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[02:13:50] <NTU> no rule to make target deb-pkg.. it worked before..
[02:14:20] <NTU> maybe thats only for kernels..
[02:15:18] <NTU> whats the automagic way for non-kernels is what i want to know..
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[12:07:34] <jepler> NTU: "debuild" is the command I invoke in a debianized source tree. behind the scenes it invokes dpkg-buildpackage.
[12:07:38] <jepler> and other things
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[12:39:38] <jepler> huh, over half the commits in our git are *not* on the master branch
[12:39:38] <jepler> $ git rev-list origin/master | wc
[12:39:38] <jepler> 15707 15707 643987
[12:39:38] <jepler> $ git rev-list --all ^origin/master | wc
[12:39:38] <jepler> 14955 14955 613155
[12:39:58] <jepler> er, nearly half
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[13:13:48] <jepler> on the odroid, "opengl es" is accelerated, but standard (classic?) opengl isn't. unfortunately, "opengl es" does not have a wire protocol; it's for local display only
[13:14:05] <cradek> oh ick.
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[13:17:47] <jepler> I'm also not sure at what point opengl es started being accelerated on linux boxes where opengl is accelerated. On my debian jessie laptop with intel graphics, opengl es is shown as accelerated.
[13:18:59] <jepler> libgles1-mesa-dev is not on 10.04
[13:20:49] <jepler> and on my debian wheezy desktop with nvidia, opengl es is not accelerated
[13:21:05] <jepler> so even if I can make axis able to use either one, it'll also have to figure out which one to use
[13:22:48] <cradek> it would be nice to know what the situation will be like in a few years
[13:23:37] <jepler> ooh wikipedia says: > For full compatibility with OpenGL on ES-only devices, Nvidia offers a BSD licensed library called Regal
[13:23:49] <cradek> ooh!
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[13:24:18] <jepler> https://github.com/p3/regal
[13:24:36] <jepler> Compatible
[13:24:36] <jepler> Immediate mode, fixed function, GL_QUADS work everywhere, emulated as necessary.
[13:24:44] <jepler> I'll be taking a good look at this
[13:25:31] <jepler> still for odroid I might need to figure out how to switch between regal and glx at runtime, blah
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[15:34:58] <NTU> how do you automatically debianize a tree like deb-pkg though..
[15:35:18] <NTU> deb-pkg works flawlessly yet it seems to only want to work with kernels
[15:47:25] <cradek> there is no such thing as automatic -- that only works because someone worked hard on it
[15:47:51] <cradek> for other trees, see the debianizing introduction/howto I linked to yesterday
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[16:08:32] <mozmck> NTU: look up make-kpkg
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[16:26:36] <skunkworks> quite a few days at 16us...
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[16:43:01] <pcw_home_> man that guy with the lathe has his troubles
[16:43:34] <cradek> he just needs to stop running pncconf and troubleshoot
[16:43:55] <pcw_home_> Yeah pncconf using machine on for spindle enable is not right
[16:44:08] <cradek> I have no idea what he means when he says he "gets absolutely no movement"
[16:44:39] <pcw_home_> no idea either
[16:44:53] <cradek> there are a LOT of spindle signals to worry about
[16:45:09] <pcw_home_> yeah
[16:45:16] <cradek> there are many (redundant) outputs and several inputs that have to be right
[16:45:35] <cradek> you can easily get some kinds of motion and not other kinds, if you have some inputs right but not others
[16:45:49] <cradek> but you already know this, sorry
[16:46:42] <cradek> I bet a lathe is a hard first retrofit
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[16:47:57] <pcw_home_> Yeah, also weird that there's a high res encoder with only A
[16:51:12] <pcw_home_> at one time there was a bug in the hostmot2 driver where 1 /= true but I _think_ that was fixed
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[17:46:40] <micges-dev> it was fixed
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[18:03:55] <pcw_home_> I think most bugs that guy has are pncconf bugs
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[19:07:14] <CaptHindsight> http://www.3ders.org/articles/20140917-flx-arm-low-cost-scara-robotic-arm-for-3d-printing.html I'd call it the "T-Slot-Bot"
[19:08:03] <CaptHindsight> $1,799
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[19:09:49] <CaptHindsight> closed-loop motion control platform with integrated ultra-high resolution optical encoders for feedback
[19:11:28] <CaptHindsight> Synchronous Motion at Pulse Rates up to 1 MHz , ARM Cortex M4 with FPGA
[19:11:46] <jepler> did you see the video going around of the "3d printer" on wheels? long long ago I contemplated "rckins", kinematics for an RC car, but never figured out how that might work.
[19:12:48] <kwallace> Python is doing something I didn't expect. I am making a list of Z locations. z_list = [z_start], loop z_list.append(z_start + z_DoC * i), z_list.append(z_end). I start and end with the user entered value in order to make sure I get the exact value. The problem is that for a z_end of .2 prints on its own as 0.2 but from the list as 0.1999999999999999999999999 or for other values 0.x0000000000000000000001 . It doesn't matter much but my mind
[19:12:49] <CaptHindsight> it's like every project wants to use a micro vs a PC
[19:13:41] <cradek> kwallace: never use floating point values as loop iterators
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[19:14:03] <cradek> kwallace: use an integer to get the number of counts, then use multiplication of the loop counter to get the floating point value you want
[19:14:15] <jepler> floating point arithmetic has many ways to trip up the unwary
[19:14:52] <seb_kuzminsky> kwallace:
http://www.smbc-comics.com/?id=2999
[19:14:56] <jepler> trying to make a list of [0, 0.1, 0.2, 0.3, ..., 1.0] is among them
[19:18:35] <jepler> >>> .1 * 3 == .3
[19:18:36] <jepler> False
[19:19:01] <cradek> >>> .1 * 2 == .2
[19:19:01] <cradek> True
[19:19:17] <kwallace> i is an integer from "i += 1", z_DoC (float) is adjusted from the user value to get equal cuts between start and end.
[19:20:11] <jepler> and this is not Python's "fault". For example, perl has the same behavior
[19:20:14] <jepler> $ perl -e '(.1 * 3 == .3) or die "arithmetic"'
[19:20:18] <jepler> arithmetic at -e line 1.
[19:21:29] <cradek> for machining, and in most applications, those differences don't matter at all
[19:21:46] <jepler> anyway, maybe you'd like to use something like this 'frange' function:
http://pastie.org/9573323
[19:21:58] <cradek> just make sure you get the right number of iterations (don't guess when to stop by comparing accumulated floating point values)
[19:22:20] <jepler> cradek: when it comes to choosing the depths to machine at, there's a lot of difference between the last passes being at 0.8, 0.9 and 1.0; or being at 0.9, 0.9999999, and 1.0
[19:22:37] <cradek> surely
[19:23:38] <kwallace> That's why I put the user or known accurate value at the end of the list rather than an iterated one.
[19:24:05] <cradek> yes that's a good idea
[19:24:16] <jepler> that's what my proposed code did as well
[19:24:19] <cradek> but don't use floating point tests to figure out whether the one before that was the last one you should have added
[19:25:38] <kwallace> The problem is that the z_doc_list.append(my_user_z_end) prints our 0.20000000000001 instead of printing my_user_z_end before appending.
[19:25:44] <cradek> (maybe you should share the exact loop code)
[19:26:17] <kwallace> Yeah, processing ...
[19:27:01] <jepler> kwallace: particularly in Python 2.6 and earlier, Python frequently prints "excess" digits of precision on floating-point numbers. That is, it prints more digits than are required to satisfy the identity float(repr(x)) == x
[19:27:28] <jepler> in python 2.7 that is no true, and the repr of a float is 'the shortest decimal string that’s guaranteed to round back to x'
[19:27:49] <jepler> so for example where python 2.6 prints 0.29999999999999999, python 2.7 prints 0.3
[19:27:56] <jepler> well, where it repr()s that value
[19:28:15] <jepler> print x and print [x] are different, because when a list is printed, it is the *repr* of each item that is printed, rather than the *str*
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[19:30:55] <jepler> I'll stop trying to explain just in case I'm explaining entirely the wrong thing
[19:31:37] <kwallace> Oops. now I need to read back. Some of the code is here:
http://wallacecompany.com/tmp/python_puzzle.txt
[19:32:10] <jepler> int((z_range / z_doc) + .99)
[19:32:16] <jepler> it looks like you want int(ceil(z_range / z_doc))
[19:32:39] <jepler> ceil(x) is first number >= x which is exactly an integer
[19:33:22] <jepler> though the difference between int(ceil(x)) and int(x+.99) is probably not related to the present vexation
[19:33:29] <kwallace> That's a fudge so that if a user enters .1 DoC and .3 range we get 3 passes when adjusted.
[19:33:44] <kwallace> instead of four.
[19:34:55] <jepler> instead of z_cnt = 1 ... while z_cnt ... z_cnt += 1, use 'for z_cnt in range'
[19:35:36] <jepler> your algorithm is basically the one I suggested, but it's not written as very idiomatic Python
[19:36:13] <jepler> so unless there's a flaw in your code I'm overlooking, it's your expectations about how Python displays floating-point numbers that need to be adjusted
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[19:37:23] <jepler> and, if the output "--kw pocket rect z_doc_list =" is going to be consumed by humans at least sometimes, then you probably want to format the floating-point numbers to a reasonable number of decimal places
[19:39:04] <jepler> such as by a function like make_me_pretty:
http://pastie.org/9573388
[19:43:04] <kwallace> "for z_cnt in range" gives the same result, so just a style thing I guess.
[19:43:45] <kwallace> anything "--kw ...." is just for debugging.
[19:45:17] <jepler> well, then I guess we're back to: modify your expectations about floating-point numbers so that you are no longer surprised if 3 * .1 is not the same as .3, and if one or both of them print with lots of "excess" digits of precision.
[19:45:49] <cradek> I have lost track of the original question (if I ever understood it)
[19:46:43] <jepler> cradek: I think the original problem can be restated as 'I expected these both to print a nice round value':
[19:46:46] <jepler> >>> print .2
[19:46:48] <jepler> 0.2
[19:46:51] <jepler> >>> print [.2]
[19:46:53] <jepler> [0.20000000000000001]
[19:47:09] <kwallace> Yes.
[19:47:36] <jepler> and I'll throw this in for additional context:
[19:47:36] <jepler> >>> print repr(.2)
[19:47:36] <jepler> 0.20000000000000001
[19:48:23] <cradek> then I guess the answer to the question is use %f if you want to see a certain number of decimal places?
[19:48:35] <jepler> cradek: yes
[19:49:02] <cradek> that's easy *and* I totally misunderstood the question
[19:49:21] <kwallace> The only thing that bothers me is I seem to recall formating a float just chops the trailing digits, so 2.999999999999999 could become 2.9 which is off by .1, I just need to be careful to round and not just format.
[19:49:46] <jepler> >>> "%.3f" % (2.99999)
[19:49:46] <jepler> '3.000'
[19:49:54] <jepler> that is not what %f does in Python
[19:52:03] <kwallace> Okay, I just seem to recall having a problem with formating a while back. I'll play with it some more. repr is new to me, I'll look at that too.
[19:52:20] <kwallace> Thanks all.
[19:53:09] <jepler> not that you won't be able to be surprised by the behavior of %f if you go around looking for trouble
[19:53:12] <jepler> >>> "%.0f" % .5
[19:53:15] <jepler> '0'
[19:53:17] <jepler> >>> "%.0f" % 1.5
[19:53:19] <jepler> '2'
[19:53:36] <cradek> round to even (is a feature)?
[19:53:37] <jepler> (actually that is apparently the correct rule, "round to nearest even"
[19:53:38] <jepler> )
[19:53:52] <cradek> yeah what he said
[19:53:52] <jepler> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rounding#Round_half_to_even
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[19:54:02] <jepler> because round up to even is biased
[19:54:12] <jepler> err, .5 rounds up is biased
[19:54:52] <jepler> Python also supports decimal numbers but they'll eventually bite you in the seat of the pants too
[19:54:55] <jepler> >>> Decimal(".1") / 3 * 3
[19:54:58] <jepler> Decimal('0.09999999999999999999999999999')
[19:57:38] <jepler> ooh and also fractions. get a load of this great behavior:
[19:57:38] <jepler> >>> Fraction(1.1)
[19:57:38] <jepler> Fraction(2476979795053773, 2251799813685248)
[19:58:00] <cradek> looks like they should stop adding features
[19:58:29] <jepler> haters gonna hate
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[20:10:47] <rythmnbls> jepler, I get Fraction(11, 10) on Python 2.6.5 and Fraction(2476979795053773, 2251799813685248) on 2.7.8
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[20:27:16] <jepler> rythmnbls: huh, python 2.6.8 (debian 7) gives an error for Fraction(1.1)
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[23:57:33] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03Dewey Garrett 05master 431fb11 06linuxcnc 10scripts/sim_pin sim_pin: show initial value * 14http://git.linuxcnc.org/?p=linuxcnc.git;a=commitdiff;h=431fb11
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