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[02:42:04] <seb_kuzminsky> cmorley: link?
[02:42:52] <cmorley> he pushed the branch to linuxcnc
[02:47:25] <seb_kuzminsky> what's the name of the branch?
[02:47:51] <cmorley> mozck/gscreen-rapid-override
[02:49:57] <cmorley> http://git.linuxcnc.org/gitweb?p=linuxcnc.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/mozmck/gscreen-rapid-override
[02:50:34] <mozmck> did I miss something?
[02:50:38] <mozmck> hi cmorley
[02:51:07] <cmorley> nothing missed as far as I can tell. i finally had time to look at it.
[02:51:55] <mozmck> ah, I see. I did not add anything to the main gscreen gui. I'm not sure if I'll even use the functionality, but it does work as far as I can tell.
[02:52:32] <mozmck> I did put a slider on a custom skin and hooked it up, but I think we will not have it on the final product
[02:52:39] <cmorley> yes that is why the change is so safe. it will only work if someone adds code to a handler file to use it.
[02:52:58] <mozmck> did you see I added support for HAL TCL files to gladevcp -H ?
[02:53:07] <cmorley> but it is an important function
[02:53:28] <cmorley> yes i saw that. i have never used HAL TCL though
[02:54:36] <mozmck> It is pretty nice. I needed a function to only make hal connections if a certain pin exists.
[02:55:22] <mozmck> I can also pop up a nice message instead of linuxcnc just crashing with some cryptic message in a terminal
[02:55:42] <cmorley> nice. i just wish it was in python :)
[02:55:59] <mozmck> tcl is a little different. I need to read up on it a lot more.
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[02:56:45] <mozmck> Doesn't look too bad, but looks like opening braces have to be on the same line as the proc definition - maybe if blocks as well
[02:56:50] <cmorley> too cryptic for me. I'm sure it has it's merits though
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[02:57:21] <mozmck> One merit is that it exists as a hal file format right now :)
[02:57:35] <cmorley> your screen is for a plasma machine?
[02:57:38] <mozmck> yes
[02:57:47] <mozmck> first off anyhow.
[02:58:01] <cmorley> how is that going - the screen building i mean
[02:58:18] <mozmck> I'm putting the plasma stuff in gladevcp boxes, so I can switch them out with other stuff for different machines.
[02:58:35] <mozmck> So the basic GUI can hopefully be basically the same.
[02:59:10] <mozmck> Going pretty well I think - pretty big learning curve for me - python, tcl, etc. but it's starting to come together.
[02:59:21] <cmorley> interesting. - there is so many ways things can be done. I'm interested in how it all works out for u
[02:59:56] <mozmck> Yes. We are making a custom gtk theme for the looks so I've had to dig into that as well.
[03:00:03] <cmorley> I was hoping more people would tinker with a custom screen set - but maybe the bar is still too high
[03:00:22] <mozmck> That way everything should be resizeable
[03:00:32] <cmorley> yes GTK theme really can make or break a screen useability
[03:00:44] <cmorley> some themes are terrible
[03:01:03] <mozmck> Yes, probably is. You basically have to know some python and glade is not just trivial.
[03:01:22] <mozmck> gtk is not trivial is the problem. I'm not very fond of the toolkit.
[03:01:26] <cmorley> I wanted to add a couple themes to linuxcnc package but got no traction - i guess it's a pain to do
[03:02:45] <mozmck> Should not be a pain to just add to a deb if that's what you mean.
[03:03:24] <cmorley> yes GLADE people are not always so helpful either. i wanted to use the GLADE editor to show a background pic instead of the matte on a widget -- never even got a 'what are you doing ?'
[03:03:29] <mozmck> Did you make the themes here?
http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?GTK_Themes
[03:04:17] <cmorley> top one is just slightly modified by me for red buttons - just proof of concept
[03:04:56] <cmorley> i have another that has larger sliders - i never used one that was highly modified by me
[03:05:45] <mozmck> I see. Bit of a learning curve to that. I've learned a good bit already.
[03:06:15] <cmorley> i take it the screen is for commercial use?
[03:06:55] <mozmck> We plan to distribute it with our hardware.
[03:07:08] <cmorley> I think if a few more gladevcp widgets were built screens would be easier - eg jog buttons
[03:07:13] <mozmck> So I guess so?
[03:07:19] <cmorley> :)
[03:08:37] <cmorley> but now i should concentrate on converting to GTK3...ugg
[03:08:48] <mozmck> That could be.
[03:08:57] <mozmck> gtk3 seems to be a pain
[03:09:17] <mozmck> and each new version has new quirks from what I hear.
[03:09:50] <cmorley> yes it is - not very good examples - and some libraries have not converted.
[03:09:51] <mozmck> they keep changing things in non-backward compatible ways.
[03:10:38] <mozmck> I found a bug in a program I use that made columns in a list view disappear if the window was too narrow.
[03:10:46] <cmorley> in our case it's only that GLADE editor wont do GTK2 anymore that screws us
[03:10:54] <mozmck> I notice that a lot of other programs have the same problem.
[03:11:24] <mozmck> If I have the time I'd like to look at Qt instead.
[03:11:55] <cmorley> yes lots of funny stuff. i couldn't get GTK3 themes figured out either - and that is supposed to be a better feature og gtk3
[03:12:01] <mozmck> From *everyone* I read and hear from it is vastly better than Gtk.
[03:12:20] <cmorley> We just have so much invested in GladeVCP....
[03:12:42] <mozmck> Plus someone has made a Qtvcp for machinekit that I'd bet has a lot of useful stuff for linuxcnc...
[03:13:12] <cmorley> It's the direction Machinekit went...mostly because no one was interested in python and GTK
[03:13:35] <mozmck> Well, I can't blame them there ;)
[03:13:59] <cmorley> for them the fact it can be used on andriod and such is a big plus
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[03:14:27] <mozmck> heh, I don't know about that.
[03:17:06] <cmorley> well their big advancement on HAL (arguably) is the splitting of realtime and userspace program on different machines - biggest advantage is using a different machine for the UI part.
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[03:17:57] <mozmck> I can see that could be nice for some things, but I don't know about using a phone/tablet for that
[03:18:05] <mozmck> maybe for toy machines...
[03:18:16] <cmorley> (i realize I'm glossing over a bunch of work they have done)
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[03:19:10] <cmorley> It depends what your target audience and target machine is of course.
[03:19:17] <mozmck> true.
[03:20:24] <mozmck> I never could understand the need for some of the sweeping changes talked about - but that may just be me.
[03:20:29] <cmorley> The fact that they don't have a frozen 'release' would stop me from using it on big iron without a lot of testing.
[03:21:23] <mozmck> yes, I would be scared of it for that reason at least, and it seems they have been making major changes.
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[03:21:54] <cmorley> I see a lot of behind-the-scenes infrastructure changes, that will be beneficial later.
[03:21:55] <Tom_itx> feature wise how does it compare to lcnc?
[03:22:08] <Tom_itx> or is it becoming a different animal?
[03:23:14] <cmorley> at the moment it is fairly the same feature list IFAIK they do things differently and have expanding HAL's utility.
[03:23:49] <cmorley> they are developing QT uis
[03:24:24] <cmorley> They support BBB and I think raspberrypie
[03:24:42] <Tom_itx> i was aware of bbb but not pi
[03:24:56] <Tom_itx> is it more targeted toward arm then?
[03:24:57] <cmorley> ya I don't think its popular
[03:25:03] <mozmck> I'm not sure the pi has proved that usefull
[03:25:39] <cmorley> there is a lot of development in that direction.
[03:25:42] <mozmck> Seems like mostly 3d printer guys over there, but I don't think that was intended.
[03:25:56] <cmorley> but to say thats the way ther are going is maybe too strong?
[03:26:19] <Tom_itx> i think the printer guys saw opportunity in it instead of vise versa
[03:26:28] <cmorley> yes i agree
[03:26:49] <cmorley> plus they don't mind being on the cutting edge of stability it seems
[03:26:50] <Tom_itx> all they had was avr2560
[03:27:43] <Tom_itx> well they're not slamming large hunks of iron around either
[03:27:56] <cmorley> unfortunately all the work i am well versed in and interested in is fairly useless to machinekit :)
[03:27:56] <mozmck> Seemed like they wanted that cutting edge of stability in the latest releases of linuxcnc.
[03:29:27] <mozmck> what kind of work is that?
[03:29:32] <cmorley> they wanted to make large changes, linuxcnc was getting fairly stale
[03:29:49] <cmorley> i see both sides of the debate
[03:30:08] <cmorley> i work on stepconf and pncconf and gscreen
[03:30:24] <mozmck> yes, I saw some of the stuff happening. I think having those things in a development branch is the way to go for a project like this.
[03:30:35] <cmorley> hard to make a config program on a system with constant large change :0
[03:30:51] <cmorley> that is what they wanted
[03:31:07] <mozmck> people that need and want the large changes can use it, those who want machines that don't kill them can use stable.
[03:31:18] <cmorley> it was all very frustrating process.
[03:31:21] <mozmck> what, a development branch?
[03:32:13] <cmorley> from memory.. they wanted master to be able to be much less stable
[03:33:13] <mozmck> oh, hmm. I remember a good bit of heat because the new TP wasn't in 2.6, but there were many massive bugs found and fixed since then.
[03:33:52] <cmorley> then they developed ub branch waiting to merge - that took so long that the changes in ub were HUGE and made it less disable to merge...which postponed merging it which made it bigger :)
[03:34:30] <mozmck> I don't know why a branch other than master would have been bad, but oh well. I remember one machinekit guy being pretty pushy towards me for some trivial thing...
[03:34:45] <cmorley> everyone wanted the tp to be released :)
[03:35:14] <mozmck> heh, yes. changes that big are probably best merged in smaller pieces.
[03:35:23] <cmorley> yes tempers and patience got out of control - like i said very frustrating
[03:35:37] <mozmck> I'm pretty glad it wasn't, because it sure looks like it was not ready.
[03:36:11] <mozmck> I can understand that. At least they didn't do a hostile takeover like another project I saw.
[03:36:25] <Tom_itx> i wonder what sort of testing is done on machinekit
[03:36:31] <Tom_itx> before releases
[03:36:32] <cmorley> well it's a catch 22 - merge it in a branch that people will test and bugs will be found - leave it in a feature branch and they are not found
[03:37:14] <cmorley> merge it to a branch to soon before release obviously is not good either :)
[03:37:24] <mozmck> yep.
[03:37:30] <cmorley> machinekit is a rolling release
[03:37:52] <mozmck> meaning no release ;)
[03:37:59] <cmorley> yes :)
[03:38:26] <mozmck> I use kicad, which went that way for a year or so now, and it has frustrated users a lot.
[03:38:43] <mozmck> They are planning a stable release again soon, which will be good.
[03:38:49] <cmorley> ya it doesn't seem a good idea for machine control
[03:39:37] <cmorley> i think machinekit was hoping someone would come along and make releases as a project in it's self.
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[03:40:06] <cmorley> again it's that fast development vrs stability
[03:40:09] <mozmck> They were hoping that with kicad sorta as well. And some people have been making builds, but it is not the same.
[03:40:14] <Tom_itx> who are the main forces behind machinekit?
[03:40:35] <mozmck> haberler (sp?)
[03:40:42] <Tom_itx> i figured he was one
[03:41:01] <Tom_itx> i sensed a split coming at the wichita fest
[03:41:04] <mozmck> don't know who else.
[03:41:32] <Tom_itx> even being my first fest experience i felt that
[03:41:32] <cmorley> John Morris
[03:41:58] <cmorley> Charles Steinkuehler
[03:42:16] <Tom_itx> he had the printer running lcnc right?
[03:42:23] <cmorley> yes
[03:43:38] <cmorley> Alexander Rossler is building the QT ui stuff
[03:45:11] <cmorley> by Whitchta Michael was very frustrated already so I agree by the end of that the writing was on the wall I think
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[03:46:33] <cmorley> anyways other things to do ... ttyl guys
[03:52:56] <pcw_home> mozmck: the tupperware PC runs linuxcnc/Preemt-rt/hm2_eth:
[03:52:57] <pcw_home> http://freeby.mesanet.com/hp-stream-mini-preemt-rt.png
[03:53:14] <mozmck> great!
[03:54:12] <mozmck> I saw you had to use 14.04 - that kind of thing is the reason I plan to use that instead of wheezy
[03:55:34] <mozmck> I've tried quite a few different kernel settings, and haven't found much that made much difference. Haven't done 32 bit yet.
[03:57:11] <pcw_home> I probably should have tried a vanilla wheezy install
[03:59:50] <Tom_itx> pcw, what is this 'tupperware' pc you speak of??
[04:00:06] <mozmck> getting late, ttyl
[04:00:16] <pcw_home> 'nite
[04:00:16] <Tom_itx> same here..
[04:01:56] <pcw_home> tom itx: hp stream mini
[04:02:28] <pcw_home> http://www.amazon.com/HP-Stream-200-010-Mini-Desktop/dp/B00R7R1GWK
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[04:02:54] <pcw_home> (hp price is $179.99)
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[04:03:09] <Tom_itx> ahh yeah i remember that
[04:04:04] <Tom_itx> that's about what i got in this asrock setup
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[04:05:13] <Tom_itx> haven't had much time to mess with it lately though
[04:09:57] <pcw_home> Yeah its similar (it has a slow Haswell dual core instad of a Baytrail atom)
[04:10:27] <pcw_home> somwhere between a J1800 and a J1900 in speed
[04:12:24] <Tom_itx> i'm wondering if i should dump ubuntu 10.04 for a newer flavor instead of applying updates to it
[04:12:40] <Tom_itx> i'm not that crazy about wheezy
[04:18:24] <pcw_home> 10.04 is pretty old (I have linuxcnc running on wheezy, ubuntu 10,04 and ubuntu14.04)
[04:18:26] <pcw_home> what dont you like about wheezy?
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[04:19:06] <Tom_itx> i'm getting more used to it
[04:20:24] <pcw_home> if you are not doing software stepping, its pretty easy to get 14.04/preemt-RT/linuxcnc running
[04:20:26] <pcw_home> (wheezy would not boot on tupperware so thats what I did there)
[04:20:47] <Tom_itx> i'm not a linux guru so it's mostly just learning my way around it
[04:21:11] <pcw_home> wheezys default window manager is pretty spartan after ubuntu
[04:21:34] <Tom_itx> i just figured if it wasn't broke don't fix it so i've been updating 10.04
[04:21:51] <Tom_itx> i did load the wheezy cd on a ssd though
[04:22:11] <pcw_home> if its running a machine thats probably the path of least resistance
[04:22:33] <Tom_itx> nothing critical
[04:22:46] <Tom_itx> that's why i don't mind changing stuff around
[04:23:22] <pcw_home> I would think the new TP might be a reason to upgrade (but more for people doing high speed profiling)
[04:23:58] <Tom_itx> it won't run on 10.04?
[04:24:10] <Tom_itx> i thought i could upgrade to 2.7 under it
[04:24:16] <pcw_home> It should
[04:24:20] <Tom_itx> i haven't yet
[04:24:27] <Tom_itx> just 2.6
[04:24:58] <pcw_home> the main problem with 10.04 is that if you have newer hardware it may not work
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[04:25:34] <Tom_itx> i see
[04:25:53] <Tom_itx> i plugged the hdd from the old atom in the asrock and it seemed ok
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[04:27:06] <pcw_home> does USB work? (that was one of the baytrail issues)
[04:27:26] <Tom_itx> i'll have to try it again... i honestly can't remember now
[04:28:01] <Tom_itx> i've been installing windows7 on a hdd for it and need to get the linux drive back in it
[04:28:28] <Tom_itx> i'm thinking about getting the mini itx version of the board for linux
[04:28:57] <Tom_itx> they're pretty cheap
[04:29:26] <pcw_home> yeah
[04:29:34] <Tom_itx> and it will do all i need for lcnc
[04:29:48] <pcw_home> and quite a bit faster than the old D525s
[04:30:11] <Tom_itx> i'll probably move the D525 to this box and retire this MB
[04:30:52] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/itx/EPIA-MII-45.jpg
[04:30:57] <Tom_itx> that's what this one is
[04:31:29] <Tom_itx> i'm sure they don't even support it now
[04:31:36] <pcw_home> I thats an odd one
[04:32:07] <Tom_itx> EPIA MII 10000
[04:32:55] <Tom_itx> it was supposed to boot from the pcmcia slot but i don't think they ever got that far
[04:33:44] <Tom_itx> it won't run lcnc
[04:34:42] <Tom_itx> but it's been on irc 24/7 for quite a while now
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[04:38:43] <pcw_home> VIA CPU?
[04:38:58] <Tom_itx> yes, C3
[04:39:24] <pcw_home> some of those worked with linuxcnc at one time
[04:40:12] <pcw_home> a j1900 has to be at least 6 times as fast
[04:40:22] <Tom_itx> i'm sure
[04:40:42] <Tom_itx> irc doesn't require much and that's about all i do with it
[04:40:51] <pcw_home> anyway sleep time for old folks...
[04:40:55] <Tom_itx> yep
[04:40:58] <pcw_home> 'nite
[04:40:59] <Tom_itx> later
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[18:15:52] <cradek> woot
[18:16:19] <cradek> "Probe tripped during non-probe MDI command" just saved my tool length measurer
[18:17:57] <archivist> oops, nearly
[18:19:40] <cradek> g0z0 => I hear a very short move => hmm I expected it to go farther than that => oh heck did it go down instead of up => oh hey it isn't broken at all
[18:20:10] <cradek> no way could I have noticed and stopped it
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[19:13:05] <skunkworks> heh
[19:13:08] <skunkworks> awesome
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[22:37:56] <andypugh> That's strange
[22:38:16] <andypugh> Go to wiki.linuxcnc.org and search the page for "ultrasound"
[22:38:25] <andypugh> Can anyone explain that?
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[22:39:41] <Tom_itx> somebody new the password to edit and added it ?
[22:40:05] <andypugh> Who gets to decide if it should be deleted?
[22:40:10] <Tom_itx> you
[22:40:17] <Tom_itx> i give you my blessing
[22:40:52] <andypugh> Actually, it is just a link, not a page, isn't it?
[22:42:25] <andypugh> Anyway, no reason to rush into things. :-)
[22:44:32] <Tom_itx> it obviously has nothing to do with lcnc
[22:47:05] <Tom_itx> is there a history file showing who edited it?
[22:49:11] <andypugh> I don't know.
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[22:54:45] <cmorley> linuxlove did it september 2014 apparently
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[22:55:45] <Tom_itx> no clue who that is
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