ROFL... That's why I have the flat belt lathe.. STEAM!
les: You about?
back from dinner
In spiral.c how do we reduce the significant digits to 4 or 5
did Paul send you the source?
darn I keep shutting down the wrong things.
did paul send you the c source code?
well just modify the printf()
and perhaps throw in the missing %
What are the units of r?
you are going to ask me printf() syntax... and I have forgotten haha
let me look
I just did the math
they are inches or mm...depending on G20 etc
why the r 1.061032954
oh he wanted an integer thing
for a spiral x= r* theta * cos(theta)
y= r* theta* cos (theta)
put whatever you want for r really
sin theta for y
Okay. and INT is for the diff from a straight line.
well angular distance of a segment is just r* theta in radians
Okay. I got that. Now for a gcc command.
just the chord length
I get errors on sin and cos undefined.
he #included math.h
Got it with g++ Gcc wanted to fail.
Paul wrote the g++ compile command on the blackboard but I cannot read it
and it ran. wow nothing to this c code writing business<g>
I only knew borland c in dos/windows
That is a lot more than I know.
My last c text was the first edition of K&R and the last compiler was on a tandy 4.
some user prompts for number of turns, initial point spacing, etc would be in order
I will do that when I get a round tuit
les: You've got machine tools, make your own. :)
* Phydbleep is scared.. 3.5 yo running around the living room looking for batteries for her toy..
And with where they commonly go in a toy I hope she never decides the dog needs batteries..
don't worry when I had them that age my son put two butter kinves in an electrical outlet to "get the lectricity out"
he knewe it was good and made things happen and wanted some
especially when my wife put those child guard plastic things in
that just made him know there was something good in there
* Phydbleep is reminded of the Robin Williams bit "I want you to reach behind the TV and FEEL the power!"
He also gave congo the cat a ride in the fertilizer spreader
there was blood...
Bleah.. Poor kiity.
congo is ok... he is right here
16 years old
Cool.. I was hoping that was the case, but didn't want to ask and be told otherwise.
you saw the recent picture of congo and his chicken?
oh I must send you this. Just a sec
Pet chicken or chicken dinner or both?
you willl see
we actually entered this in a photo contest
the chicken follows congo around
Cureent pet, potential dinner. :)
congo does not like his chicken to get too close...but when he is sleepy the chicken snuggles right up and he does not care
I've got a dog that plays 'catch' with mice.
Paul spoiled the chicken feeding it and it pecked him when he didn't give it more food
catch with mice...haha
Couldn't figure out for the longest time what the fsck the dog was going ape about... Tear across the yard, throw something, bark, repeat..
The he would just stop and bark at the ground.. I've been finding mice that looked like they had been slobbered to death and now I know wht. :)
les how many animals you got on that farm of yours?
congo, chicken, some donkeys
I was given some chickens see...
I made a fancy cad designed chicken cage
and I am from the city...
Named Lunch, Brunch and Midnight-Snack?
all but one froze to death the firt winter
on was left...
I just let it out
but chickens are flocking animals
only one around was congo
And the flocking thing started following the cat.... ROFL! :)
so now I have a cat with a chicken that follows him everywhere
it really looks silly
Not as silly as a aussie sheperd pup trying to herd ducks.
and the duck biting back!
Neighbor has an aussie sheperd
sometimes sleeps with congo and chicken on that porch
It knew the chickens weren't allowed to get in the pond (because a chicken is stupid enough to drown) and it didn't seem to understand that the ducks are smarter.
chickens ain't smart...I know that
but pecked Paul if he didn't feed it more
he did feed it more
Paul is easily trained by a chicken!
Pecking == FOOD!
I greatly enjoyed this great intellect interfacing with a pea brained chicken
the chicken likes him really
started following him around
they seemed to be on the same wavelength...
what does that mean?
nevyn_ is now known as nevyn
les paul hen pecks?
Well Les, with an INC 0.01 spiral makes about 2k lines of code.
I can run that in about 60 seconds.
03jmkasunich 07kbuild-0-1 * 10emc2/scripts/realtime:
generalized the code in the realtime script that prevents rtapi from being
unloaded if user space modules are still accessing rtapi shared memory (this
should actually be done inside the rtapi kernel module, not in the script...)
03jmkasunich 07kbuild-0-1 * 10emc2/scripts/realtime: fixed a typo in the previous fix (thanks Chris)
03jmkasunich 07kbuild-0-1 * 10emc2/src/emc/iotask/ioControl.cc: added a call to hal_exit() when ioControl.cc terminates
nada, just working on some drawings.
I still havent looked at your stuff
and I dont have time this morning
going to leave in 15 minutes for work
well, it's 23:30 here
[06:40:23] <anonimasu> http://totallypolished.com/movies4856/movies/Newmovies/TPNEWMOVIES/millingwheels.htm
still trying to view it
I need to leave for work now
yeah took me a while to figure out why it couldn't find the codec... codec wasn't there :P
kinda a crappy video too.
bitrate too hihg, editing sucked, etc
trying to figure out why axis won't run
hm, but it's nice anyway :)
I wouldn't use THAT video as a representation of the machines speed.
Jymmm: well, you will see at what speed a hobby sized mill goes.
when you build one..
anonimasu Yep, 2000fps
Jymmm: I can go fast, but well, dosent matter if you have 5kw too little..
* fenn mutters something about airmotors
anonimasu I'm kidding =)
Jymmm: I see the datrondynamics as the speed I want..
bugt well, I want to push along a 1/2" endmill
anonimasu yours for $35,000 USD
I dont want a datrondynamics though
I want a mill...
anonimasu look at http://www.ai.mit.edu/projects/leglab/mpeg_vcd/
and watch the first movie
skip about halfway through
the "hea" one?
it'll get you the speed, i dunno about accuracy :)
that's as important..
but speed's cool :)
is that controlled positioning
Hmmm, variable speed control of a sewing machine via CNC?!
i think it only has two positions
what, a sewing machine?
no, the series elastic actuator on that movie
oh, didn't look.
oh i thought you were poking fun at me 'cause it just went up and down like a sewing machine
you could use one of those for a mill though now that i think about it
if you had a linear encoder
Not at all, I really would like to be able to control the speed of a sewing machien via CNC
start decelerating before your endpoint just like any other motion control
hm, are you sure you can position it?
are you sure you can position a servo motor?
fenn for simple embrodery
fenn: well, since they ran it that way I guess we will never know..
the question is if the actuator valve responds quickly and repeatably enough at that frequency
anonimasu email that back to me when you can please =)
jymm: work is more important :/
cheeky bugger :)
is there such thing as an air servo?
fenn: Should be.. I've seen air actuators with an encoder.
hm, you can do huydralics with encoders..
is that harder to control than an electric motor? or just not worth the effort
I did a project with a plc as driver..
fenn: The air is jumpy.. You're better off with a real hydraulic system.
Phydbleep: not really a servo is better.
Phydbleep: it puts huge requirements on pressure stability..
unless you have a constant pressure system..
with load sensing valves...
why is air jumpy?
Air want to hunt when you try to fine position something.
hm, same trouble as with huydralics
pressure drop and stuff like that..
you're saying the valve won't open and close fast enough to "bump" the actuator over a little?
then it over corrects..
yeah, and the friction within the cylinder put's another level to it..
i'm looking at using "airmuscles" for a lot of stuff
It has more to due with the expansion that goes on in air even after the valve is shut.
it's an air-powered artificial muscle with no stiction
could be fixed with a hybrid airservo/electric servo system
electric servo has different tuning that makes it correct for the airservo running away
* fenn may be babbling
friction is greater with air also..
is that a bad thing?
since the sticking makes the system over correct..
you're talking about good old drag on the motor right?
oh i guess not
it's before the seals within the huydralics > turns.. <
if you have airmusles you might ovecome it
hmm the turbine design i'm using doesn't have seals anyway
fenn: turbine design?
uses one labyrinth seal.. no o-rings anywhere in it
hm, you are talking about spinning right?
I am talking about linear motion
airmuscles for linear motion, turbine for rotary motion
fenn: Hehehe... i need to get a stack of 9" dia, 1/8" thick stainless disks. :)
hm, how much precision air do you have
how much does your pressure vary if you push it?
or when the compressor charges the tank?
what's wrong with using a regulator or two
like putting a voltage reg on your power supply
if you have any swing you are f*cked..
becasue your electronics will compensate for the pressure drop..
and when you get full pressure again the system over compensates..
there's no way around it except for a extremely stable system..
and that's a hard thing in itself :)
if the air system is large enough you won't have any problems
and if your software is written right it won't over correct if the pressure surges
since the response time of an electric motor is so much faster than an air motor
you just put reverse torque on the airmotor shaft
as long as the pressure swing doesn't throw the torque out of the electric motor's torque range
well, the app I worked on was on a racing car.. ;)
ah well that's a little different
no 50 gallon air tanks
as I said, with a constant pressure system it's not a problem..
has a small ackumulator..
positioning of the clutch
the guy running the car is handicapped..
and the voltage is too low to do it with a servo..
if you have unlimited supply of constant pressure of air/oil, it's less of a problem
hmmm these piezo proportional valves look pretty cool
a monolithic piezo-ceramic strip with integrated electrodes that are specially configured so that the element "bends" when a voltage between 20 and 40V is applied
never seen thoose in action..
just 24v proportional ones...
100 us response time
i find that one hard to believe
the ones I use are about 1000$ each :)
those are current modulated? like, a solenoid is attached to a regulator?
with temperature correction etc etc
yeah but current modulated..
and driven by PWM
who's that guy?
* fenn looks around the room.
the response speed is great, but is limited by oil viscosity
I think I've heard some about him :)
some foreigner i think :)
sounds like that
bet he is a good driver
yeah but he needs a constant air supply or else...
he sufflocates ;)
alex_joni: How's things goind?
alex_joni: seems like things got rolling with toolchanging
atleast on the lists
but.. I'm curious about the outcome
we shall see
tried CL yet?
yes, not too much though
but it seems capable..
even with hal?
or on doze ?
I am going to try the other plc implementation the other guys talked about
need to look what's easiest to do complex stuff in..
well the other (matplc) is a less complicated
not sure it cando RT
cl has some rtai patches (by paul_c in it)
cl has some rtai patches (by paul_c) in it
I'll have a look after work today
cl looks good
i cut a 3D_chips.ngc today :)
it's all fucked up cause i didn't have a 10 mm ball mill to fit in my dremel tool
how would one go about scaling the program down so i can use a 1/8" ball end mill?
if you get a nice one, e-mail me a pic
well... you need the STL model (or what that was from what the g-code has been generated)
and re-CAM it for a 1/8" ball end mill
i was thinking of changing UNITS in the .ini file
and having a smaller product
don't think it'll work
or maybe input_scale
procrastinating figuring out which CAD or CAM program to use as long as possible
I am wrinting a connection scheme..
for 48 pins
* anonimasu faints
* alex_joni is snacking
yeah .. D:
it always is
I hate cables.
you eating cables?
I'll show you a image of why
so .. after you'd eaten them?
yeah yeah eat the cables and blame it on the rats
I kinda like cables
I hate when people don't use connectors though :)
spent all day yesterday re-vamping this foam cutter.. it was all twisted together wires hanging off everywhere
would have been an extra $5 to add decent connectors and cable ties in the first place
I had to move an old robot once
had about 100+ wires to take apart
and mount back later
this may seem like a weird question, but how do you decide where 0,0,0 is on your machine?
in "machine coordinates"
It's pretty much whereever you decide it is and punch "ZERO"
well what if you have a tool changer at 1,2,3 and need to remember where it is next time you turn the machine on
At least that's how it should work for relative coordinates.. For absolute positioning you have to add limit switches/encoders.
can you actually get switches that are accurate to .0001?
i saw an optical device on the net that did that
not exactly something you order from enco
fenn: Optics are the way to go for precision, but I still use mechanicals for 'true/end-limit' feedback.
* Phydbleep is wiring a 'scram circuit' into the main power circuits on the lathe.
no variable speed?
big red shiny panic button
Cut's power, applies brake, requires a manual reset to clear.
OSHA standards specify it must be big, red, and shiny!
fenn: Don't forget 'candy-like'
one of your arcade game buttons?
For now.. I'll get a bigger one later.
alex_joni: I didnt go by home to grab the cam went with a workmate to eat
fenn: switch + index on the encoders
I am curious, could I wire up my index input..
and use it for homing, even if I dont have a servocard?
what kind of output does the index use?
5v I think..
or no it's 5v..
I dont think..
wire it up as a limit switch?
er as a home switch
wire it up to a outocoupler and use the index for locating home..
what's an "outocoupler" do?
I was wondering because I think the code is already in emc
fenn: you'd want to use both
the switch for telling where 0 is..
and move back to the next index for repeatbility..
that way it dosent matter if the switch isnt 0.00001"
* Phydbleep has an index set in the encoders he is working on..
hm, I wonder who I can check with..
an0n: the code is in emc1
but in emc2 it is a lot better
anonimasu: Maybe paul_c can tell you after the chicken training wears off?
Oh crap. :)
Morning paul_c :)
an0n: there's a pdf covering Homing in emc2
* Phydbleep tries to look innocent and fails miserably..
does it come with the cvs?
or is it at the web somwhere?
* anonimasu wont touch emc1 with a stick
as soon as the mode lock thing gets fixed it'll be great
perhaps I should file a bug report..
did you file a bug report?
strange is that it dosent show up in the debug
I am finally done with my writeup what pins go where..
it could be worse..
I need to do 2 more boxes like this.
seems like homing will work like I want it to
it's pretty configurable
now it's just a matter of building a opocoupler board..
an0n: now that's hard :D
that meal was very good. :D
just took me 45 minutes to make it!
and 2 to eat it
now that's what I call a waste of time
I got 1400 error messages
somone made a mass mail
and the mail bounced..
A-L-P-H-A, need to make a CNC powered cooking machine
with web-based interface
use a high power microwave beam
and I mean high power
not those 2kW you usually find ;)
microwaves are not suited to cooking edible food
thoose X-BAND transmitters..
that the millitary uses ;)
anonimasu, I got something whacked... my email was forged to *@edgecam.com
so much fun.
and it was sent in German too!
microwaves with the proper cooking assessory, makes good bacon.
it holds them upright, and allows the fat to drain down.
* fenn shudders
you're not eating the fat.
just the crispy bacon.
no, i'm not eating the bacon either!
we'll see who lives longer
moderation... all in moderation
fenn: who wants to live forever?
alex_joni, me :)
just make a difference, then let something (somebody) put us out of this misery ;)
my colon will be a pristine specimen when they dissect me for medical studies
i'll be framed on the wall, plasticized for all eternity
I assume there are no cellulars around you?
not cellphones, but BTS'es?
i live in a basement
fenn: not good enough
what's a bts?
base transmitting station?
the core of a cell
the heart of darkness
it's where cell phones register to
it's where packets go when they die
a few BTS'es are connected to a BSC iirc
and a few BSC to a MSC
which is connected to a VLR
and there's the HLR where you'r info is stored
like where you are now (on what VLR)
VLR=Visiting Location Register
HLR=Home Location Register
but.. it's been a while since I studied those...and never used it since ;)
so glad i don't have a cell phone
it's pretty much very nice technology
at least the network infrastructure is great
Roaming and such
if you ignore the omnipresent evil pervading any interaction with it
"pay up or die"
but yeah the network is nice
I really like how roaming is handled
you can go from cell to cell during the same call
even to a new operator (like in a different country)
and you won't notice
hand-over it's called (I just remembered)
alex_joni: Until you get the bill. :)
Phydbleep: well.. you'll notice that
but like I said .. I like the technology
Crap.. This summer is going to suck...
65F outsidde @ 4am and it's over 80F in here from all the computers..
it's 5c outside
i'm going to ride my motorcycle all through vermont this summer
we have 24C right now
and it'll get to 27C later
18C outside here.. And it's 04:35.. It's supposed to get to 26C this afternoon.. July/August are really going to suck... :\
* alex_joni can't wait to run to the mountains
Teps will swing from 20C to 50C.. :(
i am shivering right now actually
i need an electric mouse pad
mouse pad warmer
fenn: PDP-11's make wonderfull heaters. :)
Phydbleep: only a pita when you need to move them around
fenn: get a laptop
with a nice 3GHz desktop processor
alex_joni: That's just a crotch-warmer. :)
heat output to the right
it'll cook your hand
if you use an external mouse ;)
i said "warmer" not cooker! :)
well... get a longer arm
then it'll be only warmer
03paul_c 07bdi-4 * 10emc2/src/emc/ (20 files in 5 dirs): Small change to the way iosh connects to usrmotintf.
bah i'm lazy i'll just wait until it gets warm out
fenn: 100W light bulb in a 4"x4' piece of ductwork painted flat-black. :)
heh i was thinking more like a heating pad from goodwill
fenn: Hang it in a corner.. You get light and heat. :)
grow some weed.. you get light and heat and weed
And short term memory something. :)
Phydbleep: there was something.. but I forgot
what was it again?
* Phydbleep can't remember either.
Woohoo! I should have the shop cleaned up enough to take some pictures out there tomorrow.
see.. you remembered
time for more weed
alex_joni: Nope, that was unrelated to what i forgot.
alex_joni: The shop cleanup that is.
i was trying to set my machine coords to zero (testing max speeds on steppers= lots of lost steps = out of range errors) so i typed rm emc.var * to get rid of the stored coordinates
only problem was the space between emc.var and the *
Fido: make sure you don't forget about the cleanup
alex_joni: I was just trying to forget that. :D
luckily i had my .ini file open in an editor
* alex_joni shall remind you
so i ended up reinstalling emc
I'll put it in cron
fenn: what emc / what distro ?
* Phydbleep is installing Cygwin on the shop machine.
you'll only need to checkout it from CVS
i used dpkg to reinstall from the cd since the network cable doesn't reach tothe computer
it didn't reinstall right though.. tkemc is gone
try uninstalling it first
well the files in /usr/local/emc are gone
then install it
i may do that
i like the blue background
apt-get install --reinstall emc
apt didn't like using the cdrom
i did apt-cdrom add /mnt too
* fenn shrugs
apt-cdrom add /cdrom
it was mounted on /mnt though
Debian doesn't use /mnt to hang the drives off.
bdi is the first debian distro i've used
sun's up.. time for bed :)
There's a few differences between Debian and the RPM based distros
btw why is everything under dist/cl/ ?
i thought cl meant classicladder
can't think of any other acronyms
almost finished writing my gcode by hand.
wow. is it a pain. hahaha
A-L-P-H-A: didnt you say that using mastercam was a bit too much
alex_joni: skype ?
anonimasu, mastercam was fck'n up a little too much.
I guess it'd be good, if I had a complex image to mill out. but not for a geometric part.
depends on how you do your part I guess..
paul_c: is that possible in about 1.5h ?
anonimasu, remember that bracket thing i was making?
pretty busy at work right now
alex_joni: just wanna check the thing works..
anonimasu, that... that can be written by hand. I was hoping that mastercam could do it for me easily. But not realy. close. but not exactly.
ok. well then sure
* anonimasu nods
gah... No sound
A-L-P-H-A: well, mastercam outputs better code then you ever could.. most likely
if you can use it
[11:25:08] <alex_joni> http://www.flamingo.ro/produs.asp?id=6139
anonimasu, well... it's helixcal code isn't as good as mine.
it doesn't use helical G02/03. But I do.
unless, it's something wrong with my post processor.
hm, most likely your post..
how do I setup a new mastercam post?
look at one pre-written..
take the tcnc one
just looked at it.
dont have time to check now
hey! it worked.
if it works good mail me it :)
I dont like visualmill
my code compiles..
that means smthg is fishy an0n
alex_joni: yeah got some parts left to do..
going to go out into the shop to check out if I can test the pulse counting
probably #ifdef'ed everything
what's a .Z extension?
found it .. it's compress ;)
unix Z compression utililities..
who the fsck uses that anymore ;)
hm, I cant test this unless I mill the sensor mount..
mill the sensor
this is neverending..
reminds me of a funny story
went to a customer to repair a machine
had some big transistors blew up
and the machinist guy comes along:
"I could mill some of those in about 20 mins"
he said it's not that hard
they do have a notch at the upper end, but beside that it's pretty easy :D
hm, I cant wait for the big mill to arrive at work.. so I can hog more alu at once..
* alex_joni is getting a nice webcam
[11:55:41] <anonimasu> http://www.masak.se/beg/stora_bilder/Abene150_big.html
that one :)
heh.. keep the buttons
and connect them to emc
as long as emc dosent have any online programming it wont happen..
I am the only one here that understands gcode :)
so it's a bit troublesome
an0n: certainly for such an experienced programmer as you are, that won't be hard to add
you might not be up to it..
* alex_joni wonders if an0n could prove him wrong
I'm reading about 2k 4k 20k and 45k issues
Y2K Y4K Y20K Y45K that is
alex_joni: heh, I can prove you wrong..
alex_joni: but at what time?
how about this year?
one sunny day ;)
how's the winter up there?
it's summer :)
summer/winder somthing like it
well.. not now
when it'll be winter
as far as I am concerned it can rain fire..
I always thought northern people have a lot of time during winters
dosent matter, working too much :)
looong days to work
might not be the case in sweden
the machine is going to be running on friday
and I am finishing the program for it..
you still got day/nights there in winter?
more to the north then ;)
although on some days the sun dosent come up..
he might have holidays too :=
it's a 3 hour drive to the finnish border from here
I guess landscape's great there
got some pics from around?
norway has nicer landscaped..
gotta take some ;)
some day ;)
I started coding on somthing yesterday for online programming, but I need to play around a bit with QT, to make a ui..
well.. guess you should get your arse back to work then ;)
I know I have to :)
running on 2 monitors ;)
so I can irc all I want..
the other people are welding the mounts to the machine now..
and mounting huydralics..
anyone ever thought aobut a RC car motor for a highspeed motor?
for a highspeed spindle that is.
A-L-P-H-A: I thought torque was important
alex_joni: after this I need to get home to mill sensor mounts..
anonimasu, not at 10K+ rpm. and endmills that are like 1/32.
anonimasu, think of how much torque these things have to push... those RC cars aren't light.
les had some link to somthing nice
1000w electric motors..
for rc copters
how about some 1-2kW AC motors?
1kw eletric motor...
i wouldnt mind that
alex_joni, like what rpm though.
wtf is 10e54?
only about 4-5k
I have a nice small one here (90W, 3500 RPM)
hmm... 32k rpm motor, ~$50 CDN. + 15% tax.
hm, I want 1/2 at 16000k rpm
although that us kind of expensive.. :)
anonimasu, type again.
err that is
wow. these motors are scary.
* anonimasu nods
I want exactly that. 1/2" ~15k rpm.
you can cut some metal with that..
well. the spindle shaft is 1/2".
the endmill is 1/32.
I want to use it to engrave.
hm, it's still not the same :)
well, gtg for a bit
hobby store opens in 1.5hrs.
* alex_joni goes home
anonimasu, works. want it? the post processor.
the plc discussion is going forward
dcc not going through?
ah no I am at work..
mail it instead
you are anders right?
you got my email then?
I dont know yet
originally it was for TurboCNC 3.0x. I made it be valid for TCNC4.01. (cause it can now do helical G2/3
hm is it emc compatible?
or well no
you need to remove some M stuff...
* anonimasu yawns
maybe I should go home now..
I hate mastercam!
fuck'n nearly destroyed my vise.
sure... I'll make a GIANT gouge into the material, going 30ipm, half in deep, into your part.
A-L-P-H-A: perhaps you should tweak the settings
anonimasu, perhaps I should actually test the code in the simulator
time to check the freak'n mail.
not verifying it is stupid..
I'll re-write your post to match emc :)
verified fine in mastercam. just not in reality
hm, how come?
btw turbocnc has issues.. that's why I stopped running it..
it's not mastercam.. I am sure of it.. there's some masty bug with helical interpolation I cant remember but it fucked up lots of aprts for me
anonimasu, it was.
but anyways... I think it was my fault that caused mastercam to fault.
enought sitting here, doing dink. time to go to the suppliers and crap.
need stock, need tons of bunch of cheap chinese squares, and a RC motor.
tomorrow's it's retaining rings, and bearings.
you want to make the cheap router right?
well my cheap, not your cheap =)
Read my Cad_Cam post...as soon as it appears (in a min or two)
les uh oh, what did you do les?!?!?!
About using treadmill motors. That's your kind of cheap....
les : Actually, it seems more like the linear motion is the costly part, and the electronics are just par for the course.
the servos I use cost $1800 each new
on a bport, right?
yes they are made for that...and routers
les well this one is out of MDF atm =) Not a whole lot of rigidity there (yet)
but...$29 motor + $40 encoder gives .25g and almost ridiculous speed
les what to use as a driver?
only 20v supply for 240 ipm
Hi Les Got a report on running spiral on some "big iron."
les : I'm considering this --> http://www.xylotex.com/3AxSysKit.htm
rayh: how did it work out?
It was a 450 meg pc so we are not dealing in high processing power.
30 ipm was completely clean
and 60ipm ?
60 ipm was good.
180 ipm was rotten
Would characterize that as shudder or whatever.
I could probably test the program at that speed..
Still trying to find a good fast proc and see how it acts that way.
rayh: I can borrow a 3.2 off work, perhaps..
and run my machine on..
although I dont have a stg/vital
Can you hook that to your machine?
but it should show up shouldnt it?
You driving steppers?
Rutex or Gecko?
I've been holding with a purchase of a motenc/stg until everything works..
Okay. I've got the stepper drivers working here on 2.2 athalon.
dosent it show up on steppers?
I see the slowdown as the tiny lines come by but no stutter or loss of continuity.
I wish I could try SQ on emc2
since it's to much smoother..
but well, you cant get everything
Don't I know.
dosent matter too much though
I might just build a 1.2 celeron box here and ship to les.
I find it strange that emc2 is 90% faster..
I don't know that you will see that much increase across the board
when 2 has to do as much work as emc now.
I like when it responds to key input immedatly, like when stopping the machine..
It will be interesting to see how wel it is able to handle bridgeport. I'm getting anxious to see.
I want to switch as soon as we prove it can handle the task.
* anonimasu nods
emc2 seems more maintainable.. atleast what I've seen codewise of it
Yes it is much cleaner.
hm, it seems like the plc discussion has taken off pretty much at the list
Some good stuff there. Hope it keeps up.
* anonimasu nods
I love the talk about the "siemens" type control..
or well, style
I may well not win on classicladder or similar
but there should be a number of ways we can handle this.
as long as it's fairly easy to manipulate..
and constrained to add some safety and reliability
that's the most important part
I hope motion and nc gets separated though..
or well, plc and motion..
A cleaner break between the two would be very good.
aux.. so to speak..
plcs pushing along toolchanges, and being able to move the machine makes for nasty accidents..
Much of the discussion during devfest was about control within the system.
The NIST model is that the task controller is in charge of everything.
plc fails, injects a > G00 x240 y240 during a cut inside a piece..
err pocket op..
HMI and interp feed to the task stack
with a high powered machine, it's deadly..
* anonimasu nods
human machine interface or gui
another phone brb
In my opinion, the task controller is central to it all.
the gui and interp send it messages or place things on it's stack
but it decides what and when.
that makes most sense..
Now that means that much of machine logic has to reside there.
While at devfest we worked up a drawing that showed machine logic
working at several different places.
Some like limits, homes, and probe had to work at servo time and in sync with motion
Stuff like tool change had very loose timing as long as motion was controlled while the tool change was in progress.
* anonimasu nods
certainly not optimal
And clear up at the other end, next to the interpreter was the cannonical
stuff. Do this before this cannonical command and this after.
or don't do a canonical if these conditions are not met.
Those are hard coded in now but are just as much a machine logic issue as are
limits and homes and such.
Someone at fest suggested reading tables and making logic a part of tables.
that sounds and would probably be pretty slow
the actions associated with estop might be read from a kind of checklist.
hm, that sounds like a PLC program, or somthing like it..
Or the specific motions during a homing routine might be read in from a table of possible motions and actions.
hi ray sorry I was on the phne
Yea. The whole thing from top to bottom is like a PLC's logic.
so you ran big iron with servo?
* anonimasu nods
above 60 ipm there was a bit of vibration but it was not until 180 that he saw real studder.
I'm going to make a couple of revised paths and send.
See if we can get a better feeling for what and where.
ok servo or stepper ray?
I'll send them to you also so we have a three way comparison.
The mazak is stg with sd drives and the gettys servos.
These are probably 2k servo motors.
I'll test here with steppers.
If you want, I could set up a single ISA card with a 1.2 celeron and send it to you.
thanks...I can buy a board though
will need one for the BP conversion anyway
There is a line of these available new.
I looked at cheapbytes but Matt got nearly the same board from another similar outfit.
ah, the motherboard ;)
Jon Elson was pretty skeptical that it would run his parport.
Not a glitch. Loaded live and his mods and the motor just ran.
oh on your test...which file? or did you change it...
Loaded 4.20 with last week's sf and his parport stuff worked without a hitch.
His board was the UnivPWM card and two of his servo drives.
* Jymmm hands anonimasu a neck brace for all that nodding. =)
there wwas spiral, spiral2, and any other you might have made by running the c program
I was impressed with the ease of the motion retrofit.
Jymmm: I QUOTE "I AGREE!"
Jymmm: would that be a better thing to say.
anonimasu just nod already =)
unhuh unhuh unhuh unhuh unhuh ... that should keep me in agreement for a while.
rayh oh go answer your 900 line!
Right. "Wame ta talk dirty to ya?
rayh Not tonight dear, I have a headache
Oh. You saw my picture on the web 'eh.
rayh Did you see mine? http://geocities.com/jymmm/
I am designing somthing for engraving on stuff..
Jymmm: I'll have a look at your stuff in a bit
* Phydbleep waves a large magnet @ Jymmm ..
Phydbleep Most Bod Mod are SS
I was thinking one of thoose they have when they do cut scans of the brain..
Jymmm: Electromagnet.. 100kHz drive... Even SS will get hot from eddy currents. :)
BodMod == Body Modification == Tattoo, Piercings, Branding (Yes, a hot branding iron againest flesh)
Well. I can see one way that you could answers a doctors demand that you loose ten pounds.
Oh ray...comments welcome on the "using treadmill motors for servos" thing I posted on Cad_cam
phone sex again brb
Ray is a busy man since he started that business.
and STD free too!
well he puts a condum over the telephone reciever.
les is it ribbed for his pleasure?
les: And people wonder where they lose their cellphones. :)
How difficult would it be to make something to be able to use two PC power supplies to be able to get 24VDC (in a safe manner)?
From my understanding it requires isolating the grounds, but I'm a lil clueless there.
Jymmm: You have to use the +12V from both supplies, You tie the +12V from one to ground on the other one..
Then using the +12 and ground that are left you will have 24V.
Phydbleep : You can't just wire them in series due to them being switching P/S
linear, no problem.
Jymmm: Then you aren't using isolation transformers like you should be.
Phydbleep re-read the question
Jymmm: You use the isolation xfmr to isolate the power and ground.. Then you don't have the nasty loops.
Phydbleep That would defeat the purpose
Jymmm: Why not just whack together a 24V supply?
Phydbleep XMFR are difficult to find with that much current
PC PS are cheap and abundant
* Phydbleep has a 32V/40A lump sitting here.
Phydbleep if you wee to give that to me, the shipping alone would be expensive. see what I mean?
but everywhere there are PC PS, even for free that'll give you 10 to 30 amps
Jymmm: I'm not giving you my big xfmr, You nowhere near cute enough and you didn't ask nicely... :)
Jymmm: Check out isolation xfmrs.. They go on the 110V side and prevent you fry frying&dying. :)
Phydbleep Again, the idea is to avoid XFMR's of any kind.
Jymmm: Then yo're SOL..
Jymmm: You'll have to replace hte regulators in the pc-ps to get the 24V at >1A
Phydbleep I think you're missing the point.
The idea is to use cheap/free PC PS and connect them together with <something>.
Jymmm: I went through the same general bs trying to run an ATX mobo from 12V.
Jymmm: Isolation diodes and a rack of batteries, MIGHT do it.
If I had to have a 24 volt DC supply that can give me about 5 amps,
I'd look at mpjones or avel lindberg for a torroid
The 12 volt on a pc supply is not regulated. It is a multiple of the 5 volt
rayh: Yeah, Or go to the flea-market and grab an old spot welder pack. :)
rayh : Well, the idea was to use cheap/free PC PS's
Jymmm: There's a reason they're frre. :)
I see the value of free.
Jymmm: What about a microwave oven xfmr?
* Phydbleep gets microwave ovens for free all the time.
[19:38:55] <Jymmm> http://web2.murraystate.edu/andy.batts/ps/powersupply.htm
Jymmm: I had one other idea.. Check the junque piles for a dead ibm line printer.. They had a mondo 24V supply in them..
Phydbleep The idea is not to have to scavange around for this or that, just be able to use ATX power supplies. You have 36VDC, connect three, 48VDC @ 10A connect 4
Jymmm: Yeah, It's just a pita with pc ps's.
Here, PC PS are found by the pallets
Jymmm: Yeah, i have a stack of 8 or 9 here as well.
Right, which is why I was saying some circuit in the middle that could plug in as many as you wanted.
Phydbleep That defeats the prupose.
And without re-designing the whole ps, you'll have to have an isolation xfmr or you'll fry something.
:D Soooo good.
Jymmm: pc ps are not designed to daisy-chain.. you could get away with it with SOME of the old AT supplies by cutting/rewiring grounds.
Phydbleep READ MY LIPS.... I said connect them together with <some circuit>
Went to the metal suppliers, didn't have enough cash, guy gives it to me, and says pay next time. So a few hours later, I go back with some coffee, and I get the whole lot for $30CDN flat. 1ft of 2" round rod. 6061-t6. 4"x1/2"x28" flat stock, 6061-t6. :D"
A-L-P-H-A next time bring boose and see wha thte price is?
it's a tuesday. at 3pm.
I was thinking of bringing a 12pack, or a 6pack of something good.
2,3,4,6,8" squares... cheap chinese things... $33.50CDN with tax. :) not too bad.
what other toys do I need... hmm... micrometer.... 0-1" and 1-2". And then I've pretty much have everything... (got the surface guage and grinite block).
* Phydbleep is working on getting a granite slab.
you can buy the cheap ones and fix em up to a better accuracy with a level
I got a real one... but you can go to a counter place, and ask them for stuff.
* Jymmm hands les a slab.... "Calibrate this"
les, you're the only person I know of that lovse to scrap stuff. :)
best ones need an autocollimator...but that can be made from surplus stuff
you don't scrape stone...just lap it
les, uh... fun is with a girl + car + backseat + secluded area. I don't think lapping a granite block is in the category of fun.
alex_joni: Try that connection again.
oh... anyone know of a way to silence a shopvac?
ALPHA: shoot it
it's really loud, when I'm using it to suck away the chips, while I'm machining.
12 gauge ?
just like bagpipes: volume falls off as radius squared
paul_c: anyone home?
A-L-P-H-A: Add a bag of fiberfill to the outlet.
A-L-P-H-A: Like run the output into a 5 gal bucket and drop in a bag of pillow stuffing and punch lots of holes in the lid.
hey, that may work.
A second order low pass filter over the motor area helps some
a box with a small hole in it
A-L-P-H-A: It works to quiet a YZ-250 motor down with just a wad of fiberglass stuffed in the spark arrester shell. :)
les: do you need to call it that fancy?
box with a small hole does sound better
You have to change the fiberglass about once a month thouth on a c-stroke bike.. The oil makes it soggy..
than a second order low pass filter ;)
Well it's like a muffler...no glass or foam
Don't use glass in an indoor muffler.
Use the poly-fill pillow stuffing.
or just buy a Fein vacuum...56 dba at one meter?
this is a shopvac... so there is no oil.
* Phydbleep would rather Frankenstien it. :)
les, that's hardly any sound.
does it have any suction?
how do you can a 3 manuallu?
100 inches h20?
Jymmm: teach me!
let me hunt it up...my figures may be off
A-L-P-H-A: That's why I said the poly-fill.. The fiberglass will not make your lungs happy.
that sounds like a lot.
poly-fill, like from pillows?
A-L-P-H-A: Yeah, Go to the fabric store and buy the big, cheap bag. :)
argh, maybe I'll just get a new shop vac, after it dies.
[20:12:38] <les> http://www.enotalone.com/tools/B00005Q7C0.html
A-L-P-H-A: The other thing you could try is one of the spun-poly water sediment filters.. They look like they have a decent flow rate.
old shop vacs were about 90 dba at one meter
this is an OLD shopvac.
it's LOUD as hell.
I think it's louder than my mill.
you can knock that down 10 or 15 with the box over the motor part (no foam)
A-L-P-H-A: Or you could just be a cheap so&so and go get a 10' stick of the right size ABS pipe and put the vac outside. :)
That's like my dust collection system...I would love to have it ooutside...but it would suck all the heat/cool out
A-L-P-H-A: You'd crap if you heard what I had for a while as a shop vac..
ok in the spring and fall!
A-L-P-H-A: It was the main vac unit for a 2k sq/ft builintin vac system. 220V/10A/100db. :)
The Fein and others get their low noise from the use of the second order absorbers
I have designed some for ITW hand tools
and other power tools
I am not gonna spend 1/10 of the amount I spent for my shop tools on a vacuum.
Fein is $$$
$400CDN? I only spent like $4K on my whole shop.
A-L-P-H-A: That's why I said a 5 gal bucket and a pillow. :)
ok for business...not so good for hobby
hm, how many dollar's is that?
OH!!! are these the ones that cleaning ladies use?
[20:20:23] <A-L-P-H-A> http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=20615&item=4381669346&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW&tc=photo
A-L-P-H-A: are they more or less then usd?
1.26CDN = 1USD
1.26579CDN = 1USD
well, that's a cheap vaccum.
1.59517CDN = 1EUR
57.8 dba 1 meter...you could hear a whisper!
A-L-P-H-A: So $1CDN == 2 shiny beads and a whack with a stick?
I wish the Canuck dollar was weaker.
I'd start selling on Ebay again.
ALPHA's currency is becoming worthlesss...and so is ours
I was making a living doing that.
les: $1USD == 2 shiny beads and 2 whacks with a stick. :)
that tends to happen when massive budget deficits are financed by selling treasury notes to Japan and China.
Which make the Chinese RMB (Renmembi) worth about a stubbed toe. :)
I'ts just a massive transfer of wealth...
I am not on the right side of that transfer!
les: That's why I'm setting up to produce steam stuff. :)
Whad I say? Is ray a republican? heheh
I think he ran to call his broker and dump his Enron stock. :)
Oh he was just busy with that phone job.
any of you guys have experience with elevators?
I've been locked into one once..
alex_joni: Not that doesn't involve voiding the warranty. :)
I mean smart controls for elevators
like genetic programming & stuf
I know nothing of them
alex_joni: Same answer, Not that doesn't involve voiding the warranty. :)
I know how they work, but never seen one in use in anything like that
an0n: I wanna help some friends
they need to build such a system (as a project)
I've seen ga's used for traffic lights and such..
yeah, but why a ga in such a application, what are the pro's and con's ?
and what are they going to use it for?
anonimasu: It is really only useful in a multi-elevator setup, It needs to be able to assign cars as 'express' and bypass whole blocks of floors.
alex_joni: I'd think they just use logic in commercial controls
an0n: I know
but the goal is to do something out of the ordinary
to learn the building
like when somebody regularely leaves at the same time from the same floor to send a lift in advance
and such tasks...
anyways.. it was worth a shot, I'll keep googling ;)
alex_joni: that's not a GA like task..
alex_joni: optimizing the most efficient traversal order in a multi elevator system is..
kind of hard to apply :)
I know ;)
that's why usually you need some smart programming
like spiking neurons
or markov modells
* Phydbleep has to go pick up a stack of granite slabs tonight.
You can find the damndest thing if you get on the phone and look for scrap. :)
granite slabs - Oft used in grave yards.
does that count as crap?
Yep.. And it's morbid as hell, but 90% of the time you want to ask for the "dead stock". :)
and.. the best thing
* Phydbleep has seen some real crap as monuments.
no customers complaining
"rock of ages" here makes both monuments and surface plates
My monument WILL be a surface plate.
les: Hehehe... The local shop classes will come to your grave and check their precision. :)
les: going to have somone measure it with a laser convergence meter?
or whatever the name was..
autocollimator.... and yes. Of course. It must be Lab grade. +/- 25 millionths flat.
Actually I may make a "make your own autocollimator from junk parts" write up sometime.
use quicksilver to adjust ;)
let's see....how about an angular resolution of...say....01 seconds of arc?
with junk parts.
hm I wonder if I have anything I can sharpen enough to engrave with
might a centerdrill work..
anonimasu, tips are easily broken... unless it's a dormer. dormers rock.
A-L-P-H-A: it's a dormer ;)
with a very light, highspeed rpm, pass.
another tip, just file half a drill, and use it.
like a broken drill bit.
I'll use a centerdrill..
how does 0.1 sound as a pass?
that's good. (mm right???)
anonimasu, UNITS! are good.
I forget... is a hedge hog, and rod, weights? or units of length?
it's a hedgehog..
I'll go outside to try it out now..
hm, a 2kb .cnc file for my engraving..
[21:32:16] <A-L-P-H-A> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_strange_units_of_measurement
<-- entertaining read
my favorite is the milli Helen
amount of beauty that can launch on eship.
I personally like attoparsec.
just sounds neat.
I am just rating ex wifes and GF in millihelens
any in the single digits?
some are old now...so microhelens
0.1 means, you need 10 to launch one ship.
but what kind of ship?
if it's like a cheesy lazer... that's like maybe a 5 helen.
now if it's a $100million yacht, that helen unit changes.
so it'd be like 0.000005 helens?
ok exes when they were young (one still is) were pretty good.
10 millihelens at least
les, if she's older than 26, she's not young.
shut up or I will start dccing you pictures...haha
10 milihelens would be 1 helen.
I'm smoking crack.
I was thinking centihelens.
I wonder would there be a yottahelen.
roltek couldn't take it anymore
did he say anything before?
He just got in a state of depression assigning units to his GF
hmmm no I think last ex might be 40-50 millihelen
and with a few beers a good bit more!
les, so, don't allow her to christen the ship, and just drink the bottle of champaigne instead.
[21:48:26] <A-L-P-H-A> http://www.unc.edu/~rowlett/units/prefixes.html
yotta...zepto...sounds like the marx brothers
I had better bookmark that...it couls come in handy in my continuing efforts to confuse and bewilder...
[21:51:28] <A-L-P-H-A> http://www.unc.edu/~rowlett/units/index.html
all right. rating time.
you are in your twenties right?
* A-L-P-H-A hands les a big bottle of alcohol... just move on. :)
I'm 25, soon to be 26.
recent picture of ex. I am 51. Rate it.
dcc probably won't work, unless you're registered user of freenode.
it turned out good
although crap compared to how it would look if I had a sharp centerdrill..
it was pretty dull
been drilling c-rod with it
high carbon rod..
uh oh...dcc is not going...
A-L-P-H-A: you can harden it if you like...
* anonimasu did scrap a piece for work to engrave it on
well, I'll face all pices later so it dosent matte :)
uh, I was hoping that you were going ot do it like, on alu.
not something hard.
yeah, I was doing it in alu..
the c-rod was somthing I've drilled with the centerdrill earlier..
dulled it quite a bit
it's been in my lathe for a couple of months ;)
I always have a couple spares.
need to get another one at work..
dormer #2 center drills are expensive. :(
I think I paid like $8 for each.
I cant wait until I've finished theese parts..
so I can re-build my mill totally
rate in millihelen
there's vibrations from the gearbox..
I think the other vibrations I see when cutting is imbalance in the holder..
or somthing like that..
but well the gearbox is the worst
03paul_c 07bdi-4 * 10emc2/src/emc/ (drivers/simio/simbase.c motion/emcstepper.c): Commit some of the stuff that should have been done at the codeFest - Need to test the hold time to make sure it does what it is supposed to..
[22:02:46] <anonimasu> http://www.bojn.net/~an0n/AUT_6226.jpg
helens... umm... 0.005 helens? If you got enough, they could push the boat into the water...
1/2 a millihelen.
that's how it ended up looking
exponential growth though is my scale.
so, if you say... Sarah Michelle Gellar, that'd be like 1 helen.
5 millihelens? even in the camo gear?
but say... Cindy Crawford, it'd be like 0.9 helen. good enough to just launch the ship anyways.
I just saw the top... I thought it was an ugly shirt.
oh I forgot...helen is the face that launched a thousand ships. Boobs don't count?
Helen of troy. I know.
it's been on discovery channel for like a week.
I'm not a boob man... though I look at them a lot.
I am. hence the higher rating.
40 millihelens easy!
hhaha. I was sitting at lunch with my business partner... the waitress was standing right beside me... and her boobs are at eye level.
he goes "Lloyd, eyes up".
she was really cute.
There's a hostess, that was working a restuarant, she was really freak'n cute. But a little ditzy.
A 29 YO Georgia moonshiner's daughter with a camo outfit rated 40+ millihelen for me easily
what is a helen?
she was confused, like she lost her pen or something, so she spun around, on one heel, in confusion. I got such a kick out of that.
We had better fix your glasses with a GEORGIA prescription
what's the reference you compare aginst?
anonimasu, a unit of measurement.
unit of beauty
A-L-P-H-A: yeah I know
[22:12:23] <A-L-P-H-A> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_strange_units_of_measurement
<-- entertaining read
helen of troy had the face that launched a thousand ships
one millihelen will launch one ship.
I got that wrong...
I got the scales wrong.
I'm gonna shut up.
ok I will take the 5 millihelen
I need a nap... the coffee isn't doing it for me anymore.
she is 4 years older than you.
21 years younger than me.
eeew... that's like me dating a 4 year old.
les = pedophile.
lloyd, let me tell you someting...29 year olds are not little girls.
that stuff stops matter when the age of both people are old...
A-L-P-H-A: while you cant date a 4 year old it's perfectly fine for led to date a 29 year old ;)
[22:16:31] <A-L-P-H-A> http://www.lmwatts.com/materials.html
<-- <title> is "test"
A-L-P-H-A: you are shit out of luck there :p
[22:17:01] <A-L-P-H-A> http://www.lmwatts.com/materials.html
test...yeah I must change that someday...
hohum... not a lot done today..
The picture of me you are hunting in on bio
no, from the email.
your picture's from code fest already
Just wondering if the rest of us get to vote on the piccie...
oh rating Joy in millihelen?
[22:20:42] <A-L-P-H-A> http://www.lmwatts.com/a.gif
<-- is that an anarchy sign?
ok,ok, I have a little problem with authority.
"Tiger", The "Waco" of Georgia.
I promise to be good though. Kinda.
they did have a shootout on the main street in Tiger...
Michelle just called and said she killed a 4 ft copperhead behing the art gallery
remember the baby on I ran over?
didn't you club the baby to death wit that golf stick ?
heh...no the lawn tractor
it was already pretty dead.
Michelle said the 4 foot one was as big around as her arm.
setup/hold times done.. skype installed. time for a fag.
les: Boots! :)
snakes in the grass a lot here
I never kill em though
paul did skype. cool.
I've decided to use QT..
if you do commercial development you need a license for QT..
otherwise thers a freeware version..
I have just been trying to set up audio and video conferencing
cheaper than travel
I am thinking of coding somthing for writing quick gcode online at the mill/lathe
but what'�s keeping me from starting is time and that I havent touched QT with a stick..
jog + add point
that you can use from the panel..
to hack togther some pockets or a shaft with tapers and some threads..
I remember that robot in a room that you could actuall control via a java thing on the web
silly but fun
without resorting to a cam program..
cant really place anything on the lathe here else..
I would make it pick up blocks
no, at home..
my father dosent do g-code
no the web robot
Cool to remotely pick up blocks in australia with a robot from here via web
the only thing I am curious about are toolpath generation algoritms..
havent looked at that too much..
it is complicated
you can buy some toolpath engines though
les: I got screamed at when I mentioned QT.. because it
it's almost commercial..
les: I am not thinking ( pockets..
or well, acutally I was thinking a user input mode where you can jog and add points..
to your path..
teach in or somthing like that..
a one time use cam program using plastic on the web is intriguing
or rather, what is 2plastic"
you sign in...draw your stuff.... a g-code is emailed to you...you pay with secure web credit card
good idea anon.
online programming is what I refer to entering code on the controller is.. :D
cam systems are costly to buy
the idea is great
a web based on eon a low cost pere use basis...
let me try that again
java + a commercial toolpath generator, and post processor..
a web based one on a low cost per use basis
it is that time of day where the evening sun is shining in the window and I can't see the monitor
a good time to break for supper...
It's bedtime over here :)
I found a mill..
[23:06:28] <anonimasu> http://www.blocket.se/view/5041499.htm?caller=nbl_s&l=0&c=1&city=0
neat little size
err neatly sized one
damn, my knife will only hold six blades! argh
anyone interested in a Fanuc A-200?
Complete with Karel A-200 controller. US$4k
anonimasu: What are they crap?
Phydbleep: I dont know what a A-200 is.. really
and you are in the usa..
it might be the worlds nicest mill, but shipping is about $3k