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[05:22:27] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03chrisinnanaimo 05master 8fa0baf 06linuxcnc 10configs/sim/gscreen_custom/industrial_handler.py * gscreen config -fix metric choice not following preferences.
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[11:39:37] <KGB-linuxcnc> 03jthornton 05v2.5_branch 80e497d 06linuxcnc 10docs/src/lathe/lathe-user.txt * Docs: update spindle section to include feed per rev
[11:39:45] <jthornton> would there be any problem adding my thcud component to 2.5?
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[12:44:41] <cradek> jthornton: is it a normal comp with no new dependencies?
[12:45:15] <jthornton> yes, it is just a different version of the thc comp that uses two inputs, up and down
[12:46:12] <cradek> brb, sorry
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[13:08:16] <cradek> jthornton: is it the same as thc except for how the input pins work?
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[13:39:28] <JT-Shop> yes
[13:45:21] <skunkworks> another flat panel monitor fixed - buldging power supply cap
[13:45:30] <skunkworks> bulging?
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[14:04:39] <cradek> bugling?
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[14:05:59] <cradek> jthornton: for 2.5 that'd be ok I think, since it wouldn't affect any working configs and is safe. but for master it would be better if you would make one comp that had both modes, so there is no redundant code. copying a lot of code and then making a small change to one copy always causes maintenance trouble down the road.
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[14:06:45] <cradek> if you don't know how to do different modes in comp (I sure don't) maybe andy or jepler could help
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[14:27:27] <JT-Shop> ok thanks
[14:28:13] <JT-Shop> I think without looking I can add personality, but I'll look into that before I work on the master copy
[14:55:30] <skunkworks> stupid question tar.gz file - I have one that was trunkcated and won't open. Is it possible to open it with some magic?
[14:56:41] <jepler> commandline tar will do the best it can
[14:56:58] <jepler> tar xzvf broken.tar.gz
[14:57:59] <jepler> zip files have an index at the end, which is why a truncated zip file generally becomes unusable without a "zipfix" step which can partially reconstruct the index. by contrast, a tar file doesn't have such an index, so a truncated tar can simply be treated like any other tar..
[14:58:42] <skunkworks> look at that! thanks!
[14:59:21] <skunkworks> I had run a backup from our website a while back and it stopped a ways in.. Wondering how much was backedup
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[16:36:02] <IchGuckLive> hi why are the wiki pages now read only no edit
[16:36:09] <IchGuckLive> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Cam_Post
[16:36:26] <IchGuckLive> i woudt like to get my postprozessors for heekscad on this side
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[17:12:04] <IchGuckLive> done !
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[17:36:05] <cradek> andypugh: forum seems to be ok today?
[17:36:19] <andypugh> Much better, I think
[17:36:33] <cradek> I just posted and it went through in a few seconds.
[17:36:35] <andypugh> Did somone kicj the server?
[17:37:01] <cradek> lots of us poked at it, but I think dreamhost finally getting their act together is what fixed it.
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[17:43:07] <cradek> alex and I were cheering on swp, hoping he could create a dreamhost problem report, but I don't know if he managed to do it, and I don't know if those are even visible to me
[17:43:14] <cradek> so whatever, it's working again for now
[17:45:04] <andypugh> "DreamHost" seems perhaps something of a misnomer?
[17:45:26] <cradek> I doubt they're worse than any other hosting provider
[17:49:28] <andypugh> Sady that is probably true.
[17:50:05] <andypugh> It has only just ocurred to me to wonder who pays the hosting bill,
[17:51:12] <cradek> haha
[17:51:51] <cradek> last time that question was answered in public people started talking about money, which none of us who maintain the project's infrastructure want to talk about
[17:52:35] <andypugh> Yes, hateful stuff, that money :-)
[17:53:44] <cradek> some well-meaning folks said "we should have a way to contribute! yeah!" and then started worrying about bookkeeping and tax deductions and exchange rates and peak oil and the price of silver bullion
[17:53:53] <andypugh> I find myself suddenly losing interest any time anyone wants to pay me for LinuxCNC work. I think it is because suddenly it would stop being voluntary/hobby.
[17:53:55] <cradek> or something
[17:54:45] <cradek> well I get paid sometimes, but it's always a private arrangement outside the project's main structure
[17:54:58] <andypugh> (And, in fact, the most recent job I did for a friend I am going to demand payment in Mesa hardware, rather than cash)
[17:55:11] <cradek> so that's just my business and problem
[17:55:39] <cradek> heh I know the feeling. I've done similar. you're smart to know what you want and don't.
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[18:19:53] <seb_kuzminsky> i'm not sure if i wish i could get paid to work on linuxcnc, or if i only wish i could get paid to work on what *i* want to work in linuxcnc
[18:20:55] <cradek> ideally I'd get paid to work on what *I* want to work on [notice sentence stops here]
[18:24:18] <andypugh> Better still to get paid for nothing then do what you choose.
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[19:13:39] <skunkworks> http://electronicsam.com/images/core.JPG
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[19:13:50] <skunkworks> can I add more memory to linuxcnc?
[19:14:11] <skunkworks> http://electronicsam.com/images/core1.JPG
[19:16:18] <cradek> would be neat to be able to read what's on it, but you only get one chance...
[19:16:52] <skunkworks> heh
[19:17:17] <skunkworks> it was out of a glorified calculator... NCR something or other
[19:17:40] <cradek> too bad it's not still intact
[19:17:46] <cradek> have you seen the calculator museum?
[19:18:02] <cradek> there were some really amazing machines.
[19:19:53] <skunkworks> is each bead a bit? or the set of 4?
[19:20:02] <cradek> yeah each donut is one bit
[19:21:08] <skunkworks> 16.384 X 2 bits
[19:21:16] <skunkworks> 16.384b X 2 bits
[19:21:22] <skunkworks> jeeze'
[19:21:25] <skunkworks> 16.384k X 2 bits
[19:21:48] <cradek> 32 k bits? that's a lotta bits
[19:22:44] <skunkworks> 32 X32 matrix - * 4 beads.. X 2 sections
[19:23:04] <skunkworks> if I counted that right
[19:23:30] <cradek> then I get 8 k bits
[19:23:31] <skunkworks> no - I didnt do that right
[19:23:34] <skunkworks> heh
[19:23:35] <skunkworks> yes
[19:23:57] <skunkworks> 8192
[19:24:11] <andypugh> That looks like pretty late-stage core.
[19:24:30] <cradek> so it's a few hundred words of ram, depending on how big your words are
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[19:25:01] <skunkworks> Dad found that in the basement ;)
[19:27:51] <cradek> a few hundred words is a lot for a calculator, not much for a computer
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[19:28:22] <skunkworks> I remember it having a full keybaord and printer I think
[19:28:40] <cradek> a while back, I fixed a calculator that had acoustic delay-line memory and vector crt display
[19:28:51] <skunkworks> yikes
[19:29:11] <cradek> it would always go BONG when you turn it on
[19:30:56] <skunkworks> http://infolab.stanford.edu/pub/voy/museum/pictures/display/2-1-DelayLine.jpg
[19:31:00] <skunkworks> like that?
[19:31:04] <andypugh> core memory is not valueless:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-UNIVAC-Computer-Ferrite-Core-Memory-Plane-4K-Bits-1960s-/321092942350
[19:32:17] <cradek> holy crap, this is it:
http://www.oldcalculatormuseum.com/v322int.jpg
[19:32:52] <cradek> http://www.oldcalculatormuseum.com/vic14-322.jpg
[19:33:13] <skunkworks> wow
[19:34:45] <cradek> http://www.dvq.com/oldcomp/photos2/v14_4.JPG
[19:35:17] <cradek> they need to crank up the horizontal deflection a bit, but you can see how nice and readable the numbers are
[19:35:37] <andypugh> http://www.oldcalculatormuseum.com/vic14-322.html is the article, in case you found it by an image search
[19:36:25] <skunkworks> cradek, what was the issue?
[19:36:36] <cradek> mostly just power supply
[19:36:52] <cradek> thankfully, since all the ICs had their tops sanded off
[19:37:23] <cradek> the whole base of it is one huge pcb packed full of 14-16 pin dips, something pre-ttl
[19:37:56] <cradek> oh there are pics of it!
[19:38:20] <cradek> DTL, theirs aren't sanded, but have "secret" part numbers on them, ha
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[19:42:52] <skunkworks> THis is what I remember the machine looking like..
[19:42:53] <skunkworks> http://www.thecorememory.com/
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[19:43:16] <skunkworks> *electronic accounting system
[19:43:53] <cradek> cool
[19:45:52] <cradek> It turned out that electrostatic discharge through the user touching the keyboard of the calculator was powerful enough to work its way into the MOS integrated circuits and cause damage. As a result, some early 3900's ended up failing in the field. Unfortunately, repairing the circuit board was a major challenge, as repair operations tended to create electrostatic discharge that could cause even more damage.
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[19:54:38] <alex_joni> cradek: ouch
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[19:56:08] <alex_joni> cradek: any idea where I can find some cheaper nixie tubes
[19:56:27] <cradek> heh, cheaper than what?
[19:56:49] <cradek> there are a LOT of russian nixies around
[19:56:55] <andypugh> Just make your own, how hard can it be?
[19:56:55] <cradek> they made them longer than anyone else
[19:58:12] <cradek> unfortunately nixieclock-making became popular and people sucked them all up.
[19:58:22] <cradek> ideally you'd have a personal stock from before then, like I do :-)
[19:59:34] <andypugh> dekatrons are cool too. And appear to work on quadrature.
[20:00:18] <cradek> inter-stage amplification for dekatrons is tricky
[20:00:54] <cradek> I built a (purely) dekatron clock that usually keeps time
[20:01:19] <cradek> with triode amps for inter-stage amp
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[20:02:00] <andypugh> A coaxial dekatron would be a nice clock.
[20:02:29] <cradek> yeah but I don't know of such a thing...
[20:02:55] <andypugh> No, I think you would need to make it yourself.
[20:03:22] <cradek> the key to making a clock out of them is finding some of the counts-to-12 versions that were used in the days of the silly british money
[20:03:49] <andypugh> We should bring that back, to confuse the tourists.
[20:03:54] <cradek> they have taps at 6 and 0 so you can /60 with two tubes
[20:04:33] <andypugh> Are you aware that they used to price "posh" stuff in "guineas" which were £1 /1 /0
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[20:04:59] <cradek> yeah
[20:05:06] <cradek> it's amazing to me
[20:05:21] <andypugh> So a camera might cost 5 guineas 4 shillings and sixpence, which would be £ 9/ 6d
[20:05:30] <andypugh> Sory, £5 9/ 6d
[20:05:48] <cradek> I'm sure people can get used to anything...
[20:06:02] <andypugh> And computers can cope with that sort of stuff now, so there is no reason not to go back to the system :-)
[20:06:11] <cradek> of course you're right
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[20:19:43] <alex_joni> well if you can't make a proper water tap, why not use silly denominations too
[20:21:08] * alex_joni means this: http://cklaveryatuni.files.wordpress.com/2007/03/bath_tap.JPG
[20:25:48] <andypugh> I don't know what you mean? Surely everyone wants to freeze one hand and scald the other?
[20:26:38] <andypugh> (Actually, there is a reason for it. Our water regulations were _extremely_ paranoid about mixing the hot and cold water supplies.
[20:27:12] <andypugh> Even mixer taps have to keep the supplies separate right to the nozzle.
[20:27:34] <andypugh> But the market is now flooded with cheap italian taps that flout the regs.
[20:28:09] <alex_joni> andypugh: why is that?
[20:28:27] <alex_joni> I mean, what is the thinking behind the mixing no-no?
[20:29:17] <alex_joni> I always thought you use separate taps to reduce water consumption (fill the bowl with the right mix, and use that to wash), opposed to leave the water running like the rest of the world
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[20:33:11] <andypugh> The typical UK hot water system was a back-boiler behind the fire which contained treated water which circulated through a heat-exchanger coil in the hot water tank. The hot-water tank needs to be able to expand, so is fed from a header-tank in the loft, which has a float-valve to feed it from the cold water main, and a vent pipe back into the tank. This means that a leak in the heat-exchanger or a dead rat in the
[20:33:12] <andypugh> header tank can make the hot water unsafe to drink. This also means that it should be impossible for your domestic plumbing to push your hot water back into the cold-water main, even if the cold-water supply pressure should drop low enough.
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[20:51:05] <alex_joni> andypugh: I see, thanks
[20:52:21] <andypugh> I have not seen much evidence for cholera epidemics and mass-deaths now that mixer taps are commonplace.
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[20:54:47] <alex_joni> heh
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