:56:40] <les> oh.
[00:56:47] <les> yeah lithium will do.
[00:57:07] <les> EP is good too.
[00:57:11] <Jymmm> * Jymmm hands les color coded irc client that highlights when being spoken to =)
[00:57:18] <paul_c> Jymmm: BDI-4.23 is being uploaded to the server(s) so that you can burn some beer mats.
[00:57:28] <les> it would have to be on the keyboard
[00:57:43] <paul_c> ^G
[00:57:49] <Jymmm> paul_c ah, cool! When I get the replacement cdrom for the laptop I got, I'll try and install it on there.
[00:58:27] <Jymmm> * Jymmm got a ThinkPad i1500 for $50.... the cdrom was going out and got a replacement for $15 off ebay.
[01:00:04] <Jymmm> Dumb thing needs a full charged battery to update the BIOS, will get a Ni-MH battery for $45 when I know the cdrom is working correctly.
[01:00:06] <paul_c> les: Type in "/beep 30 5" to your irc window.
[01:00:26] <les> ??
[01:00:28] <les> ok...
[01:01:01] <les> I did that
[01:01:06] <les> now what?
[01:01:07] <les> haha
[01:01:22] <paul_c> http://www.mirc.com/cmds.html
[01:01:39] <les> looking
[01:02:12] <paul_c> now it will do that every time a line is directed at you.
[01:02:30] <paul_c> </pulling leg>
[01:02:33] <Jymmm> * Jymmm says hi to Jymmm
[01:03:46] <paul_c> /beep doesn't work with ksirc, but I guess it does for Les.
[01:03:52] <les> 30 beeps! haha
[01:04:05] <les> it does not say what initiates the beeps.
[01:04:55] <les> les says hi to les
[01:05:01] <les> no beep!
[01:05:15] <paul_c> pulling yer leg.
[01:05:15] <les> les says hi to <les>
[01:05:21] <les> awwwww
[01:05:50] <paul_c> do you really want 30 beeps every time someone mentions your name ?
[01:06:21] <les> um
[01:06:23] <les> no.
[01:06:35] <les> 4 would be ok!
[01:07:11] <les> haha
[01:25:10] <paul_c> right - Time for bed.
[01:46:26] <Jymmm> les you CAN setup mirc to change the color of text when your name is called.
[01:46:59] <Jymmm> At the top... click on TOOLS|OPTIONS
[01:47:28] <Jymmm> The on the left, expand the section that says 'IRC'
[01:47:54] <Jymmm> then click on 'highlight' and enter in your nicks that you use...
[01:48:16] <Jymmm> and of course, check 'enable highlighting'
[01:48:20] <Jacky^> Jymmm: you swiched my desktop !
[01:48:24] <Jacky^> :)
[01:48:25] <Jymmm> lol
[01:48:32] <Jacky^> nicks*
[01:56:36] <Jacky^> can't find a curvetracer schematic in all the net :\
[01:57:03] <Jacky^> just some simple circuit ..
[02:26:33] <Jacky^> Gnight
[03:40:29] <lilo> [Global Notice] Hi all. Hyperion 1.0 (release) looks ready to go. It includes patches for Y: line checking, unkline propagation, join throttling and ping timeout disable. In about 3.5 hours we'll upgrade the production network.
[03:41:32] <lilo> [Global Notice] This will have a pretty major effect on network operations, but should, if all goes well, be over in about 10 minutes. Thanks in advance for your patience, and thank you for using freenode!
[05:17:31] <Jymmm> Jymmm is now known as Red70sShow
[05:17:32] <Red70sShow> Red70sShow is now known as Jymmm
[06:56:09] <lilo> [Global Notice] Hi all. In about 15 minutes, we'll be upgrading to hyperion 1.0 (release). Thank you in advance for your patience, and have a great morning!
[07:09:52] <lilo> [Global Notice] Okay, here we go.... see you on the other side, hopefully. (Thanks to Australia for lighting the way....)