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[00:07:24] <pcw_home> cradek: looks like Tom_itx has it covered, if you have any troubles, I can make one tommorow
[00:09:30] <pcw_home> but beware, untested bitfiles on a 5i25 can brick a 5i25 since the PCI stuff needs to work to re-flash
[00:09:32] <pcw_home> (well only a temporary brick if you have a JTAG cable)
[00:10:59] <pcw_home> most common mistake: no .ucf file associated so pinout is random (this seldom works well)
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[00:22:16] <Tom_itx> pcw_home did you look at the file?
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[00:24:48] <Tom_itx> pcw_home, also what generates the .pin file?
[00:25:00] <Tom_itx> i gather it's just an information file...
[00:25:39] <pcw_home> the pinout file looks OK
[00:25:41] <pcw_home> mesaflash --readhmid generates pinout files for example
[00:26:08] <pcw_home> Jeplers build scripts do also
[00:26:33] <pcw_home> or maybe that just .xml files, I forget
[00:28:23] <pcw_home> the main danger in 5i25 file is making sure the proper ucf file is assosciated
[00:28:25] <pcw_home> (ISE cheerfully makes random pinouts without complaint if no .ucf file is assoscited with the top level file)
[00:28:27] <Tom_itx> it seemed to build ok
[00:31:07] <pcw_home> if there are conflicts in the pinout file you will get build errors but of course
[00:31:08] <pcw_home> illogical things like all dir and no step pins are legal so not checked
[00:31:34] <Tom_itx> yeah
[00:32:38] <Tom_itx> 5i25.ucf is associated with tht TopPCIHostmot2.vhd
[00:32:50] <pcw_home> you can verify the created bitfiles pinout with the pinout report
[00:32:50] <Tom_itx> just double checked
[00:33:16] <pcw_home> So its probably OK
[00:33:55] <Tom_itx> my only real concern was having 9 stepgens
[00:34:10] <Tom_itx> he's not using them all...
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[00:35:44] <pcw_home> 15 or so should be OK
[00:36:14] <pcw_home> (eventually you will run out of space, that the only real limit)
[00:37:53] <pcw_home> plus thay add compile time (the more stuff in the FPGA _and_ the closer you are to being full. the slower the compilation will be)
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[00:48:59] <Tom_itx> pcw_home where do i find the pinout report?
[00:49:33] <pcw_home> its one of the things map does
[00:50:13] <pcw_home> probably have to root through the menus to find it
[00:52:29] <Tom_itx> timing analizer -> post map?
[00:52:38] <cradek> pcw_home: do you think it's safe to try?
[00:52:53] <cradek> pcw_home: I don't really have a jtag cable
[00:52:58] <cradek> (but how hard could it be)
[00:53:15] <pcw_home> a paralle port and a HC125
[00:53:51] <pcw_home> if Toms pinout report looks sane its probably OK
[00:54:29] <Tom_itx> i just replaced 2 null tags with an extra stepgen pair and renumbered them
[00:54:40] <Tom_itx> adding the stepgen count to 9 instead of 8
[00:54:47] <Tom_itx> at the top
[00:54:57] <Tom_itx> 'instances'
[00:55:18] <pcw_home> If mesaflash was a bit smarter, there would be safe way to test new bitfiles
[00:55:27] <Tom_itx> and added the 'c' suffix to the function name
[00:56:42] <pcw_home> Tom_itx: do you have recent source? The ICAP stuff is pretty recent (not required but nice)
[00:56:54] <Tom_itx> source for what?
[00:57:14] <pcw_home> hostmot2 source
[00:57:34] <Tom_itx> i just grabbed the 5i25 file from your site
[00:58:01] <Tom_itx> should be in there...
[00:58:13] <Tom_itx> my 7i43 files are a bit older
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[00:58:34] <pcw_home> OK so that should be up-to-date, have to ask micges about a booting from fallback area option
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[01:00:11] <Tom_itx> if he has concerns you can generate it for him tomorrow
[01:00:18] <pcw_home> (so you could test a new bitfile by writing it to the fallback area, and booting from there)
[01:00:19] <Tom_itx> i posted the source on my site
[01:00:19] <pcw_home> if your bit file was bad, a power cycle would be all thats needed to recover
[01:00:44] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.ddns01.com:81/~webpage/cnc/C-Radek/
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[01:01:45] <Tom_itx> i don't wanna screw one up but i don't mind making one once in a while for ppl
[01:01:53] <pcw_home> I dont think theres anything you can do in a pinout file that will affect card access
[01:01:54] <pcw_home> really only bad ucf file or unassociated ucf file
[01:02:21] <pcw_home> so its very likely its OK
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[01:57:44] <KGB-linuxcnc> 05dgarr/jog_ignore_fo 2b5c9ce 06linuxcnc 04. branch deleted * 14http://git.linuxcnc.org/?p=linuxcnc.git;a=commitdiff;h=2b5c9ce
[01:57:59] <KGB-linuxcnc> 05dgarr/jog_no_fo 0d18f03 06linuxcnc 04. branch deleted * 14http://git.linuxcnc.org/?p=linuxcnc.git;a=commitdiff;h=0d18f03
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[02:22:23] <cradek> whee, burnt, rebooting
[02:22:59] <Tom_itx> ?
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[02:25:06] <seb_kuzminsky> cradek: cool!
[02:25:29] <cradek> no brick!
[02:25:33] <seb_kuzminsky> it would be cool if we had a working hm2 buildbot, then you could add a config file for the firmware you want and get automatic builds & bugfixes for it
[02:25:39] <cradek> but the stepgens are in a weird order
[02:25:55] <Tom_itx> i found that changed on mine too
[02:25:57] <cradek> 2/3, 4/5, 16/17, 6/7, 8/9
[02:26:28] <cradek> seb_kuzminsky: yeah, that would have been cool, but probably not widely needed
[02:27:29] <Tom_itx> would you rather they be at the bottom?
[02:28:10] <cradek> yeah, but that wasn't given as a requirement originally :-)
[02:28:19] <cradek> it's fine, simple hal editing -- thanks again
[02:28:33] <Tom_itx> i made the instance order somewhat match the io
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[02:28:41] <Tom_itx> that's probably why
[02:29:01] <cradek> yeah I was thinking more along the parport pin numbers
[02:31:11] <Tom_itx> i could move them to be stepgen 08
[02:31:14] <Tom_itx> if you like
[02:32:06] <cradek> I have jogs!
[02:32:08] <cradek> yay
[02:32:15] <Tom_itx> works?
[02:32:22] <cradek> yep
[02:32:24] <Tom_itx> cool
[02:32:29] <cradek> scale is wrong but it moves
[02:33:33] <cradek> actually the scale is right - jogs are just too slow
[02:33:36] <Tom_itx> keep that vhd file
[02:33:39] <cradek> so it's perfect
[02:33:44] <cradek> yeah it's right next to the .bit
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[02:53:05] <Tom_itx> cradek, i'm reordering the stepgens... i'll post the files to the same link if you wanna use em
[02:53:33] <Tom_itx> suffix D instead of C
[02:54:55] <cradek> thanks, I'll download and keep them for next time around
[02:55:21] <Tom_itx> synthesizing right now..
[02:56:39] <Tom_itx> should be the same pin order as you had with 16 & 17 tacked on the bottom
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[03:05:46] <Tom_itx> posted.
[03:07:54] <cradek> saved, thanks
[03:08:17] <cradek> if I need the 5th axis I'll reflash so they're in order again, but for now it's fine
[03:08:50] <Tom_itx> you use mesaflash to upload the bit files?
[03:08:54] <cradek> yeah
[03:08:56] <Tom_itx> i've never done a 5i25 yes
[03:08:58] <Tom_itx> yet*
[03:09:07] <cradek> I just use the packaged one from the linuxcnc repository
[03:09:12] <Tom_itx> yeah
[03:09:35] <pcw_home> You should not need to reboot anymore...
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[03:09:44] <cradek> it said I needed to
[03:10:22] <Tom_itx> pcw_home do the ether cards load the same way?
[03:10:25] <pcw_home> Ahh because your old bitfile didnt support ICAP
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[03:11:19] <pcw_home> Yes, mesaflash works with the Ethernet and EPP cards also
[03:11:33] <pcw_home> maybe even serial
[03:12:49] <pcw_home> you can check if a PCI card supports ICAP by reading offset 0x78
[03:13:47] <pcw_home> sudo mesaflash --device 5i25 --rpo 0x78
[03:14:07] <Tom_itx> what exactly is ICAP?
[03:15:23] <jepler> Internal Configuration Access Port, allowing reconfiguration of the running FPGA
[03:16:53] <Tom_itx> do they store 2 configurations?
[03:17:00] <Tom_itx> a default and a runing one
[03:17:14] <pcw_home> The standard setup uses 2
[03:17:30] <pcw_home> a user config and a fallback config
[03:17:36] <Tom_itx> right
[03:17:44] <Tom_itx> in case of an oops
[03:18:05] <pcw_home> so for example if you pull the plug while writing a new config, thats recoverable
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[03:20:55] <cradek> wow XC blending sucks
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[03:25:13] <skunkworks_> cradek: what linuxcnc version?
[03:25:17] <cradek> 2.6.4
[03:25:58] <skunkworks_> I don't think master is much better./
[03:26:13] <cradek> heck, really?
[03:26:38] <skunkworks_> only xyz - all other blends fall back to parabolic
[03:27:23] <cradek> heh, figures he'd keep the broken parts
[03:37:15] <skunkworks_> what is the lense for?
[03:41:42] <cradek> eyeglasses
[03:43:03] <cradek> putting lenses in some cool vintage solid gold frames (ebay $19 hahaha)
[03:47:02] <skunkworks_> ah - ok.
[03:48:23] <cradek> oooops space heater + spindle + vacuum = nope
[03:48:35] <skunkworks_> well that sucks..
[03:48:59] <cradek> yep
[03:49:10] <cradek> it's very smart to have the lights on a different circuit
[03:49:37] <Tom_itx> heh
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[03:50:07] <cradek> argh, my offsets are gone
[03:50:15] <cradek> siiigh
[03:50:39] <cradek> ok, maybe that's enough for tonight
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[03:55:24] <cradek> oh hey, I just realized that with super glue I could make the 6" scale that I want: mm on one side, 10ths/100ths of inches on the other
[03:55:43] <cradek> as it is, I always grab the wrong one and there are those stupid fractions
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[04:20:40] <seb_kuzminsky> cradek: i have that ruler! no superglue involved!
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[04:20:58] <Tom_itx> not easy to find but i may have one
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[04:21:14] <Tom_itx> got a bunch of 'general' rulers on a bankrupcy sale once
[04:25:52] <seb_kuzminsky> cradek:
http://imgur.com/a/oCazB (whiskey for scale)
[04:27:00] <skunkworks_> I think cradek said - mm on one side - 10/100th inch on othe..
[04:28:36] <seb_kuzminsky> i think that's what i showed
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[04:29:02] <seb_kuzminsky> here's the 12" flexible version:
http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PMAKA=319-9574
[04:29:35] <seb_kuzminsky> and here's the 6":
http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PMAKA=319-9581
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[04:30:42] <skunkworks_> how much whiskey have you been drinking?
[04:30:53] <seb_kuzminsky> err... some
[04:30:56] <seb_kuzminsky> what am i missing?
[04:31:06] <seb_kuzminsky> mm on one side, 10th/100ths on the other
[04:32:05] <seb_kuzminsky> i agree with cradek, the problem's not imperial units, the problem's fractions
[04:32:06] <cradek> by golly, that's exactly it
[04:32:08] <skunkworks_> the one you posted -
http://imgur.com/a/oCazB is metric on both sides..
[04:32:26] <seb_kuzminsky> skunkworks_: how much whiskey have *you* been drinking? ;-)
[04:32:36] <cradek> well I know I haven't had enough
[04:32:48] <cradek> (none actually)
[04:32:54] <skunkworks_> heh - I must be totally missing something
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[04:33:31] <seb_kuzminsky> cradek: it's my favourite
[04:33:43] <seb_kuzminsky> the 6" one lives in the little pocket on my shop apron
[04:33:44] <skunkworks_> oh - you mean - on the flip side...
[04:33:51] <seb_kuzminsky> haha
[04:34:02] * seb_kuzminsky points at skunkworks
[04:34:16] <skunkworks_> I have shingles - don't make fun..
[04:34:26] <seb_kuzminsky> and even cooler, it's got furlongs too
[04:34:31] <seb_kuzminsky> on the *in* side
[04:35:03] <cradek> I can have free shipping if I get 10 of them...
[04:35:31] <seb_kuzminsky> or if you wait 1-6 months for a free shipping deal
[04:35:57] <cradek> they could put it in an envelope with a 49c stamp, but noooo
[04:36:20] <seb_kuzminsky> well they'd also have to pay the guy/lady who goes to get it in the warehouse
[04:36:55] <seb_kuzminsky> i'm irrationally exhuberant to finally have a complete allen key set (again, and for a few months until i lose one)
[04:37:20] <seb_kuzminsky> http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PMAKA=800-0177
[04:37:34] <seb_kuzminsky> (i'm trying to get cradek up to the $49 or whatever's needed for free shipping this week)
[04:37:49] <cradek> my latest spam says $99
[04:38:05] <cradek> they go in a special folder...
[04:38:33] <cradek> oh hey, I should get some 1/8" end mills because I'm on the last one
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[04:39:43] <seb_kuzminsky> skunkworks_: how many shingles? in 100ths of an inch pls
[04:41:14] <skunkworks_> so far on my back.. only reports from my wife
[04:41:37] <seb_kuzminsky> stupid meat bodies
[04:41:48] <cradek> is that a virus?
[04:41:49] <seb_kuzminsky> when the revolution comes i'm going to have an awesome robot body
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[04:50:28] <skunkworks_> yes
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[04:55:00] <cradek> yuck, hope it's better soon
[04:55:55] <skunkworks_> thanks. trying to work on stress now :)
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[05:00:09] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03Sebastian Kuzminsky 052.6 60247a3 06linuxcnc 10src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc task: fix the dropped-mdi bug * 14http://git.linuxcnc.org/?p=linuxcnc.git;a=commitdiff;h=60247a3
[05:00:09] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03Sebastian Kuzminsky 052.6 4b40d3a 06linuxcnc 10src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc task: remove some dead code * 14http://git.linuxcnc.org/?p=linuxcnc.git;a=commitdiff;h=4b40d3a
[05:01:06] <seb_kuzminsky> a 1-line patch is all i have to show for a week of debugging
[05:01:19] <seb_kuzminsky> goodnight, friends
[05:04:16] <skunkworks_> that fixes it?
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[15:01:45] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03Sebastian Kuzminsky 052.7 3726cf4 06linuxcnc 10src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc Merge remote-tracking branch 'origin/2.6' into 2.7 * 14http://git.linuxcnc.org/?p=linuxcnc.git;a=commitdiff;h=3726cf4
[15:04:10] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03Sebastian Kuzminsky 05master 382a14c 06linuxcnc Merge remote-tracking branch 'origin/2.7' * 14http://git.linuxcnc.org/?p=linuxcnc.git;a=commitdiff;h=382a14c
[15:05:10] <cradek> yay for one line fixes
[15:06:36] <bjmorel_work> cradek: I saw on your website some routines for probing. Mind if I ask what kind of probe you've got?
[15:07:01] <cradek> I have a renishaw with the IR interface
[15:07:32] <cradek> an old one, but it's very nice
[15:09:26] <archivist> I dont recommend the Valeron digital techniques probe, mine has bad connections
[15:10:22] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03Sebastian Kuzminsky 052.6 397fae4 06linuxcnc 10docs/man/man9/mux_generic.9 docs: fix up whitespace in mux_generic(9) manpage * 14http://git.linuxcnc.org/?p=linuxcnc.git;a=commitdiff;h=397fae4
[15:19:31] <jepler> somebody must have homebrewed a wireless probe by now
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[15:23:09] <archivist> mine is optical to the control, it flashes LEDs around the barrel
[15:25:23] <seb_kuzminsky> jepler: what was/is the complication with the lui rebase?
[15:25:32] <seb_kuzminsky> err, gotta run, bbl
[15:25:53] <jepler> seb_kuzminsky: just a lot of conflicts due to the nml command queue patch
[15:26:06] <jepler> I knew it would be bad, but I still thought I would get it done over the weekend .. :-/
[15:26:37] <jepler> archivist: yeah, IR is probably still the best idea (vs, say, bluetooth wireless)
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[15:30:43] <archivist> mine is a huge cat 50 and impossible to get battery
http://www.collection.archivist.info/searchv13.php?searchstr=probe+pd being modified but the contacts seem bad
[15:31:38] <jepler> boo for impossible batteries
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[15:39:00] <cradek> mine takes a 9v
[15:39:16] <cradek> I guess it's from the old days, when things weren't so stupid
[15:39:58] <archivist> mine is two 3v lithiums, a pair of 123 size are too long to fit
[15:42:40] <archivist> but contact pressure and sizes just dont fit with tiny stuff so thinking of cameras again
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[15:45:52] <jepler> ADXL362 might make an interesting part of a wireless touch probe. It's an accelerometer which as a motion-activated wake mode that draws just 270nA. Together with a microcontroller, you can get a "hibernation" draw of <2µA
https://www.sparkfun.com/products/11447
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[15:46:59] <archivist> spindle rotation will set it off
[15:47:12] <jepler> sending one RC-5 remote code on touch is 3uC/mA
[15:48:14] <jepler> seems like you could have a fairly long-running probe with 3AA or a 3V lithium
[15:50:53] <ssi> build an inductive charging system into your tool carousel
[15:50:54] <ssi> :D
[15:51:06] <archivist> actually the venerable PIC chips have a button press wake mode, that could be the probe contact itself
[15:51:31] <jepler> cradek's renishaw gives pulses whenever it's active, so you can avoid starting a probing move if the battery's dead or the receiver's blocked
[15:51:50] <jepler> but you don't want to do that if you're in the drawer
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[15:52:06] <jepler> of course if you're in the toolchanger you'll wake with every toolchange
[15:52:17] <ssi> the renishaws have to be spun to wake up, I think?
[15:52:29] <cradek> it's two-way communication of some kind. the control sends a command to turn it on ... somehow
[15:52:29] <archivist> the thing I have also has a button out the cat50 taper so it senses being loaded
[15:53:00] <cradek> you certainly don't spin it (eeeek)
[15:53:55] <cradek> I either need to get more super glue, or quit cutting myself by doing stupid stuff
[15:54:03] <jepler> hmm how would you do wake-on-IR?
[15:54:04] <cradek> (ideally both)
[15:54:30] <archivist> you should spin to remove concentric errors of the probe
[15:54:50] <ssi> "The probe may be activated by RF signal initiated by an M-code, spinning or shank switch.
[15:54:53] <ssi> http://www.renishaw.com/en/rmp60-touch-probe--6100
[15:55:52] <jepler> wake on RF, hm
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[15:57:01] <cradek> heh mine must be older than their "legacy" models
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[16:01:17] <cradek> http://resources.renishaw.com/en/details/data-sheet-high-power-optical-transmission-system--7857
[16:01:28] <cradek> this is what I have - looks like it's entirely optical
[16:02:53] <seb_kuzminsky> jepler: bummer, but thanks for working on it
[16:03:05] <jepler> seb_kuzminsky: I'll keep at it
[16:03:07] <seb_kuzminsky> and on getting the nml serial number fix merged
[16:05:02] <jepler> you're welcome
[16:05:06] <jepler> thanks for finding that damned bug
[16:07:14] <seb_kuzminsky> sure
[16:07:29] <seb_kuzminsky> i'm going to ignore lui for a while and work on 2.7 instead
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[16:11:24] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03Sebastian Kuzminsky 052.6 b63d201 06linuxcnc 10src/emc/nml_intf/interpl.cc NML: improved debugging in interp_list * 14http://git.linuxcnc.org/?p=linuxcnc.git;a=commitdiff;h=b63d201
[16:15:51] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03Sebastian Kuzminsky 052.7 b7769e9 06linuxcnc 10docs/src/common/Getting_LinuxCNC.txt docs: note that linuxcnc is available for ubuntu and debian * 14http://git.linuxcnc.org/?p=linuxcnc.git;a=commitdiff;h=b7769e9
[16:15:51] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03Sebastian Kuzminsky 052.7 a2659f1 06linuxcnc 10docs/src/common/overleaf.txt docs: update copyright years to 2014 * 14http://git.linuxcnc.org/?p=linuxcnc.git;a=commitdiff;h=a2659f1
[16:15:51] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03Sebastian Kuzminsky 052.7 a659b62 06linuxcnc 10docs/src/common/Getting_LinuxCNC.txt docs: better link to the mailing list * 14http://git.linuxcnc.org/?p=linuxcnc.git;a=commitdiff;h=a659b62
[16:15:53] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03Sebastian Kuzminsky 052.7 5b75ada 06linuxcnc Merge remote-tracking branch 'origin/2.6' into 2.7 * 14http://git.linuxcnc.org/?p=linuxcnc.git;a=commitdiff;h=5b75ada
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[17:04:17] <seb_kuzminsky> attrition in the debian camp continues :-(
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[17:07:51] <cradek> I have missed all of this so far except I heard someone mention it - what's happening?
[17:11:56] <seb_kuzminsky> a bunch of long-time debian developers have quit for various reasons, mostly related to "i can't take all the anger and negativity and personal attacks any more"
[17:12:16] <seb_kuzminsky> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTg0MjM
[17:12:19] <Roguish> Gotta read Slashdot
[17:13:08] <archivist> I have been cured of /. about 6-8 years ago
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[18:43:19] <jepler> cradek: RedHat has developed a group of new programs under the umbrella of "systemd", a program which replaces PID 0. Like Ubuntu's "upstart", it aims to modernize the init system as well as other things like management of logged in users.
[18:43:49] <jepler> cradek: Many components of Gnome are tightly coupled with systemd, and many components which used to be independent (e.g., udev) have also become closely coupled with systemd.
[18:44:29] <jepler> cradek: during the Debian Jessie development cycle, there has been a long-running flamewar between people who like systemd and people who like the status quo
[18:45:05] <jepler> while I tend to side with "status quo", there are a lot of visible a--holes on that side
[18:45:40] <jepler> well there are jerks on both sides
[18:46:24] <cradek> my knee jerks firmly in the direction of not wanting gui stuff stirred in with system stuff
[18:46:25] <jepler> but only the status quo side has an obviously mentally ill individual who inexplicably spams the linux kernel (!) mailing list about ten times a day, for instance to plug his new music video "f--- systemd"
[18:46:39] <cradek> wow
[18:46:53] <jepler> and somehow he has also started ranting about feminism
[18:46:59] <cradek> wow!
[18:47:04] <jepler> so it looks really bad for the status quo side
[18:49:41] <jepler> personally, I find some of the ideas in systemd very interesting, but it very much feels like a "moving target" and therefore likely to need another tough migration from jessie to jessie+1; and also the systemd authors are committed to non-portability -- they use linux-only syscalls and are on record as unwilling to add a portability library that would ever allow e.g., a port to freebsd. as I'm a user of debian kfreebsd, this
[18:50:13] <jepler> it's a really weird attitude that I don't understand. "we think you're likely to have difficulty porting this to freebsd" I would understand; "there's no way we'll take portability patches" is altogether weirder.
[18:50:19] <cradek> kfreebsd, this ...
[18:50:33] <jepler> this is an important strike against it
[18:50:36] <cradek> ah
[18:50:50] <cradek> yeah that's hard to understand and smells kind of like mental illness
[18:51:29] <jepler> but anyway it's become a real sh--storm in the debian community and it sucks
[18:51:38] <cradek> yeah I can see where it would
[18:51:41] <cradek> thanks for the explanation
[18:51:51] <jepler> fwiw I have systemd installed on my everyday laptop and it has not caused me any trouble
[18:52:09] <cradek> has it caused you any benefit?
[18:52:25] <jepler> at some point the output of "dmesg" became colorized, I dunno if that's their doing
[18:52:37] <jepler> (systemd replaces syslogd with journald, so it does interfere^Wenhance logging in some way)
[18:52:40] <seb_kuzminsky> dmesg, really?
[18:53:17] <seb_kuzminsky> many improvements are not visible to users, they simply remove behind-the-scenes cruft that bug developers
[18:53:33] <seb_kuzminsky> i have no opinion about systemd, btw
[18:53:35] <cradek> did they break^Wmodernize all the things we know and love about syslog, like remote logging?
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[18:56:08] <jepler> cradek: yes from some googling it looks like it
[18:56:23] <cradek> welp
[18:56:55] <cradek> it's easy to forget to rewrite everything when you're rewriting things
[18:57:33] <jepler> some of their recent acquisitions are a new name resolver and a new network time synchronization server
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[18:58:45] <cradek> that's hard for me to understand
[18:58:52] <jepler> it's quite easy for me to slip into thinking of systemd as class CADT development model
[18:59:02] <cradek> sure sounds like
[19:00:33] <jepler> but on the other hand, RedHat (who I think are employing the principal developers of systemd) are confident enough in it to ship it in RHEL
[19:01:08] <jepler> not that I know who is using RHEL but it's software that you pay money for so it must be good
[19:02:00] <jepler> on the other hand, you also have representatives of Red Hat Product Security recommend to disable parts of systemd, sooo
http://www.openwall.com/lists/oss-security/2014/11/12/6
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[19:03:09] <cradek> whyyyyyy would you write a new replacement for bind?
[19:03:26] <jepler> I can tell you're a status quo kind of guy
[19:03:59] <cradek> who would want to take that on? it has years and years of fixes and hardening
[19:04:13] <jepler> do you remember being a young programmer who could do anything?
[19:04:17] <jepler> I do
[19:04:32] <jepler> "I can write a DNS resolver in 35 lines of Python", I used to say
[19:05:13] <cradek> and I could make it replace ntp and init and syslog too, with 35 more lines!
[19:05:35] <jepler> argh I am sorry I've steered this conversation into ad hominem attacks on systemd developers
[19:06:13] <cradek> it's a thing that happens
[19:06:14] <jepler> I am also very much a status quo guy
[19:06:36] <seb_kuzminsky> i bet jmk thinks of you as a "shiny new things" guy
[19:07:02] <cradek> heh
[19:07:02] <jepler> probably. it is a spectrum
[19:08:03] <cradek> after years and years of fixes and hardening, some people look at software as done, others look at it as ugly and inelegant
[19:08:25] <seb_kuzminsky> and they're both right
[19:08:34] <cradek> perhaps
[19:08:57] <seb_kuzminsky> we've had reperesentatives of both schools in our recent debates about NML
[19:11:53] <memleak> one thing i love about systemd is the start-up times and all the colors :)
[19:12:05] <seb_kuzminsky> does it start up super quick?
[19:12:09] <cradek> that's two things
[19:12:16] <memleak> lol yes it is, sorry
[19:12:26] <memleak> and seb_kuzminsky yes it does
[19:12:38] <seb_kuzminsky> "one thing i love about systemd is it makes 2 == 1"
[19:12:44] <memleak> xD
[19:12:45] <cradek> 1:12PM up 657 days, 21:33, 12 users, load averages: 0.26, 0.17, 0.10
[19:12:47] <jepler> if I was rebooting all the time I might care about boot times :-P
[19:12:56] <seb_kuzminsky> haha
[19:13:02] <memleak> when i was doing rtai development i was rebooting every few minutes..
[19:13:14] <cradek> (I had to check three machines before I found one up > 1yr)
[19:13:15] <memleak> either that or experiencing kernel panics
[19:13:24] <seb_kuzminsky> maybe cradek would reboot more often if it didnt take 658 days for his machine to come up
[19:13:30] <memleak> systemd really came in handy for me at that point
[19:13:55] <seb_kuzminsky> memleak: i bet
[19:14:23] <memleak> its a real pain to work though, too much documentation and too much code and complicated scripting
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[19:14:40] <jepler> too much documentation ?!
[19:14:41] <jepler> zowie
[19:15:24] <memleak> yes i was trying to write a simple systemd start-up script and it was an enormous webpage on writing a systemd script with several pages per function
[19:15:36] <seb_kuzminsky> yikes
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[19:17:25] <jepler> that's weird, one claim about systemd service files is that they're simpler than a sysvinit shell script
[19:17:41] norbert_ is now known as Guest8791
[19:18:04] <jepler> norbert: why do you / why does your client change your nick from a sensible one to "Guest1234" ?
[19:19:37] <memleak> freedesktop.org/software/systemd/man/
[19:20:12] <Guest8791> Hope someone are able to help, I did a commit "f2ec59a600ff5ed9336df217bfc4b98d76329bd9" some time ago, that did fix an smal error with the pause button on gmoccapy, but unfortunately it was only aplied to 2.7, not to 2.6. Now I found an other smal bug, I need to fix in 2.6 also, but I am afraid I will destroy 2.7 and master if someone later merge 2.6 in 2.7. So how can I get the patch I made also in 2.6.
[19:20:21] Guest8791 is now known as norbert__
[19:20:54] <norbert__> Sorry, for commenting as guest, I forget to change my name, I am norbert, (gmoccapy_man)
[19:21:19] <jepler> norbert__: my screen shows that you were initially called "norbert_" but then your name immediately changed to "Guest"
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[19:21:50] <norbert__> Yes I do not understand that eather, it only hapens on the debian computer
[19:22:47] <norbert__> bbl, wife is calling
[19:25:25] <seb_kuzminsky> must be that new systemd irc client
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[19:28:43] <PCW> Ran hm2-eth all weekend with 4 KHz servo thread on a H81 MB w G3258, no errors
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[19:29:13] <seb_kuzminsky> sweet
[19:30:22] <PCW> ~25 usec worst case write time ~95 usec worst case read time (read sends request and waits for reply)
[19:31:33] <seb_kuzminsky> that's really impressive
[19:31:58] <seb_kuzminsky> i look forward to getting that software out to users with our 2.7 release
[19:32:11] <PCW> actual network stack jitter is really small on this machine for whatever reason (I think speed or cache size)
[19:32:25] <seb_kuzminsky> what nic does it use?
[19:32:40] <PCW> crappy RTK 8111
[19:33:19] <PCW> (well and USB NIC for internet)
[19:33:48] <seb_kuzminsky> cool
[19:36:09] <PCW> So I am looking forward to 2.7 release also, I dont anticipate any bad surprises
[19:36:10] <PCW> (other than people having network config issues or fighting with the network mangler)
[19:36:54] <jepler> we need a document that helps people choose which RT kernel to use
[19:37:11] <jepler> 1. software stepgen, or one of the drivers not ported to uspace: rtai
[19:37:23] <jepler> 2. intelligent motion control: uspace
[19:37:55] <jepler> well that was pretty short :-P
[19:38:12] <PCW> yeah of course you can run PCI/Parallel connected hardware on uspace also
[19:38:35] <seb_kuzminsky> i'd like to put the install/upgrade/configure docs in git for 2.7, instead of on the wiki
[19:39:01] <seb_kuzminsky> in the Getting Started section, probably:
http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.7/html/
[19:39:05] <jepler> all mesa and pico boards run great on uspace as far as I'm aware
[19:39:30] <PCW> Yeah
[19:39:31] <cradek> my 5i25 worked great
[19:39:35] <jepler> but the older boards just aren't ported over
[19:39:51] <jepler> totally happy to accept patches from anyone who can test them
[19:39:59] <PCW> exceptions maybe people needing the fastest servo thread possible
[19:40:16] <seb_kuzminsky> i wonder if the General Mechatronics folks are interested in porting their driver? i'll mail them and ask
[19:40:45] <jepler> ISA boards that use memory-mapped I/O may not readily port to uspace
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[19:41:16] <jepler> ISA boards that use in/out b/w/l should be easy until they get rid of userspace iopl()
[19:41:33] <PCW> Probably not a lot of memory mapped ISA I/O cards
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[19:48:28] <jepler> hal_evoreg seems to be the only one in tree
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[19:49:59] <seb_kuzminsky> does isa have horrible latency nowdays?
[19:50:29] <jepler> I don't think it's gotten better
[19:50:35] <jepler> but where would you buy a motherboard with isa slots anyway?
[19:51:31] <cradek> one does not buy motherboards
[19:51:44] <jepler> it's true, cradek has a stack of 486DX motherboards in his office
[19:52:06] <jepler> if only he could get the memory chips for them, as well as the ISA-slot MFM hard drive controller
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[20:05:18] <jepler> cradek: bad news, Debian hasn't run on 486es for years --
http://mid.gmane.org/1415655187.3087.10.camel%40adam-barratt.org.uk
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[20:35:30] <skunkworks> cradek: if you are a integrator - you buy new motherboards.. :)
[20:35:35] <skunkworks> an..
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[20:39:39] <Tom_itx> Guest usually happens if you don't log in before the timeout
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[21:04:40] <norbert__> seb_kuzminski: Could you please chery pick f2ec59a600ff5ed9336df217bfc4b98d76329bd9 and place it in 2.6 too?
[21:05:06] <norbert__> I am realy afraid breaking every thing again
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[21:50:24] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03Norbert Schechner 052.6 0f5a451 06linuxcnc 10src/emc/usr_intf/gmoccapy/gmoccapy.glade 10src/emc/usr_intf/gmoccapy/gmoccapy.py 10src/emc/usr_intf/gmoccapy/release_notes.txt gmoccapy_1_3_2 - PAUSE button did not get active on M01 * 14http://git.linuxcnc.org/?p=linuxcnc.git;a=commitdiff;h=0f5a451
[21:50:24] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03Chris Radek 052.7 3e70eea 06linuxcnc Merge branch '2.6' into 2.7 * 14http://git.linuxcnc.org/?p=linuxcnc.git;a=commitdiff;h=3e70eea
[21:50:24] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03Chris Radek 05master 5a12a79 06linuxcnc Merge branch '2.7' * 14http://git.linuxcnc.org/?p=linuxcnc.git;a=commitdiff;h=5a12a79
[21:50:32] <jepler> thanks cradek
[21:50:39] <cradek> no problem!
[21:51:56] <micges> seb_kuzminsky: around?
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[22:08:36] <seb_kuzminsky> micges: hola
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[22:11:16] <micges> seb_kuzminsky: there is latest stable branch of mesaflash called 3.1
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[22:13:16] <micges> could you update package in some free time to be sure users get all working binary?
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[22:14:58] <seb_kuzminsky> micges: sure, will do
[22:15:14] <seb_kuzminsky> do you want me to build a different branch this time, or still master?
[22:18:14] <micges> use branch v3.1
[22:20:15] <seb_kuzminsky> ok
[22:23:44] <seb_kuzminsky> micges: you need to update the debian/changelog file with the new version number & change information
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[22:25:02] <micges> dang, I'm on winblows now, can I do it in few hours?
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[22:26:47] <seb_kuzminsky> no rush from me
[22:26:59] <seb_kuzminsky> let me know when you want me to pull again
[22:27:25] <micges> thanks
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[22:50:48] <skunkworks> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8gfsly2EjE&feature=youtu.be
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[22:51:39] <jepler> you have to configure your DNS servers?
[22:51:40] <seb_kuzminsky> cool!
[22:51:52] <seb_kuzminsky> no, it uses mdns usually, which is totally the right thing to do
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[22:55:14] <jepler> seems to be a pretty decent clone of axis in somebody else's favorite toolkit
[22:55:53] <jepler> ooh the coordinate axes are not in hershey font
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[22:56:34] <seb_kuzminsky> with (apparently) a zeroconf tcp backend, whcih is awesome
[22:56:47] <jepler> jog velocity is not exponential
[22:57:43] <seb_kuzminsky> i like that you can hear the steppers humming in the background
[22:58:22] <jepler> it just seems like total overkill when the only sane choice is to run realtime, task and UI all on the same single machine
[22:59:12] <jepler> interesting to have 3 separate jog speed sliders in machineface
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[22:59:47] <jepler> of course having 24 different sized buttons all with different colors makes my teeth hurt
[23:00:45] <seb_kuzminsky> i like the use of hue to indicate axis, and saturation to indicate jog increment, but yes it's a bit garish
[23:01:35] <jepler> was that selecting individual lines of code to run ?
[23:02:08] <seb_kuzminsky> i didn't understand what he was showing by selecting the lines
[23:02:17] <jepler> I had audio off so I'm only guessing
[23:03:11] <seb_kuzminsky> the awesome sauce there, imo, is mdns to discover a controller on the network, then talking to it over tcp (with the gui running in a browser)
[23:03:28] <seb_kuzminsky> i guess it's talking to that server that jepler mentioned the other day, which then turns around and talks nml to task
[23:03:45] <kb8wmc> jepler: good evening sir, wondering if you have any experience with setting up camview/camera as I am lost attempting to get the machine to move when I attempt of activate the G43H99 code on my machine
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[23:04:06] <jepler> kb8wmc: nope, never used camview
[23:04:27] <kb8wmc> ok...tnx for answering....
[23:04:42] <seb_kuzminsky> kb8wmc: g43 shouldnt move the machine
[23:05:21] <kb8wmc> seb_kuzminsky: well may be that I am not understanding the instructions properly then
[23:06:06] <jepler> what seb says about G43 is correct.
[23:06:07] <jepler> > G43 and G43.1 change subsequent motions by offsetting the Z and/or X coordinates by the length of the tool. G43 and G43.1 do not cause any motion. The next time a compensated axis is moved, that axis's endpoint is the compensated location.
[23:06:47] <jepler> so if you command G43H99, and it has a different Z tool offset from the one previously in effect, then the next Z motion is to a Z value that takes into account the tool length
[23:07:05] <jepler> (the wording needs to be updated because tool offsets are now possible on all axis letters, not just X and Z)
[23:07:13] <kb8wmc> ok, rgr that jepler, I do remember that now, the use of the G43 is for setting an offset
[23:07:16] <jepler> (but google served me up version 2.4 documentation anyway)
[23:07:33] <jepler> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/html/gcode/gcode.html#sec:G43
[23:07:47] <jepler> jthornton:
http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/html/gcode/gcode.html#sec:G43 should say that any axis letter can be affected by G43, not just X/Z
[23:07:49] <kb8wmc> jepler: tnx...
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[23:13:55] <kb8wmc> jepler: suffice it to say, I am confused about the setup of the camview, I probably have overlooked something and/or just how it is supposed to function
[23:14:23] <seb_kuzminsky> i've never used camview, and i have no idea how it's supposed to be set up, sorry...
[23:14:38] <kb8wmc> not a problem seb
[23:15:09] <kb8wmc> I will ask around some more and maybe find someone that has successfully set it up
[23:15:17] <kb8wmc> tnx for your time sir
[23:15:24] <kb8wmc> sirs
[23:16:06] <seb_kuzminsky> you're welcome, sir
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[23:46:40] <jepler> huh, is my u3 operating without l2 cache? of course this could just be upstreaming something already in the odroid kernel tree..
https://lkml.org/lkml/2014/11/17/217
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[23:47:52] <seb_kuzminsky> strange
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[23:51:21] <seb_kuzminsky> http://pastie.org/9726441
[23:51:30] <seb_kuzminsky> lstopo on my u3 shows no L2 active
[23:51:47] <jepler> .. yes, there is code in the odroid kernel to enable the l2 cache
[23:52:01] <jepler> seb_kuzminsky: but it might just not be smart enough to find it
[23:52:08] <jepler> (that's what my lstopo shows too)
[23:52:12] <jepler> [ 0.000000] Running under secure firmware.
[23:52:15] <jepler> and this is in dmesg
[23:52:24] <seb_kuzminsky> jepler: right
[23:52:50] <seb_kuzminsky> heh, my dmesg is empty because my u3 runs runtests, which clears dmesg frequently
[23:54:12] <jepler> I have a /var/log/dmesg
[23:55:48] <seb_kuzminsky> yeah, there's that