and anyway, it would cost more. I aint that rich
just shot out an email to Till on the list
hope it makes sense.
does it say "all your base are belong to us"?
it is about segmentqueue and cubic.c
when does paul_c get to you?
in about a week
les: got a soltion?
I have my G200x running on my bench btw :)
We wiil just run on a real machine and try to debug.
ever seen a NEMA34 stepper spin at 3000rpm? ;)
Also I will have the glentek folks visit while he is here
At that time we will decide on the idea of marketing cnc machines.
hm, I wonder what torque you have :)
at 3000? not much i guess
les: My samples came in for the sensor chips.
* anonimasu nods
but it has the same power outout as at 600rpm ...
Phy which sensors?
For the 4096 ppr encoders.
so, with some gearing ... anyway, 3000rpm was too fast really, just a test of how fast they spin
There's an 8-pin dip to test with and something I can barely see for the production ones.
hmm constant power means min radii are the square of the speed
no wait a sec
let me think
the cube of the speed
square sounded better
constant torque is square...A= V^2/r
so constant power must be a cube
torqu drops off lineraly with rpm
for constant power
spinning at 6krpm is still cool
torque = k/V for constant power...speed goes up, torque goes down
but usable speed
and anyway, min radii is related to available acceleration,
which is torque
OUTPUT torque of the motor/gearbox combo .. not motoro torque
so with a constant power output ..
and 2:1 or 4:1 gearbox ...
so in general corner radii go up as the square of speed for servos and the cube for conventional steppers right?
I get the same output torque at a particular output shaft rpm
internally, the motor spins twice as quick
with half the rpm
of course if you supply more baseline torque in the first place you can compensate some
not really, no
because stepper system do not operate torqu limited
they usually operate well below stall torque .. maybe only 25%
I mean to the stepper...providing that inertia does not go up the same amount
so from a typical stepper system you get the same corner radii at low and high speeds, simply because its so far within its margins ..
so it's just a torque to polar moment of inertia thing
this will change witht he "unstallable" G200X variant of course :)
gee I think that ratio is called?
i ahve the basic FPGA based variant running fine ...
Well good. It's still in the running...
I of course still want an emc commercial machine
hey, I would have thought you two went to code fest.
when is it again?
nah, not me
if we cannot fix segmentqueue fully it's just plain dead
for me, EMC will never spin steppers like dedicated hardware
agreed...native pc is not the place to generate steps
the simplicity of a USB connection from a standard PC running either 'doze or linux, no RT complications ...
0.191 oz-in is weeak.
A-L-P-H-A: geared down 100:1 its fine.
jymm meant oz in s^2
inertia not torque
yeah rotar inertia
robin_sz: That was the other reason i wanted to offlod to the hardware.. No rt. .No mp3 player glitches. :)
Phydbleep: yeah, agreed
so long as its open source hardware, I'm happy :)
les was looking at oriental motors website, but I'm clueless (espeiaclly today)
I used oriental motor steppers for some of that encoder production testing gear
wow. that's really fine movement. 100:1
has everyone bailed...
I dont think you should offload the segment planner from the p...
still franticlly packing
watch it only be paul_c showing up. heh
jmkasunich, bring a webcam.
has Imperator been around? he might already be on a plane
unless you can backport/port changes that happens to whatever you generate your motion with back to the the program..
and then setup a direct link, so I can video confrenece in, and shove my stupid 2cents in.
he is I think
anyone greeting him at the airport?
got a mail from him, he's staying at the same motel as me, I wanted to arrange a meeting time/place
he was going to stay down here with Paul and I after the code fest but could not get his flight changed at such a late date
I've been stuck at work last few days, no chance to touch base with folks
anonimasu: I'm offloading the movement path storage and all the encoder logic.
jmkasunich, don't touch people's bases without permission... otherwise you may get slapped, or worse, beatup.
jmkasunich Greetings. :)
* jmkasunich is too tired for A-L-P-H-A's banter
Phydbleep: motion planning?
JMK I just wrote a longish list email to Till
shit... I gotta finish getting ready.
Hope it makes sense
I'm supposed to be packing my truck this evening, and it's fscking SNOWING!!!
read it and tell me what you think
jmk it will freeze tonight and snow above 3000 feet
jmkasunich: Snowing? It's sunny and 71 here.
we have an inch already, and expecting 3-5
* Jymmm email's MotherNature@Earth.org and request is stop snowing till jmkasunich finishes loading the truck.
1-3 above 3000 here
Jymmm: it will probably bounce
she has serious spam filters
Of course sunny and 70 means that we will probably be ass deep in snow tomorrow. :)
jmkasunich : Actually, just got an auto-responder back... Will respond to your request come Summer time.
This kinda look interesting --> http://www.embeddedtronics.com/microstep.html
can't believe it... eariler this week it was almost 80, sunny and beautiful
* Phydbleep lives in New Mexico where if you don't like the weather you can wait 5 minutes or leave.
les: you email sounds reasonable
It is my best understanding of how it works
yours is probably better than mine
when it comes to the TP, I just copied EMC1 for EMC2.
i.e. the cubic subinterpolator doesn't really do much of anything.
in time I want to rip it out and do something better, but...
Well I will beat up anything you guys do up there on a real high speed machine with Paul's help
at least servo stuff
well, gotta go and load stuff up
The main thing we want to do is completely debug segmentqueue
ok john go load in the snow
(was just hoping to talk to Imperator or other folks heading to fest)
* Phydbleep wanders off to get wood..
Hmm... Maybe I should have said 2x4's instead..
thought you were building a fire
I ought to...it's 43 now
No comments from any of you on that driver?
(btw, PIC's can be reprogramed, right?)
read back but did not see
have oldtimers I think
les this http://www.embeddedtronics.com/microstep.html
Yeah, These are all flash parts I'm using.. With external fram for data storage.
Looks ok I guesss
for very small machines
les why's that?
just the ratings
Big and small machines might have different meanings for us
les - well it's something like that or like xylotex
well it is enough for a sherline or something
not for a bridgeport
les I was looking at this, then robin_sz pointed out that it doens't do microstepping http://www.pilotltd.net/cnc.htm
marginal for a mill drill
les It'll be used on somethign you can carry in your hands =)
you need microstepping for sure.
I dont have any, but PIC programmers are cheap iirc
I got an ATMEL STK300
but thats about it
I am buying some of those shumatec dros that use them I guess
waiting because mousr has some of the parts back ordered
I am putting dros on a bunch of machines
table saw, planer, etc
How do you do ISP on a PIC?
now that they are dirt cheap
(just being nosey here)
in system programming
well in this case I just download a doze program and run it rs 485 I think
let me get a link
So most PICs permit this?
[00:45:39] <les> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ShumaTech/
do most drivers have a BRAKE circuit in them?
most use dynamic braking
When my machine brakes it returns the kinetic energy to the power supply cap
anon you are up late!
gosh must be 0300 or something there?
that is not up late...it's up early!
jymmm 1/2 MV^2=1/2C(V+Vrise)^2
Vrise is about 5 volts for me now
if segmentqueue is fixed it will be MUCH more
yup thought so
ok you are just an early riser
les whats that for now?
les that's what I say... huh?
les what was that?
les <les> jymmm 1/2 MV^2=1/2C(V+Vrise)^2
left term is kinetic energy
les: still havent gone to bed
les Ah, ok
right term is energy stored in a capacitor
wow anon I can't do that kind of stuff anymore
les: oh, I'll sleep tomorrow instead
les: I am getting too old for doing it also
heh yeah I used to do all night parties or work
And I worked the night shift for a couple years
I was a manufacturing process engineer for an IC wafer fab line long ago on the night shift
workers would often fall asleep
not on our night shifts... ; )
and guys and girls would do naughty stuff in empty offices
I did that I guess
Who did what in which empty orifice?
I was pretty young
and so were the girls
percs of the night shift
PHY...we did what girls and guys might be expected to do at 2 am in an empty building
ahhh it certainly was not work then
It kinda is now.
BTW.. Did you know that dyslexia can be fun? Driving down the street reading signs and see one on a mini-mall reading "Orifices for rent, Inquire within."
I had to pull over and park I was LMAO..
reminds me of last time I went down to u. of florida with my son (I went there)
we got a motel room and it turned out to be a cathouse
les starting his education right I see
well The entire University of Florida was pretty much a cathouse I guess...but no charge.
* anonimasu makes a mental note on where to apply
bet the Student Service Medical was open 24/7
I um...didn't get out of the place single though.
les Repeat after me... I DONT, I DONT I DONT
i did i did i did
well, that's not really a bad thing or is it?
oh I went back to school in my mid 20's after a bit of a break to finish my engineering degree
those 19 year old girls...
what can I say?
I bet a uni is a good place to meet somone..
girls without brains are the worst thing there is..
Too bad I don't have a date...I would be at the tiger drive in right now
no dates...because no girls
well under 80
les what about that one girl thats sweet on ya?
and you pick em up truck
oh that girl at the food mart?
what, shes 82 or something?
no...just not my type
[01:22:11] <les> http://www.tigerdrivein.com/
I would like to go though...
they still have those?
A relative of mine reopened an old one here
nevyn_ is now known as nevyn
les You're in GA? I thought OH for some reason
yeah ga but right at the north carolina border near the smokey mountains
The highest terrain east of the mississippi is around here
just under 7000 ft
just checked the weather station on the highest peak but it is down due to a lightning strike they say
should be about 20 degrees there tonight
kinda cold for almost may
I am from chicago...so not so bad
JMK is in ohio and it is snowing a lot there now
surely, surely anon has fallen asleep now and his head is on the keyboard
no way :)
you know this is VERY unusual weather we are having
anonimasu WAKE UP AND GO BACK TO SLEEP!
it will kill many crops
[01:37:43] <les> http://www.srh.noaa.gov/productview.php?pil=GSPAFDGSP
40 knot wind at 850 mb...I am at about that pressure altitude here
That's a chill factor of about 0f
and almost may!
this is incredible.
anon that is about 60 km/hr wind at -1c
well I am going to have a snack and hit the sack I think
* Phydbleep abuses Postscript with a rudely shaped turnip.
What is a MT2 taper? Or I guess I should ask, what do I want to know about it
I can't find a comparison list =(
Jymmm: MT2 == Morse Taper #2
no drawbar though, correct?
* Phydbleep is still abusing Postscript with a rudely shaped turnip.
Drawbar? Lock in bolt?
like I said, what do I want to know about it.
nope.. Whack it in, it's a friction fit.
ok, that's what I needed to know.
Might want to paint it with some dye-chem and check the fit.
Nah, just saw a mini mill with a MT2 but wanted to be sure that was what it was.
Depending on the spindle it may be a 70%+ contact or it may be two contact rings.
MT2 == standard bits. :)
How's that for an answer?
that one sucks
your 2nd one was much better =)
when you said friction, that actually answered all the questions I had
Hehehe.. it looked like you wanted a technical answer.. I gave you one. :)
not many place describe/compare collets/tapers
like "this is good for blah"
Morse is a shallow cone with a flat tang.
Take care of it and it'll last 50 years. :)
Hell.. Longer than that.. My lathe is from 1937 and the tapers are fine, the ways are a little worn but not bad enough to affect what I want.
this was a mill using mt2
As long as there's a hole in the spindle for a knock-out bar your fine.
yeah, but sounds cheesey
Stuck MT is no fun. :[
* Phydbleep is still abusing Postscript with a rudely shaped turnip.
Actually it's 'vi' and 'wordpad', but it's still blunt instruments.. :)
Wow.. This is scary... This POS-tscript hack is actually working. :)
I have a PWM track with a 720 count tach track inside that.
All in a 2" dia circle. :)
* anonimasu sighs
I need caffeine
hm, how small could you make it?
* Phydbleep has had too much caffeine..
and could you etch that designon glass?
Oh yeah.. Photo-etch and it's perfect.. I was looking at the elctroforming process les(I think) was talking about for doing them in nickle.
if you find somone to make the screen for you that'd super precise
But.. I'm going to print the test units on an inkjet because I'm a cheapskate. :)
a 1000$ investment if you can make 1000 encoders for under $2 each and have them very precise is a good deal..
or more encoders..
I can get them in mylar real cheap.
I have no idea what mylar is..
[12:39:25] <Phydbleep> http://www.thinmetalparts.com/Mylar_encoders.htm
25 million dpi res. :)
hm, I need encoders like that.
I'll use 2500 dpi of it and have lots of precision. :)
0.016mm per dot..
cant call that lots of precision really
5mm/2000(1000 line differential encoders)
although I run that x5 at the drives since I cant generate enough pulses to push it along at the speed I want
4096 ppr.. 0.0898 degrees/step.. 10:1 geardown with most leadscrews gives 40960steps/inch.
and I run 4:1 for more torque..
That 10:1 is just the leadscrew.. are you running a 4:1 on top of that?
err.. damn wrong way
it's motor 4:1 leadscrew
so 16384 steps/inch for you with this..
That's not precise enough for you?
Wow.. That would feed at 90 ipm with these..
the precision isnt the trouble :)
the speed is
that's more like it ;)
atleast that's the speed I crave for.. but my machine wont make it at that speed ever
the encoders I have now :)
90 ipm is full control.. It will traverse at whatever speed the drive units will take.
[12:51:08] <anonimasu> http://www.galilmc.com/products/optima/dmc1800.html
one of thoose 5 axis cards ;)
but a 3 axis drive are 795$ + the card
err 4 axis
They like to think those are soid gold don't they. :)
galil is good :
I wonder if you could use that card with emc somehow
but well a vital is cheaper, although a dumb card
* Phydbleep is building a smart-box.
* anonimasu yawns
I hope it'll work :)
WooHoo!... PWM, Tach and Sync all on one wheel!
* Phydbleep got it..
Now to save it before I fsck up and lose it.
Got it.. Two copies even. :)
anonimasu: Want to see it?
* Phydbleep is going to run off and fall over before the meeting gets going..
AMP-19540 4-axis drive for four brush or brushless motors up to 500 watts $795 / $495
hm, no 0-10v in on thoose :/
pdf xfer lost some detail, but you'll get the idea.
Not bad for hand hacked .ps.. :)
Especially as I had to learn it as I went.
you should generate a SVG out of it..
scalable vector graphics..
scales from 0,001 to infinity..
Ahh.. i was going to generate a app tha would take the data and spit wheels too.
[13:15:52] <anonimasu> http://www.adobe.com/svg/
same tech as the icons in OSX..
The encoder looks fine
Thank you. :)
I'll be back later going to find the fuel pump on my car
Well, I'm off to fall over because i'm seeing little vector lines everywhere..
G'nite, G'morning, Good grief it's 0720.. :\
Good morning all.
it is at that
I am back with more problems
and needing some help with my limit switches "again"
this is to do with the ini file
still there dave?
now I am
do you use tool length....g43 g49?
yes I certainly do
if I do....g43 Hn then the tool length shows in Z immediately
however if I then do a g1 xn yn the Z takes off for the basement.
but in an opposite direction of your intended pos.
any move that does not have an explicit move in z does this
are you using a home
yes I think that's right
I have buried a tool or two meself
you mean Z is all of a sudden not modal?
I think that violates rs274ngc
I would say it's modal
you have a copy of my turkey call prod code right?
that shows g43 very well
no I don't
let me dcc it...have a look
touch your part and call it zero, go back home and that will be your z height offset
when you call up the g43 hn then you tell z to go to zero and it will be at the top of the part
as I understand it modal says that a value that is set stays that way until set to something else
when you call out the g43 Hn from the home pos. then you should see a positive # in the pos screen that matches the # in the tool height offset. If z down is z-
yep that works.
when you go to zo does it go to the top of the part
however you cannot command z0 ... it cannot be smaller that the z offset
Note I touch off in the program with zero offset using g92 in mdi
g1 f10 z0
then first tool is .75 higher
after the g43 in the program it stays that way until a g49
btw what about your home switch prob trp?
then any -z will be in your part and any +z will be above
...I measured all of my tools with the height gage
then entered those values into the tool table.
those of course reflect the tool tip when z is in home position
my standard tool holderis zero offset
I use that as a datum for the others
I measure them in a dial thickness gage table
which should work... I could subtract my shortest tool length from all but that doesn't alter the problem of having to set an explicit z for any move
?? I don't...it just takes care of it
I touched off with the standard tool...and the program starts with a tool 0.75 shorter
so -.75 is the offset in the var file
les, do you use a g55... with a z offset
and z ends up going .75 lower than before for a z move
trp I gennerally do not use a z for g55
just a safety thing
Do not like to mix g92 and g55 z
gets confusing that's all
I'm using 2.18 with a 25 Mar cvs
thats right I was just wondering how you get a tool with zero offset for a datum
well I use my tool holders...and just pick a particular one to touch off on
most of the tools I have are constant length
for example a .02 end mill and a .5 are the same length
but a few are not
thats makes setup easier
yes it does
how about the limits
I am told to use bridgportio for this setup and I dont see how to assign my pins fort the limit and home.
I use dio on the stg servo card but it should be similar
all limit switches are normally closed on mine
safer that way
I have a 24 volt supply out to prox switch which when activated pull in a relay and send 5 volt to pin 12 on the parpart
what is brb phone
trp...I don't think there are enough pins on the pport to do what you want.
Yes, Smithy Mill is set up this exact way and I dont have a copy of the .ini. Ray was supposed to get me help but went to DC before I could catch him last night
at this point I'm on a stg and there I have all the inputs I need for axis home, fault, and + and - limits
I think they use all the homes on one pin
I am using the limits as a home also.
when homing the limits are deactivated til the cycle is finished.
and what is not working about this?
I just dont know how to set up the .ini file to make it happen.
right now the relay trips and sends to signal to the # 12 pin and nothing happens
need coffee! back in a flash
I think all you need is the state ( 0 or 1 ) set correctly in the ini file for each axis
mmmmmmmm. coffee. I tried that and it starts up in e-stop when changed. no way to get it out of e-stop either when I change the polarity
The pin doesn't seem to be assigned to anything yet
#12, 13 or 15 that is
On som estepper production testers here I homed by driving it into a limit
on stepper emc I am not sure
been there, done that.
not sure about how or whether switch state change latches
should work the same with stepper or servo
yeah...but I use index pulse...so home switch doe some different things
it reverses direction and enables index detection
limits wont work either
and it does latch
using +5 on all of these?
paul_c said to hook up to 12, 13 "or" 15. thats what I did to 12
are the pport pins assigned in the ini?
I dont see an assignment for limits in the ini file
or home for that matter
which makes me think they are hard coded
I would think so.
right now I am using minimilltask
should I try bridgeporttask
according to ray I am supposed to change something else also but he is unavailable for comment at the moment
I rather expected Ray and Matt to be on this morning
send Ray and email...I'm sure he is checking his mail
funny ieee 1284 lists +7 max input voltage on pp
already did that but was hoping to get some work done this morning
Im in a hurry and dont know why
well it is always nice to get a machine running
dave-e, did you get the g43 worked out
I looked at the code from Les...and he doesn't have the problem I do
he can make moves that work the way I think they should
what again is your problelm
and are you at your machine
that unless I specify a Z value with any move the Z heads for min Z ... max neg value
not at machine
when you are home does your z read 0
but before I do a g43
after g43 it reads the tool z offset
when you go to touch off take that # and put it in the Hn position for that tool
go back back home and call out the g43 Hn and see what it reads.
I don't do it that way...I just use a height gage for tool length
so if I do a g43 H6 then I get 2.43" on z
g43 H3 get me 6.45"
my part top is at -7.3"
Then the offset is wrong
for that tool
only if one assumes that top of part is tool length
top of the part is "0" usually
do you have emc running on a box in front of you
that still doesn't solve the problem of being able to move without a declared Z value
no emc on this box...just a desktop machine
home is the declared z value.
the offset is the difference between home and top of part
Try this when you get a chance
home all axises
increment z down 1"
go to that tool and put in the 1" into the tool you would call out with the g43 Hn
go to MDI and call out g43 Hn
Increment down 1". Your z should read zero at that point
wait you should go back to home before calling out the g43 Hn
that make sense and that will work.
if you dont the z will read 0 where you are setting
I'm just bitching because to make things work I have to ...
so z is now 3.42 inches
is that the # you have in the H6 pos
now to move I do: G1 X 5 Y 0 Z 3.42 F20
no you have to do a zo to get to the offset pos
notice I didn't want z to move so I had to say so...otherwise it simple heads for the bed
z moves without a commanded move
is that right?
that is what is happening and I don't think that is right
no it is not
since all the "experts" are at nist I'm going to try to contact them ....
without commanding z to move it should not do anything. what happens when you go to zero
I get a out of range error
how much travel do you have in z
since 0 is not +2.43"
mine does not actually move with JUST a g43
true ... just changes the z offset
wonder if the code is broken
I think so
g43 wont move it.
no just reflects the position of the tool tip
if you give it just an x move what happens
z moves neg also
why do you put in a 1" tool length after you home z0.0 . if your moving your tool down 1" it should z-1.0 for tool offset or at least that's how all the fanuc's work
just so I understand...when you issue a g43 in program or mdi things move?
no ... no movement on g43
what happens with just a y move
I think any commanded movement causes z to move
you should try each x seperately and Y seperately. that may narrow the problem
unless one specifies current z to hold it in place
I'll do that
for sure a neg offset value make the tool go LOWER
looks like your problem is not the g43 you are doing that right
and it seems to be working correctly.
I think it is a bug
axis motion seems to be the problem. your z is tied to your x and or y when you command a move
and so few people use g43 that it doesn't show up until someone upgrades to the current cvs
my code is about a year old
I'm going to go off and test some more...see ya later
I am using rc46
I learned quickly to not use the latest source!
trp so you are using 12v in on the epp?
nevyn_ is now known as nevyn
I needed spindle otherwise I would still be back on 2.18 as released
what is epp
no i am using 5v
pull up resistor?
I have a 24v supply to operate the limits which pull the relay for the 5v
does the state change show up on ioshow?
resister to make sure I am getting 5v only
I havent tried to look at that.
might be a thing to check
it's on the gui somewhere up top
I have to go out an see a few thing to get more info. I'll be back when I try the bridgeportio and look at the show
that may help you guys help me a little more. May even solve it. We'll see
more coffee and off to work. see ya
I am going to do something silly and rescrape one of my mills
must make some quick dovetail templates
has any worked on electronic gearing for emc
it is being worked on this week I think
at the codefest
can emc have more than one spindle
hmm don't know
I'm sure it could be done if you have the analog outs
how does emc now between a spindle and an axis i thought the last axis was always spindle
That was my impression
I do not have that set up
I just don't let the computer turn on the spindle right now
just for safey
but I might do it later
a fault to e-stop would be needed if the spindle stopped or stalled
is this something that they will be workin on next week is a better define of spindle
yes I think they will be
what is xxyz
are those on the wiki list?
hmm I checked...they are not
put them in code base queries if you wish
xxyz= electronic gearing
1:1 master slave
i thought electronic gearing was ratio between master and slaved axis or spindle with different master's and slaves to be called out
is there a locking problem in python-Axis in some system? my Axis window is locking sometimes
does anybody know how to export a draw to g code in Qcad?
if les is logging...then... Z moves after a g43 Hn if X, Y , X&Y.
bowika....you may be forced to export as dxf the use a converter
can you recommend such a converter?
no...do a web search...there are several free or almost free one out there
a lot of people just use brute force and hand code
* Phydbleep laughs maniacally..
* Jymmmm slaps a straight jacket on Phydbleep
Buwahahaha!.. It's Postscript!
* Jymmmm gives Phydbleep his medication
* Phydbleep has a rudely shaped turnip and is not afraid to use it..
* Phydbleep abuses Jymmmm with a rudely shaped turnip.
* Jymmmm takes turnip and places it somewhere on Phydbleep where the sun dont shine
PWM, Tach, and Sync all on the same disk. :)
now, what the hell you talking about?
Jymmmm is now known as Jymmm
Grab that and see.
pdf file. :)
* Phydbleep has flinging it via dcc..
* Jymmm dog piles robin_sz!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
robin_sz tag, your it!
Phydbleep: btw, I dont get what you mean with PWM?
sigh? No sigh!
err PWM on the encoder..
* Jymmm pokes robin_sz with a redhead
anonimasu: Yeah, Positioning track is symmetric pwm.
Phydbleep: explain what it does..
so .. the ADC and DAC didn't really work on my G200X ...
robin_sz: Bummer! Warranty?
primarily because Mariss soldered the DAC where the ADC should be etc
Phydbleep: he's been modding it too much ;)
Ouch.. Assembler head-space..
Phydbleep: yeah, I should ask for my money back ;)
robin_sz you didnt pay for it, did ya?
Who can pass a pdf file to Jymmm ?
Phydbleep dont worry about it.
robin_sz DEMAND a refund! =)
Jymmm: too late, I just lifted the chips ..
Phydbleep: I do not get what you are doing with the PWM track on your encoder could you explain that a bit more?
they are only 14 pin, so easy to lift
It's an 8 bit encoded symmetric pwm track and the encoder reads it and interpolates the position to output 4069 (12 bit) ppr.
robin_sz cool. lucky you =)
when you get to BIG chips, and you dont have the exact right desolder tool, its safer to use a razor blade to cut all the legs off
then just mop the legs up with an iron when you tipped the dead package out.
right .. I must go solder them back in .. heres hoping it works!
Ok, what combination of driver stepper in respect to uni/bi is there? I mean if I have a uni driver, can it be made to run uni/bi steppers? or the other way around? (excluding the 4wire)
robin_sz: tHEN GET EYE-STRAIN SOLDERING THE NEW ONE ON. :)
smd is easy ...
lets see .. 14 pin chip .. by hand ..
* Phydbleep changes the batteries in the @#^@#$%^@# keyboard..
soldering time .. .2 seconds
* Jymmm snickers @ Phydbleep
Takes longer than that to find it after you sneeze. :)
you dont solder them pin-by-pin you know
yeah, for pad clean up
Yeah, thats what Yaesu told me todo it
soldering them down I just put a big blob of solder on and drag a wave down the pins
surface tension leaves em individually done
anyway .. later
you leaving already?!
* Phydbleep nails robin_sz's foot to the floor..
Nope.. He's not. :)
Damn... now robin_sz is gonna have a JeeeeeBus complex
So.. Does anyone think that 25 million DPI is not enough res to print an encoder?
[21:21:51] <Phydbleep> http://www.thinmetalparts.com/Mylar_encoders.htm
Jymmm: What have you been told about violating the trades description act?
TDA Britains answer to consumer fraud laws.
Remember what the judge said.. Neither one of us is allowed to "think".. :)
So who wants to critique a encoder?
there have been photographed scaled encoder/resolvers around for yrs
dmess: Yeah, Standard techniques, non-standard format. :)
Phydbleep: can you make the encoders smaller if you have them print them?
or are the limit the speed you can count at?
the limit is 2000 degrees of rotation/second for this design.
360 rpm at the shaft for full control.
that's it? you better go back to the drawing board!
come back when you get it to 36Billion dpi resolution
WTF do you want for <$10?
* Phydbleep sends a wheelie-bin chasing Jymmm.
Oh, for $10, make it 36Trillion dpi resolution
Phydbleep and this'll work with 1/4-20 threaded rod, right?
This will work with any rotary motion.. Leadscews, spindles, etc..
Phydbleep: with that speed limit it's usless for spindles.. and stuff other then hobby machines going really slow..
I know it's $10..
anonimasu: You've never seen my lathe... the spindle in it will get down to <45 rpm in backgear.
Top speed on the spindles is <2k and I don't need to count every 0.088 degree output at that speed, just rpm/sync
well I am thinking positioning, as in servos..
So am I.. 10 tpi leadscrew gives 40960 ppi or 0.00006"
I think 6 millionths is close enough. :)
oh, but if that limits the speed of the motors to 300rpm..
I dont see it as a good option, because of that..
I am thinking about commercial machines, and the speed they operate at..
I've got the parts tracked down for a 10x speed/res model, but I still can't get a firm price for single lots.
I have the encoders I'll use until my servos die or I buy new ones..
the max output of the encoders I have are 100khz..
This system is not dependent on these encoders, that's the whole idea.. Modular design. Use the encoders you have or make new ones.
It would just take different firmware for quad or gray encoders.
I am going to buy a vital.
but I am trying to help you out :)
20 MHz of pic for every encoder and drive channel. 3 Mbit control bus between them, usb or firewire to tie to the pc.
Thanks, I am noting grapes. :)
Slow motor speed under full control, etc.
that's a good thing..
with great resolution
but you need that with fast speeds aswell, that's the main point in using servos as I see it
speed & torque
the accuracy gain isnt that extreme compared to steppers..
Yeah, This was basicly a retrofit to turn any brushmotor/encoder into a closed loop servo when I started...
that's the only reason I am talking about the speed..
But i wanted one that could read position without moving the shaft on a power up.
if I could I'd push my machine along at 300 ipm ;)
ADCs and DACs working
well, 4 dacs
and 3 of the 4 ADCs
Precision is more important to me than speed right now.. I can punch "GO", lock the door and go deal with the kid till the part is done. :)
Plus, I want a hands-off system for pcb milling...
how many 100$ are you going to spend for that precision?
* Phydbleep does not want to stand there listening to Brrrzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz @ 140 db for > 0ms.
got an air spindle yet?
anonimasu: I'll buy a used machine to retrofit.
hes the pcb milling guy .. an air spindle would be good for him
robin_sz: No air, pmdc. :)
is it quick enough?
1hp @ 6k rpm? 5:1 gearup for a 0.05 deep cut.
so 30K rpm?
I'll go multi-pass if I have to for bus-bar stuff.
but 1hp is way more than you'll ever use on a tiny cutter
have a think about an air spindle ..
PWM control.. I'll back the power down,, The 1hp is so I can swing a 1/4" endmill in it too. :)
will you be milling alu?
and other stuff on it?
Yeah, for small detail stuff.
when does the code fest begin
* Phydbleep thought it was already over or he would not have been flapping his keyboard.
there was qiye a lot of work on the interp I saw ..
18:00 GMT is 12:00 here and I slept through it..
me goes to see if they slapped a GPL on it yet
anything on segmentqueue?
seg-q is movement planner?
not yet it seems
I hope they do work on it
well, the only commits I can see are on the interp
so much for emc2 being the development, emc1 being stable/lockdown
people are *never* going to work on or use emc2 if emc1 is still being atively worked on
* anonimasu nods
the interp mods will do very nicely for the G200x thanks ;)
I'll be hacking at emc2 later. :)
who was doing the ISA servo card?
yeah I think os
ISA is dead.. :\
PCI would be the way to go.
it's for the same reason you limit the speed of your encoders..
the cost of developement..
That was why I was going dual lpt for prototyping. PCI card with dual lpt's is <$10 and buffers everything nicely.
ISA is easy & cheap.. PCI costs lots to develop apparently
I dont know why though
2 layer vs 4-6 layer boards..
ISA is <20 MHz.. PCI is 33 MHz and up.. Lot's of little factors that really shouldn't make it that expensive, but do anyway.
hm, would doing PCI on a single layer board be impossible..
there's fpga cores for pci..
* Phydbleep wonders what the max data-rate for a pci lpt is.. ~ 1 MHz for XT/AT standard ..
PCI on a single layer == impossible.. Second layer is need for signa paths.
robin_sz: still there?
well wouldnt you reduce that with a fpga?
Nope.. You need the seconlayer to get to the signals in the connector.. You could do a 2 layer stub with the connector and ribbon cable to a single layer daughterboard.
It would have to be cabled like ATA-133 drive cables where every other line is ground for signal seperation though.
Hmm.. Syba SB-PCI-2P 1.5 MByte/sec EPP/ECP X 2 = ~25MBit/sec.. Not bad for $9. :)
anonimasu: you called?
robin_sz: an nevermind
was about fpga:s
do you have a clue about the size of: http://www.blocket.se/view/4803220.htm?caller=nbl_s&l=0&c=1&city=0
* robin_sz tries to rememebr the name
I am considering buying it..
sounds quite expensive . its a "training" lathe ... from schools mainly
I think they see making something useful as a bonus,
and a rare event
it's pretty cheap compared to non cnc lathes
Denford is it?
Denford Orac rings a bell
[23:56:26] <robin_sz> http://www.gandmtools.co.uk/cat_leaf.php?id=148
I wonder if I should mail and ask for the size
thats an Orac ...
similar sort of thing
hm, it looks smaller though
it would be a very safe machine to use
I need a good lathe..
my current lathe is so very bad..
if ever it gets out of control, you could just reach in and stop it