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[02:36:03] <seb_kuzminsky> anyone notice that source code syntax highlighting was broken in our docs on Precise? me neither....
[02:36:11] <seb_kuzminsky> http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/buildbot/builders/docs/builds/878/steps/compile/logs/warnings%20%2826%29
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[03:25:50] <seb_kuzminsky> it's also broken on hardy and lucid
[03:26:15] <seb_kuzminsky> a debugging job for another night....
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[15:41:52] <riz_> I am attempting to make a sample GUI and read out the position from linuxcnc. As with halui, I am using emcStatus as my data to the UI. I am noticing when running the GUI that the position comes out very choppy, sometimes not updating for seconds at a time. However, when I read directly from emcmot_hal_data or some other place it comes out just fine. Does anyone have any idea why this may be?
[15:42:21] <riz_> I tried tracing to see where emcStatus gets updated with position values, but I couldnt find that either...
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[15:45:38] <riz_> Works fine even if I read from emcmotStatus
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[16:08:07] <KimK> riz_: Thanks for your patience, someone will have an answer for you eventually, I'm pretty sure.
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[16:14:25] <skunkworks> kimK: ready for the fest?
[16:15:52] <KimK> skunkworks: Ha, no.
[16:16:08] <KimK> But we will proceed anyway!
[16:16:16] <skunkworks> we will be there sometime wednesday
[16:17:13] <KimK> I'll look forward to it. Did I see something about you bringing your accupins? That should be interesting, I'll look forward to seeing that too.
[16:17:42] <skunkworks> yes - a head and a scale
[16:17:53] <KimK> Excellent
[16:18:47] <skunkworks> kimK: did they ever get that viper running?
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[16:27:08] <KimK> skunkworks: The Viper has been up and down for awhile, which trouble are you referring to?
[16:27:26] <skunkworks> I thought it was a linuxcnc canidate..
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[16:32:57] <KimK> Oh, I see. Yes, it is on the candidate list, but only if it can be converted as it should be, and completed in one week, and we (and LinuxCNC) aren't there yet, but we're getting closer. In the meantime, it has some hydraulic and mechanical issues.
[16:33:22] <cradek> completed in a week!!
[16:33:53] <cradek> (actually it probably is quite possible with some competent planning ahead)
[16:33:56] <skunkworks> cradek, youi did yours in a month...
[16:34:00] <seb_kuzminsky> and the hackfest is one week - coincidence?
[16:34:07] <skunkworks> heh
[16:34:17] <cradek> skunkworks: did I really?
[16:34:35] <skunkworks> that is what I remember...
[16:34:43] <cradek> seb_kuzminsky: what was yours? was it 14 hours to making chips?
[16:34:45] <seb_kuzminsky> cradek converted my bridgeport in ~12 hours, but that's maybe a simpler machine...
[16:34:58] <KimK> Keep chatting gents, I'll be back in a bit.
[16:35:02] <cradek> I remember we timed it but I don't remember the result :-)
[16:35:10] <seb_kuzminsky> seeya KimK
[16:35:38] <seb_kuzminsky> i can't wait for the hackfest, i'm super excited
[16:35:43] <cradek> me too
[16:35:49] <seb_kuzminsky> i'll be there probably wednesday night
[16:35:58] <cradek> I'll probably be there Sunday night
[16:35:59] <seb_kuzminsky> and stay until sunday morning
[16:36:01] <skunkworks> same here.
[16:36:27] <skunkworks> (wed->sun)
[16:36:52] <cradek> already bought my 60 gals of diesel (cough cough)
[16:36:58] <skunkworks> yikes
[16:37:05] <skunkworks> house loan?
[16:37:23] <cradek> heh nope, just stuck my credit card in the pump a few times (it stops at each $100)
[16:37:32] <skunkworks> wow
[16:38:10] <andypugh> I arrive 2pm Monday. Jetlagged to heck.
[16:38:43] <seb_kuzminsky> andypugh: i'm looking forward to meeting you in person after working together all this time :-)
[16:38:51] <cradek> me too, definitely
[16:38:57] <andypugh> cradek: According to a presentation I saw at work, you are the only American to consider diesel a mainstream fuel.
[16:39:08] <cradek> haha
[16:39:38] <cradek> it's getting better. if I go to the VW lot there are LOTS of new diesel models available to buy
[16:39:41] <seb_kuzminsky> i live in a yuppie-wannabe-hippie town, and small diesels are all the rage here
[16:39:43] <cradek> they used to be impossible to find.
[16:39:51] <cradek> yes it's changed a lot in the last 5 years
[16:40:12] <seb_kuzminsky> ok half the rage, gasoline/electric hybrids are popular too
[16:40:30] <cradek> people still think of them as loud and smelly (like my bus, haha) and those opinions take time to change
[16:40:35] <andypugh> Diesel was shown in the same top-right corner as BEV and fuel-cell.
[16:40:45] <skunkworks> we have a lot of suv hybreds here.. :(
[16:41:12] <cradek> yeah those are funny (we got the mileage up to 20! Only $50000!)
[16:41:34] <andypugh> Then, bizarrely, later in the pesentation "Of course, if we do launch Lincoln as a luxury brand in Europe, we won't be able to do that without a Diesel offering"
[16:41:39] <skunkworks> work here leased 3 priuses for the sales people...
[16:42:01] <skunkworks> priuses?
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[16:42:11] <andypugh> Praipes?
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[16:44:47] <jepler> I'll be arriving sunday and staying for the full amount.
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[16:49:38] <CaptHindsight> I tried to find a supply of used 4-6 cylinder diesel engines a few years ago and they were nearly impossible to find here
[16:51:36] <CaptHindsight> andypugh: how many can you fit into a shipping container?
[16:52:08] <andypugh> Hundreds?
[16:52:39] <andypugh> But they need all their anciliaries to even stand a hope of working, including the correct PCM, and the PCM needs the cluster is is paired with, and so on.
[16:52:40] <cradek> a while back, surplus center had some 3-4 cyl ones, but I think they were new
[16:52:52] <cradek> think they were for generators etc
[16:53:02] <CaptHindsight> there also has to be a way of running them in older cars
[16:53:28] <cradek> I'm sure these were all mechanical
[16:54:43] <CaptHindsight> 20+ year old VW diesel engines go for over $2k in good shape
[16:55:02] <andypugh> Rotary-pump engines are easy, yes. But also not particularly nice.
[16:55:40] <andypugh> There probably actually is a market then. I would expect to pay £200 for one.
[16:56:02] <cradek> https://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?item=28-1835
[16:56:29] <cradek> would be insane to spend $2k on an old one. you can get the whole car for that.
[16:56:44] <CaptHindsight> not in the Chicago area
[16:56:59] <CaptHindsight> any diesel is crazy overpriced around here
[16:57:02] <cradek> uship.com
[16:57:05] <andypugh> 26.4hp?
[16:57:17] <jepler> it's not intended for a car
[16:57:20] <jepler> by a long shot
[16:57:31] <andypugh> Rice puddings laugh in it's face, wet brown paper bags openly sneer at it.
[16:57:33] <cradek> http://lincoln.craigslist.org/cto/3869370678.html
[16:57:39] <CaptHindsight> http://chicago.craigslist.org/sox/pts/3843341147.html
[16:57:57] <cradek> http://lincoln.craigslist.org/cto/3820289880.html
[16:58:22] <cradek> heck I might try that '90 if I needed a cheap car
[16:58:31] <cradek> only 200k miles, haha
[16:59:38] <CaptHindsight> the US has done a pretty good job of keeping diesels out of cars
[17:01:01] <CaptHindsight> what day or days will most everyone be at the fest? Friday-Sat?
[17:02:53] <cradek> I'll be there the full week sunday-sunday
[17:03:06] <cradek> a lot are coming wednesdayish and staying through the weekend
[17:03:18] <cradek> I bet some are coming only for the last saturday
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[17:05:50] <CaptHindsight> I'm trying to get a feel for what to do with pushing support to 3.8 kernels and some of the devs with thin skins
[17:05:53] <pcw_home> Friday-Sunday if i can remember where I booked my flight
[17:09:57] <CaptHindsight> I wasn't aware of some of the issues that Matt listed on the ML
[17:11:55] <CaptHindsight> with copyright/licensing confusion
[17:14:36] <CaptHindsight> pcw_home: have you seen the FPGA cape/shield/expansion board for the BBB?
[17:15:37] <CaptHindsight> http://ebrombaugh.studionebula.com/embedded/bcc/index.html
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[17:29:52] <cradek> CaptHindsight: what do you mean by pushing support?
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[17:32:05] <cradek> CaptHindsight: the stuff matt says is true, but it's not an emergency and no reason not to proceed with development
[17:32:59] <cradek> CaptHindsight: I encourage you to assume everyone is working in good faith, and you should proceed and work with all of us if you have stuff to contribute.
[17:33:04] <CaptHindsight> cradek: well I'm not really sure what to do at this point
[17:33:19] <CaptHindsight> it seems that way
[17:33:21] <cradek> here is the right place to talk about the situation
[17:33:26] <cradek> whatever it is :-)
[17:34:02] <CaptHindsight> we're planning on using Linuxcnc in China and we'll have to support it
[17:34:14] <cradek> that's great
[17:34:27] <CaptHindsight> but it's not going to be with Ubuntu
[17:34:33] <cradek> I'm sure lots of people in china are using it already
[17:34:40] <CaptHindsight> a few
[17:35:43] <CaptHindsight> the official version from Linuxcnc will be ubuntu
[17:37:05] <CaptHindsight> it comes down to how to handle newer kernels and non debian/ubuntu
[17:37:09] <cradek> yes it is likely but not a sure thing that the next livecd we make, if we make one, will be based on ubuntu12
[17:38:41] <cradek> how to handle newer kernels (what rtos system to use) is very much up in the air now - rtai is almost working, others are also almost working
[17:39:02] <CaptHindsight> yeah. memleak is working on it full time here
[17:39:10] <pcw_home> CaptHindsight: yes Ive seen that but what a tiny amount of I/O
[17:39:22] <CaptHindsight> and we have a few devs in China that can also start working on it full time
[17:39:23] <cradek> oh is he with you? we've worked together a tiny bit.
[17:40:05] <CaptHindsight> yes, he's in the next room :)
[17:40:29] <cradek> what rtos are you hoping to use?
[17:40:40] <cradek> (whichever one seems to work first?)
[17:40:50] <CaptHindsight> all kernel and firmware/coreboot x86 types but new to Linuxcnc
[17:41:26] <CaptHindsight> heh, RT-Preemept is having page fault issues with anything 3.x
[17:41:49] <CaptHindsight> and we are willing to work on RTAI for 3.8
[17:42:28] <CaptHindsight> I just saw 3.2 working on ARM last night
[17:43:58] <CaptHindsight> we can have support from the bare metal on AMD APU mainboards using coreboot
[17:44:41] <CaptHindsight> all the devs are x-AMD BIOS/EFI/coreboot employees
[17:45:45] <CaptHindsight> I'm just trying to see how we can play well with the debian/ubuntu-centric development
[17:45:56] <cradek> how close is rtai to working? do you know?
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[17:46:54] <CaptHindsight> not sure yet, the 3.8 patch is only a couple of days old
[17:47:09] <cradek> if you ask more specific questions about "playing well" maybe I can try to answer them?
[17:48:25] <CaptHindsight> every time a kernel issue comes I've noticed "are you using a debian kernel"
[17:49:02] <CaptHindsight> so we'd like to have Linuxcnc work with other than debian
[17:49:05] <cradek> yeah, for better or worse, virtually all of us are using the same kernel which is known to work well on lots of hardware
[17:49:17] <CaptHindsight> and we'd like to expand that
[17:49:29] <cradek> I guess what I'm saying is it's expected that you will have to figure out a lot of the nondebian kernel stuff on your own
[17:49:44] <CaptHindsight> that's fine
[17:49:54] <cradek> we would be very happy if you can contribute it to us when you do, the more platforms we can run on the better
[17:50:07] <CaptHindsight> that's the plan
[17:50:47] <cradek> unfortunately you're working on new platform, new rtos, and new experimental code (mhaberler's branches for supporting the new rtos) all at the same time
[17:51:38] <CaptHindsight> yeah, has to happen
[17:51:39] <cradek> if you could manage to get rtai working you'd be likely to have a stable system in short order
[17:51:48] <cradek> I should probably go read the rtai list again
[17:52:16] <CaptHindsight> memleak cleaned up >100K lines of old cruft
[17:52:40] <cradek> yeah, he said that but I don't know what it means
[17:52:51] <CaptHindsight> and some of the older devs jumped back in after the cleanup
[17:52:59] <cradek> you mean rtai folks?
[17:53:06] <CaptHindsight> yes
[17:53:16] <cradek> that's probably good then
[17:53:35] <cradek> the more people who know rtai intimately the better (there seem to be very few)
[17:54:54] <cradek> is one of you Shahbaz?
[17:55:22] <CaptHindsight> no, but that rings a bell
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[18:01:27] <CaptHindsight> earlier this year there was concern that RTAI wouldn't be able to keep up with kernel.org
[18:01:52] <cradek> yes that's been the concern for years, and it's probably getting worse
[18:01:55] <CaptHindsight> the move to support xenomai and RT-Preemept was wise
[18:02:09] <cradek> kernels change major versions so frequently now
[18:02:21] <cradek> yes more options is always good
[18:02:30] <cradek> does xenomai work? that seemed like the most promising
[18:02:47] <CaptHindsight> on 2.x last I heard
[18:03:13] <cradek> hm if it's only on 2.x that's no better than rtai
[18:03:40] <CaptHindsight> memleak was testing this all week
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[18:05:44] <CaptHindsight> have to go, but we're really just trying to get Linuxcnc working with newer kernels
[18:06:23] <CaptHindsight> oh and I'm working on a vision system for automatic calibration
[18:06:26] <cradek> I definitely appreciate your work to that end, we all do
[18:06:45] <CaptHindsight> should be handy for PCB milling and similar
[18:07:04] <cradek> cool
[18:07:14] <cradek> pcb milling is tricky: they are not flat, and they're hard to flip and realign
[18:07:36] <CaptHindsight> Linuxcnc will actually be in a PCB printer
[18:07:45] <jepler> it would be pretty awesome to be able to just flip a two-sided board and not have to line it up (for all the zero times I've done two sided boards:P)
[18:07:51] <CaptHindsight> prints the PCB and the conductors all from fluids
[18:08:05] <cradek> that sounds magical
[18:08:26] <CaptHindsight> building a 5-axis system now with a laser on another 2
[18:08:32] <seb_kuzminsky> CaptHindsight: when you said that Xenomai works "on 2.x last I heard", you meant version 2.x of the xenomai patches on the 3.x linux kernels, right?
[18:08:32] <jepler> oh, depositing conductor instead of milling it away?
[18:09:05] <CaptHindsight> seb_kuzminsky: think so, have to ask memleak
[18:09:34] <seb_kuzminsky> ok thanks
[18:09:38] <CaptHindsight> jepler: yes, it's all additive, so no milling, drilling, etching, bonding etc
[18:09:49] <jepler> interesting
[18:10:15] <CaptHindsight> we'd like to have Linuxcnc inside all the 3d printers
[18:11:02] <CaptHindsight> it keeps the interface consistent and all the CAM/postprocessors will have the same target
[18:11:29] <jepler> do you have a link about this PCB fabrication process?
[18:12:46] <CaptHindsight> not yet, it's not open
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[18:13:32] <CaptHindsight> it similar to multiwire only with printer conductors
[18:13:46] <CaptHindsight> so vias are the same dia. as the conductors
[18:15:59] <CaptHindsight> we have been talking to all the major CAM providers, NX, Mastercam, HSMworks etc
[18:16:54] <CaptHindsight> and it's easy to give them the specs for G-code since it's LinuxCNC, now the adding/putting tools are another story
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[20:51:32] <seb_kuzminsky> linuxcnc-build: force build --branch=halui-jogging-fix checkin
[20:51:32] <linuxcnc-build> build forced [ETA 1h29m10s]
[20:51:32] <linuxcnc-build> I'll give a shout when the build finishes
[20:52:58] <seb_kuzminsky> this is totally nuts, with that branch we now have *3* separate flags that monkey with the linuxcnc script's output
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[20:59:06] <cradek> by all means you should unscrew master
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[20:59:40] <cradek> I wanted tests to be reliable in the release branch without screwing anything up, so I made the smallest change possible
[20:59:51] <seb_kuzminsky> you did the right thing, i'm just whining
[21:00:04] <cradek> heh ok :-)
[21:00:21] <seb_kuzminsky> i bet hardly no one uses -d or -v (or -r)
[21:03:05] <seb_kuzminsky> remind me how that branch fixes the intermittent failure?
[21:06:26] <seb_kuzminsky> oh, you told me here:
http://linuxcnc.mah.priv.at/irc/%23linuxcnc-devel/2013-05-29.html
[21:07:23] <seb_kuzminsky> hm, no, that doesnt make sense to me any more
[21:08:06] <seb_kuzminsky> the output of the test doesnt matter in 2.5, only the "ui" gets to say whether it passed or failed, and it's not picky
[21:17:47] <seb_kuzminsky> ah ok, i'm starting to remember
[21:18:49] <seb_kuzminsky> runtests finds & runs test.sh, which returns true, and then runtests compares result with expected and that fails because of the squirrelyness with "unexpected realtime delay"
[21:20:40] <seb_kuzminsky> i think in 2.5 i should take jepler's advice:
http://linuxcnc.mah.priv.at/irc/%23linuxcnc-devel/2013-05-29.html#19:02:26
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[21:33:37] <linuxcnc-build> build #283 of precise-i386-realtime-rip is complete: Failure [4failed compile runtests] Build details are at
http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/buildbot/builders/precise-i386-realtime-rip/builds/283
[21:35:58] <linuxcnc-build> build #1082 of hardy-i386-realtime-rip is complete: Failure [4failed compile runtests] Build details are at
http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/buildbot/builders/hardy-i386-realtime-rip/builds/1082
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[21:37:53] <linuxcnc-build> build #1082 of lucid-i386-realtime-rip is complete: Failure [4failed compile runtests] Build details are at
http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/buildbot/builders/lucid-i386-realtime-rip/builds/1082
[21:39:06] <linuxcnc-build> build #1080 of checkin is complete: Failure [4failed] Build details are at
http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/buildbot/builders/checkin/builds/1080
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[21:42:28] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03chris 05halui-jogging-fix-2 fc28e24 06linuxcnc 10scripts/linuxcnc.in * linuxcnc script: add -r for runtests
[21:42:28] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03chris 05halui-jogging-fix-2 4f95cbc 06linuxcnc 10tests/ 10halui-jogging/expected 10halui-jogging/test-ui.py 10halui-jogging/test.sh * tests: make halui-jogging report its problems
[21:42:32] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03chris 05halui-jogging-fix-2 9f46fcf 06linuxcnc 10tests/ 10halui-jogging/expected 10halui-jogging/halui.ini * tests: fix amd64 failures for halui-jogging test
[21:42:40] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03chris 05halui-jogging-fix-2 7a641f1 06linuxcnc 10tests/ 10(7 files in 4 dirs) * reenable t0 tests
[21:42:46] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03seb 05halui-jogging-fix-2 72be608 06linuxcnc 10tests/ 03halui-jogging/checkresult 04halui-jogging/expected * halui-jogging test: let the test script choose pass/fail
[21:42:53] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03seb 05halui-jogging-fix-2 e7b3a54 06linuxcnc 10tests/ 10(9 files in 6 dirs) * turn on output from all "unreliable" tests and unskip
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[22:06:54] <micges> andypugh: did you figure out sserial problem from forum?
[22:07:02] <andypugh> No.
[22:07:45] <andypugh> It looks like it is probably a genuine communications problem, and as far as I can see the segfault is nothing to do with my code.
[22:08:11] <micges> noise?
[22:08:21] <andypugh> That was what PCW said.
[22:08:48] <micges> I see
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[22:22:07] <linuxcnc-build> build #1086 of precise-amd64-sim is complete: Failure [4failed compile runtests] Build details are at
http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/buildbot/builders/precise-amd64-sim/builds/1086 blamelist: Chris Radek <chris@timeguy.com>, Sebastian Kuzminsky <seb@highlab.com>
[22:22:46] <linuxcnc-build> build #1084 of precise-i386-sim is complete: Failure [4failed compile runtests] Build details are at
http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/buildbot/builders/precise-i386-sim/builds/1084 blamelist: Chris Radek <chris@timeguy.com>, Sebastian Kuzminsky <seb@highlab.com>
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[22:24:34] <cradek> seb_kuzminsky: yeah I didn't fix anything, I just made the error(s) visible
[22:25:02] <linuxcnc-build> build #1086 of hardy-amd64-sim is complete: Failure [4failed compile runtests] Build details are at
http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/buildbot/builders/hardy-amd64-sim/builds/1086 blamelist: Chris Radek <chris@timeguy.com>, Sebastian Kuzminsky <seb@highlab.com>
[22:25:02] <cradek> I suppose somehow turning off that warning would be the next step
[22:27:01] <linuxcnc-build> build #1082 of lucid-i386-sim is complete: Failure [4failed compile runtests] Build details are at
http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/buildbot/builders/lucid-i386-sim/builds/1082 blamelist: Chris Radek <chris@timeguy.com>, Sebastian Kuzminsky <seb@highlab.com>
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[22:28:42] <linuxcnc-build> build #284 of precise-i386-realtime-rip is complete: Failure [4failed compile runtests] Build details are at
http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/buildbot/builders/precise-i386-realtime-rip/builds/284 blamelist: Chris Radek <chris@timeguy.com>, Sebastian Kuzminsky <seb@highlab.com>
[22:29:07] <linuxcnc-build> build #1084 of lucid-amd64-sim is complete: Failure [4failed compile runtests] Build details are at
http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/buildbot/builders/lucid-amd64-sim/builds/1084 blamelist: Chris Radek <chris@timeguy.com>, Sebastian Kuzminsky <seb@highlab.com>
[22:29:27] <linuxcnc-build> build #1083 of lucid-i386-realtime-rip is complete: Failure [4failed compile runtests] Build details are at
http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/buildbot/builders/lucid-i386-realtime-rip/builds/1083 blamelist: Chris Radek <chris@timeguy.com>, Sebastian Kuzminsky <seb@highlab.com>
[22:29:46] <linuxcnc-build> build #1085 of hardy-i386-sim is complete: Failure [4failed compile runtests] Build details are at
http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/buildbot/builders/hardy-i386-sim/builds/1085 blamelist: Chris Radek <chris@timeguy.com>, Sebastian Kuzminsky <seb@highlab.com>
[22:35:04] <linuxcnc-build> build #1083 of hardy-i386-realtime-rip is complete: Failure [4failed compile runtests] Build details are at
http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/buildbot/builders/hardy-i386-realtime-rip/builds/1083 blamelist: Chris Radek <chris@timeguy.com>, Sebastian Kuzminsky <seb@highlab.com>
[22:35:05] <linuxcnc-build> build #1081 of checkin is complete: Failure [4failed] Build details are at
http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/buildbot/builders/checkin/builds/1081 blamelist: Chris Radek <chris@timeguy.com>, Sebastian Kuzminsky <seb@highlab.com>
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[22:40:52] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03seb 05halui-jogging-fix-2 0efafa0 06linuxcnc 10tests/halui-jogging/checkresult * fixup! halui-jogging test: let the test script choose pass/fail
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