and I'm trying to compile emc from cvs
yeah, I saw those ..
I wish I saw thoose before grabbing tcl off the debian archive..
where do I get the -dev versions of what he made?
why does paul distribute tcl/tk/tclx ? surely they arein debian?
it came with xlib and stuff..
asdfqwega: not sure you can
robin_z: isnt it to circumvent some of the deps..
robin_z: the standard debs installed a heap of stuff..
robin_z: paul patches them to be single-thread
ok, is that good?
I should think so...tkemc won't work properly with multi-thread
wheres his repository again?
hm isnt the guy off emc2 tkemc?
Well, until I get the latest emc .deb off of him, I'm stuck trying to compile
hmm .. he doesnt seem to have the source debs on there
asdfqwega: are you compiling emc1 or emc2
2.6 kernel keyboard bollux !@#$%#$...
Paul said he'd post me a copy of BDI 4.12...but I have no idea of when it would get here, or even if he has my address
It's nice of him to do so, but I was rather hoping for a shiny new emc-0.0.1-14-i386.deb I could just drop in - and not have to do a re-install
yeah, .debs are the way to go
we could have stable, testign and unstable trees
unstable being cvs head
testing being the release candidate
A stable, testing and unstable release? Brilliant!
(If you haven't seen some Guiness commercials in the USA, you won't get it)
I dont have TV
it agaisnt our religious beliefs
Something along the lines of Python-esque animation, with inventors in white lab coats
robin_z: are you serious?
for the same reason, we dont use motorised transport either
robin_z: I like that :)
"Look at my latest invention! I've invented a way to carry six beers in one hand!"
"Six beers in one hand? Brilliant! Let's drink them!"
I hate tv's..
I hate tv, but I love commercials...they're an artform :)
we also reject the use of metal cutlery.
wood is the only true cutlery.
* robin_z wonders how far he can go with this wind up
the no tv bit was true, the rest is bollocks :)
I eschew the use of horses, myself...coconuts are good enough
you cant make decent glue out of cocnuts!
Sure you can...but you need to add a lot of horse to the recipe
* anonimasu yawns
* asdfqwega considers doing a --nodeps
I'll surely burn in debian purgatory...but what the heck
hm, it's just the tclx8.4-dev that has a problem
Maaaaybe Paul had some -dev stuff in the Morphix repository...
heh. Day1 Design. Day2 bore out a single hole, measure everything. Day3 make a tool to hold the giant tap and tap the part. Day4. Mill out the part by hand (horribly done), and disassemble and reassemble mill. Mill's measurable backlash = 0.0005" [on that axis] I'm happy now.
must have lost power overnight
cradek_ is now known as cradek
* anonimasu yawns
I have just sold and delivered 2 robots
and I gotta install them this week
another customer called with some problems, etc.
well... it's actually ok ;)
I feel alive :P
how bout you?
how's the tree planting going?
havent been working on that today
been helping out in the store
I had a great talk to rayh yesterday
about making a wire-suspended cutting machine
oh neat :)
I think the main challenge would be getting it rigid enough..
* asdfqwega has a sudden image of Tarzan with a cutting spindle...
it's for a plasma
so.. tarzan with fire ;)
Fire on which end, that's the question
* anonimasu would love to build a robot..
although a very small one..
an0n: get a cheap puma on ebay
or off some junkyard
and retrofit it with emc ;)
plasma on wires eh?
maybe a laser on wires later :D
I can imagine the system, but I can also imagine significant problems :)
I am curious how it'll behave
you were thinking of the full 3 axes on wires, or some sort of sled pulled about the table?
but it would be a cheap, big machine
alex_joni: I cant get one off ebay
full 3 axes on 6 wires/motors
I am in sweden
most places dont ship to here
well, yes. but consider ... the BIG machines tend to cut thick plate
e.g. slow speed
building one wouldnt be that hard..
thick plate means being precisiley vertical is important
liek +- 1 degree
yeah if you have 1deg at the base
1 degree of torch angle = 2 degrees of edge
how about one of those RC-gizmos.. to keep it vertical
with another local motor
it makes a big diff..
2 of them
maybe 1deg per cm..
I dont know how to calc it..
I don't want it that big...
3x6m or so
anyway, I cant quite see it being stiff enough, motion wise
I guess we'll see ;)
unless you can get true position feedback from the head
how's it going paul?
there's a new guy working on 2.6 (at least he said so...)
I just ordered a programming cable for the Rabbit
I directed him to pc_2_6_test from emc2 CVS
It won't compile
going to dump Steve Hardys EMC interp port into it
he's trying to figure out a Makefile.inc (with as little changes to Makefiles as possible) to get emc2 working under 2.6
I asked him to send an email to the dev-list when he encounters problems
Send him my way
maybe I'll send myself yourway too ;)
I plan to install a 2.6 too
might not be able to reply to any emails till mid Feb.
short question about that: can I keep 2.4 and 2.6 running in parallel?
I remember having to change modutils when switching from 2.2 to 2.4
Not unless we install kernel modules in a sane location
along with other stuff (gcc, some libs)
paul_c: didn't quite get that...
GNU tool chain does not change
ok, that's good to know (a 3.3 would probably be ok)
you can use the same compiler & libs for both
an upgrade to module-init-tools is needed, unless you already have it installed
don't think so, but I'll check
so you're saying a dual-boot is possible?
boot a 2.4 kernel or a 2.6 kernel?
the guy from yesterday is "SWPadnos"
he sent an email to the dev-list some days ago, but yesterday he was around and we talked a bit
robin_z: still around?
robin_z: seems some stuff is missing from the wiki... ;)
robin_z: I added a page yesterday as an intro to the wiki.. it seems to be gone now
found it :)
wasn't on the HomePage
but on EmcKnowledgeBase
just a default page name
different page ;)
[15:23:01] <alex_joni> http://www.redpoint.org.uk/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?EmcKnowledgeBase
[15:23:11] <alex_joni> http://www.redpoint.org.uk/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?HomePage
* alex_joni leaves for a while...
havin fun learning to edit WiKis
tip: mangle any URL to the wiki page to confuse wiki-spammers
[16:17:32] <paul_c> http://www.foo.com/w1k1-warz
* robin_z adds some more crap to the wiki
ahh, maybe emcwiki.pl then?
I think the scumbags grep for "wiki"
ok, I'll copy the script .. leave the old one up there for a while too
* alex_joni is back
I do like the wiki idea more and more
who/where/why is this wiki ?
to be filled
robin_sz set it up, as a test... if it turns out ok, it'll be moved to Steves site
Looks like vertually all the bugs/problems have been fixed with BDI-4.12
paul: how do I get it to put it on the site?
can you ftp it in ?
hi steve2 ;)
dang silent disconnects
can you email me the login/passwd ?
how about /msg ?
* alex_joni is really lazy now...
* paul_c being lazy
hmmm... seems we both are...
That would mean having to pick up a pen & paper
now that's a problem ;)
I'd have to start the sendmail program
/msg will be fine.
I'll msg to your logger
how about that?
robin - I am ready to change the wiki link, are you here?
* alex_joni is gone home
stevestallings2: feel free to change the link whenever you like
[17:21:51] <robin_z> http://www.redpoint.org.uk/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl
I'll delete the old .pl file tomorow sometime
link has been updated, now if I can just get FrontPage to quit converting &# characters back to plain text 8-)
Hahahaha...who wrote this wiki?
Look out, the underpants gnomes are going to sic the copyright pixies on you
robin set up the wiki, I provided links from LinuxCNC
what is the risk you see from gnomes?
hopefully the links are resistant to scans for "WiKi"
Ah, just the section "Debian installation"
Hey, paul_c...you're stateside right now, aren't you?
OK, so I see WiKi content can be somewhat "free form" 8-)
* asdfqwega pesters paul_c for the latest .debs
* robin_z cuts and pastes bits of stuff from various pages into the wiki
Robin with a wiki is probably like giving a monkey the keys to bannana plantation
a monkey in a plantation would have some sense of direction and purpose
aye, and a 'nanner in his mouth, too
thats info wiki-ing for one night
* paul_c edits wiki pages.
Has anybody here ever used the Realtime Testsuite LiveCD?
yup - On two systems
* robin_z gets all axcited about running the NIST gcode interp on his G2002
I wonder what Steve compiled it with ... the almost free dynamic C from rabbit, or the expensive thing
whatever, it will be fun to play with
I'm trying to understand the RT LiveCD scores...
I'm almost sure that large numbers are bad :)
It'd be nice if there was something (legible) that you could point to "THIS is the best hardware to use"
And since I opened my mouth to suggest it, I guess I'm nominated
asdfqwega: id say, that is almost a pointless exercise
the average life of a motherboard in supply is, about, 6 months
you'll never stay on top pof it
a list of common gotchas might be useful instead
laptops with APM: gotcha
no parallel port: gotcha
paul says something about some chipset or other
and onboard video ram shared with system ram?
and, worse, when youve recommended a Tyan B45-AR345G, then people will assume that they need just that, and when they cant find it, assume nothing else will work
yeah, but ive run emc on Intel 810 chipset systems just fine ...
yes, with onboard video
there are some rules I guess
but some other things seem harder to define
I have to say ... im impressed with Steve Hardy's GUI for the G2002
considering hes developed on his own, in not that long, its quite good
robin: got a link
yeah, which version you wanna see? windows or linux?
linux, of course!
the windows one is easier to install ;)
Feh, like that's going to deter me
I just wanna know what this G2002 thingy is
its a open-source hardawre based step generator
controlled over USB
[20:22:38] <robin_z> http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/geckodrive/files/G2002%20Project/G2002%20Misc./
ypou want the g2002_alpha_2.tgz
I've heard something about that last year...
very very fast, very smooth
steve has ported the emc interp to it :)
Ugh...looking will have to wait until I can dig up my Yahoo! ID
I'll stick it on my server if you wanr
Thanks, but no need
If you want, you could always help me stare at Paul until he updates his .deb repository
I suspect that wont be until he rurns to the UK, mid feb at earliest
Yeah, I kinda figured
I've just been doing way to many "install, test, break, re-install" cycles lately
And I was all eager when he said he fixed the problems in the new BDI :)
so do any of the BDI-4 work?
Paul said 'virtually all problems in BDI-4.12 are solved'
I have not a whole lot if interest in the BDIs anymore
I haven't tried the BDI-4 yet - don't have good broadband
im a .debs convert :)
robin_z: I don't either, but I have no idea what to recommend to new users.
I was using the .debs
recommend they install sarge and grab the debs then ;)
Well, some good came of my Frankenstein computer work...
What cause my old EMC to fail - not exactly the motherboard
Either use jumper switches or autodetection - and autodetection is flaky
Set jumpers, works perfectly
taking a break
I NEED to hire a spray painter
this is getting old
But since I will not find one here...
I am gonna go ahead and automate painting
what are cheap PLCs going for theses days?
2 spray heads, 2 solenoids, a motor, and some ss relays should do it
going to use the new motion-coordinated IO in emc?
ought to be able to throw that together pretty fast
well pretty much out of dio with stg
so use a parallel port
I could do that
"simple matter of programming"
CIA-temp601 is now known as CIA-7
I have used pcs and parports for soft PLCs with dos and c way back
This time just grabbing a PLC will free me quicker though
I think they are not more than $200 or so
les_away: I made the smaller of my two pulleys successfully, but I think the big one is not within my ability...
I'll try some stuff tonight, but I might have to take you up on your offer
heck...a basic stamp would work fine
No problem...I can whip that out for you
do you have a cnc lathe too?
No, but I have a well tooled Boxford VSL 500
I'ts a nice little lathe
can I just stop by and use it?
little...hmmm weighs a couple thousand I guess
But I'm not exactly down the street
yeah, too bad about that
But if you had a trip to Atlanta or Greenville or Charlotte you could
I was just being funny
well lots of list members have stopped by
this will work:
[21:22:12] <les_away> http://www.tri-plc.com/t100md.htm
I'm gonna automate painting here
* robin_z scrolls up
all built in a box?
saw some other PLCs for under a hundred
is price *that* important?
189...not in a box I think
I would put getting it going TODAY as being a big plus if it really needs doing
No...I just want to end my spray painting carreer NOW
Gosh this thing is a pretty good stepper conteoller
10 amps 24v
even reads encoders
had the Baldpr guy in today
I just need to operate solenoids for a couple spray heads
well, yeah and no
this is Baldor ...
I phone them and the rep is on site within 2 hours
talks about the machine, gets some specs ..
quotes some guide prices ...
Baldor less expensive than SEM?
says "let us know when you are ready, we'll ship it up to you. when its mounted, call us and we'll send an engineer to help tune it. try it for a few eeks, if its no good, send it back. no cash down"
must be including amp
yeah and controller and front end software
you have been using steppers right?
steppers were a bit of a disaster, under Mach2 anyway
so I used those Burny things on a couple ..
but the price is scary
I stopped using them in tools a LONG time ago
this is better servos (brushless v brush DC)
for half the cash
brushless is good
and a far mor capable controller
pid yes, ff, not sure
that NextMove ESB thing ..
8 servo channels, shed loads of IO, analogue IO etc
should be enough
you looked at the spec a while ago
I am suprised at how much those cheap PLCs can do
and they are a web server
isnt everything these days?
its usually almost embedded by default
ordered a prgramming lead for the G2002 embedded micro
steve hardy has got his emc interp port to it working
im sort of thinking servos and a proper baldro controller for the big machiens
steppers and a G2002 for the small (4x4) stuff
the interpreter is by far the best part of emc
needs subroutines though
yes tell me about it
had to do that array in a test editor pasting stuff
you know geneva right?
Been there a couple times
[21:36:29] <robin_z> http://www.skyandsummit.com/Glacegeneve/
similar waether to your I bleieve :)
No it was Zurich not Geneva
It was for all that powder coat stuff
well, switzerland anyway :)
well, if you ccant sort out your paint application, no one can :)
hows the sander? bored yet?
I let him walk home and take a nap at lunch
he is 75
He is doing ok
watch that RSI
I am going nuts
can't do repetitive tasks
repetetive strain injury
lunch has defrosted...back in a while
CIA-temp319 is now known as CIA-7
I think I will get that plc...I like that it can be programmed in basic
not a great ladder logic fan
whats an alternative to it?
basic or c
na, to a plc
I just decided to automate the spray painting
thats cool, but what about plc, is there an alternatitive to it?
I could use a pc, a basic stamp, or a host of other things
how many parts will you be able to auto magically paint?
at a time
But the trick is to get it done fast
Just one at a time...the parts rotate
cycle time is 3 seconds
completely even coat Im guessing as well
plus placing/removing the part
well you saw the picture...pretty even coat
I bet I missed that
I just got home a bit ago
i'll get it
CIA-temp634 is now known as CIA-7
hey, you know my BIG laser ...
needs some exotic RF connectors ...
I found some on Ebay .. :)
here is the link I had before gezr
CIA-temp194 is now known as CIA-7
[22:00:06] <les_away> http://www.dynamiccalls.com/Catalog.htm
look at "crystal over slate"
you know that plc has encoder reading and PID
pretty fast too
les_away is now known as les
gotta find some solenoids here
looks sweet les :)
made with emc
its a flange )
it's a frisbee
I need two spray heads...one for the top and one for the side
unless I could get a gun to do a figure 8 spray pattern
get the angle jsut right, split nozzle maybe ...
if you have a programable method, you can mount the sprayhead on an arc, rotate the part front/back, then park at the side facing the gun, then arc the gun around the part, repeate right?
well I have seen clogged nozzles do a figure 8
2 guns might be cheaper and more reliable I guess
gezr: yes I could do that easily
But I have LOTS of spray guns
* robin_z adds another two weeks to the project
( my old company invented paint spraying)
im really tired today for some reason
get some nice pre-made linear actuators
painting 800 of those things
those linear rail and belt things
painted 800 today?
oh and 36 degreesf in the booth
is that hot?
how long did that take?
hmm 4 hrs or something like that
I was also working on robotics stuff
* gezr see les having a clap on/clap off automated turkey call making setup in a year
that reminds me, must size some servos
Oh I am sizing servos for that foam cushion manufacturer still
or already did
that countersunk hole, its a pne operation job, special cutter?
90 degree v
and a drill first?
les : ever consider using a dual Z axis on that thing of yours?
but It make about 1 a second already
save you a tool change and many many plunge operations
one of them procuner heads with 6 drills in it and just one plunge?
I could...but I want to see how the sales go before I do stuff like that
Hard tooling is often faster than cnc
surely those holes must take up abut 40% of the total machining time?
But it's the versatility that gets the job
robin: no, only a tiny fraction
its the chopping out that takes the time, severla passes
The big ones are hollowing it out and cutting it out
it's just a thin shell
And I am severely hp limited
oh my lord, I cant think of what its called, machine, rotates the part to a station, something is done to it, then it gets rotated to another station, and now you have 2 parts going, on and on, till a complete part pops out and 8 more getting stuff done?
hollowing takes 45 seconds
like a reloading press for cartridges
but then you have a single use machine
speaking of which ...
anyway, im almost done with my new blast cabinet :), I need to devise a vacume method for it
should get the STL files back from the 3d scanner tomorow :)
(too fscking expensive!!)
300 GBP to scan a handgrip!!
to go on this:
I have paid big $ to have things scanned
[22:17:06] <robin_z> http://www.hps-tr.com/ultraStocks.htm#fr703
gezr: picture of your casbinet?
that grip :)
les : www.masternode.net/gallery in the machine stuff
I like to hear some feedback on it
I have a good deal going with that gunsmith ... I sort out automating his grip production, he gives me one of those rifles.
robin: I did some grips once for a power nailer
haha 2024 AL
high pressure die cast I presume
It was the prototype for the silenced explosive nailer
actually to be later done in glass filled nylon
hilti!!! the competition
5 chamber silencer built in
went grom 160 dba to mid 80s
easy when you know hoe
It basically makes no sound of it's own
right, jut the nail hitting wood
Well I modelled it in spice
But made the whole thing in 2024 and 4140
like a well silenced .22LR
'cause I didn't really calculate the stresses
you hear the click of the pin hitting the cartridge ...
and didn't want to blow my hand off
and the SMACK of the lead hitting the target
you usually need a muzzle brake to silence .22lr
the quite stuff is sub
Hey I must go out to the shop a bit
the day s not quite done
have to paint 4 robotic tester enclosures
powder would be good
back, spent another 30 bucks at home depot
got me a ruber pipe thing, to use as the vacume release vent so I dont colapse the box, new feeder line and air line, and thing I can connect the vacume line to