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[15:50:26] <skunkworks> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mach1mach2cnc/message/139196
[15:50:29] <skunkworks> poor brian
[15:57:21] <cradek> > There will be a small amount of work that the user needs to do to register there machine ... This is normal in today's world
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[16:24:02] <skunkworks> heh
[16:24:14] * skunkworks hugs linuxcnc and linux
[16:36:56] <skunkworks> there was a big discussion - css doesn't work on mach3 (tried to make it work and gave up). So now everyone is waiting for mach4 as it is going to work. Yet his comment on it was 'I don't see why it will not work .. The Feedhold and FRO
[16:36:56] <skunkworks> are FAST on Mach4 and I have a guy that worked for Mori Seiki try the
[16:36:56] <skunkworks> machine and he was pleased to see that it responded as quickly as any
[16:36:57] <skunkworks> machine he had run in the past. So with that sort of update speed I
[16:36:57] <skunkworks> think CSS will work as we all would like!
[16:36:59] <skunkworks> '
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[18:42:21] <seb_kuzminsky> any thoughts on this machine?
http://denver.craigslist.org/bfd/3601296380.html
[18:42:32] <seb_kuzminsky> moog hydra path III, for sale near me
[18:42:52] <seb_kuzminsky> looks a lot like my bridgeport r2 e3, but with a tool changer and 4th axis, anda more common spindle taper
[18:43:24] <cradek> I thought those were hydraulic, but sure looks like it has electric servos...?
[18:43:57] <cradek> what's the spindle?
[18:44:00] <pcw_home> Yeah moog and hydra raise the oh-no its hydraulic flag for me
[18:45:00] <cradek> for your garage or for a bigger place?
[18:46:05] <seb_kuzminsky> i think this one uses electrons
[18:47:03] <seb_kuzminsky> the spindle is described as "30-taper", which i think means cat-30?
[18:47:43] <seb_kuzminsky> my vague idea is to buy it and put it in my garage, then sell the r2e3
[18:47:52] <cradek> could be cat, bt, nmtb, or others
[18:48:07] <seb_kuzminsky> hmm, right
[18:48:24] <cradek> actually it looks like none of those to me. looks like a truncated 30
[18:48:57] <cradek> (in the cardboard box you can sort of see some)
[18:49:01] <seb_kuzminsky> are you looking at that picture of a cardboard box fulll of tool holders?
[18:49:04] <seb_kuzminsky> oh, right :-)
[18:49:28] <cradek> I would not assume these are easier to find than QC, but there sure are plenty of them with it
[18:49:44] <seb_kuzminsky> the guy said it comes with "hundreds" of tool holders...
[18:49:55] <cradek> wow
[18:49:58] <seb_kuzminsky> not that i've ever run out what with that batch you sold me
[18:50:23] <cradek> check carefully for wear - it might be totally worn out in heavy production
[18:50:28] <seb_kuzminsky> he's asking $7k, and it's just a 30 minute drive away
[18:50:31] <cradek> especially if the oilers weren't kept clean
[18:50:33] <seb_kuzminsky> yeah, good point
[18:51:08] <seb_kuzminsky> i can check the runout in the spindle with a dti, and the backlash in the screws
[18:51:24] <seb_kuzminsky> inspect the ways for those scraper marks
[18:51:35] <seb_kuzminsky> see if lube is flowing from all the right orifices
[18:51:42] <cradek> check saddle slop at the center and ends of travel
[18:51:53] <seb_kuzminsky> by pushing on the table with my hands?
[18:52:01] <cradek> yes, take a magnet base and a dial indicator so you can measure slop as you push and pull on the table
[18:52:04] <skunkworks_> is that a fixture plate on the table - or the table?
[18:52:12] <cradek> I don't know...
[18:52:30] <seb_kuzminsky> funny-looking table if so
[18:53:13] <seb_kuzminsky> i should drive up there and look at it
[18:53:14] <cradek> I sure like a bed mill more than a knee mill - the not having to fiddle around with Z travel is so nice
[18:53:16] <seb_kuzminsky> supposedly it's under power
[18:53:31] <seb_kuzminsky> yeah, that does sound nice
[18:53:38] <skunkworks_> yeck.
[18:53:52] <skunkworks_> heh - makes it hard to justify a convert...
[18:54:04] <cradek> yeah if it works...
[18:54:05] <seb_kuzminsky> i also find myself envying your ability to mill off the edge of the table
[18:54:16] <seb_kuzminsky> lalalalala i'm not listening to you lala
[18:54:30] <cradek> yours can do that on the front edge, can't it?
[18:54:51] <seb_kuzminsky> oh yeah, and it's three-phase, so i'd need to switch out the transformer like we did on the bridgeport
[18:55:20] <cradek> eek
[18:55:31] <seb_kuzminsky> that was exciting! :-)
[18:55:36] <cradek> you might not realize how lucky you got with that
[18:55:49] <seb_kuzminsky> hm, no, i didn't realize
[18:56:03] <seb_kuzminsky> was that a hard transformer to find? or is it unusual that it's so easy to convert?
[18:56:05] <cradek> how many hp on the spindle?
[18:56:06] <skunkworks_> you need to find a machine similar like cradek has.. Don't do a horzontal 'upgrade'
[18:56:15] <skunkworks_> ;)
[18:56:24] <cradek> yeah it can be hard to find the perfect transformer, depending on the DC bus voltage and how picky the amps are about it
[18:56:24] <skunkworks_> did someone get into HV?
[18:56:38] <seb_kuzminsky> HV?
[18:56:55] <cradek> ?
[18:57:08] <skunkworks_> high voltage? (the way you are talking - it sounds like you almost got electricuted.. ;))
[18:57:17] <skunkworks_> or lucky in finding a transformer?
[18:57:22] <cradek> transformer luck
[18:57:33] <skunkworks_> ah - wow - I read to far into that one/
[18:58:51] <cradek> I think he's got a 400->120 oversized running derated, 240 input to get 100v rectified out
[18:59:30] <seb_kuzminsky> you made the conversion really easy, thanks again :-)
[18:59:56] <cradek> 400 in is an oddball that took a while to find. if I remember right, I think I found it and jmk picked it up in cleveland and shipped it to me.
[19:00:16] <cradek> welcome :-)
[19:00:34] <seb_kuzminsky> i wonder how hard it would be to sell the bridgeport...
[19:00:37] <cradek> I sold you a kit, haha
[19:00:57] <cradek> seems like there are no machine tools in CO. probably not hard.
[19:01:10] <cradek> long effing way from there to the rust belt
[19:01:33] <skunkworks_> Neat
[19:02:27] <skunkworks_> that is sort of what we found to run the servos in the K&T - big ass transformer that input 220 and output somwhere around 150v.
[19:02:46] <cradek> is it single phase!?
[19:03:00] <skunkworks_> oh - no. we have 3 phase. (so a bit easier)
[19:03:50] <cradek> yeah single phase transformers get unmanageable much faster
[19:04:03] <cradek> 5x the mass? 10x?
[19:04:14] <skunkworks_> it is physically big. we mounted it outside the box
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[19:04:56] <cradek> seb_kuzminsky: I think that is the table in the photo showing A. it has a logo on it.
[19:05:40] <cradek> wonder why the 2x4s. does the quill fall?
[19:07:16] <seb_kuzminsky> or a sheet metal chip tray?
[19:07:39] <seb_kuzminsky> i'm looking at the second A picture
[19:09:25] <cradek> 11k Onboard Memory and RS232 Input
[19:09:40] <seb_kuzminsky> aw yea
[19:09:46] <cradek> might be cat30
[19:10:07] <cradek> http://www.lislesurplus.com/misc/Moog-cnc-vertical-machine-center-w-24-pos-atc-mint/
[19:10:10] <cradek> haha "mint"
[19:10:23] <cradek> this has the original control but new motors??
[19:10:41] <skunkworks_> sure - brushed motors wear out...
[19:10:45] <cradek> seb_kuzminsky: the r2e3 docs specify the program memory size in "feet"
[19:11:41] <cradek> oh wow, the "saddle" is full width
[19:11:45] <cradek> http://www.lislesurplus.com/misc/Moog-cnc-vertical-machine-center-w-24-pos-atc-mint/Moog-cnc-vertical-machine-center-w-24-pos-atc-mint-1.jpg
[19:12:02] <cradek> that will probably have a lot less wear then
[19:12:46] <seb_kuzminsky> cool picture
[19:12:59] <seb_kuzminsky> that table looks narrow compared to the bridgeport
[19:13:49] <cradek> The Hydrapath was Moog's jump to a servo/screw driven CNC.
[19:15:55] <seb_kuzminsky> looks like the same kind of CV spindle transmission as on the r2e3
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[19:16:18] <cradek> it may be the same head?
[19:16:36] <kwallace> What's wrong with the R2E3?
[19:16:44] <cradek> no tool changer
[19:17:14] <seb_kuzminsky> nothing wrong with it, it's working well
[19:17:24] <seb_kuzminsky> but oh! the shiny!
[19:17:35] <seb_kuzminsky> toolchanger & A axis, really
[19:18:25] <cradek> a small A axis would be easy to add
[19:18:32] <cradek> a toolchanger would be about impossible to add
[19:18:48] <seb_kuzminsky> here's an older hydrapoint with a full-width saddle:
http://www.cnconabudget.com/stuff.html
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[19:19:03] <seb_kuzminsky> right...
[19:19:19] <cradek> ugh, a series 1 never-quite-upright head
[19:19:31] <cradek> I really wouldn't want that on a cnc.
[19:19:51] <kwallace> $7k for an experienced machine seems a little high. The Shizuoka next to me went for 1.5k.
[19:20:14] <seb_kuzminsky> kwallace: whoa! where was that?
[19:20:33] <seb_kuzminsky> 7k is his asking price, it hasnt moved in about a month so i bet he'd come down
[19:21:36] <kwallace> http://www.ebay.com/itm/251235604390
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[19:23:46] <seb_kuzminsky> oh yeah, i guess if the machine is working that's worth a couple of grand ;-)
[19:24:21] <cradek> I'd sure pay an extra $k for currently-seems-to-work
[19:24:32] <cradek> but maybe not an extra $5k
[19:24:38] <seb_kuzminsky> yeha
[19:24:40] <seb_kuzminsky> yeah
[19:25:16] <kwallace> The controller doesn't count.
[19:25:22] <cradek> on my last project, about $2k was the price to replace the things that would have been obviously not working if it was under power
[19:26:24] <cradek> if someone has a line of several of the same machine, beware the not-working one
[19:26:32] <cradek> because it's not just the tape reader that's bad on it :-)
[19:26:58] <seb_kuzminsky> the first one to die gets canibalized for parts for the other machines, right? :-)
[19:27:06] <cradek> you betcha
[19:27:29] <cradek> then all the bad parts get piled together and sold as "doesn't seem to work"
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[19:28:03] <seb_kuzminsky> ugh
[19:28:56] <cradek> kwallace: I'd also pay another $k for a dc servo vs a stepper machine, but we're still only up to $3k5
[19:30:43] <cradek> http://www.logicpaintball.com/DisplayOn.jpg
[19:30:54] <cradek> 2001!?
[19:34:43] <andypugh> A servo-hydraulic machine would be a lot of fun.
[19:35:00] <cradek> for holding something down with?
[19:35:29] <seb_kuzminsky> for spray-painting the inside of your garage with hydraulic fluid
[19:35:31] <andypugh> Very stiff, very fast.
[19:35:40] <cradek> very loud
[19:36:17] <andypugh> You should see the servo-hydraulic chassis test machines at work. 6-axis heaving on all 4 wheels at once to simulate road-lads in real-time.
[19:36:19] <cradek> to be fair, I'd really love to see one work in someone else's shop
[19:36:28] <seb_kuzminsky> the guy on practical machinist said they smelled really bad, even when new
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[19:37:13] <andypugh> I spent a number of years working with servo-hydraulic tensile test machines. They can do some impressive things.
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[23:11:32] <andypugh> If I have a struct which contains a char* member called "name" then struct->name = "thingy" is perfectly OK. However, how do I do this if I want the string to be created at runtime? Do I have to malloc and strpy?
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[23:27:06] <seb_kuzminsky> andypugh: if you use the string constant "thingy" in your C code, the compiler will place that string in your data segment at compile time
[23:27:22] <seb_kuzminsky> then you can assign the address of that string to any char* you want, at any time
[23:28:12] <seb_kuzminsky> if you want to set the contents of the string dynamically at runtime, then yes you need to malloc space for it (and free it when you're done!) and snprintf or strcpy or something into it
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[23:33:00] <andypugh> That's a pain :-)
[23:33:18] * seb_kuzminsky shrugs
[23:33:46] <andypugh> I am not sure I have control of when the recieving object unloads.
[23:33:55] <seb_kuzminsky> bbl
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